Speaker 1: When you're on the field, kill the other dude. When
Speaker 1: you're not on the field, you don't have to.
Speaker 2: Kill the other dude.
Speaker 1: But when you're on the field you want to win.
Speaker 1: You just have to realize when you're not on the field.
Speaker 1: The problem is I think people don't realize when they're not.
Speaker 2: On the field. The best selling are there on the Post,
Speaker 2: the number one health and wellness podcast and Purpose with
Speaker 2: Jay Shetty. Hey everyone, welcome back to On Purpose, the
Speaker 2: number one health podcast in the world. Thanks to each
Speaker 2: and every one of you that come back every week
Speaker 2: to listen, learn and grow. Now you know that I'm
Speaker 2: fascinated about speaking to people from different backgrounds, different walks
Speaker 2: of life, people who've made interesting choices, decisions, had life
Speaker 2: events that have changed the trajectory of their journey, and
Speaker 2: I like diving into the insights that they have, the
Speaker 2: wisdom that they have, some of the mistakes and failures
Speaker 2: that came along the way as well. And today's guest
Speaker 2: is one of those individuals. I'm talking about, the one
Speaker 2: and only Aril Emmanuel, chief executive officer of Endeavor, a
Speaker 2: global sports and entertainment company home to many of the
Speaker 2: world's most dynamic and engaging stories, including me brands, live events,
Speaker 2: and experiences. The company is composed of industry leaders, including
Speaker 2: entertainment agency, Sports, fashion, events and media company IMG and
Speaker 2: premier Mixed Martial Arts organization UFC. In two thousand and nine,
Speaker 2: Ariel orchestrated the largest talent agency merger in history when Endeavor,
Speaker 2: the agency he founded in nineteen ninety five, joined forces
Speaker 2: with agency William Morris to form WME. Now we're about
Speaker 2: to dive into his story. He doesn't do a lot
Speaker 2: of podcasts. We're very lucky. Please welcome to the show
Speaker 2: and on purpose. Ariel Emmanuel ari thank you for being here,
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. Yeah, you've had quite the
Speaker 2: journey and or we're just talking about it.
Speaker 1: When I was in the mailroom, you know, they're the
Speaker 1: Thomas Guide fifteen cents a mile.
Speaker 2: I was figuring out because your highest is.
Speaker 1: And maybe we don't want to let people know where
Speaker 1: it is way up in the hills. I would have
Speaker 1: never been able to get here using a Thomas Guide.
Speaker 1: Thank god, there's you know, ways and Tesla their system.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I wondered what that was like. When you
Speaker 2: were like meeting clients, You're like it was horrible. It
Speaker 2: wasn't horrible.
Speaker 1: Actually you realize how to get around. It was a
Speaker 1: great experience that, oh so if I'm booking, if I'm
Speaker 1: going to be in the valley and I have that
Speaker 1: thing that it does take forty five minutes to get there,
Speaker 1: so once you kind of it was actually the right steps.
Speaker 1: And a lot of people went through the mail.
Speaker 2: Whether it be very Diller, David Geff and Mike Go.
Speaker 1: I mean, everybody did it, and I would have never
Speaker 1: been able to get here though using the Thomas Guide.
Speaker 2: That's good, That's that's aging me saying the Thomas Guide. Well, no,
Speaker 2: I remember my parents. We used to drive to Europe
Speaker 2: because my parents couldn't always afford to fly, and so
Speaker 2: we'd have the A to Z in England, which is
Speaker 2: like this big map, A to Z big map that
Speaker 2: they'd pull out and then track it across like physical map,
Speaker 2: and then we'd have one for Europe, one for like
Speaker 2: Crazons in Switzerland, and so we'd drive over and I'd
Speaker 2: see my parents like pull over and oscar instructions. It
Speaker 2: was it was a different world. And you've watched that,
Speaker 2: and I mean, you're still looking credit for I'm like
Speaker 2: I'm like when yeah, you haven't aged yourself at all,
Speaker 2: But when I think about how much times have changed, Like,
Speaker 2: what is if you could say that these are the
Speaker 2: couple of the biggest changes you've seen in the last
Speaker 2: three decades in this industry, in the world that you're
Speaker 2: most astounded by, because I think we're getting used to change.
Speaker 2: I think, for I didn't grow up with a phone,
Speaker 2: Like I got my first phone when I was thirteen
Speaker 2: or fourteen, and it was a Sony Ericsson like brick
Speaker 2: with a little antenna. Yeah, the flip phone. Yeah, it
Speaker 2: was one of those. Yeah, one of those old flip
Speaker 2: phones Sony Ericson had a little you know, antenor on
Speaker 2: top of it. My mom had one of the big,
Speaker 2: like chunky brick style phones. But I feel like we're
Speaker 2: getting so used to change, being so rapid that we
Speaker 2: actually don't spot patterns. If you've spotted any patterns over
Speaker 2: the last three decades, what would you say they are?
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's patterns, you know, but I
Speaker 1: think you have to look at them in different sectors,
Speaker 1: whether it be tech, whether it be the entertainment business.
Speaker 1: The one pattern I do see changes happening a lot faster.
Speaker 1: So the pick up the phone probably took seven years.
Speaker 1: The speed of adaptation, the one big change, it's just
Speaker 1: now happening very quickly, and that just lets people you
Speaker 1: better be really comfortable in the uncomfortable and change. And
Speaker 1: that's a mindset, that's a process to get to. That's
Speaker 1: what you have to realize. It's happen and all this
Speaker 1: is going to happen a lot quicker now, which is
Speaker 1: I don't think it's good or bad, it just is
Speaker 1: what it is.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love what you just said there. So my
Speaker 2: entire show I just went on a world tour, and
Speaker 2: the entire show was based on the premise of getting
Speaker 2: the audience to sit in discomfort. So I would literally
Speaker 2: bring up random audience members and one of them was
Speaker 2: locked in a box on stage for fifteen minutes alone
Speaker 2: without any sound. We had other audience members come up
Speaker 2: and have to do toss the uncomfortable. I love the
Speaker 2: idea of getting comfort. You better breathe through it. You
Speaker 2: better breathe through that's the only way to do it.
Speaker 2: I was going to ask you, like, how have you
Speaker 2: trained your mind to be comfortable with discomfort?
Speaker 1: I'm not sure any of us are really comfortable with
Speaker 1: ourselves as we mature and kind of get.
Speaker 2: Into I said this to a client today.
Speaker 1: I said, there was a period of time I just
Speaker 1: didn't want anybody to find out that I really wasn't
Speaker 1: that bright, and it was you know, I was scared, right,
Speaker 1: And that I think goes back to my childhood and
Speaker 1: being dyslexic and not believing that you know, I'm okay,
Speaker 1: I'm not stupid. Right in my family, stupid was the
Speaker 1: definition and smart with them. But I started fasting, and
Speaker 1: once you start doing.
Speaker 2: It, it's not comfortable.
Speaker 1: And I just started telling, you know, start that little voice. No,
Speaker 1: I'm not giving a hand to that little voice. No,
Speaker 1: I'm getting up, even though I don't want to get up.
Speaker 1: And then it's that conversation you're constantly Is that, somebody said,
Speaker 1: my constant negotiation with myself.
Speaker 2: And now it's.
Speaker 1: If I meditate for twenty minutes every day, it's not
Speaker 1: easy sitting there for twenty minutes your toe, which is
Speaker 1: something you got to get through it. And it's just oh,
Speaker 1: I'm going to do a cold bath for five minutes
Speaker 1: every day. That's not fun, and it's just teaching your body. No,
Speaker 1: you can get through this. I'm not listening to that voice.
Speaker 1: I'm just breathing through it. I'm just getting through it.
Speaker 2: And it's been probably fifteen years of that.
Speaker 1: And it translates into business because then, okay, we're taking
Speaker 1: over IMG. I'm going to move to London for four months.
Speaker 1: Kids in the family is going to be on the
Speaker 1: East Coast for the summer, and it's going to be brutal,
Speaker 1: and yeah, you can do it, or at the UF
Speaker 1: any of these new tasks that you take on because
Speaker 1: you're telling yourself a story that whether it's going to
Speaker 1: be good or bad, that's not the truth. You have
Speaker 1: to just realize that thing's not the truth and you
Speaker 1: just have to go through it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not going to be easy. So what who cares? Like, Yes,
Speaker 2: that's part of the process.
Speaker 1: That's actually part of the interesting thing that we're all doing.
Speaker 1: So yeah, no, I love that because it did start
Speaker 1: though with not eating.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Interesting, you know the when I started learning about what
Speaker 1: fasting does or eating windows do to your body and
Speaker 1: autophagy and et cetera, et cetera, that then got your mind, Okay,
Speaker 1: I can do this, and then you just start building
Speaker 1: on that. I probably passed the point of health emotionally healthy.
Speaker 2: But yes, I'm way past it. But yeah, no, but
Speaker 2: I love that because that's super practical, right, Like, that's
Speaker 2: not an ethereal concept. The idea is you were able
Speaker 2: to put yourself through things that you didn't want to do, no,
Speaker 2: but that were actually good for you. And I find
Speaker 2: that that's why I hope yeah. Yeah, but the idea
Speaker 2: that most of what we don't want to do, that
Speaker 2: we choose to do is actually what helps us get
Speaker 2: ahead in life.
