Speaker 1: Welcome to Noble Blood, a production of iHeartRadio and Grim
Speaker 1: and Mild from Aaron Manky. Listener discretion advised.
Speaker 2: On April twentieth, twenty twenty three, Elon Musk unverified the Pope.
Speaker 2: I bet that was a sentence you never thought you'd
Speaker 2: hear on this podcast. Musk, the eccentric billionaire who bought
Speaker 2: the website formerly known as Twitter seemingly for the Lafts,
Speaker 2: had changed his policy on verification. Previously, verification had been
Speaker 2: subject to a rigorous evaluation to verify the accounts of
Speaker 2: public figures and organizations, but now the coveted blue check
Speaker 2: was available to anyone with eight dollars a month to spare.
Speaker 2: The end result was that, at least temporarily, a blue
Speaker 2: check mark or public figures and organizations no longer conferred
Speaker 2: any meaningful marker of identity. Those unwilling to pay for it,
Speaker 2: like Pope Francis, were simply unceremoniously stripped of their blue check.
Speaker 2: If you were, like me, someone who often found yourself
Speaker 2: on the history nerd side of Twitter, you might have
Speaker 2: noticed a couple of odd terms trending as the verification
Speaker 2: mayhem unfolded, namely, Auvignon and Western Chisholm. In the early
Speaker 2: fourteenth century, Pope Clement the fifth had moved his court
Speaker 2: from Rome to Avignon in what is now France. The
Speaker 2: papacy would remain there unchallenged for over seventy years and
Speaker 2: through six more popes, until Gregory the eleventh moved his
Speaker 2: court back to Rome in thirteen seventy six. What does
Speaker 2: this have to do with Elon Musk.
Speaker 3: You asked.
Speaker 2: The answer lies in a third trending term, antipope. When
Speaker 2: Gregory the eleventh died in thirteen seventy eight, the College
Speaker 2: of Cardinals in Rome set about their usual business of
Speaker 2: electing a new pope, which they did Urban the sixth,
Speaker 2: But some cardinals opposed the move from Avignon back to Rome,
Speaker 2: so they elected a pope of their own in Avignon,
Speaker 2: who would become known as the anti Pope, Clement the seventh,
Speaker 2: though they just called him Pope Clement the seventh. A
Speaker 2: total of three antipopes would be elected and reign from
Speaker 2: Avignon and two more from Pisa. From June fourteen o
Speaker 2: nine to May fourteen fifteen. There were popes in all
Speaker 2: three cities, each believing wholeheartedly that he alone was the
Speaker 2: world's singular direct line to God. Twitter story argued mostly jokingly,
Speaker 2: that Musk's decision to unverify Pope Francis was akin to
Speaker 2: a modern day Western chism, With the Pope in Rome
Speaker 2: stripped of the mark that made it clear he was
Speaker 2: the one and only Pope, Musk was leaving the door
Speaker 2: open for someone else to claim the papal throne, at
Speaker 2: least on Twitter. The brief verification of Pope Francis was
Speaker 2: many things, a technological oversight, a notable day in Twitter's
Speaker 2: slow downfall, an opportunity to laugh, perhaps nervously, at the
Speaker 2: idea of Elon Musk accidentally taking control of the Catholic Church.
Speaker 2: But it was not, in fact a crisis in the Vatican.
Speaker 2: The papalexperts of Twitter dot com, however, were quick to
Speaker 2: point out that a Twitter verification schism, funny as it was,
Speaker 2: would not have even given us the first modern antipope.
Speaker 2: In the last sixty or so years, at least ten
Speaker 2: men have claimed the Holy See, each girded by a
Speaker 2: variable number of followers but an equally fervent belief in
Speaker 2: the righteousness of their pontificate. Most of these were clergy
Speaker 2: associated with specific offshoots of the Catholic Church before they
Speaker 2: claimed an appointment to the papal throne. But Twitter that
Speaker 2: day was almost entirely focused on a man named David Bowden,
Speaker 2: a former real estate agent and furniture maker originally from Oklahoma, who,
Speaker 2: in the Year of Our Lord nineteen ninety decided that
Speaker 2: he was the only one who could lead the church
Speaker 2: in the right direction. I'm Danas Schwartz, and this is
Speaker 2: noble blood.
