1 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:10,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:16,960 Speaker 1: noon Eastern on Appocarplay. 4 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 2: And then Rounoto with the Bloomberg Business app. 5 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch 6 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 7 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 3: As we have the voice now of Michael Zelden, an 8 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 3: important part of our coverage. The former federal prosecutor is 9 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 3: with us here, and Michael, I'm glad to see you. 10 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 3: I'd like to get back to this idea of overreach 11 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:40,199 Speaker 3: or overstepping, whether the Special Council did, in your opinion, 12 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,200 Speaker 3: pull a comy as some are saying here by very 13 00:00:43,280 --> 00:00:47,160 Speaker 3: personally describing Joe Biden going beyond the actions that involve 14 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 3: the handling of classified documents. 15 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 4: I think so. 16 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:53,880 Speaker 5: Remember I was an independent council. I investigated George Herbert 17 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 5: Walker Bore and we submitted a report as well, and 18 00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 5: we were very careful to just give facts. We weren't 19 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,040 Speaker 5: trying to put our minds in those of the jewelry 20 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 5: and say, well, if we were to go to trial, 21 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,959 Speaker 5: some might think that that was not part of our purview. 22 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 5: Ours was what was the evidence and on that evidence, 23 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 5: what was the basis of our decision to charge or 24 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:18,479 Speaker 5: not charge? And I think that her could have done 25 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,800 Speaker 5: that much more clinically than he did. I think that 26 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 5: he was trying to explain to Merrick Garland why, in 27 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:30,679 Speaker 5: the face of evidence of willful retention and dissemination, he 28 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 5: was not going to recommend charging. And so he said, look, 29 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:36,319 Speaker 5: here's why I'm not recommending charging. So he was trying 30 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:38,480 Speaker 5: to do the right thing. But I think that he 31 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:44,560 Speaker 5: just overstepped his bounds of reporting when he talks about 32 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 5: age in a political context, when he has to know, 33 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 5: because he comes out of the Trump White House, when 34 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 5: he has to know that age is the biggest issue, 35 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 5: the biggest hurdle that Biden faces. 36 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 4: So to stick that in there was. 37 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 5: Just unfortunate, even if his intention was not political. 38 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 3: Interesting you would know the answer to this when the 39 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:11,080 Speaker 3: Special Council or as you described yourself, independent council comes 40 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 3: out with this report. Is there not an editing opportunity 41 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:17,240 Speaker 3: here for the Attorney general? 42 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:17,800 Speaker 6: For instance? 43 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 3: In this case, would Merrick Garland be able to say, hey, 44 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 3: you might need to walk this back, this personal stuff here, 45 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 3: or is that the purpose of a special or Independent 46 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 3: Council where the Attorney General has no hands on the 47 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 3: final products. 48 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 4: It's a great question. 49 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 5: Under the regulations, the Special Council submits the report in 50 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,919 Speaker 5: confidence to the AG and then the AG decides what 51 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 5: to do with it. Now, what did we see in 52 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:47,760 Speaker 5: the Muller investigation. Muller submitted his report to Barr. Barr 53 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:50,760 Speaker 5: gave a summary of it which was a bit misleading. 54 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 5: Muller was very upset, and then they ultimately released the 55 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 5: final report. Garland, to overcome that problem, has said, look, 56 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:01,760 Speaker 5: what you give me is what's going to go out 57 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 5: unless there's. 58 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 4: You know, a factual error. 59 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:07,240 Speaker 5: You know you said two plus two equals five, will 60 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:10,360 Speaker 5: make you say it equals four. But otherwise we're sending 61 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 5: this out. I don't want to have any appearance like Barr. 62 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 4: Did, of putting my finger on the scale. 63 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:19,080 Speaker 5: And so that's what That's what happened here. And I 64 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:22,440 Speaker 5: think that if for a normal case this report. 65 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 4: May not have seen the light of day in this 66 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 4: current form. 67 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 3: Well, could we then accuse the Attorney General of being 68 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 3: too careful? 69 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:35,119 Speaker 4: Well, you know some are already doing that. 70 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 5: People, if you read the internet, are accusing him of 71 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 5: exactly that, of slow walking the January sixth investigation and 72 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 5: picking her a political Republican by background, a capable attorney 73 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 5: by oh measures. But why is it they say that 74 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 5: when a Democrat is being investigated, we get these republican investigators, 75 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 5: and when a republic is investigated, we get it a 76 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 5: Republican indust gator. 77 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 4: Why is it that way? So he's going to get criticized. 78 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:06,720 Speaker 4: He's going to get criticized. 79 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 5: But I do think when you get down to the 80 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 5: bottom of this, her intentions may have been honorable, but 81 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 5: I think his choice of language was unfortunate, and particularly 82 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 5: unfortunate in the context of a political campaign. 83 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 3: Let's get to the language involved and the findings that 84 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 3: involved classified documents themselves totally irresponsible. I lifted first and 85 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 3: foremost off this report. But also willful retention. Doesn't that 86 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 3: suggest that Joe Biden is guilty of the very same 87 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 3: thing that they're charging Donald Trump with. I know there's 88 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 3: a separate obstruction layer for Donald Trump here because of 89 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 3: moving documents and evading that retrieval process, But if willful 90 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:55,119 Speaker 3: retention is taken at face value, that means Joe Biden 91 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 3: knew he was doing something wrong. 92 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:58,560 Speaker 6: Along with the sharing of classified information. 93 00:04:58,680 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 7: No. 94 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, the report is a little bit confusing. 95 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 5: Sometimes they call it will for retention, and sometimes they 96 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:08,120 Speaker 5: say it's ambiguous whether there was wilfulness. But the bottom 97 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 5: line is he said he wilfully retained and disseminated classified information. 98 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,160 Speaker 5: Now Biden takes issue with whether it was classified information. 99 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 5: A lot of it was notebooks or diaries that Biden kept, 100 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,880 Speaker 5: and he said there was a private property, not classified 101 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:27,839 Speaker 5: information in ordinary classification. But you know, that's really not 102 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 5: a good answer. The answer is that he retained, He 103 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:36,719 Speaker 5: purposely retained, and he disseminated. And I think that had 104 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 5: Trump done just that and then given all the stuff back, 105 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 5: he would not have been charged. And that's why I 106 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 5: think that Biden and Trump align on the retention and dissemination. 107 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 5: But where they separate is, as you said, on the obstruction. 