WEBVTT - Republicans' Secret Impeachment Weapon 0:00:01.000 --> 0:00:04.320 The second full day of President Trump's impeachment trial has 0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:07.200 just concluded, and Senator Ted Cruze has come straight from 0:00:07.240 --> 0:00:09.840 the Capitol to our studio here to help give us 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:11.760 all a behind the scenes look into what this means 0:00:11.960 --> 0:00:14.960 for the president and the country. This is Verdict with 0:00:15.040 --> 0:00:26.400 Ted Cruz. Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz. I'm 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:30.240 Michael Knowles. I am joined by the Senator himself, clearly 0:00:30.400 --> 0:00:33.720 a glutton for punishment, not sleeping at all this week, 0:00:34.000 --> 0:00:37.040 going straight from the impeachment trial to the studio, right 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:40.599 back to the Capitol. Well, Michael, I'm thrilled that it's 0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:43.400 at least eleven PM and not three in the morning 0:00:43.440 --> 0:00:45.400 like it was last night. This is an early night. 0:00:45.600 --> 0:00:48.720 It's been twenty two hours now the impeachment trial, and 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:51.880 we've still got a distance to go. But but we're 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:53.720 making progress. You know what I want to do before 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:55.560 we get into what happened today, because I think some 0:00:55.600 --> 0:01:00.200 significant things happened today. We're twenty two hours in. I 0:01:00.200 --> 0:01:03.760 think the vast majority of Americans have completely tuned out 0:01:03.800 --> 0:01:08.200 this impeachment. They are simply not paying attention. What is 0:01:08.240 --> 0:01:13.160 it that the House Democrats are accusing President Trump? Of 0:01:13.200 --> 0:01:16.400 having done what is at the core of this whole 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:20.520 impeachment trial. So the House Democrats voted out two articles 0:01:20.520 --> 0:01:24.120 of impeachment. The first one is something they're calling abusive power. 0:01:24.840 --> 0:01:29.440 The second one they're calling obstruction of Congress. Neither one 0:01:29.440 --> 0:01:31.960 of those is a crime. Neither one of those I 0:01:32.040 --> 0:01:35.759 believe is an impeachable offense. But what do those refer 0:01:35.880 --> 0:01:39.720 to specifically? So abusive powers where they focused most of 0:01:39.760 --> 0:01:43.360 their time, And what they're arguing is that the president 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:47.240 delayed military aid to Ukraine. Now, Ukraine, as a country 0:01:47.280 --> 0:01:49.080 in Europe, used to be part of the Soviet Union, 0:01:49.600 --> 0:01:52.400 broke off. It's now separate democracy, it's a friend, it's 0:01:52.440 --> 0:01:56.280 an ally. Remember back in twenty fourteen when Obama was president, 0:01:56.520 --> 0:02:01.320 Russia invaded Ukraine invaded what's what's called Crimea, and Russian 0:02:01.320 --> 0:02:04.040 and Ukraine have been in real tension. The Ukrainians don't 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:06.880 like that. The Russians have had a bad history of 0:02:07.320 --> 0:02:09.760 riding in with tanks and invading their country, and so 0:02:09.800 --> 0:02:13.600 we've given them military aid. And what the Democrats are 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:18.320 arguing is the President delayed that military aid in exchange 0:02:18.480 --> 0:02:23.800 for asking Ukraine to launch two investigations, one an investigation 0:02:23.880 --> 0:02:27.880 into whether Ukraine had interfered in the twenty sixteen presidential election, 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:32.000 the election between Trump and Hillary. Okay, and two an 0:02:32.160 --> 0:02:37.480 investigation into Barisma, which is a Ukrainian natural gas company 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:42.720 that on whose board Hunter Biden, Joe Biden's son sat. 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:45.840 They'd paid Biden a whole lot of money and it 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:49.280 was not for his expertise in Ukrainian natural gas. Well, 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:53.440 that is certainly true, right, So this is what people 0:02:53.520 --> 0:02:56.200 referred to as the quid pro quo. Yes, that Trump 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:59.360 was withholding military aid and he wasn't going to release 0:02:59.400 --> 0:03:03.399 the aid until they launched an investigation into the bidens 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:05.880 because he is afraid that he's going to run against 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:09.560 Joe Biden twenty twenty. And they've spent almost every minute 0:03:09.560 --> 0:03:13.600 of the last twenty two hours trying to prove those 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:17.920 two points. Okay, here's the problem. Number one, temporarily delaying 0:03:17.960 --> 0:03:22.600 military aid is not illegal, and it's not an impeachable offense. 