1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,479 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you so much, as 3 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 1: always for tuning in. Shout out to our super producers 4 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: Casey Pegram, Max Williams, the one and only A how 5 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:46,159 Speaker 1: Andrew Howard before we get started today. No, we have 6 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,240 Speaker 1: this crazy announcement. This is massive, man, and I don't 7 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: know about you, but I've had a really hard time 8 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:54,720 Speaker 1: not talking about it on air. Right. Also, who am I? 9 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: I'm Ben? Hey, Ben, it's me. No, I've had a 10 00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: hard time with it. Two, it's like having a secret. 11 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 1: The secret secrets are no fun though, Ben. Secret secrets 12 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:06,679 Speaker 1: hurt someone, and we don't want to hurt you, Ridiculous Historians. 13 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 1: So it's time to let the badger out of the bag, 14 00:01:09,080 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 1: is said, Okay, if I use a stuff they don't 15 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 1: want to know coined and trademarked catchphrase. Oh of course, 16 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: because this is a special occasion. People who know me 17 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: on Twitter might have seen last week I did a 18 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,559 Speaker 1: vague post where I was like, oh, there's an announcement. 19 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: Spoilers we can't tell you just yet. Stay tuned. This 20 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 1: is the moment you were staying tuned for folks. While 21 00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:38,399 Speaker 1: Noel and I at our team have been faithfully recording 22 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 1: new episodes of Ridiculous History, we have also been working 23 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: assiduously in the background on creating more shows in the 24 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: Ridiculous Universe, and today we are super proud to announce 25 00:01:55,800 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: our first new Ridiculous show is finally coming to the world. 26 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:03,680 Speaker 1: It's true, Ben, Uh, It's it really is kind of 27 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 1: an m c U type situation. There's gonna be all 28 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:10,840 Speaker 1: kinds of easter eggs and shared character experiences and chronology. 29 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: Maybe not quite that extreme, but it's definitely gonna be 30 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: a lot of fun. And the first show in what 31 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 1: we have dubbed the Ridiculous Universe is called Ridiculous Romance. 32 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: Who can we get, uh, Max, can we get some 33 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:28,440 Speaker 1: like wild rockets? Applause? Yeah? Maybe hit him with an 34 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:32,840 Speaker 1: oo la law the same thing, or like a cat called? 35 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,200 Speaker 1: Maybe not cat called. We know the problematic and troubled 36 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 1: history of cat calls, but yeah, Ben. A couple of 37 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 1: pals that you introduced me two years ago, Eli and Diana, 38 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:47,640 Speaker 1: a lovely married couple who both come from improv background 39 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: here in Atlanta. You've done some work with and we've 40 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 1: both been pals with for a while now are hosting 41 00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 1: this show, and it is charming, It is lovely everything 42 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: about it. I'm just absolutely over the moon about yeah 43 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: us Yeah, And we're gonna have Eli and Diana on 44 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:07,360 Speaker 1: a future episode of Ridiculous History to learn a little 45 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: bit more about their story and the things they explore. 46 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 1: You can hear the trailer now, you'll probably hear it 47 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: on our show. We're just we're over the moon about 48 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: this one. We did have with transparency is important. As 49 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 1: you said, secret secrets are no fun, Noel, You and 50 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: I did have a little conversation after we had heard 51 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:30,120 Speaker 1: some of the first episodes where we thought, are they 52 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: gonna be funnier than us? Not that that's hard. Well, 53 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: you know, we have our own specific trademark and copyright 54 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: a brand of humor um. But but Eli and Diana 55 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: bring their own delightful warmth and humor to conversations about 56 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:51,400 Speaker 1: love triangles, weird falling outs among royals, you know, you know, 57 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:54,560 Speaker 1: all the things that can happen when the heart is involved, Ben, 58 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 1: And it's kind of stuff we touch on here in 59 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History from time to time, and this show is 60 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 1: specifically voted to those types of stories, and um Diana 61 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: and Eli also do these wonderful little kind of flashback 62 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,800 Speaker 1: re enactment situations. They've got songs. Gosh, what I'm saying 63 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: it out loud? It really does sound like we have 64 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: something to worry about. But maybe not. Uh, it's all 65 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:18,360 Speaker 1: in the family, right. But when does the first episode drop? 66 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 1: I think we've got a trailer coming up, and then 67 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: episode one the following week. Yeah, yeah, it may very 68 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:28,800 Speaker 1: well be out as you hear this episode today. So 69 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 1: we do hope that you welcome them to the Ridiculous Universe. 70 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 1: We can't wait to hear what you think about their 71 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:41,040 Speaker 1: explorations because they, again as a married couple, can assure 72 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 1: you the course of true love never did run smooth. 73 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:48,720 Speaker 1: So this if you like ridiculous history, you're gonna love 74 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:52,480 Speaker 1: ridiculous romance. You might see Nolan I pop on there 75 00:04:52,560 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 1: as well. But there is more on the way. No, 76 00:04:56,839 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: all that MCU comparison is so astute. I love it. 77 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:07,720 Speaker 1: We're assembling some ridiculous Avengers and our own show continues today. 78 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:11,719 Speaker 1: We're diving into something that has I think, well, I 79 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: don't know about you men, but stories about weird medical 80 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:20,039 Speaker 1: maladies throughout history. Always fascinated me because one of the 81 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: things that we've done for fun, just like off air, 82 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: just hanging out, is looking up these strange conditions of yesteryear. 83 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: Like one of my favorites is brain fever, just because 84 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 1: of the name. Oh totally. I'm also a huge fan 85 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:38,560 Speaker 1: of laundry lists of side effects and potential symptoms that 86 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:41,720 Speaker 1: go along with these, especially when they're super cartoonish and 87 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:45,599 Speaker 1: involved things like madness. You know, I always like make jokes. 