108 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 5: Is that obstruction that god Trump indicted, because otherwise I 109 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:03,919 Speaker 5: think these cases and have similarities there the scope is different. 110 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 5: Trump had, you know, hundreds of documents and Biden had 111 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 5: twelve or something. But it is really about obstruction that 112 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 5: differentiates the two of them, and her, to his credit, 113 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 5: made plain that this is not the same. 114 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 4: This is not an apples to apples. 115 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:22,560 Speaker 5: Comparison Trump to Biden is apples to oranges, especially because 116 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 5: of volume and destruction and obstruction. 117 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:30,600 Speaker 3: So you do agree then with the decisions and not 118 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:34,239 Speaker 3: file charges in this case, obviously I do. 119 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 5: But in some sense, you know, in some you know, 120 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 5: strange way, Biden might have been better off getting charged 121 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:44,159 Speaker 5: than not getting charged. At least he would have a 122 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:47,960 Speaker 5: form to say, I'm not infirm, have my mental acuity. 123 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:51,159 Speaker 5: But I think to the last conversation you had, he's 124 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 5: got to be out on. 125 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:52,919 Speaker 4: The campaign trail. 126 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 5: He has to be talking every day to overcome this 127 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 5: notion that he's too old and too infirmed. He's got 128 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:01,720 Speaker 5: to be like Mary Trubman in nineteen forty eight. He's 129 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 5: got to be on a whistle stop every day out 130 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:08,160 Speaker 5: there so people can see his mental acuity. Otherwise I 131 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 5: don't think he overcomes this and. 132 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 3: Start doing push ups on the Rose Garden first thing 133 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 3: in the morning. Michael Zelden, I have to ask you 134 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:18,560 Speaker 3: about what's happening around Donald Trump as well, because yesterday 135 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 3: was supposed to be the day we reported on oral 136 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 3: arguments before the Supreme Court in this Fourteenth Amendment case. 137 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 3: This has to do with ballot access, of course, separate 138 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 3: from the presidential immunity ruling that may well get to 139 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 3: the Supreme Court. That's something that we can talk about separately. 140 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 3: But when it comes to this idea of barring Donald 141 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 3: Trump from the ballot for quote unquote engaging in insurrection, 142 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 3: as we fumble around the definitions of these words that 143 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,280 Speaker 3: we're using, what's the difference, in the eyes of the 144 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,040 Speaker 3: law between a riot and an insurrection? 145 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 5: Michael Well, an insurrection is organized and a riot is 146 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 5: spunt taneous. I think the language of the Fourteenth Amendments, 147 00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 5: Section three says engage in an insurrection against the constitution. 148 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:12,679 Speaker 5: It doesn't say engaged in arm warfare against the government. 149 00:08:12,720 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 5: And theoretically, an insurrection against the constitution is trying to 150 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 5: prevent the orderly transfer of power. 151 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 4: I mean, the bedrock. 152 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 5: Principle of our constitution is the orderly transfer of power. 153 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 5: And the whole faked elector's scheme and all that stuff, 154 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:34,840 Speaker 5: I think is easily seen as an attempt to disrupt 155 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 5: the constitution too. 156 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 4: Doesn't have to be violence. It can be just the 157 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 4: fake elector's scheme. 158 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:46,120 Speaker 5: But we didn't get there in the court yesterday, and 159 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 5: the Court seems that it's going to rule that you 160 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 5: need congressional action to give effect to this section. It's 161 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:55,520 Speaker 5: not self executing. And they're never going to get to 162 00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 5: the question of whether this was an insurrection or a riot, 163 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:00,680 Speaker 5: or whether it has to be violent, so whether it 164 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:05,839 Speaker 5: could be just an attempt to violate the constitutional transfer 165 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:07,559 Speaker 5: of powers rules. 166 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:10,840 Speaker 3: I always learned something when we talked to Michael Zelden, 167 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 3: a former federal prosecutor. He's been there as a special 168 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 3: counsel as well. 169 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 6: Michael's great to see you. 170 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:20,520 Speaker 3: Thanks as always for the help, and have a great weekend. 171 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast kens 172 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 1: just live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apple car Play 173 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:28,000 Speaker 1: and then roud. 174 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 2: Oro with the Bloomberg Business app. 175 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 176 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 177 00:09:39,200 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 8: It's pretty remarkable stuff, Joe, to see the S and 178 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 8: P five hundred north of five thousand, a president of 179 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 8: the United States on like the previous administration, who doesn't 180 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 8: seem immediately to want a flex on it. And you know, 181 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:53,600 Speaker 8: Donald Trump just last week said that the stock market 182 00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 8: is a record because his polls against Biden are so 183 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,760 Speaker 8: good that investors are projecting that I will win and 184 00:09:58,880 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 8: drive the market up. 185 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 2: It's funny. 186 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 3: I checked no tweet at the Potus account, at least 187 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 3: not yet unless it was just now while you were 188 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 3: talking on S and P. 189 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:07,520 Speaker 6: Five thousand. 190 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 3: But it is interesting, don't I'm not going to open 191 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,160 Speaker 3: this whole can of worms right now. I'm not going 192 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 3: to bring up the Super Bowl predictor maybe I will later. 193 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:17,839 Speaker 6: But history does show us the. 194 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,960 Speaker 3: Stock market in the long term out performs under democratic administrations, 195 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,680 Speaker 3: which is why that whole conversation is really funny. I mean, 196 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 3: if you're looking at we're a data company, that's just refutable. 197 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:29,480 Speaker 3: Not to say that we wouldn't have rally time in 198 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 3: another Trump term. 199 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 8: Well, it's interesting to see a market performing like this 200 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 8: one is at the same time where voter sentiment clearly 201 00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 8: is still not great around the economy or around President 202 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:42,360 Speaker 8: Biden's approval of it. He continually gets low marks on 203 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 8: the economy issue, but he also continually pulls poorly on 204 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:47,559 Speaker 8: something he cannot change, which is the fact that he 205 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 8: is eighty one years old and has at least a 206 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:51,679 Speaker 8: perception problem when it comes to his mental acuity, and 207 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:53,480 Speaker 8: we've seen that on full display over the last twenty 208 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 8: four hours. 209 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:55,200 Speaker 4: Boy, that's for sure. 210 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 3: What a display last night, which is where we have 211 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 3: to bring in Josh Wingrow Bloomberg White House correspondent. It's 212 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:04,760 Speaker 3: great to cease or I can't imagine the feeling in 213 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 3: the West wing this morning after what was a very 214 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 3: emotionally charged experience this news conference. His anger apparently was 215 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 3: enough that he felt a need to stand in front 216 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:18,080 Speaker 3: of reporters. Do you have a sense of whether the 217 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 3: Press office of the Communications Office wanted to see that happen. 