1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: Content warning. This podcast discusses violence, murder, suicide, civil unrest, 2 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:11,320 Speaker 1: aggressive policing, racism, and lynching. If you or anyone you 3 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 1: know is considering suicide, her self harm, or just need 4 00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: to talk about problems, please call the National Suicide Prevention 5 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 1: Lifeline to seven three or text the crisis text line 6 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:36,159 Speaker 1: at seven one. Previously un after the uprising, she seems 7 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 1: to be under the impression that you might know the 8 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:46,160 Speaker 1: pass code to Danye's phone. I have might be here 9 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:47,680 Speaker 1: when I was running out Why to say, you know, 10 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: we were trying to find out you know what, what 11 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 1: do you have to do to get the sheet back? 12 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: And he was like sheet, what what are you talking about? 13 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: But what was your sense or memory of like what 14 00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: they seemed to be there for some bullshit? She wants 15 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: that sheet I don't know about specifically the part in 16 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:05,320 Speaker 1: the tree um In terms of it not you would 17 00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 1: have to ask whoever untied off the tree branch. No, 18 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:12,040 Speaker 1: my investigator didn't do it. When there's an legal mechanism 19 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 1: that someone uses, that is rather overwhelming for someone to say, well, 20 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 1: that sheet didn't come from my house. That's not going 21 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 1: to dissuade me from the fact that that's a suicide. 22 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 1: I believe that our report will be concluded in the 23 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,679 Speaker 1: near future. Why is that still open. It's been seven 24 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 1: and a half month. Our detectives are very big. What 25 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:44,479 Speaker 1: you're looking at is the aftermath of the grand jury 26 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: deciding not to indict Officer Wilson. A young man found 27 00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:59,880 Speaker 1: hanging from a tree in October. His mom believes so 28 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:05,440 Speaker 1: One murdered her son targeting him. Don Ye became an 29 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:07,960 Speaker 1: activist in the wake of the shooting death of Michael 30 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: Brown by a white police officer, and that's why Melissa 31 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 1: mckinnis wants St. Louis County police to dig deeper to 32 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:22,080 Speaker 1: her son's death. He was not suicidal. This is after 33 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 1: the uprising, the death of Donye Dion Jones. Does it 34 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 1: have a four digit or a six digit? She gave 35 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 1: a different one six, So she said try three, six, five, eight, seven, 36 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: and then the last number either five or four to close. 37 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: It was August of nineteen. The Mike Brown Jr. Memorial 38 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 1: had just wrapped up down the street, and we sat 39 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,440 Speaker 1: down with Melissa outside of a coffee shop in Ferguson. 40 00:02:56,280 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 1: In episode six, Deja gave us several pass codes to 41 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 1: try on his two cell phones, his older iPhone and 42 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:06,560 Speaker 1: his newer Android. It's a try again, so this time 43 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: try four as the last ditch of three, six, five, 44 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:19,079 Speaker 1: eight seven, four and trying some time. Okay, what did 45 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 1: you say? Well here so three six, five, eight, seven, 46 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: eight seven and did you do five or four last 47 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:31,079 Speaker 1: time to try for this? Oh? It's differ open yet 48 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:36,120 Speaker 1: to try. It was tense trying a code, it not 49 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: working the phone, making us wait a minute or so 50 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 1: before we could try again, and in the end none 51 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: of the codes Desia had given us worked. Melissa had 52 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: never been hopeful. I'm sorry that didn't work. Yeah, if 53 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: we if we were to find someone who, for money 54 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 1: could try to crack one of those, do you know 55 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 1: which one he used more often? Was the one found 56 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: out there? Okay? Would you be willing to let someone try? 57 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: Melissa said it was the Android she found with Donya 58 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 1: when he died, and we would now be tasked with 59 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:16,839 Speaker 1: finding a hacker who could crack it. Before leaving the cafe, 60 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 1: we asked Melissa about the Mike Brown memorial she had 61 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 1: just taken part in, and what it was like to 62 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 1: see so many of her activist friends again. Was this 63 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: the first time you'd seen a lot of the activists 64 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:34,800 Speaker 1: you'd worked with for a while. Yeah, what did this idiot? 65 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 1: Mainly just of me kept saying that, you know, they're 66 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: proud of me, they're here, they love me. They wanted 67 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:55,799 Speaker 1: me to speak. You did want to. I just didn't 68 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 1: you feel comfortable to while me and Ow, I'm angry 69 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: and I was kind of scared if I was gonna 70 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: reacted towards certain Yeah, but everybody was pretty supportive for 71 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 1: the most ba to my face, I feel supported. I 72 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:21,479 Speaker 1: just it's hard for me to move forward. It's hard 73 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: to even raise my fist, it's hard to eaven. I 74 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 1: don't feel like I'm really part of that after this 75 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: community the way that I was before, you know, because 76 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:41,920 Speaker 1: I signed it scared. So my fight is different, you know. 77 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 1: So I'm not there yet to like fight like they're fighting. 78 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 1: And I don't think I'll ever fight like them. I 79 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:54,719 Speaker 1: think that my fight is different now. It took some 80 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:57,440 Speaker 1: time and some research, but we were able to find 81 00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:00,479 Speaker 1: a company in Texas that can hack into certain models 82 00:06:00,480 --> 00:06:04,040 Speaker 1: of Android phones. This is a deceased person's phone. Correct. 