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Speaker 1: Homily Ellis, and this is pop and Packs, the segment

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Speaker 1: where I bust open.

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Speaker 2: An old pack of NBA cards with a former player.

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Speaker 1: Today's guest is former Mavericks point guard Derek Harper. Half

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Speaker 1: talks about some of his battles with some of the

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Speaker 1: best trash talkers in the NBA, like Gary Payton and

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Speaker 1: Vernon Maxwell, his friendship with current Indiana Pacers head coach

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Speaker 1: Nate McMillan, and how Hart knew that Dale Ellis was

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Speaker 1: going to be a start before anyone else in the league.

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Speaker 2: This is popping.

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Speaker 1: Packs, waiting for half, waiting for half, waiting for half.

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Speaker 1: He's connecting and there he is. Hey, Derek Harper, welcome

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Speaker 1: to the no dunty. Here's a gram account popping packs.

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Speaker 1: How are you feeling about the Maps heading into the playoffs?

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Speaker 3: Excited?

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Speaker 4: It's the first time since two sixteen, so I think

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Speaker 4: that kind of breeds excitement. They're a very good team.

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Speaker 4: As you know, they're offensively. They set a new record

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Speaker 4: for offensive rating, which I think is fantastic. You think

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Speaker 4: about what the NBA has become. It's not a back

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Speaker 4: to the basket post up, guys. The physicality is different.

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Speaker 4: Even though the Clippers, who the Mavericks are going to face.

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Speaker 4: They play a very physical style, so I'm excited. I

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Speaker 4: think the team is excited. They're well coached, they share

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Speaker 4: the basketball. They're a fantastic basketball team, and I think

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Speaker 4: have a chance because they are so efficient on the

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Speaker 4: offensive end of the floor.

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Speaker 1: You're pretty familiar with a European born player in Dallasy.

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Speaker 1: He was okay, he was okay for a few years,

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Speaker 1: they won a championship, and now you've got another European

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Speaker 1: born player. I mean, did you expect, you know, when

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Speaker 1: you first heard about Luca that he'd be this good

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Speaker 1: in his second season.

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Speaker 4: You know, if anybody told you that they knew that,

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Speaker 4: or if they're expected that, they're telling you a lot,

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Speaker 4: because I don't think anybody expected this kid to be

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Speaker 4: what he is. All with that being said, I'll say this,

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Speaker 4: I don't care what level it is, but when you've

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Speaker 4: played professional basketball since you were fourteen, at a very

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Speaker 4: young age, there's certain things that you're going to be

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Speaker 4: better at than say a guy that's in high school,

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Speaker 4: learning from high school, going to college, things of that nature.

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Speaker 3: I mean, Luca, you can.

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Speaker 4: Tell he's like an old man as a basketball player,

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Speaker 4: and he's very fortunate that he has the size, he

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Speaker 4: has the IQ. The guy is just nobody does it

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Speaker 4: the way he does it. And I don't think anybody

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Speaker 4: dominates the game right now like he does. He makes

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Speaker 4: it look so easy. I mean, I said the other

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Speaker 4: day that we have Luca wrong. Everybody says he's from Slovenia.

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Speaker 4: I think Luca is from Mars. The way he does

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Speaker 4: things out on the.

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Speaker 3: Floor, it's just like taking candy from a little baby

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Speaker 3: man to be quite pleasure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you said that. No one could have predicted

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Speaker 2: how good he was going to be. I bet my

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Speaker 2: Cuban may you somewhere off saying I I you, That's

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Speaker 2: why I try for it.

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Speaker 3: I mean, not even Mark, more Donnie, Yeah than Mark.

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Speaker 4: You know, Donnie is the GM and Donnie has always

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Speaker 4: been great at finding Euros that can actually play. Valatunis

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Speaker 4: not Valatunas played with the Golden State.

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Speaker 3: Warriors, Donceelina Marcelonas. There you go.

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Speaker 4: He was a he was a He had a hand

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Speaker 4: in drafting him and he turned out to be an

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Speaker 4: All star.

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Speaker 3: So they have a good eye, a unique eye.

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Speaker 4: They they go abroad not afraid of the Euros, and

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Speaker 4: you have to give the late David Stern a lot

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Speaker 4: of credit for making this game European and that's why

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Speaker 4: we're finding so much talent from overseas.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 1: Well, what we do today anyway, Harp is I have

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Speaker 1: a pack of basketball cards from the ninety one to

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Speaker 1: ninety two season. I'm going to open them up, and

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Speaker 1: you obviously played in that era, and hopefully you can

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Speaker 1: tell us a few stories about the guards you've played with,

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Speaker 1: or again, we'll see what's in the cards, all right,

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Speaker 1: So okay, I'll just show you here they are. Here,

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Speaker 1: they're up at deck. Okay, was that your first season

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Speaker 1: in New York ninety one ninety two?

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Speaker 3: Yes, it was there in February of that year, yes.

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Speaker 1: Sir, Okay, okay, Well it's a good one, the first

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Speaker 1: one up, because you've battled against this guy in the

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Speaker 1: ninety four finals. He played for the Houston Rockets. He

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Speaker 1: was only there for their first championship season. He got

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Speaker 1: traded in their second championship season.

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Speaker 3: Okay.

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Speaker 1: A bit of a scorer, a bit of a guy

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Speaker 1: who could light it up every now and again and

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Speaker 1: had a great nickname. Also played for the San Antonio Spurs,

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Speaker 1: but I most remember him as a Houston Rocket, number

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Speaker 1: eleven shooting guard point Bernard Maxwell.

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Speaker 3: There he is.

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Speaker 4: That's my guy. That's my guy. He's a Florida guy.

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Speaker 4: I'm a Florida guy, So we have that respect thing

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Speaker 4: in common with each other.

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Speaker 3: Vernon as a competitor is what I remember about him.

