WEBVTT - Memory/Story Editing 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:06.000 Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:14.600 Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:17.119 My name is Robert lamp and I'm Julie Ducklas, and 0:00:17.440 --> 0:00:20.960 this week we're talking about memory editing. And if this 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:27.480 were your average science journalism story, you would inevitably start 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:30.120 with a reference to Eternal Sunshine of the Spot Spot 0:00:30.160 --> 0:00:33.360 was Mine. You know, have you have you noticed this trend? 0:00:33.600 --> 0:00:37.080 Like any story that relates at all to changing memories 0:00:37.159 --> 0:00:39.879 or racing memories, they will name drop that film in 0:00:39.960 --> 0:00:43.120 the lead. Well, because it was such an intriguing idea 0:00:43.400 --> 0:00:47.800 that you could, uh you could alter or completely remove 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:52.280 a memory that had been dogging you your entire life. Yeah, 0:00:52.360 --> 0:00:54.360 it's true. But I you know, I feel like there 0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:58.480 have been enough stories about like changing memories and and 0:00:58.480 --> 0:01:01.240 and and what memories actually are, that we don't need 0:01:01.280 --> 0:01:04.480 that film as the reference point anymore for an actual 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:07.360 story about the science of memory and the science of 0:01:07.400 --> 0:01:10.399 altering memory. I always feel like a little bit insulted. 0:01:10.480 --> 0:01:12.640 You know. It's like someone's like, hey, so if you've 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:15.720 seen let me tell you about space. You've seen Star Wars, right, Like, 0:01:15.760 --> 0:01:17.479 you don't have to start with Star wars. We live 0:01:17.480 --> 0:01:19.959 in a the world. We're surrounded by space, alright, Alright, 0:01:20.040 --> 0:01:22.800 so I think, and maybe I'm projecting my own feelings 0:01:22.840 --> 0:01:25.960 on here, is that the problem is that the spotless 0:01:26.000 --> 0:01:30.920 mind idea is it's erroneous. And it takes this idea 0:01:30.959 --> 0:01:35.319 that you could like return your mind to some pristine 0:01:36.120 --> 0:01:40.959 platonic state, right where everything is completely new and fresh. 0:01:41.040 --> 0:01:43.440 But that is not the case. Our minds are the 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:46.360 cages that we have. But it turns out that we 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:50.320 can actually tame them to a certain degree. We can't erase, 0:01:50.440 --> 0:01:53.160 we can't make them spotless, but we can make them 0:01:53.200 --> 0:01:55.960 a little bit more manageable. The problem is just just 0:01:56.000 --> 0:01:59.520 this inherent misunderstanding of what memory is in the first place. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:02.760 And I was looking at this survey that was published 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:05.720 in two thousand eleven by PLS so one found that 0:02:05.800 --> 0:02:08.640 almost two thirds of Americans believe that memory works like 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:12.560 a video camera and that it's like we're recording events 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:16.880 so we can review them later. Yeah, it's not so 0:02:16.919 --> 0:02:19.079 at all. And we've we've discussed the science of memory 0:02:19.400 --> 0:02:21.560 um a good bit in previous episodes. Off to make 0:02:21.560 --> 0:02:23.359 sure I throw some of those back up on the 0:02:23.720 --> 0:02:26.320 website and on the social media pages around the time 0:02:26.360 --> 0:02:30.760 this episode publishes. But indeed, we've talked before about the 0:02:31.480 --> 0:02:35.320 seven Sins of memory. Uh. These of course were brought 0:02:35.360 --> 0:02:38.000 to mind by Daniel Shackter, the former chair of Harvard 0:02:38.080 --> 0:02:41.320 University Psychology Psychology Department and author of the book The 0:02:41.320 --> 0:02:45.000 Seven Sins of Memories Cohen How the Mind forgets and remembers, 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:48.520 and he mentions, uh, these seven just seven ways that 0:02:48.919 --> 0:02:53.799 all our memories are uh untrustworthy at the very least. 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:57.160 For instance, there's transience, So that's the weakening or loss 0:02:57.200 --> 0:03:00.280 of memory over time. What you have for lunch eight 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:05.480 years ago today, the side of sweet potatoes there human 0:03:06.720 --> 0:03:08.880 sprinkling on top. Okay, well that was a really good 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:11.240 sandwich apparently, so that was stuck with you. But for 0:03:11.240 --> 0:03:14.280 the most part, these memories just fade over time. It's 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:17.240 just how it works. And then there's absent mindedness. Uh 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:20.040 so this involves attention in memory. We're just not paying 0:03:20.080 --> 0:03:21.920 attention to what's going on around it, so we're not 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:25.400 getting all the data. There's blocking, that's the failed attempt 0:03:25.400 --> 0:03:28.480 to recall tidbits of memory a face, a name, Etceterates 0:03:28.520 --> 0:03:30.200 on the tip of my tongue. But I can't remember 0:03:30.200 --> 0:03:33.480 what it is. Uh. There's misattribution. This is when we 0:03:33.520 --> 0:03:37.320 recall an authentic memory, but then aspects of it are misattributed. 