83 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 1: I wish I had a clearer answer for you. A 84 00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: lot of these phones that have a qual Com chip 85 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 1: set usually give me an option to bypass the pass 86 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: code and our software, but I never have luck with them. 87 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: It might just be one of those things gotta try 88 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 1: once again, though I'm not too too hopeful on it. 89 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 1: You know, every kind of phone is different as far 90 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:31,039 Speaker 1: as what it produces. You'll get the text messages in 91 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 1: the and hopefully we'b history and all that stuff. Location 92 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:38,039 Speaker 1: data could be a little weird with phones. Location data 93 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: was high on our list of things we wanted from 94 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: the phone, but remember the phone had no cell service 95 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 1: at the time Donye died. He only used it where 96 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: he could log into WiFi, so Google Maps location data 97 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,440 Speaker 1: would only show up when his phone was logged into 98 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 1: a WiFi network. But still this would be something, and 99 00:06:57,240 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: more importantly, we hoped to be able to find some 100 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: text message from whoever it was. Donie left to see 101 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 1: the night he died, So Melissa gave us the Android 102 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 1: phone and we shipped it off to Texas. I called 103 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:15,720 Speaker 1: my getting the sheet and she said no. She said, 104 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 1: we're going to destroy the sheets, and I said, why 105 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: are you going to destroy the sheets? That's part of 106 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: the evidence. We're gonna have a private investigation. She said, well, 107 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 1: that's our policy. We have to destroy anything with bodily 108 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 1: body fluids on it because of a health risk. I said, well, 109 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: my son's clothes had black blood splatter on it and 110 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: they had mulcans on it, and you gave that to 111 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: us with no problem. I said, so we're gonna need 112 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 1: that sheet back. She said, well, I don't control it. 113 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: I said, okay, I got you. So I went, had 114 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 1: everybody called. It was like it was an action social 115 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 1: media action I did. I had everybody called my supporters, 116 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 1: and then I had the attorney call that tiny put 117 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 1: a fear in him, there will be a private investigation, debt, 118 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 1: and that she is very important to this investigation. You 119 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 1: guys already ruin the clothes. What's the status right now? 120 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 1: The lawyer and she is it to be. I don't 121 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: think that this comment from Melissa and supported by her family, 122 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:27,239 Speaker 1: that she would never get back the bedsheet that Dana 123 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: was hanged with was from one of our first meetings 124 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 1: with her back in the spring of As the sheet 125 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: was considered evidence in an active case, she could not 126 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 1: retrieve it until the case was officially closed in August, 127 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 1: when we tried unsuccessfully to open Danya's phone with the 128 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 1: pass codes Desia had given us. Detective Andrewer had by 129 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:51,680 Speaker 1: then finally released his case report. We were able to 130 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: request a copy, and when it arrived, there were several 131 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:58,679 Speaker 1: details that jumped out at us. For one, just in general, 132 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 1: we were shocked by how little investigating Andrewer had actually done. 133 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:06,720 Speaker 1: According to his report. After leaving Melissa's house the morning 134 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: of Donyae's death, Detective Andrewer did the following things. One 135 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 1: he conducted a search of the Computer aided Report Entry 136 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:18,080 Speaker 1: program and the Crisis Intervention Report Program to look for 137 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:22,680 Speaker 1: prior reports documenting any psychological episodes with Donja, and he 138 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 1: found that there were none. Two, he searched the computer 139 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: aided Dispatch for calls about suspicious persons by Melissa, of 140 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 1: which there was one on August fourteenth of that year, 141 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 1: when Melissa apparently called into report a man looking into 142 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: people's vehicles. Three, he scanned Danna's Facebook page. This was 143 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,440 Speaker 1: a newer page and only had posts from March through September, 144 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 1: which didn't reveal much except that Donna was starting to 145 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: buy houses for his business, which he called moving on 146 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 1: up properties. This is all he did the day Donya died, 147 00:09:56,360 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 1: the seventeenth of October. Then on October thirty one, fourteen 148 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: days later, at Andrew's request, a different detective went to 149 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 1: the medical Examiner's office and grabbed the bedsheet and delivered 150 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:13,840 Speaker 1: it to the crime lab for DNA analysis. So some 151 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 1: quick things to point out. One, he never spoke to 152 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: anyone else who knew Donna, not even his brother Javan. 153 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: Back in episode one, County p D spokesman Sergeant Sean 154 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:29,439 Speaker 1: McGuire told us that the final report would reveal what 155 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 1: detectives looked into and who they talked to. Well, they 156 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 1: looked into their internal databases for other hits on Donna 157 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: and found none, then talked to no one. And speaking 158 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 1: of talking to no one, page four of the report 159 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 1: contains a little box at the bottom that reads neighborhood canvassed, 160 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 1: and that box is marked with an X. Canvassing a 161 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:54,199 Speaker 1: neighborhood means that officers speak with neighbors and asked them 162 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 1: basic questions like did you see or hear anything unusual 163 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: last night. Since there is nothing written anywhere else in 164 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:05,440 Speaker 1: the report about which neighbors at which addresses were spoken to, 165 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,600 Speaker 1: we figured we would just knock on Melissa's neighbors doors 166 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:11,320 Speaker 1: and ask for ourselves if police had interviewed them the 167 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: morning Don died. All right, my name is Ray. I 168 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 1: just wanted to know if I could either ask you 169 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,160 Speaker 1: a question for like five minutes, or maybe set up 170 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:24,959 Speaker 1: a time when I could call you. This is the 171 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: first neighbor we spoke with. She wouldn't open the door, 172 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: so it's very hard to hear. We cranked the audio 173 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: to try and catch her voice, so we apologize for 174 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 1: the sound quality here. Did the police ever ask you 175 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:38,080 Speaker 1: any questions? They never knocked on the door and talked 176 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 1: to anyone in else No. Yeah, she lives alone and 177 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:44,680 Speaker 1: like she said, police never spoke to her. She finally 178 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:46,679 Speaker 1: opened the door a bit and spoke about the night 179 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:55,000 Speaker 1: of Danye's death. Yeah, I didn't. I didn't see nothing. 