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Speaker 1: Let's talk about censorship just really quickly. We have such

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Speaker 1: a huge show for you. Ben Winingarden's going to join

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Speaker 1: us here in a couple minutes. But censorship control is

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Speaker 1: really what it is. Censorship isn't really the right word

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Speaker 1: to use. Its control controlling what you are allowed to see, hear,

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Speaker 1: what you are allowed to say. And just understand why

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Speaker 1: the communist loves it now and why the communist has

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Speaker 1: always loved it. He is selling misery. He understands that

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Speaker 1: he cannot possibly exist without lies, without putting on a mask,

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Speaker 1: without hiding what he wants to do to you in

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Speaker 1: your country.

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Speaker 2: So he must control everything.

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Speaker 1: A big shout out to Hillary Clinton for once again

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Speaker 1: putting something on tape that proves my point perfectly.

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Speaker 3: There's no way to sugarcoat it, there's no way to

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Speaker 3: explain it away. Autocracy is on the march, and we

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Speaker 3: now have a government in the United States that has

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Speaker 3: thrown in its slot with the autocrats, which has made

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Speaker 3: a choice to support those who wage war not peace,

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Speaker 3: who has given enormous power to the men who control

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Speaker 3: the information flow in our world, who have all pledged

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Speaker 3: allegiance to the continuation of algorithms that not only addict us,

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Speaker 3: but poison us with hatred and fear.

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Speaker 1: You know what she's saying, This free speech stuff is

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Speaker 1: dangerous to all the control we used to have. They

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Speaker 1: believe in control because what they're selling is horrific and

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Speaker 1: they know it. That's why abortion becomes women's reproductive rights.

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Speaker 1: That's why you could go down the list of every

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Speaker 1: single issue and you will find out they have somehow

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Speaker 1: come up with some language that lies about what it

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Speaker 1: really is. And don't think this is just something that

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Speaker 1: exists over in Europe or China or North Korea. It's

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Speaker 1: right here in the good old US of A. We've

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Speaker 1: been living in it for years now. During COVID we

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Speaker 1: saw it turned into overdrive, and so many of these

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Speaker 1: people Trump or No Trump are still in their positions

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Speaker 1: of power. We're going to talk about the censorship industrial complex.

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Speaker 1: We're going to talk about control. Ben Winingarden has so

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Speaker 1: many thoughts on this, and he joins us next.

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Speaker 4: I believe the dismissing people, dismissing their concerns, or worse yet,

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Speaker 4: shutting down media, shutting down elections, or shutting people out

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Speaker 4: of the political process protects nothing. In fact, it is

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Speaker 4: the most surefire way to destroy democracy and speaking up

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Speaker 4: and expressing opinions isn't election interference, even when people express

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Speaker 4: views outside your own country, and even when those people

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Speaker 4: are very influential, and trust me, I say this with

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Speaker 4: all humor. If American democracy can survive ten years of

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Speaker 4: Thunberg scolding, you guys can survive a few months of

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Speaker 4: Elon Musk. But what German democracy, What no democracy, American,

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Speaker 4: German or European will survive, is telling millions of voters

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Speaker 4: that their thoughts and concerns, their aspirations they're pleased for relief,

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Speaker 4: are invalid or unworthy of even being.

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Speaker 2: I love that.

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Speaker 1: I love that America is starting to lead when it

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Speaker 1: comes to freedom again, and it saddens me a great

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Speaker 1: deal what's happening in Europe and what happened in this country.

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Speaker 1: Let's not just point fingers across the pond under the

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Speaker 1: Biden administration, joining me now to discuss the censorship, the

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Speaker 1: communists love of it, and so many other things. It's

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Speaker 1: been wide garden editor at large of real clear investigations.

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Speaker 1: Ben communists are selling something evil and horrible. They always

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Speaker 1: have been, and so they've always believed in controlling what

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Speaker 1: people can see and hear. It's just that simple, because

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Speaker 1: you can't sell a demonic religion of destruction if you're

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Speaker 1: being honest about it.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely right, and to your point, that's why the communists

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Speaker 5: generally go after religions first, because as an anti religion,

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Speaker 5: they don't want to have to compete against a religion

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Speaker 5: that actually puts in place a system where man isn't

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Speaker 5: God and.

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Speaker 6: Lording over slaves.

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Speaker 5: But people are actually endowed with inalienable rights. They can

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Speaker 5: think for themselves, they can pursue their interests, their passions,

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Speaker 5: their ambitions as they see fit, and they can be sovereign.

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Speaker 5: They can be kings in their own home. And to

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Speaker 5: your point, at core, the censorship, what I would call

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Speaker 5: the censorship industrial complex that has lorded over Americans speech

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Speaker 5: and really global speech for the last decade or so.

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Speaker 5: At the end, to your point, is all about power

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Speaker 5: and control. If you can control the narrative, you can

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Speaker 5: control populations, you can control and maintain a political monopoly

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Speaker 5: and therefore monopolize power. Pure and simple, that's what censorship

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Speaker 5: is about. And they will drum up all kinds of

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Speaker 5: other justifications for it. We don't want dangerous speech, so

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Speaker 5: called to proliferate, because that can lead people to go

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Speaker 5: down bad pads, and it can threaten national security, it

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Speaker 5: can threaten public health, etc. But these are all pretexts

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Speaker 5: that in reality are used to silence dissenters from regime orthodoxy,

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Speaker 5: whoever that regime is and whatever their orthodoxy is.

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Speaker 6: And Vice President of.

