1
00:00:01,960 --> 00:00:05,360
Speaker 1: As an actor include all the TV shows that I've

2
00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:09,280
Speaker 1: done in New York, and I'm so lucky to have

3
00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:12,160
Speaker 1: been in them. But as an artist, I don't think

4
00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:15,040
Speaker 1: those made it for me. I feel like I have

5
00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:15,800
Speaker 1: more to give.

6
00:00:18,760 --> 00:00:23,400
Speaker 2: Welcome to Off the Cup, my personal anti anxiety antidote. Boy,

7
00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,920
Speaker 2: do we have a good one for you today? Let

8
00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:29,760
Speaker 2: me take you back. There was a very short era.

9
00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:32,720
Speaker 2: It was a moment in time. It was a flicker

10
00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:37,599
Speaker 2: of light that I was the exact right age, at

11
00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,800
Speaker 2: the exact right time, in the exact right place to

12
00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:44,600
Speaker 2: be right in the middle of it. And it was magic.

13
00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:49,040
Speaker 2: From nineteen ninety eight to two thousand and four, if

14
00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:51,920
Speaker 2: you were a twenty somethingter professional woman living in Manhattan,

15
00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:55,440
Speaker 2: you saw your life, or maybe the life you wanted,

16
00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:59,640
Speaker 2: depicted on screen in a hit television show with much

17
00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:03,240
Speaker 2: better fashion than you could ever afford. Sex and the

18
00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:06,040
Speaker 2: City came out when I was finishing college, and then

19
00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,600
Speaker 2: I moved to the city to become a writer. No surprise,

20
00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,680
Speaker 2: it made a big impact on my life. And if

21
00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:15,839
Speaker 2: you lived in the city, it was like a guidebook.

22
00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:18,720
Speaker 2: It told us what restaurants to go to, which clubs

23
00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,000
Speaker 2: and bars to go to, where to shop, where to live,

24
00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:23,440
Speaker 2: where to look for love? What kind of guys to avoid?

25
00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,039
Speaker 2: I bought my first Manolo's when I was twenty three.

26
00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,280
Speaker 2: I spent an entire paycheck. It would be years before

27
00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:33,640
Speaker 2: I could afford my second pair. But whether it was

28
00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,600
Speaker 2: Sushi Samba or the Gay Bars and Chelsea or Monkey

29
00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:39,520
Speaker 2: Bar or Barney as you name it, we were lucky

30
00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,760
Speaker 2: enough to just go to all the places they went.

31
00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:46,039
Speaker 2: Millions of people watched the show, we got to live it,

32
00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:50,559
Speaker 2: and looking back, it was such a bygone era of television,

33
00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:54,000
Speaker 2: of New York City, of media, of fashion. It's an

34
00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:56,560
Speaker 2: incredible time capsule. And of course it lives on in

35
00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:59,080
Speaker 2: the two Sex and the City movies and the rebooted

36
00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:01,360
Speaker 2: and just like that's series which just ended this year.

37
00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:06,279
Speaker 2: It is beloved and deservedly so. And my next guest

38
00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:11,320
Speaker 2: is a huge or shall I say big reason why.

39
00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,720
Speaker 2: He's known for his roles on Law and Order and

40
00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,040
Speaker 2: The Good Wife. He's an award winning actor of film

41
00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:21,120
Speaker 2: and television and theater. Chris Notath, Welcome to Off the Cup.

42
00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:22,680
Speaker 1: What an intro.

43
00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:29,480
Speaker 2: Listen. You have to know how people feel about that show.

44
00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:33,480
Speaker 2: And like I said, I was the perfect age and

45
00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,760
Speaker 2: time and place and profession and personality for that show.

46
00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:38,520
Speaker 2: It just spoke to.

47
00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:44,160
Speaker 1: Me, Yeah, I should have taken it more seriously.

48
00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:50,520
Speaker 2: I think that you just enjoyed it and obviously worked

49
00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:52,840
Speaker 2: very hard on it. But I think that was probably best.

50
00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:56,160
Speaker 1: I did enjoy the early years. I did think it

51
00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 1: got a little over glamorized later on, Yesez, I thought

52
00:03:02,760 --> 00:03:06,480
Speaker 1: it lost its compass a bit later on. It's like

53
00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:09,440
Speaker 1: anything to please the audience type of thing once they said,

54
00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:12,360
Speaker 1: oh they like this, you know, yeah, Whereas there was

55
00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:18,880
Speaker 1: bittersweetness and irony and satire and drama at the beginning,

56
00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:22,640
Speaker 1: and it wasn't so much about the moon. I can't

57
00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:25,160
Speaker 1: even pronounce that show. Pronounce that for me?

58
00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,760
Speaker 2: Well, Manolo's yeah, yes, it's a good thing that you can't.

59
00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:33,040
Speaker 2: It's fine, it's not for you. It wasn't for you,

60
00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:39,320
Speaker 2: but you're right. The movies became references like how many

61
00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:43,880
Speaker 2: outfit changes can we have in one scene? And little

62
00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:45,800
Speaker 2: it lost sort of the heart of it a little bit.

63
00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:46,440
Speaker 2: I know what you mean.

64
00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:49,400
Speaker 1: But there was a lot in those first years that

65
00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:50,880
Speaker 1: was new and different.

66
00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:52,640
Speaker 3: And it was grittier.

67
00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:54,920
Speaker 1: I didn't even I don't think any of us knew

68
00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:59,360
Speaker 1: what it would become. I certainly didn't. I remember when

69
00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,120
Speaker 1: my agent first said, do you want to go on

70
00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:04,720
Speaker 1: in this meeting because HBO at that time was still

71
00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:08,520
Speaker 1: finding its way. Yeah, yes, And they said do you

72
00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:10,480
Speaker 1: want to go? You don't have to it's this little

73
00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:14,120
Speaker 1: ditty you know or something. They said, well, I'm not

74
00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,280
Speaker 1: working right now, let me go find out. And what

75
00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:18,640
Speaker 1: I read the pilot, the line that intrigued me was

76
00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:21,080
Speaker 1: when she says at the end, have you ever been

77
00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:23,200
Speaker 1: in love? And he says, abs fucking I said, well,

78
00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:27,760
Speaker 1: that's interesting. Yes, sure about this name, mister big, What

79
00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:33,960
Speaker 1: the hell is that? So? I think I went into

80
00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,839
Speaker 1: Darren's Star to meet Darren Starr and I was wearing

81
00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:40,680
Speaker 1: sunglasses and he had no idea about my previous career.

82
00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,960
Speaker 1: And I read somewhere he said if I had seen

83
00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:46,200
Speaker 1: him in Law and Order, I never would have cast

84
00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:46,560
Speaker 1: him in.

85
00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:48,640
Speaker 3: This, Oh my gosh, because you.