218 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 9: I think the people around Joe Biden that we've been 219 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 9: talking to think that it was always the case he's 220 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:30,440 Speaker 9: ticked about this report, not just the mention of his son, 221 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 9: which is always a third rail if you want to 222 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:36,120 Speaker 9: get bottom of skin, but more broadly just what they 223 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 9: view as political commentary and her going over his skis 224 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:44,200 Speaker 9: and not sort of sticking to calling balls and strikes, 225 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 9: And so they wanted to get Biden out there. Some 226 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:48,960 Speaker 9: people were talking today wish he had not turned around 227 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 9: and come back to the lectern. His last answer once 228 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:55,079 Speaker 9: he did, of course, was a long explanation of the 229 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 9: situation in Gaza, but of course included referring to the 230 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,320 Speaker 9: Egyptian president CC as the president of Mexico, and that, 231 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:04,320 Speaker 9: of course is combined with the report thrust all this 232 00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 9: in to the system here. Democrats, I'm trying to be 233 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 9: polite here, have an occasional propensity to panic in a 234 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 9: way that Republicans maybe don't. We're seeing some of that, 235 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 9: I think a bit right now. But I think it's 236 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 9: important to bear in mind there is no serious challenge 237 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 9: to Biden as the nominee. There's no public effort ouse 238 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:30,440 Speaker 9: to miss the nominee. The machinery to do so would 239 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,320 Speaker 9: be difficult, if not impossible at this stage. Kama Harris 240 00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:37,679 Speaker 9: is standing by him. Every top Democrat not named Dean 241 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 9: Phillips is standing by him. So for now, this is 242 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 9: a question that is circuly in the minds of voters 243 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 9: and quietly among Democrats, publicly among Republicans. But I think 244 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 9: we should be cautious not to overstate that there's any 245 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 9: kind of serious push at this stage to make Joe 246 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 9: Biden not the nominee. Every sign is he wants to 247 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 9: be the nominee. He wants to run again well. 248 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 8: And so it becomes a question of how best he 249 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:03,000 Speaker 8: can effectively campaign. Yeah, in seeking not just you know, 250 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 8: ultimately the confirmation of denomination, but a second term. And 251 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 8: it's worth keeping in mind here. I mean, Joe and 252 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 8: I are broadcasters. I've said things on air that I 253 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,439 Speaker 8: don't mean. I said murders and acquisitions on more occasions 254 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:17,559 Speaker 8: than one. Donald Trump confused NICKI Haley and Nancy Pelosi 255 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 8: just recently. Other people do this. This is not unusual 256 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 8: for someone to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. 257 00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 8: It just all adds up to an optics problem. Specifically 258 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 8: when it's optics like this around facts you can't change. 259 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 8: You're on camera saying these things, You're in writing in 260 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 8: a DOJ report, calling into question your ability to recall 261 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:40,319 Speaker 8: to your memory. And you're eighty one and you can 262 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:43,560 Speaker 8: do nothing about that number. What's the spin for the 263 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:44,680 Speaker 8: White House and the campaign? 264 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 9: Well, first of all, murders and acquisitions would be a 265 00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 9: great story. 266 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:49,960 Speaker 4: Let's do it. 267 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 9: There are two schools of thought here. One is that 268 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 9: Biden is going to kind of campaign a little bit 269 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,880 Speaker 9: around the press, which is not uncommon in today's area. 270 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:03,720 Speaker 9: He's going to sit down for more friendly conversations podcast 271 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,360 Speaker 9: like this and that as opposed to sitting down for 272 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 9: a lengthy interview with a newspaper with Bloomberg with a 273 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 9: network turning down the super Bowl, for instance. So that 274 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 9: is the strategy they've been running. The other school of thought, 275 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:18,680 Speaker 9: which kind of actually got a little bit more juice 276 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 9: in the last twenty four hours, paradoxically, is, for lack 277 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 9: of a better phrase, the let Joe be Joe camp 278 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 9: get him out there. You know, these people around him 279 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 9: who believe that he is totally in great shape, you know, 280 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:35,680 Speaker 9: who think he's so sharp, who say that in private meetings, 281 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:39,560 Speaker 9: his recall is remarkable, his grasp with these complex foreign 282 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 9: situations in particular is remarkable. That's what democratic aids and 283 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 9: allies of him tell you. And then the question is, 284 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 9: course is okay, So why don't you let him do 285 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 9: that more in public? And so I think that that 286 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 9: is the tension that they're going with right now. If 287 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 9: we're going to have gaffes, do you have them when 288 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 9: you're flooding the field with Joe Biden talking about stuff 289 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 9: that they want him to talk about, or do you clawback, 290 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 9: have you know, more microdosing of Biden? And therefore any 291 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:07,680 Speaker 9: one gaff Well, we'll stand out a little bit. 292 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 6: Is this the coolest guy in the room. 293 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 3: When does Josh Winbrook at his own show that could 294 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 3: listen to you all day long? Micro dosingros today introduced 295 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 3: micro Dosing Joe Biden. Yeah, Balance, thank you for coming 296 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 3: to see us, as you're wonderful. Bloomberg White House correspondent 297 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 3: Josh Wingrove the stylings of Wingrove here on Bloomberg TV 298 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 3: and Radio. I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Lines as we 299 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 3: put a finer point on this, Kaylee, as you mentioned, 300 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 3: we spoke with the Ukraine's ambassador to the US yesterday. 301 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:39,720 Speaker 3: We heard from her a little bit earlier in the program. 302 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 3: Daniel Freed is with US now, former Ambassador to poll In, 303 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:46,720 Speaker 3: former Assistant Secretary of State for Europe to get a 304 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,760 Speaker 3: better sense of the needs for Ukraine, but also the 305 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 3: timeline because it looks like this isn't going to happen 306 00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 3: very quickly. 307 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 6: And Ambassador, it's great to have you back with us. 308 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 3: Appreciate your time as you look at a potential slow 309 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 3: role here on Capitol Hill. How worried should Ukraine be 310 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 3: about being left alone abandoned by its Western allies. 311 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 10: Being abandoned by its Western allies is not going to happen. 