1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: Calzon Media. 2 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:06,360 Speaker 2: Welcome to it. Could that be here? 3 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 3: A podcast where the the the ancient leftist adage there 4 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 3: was power logistics has finally been realized by one Donald Trump. 5 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 3: I am your host, Mia Wong, and with me is Gear. 6 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:18,079 Speaker 3: How are you doing, Gear? 7 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:20,440 Speaker 4: Just another great day in America. 8 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:24,000 Speaker 3: It's great, it's great. There were arresting judges. It's it's 9 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:25,920 Speaker 3: a good time. It's great. 10 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 4: Something that Mia has probably called for before, but under 11 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 4: different circumstances. 12 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 5: Hey, look, have I ever publicly called for the arrest 13 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 5: of the judge. 14 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:35,320 Speaker 2: I'm not sure I have. 15 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 4: Maybe probably not, because like arresting power itself is a 16 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:40,960 Speaker 4: little bit problem hashtag problematic. 17 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean this is this is this is this is. 18 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 5: A carcial solution to this. This is Garrison, Like we 19 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 5: kind of for using carcialism to solve the problems of 20 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 5: the cucural system. Sure, speaking of carcural systems, there is 21 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:56,600 Speaker 5: the economy that we're all living under, which is also 22 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 5: quite literally a cucural system, because so much of it 23 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 5: is based on prisident and slave labor of various kinds 24 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 5: across the world. Now, I have good news and I 25 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 5: have bad news about this. 26 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 2: I don't remember what the good news was. 27 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 3: So we're only getting the bad news, which is that 28 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 3: well the good news and the bad news is that 29 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 3: this the system that we all. 30 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:12,760 Speaker 2: Grew up on. 31 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 3: That the economic system that has, you know, supported us 32 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 3: our entire lives or not supported us for our entire lives. 33 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 3: The thing, you know, the system that encompasses everything we 34 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 3: have ever known, is fucking dead. 35 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 2: It is dead as shit. 36 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 3: The economic system that existed literally at the end of 37 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 3: last year does not exist anymore. It is it right 38 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:34,759 Speaker 3: now in the process of dying, and the thing that 39 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,759 Speaker 3: is emerging has not emerged yet, which means we get 40 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 3: to go to the Gramsey quote where he says, this 41 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 3: is the time of monsters. 42 00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:46,760 Speaker 4: The Chinese century. My favorite see whatever Gramski, how do 43 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 4: we say this guy's name Gramski, Gramm gram Sheet see 44 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 4: you fucked up too? Yeah, my favorite gram Sheet quote? 45 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 4: Or entering the Chinese Century? 46 00:01:58,160 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 2: Look I okay, So, like here's the thing. 47 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 3: I I, on a fundamental level think that GRAMPSI is 48 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 3: like the harbinger of the entire retreat of the twentieth 49 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 3: century left. So I hate him and therefar if you 50 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 3: say his name properly. Also, we're going to get into 51 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 3: a little bit about white. The Chinese century is going 52 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 3: to also be a complete shitcho for them too, But 53 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:15,639 Speaker 3: you know. 54 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 4: The Canadian century, I don't know. 55 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 2: Finally, the Yugoslavian century. 56 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 4: With God Emperor Mark Carney in charge, he will usher 57 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:33,040 Speaker 4: in a new era of Canadian progress and global supremacy. 58 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 4: As climate change worsens, the Canadian economy will suck up 59 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 4: all of the independency and resources from the US in 60 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,000 Speaker 4: the late twentieth century. And finally we will have a 61 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:48,519 Speaker 4: Tim Hortons in every country in the planet. 62 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 3: I'm so excited for us to finally get our first 63 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 3: war between two countries with Tim Hortons in it. 64 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:57,359 Speaker 4: That will be exciting. 65 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 3: So here is a story that we have told on 66 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 3: the show many many, many, many many many times, and 67 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 3: it is the story of the structure of the modern 68 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 3: world economy. The birth of the liberalism, the ascendancy of 69 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:14,480 Speaker 3: free trade, the decline of the US as the world's 70 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 3: grand manufacturing power, the collapse of the clower of the 71 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 3: global working class, and the generalized ascension of capitalism, and 72 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:23,959 Speaker 3: this specific force of capitalism as the structuring force of 73 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 3: the world system. It is a story of how structural 74 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,600 Speaker 3: forces and contingent choices, technological changes in class weres, domestic 75 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:34,200 Speaker 3: politics and grand international maneuvers, and international relations built a 76 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 3: political and economic structure that ruled the world for half 77 00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 3: a century of American hegemony. And we are going to 78 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 3: tell a very very abbreviated version of that story for 79 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:46,760 Speaker 3: one final time because that world. 80 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 4: The world, say final, because you'll probably do this again 81 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 4: in two years. But okay, the. 82 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 3: World that we were all born into, that world is 83 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:57,400 Speaker 3: fucking dead and Donald Trump has killed it. 84 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 2: This is how it died. Garrison. Yes, in the beginning, 85 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 2: there was war. 86 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 3: Sure, in the ashes of a continents read by the 87 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 3: flames of fascism, two army's stood triumphant over a new world. 88 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:20,480 Speaker 3: One of them, unfortunately, was the United States. The second one, unfortunately, 89 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 3: was the USSR. Now it's also worth mentioning that very briefly, 90 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 3: both the French and the British assumed they would also 91 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 3: be like superpowers and no jokes, washed failed failed powers, 92 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:37,600 Speaker 3: zero out of ten absolute dipshits destroyed. 93 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 4: Now, oddly enough, Japan walked away with more power than 94 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:44,599 Speaker 4: either of those countries. Yes, yeah, a little bit, a 95 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 4: little bit odd considering the conditions that led to this happening. 96 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 3: Well, you know, I mean, but the actual shift here though, 97 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 3: and this is and this is you know, this actually 98 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 3: is a lot of what this episode is about is 99 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 3: that the thing that World War One or World War 100 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 3: two did was was more I would also do this, 101 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,719 Speaker 3: but was fundamentally break the power of the old world empires. Right, 102 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,599 Speaker 3: because the world had been ruled for several hundred years 103 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 3: by various combinations of the French, the British, and the Germans. 104 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 3: And you know this is some extent like Spain, but 105 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 3: Spain was sort of gone, right, But like those old 106 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:21,440 Speaker 3: World empires had been what had structured everything in the world, 107 00:05:22,279 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 3: and at the end of World War Two that suddenly 108 00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 3: wasn't the case anymore. And the product of this was 109 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 3: that if if you look at the places in the 110 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,720 Speaker 3: world that had the largest remaining industrial reserves, right, you know, 111 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 3: I mean, there was obviously some industrial production in Latin America, 112 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 3: particularly Argentina. There was some like Chinese manufacturing belts that 113 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:42,719 Speaker 3: were run by Japan in China that weren't destroyed. And 114 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 3: then there was the entire manufacturing power of the United States. 