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Speaker 5: Vance there, even though it may have fallen on deaf

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Speaker 5: years and I love that you have the Europeans not

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Speaker 5: laughing at the joke about Gretit Tunberg. But he's raising

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Speaker 5: a very serious and basic and fundamental point, which is

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Speaker 5: that governments are responsible to their people, and if not,

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Speaker 5: they're basically acting as masters and we are the slaves

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Speaker 5: as opposed to them actually governing with our consent and

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Speaker 5: being responsive to our concerns. And if you're going to

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Speaker 5: silence the other half of a country, if you're going

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Speaker 5: to not permit dissent, you're not being responsive to your people,

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Speaker 5: and you're not a government, you're a tyranny. And thank god,

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Speaker 5: what a change in administry from one that not only

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Speaker 5: supported a censorship industrial complex here but supported its growth

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Speaker 5: abroad as well, and now we have an administration that

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Speaker 5: defends that liberty, that natural right at home and is

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Speaker 5: also going to defend our liberty as abroad as well.

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Speaker 5: And we're going to work together with allies and partners

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Speaker 5: who actually share those values and principles as opposed to

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Speaker 5: privileging those who talk about democracy while they impose policies

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Speaker 5: that are anything but including when it comes to speech.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's funny brought up about the safety thing. I remember,

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Speaker 1: like it was yesterday, Jensaki and all of them talking

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Speaker 1: about how they had to go to Facebook.

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Speaker 2: Well here she was about COVID.

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Speaker 7: In terms of actions Alex that we have taken, or

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Speaker 7: we're working to take, I should say, from the federal government,

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Speaker 7: We've increased disinformation research and tracking within the Surgeon General's Office.

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Speaker 7: We're flagging problematic posts for Facebook that spread disinformation.

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Speaker 2: It blew me away. I remember watching things like that.

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Speaker 8: Ben.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure I have the same effect on me that

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Speaker 1: it did on you, and my jaw would just drop.

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Speaker 2: It's not just that they.

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Speaker 1: Were doing it, they were bragging that they were doing

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Speaker 1: And of course, it's always for your safety, always, always, always.

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Speaker 2: Stalin said the exact same stuff. Mau said. The stands up.

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Speaker 1: It's always for your safety, of course, but here in

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Speaker 1: the United States of America, the land.

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Speaker 2: Of the Free.

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Speaker 1: They felt totally comfortable standing up in front of the

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Speaker 1: American people and let them know that the White House

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Speaker 1: was flagging problematic posts.

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Speaker 2: I'm fluorid at what's happened to this country.

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Speaker 5: A tyranny for your own good, of course, And you're right,

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Speaker 5: they say it, and it's like so matter of fact

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Speaker 5: the approach. Oh yeah, we're going to surveil social media

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Speaker 5: en mass for ideas and opinions and even facts that

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Speaker 5: we don't like, and then we're going to tell the

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Speaker 5: big tech companies that we have the power to destroy

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Speaker 5: with regulations and even by a statement from a president

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Speaker 5: who says, by the way, you're killing people by what

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Speaker 5: you allow to traffic on your platform, and we're going

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Speaker 5: to tell them you better take down this speech. We

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Speaker 5: don't like, but it's for it's all for public health,

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Speaker 5: and fully in accordance with public health authorities. Of course,

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Speaker 5: didn't abuse those authorities and run rough shot over our

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Speaker 5: rights and invent out of thin air things like six

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Speaker 5: feet social distancing and made us wear three masks that

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Speaker 5: didn't do a thing, and on and on, of course,

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Speaker 5: But even if that weren't the justification for it. The

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Speaker 5: fact that they could build that apparatus is the thing

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Speaker 5: that's really terrifying.

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Speaker 6: And I dove pretty deep in.

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Speaker 5: Investigative reporting and testified a couple of times before Congress

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Speaker 5: on what they actually did. But it is staggering what

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Speaker 5: that administration built in the way of a censorship apparatus,

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Speaker 5: and through that pretext of first public health and pandemic

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Speaker 5: emergency measures, and then expanding it way beyond that, and

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Speaker 5: really starting with the pretext of the Russians are interfer

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Speaker 5: in our system and so there's a real problem on

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Speaker 5: social media and we need to clamp down on foreign

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Speaker 5: information operations and interference. Then we're going to take those

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Speaker 5: powers and graph them onto Americans because actually, it doesn't

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Speaker 5: really matter where the wrong think is coming from. What

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Speaker 5: matters is the content of the wrong thing. So we're

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Speaker 5: not going to care that much about attribution. And basically,

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Speaker 5: you had a number of agencies within the federal government,

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Speaker 5: including a subagency in Department of All Land Security that

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Speaker 5: no one ever heard of, SISA, the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure

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Speaker 5: Security Agency, and they created essentially an outsourced censorship regime.

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Speaker 5: Everyone has heard by this point about the Disinformation Governance

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Speaker 5: Board that the Biden administration had to scrap because people

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Speaker 5: called it out for the Orwellian tyrannical engine that it

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Speaker 5: would have been. But already a DGB, a Disinformation Governance

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Speaker 5: Board really existed, but they outsourced it to try and

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Speaker 5: flout law and the Constitution, and of course the First Amendment.

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Speaker 5: You had SISA working with third party quote unquote NGOs, researchers,

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Speaker 5: academic institutions, and they created a non governmental so called

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Speaker 5: vehicle at least in name, that would look to social

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Speaker 5: media en mass all of our tweets, all of our

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Speaker 5: Facebook posts, four narratives that threatened election infrastructure. That is,

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Speaker 5: if you had questions about the integrity of mass mail

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Speaker 5: in balloting, of all the other pandemic era quote unquote

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Speaker 5: emergency measures that were imposed to eviscerate and erod the

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Speaker 5: integrity of the twenty twenty elections, they said that poses

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Speaker 5: a threat to our critical election infrastructure.

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Speaker 6: So your tweets basically.

