WEBVTT - I Choose ... MORE with Joan Lunden 0:00:01.560 --> 0:00:09.039 You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Girl. Welcome 0:00:09.119 --> 0:00:12.600 back to I Choose Me, where we talk about choices 0:00:12.720 --> 0:00:17.080 big and small that help us improve our lives. I 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:21.640 wanted to spend days with Joan London, trailblazing journalist and author, 0:00:21.800 --> 0:00:26.599 soaking in her incredible stories and lessons. Here's some more 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:27.520 of our conversation. 0:00:28.080 --> 0:00:30.680 Oh, I love the title of this. I love I 0:00:30.800 --> 0:00:33.440 Choose Me. Obviously, I choose. 0:00:33.280 --> 0:00:36.640 Me, Yeah, over and over on. 0:00:36.560 --> 0:00:38.960 The entire journey, again and again and again. So of 0:00:39.000 --> 0:00:41.519 course when I heard the title of your podcast, I 0:00:41.560 --> 0:00:45.120 was like, I love that. Yes, you're like women, child 0:00:45.240 --> 0:00:45.559 do it? 0:00:45.760 --> 0:00:49.320 No, and we're not taught to choose ourselves. 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:52.440 Men are taught at a very young age choose you 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:54.600 go out on that football field, you show them whose 0:00:54.640 --> 0:00:59.280 boss you do this like? And you know it's getting better. 0:01:00.040 --> 0:01:05.080 But I just think almost inherently, women don't think that way. 0:01:05.120 --> 0:01:09.440 Maybe it's because certainly as life goes on, you have 0:01:09.840 --> 0:01:13.080 you have children and like A, I don't. I don't 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:14.760 mean it's done a great men, but I mean men 0:01:14.800 --> 0:01:16.360 get up in the morning and they think what am 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:18.199 I gonna wear to the I have a big meeting today? 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:20.160 What am I gonna have for breakfast? And then I 0:01:20.200 --> 0:01:21.480 got to get in the car and leave now because 0:01:21.480 --> 0:01:23.360 I don't want to be late for that meeting. Women 0:01:23.400 --> 0:01:26.080 get up and say, did I buy the ice skates? 0:01:26.200 --> 0:01:29.040 Do I have the hot right hockey stick? Oh my god, 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:34.240 I've got this? Have a parent teacher meeting. You we 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:38.360 juggle so much, shoes, your children over yourself. And it's 0:01:38.360 --> 0:01:41.440 a completely different mindset. And that's not to say that 0:01:41.440 --> 0:01:43.480 a lot of men are doing a lot more these days. 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:46.200 And I have a great husband who's been, you know, 0:01:47.400 --> 0:01:51.280 very hands on, not like a mother. He's not trying 0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:53.080 to remember if you bought the hockey stick or not, 0:01:54.520 --> 0:01:57.240 but he's been very hands on. But it's it's a 0:01:57.280 --> 0:02:00.920 real Oh, it's just such a I always felt like 0:02:00.960 --> 0:02:04.800 you're walking like this tightrope. And as you're walking this 0:02:04.960 --> 0:02:08.280 type rope as the working woman, every time you kind 0:02:08.320 --> 0:02:09.960 of fall over to one side and think, oh man, 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:11.360 I should have been at the office. And then I'll 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:12.840 run this say oh god, I should have been with 0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:18.400 the kids. Yeah, And it's just this emotional things. It's 0:02:18.440 --> 0:02:22.639 like torture. We torture ourselves. Yeah, we torture ourselves. 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:26.360 I know, and I love spreading the message of how 0:02:26.440 --> 0:02:30.240 important it is to choose yourself, even to you know, 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:34.840 especially to younger girls. My daughters are you know, young 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:38.600 women who they live their life by this now, and 0:02:38.639 --> 0:02:43.519 they they comprehend it on a level that I never did, 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:46.280 and I'm sure you never did either, we as women, 0:02:46.680 --> 0:02:49.280 and I just get a little bit upset that we were, 0:02:49.440 --> 0:02:52.320 that we've had to work this hard for so long 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:57.079 to come to this magical place where we allow ourselves 0:02:57.800 --> 0:02:59.760 to choose themselves, to love ourselves. 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:02.960 Only Mike in our fifties or sixties, right, But I 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:04.680 mean I saw a picture of your daughters. You have 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:06.000 such beautiful daughters. 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:07.560 Oh my god, gosh, thank you. 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:10.920 So how many daughters do you have? I only have three? 