Speaker 1: I say said this to my kids. You know, success
Speaker 1: is a lot of the things we're talking about. One
Speaker 1: of it is and that goes to kind of putting
Speaker 1: yourself showing up. Like there's a voice saying, you mean,
Speaker 1: I gotta get on that plane for sixteen hours, I
Speaker 1: gotta just go have a lunch and I gotta fly
Speaker 1: back from China.
Speaker 2: I don't want to do that.
Speaker 1: Okay, it said, I don't want to do it, that
Speaker 1: little voice, I'm doing it, and learning to say, oh
Speaker 1: that's the voice. No, I'm getting on the plane and
Speaker 1: showing up kind of going through it. Yeah, that's that's
Speaker 1: part of growing up and being successful. A lot of
Speaker 1: people are too lazy to fight that voice. And over time,
Speaker 1: when you get older, and I'm a lot older than you,
Speaker 1: you don't.
Speaker 2: Want to fight the voice. And all the things I
Speaker 2: do now is I think because as you get older,
Speaker 2: that voice takes over more and more. It's easy, you know,
Speaker 2: don't get up at five o'clock and work out. No,
Speaker 2: don't do this, and I do it. I don't care.
Speaker 2: As soon as soon as that voice turns on, I'm
Speaker 2: doing this. Yeah, it's really interesting you say that, because
Speaker 2: I feel like a lot of people say they can't
Speaker 2: hear they're in a voice, and it's because that in
Speaker 2: a voice they're just not listening. It was so loud
Speaker 2: when we were younger, yes, but it gets quieter and
Speaker 2: quieter and quiet because the other voice. We kept listening
Speaker 2: to it, and it got louder and louder and louder,
Speaker 2: and so now we're having to unlearn that loud voice.
Speaker 1: And for me, it was for me, it started with
Speaker 1: fasting periods. You know, I do twenty four and I
Speaker 1: do sixteen, and sometimes of forty eight or sixty. And
Speaker 1: it's then kind of evolved into multiple things to keep
Speaker 1: it exercised that I cannot listen to the voice.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And you need friends who pushed you
Speaker 2: to I remember a few years ago, you know, whether
Speaker 2: it was skydiving or whether it was cold plunges. As
Speaker 2: you mentioned there, it's like you need to be surrounded
Speaker 2: by a community. I just literally, I've got some friends
Speaker 2: from London staying with me right now this week, and
Speaker 2: I took them to do a cold plunge with me.
Speaker 2: You know, every day we've been doing a hike. Every morning,
Speaker 2: we've been doing infrared so ona and they don't do that.
Speaker 2: They don't do that, They've never done it before, and
Speaker 2: it was just interesting they do on their cold plunch
Speaker 2: they did really well, and they were saying that because
Speaker 2: we were I was like trying to coax them through
Speaker 2: it and helping them breathe. So on their first time
Speaker 2: they did the first one. One of them did four
Speaker 2: minutes and they had did three on their first time. Incredible.
Speaker 2: It was amazing after get past the first minute exactly exactly.
Speaker 2: So it was a brilliant result. But it was that
Speaker 2: idea of your community of people around you when you
Speaker 2: were I love what you just said there that you
Speaker 2: were scared at one point in your life of being
Speaker 2: figured out as not being so smart. And you said
Speaker 2: that came from your childhood and yeah, you had ADHD dyslexia.
Speaker 2: From what I've researched, walk me through how that idea
Speaker 2: stays even after you're starting to see success, because I
Speaker 2: think people believe that when you become successful, when you
Speaker 2: close your big deal, when you build a company, that
Speaker 2: some of that goes away. You know. Arnold Schwarzenegger. Did
Speaker 2: you see that documentary, which one the most recent one
Speaker 2: that he did, just about him kind of growing up
Speaker 2: in bodybuilding. I don't think so, I don't see this.
Speaker 2: So he talks about, you know, he won mister Olympia
Speaker 2: and everybody was telling him how great his body was, right,
Speaker 2: and they're all looking at like, oh my god.
Speaker 1: In his head he was saying this is wrong. That's wrong,
Speaker 1: this is wrong. And you're like, nobody would have said
Speaker 1: that to me. You know, some people say it's your
Speaker 1: in a voice, your shadow. My shrink used to tell
Speaker 1: me it's your shadow. Maybe people were thinking I was successful.
Speaker 1: I was thinking about that kid that couldn't read and
Speaker 1: that during passover didn't want to read the questions because
Speaker 1: because I was the youngest and going into this sewing.
Speaker 1: That's why I hate pass over now, the anxiety I
Speaker 1: had when I was a kid, and so it's just
Speaker 1: kind of upbringing. I'm no longer dealing with those issues.
Speaker 1: It's not like I'm beating my chest all. I'm successful,
Speaker 1: but I'm comfortable. And it's that and a good way
Speaker 1: drove me like I'm going to.
Speaker 2: Prove everybody wrong. And you know, any bully comes up
Speaker 2: to me, Yep, we're going to get in a fight.
Speaker 2: Anybody calls me stupid, Yep, we're going to get in
Speaker 2: a fight. Physic You know, that's when I was young,
Speaker 2: and it's just held over and then there's the point
Speaker 2: in time where you're saying, Okay, I'm not doing this anymore.
Speaker 2: I have to deal with these crazy, stupid fellows.
Speaker 1: Yes you're successful, Yes it's okay, nothing's being taken away
Speaker 1: from you. And so that just came with age.
Speaker 2: A lot of shrinks and a lot of other therapies
Speaker 2: that we'll get into later. Yeah, but I think it's
Speaker 2: really important because I think there's two things there. One
Speaker 2: is that it doesn't go away on its own. No,
Speaker 2: revenge is not the solution or proving someone kind of
Speaker 2: I would say a good way to stop revenge. And
Speaker 2: I would say anger got you to a certain point.
Speaker 2: You after you get to a certain point. If you
Speaker 2: stay with anger and resentment and fear, you only can
Speaker 2: get to a certain point in your life.
Speaker 1: And once you make the transition that you know something
Speaker 1: that's never going to get me over the hump and
Speaker 1: you have to go a little deeper. And that's scary
Speaker 1: and takes work.
Speaker 2: When you know, when you sit and yoga, I don't
Speaker 2: know what it is, it just opens up things to
Speaker 2: come to you and the process to come to you.
Speaker 2: And that's what happened at you know, I don't know
Speaker 2: when it really happened, probably twelve fifteen years ago that
Speaker 2: I was on this journey to kind of find out
Speaker 2: I don't want to be that guy that's somebody says
Speaker 2: something I go to Code red nine. That's not healthy.
Speaker 2: That's way too much energy. Yeah, it's emotional energy that
Speaker 2: you know is exhausting, absolutely, and that's what it is.
Speaker 2: It's exhausting, it's draining, and it takes away from that
Speaker 2: creative energy, the spark that's I let things in that
Speaker 2: actually need to come in.
Speaker 1: That then you can see the world differently and like
Speaker 1: wait a second, Like you're not saying it through those eyes,
Speaker 1: you're seeing it.
Speaker 2: Through a different like way. What about this? What about
Speaker 2: that you can be creative? That's a better place to be. Yeah, yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you as well. I mean you
Speaker 2: probably get usd this all the time, but I think
Speaker 2: it's important contact setting for everyone who's listening. The idea
Speaker 2: of like sitting in the discomfort as you were talking
Speaker 2: about it. My wife and I huge entourage fans, and
Speaker 2: I can imagine that it's cool but uncomfortable to have
Speaker 2: your image displayed it a certain way that has pros
Speaker 2: and cons. And there was and there was aspects of
Speaker 2: that character one hundred percentro which but you know, I
Speaker 2: was very aggressive and you know when we started the business,
Speaker 2: we couldn't compete on price because commissions were commissions. There
Speaker 2: was five other big players and we just had a
Speaker 2: one be more creative, two more aggressive.
Speaker 1: And uh and fight. So yeah, that was true to form.
Speaker 1: I mean not all of it, but in the surrounding it. Yes,
Speaker 1: I don't know what entourage would be now that character.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So yeah, and what what was stuff for you?
Speaker 2: Like that's definitely not me? Like, were there anything no
Speaker 2: TV candidate. That show gave me anxiety. Yeah, I can,
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: It gave me a lot of So I didn't watch
Speaker 1: a lot and people now watch it.
Speaker 2: I mean, during we watched the pandemic.
Speaker 1: I got a lot of calls from guys I know
Speaker 1: that had kids, and the kids started watching kids and
Speaker 1: college started watching, and I was like, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't see that episode.
Speaker 1: You know, I did watch the episode, which I never did.
Speaker 1: I think he started using squirt gun on people. I
Speaker 1: didn't see that.
Speaker 2: I mean, I did see that, but I didn't do that.
Speaker 2: It's good to know you didn't use That's important. How
Speaker 2: have you harnessed or how has your aggression matured in business?
Speaker 2: Because the reason why I raised that is because I think,
Speaker 2: you know, we kind of swinging pendulums in the world.
Speaker 2: So if you think about business back then and how
Speaker 2: we viewed Wall Street, and even when I was growing up,
Speaker 2: like the dream was to be an investment bank, and
Speaker 2: that's what everyone was becoming in London and that was
Speaker 2: the big goal when I was a kid, And did
Speaker 2: you want to become one? I wanted to become one
Speaker 2: without knowing what it was. Yeah, right, like, you know,
Speaker 2: that's what happens. And I went to cast Business School
Speaker 2: and did management science, and I was training to go
Speaker 2: off into the corporate world because that's what I thought
Speaker 2: you had to.