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Speaker 5: Questioning mail in balloting and those ballot boxes all over

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Speaker 5: the country, those were like potential mini terror attacks. And

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Speaker 5: SISA worked with third parties to lobby the social media

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Speaker 5: companies to change their content moderation policies so called really

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Speaker 5: their censorship strategies to make sure that anything challenging election

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Speaker 5: integrity from their perspective would be potentially flagged and categorized

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Speaker 5: as wrongthink and liable to be censored, violating their terms

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Speaker 5: of service. And these outsourced entities, and I'm thinking primarily

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Speaker 5: of the Election Integrity partnership here when about flagging tweets,

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Speaker 5: Facebook posts, and other content, violating the very social media

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Speaker 5: content moderation policies they lobby the social media companies to create,

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Speaker 5: and God Americans censored some of that content was flagged

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Speaker 5: by the government. And of course this vehicle was created

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Speaker 5: by the government to avoid the First Amendment issues by

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Speaker 5: creating another entity to do it. And you had multiple

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Speaker 5: federal courts agree this was censorship by proxy. This was

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Speaker 5: maybe the greatest attack on the First Amendment in American

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Speaker 5: history at the scale of social media, and sadly and

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Speaker 5: in some ways this brings us to today where we

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Speaker 5: see this kind of crisis playing out in other realms.

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Speaker 5: The Supreme Court refused to rule on the merits of

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Speaker 5: that case. They said the plaintiffs lacked standing, and they

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Speaker 5: kicked it back to the Lower courts, So we didn't

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Speaker 5: get the Supreme Court to step in and say what

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Speaker 5: happened here was censorship by proxy. You had government pushing

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Speaker 5: all these social media companies to censor. It created vehicles

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Speaker 5: on the outside to push them to censor. Things that

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Speaker 5: the government wanted flagged got censored. They abridged our speech,

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Speaker 5: They tried to abridge our speech. There was a conspiracy

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Speaker 5: to do it by proxy from these third parties. If

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Speaker 5: not directly by what the government was saying in direct

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Speaker 5: emails and phone conversations and publicly to the social media companies,

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Speaker 5: Supreme Court would not step in and do its duty

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Speaker 5: to rule on the merit and.

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Speaker 6: To curtail and prohibit that behavior.

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Speaker 5: So now it's incumbent on a president and a Congress

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Speaker 5: to do it. The executive branch has started that work.

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Speaker 5: It started it within hours of the president's inauguration with

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Speaker 5: an executive order, and now it's time for Congress to

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Speaker 5: do its job. Beyond the oversight it did, which was

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Speaker 5: important over the last four years to expose the size,

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Speaker 5: scope and nature of this complex of government agencies and

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Speaker 5: NGOs and academic entities, and beyond that worked to silence

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Speaker 5: us directly and by proxy.

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Speaker 1: Ben these people obviously they're a bunch of nutballs, and

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Speaker 1: I don't like to We don't man worship here anybody

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Speaker 1: on the show but Elon Musk purchasing Twitter, which of

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Speaker 1: course he renamed X, which is kind of weird, but anyway,

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Speaker 1: he renamed it X. It sounds small if you're not

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Speaker 1: somebody aware of how powerful social media has become. But

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Speaker 1: he really is the mortal enemy of all these evil monsters.

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Speaker 1: Is the fact that he took one of the biggest

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Speaker 1: companies and freed it up.

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Speaker 2: For lack of a better way to put it, they.

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Speaker 1: Had everything, and the fact that he took one thing

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Speaker 1: it really hurt them, didn't it.

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Speaker 6: It really hurt them.

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Speaker 5: And it also has now caused the other social media

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Speaker 5: companies to, at least in their rhetoric, if not in

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Speaker 5: their policies, have to change and go back towards something

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Speaker 5: more closely resembling free speech, even though they're still by

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Speaker 5: no means there for no other reason than the competitive

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Speaker 5: pressure that X brought to it. But I think to

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Speaker 5: your point, we ought to have thought of social media

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Speaker 5: companies pre the second Trump administration as essentially controlled assets

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Speaker 5: of the national security and intelligence apparatus. We would have

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Speaker 5: liked to think of them as this is the digital

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Speaker 5: public square, this is the printing press, this is newspapers,

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Speaker 5: This is the public square in twenty first century America.

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Speaker 5: But in reality, while they may have started out that way, governments,

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Speaker 5: including our own, realized that if you could harness this power.

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Speaker 5: First of all, these are tools of mass surveillance and intelligence,

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Speaker 5: because you can develop a massive profile on people if

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Speaker 5: you know what they're saying and who they're communicating with,

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Speaker 5: at what times and where, and what the impact is.

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Speaker 5: But also that you can manipulate public opinion if you

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Speaker 5: can control what is allowed to be propagated on the

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Speaker 5: social media platforms and what isn't seen, what's banned, and

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Speaker 5: what shadow band what doesn't get the circulation that it

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Speaker 5: otherwise would. So in the hands of good and benevolent people,

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Speaker 5: these platforms can be great tools, and in the hands

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Speaker 5: of those who want to exploit them, sometimes maybe in

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Speaker 5: pursuit of beneficial things, but other times eviscerating our rights

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Speaker 5: here at home. You can see the danger in it,

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Speaker 5: and he took essentially what I would argue is a

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Speaker 5: national security or intelligence asset out of the hands of

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Speaker 5: those services, because it was the national security and intelligence

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Speaker 5: apparatus that was pressuring and colluding with the likes of

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Speaker 5: X and the executives at the other companies to ensure

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Speaker 5: that the narrative they wanted was out there, and things

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Speaker 5: they didn't want, like the Hunter Biden laptop story, weren't

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Speaker 5: out there. And he took it, and he put up

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Speaker 5: forty plus billion dollars to say I'm going to free

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Speaker 5: the bird.

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Speaker 6: As he put it, that was.

