Speaker 1: The following is a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. This is Mick Shot
Speaker 1: screaming live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the official
Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboys at now. Here are Bill Jones, Everson Walls,
Speaker 1: and Nicky Spagnola. And it is an absolutely beautiful Thursday
Speaker 1: in the metro planks, and it's a beautiful day for
Speaker 1: mix shots as we are putting Baltimore behind us, Bill
Speaker 1: Jones along with Mickey Spagnola and Everson Walls. Yes, it's
Speaker 1: time we gotta move on, don't we What do you
Speaker 1: think we need to move on? No, I'm still in
Speaker 1: that mood. Time for since I'm still in that mood. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. You know what, Let's let's ask Bill Belichick
Speaker 1: what we should do. What do you say? Yes, do
Speaker 1: you want to ask Bill Belichick? Let me see. It
Speaker 1: would help if myke it would help, if my audio work.
Speaker 1: But it does it? So it didn't work. It didn't work.
Speaker 1: Why does my computer mute at the most inappropriate time?
Speaker 1: All right, here we go. We're gonna try it again. Here,
Speaker 1: we're gonna try it again. And here you go, it's
Speaker 1: still muting. Unbelievable. Okay, you know what I run this
Speaker 1: thing about as well as the stop the run of
Speaker 1: the other team. Oh no, right, you got muted there,
Speaker 1: I got yeah, I got muted. All right, Bill, I'll
Speaker 1: by the other show. I'm gonna figure it out. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna pull out what he was trying to say. Yes,
Speaker 1: we're on to Cincinnati. Okay, We're on to Cincinnati. Right.
Speaker 1: I was gonna try and pull you out of the
Speaker 1: hole there, Okay, we're on the Cincinnati because you know so,
Speaker 1: I had some stuff ready, but I'm gonna leave it alone.
Speaker 1: I was gonna tell you Bill that yesterday, December ninth,
Speaker 1: so twenty nine years ago was the last edition to
Speaker 1: the Dallas Times Herald, And for some reason it hit
Speaker 1: me yesterday and I went upstairs and grabbed the old
Speaker 1: copy that I kept from the last edition, and I
Speaker 1: read it cover to cover right the news, the metro, business,
Speaker 1: the sports, and I just want you to know that
Speaker 1: your name is in the last edition of the Dallas
Speaker 1: Times Herald. In a column by I think it was
Speaker 1: Skip Bayless mentioned that he got interviewed by Bill Jones. Really, yes,
Speaker 1: so your name. I'm not sure if I want people
Speaker 1: to know that. Yes, in fact, he would be a
Speaker 1: regular guest on when I would fill in for Scott
Speaker 1: Murray on Sports Extra on when I worked at Channel five. Right, yeah, right.
Speaker 1: And the reason you'll have to send me a copy
Speaker 1: of that, the reason it's in there, it was because
Speaker 1: the last day that we worked was December eighth, and
Speaker 1: it was a Cowboys Saints game at Texas Stadium, and
Speaker 1: all the media showed up, you remember that, and we
Speaker 1: were all getting interviewed as we were trying to watch
Speaker 1: the game and contemplate the rest of our lives, knowing
Speaker 1: that this was our last day of work, not knowing
Speaker 1: what the future would hold. But yeah, I they listened,
Speaker 1: you know. And the other thing I didn't realize there
Speaker 1: was nine hundred people when you include everybody that was
Speaker 1: connected to the paper, the delivery people, you know, press
Speaker 1: and all the press room and all that stuff, there
Speaker 1: was nine hundred people that lost jobs. And they listed
Speaker 1: everybody's name that was on the payroll on two pages
Speaker 1: inside the first section of the paper. Yeah, I've forgotten
Speaker 1: that part, and I don't know if I ever looked
Speaker 1: at it, but it was interesting to read the sports section.
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what it might be twenty nine
Speaker 1: years later, but I'll put that sports section up against
Speaker 1: anybody that they're doing today. It was still pretty comprehensive
Speaker 1: and it was pretty darn good reading too, And it
Speaker 1: was a testament to competition. Yeah, I mean at the
Speaker 1: times here on in the morning news going up against
Speaker 1: each other. I mean that's that created great products on
Speaker 1: both sides of it. And then the fort Worth Pager,
Speaker 1: I'll tell you where we created. It created a bunch
Speaker 1: of sacrificial lambs. That's where they created. You had players
Speaker 1: like myself trying to stay out of trouble. You know,
Speaker 1: you had players like Dennis Thurman were hiding from reporters
Speaker 1: like Gary Myers of course with the news. But then
Speaker 1: who was a gym did? Was it? Uh? It was
Speaker 1: a beat writer for at that time it was myself.
Speaker 1: But before when you first got there, it was Jim
Speaker 1: Dead before. Yeah, yeah, Jim did high. He's he's lurking
Speaker 1: around uh locker rooms and lockers trying to dip in
Speaker 1: on a conversation if you and the fellow defensive back
Speaker 1: or having a beef about the organization. You can bet
Speaker 1: the old uh fort Worth Star was right there sneaking
Speaker 1: around with a recorder, trying to trying to dip in
Speaker 1: on our conversation. So yeah, a lot of good people there,
Speaker 1: but it was a few of them that that competition
Speaker 1: created a lot of a lot of negativity around that
Speaker 1: locker room. And and that was good for selling papers,
Speaker 1: but it was for the for the program itself, for
Speaker 1: the Cowboys program. Did we even have recorders back day? Yeah,
Speaker 1: one of those. You had one of the most CIA
Speaker 1: records is back in the day. Man, that's what's real.