Speaker 1: Don't you remember when you were growing up, the objective
Speaker 1: was how big the stack was? Yes, I never had
Speaker 1: that objective, they're saying, for whatever reason my parents didn't.
Speaker 2: That was not.
Speaker 1: The objective was to do well in the world and
Speaker 1: make the world a better place. All absolutely, and I
Speaker 1: think allow of my friends that was how big.
Speaker 2: Is the stack? Totally same for me. I didn't grow
Speaker 2: up with a lot. My parents didn't have a lot,
Speaker 2: but they always gave in charity, They helped the community.
Speaker 2: My mom did a ton of community work. And then
Speaker 2: I obviously met monks when I was eighteen years old,
Speaker 2: so like that became my paradigm shifted massively, and I
Speaker 2: was always far more creative than anything else, and that's
Speaker 2: what I enjoyed. But I guess the question I'm asking is,
Speaker 2: I think we've gone from that very aggressive, very competitive, brash,
Speaker 2: harsh energy and then we swing to this pendulum where
Speaker 2: everyone's like, well, no, you just got to be fully like,
Speaker 2: empathetic and vulnerable and compassion. I'm like, so how do
Speaker 2: you Yes, So here's what it is. What is the
Speaker 2: middle ground balance? Because the ance is always somebody.
Speaker 1: Here's somebody, a really smart person. I won't say who
Speaker 1: told me.
Speaker 2: You have to know.
Speaker 1: And this only comes with time and maturity. When you're
Speaker 1: on the field. When you're on the field, kill the
Speaker 1: other dude. When you're not on the field, you don't have.
Speaker 2: To kill the other dude for you.
Speaker 1: It's got to be a good deal for me, it's
Speaker 1: got to be a good deal, et cetera. But when
Speaker 1: you're on the field, you want to win. You just
Speaker 1: have to realize when you're not on the field. The
Speaker 1: problem is I think people don't realize when they're not
Speaker 1: on the field. And that has come over time. Like
Speaker 1: when am I on the field, Okay, when I'm on
Speaker 1: the field, I'm playing to win. When I'm not on
Speaker 1: the field, I can be in a different mindset. That
Speaker 1: shift for me going to fear Anger. I always thought
Speaker 1: I was on the field and for a long time
Speaker 1: to get the company where I wanted, I was always
Speaker 1: on the field.
Speaker 2: Now I don't have to.
Speaker 1: Be on the field all the time, and that not
Speaker 1: being on the field enables you to think properly and
Speaker 1: just let things in and grow.
Speaker 2: That gets you to other things that.
Speaker 1: Al sudden affect the field in a different way. You
Speaker 1: have different moves. It's probably how great players as they
Speaker 1: get older, Lebron James, Michael Jordan, their bodies are not
Speaker 1: the same, but they're better players because they just know
Speaker 1: how to do it differently. So when I'm not on
Speaker 1: the field, I'm not on the field. When I'm on
Speaker 1: the field, I'm playing pretty hard.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really unique inside. I like that because
Speaker 2: I feel like that's also what challenges people in their
Speaker 2: personal relationships, because not only have people not on and
Speaker 2: off the field in business, they don't know how to
Speaker 2: switch it off when they go home, and so your
Speaker 2: wife and your kids, or your husband or your partner
Speaker 2: or whoever it may be, ends up getting that same
Speaker 2: treatment as you do at work because you haven't reached
Speaker 2: that maturity level of knowing how to And it's not
Speaker 2: as easy as a light switch. Oh no, Like it's
Speaker 2: not just oh I'm work off work hat on. It
Speaker 2: doesn't work like that. And your partner, depending on what
Speaker 2: they do, you might be off the field, they might
Speaker 2: be on. They want to be on the field because
Speaker 2: they're going through their things. It's just like, that's what
Speaker 2: it is. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, we just I just
Speaker 2: got back from tour and we went to Bali for
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks just to relax with me and
Speaker 2: my wife. And it's so funny because she's she's a
Speaker 2: vegan chef and recipe developer and incredible w knows everything
Speaker 2: about irada and herbs and nutrition and she's made me
Speaker 2: very healthy compared to what I used to be. But
Speaker 2: she's on the field right now because her career is booming.
Speaker 2: She's doing incredibly well and it's so fun to watch.
Speaker 2: And it's so funny because I was like, yeah, we're
Speaker 2: going to Barley. She's like, you know what, I think
Speaker 2: we're going there for a bit long. And I was
Speaker 2: like that was me, Like I used to say that
Speaker 2: like five years ago. And so it's just like, Okay,
Speaker 2: it's not only your life. Yeah, you have two people
Speaker 2: and you just have to navigate. Oh, I'm not gonna
Speaker 2: feel shit. Okay, I got to think about this. Maybe
Speaker 2: even though I want to be there three weeks, maybe
Speaker 2: it's only a week and a half. Yeah, yeah, and
Speaker 2: I'll just be off the field. Here, I'll figure out
Speaker 2: what to do. Yeah, yeah, And I think it's hard
Speaker 2: because I think, yeah, we struggle when you've done for
Speaker 2: other people too, when you've said things when you're on
Speaker 2: the field. It's hard for the person, especially in business
Speaker 2: for now, to view you differently when you're off the field.
Speaker 2: It's every marriage, every relationship, every personal situation changes after
Speaker 2: ten years I was, I'm not the same person.
Speaker 1: I was from ninety five to two thousand and five.
Speaker 1: I'm not the same person from two thousand and five
Speaker 1: to twenty fifteen. I'm definitely not the same person from
Speaker 1: fifteen now. And yeah, people's viewpoints of me is probably
Speaker 1: what it was in ninety seven ninety eight night. And
Speaker 1: let me just say something that guy was not. I mean,
Speaker 1: he was a good guy, but he was always on
Speaker 1: the field and he was a shame nervous, angry fighter.
Speaker 1: Not that I'm not aspects of those things, working on them,
Speaker 1: but yeah, yeah, that changes.
Speaker 2: It's and when they come into your relationship, they have
Speaker 2: all this now, they can read everything, see everything and like, oh,
Speaker 2: that's the guy, yeah or not. That's why I'm doing this, dude.
Speaker 2: I'm just a gentle, nice hugging. Well, no, I I
Speaker 2: the reason why I always enjoy these conversations is because
Speaker 2: I think I struggle with that in perception too, where
Speaker 2: I feel people believe that someone who is mindful or
Speaker 2: meditative has to be a certain way at all times.
Speaker 2: Do you know when you're on the field. Yeah, absolutely, Yeah.
Speaker 2: And that's why I love that piece of advice is
Speaker 2: that you you said it in a way that I
Speaker 2: think makes it so easy to think about. And that's
Speaker 2: why I really appreciate it. And that's exactly what it
Speaker 2: is for me, Like, and my team knows that they
Speaker 2: can see that when I'm in the zone and I'm
Speaker 2: not or where I'm winning my home kid or away
Speaker 2: kit like however you put it, Like, yes, I totally
Speaker 2: like that kid. Yeah howay JZ right, Like and I
Speaker 2: can feel that and I think that you have to
Speaker 2: know that. But I think the idea is that we
Speaker 2: like to simplify people because it makes it easier.
Speaker 1: For us if you're going after the stack and that's
Speaker 1: the goal, right, which is like crazy, Like I agree,
Speaker 1: it's so arbitrary, the stack. You're always on the field.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: What you don't realize is you can be happy at
Speaker 1: whatever the level.
Speaker 2: Of the stack is. Yeah, there's just a different way to
Speaker 2: think about it, and you will get to a very
Speaker 2: big stack by figuring out this first. If when you're
Speaker 2: on the field, when you're off the field, absolutely, and
Speaker 2: I think that's the difference. I wanted to ask you
Speaker 2: the difference in success and happiness or success and contentment,
Speaker 2: because you've it sounds like you've worked on both and
Speaker 2: tried to be conscious of both. How have you seen
Speaker 2: the difference and how do you work on I was.
Speaker 1: Never content before probably the first twenty years of business.
Speaker 1: I mean I was just I was going to prove
Speaker 1: everybody wrong. I was going to prove to myself I
Speaker 1: wasn't stupid, and I was just running hard. When I
Speaker 1: say this word, that doesn't mean that I'm not in business.
Speaker 1: I'm content and all the things I thought about that
Speaker 1: I wanted to accomplish and how I saw the world
Speaker 1: kind of played out. I'm a really lucky guy. I'm
Speaker 1: comfortable that I'm not stupid, and I got a lot
Speaker 1: more I want to accomplish because I want to accomplish it,
Speaker 1: not to get the stack any bigger, and I'm happy
Speaker 1: doing that. That's a completely different place from the first
Speaker 1: twenty years where I had no idea.
Speaker 2: I just.
Speaker 1: I thought about the stack and what success was in
Speaker 1: such a different way than I think about it now.
Speaker 2: And do you think everyone there's that brilliant quote from
Speaker 2: Jim Carrey where he said that everyone should become rich
Speaker 2: and famous and achieve everything they ever wanted, just to
Speaker 2: realize that it's not the point. Do you think that
Speaker 2: there was some I had that Yeah, yeah, that's genius. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I love that statement because I feel like this there's
Speaker 2: something about pursuing success as you see it, which may
Speaker 2: not be a perfect definition, experiencing some success then going wall,
Speaker 2: wait a minute, this wasn't it. And I feel like,
Speaker 2: because you always hear successful people say oh it isn't there,
Speaker 2: but it's almost like I think, oh, I'm happy where
Speaker 2: I am. Yeah, I'm really I'm so glad that it
Speaker 2: played out. Those statements are actually accurate, you know, like
Speaker 2: it's enabled me now to kind of when I started
Speaker 2: this twelve years or whatever, yeah, to get to this place.