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Speaker 5: A courageous move in terms of the principle of let's

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Speaker 5: defend free speech. It's courageous because he might have lit

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Speaker 5: billions of dollars on fire. And maybe it was most

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Speaker 5: courageous of all because, as a consequence of it, all

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Speaker 5: of these other governments that wanted to have control over

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Speaker 5: the social media companies now feared that there was an

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Speaker 5: asset that was not in their hands. He disarmed them,

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Speaker 5: he took it out of their hands.

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Speaker 6: And of course there was a massive.

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Speaker 5: Onslaught against Musk as a consequence of it, and that

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Speaker 5: onslaught continues, and it only intensified, of course, when he

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Speaker 5: backed Trump. But you had the Biden administration any number

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Speaker 5: of agencies investigating him after you had the European governments

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Speaker 5: who hate his guts, they have their own regulatory regime

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Speaker 5: that threatens to impose crippling, crippling finds on the likes

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Speaker 5: of X and other social media companies if they don't

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Speaker 5: censor content the way that those European governments want. And

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Speaker 5: of course most of the European nations have nothing remotely

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Speaker 5: resembling the First Amendment.

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Speaker 6: That governs their regulatory regime.

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Speaker 5: So this was a courageous move, a costly move in

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Speaker 5: defense of free speech, and thank god he did it.

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Speaker 5: It's still not a perfect social media platform by any means,

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Speaker 5: but when we look back in history, and really if

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Speaker 5: you look at the ability to have anything resembling a republic,

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Speaker 5: of course, it depends first on the ability to be

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Speaker 5: able to debate, to share information, ideas, to argue and

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Speaker 5: made the best argument win.

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Speaker 6: And you can make the case.

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Speaker 5: That if he didn't buy X, and if he didn't

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Speaker 5: take all these swings and arrows, and by the way,

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Speaker 5: if he weren't so important to the US government as well,

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Speaker 5: because of all the technologies he develops that have sort

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Speaker 5: of made him a protect man in some way. Is

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Speaker 5: despite all the swings and arrows against him. This could

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Speaker 5: be the difference between freedom and tyranny in this country

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Speaker 5: when we look back on it over the long run.

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Speaker 1: Then something I was thinking about, actually, I was thinking

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Speaker 1: about it this morning. I was thinking about COVID and

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Speaker 1: all the evil, horrible lockdown crap all the demons in

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Speaker 1: this country did. And then I thought about where all

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Speaker 1: those people are now, and this could expand way beyond COVID.

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Speaker 1: We're obviously talking about censorship here. All the evil things

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Speaker 1: that were done to the American people over the last

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Speaker 1: four or five, six years, ten years, pick your number,

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter. The people who did it are not in prison.

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Speaker 1: Most of them are not resigning, retired, fired in disgrace,

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Speaker 1: had to change their name and move into the rocky

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Speaker 1: mountains somewhere.

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Speaker 2: These people were.

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Speaker 1: Still among us, and many of them still have a

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Speaker 1: bunch of power and the desire to do what they

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Speaker 1: did again.

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Speaker 2: How do we stop that?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And to your point, they even took preemptive steps

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Speaker 5: like Partning the likes of Anthony Fauci and others to

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Speaker 5: try and protect themselves. What we have right now is

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Speaker 5: the beginnings of it, which is, first of all, you

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Speaker 5: have all of these people who were targeted by the

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Speaker 5: censorship apparatus, by the public Health establishment and others, and

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Speaker 5: they have actually assumed the very seats with the very

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Speaker 5: authorities that were used to try and destroy them before.

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Speaker 5: So I'm thinking of of course RFK Junior, of course

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Speaker 5: Donald Trump himself, J. Bodicharia, and Nih and others.

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Speaker 6: Well.

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Speaker 5: Bodicharia, by the way, was one of the plaintiffs in

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Speaker 5: that case that went to the Supreme Court I mentioned before,

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Speaker 5: and one of the leaders of the Great Barrington Declaration

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Speaker 5: which called for essentially liberty in response to the COVID response.

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Speaker 5: But he was one of the plaintiffs in that case

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Speaker 5: Missouri v.

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Speaker 6: Biden.

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Speaker 5: So you have people who were targeted by the regime

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Speaker 5: and by the system who are now in places of power.

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Speaker 5: That's a start. There's some level of justice in that.

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Speaker 5: The Trump administration goes further in the way of policy.

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Speaker 5: And a big part of how these people have accrued

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Speaker 5: their powers is first of all, obviously when they're in government,

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Speaker 5: but second of all on the outside, when they're in

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Speaker 5: this gulag archipelago of NGOs.

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Speaker 6: And think tanks, etc. And academic institutions.

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Speaker 5: And the Trump administration put forth that first day executive order,

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Speaker 5: which essentially says no federal personnel can engage in this

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Speaker 5: sort of censorship directly or by proxy behavior, and also

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Speaker 5: no federal resources can go towards it, and that of

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Speaker 5: course means money and money.

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Speaker 6: Government money is part.

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Speaker 5: Of the lifeblood of all of these outside organizations, imperative

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Speaker 5: to them. It helped birth this whole burgeoning censorship ecosystem

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Speaker 5: on the outside. So depriving it of government employees, depriving

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Speaker 5: it of government policies, and depriving it of federal government

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Speaker 5: money is hugely significant and shouldn't be understated, as is

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Speaker 5: the oversight work, because no one wants to be named

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Speaker 5: and shammed and exposed. And if you could put a

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Speaker 5: face and a resume and a record with the kind

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Speaker 5: of tyrannical activity that we saw, no one wants that.

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Speaker 5: So all of those things matter. The executive action and

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Speaker 5: the oversight work matters. The next thing has to be

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Speaker 5: codifying this in the law, and there's evidence that this

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Speaker 5: Congress is going to try to do it.

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Speaker 6: Let's see what happens.