0:03:37.360 --> 0:03:40.240 And this includes scenarios such as incorrect incorrect time or 0:03:40.240 --> 0:03:45.040 place identity, misattribution, or confusion over the originator of an idea. 0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:48.000 We've all had those conversations where you're telling a story 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:50.640 about something that you think happened to you and it 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:52.960 turns out it's happening to the person you you're you're 0:03:52.960 --> 0:03:56.680 speaking to, or you have some very pivotal detail of 0:03:56.680 --> 0:03:59.160 the story completely backwards, like oh, that trip that wasn't 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:00.640 a trip I took with this person, was a trip 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:03.240 I took with this person. It wasn't this past girlfriend, 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:05.000 it was this past girlfriend, or you know, whatever the 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:10.119 scenario might be. And then there's suggestibility. Our minds are 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:14.920 and our memories entirely susceptible yes to to suggestions. So 0:04:16.640 --> 0:04:18.880 you were to say it enough times, I might either 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:22.520 actually get a astronomy sandwich for lunch or falsely remember 0:04:22.560 --> 0:04:26.080 that I had one. There's bias, uh, and that you 0:04:26.120 --> 0:04:30.159 see this all the time in people's memories of crimes. 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:34.440 If they have a particular bias in mind regarding uh uh, say, 0:04:34.560 --> 0:04:37.960 the racial profiling of suspects, then that's going to have 0:04:38.040 --> 0:04:41.280 an influence on how they remember the crime that occurred. 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:44.719 And then there's persistence, and that's the unwanted recall of 0:04:44.760 --> 0:04:47.800 information that's disturbing and that actually ties in a lot 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:49.920 with what we're gonna talk about in this episode. So 0:04:50.360 --> 0:04:53.480 there are all these ways that our memory is pretty 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.400 much jack from the get go. And to your your point, 0:04:56.520 --> 0:04:59.240 so many people think it's just all a bunch of 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:02.960 video information and stored in her head, which which couldn't 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:07.040 be further from the truth. Yeah, there's that great cognitive 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:10.960 psychology experiment that was done by Daniel Simon's and Christopher 0:05:11.080 --> 0:05:14.760 Chebery's that showed how selective attention works. You probably heard 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:19.080 about this. There's a video of people with white shirt 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:21.599 song and a video of people with black shirt song 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:23.920 and they were playing I think basketball or something like. Yeah, 0:05:23.920 --> 0:05:26.160 I watched it, but I really wasn't paying that much attention. Okay, 0:05:26.240 --> 0:05:28.800 well then you if you were, if you were doing 0:05:28.800 --> 0:05:31.960 it as as they instructed, you were probably looking at 0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:34.680 the white shirted team, right. You were told to really 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:37.760 figure out how many passes were made between the members 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:42.320 of this white shirted team and you probably, as participants did, 0:05:42.600 --> 0:05:46.359 did not notice the gorilla walking through the clutch of 0:05:46.440 --> 0:05:49.640 white shirted and black short players. So this is a 0:05:49.640 --> 0:05:54.120 good example of attention and selective attention and memory. Yeah, 0:05:54.160 --> 0:05:57.240 there are a number of these type of pranks that 0:05:57.279 --> 0:05:59.320 you see carried out and that you can find them 0:05:59.320 --> 0:06:02.080 on YouTube once where they'll take say an individual will 0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:04.480 be sort of in the background for a person and 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:06.760 then they'll like switch out the person playing that part 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:09.360 to see if they notice. And it's it's phenomenal how 0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:12.799 how often people do not notice. Um. There's a British 0:06:12.839 --> 0:06:15.880 television series called The Black Mirror, which we've mentioned before, 0:06:15.880 --> 0:06:18.800 and there's an episode titled The Entire History of You, 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:23.880 and in this near future sci fi vision of reality, 0:06:24.320 --> 0:06:28.720 most people have this little electronic device called a grain 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:34.839 implanted uh in their brain and it basically collects constant 0:06:34.920 --> 0:06:37.800 video of their life and then you can go back 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:41.400 and replay the video, which of course ends up having 0:06:41.400 --> 0:06:45.560 disastrous um consequences for the characters in this particular episode. 