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:25.160 Presidents have done that over and over and over again 0:03:25.200 --> 0:03:28.239 all sorts of foreign aid. You see temporary delays that 0:03:28.280 --> 0:03:32.680 are put into place. But number two, asking a foreign 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:36.720 country to engage in an investigation is not illegal on 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:40.040 its face. And it's not an impeachable offense that that's 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:43.400 what there's And in fact, the President admits he asked 0:03:43.520 --> 0:03:46.320 Ukraine to engage in these investigations. So it's it's really 0:03:46.360 --> 0:03:49.320 kind of stunning. They're standing up there arguing over and 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:53.320 over again the President wanted Ukraine to investigate, and Trump 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:56.280 has said on live TV over and over again, yes, 0:03:56.320 --> 0:04:00.800 I wanted Ukraine to investigate. We've seen the transcript from 0:04:00.880 --> 0:04:03.160 this phone call with the President of Ukraine right this 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:05.840 was released. I know most people's eyes glaze over when 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.280 when everyone gets into the weeds over what he did 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.480 with Ukraine and is that impeachable and on and on 0:04:11.520 --> 0:04:14.920 and on. But I think we all basically agree on 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:18.760 the facts of the case, which is they withheld the AID, 0:04:19.000 --> 0:04:21.680 then they release the aid. President Trump did ask for 0:04:21.720 --> 0:04:26.040 an investigation by Ukraine into this corruption. And I guess 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:28.479 what doesn't make sense to me is they impeach the 0:04:28.520 --> 0:04:33.479 president for this except Ukraine got the AID and we 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:36.960 never got an investigation into the corruption. Well, and it's 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:39.480 even you're right on both of those points, but but 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:42.400 but even more broadly so, so it's the narrative from 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:45.400 the House Democrats has changed. You remember there was for 0:04:45.440 --> 0:04:47.320 a couple of months we were hearing over and over 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:52.200 again the phrase quit pro quo. Right, quit pro quo 0:04:52.320 --> 0:04:53.800 is a sort of phrase. Look, most people don't know 0:04:53.880 --> 0:04:56.120 quit pro quo means. It's a Latin phrase. It sounds 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:59.680 kind of scary. Quit pro quos are not illegal. This 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:03.080 would surprise anyone who's turning on the six o'clock news, 0:05:03.400 --> 0:05:08.120 because the media we're breathlessly saying, oh my god, this 0:05:08.200 --> 0:05:10.640 may have been a quid pro quo. So Quid pro 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:14.919 quo is Latin for an exchange of something of value 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:18.359 for something else of value. It means literally, this for 0:05:18.440 --> 0:05:20.159 that right, I give you this, you give me that. 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:23.000 You know, it would take a Yale graduate to to 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:25.960 really dive down on the Latin transfer. You know what 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:28.200 it is. It's my Roman heritage, that's where it comes from. 0:05:28.520 --> 0:05:32.320 But look, quid pro quos in foreign policy, we do 0:05:32.360 --> 0:05:35.760 every single day that they're not only not illegal, that's 0:05:35.760 --> 0:05:37.520 it's the bread and butter of foreign policy. I'll give 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:42.039 you an example. Nicholas Maduro is the dictator of Venezuela. 0:05:42.120 --> 0:05:47.359 Right now, we have sanctions, economic sanctions in place against Venezuela. 