Speaker 1: You have real to real, that's what you have neck
Speaker 1: in day. But anyway, you know, but not only that,
Speaker 1: go ahead, I was gonna say not only that is uh.
Speaker 1: I can say this from the TV side of things,
Speaker 1: the competition was so much greater as far as the
Speaker 1: TV stations are concerned, because the TV stations gave the
Speaker 1: sports more time. I mean we literally here's the difference
Speaker 1: between nineteen ninety and thirty years later here in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty as far as how much time we get for
Speaker 1: our sports cast on the local news. Okay, back in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety, each station at they would at five o'clock
Speaker 1: you'd get a three minute sportscast and then you'd go
Speaker 1: four minutes at six o'clock and four and a half
Speaker 1: minutes at ten o'clock. That was a standard you go
Speaker 1: from today all the stations we get two minutes at
Speaker 1: six and two minutes and thirty seconds at ten o'clock.
Speaker 1: And that's basically it and um. But but the other
Speaker 1: part of that is uh, and this is where the
Speaker 1: fans really That's what Everson says. Sometimes it could be
Speaker 1: a detriment for the players. But the access that the
Speaker 1: media had back then, there was no comparison with what
Speaker 1: it is today, even in a non COVID year, especially
Speaker 1: in a COVID year, I mean there was there's basically
Speaker 1: no access at all. But uh, back then, I mean
Speaker 1: we had the run of the locker room when yes,
Speaker 1: you did exactly you did, and there was there was
Speaker 1: some time did that you even are relishing in that fact,
Speaker 1: you had the run of my locker room. That back
Speaker 1: not cool at all. I don't know what kind of
Speaker 1: tact that Spagnola had back in the day. But when
Speaker 1: you gotta dodge Myers and Dint and skilled Bayliss every day,
Speaker 1: and they're looking to take down Tom Landry, they're looking
Speaker 1: to take down tech Schram. They got a beef with
Speaker 1: gil Brant, and then they'll come to me and say, hey, Everson,
Speaker 1: what do you think about gil Brant? Hey man, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm in the negotiation right now. Can you get out
Speaker 1: of my face with that, please? Some man? No, No,
Speaker 1: you know, I did. I did, I do, Everson, I
Speaker 1: upgraded the ethics when I got there. Okay, thank god,
Speaker 1: thank god, thank god. But you remember, we had we
Speaker 1: had a little small cubicle office in the at the ranch,
Speaker 1: right there by the entrance where the where the players
Speaker 1: came in, so that mine said it was the first
Speaker 1: one by the door. So when the door was opened
Speaker 1: and you guys were leaving, if somebody was leaving on
Speaker 1: crutches and they didn't announce the injury, it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: somebody's hurt. That's exactly right, you know. If you know
Speaker 1: what we would do as a TV station on the
Speaker 1: morning after a game, if let's say Troy Aikman had
Speaker 1: not a major injury, but let's say he had something
Speaker 1: something happened to him on Sunday, we would have a
Speaker 1: crew that would be at Valley Ranch before eight o'clock
Speaker 1: in the morning to get Troy walking from his car
Speaker 1: in the parking lot. We would be there with our camera,
Speaker 1: with our camera as he got out of his car
Speaker 1: and limped into the locker room. We would follow him
Speaker 1: all the way into the locker room and sold by
Speaker 1: eight eight o'clock in the morning. The day after, we
Speaker 1: would have some sort of update on the condition of
Speaker 1: Troy Aikman. Um, Hey, you had, you had. Some of
Speaker 1: the biggest stories were written when everyone was gone home,
Speaker 1: and then there was always someone trying to lag behind
Speaker 1: because they were part of a huge story, and you
Speaker 1: guys would be waiting outside to pounce on them right
Speaker 1: right away. You know. That was especially doing the strike season.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it was horrible. Nineteen eighty seven, bad man.
Speaker 1: I'll give you, I'll give you. I'll give you one
Speaker 1: more story on the parking lot. And it was the
Speaker 1: last time I ever did this. You know, when the
Speaker 1: guys used to walk out and they didn't do their
Speaker 1: interviews and everybody'd run after them. Well, when the Herschel
Speaker 1: Walker trade was announced and Herschel tried going out the
Speaker 1: back doors, he tried going out the door in the
Speaker 1: equipment room. Remember, you can get onto them, that's right,
Speaker 1: that's right. You have immediate access to your car from
Speaker 1: the equipting. Somebody yells, oh Herschel's going to his car,
Speaker 1: and everybody goes running out right TV cameras. They're trampling everybody.
Speaker 1: I started running and I go, what am I doing.
Speaker 1: I'm kind of a gross person and I'm running to them.