0:06:45.720 --> 0:06:48.479 But it's it's very interesting that model because they they 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:53.120 in this episode they create a sci fi technological version 0:06:53.200 --> 0:06:55.919 of memory that is in keeping with the with the 0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:59.159 way most people think memory is right, and in fact 0:06:59.240 --> 0:07:02.279 it's not. As you said, there are seven sins of memory. 0:07:02.800 --> 0:07:04.359 And really, if you think about it, we are the 0:07:04.400 --> 0:07:09.039 magicians of memory because we have misdirection and misp misperception, 0:07:09.640 --> 0:07:11.880 and then we try to piece together this pattern that 0:07:11.960 --> 0:07:15.040 makes sense to us, and boom, you have this manufactured 0:07:15.120 --> 0:07:18.920 reality that comes out on a plate for you. Um. 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:21.920 And the thing is is that we continue to take 0:07:22.000 --> 0:07:25.200 this memory out and look at it all the time. 0:07:25.640 --> 0:07:28.560 In fact, every time you take out a memory, you 0:07:28.640 --> 0:07:31.480 change it a bit. Yes, yeah, I've we mentioned before 0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:34.560 that don't think of your memory as a little stone 0:07:34.640 --> 0:07:37.400 sculpture that you keep in a drawer. It's a sculpture 0:07:37.440 --> 0:07:39.880 made out of clay. Every time you take it out, 0:07:40.080 --> 0:07:42.600 you're jabbing it, you're changing it. You're bringing new information, 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:45.559 new interpretation into that memory. And then you put it back. 0:07:46.000 --> 0:07:48.160 And so so every time you draw it out, you're 0:07:48.520 --> 0:07:52.000 you're changing, you're getting it a little bit further removed 0:07:52.000 --> 0:07:55.240 from the actual reality. And here's the thing. These memories 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:58.360 are the foundation of the story of who you are, right, 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:02.239 and so this is where emotional health and something called 0:08:02.360 --> 0:08:05.800 story editing comes in because there's this idea that you 0:08:05.840 --> 0:08:10.320 can change your memory and maybe even alter your future. 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:13.760 And we'll get more into that, but before we do, 0:08:14.200 --> 0:08:16.400 I want to discuss a little bit about why we 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:18.160 take these memories out in the first place and sort 0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:20.080 of obsess over them. And in order to do that, 0:08:20.120 --> 0:08:23.160 you gotta go to Papa Freud. Yeah, and it's great because, 0:08:23.160 --> 0:08:26.720 in classic Freud's style, he goes right to your childhood, right, 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:30.320 oh yeah, yeah. In fact, um, in beyond the pleasure principle, 0:08:30.440 --> 0:08:34.960 Freud actually documents his grandson's particular habit of taking his 0:08:35.040 --> 0:08:38.000 toys and hiding them or throwing them away. And when 0:08:38.000 --> 0:08:41.560 he does that, um, his grandson says forth, meaning gone. 0:08:41.960 --> 0:08:45.079 And then he watches his grandson um taking them back 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:49.240 and saying, dah, they're here. So, in this one particular 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:53.199 instance and beyond the pleasure principle, his grandson has like 0:08:53.760 --> 0:08:55.559 I think, it's just like a real with a string 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:58.600 tied to it, and he's in his crib and over 0:08:58.640 --> 0:09:01.520 and over again he does the dog game. He throws 0:09:01.640 --> 0:09:03.760 that spool away and then he reels it back in. 0:09:03.960 --> 0:09:07.480 And so what Freud says is that the kid is 0:09:07.520 --> 0:09:12.880 actually um marking a cultural achievement here because the kid 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:15.320 is equating this and just stay with me on this, 0:09:16.080 --> 0:09:19.760 uh that this fort doab has gone and back with 0:09:20.000 --> 0:09:23.960 his mom and his mom leaving him but coming back 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:26.760 and saying that he's getting far more pleasure from the 0:09:26.920 --> 0:09:30.960 daw part the coming back part, and so he's mastering 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:36.240 control over his emotions at his mother sometimes disappearing or 0:09:36.280 --> 0:09:39.079 having to leave the room. And this idea that that 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:42.920 you know, your your main caregiver might not come back 0:09:43.120 --> 0:09:47.760 or come back, that's that's pretty fascinating uh interpretation, and 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:52.480 especially since the father of a nearly two year old 0:09:52.480 --> 0:09:55.560 who's really into that the whole casting of objects and 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:58.320 then also playing hide and go seek with like a 0:09:58.360 --> 0:10:00.520 stuffed cat and that we have in the house. It 0:10:01.000 --> 0:10:03.120 really loves to be who go, Where's where's fat cat? 0:10:03.120 --> 0:10:05.120 Where's fat cat go? Oh? Well, fat cats under the 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:08.960 slide and then it's you know, tremendously um entertaining to 0:10:09.040 --> 0:10:12.240 him defined the cat that was barely hidden. Yeah, So 0:10:12.280 --> 0:10:15.400 this is a huge lesson for humans that life is ephemeral. 