115 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 3: And this meant that alone among countries, right, the US 116 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:54,480 Speaker 3: was in the most dominant position, like one of the 117 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 3: most positions of great power has ever been and even 118 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 3: though there technically was a second great power, right, they 119 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,440 Speaker 3: had an unbelievable percentage of the world's total manufacturing power, 120 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 3: We had an unhinged percentage of the world's total gold reserves. 121 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,279 Speaker 3: We had I mean, I guess, like the second largest 122 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 3: army in the world. But you know, like we were 123 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:14,840 Speaker 3: significant the more technologically advanced than the USSR. And this 124 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 3: had a bunch of extremely weird consequences because there was 125 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 3: really no way for the amount of like concentrated industrial 126 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 3: power the US had to go but down because we 127 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 3: controlled so much of the world's wealth and so much 128 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 3: of the world's manufacturing capacity that the only thing that 129 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 3: could ever possibly happen was that the rest of the 130 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:38,279 Speaker 3: world would catch up. And this was a thing that 131 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 3: was actually necessary. And this is something that was that 132 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 3: was spurred on by the American industrial class, right, because 133 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 3: they suddenly had all of these like jeep factories you're 134 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 3: trying to make cars out of, and they needed people 135 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 3: to buy the cars. And the only way to do 136 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,599 Speaker 3: that was to rebuild Europe and to rebuild Japan in 137 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,479 Speaker 3: order to sort of rebuild these places as markets and 138 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 3: so for like a very brief time. And this is 139 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 3: the sort of like golden age that all of these 140 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 3: Trump people know these like weird dipshits like harkened back to. 141 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 3: Was this like part time of like unmatched American power, 142 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 3: but also it was it was a time in the 143 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 3: world economy where you could have multiple powers industrializing at 144 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:15,520 Speaker 3: the same time without it being zero s and that 145 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 3: just was not going to last because at a certain point, 146 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 3: and this is accelerated by things we've talked about in 147 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 3: other episodes, like this attempt by a bunch of what 148 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 3: we're called the Non Aligned Movement or sort of the 149 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 3: G seventy seven, you know, also like the Third World Movement, 150 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:36,960 Speaker 3: a bunch of these countries that were non alliance, like Yugoslavia, India, Pakistan, 151 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 3: which you can immediately tell how this alliance is going 152 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:40,920 Speaker 3: to shit because these two countries are allied, are like 153 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 3: in the same alliance, right, like you know, this is 154 00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 3: the Chiito's Yugoslavia is in this with like Saudi Arabia, 155 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 3: these countries sort of like economic strategy was to create 156 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 3: something that actually is in a lot of ways kind 157 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 3: of like what Trump is trying to do, which is 158 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 3: like using their control of resources, although again the resource 159 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 3: of the US has now is like money basically took 160 00:08:01,200 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 3: all of the fucking world's resources, right, but using that 161 00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 3: to develop your own local industrial basis so you can 162 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 3: have your own local manufacturing economy. And this is something 163 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 3: that like a lot of countries pursued this, like Venezuela 164 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 3: pursues this, like Bolivia pursues it is. This is something 165 00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 3: that like everyone like kind of across the political spectrum 166 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 3: is trying to do in like the sitties and seventies 167 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 3: and through the eighties. But the thing is it's destroyed 168 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 3: by the second thing that's sort of a model for 169 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 3: what these people are trying to do, which is what 170 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:32,439 Speaker 3: Reagan was able to do to the American economy in 171 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 3: the sort of nineteen eighties. And what Reagan is able 172 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,280 Speaker 3: to do is Reagan actually does something that sounds really 173 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 3: bizarre now, but he was actually successfully able to temporarily 174 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:46,439 Speaker 3: for about maybe like six years, six or seven years, 175 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 3: was able to actually like dramatically ramp up American like 176 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,120 Speaker 3: like industrial production and like was able to do the 177 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:55,920 Speaker 3: whole sort of like we're bringing the jobs back to 178 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 3: the US. But the thing is, the way he did 179 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 3: this was not the way the Trump administration is doing it. 180 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:02,880 Speaker 5: Right. 181 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 3: What he did was, on the one hand, he blew 182 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 3: a smoking crater in the entire world economy. And that 183 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 3: garrison will sound familiar to you because these people are 184 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 3: trying to. 185 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,959 Speaker 2: Blow a hole in the American economy, right, like you 186 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 2: have seen this. 187 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 4: Yes, I have seen the stonks and the trade and 188 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 4: the shipments, yes I am. 189 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 2: Yeah. 190 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 3: But but even like like Elon Musk would like deliver 191 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:27,000 Speaker 3: like post about this, right, like very deliberately about how 192 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 3: he wants to destroy the economy so that there could 193 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 3: be like a oh yeah, brief economic hardship and that 194 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 3: a golden age. 195 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,559 Speaker 4: Right, necessary hardship will have to endure for a short 196 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 4: period of time to then reach the like utopia which 197 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:39,680 Speaker 4: is surely around the corner. 198 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, And it's interesting because when when when serious people 199 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 3: have to defend this like Fox Okay, I say serious people, 200 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:50,200 Speaker 3: I'm taking this and I'm saying Fox News because like serious. 201 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 2: Look, look here's a serious clouds. 202 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't have to defend this, right, Like, Okay, 203 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 3: you know we're not dealing with like you know, we're 204 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:58,719 Speaker 3: not dealing with like intellectual titans here. But like when 205 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 3: someone who is mildly more intelligent than Elon Musk has 206 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 3: to defend this, it is Reagan, they point you, because 207 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 3: Reagan and Carter was also had a hand in this. 208 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 3: But Reagan does this thing called the Folker shock, right, 209 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 3: like working working hand in hand with. 210 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 2: Paul Volker's the head of the Federal. 211 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 3: Reserve, which notably, Trump just spent a bunch of time 212 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 3: threatening to fire the head of the Federal Reserve and 213 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 3: then had to back off on that because all of 214 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 3: the markets were like, this is our fucking rubicon, Like 215 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 3: we don't. 216 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:23,160 Speaker 2: Give a fuck about any of the other thing. Well, 217 00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 2: I we kind of give a fuck up the other 218 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 2: things he'd be doing. 219 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 3: But like, if you fire the head of the Federal Reserve, 220 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,199 Speaker 3: like we're going ape shit. But like, you know, the 221 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,600 Speaker 3: Fed and Reagan work together in order to do this thing, 222 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 3: which is the jack interest rates to just like unhinged levels, 223 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 3: causing everyone else's debt in the world to become like 224 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:46,640 Speaker 3: unbelievably unsustainable to repay this like annihilates boast of the 225 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 3: world's economies. This also creates like a double dip recession, 226 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:52,240 Speaker 3: where the US has like almost twenty percent unemployment. 