1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: So we're all big, big fans of folklore. Folklore is 2 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: a fascinating way to explore history, to explore a culture, 3 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 1: to explore the world around you. And it may surprise 4 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:18,919 Speaker 1: some folks living in the West to learn that things 5 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:24,799 Speaker 1: the West treats as folklore are treated very much as 6 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 1: reality in different parts of the world. In ancient North 7 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 1: African and Middle Eastern belief systems, there is another type 8 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 1: of sentient creature that exists invisible all around you, and 9 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: they have their own beliefs, they have their own motivations. 10 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 1: They're called Jin. Matt, you did you epd a wonderful 11 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 1: series on Jin that happened after we did this episode. Yeah, 12 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 1: there's a whole show right now that you can find 13 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: called The Hidden Jin. Check it out. It's it's really great, 14 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: hosted by Robbia Shaudry and uh an excellent show. It's 15 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 1: on the Grim and Mild slate of shows from Aaron Mankey. 16 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 1: But guys, we're talking about genies, right, Yes, I know 17 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 1: these things. They're blue, they shake, shift, they do great impressions. Right, 18 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 1: A particular type of gin made, but there are many 19 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: types of gin. You know, the coolest part of their 20 00:01:26,720 --> 00:01:32,039 Speaker 1: origin story is that they were created out of smokeless fire, 21 00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:35,840 Speaker 1: which I always thought was so cool. Sorry, guys, sorry, 22 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:38,480 Speaker 1: I guess Emily I heard we're talking about Gin Uh 23 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: you got can I have my Well, there's uh. And 24 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: we're also not talking about Jin the Rapper formally with 25 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: DMX who it was pretty good, just a splash of 26 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: tonic for me. So let's learn about together, guys. That's 27 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:02,920 Speaker 1: it rom you as too, psychic powers and government conspiracies. 28 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back 29 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 1: now or learn this stuff they don't want you to know. Hello, 30 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 1: welcome back to the show. My name is Max, my 31 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: name is Noel, I'm Ben. You are you? And that 32 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: makes this stuff they don't want you to know. We 33 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:30,720 Speaker 1: hope this podcast finds you amid Grand Adventure. If so, 34 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: we'd love to hear about it. So I'll just get 35 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: this out of the way, because we talk about the 36 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:37,840 Speaker 1: Twitter and the Facebook stuff usually at the end of 37 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:40,440 Speaker 1: the show, right us, Well, we'll just we'll just mention 38 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 1: here that if you haven't found us yet, please do. 39 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:47,079 Speaker 1: We are conspiracy stuff on both Facebook and Twitter, and 40 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:49,919 Speaker 1: that's one of the most immediate ways to contact us. 41 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:52,640 Speaker 1: We would like to thank the listeners out there who 42 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: wrote to us several times over the past months and 43 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,399 Speaker 1: asked us to cover this topic because it just kept 44 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:00,799 Speaker 1: popping up in conversation, right, yeah, would pop up in 45 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:03,400 Speaker 1: conversation and on the fringes of a topic that we 46 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 1: were discussing. It came up I think in Alchemy. I 47 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:08,920 Speaker 1: remember you guys mentioning it, and it came up in 48 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:11,919 Speaker 1: a couple other places right before that too. I also 49 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,799 Speaker 1: seem to recall it coming up one time. I was like, 50 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 1: all right, all Jin demons, and Ben schooled me real quick. 51 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: So hopefully we'll get some more of that schooling. Oh 52 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:21,400 Speaker 1: I don't know. We might get schooled on this one, guys. 53 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:24,840 Speaker 1: We might. We might be the ones going to school 54 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 1: because this is one of our This is an episode 55 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 1: that's somewhere between a folklore episode, a cryptic episode of 56 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:36,400 Speaker 1: possession episode. Jin run into a lot of things, and 57 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:41,480 Speaker 1: first first we have to do a disclaimer for this one. 58 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: As Ben said, this is an academic exploration of this 59 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 1: topic about the folklore behind the what a gin is, 60 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: what Jin are, and we're not we're not trying to 61 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 1: persuade anybody to look at anything in a certain way, 62 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: especially uh to ascribe to any certain set of beliefs 63 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: or anything like that. Right, and our goal is not 64 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:05,800 Speaker 1: to confirm or deny anyone's religious beliefs. Right. Your spiritual convictions, 65 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 1: as always, are your own. So let's get into this exploration. 66 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: This is fascinated the three of us for a long time. 67 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: If you grew up in the West and are not 68 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 1: uh practitioner of Islam or not familiar with some of 69 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 1: the beliefs surrounding the Middle East and other related parts 70 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: of the world, then you probably have some very specific 71 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 1: ideas of what a jin or a genie is. Oh sure, 72 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 1: I mean a lot of my beliefs come from pop culture, 73 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:40,920 Speaker 1: from movies, television, books, comics, things where it would be 74 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 1: a genie usually spelled with a G, sometimes spelled with 75 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: a J, as in the case of I had dream 76 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:49,280 Speaker 1: of genie. Yes, yes, exactly, that's back from the sixties. 77 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: That's always the image I had of what it looked 78 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: like inside the lamp. She had cushions everywhere, and it 79 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: was like this built in like you know, it looked 80 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:59,599 Speaker 1: like a really sweet RV or something, you know, like 81 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:02,719 Speaker 1: with shag carpeting, you know, like it was nice. It 82 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 1: was super nice. Yeah. Well then you go you go 83 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,680 Speaker 1: to you know, horror films that look at genie's Like 84 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:11,600 Speaker 1: wish Master was one that I've watched when I was younger. 85 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 1: I probably shouldn't have watched it back then. Wasn't that 86 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 1: a West Craven movie? I think Wes Craven was part 87 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 1: of he produced it or something. Uh. Yeah, But then 88 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: we get to Aladdin, the Disney movie, which you know, 89 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 1: I don't know but you guys, but I was quoting 90 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:27,600 Speaker 1: that movie for years. Yeah. Man, I had that soundtrack 91 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:31,360 Speaker 1: on CD. It's a fantastic It's just a fantastic film. 92 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:33,600 Speaker 1: We watched it recently, and that that holds up for 93 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:38,040 Speaker 1: a film film? Yeah, well yeah it was film. Uh. 94 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 1: And then you you know, you move a little bit 95 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:42,920 Speaker 1: forward and you get to video games, where there are 96 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: different types of jin's uh that I've encountered in many 97 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,359 Speaker 1: a virtual world. You probably have too. So what do 98 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,160 Speaker 1: we know about what these gins are? From these things? 