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Speaker 5: You know, it's obviously we've been burned before expecting there

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Speaker 5: to be a robust legislative action and there's some who

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Speaker 5: would you would think be on our side who aren't.

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Speaker 6: On this issue, you.

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Speaker 5: Have to have legislative action to codify it so that

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Speaker 5: you can turn the president's executive action into law that's

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Speaker 5: on the books and that can outlast any one president.

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Speaker 5: Now I would step back and say it's absurd on

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Speaker 5: its face that you need laws to codify what the

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Speaker 5: First Amendment already says. But these people have so perverted

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Speaker 5: our system and have such a warped perspective on what

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Speaker 5: their powers ought to be, and they think they know

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Speaker 5: best for the American people.

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Speaker 6: And so consequently, I think you need laws, and.

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Speaker 5: Not only laws that codify what the administration is doing.

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Speaker 5: And the administration is also, by the way, going to

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Speaker 5: go back and do a review of everything the Biden

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Speaker 5: administration did, and maybe there will be some law enforcement

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Speaker 5: action at the end of all that. But beyond that,

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Speaker 5: I think there needs to be real teeth to the laws,

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Speaker 5: and that means you have to have criminal penalties. It

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Speaker 5: can't just be you get fired, maybe you lose your pension,

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Speaker 5: if you engage in this sort of conduct conduct, there

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Speaker 5: have to be criminal penalties, and then the law has

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Speaker 5: to be enforced because if not, there is no to

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Speaker 5: turn action. And to your point, few have paid any

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Speaker 5: real price except maybe being out of power. And so far,

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Speaker 5: maybe their budgets have been cut, their prestige has been lost,

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Speaker 5: they've been exposed publicly, and half the country may find

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Speaker 5: them to be contemptible. Until and unless there is real teeth,

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Speaker 5: there's going to be nothing to deter that sort of action.

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Speaker 5: And basically you're gonna have tyrants in waiting ready to

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Speaker 5: spring when there's a new administration, in new Congress, et cetera.

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Speaker 5: So it has to be done by law, executive action,

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Speaker 5: and then ultimately you got to change.

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Speaker 6: The culture, and that's the really hard part.

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Speaker 5: You have to have a country that produces people who

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Speaker 5: don't view the world the way these people view the

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Speaker 5: world and think they're smarter than everyone else, they're morally

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Speaker 5: superior to everyone else, and so they not only have

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Speaker 5: a right, but an obligation to lord over us. And

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Speaker 5: that's a generational project, and that's a project that we

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Speaker 5: all have to engage in our own lives, starting with

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Speaker 5: our families, our friends, and in our communities.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the long term I totally agree, that's the

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Speaker 1: ultimate solution, and I'm glad you brought up people going

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Speaker 1: to prison, because everyone just thinks I'm an unhinged barbarian

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Speaker 1: when I say we can't save the gover we can't

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Speaker 1: save the country without government people going to prison. And yes,

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Speaker 1: I hate the government and I can't stand these people,

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Speaker 1: but that's not.

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Speaker 2: Why I say it.

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Speaker 1: Unless government people go to prison, they're just gonna do

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Speaker 1: all the same stuff against they know they can. There's

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Speaker 1: no consequences. Kevin Klinsmith getting twelve months probation for using

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Speaker 1: his job at the FBI to lie on a freaking

440
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,680
Speaker 1: warrant application. He should be buried under the federal jail somewhere.

441
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 1: A guy should never breathe free year again. But these

442
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: people were never held to account.

443
00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:27,159
Speaker 5: And to your point, who was the presiding judge in

444
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 5: the clin Smith case.

445
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 6: I believe it was Judge James Boseburg.

446
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:32,360
Speaker 2: It was.

447
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,360
Speaker 1: It was same freaking guy, Ben my brother, Thank you,

448
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 1: come back soon.

449
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:41,760
Speaker 2: I appreciate you. All right, We're not done, We'll be back.

450
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,919
Speaker 1: It's amazing how long censorship has been around. You know,

451
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,360
Speaker 1: it didn't start with Joe Biden by any stretch the imagination.

452
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:08,080
Speaker 1: It didn't even start with communism, tyrants, evil people who

453
00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:11,199
Speaker 1: can't sell their ideas to the masses simply try to

454
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: control them.

455
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 2: That's what they do.

456
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 1: Evil people abound in evil people who want to do

457
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: evil things will always try to control what you can

458
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,880
Speaker 1: see here and say, joining me now to talk about

459
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:27,080
Speaker 1: this and many things, my friend Jeffrey Tucker, founder and

460
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:31,919
Speaker 1: president of the wonderful Brownstone Institute, Jeffrey. Censorship may have

461
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: been pushed into overdrive in this country under President Joe Biden,

462
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 1: if we're still pretending he was president.

463
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 2: But it didn't begin with him.

464
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: Communists in particular have loved it forever they need it.

465
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 9: We don't know how long we've lived in a censored world.

466
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:50,640
Speaker 9: I suspect it's been for most of our lives. Actually,

467
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:53,399
Speaker 9: it's true that we didn't have the technology in the

468
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 9: past to know everything in real time and to get

469
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 9: a diverse range of views.

470
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:00,360
Speaker 8: I mean, I grew up in a world with.

471
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 9: Three television stations that all had the same thing, and

472
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:07,119
Speaker 9: nobody really had much hunger for news beyond that. On

473
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 9: the other hand, we kind of trusted the system. We

474
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:14,480
Speaker 9: figured that everything worked just fine, and nobody really questioned it.

475
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:19,360
Speaker 9: But now then that with technology came along to make

476
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 9: everybody a reporter. You have citizen journalism, as Elon says,

477
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 9: and it's like the ruling class just panicked and said, Okay, no,

478
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 9: we're going to make the Internet work exactly the way

479
00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 9: television worked in the nineteen seventies. And the Biden administration

480
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 9: even put out a document to that effect called Declaration

481
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 9: on the Future of the Internet, in which they imagined

482
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:47,119
Speaker 9: a world of stakeholders working with governments.

