Speaker 1: Fellow ridiculous historians, we are returning to you this weekend
Speaker 1: with a celebration and a classic episode. Happy Father's Day
Speaker 1: to all the fathers out there.
Speaker 2: Dude, have you seen the movie The Miami Connection? Have I?
Speaker 2: Why am I asking you? I don't know? It's okay.
Speaker 2: It's an eighties absolute.
Speaker 3: Bonkers B movie that involves ninja's and like some tough
Speaker 3: fighting guys who are in a hair metal band called
Speaker 3: Dragon Sound.
Speaker 2: But there's this one plot line.
Speaker 3: This one dude from Dragonstown I think, is the keyboard
Speaker 3: player who's trying to find his father and at one
Speaker 3: point he gets a letter in the mail and it
Speaker 3: gets this really heartwarming scene where he goes, he opens
Speaker 3: the letter and he goes, my father, and then he goes.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Just just look up that scene. It'll
Speaker 2: warm your damn heart. It's so good.
Speaker 3: It's a terrible movie that was made by a taekwondo
Speaker 3: master to promote his taekwondo school.
Speaker 2: Back amazing. It's got songs that are about the stuff
Speaker 2: that happens. Right.
Speaker 3: I love that we'll fight the ninjas and we'll get
Speaker 3: the cocaine.
Speaker 2: It's so good. That's great.
Speaker 1: We hope that you enjoy our exploration of Father's Day.
Speaker 1: A few years back. We were surprised to find that
Speaker 1: Father's Day, which we've always accused of being kind of
Speaker 1: a hallmarket in creation, Father's Day, was not immediately popular
Speaker 1: when it was proposed, originally because people thought celebrating your
Speaker 1: father was a little too effeminate.
Speaker 2: Let's roll that beautiful Father's Day footage.
Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to
Speaker 1: the show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much
Speaker 1: for tuning in. Let's hear it for our super producer,
Speaker 1: Max Live Williams.
Speaker 3: I was gonna say, Max Liar Williams, he's not to
Speaker 3: be trusted. He gave us this big countdown to our
Speaker 3: first session in the new studio, and turns out he'd
Speaker 3: been recording the whole.
Speaker 2: Time, the whole damn time. God forbid of those outtakes
Speaker 2: that are making into the world. Oh yeah, it's gonna
Speaker 2: be over for us.
Speaker 1: It's true though. I'm Ben gar Nol. We are here
Speaker 1: in person at the New studios. This is for any
Speaker 1: longtime listener. This is the first time you and I
Speaker 1: have recorded in a actual podcast studio instead of something
Speaker 1: we bootlegged totally.
Speaker 3: Not to mention the first time Ridiculous History has recorded
Speaker 3: in person.
Speaker 2: In over a year. I'd say we dabbled, you know,
Speaker 2: post pandemic.
Speaker 3: In our previous offices, but frankly, we just kind of
Speaker 3: gotten so used to the workflow being able to podcast
Speaker 3: in our underwear, it was a hard sell to leave
Speaker 3: the house.
Speaker 2: But now we're here, pants and all. How do you
Speaker 2: know I have pants? I'm a different don't need to know.
Speaker 2: It's true.
Speaker 3: We can't see below the bells on Max. He's in
Speaker 3: a whole glass you know, booth situation. It's very I
Speaker 3: don't even.
Speaker 1: Know we're another camera. He refuses to turn it on,
Speaker 1: but there's a camera that lets us see what Max
Speaker 1: is doing.
Speaker 2: Pants cam.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, actually it's only the upper half, so you
Speaker 4: still want to know, all right.
Speaker 1: Well as you are, as you are probably aware by
Speaker 1: the nature of the title. Here, folks, in typical Ridiculous
Speaker 1: History fashion, we are celebrating a holiday after it happens
Speaker 1: only a couple of days though, we're getting closer and
Speaker 1: to get all.
Speaker 2: Time you want me about it.
Speaker 3: We're recording it well before the holiday. The holiday falls
Speaker 3: this coming Sunday. We're recording this on a Thursday, and
Speaker 3: you'll be here on a Tuesday. Wrap your brain around
Speaker 3: that this is.