312 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 10: The Europeans are standing with Ukraine. The question is whether 313 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 10: the United States will abandon Ukraine, which would be an 314 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 10: appalling defeat for American interests. Not since the years before 315 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:33,240 Speaker 10: World War Two? Will the US have failed to support 316 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 10: security and freedom in Europe as is apparently what some 317 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 10: in Congress want. But yesterday's vote was a piece of 318 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:50,360 Speaker 10: good news. That's sixty seven Senators in support of assistance 319 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 10: to Ukraine. That's something to work with. The faster it 320 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 10: goes through, the better off American interests will be. 321 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 8: We think about American interests. This was something that the 322 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,119 Speaker 8: Ukrainian Ambassador to the US spoke with Joe and I 323 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 8: about last night. She essentially tried to characterize Ukrainian interest 324 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 8: is very aligned with American interests, that basically all of 325 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:14,439 Speaker 8: this is about democracy. And just take a listen, if 326 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,400 Speaker 8: you will, ambassador to some of what she told us 327 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:17,959 Speaker 8: in this conversation. 328 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:20,840 Speaker 7: Here she is, we have to also show that we 329 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 7: can stay the course and again today even though the 330 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:27,560 Speaker 7: discussions were difficult, even though it's an election year. Of course, 331 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:31,119 Speaker 7: you know there are in every country, internal issue that 332 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:33,159 Speaker 7: needs to be addressed. But I was so happy to 333 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 7: see that. You know, it was a very strong bipartisan 334 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 7: support and not yet a final of course, just the 335 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:42,880 Speaker 7: first step in the right direction. 336 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 8: So referring their ambassador free to the step the Senate 337 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:51,320 Speaker 8: took yesterday, the procedural vote to move forward the supplemental 338 00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:55,399 Speaker 8: package that would include aid for Ukraine. But to go 339 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 8: back to the point you were making about how Western 340 00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 8: allies are not going to turn away from Ukraine because 341 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:02,400 Speaker 8: some of those Western allies are European countries which are 342 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,200 Speaker 8: very much still there to support. How much can Europe 343 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 8: do though, if the US decides, if the House of 344 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:13,200 Speaker 8: Representatives will decide, no, we're done, can Europe really pick 345 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:14,960 Speaker 8: up the slack of the United States. 346 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:23,439 Speaker 10: No, Europe doesn't have the weapons or the military industry 347 00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:26,359 Speaker 10: to make up the shortfall if the US drops out. 348 00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 10: Europe does have the money, and European leaders and European 349 00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:37,360 Speaker 10: parliamentarians have told me directly that they need to replenish 350 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 10: their stocks. They need to replenish their stocks and are 351 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:44,479 Speaker 10: willing to pay for it. So this is a question 352 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:50,159 Speaker 10: not of European resources or political will, but physical possibilities combined, 353 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:54,160 Speaker 10: the US and Europe together can help Ukraine fight off 354 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,719 Speaker 10: the Russians and maybe do much better this year than 355 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:00,760 Speaker 10: last year. But the US has to get in the game. 356 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:05,080 Speaker 10: This doesn't mean US soldiers on the ground. The US 357 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 10: play here is to use our resources, the old Arsenal 358 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:13,120 Speaker 10: and democracy to help the Ukrainians fight the good fight, 359 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 10: and they can succeed. They can succeed in holding off 360 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 10: the Russians and taking the fight to the Russians, especially 361 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 10: in areas of Ukraine that Russia occupies. But we have 362 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:25,800 Speaker 10: got to do our. 363 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 6: Part, Ambassador. 364 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 3: We spoke with Oksana Markarova about the dual needs for 365 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 3: manpower and weaponry, and she made it clear that the 366 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 3: ask for the US here this is about money for weapons, 367 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 3: specifically missiles, even more specifically interceptors. If we gave them 368 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 3: everything they wanted and needed in this case, though, where 369 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 3: do they find the soldiers to fight the war? 370 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 10: Embassador Makarov really is good and I think, but you 371 00:19:55,960 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 10: the excerpt of the interview you played shows that Ukrainians 372 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 10: are now debating whether they have to call up more 373 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 10: of their young men to fight. That's a decision they're 374 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 10: going to have to make, but calling up their young 375 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 10: men to fight doesn't do any good if they don't 376 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 10: have the weapons. The Ukrainians are beginning to make more 377 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:18,760 Speaker 10: of their own weapons, and they're doing so in collaboration 378 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:24,240 Speaker 10: with European countries, but they need the American weapons. We 379 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 10: can provide them. If we do, there is a reasonable 380 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:32,040 Speaker 10: chance that the Ukrainians could hold off the Russians on 381 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 10: the ground and take the fight to the Russians using 382 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:41,040 Speaker 10: longer range longer range rockets, and defend themselves in their 383 00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:45,959 Speaker 10: interior using anti aircraft systems. There is a reasonable theory 384 00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:50,000 Speaker 10: of relative Ukrainian success that's available. It's not a long shot, 385 00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 10: it's a realistic shot. But we have to get off 386 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:55,280 Speaker 10: the dime and do what's needed. And by the way, 387 00:20:55,800 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 10: this is not a case of the US supporting a 388 00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:01,439 Speaker 10: country that doesn't want to fight to save itself. This 389 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 10: is a case of the United States needing to support 390 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:07,679 Speaker 10: a country that wants to save itself, that is willing 391 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,959 Speaker 10: to fight, is not asking us to fight for it, 392 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 10: but is fighting in common cause with us and in 393 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:15,960 Speaker 10: the name of European security. 394 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 4: This is a good thing. 395 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:22,919 Speaker 8: Well, do that exact point, Ambassador about it being Ukrainian 396 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 8: soldiers fighting so that US soldiers don't have to. That's 397 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,520 Speaker 8: not necessarily the case. If Russia were to attack a 398 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 8: NATO country in Article five comes into question where the 399 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:36,719 Speaker 8: US may have to engage in that case. Denmark's Defense 400 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 8: minister is said, within the last twenty four hours he 401 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 8: thinks Russia could attack a NATO country within three to 402 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 8: five years. Does that timeline seem accurate to you? Does 403 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 8: the fate of Ukraine depend on what that timeline might 404 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 8: actually look like? 405 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:55,240 Speaker 10: Well, the fate of Europe depends on how well we 406 00:21:55,280 --> 00:22:00,640 Speaker 10: do in helping the Ukrainians fight our Russian aggression if 407 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 10: the Russians, if Putin thinks he can succeed, he might 408 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 10: well consider an attack on one of the US allies 409 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 10: in the Baltics to seize some territory and to help 410 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:22,240 Speaker 10: take down NATO. Putin is playing a very serious game. 411 00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 10: We can defeat it. This is not inevitable. But if 412 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 10: you listen to the Tucker Carlson interview with Putin, and 413 00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:34,760 Speaker 10: I've listened to it all, it is Putin in his 414 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:39,480 Speaker 10: triumphalst mood. He thinks he's winning, he thinks history is 415 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,960 Speaker 10: on his side, and it is clear, if you know 416 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:47,920 Speaker 10: how to read it, that he will not stop with Ukraine. 