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Speaker 1: To listen all at once ad free, subscribe to True

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Speaker 1: Crime Clubhouse on Apple Podcasts. Welcome to Lives of Crime,

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Speaker 1: True Crime from True Criminals. I'm Steve Fishman. This week

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Speaker 1: we present part two of the Larry Mass story. When

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Speaker 1: we met Larry in episode one, he was a seventeen

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Speaker 1: year old delivery boy at the local supermarket who had

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Speaker 1: just been seduced by Linda, a beautiful older woman. The

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Speaker 1: affair took off, and then Linda insisted that Larry meet

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Speaker 1: her husband. Larry assumed he was a businessman. In fact,

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Speaker 1: he was a mob assassin known as the Grim Reaper.

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Speaker 1: But Greg, that's the Grim Reaper's real name, is okay

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Speaker 1: with the love triangle. He likes having Larry around. It

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Speaker 1: turns out the Grim Reaper has his own plans for Larry.

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Speaker 1: Well this episode The Education of an Assassin Part two.

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Speaker 2: There were true feelings between me and Linda, and they

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Speaker 2: just grew stronger and stronger. Greg knows he's okay with it.

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Speaker 2: Now that Greg knows, the weight of the world.

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Speaker 3: Is off my shoulders.

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Speaker 2: Greg and I have this new camaraderie, this new friendship.

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Speaker 2: We even joked about our situation. Greg starts confiding in

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Speaker 2: me in lots of things. One of those things is

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Speaker 2: that he has another wife two hours away in New Jersey.

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Speaker 2: Now I realized how I had all those nights alone

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Speaker 2: with Linda. If I'm at the club every day, wimpy boys,

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Speaker 2: now I call it the club, not the office. I

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Speaker 2: know it's a club, and I see all these piles

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Speaker 2: of money coming in, lending money out, the number of business.

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Speaker 3: I know it's not legal, but it's Brooklyn.

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Speaker 2: Linda is in his year all the time. She wanted

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Speaker 2: me to be another break. I actually mentioned that to

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Speaker 2: my father. They're opening a company and they liked me

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Speaker 2: to be the sales manager. So he's a little concerned.

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Speaker 2: He doesn't want me to walk away from the fire

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Speaker 2: department plan that we have that I was going to

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Speaker 2: be a fireman just like him, and I assured him

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't.

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Speaker 3: The one uneasy.

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Speaker 2: Part I had was having to continue to lie to

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Speaker 2: my parents. My father he had no idea I was

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Speaker 2: sleeping with this older woman. I couldn't tell them I

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Speaker 2: was with this mob guy, but I did want them

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Speaker 2: to meet him. I said, he's a lot like Uncle Albert.

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Speaker 2: My uncle Albert is my mom's brother. He's a dinosaur

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Speaker 2: in the Colombo family, well respected and a good good man.

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Speaker 2: We meet it the same restaurant. Greg took me to

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Speaker 2: the first time Sorrento's and walked us to a back table.

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Speaker 2: Greg's table. Greg is very charismatic, very articulate. He was

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Speaker 2: able to have my father laugh and think. He's a

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Speaker 2: regular guy. He's a good guy, and he has good

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Speaker 2: plans for me and my mom and dad they probably

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Speaker 2: knew in the real world sometimes it's who you know,

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Speaker 2: not what you know.

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Speaker 3: Greg.

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Speaker 2: This night at the table was all of that. I

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Speaker 2: was enamored by Greg. I dressed like him. He had

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Speaker 2: a gold watch. I had a gold watch. He had

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Speaker 2: a pink e ring. I had a pink ear ring.

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Speaker 2: He has a Greg and diamonds on his wrist. I

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Speaker 2: went and bought a Larry and diamonds.

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Speaker 3: He was my model.

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Speaker 2: Somehow, some way, I find out the warehouse blows up.

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Speaker 3: Our whole warehouse goes up in flames.

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Speaker 2: Was it a setup? Was it an insurance job? I

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Speaker 2: never found out, but there was no more supply company.

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Speaker 2: I took myself off the fire department list and now

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Speaker 2: on a no man's land, telling Linda, what am I

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Speaker 2: going to do with my life. Now, I gotta go

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Speaker 2: back and take the fire department test again, or the

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Speaker 2: police department test. Police, you can't take that, And I

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Speaker 2: says why. I says, it's a great job you work

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Speaker 2: for the city.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, she got mad.

