Speaker 1: Pushkin.
Speaker 2: I don't move back home with my parents. I don't
Speaker 2: get a cheaper apartment. I don't make any of the
Speaker 2: adjustments you have to make. When you do this like
Speaker 2: your primary source of income and you are now starting
Speaker 2: a fashion brand, I mean I did this in like
Speaker 2: the dumbest way possible.
Speaker 1: Busaio O Lupona spent her formative years in both Nigeria
Speaker 1: and small town Davis, California. She made it to the
Speaker 1: precipice of success with a lucrative career as a lawyer
Speaker 1: at an elite New York City law firm, and then
Speaker 1: left to start a fashion label in her thirties. Her
Speaker 1: label is absolutely titled busaio Not only is it her name,
Speaker 1: but in one of the many Nigerian dialects, Busaiyo means
Speaker 1: to add joy, and adding joy to a dreary law
Speaker 1: career was what first sparked Oloopona's entrepreneurial spirit to begin
Speaker 1: with creating homemade designs she could wear in a professional
Speaker 1: setting while utilizing the vibrant prints of her Nigerian youth.
Speaker 1: And this is her Clothing Labels mission to bridge the
Speaker 1: cultural gap between what business professionals can wear in states
Speaker 1: and the more bold designs of West Africa. Ol Loopona's
Speaker 1: story is about finding your joy and pursuing it at
Speaker 1: all costs. This is started from the bottom, hard earned
Speaker 1: success stories from people like us. Can you take me
Speaker 1: back to your very first day of school in Davis, California.
Speaker 1: It's your first day of middle school in the United States. Yeah,
Speaker 1: tell me everything.
Speaker 2: I remember. First of all, coming to America was like
Speaker 2: I was in a boarding school in Nigeria. I was miserable.
Speaker 2: So it was literally they being rescued like I. And
Speaker 2: you know, I had had this fantasy right of what
Speaker 2: America was like, and in some ways it had really
Speaker 2: up until then would really met up to it. I
Speaker 2: remember going to the my American grocery store for the
Speaker 2: first time and seeing all these different types of fruits
Speaker 2: and all these you know, fruits that are only read
Speaker 2: about in books and then see like strawberries, like seeing
Speaker 2: them in person. You know, there was just so many
Speaker 2: things that were like a delight, right, And so I
Speaker 2: remember it was Oliver Wendell Holmes's junior high school. I
Speaker 2: was starting the eighth grade and I was supposed to
Speaker 2: be starting ninth. Actually I had gone through school really fast,
Speaker 2: so I was quite young. I was only twelve years
Speaker 2: old and very young, yeah, super young, and in a
Speaker 2: new country, right. I remember I had my hair wrapped
Speaker 2: with so we have something in our culture called inrokiko,
Speaker 2: which is hair threaded, like your hair streaded. So my
Speaker 2: mom had done it for me, which is literally wrap
Speaker 2: your head in like thread and it s took a
Speaker 2: very popular style in Niger and throughout West Africa really,
Speaker 2: and I remember I was writing traditionally dyed hand eyed
Speaker 2: clothes and I just remember being so excited. And I
Speaker 2: don't think that the fissure and the cracks came that
Speaker 2: first day, but it's probably that first week right where
Speaker 2: like the response to me was just not what I
Speaker 2: dreamt of, you know. I thought I was gonna have
Speaker 2: friends and I was gonna just I was so excited
Speaker 2: to be in America, and it literally was like hellish.
Speaker 2: And I remember, I don't remember if it was that
Speaker 2: day or a few days later. I told my mom, like,
Speaker 2: take my hair out of this thing. I don't want
Speaker 2: to wear my hair like this anymore. The clothes, I
Speaker 2: was like, I needed new clothes, and so, of course
Speaker 2: all they could afford at the time was like closed
Speaker 2: from Salvation in the army. She did everything to make
Speaker 2: sure we were like, you know, dressed well and everything,
Speaker 2: like God, I'm gonna start crying justin you know, just
Speaker 2: because you know, we got here. And I was like,
Speaker 2: these clothes that we brought, I'm not gonna wear them.
Speaker 2: And of course they didn't have a ton of money.
Speaker 2: My dad was an assistant professor, and which people will
Speaker 2: assume that, oh, that means that you're making a really
Speaker 2: good living, but with four children, actually not, you know,
Speaker 2: he I think it was like thirty forty thousand dollars
Speaker 2: a year or something like that, and trying to feed
Speaker 2: like a family of sex and they're starting in a
Speaker 2: new country. They didn't have very much, and so she
Speaker 2: would buy these clothes for us from Salvation Army and
Speaker 2: I would just be like, no, I don't I don't
Speaker 2: want to wear these. You know, these are not like
Speaker 2: what the kids in school were wearing. So I did
Speaker 2: everything to try to mold in shape and become something
Speaker 2: that was acceptable to my peers, right, But it never
Speaker 2: really worked, you know, and was really socially isolated for
Speaker 2: a very long time.
Speaker 1: What was one that taunts you.
Speaker 2: Oh God, how you want me solving the film The
Speaker 2: Gods Must Be Crazy had just come out. So I
Speaker 2: would sit there and like kids would click in my ear, like,
Speaker 2: you know, because they speak souls loud, which I can pronounce.
Speaker 2: Most of us can't say that sound. The sound is
Speaker 2: aspiration in your in your throat essentially, Yeah, that's what
Speaker 2: people call it. But so people would literally click in
Speaker 2: my ear and like say, like, do you do you
Speaker 2: talk like this? Do you guys wear clothes? Do you
Speaker 2: live in trees? Spitballs? You know? I would have spitballs.
Speaker 2: I hope kids don't do it anymore, like literally make
Speaker 2: cover paper with spit, like blow it through like a
Speaker 2: pen at you. Oh god, my hair. At one point,
Speaker 2: it was like, you know, Medusa was the was the name.
Speaker 2: There was so much, you know, and at this point
Speaker 2: I start eating to kind of deal with it, right,
Speaker 2: So then I'm overweight and so there's that you know,
Speaker 2: challenge and that kind of torment. So there was a lot.
Speaker 2: I mean, I think at that time too, the narrative
Speaker 2: on the African continent was very poverty. People's perception of
Speaker 2: Africa was really it's not like now where I actually
Speaker 2: think that we've managed to complicate the narrative and like
Speaker 2: we as you know, both the Africans on the continent
Speaker 2: and living here are really telling a different story about
Speaker 2: the place that we come from. But at that time
Speaker 2: there was none of that. So it was literally like
Speaker 2: starving children from Athiopia, you know, that was basically it.
Speaker 2: Oh and then of course the animal narrative that this
Speaker 2: was a continent, it was just full of animals, and
Speaker 2: so there was just a lot of like do you
Speaker 2: have a pet monkey? Do you have that? It's just
Speaker 2: just stuff like now sounds ridiculous, but at that time
Speaker 2: was completely the norm was completely.