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:12.200 You have three? 0:03:12.480 --> 0:03:13.519 Four or five daughters? 0:03:13.520 --> 0:03:18.400 Five daughters? Yes, and they're just awesome. And you know, 0:03:18.520 --> 0:03:22.800 the older ones, of course, lived through all those years 0:03:22.800 --> 0:03:26.640 with me on GMA. They came into the studio, although interestingly, 0:03:26.760 --> 0:03:30.359 as each one has finished the book, reading the final manuscript, 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:34.000 they said, wow, I didn't know this or I didn't 0:03:34.040 --> 0:03:36.040 know that, and like I was there with you, but 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:40.400 I didn't know this. And then there's my younger girls, 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:46.920 because Jamie's forty five, Sarah's, Lindsay's forty two, and Sarah's 0:03:46.960 --> 0:03:50.960 thirty eight. How do you remember all the ages? And 0:03:51.000 --> 0:03:57.160 then the twins Kate and Max are twenty three, and 0:03:57.480 --> 0:04:00.240 Kim and Jack are turning twenty one. They're twenty months apart, 0:04:00.520 --> 0:04:05.440 are turning twenty one. So those two young girls, they 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:08.080 are going to be reading a book about a person 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:12.520 that they don't know that much about. In a way, 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:16.200 it's it's really weird to me. They're going to read 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:21.000 it completely different than my older girls. And I'm so 0:04:21.360 --> 0:04:25.200 cognizant of that that they don't. They were never around 0:04:25.240 --> 0:04:27.960 with me when I was riding around the limousines and 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:31.240 you know, on red carpets every year other day. They 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:35.919 didn't live that life and the older girls did. But 0:04:36.320 --> 0:04:40.839 to my younger girls, I'm just kind of a normal mom. 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:47.080 So it's going to be really interesting to hear their take. 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:54.040 Yeah, what advice would you give to us to help 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:56.040 us all believe in ourselves the way you have? 0:04:58.040 --> 0:05:01.920 Oh? I think that, you know, I just saw this. 0:05:01.960 --> 0:05:06.320 It's ironic. I just saw this, not a meme, but 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:09.320 this little video yesterday on my feed, one of my 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:12.800 social media feeds that showed if you have an ant 0:05:12.839 --> 0:05:14.760 on a piece of paper and you draw a circle 0:05:14.800 --> 0:05:17.880 around it, the ant won't go out of the circle 0:05:18.200 --> 0:05:23.120 the drawing the drawn circle around it. Like I'm dying 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:24.720 to like try this, Oh, I want to try this. 0:05:24.880 --> 0:05:27.279 Give me the same with the same with like a spider, 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:30.960 Like if you draw this line, but once if you 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:33.479 keep drawing the lines, this guy showed if you draw 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:37.560 the lines smaller and smaller so that pretty soon any 0:05:37.640 --> 0:05:42.760 movement lets them go across the line, then then they'll 0:05:42.800 --> 0:05:47.640 never be they'll never have a line hold them in again. 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:51.320 So now just think about this in terms of us. 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:57.520 We inherently draw lines around ourselves, like we all do. 0:05:57.880 --> 0:05:59.800 Like I'm sure you've had a fitness trainer that says, 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:01.960 do as many sit ups as you can, and you 0:06:02.000 --> 0:06:04.080 do twenty, and they say, why did you stop at twenty? 0:06:05.400 --> 0:06:07.000 I don't know, because I thought that's how many I 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:12.240 could do. I mean, we all make boundaries, and so 0:06:12.920 --> 0:06:15.760 I think what I was learning, just like that ant, 0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:18.680 or just like that spider that crossed over the line 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:21.680 and then no line could hold them back, is I 0:06:21.760 --> 0:06:27.000 learned pretty early on that I crossed those lines and 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:30.080 like Okay, I can do whatever whatever I want, and 0:06:30.120 --> 0:06:33.560 if you can kind of have that concept as a 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:37.200 young person, or is anybody any age that feels like 0:06:37.720 --> 0:06:42.200 they just are limiting themselves? And I say that because 0:06:42.200 --> 0:06:46.040 that's actually exactly what they're doing. They're