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Speaker 2: She jumped down my throat. You could arrest somebody. How

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Speaker 2: could you know? You can't be a cop?

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Speaker 3: All right, all right? If I got to do something.

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Speaker 3: The very next morning, I go to the house. Greg

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Speaker 3: is there. He's not upset, he's not broken.

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Speaker 2: We sit down and he explains to me how unfortunate

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Speaker 2: it was that the place burned up. It's just another

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Speaker 2: day gone by. What I think we'll do is we'll

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Speaker 2: bring you into the numbers business. I really don't have

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Speaker 2: much of a choice, so I said, okay, I'll start today.

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Speaker 2: Greg saw that I had whatever it is, a gene,

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Speaker 2: some DNA, something that separated me. Not sure, but he

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Speaker 2: saw something. He bypassed putting me with all the younger guys.

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Speaker 3: He kept me direct with him.

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Speaker 2: That sort of made me an unofficial equal to Greg Jor.

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Speaker 2: Greg Junior is Greg's son. Greg Junior is bringing me

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Speaker 2: to different areas, and I'm picking up little slips of

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Speaker 2: paper from warehouses and queen's warehouses in Brooklyn, factories, businesses,

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Speaker 2: all these different places. I was smarter than most of

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Speaker 2: these wise guys, so I enhanced it. It made these businesses

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Speaker 2: even better. I see in the club they have these

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Speaker 2: football tickets, these football parlay cards. So I asked Greg.

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Speaker 2: I says, can I bring these with me? That's a

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Speaker 2: great idea. So I brought them and they were going

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Speaker 2: like hotcakes. I went from just picking up a piece

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Speaker 2: of paper making two hundred a day, now I went

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Speaker 2: to four hundred a day. Greg Junior hooks me up

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Speaker 2: with a.

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Speaker 3: Guy who is a book maker.

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Speaker 2: Now I'm bringing back bets anywhere from one two hundred,

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Speaker 2: five hundred thousand. Now I'm starting to make big money

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Speaker 2: on anybody's standards. Six months later, I'm now in my

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Speaker 2: twenty one and a half. I become a major bookmaker

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Speaker 2: in the city. Other families edging off to me. I

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Speaker 2: ultimately got permission to open my own and now the

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Speaker 2: money is getting somewhat mind boggling. Wasn't officially a wise guy,

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Speaker 2: but I was now a mini Greg.

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Speaker 3: He's sort of grooming me.

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Speaker 2: He was teaching me to be the consummate mobster, just

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Speaker 2: like Kim. When you got it, you'll walk into a

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Speaker 2: room and they'll smell you.

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Speaker 3: They'll know you're a gangster.

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Speaker 2: I felt like it was part of something, meeting captains

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Speaker 2: and goodfellas and I was being treated with respect and

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Speaker 2: they knew I was an Erner.

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Speaker 3: When you're an Erna, you'll love it. Greg said I

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Speaker 3: have to get a caddy.

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Speaker 2: He had Bobby, one of his men, bring me to

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Speaker 2: Nelson Baumb mcadillac. I had no credit, but Bobby told

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Speaker 2: Nelson momb this is Greg's nephew.

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Speaker 3: I drove out with the car.

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Speaker 2: I'm spending literally hours in the office manning the phones.

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Speaker 2: Linda's getting a upset with me because we're not spending

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Speaker 2: as much time together. The business as great as it

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Speaker 2: could be, there were ups and downs. There were times

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Speaker 2: we lost a fortune and I had to borrow money.

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Speaker 2: This is where I started seeing the other side of Greg.

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Speaker 3: There was no slack. If I had a six month

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Speaker 3: bed run, I had.

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Speaker 2: To pay that juice. There's no missing payments to him.