0:10:16.000 --> 0:10:19.160 Things come, things go, people come, and people go, And 0:10:19.760 --> 0:10:24.120 this really ties into the idea of repetition compulsion and mastery, 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:27.360 and maybe, just maybe that's why we continue to take out, 0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:32.440 in particular traumatic memories bother some memories, and we look 0:10:32.480 --> 0:10:35.920 at them and examine them over and over again, each 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:40.760 time hoping to get a better understanding. But the problem 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:46.199 is that, especially according to Freud, those memories are unconscious. 0:10:46.280 --> 0:10:49.440 They are buried and they are hidden, and so you 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:52.320 just kind of get these little crumbs of your unconscious. 0:10:52.760 --> 0:10:56.679 But then you have someone by the name of Timothy D. Wilson, 0:10:57.080 --> 0:11:00.240 this is a University of Virginia psychologists, who says this 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.679 unconscious or unconscious as he calls it, is off limits 0:11:03.720 --> 0:11:07.319 to us. So it's really only through conscious thoughts that 0:11:07.360 --> 0:11:13.040 we can change the mechanisms of the unconscious world for us. Mm. 0:11:13.120 --> 0:11:16.120 So he has this idea of, for instance, if you 0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:20.160 establish regular acts of kindness, that you could tease out 0:11:20.200 --> 0:11:26.720 progressive changes in behavior as determined by your unconscious. So 0:11:26.800 --> 0:11:31.280 now we're talking about changing your behavior through your story 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:35.679 of yourself. Yes, yes, yeah, And this is what this 0:11:35.720 --> 0:11:38.360 is where everything really gets interesting here, because essentially we 0:11:38.400 --> 0:11:41.600 are getting into that eternal sunshine of the spotless mind territory. 0:11:41.679 --> 0:11:45.240 But instead of changing your memories through the use of 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:48.319 lasers or or a little bit of a little tiny 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.559 electronic device that goes in your brain as in Black Mirror. 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:54.120 It's about thinking about it is that I'm using your 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:58.920 actual mental architecture as it exists, your actual mental machinery, uh, 0:11:59.000 --> 0:12:01.280 that you have in your head, and using it to 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:05.160 alter memory, using the weakness of memory as a strength. 0:12:05.200 --> 0:12:08.720 Really yeah, and it's really effective, as we will discuss UM. 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:12.119 Wilson in his two thousand eleven book Redirect, The Surprising 0:12:12.160 --> 0:12:15.280 New Science of Psychological Change, looks at why programs like 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:19.400 Scared Straight, you know, the taking the at risk youth 0:12:19.480 --> 0:12:22.320 to prisons and trying to scare them straight, why those 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:26.079 sort of programs fail, and why story editing just having 0:12:26.080 --> 0:12:29.880 those kids change their story, their narrative maybe a far 0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:33.360 more effective strategy. Yeah. Yeah, I've been reading a little 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:35.800 bit about this, uh to it in regards to children, 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:39.280 like the dangers of labeling um, particularly reading an article 0:12:39.360 --> 0:12:42.680 on biting and about how just the one thing they 0:12:42.760 --> 0:12:45.640 always advises and dealing with biting, which which is a 0:12:45.679 --> 0:12:49.720 pretty common occurrence with with children, especially as their acquiring 0:12:49.760 --> 0:12:53.360 language and learning how to better express themselves, uh than 0:12:53.480 --> 0:12:56.160 by simply you know, fighting into something is that. But 0:12:56.200 --> 0:12:58.560 there's there's always this danger of referring to them as 0:12:58.600 --> 0:13:01.040 a bitter, because then that comes their story and they 0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:03.520 can interpret interpret that, even at a very young age, 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:05.600 and they say, oh, I'm a buyer, So I bite 0:13:05.720 --> 0:13:07.280 in the same way that one might think, oh, well 0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:09.880 I'm you know, I'm destined to wind up in a 