88 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: I think probably I'm not alone in this. When you 89 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:51,880 Speaker 1: see big pharma advertisements on television where they are required 90 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: by law to list potential side effects, and you know, 91 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:57,239 Speaker 1: there's rattle off things that includes like, you know, bloody 92 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: diarrhea and uh, you know what you always say, like 93 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:05,359 Speaker 1: Walt Wally or whatever, and you know, and death. But 94 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: this one that we're talking about today, the Devonshire Colic, 95 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: absolutely has those laundry lists. Yeah. Yeah, the devon Shure 96 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:19,720 Speaker 1: Colic was a mystery for quite a long time. It's 97 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:23,120 Speaker 1: a mystery that we're going to solve today. But when 98 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:27,280 Speaker 1: we look back at people of the past, we think 99 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 1: of we think of certain afflictions or conditions as somewhat archaic, right, 100 00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: Like maybe brain fever was something people didn't quite understand. Consumption, 101 00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 1: which we now recognized to be tuberculosis, was also not 102 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:45,719 Speaker 1: super well understood for a long time, And when you 103 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: think of the eighteenth and nineteenth century, you might think 104 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 1: of things like gout, which is often portrayed as a 105 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: condition that primarily only the well to do might contract. 106 00:06:57,440 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: That's the stage. Yeah, it is. And I think the 107 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 1: reason and for that is because some of it had 108 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:06,159 Speaker 1: to do with eating very rich, processed foods. I can't 109 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: not think of the episode of King of the Hill 110 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:13,160 Speaker 1: when Bobby becomes obsessed with this delicatessen and he constantly 111 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 1: goes and he's eating like I think it's like, you know, 112 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: liver worst sandwiches or something like that, and he develops gout. Uh. 113 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 1: And it is there. It is sometimes associated. It is 114 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: something that people can still get if they're eating foods 115 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 1: that are really really rich and certain things that can 116 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:32,240 Speaker 1: like build up in your system. And I'm sorry to 117 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 1: be so vague about that. I'm obviously not a gout scientist. Yeah, 118 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:38,680 Speaker 1: I think it's safe to say there are very few 119 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: gout enthusiasts in the world here's something that we notice 120 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 1: if you look back at history. The truth of the 121 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: matter is, before the age of modern medicine, people had 122 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: tons of afflictions or conditions real or perceived that they 123 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: couldn't quite concretely explain. And with the benefit of modern 124 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 1: science and retros fact, we can say that in many 125 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 1: cases of folks were experiencing something that continues today that 126 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,880 Speaker 1: as dangerous side effects. It's mild lead poisoning. The most 127 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: famous outbreak of this accidental lead poisoning was this thing 128 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: called the Devon colic in this English county in the 129 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:26,280 Speaker 1: seventeen hundreds, this condition was affecting thousands of people. And 130 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 1: here comes our laundry list. The victims primarily dudes, and 131 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: they were experiencing stuff like paralysis, madness, blindness, death. It 132 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 1: was It first got reported in seventeen o three and 133 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 1: it just continued year over year to increase. And I 134 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 1: think it was seventeen twenty four when there was a 135 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 1: pretty big upsurge in the number of cases. And this 136 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: was also a year there's where our mystery starts. This 137 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 1: was also a year that was noted for a bumper 138 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: apple crop. I love a good bumper apple crop. Ben. 139 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: And it was the opinion of one John Huxon, who 140 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,840 Speaker 1: investigated this mysterious malady and published his findings in seventeen 141 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: thirty nine, that one of the primary causes was cider 142 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:17,000 Speaker 1: apple cider. And there's a great article on Flanders Health 143 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:21,959 Speaker 1: dot us that talks about the notion of taking the waters, 144 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:23,840 Speaker 1: which is something that I've never heard, but I think 145 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:25,960 Speaker 1: I'm gonna start using that. Uh you ever heard of 146 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: a schwitz? Been taking a schwitz? Yes? Yeah, yeah. They 147 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: talked about that on the Sopranos. A lot have a schwitz. 148 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 1: That means you go and sweat it out in a sauna, 149 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 1: and that was exactly they were talking about. In the 150 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:39,319 Speaker 1: town of Bath, England, in England's West Country, there were 151 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 1: lots of these fashionable spas. This was basically considered a 152 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 1: spa town, and it was suggested that folks who were 153 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 1: afflicted with gout rheumatics. I don't know how to pronounce 154 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 1: this ben a g u E says, I don't I 155 00:09:56,360 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 1: don't know that one lethargies or apoplexies for gretfulness, shakings 156 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 1: and weakness of any member. I imagine that member referring 157 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:10,120 Speaker 1: to like limbs yes, yeah, you're you're correct. So they 158 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 1: would go to places like Bath, England and taking and 159 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: I agree, take the waters is an awesome phrase. We're 160 00:10:17,320 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 1: officially bringing this from back. Here's what they would do. 161 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: They would sit for up to three hours at a 162 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:26,679 Speaker 1: time up to their necks in this warm water. And 163 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,000 Speaker 1: they would do this several times a week for as 164 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:31,600 Speaker 1: long as six months. And while they were doing this, 165 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 1: they were also ingesting a lot of the local spring water. 166 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 1: And the idea of curative restorative springs is a very 167 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 1: old one, and it's an idea that you know, is 168 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 1: with us to a degree in the modern day. The 169 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: weird thing about this, although it might sound like kind 170 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: of a placebo, the bizarre thing that's somewhat mysterious here 171 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 1: is that this treatment appeared to work in the majority 172 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: of cases. In fact, a lot of people who experienced 173 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:06,840 Speaker 1: paralysis from severe or acute lead poisoning later found their 174 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: condition mitigated by doing this process, by taking the waters 175 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: in Bath. Why how well, we'll tell you in a 176 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 1: little bit, but before we do, let's take a closer 177 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: look at lead. You know, no, I always remembered growing 178 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:34,000 Speaker 1: up some of my relatives, my great, my great great 179 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,320 Speaker 1: some things. They were the kind of people had the 180 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 1: really fancy flatwear and cups or glasses in one of 181 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 1: those hutches, and you know, you would only ever take 182 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:47,960 Speaker 1: it out for special occasions. And my mom's got one 183 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 1: of those. Yeah, it's weird. It's like that. There's so 184 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: many things your parents have that you are not allowed 185 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 1: to touch, which is so strange. Like the decorative soaps 186 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 1: you can't use the fancy soap that's for company, fake fruit, 187 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: fake fruit, specifically, monogrammed towels, hand towels. You know, you're 188 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 1: not supposed to actually dry your hands on these towels 189 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 1: that are in the bathroom. There's a separate stack of 190 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:11,640 Speaker 1: towels that you're supposed to use to dry. I've never 191 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 1: understood that, but it's it's it's it was a different world. 