Speaker 1: No norm and the sort of thing that you know,
Speaker 1: what was to happen. As an adult, you could dismiss
Speaker 1: them in such a way to say, obviously, these people
Speaker 1: are like uninvolved a type of people. But as a kid, you.
Speaker 2: Take it all in. Oh my gosh, you take it
Speaker 2: all in. And I mean, there were so many good
Speaker 2: things about that. Being so awful as it was, I
Speaker 2: think I was so desperate to get the hell out
Speaker 2: of Davis right like. That was very clear to me,
Speaker 2: and it gave me a determination to get the hell
Speaker 2: out of there, which was a total blessing.
Speaker 1: Could your parents sympathize.
Speaker 2: I think, yes, and no. I think they were going
Speaker 2: through their own kind of immigration. Like immigration is actually
Speaker 2: more traumatic than I think most of us really, I
Speaker 2: don't even I didn't even start thinking about it till
Speaker 2: very recently, in like the language of trauma, right, And
Speaker 2: of course trauma is like a word that we now
Speaker 2: throw around quite a bit and freely, so I'm actually
Speaker 2: quite careful in how I use it. But I do
Speaker 2: think that there's actually a huge amount of loss that
Speaker 2: comes from I know, there's a huge amount of loss
Speaker 2: that comes from leaving your home and starting out in
Speaker 2: a new place. And they were kind of doing it
Speaker 2: for the second time. I was actually born here, but
Speaker 2: once my father finished grad school, like, we moved back
Speaker 2: to Nigeria. So they were coming back and they'd been
Speaker 2: here before, but they were going through their own challenges,
Speaker 2: and I think they were raising teenagers, and they had
Speaker 2: a lot of fear about out us losing our culture
Speaker 2: or kind of getting sucked into kind of I think
Speaker 2: there were things about America that scared them.
Speaker 1: I mean, like I would imagine and I don't come
Speaker 1: from a family of immigrants or you know, not any
Speaker 1: immigration that happened a long time back. But I imagine
Speaker 1: the dream for an immigrant parent would be take advantage
Speaker 1: of the financial opportunity and take refuge in your own
Speaker 1: home culture.
Speaker 2: You got it. That was That was exactly it, and
Speaker 2: that was the rule from day one for us. Was
Speaker 2: like in this house, this is Nigeria. Out there, do
Speaker 2: whatever you want, but in here, this is Nigeria.
Speaker 1: Your dad's a professor. So you might think perhaps maybe
Speaker 1: a little more, maybe it was a little more open
Speaker 1: minded than I'm expecting. But what was expected of you?
Speaker 1: What do you think they were hoping for your future?
Speaker 2: I think what you said was really right, like you
Speaker 2: actually described it so succinctly and perfectly, which is take
Speaker 2: advantage of the economic opportunity that's available in America. But
Speaker 2: in terms of your life path and your own personal values,
Speaker 2: you continue to be as Nigerian as possible, which is
Speaker 2: an impossible project, right, Like it is impossible, Like you know,
Speaker 2: and the life of a Nigerian woman's actually quite prescribed
Speaker 2: and defined, which is once you hit a certain age,
Speaker 2: you get married and you have kids and that's that's that,
Speaker 2: and you continue you replicate and in our culture, children
Speaker 2: are like children are your inheritance. Children are everything, and
Speaker 2: so for them it was like once you hit a
Speaker 2: certain age, you get married, like twenty five twenty six basically,
Speaker 2: and you have children. And I don't have children and
Speaker 2: I'm not married, and so those things for them, I
Speaker 2: think is challenging, right because I also made very different
Speaker 2: choices with my professional wife, But for a very long time,
Speaker 2: I kind of stayed on the path and the traditional
Speaker 2: path that you know, looked really good from the outside,
Speaker 2: that kind of really fit into what they wanted. But
Speaker 2: I think that this kind of personal piece is also
Speaker 2: really is really huge in our culture. It's a very
Speaker 2: the life of a woman is very very clear. Oh
Speaker 2: and I'm Nigerian, but specifically I'm Eurorobat, which is the
Speaker 2: tribe that I come from.
Speaker 1: What does a career look like? Then, if you're expected
Speaker 1: to be married with kids at twenty five, oh.
Speaker 2: You're expected to do all of that. Like my father,
Speaker 2: we had three girls and a boy. There was never
Speaker 2: any distinction between where we were expected to accomplish at all.
Speaker 2: Like it was like from day one you were expected
Speaker 2: to produce, you were expected to be a rock star,
Speaker 2: and that was the end of that. But simultaneously on
Speaker 2: top of that, for women, you're also expected to bring
Speaker 2: that same level of excellence to the home and be
Speaker 2: a homemaker and all of those things. So when we
Speaker 2: were growing up, professional achievement was a given. I think
Speaker 2: what was different about it or kind of what was
Speaker 2: on top of that was doctor, lawyer, architect, engineer, and
Speaker 2: that was basically it. Right, there's a reason you have
Speaker 2: so many Nigerian doctors. It's not because like they all
Speaker 2: wanted to be doctors, you know in America, Like there's
Speaker 2: so many. I mean, it's that's not it. Or an accountant,
Speaker 2: sorry I forgot accounting.
Speaker 1: Did any of those seem remotely appealing to you as
Speaker 1: a kid.
Speaker 2: I love the arts, I love theater. All the kids.
Speaker 2: The only kids that were nice to me were the
Speaker 2: theater kids, like the weirdo theater kids. And I say
Speaker 2: that with such love and affection. I proudly am one
Speaker 2: of them. And those were my friends. And that's what
Speaker 2: I wanted to just wanted to be an actor when
Speaker 2: I was younger, and my parents were like, well acting kidney,
Speaker 2: like what we did not come to America for you
Speaker 2: to be an actor, you know, And they had this
Speaker 2: thing that they always said like you must have a certificate,
Speaker 2: you know, like there's an idea that like a piece
Speaker 2: of paper that no one can take away from you.
Speaker 1: So that's like a diploma certificate.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like not just a diploma, like you know, being
Speaker 2: a doctor, you have an actual professional certification. If you're
Speaker 2: a lawyer, you have a particular you know, if you're
Speaker 2: an engineer. You know, these kind of professions where somebody
Speaker 2: says you are skilled to do this.
Speaker 1: I have never heard of put that way. That is
Speaker 1: a great way of putting it.
Speaker 2: It's not a diploma.
Speaker 1: Children, you must have a certificate.
Speaker 2: Right, So no one can take your certificate from you. Right,
Speaker 2: So that really leaves like four or five professions with certificates.
Speaker 2: And so you know, my older sister is a doctor,
Speaker 2: I'm a lawyer. My little sister's a lawyer.
Speaker 1: How did you pick?
Speaker 2: I picked law because this was the time where people
Speaker 2: would say, if you don't know what to do, you
Speaker 2: can go to law school and you can do anything
Speaker 2: with it, which is not true. Like, if I could
Speaker 2: leave one lesson on this entire conversation, do not go
Speaker 2: to law school because you don't know what else to do,
Speaker 2: and you think you can do anything with a law degree, because.
