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Speaker 1: The volume.

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Speaker 2: This is Prime Cuts, the best of the Colin Coward Podcast.

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Speaker 2: Jeff Benedict, Boy, this was good. Author of the new

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Speaker 2: book Lebron, great insight into the decision and other major

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Speaker 2: turning points in Lebron's career. Oops Tonight host Jason Timpf

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Speaker 2: and I discussed big NBA topics, including why Luca maybe

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Speaker 2: turning into a headache for the MAVs, and Mike Silver

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Speaker 2: and I discuss what is reportedly the end of the

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Speaker 2: Dan Snyder era in Washington. All Right, my buddy, Mike Silver,

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Speaker 2: part of the volume, longtime NFL reporter writes for Ballely

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Speaker 2: Sports in the San Francisco Chronicle, actually begin going to

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Speaker 2: be doing some warrior games since he knows Steve Kerran

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Speaker 2: knows hoops, which is great. We'll get into that in

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Speaker 2: a second. Daniel Snyder, it's hard to ruin a great brand, right,

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Speaker 2: Like Donald Sterling was a bad human, but that was

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Speaker 2: never a great brand, right. Robert Sarver did all he

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Speaker 2: could to ruin the Suns, but it wasn't a huge

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Speaker 2: national brand. Seventies, eighties, nineties, Washington was the Packers. I

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Speaker 2: mean they were when I was a kid growing up.

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Speaker 2: They were the franchise after Dallas and the Steelers, and

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Speaker 2: it's such a great fan base, exactly, exactly, So a

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Speaker 2: lot of people felt, despite the harassment charges, that the

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Speaker 2: owners would support Dan Snyder and he would just figure

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Speaker 2: out a way despite bad pr to hang around. Any

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Speaker 2: insight to what possibly happened.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think one thing that happened is that one

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Speaker 3: of his own publicly started talking about maybe kicking about

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Speaker 3: And I know jimmers say really really well. I admire

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Speaker 3: his conviction. He goes against the grain at times. It's

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Speaker 3: possible Jim Rsay just spoke honestly and from his heart.

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Speaker 3: It's also possible that Jim Ersay had had some conversations

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Speaker 3: with other owners who said, you know what, we agree

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Speaker 3: with you, and if you say that, you know you'd

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Speaker 3: have our at least quiet support. But that was not

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Speaker 3: insignificant when Jimmersay started public you know, came out publicly

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Speaker 3: and said, yeah, I don't know, maybe we should get

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Speaker 3: rid of this guy. Jim Ersay has three daughters, He's

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Speaker 3: very close to him. He didn't like the way that

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Speaker 3: the allegations against Stan Schneider were selling NFL owners and

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Speaker 3: the league. You know, prior to that it had been thought, well,

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Speaker 3: a lot of owners have skeletons. Trust me, I worked

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Speaker 3: for them.

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Speaker 4: For eight years. Trust they do.

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Speaker 3: Whole other podcast topic. But you know a lot of

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Speaker 3: owners have skeletons, and a lot of owners more charitably

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Speaker 3: and have people come out of the woodwork to accuse

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Speaker 3: them of things that maybe aren't totally accurate. But they

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Speaker 3: didn't want to open that can of worms where you know, okay,

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Speaker 3: if accusations happen, it sets the stage for these right franchises.

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Speaker 3: They want to be generational that while we've been on

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Speaker 3: this podcast that you know, each one is appreciated and

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Speaker 3: another one hundred thousand dollars or something. You know, they

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Speaker 3: didn't want to open that can of worms. And remember

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Speaker 3: Jerry Richardson faced some pretty serious allegations just passed away recently.

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Speaker 3: That problem got solved because he was older and he

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Speaker 3: was just done. He was like, you know what, fine,

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Speaker 3: I'm out. And they didn't have to the NFL owners

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Speaker 3: didn't have to deal with it. The NBA solved the

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Speaker 3: problem twice by throwing money at the problem. Essentially a

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Speaker 3: having the balls Adam Silver on his first day on

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Speaker 3: the job to say you're out. Donald Sterling, whether it's

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Speaker 3: constitutional or not, and then a giant offer from Steve

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Speaker 3: Ballmer and again with the suns that happened with Starvers.

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Speaker 3: So you know, this is a little bit of all

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Speaker 3: of that. Daniel Sider wasn't going to make it easy

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Speaker 3: and walk away, but I think once he heard Jim

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Speaker 3: Mersey say that, he realized, man, something has turned.

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Speaker 2: Now the next least popular owner is Jimmy Haslam, who

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Speaker 2: infuriated owners for another reason, an egregiously bad fully guaranteed

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Speaker 2: contract to Deshaun Watson. So if we had a ranking

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Speaker 2: of least popular owners among other billionaire owners, Haslam now

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Speaker 2: is number one.

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Speaker 3: Right, Well, that's so cool that you broached that because

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Speaker 3: I used to do owner rankings.

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Speaker 4: As far as I know, I'm the only one i've.

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Speaker 3: I did them annually for SI dot com and then Yahoo,

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Speaker 3: and of course they were my rankings about who I

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Speaker 3: thought were doing the best jobs of owning teams.

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Speaker 4: But that actually has my wheel.

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Speaker 3: Spinning, like what about an insighty odor rankings of which

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Speaker 3: owners are the most hated among the other owners. And

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Speaker 3: you know, you bring up a good point, but I

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Speaker 3: think in the end, you know, yeah, that frustrated other

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Speaker 3: owners that Jimmy Haslam did that because now we got

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Speaker 3: to deal with this guarantee contract stuff. And other owners

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Speaker 3: didn't like it when David Tepper came in and gave

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Speaker 3: Matt Rule. Sounds weird in retrospect, but gave Matt Rule

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Speaker 3: all that money because it messed up the coaching contract market.

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Speaker 3: But I feel like owners get over that stuff, you know, eventually,

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Speaker 3: but the you know what owners can't get over allegations

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Speaker 3: have proven and maybe we'll never know that one owner,

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Speaker 3: Daniel Snyder, allegedly cooked the books and screwed them out

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Speaker 3: of their share of the gates. That's less forgivable, you

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Speaker 3: know for the billionaire set. So yeah, they tend to

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Speaker 3: stick together. They tend to not want to set precedents like, oh,

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Speaker 3: a couple of accusations could knock Xoder out of the

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Speaker 3: league and make them lose this incredible investment. But you know,

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Speaker 3: Daniel Snyder put them through the rigger in a lot

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Speaker 3: of ways, and Ers, possibly knowing that he spoke for

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Speaker 3: a larger contingent, was kind of like, Okay, this is

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Speaker 3: this is a nightmare. Look if the Colts play the Commanders,

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Speaker 3: if they're still called that at the FedEx Field or

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Speaker 3: a new stadium, and Jim Orsay takes the field pregame

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Speaker 3: to Goschmouze. He should get like an adoring celebration and

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Speaker 3: a prolonged ovation from those Washington fans for a huge,

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Speaker 3: huge assist on getting Daniel Snyder the f out, because

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Speaker 3: heaven knows, it's been long coming and it's tough to

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Speaker 3: shed any tears.

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Speaker 2: So I want to talk about the Niners because you

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Speaker 2: have such in depth, you have tentacles all over that organization.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, increasingly when I follow your Twitter feed,

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Speaker 2: all your critics are lightening up because you've been right

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Speaker 2: so many times and broken so many stories. They are

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Speaker 2: like silver, I hate eh, whatever, what's the latest news.

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Speaker 2: So the trail ant stuff is interesting. I was talking

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Speaker 2: to Jordan Palmer the other day and he's like, you know,

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Speaker 2: if you look at the offense San Francisco runs, a

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Speaker 2: lot of these plays are scheme to succeed. Sam Donald's

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Speaker 2: going to have the best protection, the best weapons, the

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Speaker 2: best coach he's ever had. And we know he's a big, strong,

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Speaker 2: athletic kid and coachable and hard working. He's just not

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Speaker 2: accurate enough. But this system makes you more accurate. Don't

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Speaker 2: be shocked if Jimmy Garoppolo is not nearly as good

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Speaker 2: with the Raiders as he was with the Niners. So

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Speaker 2: brock Purty, I think the franchise likes a lot and

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Speaker 2: Sam Donald are in house. We all know at some point,

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Speaker 2: and I think the Niners are, and even some of

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Speaker 2: the sound and some of the quotes from your articles,

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Speaker 2: they're going to move off something if they missed. They're

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Speaker 2: not going to try to double down on wrong. Let's

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Speaker 2: just be honest. Could Trey Lance be moved before the season.

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Speaker 3: He could, but I believe that brock Purty's injury and

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Speaker 3: the uncertainty that still surrounds his recovery made that much

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Speaker 3: much less likely. Before the playoffs, I wrote and reported

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Speaker 3: it's over. Brock Purty's the guy because they want to

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Speaker 3: go with this model where they pay everybody and have

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Speaker 3: the quarterback on the rookie deal. Yeah, that's what That's

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Speaker 3: what trading for that pick was about. That's what drafting

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Speaker 3: Lance was supposed to be about. And with Purdy, the

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Speaker 3: model is even better. You're not even allowed to reopen

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Speaker 3: his contract for two more years. It's even cheaper than

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Speaker 3: Trey Lance's deal, and he showed Kyle Shanahan. You know,

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Speaker 3: people are like, well, how can you say Perdy. I'm like,

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Speaker 3: I'm not saying that. Kyle believes it based on what

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Speaker 3: he saw for Purdy the guy. So going into that

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Speaker 3: Philly game for the Conference championship, the only thing that

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Speaker 3: kuld of derailed that plan was what happened. If Rock

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Speaker 3: Party had broken his leg, it would have been brutal

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Speaker 3: and it would have hurt and it would have sucked.

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Speaker 3: But they would have been like, fine, he'll come back.