86
00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,800
Speaker 1: Know, so I lucked out that way, and I just said, sure,

87
00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,680
Speaker 1: let's let's let's go with it. I was at the

88
00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:59,039
Speaker 1: time doing a Law and Order movie called Exiled, and

89
00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:03,719
Speaker 1: I was all wrapped up in that, so I really

90
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:06,920
Speaker 1: hadn't given it much thought, but the writing was so

91
00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,520
Speaker 1: good it sort of took care of me.

92
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:11,280
Speaker 3: You know, uh huh, you know what I mean?

93
00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,360
Speaker 2: Were you told? And listen, we're gonna I want to

94
00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:16,440
Speaker 2: talk about you as well. But while we're on Sex

95
00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:20,520
Speaker 2: and City, were you told at the beginning that you

96
00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:24,240
Speaker 2: were going to be a long time love interest or

97
00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:26,360
Speaker 2: were you told like maybe a season?

98
00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:29,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it was season to season And then

99
00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:32,880
Speaker 1: when it caught fire, like I said, they said, hey,

100
00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:37,839
Speaker 1: you know, let's take advantage of this. I'll never forget again.

101
00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,840
Speaker 1: When we shot it, I just I had a lot

102
00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:43,599
Speaker 1: of fun doing it. At that time. I had I

103
00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,719
Speaker 1: thought a nice chemistry with the girl who plays Carrie.

104
00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:52,080
Speaker 3: And that girl, that girl, and but I.

105
00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:54,760
Speaker 1: Kind of said, okay, that job's over, you know. And

106
00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:58,039
Speaker 1: you know, HBO at the time, which was different than

107
00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,000
Speaker 1: other TV, would repeat it over the so we shot

108
00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,960
Speaker 1: and it repeated. So I hadn't heard anything in a while.

109
00:06:04,000 --> 00:06:07,120
Speaker 1: So I was outside a cafe in New York Upper

110
00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:09,160
Speaker 1: East Side with my good friend Charlie Kipps, who wrote

111
00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,160
Speaker 1: exceled talking, and all of a sudden we both heard

112
00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,400
Speaker 1: this sort of noise coming toward us, who was a

113
00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,479
Speaker 1: sort of a group of young women, and there was

114
00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:22,120
Speaker 1: kind of like, you know, I was hearing lies like

115
00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:26,840
Speaker 1: is that that? Is? That? That? That's And I was like, oh, yeah,

116
00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:29,520
Speaker 1: what And all of a sudden they started screaming at me. Now, look,

117
00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:31,120
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to pretend to a rock star thing,

118
00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:33,240
Speaker 1: but I turned my head and they were coming at me.

119
00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:34,560
Speaker 3: Yelling, are you about that?

120
00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:35,880
Speaker 2: Big? Yeah?

121
00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:40,160
Speaker 1: Got the fuck up? Let me get out of here.

122
00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:43,800
Speaker 1: I was. It scared me a little now, but that

123
00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:47,880
Speaker 1: was the beginning of like saying this, this has caught

124
00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:51,880
Speaker 1: the imagination of people. Yes, I still didn't take it

125
00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:56,040
Speaker 1: too seriously, but that was my first insight into this

126
00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:57,479
Speaker 1: could be bigger than I ever thought.

127
00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:01,839
Speaker 2: And it was because then it became culturally very important.

128
00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:07,560
Speaker 2: But more than that, I remember after nine to eleven,

129
00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,840
Speaker 2: which you know, was just so devastating to those of

130
00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,360
Speaker 2: us who lived in Manhattan, especially shows like Sex and

131
00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,560
Speaker 2: the City and SNL and even like the Mets and

132
00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,520
Speaker 2: the Yankees, they were really important. They had a bigger

133
00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,480
Speaker 2: job to do now, which was to bring New Yorkers

134
00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:28,440
Speaker 2: together and show the world we were going to be okay.

135
00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:30,600
Speaker 2: And I loved the episode that had the ladies going

136
00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:32,000
Speaker 2: I don't know if you remember this, because you weren't

137
00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,840
Speaker 2: in this part, but the ladies go downtown. They talk

138
00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:38,480
Speaker 2: about throwing some much needed money downtown to like save

139
00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,600
Speaker 2: the economy, and it was a thing we were all

140
00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:45,880
Speaker 2: talking about, you know, going downtown, eating downtown so that

141
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,320
Speaker 2: these businesses could open up again. And it took on

142
00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:52,720
Speaker 2: a whole new level of relevance. So I mean, through

143
00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:57,680
Speaker 2: all the iterations of those six seasons, it just became.

144
00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:01,520
Speaker 1: Part of New York, part of what it still is.

145
00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:03,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I do remember that.

146
00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:05,960
Speaker 1: God nine to eleven, I was downtown and then I

147
00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:09,600
Speaker 1: lived in the village, and I remember we went to

148
00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:13,200
Speaker 1: this place, the Knickerbocker, and just watched the people on

149
00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:18,320
Speaker 1: University Place coming from downtown walking covered in ash, some

150
00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:19,960
Speaker 1: of them. It was, yes, docking.

151
00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:22,400
Speaker 3: It's just wow, you know what's wild?

152
00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:25,960
Speaker 2: Chris. So, I mean I lived that too, and I

153
00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,840
Speaker 2: have my own memories, and I took pictures that day

154
00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:36,160
Speaker 2: with my camera. And my son, who's now ten turning eleven,

155
00:08:36,800 --> 00:08:40,400
Speaker 2: is learning about it in school and he's very interested

156
00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:43,280
Speaker 2: and he knows that I was there, and you know,

157
00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,000
Speaker 2: you know, mom, can I see your pictures, which he

158
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:48,200
Speaker 2: very rudely asked if they were in black and white,

159
00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:51,520
Speaker 2: and I'm like, dude, dude, it was two thousand and one.

160
00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,760
Speaker 2: We had colored pictures. But he wanted to go to

161
00:08:55,760 --> 00:08:59,679
Speaker 2: the nine to eleven Memorial downtown and the museum. So

162
00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:01,960
Speaker 2: I'm I'm seeing it again. I'm seeing nine to eleven

163
00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:03,559
Speaker 2: kind of again through different eyes.

164
00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:04,160
Speaker 1: Wild.

165
00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,679
Speaker 2: Okay, we're going to get back to sex and the city,

166
00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,680
Speaker 2: but I want to just talk about you. I know

167
00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:12,000
Speaker 2: you're born in the Midwest, but then you moved to Stanford,

168
00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:13,520
Speaker 2: Connecticut pretty young, right.

169
00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,559
Speaker 1: Our family, Yeah, both my parents to find work.

170
00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:19,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the town next to mine, so I'm real

171
00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:21,880
Speaker 2: familiar with it. What kind of kid were you?

172
00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:31,600
Speaker 1: Oh jeez, I was kind of wild and untamed. I

173
00:09:31,640 --> 00:09:33,880
Speaker 1: was getting a lot of trouble in school at a

174
00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:37,880
Speaker 1: young age. You know. I had two older brothers sort

175
00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:43,240
Speaker 1: of used me as a soccer ball in a loving way.