483
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 8: So that's what they were going to do.

484
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,359
Speaker 9: And then they would have gotten away with it too,

485
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 9: But for Elon Musk and the purchase of Twitter and

486
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 9: turning it into x has just blown up in the

487
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,360
Speaker 9: entire world and done much more besides. So now we're

488
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 9: facing this kind of astonishing information flood on an increasing level,

489
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 9: and we can't even believe what we're what we're seeing.

490
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:21,160
Speaker 9: It's every day is kind of mind blowing. And adolescence

491
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 9: is always the same that we've been lied to, we've

492
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:27,360
Speaker 9: been robbed, we've been pillaged, and that there's an overclass

493
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:30,920
Speaker 9: out there that has long lived at our expense. So

494
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 9: that seems like, you know, the upshot of what we're learning,

495
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,879
Speaker 9: and every day and every minute has just been an

496
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 9: unfolding of that truth.

497
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 1: Jeffrey, this may sound off topic. Maybe it is off topic,

498
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: but hearing you describe it in that way, you know

499
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 1: what you know what bugs me is I love history.

500
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 1: I'm a history freak. I geek out on ancient history.

501
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 1: But you to World War two, you name it. I'm

502
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: just I'm a history geek. I guess that's part of

503
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: getting old and gray. I just love history, and the

504
00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:05,440
Speaker 1: older the history gets, the fewer and fewer sources you

505
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: get for any one story. You know, world War two,

506
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:10,480
Speaker 1: you're gonna have a bunch of sources, But the Battle

507
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 1: of Troy you have one?

508
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 2: It did it even happen?

509
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 8: Right?

510
00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:17,000
Speaker 1: How much of the history that I know and love

511
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 1: that maybe you know and love that people watching know

512
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,440
Speaker 1: and love. How much of the history of the world

513
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,040
Speaker 1: is just a flat out lie.

514
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 9: You know, it's amazing that you say that, you put

515
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 9: it that way, and that you say it that way.

516
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 9: That is exactly what I've been thinking. And we have

517
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 9: to rethink kind of everything you know, from the follow

518
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 9: from through through everything. And I can't get enough of

519
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 9: this now. And probably you're in the situation I am

520
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 9: where I'm just in a constant state of incredulity, you know.

521
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:51,640
Speaker 9: You know, oh that's what you say happened, What really happened?

522
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 8: You know.

523
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 9: And from from the Brownstond point of view, we're mainly

524
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 9: dedicated to figuring out the history of the last five years.

525
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 9: And it is not easy, I can tell you. It's

526
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 9: just it's kind of a NonStop investigative effort, and it's

527
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 9: it's truly overwhelming, and it would have been impossible without

528
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 9: all these new tools that we have. But even with them,

529
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,240
Speaker 9: we're still trying to piece it together, to say nothing

530
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 9: of you know, the Cold War, you know, the the

531
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 9: Latin American wars of the nineteen eighties, Vietnam, you know, Korea.

532
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 9: You just go back in time, and who knows what

533
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 9: it is.

534
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 8: We don't know.

535
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:44,719
Speaker 9: And then we had this document dump for the CIA,

536
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 9: because there's in Washington. If you've hung around Washington enough,

537
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 9: you figure this out that there's two information streams. I mean,

538
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 9: one is what the public knows and the other is

539
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 9: the classified information stream. And there's a firm barrier between

540
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,480
Speaker 9: those two things. And and Trump was advocating for the

541
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:07,560
Speaker 9: release of the JFK files and uh and and he

542
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 9: pushed for it last time, he pushed for it. This

543
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 9: time he put out an executive order demanding it, and

544
00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 9: it still wasn't coming. It still wasn't company. So finally

545
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:17,719
Speaker 9: he went to the JFK Performing Arts into the Kennedy

546
00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 9: Performing Arts Center and announced that they would becoming sending

547
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 9: the entirety of the Washington establishment into overdrive panic. And

548
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 9: they jumped all these documents withholding some but and they

549
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 9: weren't even entirely sure, according to New York Times anyway,

550
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 9: New York Times is panicked about this. They were not

551
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 9: even sure entirely what it is that they dumped. And

552
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 9: we're getting our first look at it now. And of

553
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 9: course it turns out the CIA, you know, the operations

554
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 9: the CIA are are are revealed within this, within this,

555
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 9: within these documents, confirming confirming your worst fears, you know.

556
00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 9: And but that's the way we're getting the information. So

557
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 9: I guess to some extent, I feel like there's no

558
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 9: chance we're ever gonna put this genie back in the bottle.

559
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 9: And I'm quite frankly glad about that.

560
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: How does the normal person, how do they how do

561
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 1: they navigate this new world? Because you brought up Elon

562
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 1: Musk and X and social media and Trump, the JFK

563
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: files and right.

564
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 2: So, okay, now we went from having.

565
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,400
Speaker 1: A few very tightly controlled sources by evil people to

566
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: now and it's endless now at this point in time,

567
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: if you want to drink water, you have to drink

568
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: from a fire hydrant that's just been opened up. And

569
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 1: anyone with any experience and that knows that can be

570
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: extremely dangerous and has it is to your health. So

571
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 1: if I'm a normal person and I wake up in

572
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: the morning and I pick up my phone, how do

573
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: I even.

574
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 2: Start to walk through this world? What do I do?

575
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 8: Yeah, I don't know.