Speaker 2: I'm not sure I would have ever gotten to it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: with a different mindset. Yeah. Yeah. And in ninety five
Speaker 2: you had a big accident, right like there was something
Speaker 2: that it was ninety It was ninety three, ninety three.
Speaker 1: I was working at ICM. There was a breakfast place
Speaker 1: called Cape Mandalini's. It was walking down Whilsher. It was
Speaker 1: about three blocks away coming back, and I and just
Speaker 1: sitting on the curb. I said to myself, I was
Speaker 1: going to the breakfast, like, wow, you know I got
Speaker 1: to move back from this curve.
Speaker 2: These cars could hit you. And I was not in
Speaker 2: the street.
Speaker 1: Cut to I'm walking back from breakfast in the crosswalk
Speaker 1: right outside of where the ICM building was, and a
Speaker 1: flatbed truck didn't see me, took a left on to
Speaker 1: Wilshire hit my left side. Nine o'clock in the morning, Friday.
Speaker 1: Guess what happens? Your life changes you like life not
Speaker 1: address rehearsal.
Speaker 2: I was laying in there.
Speaker 1: I just wiggled my fingers and toes, I said, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm not crippled, kind of. I was outside my body screaming.
Speaker 1: I was laying there watching myself scream, and then I
Speaker 1: just set myself Life's not address rehearsal. I did a
Speaker 1: rehab because I couldn't bend my leg, and then I
Speaker 1: did a surgery on my leg. And then I did
Speaker 1: another rehab, so that was eighteen months of hell. And
Speaker 1: then I said what do you want to do? And
Speaker 1: I definitely didn't want to be at ICM.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Was what was the phrase I used to hear when
Speaker 1: I was at ICM back and anything. It was like
Speaker 1: I cover myself. That's what it stood for.
Speaker 2: So there was.
Speaker 1: No camaraderie culture or anything.
Speaker 2: And so.
Speaker 1: Me and three other guys decided to start when I
Speaker 1: could be healthy, and we kind of get it in
Speaker 1: ninety five, on my birthday March twenty ninth, we let
Speaker 1: loose so and that that was the catalyst to say,
Speaker 1: why it's not a dress rehearsal you but to get
Speaker 1: to what you want to get to. And that kind
Speaker 1: of thesis is at the twenty year mark, change in
Speaker 1: how I look at life? And am I still going
Speaker 1: to be that angry guy? And you know all the
Speaker 1: different routes we all taken our lives to get to
Speaker 1: where the end is.
Speaker 2: So, yeah, did you try and change aspects of the
Speaker 2: coach based on that statement that you built or did
Speaker 2: you find that I.
Speaker 1: Just wanted to treat people well, you know inside and
Speaker 1: share clients and communicate better and there's a guy named
Speaker 1: Phil Raskin the first employee, and they fired him. In
Speaker 1: the Israeli Army. You don't let anybody stay, you know,
Speaker 1: you take you go, get the bodies.
Speaker 2: I said, you're hired now.
Speaker 1: We had no money, we're not making any money. And
Speaker 1: I said, we're hiring you if they're firing you. And
Speaker 1: how we treat people was kind of the crucial thing
Speaker 1: different about how we did things. I think one of
Speaker 1: them and I think it's progressed. I don't know if
Speaker 1: it's perfect now. You'll have to ask the guys running
Speaker 1: the agency right now. But I think overall, I hope
Speaker 1: people feel that way.
Speaker 2: What was it like building something from scratch when there
Speaker 2: wasn't any money, Because I feel like it's easy to
Speaker 2: look at you now and ever you know, it's well
Speaker 2: it was two years, yeah, and no salary because you're
Speaker 2: out on your own.
Speaker 1: There's well, we were being we were we were in
Speaker 1: a tussle with ICM over commissions and because we couldn't
Speaker 1: take the commissions because they say they deserved it, because
Speaker 1: we're in a content this whole like, and they were
Speaker 1: going to sue us for certain things, and and so
Speaker 1: we had no money. I mean we knew things. We
Speaker 1: had money, but a lot of stuff was old stuff.
Speaker 1: About a year and a half, two years in we settled.
Speaker 1: I might be getting dates wrong, but right around then
Speaker 1: and then we had money.
Speaker 2: And and in that period of time the world changed.
Speaker 1: Mike Olvias left the business who was the god and
Speaker 1: Ron Meyer, Bill Haber and then Gavin Palone left this
Speaker 1: company UTA, and a lot of shifting happened, and we
Speaker 1: had put on we had taken a couple people from
Speaker 1: c A. Marty Allen and and we put on a
Speaker 1: bunch of TV shows that were successful. And we had
Speaker 1: money because of those, because they were going into syndication
Speaker 1: and packages and so it was like free agency in baseball.
Speaker 1: We have money and people are like shifting what are're doing?
Speaker 1: And we were home. We got you know, we're just
Speaker 1: timing and we were in the right place at the
Speaker 1: right time.
Speaker 2: What was the hottest thing you had to do in
Speaker 2: those two years? You just had to work, you know,
Speaker 2: with nobody putting the time, just putting the time, and
Speaker 2: you were doing seventeen hour eighteen hour days. Wife was
Speaker 2: pregnant at the time, my ex wife with our eldest
Speaker 2: and uh keep on building and how are we going
Speaker 2: to do it? And you know, the five of us,
Speaker 2: I think Marty had joined and then two and a
Speaker 2: half years in Patrick Whitesell had joined, and just kind
Speaker 2: of how we keep on progressing and doing it like
Speaker 2: with no none of us had ever done it before.
Speaker 2: We were all, as my father was saying in Yiddish,
Speaker 2: we were all pitchers, you know, the small nothings, and
Speaker 2: so we just figured it out. But but you know,
Speaker 2: it wasn't like, oh we went from no money to her. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was nothing and we were happy. Yeah, we're really
Speaker 2: happy because we were in our own heads. It was
Speaker 2: successful and it was hard, but we had fun. Yeah,
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Speaker 2: make sure you use the code on Purpose. Yeah. While
Speaker 2: I was a student and before I ever started doing
Speaker 2: things online, I used to do events in my local
Speaker 2: area in London and like ten people would show up
Speaker 2: every week to hear me speak about spirituality, psychology, human
Speaker 2: behavior and I loved it. I did it for ten
Speaker 2: years before you get to school to possibly be a banker. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and then what what not that this we're going to
Speaker 2: reverse the interviewwh what was the transition to, like, Oh,
Speaker 2: I don't want to do this. What happened in your mind?
Speaker 2: Or life event? So I think life event that I
Speaker 2: met a monk, and I'd never met at work before
Speaker 2: at school, so they would come in, we'd have speakers
Speaker 2: come in, whether it'd be CEOs or athletes or celebrities
Speaker 2: or former alumni or whatever it may be. And one
Speaker 2: day a monk was invited to speak at a small
Speaker 2: college session and some of my friends would getting a
Speaker 2: business session. No no, no, not a business just a
Speaker 2: general like yeah, And I was invited to go because
Speaker 2: some of my friends were getting into meditation at the time.
Speaker 2: This is early like we're talking about like two thousand
Speaker 2: and six, two and seven, So we were doing that
Speaker 2: and it was and my friends were kind of getting
Speaker 2: into that space. So they were telling me to come along,
Speaker 2: and I was like, yeah, i'll go if we go
Speaker 2: to a bar afterwards, like that's the kind of guy
Speaker 2: I was growing up. And so I went along and
Speaker 2: you weren't married at design? Oh no, I'm eighteen years old.
Speaker 2: I'm eighteen years old. I'm you know, how to start
Speaker 2: college around that time. And so I go to this
Speaker 2: event and I hear this monk speak and I'm kind
Speaker 2: of there going Okay, when are we going to leave?
Speaker 2: Like who cares about this stuff? Well? How does this
Speaker 2: benefit my life? And I actually walked away feeling completely
Speaker 2: just reflective because this monk was saying that the greatest
Speaker 2: gift was to use your skills in the service of others.
Speaker 2: Like he was saying that whatever you've been given, that
Speaker 2: was his main thing, that was his main theme, to
Speaker 2: improve other people's lives. And it was like, I'd never
Speaker 2: heard that from anyone before at eighteen, And I realized
Speaker 2: that when I was eighteen, I'd met people who were
Speaker 2: rich and famous and beautiful. You thought that was a stack, Yeah,
Speaker 2: But I was like, this is this guy seems happy,
Speaker 2: he seems content, he has something that at what point
Speaker 2: in the lecture did that like hit you? Because at
Speaker 2: one point you're sitting it. Let's go get some beers. Yeah.