99 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 1: I have to say, I think he passed over a 100 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:58,280 Speaker 1: very important gen Snoop Dogg's Gin and Juice. Oh sorry, 101 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:02,040 Speaker 1: I also packed passed over Zam. You know, Oh we 102 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: forgot Kazam yeah, Shack, thank you narrowly avoided the email 103 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 1: on that from Shack himself. So what do we know 104 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 1: about genies from those pieces of pop culture. Well, here 105 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: are some of the main I guess we can call 106 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 1: them tropes that have been established about your standard run 107 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:22,440 Speaker 1: of the mill genie jin who call it what you will. Uh. One, 108 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:27,200 Speaker 1: Often they are imprisoned inside a material artifact, usually a 109 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: ring or you know, typically a lamp, and I guess 110 00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 1: it could be really anything, could be perhaps a chest 111 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 1: of some kind, like a book, even you know, you 112 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:39,919 Speaker 1: see different versions. Remember um, the care Bears movie where 113 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:44,040 Speaker 1: there was this creepy green faced ghost thing trapped inside 114 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 1: of a book and made the magician's assistant like, do 115 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:49,680 Speaker 1: weird stuff? I do not. I would argue that that 116 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:52,159 Speaker 1: is a gin in a way, because it's sort of 117 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:56,240 Speaker 1: imprisoned inside this artifact. Anyway, I digress. That always scare 118 00:06:56,279 --> 00:06:57,360 Speaker 1: the crap out of when I was a kid. That 119 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:03,840 Speaker 1: felt like a very intense film when I was really intense. Yeah, anyway, 120 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 1: So that's that's that's a huge part of it. Number Two, 121 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 1: Typically they grant wishes with perilous outcomes and think of 122 00:07:11,160 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: even like in films you have like an evil like 123 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 1: apparition that can say I can make this happen for you, 124 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: you know, but then other things fall apart as a 125 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:21,240 Speaker 1: result of it. You know. That's not really what we 126 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 1: think of when we think of a Laddin, you know, 127 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 1: but that usually those wishes were I want to be 128 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: the king or I want to be you know, Prince 129 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 1: Sali or whatever, and that all worked out. But there 130 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:32,040 Speaker 1: are well, there are things that go wrong along the 131 00:07:32,080 --> 00:07:35,120 Speaker 1: way trying to get this wish, but doesn't necessarily have 132 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:38,240 Speaker 1: this built in catastrophe like this one to one like 133 00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 1: you wish that made something horrible has happened to somebody else, 134 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: so um, the perilous outcomes definitely different versions of that. 135 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: And finally, I mean, a really common perception of this 136 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 1: genie type of gin um is that they have magical powers, 137 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 1: you know, can shape shift. And to me, something that 138 00:07:57,360 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 1: it always sticks with it for me is that they 139 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 1: have a master that once they appear to them, they 140 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: are bound to that master until they have used up 141 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 1: some finite number of wishes. Interesting stuff, you know, because 142 00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: what we're talking about now would be again these Western 143 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:18,200 Speaker 1: conceptions we have baseballers on pop culture. Probably one of 144 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 1: the biggest popularizers of the of Jin folklore. The concept 145 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: of Jinn comes to us from uh Sharra's Odd and 146 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 1: the thousand and one Stories, right, or excuse me, a 147 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 1: thousand and one Arabian Nights. But before we go into 148 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: the actual world or belief system involving Gin, I have 149 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 1: to ask you, guys, because I can't let it go listeners. 150 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,719 Speaker 1: You may have heard me accidentally humming part of this 151 00:08:46,800 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: song as as Nolan that we're talking. What's your favorite 152 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 1: song from the aladdined soundtrack? Oh? Man, do you have one? Musically, 153 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: I'm really fond of the Arabian Nights song. Um, it's 154 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,080 Speaker 1: got a really cool melody, very evocative. I do think 155 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,880 Speaker 1: that's interesting. When I watched rewatched Aladdin recently, the lyrics 156 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: changed a little bit, coup a couple of lines. No, No, 157 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: there was just I remember when it came out and 158 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,800 Speaker 1: I have the soundtrack and there's a line in the 159 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 1: song where it says talking about you know what it's 160 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: like in this part of the world, And there's a 161 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 1: line that says where they cut off your hand if 162 00:09:27,320 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 1: they don't like your face. It's barbaric, but hey, it's home, 163 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 1: and they they changed that it's not that lyric anymore. 164 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 1: Do you think those do maybe to post nine eleven. 165 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: I'm not sure when it happened, but um, you know, 166 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:43,360 Speaker 1: someone definitely in and somewhere along that process found that 167 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: line to be offensive. So do you think maybe it 168 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 1: was just a censorship thing where they said that line 169 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:53,920 Speaker 1: is too too much for kids. That's what I was, 170 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 1: That's what I would think. I mean, because you know, 171 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: I think too that movie has been re issued probably 172 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 1: several times, so i'd also to see what point that happened. 173 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 1: But we digress, But we digress, So let's digress further. 174 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: Is let's digress all the way to the beginning, as 175 00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: as the Mad Hatter said to Alice, started at the beginning, 176 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 1: go through the middle, and stop at the end. Jin 177 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:22,680 Speaker 1: smelled j i in in in English, sometimes d j 178 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 1: i in in the root of genies. This concepts let's 179 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 1: look at the word first. Etymology. It's often said to 180 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:34,200 Speaker 1: come from an Arabic root word meaning to hide, and 181 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,079 Speaker 1: some interpretations take this a little bit further to mean 182 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 1: beings who are concealed from the senses. Uh Jin is 183 00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: the plural. The singular would be genie j i n I, 184 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: and that's where genie comes from. But uh it when 185 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,120 Speaker 1: it was anglicized in some places, people took it to 186 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:59,560 Speaker 1: mean a guardian of a specific place. And while these 187 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:07,120 Speaker 1: are popular theories there, there are also competing theories or interpretations, 188 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: one saying that one saying that Genie or the concept 189 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:17,480 