417 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:51,560 Speaker 10: This is something the Biden administration has pointed out and 418 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:56,119 Speaker 10: something many NATO countries have pointed out. Putin will not 419 00:22:56,280 --> 00:23:00,440 Speaker 10: necessarily stop with Ukraine if he thinks the US will 420 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,800 Speaker 10: not defend Europe, and if he thinks that NATO is 421 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,000 Speaker 10: paper tiger, all. 422 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:07,680 Speaker 8: Right, and we will leave it on that note. Thank 423 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 8: you so much for joining us today, Daniel Freed, the 424 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 8: former ambassador to Poland. We appreciate your time. This is 425 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 8: Bloomberg TV and Radio. 426 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:22,280 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 427 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,959 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon Eastern on Emocarplay. 428 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:27,480 Speaker 2: And thenroud outo with the Bloomberg Business app. 429 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch 430 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 431 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 3: I'm well meaning and I'm an elderly man, and i 432 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:40,639 Speaker 3: know what the hell I'm doing. That was Joe Biden 433 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,400 Speaker 3: who said that, not me last evening in an emotionally 434 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:47,560 Speaker 3: charged news conference, keying off the phrase Kaylee lines in 435 00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 3: the Special Council's own report describing him as a well 436 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,440 Speaker 3: meaning elderly man with a poor memory. 437 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:56,880 Speaker 6: He checked that last part. 438 00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 8: Yes, he did, and of course that wasn't the only 439 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 8: that referenced his memory in the Special Council's report. He 440 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,360 Speaker 8: talked about how his memory was worse in the interviews 441 00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 8: with the Special Council and his team than it was 442 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,919 Speaker 8: when he was speaking with his ghostwriter years before that, 443 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:12,440 Speaker 8: saying he couldn't recall important years in which he was 444 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 8: vice president when his son died. And we know that 445 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,400 Speaker 8: the death of Bo Biden is a very sensitive subject, 446 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:20,399 Speaker 8: of course to the President, and he took specific issue 447 00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 8: with that last night as well, and. 448 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:26,000 Speaker 3: So he emerged in a hastily scheduled news conference pretty 449 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 3: late for him as well. Some Democrats today, allies of 450 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 3: the president, think he should not have done it well. 451 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,959 Speaker 8: And there remains a question, and especially the answering at 452 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 8: the very end of questions around the Middle East in 453 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 8: which he mistakenly identified Egyptian President Altisi as the president 454 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:44,439 Speaker 8: of Mexico, another gaff that is really being clung to 455 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:48,960 Speaker 8: this morning, as these questions around his memory are just intensifying, 456 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 8: or the perception at least that there is an issue here. 457 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,840 Speaker 8: And on that note, let's assemble our political panel. Rick 458 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,480 Speaker 8: Davis is with us. He is Bloomberg Politics contributor and 459 00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:58,840 Speaker 8: of course partner at Stone Court Capital, and Lincoln Mitchell 460 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:00,679 Speaker 8: with us as well. He's a political analyst in the 461 00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 8: lecture at the School of International and Public Affairs at 462 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,960 Speaker 8: Columbia University. So Lincoln, just to begin with you. Obviously, 463 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:11,160 Speaker 8: these issues around the perception of Biden's age and mental 464 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:13,760 Speaker 8: acuity are not new to just the last twenty four 465 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 8: hours since this report came out. Three days ago, NBC 466 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 8: ran a poll that showed sixty two percent of people 467 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,080 Speaker 8: have major concerns about his age and acuity and ability 468 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:26,439 Speaker 8: to be president for a second term. There were more 469 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 8: than that who said they have at least major or 470 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 8: or moderate or minor concerns about that. This has been 471 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:35,120 Speaker 8: the reality for some time now, and the Democratic Party 472 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:37,960 Speaker 8: has only doubled down on Biden as their candidate. Are 473 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 8: we going to see that proven out to be a mistake. 474 00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 11: Well, one way to think about this election is one 475 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 11: party is running an old man who is in poor 476 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:50,400 Speaker 11: physical health and declining mental facilities, and then the Democrats 477 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 11: are nominating Joe Biden, Right, so both of these candidates 478 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,560 Speaker 11: are essentially too old. Both are I think Biden is 479 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 11: kind of a normal state of mental decline for men age. 480 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:02,640 Speaker 11: I'm not a doctor, I do have elderly relatives, etc. 481 00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 11: And Donald Trump is somebody who has facing much more 482 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:09,960 Speaker 11: profound psychological and mental challenges that seems obvious to me. 483 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 11: But I want to make another point here. There's no 484 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,119 Speaker 11: such thing as the Democratic Party. There's no such thing 485 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 11: as the Republican Party. There aren't twelve wise old men 486 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,000 Speaker 11: and women sitting in a blue room somewhere or a 487 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,160 Speaker 11: red room somewhere making these decisions Joe Biden is making. 488 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:28,639 Speaker 8: Then there's a DNC, and they are completely powerless in 489 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 8: both these situations to do something about it. 490 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,880 Speaker 11: Rona McDaniel or Jamie Harrison on the Democratic side can't 491 00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:35,919 Speaker 11: pound his fist on the table and say, Joe Biden, 492 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 11: you can't run. And I want to make another point here. 493 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 11: One of the reasons Joe Biden. We hear this a lot. 494 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,679 Speaker 11: Joe Biden has to run for reelection because Kamala Harris 495 00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:51,320 Speaker 11: is unpopular. The causality there is wrong. Kamala Harris is 496 00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,439 Speaker 11: unpopular because Joe Biden has to run for reelection. Let 497 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 11: me explain. Joe Biden made sure that Kamala Harris would 498 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,920 Speaker 11: Paris be unpopular, making it clear she was not part 499 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,920 Speaker 11: of his inner circle, giving her assignments that were essentially impossible, 500 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,360 Speaker 11: pushing her aside, because had she been as powerful as 501 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,399 Speaker 11: popular sorry when and now as she was at the 502 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 11: time of the election, they would be it would have 503 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:16,800 Speaker 11: been tremendous pressure. Here you go for him not to run. 504 00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:22,119 Speaker 11: There's no snari there never was where he gracefully steps aside. 