Speaker 3: In order for.
Speaker 2: Any religious organisation to endure, it has to strike a delicate,
Speaker 2: mysterious balance between holding on to its central tenets and
Speaker 2: traditions and updating itself as the world around it inevitably changes.
Speaker 2: In January nineteen fifty nine, when Pope John the twenty
Speaker 2: third announced his intention to convene a Second Vatican Council,
Speaker 2: the world had been irrevocably changed by the horrors of
Speaker 2: the world wars, by the trepidation of the rebuilding and
Speaker 2: globalization that followed, and by the tension that came with
Speaker 2: the brewing Cold War. We're about to get into some
Speaker 2: complicated religious bureaucracy. So before we get any further, I
Speaker 2: figure it would be helpful to explain some terms. The
Speaker 2: Second Vatican Council, or Vatican two as it often called,
Speaker 2: was an ecumenical council, which is the term they used
Speaker 2: to describe a gathering of all bishops and other church
Speaker 2: authorities during which they consider and rule on questions of doctrine, administration,
Speaker 2: church practice, and the like. Despite its name, Vatican two
Speaker 2: was not the second ever ecumenical council, just the second
Speaker 2: to take place in the Vatican City. There have been
Speaker 2: twenty seven ecumenical councils in total, dating all the way
Speaker 2: back to the fourth century CE, with different sects of
Speaker 2: Christianity accepting the conclusions of some and not others as
Speaker 2: they saw fit. The Catholic Church accepts twenty one of them.
Speaker 2: When Pope John called the Ecumenical Council that would be
Speaker 2: known as Vatican two, there had not been an ecumenical
Speaker 2: council in nearly one hundred years since the First Vatican
Speaker 2: Council had concluded in eighteen seventy. It took roughly three
Speaker 2: years to prepare for the Second Vatican Council. Before putting
Speaker 2: together the council, the Vatican first needed to conduct an
Speaker 2: evaluation of the Catholic world, from bishops to the faculty
Speaker 2: of Catholic universities. Thousands of individuals and institutions replied with
Speaker 2: their wishes for the future of the Church, and immediately
Speaker 2: the conflict was clear. This Ecumenical Council would be divided,
Speaker 2: which we those who believed it was the duty of
Speaker 2: the Church to remain steadfast to resist change, because to
Speaker 2: change would be to give in to the pressure from
Speaker 2: an increasingly secularized world, and those who believed equally strongly
Speaker 2: that change was necessary for the Church to continue to
Speaker 2: thrive in that world. The Council opened on October eleventh,
Speaker 2: nineteen sixty two, and met in four sessions over the
Speaker 2: course of a little over three years. Pope John the
Speaker 2: twenty third died in nineteen sixty three, so the final
Speaker 2: three sessions were overseen by his successor, Paul sixth.
Speaker 3: He closed the.
Speaker 2: Council on December eighth, nineteen sixty five. Vatican two is
Speaker 2: remembered as the most significant event in the history of
Speaker 2: the Catholic Church since the Reformation. It enacted change to
Speaker 2: an extent unseen in the Church's history and on a
Speaker 2: global scale not possible in prior centuries. To read out
Speaker 2: and explain every change would take too much of our time,
Speaker 2: but some changes that might stand out. This was the
Speaker 2: moment the Church stopped conducting liturgy in Latin, and when
Speaker 2: priests began to be allowed to preach facing the congregation
Speaker 2: for the first time in hundreds of years. Lay people
Speaker 2: were widely allowed to take communion under both kinds, that is,
Speaker 2: they could receive both consecrated bread and the wine that
Speaker 2: previously had been limited to members of the clergy. Of course,
Speaker 2: these were only a few of many changes, some of
Speaker 2: which went to matters of much greater importance to the
Speaker 2: doctrine than did the issue of in which direction a
Speaker 2: priest could stand. But it's hard to understate how important
Speaker 2: a shift Vatican two was for the Catholic world and
Speaker 2: how divisive. The conclusion of the Second Vatican Council and
Speaker 2: all the change that accompanied it did little to quell
Speaker 2: the dissension that had been bubbling over the past several years,
Speaker 2: if not longer. Many people, both lay and clergy, continue
Speaker 2: to believe steadfastly in traditionalist Catholicism, and some went so
Speaker 2: far as to espouse the belief that by changing the
Speaker 2: Church and its practices, hope John the thirteenth committed heresies
Speaker 2: that effectively nullified his nineteen fifty eight appointment to the papacy.