Speaker 1: originally came from what we're seen as demons or evil 190 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:23,720 Speaker 1: spirits in early Christian or Judeo Christian beliefs. But unlike 191 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: some other supernatural beings, uh jin are actually mentioned in 192 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 1: the Koran. They have an origin story right um. In 193 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:39,239 Speaker 1: the Koran, God actually makes three sapient forms of life, angels, 194 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: gen and humans. Men were made of clay, angels from light, 195 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:48,359 Speaker 1: and Jin are described as being made of a smokeless 196 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 1: scorching fire, which is sort of sinisters sounding if you 197 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 1: ask me, crazy stuff. Like humans, Jin have free will, 198 00:11:55,880 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 1: some are Muslim and some are not. And like humans, 199 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 1: Jen being capable of good and bad will be judged 200 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 1: by God on the Day of Judgment and sent to 201 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: Hell or to paradise as their actions accord. But here's 202 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:15,000 Speaker 1: the thing. Although Jin are mentioned in the Koran, they 203 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: were believed in before before Islam. They were they were 204 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:25,319 Speaker 1: pre Islamic originally, and in some cases there's some evidence 205 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: that they were maybe gods or at least spirits that 206 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 1: were paid tribute to uh In in Palmira, for example. Yeah, 207 00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:38,160 Speaker 1: there's this Aramaic inscription in a place called Beth Fasil 208 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: which pays tribute to the genie spelled g I n 209 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 1: in a y e As the good and rewarding gods. 210 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,880 Speaker 1: So until about the fourth century, as we rate time today, 211 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: uh many of the populations that were in the Middle 212 00:12:56,520 --> 00:13:02,559 Speaker 1: East practice a different polytheist stick religions. There were there 213 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:06,040 Speaker 1: were significant Jewish and later Christian minorities that developed, but 214 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:11,120 Speaker 1: Polytheism remained the dominant belief system in pre Islamic Arabia 215 00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: and Jin which started in some cases being worshiped as gods, 216 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 1: are thought to have later been downgraded to lesser status 217 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: as spirits as demons, especially after the religious waves of monotheism. Yeah, 218 00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 1: I can see that you demonize the gods that came prior. 219 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,720 Speaker 1: I understand that. Well, there's religious syncretism to write, uh 220 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 1: the idea that the idea that when a religion is 221 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: growing or spreading, it says, well, these other things that 222 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 1: exist do exist, and we're not. What what we're doing 223 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,840 Speaker 1: is we're showing you why they exist. They're also part 224 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 1: of this belief system, which is the one true belief 225 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 1: system is typically how a lot of religions handle it. 226 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 1: So where do jin hang out? A lot of times 227 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 1: they're in dark places. That maybe why when the west 228 00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: Owners came along to create stories out of this, they 229 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:18,200 Speaker 1: put him in a lamp that's really dark, or in 230 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 1: a you know, a ring, or in a cave or 231 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: something like that. Lost as well, like sort of like 232 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: they're buried like like you know, totally shut away, as 233 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:29,520 Speaker 1: if they were not ever meant to be discovered again 234 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:31,760 Speaker 1: kind of thing. Yes, and again, because they're supposed to 235 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 1: be isolated, right right, And if we could talk just 236 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,440 Speaker 1: a little bit about the idea of where the artifact 237 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 1: belief comes in. Solomon was King Solomon's thought to command 238 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 1: spirits that were a type of jin through the use 239 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: of a ring, right, the Ring of Solomon, which I 240 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 1: think also still shows up in pop culture. Right, Yeah, Oh, 241 00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 1: the that ring is everywhere. I would say, and I 242 00:14:57,680 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 1: don't know if this is true because I haven't looked 243 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 1: too much into it, but the one ring to rule 244 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:06,360 Speaker 1: them all, I think that might have like have some kickbacks. 245 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:11,600 Speaker 1: And then also the also we should mention the Grimoires 246 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:13,720 Speaker 1: or the books of magic known as the Key of 247 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: Solomon or the lesser Keys of Solomon also thought to 248 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: contain rituals which, when performed properly, allow one to communicate 249 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: with and or control these spirits. Uh, Matt Nolan, I 250 00:15:27,920 --> 00:15:30,200 Speaker 1: have not attempted to do this as far as I know. 251 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: Speak for yourself, sir, Yeah, okay, okay, Matt and Noel 252 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 1: have attempted to do this. I don't want to put 253 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: you guys on glass and ask too much about how 254 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 1: how it worked out. Let me, we're here right that 255 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 1: that doesn't change one way or the other. So the 256 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 1: the idea here, which I thought was fascinating, and I'm 257 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 1: speculating here. I wanted to ask you listeners, because I 258 00:15:57,160 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: couldn't find any solid proof of this, but we're there 259 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:06,120 Speaker 1: Jin cults like what other than you know, other than 260 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: being a statue or shrine one would pay tribute to, 261 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 1: were they're actually religious systems that were large built on 262 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 1: worshiping maybe one or two creatures or gods that would 263 00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 1: later become jin. I don't know, but it's interesting. Well, yeah, 264 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: and it wouldn't have to be It wouldn't have to 265 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:25,400 Speaker 1: be that large to be a cult of a certain gin, 266 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 1: especially if it was worshiped, you know, for hundreds and 267 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,720 Speaker 1: hundreds of years for a while there as a god. 268 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: Then everything broke off as the new religions came through, 269 00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: and then they you know, maybe an isolated group somewhere. 