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Speaker 2: He talks more.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if I can say shit on here

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Speaker 4: or not, but let him. Bernon talks more shit than

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Speaker 4: any He talks more shit than I do, and that's

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Speaker 4: hard to do.

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Speaker 3: But we've competed against each other a lot.

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Speaker 4: He thinks he's the best player out of Florida and

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Speaker 4: from the back court. I think that I am, and

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Speaker 4: I love the guy playing and simple. I've had a

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Speaker 4: lot of fun with burning.

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Speaker 1: He's my guy who talked more in the ninety four

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Speaker 1: finals than you or him when you're going up against

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Speaker 1: each other, and.

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Speaker 4: You know what, it had to be me because we

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Speaker 4: were supposed to win that series.

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Speaker 3: Yeah right, And when you come in second hat, all

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Speaker 3: you do is talk shit.

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Speaker 4: What if what if I had done this? What if

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Speaker 4: this had happened? Things would be different. But our great competitor,

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Speaker 4: Vernon one of the few people as a player as

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Speaker 4: a two guard in the NBA, is one of the

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Speaker 4: few people that actually scored fifty or more points in

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Speaker 4: the game. Just the terrific basketball player all around and

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Speaker 4: a fun guy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, this next guy was.

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Speaker 1: A New York nick. I guess you probably did play

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Speaker 1: with him. But he didn't have a super long career.

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Speaker 1: But he had a really big moment in the Slam

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Speaker 1: Dunk Contest in nineteen eighty nine.

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Speaker 2: He won it, and he's got a great nickname.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, his career didn't quite He didn't have a

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Speaker 1: super long career.

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Speaker 4: Talking Kentucky's Kenny A Kenny.

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Speaker 2: Skywalker Skywalker there he is.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, ah, man didn't play, didn't.

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Speaker 4: You know, when you don't play the same position as guys,

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Speaker 4: even though you pay attention to them, you pay attention

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Speaker 4: to their game. I don't think he got he didn't

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Speaker 4: reach his full potential as a player. I thought he

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Speaker 4: had the body type, the athleticism to be better than

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Speaker 4: his career turned out. It was cut short, obviously, But

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Speaker 4: you know, to be one of the four hundred plus

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Speaker 4: players as a professional, clearly you're pretty darn good. And

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Speaker 4: I just think he could have been better as a player.

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Speaker 3: Yeah that he had.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's I always think it's tough when, you know,

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Speaker 1: start their career in New York City or somewhere as well.

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Speaker 2: I think, you know, you just get so much attention. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's hard to you know, it's hard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay. This next guy was a shooting guard, more

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Speaker 1: a shooting guard than a point guard. He spent most

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Speaker 1: of his career with the Phoenix Suns. He got traded

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Speaker 1: to Philadelphia and then he went to Utah. He played

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Speaker 1: on the Jazz and those last two seasons where they

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Speaker 1: made the finals against the Chicago Bulls.

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Speaker 2: Former coach of the next former coach of the Suns,

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Speaker 2: and had.

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Speaker 1: A free throw had a free throw routine where he

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Speaker 1: went like this every time he shot a free throw.

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Speaker 4: You're talking Jeff Hornis Jeff HORNI sack there you go?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, man, that's my guy too.

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Speaker 4: Between here stock Man, these are probably two of the

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Speaker 4: grittiest players that ever played against. Lee just complimented each

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Speaker 4: other to stremely well. Could Horney could shoot the cover

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Speaker 4: off of it, didn't miss open shots.

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Speaker 3: And very clever, Just a very nifty basketball player.

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Speaker 4: Everybody can't be athletic, you know, And running jump and

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Speaker 4: all that stuff, no point intended. But Jeff was a

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Speaker 4: very He was a very cunning player and a very

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Speaker 4: tough player to play against. He competed every single night.

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Speaker 4: I have a lot of respect for him. I hear

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Speaker 4: he's coaching high school basketball, which tells you that he's

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Speaker 4: he's a he's a he's a basketball lifer.

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Speaker 1: But I'll say, yeah, he he did a great job

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Speaker 1: there in Phoenix in his first seasons.

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Speaker 2: And then you know, I sort of they just missed

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Speaker 2: the playoff.

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Speaker 1: I think, in fact, they lost to the Mavericks in

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Speaker 1: the last game of the season.

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Speaker 4: Have to and coaching in the league, you have to win.

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Speaker 4: I mean if you don't when then your job is

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Speaker 4: up for grabs every single season. Yeah, it's just a

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Speaker 4: tough way to, uh, to live when when you don't

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Speaker 4: have the town everybody wants to coach. They think they

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Speaker 4: do until you get the opportunity and you find out

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Speaker 4: that it's more than Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Okay, this next guy was I think he was like

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Speaker 1: the number one pick in like seventy seven or seventy eight.

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Speaker 2: He turned out to have a pretty good career.

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Speaker 1: But I would say his son, who currently plays, is

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Speaker 1: having a better career than than than his dad did.

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Speaker 1: His dad played on those Lakers teams that you battled

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Speaker 1: in the late eighties two and off the bench, he

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Speaker 1: was the He was like a backup center who then.

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Speaker 2: Became the full time. You're talking Clay, Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Clay Thompson. What what do you say about Clay?

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Speaker 4: You're talking Michael not not the Sun. Let me let

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Speaker 4: me think Michael Thompson. He's a big ten guy. I

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Speaker 4: know he went to Minnesota. I want to give him

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Speaker 4: his due respect because he was a tremendous help to

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Speaker 4: the Lakers being champions back to back to back. Very

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Speaker 4: intelligent basketball player, had had a great IQ, could shoot

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Speaker 4: the basketball. He was one of the first bigs that

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Speaker 4: actually spreaded the floor and stretched the floor.

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Speaker 3: A little bit. Michael Thompson did.