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Speaker 3: It's because of what happened to was throwing elbow. You're

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Speaker 3: not totally sure. A you're not sure when, and B

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Speaker 3: you're still not positive that it's going to be like

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Speaker 3: it was before. And I have PTSD because a lot

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Speaker 3: of my Twitter critics probably weren't born when I was

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Speaker 3: right about the Joe Bontana Steve Young stuff. But Joe

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Speaker 3: Bontana missed basically two seasons after elbow surgeries, and he

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Speaker 3: did come back after that. It'd have two really really

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Speaker 3: good years with the Chiefs, but nothing is promised, and

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Speaker 3: so I think because of that, it gives them an

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Speaker 3: opening to say, look, we knew Lance was going to

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Speaker 3: take a while to develop because he was raw. It's

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Speaker 3: taken longer. It didn't work when we just handed it

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Speaker 3: to him last year. We ended up having to bring

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Speaker 3: Garoppolo back as a hedge and ultimately turned the party.

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Speaker 3: But maybe we can develop him and use this offseason

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Speaker 3: to get him some more reps. And I don't know

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Speaker 3: if this offense makes you more accurate, because you're going

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Speaker 3: to have to be more accurate than or consistently accurate

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Speaker 3: than Trai Lance was before he got hurt last year.

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Speaker 3: But you know, there's still a lot of things to

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Speaker 3: potentially like about him. So I believe what they'll do

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Speaker 3: is they'll say, look, party's not going to be here

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Speaker 3: till at least the start of the season, maybe longer.

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Speaker 3: We're gonna split reps between Lance and Dartl's see how

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Speaker 3: they react, see what we have. Basically, if one of

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Speaker 3: them has to start the opener, it's the guy we

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Speaker 3: think gives us the best chance to win. And I

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Speaker 3: think one thing that people are missing here is that

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Speaker 3: when they say, well, they're going to trade Trey Lance

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Speaker 3: and admit their mistake, Yeah, eventually they're going to admit

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Speaker 3: their mistake. If it was a mistake, but they're not

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Speaker 3: fielding offers to get back in the first round for

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Speaker 3: Trey Lance. And I know it only takes one team,

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Speaker 3: but if they trade Trey Lance, now, I think it's

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Speaker 3: for a three or something. And so I just don't

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Speaker 3: think you have urgency too. You don't know about Purdy,

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Speaker 3: you'd like another option, you'd like to see if you

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Speaker 3: can develop a more because you do have a lot

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Speaker 3: of vested in them. You're not paying them a lot,

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Speaker 3: and you can always move them, you know, a year

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Speaker 3: from now, if it goes the way you wanted to

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Speaker 3: with Purdy, and possibly if it does with Darnold. So

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Speaker 3: I think if someone called them and said we will

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Speaker 3: give you it too, like something, they thought.

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Speaker 4: Oh take a second, yeah they yeah.

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Speaker 3: I think if someone calls and says we'll give you

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Speaker 3: a three for Trey Lance, they go three. Let's see,

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Speaker 3: we currently have ninety six picks in the third round.

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Speaker 3: Not all these guys are going to make our team.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I just don't think. I think I'd rather

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Speaker 3: have a chance to, you know, develop of this offseason.

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Speaker 4: Maybe they will.

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Speaker 3: I don't even think they'll necessarily get off for a

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Speaker 3: three right now. But listen, if he goes out and

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Speaker 3: looks good in the preseason and possibly earlier the season,

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Speaker 3: they could get a lot more for him a year

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Speaker 3: from now.

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Speaker 2: So you went to cal Aaron Rodgers did. But Aaron

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Speaker 2: Rodgers has gotten a little bit more indifferent and critical

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Speaker 2: of the media over the last several years. And I

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Speaker 2: said this on the show today. There's a lot of

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Speaker 2: reports now that this thing won't get done Jets and

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Speaker 2: Packers until after the draft. So Green Bay does have

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Speaker 2: a need at tight end that's fairly urgent. They'll probably

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Speaker 2: draft a tight end in the first round. They need

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Speaker 2: another receiver, pretty thin and young at receiver. They'll go

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Speaker 2: that in the second round. But the roster is good,

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Speaker 2: not great, but it's good. It's not San Francisco, it's

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Speaker 2: not Philadelphia. I don't think it's as good maybe as

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Speaker 2: you know a Buffalo or as you know the top

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Speaker 2: teams in the AFC.

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Speaker 4: But it's a good roster. I believe that.

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Speaker 2: Aaron if he just came out and just said guys,

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Speaker 2: I'm in for two years minimum, it would be over.

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Speaker 2: You could then the Jets would be like, Okay, we

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Speaker 2: know it, you know it. But I said this today,

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Speaker 2: and I've been critical of Aaron. But Aaron's too smart

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Speaker 2: to not know that once you take the most money,

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Speaker 2: you won't have the best roster. He took the money.

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Speaker 2: He's too smart to think, yeah, two rookie receivers, I'm

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Speaker 2: not going to work with him in the off season.

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Speaker 2: That'll work great. I honestly think that we all make

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Speaker 2: choices on what matters to us. You have a great family,

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Speaker 2: great friends in your career. You have prioritized those and

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Speaker 2: they're all strong. Some people care about their careers, some

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Speaker 2: people care about social life somewhat less stress. Aaron's made

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Speaker 2: a decision, in my opinion, and winning. Second, what he

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Speaker 2: wants is control over the media, over situations, over the Packers.

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Speaker 2: That he could end all this bullshit. He can end

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Speaker 2: the drama.

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Speaker 5: Mike.

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Speaker 2: If you just said two years I'm in, I'll think

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Speaker 2: about a third. Why doesn't he do that?

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Speaker 3: Well, first of all, I've also made some bad decisions

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Speaker 3: in terms of priorities, specifically continuing to root for cal

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Speaker 3: which is you know, no, and I joke, but you know, charitably,

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Speaker 3: for Aaron, I would say this, he said he was

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Speaker 3: thinking about retiring, you know, very seriously recently. That's what

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Speaker 3: he you know, will take up at his word. It's

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Speaker 3: I think it's better not to say I'm in for

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Speaker 3: two years if you're not sure that you are. And sure,

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Speaker 3: he could say I'm in for two years and you know,

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Speaker 3: by December be like, oh, I'm you know, this is terrible,

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Speaker 3: I'm out here. But maybe it's to his credit that

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Speaker 3: he's not sure he's in for two years. And listen,

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Speaker 3: I know I know from talking to my sources that

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Speaker 3: the Jets understand that there's a scenario where he only

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Speaker 3: plays one and they are not telling the packers, sorry, man,

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Speaker 3: we take it or leave it. What they're saying to

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Speaker 3: the packers is, look, man, you know if it comes

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Speaker 3: and he plays one year, we give up all this

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Speaker 3: That seems kind of skewed. Is there a mechanism in

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Speaker 3: this trade where if that happens, we get something back

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Speaker 3: after he retires? And I think that's you know, they

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Speaker 3: consider that a reasonable request. So yeah, Aaron can end

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Speaker 3: that if he just said I'm in for two But

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Speaker 3: maybe it's to Aaron's credit that he's not saying that

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Speaker 3: because he's just not sure.

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Speaker 2: Your guess how long you would play with the Jets.

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Speaker 2: I think it's too you know, Aaron's career, first year

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Speaker 2: as a starter in Green Bay, first year with Hackett,

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Speaker 2: it has taken him usually because I've been told he's

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Speaker 2: not a big grinder in the off season like a

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Speaker 2: Brady A. Peyton or Russell Wilson, that Aaron's second year

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Speaker 2: is usually the year he pops. Well, I don't think

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Speaker 2: he wants to do a one walk off and be average.

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Speaker 2: I think he wants to end. It's good for his legacy,

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Speaker 2: it's good for money, it's good. I think he wants

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Speaker 2: to have a reviable year and I don't think his

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Speaker 2: first year, frankly is going to be great.

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Speaker 3: But he doesn't consider this year one, first of all,

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Speaker 3: Year one with Hackett on la floor was a whole

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Speaker 3: new scheme and that I believe that was a legitimate adjustment.

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Speaker 3: By the way they got to the NFC Championship game.

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Speaker 3: He did not have a great statistical year, but they

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Speaker 3: went thirteen to three and got to the FFC Championship game.

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Speaker 3: But I think the way that he and the Jets

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Speaker 3: are thinking of this is this is essentially year four

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Speaker 3: after a gap, because it's Hackett, and because it's that offense,

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Speaker 3: and it's not like Hackett plus Lafloor. By the way,

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Speaker 3: Att Haacket plus Sola, who's like you run the offense,

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Speaker 3: I'm you know, I'll keep an eye on my specialty,

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Speaker 3: which is defense. So if you believe that Aaron and

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Speaker 3: Hackett are now resuming a very fruitful partnership that won

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Speaker 3: consecutive MVPs their next two years together, and it's the

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Speaker 3: Jets receipts and other players who are going to have

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Speaker 3: to adjust to that, Aaron may not think it's he.

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Speaker 3: Aaron probably thinks I'm going to just be rolling for

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Speaker 3: the get go. But going back to what you said earlier,

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Speaker 3: just as he made a decision not to work with

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Speaker 3: the new receivers a year ago, when clearly, as Patrick

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Speaker 3: Mahobes could tell you, that was an important thing to

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Speaker 3: do for winning, I think that's what you need to

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Speaker 3: look at. If this trade doesn't get done Draft weekend,

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Speaker 3: you will probably hear I suspect, Hey, it turns out

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Speaker 3: Aaron Rodgers and Garrett Wilson and Al Lazard and you know,

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Speaker 3: all those Jets targets are working out in La or somewhere,

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Speaker 3: and because there's nothing to stop him, you can't say

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Speaker 3: he's tampering. And you can't say Garrett Wilson's tampering. So

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Speaker 3: I think it is important to have to hit the

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Speaker 3: ground running at your and that that'll be the way

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Speaker 3: we know if there's no trade right away or the

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Speaker 3: next couple of weeks, I would expect we'll see him

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Speaker 3: and those guys for the Jets start to work together.