Speaker 2: At the beginning, I was kind of like, Okay, what
Speaker 2: is he going to say when he came out and
Speaker 2: you know, he's dressed in robes and he he was
Speaker 2: from India, and like, you know, I'm a kid in London,
Speaker 2: Like you know, there's nothing externally attractive about him. And
Speaker 2: then as he spoke, like as I actually listened to him,
Speaker 2: I was just mesmerized, and so I said to him,
Speaker 2: I just want to follow you around. So I ended
Speaker 2: up following him around for the rest that week. He
Speaker 2: was doing events in London homes and different things, and
Speaker 2: then at temples. And then I started visiting him in
Speaker 2: my summer on Christmas vacations in India, and then when
Speaker 2: I graduated from college, I went and actually lived with
Speaker 2: him as a month for three years in India and
Speaker 2: the UK. And when your parents said, they were like
Speaker 2: completely like yeah, and all of our friends and family
Speaker 2: he's been brainwashed. It was it was like it's really
Speaker 2: interesting because and I'll talk to this about perception. It's
Speaker 2: really interesting because everyone now is kind of like, oh, Jay,
Speaker 2: you just you know, this is a good story, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, dude, when I chose to become a monk,
Speaker 2: it was not a good story. People thought it was
Speaker 2: the dumbest idea of all time, Like it was like
Speaker 2: career suicide. It was poor kid, what happened? Like, what
Speaker 2: happened to this kid who got a first class on
Speaker 2: his degree at university? Straight a's you know, like what
Speaker 2: is going on here? And all of a sudden, I'm
Speaker 2: taking this part. Your parents must have freaked out. My
Speaker 2: parents freaked out, and my extended family freaked out even more,
Speaker 2: which made my parents freak out more. They came from India, correct,
Speaker 2: So that upbringing and that going back that way, Oh
Speaker 2: my god, yeah, exactly so, but I felt cooled. I
Speaker 2: started listening to my inner voice when I was fourteen
Speaker 2: years old, and it's been so loud ever since. I
Speaker 2: don't know any other way to go, and so for me,
Speaker 2: it was so so loud, And so that was the
Speaker 2: shift in my trajectory where you come out After three years,
Speaker 2: I hoped I'd do it forever and that I really
Speaker 2: thought I was going to do it for the rest
Speaker 2: of my life. It did not work out. So what
Speaker 2: was whit? Why? A couple of things. One thing was like,
Speaker 2: it's super tough on your health to live communally, like
Speaker 2: when you're living potentially sometimes with thirty people in a room,
Speaker 2: one hundred people in a room. People wake up at
Speaker 2: different times. You're being woken up by everyone, the common cold,
Speaker 2: you're sharing bath showers like you know, like the space
Speaker 2: is like everything's communal in that space. It's hard on
Speaker 2: my It was hard on my immune system to live
Speaker 2: in that way. Of course, I'm a kid from London,
Speaker 2: like I didn't grow up with lots of comforts, but
Speaker 2: it was definitely more comfortable than a monastery. And then
Speaker 2: on top of all of that, I just had this
Speaker 2: honest transparency. And that's what monk teachings are meant to do.
Speaker 2: It's meant to make you self aware, and my self awareness.
Speaker 2: I'm quite independent. I'm quite a rebel, like I like
Speaker 2: doing things my way, and I fish is not that
Speaker 2: this is not that I feel like I want to
Speaker 2: share what I've learned in this cool, accessible, relevant way. World. Yeah,
Speaker 2: where the world is, which is the world I come from?
Speaker 2: And if I stay here then I'm actually going to
Speaker 2: be pretending to be someone I'm not. And so it's
Speaker 2: like I'm going to go back, and you know, that's
Speaker 2: that's that's a big that's a big thought. It was,
Speaker 2: it was, and I had no idea what that meant then,
Speaker 2: but I just know that it was loud, and that
Speaker 2: it was real, and that it had happened. It had
Speaker 2: to happen. It was you know. I think it's it's
Speaker 2: funny your your brother said this about you. He said that,
Speaker 2: he said this in his book Brother's Manual. The speed,
Speaker 2: danger and risk that make other people nervous make guys
Speaker 2: like Ari serene. And and it's and I want to
Speaker 2: dive into that with you. But for me, that's what
Speaker 2: it was that you didn't know where it was, but
Speaker 2: you knew you had to be on that road. Yes,
Speaker 2: And and I don't know how to stop myself. I
Speaker 2: can't pretend to myself. Is where I've always been, like,
Speaker 2: I have to be all of myself, and i'm and
Speaker 2: when decisions are against the grain and no one agrees,
Speaker 2: chances are'm on the right path. And so even when
Speaker 2: I came back then I had the opposite where everyone
Speaker 2: around me was like, you wasted three years. Look at
Speaker 2: everyone around you. They've got jobs. Now what are they
Speaker 2: saying now? Yeah, well, I mean obviously it changes now.
Speaker 2: Obviously it changes now, But but it isn't, isn't it.
Speaker 1: I had this, I sent this email out to the company.
Speaker 1: You know, most people think success is this, Yeah, that's success,
Speaker 1: and that you just it's your journey, yeah, and it's
Speaker 1: just you don't know where it's still going, but it's
Speaker 1: probably gonna go this way and it's going to go
Speaker 1: that you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, how how have you had the courage going back
Speaker 2: on that same point, how have you had the courage
Speaker 2: to be open to speed, danger and risk when other
Speaker 2: people thought? Especially what what I think we don't recognize
Speaker 2: is as you become more successful, as you make bigger decisions,
Speaker 2: it's not that just more doors open. Sometimes there's even
Speaker 2: more doubt because now people are like, can you can
Speaker 2: you get the next one? Right? Most people don't want
Speaker 2: to risk it all correct, once you get to something
Speaker 2: like why would I risk that? Correct? Like, why do that?
Speaker 2: You're it's going to be on a perfect life path.
Speaker 2: So I've said this before in.
Speaker 1: Certain interviews, I don't remember exactly which one. When you're
Speaker 1: in a class and you're figuring out where to sit
Speaker 1: in the class because you think you've psychologically figured out
Speaker 1: if I said here, the teacher won't call on you
Speaker 1: to read. And you're so anxious and you're so nervous,
Speaker 1: and you're so afraid It's not like I don't get
Speaker 1: anxious about big deals. I mean, I got really sick
Speaker 1: doing the UFC deal, moving that I am moving to London.
Speaker 2: Not great for four months when we took over it, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: so what you know, I'm not nervous about those things.
Speaker 1: I don't know why. It's just my upbringing, you know,
Speaker 1: things I went through that I could get over. So
Speaker 1: working hard, doing all the things, showing up, you know,
Speaker 1: getting on that plane for the lunch in China and
Speaker 1: then flying back after the lunch.
Speaker 2: That's kind of how I operate my life.
Speaker 1: I don't know how what my mom fed me or
Speaker 1: did and my dad. But yeah, I'm not worried about
Speaker 1: the hard work and all of it takes hard work,
Speaker 1: as you know. And I'm not trying to prove to
Speaker 1: anybody what. I'm not letting their definition of success, not success,
Speaker 1: what I should do, what I shouldn't do, dictate what
Speaker 1: I want to do. Like you, I got my own
Speaker 1: ideas about what I want to do. I just keep
Speaker 1: on following them. Hopefully I keep on getting in tune
Speaker 1: with my voices, definitely listening to people in my life
Speaker 1: that I trust. But then you know, it's like Okay,
Speaker 1: it's time to bet like we just did with WWE
Speaker 1: and doing something new, and here's what we're going to do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: those are not easy decisions.
Speaker 2: And yeah, it's really interesting because even I'm very comfortable
Speaker 2: and the uncomfortable, I'm really comfortable, and the uncomfortable I
Speaker 2: think when most people don't like uncomfortable conversations, don't like
Speaker 2: to be uncomfortable, business don't like that. I do enjoy
Speaker 2: that a lot. I like awkward. I'm comfortable and awkward.
Speaker 2: I like just saying what it is. I do not care.
Speaker 2: You can like me, not like me. I was never
Speaker 2: one of the cool guys. I'm good. I think it
Speaker 2: was so funny because Mike Milkine was sitting and you
Speaker 2: see yesterday just here, And it was interesting because there's
Speaker 2: this shared experience of there's a healed sense of self worth,
Speaker 2: but then there's this embracing our own insignificance, like you
Speaker 2: just said you're like, we're I'm also insignificant. And it's
Speaker 2: really interesting because everyone who's kind of has a settled mind.
Speaker 2: I'm not sure people get to the second one, but
Speaker 2: not what we need to. Oh why do you think
Speaker 2: we don't get there?
Speaker 1: I've had this conversation with many people, this concept of legacy,
Speaker 1: and once you actually believe it, not just say it.
Speaker 1: I mean legacy. I mean presidents of legacies. Guess some
Speaker 1: entertainers have legacy, sports stars have legacies. Business people guys, no,
Speaker 1: they don't have legacies. And once you get to that
Speaker 1: point and comfortable in that point, this whole concept that
Speaker 1: what's my legacy? Which is a jerk off conversation, you
Speaker 1: can move past a lot of this stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're sitting there, what's my legacy? Yeah? Yeah, it's
Speaker 2: a bad question. It's a bad question like that, that's
Speaker 2: why you're doing it. Yeah, I agree, Oh my god,
Speaker 2: that's crazy. Yeah, it's I do you know what I
Speaker 2: think it comes from. I think we never get to
Speaker 2: embrace our own insignificance because we're scared of where it
Speaker 2: leads to low self esteem. So there's that angle, but
Speaker 2: definitely I don't have that, yes, exactly. But the deeper angle,
Speaker 2: which is what you're raising, is that I think as
Speaker 2: humans we're so addicted to immortality because at least from
Speaker 2: a spiritual point of view, our consciousness and energy is immortal,
Speaker 2: and there's such an addiction to immortality and longevity that
Speaker 2: we have that for us to live after we die.