Speaker 2: This belief became known as set of a Cantism, coming
Speaker 2: from the Latin phrase set of a cante, meaning with
Speaker 2: the seat being empty. The phrase was generally used to
Speaker 2: indicate the interregnal periods of the papacy after one pope
Speaker 2: had died but before a new one was elected. The
Speaker 2: set of a Cantist's adoption of the term went to
Speaker 2: their central claim that the nullification of Pope John's appointment
Speaker 2: meant that, in fact, the Holy See had remained vacant
Speaker 2: since nineteen fifty eight. But what do you do when
Speaker 2: you believe the Holy See to be vacant but the
Speaker 2: Vatican doesn't agree? Some set of a Cantists saw an
Speaker 2: obvious solution to the problem of the empty papal throne
Speaker 2: to take matters into their own hands and elect a
Speaker 2: pope themselves. David Bowden's life started out about as unremarkably
Speaker 2: as a life can start out for someone who would
Speaker 2: later claim to be the rightful pope for decades. David
Speaker 2: was born in nineteen fifty nine, the very year Pope
Speaker 2: John the thirteenth called for an ecumenical council in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma.
Speaker 2: His parents, Kennett and Clara, also known as Ticky Bowden,
Speaker 2: were devout Conservative Catholics, and Vatican Two, which concluded when
Speaker 2: David was only six years old, felt like a betrayal
Speaker 2: of their faith. The result was a traditionalist upbringing for
Speaker 2: David and his brother Brian that sowed the seeds of
Speaker 2: set of Acantism. Eventually, the Boden family became involved with
Speaker 2: the Society of Saint Pius the tenth, an international fraternity
Speaker 2: of traditionalist Catholic priests, which was founded in nineteen seventy
Speaker 2: by Archbishop Marcel Lefevre, who had been one of the
Speaker 2: leading clerical voices of opposition during Vatican Two. The Society
Speaker 2: acknowledged the Pope in Rome, but took enough issue with
Speaker 2: the reforms of Vatican Two that it was still considered
Speaker 2: schismatic by the Vatican. David Baden entered the Society's seminary
Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy seven, moving to Eccombe, Switzerland to begin
Speaker 2: his spiritual training, before transferring to a location in Michigan
Speaker 2: later that year. By the time David was dismissed from
Speaker 2: the seminary in nineteen seventy eight. It's possible he had
Speaker 2: heard of someone named Clemente Domingazigomes, known to his followers
Speaker 2: as Pope Gregory. The seventeenth Gomez, was a controversial Spanish
Speaker 2: bishop who proclaimed that Christ had come to him in
Speaker 2: a series of visions, promising that he would be pope
Speaker 2: and return the church to its former glory. Gomez cobbled
Speaker 2: together his own college of cardinals and crowned himself on
Speaker 2: August fifteenth, nineteen seventy eight, in Seville, Spain, founding what
Speaker 2: would become known as the Palmarian Christian Church. David Bowden
Speaker 2: couldn't have been particularly satisfied by that papal alternative. The
Speaker 2: Palmrian Christian Church has long been widely considered something of
Speaker 2: a cult, but that would have been the first significant
Speaker 2: example in David's lifetime of some kind of conclavist adjacent movement.
Speaker 2: A little bit more messy theology, there are several different
Speaker 2: distinct kinds of antipopes, and the differences really boil down
Speaker 2: to how those antipopes came into their claims. Many modern
Speaker 2: antipopes simply claim that God told them that they were pope.