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Speaker 2: Well. I'm very excited I get to talk to Jeff

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Speaker 2: Benedict after he finishes another absolutely consumable book. You know,

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Speaker 2: he wrote The Dynasty. The insight on the New England Patriots,

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Speaker 2: which is soon to be a documentary on Apple TV,

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Speaker 2: was tremendous. He co wrote the book with my friend

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Speaker 2: Armin Katayan Tiger Woods. And now the new book is

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Speaker 2: Lebron and it's the kind of in depth reporting and

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Speaker 2: context that you just don't get on certainly on shows

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Speaker 2: like mine, but you don't even get in like a

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Speaker 2: magazine article of some renowned It's such quality reporting. And

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Speaker 2: I thought I knew just about everything about Lebron, but

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Speaker 2: the details and the digging here is so fun. You

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Speaker 2: start the book, the topic is the decision, which for

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Speaker 2: years I defended Lebron on David Stern argued with me,

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Speaker 2: I'm like listen, he gave millions of dollars of the

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Speaker 2: Boys and Girls Club give me a break and Stern,

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Speaker 2: as you know, appalled is too strong but didn't like it.

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Speaker 2: So let's you start the book there. Maverick Carter, who

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Speaker 2: I know very well consider a friend, had some leverage

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Speaker 2: in creating this. Let's go back to the decision. People

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Speaker 2: may just remember the Jim Gray interview. It's quick. How

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Speaker 2: did it land for Lebron? Talk about the genesis of it.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's fantastic because Lebron had been he was being

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Speaker 1: courted for a year or longer by a handful of

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Speaker 1: teams that were pulling out all the stops to get him.

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Speaker 1: And you know, it was the question not just in

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Speaker 1: the NBA, but the question in sports that summer was

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Speaker 1: where is Lebron going to go? Or is he going

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Speaker 1: to stay in Cleveland? And the reason I decided to

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Speaker 1: open there is because, first of all, I was able

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Speaker 1: to get access to some information about that day and

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Speaker 1: that decision that has never really come out before. And

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Speaker 1: that's why I wanted to start the book. In a

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Speaker 1: car pulling out of the private airport in New York,

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Speaker 1: making its way through the back roads of Greenwich to

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Speaker 1: the home of the man who really Mark Dowley, who

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Speaker 1: helped put this together with Maverick, And I just thought

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Speaker 1: this gives the reader the opportunity to feel like they're

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Speaker 1: literally in the car with Lebron as he's en route

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Speaker 1: to make a decision in a part of the country

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Speaker 1: that most people have never been to. I mean, most

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Speaker 1: Americans have never been to Greenwich, Connecticut. And in a way,

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Speaker 1: it's a weird place when you think about it. Why

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Speaker 1: in the world would you choose Greenwich to make this announcement.

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Speaker 1: It's Nick's country, if anything, and if you were going

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Speaker 1: to go to the Knicks, Greenwich is an odd place

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Speaker 1: to go to do this. And so I wanted to

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Speaker 1: go there with the reader because I just thought it

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Speaker 1: allowed me to show so many things about Lebron at

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Speaker 1: that moment in his life. And I just love the

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Speaker 1: scenery of them getting out of the car and Greenwich

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Speaker 1: at this estate, Maverick and rich Paul, and they're flying

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Speaker 1: so high in that moment, they're so happy, they're so

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Speaker 1: almost in a way there is a naive ta about

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Speaker 1: what's about to happen, and they're so loose.

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Speaker 4: And then in a couple of hours, all hell breaks.

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Speaker 2: It does take people listening now, because there is so

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Speaker 2: much depth to this book. You can give away a

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Speaker 2: lot and not give away a third of it. But

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Speaker 2: when did they realize something had gone poorly with the decision?

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, they started a sense that things

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Speaker 1: aren't great immediately after the decision was announced and the

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00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 1: initially ESPN broadcast had concluded, meaning the live event with

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Speaker 1: Jim Gray, and then Lebron had to do an interview

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Speaker 1: with Michael Wilbon who was in studio and doing a

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Speaker 1: remote interview with Lebron who was still in Greenwich at

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Speaker 1: the club, and the questions. One of the questions Wilbon

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Speaker 1: asked him was if he could see what was happening

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Speaker 1: in Cleveland. They were already burning his jersey, But it's

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Speaker 1: not till later that evening, before they've left Greenwich though,

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Speaker 1: to get on a private plane to go to Miami.

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Speaker 1: They hung around for a while. They actually went back

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Speaker 1: to Dowy's house and they were listening to music and

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Speaker 1: hanging out. And then Dan Gilbert's letter shows up on

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Speaker 1: the website and you're starting to go like wow, Like

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Speaker 1: the New York Times puts up a story that's referring

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Speaker 1: to the Evil Empire. And this is all happening in

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Speaker 1: real time and Twitter works now right, It's Twitter's fairly

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Speaker 1: new at this point, but it works, and the tweets

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Speaker 1: are coming from all over the place, not just sports people,

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Speaker 1: but people in entertainment, late night comedy. Everybody's piling on.

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Speaker 1: And so by the time Lebron and his inner circle

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Speaker 1: are in the air to fly to Miami, they know

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Speaker 1: it's bad. And I love how Rich Paul refers to

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Speaker 1: the quietest flight he'd ever been on with Lebron and Maverick.

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Speaker 2: So there was a sweepstakes, as you note, to get Lebron.

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Speaker 2: The Knicks had an interesting pitch, but Miami's landed. Tell

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00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 2: our audience why, and they're tact, which is to me

404
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:51,199
Speaker 2: pat Riley's one of the smartest guys in league history.

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Speaker 2: Not a shock he hit the right notes. Yes, yeah,

406
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Speaker 2: I love. The reason I love the Knicks pitch is

407
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 2: because it's so New York and it's just so over

408
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 2: the top and so inappropriate in terms of what you

409
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 2: need to lure Lebron to your team. Lebron had so

410
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,399
Speaker 2: much access to fame and glitz and glamour, that's not

411
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Speaker 2: what he was looking for. And he wasn't looking for

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Speaker 2: a billion dollars. He was looking for rings championships. And

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00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 2: so New York does this thing where they hire a

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Speaker 2: filmmaker who doesn't know anything about basketball. He didn't know

415
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Speaker 2: the difference between a basketball and a golf ball. And

416
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Speaker 2: so he goes out and brings in Jonathan Hawk, who

417
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 2: knows how to make a sports documentary, and they have

418
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Speaker 2: all the celebrities in New York City lined up, from

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Speaker 2: Harvey Weinstein to Reggie Jackson to Alec Baldwin, I mean,

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Speaker 2: Robert de Niro, everybody wanted in this documentary. And they

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Speaker 2: even got Donald Trump. They went up to Trump Tower

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Speaker 2: and got Trump to sit for an interview. Anybody they

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00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 2: interviewed is pitching lebron On White needs to come to

424
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Speaker 2: New York. To me, the best part of that whole

425
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:09,199
Speaker 2: story and the smartest thing they did, was to go

426
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:12,400
Speaker 2: get Tony Soprano out of retirement and to bring him

427
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:14,360
Speaker 2: in to do a sketch at the end of the film,

428
00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 2: and it's basically Dandal Feini getting back in that role

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00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,720
Speaker 2: with Edie Falco. It was brilliant, and I told the

430
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 2: story through.

431
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 1: The lens of Jonathan Hawk, who shot the interview in

432
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:30,119
Speaker 1: Tony's apartment, and they pitch him and it's basically literally

433
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 1: the offer you can't refuse. And Lebron thought it was

434
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 1: funny because it was it was clever, it was funny,

435
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 1: but it wasn't right. And then Riley comes in and

436
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: Riley's last and Riley brings in a bag of rings

437
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,080
Speaker 1: and he puts him on the table and you know,

438
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 1: Lebron asks him what's in there, and he dumps him

439
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: out and there is championship rings that he's won everywhere,

440
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:01,960
Speaker 1: and it's what Lebron wants, and he has this really

441
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:06,160
Speaker 1: important line to keep the main thing the main thing.

442
00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: Lebron didn't know what that was in the moment, but

443
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,560
Speaker 1: Maverick knew what it was because he'd read Steve and

444
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:19,040
Speaker 1: Rcovey's book and certainly understood what Riley was saying. And

445
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 1: the main thing in Miami with pat Riley is winning championships,

446
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: and he knew that that was the main thing for Lebron.

447
00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:31,679
Speaker 1: And I just thought, wow, like these two contrasts the

448
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: Knicks in the heat. So the Miami story is four years,

449
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 1: two championships. I think the arc of many of our lives.

450
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:51,439
Speaker 1: Is the hardships come before the titles or the runs. Right,

451
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 1: We've all struggled in our life. Lebron struggles are the

452
00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:59,000
Speaker 1: struggles of the greatest basketball player evert The decision dinged

453
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 1: them a little bit. But Miami was Miami felt like

454
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 1: it was going to work very quickly. You had the

455
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 1: smart owner, pat Riley, a young, brilliant young coach. You

456
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 1: had d Wade Haslam, the culture, and then he loses

457
00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 1: to the Mavericks and for the only time in his

458
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 1: career looked afraid on the court. That was a real

459
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:25,080
Speaker 1: turning point for Lebron. Talk about that, it's a huge

460
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 1: turning point. I would say, it's not really a disagreement

461
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,400
Speaker 1: with you. But I think the decision did more than

462
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: Dingham because the ramification of the decision is he is

463
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:41,800
Speaker 1: the villain of American sports. His first year in Miami,

464
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 1: he hated and anyone who was in Cleveland. I was

465
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,359
Speaker 1: not there the night that Lebron returned to Cleveland, but

466
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 1: I interviewed people who were It was violent. I mean

467
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 1: it was scary. People who were on that team said

468
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: they were afraid. The security in the arena. People that

469
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 1: were there to protect the Miami players. They had never

470
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 1: seen or felt anything like that at an American sports event.