Speaker 1: The world in which we live, and this is a
Speaker 1: holiday that is I think it's the pepsi to the
Speaker 1: Coca cola that is Mother's Day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a well meaning idea that wasn't immediately
Speaker 3: adopted until people figured out how they could make a
Speaker 3: buck off of it, that's right, and then followed by
Speaker 3: backlash against those well meaning aforementioned well meaning folks.
Speaker 1: It's Father's yes, plus their hearts. Indeed, Noel as as
Speaker 1: a father, I think you were telling me off air
Speaker 1: that you forgot about the holiday until until your family
Speaker 1: reminded you.
Speaker 2: Well, isn't that as it should be? Well?
Speaker 3: What am I going to be counting down the day
Speaker 3: as to Father's Day? Where is my whatever you get
Speaker 3: on Father's Day.
Speaker 2: In my card? I'm not petty, I'm petty in other ways.
Speaker 2: Ty would be good. I'm not a tie guy, though,
Speaker 2: maybe a money clip.
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe you could get into cravats.
Speaker 2: There you go. Isn't that the same thing as It's.
Speaker 1: Just like it's a fancier but somehow lazier.
Speaker 3: What's the short time? Ascott the Fred wears on Scooby Doo.
Speaker 3: Oh Ascott, Yeah, you could get it, Askedcott. That's definitely
Speaker 3: a choice. I gotta say, though, Father's Date.
Speaker 1: It's funny because, like a lot of people, I don't
Speaker 1: think we really explore the history. Most times you just remember, oh,
Speaker 1: that day's coming up, and you remember it like right before.
Speaker 2: At least I usually because Google changes their luck. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I was informed that I will be taken to a
Speaker 3: brunch on Sunday, the Father's Day. And I honestly they
Speaker 3: said it like as though I were supposed to know
Speaker 3: when that was going to be, and I had no
Speaker 3: idea because I needed to put it in my calendar
Speaker 3: to some degree. And I just they gave you the date,
Speaker 3: and there it is, and I'll show up.
Speaker 1: Oh good, your presence is the president. Yeah, so okay,
Speaker 1: as we as we learn with Mother's Day, you described
Speaker 1: that heartbreaking kind of commonality they have. Father's Day is
Speaker 1: kind of recent too, I guess, in the grand scheme
Speaker 1: of things, I thought for a long time I thought
Speaker 1: it was like an early eighteen hundred's Day.
Speaker 3: I don't think I had much of a concept for it.
Speaker 3: I just always lumped it in with kind of the
Speaker 3: greeting card holidays of the world, you know. Woodrow Wilson,
Speaker 3: as we mentioned in the Mother's Day episode, described Mother's
Speaker 3: Day or as a way to recognize that tender, gentle army,
Speaker 3: the mothers of America. And it turns out part of
Speaker 3: the backlash around making Father's Day a thing was that
Speaker 3: it was like two like it it was for girls.
Speaker 2: I will not be recognized by my family.
Speaker 3: I will be recognized by my labors and the flat
Speaker 3: of my brow.
Speaker 1: You shall have one firm handshake upon your eighteenth.
Speaker 3: Birthday, and then we will never speak again exactly.
Speaker 2: And yeah, it's weird.
Speaker 1: People said, well, this feels kind of effeminate because we
Speaker 1: have this association with Mother's Day.
Speaker 2: It came first, did come first? Did come first?
Speaker 1: And Father's Day then became an interesting concept that not
Speaker 1: everybody was on board with. We know that people were
Speaker 1: trying to make Father's Day a thing in the early
Speaker 1: nineteen hundreds, I think in West Virginia in nineteen oh eight. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were really trying to make fetch happen Father's Day. Fairmont,
Speaker 1: West Virginia, July fifth, nineteen oh eight. Grace Golden Clayton
Speaker 1: Love fabulous old timy name suggested to a local Methodist
Speaker 1: minister that services beheld to commemorate and celebrate the fathers
Speaker 1: who lost their lives in a deadly mind explosion. Hundreds
Speaker 1: of dudes. Three hundred and sixty one dudes. So this
Speaker 1: is this is a very well intentioned thing, as you said,
Speaker 1: but it's coming out.