192 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: But you're right. Then, those decorative cabinets where they're meant 193 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:20,400 Speaker 1: to be on display, like at the very best, I 194 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: will try to serve guests with the non chipped flatwear. 195 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:26,520 Speaker 1: Well yeah, well yeah, here's the thing I have I 196 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 1: always wondered as a kid, you know, and see this, 197 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 1: the fancy flatwear and glassware taken out, you know, on 198 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: Thanksgiving or something like that when the whole family gets together. 199 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: But there was one set of glasses I was never 200 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: taken out, never really touched. I was forbidden from playing 201 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 1: with them or drinking from them. And I always thought 202 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:50,400 Speaker 1: it was because my parents assumed I would break things, 203 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:53,560 Speaker 1: which I would. I was a klut sort of cartoonishly 204 00:12:53,600 --> 00:13:00,319 Speaker 1: clumsy child. But later I learned that this glassware contained lead, 205 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 1: and my parents and uncle's and aunts were aware of this, 206 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: and so they didn't want to throw this stuff away. 207 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,199 Speaker 1: But they certainly didn't want their kids drinking lead, because 208 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: they come from the modern era and are very well 209 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:18,800 Speaker 1: aware of the problems that lead can pose, especially when 210 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: children are exposed to it. Because since the times of 211 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 1: ancient Rome, lead has made its way into alcohol specifically, 212 00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 1: it could happen a couple of ways. We know now. 213 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,960 Speaker 1: It was either due to the makers of said booze 214 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:39,679 Speaker 1: wine or whatever using lead ascetate to sweeten the to 215 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:44,560 Speaker 1: sweeten the sauce, or story and stuff and containers that 216 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 1: were glazed with lead. So weird. Yeah there. I'm a 217 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 1: big fan of books with very specific titles, as I 218 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:55,960 Speaker 1: think you are, and also a fan of anonymously published 219 00:13:55,960 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 1: books that adds a certain mistique to it that I 220 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 1: just can't get enough of. But there was one published 221 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:05,800 Speaker 1: in seventeen called Valuable Secrets concerning the Arts and Trades, 222 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:10,320 Speaker 1: and in it it contained a recipe for treating wine 223 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: with lead. And the idea was that you would take 224 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 1: wine vinegar and saturated with letharge, which so funny because 225 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: it's also that's one of the conditions that leads, is 226 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: that that comes from lead poisoning lethar gene, which maybe 227 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: that's the etymology there, who knows, but letharge is lead 228 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: ox side essentially. And then you would add about a 229 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 1: half a leader of this concoction of of wine vinegar 230 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:42,880 Speaker 1: and this lead material to each hogs head of wine, 231 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 1: a hogshead being a cask that would hold fifty imperial 232 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 1: gallons in metric that's about two leaders. And then doing 233 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: this would make sense to you at the time because 234 00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 1: you would know a lot about making and story wine, 235 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 1: but you wouldn't know much about the long term effects 236 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:05,480 Speaker 1: of lead exposure. So it's a win win from your 237 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 1: perspective as a wine maker. The wine is going to 238 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 1: be protected against going bad, and added bonus, it's gonna 239 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: taste ever so much sweeter, just a little bit sweeter. 240 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 1: And here's what was happening. The lead oxide was reacting 241 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 1: with any ascetic acid in the vinegar to form a 242 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: soluble lead acetate. And this concentration of lead in the 243 00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 1: wine may have in many cases exceeded fifty parts per million, 244 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 1: which just the basic explanation for that is that it's 245 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 1: very it's bad. So it wouldn't it would be enough 246 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:46,280 Speaker 1: for the metal to deactivate the enzymes of yeast that 247 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 1: could threaten the alcoholic content of the wine, but the 248 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: amount of lead acetate would still there. There wouldn't be 249 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 1: enough there to interfere with the actual taste other than 250 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:02,680 Speaker 1: that sweetness. And so what we're looking at is an 251 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 1: adulteration of booze with lead, either deliberately or by accident, 252 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: you know, depending it might have just been in the 253 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: containers glazed with lead. And this this had effects on 254 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: multiple populations across centuries, from Roman times to the Middle Ages. 255 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 1: Sometimes the amount of lead would cause these community wide 256 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:30,080 Speaker 1: outbreaks of severe lead poisoning, and they are and it 257 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 1: seemed like, uh, it seemed as though people just weren't 258 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 1: making the connection for a long time, and they thought 259 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: there were these regionally specific you know, we love the 260 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: weird disease names, just regionally specific, strange names for things 261 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: like the pied in colic. Right, that was one that 262 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 1: was regional to France. And isn't colic like that condition 263 00:16:51,280 --> 00:16:57,520 Speaker 1: that babies have or that's cough a lot? Ye like? Yeah? Yeah, 264 00:16:57,560 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: Colic the way we understand it today is a severe 265 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 1: pain in the abdomen caused by gas or obstruction of 266 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 1: the intestines. And we all associated with babies. I think, man, 267 00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:10,719 Speaker 1: that college sure was a severe pain in my abdomen. Man, 268 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 1: let me tell you what. Yeah, there it is. Yeah. 269 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: They were saying that they were describing this umbrella of conditions, 270 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 1: this umbrella group of conditions as colic because people were 271 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:28,399 Speaker 1: feeling generally unwell. My favorite name though, properly for this 272 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 1: is uh, well, you know what it is, Oh, I 273 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 1: know what it is. It's the dry gripes, the drag gripes. 274 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: That was that was regional to Massachusetts. Uh. In the 275 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 1: American colonies back in the early seventeen hundreds, and in 276 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:44,359 Speaker 1: the southwest of England they referred to it as the 277 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: Devon colic or the Devonshure colic. That was a little later, actually, 278 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,960 Speaker 1: but that one involved. That's the thing. Then these all 279 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 1: kind of had slightly varying symptoms. It would seem like 280 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 1: I don't quite understand how they lumped them all together. 281 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: But this and involve stomach pains, constipation, and mental disturbances. 282 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: The last one spooky. And I shouldn't laugh about the 283 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:11,439 Speaker 1: dry gripes because you know it affected real people. But 284 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: I cannot wait to call out of work one day 285 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:17,880 Speaker 1: by saying I'm sorry, I can't make this meeting. I've 286 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: got the dry gripes and I need to take the waters. 