471
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:07,480
Speaker 1: That first year in Miami for Lebron, I think was

472
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,439
Speaker 1: different because Lebron likes to be liked and he was

473
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:13,880
Speaker 1: hated that year. And then on top of that, they

474
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 1: were supposed to win and they didn't win, and I

475
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:21,000
Speaker 1: think that's what plunged Lebron into a dark period. The

476
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,440
Speaker 1: summer after losing to Dallas is the darkest period of

477
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: Lebron's career for him personally, and it's really a moment

478
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 1: of self discovery where he's locked away in Miami. He

479
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,920
Speaker 1: doesn't want to talk to anybody, not family, not friends.

480
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: He's listening to certain kinds of music, and really when

481
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 1: he comes out of that, it's interesting when he comes

482
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:44,240
Speaker 1: out of that. I just thought it was interesting that

483
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: one of the first people he saw when he came

484
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: out of that was Bono in Miami, who had come

485
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 1: YouTube was there touring, and he had some private time

486
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: with Bono backstage. I just thought it was interesting because

487
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: I was thinking to myself as a writer, Bono's probably

488
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 1: one of the only people on the planet who could

489
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 1: actually say in that moment, I've been through more than you.

490
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: I know what this is like, Like I've been in

491
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,560
Speaker 1: worse spots than you because I've been doing this longer

492
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,240
Speaker 1: and I'm a world around rockstar. And I'm sure he

493
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 1: didn't say those things to Lebron, but there aren't many

494
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 1: people Lebron can get in a room with who could

495
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,719
Speaker 1: actually say I've been to these places that you're in

496
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,959
Speaker 1: right now. And he comes out of that, and Dwayne

497
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 1: Wade has a big part of him coming out of that,

498
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: because that's when they have the conversation about this needs

499
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: to be your team. It's sort of like it's okay

500
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 1: to take over, you need to dominate. This is my

501
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: city and my team in my town. But we're not

502
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: going to win unless you take the reins and boy,

503
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: the next season, Lebron's the scariest player in the NBA.

504
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 1: I mean, everyone's afraid of him. You don't want to

505
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:58,320
Speaker 1: play this team and that guy, and I think the

506
00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 1: next three years to me, those are the scary Lebron hears.

507
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 1: Let's go back to you talk about in the book.

508
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:13,240
Speaker 1: There's obviously great debate. Lebron now starts stacking up championships

509
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:17,000
Speaker 1: in Miami and the Michael Jordan. Stuff really starts to

510
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 1: become a comp and nobody had really ever challenged Michael Jordan.

511
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:24,400
Speaker 1: It was just Russell.

512
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:28,240
Speaker 2: Early, then Kareem, then Magic. Then you know, you kind

513
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 2: of got ten years to yourself as the greatest player ever.

514
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 2: And all of a sudden after the second title, people

515
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 2: start talking about, Wow, this guy is different. Yes, but

516
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 2: in his early days in high school Jeff nobody talked

517
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 2: about Michael Jordan. Their games were different, Their personalities are

518
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 2: completely different. One is much more hyper aggressive, much more

519
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 2: the score not necessary, not necessarily ever conciliatory or considered

520
00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 2: about your feelings. Lebron's comp was not my as you.

521
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 1: Noted, Yeah it is, because it's interesting you reference that

522
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 1: high school years. One of my favorite scenes in this well,

523
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 1: I'm going to say two of them, because they're kind

524
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 1: of coupled. It's Whenick Maverick goes back. He leaves college

525
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 1: after one year, right realizes he's not going to play

526
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 1: in the NBA, goes back to Akron to go to

527
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,240
Speaker 1: school and to work with Lebron and help Lebron and

528
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 1: navigate those tenuous high school years coming up for him.

529
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 4: Andy starts coaching his AAU.

530
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: Team and they go to Chicago in the summer, and

531
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 1: one of the guys from Jordan's Jim, who works with

532
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:40,400
Speaker 1: Michael Jordan trains with him, approaches Maverick and invites him

533
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 1: and Lebron to come to Michael's Jim in Chicago, and

534
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: they go. Michael's not there, but they go and they

535
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 1: check it out, and it's like they've entered that sort

536
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:53,920
Speaker 1: of celestial space where Michael Jordan trains. It's a private

537
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: place not anybody can go, and other NBA players who

538
00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 1: are active in the league go there to train and run.

539
00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 1: Remember Michael's retired right now, but they go there, and

540
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 1: one of the things that Lebron gets to do is

541
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:10,760
Speaker 1: he gets to scrimmage run with these NBA players, guys

542
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: like Antoine Walker, big time players, big bodies, playing with

543
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: a teenager. And for the first time, the floor looks

544
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 1: different to Lebron, it's a different floor. And that's why

545
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,560
Speaker 1: that chapter is called a different Floor. It's the same

546
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: dimensions of the floor that he plays on at Saint VI's,

547
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: except everything's different. The passing lanes are more narrow because

548
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 1: the guys are so much bigger. Their arms are longer.

549
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 1: When they put their arms out the routes to the

550
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 1: basket just aren't there that he sees in high school games.

551
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: It's all different for him. And that is a huge

552
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 1: eye opening experience for him. And one thing happens. He

553
00:32:55,920 --> 00:33:00,760
Speaker 1: can't guard anybody in those scrimmages. They're too good, they're

554
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 1: too fast, the too big. He can't guard them. But

555
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 1: he can score against these guys, which is phenomenal. He

556
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 1: can score buckets with some of the best NBA players

557
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:15,320
Speaker 1: and he's only in high school. That's really important. And

558
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 1: then here's the second part. Later they go back there

559
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 1: and they're there and they're about to leave, and they

560
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 1: go outside and Marten pulls up in a red sports car.

561
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 4: And gets out.

562
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: Now at this moment, Michael knows he's coming out of retirement,

563
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 1: but nobody else knows that. He hasn't announced it yet,

564
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 1: And so he gets out. The coolest athlete in the

565
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 1: world gets out of the car and approaches Lebron. He

566
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: knows who Lebron is, and Lebron certainly sees who he is.

567
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 1: This is his idol, this is the guy whose posters

568
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: are on his bedroom walls. It's the guy whose number

569
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 1: he wears. And now they're in a conversation, and Michael

570
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: invites him back inside and they talk and Michael doesn't

571
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: give him advice, because Michael's not that kind of guy.

572
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 1: But it doesn't matter. It's what he did give him

573
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,640
Speaker 1: was he gave him his cell phone number, which to

574
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:19,360
Speaker 1: me is a lot more important than advice because of

575
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 1: what it says to Lebron. Michael doesn't give his phone

576
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: number out to anybody. Lebron's now one of the few

577
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 1: people in America who has Michael Jordan's cell phone. And

578
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,720
Speaker 1: when he leaves Chicago that night, by the way, Colin,

579
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 1: the next day is the first day of school at

580
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,600
Speaker 1: Saint fee, Maverick's got to race him home because he's

581
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: got to be in school the next day, and in

582
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 1: his pocket he's got Michael Jordan's phone number. And he

583
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:47,280
Speaker 1: wrote in his journal about that and about how cool

584
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: that experience was. And to me, what did Michael think

585
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 1: of Lebron in that moment? Did he really think that

586
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 1: Lebron was actually going to threaten him as the potential

587
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:03,600
Speaker 1: greatest player of all time time? I don't know, Probably not,

588
00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 1: because he was still a kid and he was very

589
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,319
Speaker 1: encouraging to him at that moment. But Obviously, as time

590
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 1: goes on, and it doesn't take long. By the time

591
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 1: you get to Game five against Detroit, you know, like

592
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 1: this guy is actually that guy, like he is the future.

593
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 1: He is that good and there isn't anyone else like him.

594
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 1: And so I just think that Michael Jordan origin stories

595
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,760
Speaker 1: with Lebron, they're real, and there's some of the most

596
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:34,720
Speaker 1: interesting parts of Lebron's story.

597
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 5: I'm really intrigued with this Memphis matchup. It makes a

598
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 5: lot of sense for the Lakers on a couple of

599
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:44,879
Speaker 5: different levels. The Memphis Grizzlies are a team that play

600
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 5: a lot of guys that typically don't shoot very well, right,

601
00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 5: John Murray, you can go underneath screens. Dylan Brooks has

602
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 5: been shooting well for a couple of weeks, but he's

603
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,799
Speaker 5: a guy that I guarantee you Darvin Ham's gonna dare

604
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 5: to shoot. And then obviously in the front court with

605
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 5: Steven Adams out, with Brandon Clark gout, yeah, looking at

606
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:04,759
Speaker 5: Xavier Tillman or Jaron Jackson there, Darvin Ham loves to

607
00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 5: dare people to shoot, and I think this is a

608
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:09,719
Speaker 5: series that actually bodes well for the Lakers there. And

609
00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 5: then on the other end of the floor. Who is

610
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:15,800
Speaker 5: the best surgical matchup hunting player and probably the history

611
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:18,400
Speaker 5: of the NBA, Lebron James. And so he's gonna be

612
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,719
Speaker 5: calling up John Morant to every single conceivable action. He's

613
00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 5: gonna be get doing everything in his power to get

614
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 5: Dylan Brooks off of him or to get Anthony Davis

615
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 5: into favorable matchups. And obviously there's a long road ahead.

616
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 5: If they win, I think they're gonna face the Warriors

617
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:34,960
Speaker 5: in round two. If they win that, there's a very

618
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:37,719
Speaker 5: good chance they're gonna play Phoenix in round three. If

619
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 5: they win that, there's a very good chance you're gonna

620
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 5: get Boston or Milwaukee at the end of that. So

621
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 5: it's a very long road. It's a lot to put

622
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 5: on Lebron James and Anthony Davis physically.

623
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 4: But here's the deal.

624
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:51,840
Speaker 5: You made it to the playoffs, ish, and you're probably

625
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,359
Speaker 5: gonna be a slight favorite in round one. I'd call

626
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,759
Speaker 5: that a resounding victory compared to where we were before

627
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:57,320
Speaker 5: the deadline.

628
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 2: Well, the other thing is Memphis isn't Cleveland young or

629
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 2: ok C or Houston young. But Steven Adams is one

630
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 2: of the few guys with some playoff experience, and he's out.