270 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:40,640 Speaker 1: I can totally imagine that. I can also see like 271 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: maybe there's like a rogue jin, you know, who wants 272 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: to like become more like a god and then command 273 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:48,320 Speaker 1: his own followers. I could just see that in terms 274 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: of like folklore. Oh yeah, that happens, and we'll get 275 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: to it just a second. I think we'll really appreciate 276 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 1: this part. Before we get to that, let's talk about 277 00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 1: the different types of gin, because not all are created 278 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: ep some have specialties, some are automatically evil, some could 279 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 1: go either way. But as we go into this, you 280 00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 1: want to establish that the folklore gets kind of sticky 281 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:16,160 Speaker 1: because there are creatures or beings in other and other 282 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 1: regions or and sometimes even in other belief systems that 283 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 1: are considered gin. And then there their arguments that people 284 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 1: will have over whether that whether one type of creature 285 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:32,600 Speaker 1: should be considered a subclass of gin or its own thing. Well, 286 00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: that being said, jen are smart, have social organizations, uh 287 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,639 Speaker 1: in their community. They have kings, they have laws of marriages, 288 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:45,720 Speaker 1: they have births, you know, all the normal days of 289 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:52,920 Speaker 1: our lives. Stuff. They just But while humans cannot perceive jin, 290 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: apparently they can perceive the human world. So this it's 291 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:01,199 Speaker 1: an interesting idea because it means that there is an 292 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:05,879 Speaker 1: invisible world occurring all around us, and we are in 293 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: some sort of glass house of existence or some sort 294 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 1: of one way mirror. Yeah, there there are a few 295 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,679 Speaker 1: planes of existence up than we are, and somehow they 296 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:17,640 Speaker 1: can see down, but the mirror only goes one way. 297 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 1: That's cool. So one common belief in Muslim lord list. Again, 298 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:30,359 Speaker 1: this list is not this list is not universally accepted. 299 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: But let's let's look at the various types of jenn. 300 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 1: The first would be uh the mariad or married m 301 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:42,440 Speaker 1: A R I D and I do apologize for pronunciation 302 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:49,359 Speaker 1: of Arabic here uh. In Lane's Arabic English lexicon, these 303 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:53,439 Speaker 1: types of Jin are said to be the strongest, the 304 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 1: ones of great power in in the in the Lanes lexicon, 305 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: there actually said to be evil. But this isn't universally 306 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: agreed on. These are the ones we think. I've only 307 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:07,879 Speaker 1: think of the genie in Aladdin. The ability to do 308 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: all these powerful things, even unto granting wishes, if you 309 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: flatter them enough, if they like you, if you do 310 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:22,480 Speaker 1: something for them. Uh. And that's so, that's what people 311 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: in the West generally think about. But that's not all 312 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,000 Speaker 1: of the gin in the world. Now you also have 313 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:30,880 Speaker 1: an affret and this is one that I have heard 314 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 1: of before. You may have heard of this as well. 315 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: It's often described as this enormous winged creature of fire. 316 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:40,959 Speaker 1: Think of Phoenix almost in my head, and that's what 317 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,439 Speaker 1: I'm seeing. Can be either sex, male or female. It 318 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:48,200 Speaker 1: lives ground, underground, and a lot of times it will 319 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:52,959 Speaker 1: it will fly around ruins of someplace where tragedy has 320 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 1: occurred or war has been fought, or you know, where 321 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 1: something has where something has occurred where perhaps there was 322 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,679 Speaker 1: f And then we get to it's called the sat 323 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:07,240 Speaker 1: or the shy tan s h i t a n 324 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: s h a y t a n. This this goes 325 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 1: exactly to what you were talking about. And also, uh, 326 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:20,919 Speaker 1: the concept is like this that during the creation of 327 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 1: the world. There is one jin that refuses to bow 328 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:29,439 Speaker 1: to God, and its name is Iblis. Sounds familiar, sounds 329 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:34,680 Speaker 1: a little like, Oh, I don't know, was that the 330 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:38,440 Speaker 1: church lady Revercott, I don't know, was it? So this 331 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 1: is that this would be considered the devil in the Qoran, 332 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 1: and the devil had followers Jin who decided to side 333 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 1: with Iblis. Uh. And it's it's interesting because while there 334 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,800 Speaker 1: are parallels, they are you know, there are differences as well. 335 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 1: The primary thing here is that these creatures, which sometimes 336 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: are not considered gin but simply demons. Depending upon which 337 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:09,959 Speaker 1: scholar you're talking to or which book you're basing it on, 338 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 1: is it based on the Koran? Is it based on 339 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 1: earlier like folklore, right, academic studies, So there are going 340 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 1: to be differences in interpretation here, but the main thing 341 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:21,680 Speaker 1: that always stays the same is that these are the 342 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 1: bad guys nice, they're not cool. Uh. And then speaking yeah, 343 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 1: speaking of not cool, there's something else the google. So 344 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,760 Speaker 1: I guess that's where that word comes from. Yes, yeah, 345 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:41,399 Speaker 1: just so. Yeah. Nowadays we think of gooules as the 346 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 1: m as similar to a vampire, right, These undead creatures 347 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: usually that eat flesh rather than drink blood for sustenance 348 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 1: is what I see. I see two d little pixelated things. 349 00:21:55,359 --> 00:22:00,640 Speaker 1: They tend to travel by shambling, yes, the primary form 350 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,199 Speaker 1: of locomotion. I actually think I play the Fallout series 351 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 1: a lot to really enjoy those. And there is a 352 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:09,359 Speaker 1: whole um, you know, group of characters called ghouls, and 353 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,640 Speaker 1: they've basically been irradiated to the point where there they 354 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,880 Speaker 1: look like you know, zombies, but they don't necessarily eat 355 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:19,520 Speaker 1: flesh unless they've kind of passed a threshold and then 356 00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:21,719 Speaker 1: they get to a point where they will be exactly 357 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 1: they're called feral guals. Exactly do they have Do they 358 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: have any profound abilities or they just rotting people? Um? 359 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 1: It depends. Like there are some that are so irradiated 360 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:34,080 Speaker 1: that they can actually shoot like radiation energy a you 361 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 1: and like vomit like you know, radiate radioactive goo. Um. 362 00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:39,399 Speaker 1: But you know, some of the ones that are that 363 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:42,160 Speaker 1: are still more or less human, They you know, run 364 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 1: taverns things like that. You know, so that the ghouls 365 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: that we're talking about are a little different, I know, 366 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 1: but I love those guls. There are several that you 367 00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:55,720 Speaker 1: interact with in the third ones that make you very happy. Uh. 368 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,679 Speaker 1: But these these a lot of times will inhabit a graveyard, right, 369 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:04,359 Speaker 1: or other places that just there's no humans. And this 370 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: type of jin has been said to be sired by 371 00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:12,919 Speaker 1: it bliss so not siding with this uh, diabolical character 372 00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: against God, but to have been created by this diabolical character. 