Speaker 2: Such was the case in the Apostles of Infinite Love,
Speaker 2: an early traditionalist Catholic movement that began in the thirties
Speaker 2: but picked up some momentum following Vatican Two. Its first
Speaker 2: two popes claimed that they had been mystically made so
Speaker 2: without any need for an election or outside consideration. That's
Speaker 2: not entirely dissimilar to what Domengezi Gomez did, and that
Speaker 2: would become clear that he didn't actually care much for
Speaker 2: the practice of electing a pope by conclave when in
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five he suppressed the cardinalate and single handedly
Speaker 2: appointed his own successor. But in the decades since Vatican Two,
Speaker 2: many had to genuinely believe that although the throne of
Speaker 2: Saint Peter was vacant, the process by which a pope
Speaker 2: was chosen was still important. One needed a conclave to
Speaker 2: elect a new head of church. These people became known
Speaker 2: as Conclavists, espousing the belief that not only was a
Speaker 2: conclave important, but that one could or even should, convene
Speaker 2: their own conclave to elect a rightful pope outside of
Speaker 2: the Vatican. Despite David's dismissal from the Seminary, which he
Speaker 2: maintained was due to infighting in the institution rather than
Speaker 2: any wrongdoing on his part. David Bodden initially remained loyal
Speaker 2: to the Society of Saint Pius the Tenth. The Boden
Speaker 2: family moved to Saint Mary's, Kansas, where the society ran
Speaker 2: Saint Mary's Academy and Collegevid's brother Brian Bodden, attended school there,
Speaker 2: and David took a job, hoping to prove himself worthy
Speaker 2: of readmission to the Seminary, but in nineteen eighty one,
Speaker 2: several years and a failed seminary application later, David became
Speaker 2: dissolutioned by the Society of Saint Pius the Tenth and
Speaker 2: he struck out on his own, with his family quickly
Speaker 2: following suit. Over the next few years, the Boddends became
Speaker 2: drawn to the set of vacantist movement, and soon they
Speaker 2: believed firmly that every pope after Pious the twelfth was
Speaker 2: a heretic unfit for the papal throne, because the Society
Speaker 2: of Saint Pius the Tenth, though traditionalist, still acknowledged the
Speaker 2: Pope in Rome, who by this time was John Paul
Speaker 2: the Second. The Bodens deemed that society heretical too. As
Speaker 2: David continued to study under his own guidance and become
Speaker 2: more deeply involved with the set of a Cantist movement,
Speaker 2: or at least as involved as one could be without
Speaker 2: being ordained, he began to reach a new conclusion that
Speaker 2: perhaps there was a solution to the problem of the
Speaker 2: empty papal throne, and before long another conclusion that perhaps
Speaker 2: he was the one to fill it. In nineteen eighty seven,
Speaker 2: David began campaigning for lack of a better word. According
Speaker 2: to his writings, which he uploaded to the online ebook
Speaker 2: service script, it was in September of that year that
Speaker 2: he received a letter that would solidify his conviction that
Speaker 2: a new pope must be elected. The letter was otherwise unspecified,
Speaker 2: but he claimed that it included a quote from what
Speaker 2: he described as the only Vatican Council, that is, the
Speaker 2: first Vatican Council, which stated that Saint Peter quote would
Speaker 2: have perpetual successors in the papacy until the end of
Speaker 2: time end quote. Apparently from that letter, David immediately knew
Speaker 2: that a new pope must somehow be elected, and he
Speaker 2: decided to take.
Speaker 3: Up the cause personally.
Speaker 2: Around this time, David connected with Teresa stanfill Ben's, a
Speaker 2: Denver based woman who shared his convictions around the state
Speaker 2: of the Catholic Church and the need to call a conclave. Together,
Speaker 2: the two of them wrote a book straightforwardly titled Will
Speaker 2: the Catholic Church Survive the Twentieth Century. The book laid
Speaker 2: out numerous objections to Vatican two and their thoughts on
Speaker 2: how the Church might be saved. One such thought stands
Speaker 2: out because the actual college remained faithful to someone who
Speaker 2: they believed was a false pope. David and Theresa championed
Speaker 2: and apparent precedent within the Catholic Church for the election
Speaker 2: of a pope by quote true Catholics, that is, laypeople,
Speaker 2: instead of the usual College of Cardinals, which generally consists
Speaker 2: of senior clerical officials in the Vatican. With the path
Speaker 2: forward finally clear, David began planning to hold a papal election.