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Speaker 4: And then he had an uncanny ability to play with

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Speaker 4: his back to the basket. So I think when you

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Speaker 4: have those two skills as an offensive player, surely your

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Speaker 4: contribution is going to be unique and much needed. And yeah,

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Speaker 4: think about the Lakers winning championships. He certainly comes to

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Speaker 4: the forefront because he made some timely plays for that

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Speaker 4: Laker team.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember that series obviously in id. I was

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Speaker 1: probably a you know, that was an incredible series there,

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Speaker 1: you guys. I mean, if that, if that home court

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Speaker 1: advantage is yours, I think you'd probably win that series.

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Speaker 4: I would agree, Yeah, I would agree with you. You know,

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Speaker 4: I thought we would win the series because we were

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Speaker 4: confident as a group. There was never a moment where

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Speaker 4: we wavered from thinking that we could beat the Lakers.

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Speaker 4: But it's one thing to think it, it's another thing

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Speaker 4: to do it right. We were not able to get

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Speaker 4: over the hump. And I don't have any feelings about

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Speaker 4: it because I played against some Hall of Fame players

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Speaker 4: when I started thinking about that Laker team that that

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Speaker 4: was a nemesis for us more or less. You know, Magic,

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Speaker 4: Kareem Worthy, all those guys are in the hang of

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Speaker 4: Hall of Fame.

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Speaker 3: So no love long. We gave it all we had.

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you what though, the that you know, the

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Speaker 1: reunion rowdies there like that was a nothing like that

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Speaker 1: was as tough as place.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, nothing like it. It was a huge six man

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Speaker 4: for us. I just wish we could have taken advantage

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Speaker 4: of it more man. You know, you look back at

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Speaker 4: your career in different moments in your career, and those

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Speaker 4: people were good enough they deserved the championship.

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Speaker 3: The rowdies did.

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Speaker 1: Wait yeah, yeah, well I guess they well what do

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Speaker 1: you call the American out just the m f f LS.

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Speaker 2: I guess the new fans are there?

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Speaker 1: The fans for Light?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, they're mass fans for life. That's what m

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Speaker 3: f f y L stands for.

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Speaker 1: And do you look at do you look at the

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Speaker 1: you know, like the Lakers and the Pistons series. Obviously

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Speaker 1: the Lakers wanted in the end, but you know when

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Speaker 1: you look at the Pistons, they hadn't won the championship

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Speaker 1: at that point. Did you feel you were a good

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Speaker 1: match up for them? And uh and and everything like that.

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Speaker 1: I mean, obviously you feel confident you could beat them,

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Speaker 1: but you know, matchups.

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Speaker 3: It would have been.

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Speaker 4: They were tough is what they were. They played with

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Speaker 4: a crazy tenacity. The rules were different back in the eighties,

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Speaker 4: and they had bodies lamber, they had some some uh

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Speaker 4: what how do I put it nicely? They had some

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Speaker 4: tough guys, is the way I would bordered. They had

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Speaker 4: the very tough minded players. Lambert, Yeah, a guy that

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Speaker 4: you want to go down an alley with, Dennis Rodman,

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Speaker 4: Rick Mahorn Johnson. I mean, all those guys, you knew

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Speaker 4: when you saw them they were going to leave it

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Speaker 4: out there. And they were big guys, you know, little guys.

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Speaker 4: I tell people now, like these guys going to the

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Speaker 4: rim and getting easy baskets. Now in the NBA, there's

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Speaker 4: no damn way that would have happened.

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Speaker 3: Back in the day.

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Speaker 4: They would have been shooting free throws, kicking themselves off

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Speaker 4: the floor because there was a different style of basketball

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Speaker 4: back then, and the Pistons were tough. I'm not going

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Speaker 4: to say we couldn't have beat them, yeah, but we

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Speaker 4: would have had to play our best to win against

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Speaker 4: Detroit great backcourt, great coach and Jeff Dailey, So you know,

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Speaker 4: you fight fire with fire, and that's what we would

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Speaker 4: have had to do.

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Speaker 1: I had James Worthy on here a few weeks ago,

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Speaker 1: and we were talking about the Lakers and the Celtics rivalries,

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Speaker 1: and you remember that that play where Kevin McHale basically

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Speaker 1: takes Kurt Rambis's head off.

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Speaker 4: I remember like it were yesterday. It's something that you

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Speaker 4: won't ever forget if you ever saw it.

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Speaker 3: Right either around that area.

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Speaker 4: You don't forget that kind of stuff and that could

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Speaker 4: have turned into an all out brawl, because if somebody

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Speaker 4: takes you out of the air like that, personally, I

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Speaker 4: want to fight that.

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Speaker 3: That's just it's just that simple. I'm gonna fight.

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Speaker 4: Nobody's gonna take me out of the air like that

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Speaker 4: and me not get up and hit somebody.

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Speaker 3: I mean that.

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Speaker 4: That was one of the all time That and Larry

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Speaker 4: Bird and and and uh Julius Irving fighting in a

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Speaker 4: game where some of the craziest highlights I've ever seen

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Speaker 4: in my career.

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Speaker 1: The funny thing about that Kevin McHale one is I

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Speaker 1: think he only got a normal faul, just a.

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Speaker 3: Personal It was go shoot two free throws right and.

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Speaker 2: Floing.

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Speaker 4: Yes, But then you always knew there would be a

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Speaker 4: retaliation what happened, somebody else would do the same freaking

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Speaker 4: thing to the opposite team.

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Speaker 3: That that was just the way it went, you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well is that also that play with Bill Robert

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Speaker 1: Parrish just lays punches onto Bill Lambia.

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Speaker 5: Oh yeah, and he doesn't even get a foul on

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Speaker 5: that line. Listen, you don't. You didn't want to mess

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Speaker 5: with the chief. First of all, you didn't want to

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Speaker 5: mess with Robert Robert Parrish. He was one of the

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Speaker 5: beat the guys in the league, and every big in

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Speaker 5: the league knew that, you know what I mean, They

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Speaker 5: knew not to mess with fucking uh the Chief because

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Speaker 5: he was a tough, heart nosed guy.