373 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 1: And then there is the gen j a n n 374 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:26,840 Speaker 1: uh thought of as the weakest type of jin. So 375 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:31,920 Speaker 1: a few traditions divide gin into three classes, those who 376 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: have wings and fly in the air, those who resemble 377 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:38,119 Speaker 1: snakes and dogs, and those who simply travel ceaselessly. But 378 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:42,160 Speaker 1: they've also been described as creatures of different forms vultures, snakes, 379 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 1: others like humanoid. They might even be dragons or a 380 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: number of other animals. And and it said that some 381 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 1: of these can shape shift right, right, So that would 382 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:55,959 Speaker 1: maybe another reason why we have so many different depictions 383 00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 1: of animals and very widely varying animals. And let's talk 384 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:06,440 Speaker 1: about gin and magic. Did you think I was gonna 385 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:09,439 Speaker 1: say jen and juice? You were? I was hoping I 386 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,879 Speaker 1: would to hope springs eternal. I guess that will be 387 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: for after work, right, Uh. In folklore, of course, these 388 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:21,000 Speaker 1: beings are often associated with magic, its concept that exists 389 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 1: in the modern day still as the old rubb a 390 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 1: magic lamp, get some wishes bits. And we mentioned that 391 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:33,080 Speaker 1: certain historical humans like King Solomon were said to control Jin. 392 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 1: And in some ways acts of magic entirely have been 393 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: described as a magician entering into some sort of contract 394 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:45,040 Speaker 1: with one or more of these beings of Gin and 395 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 1: worshiping them, or I guess paying some sort of obeesience 396 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 1: in order to receive information. That's one of the big 397 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: ones about unknown things, so Claire sentience, clairvoyance, or to 398 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:04,639 Speaker 1: received riches power. Well, you know, the whole standard, the usual, 399 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:08,880 Speaker 1: the usual, uh supervillain starter package. And we've got some 400 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 1: lines from the Koran here I had mentioned Iblis, right, 401 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: We mentioned Iblis, who would be Satan in in this story. 402 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:23,240 Speaker 1: Satan didn't follow or Iblis didn't follow God's command to 403 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:28,200 Speaker 1: prostrate himself unto man. So he's still he still wouldn't 404 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,639 Speaker 1: play ball. But he said, I'm not the one to 405 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:34,159 Speaker 1: prostrate myself to a human being, because you know, you 406 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 1: made him out of clay. And then to which point 407 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:43,200 Speaker 1: God said, get out. And the existence of Jin, as 408 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:49,160 Speaker 1: mentioned in the Koran matters immensely, maybe more so than 409 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 1: you might think, because for many people they would say, well, 410 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 1: Matt Noel Ben, this is interesting, but this is folklore. 411 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 1: Why are you talking about it? We'll tell you after 412 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor. Here's where it gets crazy. 413 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:19,240 Speaker 1: You see, belief in jin is not something restricted two 414 00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 1: thousands of years ago. It is not something that exists 415 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 1: distant chronologically. There is a modern belief in jin. There 416 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:36,040 Speaker 1: are like people across the world believe that jin are real, 417 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:38,720 Speaker 1: and they want to prove that it's real through science. 418 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:43,600 Speaker 1: Right though not all Muslims believe in Jin, many do, 419 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: and some universities published research and hold workshops seeking to 420 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:52,360 Speaker 1: prove the existence of jin and argue how they exist 421 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:55,879 Speaker 1: in the modern world or how science can help humanity 422 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: understand the nature of these beings. So an example would 423 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 1: be from jen an Invade Campus by Purvis Hood boy 424 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,840 Speaker 1: Um a workshop quote. A workshop title Jin's and Black 425 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,359 Speaker 1: Magic was organized in Islamabad by the Department of Humanities 426 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 1: at the Comsats Institute of Technology, which is the c 427 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:15,879 Speaker 1: I I T, one of Pakistan's largest universities. We invited 428 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:21,760 Speaker 1: speaker Razab Xil Hawk introduced as a spiritual cardiologist is 429 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 1: reputedly an expert on demonic possessions and evil spirits. So 430 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 1: this is an elite university in Pakistan, So this this 431 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 1: is an active area of studying, right, It's it's very 432 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 1: important to say, for instance, unlike um, unlike what would 433 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:46,240 Speaker 1: another thing be fairies or you know, uh, imagine insert 434 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:51,480 Speaker 1: supernatural being here. Uh, it's it's not as uh, it's 435 00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:54,760 Speaker 1: not as derided as those kinds of beliefs. Or it's 436 00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:57,959 Speaker 1: kind of like an an angels expert came to speak 437 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 1: at Harvard or something as yeah, that's not a bad comparison, 438 00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,439 Speaker 1: you know, or at M I T or something. So 439 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 1: while proposing theories about the nature of jen, these researchers 440 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,520 Speaker 1: and academics have at times have the times said, well, 441 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 1: science can help us understand these were there, you'll see 442 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 1: references to maybe microorganisms or parallel universes, or forms of 443 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 1: imperceivable energy and higher frequencies. At this point, the concept 444 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:31,080 Speaker 1: of gen is not scientifically accepted in the West or 445 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,199 Speaker 1: many non Muslim parts of the world. And again we 446 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,800 Speaker 1: want to emphasize we're not painting with a broad brush here. 447 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 1: We're saying nothing about all people of a specific religion, 448 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: where what we are establishing instead is that people in 449 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: the modern world today, as you listen to this, believe 450 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 1: that jin exists. And that's not just that they don't 451 00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:55,840 Speaker 1: just exist as some sort of passive, watchful entities, right 452 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 1: that you can maybe get some wishes out of if 453 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: you have the right ring or the right lamp. They 454 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,280 Speaker 1: have agency, They have the ability to do things in 455 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,520 Speaker 1: the human world to humans, and this is kind of 456 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 1: the disturbing part. I don't know, man, I feel like 457 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 1: there's plenty of Christians that would say the same thing 458 00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:16,320 Speaker 1: about angels. I think that's an excellent point. Yeah, no, absolutely. 