505 00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:27,680 Speaker 11: Nobody spends forty years running for president to serve one term. Now, 506 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 11: the real problem is that in summer of twenty nineteen, 507 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,120 Speaker 11: when Biden announced he was in the race, the best 508 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,200 Speaker 11: case scenario is that we would be here today, because 509 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 11: the worst case scenario was that he would have gotten 510 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 11: the nomination and lost. So the Democratic leadership, Joe Biden, 511 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 11: we've gotten themselves into this position and there's no easy 512 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 11: way out, and there's certainly no easy way out now. 513 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:50,399 Speaker 11: The only way out is to make the contrast betwe 514 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,040 Speaker 11: with Donald Trump. If you want to place an opinion 515 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,360 Speaker 11: piece in an elite media outlet in the United States, 516 00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:57,760 Speaker 11: you have to write something like Trump. Joe Biden has 517 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,119 Speaker 11: to talk about his accomplishments and make the argument for 518 00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,480 Speaker 11: a second term. If you actually tell that to Joe 519 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,119 Speaker 11: Biden as a consultant, that's malpracticed. He has to remind 520 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 11: people of how dangerous, unhinged, avaricious, and authoritarian Donald Trump is. 521 00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 11: Otherwise Biden will lose. 522 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:18,040 Speaker 3: All right, Rick Davis, you're a specialist on political stagecraft. 523 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:20,119 Speaker 6: Should Joe Biden have come out last night? Or did 524 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:21,040 Speaker 6: he just make it worse? 525 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 2: Yeah? 526 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 6: I keep thinkings simple. 527 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:27,879 Speaker 12: Sure he could have come out last night, but he 528 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 12: shouldn't have come out mad. I mean, nobody wants to 529 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,679 Speaker 12: see an angry old man screening into the cameras. I 530 00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 12: mean so depressing. I mean, like, regardless of how emotionally 531 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:43,160 Speaker 12: he was about being mistreated by this special prosecutor, you know, 532 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,120 Speaker 12: the people around him need to have the ability to 533 00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 12: say absolutely not until you calm down, You're not going 534 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 12: in front of cameras for any reason. I mean, like 535 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,720 Speaker 12: he needs to be the happy warrior, not the angry guy. 536 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:58,040 Speaker 12: The angry guy's Donald Trump. Where's that contrast? I mean, 537 00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 12: I like the old man Biden when he was kidding 538 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 12: about his age and said that like, what was it? 539 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,239 Speaker 12: You know, he looked back on his career of two 540 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:06,880 Speaker 12: hundred and eighty years now. 541 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,720 Speaker 4: That's funny, Like we all want to see him. 542 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:14,120 Speaker 12: Say that, not like screaming at the breast because he's 543 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:16,680 Speaker 12: been mishandled by his own Justice Department. 544 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 6: I gotta tell you. 545 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 12: I mean, like, as a campaign manager, I think I 546 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,680 Speaker 12: would have been sticking nails in my eyes last night 547 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:24,560 Speaker 12: as he did this. And of course, what is his 548 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 12: greatest offense and he's been doing it his entire life. Oh, 549 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 12: I'll take one more question, and it's. 550 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:30,960 Speaker 2: Always a gap. 551 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:35,719 Speaker 3: I mean almost one hundred percent, it's always the last question. 552 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 8: Yeah, it's a pretty incredible pattern. Rick, to your point 553 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 8: though about sometimes he just kind of takes the reality 554 00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 8: and decides to go with it. Think about Bidenomics. It 555 00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 8: was initially tied to him in a negative way, and 556 00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,440 Speaker 8: they decided to take Bidenomics and try to spin it positive, 557 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 8: Dark Brandon. They literally sell merchandise with the aviators and 558 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 8: laser eyes. Now can you do that though with age 559 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 8: and mental acuity? When you're eighty one and no one 560 00:29:57,880 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 8: can do anything about the fact that you are eighty one? 561 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,040 Speaker 8: What is the way to spin this for this campaign? 562 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 2: Yeah? 563 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 12: Again, I mean, like, first of all, I do like 564 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 12: Dark Brandon. 565 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 6: So let me just. 566 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 12: Say that I don't consider that angry. 567 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 2: I consider that entertainment. 568 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 12: And again it's funny, right, I mean, like, why can't 569 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,280 Speaker 12: he be the happy warrior. Why can't he start every 570 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,080 Speaker 12: day thinking, Wow, this is the greatest day of my life. 571 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,880 Speaker 12: I'm President United States. I've worked my entire career to 572 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:23,239 Speaker 12: be in this job, as Lincoln said, and like I 573 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 12: live a dream job. This is like a positive thing 574 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 12: versus and the country is a great country for good 575 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,280 Speaker 12: versus the contrast with Donald Trump, which is I've been robbed, 576 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:38,440 Speaker 12: I've got grievances. The world is horrible. 577 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 6: Our country is awful. 578 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,560 Speaker 12: I mean, like, I don't know why that isn't just 579 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 12: obvious that in a place where seventy percent of the 580 00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 12: country doesn't like either one of them, if one's the 581 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 12: nice guy who's trying to do good for everyone and 582 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 12: the other is painting this dystopian you know, future, then 583 00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:55,640 Speaker 12: who do you. 584 00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 4: Think they're gonna pick? 585 00:30:56,520 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 6: It's not that hard to figure out, Lincoln. 586 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 3: When we look back now, a lot of people blame James, 587 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 3: call me me for Hillary Clinton losing the election. We've 588 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 3: got a much longer amount of time here between this 589 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,640 Speaker 3: report and when people vote. But if Joe Biden were 590 00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 3: to lose this election, will her be blamed? 591 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 11: Well, maybe some will blame him, but there's no reason 592 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:23,160 Speaker 11: to blame her if Biden loses this election. I mean 593 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 11: this is we are now in February. The election is 594 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 11: about nine months away. There will be some other events 595 00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:29,720 Speaker 11: in courts for those of you who haven't been paying 596 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,200 Speaker 11: attention between now and the election that will make this 597 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 11: seem much less important. If Joe Biden loses this election, 598 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 11: my sense is that the person the main person to 599 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 11: blame is Joe Biden. 600 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,960 Speaker 8: Okay, Well, you mentioned events in courts, and there has 601 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:45,320 Speaker 8: been at least some buzz about perhaps the reason Nikki 602 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:46,960 Speaker 8: Haley is still in the race is because we don't 603 00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 8: really know whether or not Trump could get convicted of 604 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 8: a crime between now and the election, or even now 605 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:54,120 Speaker 8: and the convention. What kind of lane of opportunity it 606 00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:57,040 Speaker 8: may open for someone else to be the Republican nominee Lincoln? 607 00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 8: In your mind, is it more likely that Trump would 608 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 8: end up the Republican nomine near that Biden won't end 609 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,000 Speaker 8: up the Democratic nominee come November. 610 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,640 Speaker 11: Well, we should note that, Nikki ha there's a saying 611 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 11: in politics you can't beat somebody with nobody. Nicki Haley 612 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 11: proved that wrong because she lost in Nevada primary two 613 00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:15,640 Speaker 11: to one to none of the stated candidates, which course 614 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:19,760 Speaker 11: was a Trump surrogate. What you're asking me, I'm a 615 00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 11: political scientist. I have a peaching political science, much to 616 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:24,360 Speaker 11: my mother's sugar, and I never went to medical school. 