287 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: I am become weird. I have the dry grips and 288 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: I must take the waters. Post taste, we're making. We're 289 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:32,360 Speaker 1: slowly building the best get out of work letter ever. Uh. So, 290 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,359 Speaker 1: you're right. They had the variation in the symptoms most 291 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,200 Speaker 1: likely dependent upon the amount of lead to which people 292 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: were exposed. There was something else that was happening. There 293 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 1: was a thing called painters colic because there was a 294 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 1: lot of lead in paint and this would cause chronic 295 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 1: constipation of the painters and for people who manufactured paint. 296 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 1: Everybody was looking for a reason to explain this, but 297 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 1: they were usually looking for a reason to explain this 298 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:04,680 Speaker 1: ccific regional outbreak they were witnessing. That's where John Huckson 299 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: comes in Seour. He's an English doctor. He notices there 300 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:12,480 Speaker 1: there's a ton of people coming to him saying they've 301 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: got the cold sweats, they've got stomach pain. Perhaps most distressingly, 302 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 1: they're vomiting a lot of bile with blood in it, 303 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 1: and then they're becoming paralyzed. So he says, this is 304 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:30,520 Speaker 1: an outbreak of Devonshire colic. And it's so weird because 305 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: they knew that there was. This seemed to be some 306 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: sort of correlation right between the apple harvest, cider drinking 307 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 1: and the sickness. As far back as three a doctor 308 00:19:43,320 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 1: named William Musgrave said that the cause of Devonshire colic 309 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: was roof and acid sida drunk in two great quantities. 310 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 1: T O O. Yeah, yeah, so you know, drinking too much, 311 00:19:56,040 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 1: but specifically the cider. And you know in Devon even 312 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:02,919 Speaker 1: to this day, or Devonshire is it people call it Devon. 313 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 1: They definitely still call it that. But I guess maybe 314 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,080 Speaker 1: the shire is just sort of like means Devon town, 315 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 1: you know, a shire, right like in the Hobbit. But 316 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 1: it is very much still prime cider country. Yeah. And 317 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:19,720 Speaker 1: and from what we understand, the terms are often used 318 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: interchangeably Devon or Devonshire. Uh So they understand that there's 319 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 1: this correlation, right, And the weird thing is three Musgrave 320 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:33,679 Speaker 1: is right in a way, Devin cider is the source 321 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 1: of this condition. But the cider itself, the roughness, the acidity, 322 00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 1: the amount consumed, didn't really have much to do with 323 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 1: what was happening. Everything he described right read urine, pale skin, 324 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:55,119 Speaker 1: frequent vomiting, incredibly painful stomach aches. These are all textbook 325 00:20:55,160 --> 00:21:00,119 Speaker 1: definitions of lead poisoning, especially at severe paralysis. Wait, when 326 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 1: you say bright red urine, does that mean there's blood 327 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 1: in the urine or is it just like you know, 328 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 1: sort of like when you're dehydrated your urine becomes very orange. Yeah, 329 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:11,720 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's a good question. We know people 330 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 1: are definitely vomiting up some blood, but as far as 331 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:18,680 Speaker 1: bright red urine, um, it may have just been discoloration, 332 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 1: because otherwise they he probably would have noticed a blood 333 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,280 Speaker 1: content of some sort. That's true because blood in the 334 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 1: not to be too gross, but like if you ever, 335 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:31,639 Speaker 1: you know, had any kind of blood go into water. 336 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 1: You know that it proliferates in the water much differently 337 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:36,879 Speaker 1: than urine, Like it has sort of a cloud equality too. 338 00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: That's yeah, that's a good point. So later there's a 339 00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:44,160 Speaker 1: medical historian who comes along. His name is H. A. Waldron, 340 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 1: and he knows that the cider makers of Devon tended 341 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:54,880 Speaker 1: to process their apple harvest in these leadlined pounding mechanisms 342 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:59,080 Speaker 1: and presses. This is coming from Great Atlas Obscure article 343 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:03,200 Speaker 1: the History of back And so there's another important piece here. 344 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 1: The poor members of the community lived almost entirely off 345 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:11,439 Speaker 1: cider and apples and everything they're touching, all the cider 346 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:18,040 Speaker 1: they're touching has spent some time absorbing lead. And these 347 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:21,200 Speaker 1: doctors are in this race to figure out, like how 348 00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:23,880 Speaker 1: do we treat this? How do we We can't tell 349 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 1: people not to eat, it's their main source of food. 350 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:29,120 Speaker 1: We need to know what's going on, or we need 351 00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: to at least sort of mitigate these symptoms. And so 352 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: many members of the medical establishment of the day ended 353 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,400 Speaker 1: up sending their patients, like we said, to Bath and 354 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 1: the town's name, like you said earlier, Nor refers to 355 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:48,159 Speaker 1: those local springs. They've got a nice temperature about a 356 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:52,720 Speaker 1: hundred and twenty degrees fahrenheit or so, and people loved 357 00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 1: hanging out in these and there was a long standing 358 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,199 Speaker 1: belief that the waters were curative or restorative due to 359 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:03,120 Speaker 1: their mineral content. But healing spring waters right, Um, there 360 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:05,919 Speaker 1: is a town I want to say it's in North Carolina. 361 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,680 Speaker 1: Hot It's called literally called hot Springs. I believe it's 362 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,359 Speaker 1: North Carolina. But um, these natural hot springs just come 363 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:13,200 Speaker 1: right out of the ground and they build these kind 364 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 1: of structures around them that you can, you know, have 365 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 1: a nice slush fits in. But as it turns out, well, 366 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,400 Speaker 1: these situations are indeed super relaxing and a nice way 367 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 1: to unwind unless you put some kind of you know, 368 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: uh like epsom salts, say, for example, which can bring 369 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,160 Speaker 1: down swelling. It's a good way to treat doubt, even 370 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 1: I believe, again not medical advice, but I think I've 371 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:38,480 Speaker 1: read that, um, it can reduce inflammation for example. The 372 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,639 Speaker 1: waters themselves don't really do much other than you know, 373 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: mellow you out, uh. And that was addressed in a 374 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 1: nine edition of the Medical History Journal by Audrey Haywood, 375 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 1: who discusses literally is his medical history and kind of 376 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:57,240 Speaker 1: debunk certain myths, of which there are many. As we know, 377 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:01,840 Speaker 1: practicing medicine oftentimes is just what it's sounds like, especially historically. 