180 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 1: I did hear nothing. I wouldn't have been the police either, 181 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 1: so they still could have knocked and asked. Then we 182 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:06,599 Speaker 1: went to another neighbor's house. Hey, I just didn't know 183 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: if I could get like five minutes of your time 184 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:09,680 Speaker 1: to just kind of ask, like what you saw? The 185 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 1: questions like I said, done over here? Yeah, Yeah, he 186 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:16,680 Speaker 1: killed himself and we just want to like run down 187 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:22,040 Speaker 1: all the possibilities. Usually they just painful to that somebody 188 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:26,839 Speaker 1: killed himself. It was no signable struggle, you know, family, sure, 189 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: I mean I wanted to know, like do you did 190 00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:31,679 Speaker 1: the cops ever come knock on your door? Cops never 191 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:43,239 Speaker 1: asked any questions, uh investigation and and what they determined 192 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,320 Speaker 1: was what it is. They didn't they never worked with 193 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:48,760 Speaker 1: the idea that that that that it was some retribution 194 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: for her protesting. This neighbor clearly has his opinion, but 195 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: he did confirm that the police never interviewed him. We 196 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: knocked on two more doors and one of the people 197 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:00,640 Speaker 1: who answered said they didn't live there at the time 198 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 1: of the incident. At the last house we went to, 199 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:05,559 Speaker 1: a teenager answered the door, so we don't want to 200 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 1: use their voice. They told us that to their knowledge, 201 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 1: police never came by and asked anyone in the house 202 00:13:10,640 --> 00:13:14,239 Speaker 1: any questions. It looks like the neighborhood was not canvassed, 203 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: despite the police report claiming the contrary. And what needs 204 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 1: to be noted here is that the final case report 205 00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:24,439 Speaker 1: has sections drafted by different people. Detective Andrew Or has 206 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 1: the longest portion at the end, but the first officer 207 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,480 Speaker 1: to arrive on scene the morning Danya died, Officer Chad 208 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:34,600 Speaker 1: lampricked drafted a portion. Then Detective Michael Kamerer from the 209 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 1: crime scene unit also drafted a portion. It's unclear, but 210 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 1: based on where it falls in the report, it appears 211 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:42,680 Speaker 1: that it may have been Lambrick to check the box 212 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 1: stating that the neighborhood had been canvassed. Yeah, and then 213 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:49,959 Speaker 1: they said that they canvased my neighborhood. They spoke with 214 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:56,080 Speaker 1: my neighbors. And when John and Ray asked my neighbors 215 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 1: if they had been spocused too, they have been interviewed, 216 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: they all said hello. The way that works, we do 217 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,839 Speaker 1: canvases all the time. So in the police report it 218 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 1: was the name, the time, the date, uh the address 219 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:15,600 Speaker 1: upon whatever however the contact was made. All of those 220 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:18,439 Speaker 1: contacts would be listed in the police report. Did they 221 00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:21,360 Speaker 1: listen them in the police report as having talked to them? 222 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: Since we are looking into the investigative efforts of county detectives, 223 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 1: we felt the need to talk to someone who would 224 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: know just how these sorts of investigations should happen. So 225 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,240 Speaker 1: we spoke with Captain Carroll Jackson a retired commander from 226 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 1: the University City Police Department. University City is one of 227 00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:43,040 Speaker 1: the municipalities in St. Louis County. Captain Jackson was a 228 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 1: police officer for thirty seven years. Melissa was on the 229 00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: call with us when we spoke to her. No name, 230 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: none of that. Now that's not the way it works. No, 231 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:56,720 Speaker 1: you have to put in the police report when you 232 00:14:56,840 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 1: can't what it means. You don't just canvas the neighborhood. 233 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 1: You say, I went to twelve, no answer, you have 234 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 1: the name, you have no answer? Or I spoke with them, 235 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: they they didn't hear anything, they didn't see anything. How 236 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 1: how can you do an investigations and say you can 237 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: and say you don't have many informations to who talked 238 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:24,360 Speaker 1: to who? Interestingly, in Detective Cameras section of the report, 239 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:27,400 Speaker 1: he notes that a request was made by the crime 240 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: lab to also get ahold of Danyae's pants, the ones 241 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,720 Speaker 1: that were found rolled down around his ankles when he died. 242 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 1: Camera notes, however, that by then the pants had already 243 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 1: been sent on to the funeral home, and of course 244 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: by then Dinia had been buried and the pants returned 245 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: to his mother and any hope of pulling DNA from 246 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: them was lost. In episode three, the pathologist Dr Gersham 247 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 1: Norfleet told us that the crime lab swabbed the portion 248 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 1: of the sheet tied to the tree, and we countered 249 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 1: that that wasn't possible because a sheet had been untied 250 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: by his own investigator, Michael Tarticio, and then the whole 251 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 1: sheet was placed beside Danye's body in the body bag 252 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 1: as it traveled to the morgue. We wanted a second 253 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:16,360 Speaker 1: opinion on how the ligature should have been handled. When 254 00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: you are collecting the ligature, how is it collected? So 255 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 1: the ligature, what you wanna do is you want to 256 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: cut away from the knots, and you pretty much want 257 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,760 Speaker 1: to preserve the knots. This is Christian Torres again. You 258 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 1: heard him in episode four talking about how he uses 259 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,440 Speaker 1: Carl Berdan's adjusted glaster equation in his own work as 260 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 1: a medico legal investigator. You have your point of suspension 261 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:46,000 Speaker 1: with the ligature is tied to and if there's a knot, 262 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 1: you cut away from it. And once you cut, you 263 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 1: take a string and tape it from one side and 264 00:16:54,640 --> 00:16:57,400 Speaker 1: tape it on the other side to show where you 265 00:16:57,520 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 1: have made the cut. So you are able to put 266 00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 1: much reconstruct the hanging in the autopsy room. We had 267 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 1: been shocked to learn that the ligature in Dana's case 268 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:13,120 Speaker 1: was not bagged or separated from his body in any way, 269 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:17,000 Speaker 1: and asked Christian how he transports a ligature to the morgue. 