176
00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:46,480
Speaker 1: But we were lucky in those days. In Stamford was

177
00:09:46,559 --> 00:09:49,680
Speaker 1: such a rural North Stamford. I lived on Webb Hill Road,

178
00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:54,800
Speaker 1: off a long ridge. Yep, too many corners. Okay, you

179
00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:58,600
Speaker 1: could have been in Vermont. We we had a believe

180
00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:01,040
Speaker 1: it or not, This is kind of funny Webhill Road,

181
00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:04,839
Speaker 1: and you went up Webhill Road and you got toward

182
00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:09,280
Speaker 1: our little driveway and on the left side was a

183
00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:12,640
Speaker 1: eight acres of a house with a field that was

184
00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:16,320
Speaker 1: a Saint Bernard kennel with like hundreds of Saint Bernards

185
00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:17,200
Speaker 1: that when you would.

186
00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:19,120
Speaker 3: Walk by, you know, oh my gosh.

187
00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:19,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

188
00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:23,480
Speaker 1: On the left was a little tiny graveyard from the

189
00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:27,520
Speaker 1: eighteenth century of all the webs who were buried in

190
00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:31,680
Speaker 1: this little plot at the base of our stone driveway

191
00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:34,080
Speaker 1: which went up and then over to our house, which

192
00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:36,760
Speaker 1: was a barn that had been turned into a house

193
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:40,360
Speaker 1: like turn of the century. So my brother and I

194
00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,079
Speaker 1: lived in the hayloft. So we lived the really and

195
00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:46,640
Speaker 1: across the field was the meadow. We had a lot

196
00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:50,680
Speaker 1: of nature around us. And across the field was a

197
00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,360
Speaker 1: home we called the Haunted House. It looked like a

198
00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:57,120
Speaker 1: Southern sort of one of those homes that's got to

199
00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:00,719
Speaker 1: wrap around porch and a widow's peak, widows whatever they

200
00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:01,120
Speaker 1: call it.

201
00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:02,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

202
00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:05,200
Speaker 1: Apparently in the twenty some woman for whatever reason walked

203
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,280
Speaker 1: out and never came back, and everything just sat there

204
00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:11,880
Speaker 1: for decades. He used to sneak in there and it was,

205
00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,360
Speaker 1: you know, all the pictures and the letters of people.

206
00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,600
Speaker 1: Still a life, you know, this whole life was. Yeah,

207
00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:22,280
Speaker 1: we used to nip a vase or something, a grand piano,

208
00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,840
Speaker 1: the slippers under the bed. It was truly haunted, ow creepy.

209
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:32,319
Speaker 1: It was, so my imagination was pretty excited by all this.

210
00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:33,040
Speaker 1: Growing up.

211
00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:38,000
Speaker 2: What happens when your dad dies you're eleven.

212
00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:42,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you know, it's hard to talk about. It

213
00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:48,400
Speaker 1: was such a painful marriage they had. My mom was

214
00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:51,360
Speaker 1: a very ambitious woman and the successful one, and my dad.

215
00:11:52,880 --> 00:11:54,800
Speaker 1: I consider him to be a war hero. I mean

216
00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:58,760
Speaker 1: he came out a career. He was on a flew

217
00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,400
Speaker 1: their planes off the aircraft carriers, and I think he

218
00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:07,199
Speaker 1: was very damaged by it. And I think coming out

219
00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:12,120
Speaker 1: of the Navy he lost his way and didn't know

220
00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:15,000
Speaker 1: how to get back into normal society. And I know

221
00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:17,080
Speaker 1: that some of this program is about mental health, and

222
00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,840
Speaker 1: part of what I feel bad about is that he

223
00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:24,880
Speaker 1: had no outlet to go to. They went to booze

224
00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:28,640
Speaker 1: and smoking, and it's like they didn't know better, and

225
00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:31,320
Speaker 1: he it was painful to watch as a kid. So

226
00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:33,880
Speaker 1: that sort of is part of the fabric of growing up.

227
00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:37,720
Speaker 1: So that the marriage was bad and it was hard

228
00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:40,520
Speaker 1: for us, and it was almost I don't want to

229
00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:46,319
Speaker 1: say a relief, but maybe like maybe he's found some peace.

230
00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:49,439
Speaker 1: I don't know about him a lot. He's buried in Arlington.

231
00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:53,000
Speaker 1: I brought my son over because he did a silver Star.

232
00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,920
Speaker 1: He won a lot of different things flying and we

233
00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:59,079
Speaker 1: have a picture of my oldest son Ryan and I

234
00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:02,600
Speaker 1: had his grave Orlington. And he was a really smart man.

235
00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:05,839
Speaker 1: He was like a he was super like. He could

236
00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:07,959
Speaker 1: have been a what do they call them bridge when

237
00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:11,760
Speaker 1: they played that game bridge, Like he could have been

238
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:17,640
Speaker 1: a bridge whatever master. Yeah. Yeah, Whereas my mother was

239
00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,160
Speaker 1: super ambitious and I guess felt the weight of having

240
00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:22,760
Speaker 1: to take care of three boys. God I have two,

241
00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:26,320
Speaker 1: and like I can imagine alone because basically, you know,

242
00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:28,520
Speaker 1: he worked for an insurance company and was making nothing. Well,

243
00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:32,480
Speaker 1: of course, in those days things were very reasonably cheap,

244
00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:36,200
Speaker 1: I mean compared to we're talking the sixties, for God's sake.

245
00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, but the.

246
00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:41,079
Speaker 1: Pressure was on her and she she was a very

247
00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:45,520
Speaker 1: glamorous woman, very headstrong, and so that was a that

248
00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:49,240
Speaker 1: was tough. And I think my brothers and I had

249
00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:52,079
Speaker 1: a lot of freedom because she would work. Yeah, we

250
00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:56,360
Speaker 1: liked in New York. But she she demanded a lot

251
00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:57,280
Speaker 1: from us too.

252
00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:01,360
Speaker 2: And I know your team years are a little tumultuous.

253
00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:05,199
Speaker 2: There's some moves, there's some trouble eventually, boarding school. What

254
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:07,720
Speaker 2: what happens when you get to the Barlow School?

255
00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:11,800
Speaker 1: Though? Oh Barlow was like a lifesaver for me. Yeah,

256
00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:15,160
Speaker 1: I mean, listen, it was the late sixties. All my

257
00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:18,840
Speaker 1: I you know, I had When you're thirteen and fourteen,

258
00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,320
Speaker 1: it's your friends that become your family. And of course,

259
00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:29,000
Speaker 1: you know, jeez, marijuana and that rock and roll was

260
00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:30,280
Speaker 1: all coming to Fruition.

261
00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:31,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

262
00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:34,080
Speaker 1: I remember I went with my brother to try to

263
00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:37,240
Speaker 1: get to Woodstock, just in my friend at the back

264
00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:39,160
Speaker 1: seat of the car. We got We got there, but

265
00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:43,240
Speaker 1: so far back in the line, it's like, uh, what

266
00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:44,040
Speaker 1: do we do now?