459 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 1: But the creepy thing here is what if these things 460 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:24,640 Speaker 1: do exist and they can possess humans to cause humans 461 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 1: to do things that they normally wouldn't, perhaps to influence 462 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: something politically, a movement or something like that. I that's 463 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: one of the beliefs, right right, Yeah, there's this belief 464 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:42,719 Speaker 1: that jin are able to possess human beings. And this 465 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,360 Speaker 1: this is a weird thing. So you can go right 466 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:50,440 Speaker 1: now on YouTube and see footage of what what are 467 00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 1: said to be exorcisms. And we we talked about this 468 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 1: a little bit in a previous episode when we cover 469 00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:00,160 Speaker 1: the differences between exorcisms around the world, you know, like 470 00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 1: the Catholic Church has a very specific right and uh 471 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 1: and in Islam there are specific rights as well. You 472 00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: can also find people who are you know, who are 473 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: describing the signs of possession by a jin or the 474 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: signs of someone trafficking and magic, the sign that you 475 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:27,200 Speaker 1: have encountered somehow a jin, and the possession is typically 476 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:33,200 Speaker 1: exorcised through uh the recitation of the Koran, seeking refuge, 477 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: remembrance and supplicators uh as. It's also a way that 478 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:42,000 Speaker 1: other sicknesses or problems might be addressed. And I really 479 00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 1: like people to check out our our previous episode on 480 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 1: exorcism because we had an interesting conversation that I guess 481 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 1: we won't get into too much here, but I want 482 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: to know what you folks think is possession real in 483 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 1: your experience because we know that historically signs of mental 484 00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: illness were mistaken for possession. We know that signs of 485 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:11,320 Speaker 1: grief or maybe psychotic breaks or maybe even mental disabilities 486 00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: all mistaken for possession at some point in the past, 487 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 1: which is a horrific thing. But according to people who 488 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:22,560 Speaker 1: believe this jim Jin possession is something that experts can 489 00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:27,640 Speaker 1: clearly discern through the use of these techniques drive drive 490 00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 1: the Jin out, and unlike demons possessing people in Catholic 491 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: or Christian belief systems, Jin are not necessarily evil. Yeah, 492 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:43,320 Speaker 1: that's a huge difference. Have free will. So I was 493 00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: looking at in the course of research, I was looking at, uh, 494 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: some some scholars, some Islamic scholars talking about Jin possession, 495 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: and one of the big reasons for possession, according to 496 00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 1: some of these sources was love, like a jin being 497 00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 1: in love with a human, with the human that they're possessing, 498 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 1: or with another human that they're possessing a to get 499 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 1: to be What if we take it back a step 500 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:17,120 Speaker 1: to our early description of kind of the preconceived ideas 501 00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 1: of a genie or a gin, and as we've gotten 502 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:23,360 Speaker 1: to where we are now in the podcast, I think 503 00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 1: we've sort of taking that apart a little bit. And 504 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: I'm just wondering, is that do you consider that version 505 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 1: those points we made about you know, being chained to 506 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 1: a an artifact of sub sort and you know, granting 507 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: wishes and things like that, and ultimately being a force 508 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: for kind of chaos based on what happens when those 509 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,400 Speaker 1: wishes are granted. Is all that just from kind of 510 00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:48,920 Speaker 1: like whitewashed like re tellings of you know, folk stories 511 00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:51,840 Speaker 1: and made to be more palatable for a wider audience, 512 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 1: sort of like in the same way that you know, 513 00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 1: grim fairy tales were much much nastier and then they're 514 00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: sort of retooled. You know, that's really question, what do 515 00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:03,720 Speaker 1: you think that. I would say, that's exactly what's happened, 516 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:07,800 Speaker 1: because we've got one specific type of gin that are 517 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:11,960 Speaker 1: being described by most of the popular culture that the myriad. 518 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:14,040 Speaker 1: I don't know how to say it correctly. I think 519 00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:17,840 Speaker 1: it's the mariad uh. And you know, so you've got 520 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,840 Speaker 1: that one particular story and then you kind of expand 521 00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:22,480 Speaker 1: out and say, well, this is what all genies are 522 00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,360 Speaker 1: like when you look at it through that lens. I 523 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: think that's what's happening. Yeah, I can see the religious 524 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 1: syncretism occurring there as well. And it's also important for 525 00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 1: us to note that modern belief in jin is not 526 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 1: necessarily unique in in that um just in the process 527 00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: of this sort of belief, for instance, there are other 528 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: persistent beliefs in things that you know, the rest of 529 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: the world will call supernatural rather than factual. Ghost of 530 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 1: ancestors are still commonly venerated in religions around the world. 531 00:33:56,760 --> 00:34:01,000 Speaker 1: And then invisible elves in Iceland. You guys heard about that, 532 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:04,720 Speaker 1: right They they're real guys, I think they're real. The 533 00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 1: who do folk? Uh? These elves in Icelandic folklore. The 534 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:16,840 Speaker 1: belief is so commonplace, or purportedly so commonplace, that it 535 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 1: affects modern construction. Also, I one thing that fascinates me 536 00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:30,080 Speaker 1: is when when people look at beliefs in spirits, and 537 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:32,360 Speaker 1: you know, there are some people who can put up 538 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:37,440 Speaker 1: a very strong argument that jin are not spirits so 539 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:42,240 Speaker 1: much as they are another type of living, thinking being. 540 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:47,040 Speaker 1: You know, because they do live, they're not undead. So 541 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:53,839 Speaker 1: this stuff astonishes and amazes me, both the growth of 542 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:58,000 Speaker 1: the folklore to the modern day beliefs. And I know 543 00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:02,120 Speaker 1: for certain that it is easy for some people to 544 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:06,719 Speaker 1: feel maybe condescending in some way and say, oh, look 545 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 1: at this outdated belief. And I live in the modern age. 546 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,120 Speaker 1: And because I live in the modern age, I know 547 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 1: better than these people who believe differently. For me, but 548 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: especially if you live in the developed world, I would 549 00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:25,360 Speaker 1: ask you to examine some of the common beliefs we have. 550 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:28,319 Speaker 1: Future historians are going to think that we were so 551 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 1: foolish when we explained the following situation. Yes, back in 552 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,400 Speaker 1: the day, we used to hop into these machines the 553 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,560 Speaker 1: weight thousands and thousands of pounds and we're we're powered 554 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:42,920 Speaker 1: by explosions internally, and we would drive within feet of 