Speaker 1: And I said, that's it. I will never run to
Speaker 1: the person lot after anybody ever again. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: all the other idiots. Yeah, and this was this was
Speaker 1: pretty funny. We you know how they used to do
Speaker 1: grades right after the game, which you know, we were
Speaker 1: forced to do it, and they were always wrong. And
Speaker 1: that was the only thing the players read were grades. Right,
Speaker 1: you give them an a God forbid if you gave
Speaker 1: them a D or something, you know. So that section
Speaker 1: of the team. So I came up with the idea,
Speaker 1: we're not doing grades. We're gonna do thumbs up, thumbs
Speaker 1: down and in the middle right, So and so at
Speaker 1: the end of that we we we had two more categories,
Speaker 1: and this was after the Saints game, and one of
Speaker 1: them was for something I can't remember what it was.
Speaker 1: It was for doing something good, and the last one
Speaker 1: was bad day at the office. Right, and so I
Speaker 1: finished bad day at the office with entire dime times
Speaker 1: Harold Stay, that's the girl. That's that is what you
Speaker 1: call a bad day at the office. It absolutely How
Speaker 1: did you how did you find out that it was folding? Um?
Speaker 1: I it was a noon it was a noon start,
Speaker 1: and I would get there you know too. Two. This
Speaker 1: is on a Sunday morning, Sunday morning, noon, uh, December eighth,
Speaker 1: and I'm sitting at my spot in the press box
Speaker 1: and the phone rings and uh, I think it was
Speaker 1: Dave Pelletier, the assistant pr director, picks up the phone
Speaker 1: and he goes, Uh, Mickey, your sports editor wants to
Speaker 1: talk to you. And I'm going I'm gonna talk to
Speaker 1: me at nine thirty ten o'clock in the morning. You know,
Speaker 1: there's nothing going on. So I go there and it
Speaker 1: was Gary Hardy. Uh and uh, he says, Mick, I
Speaker 1: got bad news for you. He goes, uh, the paper
Speaker 1: has just been sold to the Dallas Morning News and
Speaker 1: this is going to be our last edition. We're going
Speaker 1: out of business. And I'm going seriously he goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: he goes, I hate to have to tell you this,
Speaker 1: and he goes, can you do me a favor? He goes,
Speaker 1: when the other people on the staff come in, can
Speaker 1: you let them know that this is the news. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, I'm going me, I go, you mean to
Speaker 1: tell me? I gotta go up to Frank Luxo, who's
Speaker 1: been doing this job since nineteen seventy two. And I
Speaker 1: got to tell him he's out of work. And so
Speaker 1: I basically stood out in the hallway and um, people
Speaker 1: start coming in. Wow, and Skip saw me standing out
Speaker 1: there when he came in, and it was like, what
Speaker 1: are you doing out here? And I said, okay, let
Speaker 1: me break the news to you. Uh. And same thing
Speaker 1: with Frank. I had to tell him, yeah, this is
Speaker 1: your last day of work. And so our joke that
Speaker 1: day basically was well, if you need another good clip
Speaker 1: to get get a job, you better make this one good,
Speaker 1: a good one. Uh. And And I remember I remember
Speaker 1: go ahead Everson, No, No, you go ahead, say. I
Speaker 1: remember I remember kind of watching the game like I'm
Speaker 1: watching but I wasn't seeing, and it was just like
Speaker 1: the whole thing was just a I don't know, it
Speaker 1: was a cloud that whole day trying to cover the game. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like a blurer, right. And I remember and I go
Speaker 1: back and read my my, my game story. And it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, those first four paragraphs were really good that
Speaker 1: it just fell off. It just was like it wasn't me.
Speaker 1: You know, you you you know what it's like to
Speaker 1: get cut. You know. Funny you say that because we
Speaker 1: hung around in the locker room afterwards, uh to say
Speaker 1: something to Jimmy. We didn't know if he knew it
Speaker 1: or not. And we're, you know, we didn't know if
Speaker 1: we'd ever see him again or what our jobs would be.
Speaker 1: And so there was like three or four of us, Me, Frank,
Speaker 1: Susie Woodhams. I think there was one of their person
Speaker 1: with us. And he comes out and he looks at
Speaker 1: us and he had heard right, and he all he
Speaker 1: did was kind of you know how he used to
Speaker 1: smack his lips and he goes, well, whatever he goes.
Speaker 1: Now you know how coaches feel, So Jimmy, it's, oh, wait,
Speaker 1: how coaches feel when this guy cut somebody every day?
Speaker 1: And now he talks about how coaches feel. Give me
Speaker 1: a break, could be a break, how coaches feel he
Speaker 1: cut somebody every month and he's talking about that. Come on,
Speaker 1: only Jimmy could turn that around to where he if
Speaker 1: teachable moment right for him to show to you give
Speaker 1: me a break. Yeah, that was. That was, and you
Speaker 1: know he was he was trying. I think he was
Speaker 1: trying to kind of lighten the situation. But yeah, that was.