267
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:46,640
Speaker 3: People buy another town.

268
00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:49,520
Speaker 1: We were at Woodstock, we didn't hear any music, but

269
00:14:49,800 --> 00:14:54,400
Speaker 1: we're our road ten miles out. Yeah, And I just

270
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:56,640
Speaker 1: think it's a little crazy when I think back of

271
00:14:56,840 --> 00:14:58,880
Speaker 1: what my friends and I used to do. We're you know,

272
00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:04,680
Speaker 1: getting trouble seemed to be fun, you know, taking down

273
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:09,400
Speaker 1: the signs of all the streets or whatever, but which

274
00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:12,560
Speaker 1: drove my mother crazy. And so that's what I mean

275
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:16,280
Speaker 1: when I was a bit wild and untamed, although around

276
00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:20,720
Speaker 1: her it was like, you know, the military, and it

277
00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:23,000
Speaker 1: was an odd life because she had a very sort

278
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,200
Speaker 1: of glamorous life. She was a CBS news correspondent and

279
00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:31,520
Speaker 1: so she was some really big names were coming around

280
00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:34,520
Speaker 1: the house and of course like great impression. So when

281
00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:37,560
Speaker 1: I was getting in trouble at school for having a cigarette,

282
00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:40,160
Speaker 1: which was terrible that we were doing that, smoking it,

283
00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:46,040
Speaker 1: you know, fourteen or fifteen, but we were, and that

284
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:52,680
Speaker 1: just sort of enraged her. So she, I think mistakenly

285
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:56,480
Speaker 1: said these kids need a father. So she got married

286
00:15:57,400 --> 00:16:00,800
Speaker 1: and we moved, of all places, to Newport Beach, California.

287
00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:05,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, big mistake. Yeah, God, we hated it.

288
00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:08,840
Speaker 1: And you know, he wasn't thinking and then she walked

289
00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:12,480
Speaker 1: away from She could have been what doing with Barbara Walters.

290
00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:15,600
Speaker 1: She was right on the cusp of making that happen.

291
00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,200
Speaker 1: It was very popular at CBS. She had just done

292
00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:24,320
Speaker 1: one of the first women commentaries in the sports world.

293
00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:26,840
Speaker 1: You know, now women are all over the place.

294
00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:28,240
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, but then it was rare.

295
00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,160
Speaker 1: Yeah sixty nine. Suddenly she I think it was with

296
00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,440
Speaker 1: Frank Efft, because I know he worked for a CBS.

297
00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:35,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that was a big thing. And she walked

298
00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:37,760
Speaker 3: away from all of that and because.

299
00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 1: To marry this guy. I think she was in love

300
00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:43,040
Speaker 1: with the guy, and you know, she thought she was

301
00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:45,600
Speaker 1: and she thought she was helping saving the family because

302
00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:51,120
Speaker 1: these wild kids need to be crawled at. So we moved.

303
00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:53,880
Speaker 1: There was just terrible. I mean, the culture shock of

304
00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,880
Speaker 1: going from the Connecticut woods and your friends to southern

305
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:01,160
Speaker 1: California where people are saying things like bitching and far

306
00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:08,600
Speaker 1: out like man, it was painful and I got in

307
00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:16,959
Speaker 1: trouble there, you know. And then her fix was, well,

308
00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:19,920
Speaker 1: I really wanted to go back east, and you're going back.

309
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:23,240
Speaker 1: You're going to a prep school. You know, your brother

310
00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:25,960
Speaker 1: went to Mount Herman. My oldest brother's you know, a scholar,

311
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:31,960
Speaker 1: you know, really smart athlete, one in boards and pole vaulting,

312
00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,320
Speaker 1: did all kinds of stuff. You know. Meanwhile the younger

313
00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:39,840
Speaker 1: fuck up, like I just didn't know what to do

314
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:44,760
Speaker 1: with me, you know. And uh so she said, yeah,

315
00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:46,639
Speaker 1: you're going to Mount Herman and you're gonna get a

316
00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:50,160
Speaker 1: great education. So we went up to interview and they

317
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,600
Speaker 1: kind of looked at my record and looked at my

318
00:17:52,720 --> 00:18:00,199
Speaker 1: mom's but we do know, there are some kinds of

319
00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:04,280
Speaker 1: schools that are happening that I think may be better

320
00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:09,360
Speaker 1: for him, and because he's not for this, you know,

321
00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:11,760
Speaker 1: and she said, oh, but what would that be. Well,

322
00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,560
Speaker 1: there's the Buxton School, and there's the Barlow School over

323
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:19,040
Speaker 1: in Amenia, Dutchess County, and that may fit him a

324
00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:22,840
Speaker 1: little bit better. And so, you know, my mother was

325
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,760
Speaker 1: very suspicious. She believed in the Ivy League, you know.

326
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,359
Speaker 1: But we'll go look at it. So we drove into

327
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,720
Speaker 1: the gorgeous I don't know if you've been to Dutchess County,

328
00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:34,159
Speaker 1: it's beautiful arm and especially in the this is nineteen

329
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:38,199
Speaker 1: seventy now, the rolling hills and the something bucolic about it,

330
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:41,240
Speaker 1: right out of a kind of a Wordsworth poem or something. Yes,

331
00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:45,080
Speaker 1: So we were driving past the campus and there it

332
00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:47,960
Speaker 1: is on a hill, just beautifully laid out, and I

333
00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:49,840
Speaker 1: was like looking at it. And we made a turn

334
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,280
Speaker 1: and we were coming down to go to the medmaster's

335
00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,760
Speaker 1: house and I looked at the left and there's this gorgeous, beautiful,

336
00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:01,640
Speaker 1: sparkling small not lake, but big big pond, let's put

337
00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:04,040
Speaker 1: it that way. It's small lake kind of thing, and

338
00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:06,199
Speaker 1: I looked, and all of a sudden, there were like

339
00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:08,760
Speaker 1: ten young women skinny dipping.

340
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:10,000
Speaker 2: Oh.

341
00:19:10,119 --> 00:19:12,840
Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, this is for me.

342
00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:17,280
Speaker 1: Look my mother was looking the other way to make

343
00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:19,280
Speaker 1: the turn, and I said, geeze, mom, I have a

344
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:20,600
Speaker 1: really good feeling about this.

345
00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:25,600
Speaker 2: I'm gonna like it here.