Speaker 1: That is not true.
Speaker 2: If you have a law degree, you can be a lawyer.
Speaker 2: That's it. That was what I mean. I feel like
Speaker 2: it's changed a little bit, but late nineties, like early
Speaker 2: two thousands, it was like, oh, you know, if you're
Speaker 2: stilling worrying, you can you know, there's so much versatility
Speaker 2: with a law degree. You can do all sorts of
Speaker 2: things with it. No, it's not true. You can be
Speaker 2: a lawyer, that's it.
Speaker 1: I wonder if that was the sneaky way just to
Speaker 1: get your kids into well, if the law school.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, in law schools they have their
Speaker 2: own racket. That's a whole nother conversation. But yeah, I
Speaker 2: really believed it. I didn't know. Again, you have to
Speaker 2: realize I was twenty when I graduated from cayl Wow.
Speaker 2: So twenty yeah, because I started I was twelve years
Speaker 2: old in eighth grade. So I was twenty years old
Speaker 2: and you are sixteen. Yeah, I was a sixteen when
Speaker 2: I first Yeah, it was a terrible idea. Wow, should
Speaker 2: we say that we went to the same speek.
Speaker 1: We went we both were both Cowers.
Speaker 2: Both when we both go Barris, We both went same
Speaker 2: undergrad so that's why.
Speaker 1: But you you wind up after Berkeley, you end up
Speaker 1: at NYU Law School.
Speaker 2: Well, so there's a tension that's happening while I'm at
Speaker 2: cayl right, because I want a major in theater. I'm
Speaker 2: not that good and my parents are like no, so
Speaker 2: I minor in theater and then I.
Speaker 1: And major in business.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I get into right, so the business program
Speaker 2: is like difficult to get into. I get into it
Speaker 2: and it's you don't turn it down, right, So.
Speaker 1: It's like best business schools in the country.
Speaker 2: And I'm like, So I'm like at HOSS and I'm
Speaker 2: like minory in theater and literally I might as well
Speaker 2: have been to people like walking up the hill to
Speaker 2: hass is like I'm being tortured. And then theater I'm like,
Speaker 2: loving my life. But but that bifurcation of the thing
Speaker 2: that your spirit and soul, the thing that makes you
Speaker 2: feel awake, versus the thing that is expected. And at
Speaker 2: this point I'm not it's not just my parents, it's
Speaker 2: also my own. I think I've also bought into the
Speaker 2: idea that you need a profession or a job that
Speaker 2: gives you stability and gives you an identity and I
Speaker 2: like the paycheck, right, Like you know, I like the paycheck.
Speaker 2: I'm I'm really independent. I wanted to be able to
Speaker 2: have my own kind of everything at a very young age.
Speaker 2: So I came to visit my sister, older sister who
Speaker 2: was at TULU, who's at NYU Medical School at the time,
Speaker 2: fell in love with the city, fell so hard for
Speaker 2: New York and was like, I'm moving here. I don't
Speaker 2: care how it's going to happen. And I went back
Speaker 2: to the ban and I was like, I got to
Speaker 2: get out of here. And this was when the if
Speaker 2: you don't know what to do and you're exploring and
Speaker 2: your law degree and is versatile, it was like, what's
Speaker 2: the answer, and why you law? That's the answer, and
Speaker 2: that's what I did.
Speaker 1: What was that experience?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 2: I love law school? I absolutely loved it.
Speaker 1: What did you love about it?
Speaker 2: The education itself is a different type of thinking. It's
Speaker 2: a different It's literally like learning a new language and
Speaker 2: a new way of communicating. You are being forced to,
Speaker 2: first of all, I think, just being analytical and ask
Speaker 2: really specific and new questions, to look at a situation
Speaker 2: a certain way, and then kind of consider all the
Speaker 2: different ways that you can look at a situation like
Speaker 2: such a situation. Also, the law school model is you know,
Speaker 2: you're with the same one hundred people in your class
Speaker 2: all day, kind of like going back to elementary school,
Speaker 2: where like you're not changing classes, you're literally with the
Speaker 2: same people for a whole year. So I just got
Speaker 2: to meet some of the best, most interesting people in
Speaker 2: my life and they're still in my life. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's the thing. The joke about LUSCH was it attracts
Speaker 2: all these people who don't know what else they want
Speaker 2: to do, so you end up meeting some really dope people.
Speaker 2: And like NYU was really fun, and like I think about, it,
Speaker 2: laid the groundwork for so much of what I'm doing
Speaker 2: now in so many ways, strange ways. So the study
Speaker 2: of law is actually fantastic. It's the practice of law
Speaker 2: that is not so fun.
Speaker 1: What were your first couple of jobs after?
Speaker 2: My first job was really long. It was a six
Speaker 2: year job. I was an associate at Clary Gottlieb. I'm
Speaker 2: not sure I should say their name, but is it
Speaker 2: a fancy white shoe law firm downtown? Very How should
Speaker 2: I say this? So when you graduate from certain law
Speaker 2: schools in this country. There's something that's kind of in
Speaker 2: some ways it's wonderful that they've really set up, which
Speaker 2: is like you graduate from law school and you go
Speaker 2: work for these corporate law firms and usually you owe
Speaker 2: a lot of money and they pay an insane amount
Speaker 2: of money and everybody kind of gets paid the same.
Speaker 2: Like you can google the salaries now, which I don't
Speaker 2: even know what they are, but at that time it
Speaker 2: was like one hundred and twenty five thousand dollars a year.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And you have a secretary, you have an annex card,
Speaker 2: you have cards that take you home every night. In
Speaker 2: these jobs, they come to the school to interview you.
Speaker 2: The firms come to the schools, especially like New York
Speaker 2: schools from the Boston schools. Yeah, and they take you
Speaker 2: out to all the fancy restaurants, the no Boos, the Boulets,
Speaker 2: the Danielle's, like free, they pay for everything. It's like
Speaker 2: a recruiting period. Right. You think you're eating free stuff.
Speaker 2: It's not free, because nothing in life is free.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: They're going to get it out of you later. And
Speaker 2: you also remember you owe. In my case, I owed money.
Speaker 2: I owed a lot of money, and so I owed
Speaker 2: from my undergrad and I owed from law school. So
Speaker 2: you now have these like shiny toys being given to you.
Speaker 2: It's a very hard thing to say no to, especially
Speaker 2: when you are that young. And again, I think New
Speaker 2: York City can be I love the city, but I
Speaker 2: think sometimes there's there's it can be very intoxicating. And
Speaker 2: I totally got intoxicated by like the yeah, the fanciness
Speaker 2: of everything, you know, Like why is that well, I
Speaker 2: mean think about it. You're twenty something, like I've never
Speaker 2: seen this kind of money before my life. And these trappings,
Speaker 2: you know, they're called golden handcuffs for a reason. Like
Speaker 2: these trappings feel, they appear nice. Right, I'm gonna have
Speaker 2: like my own office. I'm gonna have my own secretary.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna have an AMEX card, you know, and you
Speaker 2: know BlackBerry, all these things right that at that age,
Speaker 2: I think I confused for like adulthood or something. So
Speaker 2: I took the job at Cleary and it was phenomenal
Speaker 2: legal training. But again, when you are not in alignment,
Speaker 2: I don't care how much you dress up that pig
Speaker 2: with all the lipsticks, It's not gonna work. And the
Speaker 2: thing about law firms is you are there at eight years,
Speaker 2: you're gonna make partner or you're out. I mean, I
Speaker 2: was not any close to making partner.