Speaker 1: That was his deal. And the other thing I remembers,
Speaker 1: so if you remember, so this was nineteen ninety one. Uh,
Speaker 1: And I'd forgotten this until I read it again, that
Speaker 1: when Tech Shramp, when they bought the team and then
Speaker 1: Tex left. It was about May of eighty nine. He
Speaker 1: took the job with the uh what did they call it,
Speaker 1: the European Football League was the World League of American Footballball. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he took that job and his suite was right next
Speaker 1: to the press box. And you know, Tex used to
Speaker 1: sit in the press box for the games, but once
Speaker 1: that happened, he just stayed in his suite. We go
Speaker 1: in there and say hi to him, but he never
Speaker 1: came back in the press box until that day he
Speaker 1: came back to kind of give us each a handshake
Speaker 1: and a hug and say hey, sorry to hear it happened.
Speaker 1: But that was the first and only time he came
Speaker 1: back in the press box after he parted ways with
Speaker 1: the Cowboys. Yeah, so anyway, twenty nine years ago, Well, Mickey,
Speaker 1: I twenty nine years ago. I would say things turned
Speaker 1: turned around very nicely for you years. I think I
Speaker 1: survived somehouse way. But that day, boy, no, no, it
Speaker 1: was it was that it was that company man mentality
Speaker 1: that he took. See when they when he when they
Speaker 1: had him firing everybody else, you know, that that solidifier
Speaker 1: for him, this oh, this guy will do anything to
Speaker 1: keep a job. So they that's why that was a
Speaker 1: test for you, spat. They wanted to They wanted to
Speaker 1: make sure that you were willing to do anything to
Speaker 1: sell your brothers down the river. And you did a
Speaker 1: good job. Man, that's pretty good man. So they long
Speaker 1: have you been a cowboy? Bill Bill, they'll have the
Speaker 1: crankiest guy in the world telling everybody that they're fired.
Speaker 1: That's right. You know, you're supposed to give it to
Speaker 1: him in a soft manner. But here's fat hey guy,
Speaker 1: you're out? Yeah me too, Yeah, yeah, yeah, go cry
Speaker 1: me a river. Yeah, I've been there been that power. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I see you later. I don't think it happened that
Speaker 1: and ever since, ever since. It was in December also,
Speaker 1: so you know management at the times Zerold it was
Speaker 1: in December. They said, who would be the best guy
Speaker 1: to tell every all of our employees that they won't
Speaker 1: have a Christmas this year? This is Scrooge Christmas. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it stole a lot of things. Oh man, what the
Speaker 1: spots bags? What spot? Unbelievable? And so how long before
Speaker 1: you started working for the Cowboys? Oh? It was another
Speaker 1: nine years I freelanced, remember, Oh yeah, Well, because you
Speaker 1: were with freelancing and you were what was the inside?
Speaker 1: What was the skip? Baylor's the inside, the Insider? That's right, right,
Speaker 1: did the Insider? And then talk radio started and I
Speaker 1: started working at the Ticket, and the Cowboys got good,
Speaker 1: and there was all the freelance I could handle from
Speaker 1: all around the country, people wanting stories on the cowboys,
Speaker 1: and you know that kind of saved me that they
Speaker 1: got good when there was work to do. Yeah, when
Speaker 1: when did you When did you realize, I want to know,
Speaker 1: when you realize that, hey, this might not be a
Speaker 1: bad thing. When did you realize that to change and
Speaker 1: communication was coming. It took about six months because that's
Speaker 1: when we started the Insider, uh, And that's when I
Speaker 1: started getting freelance and doing other stuff being you know,
Speaker 1: the correspondent for USA Today and Sporting News and things
Speaker 1: like that. So I picked up a lot of work, uh,
Speaker 1: and I picked up some TV stuff. Uh, And then
Speaker 1: the radio thing happened, and yeah it. I ended up
Speaker 1: doing it till two thousand when I started with the
Speaker 1: Cowboys and on TV. Yes, yes, twenty years see. So
Speaker 1: that was all you have to start grooming yourself like damn,
Speaker 1: my nose hairs out of control? All right, Well that's
Speaker 1: a good way to kick off this. At this the
Speaker 1: mix shot us. And so when we come back, maybe
Speaker 1: we will move on to Cincinnati. We will see when
Speaker 1: Mike shots can continue us in a moment. Hey, they're
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Speaker 1: back to mixed shots? You know what? You can now
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Speaker 1: personalized mosaic and may show up on the AT and
Speaker 1: T Live FX video board during the game. Next home
Speaker 1: game for the Cowboys a week from Sunday when the
Speaker 1: San Francisco forty nine ers come to town, and that
Speaker 1: will be a noon kickoff. We talked about that yesterday.
Speaker 1: Cowboys next out of Sunday night football to a noon kickoff.
Speaker 1: That's right, That's right, guys. That that that's that's I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: that's still pretty embarrassing. Uh, you know, to go from
Speaker 1: prime time to noon. I mean they could have put
Speaker 1: them at three thirty, right, They just dropped them all
Speaker 1: the way down. Is that punishment? You know? Is that
Speaker 1: just sticking it to the Cowboys because they I'm sure
Speaker 1: they have other slots they could have chosen, but they
Speaker 1: put us all the way down to noon. I think,
Speaker 1: well you know that they had those Yeah, yeah, it does.
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter. Obviously. You can move anything around the
Speaker 1: way you want, so there's there's no precedent set here.