346
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,080
Speaker 1: I think I may like it here. And so I

347
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:33,119
Speaker 1: went and it. It definitely changed my life. I don't know,

348
00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:36,960
Speaker 1: I think I should be instituted every institution. I've gone

349
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:40,880
Speaker 1: to Barlow, Marlborough College, Yale Drama, I've I've had such

350
00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:48,480
Speaker 1: great times and so happy. I should institutionalize myself. But

351
00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,040
Speaker 1: that kind of tremendous. Yeah. I like the structure, and

352
00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:57,440
Speaker 1: I like I like academia. I like the study of everything,

353
00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:01,159
Speaker 1: and I mean Yale drama was great because I had

354
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 1: been struggling for you know, New York in the late seventies,

355
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:09,600
Speaker 1: early eighties. It's like, it's just it was hard and

356
00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:13,800
Speaker 1: suddenly to go to drama school at Yale, where they're

357
00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:15,760
Speaker 1: going to say, you'll probably end up doing about twenty

358
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:19,480
Speaker 1: five plays within three years because you've got directors, designers,

359
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:24,720
Speaker 1: actors all working toward that production. You know, our first production,

360
00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:28,600
Speaker 1: our first year was the lower depths and Gorky and

361
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,199
Speaker 1: it was like God, it was like, I get to

362
00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:33,439
Speaker 1: do this part I played. The actor actually was a

363
00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:34,480
Speaker 1: drunken Russian.

364
00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:38,359
Speaker 2: But you get I mean, you end up being able

365
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,560
Speaker 2: to study with like two great Sandy Meiser and Stella Adler, Like.

366
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I did stella Adler's and Meisner was great,

367
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:48,639
Speaker 1: the greatest teacher I had there. Actually, because Meisner was

368
00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:52,000
Speaker 1: off and away he wasn't doing well. I actually studied

369
00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,840
Speaker 1: privately with him. But Richie Pinter, who ran the school,

370
00:20:56,359 --> 00:21:02,160
Speaker 1: was just this great teacher. And again another institution I thrived.

371
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,520
Speaker 2: And how do you get to law and Order after Yale?

372
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:08,000
Speaker 2: How do you get to law and order? How does

373
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:08,440
Speaker 2: that happen?

374
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:12,919
Speaker 1: Well? I didn't immediately get I got out of Yale,

375
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,840
Speaker 1: and god, the first job I got, you know, was

376
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,679
Speaker 1: a soap opera, Believe it or Not, which was really boring,

377
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:25,720
Speaker 1: and I knew I didn't like that. And then I

378
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,679
Speaker 1: did some jobs here and there, you know, but I

379
00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:33,719
Speaker 1: was really a little frustrated. And then I got a

380
00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:38,679
Speaker 1: movie which would today would be considered a low budget movie,

381
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,960
Speaker 1: and it was shooting in Indonesia, in Jakarta, and it

382
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: was called I was like, Ji Karta, this is like,

383
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,679
Speaker 1: I mean, my geography wasn't too solid. I guess. I

384
00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:55,359
Speaker 1: was like, what the hell is the capital of Indonesia?

385
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,879
Speaker 1: But it's like everyone knows it from Bali being down

386
00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 1: an hour and a half light.

387
00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,400
Speaker 3: Everyone goes to you know, they're not the same.

388
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,359
Speaker 1: No, even though it's the same country.

389
00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:07,200
Speaker 2: Right, they're not the same.

390
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:09,240
Speaker 1: And they said I was going to be there for

391
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,960
Speaker 1: eight weeks, and I was there for about seven months.

392
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:15,879
Speaker 3: Oh wow, Yeah.

393
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,679
Speaker 1: And what happened was the living experience turned into the

394
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:21,840
Speaker 1: whole thing. The movie was just my day job, and

395
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,400
Speaker 1: at that point I was making what would today would

396
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,000
Speaker 1: be considered scale. But for me it was like heaven,

397
00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,760
Speaker 1: you know, because I made some of my most lifelong

398
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:34,280
Speaker 1: friends there. And it was right after that when I

399
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: got home in the fall. I went in January of

400
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,520
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty seven, and I got back in November of

401
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,679
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty seven from that job. But I started to

402
00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,120
Speaker 1: get back in the swing of things, and I got

403
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 1: the audition and I had been an auditioning and a

404
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:55,239
Speaker 1: very well known and respected casting director named Lynk Kressel.

405
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:57,359
Speaker 1: I was a terrible I probably still am. I was

406
00:22:57,359 --> 00:23:02,320
Speaker 1: a terrible auditioner. I missed. Thought, yeah, you just go

407
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 1: and you wing it because you want to be spontaneous,

408
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 1: and that can work once in a blue moon, but

409
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:10,840
Speaker 1: then when you got to come back and do it again.

410
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 1: I remember I had a great audition for Moonstruck. I

411
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:15,879
Speaker 1: would have got Nicholas Cage anywhere, but I had a

412
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 1: great one. And they called me back and I was like,

413
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:20,880
Speaker 1: I'll just do the same thing because I had gone

414
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,480
Speaker 1: there and winged. Yeah, I can just stunk up the room.

415
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, I can't see it. But Lynn Kressel

416
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:32,080
Speaker 1: actually said, listen, don't do what you usually do. You

417
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 1: need to take me seriously. You've got telling me you

418
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:41,000
Speaker 1: your auditions are. You know you could get this put

419
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:47,040
Speaker 1: something into it. And so I did, and I had

420
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 1: to be flown out to the Black Tower and Universal,

421
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:54,439
Speaker 1: which is where when it starts getting close you go

422
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 1: up there, and George Zunza was there, who was my

423
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 1: first partner. I don't know. They liked our chemistry kind

424
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 1: of and also the physical difference, and I guess I

425
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:09,639
Speaker 1: was what they were looking for. And I was super

426
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:14,199
Speaker 1: exciting because shooting in New York a series and getting paid,

427
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,920
Speaker 1: I mean holy cow. I just you know, I was

428
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,560
Speaker 1: used to living in maid's rooms for eighty eight dollars

429
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:25,680
Speaker 1: a month. And I have to tell you that practically

430
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:29,119
Speaker 1: all of my first year of Law and Order for me,

431
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:33,760
Speaker 1: I can't even watch the episodes. My acting is so bad. No,

432
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 1: I just didn't understand what I needed to do, which

433
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,359
Speaker 1: is to not try to do so much. It's like,

434
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 1: why are you, dude? Why are you? Why are you indicating?

435
00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 1: Why shut up? You know? You know, it was almost

436
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:57,480
Speaker 1: the language was so spars, so uncharacter driven, that you

437
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,239
Speaker 1: felt you had to make something out of it. And

438
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:04,200
Speaker 1: I watched that whole first season. I just go, oh god,

439
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 1: it's hard for me. But you know, they didn't fire me,

440
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 1: and I think I started to get the hang of it, probably,

441
00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 1: I would say, by the last couple of episodes, and

442
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: then I realized it's just about being there and letting

443
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:21,600
Speaker 1: the moment happen.

444
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 2: And then does sex and the City start at the

445
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 2: simultaneously like you're doing.

446
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 1: I left the Law and Order in ninety five. I

447
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:45,679
Speaker 1: just ninety eight ninety nine. Yeah, we did the pilot.

448
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:47,439
Speaker 1: I think at the end of ninety eight somewhere Night

449
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,440
Speaker 1: got you. Yeah, came out in ninety nine.