631
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 2: So Memphis is fairly young, and I always felt this

632
00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:19,399
Speaker 2: year that you know, they're one of those teams built

633
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,359
Speaker 2: for the regular season because they play hard and they

634
00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 2: have depth, and you can win a lot of games

635
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 2: in this league off playing hard and having ten guys

636
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 2: that doesn't matter nearly as much. So now they get

637
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 2: smaller without Steven Adams plays right into Anthony Davis's hands,

638
00:37:34,920 --> 00:37:37,439
Speaker 2: and he's had the best two week stretch arguably since

639
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:39,120
Speaker 2: he's been a Laker. If you take out the bubble,

640
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,200
Speaker 2: he's been completely dominating.

641
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:42,520
Speaker 4: Again.

642
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,480
Speaker 2: He didn't play particularly well today in terms of total points,

643
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:48,360
Speaker 2: but down the stretch he had a couple of key baskets.

644
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:50,760
Speaker 2: So I think you get a Memphis team that's smaller,

645
00:37:53,200 --> 00:38:00,480
Speaker 2: had injuries, young, and let's be honest, the job Morant

646
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:06,920
Speaker 2: stuff still not great. So I if you say to me, Okay,

647
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 2: there's a team in the playoffs that could be a

648
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 2: little volatile of all of them, and I'd be like

649
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 2: Clippers because of Kawhi, you never know if he's going

650
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 2: to play Westbrook. They had a fight on their bench,

651
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,400
Speaker 2: So like Clippers feel very vaulatle to me and I

652
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 2: think Memphis as a young one of the younger playoff teams.

653
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:27,239
Speaker 2: Cleveland in the East is very young, but Cleveland doesn't

654
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 2: feel immature. Everybody in Cleveland knows exactly what they are

655
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 2: and what they do. Donovan Mitchell has already clarified their offense.

656
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 2: He takes the last big shot and everybody knows it.

657
00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:40,000
Speaker 2: Mobley's you're big, he's your young guy, but he knows

658
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:45,560
Speaker 2: laden games. They all step aside for Donovan Mitchell. Memphis

659
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 2: has some egos, they're chatty. I think the Lakers win

660
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:50,080
Speaker 2: that series.

661
00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:50,840
Speaker 4: I really do it.

662
00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 2: I think Anthony Davis is going to have a fantastic

663
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 2: series Without Steven Adams.

664
00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:00,319
Speaker 5: Memphis is very dangerous because they have guys that are

665
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:02,480
Speaker 5: capable of knocking down shots. Like here's the think of

666
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 5: John Muran. Like we learned from last year's playoffs, Like

667
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 5: Desmond Bane really good, interesting player, excellent shooter, good defensive player,

668
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 5: can do some slashing, but he really struggled to beat

669
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 5: people off the dribble last year in the playoffs. That's

670
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,760
Speaker 5: a concern. The playoffs in general will take your weakness

671
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:22,080
Speaker 5: and shine the biggest magnifying glass. Yeah, that's what the

672
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 5: playoffs do the same thing with John Moran. It's hey, yeah,

673
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,040
Speaker 5: you knock down pull up threes at thirty percent this year,

674
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 5: that's great. We are going to dare you to take

675
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:32,400
Speaker 5: that this year to the point where we're going to

676
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 5: actually try to get into your head by making you

677
00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:36,960
Speaker 5: think you can't do it. That's the way that these

678
00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:40,799
Speaker 5: these especially these veteran playoff teams try to attack you

679
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:44,000
Speaker 5: and make you feel uncomfortable, make you lack confidence, and

680
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 5: at the end of the day, like it all comes

681
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,280
Speaker 5: down to the physical side of things, like Lebron James

682
00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 5: has to hold up, Anthony Davis has to hold up.

683
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 5: But over the course of a playoff series, the team

684
00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 5: that wins is usually the team that generates higher quality

685
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,240
Speaker 5: shots in the half court. Who do you trust more

686
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 5: to get stops in the half court for seven games

687
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:07,319
Speaker 5: Lebron James, Anthony Davis, Jared Vanderbilt, Austin Reeves or you know,

688
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 5: John Moraet, Desmond Bayn, Dylan Brooks and Jared Jackson. And

689
00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:12,560
Speaker 5: then on the flip side of that, when Memphis has

690
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:14,839
Speaker 5: to score against them, I just think I just think

691
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 5: the Lakers are going to get better quality shots over

692
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:19,320
Speaker 5: the course of the series wouldn't be surprised if Memphis

693
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 5: jumped up to a one zero lead or a two

694
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 5: to one lead. But I think as the series progresses,

695
00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:27,080
Speaker 5: the older, more talented team in the Lakers is in

696
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:30,520
Speaker 5: the best shape. I want to say this though I

697
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:35,600
Speaker 5: am a big believer in what Golden State does, but yes,

698
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 5: Andrew Wiggins is back. However, he's a rhythm player who

699
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 5: has not played really intense competitive basketball for a while.

700
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 5: Had they fallen to seven and drawn that Memphis matchup,

701
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 5: I think Memphis would have beat them. That's how much

702
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,000
Speaker 5: I view the importance of getting Andrew Wiggins up to speed.

703
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 5: So it is so critically important that they get this

704
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:02,040
Speaker 5: series against Zacremento, a team who's very good and very

705
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:05,640
Speaker 5: offensively skilled, as an excellent home court advantage. But they

706
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 5: are not the biggest and most athletic team in the world,

707
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 5: so Golden State, in their lack of athleticism, will have

708
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:15,760
Speaker 5: less of a factor to play in that particular series.

709
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:18,280
Speaker 5: And I don't know if you notice, but Golden State's

710
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 5: actually a minus two hundred favorite to win that series.

711
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:23,640
Speaker 5: That's a pretty significant favorite. If they get out of

712
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 5: that series, that buys you from now three additional weeks

713
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,280
Speaker 5: to get Andrew Wiggins up to speed for a potential

714
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:33,359
Speaker 5: matchup with Memphis or LA, two massive teams that are

715
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,319
Speaker 5: incredibly athletic and big, and at that point I feel

716
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 5: better about well.

717
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:40,360
Speaker 2: And Gary Payton just the other night got extended minutes.

718
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 2: So now Gary Peyton, you can put him on for

719
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 2: a good at sixteen minutes a night. Just put him

720
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:50,799
Speaker 2: on Daron Fox and then put Klay Thompson, Dante de Vincenzo.

721
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 2: We've talked about this Golden State's absurdly deep in the

722
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:57,600
Speaker 2: back court and very thin in the front court. But

723
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 2: Dearon Fox is their fourth court guy. I think he's

724
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:03,919
Speaker 2: the best guard in the NBA and the fourth quarter

725
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:06,320
Speaker 2: this year in terms of what they call crucial points.

726
00:42:07,160 --> 00:42:09,920
Speaker 2: So you know, I saw the other night Peyton played

727
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 2: like eighteen twenty minutes, and I'm like, that's exactly what

728
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 2: they wanted. So Wiggins isn't ready to go at that level.

729
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 2: And they'll have to massage that a little because Cominga's

730
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,800
Speaker 2: finally now playing real minutes and they're gonna take them away.

731
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 2: So that's a weird, you know, confluence of events where

732
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,799
Speaker 2: it's like we need Wiggins desperately, but you know, Kuminga's

733
00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 2: actually started to put log in eighteen twenty twenty four

734
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:36,360
Speaker 2: minutes and been productive. So now you got to peel

735
00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 2: him back, so you got to massage that in the

736
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:40,600
Speaker 2: locker room. And the chemistry has been weird with the

737
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 2: Warriors this year since the Draymond Jordan Poole inflammation. But

738
00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 2: I like their matchup in the series. He throw a

739
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 2: lot of bodies at Fox. You know, Golden State will

740
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:53,800
Speaker 2: have to win a road game, but this is almost

741
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:57,919
Speaker 2: you know, it's a bus ride, and I also think

742
00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:02,360
Speaker 2: this they'll get the whistle. They know how to manipulate officials.

743
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,600
Speaker 2: They know how to do the psychological manipulation. I mean,

744
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 2: Sacramento is like the little brother down the road to

745
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:14,359
Speaker 2: the Dynasty, and you can see in spots them being

746
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:18,920
Speaker 2: a little overwhelmed and the Warriors, you know, trash talking,

747
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,239
Speaker 2: getting in their head and getting the favorable whistle the

748
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 2: Dynasty does in the first round. My entire life, I

749
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 2: don't think the league is rigged, but I do think

750
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:33,959
Speaker 2: veteran teams manipulate officiating in the playoffs, where referees tend

751
00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 2: to swallow the whistle. You're not going to get that

752
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:41,880
Speaker 2: high octane offense that draws all those fouls. The Warriors

753
00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:44,440
Speaker 2: can slow it down, speed it up, they'll get the whistle.

754
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,400
Speaker 2: So I think it's one of these series. It's a

755
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:52,320
Speaker 2: really good series for Golden State. There were some real

756
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:58,040
Speaker 2: worrisome matchups. Even the Lakers size could be a huge problem.

757
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 2: I think they locked down well. Again, the Warriors can

758
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:05,480
Speaker 2: beat somebody with size. They just need Andrew Wiggins.

759
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 5: Like when I say I would have picked Memphis to

760
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:08,759
Speaker 5: win in the first round, that's one hundred percent and

761
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:11,759
Speaker 5: Andrew Wiggins take like that. It's all associated with the

762
00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:14,960
Speaker 5: fact that he is so imperative to their athletic ceiling

763
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:17,240
Speaker 5: that they need to compete in a series against that team,

764
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 5: giving them an extra three weeks from now to get there.