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Speaker 3: Yea.

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Speaker 4: And they have I've seen this, those those rerun plays

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Speaker 4: that you're speaking of right now on online on Twitter

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Speaker 4: and things like that, and it always just brings back

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Speaker 4: crazy memories because of how the game is played now.

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Speaker 4: Now you have guys that we're speaking of right now,

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Speaker 4: you're talking about Bill Amber. You're talking to Bill could

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Speaker 4: have could have played in this era era because he

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Speaker 4: could shoot the ball.

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Speaker 3: But you know, you start talking about.

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Speaker 4: The Chief, Robert Parrish, James Worthy and all the different people,

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Speaker 4: those Kurt Rambers, those guys couldn't play in this era

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Speaker 4: because they couldn't shoot the ball from them. I mean,

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Speaker 4: it shows you how much the game has revolved, you

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Speaker 4: know what I mean, It's so different at this juncture.

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Speaker 4: And I think out of the guys that we're speaking of,

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Speaker 4: the only one that could have could have made a

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Speaker 4: living right now is is your guy Bill Lamberd because

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Speaker 4: he could actually shoot the ball from the perimina. So

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Speaker 4: go figure.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's crazy because he was one of the first

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Speaker 1: guys who really stretched out. I remember in Game two

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Speaker 1: of the ninety Finals he hit six three pointers. I

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Speaker 1: think it was a record of their time. You know,

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Speaker 1: they end up losing that game, actually, but yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean the big guy to be very uncommon, Yeah, very uncommon. Yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: this this next guy, I'm sure you had some good

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Speaker 1: battles with. I'm pretty sure he played his entire career

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Speaker 1: with one team to Seattle SuperSonics. He went onto coach

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Speaker 1: the Signings, he went on to coach the Blazers, and

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Speaker 1: he's currently coaching the Indown and Paces right now.

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Speaker 3: Nate McMillan, that's what I got, Nate. Wow.

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Speaker 4: That let me count the ways on how much I

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Speaker 4: respect Nate McMillan. Not surprised that he's a coach because

345
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Speaker 4: he had a coach's mentality as a player, and we're

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Speaker 4: in I had a lot of success against Nate McMillan.

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Speaker 4: I have a lot of respect for him as well,

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Speaker 4: if that makes sense. If you talk to Nate, he

349
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Speaker 4: would shake his head and just fucking probably just laugh

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Speaker 4: because again I talked so much shit to he and

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Speaker 4: Gary Payton Man back in the day that they probably

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Speaker 4: feel the same way about me. I don't know if

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Speaker 4: Nate had as much success as Gary did, but I

354
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Speaker 4: had a lot of success against he and Gary Payton,

355
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Speaker 4: and I think Nate, if Gary was the best player

356
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Speaker 4: on that team, he and Dale ellis, Nate was the

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Speaker 4: most important player on the team because he had to

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Speaker 4: deal with those motherfucking guys. And I know I know

359
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Speaker 4: Dale very well and I know Gary very well, and

360
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Speaker 4: I know those two guys, they're a handful to play with,

361
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Speaker 4: to compete against.

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Speaker 3: I love Dave McMillan is all I can say.

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Speaker 4: And he's done a fantastic job as a head coach,

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Speaker 4: and like I said, he's a student of the game,

365
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Speaker 4: and you know, being a coach and a player, I

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Speaker 4: think it speaks for itself.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, talking about guys talking trash, I think

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Speaker 1: Gary Payton was talking trash coming out of the womb.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, there's no doubt about Gary. And Top's

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Speaker 3: good shit too.

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Speaker 4: And you know, if you talk as much shit as

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Speaker 4: Gary talked, well you better be able to back it up.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, for him, he was able.

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Speaker 3: To back it up.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, you know, it flies a little different when

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Speaker 4: you can back it up.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, this next guy, shooting guard. Guy spent most

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Speaker 1: of his career with the Milwaukee Bucks and then he

379
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Speaker 1: ended up with the San Antonio Spurs. Good shooter, never

380
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Speaker 1: an all star, good defensive player as well. His son

381
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Speaker 1: was playing for the Boston Celtics a few years ago.

382
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Speaker 1: But he's not in the league anymore, I don't think.

383
00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,440
Speaker 1: But just a good, reliable, consistent guy.

384
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Speaker 2: And uh adam.

385
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Speaker 3: They played most of his career. He played most of

386
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Speaker 3: his career where Milwaukee, with the Milwaukee Bucks. Yeah, I

387
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Speaker 3: should know this one.

388
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Speaker 2: Uh he went to Tulsa.

389
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Speaker 3: Little, I got it. Not Frasier h Shucks drawing a blank.

390
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:25,919
Speaker 3: I'm drawing a blank. I know Terry t No, not

391
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Speaker 3: Terry Tiger.

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Speaker 2: He's got in the literation. His named Paul Pressy, Paul Pressey.

393
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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's my guy, Press Yeah press God. Lee changed

394
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Speaker 4: the game in his own way.

395
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Speaker 3: Lee.

396
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Speaker 4: You know they have that point the big point guard,

397
00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:46,080
Speaker 4: point press point three three, you know whatever they call it.

398
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:46,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

399
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:53,080
Speaker 4: Uh, Don Nelson is the original originator of the big

400
00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:59,680
Speaker 4: point guard, the Paul Pressey type point guard, and Shucks

401
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,440
Speaker 4: Press played that role. Lee, if you would as well

402
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:07,000
Speaker 4: as anybody not a great shooter. Shot that he was

403
00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:10,879
Speaker 4: never an All Star is what I am. Because he

404
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,879
Speaker 4: had the game and the production as a player where

405
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 4: I think he could have possibly been.

406
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Speaker 3: Right, I've gone a little darkly, there's that.

407
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:20,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine.