Speaker 1: So do you think that's because the passion wasn't there.
Speaker 2: I think it's really impossible to be great at anything
Speaker 2: if you don't have some kind of innate, innate thing
Speaker 2: for it. I think it's actually impossible. It's literally rowing
Speaker 2: against the current innate desire for it, or any desire
Speaker 2: innate talent. I'm doing corporal or where you have to
Speaker 2: like mark up a three hundred page document. No, I
Speaker 2: don't have the talent for that. It's so boring. And
Speaker 2: that's just the fact. And I think this is part
Speaker 2: of what I'm saying, like you have to know yourself.
Speaker 1: We'll be back with more of my conversation with Busso
Speaker 1: or Lupona after the break. We're back with more of
Speaker 1: Busseo or Lupona. At this point in her story, she's
Speaker 1: burnt out in her lock career, but she loves fashion,
Speaker 1: so she thinks she could make it in the industry
Speaker 1: as a designer. She has money and an idea. How
Speaker 1: hard could it be? So we haven't talked yet about fashion.
Speaker 1: Did you care about fashion as a teenager, When did
Speaker 1: fashion into your life and in what way I cared.
Speaker 2: About fashion as a kid, because I always remember my
Speaker 2: first like deep fashion memory was my father coming back
Speaker 2: from South Korea and buying me a red dress that
Speaker 2: I become obsessed with, like I literally cannot stop wearing
Speaker 2: a stress and like that's my first like deep fashion memory.
Speaker 2: And also you're about culture. We're obsessed with clothes. We
Speaker 2: have a tradition in our culture called should I be,
Speaker 2: which means that when you're doing any kind of event,
Speaker 2: we pick up fabric right and everybody wears that fabric,
Speaker 2: and so you design your own version of that fabric
Speaker 2: because it identifies the relationship between you and the people
Speaker 2: doing the event. So there's always opportunities to kind of
Speaker 2: design because anytime you have an event coming, you have
Speaker 2: to like make up a new outfit. And the law
Speaker 2: firm really factors into fashion for me because I had
Speaker 2: the kind of strong call to start going back to
Speaker 2: Nigeria and like visiting my family and like reconnecting with
Speaker 2: my culture, like the early two thousands. I think the
Speaker 2: first time I go back is two thousand and two,
Speaker 2: and then starting two thousand and five, I start going
Speaker 2: every year. It becomes almost like a pilgrimage. I don't
Speaker 2: understand why, but every year I buy a ticket and
Speaker 2: I go. And starting in eight I started making clothes
Speaker 2: for myself, like things I wanted to wear back. So
Speaker 2: I'm at the law firm now I started clearing at
Speaker 2: two thousand and five. I'm at the firm, but I
Speaker 2: know that I want to start wearing clothes that are
Speaker 2: kind of at the intersection of both cultures.
Speaker 1: At the intersection of what's appropriate professionally exactly and.
Speaker 2: Culture and tradition exactly. And that's like actually a very
Speaker 2: specific thing.
Speaker 1: I don't even know that would exist, it.
Speaker 2: Did it, and so that's why I was going to
Speaker 2: make it, and so but I also knew in the
Speaker 2: beginning it was just that was literally the initial impetus
Speaker 2: was like I wanted to wear clothes that I could
Speaker 2: wear to a very traditional law firm. I mean, people
Speaker 2: would still stare, but like it wasn't so crazy, but
Speaker 2: like would fit in the law firm, but also kind
Speaker 2: of captured my culture and tradition. But at this point
Speaker 2: I'm wearing it around the office and there's some stuff
Speaker 2: that people are like, oh great, and then all this timeployee.
Speaker 2: You see like a double take, like what the fuck
Speaker 2: is she wearing?
Speaker 1: Were you ever like reprimanded?
Speaker 2: Any official clarity was no, it's not it's not that
Speaker 2: kind of place. It's very international law firm. And the
Speaker 2: clothes really marked me as being different. I mean that
Speaker 2: was very clear. And then I think that desire of
Speaker 2: like I need to show up a certain way was
Speaker 2: becoming like I could not ignore that anymore, Like it
Speaker 2: was becoming like overwhelming in many ways.
Speaker 1: And in a way it might have been a physical
Speaker 1: manifestation of your litteral inner feeling of I shouldn't be here. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: I don't belong here.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, there were other ways. I mean there were so
Speaker 2: many things that that marked me. So at this point
Speaker 2: we kind of sit down me in the firm and
Speaker 2: are like we need to go out separate ways. So
Speaker 2: it was like, oh, let's let's divorce in September like
Speaker 2: that kind of thing. So at this point I'm like,
Speaker 2: you know what, I'm just gonna go work on Pussia.
Speaker 1: How do you get the courage to do that? I
Speaker 1: mean you have loans?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So the thing about remember I've made a crap
Speaker 2: ton of money for six years, so I had like
Speaker 2: a pretty nice nest egg, which was stupid in my
Speaker 2: In my mind, I thought, oh, this is great. I
Speaker 2: have enough money, I know, because I don't give up anything.
Speaker 2: I don't move back home with my parents, I don't
Speaker 2: get a cheaper apartment. I don't make any of the
Speaker 2: adjustments you have to make when you lose like your
Speaker 2: primary source of income and you are now starting a
Speaker 2: fashion brand. I mean I did this in like the
Speaker 2: dumbest way possible. I thought, Yeah, I thought the clothes
Speaker 2: were going to come out on the market and on
Speaker 2: the website, and I was just gonna make tons of sales.
Speaker 2: I mean I was already selling when I was at
Speaker 2: the firm doing pop ups. But I really felt like
Speaker 2: if I moved to do this full time, you know,
Speaker 2: I was going to get a lot of like big
Speaker 2: store accounts, and next thing, you know, I would be
Speaker 2: like able to live off of this brand.
Speaker 3: Where did that delusion come from? I was gonna call
Speaker 3: it assuredness self assuredness delusion, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you're a lawyer and now you're
Speaker 1: quitting your job, and you're saying I'm going to end
Speaker 1: up in all these I.
Speaker 2: Think it's At first, I think it's not knowing, like
Speaker 2: not really understanding how challenging the fashion business really is.
Speaker 2: You have to know the business that you're entering, right, Like,
Speaker 2: if you're going to do what I did, should like
Speaker 2: have a deeper understanding of how the business works. Right.