limiting themselves by 0:06:46.080 --> 0:06:50.560 their own boundaries, and we almost can't help it. But 0:06:50.720 --> 0:06:54.000 to make those it's like kids. You say, oh, the 0:06:54.080 --> 0:06:57.560 kid needs boundaries, and it feels safe to have. It 0:06:57.560 --> 0:07:01.440 feels that circle. But you know, I always use the 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.320 example of the show I did Behind Closed Doors where 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:08.880 I jumped with the Golden Knights and on an aircraft 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:11.559 carrier and an F eighteen and all these things, and 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:14.360 people are like, oh my god, you just like you have, 0:07:14.600 --> 0:07:17.760 you know, balls, You're not afraid? Do you think that? 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:20.840 Every time I drove out of my driveway with yet 0:07:20.960 --> 0:07:25.760 another uniform packed in my suitcase to go off and 0:07:25.880 --> 0:07:29.280 go through training so I could do what my husband 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:36.800 refers to as my stupid human tricks, No, I felt 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:39.320 cautious and am I really going to be able to 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:42.560 pull this off? Like I probably thought that before almost 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:46.000 every one of those stories, But then I just said, 0:07:46.560 --> 0:07:50.160 but I'm going to do it anyway. That's pretty much it, 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:54.040 and that's you know, I just think that people hear 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:57.640 opportunities all the time, Like somebody will be You'll be 0:07:57.680 --> 0:07:59.880 with a group and somebody will be talking about something, 0:08:00.400 --> 0:08:04.280 and people tend to think, oh, that's so great, Wow, 0:08:04.360 --> 0:08:08.200 that's gonna be a great opportunity for someone. Why not you? 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:13.800 Why not yea? Why not you? And I've always kind 0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:16.320 of lived my life that way. So I've snatched onto 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:19.720 every one of them. And consequently, I have a memoir 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:22.680 that was really hard to do because I had to 0:08:22.680 --> 0:08:25.200 figure out what things am I going to actually use 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:28.160 because at first I wrote like one hundred and eighty 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:32.240 thousand page memoile, Well, you can't go over one hundred 0:08:32.240 --> 0:08:34.560 thousand words. Nobody wants to read over one hundred thousand words. 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:37.160 So I'm like, what am I going to let go of? 0:08:37.880 --> 0:08:40.319 And what am I going to leave in? And then 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:44.959 I also decided I'm a voracious reader. I love reading books. 0:08:45.040 --> 0:08:50.480 I love books, And what do I love about them? Well? 0:08:51.400 --> 0:08:55.120 I love reading novels and they take you into their world. 0:08:55.240 --> 0:09:00.480 They with adjectives. They they define what the what the 0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:02.600 area is like, and what the person is like, and 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:05.840 what's happening. Don't you want to write a book like 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:09.640 the books you like? And that's when I decided that 0:09:09.720 --> 0:09:12.600 it shouldn't be an autobiography, which was the first draft 0:09:12.679 --> 0:09:15.720 I wrote, and I decided it needs to be a memoir. 0:09:16.240 --> 0:09:18.360 You can't just say and so then you know, the 0:09:18.400 --> 0:09:20.000 first time they offered me that job, I had to 0:09:20.000 --> 0:09:22.959 turn it down. Uh uh. I was writing up in 0:09:23.000 --> 0:09:24.840 the elevator that day. I knew I had to meet 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:27.360 with the executives and tell them I wasn't gonna How 0:09:27.400 --> 0:09:28.400 am I going to tell them? 0:09:28.800 --> 0:09:29.000 Oh? 0:09:29.080 --> 0:09:30.760 There they are? Is I get off the elevator, They're 0:09:30.760 --> 0:09:33.520 already at the table. So now as the waiter is 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:36.120 unfolding my napkin, like, get your get the words in 0:09:36.160 --> 0:09:38.160 your head, Joan, how are you gonna do this? That's 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:41.240 what they want to hear. They want like a like 0:09:41.280 --> 0:09:43.600 all the novels that we all read and that we love. 0:09:43.880 --> 0:09:47.719 They want to be inside your head. Yeah you did that. 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:51.640 I did you did because I can feel myself and 0:09:51.679 --> 0:09:54.640 I'm sure everybody that reads this book can feel themselves 0:09:55.120 --> 0:09:57.240 in those scenarios that you found yourself. 