0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:50.120 We have said if if Maduro steps down, we'll lift 0:05:50.160 --> 0:05:53.400 those sanctions. That's a quid pro quo. It's out and 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:56.960 it's open. We're lifting sanctions if Maduro steps down. You 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.080 look at Obama's a rand nuclear deal. That was a 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:02.560 quid pro quo. Obama gave over one hundred billion dollars 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:05.480 to Iran in exchange for a promise not to develop 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:08.919 nuclear weapons. Now that's a promise they weren't keeping, and 0:06:08.960 --> 0:06:10.839 they use the money to try to kill Americans. But 0:06:10.839 --> 0:06:14.000 that was a quick pro quote, right, So all of 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:17.279 this focus on was this a quid pro quote misses 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:22.000 the point. The question is whether it was done with 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:26.960 corrupt intent, and that all comes down to whether these investigations, 0:06:26.960 --> 0:06:30.800 whether the President had a valid reason to ask U 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:33.039 Crane to engage in these investigations and to withhold the 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:40.599 aid either or both. But the real peace. If the 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:44.200 President had a valid reason, the legitimate reason to ask 0:06:44.279 --> 0:06:47.200 U Crane to engage in the investigations, then everything the 0:06:47.240 --> 0:06:50.760 House is saying, everything the House Democrats are saying, is nonsense. 0:06:51.839 --> 0:06:56.520 And what is interesting now two days into it is 0:06:56.560 --> 0:06:59.800 they've devoted virtually every moment to trying to prove that 0:06:59.800 --> 0:07:02.240 he asked for the investigations, which he admits, which we 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:06.640 already know this is something which we and almost zero 0:07:07.880 --> 0:07:13.200 to proving that asking for the investigations was illegitimate or inappropriate. Well, 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:14.880 this is what I want to get to. So you've 0:07:14.920 --> 0:07:17.000 now had to sit through twenty two hours of this 0:07:17.480 --> 0:07:20.200 because there were three groups here, right There's there were 0:07:20.200 --> 0:07:23.400 the House Democrats. They're being led by Adam Schiff and 0:07:23.720 --> 0:07:26.800 they're the people who are pushing impeachment. There's President Trump's 0:07:26.880 --> 0:07:29.400 legal team, the White House Counsel and his lawyer, and 0:07:29.440 --> 0:07:32.600 they're the ones defending the president. Then there's the jury 0:07:32.760 --> 0:07:35.360 because this is a trial, and this is a special 0:07:35.440 --> 0:07:39.040 jury because the jury is you, guys, the senators are 0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:42.160 the jury in the impeachment trial. You've been listening to this, 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:45.160 and let me correct you briefly and something. Yes, the 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:48.240 senators of the jury, but oddly enough we're also the judges. 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:52.280 And it's a strange dynamic under the Constitution. The hundred 0:07:52.320 --> 0:07:56.240 senators decide every question of law and every question of fact. 0:07:56.240 --> 0:07:58.320 And it's not a jury like you know, if you 0:07:58.360 --> 0:08:00.200 turn on Law and Order, it's not a jury like 0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:02.480 that you think about it. A jury is not supposed 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:04.600 to know anything about the case. Is not supposed to know. 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:07.480 The defendant is not supposed to know the prosecutor is 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:11.880 not supposed to have conversations in this case senators. Look, 0:08:12.080 --> 0:08:14.400 Senators deal with the president, deal with the president all 0:08:14.400 --> 0:08:17.040 the time. The Framers knew that when the Constitution gave 0:08:17.520 --> 0:08:20.840 impeachment to the Senate, they knew fully well senators would 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:24.200 be dealing with players, would be involved, would be speaking 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:27.560 to the public. And so actually, I will point out 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:31.280 that the President did tweet out this very podcast today, 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:34.400 so obviously there is some relationships. Sure, But you know, 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:38.280 