227 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:54,079 Speaker 2: But he's able to. 228 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:58,439 Speaker 3: Write this out specifically because like, this thing actually benefits 229 00:10:58,480 --> 00:11:01,079 Speaker 3: a bunch of sections of the American capitalis class. Like 230 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 3: if you are someone who holds debt, right, this is 231 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:06,679 Speaker 3: fucking great for you. And this is something very different 232 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:09,400 Speaker 3: from what's happening right now because nobody is winning the 233 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:13,440 Speaker 3: trade war, Like everyone is just having the very worst 234 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:14,200 Speaker 3: time I've ever had. 235 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 4: It does seem like a globe of losers. 236 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:22,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, But the thing that Reagan does that actually allowed 237 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 3: him to temporarily restore the profitability of a lot of 238 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,960 Speaker 3: American manufacturing. And there is still a lot of American manufacturing. 239 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 3: We'll get to that in a bit. But the thing 240 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 3: he was able to do was the thing that Garrison 241 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:34,480 Speaker 3: I was threatening at the beginning of the show. 242 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 2: By the time I am done doing this, pot like 243 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:38,559 Speaker 2: maybe not this podcast block. By the time I. 244 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 3: Finish doing it, could happen here when I like die 245 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 3: on the battlefield in fifteen years, everyone will be able 246 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,080 Speaker 3: to fucking explain the Plaza Chords and the reverse Plaza 247 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 3: Chords because they're they're the central thing that got us 248 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 3: to this alt of this fucking place, which is that 249 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:56,640 Speaker 3: Ronald Reagan goes to Japan and goes to like West Germany, 250 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 3: and the subtext of what he's saying is like you 251 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,840 Speaker 3: are a Maria military protectorates and because you are American 252 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 3: build or Japan by the way, it's like the great 253 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 3: industrial power of the nineteen eighties right and through the nineties, 254 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 3: Like they are like the defining like they are the 255 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,000 Speaker 3: thing that everyone thinks about China today. Like if you 256 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 3: want to find every argument people make about China from 257 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 3: the entire political spectrum, like all the way from like 258 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 3: people in the one hands going like this is they're 259 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 3: going to destroy American hegemony to people on the other 260 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 3: hand being like this is what socialism is, you can 261 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:26,040 Speaker 3: find all of those same arguments people made about Japan 262 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 3: in like the eighties. But you know, what Reagan forces 263 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 3: these countries to do is to increase the value of 264 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 3: their currency relative to the dollar. Right, so the dollar 265 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:37,240 Speaker 3: is suddenly worthless, and because the dollar is like worthless 266 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 3: relative to other international currencies, it makes US manufacturer more competitive. 267 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 3: And this like temporarily restores American techleological production, but then 268 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 3: they have to reverse them because that nukes the entire 269 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 3: Japanese economy, and the Japanese economy becomes an entire thing 270 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 3: of real estate speculation, which you know, I guess, I 271 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 3: know you may be too young to remember what happened 272 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,079 Speaker 3: the last time that we base the entire. 273 00:12:57,920 --> 00:12:59,679 Speaker 6: Economy of ailsa speculation. 274 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 2: But that's not true. 275 00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 4: I say, you're like a few days older than me. 276 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 4: Come on, that's unbelievably not sure. 277 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 2: I am over half a decade older than you. Is 278 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:10,240 Speaker 2: that real? 279 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:10,559 Speaker 5: No? 280 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, real, Yeah, we'll talk about this afterwards. I don't 281 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:15,719 Speaker 4: I don't think that's true. Let me pull up my 282 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:26,959 Speaker 4: mea Wong docs file to check once, all. 283 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,560 Speaker 3: Right, while Garrison checks to be a Wong Docks file. 284 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,600 Speaker 3: The economy that is built up from all of us, though, right, 285 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 3: is an economy based on a few different things. One, 286 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 3: it's based on an entire network of global supply chains 287 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:37,319 Speaker 3: with you know, like very very minimal tariff barriers between them. 288 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:37,559 Speaker 4: Right. 289 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 3: It is based on the sort of doctrine of free trade, 290 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 3: which is, you know, not really free, but obviously like 291 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 3: the ways that these were written structurally benefited the US, right, 292 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 3: where like the US is allowed to do all of 293 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 3: this shit for like its corn production that nowhere the 294 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 3: country is allowed to do. Like all of the market 295 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 3: tampering that all these people scream about is just what 296 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 3: the U S does with corn. But you know, the 297 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:01,920 Speaker 3: entire canoxysm was based on being able to cheaply produce 298 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 3: different components of goods in different countries, assemble them, and 299 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 3: then move them across the world cheaply in order to 300 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 3: sort of avoid the localized power of workers movements. It 301 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:16,199 Speaker 3: is based on the US running a series of bubble economies, 302 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:18,080 Speaker 3: so the tech bubble, the housing bubbles, heata, et cetera. 303 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 3: And it is based on the US dollar and the 304 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 3: bond as like the fundamental aspects of the like as 305 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:24,800 Speaker 3: the world reserve currency, the. 306 00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:26,560 Speaker 2: Fundamental thing that drives the system. 307 00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 3: And when we come back, we will talk about this 308 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 3: literally all exploding and what it's going to do for 309 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 3: all of. 310 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 2: You, which is not good. 311 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 6: Yay, okay, we are back now. 312 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 3: One of the things that have in a lot of 313 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 3: ways locked the system in place was that because of 314 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 3: the that these manufacturing like networks are set up right, 315 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 3: because they're all so interlinked, because they're all dependent on 316 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 3: like exploiting differences between production capacity and like labor costs 317 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 3: in different countries. They are all so interconnected that if 318 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 3: you try to pull one thread out of it and 319 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 3: do a major change to the system, the entire thing 320 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 3: is at risk immediately. And this meant that there has 321 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 3: always been an enormous structural incentive to keep things the 322 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 3: way they were, even if everyone can also already like 323 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 3: realize that they're kind of fucked up. And this stays 324 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 3: all the way back to like things that most people 325 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 3: largely have forgotten about. But like Obama, for example, ran 326 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 3: on renegotiating NAFTA, and he never like intended to do that, 327 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 3: but like even if he had the moment he got 328 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 3: into power, you know, like Trump renegotiates NAFTA too, right, 329 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 3: but he renegotiates NAFTA and it's just like the same 330 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:50,240 Speaker 3: trade deal. 331 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 2: Because for a long. 332 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 3: Time, right, if if you were going to run the 333 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,800 Speaker 3: capitalist economy in a functional way, the only thing you 334 00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 3: could possibly do was run it the way he had 335 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 3: already been set up, because there were so many structural 336 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 3: factors about how this is no production works, that this 337 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 3: is only that this is the only way you could 338 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 3: run it and still like have the economy not explode. 