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Speaker 2: He said, business is business. He loved nothing more than

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Speaker 2: his money. I started seeing it. I started getting privy

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Speaker 2: to hits. Starts out with beatings, people that didn't pay

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Speaker 2: bring them in the club. We'd go to work on

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Speaker 2: a guy, and you're always being watched. The first inkling

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Speaker 2: of me going over the line where beatings were being

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Speaker 2: given out. Once you justify the beatings, you go to

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Speaker 2: the next step. I knew there was an issue with

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Speaker 2: a member of our crew named Bucky. Bucky had done

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Speaker 2: something wrong based on what Greg told me, and they

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Speaker 2: had it straighten it out. I found out that day

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Speaker 2: through some talk in the club that Bucky wouldn't be

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Speaker 2: around anymore.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Bucky, poor guy got involved in drugs. Yeah, well

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Speaker 3: he should have known better.

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Speaker 2: Nobody in the family is condoning drug dealing from the

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Speaker 2: higher ups all the way down.

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Speaker 3: That's a death penalty.

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Speaker 2: I was around long enough to catch the drift of

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Speaker 2: what the conversations were here.

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Speaker 3: I am hearing a guy got killed.

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Speaker 2: And it's just normal conversation. It's like it's his fault,

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Speaker 2: nobody else's fault. So obviously I was uneasy, but I

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Speaker 2: wasn't there. I wasn't directly part of it, so it's

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Speaker 2: easy for me to say, oh.

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Speaker 3: I didn't do anything. And that was a test.

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Speaker 2: If I would go over to it and run in

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Speaker 2: the back and say, Greg, that's bucky things that you

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Speaker 2: shouldn't say. You don't talk about these things, loose lips,

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Speaker 2: sing chips. You listen and you don't talk. Greg one

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Speaker 2: day asked me to give a guy a flat tire.

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Speaker 2: But I do that for him, I said, of course, Greg.

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Speaker 2: I'm thinking in the back of my head the guy

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Speaker 2: must have talked in his spot or disrespected him in

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Speaker 2: some way. And you know, I think I did that once.

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Speaker 2: Somebody kept parking in my driveway, so I gave him

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Speaker 2: a flat Tara. I don't think I need to be

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Speaker 2: a gangster to do that. The next day, I come

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Speaker 2: to the club and there's the daily news on the

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Speaker 2: bar and some of the guys are looking through it.

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Speaker 2: I see one of the headlines, a man killed fixing flat.

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Speaker 2: Keep your mouth shut. Most people would never put themselves

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Speaker 2: in that position. And those are the things that went

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Speaker 2: through my head.

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Speaker 3: How am I here? Deep down I knew I was

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Speaker 3: part of that, but it was easy for me to say, well,

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Speaker 3: I wasn't there. I didn't do it. I didn't shoot him.

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Speaker 2: But later on I would learn I was as guilty

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Speaker 2: as the person that pulled the trigger. There's something called conspiracy.

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Speaker 2: The next step for me was literally going to the

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Speaker 2: hardware store and buying a shovel. I didn't think Greg

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Speaker 2: was taking up gardening, but I still knew to keep

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Speaker 2: my mouth shut. He tells me get two shovels and

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Speaker 2: take a ride with Greg Jr. We just had to

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Speaker 2: go dig a hole and make sure it's real deep.

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Speaker 2: Brought the shovel, put it in Greg Junior's car and

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Speaker 2: we take a ride way out of Staten Island and

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Speaker 2: we'd go into an area called Wolf's Pond off of

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Speaker 2: secluded dirt road is a lot of woods. There was

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Speaker 2: also a bird sanctuary that another local gangster use to

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Speaker 2: bury bodies. It was definitely starting to get dark. Within

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Speaker 2: fifteen to twenty minutes, it was pitch black. There was

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Speaker 2: a cold night. We were in leather jackets, dressed like

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Speaker 2: just coming from the club. I was sweating because it's

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Speaker 2: hard work and the ground was harder because it was cold.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'd never dug a hole or a crave

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Speaker 2: or anything before. Who was going to get hit is

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Speaker 2: the main thing on my mind. We were both wondering

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Speaker 2: who was going to be But again, you can't ask

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Speaker 2: that question. It took us hours and Gregory Jr. He

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Speaker 2: would make jokes and lighten up even the toughest of situations.

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Speaker 2: I can't wait to become the shooter because he doesn't

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Speaker 2: want to dig holes for the rest of his life.

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Speaker 3: I says, Oh, that would be easier.