Speaker 2: He reportedly sent over two hundred copies of his and
Speaker 2: Theesa's book to every set of a Cantist priest and
Speaker 2: set of a Cantist publication he could get a hold of,
Speaker 2: hoping to inflate the number of voters at the election
Speaker 2: and thereby its legitimacy. He was hopeful that at least
Speaker 2: one ordained priest would come and vote in his homespun
Speaker 2: papal election. A few, he said, expressed interest, but ultimately,
Speaker 2: in the end none came. After months of planning and
Speaker 2: a handful of delays, putting together a papal election on
Speaker 2: your own is a logistical challenge, after all, the big
Speaker 2: day finally rolled around on July sixteenth, nineteen ninety, a
Speaker 2: day which David would later note was serendipitously also the
Speaker 2: Feast of Our Lady of Mount Carmel, a liturgical feast
Speaker 2: which had come under some scrutiny from the Vatican following
Speaker 2: Vatican two. With no perish or church to speak of,
Speaker 2: David Bowden convened the conclave in the thrift store his
Speaker 2: family owned in Bellevue, Kansas. Out of second hand furniture,
Speaker 2: the conclave made the best approximation they could of a chapel,
Speaker 2: homemade pews padded with leopard print cushions, papal throne all
Speaker 2: atop some classic nineties shag carpeting. The conclave was composed
Speaker 2: of six lay believers, including Teresa Stanfill Ben's Kennett and
Speaker 2: Tickie Bowden, David's parents, and David himself, along with a
Speaker 2: couple who traveled from Michigan for the occasion. It only
Speaker 2: took one round of voting by secret ballad before it
Speaker 2: was decided David Bowden would fill the papal throne that had,
Speaker 2: according to the conclave, been vacant for over thirty years
Speaker 2: since Pius the twelfth died the year before David's birth.
Speaker 2: The newly crowned pope chose the name Michael first, after
Speaker 2: Saint Michael, the archangel, who was said to have battled
Speaker 2: the devil himself and defended the faith against heresy. In
Speaker 2: a statigy shaky blurry video taken on the day of
Speaker 2: the election, the videographer, presumably David's father, shows David kneeling
Speaker 2: before their homemade altar in a white skull cap, a
Speaker 2: white stole with crosses on it, and a robe that
Speaker 2: looked like it may have once been a tablecloth. In
Speaker 2: a charming, somewhat mid Atlantic accent, David's father, Kenneth declares,
Speaker 2: abay moose Popham, we have a pope, and then, like
Speaker 2: all proud dads have done since the invention of the
Speaker 2: video camera, he struggles to figure out how to zoom
Speaker 2: in on the new leader of his faith. A farmhouse
Speaker 2: for a palace, an attic for a chapel, a pickup
Speaker 2: truck for a popemobile. In twenty eleven, an independent documentary
Speaker 2: was made about Pope Michael, detailing his rise to the
Speaker 2: thrift shop throne and the small but fervent movement that
Speaker 2: he had gathered around him. The film offers an intimate
Speaker 2: portrait of Pope Michael that one could never dream of
Speaker 2: getting for, say, Pope Francis. We see him eating dinner
Speaker 2: at home in Kansas with his mother Ticky, and his
Speaker 2: seminarian and papal secretary, Phil Friedel, a young man from
Speaker 2: Chicago who had left a girlfriend and an engineering education
Speaker 2: behind after corresponding with Pope Michael and feeling called to
Speaker 2: his church. We see the Christmas lights Michael used to
Speaker 2: decorate his workspace, slash chapel in his mother's attic, the
Speaker 2: old computer he used to email with his followers and
Speaker 2: update his website, and the aviator Sonny's off white trench
Speaker 2: coat combo he wore when he ran errands. We also
Speaker 2: hear about the struggles Pope Michael has faced over the years.
Speaker 2: A primary problem was that he was unknown ordained for
Speaker 2: the first twenty one years of his reign. He never
Speaker 2: did gain acceptance to a seminary after his dismissal in
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy eight, and he couldn't very well do so
Speaker 2: while both rejecting the Vatican and claiming.
Speaker 3: To already be pope.
Speaker 2: But his technically lay status meant that he could not
Speaker 2: perform any of the traditional duties of a pope or
Speaker 2: a priest for that matter. That meant, among other things,
Speaker 2: that he could not offer Mass. So in order to
Speaker 2: preach his gospel and grow his following pope, Michael turned
Speaker 2: to the newly minted Internet and started a blog, which
Speaker 2: he called Vatican in Exile. He used it to maintain
Speaker 2: contact with his followers, who remained small in number but
Speaker 2: who were based around the world. He also used it
Speaker 2: to solicit new followers, to criticiz size the Vatican, and
Speaker 2: to try to combat those who would seek to delegitimize
Speaker 2: his reign. For the entirety of Michael's reign, his blog
Speaker 2: and the Internet in general would be the primary.