576
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 9: It's a completely different world with a kind of a

577
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 9: constant dopamine rush, which, as you say, is not actually

578
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:03,680
Speaker 9: very helpful about this, you know, it's not helpful for

579
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 9: us spiritually and mentally and otherwise. But we've got decades

580
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 9: of disinformation to unravel, and those are just the times

581
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 9: we live in. We're going to find out worse and

582
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:22,280
Speaker 9: worse things every day. I've been quite frankly shocked beyond

583
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 9: anything that I ever expected about the revelations from DOGE,

584
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,800
Speaker 9: and I don't think that people have fully processed the

585
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 9: implications of what they've said over and what they've discovered

586
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 9: over the last couple of months, and I mean, like

587
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 9: even a conservative estimate is that ten percent of the

588
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 9: US budget is essentially unaccounted for. I mean, that's that's

589
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 9: an unbelievable figure. I mean, we were talking about since

590
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,720
Speaker 9: since the end of World War two, something like what

591
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:03,719
Speaker 9: a twenty trillion dollars has come and gone that's not

592
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 9: been accounted for and that But what do you do

593
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:07,640
Speaker 9: with that kind of information?

594
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 8: How do you run that down? I don't know.

595
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 9: And then you've got the other problem that the Trump

596
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,879
Speaker 9: administration and the people within the Trump administration that one

597
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 9: transparency that want to get the information out are facing,

598
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:26,760
Speaker 9: you know, attacks from every angle, unrelenting, like every single

599
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:33,120
Speaker 9: minute of every day is and not to mention threats

600
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:36,719
Speaker 9: on the threats on their lives, right and now Elon's

601
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 9: faced with having you know, Tesla Dealership's burning and Tesla's

602
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 9: burning on the street and people selling the.

603
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 8: Stock and everything. It's it's what a time to be alive, astounding.

604
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: Speaking of the last five years in Brownstone and the

605
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: work you've been doing. I can I'll never be able

606
00:34:57,200 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: to let it go. Every Maybe that's the Irish in me.

607
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 1: Maybe it's it's just a Kelly thing, but I'm never

608
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,120
Speaker 1: going to let it go. What I watched happen to

609
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:07,040
Speaker 1: this country when we got a new virus from China.

610
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,320
Speaker 1: Honestly the other day I brought it up online, and

611
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 1: I've talked about this on the show before. The fact

612
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: that every single institution in the United States of America,

613
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 1: from the medical institutions to the freaking Central Intelligence Agency,

614
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 1: demanded that everybody say it didn't come from a lab

615
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 1: when it came from a lab. And again, it's not

616
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: the lie. That's amazing. Why Why is it every institution

617
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:37,080
Speaker 1: in the country decided to together join forces and lockshields

618
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:39,680
Speaker 1: against the truth. And that's just one of a million

619
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,759
Speaker 1: ways they tried to censor out all the honesty, all

620
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 1: the true things during COVID.

621
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:48,280
Speaker 9: And the silliness, right, I mean the six feet of distance,

622
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 9: you know, that censorship, the claims that the vaccine was

623
00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,920
Speaker 9: the magic cure when it clearly was not, and anybody

624
00:35:55,920 --> 00:36:00,759
Speaker 9: could have known that even without reading the EA, extended

625
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 9: closures that ruined kids' lives, the destructions of small business,

626
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:12,400
Speaker 9: and the silence on the part of elite sectors. You know,

627
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 9: in in academia and in media and so on. It's

628
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 9: it's incredible. It's an event that discredits an entire generation

629
00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 9: of legacy institutions, from think tanks to universities, to professors

630
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 9: to media outlets. And they're terrified for people to talk

631
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 9: about it. Really, and and yet we have to talk

632
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:40,399
Speaker 9: about it, and we should not get over it. We

633
00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 9: need a truth on what happened over the last five years,

634
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,879
Speaker 9: why all this stuff happened, you know, who was behind it,

635
00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:50,760
Speaker 9: why they engaged in it. Just some some truth and honesty.

636
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 9: I think we're going to get there, but it's going

637
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 9: to take new institutions like brown Sion and and and

638
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 9: you too to make it happen, because the legacy just doesn't.

639
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 9: They want it all, you know gone. The New York

640
00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 9: Times has only recently started saying basically, mistakes were made.

641
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 9: You know, now shut up. That's essentially it. But there's

642
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 9: a lot more to it. There's a lot more going on.

643
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:21,280
Speaker 9: And and forget justice. We just need truth.

644
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, talk to me about Murphy versus Missouri.

645
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 8: Yeah, the censorship issue. So here's the problem. It's not

646
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:32,960
Speaker 8: a problem.

647
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 9: Trump has put in a an executive order that forbids

648
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:42,320
Speaker 9: the federal agencies from from from from being involved, and

649
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:45,799
Speaker 9: it was a very good executive order in any kind

650
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:51,600
Speaker 9: of third party censorship efforts, and that presumably makes that

651
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:55,719
Speaker 9: litigation kind of puts it on the back burner. Uh

652
00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 9: And and meanwhile, you know that the litigators had worked

653
00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,320
Speaker 9: for years on Discovery to get little bits and pieces

654
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 9: actually got about ten thousand pages. But then Zuckerberg comes

655
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,400
Speaker 9: out and just confesses the whole thing. Right, they're just

656
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,920
Speaker 9: being perfectly honesty how they censored at the behase of governments.

657
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,520
Speaker 9: The problem with the executive order is that it's not

658
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 9: it's not in law yet and and that litigation is

659
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 9: going to be ongoing, but I doubt that we're going

660
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 9: to get anything from the Supreme Court out of it.

661
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 9: What we really need is some strict legislation from the

662
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 9: Center and that would that would help. At the same

663
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 9: time the censorship goes on. You know, this is this

664
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 9: is part of the problem with all of these platforms,

665
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 9: from from LinkedIn to to Facebook to YouTube have deep

666
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 9: algorithmic structures that were trained to censor, so they no

667
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 9: longer needed the pressure from the federal government to do it.