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Speaker 2: Little by little, you sink, and I was sinking a

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Speaker 2: little further that night. Every time I did something, no

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Speaker 2: matter how small it was, whether we cracked the guy

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Speaker 2: around in the place, or I bought the shovel or

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Speaker 2: dug with that shovel, Linda was always beaming.

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Speaker 3: She was proud. I was the one that she brought along.

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Speaker 2: I was her personal thing, toy. She loved to tell

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Speaker 2: greg See, I told you he was a tough guy,

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Speaker 2: and I would feed off of that.

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Speaker 3: I gotta be honest.

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Speaker 2: When she would say that I was feeling really good,

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Speaker 2: greg would say things like I'm like a son to him,

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Speaker 2: which made it a whole new level of family. Him

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Speaker 2: now deep into the life, and it's way past ankles,

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Speaker 2: it's way past knees, because let's face.

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Speaker 3: It, I gave a guy a flat. He's dead.

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Speaker 2: I dug a grave. I know somebody's laying in that grave.

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Speaker 2: I still don't know who it is to this day

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Speaker 2: that's close to chest or neck deep because the next

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Speaker 2: time I'm going to probably have to watch.

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Speaker 3: Him shoot somebody.

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Speaker 2: So one day we're in the office at the back

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Speaker 2: of the club, Greg's office. That's where we run our

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Speaker 2: gambling in numbers from the day to day operations, and

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Speaker 2: Donnie's one of our number runners.

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Speaker 3: He comes walking in as usual. Donnie was a.

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Speaker 2: Big guy, a little heavy set, and he comes every

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Speaker 2: single day to the club to drop off the numbers.

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Speaker 2: Donnie came in the club. I was sitting at the desk.

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Speaker 2: Greg Junior was on the couch. Abby Zam was in there.

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Speaker 2: Kamene Cessu was in there, part of Greg's group, and

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Speaker 2: when he came in Donnie, I got up to let

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Speaker 2: Donnie sit down, and I went and stood by the door.

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Speaker 2: After Greg takes the money, counts it deliberately, he looks

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Speaker 2: up to Donnie and he says, hey, Donnie, what is this?

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Speaker 2: I hear I'm arett. Everyone just got quiet now in

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Speaker 2: this life. And Greg told me this once before. If

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Speaker 2: somebody calls you a RHT, you have the right to

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Speaker 2: kill them on the spot. They have to have proof,

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Speaker 2: they have to be one hundred certain to make a

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Speaker 2: statement like that, what is this I hear?

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Speaker 3: I'm Arett.

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Speaker 2: Donnie's face turned white. You could see him get clammy

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Speaker 2: and sweaty. I mean, his temperature must have really shot up.

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Speaker 2: And he tried to talk his way out of his says,

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Speaker 2: come on, I was drunk, just having some nonsense talk.

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Speaker 2: So Greg asked, if you don't have any proof? He says, no,

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Speaker 2: of course not. I'd never be able to prove something

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Speaker 2: like that. It's not true. Did you have no proof?

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 2: He reached into the drawer, pulled out a thirty eight

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Speaker 2: and shot him from about two feet away, right across

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Speaker 2: the desk. I was less than six feet away when

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Speaker 2: the gun blasted, blood, ghosts spraying around. We all sort

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Speaker 2: of turned away. I remember Calmine diving away from the door.

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Speaker 2: You know, nobody wants to get hit with a straight

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Speaker 2: bullet or anything. The guy just fell to the floor.

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Speaker 2: All of us were shocked because none of us knew

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Speaker 2: this was gonna happen. Greg walked from behind the desk

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Speaker 2: and he put one more behind his ear.

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Speaker 3: That's his trademark.

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Speaker 2: He told Bobby take a walk to the carpet store,

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Speaker 2: which was just a block away, order a carpet, rolled

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Speaker 2: this up and get it out of here. So we

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Speaker 2: literally rolled him up in the carpet, carried him out

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Speaker 2: in broad daylight, threw him in the trunk, and Carmine

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Speaker 2: drove off with him. Me and Bobby walked to the

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Speaker 2: carpet store and he picked out this weird orange color.

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Speaker 3: It was like a burnt orange.

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Speaker 2: We had like brown paneling on the walls, the ceiling

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Speaker 2: was probably a light cream color.

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Speaker 3: And the color did not match Greg's office at all.