Speaker 2: I didn't have that, right, Like, there's stuff that you
Speaker 2: can read from books, But like every business, anything you're pursuing,
Speaker 2: has its own language, has its own calendar, has its
Speaker 2: own scheduling, has its own way of people doing things
Speaker 2: in that space. So I immediately decide that I'm going
Speaker 2: to go to a trade show, and there's a huge
Speaker 2: trade show in Vegas. I'm resourceful, right, I'm on the
Speaker 2: computer clackety clock figuring out which trade shows are good
Speaker 2: for fashion. I buy a booth, right because I have
Speaker 2: all this money, And I buy a booth and put
Speaker 2: on my clothes, and again I'm thinking, I'm going to
Speaker 2: come back from that trade show and I'm going to
Speaker 2: have like fifty new stores and we're going to be
Speaker 2: in business. Go to Magic, which is that's the trade
Speaker 2: show in Vegas. Spend drag my best friend, We spend
Speaker 2: in hotels, we do everything. The booth is I think
Speaker 2: five thousand dollars, so you can do the Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: that expensive, you can do the math. And I come
Speaker 2: back with I think two or three store accounts.
Speaker 1: Now that that to me sounds like a success.
Speaker 2: I mean, we spent ten thousand dollars by the time
Speaker 2: I paid for the booth, our hotel, flying to Vegas,
Speaker 2: getting the close to Vegas. Uh, it was almost like
Speaker 2: seven or eight thousand dollars. And the orders are like
Speaker 2: two three thousand each maybe, so they're tiny stores. It's
Speaker 2: good in the sense that a couple places are like, oh,
Speaker 2: what you're doing is interesting. I remember getting a lot
Speaker 2: of questions and like and it's still something I battle
Speaker 2: against today. It's like, are these made by a collective?
Speaker 2: In Africa? It's like, no, we don't do collectives. You know,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of attachment to that idea of like
Speaker 2: a collective of women like so wingful, Like people have
Speaker 2: a thing about that, and I'm like, no, we don't
Speaker 2: think that this very charitable model, like oh, you're helping
Speaker 2: the women. Oh, And I'm like what, Like, no, we
Speaker 2: don't do that. I don't know anything about collectives. So
Speaker 2: I pay for magic right, Like in my brain this
Speaker 2: is going to be like, get me to where I
Speaker 2: need to go. I would walk into boutiques and be like,
Speaker 2: hey you, I'm a designer from Brooklyn and and you know,
Speaker 2: would love to sell you my collection. You don't do that.
Speaker 2: That's not how the business works. There's a schedule to
Speaker 2: these things. You can't just walk into somebody's store and
Speaker 2: say like, do you want to buy my stuff? So
Speaker 2: I just make so many mistakes. I still keep having
Speaker 2: my pop ups, which are like people are starting to
Speaker 2: respond to. So I would basically rent a space. I
Speaker 2: ended up for most of the life of the brand
Speaker 2: before things kind of blew up, renting a space on
Speaker 2: Avenue C and would literally set up my clothes, would
Speaker 2: take all my racks and all the clothes and set
Speaker 2: them up in the space and invite people to come
Speaker 2: for two days to come buy from us Avenue C
Speaker 2: and the Lower East Side. Literally, these guys, I forget
Speaker 2: how I found them. They just had an empty space
Speaker 2: and they would rent it out to different different businesses.
Speaker 2: So once I found them, I would do a pop
Speaker 2: up like three or four times a year. But I
Speaker 2: mean I blew through the savings very very quickly. So
Speaker 2: by twenty fifteen. I was broke.
Speaker 1: I had no money, and you started this thing.
Speaker 2: Twenty eleven late twenty eleven. Twenty twelve was like our
Speaker 2: official launch, So by twenty fifteen there was no money left.
Speaker 1: Welcome back with the rest of my conversation with Bussio
Speaker 1: O Lupona. After the break, after diving headfirst into the
Speaker 1: fashion world without doing the legwork to understand the industry,
Speaker 1: Bussio lost all her money. She had to find a
Speaker 1: way to sustain herself and to keep her business dreams alive.
Speaker 2: Went back to applying for jobs, legal jobs, which was
Speaker 2: really painful. Crazily, I ended up getting a job with
Speaker 2: New York City, like literally under the nick of time.
Speaker 2: I got a job as a lawyer for one of
Speaker 2: the agencies for the city. That was March of twenty fifteen.
Speaker 2: And the joke was we were in one office when
Speaker 2: I got the job, and then within like nine months
Speaker 2: we were moving to a new office, and the new
Speaker 2: office was in the same building as Clary Gottlieb as
Speaker 2: my law firm. Yeah, and I remember walking in to
Speaker 2: the same building and making a third of what I
Speaker 2: made before, No secretary, nothing, sitting in a tiny cubicle
Speaker 2: that is maybe half the space of this tiny room
Speaker 2: that you and I were sitting in bullpen where everyone's
Speaker 2: around you. And I remember the first day I cried
Speaker 2: because now I was like the brand wasn't doing well,
Speaker 2: I wasn't making any money, and now I had to
Speaker 2: go back to law.
Speaker 1: Back to where you started literally physically with the Wars office.
Speaker 2: Yeah, with nothing, like I felt at the time, felt
Speaker 2: like I was like spiraling, like you know, And I
Speaker 2: remember that it was like walking in that day and
Speaker 2: then seeing the people, you know, because I left. I
Speaker 2: left the firm like I'm going to go launch my
Speaker 2: business and you know, the fanfare of that, and now
Speaker 2: I'm coming back and like now I'm like a worker bee,
Speaker 2: like really worker bee. And it was really painful. It
Speaker 2: was really painful for like a few weeks because I
Speaker 2: had to kind of make that mental shift like this
Speaker 2: is why we're here, and we have to like make
Speaker 2: a living and we have to like there's certain things
Speaker 2: that we have to do to get ourselves. And at
Speaker 2: this point, I'm thirty seven, thirty six, right, I don't
Speaker 2: own a home. There are things that I want for
Speaker 2: myself that I don't have. Yea, I have this business
Speaker 2: that's like fledgling and barely making it. So this is
Speaker 2: when I do think about the wisdom of my father,
Speaker 2: which is I have a certificate that I can use.
Speaker 2: So I was able to like dust that thing off
Speaker 2: and get another job. And then that was the beginning
Speaker 2: of what I think is like the kind of second
Speaker 2: phase of the business.
Speaker 1: How did you recover from that beyond being able to
Speaker 1: reset at this job? Like what did what did you
Speaker 1: do beyond being on the reset so that.
Speaker 2: That job is a lifeline, right, Like, and I think that,
Speaker 2: you know, when I was thinking about this conversation, we
Speaker 2: never know how our story is ending right or where
Speaker 2: it's going right. So in that moment, I, as I
Speaker 2: told you, as I entered that building, I was so devastated.