Speaker 1: It's like we can do anything we want. Oh you
Speaker 1: were you were scheduling for the evening. No, no, not
Speaker 1: the Cowboys. You guys are not going to embarrass this station.
Speaker 1: So that's just you know, the three twenty five window
Speaker 1: is is for TV networks, that's considered a prime window
Speaker 1: that late Sunday afternoon, and so they would be going
Speaker 1: from prime time time Sunday night to almost primetime at
Speaker 1: three twenty five on Sunday. So if you're not gonna
Speaker 1: be and so they will have multiple games at three
Speaker 1: twenty five, but the second game that's not the primetime game.
Speaker 1: You're just going into your own local markets anyway. So
Speaker 1: you actually probably have more people getting the Cowboy game
Speaker 1: even with a three and nine or what will be
Speaker 1: a four and nine Cowboys Steve next week against San Francisco,
Speaker 1: you'll get them to ground. Chuck, come on, exactly what happened?
Speaker 1: That's the right the country's looking at us. Now we
Speaker 1: are ground Chuck. You know what, though, there's hope on
Speaker 1: the horizon. You know, why tell me thirty seven year
Speaker 1: on a Cincinnati. It's nothing about the past, nothing about
Speaker 1: the futures right now with Cincinnati. There you go. We're
Speaker 1: on to Cincinnati. Could you hear that? Finally so sounded
Speaker 1: like Bill Belichick. I know that gravel. I know that
Speaker 1: gravelly voice. I know that gravelly voice. Uh huh, that's right.
Speaker 1: We're onto Cincinnati. And here we are. We're onto Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: And what update do you have from the Star in
Speaker 1: Fresco Mickey Spagnola about the Cowboys and the Bengals. Well,
Speaker 1: the Cowboys basically had a practice today, but it was
Speaker 1: closed to everybody, and Mike McCarthy didn't was not scheduled
Speaker 1: to do his uh media conference call. We're supposed to
Speaker 1: get players, and I think it should have happened maybe
Speaker 1: started a half hour ago. But yeah, I saw some
Speaker 1: quotes from Zeke. Yeah, Zeke was supposed to talk, and
Speaker 1: you know yesterday he was limited. They listed him as
Speaker 1: limited in practice and they didn't practice. It was just
Speaker 1: a projection of what would have happened had they had
Speaker 1: they had they practiced so Anthony Brown and Zeke were
Speaker 1: listed as limited, Cam Irving and Donovan Wilson were listed
Speaker 1: as out, and the Bengals had a whole bunch of
Speaker 1: guys that were not injury lated missing practice guys like
Speaker 1: Geno Atkins, Mike Daniels, AJ Greene, and then they had
Speaker 1: a couple other guys that missed the limited T Higgins
Speaker 1: and Alex Redmond with a concussion. And they said Brandon
Speaker 1: Allen had a full practice. But again it was a
Speaker 1: I think there two was a well the Cowboys was
Speaker 1: a projection. There's wasn't. They actually practiced yesterday and they
Speaker 1: do expect Brandon Allen to play. He did his media
Speaker 1: availability yesterday. Yeah, and he had left. He left her
Speaker 1: last game at a chess contusion, and it was Ryan
Speaker 1: Finley who finished up against the Dolphins last week. And
Speaker 1: it looked like the Cowboys. Brandon Allen is the guy.
Speaker 1: It looked like the Cowboys. We're going to have a
Speaker 1: light practice today. So I don't I'm not sure what
Speaker 1: we'll get on the practice report when it comes out.
Speaker 1: It wasn't really And I think what he's trying to
Speaker 1: do is keep get their legs underneath them to play
Speaker 1: this next game and not wear them out in practice.
Speaker 1: So no major injuries in the last game that we
Speaker 1: have to worry about anyone missing the game, not that
Speaker 1: we not that we detected after the game, except for Zeke.
Speaker 1: And I'm sure that happened at the game at some point,
Speaker 1: because it seemed like Pollard that second half was starting
Speaker 1: to get a few more snaps, although he finished with
Speaker 1: thirty one and he'd been averaging somewhere between low twenties
Speaker 1: to thirty a game over these last five or six games,
Speaker 1: So I don't know if that was indicative of Zeke
Speaker 1: having problems with that calf or not. But we'll see
Speaker 1: going forward what takes place there. Thought. I thought Zeke
Speaker 1: ran pretty well in the ball game. What was numbers? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I got them somewhere here. I got it. He ended
Speaker 1: up eighteen for seventy seven. He and he ended up
Speaker 1: eighteen carry seventy seven yards and then four catches for eighteen.
Speaker 1: Really ran well on that screen pass that they finally
Speaker 1: executed correctly, and and uh and Tony Pollard was at
Speaker 1: seven carries for ten yards until that last play of
Speaker 1: the game where he went for about twelve yards to
Speaker 1: finish eight for twenty two, right, yeah, Pollard. I like
Speaker 1: Pollard's u involvement in the game plan from every aspect.
Speaker 1: You know, we talk about what he can do from
Speaker 1: the line of scrimmage, but that kickoff return, you know,
Speaker 1: that's something that I think he can consistently be effective
Speaker 1: at just using him all over the field. You know,
Speaker 1: he's got He's become a nice bright spot for this offense.