it's interesting when Bill Clinton had an impeachment trial, there 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:42.559 was actually an objection. So one of the people in 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:46.040 the trial referred to the senators as jurors, and they 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:49.360 raise an objection and Chief Justice William Rehnquist, who's the 0:08:49.400 --> 0:08:52.880 Chief Justice, sustain the objection and said, you're right, you're 0:08:52.960 --> 0:08:56.360 not jurors, your senators. And it's a different responsibility under 0:08:56.360 --> 0:08:58.760 the country because it's because not to get even more 0:08:58.800 --> 0:09:02.080 complicated here, but there is a fourth role, which is 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.760 that the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, head of 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:10.600 the Supreme Court, is presiding over impeachment, but he's not 0:09:10.720 --> 0:09:13.400 quite a normal judge, and the jury is not quite 0:09:13.400 --> 0:09:17.200 a normal jury. And that is because an impeachment trial 0:09:17.320 --> 0:09:20.920 is unlike other kinds of trials very much so. Now 0:09:20.960 --> 0:09:24.800 you've spent twenty two hours listening to these two arguments 0:09:24.920 --> 0:09:27.440 from the House Democrats. And let me say, by the way, 0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:30.160 to lock a hundred senators in a room and to 0:09:30.200 --> 0:09:33.920 prevent all of them from speaking. Look, I gotta say, 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:37.280 every one of us is suffering DTS. There's a reason 0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:39.360 I'm launching a damn podcast in the middle of this. 0:09:39.520 --> 0:09:42.400 I can't not talk for that long. It's so about 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:46.480 medical treatments. Well, you know, they used to say that 0:09:46.520 --> 0:09:50.000 the most dangerous place in Washington, DC was between Chuck 0:09:50.000 --> 0:09:52.760 Schumer and a television camera. Now I think have we 0:09:52.800 --> 0:09:55.280 actually don't know, because no one's ever survived that experience. 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:59.680 It's true, we need more investigation. I'm actually thinking, having 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:03.320 watched the House Democrats case for impeachment, I think the 0:10:03.320 --> 0:10:07.000 most dangerous place might be between Adam Schiff and a camera, 0:10:07.080 --> 0:10:08.920 because he's the one leading that case. And I just 0:10:08.960 --> 0:10:11.840 want to hear your thoughts on how each side is 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:15.480 presenting their case. The House Democrats pushing impeachment, the White 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:19.480 House lawyers defending the president. So yesterday we had procedural 0:10:19.520 --> 0:10:23.560 fights all day long. Half the time was the House Democrats, 0:10:23.600 --> 0:10:26.920 half the time was President Trump's lawyers. I thought they 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:29.319 both did fine. I thought they both presented their case. 0:10:30.640 --> 0:10:33.640 When you and I talk last night, I shared my 0:10:33.720 --> 0:10:35.840 views that I think I think the White House lawyers 0:10:35.840 --> 0:10:38.600 need to focus less on process and more on substance, 0:10:38.679 --> 0:10:42.600 more on demonstrating why the president is innocent, why the 0:10:42.640 --> 0:10:46.559 conduct that he admits to is not illegal, is not inappropriate, 0:10:46.600 --> 0:10:49.960 and is perfectly legitimate and justified for a president to 0:10:50.000 --> 0:10:54.360 investigate corruption and to ask a foreign government to investigate corruption. 0:10:54.400 --> 0:10:56.560 That they need to make more of the affirmative case. 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:58.680 So you've argued a lot of high profile cases. So 0:10:58.720 --> 0:11:01.880 what you're saying is maybe we're missing a little bit 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:04.880 of the thirty thousand foot view. We're missing a little 0:11:04.880 --> 0:11:07.440 bit of the big picture from the White House. You 0:11:07.480 --> 0:11:09.800 can get lost in the weeds, and it's easy to 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:13.040 do it, and I don't want that to happen to 0:11:13.080 --> 0:11:14.960 the American people. They just see a lot of bickering 0:11:15.000 --> 0:11:18.000 that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The underlying 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:20.800 If you want to understand this, case, in one sentence, 0:11:21.360 --> 0:11:25.599 can the president investigate corruption? Yes or