Speaker 2: I just like I'd lost something, you know. But it
Speaker 2: was all about what people were going to say, Like oh,
Speaker 2: if I run into someone and be like, oh, what
Speaker 2: are you doing here? You know, Like so much of
Speaker 2: my angst was about the outside appearance. And then twenty nineteen,
Speaker 2: I had like a major health challenge that would have
Speaker 2: bankrupted me if I had not had this job, right,
Speaker 2: if I had just been a working artist, like the
Speaker 2: bills were astronomical and if I didn't have this job, like,
Speaker 2: there's no way. And so for me, that job ended
Speaker 2: up saving my life. And then more than that, it
Speaker 2: gave me a little bit of peace of mind because
Speaker 2: I wasn't waking up every day like I've got to
Speaker 2: sell these dresses, I've got to sell these stresses. Like
Speaker 2: I could kind of be a little bit more relaxed
Speaker 2: about my work and my designs and think about what
Speaker 2: do I want to see in the world, and if
Speaker 2: I have a pop up, I wasn't like hysterical, like
Speaker 2: if nobody buys anything, I'm not going to be able
Speaker 2: to pay my rent. Like I didn't have that kind
Speaker 2: of energy which people can smell that this is counterintuitive.
Speaker 1: So it's sort of like not putting the entirety of
Speaker 1: your energy into your business, which you would think that's
Speaker 1: the move really allowed it the space that needed to
Speaker 1: grow yep in its own time.
Speaker 2: YEP. This government legal job was a normal nine to five, right.
Speaker 2: It was a very low stakes, low intensity environment. And
Speaker 2: so because of that, we actually have a lot of
Speaker 2: time outside for where the business was at at that time.
Speaker 2: It was actually the perfect thing and I could approach
Speaker 2: it now with love and compassion and passion. I was
Speaker 2: like doing this because I wanted to, not because I
Speaker 2: had to pay the bills. And that completely changed my
Speaker 2: relationship with the business and also gave me peace of mind.
Speaker 2: That was like the biggest, the biggest gift that I
Speaker 2: got from that job, and so I was able to
Speaker 2: use that time to really keep working on my baby,
Speaker 2: my business, and so it really freed me up. And
Speaker 2: then also the energy I brought to it was just
Speaker 2: totally different because now I didn't need it. I was
Speaker 2: doing it because I wanted to.
Speaker 1: Now that you have the sort of freedom, like what
Speaker 1: were the sort of successes that started to accumulate that
Speaker 1: allowed you to be where you're at now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there were a few things. Twenty thirteen, I'd
Speaker 2: seen a film Pariah Now my friend at a peros
Speaker 2: Ouduie start in the film, and something in my spirit
Speaker 2: just said, like reach out to her and message her
Speaker 2: and like say hi, and introduce the brand to her
Speaker 2: and see if you dress her for something. I didn't
Speaker 2: know her. I found her on Facebook at the time.
Speaker 2: I feel like now she would probably not respond. But
Speaker 2: at the time, you know, was before like social media
Speaker 2: was you know, very like it was still early twenty twelve,
Speaker 2: twenty thirteen, so.
Speaker 1: It's as curate, manicured ass.
Speaker 2: So I messaged at a Pero and I was like, hey,
Speaker 2: I saw your movie. I loved it. I would love
Speaker 2: to dress you for something. She's like, oh, thank you.
Speaker 2: Where are you. I'm like, I'm in Brooklyn. She's like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I'm in Brooklyn. And I was like, well,
Speaker 2: do you want to come over? And she came over
Speaker 2: and tried on clothes and is still a dear friend
Speaker 2: of mine. And she ended up introducing the brand to
Speaker 2: so many of her friends who are other actors. So
Speaker 2: Lupizza ended up wearing us in twenty fifteen.
Speaker 1: Oh I you're using first names here.
Speaker 2: Lupita and Youngo. Yeah, but that was from but that
Speaker 2: was literally from I mean the way that that was
Speaker 2: from this just this a little tiny thought that was like,
Speaker 2: oh you should you know I saw this movie at
Speaker 2: a pero. Is your by like me from Nigeria? And
Speaker 2: something said message her and see if she would want
Speaker 2: to dress her.
Speaker 1: I think it goes to show how often these little
Speaker 1: gestures can actually pay off.
Speaker 2: Yep, they can pay off hugely. Yeah, big lely big
Speaker 2: The pay off bigley. They can pay off bigly because
Speaker 2: that message messaging her on Facebook is what led to
Speaker 2: She had done twelve years of slave with Lupita and
Speaker 2: introduced us, and then we ended up dressing Lupita for
Speaker 2: I think a press tour in twenty fifteen. Just like
Speaker 2: just a few pieces, you know, along the way, I
Speaker 2: find mentors. So one of my mentors a woman named
Speaker 2: Mercedes Gonzales, who really teaches me like, this is how
Speaker 2: the fashion business works, these are the things that you
Speaker 2: need to be doing at this time. I'd seen Mercedes
Speaker 2: speak when I went to Magic in Vegas and.
Speaker 1: The first one, yeah, the first one were you.
Speaker 2: Lost where I lost? I didn't make any money, And
Speaker 2: she kind of adopted me and she's just an amazing
Speaker 2: woman and kind of came back and and it really
Speaker 2: became her student and was just like, Okay, what do
Speaker 2: I do? And I always say she's really instrumental in
Speaker 2: the brand's success because even though I wasn't selling successfully
Speaker 2: every season, she was demanding a new collection. So like
Speaker 2: when you haven't sold last season's collection and someone is like,
Speaker 2: where's the new collection, You're kind of like, uh, excuse.
Speaker 1: Me, You're not feeling inspired to create, but.
Speaker 2: She is like, where's the new collection? Have you shot
Speaker 2: the collection? Like she was just really on top of
Speaker 2: because she mentors like a number of fashion designers, and
Speaker 2: she had really taken me under her wing and really
Speaker 2: demanded that I like show up to the marketplace every season,
Speaker 2: because if you don't have a new collection, you're not
Speaker 2: a fashion designer. Even though I was like, wait, nobody
Speaker 2: bought the last one, you know, Mercedes was like, where's
Speaker 2: the next collection? And she really was on top of that,
Speaker 2: you know. And then are you making calls to stores?
Speaker 2: Are you trying to sell it? And I cold calling?
Speaker 2: I was so bad at it because you think, okay,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm selling you something and I'm somehow intruding on you,
Speaker 2: you know, and my brain would just like couldn't, couldn't
Speaker 2: do it, you know. It was really struggling with like
Speaker 2: cold calls and all that stuff, which is what you
Speaker 2: have to do as a designer. You have to get
Speaker 2: in front of the people that you want to sell
Speaker 2: your clothes to. That's like really critical and I just
Speaker 2: was really struggling with that. I mean, I think fashion
Speaker 2: is interesting, like you can have a brand and you
Speaker 2: can do all the fashion shows you want, and you
Speaker 2: can have all the press you want, but if you're
Speaker 2: not selling, what's the point, you know? And I also
Speaker 2: really love Mercedes for that because she, you know, she
Speaker 2: says this thing that I think is really useful for
Speaker 2: fashion designers to hear, but for any business, which is
Speaker 2: are you trying to get rich or are you trying
Speaker 2: to get famous? And if you're trying to get famous,
Speaker 2: this is not the business for you, especially for fashion,
Speaker 2: because I think you can actually get it confused, like
Speaker 2: if you're getting all the press and you're getting all
Speaker 2: these things that somehow how like the business is successful,
Speaker 2: and if you are not actually selling, you don't have
Speaker 2: a business. You just don't, even with all the press,
Speaker 2: you know. So I'm always trying to like, I appreciate
Speaker 2: the press, it's fantastic, but that's like the most important
Speaker 2: part is like are you in the marketplace and are
Speaker 2: people buying the product?