270 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:20,159 Speaker 1: We will take a bag big enough to fit the 271 00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:24,879 Speaker 1: ligature comfortably. Right. We cut the ligature as I mentioned before, 272 00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: We cut it and then we place it in this bag. 273 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:31,840 Speaker 1: And we usually place it in between the legs of 274 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 1: the sea then or like on the top of the 275 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:37,760 Speaker 1: sea then. So in this case it was with the body, 276 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:43,840 Speaker 1: but not specifically in a way that separated contact. Um okay, 277 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:47,440 Speaker 1: does that to you sound like something that could corrupt 278 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 1: potential like DNA evidence. Yes, I mean it's it's not 279 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 1: the proper way. It is not the proper way. The 280 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: police report states that the portion of the sheet that 281 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:04,720 Speaker 1: was swabbed for DNA was the not area. We wanted 282 00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: to know more specifically what the phrase not area meant. 283 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: Did it mean the actual knot or the loop that 284 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:15,800 Speaker 1: would have passed under Danye's jaw. We asked the crime 285 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:18,719 Speaker 1: lamb about this an episode three, but the technician we 286 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:21,600 Speaker 1: spoke to said she couldn't answer our questions without permission 287 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,439 Speaker 1: from her supervisor, and then we never heard from her 288 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:29,040 Speaker 1: again despite repeated efforts. This detail about where the sheet 289 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 1: was swabbed was important because of how Danya's uncle Daniel 290 00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 1: explained how he and danye stepfather Derek, lowered Danyae's body 291 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:40,960 Speaker 1: to the ground as his legs and lifted them up. 292 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:45,679 Speaker 1: Derek took the part that was on his neck, just 293 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 1: got it off, sh Okay, So then I don't so 294 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 1: I now load them down, Okay. If the DNA swab 295 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,919 Speaker 1: was taken on the part of the sheet under Danye's 296 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,239 Speaker 1: chin that Derek touched, the d NA found could be his. 297 00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 1: But if they swabbed the remaining not where Danna's head was, 298 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 1: there's a good chance that the mystery DNA isn't Derrick's. 299 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:12,679 Speaker 1: Looking at the specifics of what was written in the 300 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 1: report about the results of DNA testing, it has this 301 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 1: to say a mixture of two or more individuals was detected, 302 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 1: including at least two male contributors Freeze two or more. 303 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: When we spoke with Dr Norfleet, he told us there 304 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 1: was a second DNA profile. According to the crime Lab 305 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: it's at least two individuals. The report then goes on 306 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: to state that Donia was the major contributor of DNA 307 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:44,919 Speaker 1: found And then there is this phrase, due to limited 308 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: genetic information available and the possibility of missing a lelic data, 309 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 1: the minor component is unsuitable for comparison purposes. We called 310 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 1: the crime lab to get an explanation of what this 311 00:19:56,080 --> 00:20:00,439 Speaker 1: phrase means. Hi, I'm calling him a report working on 312 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: a story, and I just I have a report from 313 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:05,600 Speaker 1: the crime lab and there's a sentence in it, and 314 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:10,160 Speaker 1: I was just hoping for clarification on what exactly it means. Sure, 315 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: what it says, due to the limited genetic information available 316 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:20,360 Speaker 1: and the possibility of missing altic data in parentheses drop out, 317 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 1: the minor component is unsuitable for comparison purposes. Okay, Um, sure. 318 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:30,240 Speaker 1: So that's a generic statement that we use when there's 319 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,919 Speaker 1: not enough data from that portion of the mixture to 320 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: be able to do an interpretation or comparison. Um. So 321 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:42,479 Speaker 1: it's basically just inconclusive wording. Okay. So, so when they 322 00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:45,040 Speaker 1: do the swabs and and they run it and it 323 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,639 Speaker 1: turns up that this is the case, does it just 324 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 1: mean it's stalled? Out did they did they swab again? 325 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 1: What happens? Um? Right? So generally, Um, that would be 326 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 1: the end of the line for that particular sample. UM. 327 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 1: As far as being able to do any interpretations on it. Um, Again, 328 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:03,639 Speaker 1: it just depends on the case and the evidence type. 329 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 1: You know, something else can happen with it. Um. That 330 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: would just be a specific situation because this came off 331 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: a piece of fabric. So if the it would be 332 00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: up to the detective then or whoever was in charge, 333 00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,160 Speaker 1: to say, can you try swabbing it again if they 334 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: wanted it? Um, It just depends. It could be um, 335 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:24,679 Speaker 1: you know, it could be that it could be the 336 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 1: prosecuting attorney, you know, to be retested. It could be 337 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 1: you know, a defense attorney. Um. It would just depends. Um, 338 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 1: you know. Yeah. But again, whoever gets the report basically 339 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:38,160 Speaker 1: kind of decide if they want something else. Okay, thank 340 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:42,120 Speaker 1: you so much so. According to the crime Lab, when 341 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 1: a DNA sample isn't useful for comparison purposes, new sampling 342 00:21:46,920 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 1: can be requested. After all, the sheet is still in 343 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 1: possession of the St. Louis County Police. The fact that 344 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 1: this was never done is kind of shocking. Again, consider 345 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 1: the timing. Melissa has made a big splash on social 346 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:04,760 Speaker 1: media saying my son was murdered, and she scheduled a 347 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 1: public press conference. So the day before it, Detective and 348 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: Her seemingly says, fine, I'll swab the sheet and the 349 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,840 Speaker 1: pants for DNA. Wait, the pants have already been returned. Fine, 350 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 1: just the sheet. Then he seemingly does this to see 351 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 1: if there is any merit to Melissa's claim, and twelve 352 00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 1: days after that he gets the results which say to 353 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: or more individuals have DNA on the sheet. How does 354 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:33,160 Speaker 1: he respond to that? Based on his report, He doesn't. 355 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,679 Speaker 1: He doesn't do anything with it. The report says the 356 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 1: not area of the sheet was swabbed, meaning this mystery 357 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 1: DNA could in theory beyond the rest of the sheet, 358 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,919 Speaker 1: and there could possibly be usable samples available if they 359 00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:50,879 Speaker 1: swabbed the whole thing. But what happens The sheet stays 360 00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: locked up in the property department and Melissa is unable 361 00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:56,440 Speaker 1: to get it because it cannot be released to her 362 00:22:56,800 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: until Detective and Or closes the case, which he doesn't 363 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: do for eight more months until July of twenty nine, 364 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:08,680 Speaker 1: when they came in the house to talk to us. 365 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: The words were it's gonna be what it looks like, 366 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,920 Speaker 1: it's gonna be a suicide. So that day that they 367 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: came to my house, they told us suicide. Yeah, it 368 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,440 Speaker 1: could look like that, but that's not good enough. That's 369 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:24,560 Speaker 1: not a conclusion, especially because this kind of thing has 370 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 1: happened in other parts of the country in almost the 371 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 1: same manner, like in California. They would suspectful. At least 372 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,600 Speaker 1: they investigated it to the right, you know, and they 373 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: they gamed it wasn't suicide, and that should be the conclusion. 374 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:42,679 Speaker 1: They didn't ask us questions. They the question that they asked, 375 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,639 Speaker 1: why would he commit suicide? You know, they know that 376 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 1: that was her journal. Did he have any say? No, 377 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:56,399 Speaker 1: did they start They did not set his phone at all. No, 378 00:23:56,720 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: that's says that I'm not doing I'm you know, I'm 379 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: just telling you how i rejoined it to me. That 380 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:07,159 Speaker 1: is that's very substandard. We're not the experts, and that 381 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:11,199 Speaker 1: we're the expert investigators, but there's many but things like 382 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:16,200 Speaker 1: that have to have to have conclusive evidence. Quick note, 383 00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,960 Speaker 1: both Officer lamb pricked and detective Camera reported that they 384 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 1: looked at Danyae's cell phone but couldn't get past the 385 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 1: pass code, so they just moved on. Another little oddity 386 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:29,440 Speaker 1: is the color of the sheet Danyae was hanged with. 387 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,199 Speaker 1: Maybe it's not a big deal, but across reports it 388 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,679 Speaker 1: is at different times called white, gray, and light green. 389 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:40,439 Speaker 1: When we first met Melissa, one of her key points 390 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:43,680 Speaker 1: was that the sheet didn't come from her house, since 391 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: my family just came staying, I had to buy extra. 392 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 1: She's but I know what she's. We always have color. 393 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: She's never white. She's never She's under the impression it's white, 394 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 1: probably because of the photo Daniel took of danye hanging, 395 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,199 Speaker 1: But that photo was taken with the flash prior to 396 00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,399 Speaker 1: the sun fully coming up, so Melissa may not have 397 00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 1: had an accurate grasp of what color the sheet actually was. 398 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:11,960 Speaker 1: When we look at photographs of it, the color of 399 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: the sheet seems to alter with the lighting. In some 400 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 1: shots where it's still tied into the tree, it looks gray, 401 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: but it's shaded by the canopy. Under the bright lights 402 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,240 Speaker 1: of the morgue, it looks closer to white. The sheet 403 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,160 Speaker 1: itself is a fitted bed sheet, and with close examination 404 00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 1: of the photographs, you can see that some of the 405 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:33,119 Speaker 1: elastic is frayed and detached. It was sort of a 406 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:37,080 Speaker 1: mccab question, But we wondered why Danye would use a 407 00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: bed sheet, especially a fitted bed sheet, if in fact 408 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:44,240 Speaker 1: he did die by suicide. It seemed like it would 409 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: be difficult to manipulate and tie the way you would want, 410 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 1: I mean, even folding a fitted sheet as a headache. 411 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:53,119 Speaker 1: So we asked Melissa if there was rope available in 412 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 1: the house, was there something more convenient in the house, 413 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 1: like was there peel or an extension? There's an extend exactly, 414 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: there's extension corps. Actually there is. There are ropes that 415 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: were ropes in the garage because we used them to 416 00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:13,119 Speaker 1: tie things up with when we moved things. You know, 417 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 1: there were so many things that appeals in the house. 418 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: It's like we wanted right there, right in the garage, 419 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 1: and we have something all around. We have those two. 420 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:29,200 Speaker 1: Could he have quickly gotten a gun because got hold 421 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:35,359 Speaker 1: of a gun from then there is the configuration of 422 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: how the sheet was tied into the tree. Both the 423 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 1: medical investigator Michael Tarticio and Detective Anderer describing the reports, 424 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:47,199 Speaker 1: the sheet is tied in a figure eight. If you 425 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:51,880 Speaker 1: remember too. During her press conference about Danye's death, Melissa 426 00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:55,399 Speaker 1: referred to the ligature system as a Navy not and 427 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,919 Speaker 1: her husband Derek, a former Navy man himself, said he 428 00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:03,199 Speaker 1: recognized the figuration from his training. I know what I'm 429 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:07,040 Speaker 1: talking about. I've seen it. I knew exactly what type 430 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,320 Speaker 1: of natty woods. You know what I'm saying. I knew, 431 00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:15,600 Speaker 1: you know, well, I'm military man, you know you on 432 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,320 Speaker 1: certain ships or certain places they're they'll use that particularly 433 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 1: not It's called rebbit. In a rebb it alcohol. That's 434 00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 1: what as we call it and what it means. It 435 00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:30,320 Speaker 1: don't extend, It just gets tight up with weight. And 436 00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 1: so when I looked up and seen it, I was like, 437 00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:35,560 Speaker 1: that's not a regular, not even a makeshift. So I 438 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:37,600 Speaker 1: knew it was a complicated not under where he could 439 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:39,159 Speaker 1: even learned on the first one, because it's to me, 440 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 1: hella time to even try to learn this thing. We 441 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,760 Speaker 1: have three photographs of the ligature configuration that we're taking 442 00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:49,320 Speaker 1: on the scene. One picture has a tape measure extended 443 00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:52,440 Speaker 1: in it showing its height and size, and the other 444 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,960 Speaker 1: two pictures are a front and a rear shot of 445 00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:58,080 Speaker 1: this sheet tied and hanging in the tree. Here's what 446 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: I will personally say, I an experienced tree climber using harnesses, 447 00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,960 Speaker 1: lines and other rigging. I know many knots and not systems. 