0:09:56.960 --> 0:10:02.120 In that moment that oh my god, yes, that terrifying moment. 0:10:02.679 --> 0:10:12.960 Yeah, you really broke some major ground in your career, 0:10:13.040 --> 0:10:17.520 I mean left and right, but also as far as 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.400 what women were allowed to do in the East in 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:24.280 the workplace. You brought your newborn daughter to work at 0:10:24.280 --> 0:10:27.000 Good Morning America in the early eighties. 0:10:27.200 --> 0:10:29.160 Which was the most cacamaming thing that I could. 0:10:29.800 --> 0:10:33.160 Yeah, because I know what that's like. You get you 0:10:33.200 --> 0:10:36.840 wake that baby up at three am to get to 0:10:36.920 --> 0:10:41.600 the set. Yep, it's just a different, you know, a different. 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:45.120 I would do everything ahead of time, Jenny, and I'd 0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:47.480 have my bag that was my work bag, and then 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:50.199 I would have the diaper bag. I'd have it already 0:10:50.640 --> 0:10:52.600 and i'd have like a little you know, I forget 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:55.720 what those things bunting on top of the changing table. 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:58.880 And at three point thirty, I would get up and 0:10:58.920 --> 0:11:01.160 I'd get myself ready, and then I'd go and i'd 0:11:01.920 --> 0:11:04.640 scoop her out of the crib. She was seven weeks old, 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:07.240 and I started as gently as I could and put 0:11:07.240 --> 0:11:10.640 her on the bunting and ant I always put her 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:12.920 in one of those nightgowns that like open at the 0:11:12.960 --> 0:11:15.560 bottom so I could try to make her stay atsleep 0:11:15.600 --> 0:11:18.960 while I oh put on a fresh diaper. And get 0:11:18.960 --> 0:11:20.840 her into the bunting, get in the back of the car, 0:11:20.880 --> 0:11:24.040 and this was before the car set days. I'd have 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:26.120 her in my arms in the back of the limo, 0:11:27.000 --> 0:11:30.360 breastfeeding on one side, breastfeeding on the other side, reading 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:33.040 the first eighty pages of the script, and then the 0:11:33.120 --> 0:11:36.600 second eighty pages, and then she'd be conped out and 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.200 I'd go and put her in her little crib, which 0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:40.920 they gave me a little They gave me the dressing 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:43.520 room next to mine. We'd put a crib in there 0:11:44.040 --> 0:11:47.080 and a rocking chair, and she would go to sleep. 0:11:47.360 --> 0:11:50.640 I remember Barbara Walters came in one morning and she 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:53.000 came into the makeup room and said high and then 0:11:53.040 --> 0:11:56.520 she turned around to go down the hall to get 0:11:56.559 --> 0:12:00.400 coffee to the coffee room, and she walked by the 0:12:00.520 --> 0:12:05.400 open door and she stopped and she turned around. She said, 0:12:05.600 --> 0:12:08.480 I don't even believe what I'm seeing, Like I really 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:12.640 can't get over this, that your baby is sleeping there 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:15.000 while you do hair and makeup, and you're going to 0:12:15.080 --> 0:12:18.160 go down and do two hours of live television. Like 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:20.880 I can't imagine what they would have said if I'd 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:24.560 asked to bring my young daughter to work with me, 0:12:25.600 --> 0:12:32.959 and it was unprecedented. Isn't really a word? Is sufficient? Right? 0:12:33.160 --> 0:12:35.120 I got to hand a DABC. They let me, They 0:12:35.120 --> 0:12:39.040 said yes. But frankly, there had not been a lot 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:45.200 of camaraderie on the show. How do I delicately say 0:12:45.200 --> 0:12:47.800 this between the co hosts that came before me and 0:12:47.920 --> 0:12:48.480 David Hartman? 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:49.160 Right? 0:12:49.240 --> 0:12:54.160 And so she'd been she had left, and they wanted 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:58.200 to get my tush in that seat and put the 0:12:58.240 --> 0:13:01.520 team back together as the fall lineup. And that was 0:13:01.559 --> 0:13:04.360 August twenty seventh, and they said September they announced all 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:07.160 the shows in the fall lineup. I think they just 0:13:07.240 --> 0:13:10.560 felt like, just say yes to her, like, you know, 0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:12.640 whatever it takes, well, keep it to be the best 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:16.800 kept secret. I don't think they had any clue at 0:13:16.800 --> 0:13:21.240 all how the audience was going to react and how 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:26.400 it would have a ripple effect across industries, across other corporations. 