Speaker 1: A nice I wouldn't say a surprise, but when you
Speaker 1: when you have a season right now full of so
Speaker 1: many disappointments, I would not put him in that category
Speaker 1: of disappointments. I will put him as just one of
Speaker 1: the more positive points, positive points for this game, for
Speaker 1: this team. Actually, yeah, you know what, and as this
Speaker 1: seasons wore on, they've had a couple more. I think
Speaker 1: Neville Gallimore had a nice game once again. Now you
Speaker 1: see what he does right now, there's probably things he
Speaker 1: does wrong, and you know we're not charting those, but
Speaker 1: I think he ended up in four tackles. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: had four tackles in the game, and he just seems
Speaker 1: to be getting more active inside. So that was kind
Speaker 1: of a somewhat of a bright spot for a defense
Speaker 1: that just continues to struggle. You know, I you know,
Speaker 1: they're they're last in the league, giving up three hundred
Speaker 1: and ninety three points in twelve games. That is a
Speaker 1: pace of thirty two point seven five a game. And
Speaker 1: I figured out if these last four, if that they
Speaker 1: are on that same pace, they will give up five
Speaker 1: hundred and twenty four points. Five hundred and twenty four points.
Speaker 1: The single season record for this franchise in its sixty
Speaker 1: first season is it four hundred and thirty six and
Speaker 1: twenty thirteen. They're gonna beat it by over like almost
Speaker 1: one hundred points. It's unbelievable. That's not a record yan
Speaker 1: I have. It's it's I have been there. It's tough.
Speaker 1: My last two years with Dallas, if I'm not mistaken,
Speaker 1: we were three and thirteen. Tom's last year, yes, and
Speaker 1: of course Jimmy's first year one in fifteen. So that's
Speaker 1: got only four wins for myself and those guys in
Speaker 1: in two years. In other words, you were Cincinnati, boy
Speaker 1: was I Oh my god, I mean you're Cincinnati the
Speaker 1: last two years because Zach Taylor, I think they're at
Speaker 1: four twenty three and one or something like that here
Speaker 1: the last since he took over his head coach, but
Speaker 1: go ahead ever since. No, what I was saying was
Speaker 1: I know the frustration. You know, as a fan, I'm
Speaker 1: always posting about how disappointing it is and things that nature.
Speaker 1: But as a former player, being in that particular, that
Speaker 1: exact same position, just a feeling. You're talking about not
Speaker 1: being able to stop the run. They're not even trying
Speaker 1: to pass the ball most of the time. You're not
Speaker 1: being able to stop the run. Every drive that you
Speaker 1: go out there is hard to keep that positive mentality.
Speaker 1: Everything that you do doesn't work out. You see you
Speaker 1: guys up front, they can't stop the run. Holes are
Speaker 1: opening up. Linebackers know where to be found. And these
Speaker 1: are talented people that you are playing with. You know
Speaker 1: that your teammates are talented, but then you see the
Speaker 1: futility of it all. Coaches can't do anything. You go
Speaker 1: into the meeting every day, same thing, day in day out,
Speaker 1: that hum drum, just same old feeling that comes over you.
Speaker 1: It's a really tough situation to be in as a player.
Speaker 1: As we look at it from the outside, you know,
Speaker 1: guys like you Sax build you guys you can write
Speaker 1: about it. You're frustrated even writing about it. Just think
Speaker 1: if you're a player out there with any type of
Speaker 1: pride trying to do something to change anything, and no
Speaker 1: matter what you do, it doesn't work. I do feel
Speaker 1: for those guys. Trust me, I've been there. I know
Speaker 1: that futility. But man, my only my refuge was the
Speaker 1: fact that they kicked me out of there. How do
Speaker 1: you how do you make that change? And as part
Speaker 1: of the solution, that's the toughest part. How can you
Speaker 1: be part of the solution. So give Jimmy Johnson and
Speaker 1: Jerry Let me say, give Jimmy Johnson credit in regards
Speaker 1: to coming from one to fifteen and then the next
Speaker 1: year you go I think seven and nine, right, and
Speaker 1: they were like right in until the end with Babe
Speaker 1: and trying to do this thing. Yeah yeah, and then
Speaker 1: eleven and five. That's the genius to be able to
Speaker 1: pull yourself out of this situation. Like I said, I
Speaker 1: was blessed. Why I just made a phone call and
Speaker 1: I knew what my plan was individual, But to take
Speaker 1: a team, to take an entire team from this situation
Speaker 1: back to prominence, that's gonna be the tough thing to do.
Speaker 1: Jimmy did it very well with his coaching staff and
Speaker 1: the talent that they had. But the Cowboys right now,
Speaker 1: I have to see what that formula is gonna be
Speaker 1: for them to turn all of this around, because eventually
Speaker 1: you gotta start climbing your way back up, and you
Speaker 1: have to have the same the guys with the right attitude.