765
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,440
Speaker 5: That's vitally important. The Sacramento this is a Gary Payton

766
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 5: series in my opinion, and the main reason why is

767
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 5: because Sacramento has killed teams all season, along with the

768
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 5: simple combination of deeron Fox and demand of Sabonis and

769
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:36,760
Speaker 5: what they do with their dribble handoffs, and the problem

770
00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:39,359
Speaker 5: it presents for teams because you let deeron Fox get

771
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 5: downhill or if you switch it. Sabonis is one of

772
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 5: the best players in the league at beating switches to

773
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:47,640
Speaker 5: the basket, and if he draws double teams, he's an

774
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:50,839
Speaker 5: excellent passer. So what I like about the Golden State

775
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,880
Speaker 5: matchup in that series is Draymond Green and Gary Payton.

776
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:57,799
Speaker 5: Couldn't I couldn't conceive possibly mentally a better duo to

777
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 5: potentially handle those two guys. And this is again, what

778
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 5: an attribute, And this is why I actually love this

779
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:06,480
Speaker 5: move from the deadline. What an incredible attribute to have

780
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 5: as a coach, a weapon in your pocket to be

781
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:13,320
Speaker 5: able to deploy Gary Payton on the other team's best

782
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:16,560
Speaker 5: guard and to know he's gonna be able to hold

783
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:17,759
Speaker 5: that in check. I don't know if you noticed this

784
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:20,200
Speaker 5: the other night, but the Warriors won the game against

785
00:45:20,239 --> 00:45:23,400
Speaker 5: Oklahoma City, a tough fought game against Oklahoma City. You

786
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 5: might have been scammed, but it was a tough fought

787
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:28,040
Speaker 5: game against Oklahoma City, and in the fourth quarter of

788
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:30,759
Speaker 5: that game, Gary Payton shut down shake Yield is Alexander

789
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:33,560
Speaker 5: who's one of the best guards in this league. He

790
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:35,239
Speaker 5: had a couple of buckets on switches and he drew

791
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:37,080
Speaker 5: one foul, but for the most part, Gary Payton shut

792
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:39,359
Speaker 5: him down and it was how Golden State pulled out

793
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:41,319
Speaker 5: that game. He is one of the best guards in

794
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:44,240
Speaker 5: the league to guard this specific type of matchup, partnering

795
00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:48,240
Speaker 5: that with Draymond Green. I love this matchup for the Warriors.

796
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 5: I would pick them to win in no more than

797
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:53,279
Speaker 5: six games, but I'm leaning towards five. And for all

798
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:55,120
Speaker 5: the Hoops Tonight listeners out there, We're going to do

799
00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:57,600
Speaker 5: a full breakdown of this series within the next couple

800
00:45:57,640 --> 00:45:59,879
Speaker 5: of days where we'll really dive into the x's and o's,

801
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:02,239
Speaker 5: But I'm leaning towards picking the Warriors in five or six.

802
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I would take the Warriors in six

803
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 2: suns four against the Clippers five. This again really plays

804
00:46:10,680 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 2: in the Phoenix's hand. So you know, Kevin Durant's gotten

805
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 2: several games off, so they're sitting him, and here you

806
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:23,000
Speaker 2: have an inflamed bench situation where plumb Lee gets into

807
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 2: a fight. You're already asking Tylou, like, what do you

808
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:30,880
Speaker 2: do with Westbrook? Now he's great in regular season production, Okay,

809
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:33,160
Speaker 2: now we get into situational basketball.

810
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 4: What do I do?

811
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:37,720
Speaker 2: Paul George isn't available. He would be huge in this series.

812
00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 2: To defend Kevin Durant. So now I've got a little

813
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:45,279
Speaker 2: bit of inflammation. How do I use Westbrook, who's not

814
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 2: been a great postseason player? What do I do with

815
00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:53,440
Speaker 2: Kevin Durant matchup like Memphis, There's some depth here, but

816
00:46:53,480 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 2: there's a lot to me. This could not in a

817
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,919
Speaker 2: weird way Kevin Durant. Between getting hurt in warm ups

818
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 2: and now resting for the last couple of games, You're

819
00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:08,400
Speaker 2: getting the most rested, healthiest Kevin Durant in like years.

820
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:11,920
Speaker 2: And I think Phoenix is going to be a handful

821
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:13,640
Speaker 2: for the Clippers. I love Phoenix here.

822
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I'm really low on the Clippers in general, Colin.

823
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:20,680
Speaker 5: I don't know how many times we have to go

824
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 5: into the season with everybody like preaching that they're one

825
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 5: of the favorites for them to not fulfill that, for

826
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 5: us to finally learn our lessons. They don't have good

827
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:32,120
Speaker 5: rim protection, they don't have good playmaking, and that makes

828
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,480
Speaker 5: that's two vitally important things that you have to have

829
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:37,600
Speaker 5: to succeed in the playoffs. You know, this is this

830
00:47:37,680 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 5: is what the Clippers are. They are a team with

831
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 5: a bunch of wings that are wings in name only

832
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:43,719
Speaker 5: that don't move as well as they used to.

833
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 4: Right, I got a lot of guys.

834
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 5: Like Marcus Morris and Nick Batoum and Ry Covington, guys

835
00:47:48,040 --> 00:47:50,640
Speaker 5: that once upon a time would have been vital, important

836
00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 5: playoff pieces, but they're just not that anymore. And Covington's

837
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 5: out of the rotation. Marcus Morris has been hurt, but

838
00:47:55,480 --> 00:47:58,200
Speaker 5: Toom's okay, you know, but every the problem is they

839
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 5: without Paul George, they simply do not have enough shot creation. Right,

840
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 5: There's three guys on the team that can create their

841
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:07,400
Speaker 5: own shot Kawhi Leonard, Russell Westbrook and Norman Powell. And

842
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 5: Norman Powell's runs hot and cold. I mean, obviously he

843
00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 5: destroyed the Lakers the other day, but he runs hot

844
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:14,399
Speaker 5: and cold. Russell Westbrook, the game has to be going

845
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,840
Speaker 5: a very specific type of way for him to have impact.

846
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:19,040
Speaker 5: And as good as Kawhi Leonard is and he's made

847
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:22,320
Speaker 5: strides as a playmaker, he's a pull up shot maker.

848
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 5: Like he doesn't pressure the rims super well, and he's

849
00:48:24,600 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 5: not the best passer in the world. So it's like, yeah,

850
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:28,680
Speaker 5: he'll get you his thirty by knocking down his pull

851
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:30,080
Speaker 5: up jump shots. But He's not a guy that can

852
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 5: really carry an offense over the course of a game.

853
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 5: And so what they really are is a team that

854
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:36,080
Speaker 5: doesn't have a lot of shot creation. They're a good team,

855
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,439
Speaker 5: but I don't think they have nearly the playoff ceiling

856
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:40,920
Speaker 5: they need Without Paul George, I think I think the

857
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 5: Suns are going to make quick work of that.

858
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 1: Yeah.

859
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 2: Well, and also the Sons are a team between Durant's

860
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:48,239
Speaker 2: health and Chris Paul's age. He had a great game

861
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:50,799
Speaker 2: about a week ago, but like he kind of just

862
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,080
Speaker 2: gave you, hey, I'm not done yet. I'm fine, I'm

863
00:48:54,120 --> 00:48:57,279
Speaker 2: good here. But they got a huge break because that's

864
00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 2: a team Boston. I feel a little bit with Tatum

865
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 2: sometimes in Robert William's health and Marcus Smart, like they

866
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:09,520
Speaker 2: don't need to play together. Like we know the Celtics

867
00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:11,759
Speaker 2: are fine, They've been playing together now for years. They

868
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:14,919
Speaker 2: need time off, you know, Tatum needs rest. I feel

869
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,799
Speaker 2: that way with Phoenix, like Chris Paul and Durant, what

870
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:20,440
Speaker 2: they need is like five days off those legs going

871
00:49:20,440 --> 00:49:26,000
Speaker 2: into a playoff series. So I'm with you. Phoenix hasn't

872
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:28,720
Speaker 2: lost yet with Durant on the floor. I mean it's

873
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:33,720
Speaker 2: and it looks really good. You know, that's because Kevin's

874
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:36,279
Speaker 2: a high functioning player and Chris Paul is one of

875
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:38,719
Speaker 2: the smartest guys in the league. And that's where I

876
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:42,239
Speaker 2: think sometimes with Ayton they've been frustrated. Moni's been frustrated,

877
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:48,719
Speaker 2: Chris has he I think sometimes Chris Paul's really demanding

878
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 2: on his bigs, like he's really hard on them, and

879
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:56,080
Speaker 2: so like everywhere he goes, the team gets better and

880
00:49:56,120 --> 00:49:59,560
Speaker 2: the big doesn't like him. But I think Kevin Durant'

881
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 2: a unique I wouldn't call him a big, but a

882
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:08,000
Speaker 2: unique four that plays at such a high level of basketball,

883
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 2: like really gets the game. I just think him and

884
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,359
Speaker 2: Chris are going to be magic. And I don't think

885
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:16,600
Speaker 2: any I really don't. You know, we'll see With Denver,

886
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:19,879
Speaker 2: Denver still, believe it or not. Despite they've been good

887
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 2: for several years, they're still a pretty young team. They

888
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:24,399
Speaker 2: don't have a lot of playoff success. So I think

889
00:50:24,400 --> 00:50:27,680
Speaker 2: Phoenix is going to role. What did you make of

890
00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:31,480
Speaker 2: the Dallas punting those last two games of the season.

891
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 4: I think I was.

892
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:38,359
Speaker 2: Reading some Dallas media reports it's a it's as show,

893
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:41,439
Speaker 2: it's a mess. Well, you know, they hired a guy

894
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:46,000
Speaker 2: from Nike who's never been really a GM, but he

895
00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 2: was in the basketball division. Very smart guy, a relationship guy,

896
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:52,440
Speaker 2: and now they put him in charge of running you know,

897
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:58,120
Speaker 2: basketball ops. And you know, I like Mark Cuban. I

898
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:00,480
Speaker 2: think he's really smart. He tends to be what I

899
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,280
Speaker 2: would call a tech optimist. He has so much confidence

900
00:51:03,320 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 2: in his intelligence that he takes big swings and he

901
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 2: hits you know, his pharmaceutical companies brilliant. I understood. I

902
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:16,720
Speaker 2: mean it was funny when they went and got Kyrie Irving.