339 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 3: But now we have finally produced a group of men 340 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 3: so stupid that they are unconstrained by the structural limits 341 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 3: of the economy. And this is where we get into 342 00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 3: the ground of turf terracemberon right now, and we get 343 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 3: into something that is very important to understand about this, 344 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 3: which is that this shit is not about economics, right 345 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 3: in the sense that you or I were understand them. 346 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:34,480 Speaker 3: This is none of this stuff is about like we 347 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 3: want the economy to grow. It's this is not something 348 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 3: that like really any of the major sectors of capital 349 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:45,680 Speaker 3: want because it is just nucing this whole thing. And 350 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 3: this is why you've seen a split between even Elon 351 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,600 Speaker 3: Musk has like openly criticized the trade policy, even if 352 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 3: he's been sort of hedging it. What we've been seeing 353 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 3: is this widening rift. And we talked about this in 354 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 3: the last Executive Disorder, where like different factions of the 355 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,520 Speaker 3: Trump administration we're literally trying to like isolate Trump from 356 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:05,800 Speaker 3: like Navarro, who's the guy who wants to do all 357 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:08,439 Speaker 3: of the all of the tariff bullshit they've been you know, 358 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 3: like literally try to get them alone in a room 359 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:12,480 Speaker 3: so that they can they can implement their trade policy. 360 00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 3: But the actual underlying urge here is completely ideological, right 361 00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 3: it is. It is this idea that like if you 362 00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 3: run a trade deficit with a country, or if you're 363 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 3: if you are buying things from a country, they are 364 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:27,879 Speaker 3: ripping you off and you always need to be selling 365 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 3: more things than you're buying, which is just like so 366 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 3: okay on one level, like this is just so fucking 367 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,720 Speaker 3: nonsense that like attempting to explain why his bullshit is 368 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 3: kind of pointless, But we're gonna do it anyways, because 369 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,200 Speaker 3: someone fucking has to somewhere, And this actually does also 370 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 3: reveal something about the way that money has always worked 371 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 3: under these systems. Okay, So before we get to like 372 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,000 Speaker 3: what this is going to do to the entire world economy, 373 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 3: we need to talk about garrison. Do you know what 374 00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:57,840 Speaker 3: balance of payments is? 375 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 4: That sounds like something and to ask my accountant about. 376 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, so this is a technically an accounting thing, right, 377 00:18:05,320 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 3: but the balance of payments of a country it is 378 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:10,480 Speaker 3: like a leisure thing, right, But it's the measure of 379 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 3: like their accounts, right, in terms of all of the 380 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 3: money coming out of the country and all of the 381 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 3: money coming into the country. 382 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:18,120 Speaker 2: That's you know, that's like trade balance stuff. 383 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:22,119 Speaker 3: Right, and the balance of payments is actually very important 384 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 3: for a lot of countries because specifically most countries in 385 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 3: the world need to buy things in a currency they 386 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:31,119 Speaker 3: can't print. This has always been the structural limit of 387 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 3: things like modern monetary theory, which talks about how like 388 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 3: your country's ability to like have things isn't constrained by 389 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:41,719 Speaker 3: just like the pure money supply of your country as 390 00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 3: long as you're buying things in your own currency, right, Like, 391 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 3: the purpose of money is the thing that move assets around. 392 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 3: But inflation isn't a product. I mean, like, yeah, okay, 393 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 3: if you just like hammer the fucking printer button, right, Like, yeah, 394 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:58,000 Speaker 3: you can cause hyper inflation, but substantively because money is 395 00:18:58,000 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 3: something that is a production of the government, because it 396 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 3: is literally government debt. 397 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 6: Right. 398 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,160 Speaker 2: It's not a commodity in the conventional sense. 399 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:05,639 Speaker 3: Where you have to like figure out how much of 400 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:07,719 Speaker 3: that there is and there's like a limited supply of it, 401 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 3: and you have to like manage limited supply and make 402 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 3: sure the economy doesn't explode. You can just use the 403 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 3: money that you have, and you can use debt like 404 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 3: deficit spending effectively to continue to circulate goods around. 405 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:19,520 Speaker 2: The economy. 406 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:22,440 Speaker 3: The problem is if you have to buy something that 407 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:25,399 Speaker 3: is not in your currency, that's where you need trade 408 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:26,920 Speaker 3: because you need to find a way so you know, 409 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 3: I'm gonna taken example that we're gonna come back you later, 410 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 3: which is Bolivia. 411 00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:30,879 Speaker 2: Right. If you are. 412 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,120 Speaker 3: Bolivia, you need to get American dollars. You can buy 413 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:37,359 Speaker 3: like gas, right, so people can like fucking fuel their cars. 414 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 3: And the problem is you can only buy oil in 415 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 3: American dollars, so you have to find something to export 416 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:47,160 Speaker 3: to a place where you can get American dollars for it. 417 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:50,679 Speaker 3: And in this sense, balance of payments actually matters enormously, right, 418 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 3: And balance of payments is also just like a function 419 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:54,119 Speaker 3: of all of your trade deficits and all of your 420 00:19:54,119 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 3: trade surpluses sort of combined. 421 00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:56,440 Speaker 6: Right. 422 00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:59,440 Speaker 3: But think about the US, this is a notable thing. 423 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 3: Everyone uses the dollar to buy shit. There's like nothing 424 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:03,359 Speaker 3: that you. 425 00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 2: Can't buy with the dollar. 426 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,359 Speaker 3: So for the United States, none of this shit matters 427 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,119 Speaker 3: at all, none of the mottle flame of stuff. 428 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 2: It is completely. 429 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:16,120 Speaker 3: Irrelevant, like literally, completely totally and utterly irrelevant. Right now, 430 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 3: if you are like Bolivia and you run out of dollars, 431 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 3: then what you have as a spirally economic crisis where 432 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:23,800 Speaker 3: like peoples looking suddenly can't buy food because no one 433 00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 3: can buy oil, so no one can move things around, 434 00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 3: So like the entire equality literal collapses. This is a 435 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:32,080 Speaker 3: very very very common mode of economic collapse. But you know, 436 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:34,399 Speaker 3: none of the things that the right is talking about, 437 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 3: like in terms of like, oh you have like the 438 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 3: United States has like a trade deficit with China's like yeah, great, 439 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:39,920 Speaker 3: that means that we're buying. 440 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 2: Things from them. 441 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:44,360 Speaker 3: Like the one good Rand Paul quote ever was like, yes, 442 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:47,959 Speaker 3: I have a trade deficit with my grocery store, like 443 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:50,919 Speaker 3: and that's fine. 444 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 4: Mia goes full Rand Paul on the podcast today. 445 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:55,399 Speaker 5: Yeah I know. 446 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:57,640 Speaker 3: But the thing is, the thing is it is very 447 00:20:57,760 --> 00:20:59,919 Speaker 3: very funny that Rand Paul is now complaining about this. 448 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,399 Speaker 3: It's like, well, yeah, I don't know if all of 449 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:04,800 Speaker 3: you motherfuckers hadn't spent all this time like fucking polling 450 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 3: around with like Alex Jones and the Klan, like we 451 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 3: probably wouldn't be here right now. 452 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 4: The zero faults definitely, like the Tea Party does have 453 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 4: a sizeable chunk of the blame here. 454 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, Like like that's the thing, like this this is 455 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 3: your all of your fucking fault. Lock them up quick, 456 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 3: zero tot of ten zero a ten, Get him out, 457 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 3: Get him out, Get them out. 458 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: Now. 459 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 2: Do you know what else we need to get out? 460 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 2: Gett a stock. Oh it's these fucks and services. 