Speaker 2: We think the art here's my fear possible because people
Speaker 2: because I mean, I am a crazy health nut. I
Speaker 2: mean I do some crazy stuff. Yeah, and I'm into
Speaker 2: it too, so I'm.
Speaker 1: Really really But for me, it's not about living forever.
Speaker 1: It's about being healthy while I live same as long
Speaker 1: as I am. Because I see people that are older
Speaker 1: that are prisoners in their bodies as when they get
Speaker 1: to their sixties, seventies, eighties, I'm not doing that. The
Speaker 1: best thing that could happen is it's over, would be
Speaker 1: incredible and union your sleep like it's over. But until
Speaker 1: that point in time, I'm playing golf, I'm going on hikes,
Speaker 1: I'm surfing, I'm doing my thing, this whole thing about
Speaker 1: this whole world of and I hack.
Speaker 2: I hack myself to do that. But it's not to
Speaker 2: live to ever. And so that's the objective. Yes, yeah, no,
Speaker 2: I get that, and I'm totally aligned with that. I
Speaker 2: feel the same way, like I don't think it's what's
Speaker 2: the craziest thing you do for your health? I mean,
Speaker 2: I've been recent because I'm still young. There's certain things
Speaker 2: that people don't recommend yet. And so like I've been
Speaker 2: talking to people about like stem cell treatments and things
Speaker 2: like that and if you've done any stem cell therapy
Speaker 2: or anything like that. Okay, so I haven't done any
Speaker 2: of it either, but everyone's was like, yeah, you're too
Speaker 2: young to start these things right now. But I'd say
Speaker 2: the craziest thing I do right now is same as
Speaker 2: you like the fast thing, the cold plunging, the infrared
Speaker 2: so on, is the deep rest and sleep. The meditation
Speaker 2: has been a part of my life for seventeen ages.
Speaker 2: You got to push steel, yeah, yes, you got. You
Speaker 2: gotta do weights. I had to stop that last year
Speaker 2: for I had I had surgery, so I had to stop.
Speaker 2: But yes, I usually do have to do that. You
Speaker 2: have to do stuff for your kind of coeal two,
Speaker 2: your oxygen, your ability. How old you know, thirty five?
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you're right at the right if you do now,
Speaker 1: this is the time. Yeah, you got to reduce as
Speaker 1: much as you can your inflammation. You gotta have gut health. Yes,
Speaker 1: this is exactly, and then you have to figure out
Speaker 1: how to balance your glucose. If you can do those things, yep,
Speaker 1: you have thirty five percent chance of getting to the
Speaker 1: objective of one night you just.
Speaker 2: Don't wake up. Yeah right, Are you plum based as well?
Speaker 2: Or you try? Here's what it is because I'm sixty two. Okay, Wow,
Speaker 2: So I was electing free vegan, following doctor Gundrys who
Speaker 2: got me when I had my thigraid problem. Really healthy.
Speaker 1: The problem is now because I do push a lot
Speaker 1: of steel, I do do heavy cardio, I do do
Speaker 1: a lot of that stuff. I have to have some
Speaker 1: protein in my dial. So I have moved up to
Speaker 1: probably very healthy you know, grass fed, grass finish, no
Speaker 1: corn in it. All the stuff that caused inflammation. I
Speaker 1: have moved up into probably three or four days of
Speaker 1: meat and then the rest. Electing free vegan.
Speaker 2: Yeah, what's the craziest therapy you've done? You mentioned earlier
Speaker 2: there was some different strang I do.
Speaker 1: I you know, I take helmets from Thailand and from
Speaker 1: the UK every morning. I do light therapy every morning
Speaker 1: after the cold plunge. I mean if I showed you
Speaker 1: the list now, you'd be like, you've you've lost the plot.
Speaker 2: Sorry, No, I love it. Here's what happens though.
Speaker 1: As I go down all these paths, I always call
Speaker 1: my brother Zeke and I only have the following question,
Speaker 1: and then he has to do the work and I
Speaker 1: do work too. I said, okay, can it kill me?
Speaker 1: Can it injure me or hurt me? If the answer
Speaker 1: comes back, now I do it. So I started on
Speaker 1: They're you know, they're live microbes. Their microscopy can't see him.
Speaker 1: I drink them every morning. Now I've gotten too a
Speaker 1: place where I do that. I worked with this guy
Speaker 1: from from Duke as I read an article on him,
Speaker 1: and people are looking like, what are you doing?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: And I say the great line to him and say
Speaker 1: watch their facial expression. I said, well, they don't colonize
Speaker 1: in your system, and you know you can see them like.
Speaker 1: And so this goes to like, all right, I'm not lett.
Speaker 1: I'm just going to try these things as long as
Speaker 1: it can't hurt me.
Speaker 2: The list is vast. Yeah, it's great. No, it's great.
Speaker 2: I think it's I mean, this is where, this is
Speaker 2: where the world's heading. And I think everyone's looking for
Speaker 2: solutions and looking for ways. So I love hearing about
Speaker 2: it from you, and it's and it's great and it
Speaker 2: shows right, I feel like you you seem really vibrant, energetic,
Speaker 2: and and I think that's the key, right, it's vitality.
Speaker 2: I think, well, but the back is not turned into
Speaker 2: a mouse that's hunched over. Yeah yeah, yeah absolutely. Have
Speaker 2: you ever seen those absolutely that that that that scares me? Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I will do anything that too, because then it's not
Speaker 2: You're going to be a prisoner in your body. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's that's that's not that's not where you want to
Speaker 2: be in life. Yeah, talking about athletic bodies. You you
Speaker 2: talked about what you did with the w W E there.
Speaker 2: I remember when you first got involved with the UFC,
Speaker 2: there was a lot of like doubt as to how
Speaker 2: big it could get. I believe there was a bit
Speaker 2: of skepticism. How do you how do you when you're
Speaker 2: making a decision that's big money, big risk and danger
Speaker 2: going back to that point. But then everyone else is like,
Speaker 2: it's a lot of risk. This is like I don't
Speaker 2: know if it's going to work out. But then you're like, no,
Speaker 2: I know where this is going to go. How do you?
Speaker 1: How have you found that the first thing that gets
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean the first thing that I do.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm assuming you do it. Anybody successful do it?
Speaker 2: I read a lot, and I asked a lot.
Speaker 1: Of questions to Once I read an article, if I
Speaker 1: understand it, don't understand it, I want I call the
Speaker 1: person or I call the person in the article. And
Speaker 1: that happened early on how we started the firm. You know,
Speaker 1: we were in the representation business, and then I said,
Speaker 1: we have all this business, I want to buy something
Speaker 1: that we owned. I thought sports was going someplace that
Speaker 1: with increased distribution, that was going to be more valuable.
Speaker 1: And so it was like, there's not many sports you
Speaker 1: can own. I was already in business with the UFC.
Speaker 1: We did all the work about where we could take
Speaker 1: the economics internationally sponsorship. It was an easy bet and
Speaker 1: it worked out well.
Speaker 2: It worked well.
Speaker 1: The world changed on me at the time. For the
Speaker 1: like Fox sold the Disney so those two buyers out.
Speaker 1: Donald Trump wouldn't let AT and T buy Time Warner,
Speaker 1: so those two buyers are out, and the rest of
Speaker 1: it they didn't. Nobody else wanted it at the time
Speaker 1: because they had already had too much. So so it
Speaker 1: was nerve wracking for a while. But then the world changed.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's fascinating to me because I think that everyone
Speaker 2: in their micro universe or any universe is always having
Speaker 2: to make tough decisions that a lot of people around
Speaker 2: them don't understand. Whether someone listening to this right now
Speaker 2: is trying to start a new health regime, whether someone's
Speaker 2: not a.
Speaker 1: Pill, and anything we do as we now know, there's
Speaker 1: not like because I don't know about you. People come in,
Speaker 1: so what's the one thing?
Speaker 2: One thing? There is no one. I do seventeen things
Speaker 2: like and it's grown from ten. Yep, there's like being
Speaker 2: asked the one thing. It doesn't work? Yeah, absolutely absolutely,
Speaker 2: And that's why that's why the questions I'm asking you.
Speaker 2: I'm fascinated by the thought process. Well, because you're just
Speaker 2: in our lives.
Speaker 1: We're just gathering information, gathering thought process, gathering, gathering perspectives,
Speaker 1: and then we go hunting for things that we want
Speaker 1: to do and where we think the world's going. And
Speaker 1: then once you get to that point like okay, you
Speaker 1: talk to a lot of people, you have to for me,
Speaker 1: talk to investors, et cetera, and then you're then you're launched,
Speaker 1: and then there's I think I might get this story wrong.
Speaker 1: Disney when they bought Cap Cities, which had ESPN, they
Speaker 1: valued ESPN did zero at the time, and when it
Speaker 1: came out, it was the most valuable asset. Again success, right,
Speaker 1: who knows? You know, you can do all the work
Speaker 1: you can do and then all of a sudden.
Speaker 2: Get into the pool. The water is warm, dude, you
Speaker 2: gotta start swimming. Yeah, And that's what I think. I
Speaker 2: think there is so much pressure around making the right
Speaker 2: decision as opposed to making your decision right right, like
Speaker 2: as in you. I think a lot of people spend
Speaker 2: a lot of time. Is this the right decision? Is
Speaker 2: this the right thing to investor? I'm like, well, make
Speaker 2: the decision.
Speaker 1: And then we started how many people can handle change
Speaker 1: and fear the I mean you just have to be
Speaker 1: comfortable and the uncomfortable and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, what have you see? And you've worked
Speaker 2: with talent? I know you still do in in some
Speaker 2: in the ways, still work with a lot of time.