448 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 1: When I look at the photographs of the ligature, my 449 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:14,280 Speaker 1: perception is that it's complex and non intuitive. I see 450 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,080 Speaker 1: why it's written up as a figure eight system, as 451 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: from a particular angle, it does have that appearance. Nothing 452 00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 1: from my arborist experience clues me in as to what 453 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: it is, But searching through other not systems, I would 454 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: say it looks very close to a mooring knot, which 455 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:32,840 Speaker 1: is used to fasten a ship or a boat to 456 00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 1: a dock. It isn't exactly the same as a typical 457 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 1: mooring knot usually is fastened on a bite, meaning that 458 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,840 Speaker 1: you can pull one end and it will loosen the system. 459 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 1: The configuration used in Donnie's death doesn't have that. Looking 460 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,840 Speaker 1: at the photographs, it's hard to trace the exact movements 461 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: of the ends of the sheet through the system. So 462 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: I called my friend Al and asked if he would 463 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,560 Speaker 1: take a look at it for me. Al is an 464 00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 1: experienced climber, arborist, and sailor, and he knows more about 465 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:05,239 Speaker 1: rope than anyone else I know. When I looked at. 466 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 1: I was just trying to be like, how would you 467 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 1: possibly how would you not just fall out of it? 468 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Yeah, I just don't see 469 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,800 Speaker 1: how like if you've put your head in there, because 470 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,760 Speaker 1: there wasn't it wasn't cinching or anything. I didn't see it, 471 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 1: knot that would do any cinching or under neck. It 472 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: was just a loop of sheet that would just be 473 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 1: like rigidly in place, and you would pass out and 474 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:32,480 Speaker 1: just fall out of them. But obviously danya didn't fall 475 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 1: out of it, which to us means that it would 476 00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,520 Speaker 1: likely have to have been tied very tightly around Danyae's 477 00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: neck from the outset, as the sheet itself would stretch 478 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: as soon as weight was applied to it. This also 479 00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: seems to imply that it would have to have been 480 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,240 Speaker 1: tied behind Danyae's head, meaning if he was doing it 481 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:56,360 Speaker 1: to himself, he would be tying this ligature blind. This 482 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 1: is speculative, but it seems to reason that if he 483 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:02,120 Speaker 1: tied the for his neck in front of him, where 484 00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:04,600 Speaker 1: he could see what he was doing, the loop would 485 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:07,520 Speaker 1: have to be loose enough to pass over his whole head, 486 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:10,800 Speaker 1: and if it didn't cinch. Then when he put his 487 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 1: weight into it, he would fall out of it, like 488 00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 1: Al suggested. Again, we're speculating here based on a couple 489 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,160 Speaker 1: of photographs, but this wouldn't have to be speculative if 490 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 1: the sheet hadn't been untied and tossed into a body bag, 491 00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,560 Speaker 1: had it been cut away from the branch with scissors, 492 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: it would have been easy to re affix the cut 493 00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 1: ends and to observe the system the way Christian Torres suggested. 494 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 1: So not only was the possibility of independent DNA swabbing foiled, 495 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 1: so was the possibility of an independent analysis of the configuration. 496 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:49,800 Speaker 1: Here's what we have. A fitted and frayed bedsheet, likely 497 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,000 Speaker 1: either white or light gray, that Melissa says didn't come 498 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: from her house, tied in a complex fashion that Derek 499 00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 1: says he recognizes from his military days, that doesn't look 500 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:01,720 Speaker 1: like it had a sin portion based on the photographs, 501 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:04,640 Speaker 1: that has two or more individuals DNA on it who 502 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:09,240 Speaker 1: are male, and only one of whom is DNA. Melissa 503 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: wanted this sheet. She had been trying to get it 504 00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: back for months, but it was considered evidence until the 505 00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 1: case was closed. Right around the time the medical Examiner's 506 00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:21,840 Speaker 1: office had released their report on Danyae's death. Melissa's lawyer 507 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 1: called Detective Anderer. There is no audio of that call, 508 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 1: but the email Melissa's attorney sent to her explaining what 509 00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:33,600 Speaker 1: had been said read, I spoke with Detective Anderer via telephone. 510 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,680 Speaker 1: The bed sheet and reference to Donye's death is still 511 00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 1: in custody with their agency. Detective Andrewer was told that 512 00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: the bed sheet would be needed for possible further examination 513 00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 1: and to preserve it. Detective Anderer was cooperative. Now the 514 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:52,280 Speaker 1: case was closed, but Melissa didn't hear anything about the sheet, 515 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 1: so eventually we called the St. Louis County Police Department 516 00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 1: to find out how she could get it back. Yeah, 517 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: so I was just hoping to grab an update if 518 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: there is one, as to whether or not that evidence 519 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,920 Speaker 1: can be released. Yes, I spoke with those in the 520 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 1: Division of Criminal Investigation, and the proper steps will be 521 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:15,280 Speaker 1: taken to release that to uh to his mother. Now, 522 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 1: it is very out of the ordinary for any members 523 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:23,800 Speaker 1: of the media to request evidence to be released to them. Well, 524 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:25,720 Speaker 1: I'm not asking for it to be for it to 525 00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:29,080 Speaker 1: be released to me. I was just trying to find 526 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:34,600 Speaker 1: out what the steps were so she could do them. Okay, Well, 527 00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 1: then I would encourage her to come down to Saint 528 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 1: Louis County Police Headquarters. She will go up to property 529 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,600 Speaker 1: control that is located on the second floor of our building, 530 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 1: and I would encourage her to come during business hours 531 00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: Monday through Friday to do so. Okay, what does she 532 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:49,360 Speaker 1: need to have on her? Does she need just her 533 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,800 Speaker 1: I d I believe just the state Missouri idea or 534 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 1: anything with a photo and the name of hers, the 535 