0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:29.400 I don't think that they had any idea that it all. 0:13:29.640 --> 0:13:30.040 Did you? 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:32.839 Did you realize at the time how radical that moment 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:35.360 was or were you just doing what you had to 0:13:35.400 --> 0:13:36.880 do as a mother, what you felt I. 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.040 Was taking a young woman who got a great job 0:13:39.080 --> 0:13:41.480 and got pregnant at the same time, and I was 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:45.679 putting one foot in front of the other, and I mean, 0:13:45.679 --> 0:13:49.520 I asked my Remember this was nineteen seventy nine, you 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:53.960 couldn't say the word breastfeeding on television. Unbelievable. That was 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.680 one of the words that you could not say on television. 0:13:57.120 --> 0:13:59.040 And so I asked my agent, will you go ahead 0:13:59.000 --> 0:14:01.120 and ask them that if I can take my baby 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:04.560 to work because I'm breastfeeding. He was like silent for 0:14:04.679 --> 0:14:07.679 thirty seconds. I said, I'm really serious, like, just go 0:14:07.760 --> 0:14:09.720 ask them. And I would love to have been a 0:14:09.760 --> 0:14:14.800 flying on that wall, right and uh, you know, everybody thought, well, 0:14:14.840 --> 0:14:18.440 we'll just you know, we'll just keep it mum. But 0:14:18.480 --> 0:14:20.880 that didn't happen. You know, I talk about in the 0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:24.560 book how they staged this beautiful, big press conference after 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:27.480 my first day and invited all the press and we 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:33.080 had this amazing turnout, like more than they expected, and 0:14:33.520 --> 0:14:36.880 little did we know why. And you know, David Hartman 0:14:37.560 --> 0:14:41.320 welcomed everybody there and introduced me, and I opened it 0:14:41.400 --> 0:14:45.320 up to questions. First question Time magazine we heard you're 0:14:45.320 --> 0:14:47.760 bringing your baby to work. How did you work that 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.760 out with ABC? And like you, I remember, my eyes 0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:52.480 darted to the back of the room where all the 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:55.440 executives were and all the pr people who had pulled 0:14:55.440 --> 0:14:57.880 me aside like moments before, I walked out and said, 0:14:58.000 --> 0:15:00.920 what have you do? Do not say you have baby upstairs. 0:15:01.120 --> 0:15:03.200 These are critics. They will chew you up and they 0:15:03.240 --> 0:15:06.320 will spit you out and everything you can do your job. 0:15:06.400 --> 0:15:08.680 I was like, okay, I didn't really plan on bringing 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:13.080 it up. And second question, Newsweek, the show travels, how 0:15:13.120 --> 0:15:15.920 are you going to deal with that? And I said, well, actually, 0:15:16.320 --> 0:15:20.200 ABC contractually has given me the right to take the 0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:24.520 baby with me as long as i'm bricet feeding. You 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:25.160 print that. 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:29.200 Oh my gosh, that was out. 0:15:29.040 --> 0:15:31.440 Of the bag. But that became the story of the morning, 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:33.800 and you know, that's why they had all heard it 0:15:33.840 --> 0:15:36.800 and they were all there. It wasn't because ABC was 0:15:36.840 --> 0:15:40.440 announcing the new star on GMA. It was because a 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:44.600 major media corporation had given a woman the right to 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:48.920 bring her newborn baby to work. That was the breaking 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:50.280 news story of the day. 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:52.800 Well as it should have been. It changed the times, 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:56.920 It changed the trajectory of everyone's you know, experience being 0:15:56.920 --> 0:15:58.200 a mom and having to work. 0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:01.480 So that's what I was not a flag waving feminist. 