Speaker 2: Of a tragedy.
Speaker 3: Could have made it just a memorial for the thing.
Speaker 3: You not necessarily have to lump in all fathers here.
Speaker 3: But again, but a little, a little weird, just just
Speaker 3: it feels like maybe that wasn't going to stick.
Speaker 2: And it sounds like.
Speaker 1: Different local communities had their own kind of Father's Day
Speaker 1: esque things for a while, just like in the case
Speaker 1: of Mother's Day, there was this unofficial push to make
Speaker 1: it a national holiday that occurred on the same day
Speaker 1: for everyone across the nation. And a guy that we
Speaker 1: are going to cover in an upcoming episode, William Jennings Bryant, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he was a huge Father's Day fan. He was saying,
Speaker 1: you know, if you think that's effeminate for kids to
Speaker 1: love their parents, then you got work to do.
Speaker 2: That's more of a you thing, that's not a nus thing.
Speaker 4: Also touched the silver. Also, I have to backtrack, guys,
Speaker 4: because we mentioned Woodrow Wilson and I didn't say anything.
Speaker 4: All right, Woodrow Wilson, go fuck yourself. Yeah, not a
Speaker 4: great guy, boyhood home. I've already mentioned all that stuff.
Speaker 4: Here's another president, though, with cool nickname that I was
Speaker 4: not aware of. We've got we've got Woodrow go fuck
Speaker 4: yourself Wilson, and then we've.
Speaker 2: Got Calvin Silent cal Coolidge. Did you ever hear that before?
Speaker 2: I haven't heard me.
Speaker 1: I haven't heard Silent Cal, which is really but I
Speaker 1: do know why he has the nickname. He's a famously
Speaker 1: uh yeah, task turn famously urst guy one time and
Speaker 1: Max you know this story too. Uh he was at
Speaker 1: Coolidge was at a party Silent Cal and someone said,
Speaker 1: I bet I could get three words out of you,
Speaker 1: and he looked at them and he kind of like,
Speaker 1: I guess what you call it in the drag community.
Speaker 1: He read them and then he went, you lose.
Speaker 4: So there's another story about him, and it's basically so
Speaker 4: he became president when Harding died in office.
Speaker 2: He was Harding's VP.
Speaker 4: It was like the last year Harding's first term and
Speaker 4: he just kind of got reelected because he was already
Speaker 4: on there. I yeah, this guy seems fine enough, but
Speaker 4: he didn't really have interest in actually being the president.
Speaker 4: So I think this story is pretty hypocryphal. But supposedly
Speaker 4: he like handed one of his aids and letter and
Speaker 4: gotten a boat and rowed out into the middle of
Speaker 4: a lake and the letters said I am not running
Speaker 4: for reelection.
Speaker 3: He just rode away and left hallelujah, Calvin wrote, rode
Speaker 3: the boat ashore. I was thinking though, the three words.
Speaker 3: Think he also could have said go fuck yourself. That
Speaker 3: would would be but then he would have lost because
Speaker 3: he would have said three words, but it would have
Speaker 3: been mean. Yeah, it would have been an own but
Speaker 3: also like a self owned kind of.
Speaker 2: He was like the yin to.
Speaker 1: Churchill's Yang of snarkiness who you know, come along later.
Speaker 1: But uh, silent col so, I don't want to derailist.
Speaker 1: That is a really cool nickname.
Speaker 3: Uh. He was a fan of Father's Day, right, Yeah,
Speaker 3: And that's what it takes to get these things to
Speaker 3: pick up steam.
Speaker 2: You gotta have some high powered uh supporters.
Speaker 3: And even though silent Cow didn't say a whole lot,
Speaker 3: maybe didn't really want to be president. He did seem
Speaker 3: to take the whole Father's Day as a national holiday
Speaker 3: concept and run with it, but not enough that it
Speaker 3: actually happens.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's weird because we know Wilson was on board,
Speaker 1: Coolidge was on board. But if you look at the
Speaker 1: origin story of Father's Day, you see that there are
Speaker 1: two stories of when the first legit Father's Day was celebrated.