668
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:01,879
Speaker 9: And just to give you an example, when Elon took

669
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 9: over Twitter. Twitter, they tried to rip out all the

670
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:10,160
Speaker 9: gots of the censorship. But even now there's certain links

671
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:13,400
Speaker 9: and certain things that you find that uh, you know,

672
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 9: will trigger X to say, oh, you can't post that,

673
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:22,400
Speaker 9: but the note goes to the legacy url Twitter dot com,

674
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,759
Speaker 9: not to X, so you can tell that this is

675
00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 9: just legacy code still in there. So they've been working

676
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:31,279
Speaker 9: for a year to get rid of all the machinery

677
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 9: of censorship within the algorithms and have been unable to

678
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 9: do a complete job. And that process at YouTube and

679
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:46,840
Speaker 9: then Google and LinkedIn so on hasn't even begun. So

680
00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:49,799
Speaker 9: in a fact, we don't we don't have sort of

681
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 9: intensifying censorship, but we have the legacy censorship is still

682
00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:58,319
Speaker 9: you know, a continuing reality at all those platforms. Then

683
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,439
Speaker 9: you have the problem of the mainstream media, which has

684
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 9: a deep culture of political bias and aspirational professionals who

685
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 9: know better than to say anything that would expose expose

686
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:20,399
Speaker 9: the racket. So those institutions are kind of done. I mean,

687
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 9: what's interesting to me. You have Jeff Bezos over at

688
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,400
Speaker 9: the Washington Post made a big announcement We're not going

689
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,120
Speaker 9: to be biased anymore. We're going to have the op

690
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 9: ed page is going to be filled with it's going

691
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 9: to have content that's in favor of, for example, freedom.

692
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 9: Well you know that caused resignations all around. Well, we

693
00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 9: can't do that. That's a terrible idea. And that announcement

694
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 9: I think was made maybe a month or six six

695
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,360
Speaker 9: weeks ago. Nothing has changed on the op ed page.

696
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:49,959
Speaker 9: So what do you do. I think at some point

697
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 9: you just can't fire everybody.

698
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 8: I don't know.

699
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 1: All right, Finally, this all this brings me actually to

700
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,719
Speaker 1: the thing that that to be honest, it frightens me

701
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:03,200
Speaker 1: a little bit. And part of it is just because

702
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 1: I don't understand it. I'm not a technological person. AI

703
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,319
Speaker 1: artificial intelligence. I know what it is. I mean, I

704
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 1: know at least the basics of it. I certainly could

705
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,719
Speaker 1: not explain the code or anything like that behind it,

706
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 1: but I get it.

707
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:15,120
Speaker 2: What it is.

708
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,400
Speaker 1: But I'm very, very concerned about the worst people in

709
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:21,879
Speaker 1: the world coming up with the new technology that's going

710
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: to only favor them. I just it's something that concerns

711
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:25,880
Speaker 1: me greatly.

712
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:30,319
Speaker 9: When AI was first came out, and you probably remember this,

713
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,759
Speaker 9: it was chat GPT just kind of Go dropped on

714
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:34,799
Speaker 9: the world and I said, oh, this is wonderful. And

715
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:38,200
Speaker 9: then Google got its own AI and oh this is wonderful.

716
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 9: Except people quickly discovered it was wildly biased. You remember

717
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:46,160
Speaker 9: that you tried to get you know, these chat GPT

718
00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 9: or one of the other AI engines to draw a

719
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 9: picture of Founding Fathers and it looked, you know, didn't

720
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 9: look anything like the Founding Fathers, so to speak, and

721
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:58,759
Speaker 9: the questions were skewed, and it seemed like we were

722
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 9: living in an Orwellian world. Well, Grock came along, which

723
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:06,760
Speaker 9: is you know, once again Elon Musk and and became

724
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 9: an uncensored, unbiased, trainable, non woke AI engine, and so

725
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,000
Speaker 9: everybody else just immediately shaped up right, So it was

726
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 9: only that competitive pressure.

727
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 8: Uh, you know that that fixed that.

728
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:25,200
Speaker 9: So it's like we keep dodging these bullets one by one,

729
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 9: but ultimately the censorship will be baked into AI, and

730
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:35,840
Speaker 9: it probably already is at Google and Facebook and elsewhere.

731
00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 9: And at that point, the machines run us and it

732
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 9: doesn't require any kind of decision making by on the

733
00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:45,880
Speaker 9: part of any actual human person. So you know, AI

734
00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:47,720
Speaker 9: is going to lead to a world where we're fed,

735
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:51,319
Speaker 9: you know, NonStop propaganda, and like I say that, the

736
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,840
Speaker 9: only thing that separates us from that is you know, Grock,

737
00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 9: one guy in one platform. So it's it's tremendously scary

738
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:01,760
Speaker 9: just how close we came.

739
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:07,560
Speaker 1: No doubt, Jeffrey as always, Thank you, sir. I appreciate

740
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 1: you very much. I don't even understand AI, but I

741
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 1: understand it enough that it makes me nervous.

742
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,200
Speaker 2: Anyway, We're not.

743
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:34,040
Speaker 1: Done yet, we'll be back. I believe you should be

744
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,319
Speaker 1: able to say what you want to say. I think

745
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 1: if you have ideas that are different than mine, that

746
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 1: you should be able to voice those ideas just as

747
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 1: loudly as I do. I don't need or have any

748
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: desire to control you. That's because I'm not a filthy communist.

749
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:53,040
Speaker 1: Remember when the communists tell you who they are, believe them,

750
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:57,560
Speaker 1: and they always, always, always will sell their censorship desires

751
00:43:57,600 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 1: as keeping you safe.

752
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 2: Don't ever listen. All right, all right, we'll do it

753
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:03,799
Speaker 2: again