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:04.960 Remember I my mom didn't want me on a college 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:08.960 campus in America because I was so young, so she 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:11.560 sent me on world campus Afloat. Now it's called Semester 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:14.720 at See. Best thing ever because we went around the world, 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:18.560 visiting fifteen countries. That probably went a long way to 0:16:18.600 --> 0:16:22.000 me getting my first job in broadcasting. And then one 0:16:22.040 --> 0:16:24.600 of the shipmates said, what are you going to do 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:26.440 when you get back, and I said, well, I've applied 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.720 to you know, I was accepted at UCLA and U 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:31.800 SEE Berkeley, and now I'm going dating a guy that 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:35.040 goes to University of Texas, so I'm also applying there. 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:37.320 She said, well, I'm going to go to Mexico City 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:40.720 because there's this university down there and I'd love to 0:16:40.760 --> 0:16:42.520 have I want someone to go with me, we go 0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:46.520 with me. I was like, okay, and so I went, 0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:51.359 but I got My mom actually flew down from Sacramento, California, 0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:53.640 to La so we could meet her in LA and 0:16:53.720 --> 0:16:56.240 fly on to Mexico City. And when I called her 0:16:56.320 --> 0:16:59.160 to tell her I'm here, I'm ready for the flight tomorrow, 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:03.640 she said, oh, I'm really sorry. I've decided not to go. Ah, 0:17:04.080 --> 0:17:06.000 and my mom is like, so what are you going 0:17:06.080 --> 0:17:09.160 to do. I said, I'm going to Mexico tomorrow morning 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:13.679 by myself. That's my gosh. So I didn't know. It's 0:17:13.760 --> 0:17:16.080 so wonderful. I went for three months and I stayed 0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:21.160 three years. And again that all played into why this 0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:25.800 news director. Why I walked in off the street at 0:17:25.800 --> 0:17:27.840 a time when no women were coming in and applying 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:30.760 for a job at a TV station and sat down 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:33.880 and said, you know, one of your salespeople here told 0:17:33.880 --> 0:17:36.280 me that you're going to be hiring more women because 0:17:36.280 --> 0:17:38.959 the women's movement is going to force you to do that. 0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:42.639 So tell me about this job. Tell me you know 0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:45.720 what's the future for women, you know, how's things going 0:17:45.800 --> 0:17:47.840 to change. And he looked at me and he said 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:51.120 that salesperson told me I'd be impressed with you, but 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:53.800 he did know how to write an interview, because you're 0:17:53.800 --> 0:17:56.879 interviewing me. Yeah. He took me into the studio and 0:17:57.000 --> 0:18:00.600 sat me at that news set. I mean, it was 0:18:00.680 --> 0:18:02.639 just something I used to see every night on that 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:06.760 on my television at home, and I read copy and 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:11.080 he said, you've got something like I think that you've 0:18:11.160 --> 0:18:13.040 really got what it takes me in this business. But 0:18:13.080 --> 0:18:15.800 I don't have a job, but I'll keep you in mind. 0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:19.520 But fortunately the weatherman was back behind the set and 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:22.240 he saw the audition and he followed me out into 0:18:22.240 --> 0:18:25.640 the parking lot and he said, there are a few 0:18:25.680 --> 0:18:29.679 stations around the country that are hiring weather girls, and 0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:32.400 I'd like to make you Sacramento's first weather girl. 0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:35.240 And you were getting paid what, thirty dollars a week? 0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:38.600 You said, thirty dollars a week. No, it was like 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:41.639 a supposedly like a paid internship. I mean it was. 0:18:41.840 --> 0:18:45.720 It was nothing. And thank god my mom taught me 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:49.000 to recognize an opportunity. When I heard it, I said, okay, 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:52.400 oh my gosh, be at the station at five o'clock 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:57.640 on Monday. I was like, five am. Yes, I start 0:18:57.720 --> 0:18:59.840 drive time radio at five am. I want you there. 