378 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: Um and she has had this to say about the 379 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:07,719 Speaker 1: efficacy of hot springs quote. It is commonly assumed that 380 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: spa therapy has only a placebo effect, that the pleasurable 381 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: activity of immersion and warm mineral water has social and 382 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 1: psychological effects but no physiological value. Yeah, so this is 383 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:23,920 Speaker 1: why bath is extraordinary in this situation. As Heywood goes 384 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:29,080 Speaker 1: on to describe, there did seem to be measurable, significant 385 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:33,400 Speaker 1: benefits for people, especially they were suffering from processes. If 386 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: they went into these scuritive waters, they would indeed find 387 00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:49,240 Speaker 1: their conditions mitigated or cured. So let's talk about how 388 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 1: it actually works. The explanation is surprisingly simple. After you 389 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: have consumed lad, if you're human being, your body mistakes 390 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,719 Speaker 1: it for or calcium and uses it to build bone, 391 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,760 Speaker 1: and over time that poison that is accumulated in your 392 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 1: system causes all these violent symptoms. And here's something that 393 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:15,880 Speaker 1: is a hazard for the astronauts in the audience. When 394 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 1: you are weightless for a period of time, you increase 395 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:24,880 Speaker 1: calcium loss from your bones. So if you're floating in 396 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,920 Speaker 1: these springs for you know, hours at a time, several 397 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 1: days out of the week, for up to six months, 398 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:36,240 Speaker 1: your body is gradually stripped of both calcium and lead 399 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,480 Speaker 1: from your skeleton, and then you are able to avoid it, 400 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:45,359 Speaker 1: you urinate it away. And we know that research in 401 00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: the nineties confirmed this. Audrey Hayward, the author you know 402 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: just mentioned, they found that doing this regiment, even in 403 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 1: the modern day, would increase your flow of urine and 404 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: provably remove significant amounts lead from your system. So in 405 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:06,639 Speaker 1: at least one case, you really could just take a 406 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:10,919 Speaker 1: bath to cure yourself of something. Well, that's the thing, right, Like, 407 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,720 Speaker 1: if if it works one time for one set, then 408 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 1: that can easily via word of mouth or via doctor's 409 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,040 Speaker 1: kind of like relying on a very small sample size 410 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,840 Speaker 1: spread that as like the gospel for treating this condition overall, 411 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,679 Speaker 1: which isn't always going to pan out in fact, you 412 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 1: know doesn't. Yeah, And this the Bath General Hospital. Around 413 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,120 Speaker 1: the same time, they were conducting what they called the 414 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,040 Speaker 1: Trial of the Waters, which sounds like a fantasy novel 415 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,680 Speaker 1: this way. Hayway considers one of the very first long 416 00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 1: term medical therapy trials in history, and it's this same thing. 417 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:49,679 Speaker 1: The doctors were giving victims of paralysis what they consider 418 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: healthy fresh food daily soaks in these waters, and they 419 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,440 Speaker 1: found that drinking this water actually had a medicinal effect 420 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:01,439 Speaker 1: as well. We said that bath spa water was pretty 421 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: mineral rich. It was specifically rich in calcium and iron. 422 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 1: So while floating is getting rid of calcium and lead 423 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,840 Speaker 1: from your skeleton, ingesting this water is kind of replacing 424 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,359 Speaker 1: that calcium you might have been losing. Just for the record, 425 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,640 Speaker 1: it wasn't all you know, trumpets and rainbows and angel farts. 426 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: The water tasted pretty nasty from what we understand, right, 427 00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:26,880 Speaker 1: It's not like the water that you would drink from 428 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: your faucet or your water filter today. Yeah, kind of 429 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 1: a was described in Anatlas Obscure article as a sulfuric 430 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,920 Speaker 1: eggy flavor, which I guess makes sense because of the calcium. 431 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,040 Speaker 1: It will sulfur. You know, rotten eggs, you know, have 432 00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,560 Speaker 1: a smell of sulfur, And I guess there's a lot. 433 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 1: Isn't there a lot of calcium? And like egg shells, Yeah, 434 00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: eggshells are like ballpark calcium. I think, got it. Well, 435 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:54,920 Speaker 1: that makes sense then, but people were drinking this stuff 436 00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: on purpose, Ben, Yes, because they wanted to be able 437 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:01,080 Speaker 1: to move one of the walk They wanted to be 438 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:03,919 Speaker 1: able to use their limbs. Wait, so they were drinking 439 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 1: it out of the liquid that they themselves were stewing in. Uh, 440 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:11,439 Speaker 1: probably not at the same time. It was just like 441 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,359 Speaker 1: bottled and sold after. I'm sorry, I've just so many questions. 442 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:16,639 Speaker 1: You're like, I mean, like this is like human stew 443 00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,160 Speaker 1: I imagine the Uh maybe maybe maybe not. Maybe it wasn't. 444 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,679 Speaker 1: Maybe it was like the material was bottled separately. But 445 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,680 Speaker 1: I'm also picturing it as like the stuff that people 446 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,679 Speaker 1: were actually soaking in, which is really gross. Yeah. That 447 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 1: that feels like maybe a level of laziness that even 448 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:39,080 Speaker 1: I have yet to attain life goals. So watch how devonsure. 449 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 1: I'm on the way to you. Maybe maybe maybe to 450 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: streamline things, they would just give you a ladle. It 451 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,719 Speaker 1: would come with your with your with your soak experience. 452 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,719 Speaker 1: You get your ladle, and then you just, you know, 453 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,160 Speaker 1: why not kill two birds with one stone. You soak 454 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: it and you drink it all the same time. Well yeah, 455 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,280 Speaker 1: you know, but you're sitting there with other people you 456 00:28:57,280 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: don't know where they've been, and it's like the thing 457 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:03,000 Speaker 1: with public pools, you know, it's a trustful for real 458 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 1: who's gonna be in there? Right? That's always my question. 