461 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, get them out of stock. 462 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:31,080 Speaker 2: Get them out of stock while you still can. 463 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:40,720 Speaker 4: Well, we still have an economy. 464 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 2: We are back now again. 465 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 3: As I was saying, like this attempt to make the 466 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 3: American economy function in a way that it has trade 467 00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,240 Speaker 3: surpluses with every other country. And also, and this is 468 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,360 Speaker 3: also important, these people don't think that like services are 469 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 3: real and a lot of what the US exports as services. 470 00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,639 Speaker 2: But because they're all these really weird like me. 471 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:04,160 Speaker 3: Because they're all fascists, right, they all have this all 472 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,720 Speaker 3: of this weird ideological shit about masculinity and about the 473 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:11,160 Speaker 3: favoring of the concrete over the abstract, because the concrete 474 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:13,560 Speaker 3: is like masculated. It is like it is the nation, 475 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 3: right like this like steel workers and people who fucking 476 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 3: hammer coal out like this. This is what masculinity is. 477 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:21,439 Speaker 3: This is what nationalism is. This is what men are 478 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 3: supposed to do. 479 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 4: Yeah, you have the materialists on the evil side, and 480 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 4: you have the post materialists on Well no. 481 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 2: Okay, So so this is a long time ago. 482 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,679 Speaker 3: I did a bunch of episodes called The Class and 483 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:37,879 Speaker 3: the Culture War, and one of the points that I 484 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:39,960 Speaker 3: make in that episode is that one of the arguments 485 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 3: that the Canadian Jewish Marxist historian Moish Pistone makes about 486 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 3: what the Holocaust was was this attempt to pit the 487 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,200 Speaker 3: concrete part of capital against the abstract part of capital. Right, 488 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:54,680 Speaker 3: where the concrete part of capital is like the nation 489 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 3: and the worker and the factory and like the boss, right, 490 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 3: and all of these like conk things were pitted against 491 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 3: the like the quote unquote abstract part of capital, which 492 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,840 Speaker 3: is to say, like quote unquote like Jewish financiers and 493 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 3: all of the sort of like weird collection of like 494 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 3: modifiers that gets associated with like you know, the rootless 495 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 3: positive politanism, like the globalism, like all of this shit, right, 496 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 3: And what the Nazis did was embody all of that 497 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 3: stuff into just the figure of the Jewish person and 498 00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:28,200 Speaker 3: his arguments. And this is arguing about like sort of 499 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,680 Speaker 3: structural anti semitism, and what the Holocaust was was that 500 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 3: the like that was what the Nazi revolution was. That's 501 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:36,600 Speaker 3: what the liquidation of like and this is how episode describes, 502 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:38,400 Speaker 3: like liquidation of Jesus is what this is what the holocaust, 503 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:40,639 Speaker 3: This is what the genocide was. Was their attempt to 504 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,200 Speaker 3: destroy the like abstract part of part of this thing 505 00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 3: by pitting it against the concrete part of this thing. 506 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,439 Speaker 3: And this is what these fucking people are also are 507 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 3: also doing in their own way, right. 508 00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:52,119 Speaker 4: Like yeah, they're just doing it with like the price 509 00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:54,440 Speaker 4: of eggs or like the availability of housing. 510 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,159 Speaker 3: Right, and you know, and it's also renting. Like these 511 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 3: people are like unhe and gentti Semitic, right because this 512 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 3: is all part of the same ideology. They just sort 513 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:02,960 Speaker 3: of like they're doing the shit in different ways and 514 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 3: they haven't like yeah, I don't know, like if these 515 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:07,880 Speaker 3: people are in power for like a decade, we might 516 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 3: just get this right where they're literally doing the Holocaust again, 517 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 3: but like we're not at that point yet, but we're 518 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:15,959 Speaker 3: at the point is where like this this kind of 519 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 3: like under like this kind of fascist understanding of the 520 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 3: nation and masculinity and like the concrete versus the abstract, 521 00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:26,200 Speaker 3: and like these figures can be like embodied in anti thinking. 522 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 3: This is also what like what the like this is 523 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 3: what the administration is doing with immigrants, right, is like 524 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 3: passing them in that role of like the abstract like 525 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,760 Speaker 3: the foreigner, the yeah, the national, the like the anti 526 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:36,560 Speaker 3: the anti national. 527 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 4: Those things are are what is causing our economic problems, 528 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:42,479 Speaker 4: our housing problems. And then you have other instances like 529 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 4: with like Mexico and Canada where they tie in the 530 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,240 Speaker 4: trade war with this like ventanyl thing being like you know, 531 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 4: like immigrants are bringing fentanyl over the border and we're 532 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,919 Speaker 4: using tariffs as a negotiating tactic to stop ventanyls like 533 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:58,719 Speaker 4: they're they're bringing in even more like aspects regarding like 534 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 4: immigration and tying it directly to like our trade wars 535 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:08,159 Speaker 4: with these with these you know, massive massive countries, some 536 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:09,800 Speaker 4: of our most important trading partners. 537 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:14,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, and this is causing an interesting split because Trump's 538 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,200 Speaker 3: like political coalition, right, has a bunch of kind of 539 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,160 Speaker 3: different kinds of fascists in a lot of ways. We're 540 00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 3: like Trump and Navarro and like, I mean, Trump is 541 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 3: instinctually pro tariff and like he can be talked out 542 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 3: of it because again this guy's brain, like we saw 543 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 3: this last administration, like the last person in the room 544 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 3: with him can convince them but basically anything. But you know, 545 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 3: those people are structurally committed to like this specific version 546 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 3: of masculinity. And there's a lot of portions of the 547 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:41,760 Speaker 3: right that are and that are committed to like this 548 00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:44,639 Speaker 3: trade policy is like the America first American nationalist thing. 549 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,600 Speaker 3: But like someone like Elon Musk isn't that committed to this, 550 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 3: And like even a lot of the people who are 551 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:54,960 Speaker 3: like the inner circle sort of like Jarvin, like tech 552 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 3: fascist right are like okay, but hold on, like we 553 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 3: make all of our shit in China, so like you know, 554 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 3: and this is why like Elon is coming against the 555 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 3: terrorists because like, yeah, they're gonna fuck him, like because 556 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 3: he has to import stuff and export stuff from China 557 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 3: because that's where a bunch of his production facilities are, right, 558 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 3: and you know, and if once you get out of 559 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 3: the circle of of like that kind of like tech 560 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 3: fascist right, and and the tech people are the people 561 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 3: who are the most closely aligned with this administration, right, 562 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 3: like an internships are like all the sexus of the capital. 