Speaker 1: In some versions of the story, you'll hear about celebration
Speaker 1: of Washington State in June nineteenth, nineteen ten, a resident
Speaker 1: of Spokane with another great name, Sonora smart Nod.
Speaker 3: I'm going to be that, actually, guy Ben, If I
Speaker 3: were a Washingtonian, I would chastise you and say it's
Speaker 3: actually Spokane.
Speaker 2: Spokane. They will come at you for that. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I only found out because I did a podcast that
Speaker 3: was based in and around I remember that Spokane.
Speaker 2: I'm glad you said someone.
Speaker 4: I'm going to be in Spokane later this year.
Speaker 2: Well, now you can talk like a local.
Speaker 1: Thank you to the good Thank you, Nolan, thank you
Speaker 1: to the good people of Spokane. Indeed, so Sonora smart
Speaker 1: Dodd though that's a good name. Fabulous right She Okay,
Speaker 1: she was listening to a mother's day sermon at a church.
Speaker 1: It's nineteen oh nine, and she says, hang on a
Speaker 1: sick mothers are getting all this praise, and I'm not
Speaker 1: against mothers, but I think fathers should get their own
Speaker 1: day as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, equal time. It's like running for office
Speaker 3: right now. Sonora's father was a real man's man, WILLIAMS. Smart,
Speaker 3: Mister Smart, a Civil War veteran, a widower. His wife
Speaker 3: had passed during childbirth of their sixth child, as was
Speaker 3: much more common in those days. He raised six children
Speaker 3: by himself on their farm, on their homestead in Washington State.
Speaker 3: And you know, I think where you're seeing where we're
Speaker 3: going with this here, he's a great example of like, look,
Speaker 3: fathers can be mothers too, which might have added to
Speaker 3: the objections.
Speaker 2: That's a good point.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And she said, you know, my dad's awesome, and
Speaker 1: I want to show appreciation for all the hard work
Speaker 1: he did. It's incredibly it can be incredibly difficult being
Speaker 1: a single parent, especially to six children. So she says,
Speaker 1: I want to pay homage to him, but I also
Speaker 1: want to say it's for other dads in general, because
Speaker 1: I don't think I can make me liking my dad
Speaker 1: specifically a national holidays totally.
Speaker 3: They definitely could have made the mind explosion that killed
Speaker 3: four hundred you know men, at least a regional day
Speaker 3: of mourning, right, But a holiday is celebrating one dude,
Speaker 3: you know, who experienced personal tragedy.
Speaker 1: Not really how these things work. Yeah, it's tough, you know.
Speaker 1: She initially said, Okay, we're going to do it on
Speaker 1: June fifth, that's the anniversary of my father's death, and
Speaker 1: we'll celebrate Father's Day throughout all the land. But eventually,
Speaker 1: I think due to some some cross wires and planning
Speaker 1: or scheduling, you know, local government, is do I have
Speaker 1: this celebration? Got moved to the third Sunday in June.
Speaker 1: So it's one of those confusing ones. I don't understand them.
Speaker 3: One reason I'll never be able to tell you what day,
Speaker 3: you know, any of those types of holidays are on,
Speaker 3: because first of all, I'll never remember which Sunday in
Speaker 3: June we're talking about, right, and second is the third
Speaker 3: It's like I just don't remember things with numbers in
Speaker 3: them typically anyway.
Speaker 1: Like and thinks like Thanksgiving is probably one of the
Speaker 1: big examples of that in Easter two.
Speaker 2: But Thanksgiving.
Speaker 1: I'm always like, well, I just I guess I need
Speaker 1: to make sure I'm not doing anything for four Thursdays.
Speaker 2: Because it's one of those on a Thursday.
Speaker 3: I definitely if you look at my Google history, plenty
Speaker 3: of what day is Thanksgiving this year, you know, try
Speaker 3: to get that lockdown in advance.
Speaker 2: But yeah, it's true.