Speaker 2: I've alread you said what most of but you're working
Speaker 2: with the business as well as much as you Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 2: So when you're working with talent, what have you seen
Speaker 2: has been the Because I think it was interesting. I
Speaker 2: was saying when I was young, everyon wanted to be
Speaker 2: an investment banker. Now we know in America most peop
Speaker 2: want to be influencers, creators, something to YouTube. What what
Speaker 2: have you seen have been the best choices that talent
Speaker 2: have made long term for their successful careers or where
Speaker 2: are some of the mistakes people.
Speaker 1: I think most talent now realizes they're the ass and
Speaker 1: it's kind of moving towards them and and a lot
Speaker 1: of them are starting to try and figure out, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: what does that mean?
Speaker 2: Can I own other businesses? Can I get equity?
Speaker 1: It be Ryan re Duyne, Johnson, Mark Wallbert, these people, right,
Speaker 1: And I think that's been at that level. We're going
Speaker 1: to go through a whole iteration right now with AI
Speaker 1: that is gonna I think, I don't know what it's
Speaker 1: going to do, but it's going to transfer one more time.
Speaker 2: Our business.
Speaker 1: I think in a good way in that I think
Speaker 1: people are gonna have more free time than ever. They're
Speaker 1: gonna want movies, they're gonna want to entertainment, They're gonna
Speaker 1: need more. I think that we're gonna go down to
Speaker 1: a permanent four day work week. Governments are going to
Speaker 1: need it for full employment, and that means the weekend
Speaker 1: is starting on Thursday night, and that means that's three
Speaker 1: days where people need personal interaction, and so the value proposition,
Speaker 1: especially as distribution changes, you're gonna go to six Wi Fi.
Speaker 2: You're now seeing more distribution, rumble.
Speaker 1: Picking up shows, Roque. I mean, it's just expanding and expanding.
Speaker 1: Our job is to create a place where our talent
Speaker 1: can create, really for the first time even more exponentially,
Speaker 1: become their own brands and own businesses and do things
Speaker 1: that they not just the movie, not just to tell
Speaker 1: other things and will be successful for them and they'll
Speaker 1: be successful as long as we can create this kind
Speaker 1: of part perfect architecture. And we're not perfect at it yet,
Speaker 1: but we're getting better at it. And those are the
Speaker 1: clients that we want to be in business across podcast,
Speaker 1: all the different things, and that's the hardest thing that
Speaker 1: we're trying to build now in this transition.
Speaker 2: But that's where I think the world is going interesting.
Speaker 2: Four day work weeks. I think that's that I think.
Speaker 2: I think, even if it's unofficial, I don't know governments,
Speaker 2: I think because of AI Oh, and I'm saying probably
Speaker 2: in two three, four years for full employment and they're
Speaker 2: going to need it for social non unrest. You're going
Speaker 2: to have and you know you have COVID and that's
Speaker 2: almost a four day work Greek now because people don't
Speaker 2: go into the office on Fridays.
Speaker 1: That means Thursday night, what are you doing? Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: I'm in the entertainment. That's the that's the objective, and
Speaker 1: so that's what we've.
Speaker 2: Been building like events Madrid Open Barrett Jackson Art Show,
Speaker 2: et cetera. And that's where I think the world's got
Speaker 2: sporting events, et cetera. So I think entertainments can be
Speaker 2: more valuable than it's ever become. I don't think it's
Speaker 2: as we'll be as disrupted by AI. There'll be some
Speaker 2: disruption in it. Yeah, it's it's incredible to think about
Speaker 2: that because, yeah, I think people are only looking for
Speaker 2: more alternatives and options, especially for that human connection point
Speaker 2: we were talking about, how have you found it as
Speaker 2: a leader to have that where you've gone from everyone
Speaker 2: being in an office in an agency to then people
Speaker 2: working from home? Like, how have you navigated that to
Speaker 2: continue that? Like listen, we have you know, we've we
Speaker 2: had done this a long time ago. We just restarted.
Speaker 1: We did we did a book club, not the way
Speaker 1: we used to do with with Rick Rubin on his
Speaker 1: new book We do. We've had a lecture on anti Semitism.
Speaker 1: We're trying to get people in groups talking about big
Speaker 1: issues to kind of keep the company together from you know,
Speaker 1: we're in I don't know, thirty seven countries, so that
Speaker 1: people get to there's a community and they were going
Speaker 1: to start a big retreat again, which we hadn't done in.
Speaker 2: A lot of years because of COVID. So that's the
Speaker 2: way we foresee doing that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, Yeah, and
Speaker 2: I think that that's that just keeps hopefully, Yeah, and
Speaker 2: we just have to keep on working on how we
Speaker 2: keep that connection ongoing in the company. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: because you do want the architecture, right, you do want
Speaker 2: the licensing group talking to the motion picture group, talking
Speaker 2: to the online on location group to create an experience,
Speaker 2: and you want all those pieces and the outside world
Speaker 2: and the clients is asking for it too, So that's
Speaker 2: where we have to Yeah. I worked with so many
Speaker 2: organizations before and during Manu the pandemic, and then even after,
Speaker 2: and the transitions I've seen are incredible because whether a
Speaker 2: company was growing rapidly so I was working with Zoom,
Speaker 2: they were having the best success as a company financially,
Speaker 2: but it was like they had to scale like what
Speaker 2: was a small organization really quickly, and so like the
Speaker 2: burnout that comes with that is really really hard. And
Speaker 2: then you had other organizations obviously like travel entertainment, live
Speaker 2: entertainment down struggling with that and hurdling morale. And so
Speaker 2: it's really interesting to see how they both bounce back
Speaker 2: because it was hard either way, and it's really fat.
Speaker 2: You always think they're successful. They don't. It's hot. Success
Speaker 2: was hard for them though. Yeah, of course it is.
Speaker 2: Of course it is. It's it's so complicated and.
Speaker 1: It's really complicated. Success is hard and failure is hard
Speaker 1: running a business. I don't any one of them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, brutal. Yeah, what have been some of you? What
Speaker 2: would you say the last few years has been one
Speaker 2: of like your biggest misses or your biggest failures that
Speaker 2: you look back and go that taught me a lot.
Speaker 1: Well, I'll say the following because it was a success.
Speaker 1: And it was only success because I thought we had
Speaker 1: like shut everything down, and Dana White at the OC
Speaker 1: said to me, uh uh, we're not shutting down. I
Speaker 1: got scared, and he like slamming across the face, and
Speaker 1: we're going. And then he said, give me an island.
Speaker 1: And you know, I was like, you know, my brother's
Speaker 1: a doctor's telling me where the world's come. I'm like
Speaker 1: and he was like, we're and he was just driving
Speaker 1: that train. And so we got them an island and
Speaker 1: he did everything else and you know, kind of just
Speaker 1: remind me like, yeah, it's it's it's nerve wracking, but
Speaker 1: don't be scared.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was like amazing, Yeah.
Speaker 1: And I was like on the other side of that
Speaker 1: fence and I said, you know, and that's why I
Speaker 1: have great part He's an incredible partner. But I I
Speaker 1: for the first time, got really scared, and he just said, no,
Speaker 1: we just have to go, and we're going to take
Speaker 1: all the heat for it. And it was a lot
Speaker 1: of heat against him, and but we did it. If
Speaker 1: we didn't have that, the whole company would have been
Speaker 1: tanked because we needed the ESPN deal to continue to go.
Speaker 1: We needed to put on fights, and his his courage,
Speaker 1: like dragging me along was incredible.
Speaker 2: The industry today, I feel like cancel culture heat coach
Speaker 2: like it's got hotder, basically because there's more people too canceled.
Speaker 2: There's more things that people are sensitive or care about
Speaker 2: or believe in, and values like how do how do
Speaker 2: you as a talent agent think about artists going through that?
Speaker 2: Because I'm sure you've seen over the years, just so,
Speaker 2: I coached a lot of people in the music business,
Speaker 2: actors like sports people. I coach so many people in
Speaker 2: the industry jump in the water because most people want
Speaker 2: to respond.
Speaker 1: The news cycle is so fast unless you've committed murder
Speaker 1: and something whatever, let it go. The thought process is
Speaker 1: I got to jump and respond. Then it's just the
Speaker 1: story just continues the news cycle. I used to say,
Speaker 1: it's like one day, it's less.
Speaker 2: Than a half a day now. And if you just
Speaker 2: get out of this emotional mindset that you have to
Speaker 2: respond and they have to know and really nobody's going
Speaker 2: to like it's over, don't respond. And that's kind of
Speaker 2: I think the hardest thing for any artist. How have you?
Speaker 2: How have you worked with because I'm guessing you you
Speaker 2: almost buy job that have to become a coach sometimes
Speaker 2: to the people, this is my this is my this
Speaker 2: is my line.
Speaker 1: Note like why are you responding? Don't like they want
Speaker 1: you to respond because then they keep on getting the click.
Speaker 1: I think, God, I'm not on a social.
Speaker 2: Media Yeah, I won't do it. I won't. I mean,
Speaker 2: I get it. You know. Sometimes my kids send it
Speaker 2: to me. My wife sends it to me. I don't
Speaker 2: look at it. What's something that you're trying to immerse
Speaker 2: into your children? Leg? I mean you were just your
Speaker 2: son was just calling you, just talking. You're like, what's
Speaker 2: something that you feel you really want them to know
Speaker 2: and learn at the stages they are in their life.