Speaker 1: So if you need to ask yourself the question are
Speaker 1: you in this to be famous or are you in
Speaker 1: this to sell close to be rich? To be rich?
Speaker 1: Which we to be rich is how she puts it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: which which we can just distill down to like to
Speaker 1: sell clothes to actually sell the tab people enjoy the
Speaker 1: thing and buy the thing and spread through word of
Speaker 1: mouth or however right people wanting to go into buy
Speaker 1: your thing. Do you need to be in department stores
Speaker 1: to be rich as a designer.
Speaker 2: A lot of people disagree with the answer because many
Speaker 2: people will tell you like.
Speaker 1: Oh, no, you can be boutique.
Speaker 2: You can be boutique. But to be honest with you,
Speaker 2: my experience in terms of scaling, it would have been
Speaker 2: very very hard to do like a direct a consumer
Speaker 2: business and get to the point where we are at.
Speaker 2: It would have been very very difficult, even specialty boutiques.
Speaker 2: I think it would have just been really hard. I mean,
Speaker 2: for me, there was no path that I saw to
Speaker 2: being able to support the business and have it be
Speaker 2: like an independent successful brand without department stores. I just
Speaker 2: don't see it. You know. If I look at our
Speaker 2: numbers and like, who's our kind of biggest customers, it
Speaker 2: is our department stores. So it's really really difficult to
Speaker 2: kind of think about it without them.
Speaker 1: Like to end up there must feel really good. It
Speaker 1: does your stuff in this thing where you know, like
Speaker 1: even someone even if someone doesn't buy it, like people
Speaker 1: are seeing your stuff in masks as they go through.
Speaker 2: Yeah, seeing the name, I didn't think that I would
Speaker 2: get any kick out of it, but it really did well.
Speaker 2: Two things give me a kick being able to see
Speaker 2: made in Nigeria on our clothes because Nigeria. First of all,
Speaker 2: I say always say that ourpr in America is terrible,
Speaker 2: even in Nigeria, Like there's kind of a bias to
Speaker 2: whards made in Nigeria. Things. People will make stuff in
Speaker 2: Nigeria and put like maid in China on it, or
Speaker 2: like made in Italy or made in like India.
Speaker 1: Like that that makes it better.
Speaker 2: That makes it better. And so for me, there's something
Speaker 2: really intentional and really powerful about made in Nigeria in
Speaker 2: a place like sax right or name in Marcus, Like,
Speaker 2: that's really important to me. That is probably probably number one. Actually,
Speaker 2: I'm just so incredibly proud of that. And also, you know,
Speaker 2: we as a country really were really challenged economically, right,
Speaker 2: so to be able to create a company that employs
Speaker 2: people in Nigeria produces in Nigeria feels really empowering and
Speaker 2: feels amazing.
Speaker 1: How did you end up in Sacks name and Marcus?
Speaker 1: Come on, this is that's an incredible fee.
Speaker 2: So I think it would not be fair, it wouldn't
Speaker 2: be an accurate telling to not bring up everything that
Speaker 2: happened with the murder of George Floyd and the impact
Speaker 2: that that had in a number of industries is like
Speaker 2: a critical part of the story, Like there's no way
Speaker 2: to tell the story without that, and it just wouldn't
Speaker 2: be truthful. And the fact that this man was slaughtered
Speaker 2: and you know, we all watched, and that's literally what
Speaker 2: opened up many doors. I'm not saying that's the only reason,
Speaker 2: but there was just a seismic change in what consumers
Speaker 2: were demanding from stores, especially these stores that you know
Speaker 2: posted the black squares, right, So when twenty twenty happened,
Speaker 2: and I think people were challenging these companies to say, hey,
Speaker 2: do better in terms of the product assortment, who you're
Speaker 2: offering to us, who you're employing. Right, They were asking
Speaker 2: these questions kind of a three sixty degree view at
Speaker 2: how people were kind of putting their money or not
Speaker 2: putting the money where their mouth is. I think it
Speaker 2: compelled companies to kind of do a lot of inward examination,
Speaker 2: and many didn't like what they saw, right, Like, we
Speaker 2: don't have any black brands on our shelves. So we're
Speaker 2: putting up a score, but our clothes don't represent this
Speaker 2: thing that we're saying that we care about. And so
Speaker 2: I think that compelled many companies to make a change.
Speaker 2: And so one of the buyers at Sacks, Kelsey, she
Speaker 2: came across the brand and she brought us to the
Speaker 2: other buyer who was also named Kelsey, and said, hey,
Speaker 2: we think this would be great, And they were the
Speaker 2: first to I think it was within but this is
Speaker 2: what I'm saying, was like within weeks, Like you know,
Speaker 2: we went from back.
Speaker 1: In weeks the Black Square.
Speaker 2: It was probably a month or two after that.
Speaker 1: Weeks, Yeah, it's weeks.
Speaker 2: Yeah. But then Mercedes, remember she was prepared because she
Speaker 2: had been demanding a collection every season with photographs, So
Speaker 2: I was prepared. You know, what do they say about luck, right,
Speaker 2: Opportunity meets preparation.
Speaker 1: Being at a department store change good fortunes as a brand.
Speaker 2: Well, what happens is that once you're in one or two,
Speaker 2: then other I think people begin to look at you
Speaker 2: a little bit differently, and other stores start looking at
Speaker 2: you differently. So that's certainly changed. I mean, so that's
Speaker 2: definitely changed. I mean I was able to quit my job,
Speaker 2: finally quit your job.
Speaker 1: I mean that's you.
Speaker 2: That was everything that that was really.
Speaker 1: To be able to do that, you know, it's amazing.