Speaker 3: Tool of the papacy.
Speaker 2: I feel like I need to mention now if you
Speaker 2: found yourself charmed by David's quirky underdog story. We cannot
Speaker 2: forget that Pope Michael fancied himself a traditionalist Catholic pope.
Speaker 2: His blog, along with his other writings, was full of
Speaker 2: vitriol against queer and trans people. It was full of
Speaker 2: anti choice tirades, and, particularly after COVID hit anti vaccine misinformation.
Speaker 2: In twenty eleven, Pope Michael claimed to finally have been
Speaker 2: ordained and consecrated as a bishop by Bishop Robert b Arneson,
Speaker 2: who was part of the quote independent Catholic movement that
Speaker 2: saw clergy and laity break away from Rome and ordain
Speaker 2: and consecrate clergy without Vatican approval. It was an ordination
Speaker 2: that would never have stood up to scrutiny by Church officials,
Speaker 2: but it should be clear by now how little that
Speaker 2: would have mattered to Michael. Soon after, Michael wrote and
Speaker 2: published another book titled fifty four Years That Changed the
Speaker 2: Catholic Church nineteen fifty eight to twenty twelve, in which
Speaker 2: he retold his own story and espoused his beliefs on
Speaker 2: a wide range of doctrinal issues and perceived heresies and
Speaker 2: sins by the Church in the Vatican not to mention
Speaker 2: the secular world at large. The other great struggle of
Speaker 2: Pope Michael's reign, perhaps unsurprisingly, was near constant criticism. He
Speaker 2: dealt with pushback not only from modern Catholics, but also
Speaker 2: from his fellow set of Accantists, and even from former
Speaker 2: supporters and members of his own family. Teresa Stanfill Bens,
Speaker 2: who had made up one sixth of Michael's papal conclave,
Speaker 2: had denounced his papacy as a cult of personality several
Speaker 2: years prior to the twenty eleven documentary, including him on
Speaker 2: her list of anti popes on her blog. David's own brother,
Speaker 2: Brian Bawden, had been shocked by the election itself, and
Speaker 2: was quoted in the Miami Herald shortly after the election saying,
Speaker 2: oh my god, no, I don't know what to think.
Speaker 2: I don't follow the church in Rome. I don't go
Speaker 2: around electing popes either. We don't hear much about Brian
Speaker 2: after Pope Michael's election. From outside his circle, Pope Michael
Speaker 2: received ridicule from pro Vatican Catholics, from non Catholics, and
Speaker 2: of course from supporters of other anti popes. From a
Speaker 2: mixture of these, he received his many nicknames, the junk
Speaker 2: store Pope, the second hand Pope, and the thrift shop Pope,
Speaker 2: among others. He also claimed to have received many threats
Speaker 2: over the years, with one particularly colorful one promising to
Speaker 2: cut out his tongue and ship it to then Pope
Speaker 2: John Paul the Second. The ridicule never seemed to bother
Speaker 2: Michael much. In one interview, he equipped quote they called
Speaker 2: Jesus a kook too, though he did file a police
Speaker 2: report after that tongue threat. In July twenty twenty two,
Speaker 2: the Vatican in Exile Twitter account shared that Pope Michael
Speaker 2: had been admitted to a hospital in Kansas City, Missouri,
Speaker 2: for emergency surch injury and was in a coma. He
Speaker 2: never recovered and died on August second, twenty twenty two,
Speaker 2: at the age of sixty three. In another interview released
Speaker 2: shortly after his death, he claimed that his constant efforts
Speaker 2: online had earned his church over one hundred loyal members.