459 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 1: They didn't chordinate this stuff. Spoiler alert, it's gonna be me, 460 00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: that's gonna be you. You're one of them. I'm a peer. No, 461 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 1: I'm kidding. No, I'm not a monster. I would never, 462 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:17,479 Speaker 1: I would never, but you know, but the chlorine does 463 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,320 Speaker 1: knock knock that out. Do you ever hear those myths 464 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 1: about like certain pool treatments that will like show who 465 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 1: the peer is that if you pee, it's gonna all 466 00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 1: of a sudden like have some sort of like ink 467 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: stain that's gonna like track you through the pool so 468 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 1: everyone knows it was you. I don't think that's actually 469 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:33,600 Speaker 1: a real thing, but I remember hearing tell of that, 470 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 1: and it was I think a a myth that was 471 00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:38,840 Speaker 1: meant to discourage people from being in pools. I heard 472 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 1: about that, and I filed it under that's awesome if true. 473 00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:47,480 Speaker 1: I like that instant karma. Anyway, our possibly extremist views 474 00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 1: of public pools aside. Decades later, a guy named Dr 475 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:55,640 Speaker 1: George Baker finally understands that it's not the apples themselves, 476 00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:59,120 Speaker 1: so the cider itself, it's on people's drinking habits. It's 477 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 1: the lead that exists between the process of taking an 478 00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: apple from an orchard and turning it into a delicious, 479 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:10,960 Speaker 1: boozy beverage. Baker is the Queen's physician at the time, 480 00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: and he is doing something that finally helps crack the case. 481 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 1: He is corresponding with other experts. Oddly enough, he's talking 482 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 1: with Benjamin Franklin, and old Benny f is like, you know, 483 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 1: here's what happened, George. I don't know what's going on 484 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 1: with you guys over on your side of the ponds. 485 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 1: But in Boston, when I was just a weed teenager, 486 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:34,600 Speaker 1: we had an outbreak of what we recognized as lead poisoning. 487 00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,880 Speaker 1: And then we realized there were lead stills that we 488 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,320 Speaker 1: were using in the process of creating rum. And we 489 00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: know of this because there's there's still a letter and 490 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:52,320 Speaker 1: extant letter of Benjamin Franklin's where he talks about lead poisoning. 491 00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 1: And in this letter you can see that they've clearly 492 00:30:56,120 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 1: traced lead as as the culprit. And so Franklin is 493 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 1: saying to George Baker, well, you know this might be 494 00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: a similar case. Very reasonable. Now Baker has to prove 495 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 1: his hypothesis. Yeah, so Baker um in seventeen sixty seven 496 00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,960 Speaker 1: he noted the similarities between lead poisoning and this Devon 497 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: colic and he began to become highly suspicious of this 498 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:30,680 Speaker 1: acidity argument, right, that that was what was causing at 499 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,440 Speaker 1: the acidity and the cider uh. And after talking to 500 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: Ben Franklin, well, by the way, it was always popping 501 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,560 Speaker 1: up in interesting helpful ways throughout history. I know. He's 502 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:43,080 Speaker 1: a problematic dude and definitely had some weird bodies buried 503 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,320 Speaker 1: under his house, and it was a bit of a 504 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 1: womanizer and not maybe always the most stand up guy. 505 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:51,800 Speaker 1: But he definitely knew how to solve a good history mystery, 506 00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 1: didn't he He did, He did, And everything you just 507 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 1: said about him is true. Noal but he including the 508 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: part where he pops up at the weirdest moments to 509 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:06,680 Speaker 1: do a cameo in some other historical tale. So that's right. 510 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: They he had to test this, and so he takes 511 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: cider from Devonshire, which has high lead content, and cider 512 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:19,480 Speaker 1: from another area which has zero lead content. He takes 513 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 1: UH about fourteen leaders of Devon cider, and from that 514 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 1: he extracts a grain of lead sixty milligrams, and then 515 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 1: from that we can calculate today the cider contained about 516 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:33,320 Speaker 1: five parts per million of lead, and that's more than 517 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 1: enough to create the symptoms of mild lead poisoning, even 518 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 1: if you only drink about a pint a day. If 519 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:42,719 Speaker 1: you're like, hey, guys, I like cider, but I'm not 520 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,360 Speaker 1: a you know, cider hollic or whatever. I'm just gonna 521 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: have my one pint today five pm after a long 522 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,760 Speaker 1: day at work or whatever. So the problem is that 523 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:57,440 Speaker 1: some people, especially farm hands, would drink like a gallon 524 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 1: of cidered a day four leaders, and this would eventually 525 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:06,840 Speaker 1: cause severe lead poisoning. Now Baker's discovered this, he says, Okay, 526 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:09,320 Speaker 1: it's the lead. How is the lead getting in there? 527 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:11,280 Speaker 1: It's a good question, and we're gonna hop to that 528 00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:13,440 Speaker 1: in just a second. But I wanted to drop a 529 00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:16,520 Speaker 1: little bit of cider trivia on you, Ben and and 530 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 1: ridiculous historians. I recently took a much needed trip to 531 00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 1: Seattle with my daughter and my girlfriend, and during the 532 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 1: trip visited with a listener of movie Crash. It's another 533 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 1: show that I'm on, and his name is David Gooch. 534 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:31,640 Speaker 1: I don't know if he listens to the show or not, 535 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:34,160 Speaker 1: but if he does, High Gooch. But he works at 536 00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,880 Speaker 1: a cidery in Seattle called the Seattle Cider Company, And 537 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:40,440 Speaker 1: I kind of remarked that, you know, you don't you 538 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,840 Speaker 1: don't really think of cider as being like a particularly 539 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:46,560 Speaker 1: popular beverage in the United States, Like there's like, what 540 00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 1: can you think of been like on I could probably 541 00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,160 Speaker 1: count on one hand how many cider varieties are available 542 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,120 Speaker 1: at most of our neighborhood bars. It is like Strongbow 543 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 1: and like and Woodchuck, I guess. And then I know 544 00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 1: that Stella makes one too, but it's not super popular. 545 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:05,920 Speaker 1: And he pointed out that since Prohibition like ended, nobody 546 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:10,040 Speaker 1: made cider like for many many, many many years, like 547 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 1: a long long time, and I'm not quite firm on 548 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:18,000 Speaker 1: the amount of time. But his company, Seattle Cider Company, 549 00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,800 Speaker 1: was one of the very first since Prohibition to start 550 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:23,720 Speaker 1: manufacturing cider on a large scale, which I thought was interesting. 551 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 1: And he gave us a tour of the facilities and 552 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,360 Speaker 1: all of the fermentation giant vats and the canning operation. 553 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,279 Speaker 1: It was really really cool. To see that. But I 554 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,719 Speaker 1: just thought that was interesting because he he said since prohibition, 555 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,000 Speaker 1: and I thought he was referring to like, wait, it 556 00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:41,759 Speaker 1: was cider prohibited like further than like regular prohibition, and no, 557 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: I meant like since prohibition prohibition. So that was pretty interesting. Yeah, interesting, 558 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 1: And get know, I like cider. Well, the sider they 559 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: had at Seattle Cider Company was much less of a 560 00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:56,840 Speaker 1: sweet kind of saccharin cider than and it would probably 561 00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:58,919 Speaker 1: be more similar to the types of cider they would 562 00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,239 Speaker 1: have made back in the these days where it's like 563 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:04,720 Speaker 1: got an apple equality to it, but it's not sugary sweet. 