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:12.240 in a prison, so I guess I will. This is 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:14.000 the this is what I am. I guess that's what 0:13:14.040 --> 0:13:16.440 I'm going to be. Well, you know that's interesting because 0:13:16.840 --> 0:13:19.000 this is that is exactly at This is this idea 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:20.960 that you you put this narrative in place and then 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:23.600 you follow it to the letter and you become it. 0:13:24.080 --> 0:13:28.320 And Wilson first discovered this power of story editing in 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:31.480 the eighties when he found that struggling students had fallen 0:13:31.520 --> 0:13:34.920 for the same old narrative, I'm bad at school, which 0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:38.280 was driving this sort of self defeating cycle. And he 0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:41.400 gave forties students, these students who were not doing well 0:13:41.440 --> 0:13:47.079 in school a new narrative, which was everyone fails at first. Okay, 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:50.120 so that recast the whole idea, Wait, what I may 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:52.240 not be bad at school? Everyone fails at first. This 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:55.840 is a thing. So suddenly these students are being introduced 0:13:55.880 --> 0:13:58.199 to this new idea. And he had the students read 0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:01.440 accounts from other students had who had struggled with grades 0:14:01.559 --> 0:14:04.920 and then improved. There's also videotape footage of other students 0:14:04.920 --> 0:14:08.640 who relay their tales of eventual academic success. And the 0:14:08.720 --> 0:14:12.199 results were pretty astounding. The students who received the information, 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:16.040 compared to those who did not A were significantly less 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:18.640 apt to leave college by the end of their sophomore year. 0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:23.080 Be they had a significantly greater increase in grade point 0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:27.120 average even one year after the study. And see they 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.760 performed significantly better on sample items from the g r 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:34.400 E or the Graduate Record Exam. And this is all 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:38.040 from a thirty minute session, one thirty minute session which 0:14:38.080 --> 0:14:41.080 had staying power even one year after. And this just 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:44.080 shows you how important priming is really. And I was 0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:48.360 thinking about this University Michigan study, and this study they 0:14:48.360 --> 0:14:51.240 had students with the same abilities and perform its splinter 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:54.080 into two groups. The first was told that men performed 0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:57.240 better than women on math tests. The second was told 0:14:57.280 --> 0:14:59.600 that no matter what they might have heard, there was 0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:03.200 no difference and abilities among the two genders than they 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:05.960 were given the math test, and in the first group, 0:15:06.160 --> 0:15:09.440 men outscored women by twenty points. In the second group, 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:11.360 the one that was told no matter what they had heard, 0:15:11.960 --> 0:15:15.640 that the abilities are the same, they were outscored only 0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:18.400 by two points. I mean, that's a huge difference. And 0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:23.160 that's just from that one priming example and indeed stressing 0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:26.760 the point of thinking for yourself and questioning authority, not 0:15:26.840 --> 0:15:28.920 questioning authority in the sense that I'm going to, you know, 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:31.200 break a law, just because if they were questioning the 0:15:31.360 --> 0:15:34.800 established script that is handed down to us about who 0:15:34.840 --> 0:15:37.200 you are, what you are, what you're capable of achieving. 