Speaker 2: David Bodden's death did not make the waves one might
Speaker 2: expect from the death of a pope. His obituary is
Speaker 2: a curious testament to the precariousness of his position. He
Speaker 2: was named only as father David Bowden, and his obituary
Speaker 2: never explicitly mentioned his claim to the papacy, naming him
Speaker 2: instead as a member of the Saint Helen's Catholic Mission
Speaker 2: Church in Topeka. It also gave him the titles of
Speaker 2: President of the Oakland Neighborhood Improvement Association and memor member
Speaker 2: of the Citizen Advisory Committee. Nevertheless, the obituary did note
Speaker 2: that he would be lying in state at Saint Helen's
Speaker 2: in honor not afforded to just anyone, not even regular
Speaker 2: quote unquote priests. In death, as in life, David embodied
Speaker 2: many of the tensions and contradictions that defined the Catholic
Speaker 2: world after Vatican Two. The papacy in the Vatican, as
Speaker 2: we all know, continued on after Pope Michael's death, with
Speaker 2: Francis and the cardinals and the bishops and most of
Speaker 2: the world ignoring him as they always had, But in
Speaker 2: the eyes of somewhere between thirty and one hundred believers,
Speaker 2: the throne of Saint Peter was vacant.
Speaker 3: Once again.
Speaker 2: That's the story of David Bodden's peculiar and contested papacy.
Speaker 2: But stick around after a brief sponsor break to hear
Speaker 2: about how his followers have continued his mission normally here
Speaker 2: at Noble Blood. Our episode's focus on a past not
Speaker 2: always distant, but usually far back enough that by the
Speaker 2: time we press record there aren't any updates. As in everything,
Speaker 2: David Bodden's story is a bit of an anomaly. His
Speaker 2: church never had very many followers, but he had some,
Speaker 2: and they have continued to try to honor his legacy
Speaker 2: and hold his church together in the time since his death.
Speaker 2: While this episode was being written in July twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: they did so by doing exactly what Pope Michael would
Speaker 2: have wanted, by convening a co enclave and electing a
Speaker 2: new pope. Their conclave began on July twenty fifth, twenty
Speaker 2: twenty three. The Vatican in Exile newsletter reported the venue
Speaker 2: as being in Vienna, Austria, but several news outlets claimed
Speaker 2: the event took place in Kansas. The conclave consisted of
Speaker 2: two American priests and two bishops. The sessions of the
Speaker 2: conclave were chaired by Pope Michael's Archbishop Rhellia Martinez, who
Speaker 2: had brought his Pope's movement to his home parish in
Speaker 2: the Philippines. It's unclear whether Martinez was counted among those
Speaker 2: in the conclave, or whether his presence brought their number
Speaker 2: up to five. This new conclave elected an unnamed priest
Speaker 2: as their new pope rather quickly, but he didn't pick
Speaker 2: up the phone when they called to tell him.
Speaker 3: He was the new Pope.
Speaker 2: Martinez chose to give him a forty eight hour grace
Speaker 2: period to accept the papacy, during which said priest did
Speaker 2: eventually call them back, but unfortunately rejected the position, just
Speaker 2: as their counterparts in the Vatican would have done. The
Speaker 2: conclave got back to work to elect someone else, and
Speaker 2: just like David Bowden did before him. On July twenty ninth,
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, Rhelio Martinez chaired the session that saw
Speaker 2: a handful of people, presumably including himself, elect him to
Speaker 2: the papacy. News outlets reported that his return to the
Speaker 2: Philippines as Pope was celebrated with a motorcade and growing
Speaker 2: number of fervent followers, not to mention threats of excommunication
Speaker 2: from local Vatican officials. Though Pope Francis has yet to
Speaker 2: acknowledge his competitor in any way. Since Martinez's election, he
Speaker 2: has taken up the task of picking up where David
Speaker 2: Bowden left off, leading his faithful, building his following, and
Speaker 2: raging against the Vatican and its perceived heresies and the
Speaker 2: pontifical name he chose that would be his Holiness, Pope Michael.
Speaker 3: The Second.
Speaker 1: Noble Blood is a production of iHeartRadio and Grimm and
Speaker 1: Mild from Aaron Manke. Noble Blood is created and hosted
Speaker 1: by me Dana Shwort, with additional writing and researching by
Speaker 1: Hannah Johnston, hannah's Wick, Mira Hayward, Courtney Sender, and Lori Goodman.
Speaker 1: The show is edited and produced by Noemi Griffin and
Speaker 1: rima Il Kahali, with supervising producer Josh Thain and executive
Speaker 1: producers Aaron Manke, Alex Williams and Matt From. For more
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