no? Okay? And 0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:29.280 the Democrats are saying, no, you can't investigate corruption. That 0:11:29.360 --> 0:11:33.600 he couldn't ask Ukraine to investigate Barisma, this natural gas 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:39.000 company because Joe Biden, his son was making millions of 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:43.439 dollars from him, and that is nuts. That's not a 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:48.360 very good argument. Any president has the authority to investigate corruption, 0:11:48.800 --> 0:11:52.760 but has the responsibility to investigate corruption, And so I 0:11:52.800 --> 0:11:54.960 think we need to be talking more about the substance. 0:11:54.960 --> 0:11:58.319 So today though President Trump's lawyers didn't get to talk 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:00.800 at all, so we're an opening argument. Day was all 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:04.560 day long, nothing but House Democrats the Adam shifts show. 0:12:05.480 --> 0:12:07.600 That's not easy to say three times. By the way, 0:12:07.840 --> 0:12:12.920 there's some slips that come in there sometimes. But they 0:12:12.960 --> 0:12:15.480 were presenting their case, and as I said, it's all 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:21.000 focused on proving things that everyone agrees to. How did 0:12:21.040 --> 0:12:24.839 they do in the sense of the political theater. Do 0:12:25.120 --> 0:12:28.160 you think, if you're just judging this from the effectiveness 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:32.000 of their objectives, that the House Democrats are making a 0:12:32.000 --> 0:12:35.280 good argument? Look, I think for I think most partisans 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:38.400 stayed where they are. In other words, if you hate 0:12:38.400 --> 0:12:40.840 President Trump and think he's the embodiment of evil. You 0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:44.680 probably thought today was a wonderful day because it featured 0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:48.360 ten hours of House Democrats describing how horrible Donald Trump is. 0:12:49.960 --> 0:12:54.240 If you think, if you think the President has done 0:12:54.280 --> 0:12:56.840 a good job and we've gotten good results, and you're 0:12:56.920 --> 0:13:00.640 tired of House Democrats just attacking the president all day long, 0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:04.840 then today was really hard to listen to. And it 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:08.080 was made worse by the fact that it was incredibly repetitive. 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:11.439 So yesterday, when we were having procedural arguments, the House 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:14.520 Democrats basically gave their opening argument right, and then today 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:16.560 they turned around and gave the same thing. So they 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.840 keep making the same points and playing the same clips 0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:22.480 and reading the same quotes over and over and over again. 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:24.840 And we've got two more days of opening arguments. We're 0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:26.760 gonna spend all day long tomorrow, all day long the 0:13:26.800 --> 0:13:29.920 next day with them making them. Did anything new happen 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:34.280 in terms of the Democrats case, I think the single 0:13:34.320 --> 0:13:36.640 biggest thing and I think I think the House Democrats 0:13:36.640 --> 0:13:40.600 made a strategic mistake, which is they opened the door 0:13:41.160 --> 0:13:45.800 to Hunter Biden testify. Now here's why Adam Schiff got 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:48.839 up and he argued in his opening argument. He based 0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:53.120 their whole case on the proposition that the two investigations 0:13:53.160 --> 0:13:57.000 that the President asked for were sham investigations. I want 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:58.880 to read you a little bit from what Adam Schiff said. 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:03.960 He said he said that he the President wanted Ukraine 0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:09.280 to launch investigations quote that were completely without merit, that 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:15.240 were sham investigations that he later says, the allegations are 0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:21.000 untrue and they've quote been widely debunked patent lee false. 