Speaker 1: You don't want those same guys that you know have
Speaker 1: that same old old woe is me attitude. You want
Speaker 1: a different attitude. And how the coach and staff is
Speaker 1: going to be able to do this or how this
Speaker 1: organization's gonna be able to do this, that's gonna be
Speaker 1: a tough task. Yeah, And you know, the culture of
Speaker 1: the team had changed so dramatically for people that had
Speaker 1: been there with twenty consecutive winning seasons, and then you
Speaker 1: go seven and nine, seven and eight, three and thirteen
Speaker 1: one in fifteen, seven and nine, you end up with
Speaker 1: what five sixth straight or five straight losing seasons after
Speaker 1: twenty consecutive winning seasons. But it ended up getting turned
Speaker 1: around that ninety one season when they win eleven and
Speaker 1: five and actually won a playoff game in Chicago. Kelvin
Speaker 1: Martin's punt return I thought was the biggest play that
Speaker 1: probably the biggest play of this the new franchise. That's
Speaker 1: the biggest play to me of the new franchise because
Speaker 1: I never thought they could go into Philadelphia and win
Speaker 1: that game. And let's be real, that defense was the
Speaker 1: reason that they were able to do it. We talk
Speaker 1: about Troy Eigman, we talk about the triplets and all
Speaker 1: of that, but that defense was the reason that that
Speaker 1: team was able to hold on and win the Philadelphia game.
Speaker 1: Wake come back from break. I got a memory about
Speaker 1: that game that I'll share with you guys. Okay, I
Speaker 1: was there. It was very cold, and it was cold,
Speaker 1: it was windy, and I will agree with Everson on
Speaker 1: the Kelvin Martin punt return. More mix shots coming up
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Speaker 1: That was a good way to go wherever books are sold.
Speaker 1: Are you saying? Are you saying? Ever since that he
Speaker 1: was teetering at some point, I was teetering, but he
Speaker 1: he didn't. He did not elect to run a fake punt. Yeah.
Speaker 1: There was a couple of words in there that we're
Speaker 1: kind of tricky. Yeah, So there there was a great
Speaker 1: testament to just go with it. Okay, let the game
Speaker 1: play out, Let the read play out. There's no reason
Speaker 1: for a fake punt here, even though you since that's
Speaker 1: exactly right. Yeah, that's right. If we were taping, this
Speaker 1: started over right, But when it's live, you just pushed
Speaker 1: right there. I tried, I tried. There are no false starts.
Speaker 1: You know, life is one big false start for some
Speaker 1: of us. Oh, all right, you had a story to tell.
Speaker 1: Mickey had a story to tell about Dallas Philly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that nineteen ninety one, and it was cold, and I
Speaker 1: do remember that. You remember the I don't know bill
Speaker 1: if you got to sit in the press box where
Speaker 1: all the writers were. The press boxes were separated at
Speaker 1: the vet the like the home team was on one side,
Speaker 1: the TV cameras the radio booths were in the middle,
Speaker 1: and then the visitors were on the other side of
Speaker 1: the press box. And there was a window there that
Speaker 1: was removable because they put a camera in there, so
Speaker 1: if it was thirty degrees outside, that window was opened
Speaker 1: the whole game. And that poor cameraman used to get
Speaker 1: the worst stairs you've ever seen, because we're in there
Speaker 1: covering a game and we might as well, have our
Speaker 1: coats and hats and gloves on, because it was like
Speaker 1: sitting outside. I do remember that punt return. I do
Speaker 1: remember I Colt coming back and picking somebody off. It
Speaker 1: probably would have been a penalty in these days, but
Speaker 1: he nay somebody and was the last guy that could
Speaker 1: get Kelvin Martin tackled and on the team charter coming back.
Speaker 1: They probably didn't need to to any how, should I
Speaker 1: put it, they didn't need any fuel in that plane
Speaker 1: because you'd never seen guys celebrate lar and I mean
Speaker 1: the guys up front, the coaching staff, because they were
Speaker 1: under a lot of pressure, right they were the new guys,
Speaker 1: and they finally broke through and that was a big moment.
Speaker 1: And uh, I happened to be on the charter because
Speaker 1: after the paper folded. So we'll go back to where
Speaker 1: we started. I get a call from Maryland Love, Jerry
Speaker 1: Jones's ministrative assistant, and she said, Jerry thinks you guys
Speaker 1: deserve to finish out the season, so if you want
Speaker 1: to go to the game, we'll put you on the
Speaker 1: charter and put you at the hotel with the team.
Speaker 1: So that's amazing, And so I walk up to the
Speaker 1: front there, and Jimmy kind of motioned me up and
Speaker 1: they're celebrating. They're all over he hugging and and I
Speaker 1: told him, I said, you know, I said before the
Speaker 1: season started, I said the over under for wins for
Speaker 1: the Cowboys this year was like eight and a half.
Speaker 1: He goes eight and a half. He goes, Man, for me,
Speaker 1: that would have been a paycheck bet, because they ended
Speaker 1: up getting to eleven and and and that game gave
Speaker 1: him ten. Uh. And then I think they finished the
Speaker 1: season off beating um, I want to say the Bears,
Speaker 1: and maybe in the last game or something like that.