408
00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,920
Speaker 4: I I have a lot of respect for him because

409
00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:30,080
Speaker 4: he was you know, they talk about two way players now, yep,

410
00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:33,800
Speaker 4: and he was probably one of the way players in

411
00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:38,119
Speaker 4: our and the guy that that he's an originator, he

412
00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:43,560
Speaker 4: started that. He's a position of list player that played

413
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Speaker 4: a lot of positions very well.

414
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Speaker 3: I have a lot a lot of.

415
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Speaker 4: Respect for a guy like like Paul Pressey.

416
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Speaker 3: I see him from time to time.

417
00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:53,680
Speaker 4: You know, he was coaching for a while with the Lakers,

418
00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:58,119
Speaker 4: and I'm very fond of Paul Pierce.

419
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Speaker 3: I mean Paul Pressy beg you pardon.

420
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:02,440
Speaker 2: Is he a Texas guy then as well as he.

421
00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 4: I think he is from from well, he may be

422
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:10,840
Speaker 4: from Oklahoma. I think he is out on the outskirts

423
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:13,600
Speaker 4: of Texas somewhere. I think you're right, you might have

424
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:18,399
Speaker 4: heard that. And he he talks about living in this

425
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Speaker 4: area right.

426
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Speaker 2: Now, right right, Okay.

427
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Speaker 1: This next guy, he played with him for the with

428
00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,960
Speaker 1: the New York Knicks. He also spent well, he spent

429
00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:30,200
Speaker 1: his early career with the l A Clippings.

430
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:34,440
Speaker 2: There's a big power forward out of Pittsburgh and good.

431
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:36,760
Speaker 3: Scorer, Charles Charles Smith.

432
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Speaker 2: Charles Smith.

433
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:42,560
Speaker 3: There you go, Yeah, Charles Smithy shucks.

434
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:46,439
Speaker 4: I mean he had an injury after the Clippers, but

435
00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:51,200
Speaker 4: as a Clipper, as a Clipper he was, He was

436
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:55,560
Speaker 4: the almost talented offensive players in the league. And I

437
00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:59,240
Speaker 4: hate to compare him to Kenny Walker, but I think

438
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:01,800
Speaker 4: Charles left a little bit on the table. I think

439
00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:05,280
Speaker 4: Charles Smith was a better could have been a better

440
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:09,360
Speaker 4: player than he was able to show, right, and could

441
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:16,480
Speaker 4: flat score the basketball. Very intelligent human being, good human being,

442
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:21,480
Speaker 4: great family guy. I love him to death. I love

443
00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:23,520
Speaker 4: him to death. Charles was my guy when I was

444
00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,880
Speaker 4: on that Nick team. We we got along. We did

445
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:34,400
Speaker 4: a lot of uh dinners together. Just really like I'm

446
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,320
Speaker 4: very fond of Charles Smith, just really fond of him.

447
00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,640
Speaker 4: Just the way he carried himself as a professional all

448
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 4: the time. And uh, just an intelligent basketball player that could.

449
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,960
Speaker 3: Have been could have better stats, right.

450
00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 4: Because he had some years, but his numbers could have

451
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:53,639
Speaker 4: been a lot better to me as a player.

452
00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 1: Right, right, yeah, I remember him on I put this

453
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,159
Speaker 1: thing because I weren't very good at the you know,

454
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 1: in the light eighties, and he seemed to be able

455
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:02,240
Speaker 1: to put up decent numbers.

456
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 2: So yes, good to see him go to.

457
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 1: The Knicks, you know, and nearly nearly get a championship there.

458
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:09,600
Speaker 1: So it's always good when you see a guy who's

459
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:12,040
Speaker 1: spoiling hard and talented and gets a chance on a

460
00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:12,520
Speaker 1: better team.

461
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:15,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, he definitely had his opportunities.

462
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,000
Speaker 1: Okay, this next time you actually we talked about and

463
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 1: this was a sharpshooter. I think he started his career

464
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: with Dallas Mavericks actually and got traded to Seattle and

465
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 1: became an All star in Seattle only a one time.

466
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we got We came into Dallas the

467
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 4: same year. All right, we got drafted here. He was

468
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,919
Speaker 4: a fourth pick. I was the eleventh pick, and Dale

469
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:45,159
Speaker 4: and I just became friends automatically because we were in

470
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:46,080
Speaker 4: the same class.

471
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 3: I talked all the time. He never talked.

472
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 4: Dale was to me one of the most underrated players,

473
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:58,280
Speaker 4: and I think people do appreciate it now that it's

474
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 4: all said and done. But you hear the mentality killer.

475
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:07,919
Speaker 4: Dale was a killer. He was a solent assassin that

476
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:09,800
Speaker 4: could play inside outside.

477
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:11,760
Speaker 3: People forget that.

478
00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:15,920
Speaker 4: How good Dale was with his back to the basket

479
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 4: when he was at Tennessee. How he could knock down

480
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:24,880
Speaker 4: that little short baseline jump shot with ease, so smooth,

481
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,560
Speaker 4: so unassuming. A lot of people talk about being tough,

482
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 4: Dale was tough without talking about being tough, right, And

483
00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 4: a guy that I mean, I dearly love him because

484
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 4: we have shared so many moments. If I had to

485
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:44,399
Speaker 4: say who my best friend was while I was in

486
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:46,120
Speaker 4: the NBA, it was Dale Ellis.

487
00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 3: Wow and yeah, yeah, big time, big time.

488
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 2: So was he traded kind of because you had Orlando Blackman?

489
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 3: Uh? Maybe? So?

490
00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 4: You know, he demanded to be on the floor, le

491
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:03,400
Speaker 4: He was that talented. And I'll tell you a real

492
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:08,120
Speaker 4: quick story. We were on the second team together myself,

493
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 4: Dale Ellis, Elston Turner, Jay Benson, and Bill kurtin Ipius,

494
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:18,359
Speaker 4: if you would, and we used to beat the first

495
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 4: team in practice every fucking single day. And you can

496
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 4: blast that anywhere we hold our started five. You hear

497
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,480
Speaker 4: what I'm saying, Lee, I can't make it up. And

498
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 4: you can ask any of them is it true? We

499
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 4: own them? And a big reason why we were why

500
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 4: we did was because they couldn't do anything with Dale.