563 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:23,679 Speaker 3: Tech is the most closely aligned one. But you know, 564 00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 3: you can get out into like places like fucking Walgreens 565 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 3: and Walmart, right, and these are also like like the 566 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 3: Waltons as a family are like traditional backers of the 567 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:34,159 Speaker 3: right for ages and ages and ages right, there've been 568 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,359 Speaker 3: backers of far right causes. They also don't want this 569 00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:39,399 Speaker 3: because also their entire supply chains work through fucking China 570 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,760 Speaker 3: and work through moving a bunch of like commodities around, 571 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 3: and the further route you go when you when you 572 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,399 Speaker 3: start getting into like actual finance capital. These people are 573 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:48,480 Speaker 3: fucking terrified because they're looking at this and like, holy shit, 574 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 3: we're about to lose all over goddamn money. And the 575 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,160 Speaker 3: consequence to face is that all of this stuff is 576 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 3: shaping out in a sort of political battle in the 577 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 3: administration over who can get Trump in the room last 578 00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:03,840 Speaker 3: to try to figure out how how the economy is 579 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 3: going to work. But the problem is, and I have 580 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 3: been vindicated in this, in the very brief amount of 581 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,639 Speaker 3: time between when the episode of Friday came out and 582 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:16,359 Speaker 3: when we're recording this, there are no negotiations with China. Like, 583 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 3: they haven't started. There's no process for starting them. 584 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:22,120 Speaker 4: Trump does keep lying about starting negotiations, and yeah, he's 585 00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,600 Speaker 4: just lying about this, right, Chinese government says, no, we 586 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 4: have not started negotiations. 587 00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:27,880 Speaker 2: It's like, no, there's no negotiations. 588 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, and there and and again, like the structurally there 589 00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,399 Speaker 3: can't be negotiations because there's no actual way for the 590 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,720 Speaker 3: US to like not have a trade deficit with China, 591 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 3: Like there's no way you can do that. And that's 592 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,239 Speaker 3: the thing that will satisfy these people. So all of 593 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:45,000 Speaker 3: this means that the economy is fucking dead, right. This 594 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 3: is the sort of like free trade economy we've all 595 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 3: grown up in that functions off of like you know, 596 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 3: like fucking drop shipping and all this cheap production of a 597 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:55,919 Speaker 3: bunch of other countries and you know, like assemblies of 598 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,359 Speaker 3: a bunch of different like goods in different places, and 599 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:00,639 Speaker 3: the US is like the economic center of world is 600 00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:01,359 Speaker 3: just fucking gone. 601 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 2: Now. 602 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,320 Speaker 3: One of the reasons I started writing this episode in 603 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 3: the first place is that I have read so much 604 00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:14,159 Speaker 3: fucking analyzes of these goddamn turf tariffs, and do you 605 00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,959 Speaker 3: know how many of them, for a single fucking second, 606 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 3: considered what this was going to be like for anyone 607 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 3: who doesn't live in the United States. What the fuck 608 00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:29,399 Speaker 3: is wrong with people? Why does nobody fucking care about 609 00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 3: a single goddamn person who. 610 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 2: Lives beside the United States. 611 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 3: I have read so many fucking analyzes of this fucking shit. 612 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 3: I have read these things from I have read these 613 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 3: things from the business papers. I have read these things 614 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,200 Speaker 3: from fascists. I have read these things from the center left. 615 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,480 Speaker 3: I have read these things from leftists. Do you know 616 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 3: how many of these things have said anything about actual 617 00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 3: fucking people who do not live. 618 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 2: In the goddamn United States. Fucking none of them. 619 00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 3: Every once in a while you'll get like, this will 620 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:01,520 Speaker 3: be bad for the economy of China, and this is 621 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,959 Speaker 3: this is a catastrophe because the people who are going 622 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 3: to be most affected by this when when the fucking 623 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,239 Speaker 3: turf terrifts some liberation they come back into effect over 624 00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 3: the summer are the working classes Sri Lanka. 625 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 2: This is going to be. 626 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 3: The fucking apocalypse for a bunch of people who have 627 00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 3: been going through hell for years and years and years 628 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 3: and years. It's going to be places like fucking Bolivia, 629 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 3: who which is already facing a dollar crisis and is 630 00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 3: struggling to import fuel. 631 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 2: It is going to be places like Bangladesh. 632 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,520 Speaker 3: It is going to be places like Vietnam, which is, 633 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,000 Speaker 3: you know, structurally in a better position than a lot 634 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:32,720 Speaker 3: of the rest of these countries, but like fucking won't 635 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 3: be in a structurally better like balance for a structurally better 636 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,880 Speaker 3: position when it has like ninety percent goddamn tariffs on it. 637 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 3: And yes, the US is going to be real fucking bad, right, 638 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 3: Everything is going to cost a lot more money. All 639 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 3: of us are going to have a lotless jobs, The 640 00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 3: people who are in jobs are going to make a 641 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:49,719 Speaker 3: lot less money. There is going to be a lot 642 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:51,479 Speaker 3: of people fucking homeless. There is going to be a 643 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:53,880 Speaker 3: lot of people who can't get fucking food. It is 644 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 3: going to be a catastrophe. And also at the same time, 645 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 3: the US is going to look like fucking fully automated, 646 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 3: luxury gase based commonism compared to fucking Shri Lanka. This 647 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 3: kind of sort of wrote American nationalism that has consumed 648 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:11,160 Speaker 3: the brains of basically this entire goddamn country on a 649 00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 3: level so deep Americans don't even fucking think about it, 650 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:18,040 Speaker 3: like is the reason why we fucking have all of 651 00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 3: this bullshit in the first place. And this is why, 652 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,080 Speaker 3: like in like four fucking months, literally no one in 653 00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 3: the entire country social security actually going to show up 654 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,560 Speaker 3: because nineteen year ol grow up doesn't understand sequel because 655 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 3: nobody in this fucking country gives a single shit about 656 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 3: anyone who lives outside of the country enough to try 657 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 3: to do a single goddamn word of analysis about how 658 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:37,560 Speaker 3: this is going. 659 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 2: To affect everyone. 660 00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:41,400 Speaker 3: Because the death of the global economy will be felt here, 661 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 3: it is going to be felt so much fucking worse 662 00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 3: everywhere else on goddamn Earth. And I am like, I 663 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 3: am losing my fucking mind at the extent to which 664 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 3: everyone is just fucking refusing to engage with this complete. 665 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:56,880 Speaker 2: This is gonna be. 666 00:30:56,680 --> 00:31:00,120 Speaker 3: Being unbelievably fucking angry because, like I don't know, a 667 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:01,840 Speaker 3: bunch of my family doesn't live in this country, which 668 00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 3: means I have to deal with the fact that, like 669 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 3: everyone else who lives in another country, is a human 670 00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:09,280 Speaker 3: being who's exactly the same as fucking we are, and 671 00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,440 Speaker 3: this is the thing that nobody else appears to want 672 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,640 Speaker 3: to fuck deal with. I am losing my shit. Please 673 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 3: God stop talking about the tariffs as if they only 674 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:19,880 Speaker 3: affect the United States and aren't mostly going to be 675 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 3: born by everyone else. I didn't write a transition for this, 676 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,880 Speaker 3: but you know I will transition out of this by 677 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 3: again going back to the fact that all of the 678 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 3: reason this is going to be so bad is that 679 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:39,480 Speaker 3: the global economy is based on, you know, a combination 680 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 3: of resource extraction and a combination of logistical supply lines 681 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 3: that all rely on there not being one hundred percent 682 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 3: tariffs on goods and importers to the US. And when 683 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 3: this shit goes through and when the rest of the 684 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 3: tariffs go through and make it you know, the thing 685 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,680 Speaker 3: that's happening right now as an attempt to avoid this 686 00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 3: stuff is everyone you know, and this is something like 687 00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 3: Nintendo has been talking about right with a like, Okay, 688 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 3: our plan to avoid the tariffs on China is to 689 00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 3: move a bunch of our production into Vietnam. And that 690 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:08,800 Speaker 3: was happening anyways before the tariffs because of sort of 691 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 3: rising labor costs in China, and you know, a whole 692 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,800 Speaker 3: bunch of sort of factors like that. But none of 693 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:17,880 Speaker 3: that shit, none of that stuff that's like to sort 694 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:20,120 Speaker 3: of like keep the current global economy on a lifeline, 695 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 3: is going is going to be able to function once 696 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:26,479 Speaker 3: the tariffs on basically every country on Earth go into effect. 