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Speaker 2: We all just start laughing when we realized it doesn't

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Speaker 2: really match, and that was an issue.

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Speaker 3: Greg was upset about that. Bobby, what the fuck? What

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Speaker 3: color is this?

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Speaker 2: I mean rust? How does rust match with my office?

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Speaker 2: Bobby Zam is color blind and nobody knew it. You

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Speaker 2: think people would be more concerned with a stiff being

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Speaker 2: carried out and thrown in a trunk and broad daylight.

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Speaker 3: Greg could be so brazen.

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Speaker 2: A wrong colored carpet might have been a major irritation

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Speaker 2: to Greg, But in my mind, I just witnessed a

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Speaker 2: man being killed.

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Speaker 3: There turn him back.

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Speaker 2: I don't know in my own heart of heartswere head

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Speaker 2: what it is that really made me like him as

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Speaker 2: much as I cared for Greg, and as much as

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Speaker 2: I wanted to protect him, I understood that his nickname

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Speaker 2: was there for a reason. He'll take you to dinner

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Speaker 2: and for dessert, he'll kill you. There was no scruples,

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Speaker 2: there was no ethics. He wanted to get a grenade

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Speaker 2: launcher launched a grenade into one of the clubs that

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Speaker 2: we knew, we'll blow them all up. Our acting Moss

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Speaker 2: at the time said it's unethical. He had plans of

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Speaker 2: dressing his FBI agents. I remember asking him, we're going

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Speaker 2: to need licenses or you know, IDs and badges.

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Speaker 3: Tells me, don't worry. I can get.

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Speaker 2: Them beca This guy's a genius.

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Speaker 3: He can do it.

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Speaker 2: We get a message. Nicky Black sends a message to

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Speaker 2: my uncle Albert. He tells him he was gonna kill me.

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Speaker 2: Nicky Black was a longtime good fella, long time mate guy.

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Speaker 3: He was a scary guy. He had a scary look.

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Speaker 2: But being Greg's right hand man, the Grim Reapers right

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Speaker 2: hand man, I wasn't ready for fear. I wasn't ready

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Speaker 2: to be worried about him. I know he'll kill me

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Speaker 2: if he gets a chance. There's no doubt about it.

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Speaker 2: My main thing was we got to get him first.

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Speaker 2: Right around Christmas time. We're driving past Nicky's Club. I

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Speaker 2: had my binoculars. I was looking down the street and

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Speaker 2: I spotted him. That's Nicky Struck. There's Nicky, and Greg

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Speaker 2: just said, let's get him. It was like a kid

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Speaker 2: who found his lost dorg. I had a baseball hat on,

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Speaker 2: sunglasses and a bandanna. Greg had a baseball hat and sunglasses.

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Speaker 2: Jimmy had a baseball hat and sunglasses, so we were

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Speaker 2: sort of looking like cops. Greg had his rifle. I

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Speaker 2: was in the back with a shotgun. I was a

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Speaker 2: backup shooter. Thank god I was ready.

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Speaker 3: So we started inching up Nikki.

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Speaker 2: He takes off, he doesn't see us. We miss him

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Speaker 2: at the light. He makes the left. We follow, he

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Speaker 2: makes another left. He's heading back in the same direction

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Speaker 2: he came from where. Right behind him, he pulls over.

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Speaker 2: We had a siren, coffee cups in the window, so

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Speaker 2: we were looking like cops doing surveillance. As we pull up,

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Speaker 2: you adrenalines going, You feel those butterflies in your stomach.

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Speaker 3: Things going in slow motion.

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Speaker 2: And Greg's going and grabs rifle and I hear him

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Speaker 2: fumbling over himself. He hits the room button. Instead of

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Speaker 2: hitting the safety, he hits the bullet clip. I hear

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Speaker 2: the bullets come falling out, and he had no bullets.

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Speaker 2: Now I was the main shooter. I leaned out the window.

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Speaker 2: None of them budged. As we pulled up alongside. I

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Speaker 2: put the shotgun probably three inches right behind his head,

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Speaker 2: behind his ear. He stiffens up and I pulled the trigger.