617 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:26,960 Speaker 11: But what you're asking me is a medical question, which 618 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,520 Speaker 11: is which of these candidates is most likely to have 619 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 11: a major health crisis between now and the convention. And 620 00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 11: I just don't know because because barring that they will 621 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:38,560 Speaker 11: be the nominee, each of them in their party, I 622 00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 11: want to make So I don't know, man, I guess 623 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:42,160 Speaker 11: if I had to say, i'd say I don't know. 624 00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 11: I guess there's a one and one hundred chance that 625 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 11: Biden steps down and a one on one hundred and 626 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 11: one chance that Trump doesn't win the primary. One more point, 627 00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:53,080 Speaker 11: if Trump is not the nominee, Nikki Haley will not 628 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:56,120 Speaker 11: be the nominee because in each state that happens, we 629 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,920 Speaker 11: are seeing slates of Trump electors, and the more of 630 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:02,920 Speaker 11: those states that go those delegates not electors. Delegates will 631 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:05,640 Speaker 11: then go to the convention and if Trump says whatever 632 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,080 Speaker 11: reason doesn't run, they're gonna pick a MAGA candidate, not 633 00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,280 Speaker 11: Nicki Haley. So you'll be looking at Don Junior, Tucker Carlson, 634 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,520 Speaker 11: some other may be less unconventional thinking Nicky Haley. I mean, 635 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 11: so I should confess you. We talked a lot about 636 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:20,600 Speaker 11: the Super Bowl. I've been a forty nine Er fan 637 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 11: since the mid nineteen seventies because I grew up in 638 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:27,880 Speaker 11: San Francisco. There is a chance that Kyl Shanahan calls 639 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 11: me and said, listen, Brock Curt, he's got a sore arm. 640 00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:31,720 Speaker 11: Can you get to Vegas in time to play a quarterback? 641 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 11: I'm not planning my life around that, and I think 642 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 11: Nicky Haley's presidential chances are about the same. 643 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 3: Wow, look what you just started. 644 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:41,520 Speaker 8: I didn't mean to. 645 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 6: Rick and Lincoln. 646 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:44,480 Speaker 2: What a great panel. 647 00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 6: Many thanks to both of you. 648 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 3: Rick Davis, Lincoln Mitchell with us here the panel on 649 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:50,360 Speaker 3: Balance of Power on a Friday. 650 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,040 Speaker 6: It all comes back to the Super Bowl to day, 651 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:52,760 Speaker 6: doesn't it. 652 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:54,240 Speaker 8: Everybody's got it on the brain. 653 00:33:54,320 --> 00:34:00,240 Speaker 1: I understand that you're listening to the Bloomberg bellin some 654 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:03,640 Speaker 1: power podcast Kens Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on 655 00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: Applecarplay and then roud Oro with a Bloomberg Business app. 656 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 657 00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:14,360 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just Say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 658 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 3: With a Super Bowl deadline for Senators who are stuck 659 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 3: here in Washington to finish their work, as if there 660 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,360 Speaker 3: was some accountability for what happens here in elected office. 661 00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:30,239 Speaker 3: I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Lines on Bloomberg TV and 662 00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:31,719 Speaker 3: Radio the Friday. 663 00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 6: Edition of Balance of Power. 664 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 3: This brings us back Kayley to the funding bill for Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan. 665 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,280 Speaker 3: Whether they can get this cloture vote done before kickoff 666 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:40,840 Speaker 3: on Sunday night remains the question. 667 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 8: They do well with a deadline, We know that, and 668 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:46,840 Speaker 8: I'm sure for football fans especially, they're really going to 669 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,360 Speaker 8: feel that deadline. Seriously. It's just a question of this 670 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,600 Speaker 8: is the United States Senate we're talking about. In order 671 00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:55,879 Speaker 8: to move things quickly, you need unanimous consent. And Ran 672 00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:57,839 Speaker 8: Paul at least doesn't seem like he wants to move 673 00:34:57,880 --> 00:34:59,560 Speaker 8: anything quickly. And I wonder if a forty nine Ers 674 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 8: chiefs man changes his mind when he's from Kentucky. 675 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:03,600 Speaker 6: That's a great question. 676 00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 3: I don't know, but Chuck Schumer says they won't leave 677 00:35:07,120 --> 00:35:09,520 Speaker 3: until this is done. There's a two week recess looming 678 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:09,879 Speaker 3: as well. 679 00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:11,399 Speaker 1: Apparently very true to be taking. 680 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 3: But we'll see if they get their football game in 681 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 3: because there will be politics had at the Super. 682 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 2: Bowl as well. 683 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:19,440 Speaker 8: Yeah, Las Vegas is not just going to be a 684 00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 8: place where people are putting money down to bet on 685 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:22,719 Speaker 8: the Chiefs or the forty nine ers. They also could 686 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 8: be putting money down to bet on candidates they'd like 687 00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 8: to see when. Kate Acley, he reports for Bloomberg Government, 688 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:30,239 Speaker 8: has a great story out on this. You can get 689 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:32,839 Speaker 8: it on the Bloomberg terminal and online as well. Kate, 690 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,640 Speaker 8: just how many political fundraisers are going to be happening 691 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:37,720 Speaker 8: in Las Vegas ahead of the Super Bowl. 692 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:41,800 Speaker 13: Well, I don't know if I have a full exact number, 693 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:43,880 Speaker 13: and we know that some of the Senators may be 694 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 13: having to cancel or reschedule theirs, but though very true 695 00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:50,880 Speaker 13: on the books, Yeah, there are several on the books. 696 00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:56,759 Speaker 13: We know about a few of them for sure. Congressman 697 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 13: Steve Horsford, who's from Nevada, of course, is taking this 698 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:05,560 Speaker 13: opportunity and has basically an entire weekend of events set 699 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,719 Speaker 13: up to benefit his leadership pack. And then he is 700 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 13: the chair of the Congressional Black Caucus, and the Congressional 701 00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 13: Black Caucus Pack also has several events happening over this weekend. 702 00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:23,400 Speaker 13: And then of course Californian Eric Swallwell, he's got people. 703 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 13: He invited you know, you have to root for the 704 00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 13: forty nine ers if you want to go to his fundraiser, 705 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:30,480 Speaker 13: because he said, you know, that's that's there, that's who 706 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:31,160 Speaker 13: they're rooting for. 707 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:33,720 Speaker 8: To show up and saving money. 708 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:38,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, this is just what a day after Donald Trump 709 00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 3: won the Nevada Caucus, not to be confused with the 710 00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:44,880 Speaker 3: primary that Nikki Haley did not win. He's got his 711 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:47,760 Speaker 3: own hotel there right off the strip. Kate, your surprise 712 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,799 Speaker 3: is not doing a big fundraiser showing up. 713 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:50,240 Speaker 6: At the game. 714 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 13: Well, I guess we'll have to see. I mean, maybe 715 00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:55,840 Speaker 13: he can get something on the books. 