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:02.240 That was kind of like the beginning of my early 0:19:02.320 --> 0:19:04.160 morning life. 0:19:04.200 --> 0:19:06.120 For the rest of your life, for the rest of 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:15.440 my life. I want to talk about one little thing 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:19.080 before we before we go. In your book, you reflect 0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:21.400 on a time in your forties where you were faced 0:19:21.720 --> 0:19:24.359 where you face the crossroads of midlife, and you didn't 0:19:24.400 --> 0:19:28.400 recognize yourself or your body. And I can definitely relate 0:19:28.480 --> 0:19:30.680 to that. We both grew up in front of the cameras. 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:34.800 I recently saw TikTok actually from a woman named Susie 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:38.160 Trigg Tucker, who resonated with me so much. She said 0:19:38.160 --> 0:19:41.320 that sometime in her mid forties, she started looking in 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:44.159 the mirror and feeling ugly, like the beauty that she 0:19:44.200 --> 0:19:47.520 had always seen and been rewarded for was melting away 0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:52.040 in fine lines and gray hair. In your experience, what 0:19:52.160 --> 0:19:54.280 did it feel like to look in the mirror at 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:55.800 that time of your life, in your forties. 0:19:56.160 --> 0:19:59.000 It happened to me at the age of thirty nine, actually, 0:20:00.040 --> 0:20:02.280 and I picked up a magazine at the time, Charlie's 0:20:02.280 --> 0:20:04.840 Angels was on television, and it was like the three 0:20:04.920 --> 0:20:10.760 Charlie's Angels and is said fit forty and fabulous, And 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:14.520 I was like, I want to be fit forty and fabulous, 0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:19.639 but I'm not. And I literally made a decision that 0:20:20.520 --> 0:20:23.199 I had to do something about it. I was turning forty, 0:20:23.280 --> 0:20:28.560 I had had three children, continued on the fast pace. 0:20:28.720 --> 0:20:32.280 I was probably forty five fifty pounds more than I 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:35.719 should be, and thank God for you know, big shoulder 0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:39.240 pads and big hair back in those days. But I 0:20:39.320 --> 0:20:40.960 knew I had to do something about it. And I 0:20:41.000 --> 0:20:44.359 also knew that twenty years from then, I still wanted 0:20:44.359 --> 0:20:46.159 to be able to run in a race and not 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:49.400 just like watch from the sidelines. I knew that I 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:52.359 had to change my life because I looked in the 0:20:52.400 --> 0:20:57.679 mirror and I was like, you're not that attractive anymore. 0:20:57.720 --> 0:21:00.000 Like you know, you can't you can't wear the clothes 0:21:00.320 --> 0:21:02.200 that would look really good on you because you've got 0:21:02.200 --> 0:21:06.239 so much extra weight on you. You're lethargic, you're tired all 0:21:06.280 --> 0:21:10.199 the time. I wonder why you got to do But 0:21:10.280 --> 0:21:12.560 I mean, but I took that on, Jenny. It's like 0:21:12.560 --> 0:21:17.600 a second job, because when you take it on as 0:21:17.600 --> 0:21:22.000 a second job, that means that the appointment with the 0:21:22.080 --> 0:21:25.600 trainer or the appointment with the nutritionists is just as 0:21:25.640 --> 0:21:29.200 important as the interview with the president or the interview 0:21:29.240 --> 0:21:31.760 with the major star. I tried to make them be 0:21:31.920 --> 0:21:36.240 equal that they couldn't be. I couldn't not show up. 0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:39.960 I couldn't they they had. I had to make them 0:21:41.880 --> 0:21:45.040 omni important like they that I had to do them 0:21:45.320 --> 0:21:48.600 and I worked really, really really hard for a year. 0:21:48.720 --> 0:21:52.080 I mean, it didn't happen anything overnight, but but when 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:56.280 I turned forty, I had dropped forty five pounds. And 0:21:56.400 --> 0:22:00.320 it's not just a matter of dropping the weight. Come 0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:09.480 this effusive, energetic person that had started playing tennis again 0:22:09.560 --> 0:22:13.359 and started, you know, doing things with girlfriends and that 0:22:13.400 --> 0:22:15.960 I hadn't been doing because all of a sudden, I 0:22:15.960 --> 0:22:18.720 mean it literally like transform me quite frankly into a 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:24.359 different person, to the point that I think it completely 0:22:24.480 --> 0:22:30.200 changed my life trajectory for the next ten years, because 0:22:30.240 --> 0:22:35.920 when I was forty five, like five. So now I'm 0:22:35.920 --> 0:22:38.760 like forty five, I've had like five Oh. I also 0:22:38.840 --> 0:22:43.199