564 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 1: It really is almost more like an ale that has 565 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,560 Speaker 1: you know, an apple ness to it. And I quite 566 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:11,480 Speaker 1: like the ones that I tried there. Yeah, I'd love 567 00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:13,359 Speaker 1: to try out some of that local cide or if 568 00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 1: anybody feels like sending some or has recommendations cider that 569 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 1: I should try or get into. Yeah, help me, help 570 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 1: me evolve my palette. Please, God knows I need the help. 571 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:29,760 Speaker 1: So so here's the thing. He has proven the culprit. 572 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:33,439 Speaker 1: Now he's asking himself, how does this lead get into 573 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,279 Speaker 1: the process. He says, it's either an apple press that 574 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 1: has lead lined in it, or one of the vessels 575 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:43,880 Speaker 1: used for fermentation, or maybe there's lead in the pipes 576 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,640 Speaker 1: that convey the apple juice to the fermentation. That and 577 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:53,279 Speaker 1: it's a local village industry, which means this explains how 578 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 1: the levels of poison can vary from one place to 579 00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 1: the next, and eventually, especially in places where people were 580 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:06,240 Speaker 1: eye Baker was able to find particular like lead lined vessel. 581 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:10,240 Speaker 1: So at this point we might reasonably assume that people 582 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:12,920 Speaker 1: would be happy about knowing this, that they would say, 583 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:18,719 Speaker 1: oh good, it's lead poisoning. We like not being paralyzed, 584 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 1: we like not having these terrible symptoms, Thank you, Dr Baker. 585 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 1: But that's not what happened now, because a lot of 586 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:31,360 Speaker 1: these people thought you are going to ruin our main industry. 587 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:33,920 Speaker 1: They were like, bro, we know you work with the 588 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:38,439 Speaker 1: queen and that's cool for you, but we're poor. We 589 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:41,719 Speaker 1: have to do this. And in fact, many of us 590 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,440 Speaker 1: rely on apples, not just for business, but it's the 591 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:48,520 Speaker 1: main thing we eat. Well. It also reminds me of 592 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:51,320 Speaker 1: it's a little more modern example, but that botula is 593 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:55,319 Speaker 1: um scare with the pizza the frozen pizza maker. Um that. 594 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:57,240 Speaker 1: And then he ended up doing like a publicity stunt 595 00:36:57,239 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 1: to to do like a funeral for all the potentially 596 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,919 Speaker 1: in affected pizzas. And even though we know in that 597 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:07,759 Speaker 1: story the canned mushrooms that were suspects didn't end up 598 00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:11,200 Speaker 1: even testing positive fribatualism, and he had to destroy this 599 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:15,319 Speaker 1: massive amount of product and then that got out and 600 00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:17,120 Speaker 1: then it kind of it just it sort of tanks 601 00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:20,399 Speaker 1: you even if it people remember the bad news, even 602 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:22,359 Speaker 1: if it doesn't end up being true. So I could 603 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:23,840 Speaker 1: see how that would be something that would be scary, 604 00:37:23,840 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 1: even though it wasn't directly cider related, uh specifically to 605 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:31,400 Speaker 1: to the man. It was, you know, connected to the cider, 606 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:34,120 Speaker 1: but it was something that could be mitigated and then 607 00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:36,920 Speaker 1: you know, dealt with and and and move forward. I 608 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,400 Speaker 1: could see how it could put a taint on the 609 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: whole industry, you know, with people thinking, oh god, cider 610 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,120 Speaker 1: was to blame. Yeah, And it's weird because historians knew 611 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:51,040 Speaker 1: that Baker was very well aware of some cider manufacturers 612 00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:56,080 Speaker 1: not being big fans of this idea. They had also 613 00:37:56,160 --> 00:38:00,919 Speaker 1: recently campaigned to repeal attacks on cider. They were sort 614 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:05,279 Speaker 1: of in a punchy fighting mood, and locals argued that 615 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:09,360 Speaker 1: Devin's cider didn't contain that much lead, and they said, actually, 616 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:13,719 Speaker 1: the problem really is the earlier point about acidity, and 617 00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:16,400 Speaker 1: the lead that you found in the cider was probably 618 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:19,560 Speaker 1: caused by farmers shooting at birds in the orchards, and 619 00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 1: that left some bullets behind inside the apples, so they're 620 00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:28,920 Speaker 1: grasping at straws. And and he was, he was vilified. 621 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:32,200 Speaker 1: Baker was just like Samuel Weiss and washing your hands. 622 00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:36,439 Speaker 1: Baker was vilified by authority figures in the area as 623 00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:42,520 Speaker 1: a quote faithless son of Devon. And and people were, 624 00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:46,040 Speaker 1: you know, they felt to some degree betrayed, like their 625 00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 1: livelihood was in danger. But his thesis remained relatively unscathed. 626 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:58,440 Speaker 1: And it's happening while technology is evolving, so more modern 627 00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:02,840 Speaker 1: machines are replaced seen these old lead lined machines. And 628 00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 1: as much due to that as due to Baker's breakthrough, 629 00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:14,280 Speaker 1: Devonshire colic becomes increasingly rare. And then cider makers, whatever 630 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:18,280 Speaker 1: they may have said publicly or at the local oh, publicly, 631 00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:22,799 Speaker 1: is in at the local pub. And uh no, let's 632 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:27,720 Speaker 1: leave it in. Let'son's it's it's it's part of the record. Thanks, 633 00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:32,279 Speaker 1: So Uh, No, matter what they said in public, a 634 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: lot of cider makers went back to their to their 635 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:39,360 Speaker 1: operations and quietly removed lead from their process on their own. 636 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:41,880 Speaker 1: And then this would have been This is in like 637 00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:46,040 Speaker 1: the early eight hundreds, right, Yeah, by that by that point, 638 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: it's interesting because obviously even still today, we still have 639 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:53,760 Speaker 1: problems with lead contamination and water supplies like in Flint, Michigan, 640 00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 1: and even in Detroit, um because of aged infrastructure and 641 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:00,840 Speaker 1: pipes and stuff like that that there isn't the money 642 00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:05,040 Speaker 1: to replace or just you know, I guess irresponsible governance 643 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:07,400 Speaker 1: or I think it largely comes back to lack of 644 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:10,399 Speaker 1: money to improve infrastructure. We have these fates of lead 645 00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:13,120 Speaker 1: poisoning among children and lead levels that are way beyond 646 00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,719 Speaker 1: acceptable levels. Yeah, and this is a little bit of 647 00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:19,440 Speaker 1: a thought experiment. As as we're wrapping up the episode, 648 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:21,719 Speaker 1: I'm really glad you brought this up. There's a thing 649 00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:26,680 Speaker 1: that we've talked about maybe in the past on error off. 650 00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,720 Speaker 1: I've always been fascinated by it's called the lead crime hypothesis. 