450
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 2: So now you're in another New York.

451
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:57,160
Speaker 1: Another New York show, show York shows. Yeah again without

452
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: any real idea of what it would become. You know.

453
00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, right is cool.

454
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:05,920
Speaker 2: But you really could have played mister Big a lot

455
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:07,919
Speaker 2: of ways. And I think what made him such a

456
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 2: great character is that he is layered. He's not just

457
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 2: one thing or another thing.

458
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,639
Speaker 1: Well, the the funny thing is is I'm more of

459
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 1: an Aiden hair down to here playing guitar.

460
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:19,919
Speaker 2: You told me this the other night. You told me

461
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 2: this the other night, that you're more of an Aiden

462
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,720
Speaker 2: than a mister Big, and it shook me to my core.

463
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,640
Speaker 2: But Chris, tell me what this means.

464
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 1: I'm an old hippie, you know. And I don't do

465
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: woodworking like Aiden, you know. But you know I played

466
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:38,120
Speaker 1: guitar badly, and I commune with nature. I don't care

467
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:41,679
Speaker 1: about clothes. I have the same to this day. My

468
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 1: wife gave me these corduroys and I wear them out

469
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 1: and then I get them fixed. Luckily, I got to

470
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: keep all my suits from Sex in the City, so

471
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:54,160
Speaker 1: I can look dapper if I want. And I haven't

472
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,919
Speaker 1: bought a suit sentence. But the fact that people know

473
00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: me is like the businessman, dapper and all that.

474
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

475
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:05,200
Speaker 1: I had to shed so many bad habits to portray

476
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,919
Speaker 1: that man because I'm a bit of a slob. The

477
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,919
Speaker 1: part taught me a lot actually about he has patience

478
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:18,679
Speaker 1: I'm working on still. He's very modulated. He's very logical

479
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 1: and reasonable and also honest about who he is.

480
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:26,160
Speaker 3: Yes, I always say he.

481
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 1: Never tried to be anything when they go, you know,

482
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: he was terrible to carry it. He never tried to

483
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 1: be anything that he wasn't. He was who he was,

484
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:39,640
Speaker 1: which was rich, and he had a life that he liked, yep.

485
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: And he had boundaries, but he had you know, he

486
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:48,880
Speaker 1: adored carried and he probably knew that in many ways

487
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 1: they weren't right for each other. But he got a

488
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,119
Speaker 1: kick out of her, and he didn't take relationships, it

489
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 1: seems to me in the same way that she did.

490
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: I remember at the beginning I said to Jarreing, I said,

491
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,919
Speaker 1: can we get away from the suave bola? You know,

492
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 1: you know, would you like some more of this expensive wine?

493
00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:09,119
Speaker 1: Maybe I should get you a diamond to make you

494
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: feel better? Come on, I mean, my favorite episodes are

495
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: when she farts in bed.

496
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, great, when we fall in the pond great.

497
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:23,040
Speaker 1: And really my ultimate favorite were the mud Fights. Yes, Gon,

498
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 1: and that's based a little bit on a true story.

499
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,440
Speaker 1: I did have a flirtation with a well known actress

500
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 1: and I gave him the line Michael Patrick Kingey, that's

501
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 1: what makes him good as a writer. I think he

502
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: likes to take stuff from you. And I'm not going

503
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,479
Speaker 1: to name who that it was, but I said, and

504
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 1: I said, use this line in it.

505
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,200
Speaker 2: I already know what you're gonna say. He can read me,

506
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 2: but I can never.

507
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 1: But I could never get her that fucked up. So

508
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 1: when we bond at the end, I think is brilliant, brilliant.

509
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 3: Right, brilliant.

510
00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 2: But that episode was so important for his character, for

511
00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:01,920
Speaker 2: mister Big to be vulnerable. Yeah, and you needed to

512
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 2: see him kind of messed up from a woman and yeah, yeah,

513
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 2: kind of groveling and Carrie, I need your help. And

514
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 2: that that's one of my favorite episodes too, because it

515
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 2: was it was such a different It was a role

516
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 2: reversal that we needed to see, and.

517
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: That element is what to me was so missing in

518
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 1: the movies. And of course the other show I don't

519
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 1: even watch, but judging by the episode I was in,

520
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 1: it wasn't anything I was really that interested. In fact,

521
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:33,640
Speaker 1: I cut myself lucky.

522
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 3: To have died in just like that.

523
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 1: But you know, as an actor, those are all include

524
00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: all the TV shows that I've done in New York,

525
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 1: and I'm so lucky to have been in them. Yeah,

526
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 1: but I don't between you and me. Yeah, as an actor,

527
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: I don't feel they define my career. And yet I

528
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 1: don't feel i've done I look at a lot of

529
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 1: the great work that's going on. There are so many

530
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 1: good actors out there, and I kind of feel, and

531
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 1: I don't want to put it down, but I kind

532
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:13,960
Speaker 1: of feel, yeah, that was good, and thank god it

533
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: provided a livelihood. I've got two kids now and I

534
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:20,240
Speaker 1: put them in college. But as an artist, I don't

535
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: think those made it for me. I feel like I

536
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: have more to give, and I haven't. I don't think

537
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 1: I've done it. I can think of a few plays

538
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 1: that I've done where there were nights where I felt,

539
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 1: you're an artist, you did something that was moving, you know.

540
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,760
Speaker 1: I think of the last week when I did Faustust,

541
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 1: which I got pillared for by the critics. By the way, again,

542
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 1: the whole mister big thing, mister based you know.

543
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 2: Just you know, yeah, And people don't realize how much

544
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 2: theater you've done.

545
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it was what I set out to do

546
00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 1: when I got out to Coramma School until it, you know,

547
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 1: I got Law and Order and didn't look back. But

548
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 1: I've done theater throughout in different spots, you know, wasn't

549
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 1: I mean, listen my heroes growing up. I before I

550
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 1: went to the Neighborhood playoffs, I read a biography of

551
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: Lawrence Olivia and that was it for me. Ralph Richardson

552
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 1: and that life in the theater was That's what I wanted.

553
00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:24,760
Speaker 1: It just doesn't exist unless you went off to a

554
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: regional theater, you know. Three. Yeah, I didn't. I didn't

555
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 1: do that. I didn't really want to do that. I

556
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 1: wanted this romantic idea of what he had. You know,

557
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: he's the greatest theatrical actor ever. So I don't feel

558
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 1: like being in popular TV shows really means anything to me?

559
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 2: Is it not as fulfilling for you?

560
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 1: No? I'm glad, you know, And that it's meant to

561
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: culturally gives it a sort of like geez wow, people

562
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 1: love it and people enjoy it. Why do I feel like,

563
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: not that I'm obviously not wasting my time, but it's

564
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,200
Speaker 1: and I don't believe in like legacy or any thing

565
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:03,239
Speaker 1: like that, but it's like that little spark inside of

566
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:05,680
Speaker 1: me that goes, yeah, you haven't done it yet.