716 00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:56,640 Speaker 8: Right now. 717 00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,840 Speaker 13: I know one of the fundraisers is happening at Caesar's Palace, 718 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 13: so a different a different venue. But the the other 719 00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:07,000 Speaker 13: group that's out there that's real active this whole week 720 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:12,160 Speaker 13: has been the American Gaming Association, which obviously represents casinos 721 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,160 Speaker 13: and the sports betting industry, and you know, sports betting 722 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 13: has become you know, legal and huge, and many, many 723 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 13: millions of Americans are expected to put money down on 724 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 13: this game, and so the the sort of gambling industry 725 00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 13: is also out there doing events and trying to bring 726 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:35,040 Speaker 13: attention to what, you know, what that industry has become. 727 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:38,640 Speaker 8: Well, speaking of betting, I guess you could place a 728 00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 8: couple bets on what's going to happen in the Senate 729 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:42,560 Speaker 8: this weekend as well. You could bet the spread how 730 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,880 Speaker 8: many votes will actually ultimately pass a supplemental or not. 731 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,160 Speaker 8: You could you could bet whether or not it's actually 732 00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,399 Speaker 8: just going to pass. Keep it a similar way, where 733 00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:52,359 Speaker 8: do I place those bets you have that? I don't 734 00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,520 Speaker 8: know if it's like DraftKings or FANDUL or Washington Board. 735 00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:58,359 Speaker 8: But Kate, if you had to place a bet on 736 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:00,760 Speaker 8: whether or not a supplemental package can past the Senate 737 00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,680 Speaker 8: in the next two days before the Super Bowl, what 738 00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 8: are the odds on the spot? 739 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:11,200 Speaker 13: Well, I am not a betting person, fair enough, I 740 00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 13: think I have a conflict of interest. 741 00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:16,120 Speaker 8: Fair enough, she. 742 00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 6: Knows better than that, Kate. It's great to see you. 743 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:21,279 Speaker 3: Whatever your plans are for the game, I hope you 744 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 3: have fun. I think the event at Caesar's Palace, yeah, 745 00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:26,120 Speaker 3: is the wonder that's the CBC event that's going to 746 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:30,120 Speaker 3: be the party. Based on the looks of the invitation here, 747 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,000 Speaker 3: Caesar did not actually live there. 748 00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:37,360 Speaker 8: Okay, thank you for clarifying that little bit of information. 749 00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:39,200 Speaker 8: But when we talk about the Super Bowl, well this 750 00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:41,239 Speaker 8: is Bloomberg. We talk a lot about money. We talked 751 00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:43,280 Speaker 8: a lot about how expensive it is to run ads 752 00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:45,720 Speaker 8: like a thirty second ad something like seven million dollars. 753 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:47,560 Speaker 8: I want to talk about something else with Carol and 754 00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:50,160 Speaker 8: Tim though, and this relates to money rock party. Starting 755 00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 8: quarterback of the forty nine ers, I love made eight 756 00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:58,239 Speaker 8: and seventy thousand dollars this season. Patrick Mahomes made forty 757 00:38:58,280 --> 00:38:59,760 Speaker 8: four and a half million dollars. 758 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:00,880 Speaker 14: I love that you love it. 759 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:02,759 Speaker 8: It's crazy. As much as you do and know it, 760 00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:04,200 Speaker 8: it just like warms my heart. 761 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,080 Speaker 14: And I really thought what you were going to talk about, 762 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,760 Speaker 14: because you were talking about betting on politics and others, 763 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,960 Speaker 14: how many Tailor Swift related bets there are out there, 764 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:12,560 Speaker 14: Because there are a lot. 765 00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:16,960 Speaker 8: I knew you would bring that up there beginning nineteen 766 00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:17,600 Speaker 8: eighty nine? 767 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:19,760 Speaker 4: Is that how many? 768 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know. 769 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:22,399 Speaker 6: I'm just I'm just a fan. 770 00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:24,319 Speaker 14: I didn't know I worked with the swifty over here. 771 00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 6: Who isn't a swiftye Carol. 772 00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:27,680 Speaker 14: It's like, how many times you're going to see her 773 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:32,200 Speaker 14: during the game during the mv VP speech, Does she 774 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:32,520 Speaker 14: get it? 775 00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:33,120 Speaker 2: Shout out? 776 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:34,719 Speaker 14: Assuming Travis Kelsey. 777 00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 3: Gets it and they win, right, I feel like this 778 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:38,960 Speaker 3: is putting the car before the horse, Carol. 779 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:40,960 Speaker 6: We don't know who's gonna win forward. 780 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,160 Speaker 8: We don't even know if Taylor is gonna make it. 781 00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:45,400 Speaker 8: She's going to make it. 782 00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:48,280 Speaker 6: I'm confident she'll make it. I'll put money on that. 783 00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,960 Speaker 3: That's the first bet though, right if you're playing odds, 784 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 3: the first the money is on whether she's going to 785 00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:54,200 Speaker 3: actually make it to the game. 786 00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,239 Speaker 6: Now, imagine what the entrance is going to be like. 787 00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:59,000 Speaker 6: This is going to be a huge motivator. 788 00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:01,440 Speaker 3: Then the next bet will be whether he it's a 789 00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:02,800 Speaker 3: part of makes the first touchdown. 790 00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:05,000 Speaker 8: First bet is whether Taylor Swift shows up. Then it's 791 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:08,400 Speaker 8: the number of times that she's shown. Then Travis Kelcey, 792 00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:10,080 Speaker 8: whether or not he shouts her out. You know, you 793 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:10,400 Speaker 8: could do. 794 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:12,719 Speaker 14: So we're talking about the super Bowl, guys, as you 795 00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:14,000 Speaker 14: can guess, in a little bit of tailor. So if 796 00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:15,800 Speaker 14: we're also going to talk about the great CPI revision, 797 00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 14: I'm going to bring it back to that Bloomberg audience. 798 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:18,879 Speaker 6: You know, I got to go there to our core. 799 00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:20,160 Speaker 8: Leave it to Carol. 800 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:22,200 Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm guessing prices will not be down. 801 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:22,759 Speaker 1: At the super Bowl. 802 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:23,719 Speaker 2: Wait, who do you guys. 803 00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:24,040 Speaker 4: Want to win? 804 00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 2: I want Cay. 805 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:26,319 Speaker 6: Who do you want to win? 806 00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:27,000 Speaker 2: Gosh? 807 00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,440 Speaker 8: Oh no, I mean I would say the Chiefs, but 808 00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,800 Speaker 8: I feel like that's the obvious answer because every millennial 809 00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:34,920 Speaker 8: is going to want the Chiefs to win. 810 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:38,760 Speaker 3: All I can say is I'm done with the halftime stuff. 811 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,480 Speaker 3: I want a brass band on the field. 812 00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:47,400 Speaker 6: That's what's important to me this week. Thanks for listening 813 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:49,120 Speaker 6: to the Balance of Power podcast. 814 00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:52,840 Speaker 3: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 815 00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:55,520 Speaker 3: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 816 00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:58,880 Speaker 3: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern 817 00:40:59,120 --> 00:40:59,800 Speaker 3: at Bloomberg. 818 00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:00,600 Speaker 2: Car