Speaker 2: I feel very blessed, I really do. I feel profoundly blessed,
Speaker 2: and I think it's just one piece of a more
Speaker 2: Probably I feel like fashion is the doorway to like
Speaker 2: I come from a long line of teachers. Both my
Speaker 2: parents are teachers, my grandparents were teachers, so part of
Speaker 2: me really feels like that's probably my bigger calling, not
Speaker 2: necessarily like in a classroom, but using this opportunity. The
Speaker 2: storytelling piece of the brand is and really critical for
Speaker 2: me in terms of how do I tell stories that
Speaker 2: complicate the perception of Nigeria, the perception of Africa, the
Speaker 2: perception of Yuba culture, you know, things like our first
Speaker 2: and only video to ever go viral was a video
Speaker 2: from our twenty seventeen editorial shoot of our model getting
Speaker 2: her hair done the way my mom had done my hair,
Speaker 2: the hair style that I took to my first day
Speaker 2: at junior high. But there's a video of the model
Speaker 2: getting her hair done and getting wrapped with thread. So
Speaker 2: literally we shot it while we were shooting our editorial
Speaker 2: collection and posted on Instagram. I wake up the next
Speaker 2: day and I have like two thousand more followers. Then
Speaker 2: when I went to bed and my just like, something's
Speaker 2: happening on your Instagram and literally was that video. Shortly thereafter,
Speaker 2: someone at Vogue saw it and actually wrote an article
Speaker 2: about Bussio what about how this brand was like exploring
Speaker 2: traditional Nigerian hair styles through kind of documenting and telling
Speaker 2: the story. It was just about the hair, not really
Speaker 2: about the clothes. But I was like I'll take that.
Speaker 2: So I was like, we're in Vogue, you know, because
Speaker 2: you know my exploration of you're about culture and Nigerian
Speaker 2: traditions really in an attempt to situate the clothes, Like
Speaker 2: I don't want you to just like go and buy
Speaker 2: our clothes, Like I want you to understand the place
Speaker 2: from which this comes from. And so the storytelling piece
Speaker 2: is very compelling to me, Like I want you to
Speaker 2: I believe everyone can wear our clothes because I get
Speaker 2: that question a lot, but I want you to do
Speaker 2: a little more.
Speaker 1: Can be a white woman?
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I get it all the time. I get
Speaker 2: it all the time, but I want you to do
Speaker 2: a little more work in terms of understand a little
Speaker 2: bit about the culture from which this comes, understand why
Speaker 2: clothes are really important in that cultural context. And so
Speaker 2: that's my job to take you there and to teach
Speaker 2: you a little bit more about this place. And so
Speaker 2: documenting our process, taking our customers along with us as
Speaker 2: we make these clothes from the place in which we
Speaker 2: make it is like a really critical piece of the brand.
Speaker 2: If it's our food, if it's particular specific places in Nigeria,
Speaker 2: if it's the actual making of the fabrics. You know,
Speaker 2: so so much of the dying process I will document,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm taking people along with me on that journey.
Speaker 2: Like so it's been really an amazing entry way. I
Speaker 2: thought it was going to just be about the close,
Speaker 2: but it's become about so much more than that.
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Your mentor asked whether you're in it to
Speaker 1: be famous or rich. Yeah, seems like you've created a
Speaker 1: Thurston lane which is also to teach.
Speaker 2: Yeah, to teach and to have purpose, right, Like, cuse
Speaker 2: close all of this is we're all going to die,
Speaker 2: Like it's it's just closed at the end of the day, right,
Speaker 2: And I guess maybe I'm also at a point in
Speaker 2: my life where I'm really thinking about what it means
Speaker 2: to have like impact and what it means to have
Speaker 2: you know, what is it that people remember about their
Speaker 2: interactions with me, or with my brand or just in life.
Speaker 2: You know, what are the things that actually touch people.
Speaker 2: It's less about the actual physical thing, and it's much
Speaker 2: more about like did you teach someone, how did you
Speaker 2: make them feel? Did you inspire them? You know? And
Speaker 2: I don't have all the answers, but I certainly know
Speaker 2: that mentors made a huge, huge difference for me along
Speaker 2: the way. And I always hate listening to these types
Speaker 2: of conversations and just feel like I didn't get anything
Speaker 2: practical out of it, Like I got like just do it,
Speaker 2: you know. So that's why I'm like trying to drop
Speaker 2: as much resources as I can, because I really do
Speaker 2: think that it's really helpful for people to, you know,
Speaker 2: I want to listen to this conversation and be like, Okay,
Speaker 2: this is what I'm going to do next. You know,
Speaker 2: it's not that easy. And then the other thing is
Speaker 2: that the road was long for me.
Speaker 1: The road you didn't just go for your dream and
Speaker 1: that's the thing you did it. That's the thing. You
Speaker 1: didn't just go for your dream like you went some
Speaker 1: other ways.
Speaker 2: It was just long. It was long and secuitous. But
Speaker 2: I wouldn't change it. I wouldn't.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: It's it's cliche to say, but I wouldn't change anything
Speaker 2: for the journey. This whole journey has taught me. Like
Speaker 2: when you have that little voice that tells you to
Speaker 2: do something, do it, like, do it immediately. It's actually
Speaker 2: it's coming with its own power. It's like that's how
Speaker 2: universe life is trying to help you. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: And oftentimes we either have like numbed that voice that
Speaker 2: we don't hear it, or we hear it and we say,
Speaker 2: oh no, we can't. I can't really do that. Oh no,
Speaker 2: if I do, you know, we think about all the
Speaker 2: reasons not to do it, and I still do it now.
Speaker 2: But what I know is that every single time I've
Speaker 2: listened to that voice and done the thing that it's
Speaker 2: told me to do, my life has changed. Even if
Speaker 2: it's by a tiny degree, it's changed. And so many
Speaker 2: tiny degrees is where you get to where you want
Speaker 2: to go.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you for sharing today, pussayo Olpona.
Speaker 2: Well, thank you. Nice to meet you justin It was
Speaker 2: a wonderful conversation.
Speaker 1: That was Bussyo Olopona, owner of Busio n YC. I'd
Speaker 1: like to thank her for the time she took out
Speaker 1: of her busy schedu during New York Fashion Week to
Speaker 1: share her story to bring joy. The Yoruba definition of
Speaker 1: busaio says a lot. What brings us joy and what
Speaker 1: about us our likes, desires, talents might bring joy to others.
Speaker 1: It's a simple but large question that could help hone
Speaker 1: our path. After all, when life's many unpredictable moments knock
Speaker 1: us off course, what do we often turn to the
Speaker 1: joy in our lives? So if you make your joy,
Speaker 1: your business success becomes a real privilege and well a joy.
Speaker 1: By the way, Busaiyah wanted to make sure I shared
Speaker 1: with you a list of books she's found helpful throughout
Speaker 1: her journey. You could find those in the show notes
Speaker 1: for this episode. Started from the Bottom is produced by
Speaker 1: David Jah, edited by Keisha Williams, Engineered by Eventaliday, Booked
Speaker 1: by Lord Morgan with production help from Lea Rose. Executive
Speaker 1: produced by Jacob Goldstein, Who's not all open the videos
Speaker 1: for Pushkin Industries. Our theme music's by Ben Holliday and
Speaker 1: David Ja featuring Anthony Jaggs and Savannah Joe Lack. Listen
Speaker 1: to start Up from the bottom wherever you get your
Speaker 1: podcasts and if you want ad free episodes available one
Speaker 1: week early sign up for Pushkin Plus. Check out Pushkin
Speaker 1: dot fm or the Apple Show page for more information.
Speaker 1: If you like her show, please remember to share, rate,
Speaker 1: and review us on your podcast app. I'm justin Richmond.