567
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:22,440
Speaker 2: I just wanted to before we go on to some

568
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 2: lighter stuff. I want to talk about mental health. I

569
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 2: want to talk about some things that I know are

570
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 2: important to you, and I want to talk about them

571
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 2: through I know what was a challenging chapter, and that's

572
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 2: the me Too chapter and I'm covering me too at

573
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 2: CNN just like everyone else. And you're accused through this process.

574
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 2: You've denied any wrongdoing. You've never been charged. But and

575
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 2: this isn't a podcast where we like relitigate that stuff

576
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 2: at all, but I did want to give you the

577
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 2: opportunity to talk about it, address it, and talk about

578
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 2: what that life changing moment meant for you and your

579
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 2: mental health.

580
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,280
Speaker 1: Well, life changing is a good way of describing it.

581
00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, nothing came of it, and yet being

582
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 1: the focus of a media deluge. I think these writers

583
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:23,880
Speaker 1: know they have the power to change the perception of reality,

584
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:27,480
Speaker 1: and they I just don't think they care because there

585
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 1: wasn't even a cursory vetting of this. Okay, I know

586
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,960
Speaker 1: exactly what happened. I know exactly what those articles left out.

587
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 1: There was a line I read somewhere that said people

588
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 1: in who live on the sea and get into a

589
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: really rough storm, merchants, big boats, merchant marines or whatever.

590
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: They get into a terrible storm, and what do they do.

591
00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 1: They turn off the engines and let it and drift

592
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 1: through it till the waters are come to a certain

593
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 1: That's what I had to do, because you can't explain

594
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 1: it away. You can't defend yourself. It just doesn't work

595
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: that way. Never explain, never defend outother some line like that.

596
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 1: And I'm the one that put myself in the position

597
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 1: for this to happen because I was reckless, I was immature.

598
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: You know. I did the classic mistake I think that

599
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 1: many people do, which is you mistake pleasure for happiness.

600
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: I just know that I put myself in that place

601
00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:35,800
Speaker 1: to do that out of my actions of being irresponsible

602
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:40,600
Speaker 1: and maybe entitled, I don't know. And I think also

603
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,200
Speaker 1: as we talk about the character of mister Big and

604
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,600
Speaker 1: how many females loved him, that they felt betrayed that

605
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 1: the actor who played him just ruined this character that

606
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 1: they had all these fantasies about. But it's like, I

607
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 1: was never that that's just a fantasy man, that's just

608
00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 1: a character, right, But you know it was importan to them,

609
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 1: and I just chat all over it, I guess, and

610
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 1: you know that's too bad.

611
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 2: How have you gotten involved in men's mental health?

612
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 1: Oh, so a lot of things happened that I had

613
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 1: to immediately involve myself in meditation. I love the app Headspace.

614
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 1: It's been a lifesaver for me. I think therapy to

615
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:29,719
Speaker 1: a certain extent work to a point. Bart Morris, who

616
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 1: runs the Lions, then it's called I want to read

617
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: you something about what the essence of the Lions then is.

618
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:42,800
Speaker 1: Because he's better than me. Great in the unforgiving terrain

619
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 1: of relationships are primal instincts and adversaries are the lions.

620
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:55,760
Speaker 1: They lurk, sometimes unnoticed and reactions in the crucible of marriage, work, parenting.

621
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,680
Speaker 1: Picture it the line of rejection. It's mighty war echoing

622
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 1: telling us to shield ourselves, to distance ourselves from vulnerability, weakness.

623
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: It's raw. It can be heard every time we overreach

624
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:10,080
Speaker 1: and feel disrespected. In the lines then program we confront

625
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 1: these beasts, and this has cut off the delicate balance

626
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:18,839
Speaker 1: of love and leadership. When those lions take us down

627
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:22,840
Speaker 1: treacherous paths, we find ourselves lashing out, checking out, or

628
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: succumbing to fits of rage. So I like that he

629
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 1: calls them lines, and I know what he means. And

630
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:35,360
Speaker 1: this is the exact opposite of that whole man sphere thing. No,

631
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:41,480
Speaker 1: this is about coming back to your vulnerability, back to

632
00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 1: those lions that roar out because of your fears, yes,

633
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:50,320
Speaker 1: fronting them and with other men through their experiences and ours,

634
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 1: and then talking about, you know, steps to take it

635
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: and what you can do. One of the things I

636
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 1: had to do. And I don't want to talk about

637
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 1: my marriage too much because my wife's a very private

638
00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:04,840
Speaker 1: person and shouldn't need a fuck up like me, you

639
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:08,280
Speaker 1: know from my past actions. But one of the most

640
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 1: important things was writing a letter of apology for my actions.

641
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 1: And it's still not enough. I've probably run away from

642
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:20,560
Speaker 1: a lot of things because you know what you're You're

643
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 1: not gonna drink it away, You're not gonna fuck it away.

644
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:26,640
Speaker 1: You're not gonna work it away, you're not gonna travel

645
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: it away. You're gonna have to be in it and

646
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 1: let it be in you, and that's hard to do.

647
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 1: And this whole thing that happened was like the universe

648
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: saying you're going to be in this and you're gonna

649
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 1: deal with it, and you're not gonna find you can try,

650
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:50,880
Speaker 1: and then you find out very soon that it doesn't

651
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:55,360
Speaker 1: do that. So life has a way of it seems

652
00:37:56,160 --> 00:38:01,080
Speaker 1: from you, the idea that you can't escape from it.

653
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 2: Nobody gets out alive.

654
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 1: No one gets out alive. But that's what's nice about

655
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:08,480
Speaker 1: the lines den is that you know there's a brotherhood

656
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 1: of us as men talking about our fears.

657
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's really important.

658
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:15,240
Speaker 1: That's not macho or anything.

659
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:18,280
Speaker 3: It's it's yeah, like vulnerables.

660
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 1: In marriage and relationships, the way we've used substances, the

661
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:27,160
Speaker 1: way we've run away from ourselves. And I've been running

662
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,319
Speaker 1: my whole life in a way without even knowing it,

663
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 1: Like when I said mistaking pleasure for happiness, and you

664
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:40,040
Speaker 1: know I took advantage of it. You know, I guess

665
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:46,759
Speaker 1: after a while though, it's like, dude, you can you

666
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,240
Speaker 1: know you're maybe your twenties and thirties, but at your age,

667
00:38:50,200 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 1: there's no excuse so well.

668
00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 2: I think that that was really vulnerable and accountable and

669
00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:01,920
Speaker 2: I appreciate you talking about that. Yeah, I think it

670
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:05,960
Speaker 2: was important, important to talk about it that way. All right,

671
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 2: I want to end on a lightning round. Oh no, no,

672
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 2: you're gonna like it.

673
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: I hear all about your lightning rounds.

674
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you're gonna like it. The first question you're

675
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,680
Speaker 2: gonna love. Why do you walk one hundred miles every year?