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:26.440 So that's the central question, that these investigations are untrue. Now, 0:14:26.480 --> 0:14:30.960 let's take Barisma, which is the most important of the investigation. Okay, Barisma, 0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:36.000 big natural gas company, has had major problems with corruption. 0:14:36.040 --> 0:14:37.760 Tomorrow when we talk, we're gonna talk a little bit 0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:40.560 more about the evidence on Barisma that that the White 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:43.000 House lawyers have laid out and the media doesn't want 0:14:43.000 --> 0:14:45.120 to talk about. I want to drill down. We'll do 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:46.840 it tomorrow because it's going to take a lot of time, 0:14:46.880 --> 0:14:50.400 but I want to drill down into Barisma and Hunter Biden. Yes. 0:14:50.560 --> 0:14:53.240 To me, that seems like the whole heart of this 0:14:53.320 --> 0:14:56.120 impeachment question. It is the whole ball of wax. Now 0:14:56.520 --> 0:15:01.760 the Democrats look in the House. House Republicans wanted to 0:15:01.800 --> 0:15:05.280 call Hunter Biden as a witness, and Adam Schiff said no, 0:15:05.880 --> 0:15:08.960 said we're not allowing you. And it was interesting yesterday 0:15:10.200 --> 0:15:13.400 Adam Schiff said, if you have a trial and don't 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:16.160 allow the defendant to put on evidence of innocence, it's 0:15:16.240 --> 0:15:18.680 not a fair trial, right, And it was you know, 0:15:18.800 --> 0:15:20.760 it was all I could do not to laugh out loud, 0:15:20.800 --> 0:15:24.280 because that's what they did in the House, because they 0:15:24.400 --> 0:15:28.320 base their whole case on arguing that asking for an 0:15:28.320 --> 0:15:33.440 investigation into Barisma is false and completely without merit. It 0:15:33.600 --> 0:15:36.880 raises not just as relevant, but but as central to 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:41.040 the defense. Okay, what evidence was there that this was 0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:44.800 real corruption that needed to be investigated? And even beyond 0:15:44.880 --> 0:15:47.200 I mean, because I think when you get into this 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:50.720 Ukrainian company and this relative of Joe Biden, it's easy 0:15:50.760 --> 0:15:54.000 to get lost in it. I just wonder, if you're 0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:59.760 investigating the question of whether Trump should or should not 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:04.280 have asked for this investigation, whether that's an impeachable offense, 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:09.000 perhaps the most important person to talk to and get 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:13.000 testimony from would be Hunter Biden to ask him. And 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:14.840 by the way, I don't know as a fact that 0:16:14.880 --> 0:16:17.600 it was corrupt. There's a lot of indication that it 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:20.560 could well have been, but the House Democrats have had 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:23.680 zero interest in asking, and they run around with their 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:27.120 hair on fire if you even suggest that anyone would ask, 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:30.440 much less ask Joe Biden. You know, hey, Joe, why 0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:32.640 why was your son getting paid a million bucks a 0:16:32.720 --> 0:16:34.840 year by a gas company? We didn't know anything about gas? 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:39.160 I mean, I mean, this is not subtle and sophisticated, right, 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:41.160 But if the House Democrats are going to stop that, 0:16:41.240 --> 0:16:44.320 they do not want Hunter Biden to testify. Obviously, Joe 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:46.800 Biden is right now the front runner in the twenty 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:49.960 twenty Democratic presidential race, so they really don't want Hunter 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:54.080 Biden to testify last time I checked. Although I do 0:16:54.200 --> 0:16:55.800 have to say I kind of wonder if Bernie and 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:59.880 Elizabeth Warred and klobuch Are are secretly rooting rooting for 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:02.840 Joe and Hunter to testified, but they haven't indicated that 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:05.520 they have not yet. However, they could give a little 0:17:05.520 --> 