00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,920 Speaker 1: property will be released her. Thank you very much, thank 536 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,640 Speaker 1: you all right by Mayor Lyda Krusen says the city 537 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 1: of St. Louis has seven twenty three positive cases of 538 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: COVID nineteen and the city and county account for two 539 00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:16,240 Speaker 1: thirds of the deaths in the state of Missouri. Over 540 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 1: the course of this show, we haven't talked too much 541 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 1: about Melissa's illnesses for her privacy, but we will say 542 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:25,200 Speaker 1: that she suffers from lupus, so she can't just up 543 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: and run out the door any old time. Then COVID 544 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 1: nineteen happened, and with her strained immune system again, Melissa 545 00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 1: had to remain sequestered during the spring. And then the 546 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:43,080 Speaker 1: world saw this this bodycam video and separately, this security 547 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:46,240 Speaker 1: video show some of the last few minutes of George 548 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:50,520 Speaker 1: Floyd's life, stopped on suspicion of passing counterfeit money. What 549 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: seems a straightforward arrest somehow devolves into this leave excruciating 550 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:03,440 Speaker 1: to watch. It's Floyd now on the ground, begging for 551 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:08,279 Speaker 1: his life, handcuffed, gasping for air. Police officers knee on 552 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:14,080 Speaker 1: his neck while others do nothing. They asked me to 553 00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 1: come out yesterday and leave some of the actions and 554 00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 1: stuff that they're doing. I let what I'm one of them, know, 555 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 1: like I'm not ready for it, Like you know, I cannot. 556 00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:30,720 Speaker 1: I won't not right now. I just won't. I'll speak 557 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:34,719 Speaker 1: out about it. But oh that I'm not going out 558 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 1: there with this virus out there still, Harry, especially with 559 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:43,760 Speaker 1: me having a lucus And what do you make everything 560 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:47,680 Speaker 1: that's happening just kind of continuation of what started six 561 00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:50,040 Speaker 1: years ago? Or is this something I think this is 562 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:52,759 Speaker 1: a reminder. I couldn't watch the video, but I saw 563 00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: the picture that guy knilling on George's neck. He was 564 00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:03,320 Speaker 1: posed and like, yeah, he knew they were taking the picture, 565 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:07,360 Speaker 1: he knew they were recording, and it was like a pose, like, 566 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 1: make sure y'all get this. You know what I'm saying, Like, 567 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 1: this is what happened when you act up with us. 568 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,160 Speaker 1: You know this is this is what happened. This is 569 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 1: what you get. So yeah, take the picture. So he 570 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:23,239 Speaker 1: was trying to cool the point there. I think that 571 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:28,880 Speaker 1: there's always gonna be this group, this, this group that 572 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:34,280 Speaker 1: will hate us. You know, they want to be able 573 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:37,440 Speaker 1: to continue to look down on a certain group to 574 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:42,600 Speaker 1: make themselves feel better. It's sad, but we have to 575 00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:45,480 Speaker 1: continue to live. We have to continue to fight forward. 576 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,759 Speaker 1: Um be better than them. That's the only way that 577 00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,799 Speaker 1: I could see which will prosper, will make it through it. 578 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:58,240 Speaker 1: We have to be better than them. Despite her feelings 579 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:01,080 Speaker 1: on what happened to George Floyd, Melissa was still not 580 00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:03,799 Speaker 1: ready to take to the streets again. She took the 581 00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:07,520 Speaker 1: need to protect her health very seriously. It wasn't until 582 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,520 Speaker 1: mid June when Melissa told us she was finally ready 583 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 1: to go and collect the bedsheet from County p d So, 584 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:18,240 Speaker 1: with her daughter Militia and grandson Messiah by her side. 585 00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:22,360 Speaker 1: On June eighteenth, we accompanied them as they went to 586 00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 1: retrieve what Melissa considered to be her son's murder weapon. 587 00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,360 Speaker 1: I have to call him. He because normally if you 588 00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:32,719 Speaker 1: want the property, you have a letter in the game, 589 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:36,120 Speaker 1: So I gotta call him to check will deal make 590 00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,360 Speaker 1: sureys got cleared? Okay, so give me a few minutes. 591 00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,959 Speaker 1: Melissa is being told by an officer that she needs 592 00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,440 Speaker 1: to have a letter stating that her evidence is cleared 593 00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:48,640 Speaker 1: for pickup. Sergeant Granda never mentioned this, and Melissa says 594 00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:54,480 Speaker 1: she never received any letter. What would say and her? Andrew? 595 00:36:54,760 --> 00:37:00,279 Speaker 1: And he you to keep your reporting on or anything. Man. Now, 596 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,560 Speaker 1: right when I went across the street, they tell me 597 00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:10,960 Speaker 1: there this was cleared before coronavirus, and so she had 598 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,399 Speaker 1: to wait a long time, but it was clear, let 599 00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: me get you all, do me a man. She want 600 00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:18,720 Speaker 1: to step out. He's got to go all way across 601 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:22,000 Speaker 1: the hall to the detectives off running by him to 602 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:26,120 Speaker 1: make sure that when he's doing his own hand. Due 603 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,160 Speaker 1: to concerns about coronavirus, we were asked to step outside, 604 00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:36,240 Speaker 1: so we did, and we waited. Okay, Andrew's not upstairs. 605 00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:39,560 Speaker 1: He's all today. So you want to call back on 606 00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:43,440 Speaker 1: month because we're close tomorrow. Yeah, the Kings officially closed 607 00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 1: and like they like without Andrew's being here. They don't 608 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,879 Speaker 1: want to release it without his signature on there saying that, yeah, 609 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,319 Speaker 1: I'm giving them the right to take it. It's hard 610 00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:58,160 Speaker 1: to hear. But Melissa then starts asking the officer if 611 00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:02,000 Speaker 1: the sheet is still in the building. No, no, I'm 612 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,200 Speaker 1: not saying that that that the amis is probably still 613 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:08,600 Speaker 1: it's still up there, but this is the issue. He's 614 00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:12,800 Speaker 1: not here to say, yeah, they could take that's the issue. 615 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: So we left. Melissa was told to call Detective Andrewer 616 00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,680 Speaker 1: on Monday and see what was necessary to get the sheet. 617 00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 1: To get clarity on the issue, we called one of 618 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 1: the superior officers at the Division of Criminal Investigation, Mike Buslaki. 