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:41.040 And uh, and yeah, there's just something almost endlessly powerful 0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:44.080 about being able to to sort of break free of 0:15:44.080 --> 0:15:46.280 those chains. Yeah. I mean if you think about it, 0:15:46.320 --> 0:15:50.480 like in in Um some of your most um, how 0:15:50.520 --> 0:15:54.360 shows it the delicate situations in life where you were 0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:59.040 really struggling with someone or something, if someone came and 0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:04.040 gave you as script or just even this this idea, 0:16:04.200 --> 0:16:09.360 this other narrative of hey, another perception, how could that 0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:13.760 have changed your life? That's how powerful this is. Now 0:16:14.000 --> 0:16:17.120 another area that this becomes important again you mentioned earlier 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:19.920 how arguably a lot of the stuff is going on 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:23.600 into some subconscious level. There's there's say a bad memory, 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:27.800 scarring memory, traumatic memory, even that is keeps popping up 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:31.880 again and again, this persistent memory, and it's it's kind 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:34.160 of like a Rubic's cube, but not a Rubics cube 0:16:34.160 --> 0:16:35.840 that you ever sit down and say, all right, I'm 0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:37.800 gonna sit down and solve this thing. But it's one 0:16:37.800 --> 0:16:40.240 that's just always sitting on your desk or is in 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:42.480 the drawer that you're always opening, and it's there. It's 0:16:42.640 --> 0:16:46.200 it's it's seemingly unsolvable and uh, and you may tinker 0:16:46.240 --> 0:16:47.520 with it for a minute and then put it back. 0:16:47.720 --> 0:16:51.120 You're right, So your mind is tinkering with it mostly 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:53.640 the unconscious level, but every once in a while it surfaces. 0:16:54.120 --> 0:16:56.040 Can you become aware of this thing that's bothering you? 0:16:56.320 --> 0:16:59.360 So it just this this persistent um a bit of 0:16:59.360 --> 0:17:04.520 annoyance or or even just nagging depression. Anytime when we 0:17:04.520 --> 0:17:06.280 we cover a topic like this, always think back to 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:11.240 Alan Robe grulay novel Jealousy, and it's a it's an 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:15.439 experimental novel. Um. I don't recommend picking up and reading 0:17:15.440 --> 0:17:18.159 it unless you know what you're getting into. Just style 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:20.719 wise because it's a it's a little unorthodox. But the 0:17:20.920 --> 0:17:24.800 entire novel is this this man who owns a banana plantation, 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:29.600 and he's looking through Venetian blinds observing his wife and 0:17:29.840 --> 0:17:32.960 trying to figure out if she's having an affair with 0:17:33.119 --> 0:17:37.000 the guy who runs the neighboring banana plantation. And and 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:40.040 so it's just him poring over what he knows and 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:43.399 how little he knows, over and over again, uh, and 0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:47.679 occasionally observing a smeared centipede on the wall and trying 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:50.600 to decide what he should do. And the in spoiler, 0:17:50.640 --> 0:17:53.880 the entire novel passes and he doesn't decide what he's 0:17:53.880 --> 0:17:58.200 gonna do. He's just this just this endless nagging frustration 0:17:58.720 --> 0:18:01.320 over how little he knows and now and and that's 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:03.720 kind of what happens in these cases. We have limited 0:18:03.760 --> 0:18:06.800 amount of information. It's kind of like the cock Snowflake 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:09.440 that we talked about Snowflake episode. There's only so much 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:12.119 information you may know about a given situation, and unless 0:18:12.160 --> 0:18:16.560 you actually were to go outside of that bubble of knowledge, um, 0:18:16.800 --> 0:18:20.600 you're never going to solve it. So so again, these 0:18:20.640 --> 0:18:25.440 these problems, these memories, these uh, they just exist there 0:18:25.440 --> 0:18:29.160 in the in the peripheries, and and it's only through 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:32.119 actually tackling them that we can alter them into a 0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:36.080 shape that fits in and kind of vanishes into the background. Okay, 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:38.200 we're gonna take a quick break, and when we get back, 0:18:38.280 --> 0:18:40.680 we're going to talk about how you can actually get 0:18:40.720 --> 0:18:43.560 outside of that bubble of knowledge, change your narrative, and 0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:53.720 perhaps change your life. All Right, we're back, Julie. Have 0:18:53.800 --> 0:18:57.120 you read The Secret, The Secret, The Secret, the one 0:18:57.119 --> 0:19:01.000 with the little like the red wax seal on the cover. Uh? No, 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:04.159 is that is that a new novel? That's like, you know, 0:19:04.200 --> 0:19:06.560 the self help thing? Right? Oh? Is this the thing 0:19:06.600 --> 0:19:08.800 about like if you put a positive vibe out in 0:19:08.840 --> 0:19:10.840 the world, someone will give you a million dollars? I 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:13.000 think so. I have not read it myself, so I'm 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:15.239 not privy to the actual secret, but I understand that 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.480 