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Speaker 2: His nose did the windshield. His nephew, Joe Joe t

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Speaker 2: D called him, was in the passenger seat. Got hit

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Speaker 2: with a couple of pellets. I heard him screaming. The

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Speaker 2: neighbors heard the screams from miles away. We were driving

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Speaker 2: away and I still heard him screaming. I could still

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Speaker 2: hear that scream. And you become a trigger man. There

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Speaker 2: is a big difference, and I felt it. I felt

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Speaker 2: now that I was the powerful force Greg was, and

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Speaker 2: Greg had a way of projecting that pride, that good

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Speaker 2: job thing. He would come over, grab my hand in

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Speaker 2: a hearty shake, pulled.

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Speaker 3: Me close and give me a kiss on the cheek

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Speaker 3: like he was something sacred that just happened.

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Speaker 2: After this monumental hit, Jimmy and I have to get

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Speaker 2: to his house to babysit his daughter. The wife was

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Speaker 2: a little upset that we got there late, and the

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Speaker 2: first thing we'd do is pour two scotches and put

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Speaker 2: on Seinfeldt.

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Speaker 3: We were hysterical watching Jerry run down the street.

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Speaker 2: It was too much and I'll never forget the laughing

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Speaker 2: with that bread under his arm. We would drive him

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Speaker 2: back to Greg's house and we passed the scene and

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Speaker 2: it was like a dream. Thousands of people the whole neighborhood,

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Speaker 2: they all know Nicky Black. And I remember a group

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Speaker 2: of kids standing on the corner watching this whole thing unravel.

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Speaker 2: And I opened the window and I said, Hey, what's

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Speaker 2: going on? And the kids look at me, so, oh

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Speaker 2: my god, somebody killed Nicky Black.

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Speaker 3: And I said, no, kidd in. I shut the window.

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Speaker 2: I saw my face a reflection, and in that split

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Speaker 2: couple of seconds, I remember thinking to myself, how did

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Speaker 2: I go from a young, innocent, well brought up teenager

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Speaker 2: to cold blooded assassin?

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Speaker 3: But I was safe.

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Speaker 2: Being the shooter made me safe. No longer was Ida hunted.

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Speaker 2: Now I've become the hunter. But I also realized to

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Speaker 2: take a life is the ultimate bad deed.

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Speaker 3: But when you're in that life. It's a fine line.

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Speaker 3: That is the question, and that is my regret that

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Speaker 3: I allowed myself to get into that life. And you know,

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Speaker 3: if you believe in God, I do, and try to

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Speaker 3: talk to him. Where did I go wrong? It does

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Speaker 3: make me emotional because.

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Speaker 2: There are two Larriyes, the one before I got into

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Speaker 2: mob life and the one who could talk cold hearted

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Speaker 2: about doing some very bad things. I could never completely

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Speaker 2: forgive myself, and it'll be a lifelong battle.

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Speaker 1: Larry served ten years in prison for killing four people.

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Speaker 1: He received a light sentence because he cooperated.

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Speaker 3: Yep, Larry was a rat.

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Speaker 1: Why well, like everything else in his criminal career, he

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Speaker 1: followed in the Grim Reaper's footsteps. The Grim Reaper had

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Speaker 1: been an informant for the FBI for decades. Once Larry

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Speaker 1: learned that, he figured he could inform too. Who did

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Speaker 1: Larry testify against? That's right, his mob daddy, the Grim Reaper.

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Speaker 1: For more on Larry's story, read his book The Life,

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Speaker 1: a true story about a Brooklyn boy subduced into the

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Speaker 1: dark world of the mafia. The creator and host of

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00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 1: Lives of Crime is Steve Fishman. Executive producers Steve Fishman

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Speaker 1: and Kevin Wadis, Senior producer Simon Rettner, producer and engineer

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00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:09,080
Speaker 1: Austin Smith, story editor Dan Bob Koff, Our sound designer

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00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 1: is Bianca Salinas, Assistant producer Eric Axelrod. Special thanks to

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00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 1: the inimitable Fisher Stevens, The Glamours, Ria Julian and our

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00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 1: agents at WM Evan Crasseik, Marissa Hurwitz, Ben Davis. Lives

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Speaker 1: of Crime is a production of Orbit Media in association

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00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:38,959
Speaker 1: with Signal Company Number One. Follow us at ORBITMDIA FM,

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00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: on Instagram, TikTok and YouTube