697 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 3: And there's a second problem here, which is that, Okay, 698 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:32,719 Speaker 3: so what is the new economy going to look like 699 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 3: these people like that are the people running like the administration, right, 700 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,520 Speaker 3: like people like Navarro and people like Trump, and a 701 00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,400 Speaker 3: lot of the sort of like right, who is driving 702 00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 3: the policy thing here? Think that this that the production 703 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,360 Speaker 3: that's happening everywhere else in the world will just be 704 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,040 Speaker 3: replaced by the US. And there was a trap that 705 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,200 Speaker 3: people fall into with Chinese economics. And I do this 706 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 3: too sometimes because it's you know, it's a fast and 707 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 3: easy way to think about the Chinese economy, and. 708 00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 2: It's not accurates. 709 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,040 Speaker 3: It's not like, isn't capital the whole picture of what's 710 00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 3: going on? But the way that people think about the 711 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 3: Chinese economy tends to be that the reason that things 712 00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 3: are made in China is because labor is cheap there 713 00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:14,280 Speaker 3: because either a culmination of exploitation and poverty. And that's 714 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 3: true to an extent, right, But the actual sort of 715 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 3: genius from capitalist perpective of capitalis returns to China was that, 716 00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 3: you know, from a capitalist perspective, the Chinese workforce, and 717 00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:28,959 Speaker 3: this continues to be true thirty or forty years into 718 00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:32,520 Speaker 3: the transition, is highly educated and highly skilled, and the 719 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,520 Speaker 3: education was paid for not by capitalism, right, it was 720 00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 3: paid for by the sort of socialist system. Like this, 721 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 3: This combination of things of a highly educated and an 722 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 3: increasingly highly skilled as they've been, you know, working these jobs, 723 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 3: means that there is an extremely high skilled migrant labor 724 00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,320 Speaker 3: population that knows how to do a bunch of shit 725 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,760 Speaker 3: like circuit board assembly and like stuff with like chip assembly, right, 726 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,480 Speaker 3: that is vital to making electronics. And the US does 727 00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 3: not have a couple of one hundred thousand micro workers 728 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,160 Speaker 3: that you can just have and like exploit and not 729 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 3: pay healthcare costs to to know how all of the 730 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:12,759 Speaker 3: chip manufacturing shit works. Right, There are people in the 731 00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:15,080 Speaker 3: US who know how to do some of these kinds 732 00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,799 Speaker 3: of things. But we're talking, you know, even even though 733 00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:21,440 Speaker 3: the US does have a manufacturing economy and it is 734 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:23,719 Speaker 3: very high tech, it is not on the scale of 735 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:24,400 Speaker 3: these things. 736 00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:25,359 Speaker 5: Right. 737 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:28,799 Speaker 3: And the second, the second big reason why things are 738 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 3: producing in China, and this is this is the reason 739 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:32,439 Speaker 3: why production didn't just shift all shift out of China 740 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,200 Speaker 3: after twenty eleven when there were huge protests there and 741 00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,640 Speaker 3: huge riots there over sort of labor conditions, is that 742 00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,480 Speaker 3: there is an unbelievable amount of like capital outlet, like 743 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 3: this physical factory infrastructure that is in China that you 744 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,280 Speaker 3: can't easily just move out to another country. 745 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 2: And this is this is the basic things. 746 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 3: Like the power grid functions right, and you can't really 747 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,480 Speaker 3: easily replicate that, and you can't just have this thing 748 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:01,640 Speaker 3: that they're all people want to do. We're like the 749 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 3: US will just suddenly, you know, have all of these factories, 750 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 3: right and suddenly like all these things will just like 751 00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:09,520 Speaker 3: come back and miraculously like there will be all of 752 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:12,360 Speaker 3: these jobs because like who the fuck is going like, 753 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:13,839 Speaker 3: we don't we literally we don't have. 754 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:15,680 Speaker 2: The technology for this. We'll not technlogy. 755 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 3: It was like, who is going to build all of 756 00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:21,440 Speaker 3: the factories, right, Like the factories don't exist here, the 757 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,839 Speaker 3: like the interlague technical systems for them don't exist here. 758 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:27,920 Speaker 4: You don't want to switch to costing fifty thousand dollars 759 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,920 Speaker 4: available in ten years pre order now, Sorry, no available 760 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 4: in twenty years. I forgot about the environmental impact surveys. 761 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:36,560 Speaker 2: Yeah iPhone, iPhone twenty years. 762 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:36,839 Speaker 6: Yeah. 763 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:38,279 Speaker 3: But like you know, and like and like a lot 764 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 3: of this is because I like, you know, you're hearing 765 00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 3: a lot of reports now if like small business owners 766 00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:44,120 Speaker 3: we're talking about, like, yeah, it's so much easier to 767 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,040 Speaker 3: work with Chinese manufacturers, is like im possible to work 768 00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:51,439 Speaker 3: with American manufacturers, And part of that is just exploitation, right, Like, yeah, 769 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 3: there's a lot of things that like there there were 770 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,600 Speaker 3: like labor conditions that are very common in China that 771 00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:57,360 Speaker 3: do happen in the US but are much easier to 772 00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 3: do there. But also like I don't know, like China 773 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:02,920 Speaker 3: it has like an entire network of like the ability 774 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,120 Speaker 3: to basically do this sort of like pop up light 775 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,839 Speaker 3: and media manufacturing that can like retool itself really quickly, 776 00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,360 Speaker 3: and the US doesn't fucking have that, right, Like we 777 00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 3: do have a bunch of manufacturing in the US, right, 778 00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:16,920 Speaker 3: Like that is the thing that we have, but it 779 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 3: was largely pushed into like the suburbs to get rid 780 00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 3: of sort of like the masses of workers that a 781 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 3: rose in cities like Detroit, to like atomize them, right, 782 00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:26,560 Speaker 3: And this is actually like also happening in China right now, weirdly, 783 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:28,799 Speaker 3: Like China has been pivoting to a service economy for 784 00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:30,920 Speaker 3: a long time, but think this thing is those service economies. 