651 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,400 Speaker 1: You heard of this, I have not been. So we 652 00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,560 Speaker 1: know that lead is very toxic to multiple organs of 653 00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:42,319 Speaker 1: the body, the brain in particular, the lead crime hypothesis 654 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:47,520 Speaker 1: argues that there is an association between elevated levels of 655 00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:50,920 Speaker 1: lead in the blood of children, right, so they're exposed 656 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:55,840 Speaker 1: in childhood, in their formative years, and later increased rates 657 00:40:55,960 --> 00:41:00,560 Speaker 1: of crime and delinquency. Oh my god. So the idea 658 00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: of this hypothesis is that exposure to lead when you're 659 00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:08,120 Speaker 1: a kid, when your brain is developing, may have effects 660 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 1: that make you more likely to commit crimes as an adult, 661 00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:15,520 Speaker 1: you know, or as a as a you know, as 662 00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:19,439 Speaker 1: you go through your teens. This remains hypothesis, hasn't been 663 00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:23,600 Speaker 1: conclusively proven, but I would love to see information about 664 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:26,799 Speaker 1: Devon and Devonshire and maybe, you know, if there was 665 00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: some correlation between crime in that time and exposure to 666 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: lead in the cider industry. We don't have that information now, 667 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,239 Speaker 1: and we also, uh, we also have to just emphasize 668 00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 1: yet again, that is a hypothesis. It is not you know, 669 00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:47,279 Speaker 1: it's not conclusively proven. Well, and I mean, surely this 670 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:50,239 Speaker 1: isn't something that happens like, uh, you know, what's that 671 00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:52,880 Speaker 1: like genetic memory or something like that. I forget the 672 00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:57,240 Speaker 1: exact genetics epigenetics, but I did just look up crime 673 00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:03,120 Speaker 1: stats for Devon and in one or between April mar 674 00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:08,600 Speaker 1: Devon has an eighteent crime rate. So what does what 675 00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:12,120 Speaker 1: does that mean exactly? I don't know. The total number 676 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:16,040 Speaker 1: of violent crimes uh is twenty nine point five thousand, 677 00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:19,239 Speaker 1: So violent crimes does makes up thirty two percent of 678 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:22,160 Speaker 1: all crimes reported in the country, um and the number 679 00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:24,239 Speaker 1: is up four point six percent compared year over year 680 00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:27,640 Speaker 1: compared to the previous sample. Uh So, IMMA must have 681 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:30,120 Speaker 1: to do with the population because Devin, you know, the 682 00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:33,560 Speaker 1: UK in general isn't a massive land area. So I 683 00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:37,239 Speaker 1: mean for a small shire like Devon to have a 684 00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:41,319 Speaker 1: crime rate that seems pretty nuts. Yeah. No, that's a 685 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,920 Speaker 1: very good point. But again I couldn't possibly correlate that 686 00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:48,319 Speaker 1: to the lead poisoning epidemic of the eighteen hundreds, but 687 00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:52,240 Speaker 1: maybe you could. I don't know. Yeah, I mean, well, 688 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,239 Speaker 1: we would love to see the science on that. Let 689 00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 1: us know. If you are an expert, let's know what 690 00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:03,719 Speaker 1: your take on the lead prime hypothesis is. And most importantly, 691 00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,360 Speaker 1: I know the question that's been on everybody's mind. You 692 00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:09,719 Speaker 1: heard about the waters of Bath and you thought, well, 693 00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,879 Speaker 1: I want to take the waters. Guys, can I still 694 00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:18,480 Speaker 1: take the waters. The answer is yes, Uh, these waters 695 00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:23,439 Speaker 1: aren't proven to be hazardous or healing nowadays. But if 696 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:26,400 Speaker 1: the mood so strikes you find yourself in the neighborhood, 697 00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:28,840 Speaker 1: you can soak in those waters. You can take a 698 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:31,880 Speaker 1: sip of that water. You can even we should have 699 00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,000 Speaker 1: mentioned like back in the heyday of bath people are 700 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:38,040 Speaker 1: just literally laying in water for hours and hours, right, 701 00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:41,160 Speaker 1: They needed entertainment, So there would be these musicians that 702 00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:43,560 Speaker 1: would come and like play to people in a bathtub, 703 00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:46,040 Speaker 1: which sounds like it could be a fun time. You 704 00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: can do that today. You can do it the same 705 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,040 Speaker 1: way that people did it hundreds of years ago, but 706 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,760 Speaker 1: hopefully you'll be doing it for fun and recreation instead 707 00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:58,040 Speaker 1: of an attempt to no longer be paralyzed. And just 708 00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:01,799 Speaker 1: I'm at the best statistician. I'm not gonna lie, but 709 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,080 Speaker 1: the stats that I have on Devon and violent crimes 710 00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:09,120 Speaker 1: is that of the national crime rate is from Devon. 711 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:13,719 Speaker 1: I don't know, Um, you know what, just glaze over 712 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,120 Speaker 1: all of the stats stuff. I think I might be overthinking, 713 00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:19,600 Speaker 1: but um, it's very interesting that you can still hang 714 00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:23,160 Speaker 1: out in bath and tour those uh those bath houses 715 00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:25,879 Speaker 1: that you know have probably not changed much at all 716 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:28,840 Speaker 1: since the times of the story they were telling today. Yeah, 717 00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:31,759 Speaker 1: and we would love to hear your take on this. 718 00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:35,040 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for tuning in. Thanks of course to 719 00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:39,560 Speaker 1: our awesome producers Casey Pegram, andrew A. How Howard and 720 00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:42,120 Speaker 1: of course Max Williams. I think we're still working on 721 00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:45,200 Speaker 1: a nickname for Max. We might even drag Max on 722 00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:48,160 Speaker 1: the air. You know it's important and a little behind 723 00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:52,360 Speaker 1: the scenes inside baseball. Also thanks to Alex Williams compose 724 00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:57,760 Speaker 1: our theme brother to Max, no joke, Yes this is true. 725 00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:01,839 Speaker 1: And also big big thanks of course to Eli and 726 00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:05,640 Speaker 1: Diana a ridiculous romance. Uh can't wait for you to 727 00:45:05,719 --> 00:45:08,760 Speaker 1: check out their show. Big thanks of course to Eve's 728 00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:13,759 Speaker 1: jeffco who just made an appearance on Ridiculous History. And uh, 729 00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:16,880 Speaker 1: well you know we're required to say it. Big thanks 730 00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:20,440 Speaker 1: to Jonathan Strickland. Noel, I'm thinking that maybe we can 731 00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:25,760 Speaker 1: like redirect the quistions pedantic rage towards Eli and Diana. 732 00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:27,759 Speaker 1: What do you think I think they've got it coming. 733 00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:32,399 Speaker 1: It's a hazing kind of situation, right, maybe it is? Uh, 734 00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,239 Speaker 1: most importantly, man, thanks to you, and here's to us 735 00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:38,200 Speaker 1: not getting lead boys needs same Ben same, We'll see 736 00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:47,839 Speaker 1: you next time, folks. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, 737 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,560 Speaker 1: visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 738 00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:52,240 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.