501
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 3: Ellis could not stop him. He was that good.

502
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 4: And he played against Marco Wire and you know Rolando

503
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 4: Blackman to your point a few seconds ago, league and

504
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:54,199
Speaker 4: Man Dale was the big reason.

505
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 3: Man. This dude could hold his all against anybody in

506
00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 3: the league.

507
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 4: And he proved it after going to Seattle and becoming

508
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 4: an All Star and a three point champion himself.

509
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 1: So when he got traded, I mean you probably weren't

510
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 1: surprised that he grew into that superstar.

511
00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 4: No, I wasn't a surprised. I don't think anybody was.

512
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 4: In fact, I think he did better than I thought

513
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 4: he would do. I thought he would do well, but

514
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:18,399
Speaker 4: I didn't think he would turn out to be an

515
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:19,400
Speaker 4: all star caliber.

516
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 1: Retirement your retirement speech the other day, and Dick Motto

517
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 1: was there, and you said that Dick Motto.

518
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 2: Was really hot on you because Mark and Orlando couldn't

519
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 2: handle it.

520
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 3: Well.

521
00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,240
Speaker 4: I wouldn't say that they couldn't handle it, but it

522
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:35,440
Speaker 4: would have affected them a lot more in it right,

523
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,160
Speaker 4: it would then it affected me because I mean Dick

524
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 4: didn't bother me because I know he had my best interest.

525
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:46,640
Speaker 4: At heart, he was trying to grow me. I was different.

526
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 4: I was a I was I thought I was better

527
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 4: than I was at the time, you know.

528
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 3: And I thought I was the best player when I

529
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 3: got drafted by Dallas. Yeah, I thought I was the

530
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 3: best guard they had.

531
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 4: I thought, plain and simple, like better than these cats

532
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 4: playing and simple and you know that packing you have

533
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,480
Speaker 4: to be humbled, and Coach Marlin was kind of the

534
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 4: first coach that humbled me and put me in place. Yeah,

535
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:15,280
Speaker 4: but I know he respected me and appreciated what I

536
00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:17,440
Speaker 4: brought to the table as a player. And I love

537
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:19,320
Speaker 4: that guy. I love Greg Mark.

538
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 1: Okay, this next guy, I think he was actually drafted

539
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: in your same year as well, in eighty three.

540
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,919
Speaker 2: He spent I remember him mainly on the Utah Jazz.

541
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 1: He also played the Sacramento Kings, and I think he

542
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 1: actually picked up definitely one championship with the Chicago Bulls.

543
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 2: Maybe too.

544
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 1: He was a you know, end of the bench type

545
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:41,400
Speaker 1: of player, a sort of shooting guard guy out of Iowa.

546
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 3: You are talking godly, I should know this.

547
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think he was in your same draft. I mean,

548
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:52,639
Speaker 1: I'm not one hundred percent sure of that. He was

549
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 1: a big sort of shooting guard six six, and he

550
00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 1: went to our Iowa. Yeah, Jazz went to Sacramento and

551
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 1: then Chicago at the end.

552
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 2: But but you know you.

553
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:11,320
Speaker 1: I remember him on those jazz teams.

554
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 3: My boy Bobby Hansen.

555
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's my guy. Class. I love Bob Hanson. Yeah,

556
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 4: just because I know him from the day. Tough competitor man,

557
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,199
Speaker 4: Bobby would. He was a feisty little guy. Even at Alawa,

558
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,479
Speaker 4: I knew he should be around for a while because

559
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 4: he didn't back down. He was a competitor, could shoot it.

560
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:34,359
Speaker 4: You left him open, he would knock it down on you.

561
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 4: But more more than anything, Bobby was a competitor, you

562
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 4: know what I mean. He was a feisty little player

563
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 4: that played with an edge, that played with fire. And

564
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 4: much respect to Bobby Hanson. Yeah, he's a guy. I

565
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 4: like the guy. He's a cool guy.

566
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:57,200
Speaker 1: He I mean he you know, to play with frank

567
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,479
Speaker 1: Leyden on those Jazz teams next to Johnston often like

568
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 1: you're not you know, if you can't defend and you

569
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 1: can't shoot, you're not on the court.

570
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 3: So yes, yeah he did both and have a lot

571
00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 3: of respect for Bark.

572
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 1: Okay, this next guy I'm pretty sure you played with

573
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 1: him in Dallas and New York.

574
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 2: But it's not Orlando Blackman. This guy is a more

575
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 2: a big guy who was a kind of outsized center.

576
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 2: But he was how far life center? Wi Big Herb

577
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:22,360
Speaker 2: there is.

578
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 3: I mean man, big Herb.

579
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 4: Hey, Herb was smoved before Sam person Perkins was was big, smooth,

580
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:45,080
Speaker 4: student of the game, smart as Einstein, very versatile as

581
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:45,920
Speaker 4: a human.

582
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 3: Being, great heart leader. God, I love her, but I

583
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 3: keep saying I love these guys that I really do.

584
00:29:57,560 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 4: When I when I think about these guys, they just

585
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 4: brings back some of my greatest memories as a professional.

586
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 4: And I played against her when he was at Ohio

587
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 4: State as well when I was at Illinois, and there's

588
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 4: always been a mutual respect. And I saw her this year,

589
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 4: and when I see him, he's the kind of guy

590
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 4: you don't want to leave. You don't want to you

591
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 4: don't want to say bye to.

592
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 3: Herb Williams because.

593
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 4: You're always getting something, You're always getting some knowledge from him.

594
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 4: You always I'll never forget flying from mind Me to Seattle.