903
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:19,480
Speaker 2: I applauded it. I said, I like the swing. This

904
00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:21,799
Speaker 2: is going to be an atrocious defensive team. These are

905
00:51:21,840 --> 00:51:24,040
Speaker 2: two of the worst. I mean, Kyrie is an abysmal

906
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 2: defensive player. And so when people kind of embrace this

907
00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 2: as a championship team, I'm like, guys, the Warriors and

908
00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 2: Celtics were the two best defensive teams in the league. Like,

909
00:51:32,560 --> 00:51:35,640
Speaker 2: you can't win that way. You can't just score your way.

910
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 2: You can't you can't have to score one twenty six

911
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:41,200
Speaker 2: a night. It just doesn't work that way in this sport.

912
00:51:41,560 --> 00:51:45,000
Speaker 2: And I think people think it's that. And then then

913
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 2: if you've ever had a buddy who goes and plays

914
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:50,000
Speaker 2: in the NBA. It's like, man, they grind you. There's

915
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:52,200
Speaker 2: a lot of contact in this league. In the playoffs,

916
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:55,640
Speaker 2: they doubles down on it. That's why you know Kyrie

917
00:51:55,680 --> 00:52:00,520
Speaker 2: pre impost Lebron, he gets pushed around. It was Lebron

918
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:03,040
Speaker 2: was a little bit of a bodyguard, and you have

919
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:07,319
Speaker 2: to surround Kyrie with certain elements. I also think increasingly

920
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 2: Luca is a moody player, and he's going to be

921
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 2: really hard to find the Robin. You know, we talked

922
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:14,600
Speaker 2: about this. The hardest thing in basketball is to find

923
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:18,160
Speaker 2: the janis that once in a franchise player. So the

924
00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 2: Bucks have done it twice, Luel Cinder and Yannis. They

925
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:26,480
Speaker 2: got a championship one back in nineteen seventy one right Milwaukee,

926
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:29,520
Speaker 2: and they got one with the Honis. It's not a

927
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 2: great free agent hub, so you have to kind of

928
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:36,480
Speaker 2: build a culture and then eventually Kareem I want out,

929
00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:38,880
Speaker 2: I want to go West. He did, and so I

930
00:52:38,920 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 2: think when Luca came into the league there was this

931
00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:43,040
Speaker 2: sense is he could pair him with a lot so

932
00:52:43,080 --> 00:52:45,759
Speaker 2: they try the slash heir porzingis. They don't like each

933
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:48,520
Speaker 2: other and then they tried Jalen Brunson and they're like, oh,

934
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:51,000
Speaker 2: they don't really fit. Well, Jalen's been like an MVP

935
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:55,439
Speaker 2: guard play in New York. Well let's try Kyrie. Well,

936
00:52:55,440 --> 00:53:00,880
Speaker 2: now Kyrie doesn't perfectly work for him. We're falling in

937
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:06,400
Speaker 2: love with this great hyper offensive player Moody, difficult needs ball,

938
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:10,400
Speaker 2: won't defend. You know, is he gonna end up Carmelo

939
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:15,040
Speaker 2: Anthony where he has this early success in Denver and

940
00:53:15,120 --> 00:53:18,839
Speaker 2: never really then galvanizes people. I mean you start looking

941
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:21,360
Speaker 2: at the great players of all time. Everybody needed a

942
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:25,800
Speaker 2: running mate, Like Magic galvanized people. Lebron galvanized people. Michael didn't,

943
00:53:25,800 --> 00:53:28,080
Speaker 2: but he found a running mate, right Like some guys

944
00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:31,200
Speaker 2: don't do that, but they find a guy. Tim Duncan

945
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 2: finds his Tony Parker, Steph finds his clay Like. It's

946
00:53:35,840 --> 00:53:38,480
Speaker 2: way harder to find a two because it's not just

947
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:43,400
Speaker 2: the player, it's the temperament. McHale was the college You

948
00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:45,600
Speaker 2: wouldn't remember this because you're young. He led the nation

949
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:48,440
Speaker 2: in rebounding. He was known as a defensive guy that

950
00:53:48,600 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 2: rebounded at Minnesota, and he came to the NBA with

951
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:54,799
Speaker 2: all these weird moves and he was super long. Kind

952
00:53:54,800 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 2: of an unorthodox looking scorer, but he was a great rebounder,

953
00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:02,279
Speaker 2: a shot blocker in college and byrd was a score. Well,

954
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:05,160
Speaker 2: Michae could have scored more, but he's like, Okay, I'm

955
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,080
Speaker 2: going to be part of this bosh in Miami. I

956
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:09,640
Speaker 2: want to be part of this Kevin Love and Cleveland Lebron,

957
00:54:09,640 --> 00:54:13,640
Speaker 2: I'm going to be part of it. Like Luca's gonna

958
00:54:13,640 --> 00:54:16,040
Speaker 2: make you feel small. He's not gonna help you on

959
00:54:16,080 --> 00:54:18,719
Speaker 2: the defensive end. He's not gonna you're gonna get the

960
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:21,879
Speaker 2: ball late in the shot clock with him. I think

961
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:25,600
Speaker 2: lucas harder to play with than people think. And I

962
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:28,719
Speaker 2: you say, well, Michael was difficult, but Michael got the

963
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 2: right coach, also found a very willing Robin, and then

964
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:38,920
Speaker 2: he had high functioning players. Kurran Packson became gms like

965
00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 2: they knew how to play with Michael. They understood Michael

966
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:45,360
Speaker 2: was the guy those Bowl teams had really high. Bj

967
00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 2: Armstrong becomes a power agent, like you had a lot

968
00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:50,719
Speaker 2: of guys around Michael that knew how to play the

969
00:54:50,800 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 2: game and appeal to his senses and his alpha. That's

970
00:54:56,239 --> 00:55:00,600
Speaker 2: hard like that that Lucas gonna be hard to play with,

971
00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:02,279
Speaker 2: and I think we have to come to terms with it.

972
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:06,880
Speaker 5: He's entering a very important phase of his basketball development

973
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:10,439
Speaker 5: because he's starting to just slightly plateau a little bit.

974
00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:14,120
Speaker 5: And you know, I love the way you broke it down,

975
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:15,560
Speaker 5: Like you have to be willing to buy into this

976
00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:18,560
Speaker 5: like larger concept of the team because for instance, like

977
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:21,640
Speaker 5: you can break it down on a simple math level. Okay, Luca,

978
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:24,240
Speaker 5: high pick and roll is worth you know, one point

979
00:55:24,719 --> 00:55:27,560
Speaker 5: two points per possession. Therefore, if we run it one

980
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 5: hundred times in a game, we're going to score one

981
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 5: hundred and twenty points. That's great, you know what I mean.

982
00:55:31,160 --> 00:55:34,239
Speaker 5: But there is a basketball team is a living organism

983
00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:37,839
Speaker 5: and all the pieces fit together, and like it would

984
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:42,200
Speaker 5: behove Luca to start to learn how to adjust his

985
00:55:42,239 --> 00:55:45,440
Speaker 5: game to fit better with others because of the specific

986
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:47,640
Speaker 5: fact that he will be on more talented teams as

987
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:50,239
Speaker 5: time go along. This has worked. He went to the

988
00:55:50,239 --> 00:55:53,000
Speaker 5: Western Conference finals last year. I'm not trying to criticize

989
00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:55,440
Speaker 5: him overall in terms of what he's capable of, but

990
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 5: the reality is is like, hey, if you you know,

991
00:55:57,760 --> 00:55:59,799
Speaker 5: give the ball to Kyrie and maybe instead of running

992
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:01,560
Speaker 5: a hi I pick and roll where you dribble the

993
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 5: air out of the basketball for seventeen seconds. Maybe you

994
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:05,920
Speaker 5: run down the floor and come off of a wide

995
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 5: screen and use that as a dribble handoff and get downhill.

996
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:11,360
Speaker 5: You can use your same skill set, that same vision,

997
00:56:11,440 --> 00:56:14,719
Speaker 5: that same size and strength and shot making ability more

998
00:56:14,840 --> 00:56:17,799
Speaker 5: within the flow of what a team can do as

999
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:22,120
Speaker 5: a unit together, and then embracing getting in shape to

1000
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:24,520
Speaker 5: be able to be a more of an impact player defensively.

1001
00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 5: I think, look, here's the thing, the pouting. I absolutely

1002
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:31,400
Speaker 5: believe that has a negative effect on the psyche of

1003
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:34,720
Speaker 5: a basketball team when they see their star constantly bitching

1004
00:56:34,719 --> 00:56:37,160
Speaker 5: and moaning at the refs and when he's constantly not

1005
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:39,480
Speaker 5: running back on defense and you can tell his head

1006
00:56:39,560 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 5: is not in it. I again, I loved how you

1007
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:44,880
Speaker 5: brought up Carmelo Anthony because that's such an interesting comp.

1008
00:56:44,719 --> 00:56:48,879
Speaker 2: I mean, they're christ different positions, but in everybody said

1009
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 2: they love Carmelo. Man, he gave you it was about

1010
00:56:52,880 --> 00:56:55,400
Speaker 2: Carmelo getting his shot. He wouldn't even adjust to a

1011
00:56:55,480 --> 00:56:59,640
Speaker 2: three point shot like it was bizarrely rigid in his

1012
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 2: style of play.

1013
00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:04,840
Speaker 5: One hundred percent like they're not the same player obviously,

1014
00:57:04,880 --> 00:57:07,360
Speaker 5: It's more just relative to the rest of the league

1015
00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:10,480
Speaker 5: and the way his progression went, Like like Lebron was

1016
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:12,880
Speaker 5: a little bit better than Carmelo, and over the years,

1017
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:15,760
Speaker 5: Lebron kept getting better and Mellow just kind of stayed

1018
00:57:15,800 --> 00:57:18,680
Speaker 5: the same. I mean, you got moderately better in some

1019
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:21,080
Speaker 5: areas of his offensive skill set, but he never became

1020
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:24,400
Speaker 5: an impact defensive player. He never became a top tier playmaker.