Speaker 1: But anyway, yeah, that it was a huge celebration on
Speaker 1: that flight back. And uh. And who was the quarterback
Speaker 1: for the Cowboys that day, Steve Burline. That's right, that
Speaker 1: was a quarterback. That was the one. Jimmy read him
Speaker 1: the Riot Act before the game. He's and he basically said,
Speaker 1: under no circumstances do you take a sack and get
Speaker 1: that defense all riled up with that front and the
Speaker 1: crowd all riled up. He goes, I don't care if
Speaker 1: you go three for fifteen in the first half, you
Speaker 1: throw the ball away. You do not take a sack. Well,
Speaker 1: he listened because I think he was like four for
Speaker 1: twelve or some ridiculous number like that until they got
Speaker 1: that punt return and then put the game away in
Speaker 1: the like was a late third quarter or fourth quarter
Speaker 1: when that happened. But yeah, Burlton listened to what he
Speaker 1: said because we're gonna make sure we played defense and
Speaker 1: we don't give him anything. And that was the instructions.
Speaker 1: And then just lets you know, guys, the same old
Speaker 1: tried and true offense what sales tickets, and defense wins
Speaker 1: the games. It is so prevalent right now. The only
Speaker 1: teams in the NFC East that are playing defense are
Speaker 1: the ones that actually have a chance at this point
Speaker 1: to make it to the playoffs. Even as bad as
Speaker 1: the NFC East looks right now, you have two teams,
Speaker 1: two teams in the nfcast. When it's all said and
Speaker 1: done and everything balances out, those two teams have a
Speaker 1: chance to win because of how good their defense is.
Speaker 1: All you got to do is hold on. All you
Speaker 1: gotta do is not make mistakes, play good defense, let
Speaker 1: your special teams work for you. And with the Cowboys,
Speaker 1: it's so funny because they started off with that mentality
Speaker 1: and then as they start to win the Super Bowls,
Speaker 1: it all became about paying offensive players. They're the ones
Speaker 1: that they keep on the team. But guys like Ken Norton,
Speaker 1: he's gone. You know, your middle linebacker is gone. Yet
Speaker 1: you still continue to win. But there's no emphasis put
Speaker 1: on defense for this entire organization. I think they need
Speaker 1: to kind of kind of pivot a little bit. And
Speaker 1: of course you still have the amazing offensive players, but
Speaker 1: I wish we would really concentrate more on being creating
Speaker 1: a culture of defense around this organization. You know. And
Speaker 1: the other part of that is that was a December
Speaker 1: game in frigid Philadelphia. Okay, you take you back to
Speaker 1: Tuesday night in Baltimore. You talk about special teams, Okay,
Speaker 1: and it's a different game in December when you're playing
Speaker 1: out in the elements. Okay, it was a thirty nine
Speaker 1: forty degree night in Baltimore. The other night on Sunday
Speaker 1: afternoon in Cincinnati. I think the high temperature it's gonna
Speaker 1: be thirty nine and forty degrees when they play in Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: You cannot kick the same length field goals when it's
Speaker 1: in the thirties, is what it is. In the seventies, okay,
Speaker 1: And so when you're kicking these fifty yard field goals,
Speaker 1: your chances of making I don't know what the analytics
Speaker 1: say on making fifty yard field goals when it's thirty
Speaker 1: eight degrees outside, but I guarantee you it's not as
Speaker 1: great as when you're kicking when seventy eight degrees exactly,
Speaker 1: that's right. But they don't have to hook or fade. Well, no,
Speaker 1: but but as a kicker that means he has to
Speaker 1: put more effort in training. He's trying to compensate be
Speaker 1: a different dynamic. Yes, right, rights fast. I'm not giving
Speaker 1: a pass. I want him to make those field goals,
Speaker 1: but there is a dynamic too kicking a heavier ball
Speaker 1: and how it was going to go through there. And
Speaker 1: it wasn't just cold that night, Bill, it was windy
Speaker 1: windy as well. So you can see it. You can
Speaker 1: see it just playing with them try no matter way
Speaker 1: you kick it. I mean justin Tucker early in that
Speaker 1: game has his seventy field goal. Uh Street mayfield goal
Speaker 1: streaks snapped, you know, because inside forty yards and so
Speaker 1: that was an indicator that maybe maybe it's not a
Speaker 1: good night for field goal kickers. That's why you need
Speaker 1: to have a team that is built for the playoffs,
Speaker 1: and that starts with defense and special teams. All right,
Speaker 1: never an hour, ever change nine miles in Baltimore. I'll
Speaker 1: give you what was it in Philadelphia? Oh that I
Speaker 1: don't know what it was, but it was nine an
Speaker 1: hour in Baltimore. Ye, I'll give you that. That could
Speaker 1: have been a burst, Nicky, was the last time you
Speaker 1: were on that inner harbor in Baltimore? That that way?
Speaker 1: Don't kick up? Oh no, I know it will. The
Speaker 1: windchill was thirty two miles an hour. Wind the windchill
Speaker 1: was thirty two miles an hour. On that note, Chris
Speaker 1: giving us, you know, it's a good thing you had
Speaker 1: that recording. We at least mentioned Cincinnati for forty five minutes. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well tomorrow, tomorrow, tomorrow, we are definitely on the Cincinnati. Okay,
Speaker 1: We're onto Cincinnati tomorrow and mix shots. So we will
Speaker 1: see you again on Friday. Go Cowboys. This has been
Speaker 1: a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys Football Club.