595
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:33,760
Speaker 4: You can imagine Lee how long that trip was. And

596
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:35,320
Speaker 4: we sat on the back of the dam, on the

597
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:45,160
Speaker 4: back of the flight Man and talked about race and life, marriage.

598
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 4: I mean, we talked about so much Man until.

599
00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:52,680
Speaker 3: Man. Every time I see her, I want to see him.

600
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 4: I want to sit down and I want to talk

601
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:55,600
Speaker 4: to him because I know he's going to give me

602
00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 4: something positive, something to hold on to and to uh

603
00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 4: to keep me moving through through my journey.

604
00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 3: Man is a brilliant man. Brilliant.

605
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 2: It's great when you know, when I have guests on

606
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:07,960
Speaker 2: here and they tell.

607
00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: Me about stories of guys you might have played with

608
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:10,360
Speaker 1: twenty or thirty years ago.

609
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:12,479
Speaker 2: But the friendships, the friendship are still there.

610
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 1: You don't see guys every you know, even sometimes it

611
00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 1: goes a few years, but you pick up where you

612
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 1: left off.

613
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 4: Very much, very much. And Herb is, yeah, I won't

614
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,000
Speaker 4: ever forget Herb Williams. So as long as I'm on Earth,

615
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 4: I will never and I won't forget any of these guys.

616
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 3: Herb has a special place in my home. He's so.

617
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 4: He's he's selfless, right, Herb Williams is, he's a selfless

618
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 4: human being.

619
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 2: Okay, we've got two left here.

620
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 3: Now. This guy.

621
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 1: You should know this guy because he was the number

622
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: one pick in your draft.

623
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure, and he really.

624
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 1: Threatened to have a really dominant career, but injuries got

625
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:51,840
Speaker 1: to him and and sort of.

626
00:31:53,120 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 5: Big boy, big boy yeah, Ralph, Ralph SAMs.

627
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, all right, I'm sorry, I was thinking boo

628
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 4: yeah again, Sam BOYD got drafted in Michael Jordan's class,

629
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 4: So I was wrong on that.

630
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 3: My apologies.

631
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 4: Uh wow, Ralph, I have to use the same the

632
00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:17,680
Speaker 4: same thing.

633
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 3: Should have gotten more out of his career. Yeah.

634
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 4: I don't know if that's his last card, but if

635
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 4: you turned that card around me, I would really be

636
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 4: curious to what his numbers are on that car.

637
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Sacramento. He ended up averaging just three points

638
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 1: a game.

639
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 4: Injuries depleted his career, but I thought Ralph had more

640
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:42,640
Speaker 4: talent then than he than he gave us.

641
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 3: He could have reached a higher potential.

642
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 4: Was always recognized as one of the all times great

643
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 4: big guys. He was the first of the big guys

644
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 4: if you would out of Virginia.

645
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 3: He's from that DC Maryland area.

646
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 4: I played a good draft in high school, all American tournts,

647
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:02,240
Speaker 4: things of that nature.

648
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 3: Five star.

649
00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,240
Speaker 4: I've been around him a lot and always thought that

650
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 4: he was going to be a super star type player

651
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 4: and to your point, earlier injuries kind of depleted things

652
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 4: for him and he never rebounded from that. And if

653
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 4: you look at the lower part of his numbers, yeah,

654
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 4: I mean this guy was way better than that. He

655
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 4: was a lot better than what his numbers actually equals

656
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 4: out to.

657
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:31,600
Speaker 1: I I just imagine the you know, mid eighties there

658
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: when it was him and a came Elijahan, like Twin.

659
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 4: Towers, Twin Towers. That was the first of the Twin Towers.

660
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 4: Look what Elijahwan became. And I think people would have

661
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 4: turned it around because Elijahwan came out of nowhere. You know,

662
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 4: he had that big college game against Patrick Ewing in

663
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,360
Speaker 4: Colorado where he had the oxygen man's up to his

664
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 4: face trying to breathe, and that put him on the map.

665
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 4: And I think that particular year, I think he came

666
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 4: in the same year that I did too, didn't he

667
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 4: Elijah won?

668
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 1: No, he was the next year because remember the Rockets,

669
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 1: the Rockets kind of tanked to get the number one

670
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:09,960
Speaker 1: pick too.

671
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 3: That's exactly he was the next year. I know it

672
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:13,760
Speaker 3: was close, remember being close.

673
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, But long story short, Elijah won turned out to

674
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 4: be the better of the two by far, and I

675
00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:23,280
Speaker 4: don't think going into that draft that's what people anticipated.

676
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well that's the thing because Booie was in

677
00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:26,280
Speaker 1: that draft.

678
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 2: Of course he had number two.

679
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 3: Yes, I remember now that you say it.

680
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then obviously Michael at three.

681
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,080
Speaker 1: But you know, the Rockets, you know, they don't get

682
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,080
Speaker 1: too much crap over that because Elijah one is a

683
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:37,160
Speaker 1: Hall of Famer, you know, one of.

684
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 2: The greatest we've ever seen. So that one's okay and Booie.

685
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 2: Booie's career was okay, but obviously not what they were

686
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 2: did reach it. Injuries as well.

687
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 4: That's the one thing that can can can stop it,

688
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 4: that can stop greatness or potential to be great.

689
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, injuries and clearly did in that case.

690
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 2: Right, Okay.

691
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:57,960
Speaker 1: Well, I've got one last card here, Harp, and it's

692
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 1: a very interesting one because I recognize this guy always

693
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:04,440
Speaker 1: used to wear number twelve for his career, but in

694
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:07,520
Speaker 1: this one particular card, for some reason, it looks like

695
00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 1: he's wearing number twenty five.

696
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 2: And I was wondering if you could shed some light

697
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 2: on it, because it's you.

698
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:23,760
Speaker 4: I have one number twenty five because my jersey was

699
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 4: left somewhere else. They just have my jersey.