676
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah, Well I talked about my friendships going back

677
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:32,319
Speaker 1: to Jakarta, and there's a group, a couple of men

678
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 1: that I know they come from that who got me involved.

679
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:40,040
Speaker 1: All these people live in Spain and it just seems

680
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:44,839
Speaker 1: insurmountable to walk one hundred miles, and so doing it

681
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:49,319
Speaker 1: and finishing it feels incredibly gratifying and along the way

682
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:53,400
Speaker 1: the friendships deepen, which is very important to me.

683
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,560
Speaker 2: Very cool. Yeah, what is on your Spotify playlist?

684
00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 1: Ah? I'm because I know you do a thing of

685
00:40:02,280 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 1: an album that you could know.

686
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 2: You told me so I'm doing.

687
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 1: I'll just list a little bit. I call this my

688
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 1: Cigar Night perfect First, That's the Way by led Zeppelin,

689
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:20,880
Speaker 1: Great Destiny zero seven, Don't Let It Go Back, My

690
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:25,239
Speaker 1: favorite the brand new Heavies. Day by day you heard

691
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:28,000
Speaker 1: of the brand new Heavies. No old shelter, you gotta

692
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 1: get it. Barcelona, George Ezra, Great without a Song, Frank Sinatra, Great,

693
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 1: Spooky Classics, four Slip Away, Pat Metheny, ramble On, led Zeppelin,

694
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: All or Nothing at All, Frank Sinatra, Angelize, Frank Sinatra,

695
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,480
Speaker 1: which I sing at the cutting room sometimes. Let me

696
00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:50,360
Speaker 1: know when you're in New York if I needed someone,

697
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:56,160
Speaker 1: The Beatles, Carolina, The Beach Boys, Last Tangle in Paris, Gotto, Barbari,

698
00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: Stormy Classics, four Stone, sole Pit, The Fifth Dimension, One

699
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 1: less Bill to answer, to answer the Fifth Dimension? Love

700
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 1: theme from Chinatown, Till Brawner. Who can I turn to?

701
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 1: Nancy Wilson, You're the only woman, Ambrosia.

702
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 2: Oh wow, so eclectic.

703
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:21,800
Speaker 1: Jazz man, Carol King, sit yourself down, Stephen Stills, and

704
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:24,320
Speaker 1: it goes on. But you probably have four great So

705
00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 1: it's a lot of different stuff. That's when I'm having

706
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 1: a cigar and a martini.

707
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah it sounds great. Yeah, that's vibe. What's the best

708
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:36,239
Speaker 2: restaurant in New York City to you?

709
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 1: Jeez gosh, Bella Blue on the eppery side, is great

710
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:51,080
Speaker 1: Italian thing is I've been cooking so steakhouses. I went

711
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 1: to a steakhouse the other day and I said, my

712
00:41:52,520 --> 00:41:55,239
Speaker 1: stake's better than this. Oh, I have to say I

713
00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:57,839
Speaker 1: liked the Ilios. It was pretty good. I went there

714
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:02,759
Speaker 1: and it was pretty good. Crowded, but still, I like

715
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:04,680
Speaker 1: you heard of them?

716
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 3: Okay, all right, that's good.

717
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 2: Berkshire's or the City, all right, I gotta have both. Okay,

718
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 2: So yeah, yes your answers, yes, yes, okay. What's your

719
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:22,440
Speaker 2: favorite play?

720
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:26,560
Speaker 1: I want to see this play in New York ragtime.

721
00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 1: I hear it's amazing. Almost any Shakespeare. I saw Zoe

722
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,719
Speaker 1: Caldwell and Medea. That was pretty amazing. She directed me

723
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 1: an Hamlet in the late eighties. That and Sweeney todd

724
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 1: Len carry you.

725
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,120
Speaker 2: Okay? Good one, yeah, good?

726
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:52,759
Speaker 1: And there's more, but I'm you know.

727
00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:56,040
Speaker 2: Sure, Okay, this is the last question. It's it's important

728
00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 2: to me. We ask it at the end of every podcast.

729
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 2: When is it iced coffee? Season?

730
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 1: Never?

731
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:06,560
Speaker 3: It's never always hot coffee?

732
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:09,520
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, are you espresso? Are you black coffee?

733
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 1: What are you coffee? With a mix A little bit

734
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,800
Speaker 1: of almond milk and regular milk, that's it. My favorite coffee,

735
00:43:15,880 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 1: believe it round is dunkin Donuts.

736
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 3: Well that's mine too, is it?

737
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 1: Yeah?

738
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 2: Well, I'm from New England, I'm from Boston, so dunkin

739
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 2: Donuts is it for me? I don't know if you

740
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 2: can see I've got.

741
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:32,200
Speaker 1: Just had two a dunk yeah right there.

742
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, the correct answer is iced coffee season is

743
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,479
Speaker 2: year round. But we at least like that. You enjoy

744
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 2: dunkin Donuts coffee?

745
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,439
Speaker 1: Oh? Why is that the correct answer? Year round?

746
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 2: Because that's that's how I enjoy it.

747
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:50,719
Speaker 1: Very good.

748
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:53,280
Speaker 2: I have it in like fifteen degree weather. It doesn't

749
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:54,880
Speaker 2: matter what the weather is. I need ice.

750
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:56,600
Speaker 1: Cl with hot coffee.

751
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:58,040
Speaker 3: It can be here in the summer.

752
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:02,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're just opposite ends of the same coin.

753
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 2: Is what's happening here?

754
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 3: What sign are you sign?

755
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 1: Oh? I'm a scorpio.

756
00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 2: Okay, I don't know what that means.

757
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,760
Speaker 3: I don't need okay, perfect.

758
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:18,200
Speaker 2: I love that you asked anyway, Chris, note, this was

759
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:23,200
Speaker 2: really a wonderful conversation and I'm really appreciative that you

760
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 2: had it with me. Thank you.

761
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 1: Oh I'm glad you have done it. It was great.

762
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 1: Thank you for giving me the space to open up.

763
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely, absolutely appreciate it. Next week, on Off the Cup,

764
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:41,160
Speaker 2: as the holidays approach, I talked to comedian Aparna Nanturla

765
00:44:42,040 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 2: about mental health.

766
00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels like my anxiety is on its own,

767
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:47,720
Speaker 1: you know, Eat, Pray, Love Journey.

768
00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as

769
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,600
Speaker 2: part of the Reason Choice Network. If you want more,

770
00:44:54,719 --> 00:44:58,400
Speaker 2: check out the other Reason Choice podcasts, Politics with Jamel

771
00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 2: Hill and Native Land Pod. For Off the Cup, I

772
00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 2: am your host, se Cup. Editing and sound design by

773
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:08,400
Speaker 2: Derek Clements. Our executive producers are me Se Cup, Lauren Hanson,

774
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:12,279
Speaker 2: and Lindsay Hoffman. Rate and review wherever you get your podcasts,

775
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:19,439
Speaker 2: Follow or subscribe for new episodes every Wednesday,