1021
00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 5: He never evolved in those other areas of his game.

1022
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:31,320
Speaker 2: And was and was threatened by yes, yes, And I

1023
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:35,240
Speaker 2: think Luca at times feels a little threatened. First of all,

1024
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:38,160
Speaker 2: he's from outside of the country, so players like that,

1025
00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:40,680
Speaker 2: I mean, you have to ingratiate yourself to a new

1026
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:44,439
Speaker 2: culture and a new country. That's really difficult. The other thing,

1027
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:48,000
Speaker 2: Jason is if you'll get Dirk Novinsky and Dallas probably

1028
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:52,640
Speaker 2: as beloved a player as the league's had. Everybody loved Dirk,

1029
00:57:53,360 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 2: not everybody loves Luca. He's got a much more temperamental,

1030
00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:04,680
Speaker 2: moody personality, so he's naturally gonna create some disharmony in

1031
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:10,040
Speaker 2: the room. He's just a moody guy. Dirk wasn't, so

1032
00:58:10,320 --> 00:58:14,640
Speaker 2: the Mavericks multiple times switched pieces with Dirk. Almost you know,

1033
00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:18,040
Speaker 2: almost everything worked with Dirk. It just didn't get a championship,

1034
00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:21,120
Speaker 2: but like he didn't have there was no like clashes

1035
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:25,480
Speaker 2: of culture. Everybody liked Dirk, nobody likes Luca. Like it's

1036
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:27,920
Speaker 2: a big difference. I think Luca is a better player.

1037
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 2: But at this point, somebody said this years ago to me,

1038
00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:37,480
Speaker 2: They're like, in football, halftime, defense goes to the right,

1039
00:58:37,560 --> 00:58:39,680
Speaker 2: offense goes to the left. In baseball, a third of

1040
00:58:39,720 --> 00:58:43,800
Speaker 2: the teams in the bullpen, it's thirteen dudes on the

1041
00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:47,720
Speaker 2: bench every practice on that plane, Like if one guy's

1042
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:50,880
Speaker 2: music's too loud on the plane. Now you have headphones now,

1043
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:53,920
Speaker 2: but you know years ago it's like one guy can

1044
00:58:54,000 --> 00:58:57,160
Speaker 2: ruin an NBA locker room, and if the star is difficult,

1045
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:59,960
Speaker 2: it's a bad locker room. I think the maps are

1046
00:58:59,920 --> 00:59:01,960
Speaker 2: a bit of an s show right now. And I

1047
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:08,520
Speaker 2: think Luca, I mean again, they're gonna they're gonna put

1048
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:11,120
Speaker 2: the pr people to work in Dallas. It's all good.

1049
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:16,160
Speaker 2: Luca is gonna love it. But when you watch him play,

1050
00:59:16,960 --> 00:59:20,560
Speaker 2: he aggravates me at times with his barking to the officials,

1051
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:22,200
Speaker 2: Like on every play.

1052
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:26,560
Speaker 5: It's such a love hate relationship for me because as

1053
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 5: a basketball fan, there's so many things with Luca that

1054
00:59:29,320 --> 00:59:31,880
Speaker 5: I'm drawn to. Like I he is one of the

1055
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:35,160
Speaker 5: best players that I've ever seen in terms of getting

1056
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:38,360
Speaker 5: beating people off the dribble without an athletic advantage, which

1057
00:59:38,400 --> 00:59:39,920
Speaker 5: is so hard to do. It's like it's kind of

1058
00:59:39,920 --> 00:59:43,240
Speaker 5: the Austin Reeves thing, like it's all it's all misdirection,

1059
00:59:43,640 --> 00:59:46,520
Speaker 5: and and like having every move a revocably attached to

1060
00:59:46,560 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 5: a counter move that's equally as effective, and in never

1061
00:59:49,760 --> 00:59:52,840
Speaker 5: telegraphing your moves. And like Luca, there's so many things

1062
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:55,200
Speaker 5: that I love about his game and I hate watching

1063
00:59:55,280 --> 00:59:59,000
Speaker 5: him because of his approach. Not only would the heliocentric

1064
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:00,960
Speaker 5: you know, just dribble the air the basketball every time,

1065
01:00:00,960 --> 01:00:02,360
Speaker 5: but also with the attitude stuff.

1066
01:00:02,480 --> 01:00:03,800
Speaker 4: And again it's a crossroads.

1067
01:00:03,840 --> 01:00:05,720
Speaker 5: He's either going to be the Carmelo of this era

1068
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:07,800
Speaker 5: or he's going to be an all time great. And

1069
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:11,000
Speaker 5: you know what, you know, what's interesting is if you

1070
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:13,960
Speaker 5: would ask everybody two years ago, you know, or all

1071
01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:16,280
Speaker 5: of you just say last year during the Western Conference Finals,

1072
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:18,000
Speaker 5: who are the two best players you know that you'd

1073
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:20,440
Speaker 5: want for the next ten years, it'd be Jiannis and

1074
01:00:20,520 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 5: Luca and he'd be pretty close, right Like, they'd be

1075
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:25,440
Speaker 5: neck and neck with a slight edge to Giannis. I

1076
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:27,440
Speaker 5: hope it doesn't end up being one of those situations

1077
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:32,840
Speaker 5: where Yannis just dramatically decorates himself because Luca Plateau's that's

1078
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:33,720
Speaker 5: a problem potential.

1079
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:33,960
Speaker 1: Well.

1080
01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:36,840
Speaker 2: I mean, listen, Lebron was more physically gifted than Carmelo,

1081
01:00:36,960 --> 01:00:39,120
Speaker 2: but as they drifted apart, a lot of it was

1082
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:43,480
Speaker 2: Lebron got along with more players, could play with more players,

1083
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:46,640
Speaker 2: was more amenable to different styles. I mean, Miami had

1084
01:00:46,680 --> 01:00:50,880
Speaker 2: no size. He and Wade were duplication. He never liked

1085
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 2: Mario Chalmers. I mean it was like they threw him

1086
01:00:54,360 --> 01:00:57,960
Speaker 2: with Ray Allen's and Shane Battier's and Mike Miller's and

1087
01:00:58,080 --> 01:01:00,240
Speaker 2: Lebron made it work. At the time, Spot was a

1088
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:03,000
Speaker 2: kid coach and Lebron made it work. And then he

1089
01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:04,880
Speaker 2: goes to Cleveland again and he makes it work, and

1090
01:01:04,920 --> 01:01:06,880
Speaker 2: he goes to Los Angeles and he makes it work.

1091
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:11,000
Speaker 2: If you give Lebron, I mean, Jr. Smith was fun,

1092
01:01:11,680 --> 01:01:14,520
Speaker 2: but I think people forget he and Lebron were pretty

1093
01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:18,840
Speaker 2: good together, and Jr. Smith was weird and you know,

1094
01:01:19,200 --> 01:01:23,840
Speaker 2: a little eccentric and some viewed as difficult, kind of

1095
01:01:23,920 --> 01:01:28,120
Speaker 2: an iso act, you know, super talented. Lebron made it work.

1096
01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:31,160
Speaker 2: Lebron and him were close, despite that one time out

1097
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:35,400
Speaker 2: right that they called so And I think Jannis sort

1098
01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:39,000
Speaker 2: of is amenable to a lot of different teammates and players.

1099
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:43,960
Speaker 2: Luca so far isn't like I mean, look at they

1100
01:01:43,960 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 2: just bring in Jay Crowder and then Joe Ingles and

1101
01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:49,560
Speaker 2: Drew Holliday and Chris Middleton was like they stole him.

1102
01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 2: I think from like Detroit, He's worked with all of them.

1103
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:56,680
Speaker 2: He works with everybody, and Brook Lopez another big He's

1104
01:01:56,720 --> 01:02:00,480
Speaker 2: not threatened at all, Like it matters a lot, and

1105
01:02:00,520 --> 01:02:03,640
Speaker 2: it's just like I always felt Carmelo was threatened. Luca

1106
01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:07,880
Speaker 2: feels a little threatened. Jannis never does. Lebron never has.

1107
01:02:08,280 --> 01:02:11,120
Speaker 2: I mean, God, he goes into Miami, it's d Wade City.

1108
01:02:11,320 --> 01:02:12,760
Speaker 4: And it's like, all right, let's go for it.

1109
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:14,520
Speaker 2: I mean he could have picked anywhere to go, right,

1110
01:02:14,920 --> 01:02:18,200
Speaker 2: he goes to the probably the single most beloved player

1111
01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:21,840
Speaker 2: in any city. I'll go to your city. I mean

1112
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:25,240
Speaker 2: that was rife with issues. Could you have seen Carmelo

1113
01:02:25,360 --> 01:02:28,240
Speaker 2: going down there and making it work, his insecurities would

1114
01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:32,120
Speaker 2: have just flourished. So I yeah, I'm not I'm not

1115
01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:34,360
Speaker 2: anti Luca, but it's just like we've got to have

1116
01:02:35,160 --> 01:02:38,360
Speaker 2: I think we're moving to the second phase, which is okay.

1117
01:02:38,520 --> 01:02:42,920
Speaker 2: Not all these issues are Carmelo Anthony's teammates. Summer Carmelo.

1118
01:02:57,200 --> 01:02:57,880
Speaker 3: The Volume.

1119
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:04,680
Speaker 2: Make sure to check out The Draymond Green Show. I

1120
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 2: brought Draymond Green into the Volume because one of the

1121
01:03:07,040 --> 01:03:11,160
Speaker 2: more entertaining voices in sports. Unique perspective understands behind the

1122
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:15,480
Speaker 2: rope also chops up with guests like Gary Payton, Zach Levine,

1123
01:03:15,520 --> 01:03:19,840
Speaker 2: Tracy McGrady. Make sure download The Draymond Green Show wherever

1124
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:25,040
Speaker 2: you get your podcasts, only on the Volume podcast Network.