Speaker 2: I just I think they get it.
Speaker 1: It was so funny. My my youngest son is now training.
Speaker 1: He goes submchion and he's working up at Apple right
Speaker 1: now at Apple Maps, and he's decided comes out of
Speaker 1: as he's going into a junior. He's he's training for
Speaker 1: a triathlon a junior. What I loved about him is
Speaker 1: he did the work and what I mean by did
Speaker 1: the work, and it was like shocking hearing. I was
Speaker 1: just such a proud father. He talked about how you
Speaker 1: run better and how the people and ken you run
Speaker 1: better because they're on their toes and he'd done out
Speaker 1: of all this research about and he started doing it.
Speaker 1: First three weeks was brutal on his legs, but he's
Speaker 1: gotten faster on the bike. I have to do it
Speaker 1: in a box, Dad, here's what And I ride and
Speaker 1: do a POxy training and all this stuff.
Speaker 2: And I said, you're right, it does.
Speaker 1: And he has not stopped training. No, he's twenty one
Speaker 1: years old. You know, I remember how I was at
Speaker 1: twenty one years old. I wouldn't have been doing that.
Speaker 1: But his work about how to get better. He swam
Speaker 1: double the length this time. He's got a month left.
Speaker 1: And just the amount of work he's put into it,
Speaker 1: the thought process behind it, the research he did. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I mean, you couldn't be prouder, and all of them.
Speaker 1: I just try and teach him one thing. You got
Speaker 1: to work hard and you got to show up the
Speaker 1: results you're not going to control. If you do those things,
Speaker 1: then there's many other things that we all can on
Speaker 1: the list, but those are kind of it. You work
Speaker 1: really hard, you show up outcomes you can't control.
Speaker 2: That's what you want. Good advice. I love that. It's
Speaker 2: all right. It's been such a joy talking to you day.
Speaker 2: You you've been You've been such a like. It's been
Speaker 2: such a treat, just like I feel like we've been
Speaker 2: playing tennis or pickleball. Uh, that's my wife. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I was gonna say I.
Speaker 1: Need a pair of those. I will just send one
Speaker 1: of them. You'll send me the shoe size and everything.
Speaker 1: One of those two you have to wear it on
Speaker 1: the podcast, so she gets a little gets a little
Speaker 1: bit of kind of love from you.
Speaker 2: Those are awesome. Yeah, and multi balance too, so that's great.
Speaker 2: There are multiple colors. Okay, I'm gonna essentially have these
Speaker 2: in in shoes too. You Yeah, I want it, I
Speaker 2: want it all. They look great, they look great. It
Speaker 2: looks it looks great on you too. Thank you for
Speaker 2: doing this. I will. But we end every show with
Speaker 2: the final five. These have to be answered in one
Speaker 2: word or one sentence maximum, So it's super I better
Speaker 2: sit up for this. Yes, all, these are your final five.
Speaker 2: The first question is what is the best advice you've
Speaker 2: ever heard or received? No when you're on the field.
Speaker 2: The second question is what is the worst advice you've
Speaker 2: ever heard or received? I don't know if it was advice,
Speaker 2: but why would you do that? Interesting question? What's something
Speaker 2: that you're trying to unlearn being angry? That sounds hard?
Speaker 2: It's hard? How hard is it? Let's let's talk about
Speaker 2: that for a second. I'll tell you what it is.
Speaker 1: It's you know, I know when it pops up like
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, when somebody used to call me
Speaker 1: stupid in school, it was game on and that thesis
Speaker 1: where somebody treats me.
Speaker 2: As if I'm not smart or they trying to pull
Speaker 2: something on me, I just I just go to a
Speaker 2: very dark, sick place.
Speaker 1: And I've worked very hard now not to go there,
Speaker 1: to handle it differently, not that I'm not going to
Speaker 1: be like, what do you think I'm stupid? Like by
Speaker 1: doing that, you're you're acting as if I don't know
Speaker 1: what's going on here and so, and they're pulling one
Speaker 1: over me. And for whatever reason, the minute I feel
Speaker 1: like somebody's trying.
Speaker 2: To take advantage of you. Yeah, I get that. And
Speaker 2: so that is a lot of work. That is a
Speaker 2: constant work.
Speaker 1: And when I feel it coming on, Okay, that's your shadow,
Speaker 1: whatever the phrase is, that your you know, that's the
Speaker 1: work I have to do. And I don't always do it,
Speaker 1: especially those childhood ones and so, but when somebody in
Speaker 1: business does that to me recently, I kind of like
Speaker 1: I went to the bad place.
Speaker 2: I couldn't control it, and that that that's what I'm
Speaker 2: trying to work on. Yeah, what's been helping you work
Speaker 2: on that? I just kind of like recognizing it. Once
Speaker 2: I recognize it, yeah, I can breathe through it and
Speaker 2: I can get to the other side of it. But
Speaker 2: in the moment sometimes, Yeah, thanks for sharing that. I
Speaker 2: feel like I feel like for me as well. I
Speaker 2: feel like your partners and your family often see the
Speaker 2: rest of you. Oh god. I always look at that
Speaker 2: and was like, how what does my wife see? And
Speaker 2: problem is you do things that are so not smart? Yeah,
Speaker 2: and it's you know, it's it's just not good. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but then you regret it afterwards. I'm not sure I
Speaker 2: regret it, but it's just like, really, you had to
Speaker 2: do that.
Speaker 1: You're sixty two, you had to do that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: say that you had to like make calls and try
Speaker 1: and kill you.
Speaker 2: No, I'm not doing that. Yeah, all right, two more questions.
Speaker 2: The fourth question is what's something that you used to
Speaker 2: value that you don't no longer value. Well, I thought
Speaker 2: it was about stack.
Speaker 1: Now maybe somebody's gonna say he's got the stack now, yeah,
Speaker 1: but I never had I didn't have the stack at
Speaker 1: the beginning, and I didn't.
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't. That was never the end game.
Speaker 2: What is the end game now?
Speaker 1: I am really happily married. I love my kids, They're
Speaker 1: in great shape. I'm comfortable in who I am. I'm
Speaker 1: I'm happy that I have to constantly work at it now,
Speaker 1: and I'm actually in a good place to work it.
Speaker 2: I understand the work I have to do, which makes
Speaker 2: it even better. All right. Fifth and final question. We
Speaker 2: asked this to every guest longer than one sentence. I
Speaker 2: know because because you keep giving good answers, you keep
Speaker 2: giving good answers. I can't help it. You gave a
Speaker 2: really interesting answer. I was like, if I don't dive
Speaker 2: into this, my just gonna get mad at me. They're
Speaker 2: gonna be like, Jay, why did you you know? I
Speaker 2: listened to my This is what that voice they tell me,
Speaker 2: the Jay he just told you like something amazing. Why
Speaker 2: didn't uh? Fifth and final question. If you could create
Speaker 2: one law that everyone in the world had to follow,
Speaker 2: what would it be? Could be anything about any any
Speaker 2: type of law.
Speaker 1: Don't be hipocritical. If your whole thing is stay out
Speaker 1: of my life, Okay, stay out of my life. One
Speaker 1: guns stay out of my life on COVID. Just stay consistent.
Speaker 1: And that's the hardest thing because there's the shade of gray, right.
Speaker 1: I just want consistency without like the issue of money.
Speaker 1: The affirmative action issue is you know, oh it's sports
Speaker 1: and legacy people or family, you know, kind of heritage
Speaker 1: that got into the school. Well that's about money. Like
Speaker 1: oh yeah, the sports make them money and the people
Speaker 1: that went there and their kids that they.
Speaker 2: Give a lot of money. Like okay, we all get it.
Speaker 1: Like, just stay consistent with when we decide to pass
Speaker 1: a law like that, it is then across the board
Speaker 1: and the money doesn't get into and all tho stuff.
Speaker 2: That's the thing. I just look at these things. I
Speaker 2: just look at these things.
Speaker 1: I'm like the hypocrisy of oh and I'm I'm a hypocryphal,
Speaker 1: all of us.
Speaker 2: I am a h apocryphal. I understand it.
Speaker 1: I wish that we could figure out a law of
Speaker 1: that consistency whatever we decide, so that it's like, okay,
Speaker 1: if if if really what you're saying here, and we
Speaker 1: take it out across all these other issues, here's what
Speaker 1: it would mean, and so that everybody gets I don't
Speaker 1: know what that law would be no.
Speaker 2: The essence of the answer is great. I love the
Speaker 2: idea of being consistent and removing hypocrisy and the challenges.
Speaker 2: We need money, yeah, and we all have it like
Speaker 2: we all like we'll fight to death for this thing.
Speaker 2: And then but actually, please.
Speaker 1: Don't say all my apocryphal things that I have done there, right,
Speaker 1: so we all have thank you, all right, thank you
Speaker 1: so much.
Speaker 2: I love thank you. I'm glad and I love so
Speaker 2: I'm gonna send you these. I better get a care said,
Speaker 2: We're gonna send you Okay, thank you. You love this episode.
Speaker 2: You'll love my interview with doctor Gable Matte on understanding
Speaker 2: your trauma and how to heal emotional wounds to start
Speaker 2: moving on from the past. Everything in nature grows only
Speaker 2: where it's vulnerable. So a tree doesn't grow where it's
Speaker 2: hard and thick, does it. It goes where it's soft
Speaker 2: and green and vulnerable.