619 00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:33,200 Speaker 1: He didn't answer, so we left a message. Hi. My 620 00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:35,120 Speaker 1: name is Raina A. Shell Ski. I'm an associate of 621 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,680 Speaker 1: Melissa McKinney's, the mother of Danie Jones. Melissa had been 622 00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:41,480 Speaker 1: told that she could come by any time Monday through 623 00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:45,279 Speaker 1: Friday during office hours as long as she had her 624 00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,640 Speaker 1: idea and could now collect that evidence. But when we 625 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:50,000 Speaker 1: showed up on Thursday, we were told she could only 626 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 1: take it when um Detective Andrew was there to sign off. 627 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:56,839 Speaker 1: I just wonder if he's signed off and she can 628 00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,960 Speaker 1: now pick it up at any time, or if she 629 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,160 Speaker 1: needs to skin all of time to be there when 630 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,000 Speaker 1: Andrewer is present to sign off in that moment, If 631 00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: you could offer some clarity of this, you know, mother, 632 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,200 Speaker 1: it's an emotional thing for her to you know, ready 633 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:15,680 Speaker 1: herself to come collect this item, and she needs family 634 00:39:15,719 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 1: to join her for emotional support. And so I'm sure 635 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:23,400 Speaker 1: you can understand your sensitivity there around her having clarity 636 00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,759 Speaker 1: so she doesn't come try this several times. Thank you 637 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:30,400 Speaker 1: very much. The next day, Sergeant John Wall from County 638 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,480 Speaker 1: p D called Melissa. He was listed in the police 639 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,799 Speaker 1: report on Danya's death as being Andrewer's supervisor at the 640 00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:40,840 Speaker 1: time of his investigation. Melissa recorded this call as she 641 00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:43,880 Speaker 1: was heating up some food in her kitchen. So the 642 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,960 Speaker 1: play first of the creator released the property, Uh, filled 643 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:53,720 Speaker 1: up the form and gave it to the apert to 644 00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 1: set off a letter. Let's just add and I can 645 00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:02,480 Speaker 1: get every other piece of mail except here, and here 646 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,560 Speaker 1: in lies the problem. And what I'm calling you, of course, 647 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:13,560 Speaker 1: is a other seats. Uh. The company isn't picked up 648 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:19,880 Speaker 1: with it thirty days. Uh, it's destroyed the older. We 649 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:23,560 Speaker 1: do have a little bit of the sheet, so you 650 00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:26,520 Speaker 1: know that hurt detective are told you that the sheet 651 00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:34,680 Speaker 1: was tested for Dina. Uh, those swabs we do have 652 00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:38,360 Speaker 1: that that's not what we needed. We needed the sheet 653 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:41,239 Speaker 1: that that we said that we would get. And so 654 00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:45,279 Speaker 1: now you've guys destroyed a sheet because the letter that 655 00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:51,200 Speaker 1: I did not receive. You see how this sounds so crazy? 656 00:40:52,280 --> 00:41:01,160 Speaker 1: Oh yes, ma'am. Let me ask you something. Do you 657 00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:07,600 Speaker 1: have children? Do you have children? If this happened to 658 00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:10,520 Speaker 1: your child, would you want to get down to the 659 00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:13,720 Speaker 1: bottom of this and find out what really happened because 660 00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:18,400 Speaker 1: you know your your your child. Oh of course. So 661 00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:22,440 Speaker 1: when you if you were to continue to hit wall 662 00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:25,839 Speaker 1: brick wall brick wall, wouldn't you get a little bit 663 00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 1: like Larry, like trying to figure out why? So there's 664 00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:48,960 Speaker 1: no sheet unfortunately, thank you, hits the fuck all? Hm 665 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:58,240 Speaker 1: m hm m hmm okay. Melissa's prediction that she would 666 00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:01,879 Speaker 1: never get the sheet back had come true. She had 667 00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:04,560 Speaker 1: always been skeptical that the County police were taking her 668 00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:10,360 Speaker 1: son's death seriously, and now Andrew's unprofessional conduct when on 669 00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:13,440 Speaker 1: seeing at her home the morning Danye died, combined with 670 00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: his social media posts made the destruction of the bedsheets 671 00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:20,959 Speaker 1: seem like a hostile act. With no sheet, there could 672 00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:24,080 Speaker 1: be no new DNA swabs. The fact that the St. 673 00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:27,120 Speaker 1: Louis County Police Department had preserved the swabs they had 674 00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:31,600 Speaker 1: done previously was better than nothing. But if the entirety 675 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,680 Speaker 1: of the sheet had not been previously swabbed, now it 676 00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,880 Speaker 1: never would be. There would be no way to examine 677 00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:40,640 Speaker 1: the sheet for damage, or to find out what brand 678 00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,880 Speaker 1: it was and perhaps where it came from. A case 679 00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,160 Speaker 1: that started with very little evidence now had even less, 680 00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:54,160 Speaker 1: But there was still Danye's phone. That's next time on 681 00:42:54,280 --> 00:43:01,120 Speaker 1: After the Uprising. After the Uprising is directed, produced, investigated, 682 00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:04,400 Speaker 1: written and reported by myself, Raino Vachelski, and John Duffy. 683 00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,360 Speaker 1: John Duffy was also the editor. Dave Cassidy was producer, 684 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:11,200 Speaker 1: Sound engineering, design and mixed by Josh Condon. Executive producers 685 00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:13,680 Speaker 1: were Matt McDonough and Tina x Ros for Now This, 686 00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:16,719 Speaker 1: Brett Kushner for Group nine Media, and Jess Borov was 687 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:19,720 Speaker 1: executive in charge of production. Jonathan Hartwig and Bradley Rayford 688 00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:22,880 Speaker 1: were consulting producers. Eliza Craig was assistant producer. And did 689 00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:26,920 Speaker 1: additional reporting. Mallory Keenoy was a writer's assistant, Kristen McVicker 690 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,000 Speaker 1: and Taya Wilson were production assistants, and Haley Klesmer was 691 00:43:30,040 --> 00:43:33,439 Speaker 1: a post production assistant. Fact checking by Alison Humes, theme 692 00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:36,279 Speaker 1: song and other music by Zachary Walter, legal by Keith 693 00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:40,120 Speaker 1: Sklar and Peter Yazy. Special thanks to Ann Frado, Danny Gonzalez, 694 00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:44,880 Speaker 1: Barbara Copple, Alex Lester, Bethan Macaluzo, Emily Maronoff, Ruth Vaka, 695 00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,439 Speaker 1: and the Reporter's Committee for Freedom of the Press. After 696 00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:49,759 Speaker 1: the Uprising is a production of Double asterisk I Heart 697 00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:52,680 Speaker 1: Media and Now This in association with True Stories. You 698 00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:54,960 Speaker 1: can find us on Twitter and Facebook. If you have 699 00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:57,760 Speaker 1: useful information about the death of Danye Jones or anything 700 00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:00,000 Speaker 1: we've covered, please leave a message on our tip line 701 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,920 Speaker 1: and at three four seven six seven four seven four 702 00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:03,640 Speaker 1: zero one.