0:17:08.639 support to their Republican colleagues, because last time I checked, 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:12.000 it is your political party that controls the Senate. So 0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:16.359 can the Republicans in the Senate make Hunter Biden testify 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:19.480 before the Senate. Absolutely, it takes fifty one votes, fifty 0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:22.320 one Republicans, we can call Hunter Biden. Now, the way 0:17:22.320 --> 0:17:25.439 it works actually is the parties call the witnesses. So 0:17:25.480 --> 0:17:28.480 what it would mean, as President Trump's lawyers, if they 0:17:28.600 --> 0:17:30.840 want to call Hunter Biden, I've been saying for months, 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:34.440 we ought to call Hunter Biden. Why. Look the prosecutors 0:17:34.440 --> 0:17:37.359 the House Democrats, they had seventeen witnesses in the House. 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:41.040 They built the prosecution side in what was basically a 0:17:41.119 --> 0:17:43.679 kangaroo court where you say only prosecution witnesses, and we 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:46.200 don't allow the White House to call witnesses. So you've 0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:50.359 got seventeen witnesses for the anti Trump pro impeachment side, 0:17:50.480 --> 0:17:53.119 and you've got zero witnesses. The president had not been 0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:55.639 able to call a single witness. Now, if the president 0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:57.679 could call one, I'm pretty sure it would be Hunter Biden. 0:17:58.119 --> 0:18:00.200 If the president could call too, it might be Hunter 0:18:00.280 --> 0:18:02.560 Biden and the so called whistleblower. If you could call three, 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.399 my guess is Joe Biden might be number three on that. 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:09.439 We can call those witnesses or any others, and it 0:18:09.480 --> 0:18:12.760 just takes fifty one votes. We have fifty three Republicans. 0:18:12.760 --> 0:18:15.760 So if you simply have Republicans saying, you know what, 0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:18.400 we want to have a fair trial. One side has 0:18:18.400 --> 0:18:22.520 had all their witnesses. The other side, the defendant, the accused, 0:18:23.040 --> 0:18:27.359 has had zero witnesses. That's not fair. So is it 0:18:27.400 --> 0:18:29.359 going to happen? I mean, is the White House going 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:31.760 to call Hunter Biden to testify? So it's up in 0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:35.560 the air. The fight we had yesterday as we adopted 0:18:35.640 --> 0:18:39.320 basically the same scheduling order the Clinton impeachment trial had, 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:42.479 which is we'll go through opening arguments and questions from 0:18:42.520 --> 0:18:46.840 senators first, and then we'll decide whether additional witnesses are needed. 0:18:47.480 --> 0:18:49.760 And so the House Democrats they want to call a 0:18:49.800 --> 0:18:52.280 bunch of additional witnesses. The big one they're focusing on 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:56.480 is John Bolton. John Bolton was the National security advisor 0:18:56.520 --> 0:18:58.639 to President Trump. They think they're going to get some 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:02.199 dirt on Trump out of John bull that that is 0:19:02.240 --> 0:19:05.520 their big focus. Next week, the Senator is going to 0:19:05.640 --> 0:19:07.720 vote whether we're going to have additional witnesses or not. 0:19:07.840 --> 0:19:11.040 And it's going to make a big difference because you know, 0:19:11.080 --> 0:19:12.480 one of the things you and I were talking about 0:19:12.480 --> 0:19:14.080 a little earlier is how long is this thing going 0:19:14.119 --> 0:19:16.280 to last, I really want to know that because I 0:19:16.280 --> 0:19:18.480 don't live in Washington, DC, so I got to make 0:19:18.480 --> 0:19:21.120 some plans. Well, the vote next week on witnesses will 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:24.560 make a massive difference. Okay. If fifty one Senators vote 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.240 next week we don't need any more witnesses, We've got 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:30.520 all the evidence we need, then the trial will end 0:19:30.560 --> 0:19:33.399 next week, we'll move to final judgment, and if and 0:19:33.440 --> 0:19:36.360 when that happens, the president will be acquitted because because 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:39.000 the House Democrats haven't proven their case. Okay. On the 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:42.080 other hand, if fifty one senators vote that we do 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:46.040 need additional witnesses, then it's Katie bar the door. Then 0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:49.600 this thing could easily last weeks or even months. You 0:19:49.600 --> 0:19:51.760 could see six, seven, eight, nine weeks, because if you 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:55.080 go down in additional witnesses, you're you're opening the door 0:19:55.160 --> 0:19:58.640 to litigation, to assertion of privileges, to all sorts of delays. 