700
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 3: So I had to pick a number, and I picked

701
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 3: twenty five for right reason. I remember that. And if

702
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:36,399
Speaker 3: you notice there's not a name on.

703
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:37,360
Speaker 2: The back of jersey.

704
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, just one of those fluke things. It's not like

705
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:42,359
Speaker 3: it used to be.

706
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 4: Maybe there was two jerseys packed right back in the day,

707
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:48,239
Speaker 4: you know, there wasn't all this.

708
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, this fancy living back in my era.

709
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:56,640
Speaker 4: So they only had one or two jerseys and somehow

710
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 4: it got left some more else I.

711
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 3: Had to pick it.

712
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: It's crazy to me that, like, I guess this, you

713
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,319
Speaker 1: probably only wore this for one game, and this.

714
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:08,520
Speaker 2: Is the one they used for your card. Like what

715
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 2: are the chancers of that?

716
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 3: You know, not very slim to none, wouldn't.

717
00:36:12,239 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, because when I found it, I was like, it

718
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 1: looks like it's been photoshopped or something, because you know,

719
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 1: because you were number twelve and it's like, but the

720
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 1: name's not there, Like.

721
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:25,440
Speaker 3: That was a flu that was a genuine flu. Yeah.

722
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 2: Well this has been awesome.

723
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 1: Man.

724
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 2: I've got my I've got my Orlando Blackman shirt on here.

725
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:32,799
Speaker 3: There you go. That's what's up. That's my man.

726
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 4: I played in the back court with that guy you're

727
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:37,839
Speaker 4: talking about one of the best competitors and the best

728
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,040
Speaker 4: backcourt mates I've.

729
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:40,320
Speaker 3: Ever had, Orlando Blackman.

730
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 4: I would, Yeah, if I had to do it all

731
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,040
Speaker 4: over againly, I would. I would want to be in

732
00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 4: the back court with Row seven eight years and compete

733
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:49,560
Speaker 4: against anybody. There was a time where we felt like

734
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,720
Speaker 4: we were the best backcourt in the NBA and proved

735
00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:55,319
Speaker 4: it night in and night out going up against the

736
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 4: Western Conference guards, which were All Star caliber guards.

737
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 3: So Roe is my guy forever. Yeah, that's my guy

738
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 3: for life.

739
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 2: It's so just a quick story on me.

740
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 1: The first game of NBA basketball I ever saw was

741
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,959
Speaker 1: the nineteen eighty seven All Star Game, which is which

742
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: is the one where Roe hits the two free throws

743
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:17,800
Speaker 1: and we're crazy time. You know, Like from that moment,

744
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 1: I was like twelve years old and I was like,

745
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:20,880
Speaker 1: this is the greatest game in the world.

746
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:22,439
Speaker 3: And that's how I know Row.

747
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 4: That's how I know him because we trained together during

748
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:27,240
Speaker 4: the off season.

749
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 3: Every single day.

750
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,200
Speaker 4: He take us through drills and all he talked about

751
00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 4: about was when we were shooting five and six and

752
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 4: seven hundred shots is that his message is the only

753
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 4: way to know you're going to make free throws and

754
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 4: know you're going to make open shots. Is to make

755
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,520
Speaker 4: it automatic by practicing and practicing and practicing and practicing.

756
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:54,720
Speaker 4: And we practiced like it was a game all the time.

757
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 4: And I picked up that that work ethic.

758
00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 3: From Rolando Blackman and Brock Davis. So awe a lot

759
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 3: to those guys. Man, this yeah to do it.

760
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 1: I was in Dallas a few years ago doing a

761
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:06,880
Speaker 1: feature with Row and he was taking shots wearing his

762
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,400
Speaker 1: like pants and a shirt and a tie, and he

763
00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 1: was not going to meet He knocked in like six

764
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:12,839
Speaker 1: or eight Row then still on the court.

765
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:15,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he's crazy. He's crazy.

766
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:17,399
Speaker 4: I know what you mean when you say a head

767
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 4: out a tie now that yes, sure, yeah, he.

768
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,040
Speaker 3: Wanted to do a straight professional you know what I mean.

769
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 3: That's just who Row is.

770
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 4: Man from Panama, and I don't know a lot of Panamanians, right,

771
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 4: he is so real and serious.

772
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:35,799
Speaker 3: Row was the best of the rest.

773
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,880
Speaker 4: I was a college All American, high school, All America,

774
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 4: not Lewando Blackman. You see what I mean. He was

775
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 4: always the best of the rest. So he has a

776
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,000
Speaker 4: chip on his shoulder. He feels like he's got to

777
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 4: out work every single single human being in the world

778
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:52,280
Speaker 4: and that's just his approach.

779
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 3: I love that that guy as well.

780
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 2: But that work pays off in the biggest moment, you know,

781
00:38:58,320 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 2: you know.

782
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:02,480
Speaker 3: He's living proofly have improved. Yeah, this was a lot

783
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 3: of fun.

784
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 2: Man, Yeah, this is a lot of fun.

785
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:04,680
Speaker 4: Man.

786
00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 1: I love hearing all these old stories and h and

787
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,359
Speaker 1: hearing you reminisce about the times and uh, it's been

788
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 1: great and and.

789
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,840
Speaker 2: Listen all the best for the playoffs going for MAVs.

790
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 3: I think we're ready. We don't have anything to lose.

791
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 2: Everything again, exactly.

792
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 3: We lose a draw, it's.

793
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,400
Speaker 4: Not gonna do anything but mol Luca and Kate p

794
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 4: and the rest of those guys for future wins.

795
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:25,239
Speaker 3: Man.

796
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, it's exciting times again in Dallas. You know,

797
00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 1: I don't think there'll be a championship this year, but

798
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:31,839
Speaker 1: certainly it's something that you certainly.

799
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 4: It's gonna get in Luca's era that it will have.

800
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 2: All right, harp, thanks man, bless you stood your brother