555 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:46,320 Speaker 1: each other because we called it driving. And they would say, well, hey, wait, 556 00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:48,839 Speaker 1: how did you do it safely? And we said, well, 557 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 1: we had this honor system. You see. We painted lines 558 00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 1: on places where we would drive, and we just said 559 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,560 Speaker 1: we wouldn't hit each other. And would say, oh, but 560 00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:00,319 Speaker 1: so is that how you avoided accidents? So we'd say, no, no, 561 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:05,279 Speaker 1: accidents happened constantly, constantly. We we just we believed we 562 00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:09,000 Speaker 1: were safer but got hurt, right, right, So I what 563 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,840 Speaker 1: I'm what I'm saying is that it is an error 564 00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 1: for anyone me, Noel Matt you perhaps listener to assume 565 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:29,759 Speaker 1: that we have the conclusive and final answer on what 566 00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:32,200 Speaker 1: we believe in the worth of what we believe, right, 567 00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:34,320 Speaker 1: So I would say, we have to be very careful 568 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: not to cast dispersions or stones. You know, if I'm 569 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 1: in Iceland and somebody tells me not to mess with 570 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:45,560 Speaker 1: a rock because something lives there. Yeah, whether or not 571 00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:49,360 Speaker 1: I personally believe, I'm not gonna launch into some lecture 572 00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:53,359 Speaker 1: you know, about the nature of geology. Uh. And this, 573 00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,440 Speaker 1: this is where we leave it. We are a world 574 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:00,879 Speaker 1: filled to the brim with people. They're billions of us. 575 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 1: And amongst those billions, depending on who you believe and 576 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 1: what you're reading, there exists billions more unseen things that 577 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 1: in terms of philosophy and mental ability, quite similar to us. 578 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,880 Speaker 1: So just like our earlier, earlier work on coded languages, 579 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 1: you know, again, there's this invisible world and more and 580 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,440 Speaker 1: more I think about it, we're running into these concepts 581 00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 1: of invisible worlds. We talked about train hoppers and some 582 00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:40,280 Speaker 1: things as serial killer cults, when we talked about jinn. 583 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 1: So that's that's really what I see us going into. 584 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:47,640 Speaker 1: More and more are these ideas of hidden worlds and 585 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: this concept of what we can and cannot prove. But 586 00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:55,600 Speaker 1: I have a question, uh for you guys listeners, do 587 00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,440 Speaker 1: you have any in your neck of the woods. Do 588 00:37:57,480 --> 00:38:02,719 Speaker 1: you have any um popular or folklore beliefs in unseen 589 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:07,040 Speaker 1: or supernatural beings and If so, do you believe the stories? 590 00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:10,920 Speaker 1: What could you tell us some specifics? Yeah, do you 591 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:14,200 Speaker 1: have any anecdotes where you maybe have had an encounter? 592 00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,080 Speaker 1: I don't want to hear those, Yeah, that you could 593 00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,200 Speaker 1: or could not explain. And I'd like to close on 594 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:23,839 Speaker 1: a question for you guys. If if we each had 595 00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:27,040 Speaker 1: a wish and it was and you couldn't wish for 596 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:32,080 Speaker 1: more wishes, what would your wish be? Oh? Man, this 597 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,760 Speaker 1: is tough. I think I would probably. I mean, there's 598 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,640 Speaker 1: two you can split it down the middle. You can 599 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:40,680 Speaker 1: go for like a very self serving wish, or you 600 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:42,960 Speaker 1: could go for a wish that helps others. But then 601 00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,320 Speaker 1: you get into that situation where it's all about the language. 602 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,440 Speaker 1: It's all about the wording of the wish, really careful, 603 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,240 Speaker 1: you know, because you might say I want world peace 604 00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 1: and it means that everyone dies, right. Or you might 605 00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:56,279 Speaker 1: say you might say I want to live forever, and 606 00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:59,759 Speaker 1: you do, but you still age and everywhere somewhere yea, 607 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,080 Speaker 1: all your loved ones die around you. Um, I guess 608 00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:06,600 Speaker 1: I would just I would wish I would do some uh, 609 00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:11,440 Speaker 1: some very carefully worded version of just you know, just 610 00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:17,880 Speaker 1: wanting to never you know, like be able to always 611 00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,799 Speaker 1: make sure I can take care of my family and 612 00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,759 Speaker 1: myself and just have maybe not absurd wealth, but just 613 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,359 Speaker 1: be comfortable all the time and never have to worry 614 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,319 Speaker 1: about paying bills and anything of that nature. Just have 615 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 1: some sort of like maybe maybe it's a magic platinum 616 00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:36,680 Speaker 1: card that you can just pay for everything with and 617 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,640 Speaker 1: you never get a bill, you know, something like that. 618 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,239 Speaker 1: I know that's very selfish and boring, but I just 619 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:45,120 Speaker 1: feel like the world past one would you know, could 620 00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:53,239 Speaker 1: potentially be disastrous. I would ask for a single, let's say, 621 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:59,400 Speaker 1: a single tomato plant that always has tomatoes on it. Always, 622 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:01,360 Speaker 1: no matter how many ties you take from the plant, 623 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:04,440 Speaker 1: there's always more tomatoes. I think you get sick of tomatoes. 624 00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:09,319 Speaker 1: I don't care, man, Yeah, and I will never and 625 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:12,560 Speaker 1: yeah this caveat at the end, I will never never 626 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:14,640 Speaker 1: get sick of I can always sell the tomatoes. What 627 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:18,319 Speaker 1: I'm saying, have you been going through some tomato related shenanigans? Man? 628 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,680 Speaker 1: Are you okay? I was trying to imagine something that 629 00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,840 Speaker 1: would be super manageable, that would be small. I was 630 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,400 Speaker 1: trying to think of ways that it could hurt me. 631 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:30,560 Speaker 1: And you don't think you have to tomatoes and you 632 00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:33,759 Speaker 1: you didn't mention the size of the planet, So what 633 00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:38,360 Speaker 1: if it's so huge it's over It's okay. We we 634 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:40,680 Speaker 1: don't have a genie in the room. What about you, Ben, 635 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:45,719 Speaker 1: I have no idea, and I'm not sure I want 636 00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:51,360 Speaker 1: to reveal that much about my personality, but pretend I would, Okay. 637 00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:54,560 Speaker 1: I would probably wish for in a very carefully worded way, 638 00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:59,880 Speaker 1: as Noel said, I would wish for, uh, some series 639 00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,000 Speaker 1: of superpowers and try to sneak them all in as 640 00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:05,239 Speaker 1: like the same thing. My one wish would be a 641 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 1: run on sentence obviously, just a c y A right, 642 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:12,040 Speaker 1: And then I would try to use those powers to 643 00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:15,080 Speaker 1: make the world a better place, because it's all about 644 00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:18,240 Speaker 1: the journey, isn't it? And uh, And I also think 645 00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:22,960 Speaker 1: I'm also concerned, just in this fictional world of granted wishes, 646 00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,640 Speaker 1: I also wonder if there's some higher chance or likelihood 647 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:30,240 Speaker 1: of things going wrong if the wish affects more people. 