0:19:59.000 --> 0:20:01.040 We could be sitting here here months from now with 0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:04.880 the impeachment trial still going on if we call additional 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:07.680 witness But if you call additional witnesses, then we might 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:10.760 finally hear from Hunter Biden. Now my question on this though, 0:20:10.840 --> 0:20:13.240 is and by the way, if we do call additional witnesses. 0:20:13.280 --> 0:20:16.919 I'm very confident we'll call Hunter Biden. But if you 0:20:16.960 --> 0:20:19.520 call Hunter Biden, or rather if the White House calls 0:20:19.520 --> 0:20:23.720 it Hunter Biden to testify before the Senate, can't Hunter 0:20:23.760 --> 0:20:26.520 Biden just say I don't want to answer your questions. 0:20:26.880 --> 0:20:29.399 I plead the fifth and I'm not gonna I'm not 0:20:29.440 --> 0:20:31.520 going to say anything, so he can and if we 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:34.600 call Hunter Biden, he will almost certainly plead the fifth. 0:20:34.880 --> 0:20:37.840 Now here's the interesting thing. There's a federal statue that 0:20:37.880 --> 0:20:40.520 gives the Senate the authority to grant him what's called 0:20:40.560 --> 0:20:45.000 transactional immunity, which means we can force him to testify. Now, 0:20:45.040 --> 0:20:48.280 he can't be prosecuted for anything he testifies to, Okay, 0:20:48.400 --> 0:20:52.240 but you can find out, you can get his testimony, 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:55.440 and that's something the Senate can do, grant him immunity. 0:20:55.440 --> 0:20:57.480 And I got to say that idea. You want to 0:20:57.480 --> 0:21:01.679 talk about something to terrify forty seven Democrats in the Senate, 0:21:02.400 --> 0:21:04.600 It is the fact that the Senate could grant Hunter 0:21:04.640 --> 0:21:08.640 Biden immunity and hear his testimony about whether, in fact, 0:21:08.720 --> 0:21:11.840 there was corruption from Joe Biden. And let's be clear, 0:21:11.880 --> 0:21:14.879 this is not about lac Hunter Biden. It's a guy 0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:17.680 who's led a troubled life. This is not about him. 0:21:18.320 --> 0:21:22.800 This is the question about whether his dad abused his power. So, 0:21:22.920 --> 0:21:24.440 in other words, I just want to be very clear 0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:29.640 about this. Hunter Biden could be called to testify and 0:21:29.800 --> 0:21:32.240 he could say I don't want to testify. I plead 0:21:32.280 --> 0:21:35.280 the fifth And if he's going to be held responsible 0:21:35.280 --> 0:21:38.400 for anything he did, then it ends there. However, the 0:21:38.480 --> 0:21:41.520 Senate can give him immunity so he won't be held 0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:43.800 responsible for any crimes he commits. And no reporter in 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:48.120 Washington knows this or understands this. But the Senate can 0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:51.000 force Hunter Biden to testify. You can, and I'll give 0:21:51.000 --> 0:21:53.560 an example. Take a criminal case. This is something prosecutors 0:21:53.560 --> 0:21:55.600 do all the time. Let's say you have a criminal 0:21:55.720 --> 0:21:59.760 case and you have, say, you know, some drug dealers 0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:02.000 that that that you're investigating, and you've got say a 0:22:02.040 --> 0:22:05.320 low level guy, a drug dealer. You'll see prosecutors that 0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:08.040 will give that drug dealer immunity to flip on the 0:22:08.080 --> 0:22:12.000 higher ups and to make them testify. Give them immunity 0:22:12.040 --> 0:22:15.000 to flip on the higher ups. It's the same basic principle. 0:22:15.080 --> 0:22:17.520 Immunity is not always a good thing, because it means 0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:19.879 you can be forced to testify or be put in 0:22:19.960 --> 0:22:22.720 jail if you don't. That is a lot of leverage. 0:22:22.760 --> 0:22:24.680 I have to tell you, Senator, I have not heard 0:22:24.680 --> 0:22:26.760