785 00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,479 Speaker 3: A lot of that shit is like also like drop 786 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:37,840 Speaker 3: shipping production. Right, but like you know, there's no actual 787 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,439 Speaker 3: way for you know becaure like capital at like costs 788 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:42,440 Speaker 3: and things like that. There's no actual way to replicate 789 00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:45,240 Speaker 3: the conditions in China that make it like an effective 790 00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:48,600 Speaker 3: like source of global production in the US or even 791 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 3: in like a country like India, Like there's just not 792 00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:52,560 Speaker 3: the infrastructure there to do it, and there's not the 793 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:55,120 Speaker 3: sort of like migrot labor population. It's not the sort 794 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,560 Speaker 3: of things that you need. And what this means right now, 795 00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:02,840 Speaker 3: right is that like there is not a future lined 796 00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:04,640 Speaker 3: up to replace the one that we're in right now. 797 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 3: We literally don't know what this is going to do 798 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:10,080 Speaker 3: because no one has ever bothered planning this shit out, 799 00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:14,400 Speaker 3: because this is just like taking a sledgehammer to fucking everything. 800 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 3: Like they are trying to extract the copper wires from 801 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 3: the house, and in order to do this, they like 802 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:19,759 Speaker 3: you know aid because they think they think that's how 803 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 3: the economy works, is they attract the copper wires and 804 00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,799 Speaker 3: b their planned to extract the copper wires is to 805 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:24,400 Speaker 3: blow the house. 806 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:25,200 Speaker 2: Up with dynamite. 807 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,520 Speaker 3: And now no one's ever done in environmental impact statements 808 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,040 Speaker 3: on what if you blow the house up with dynamite, 809 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 3: because why the fuck would you do that? 810 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:34,960 Speaker 4: Right, Sometimes the police do that. 811 00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:38,200 Speaker 3: It's true, it's true, but I guess, I guess the 812 00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,600 Speaker 3: US is the world's police force. But you go, you know, 813 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:42,279 Speaker 3: like no one has planned for this. But the second 814 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:46,000 Speaker 3: thing is there isn't another model of capital waiting in 815 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,920 Speaker 3: the wings in the way that there was when when 816 00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:50,880 Speaker 3: the sort of Reaganites did this the economy, because the 817 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 3: Reaganites had an entire ideological apprightus. 818 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:53,839 Speaker 2: They had they had. 819 00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 3: A like a functional way for the economy to work 820 00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,200 Speaker 3: and be worse and be more exploitive. But there's there's 821 00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:03,480 Speaker 3: nothing behind this, right, There's just a vision that literally 822 00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:07,840 Speaker 3: cannot work. And so the place that I want to 823 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:09,960 Speaker 3: end as as we head into the end of the economy, 824 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,320 Speaker 3: and as you know, I like I've been trying to 825 00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,239 Speaker 3: grapple with what is it going to look like after this, 826 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,640 Speaker 3: is that we just don't know. Things in the supply 827 00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 3: chain are going to break that we have never thought 828 00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:25,640 Speaker 3: about before, Like medical systems are going to start breaking down, right, 829 00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:31,080 Speaker 3: The supply chains for like like really really basic goods 830 00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,120 Speaker 3: that we don't even think about the production process of 831 00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 3: is going to start breaking down because it relies on 832 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,360 Speaker 3: being able to cheaply import one very very specific kind 833 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,279 Speaker 3: of like I don't know, like ball bearing that's made 834 00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:46,680 Speaker 3: in one factory and suddenly cost like four hundred times 835 00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:52,080 Speaker 3: as much as it did before, And we don't know 836 00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:55,239 Speaker 3: what that's going to do. And this is on the 837 00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:58,960 Speaker 3: one hand, absolutely horrifying, right, like, this is going to 838 00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 3: mean an unbelievable amount of suffering for people across the world. 839 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,719 Speaker 3: But on the other hand, there is no plan, right, 840 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 3: They don't have a fucking strategy, and that means that 841 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,160 Speaker 3: the future of the global economy is up in the air, 842 00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:16,840 Speaker 3: and it's up to us to make it a fucking 843 00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,680 Speaker 3: better one. Right, It's we either drive these people from 844 00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 3: power and we and we destroy the basis of their 845 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:23,840 Speaker 3: power on such a fundamental level they can never return 846 00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:27,279 Speaker 3: to power, right, Like, we just we just fucking ncap them. 847 00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,920 Speaker 3: We physically seize all of the fucking assets and all 848 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:32,799 Speaker 3: of the things, of the productive capacity that they have 849 00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:34,880 Speaker 3: that has been allowing you to do this. We make 850 00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:36,440 Speaker 3: sure they can never get it again, and we make 851 00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:38,640 Speaker 3: sure that we fucking control it. And we either do 852 00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,359 Speaker 3: that or we all get crushed for a generation and 853 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:47,440 Speaker 3: we enter a period of just unmitigated global suffering, the 854 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:50,799 Speaker 3: likes of which only a few people in the most 855 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:53,840 Speaker 3: hideously wartone parts of the world have experienced today. 856 00:39:55,200 --> 00:40:00,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, I for one am very excited to see the 857 00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:06,880 Speaker 4: anarchist liberal reglobalization Alliance finally fighting in the streets of 858 00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:11,560 Speaker 4: Seattle to regain globalization full circle. 859 00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,759 Speaker 3: You know, I will point out the reason they all 860 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:18,040 Speaker 3: called it alter globalization and not anti globalization was that, 861 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:19,800 Speaker 3: like one of the one of the original. 862 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:22,359 Speaker 4: Lines them did say anti globalization, they did, right, but. 863 00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:24,279 Speaker 2: Like a like a like a lot of their argument was. 864 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:27,239 Speaker 4: Like the West Coast team, certainly this is true. 865 00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:28,680 Speaker 3: But like like it's also it's also true that like 866 00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:30,680 Speaker 3: like like one of the arguments they were making was that, 867 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:35,440 Speaker 3: like neoliberal globalization meant that people couldn't move to places, 868 00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:37,920 Speaker 3: but capital could. And the thing that they want was 869 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,040 Speaker 3: a world where people can move between things and like, 870 00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:43,680 Speaker 3: fuck capital, what the fuck like eat shit? Right, And 871 00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,239 Speaker 3: that's a world that we can build, right, we can 872 00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,719 Speaker 3: build a world where fucking nobody gets arrested by the 873 00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 3: immigration Gestapo, where like there isn't a fucking line on 874 00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:54,840 Speaker 3: the ground that dictates whether people can disappear you to 875 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:55,960 Speaker 3: a concentration. 876 00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,919 Speaker 2: Camp, and that is also globalization. 877 00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 4: Right, we just have to fucking do it and our 878 00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:06,040 Speaker 4: co clintonism. One day we can look at a beautiful world. 879 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 3: Look, if Bill Crystal can admit the radicals were right, 880 00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,000 Speaker 3: all of these other motherfuckers could come around. We've been 881 00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:15,120 Speaker 3: writ all, but we've been right the whole fucking time. 882 00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:16,480 Speaker 2: Fuck you assholes. 883 00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 3: This all of you broke this world and it is 884 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:21,120 Speaker 3: now our job to put it back together. And you 885 00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:23,600 Speaker 3: fuckers are going to back us or we are all 886 00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:25,000 Speaker 3: going to be killed by fascism. 887 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,920 Speaker 2: And those are the terms. Deal with it. 888 00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:31,640 Speaker 4: It's a strange world we live in. Boom. 889 00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:37,760 Speaker 1: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 890 00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:41,000 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 891 00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:44,640 Speaker 1: Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 892 00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:46,719 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever. 893 00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:47,640 Speaker 2: You listen to podcasts. 894 00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:49,960 Speaker 1: You can now find sources for it Could Happen here, 895 00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:52,960 Speaker 1: listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.