that's basically the secret that if you put out that 0:19:18.480 --> 0:19:21.640 positive intergy. I think it is. But it kind of 0:19:21.800 --> 0:19:23.359 gets into the same area that you see with a 0:19:23.359 --> 0:19:25.320 lot of self help books, and that's the idea that 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:28.320 if you if you believe in something, you can make 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:32.159 it real, that you can you can change yourself or 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:35.320 even change reality through the strong sense of belief and 0:19:35.400 --> 0:19:38.080 positive vibes and uh, you know, to a certain extent, 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:40.159 there's often a lot of kind of New age hokery 0:19:40.240 --> 0:19:42.320 going on in that. But as we're going to discuss here, 0:19:42.440 --> 0:19:45.280 there's also this core of reality as it comes to 0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:49.320 our ability to manipulate memories. And in this case, it's 0:19:49.400 --> 0:19:53.439 not necessarily believing in your narrative, it's understanding your narrative. 0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:56.080 And again, this is why that memory keeps knocking around 0:19:56.440 --> 0:19:59.840 and saying, hey, look at me, I'm flagged because I'm important. 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:02.879 Don't quite understand what's going on here. This is troublesome 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:08.479 for me. Right, So there's this other approach to story editing, 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:12.200 and it is to write and then rewrite your narrative. 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:15.600 James Penna Baker of the University of Texas has pioneered 0:20:15.640 --> 0:20:19.040 a really expressive writing technique that helps people recover from 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:23.400 past traumas by helping them reframe and reinterpret those events. 0:20:24.119 --> 0:20:27.760 And there's a link that if you just search for 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:30.679 writing and help some practical advice, you will see this 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:33.480 prompt for writing in the idea is that for four 0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:37.480 days in a row, fifteen minutes each you take a 0:20:37.560 --> 0:20:41.399 topic that you that's been bothering you, um, that you 0:20:41.440 --> 0:20:43.960 really want to explore more about, and you just write 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:48.200 about it, and you write really as honestly and as 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:50.760 fully as you can. Yeah, and now what would you 0:20:50.760 --> 0:20:53.080 write about? Some of the examples they give would be 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:56.040 to write about something that you're thinking or worrying about 0:20:56.080 --> 0:20:59.400 too much. So maybe you're worrying about, you know, taxes 0:20:59.400 --> 0:21:01.359 coming up and to you know, settle down and figure 0:21:01.400 --> 0:21:05.040 those out. Or uh, you're something that you're dreaming about, 0:21:05.320 --> 0:21:08.080 Say you wanted to actually do something about that nagging 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:10.800 dream where you forgot that you signed up for a 0:21:10.880 --> 0:21:14.960 class in school until right at the end at finals, 0:21:15.000 --> 0:21:17.200 you know, or or the the you know, the wearing 0:21:17.280 --> 0:21:19.720 underwear or nothing to your math class kind of dream. 0:21:20.560 --> 0:21:23.720 Other possibilities to write about include something you feel is 0:21:23.720 --> 0:21:27.119 affecting your life in an unhealthy way, be it something 0:21:27.359 --> 0:21:29.560 you know, like a personal habit, or something outside yourself, 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:32.080 or something that you have been avoiding for days, weeks, 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:35.400 or years. Tackling at fifteen minutes a day for four 0:21:35.480 --> 0:21:39.280 days in writing form. Okay, so it's interesting because what 0:21:39.400 --> 0:21:42.280 happens is that the first time you write, you will 0:21:42.520 --> 0:21:44.600 might write the thing that's bothering you, and you might 0:21:44.640 --> 0:21:47.480 touch on the thing that is actually the thing that's 0:21:47.480 --> 0:21:50.160 bothering you, because most often when you think that there's 0:21:50.200 --> 0:21:53.719 a topic that that's really the problem, there's an underlying issue, 0:21:54.280 --> 0:21:56.879 and so returning to that issue four days in a 0:21:57.000 --> 0:22:00.119 row it gives you more insight. You're peeling away the 0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:04.080 layers of the onion of of that actual problem, and 0:22:04.280 --> 0:22:08.440 in the process you're creating some sort of understanding for yourself. 0:22:08.480 --> 0:22:11.280 You are reframing that narrative so that it makes sense. 0:22:11.320 --> 0:22:14.520 If something bad happened to you in your past and 0:22:14.600 --> 0:22:17.760 it keeps coming up again and again, writing about it 0:22:17.800 --> 0:22:21.600 really forces you to reflect on it and not say, oh, 0:22:21.720 --> 0:22:25.080 this was justified, it should have happened. That's not what 0:22:25.119 --> 0:22:28.320