648 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,000 Speaker 1: So maybe if you just wish for something for yourself 649 00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:36,880 Speaker 1: and then use that to affect a larger change, it's safer. 650 00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,160 Speaker 1: It's really good. Ben, Even something like invisibility. Let's think 651 00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,480 Speaker 1: about how often that comes into play as being the 652 00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,359 Speaker 1: ultimate power to get things done, you know what I mean. 653 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:49,400 Speaker 1: So you could certainly affect some change with invisibility. You 654 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,880 Speaker 1: could sneak into so many places in Bermuda, in Singapore 655 00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:56,440 Speaker 1: and you could do the next Panama papers. I would well, 656 00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:58,600 Speaker 1: you know that's the thing. Would you be invisible to 657 00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:01,800 Speaker 1: the human eye, visible to everything? Could you wear clothes 658 00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:03,319 Speaker 1: because I don't want to try to see you. If 659 00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:11,360 Speaker 1: you want to be invisible at will to all, you 660 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,719 Speaker 1: just fall through the map listeners that listeners, Uh you know, 661 00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:17,920 Speaker 1: Matt and I wish you guys could see the way 662 00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:20,960 Speaker 1: that Nole's eyes lit up when they said through all 663 00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:25,640 Speaker 1: that was great. Uh yeah, I would go for invulnerability teleportation. 664 00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:29,040 Speaker 1: I would say, psiotic powers, just so I can get 665 00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:31,960 Speaker 1: all of them. Just say all the X men. That's 666 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,120 Speaker 1: all you have to say. Oh no, man, there's some 667 00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:37,440 Speaker 1: X men. You aren't that great. But that that gen 668 00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,680 Speaker 1: is gonna call shenanigans on that wish though, dude, Like 669 00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:42,480 Speaker 1: I mean there, it's like, man, come on, yeah, they've 670 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,960 Speaker 1: seen it all. They can't you can't do that. They 671 00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:49,920 Speaker 1: pick one be and immortal and then they would plush 672 00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:53,399 Speaker 1: you with their giant thumb. Yeah, or maybe it'll short 673 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,239 Speaker 1: circuit and Ll'll say, you know, I've had a hard week. 674 00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:58,280 Speaker 1: Been the best thing you do is a cheese steak, 675 00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,440 Speaker 1: and I'll say, thanks, dude, cool man, I appreciate it. 676 00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:09,759 Speaker 1: Never ending cheese steak, whenever ending cheese steak. Oh dude, 677 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,040 Speaker 1: that's crazy. You could feed the world with one cheese 678 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 1: cheese steak that never ends. I think, you know, I 679 00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:20,320 Speaker 1: think we're optimistic here and we're thinking of we're thinking 680 00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:23,319 Speaker 1: of the best possible outcomes. But I'm going to spend 681 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:27,200 Speaker 1: some time. Uh, I'm gonna spend some time pondering what 682 00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:29,680 Speaker 1: a decent wish would be and how you would write it. 683 00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,600 Speaker 1: We hope that you enjoyed this episode. Ladies and gentlemen. 684 00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:37,680 Speaker 1: What kind of stuff would you wish for? And please 685 00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:40,200 Speaker 1: do remember to tell us about what kind of things 686 00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,759 Speaker 1: are beings you've heard about in your neck of the 687 00:43:43,880 --> 00:43:47,120 Speaker 1: global woods. We want to hear from you. And speaking 688 00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:53,680 Speaker 1: of hearing from you, it's time for shut out corners. Yes, 689 00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:56,680 Speaker 1: that's right, shout out corner the moment in every show 690 00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:02,120 Speaker 1: where we shout out listeners who request said shout out um. 691 00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:06,000 Speaker 1: First today we have one for east Bay, newt a 692 00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:09,880 Speaker 1: k A newty. He or she is interested in hearing 693 00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:13,799 Speaker 1: more about planet nine, and I fear I can't help 694 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,080 Speaker 1: with that, can you? What's what's those nine? It's the 695 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:19,880 Speaker 1: proposed ninth planet that we found in the Solar System 696 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:23,480 Speaker 1: that's out over there by Pluto, way out there. I 697 00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:25,920 Speaker 1: missed that one, guys. I want to know more too. 698 00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,439 Speaker 1: It hasn't been confirmed yet, but it's we're pretty sure 699 00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:33,200 Speaker 1: there's something there from from the the way the other 700 00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:37,120 Speaker 1: planets move. Well, let's dig into it. That's an excellent suggestion, 701 00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:41,200 Speaker 1: Thank you, NUTI. Our next shout out is from Justin 702 00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:45,160 Speaker 1: for this quote, specifically, the best way to find a 703 00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:48,640 Speaker 1: needle in a haystack is to set the hay on fire. 704 00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:52,080 Speaker 1: This goes back to our earlier conversation about the Panama papers. 705 00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:55,439 Speaker 1: Uh and you can find Justin he is at math 706 00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:59,640 Speaker 1: math aug and that's m A T. H an you 707 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:01,839 Speaker 1: g g if you want to follow them any here 708 00:45:01,840 --> 00:45:04,359 Speaker 1: more interesting quotes. If I remember correctly, though, I think 709 00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:06,839 Speaker 1: the analogy we used was a needle and a pile 710 00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:11,919 Speaker 1: of needles. Unfortunately, needles are not flammable. In that case, 711 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:15,399 Speaker 1: it was needles on needles and finally today shout out 712 00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,080 Speaker 1: to Debbie's utant, I think of saying that correctly. She 713 00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:21,000 Speaker 1: wrote to us on Facebook. She said very nice things, 714 00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:23,440 Speaker 1: and she also said, if we are ever in the 715 00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:26,920 Speaker 1: Florida Keys, gentlemen, we are invited out to her bar 716 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,960 Speaker 1: where she bartends, and she will, she said, we will 717 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:32,680 Speaker 1: have an extra special time. I guess because she would 718 00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:38,359 Speaker 1: get as drunk. Game on. And that's the end of 719 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:42,440 Speaker 1: this classic episode. If you have any thoughts or questions 720 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,759 Speaker 1: about this episode, you can get into contact with us 721 00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:47,960 Speaker 1: in a number of different ways. One of the best 722 00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:49,799 Speaker 1: is to give us a call. Our number is one 723 00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:53,640 Speaker 1: eight three three st d w y t K. If 724 00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:55,480 Speaker 1: you don't want to do that, you can send us 725 00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:58,759 Speaker 1: a good old fashioned email. We are conspiracy at i 726 00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:02,440 Speaker 1: heart radio dot com. Stuff they don't want you to 727 00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:05,239 Speaker 1: know is a production of I heart Radio. For more 728 00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,040 Speaker 1: podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 729 00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:11,000 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.