Speaker 3: There was some cross wires, you know, local government being
Speaker 3: what it is, third Sunday in June, as is often
Speaker 3: the case with regional celebrations, the clergy back debts, and
Speaker 3: that's also a part of what led it to kind
Speaker 3: of take off. And the very first official Father's Day
Speaker 3: was celebrated on June the nineteenth year of Our Lord,
Speaker 3: nineteen hundred and ten. That was the month of the
Speaker 3: birthday of Dodd's father. Close enough, close enough birth month.
Speaker 3: And like we said, silent cal is a fan of
Speaker 3: Father's Day in general. He supports this date. He supports
Speaker 3: this observance. And fast forward nineteen sixty six, President London,
Speaker 3: big Jumumbo, big Jumbo Johnson is Jumbo or Dumbo Jumbo
Speaker 3: is definitely we did think about it, Yes, he said, Okay,
Speaker 3: I'm issuing a presidential proclamation recognizing this as Father's Day.
Speaker 3: It becomes a national holiday. In nineteen seventy two, when
Speaker 3: President Richard Nixon tricky Dick and do great impressions of him,
Speaker 3: he signed legislation saying the third Sunday of June is
Speaker 3: gonna be Father's Day. That's according to the one story,
Speaker 3: go Dick, he's tricky, he did that one thing.
Speaker 2: That was kod. I guess I don't know.
Speaker 3: We're not really taking a stance on Father's Day here,
Speaker 3: by the way, that is not for us to decide.
Speaker 2: No, No, that's that's that's for the.
Speaker 3: Father's I would just say in general, holidays of this
Speaker 3: ILK are are odd.
Speaker 1: They're often I mean reformative. The creator of Mother's Day
Speaker 1: was right. They become commodifications, they become cash grabs, you know.
Speaker 1: But but the heart of it, again, it's a cool idea.
Speaker 1: It's it's nice and as cool as Sonora's smart DoD
Speaker 1: wasn't is she wasn't the first person to have this idea, right,
Speaker 1: or wasn't the only person.
Speaker 3: No, again, it's it's I'm not trying to again, not
Speaker 3: trying to be a jerk. Here a poopoo anybody's idea,
Speaker 3: But this isn't exactly the most creative, you know, unique
Speaker 3: singular idea to ever be funk. It's just like, hey,
Speaker 3: what if we had a day that celebrated father Yeah,
Speaker 3: you call it Father's Day?
Speaker 1: You a slot in anything, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So it's really all just about like who had
Speaker 3: the gumption to really get it together and push for it.
Speaker 3: That's really more what the story is rather than who
Speaker 3: came up with the idea, because it's just as a father,
Speaker 3: not particularly creative. So yes, to your point, of course,
Speaker 3: there are several origin stories to Father's Day. We talked
Speaker 3: about the Fairmont Father's Day celebration. We have three years
Speaker 3: after the Fairmont event, a Chicago activist SJW by the
Speaker 3: name of Jane Adams two D's requested of the local
Speaker 3: legislature a city wide celebration or the very least recognition
Speaker 3: of Father's Day.
Speaker 2: But she was denied.
Speaker 1: Dang, Chicago shut her down. Let's see, that's early nineteen hundred,
Speaker 1: so she probably couldn't pay off the bribes.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's like, well, yeah, I mean it's not,
Speaker 3: is it, Tammany. No, that's a little earlier. It's Chicago
Speaker 3: has been a hive of scum and villainy politically for
Speaker 3: a long time. So maybe that she just didn't grease
Speaker 3: the right palms or pay the veig. Yeah, that's a
Speaker 3: I don't think that's a hot take of fortunately either.
Speaker 3: We do know other people tried to create their own
Speaker 3: versions of Father's Day. We'll get to I'll tell you,
Speaker 3: we'll get to my personal favorite in a little bit.
Speaker 3: But we also need to shout out Vancouver, Washington resident
Speaker 3: JJ Behringer, who read something in a local newspaper and said,
Speaker 3: all right, we're going to hold a Father's Day celebration
Speaker 3: at my church, Irving Methodists, and we'll call it the
Speaker 3: first Father's Day event. Not because he was a jerk,
Speaker 3: it's because he did not know other people that had
Speaker 3: this idea before he got to wonder too the religious
Speaker 3: angle here with like some of these Methodist ministers sort
Speaker 3: of spearheading this. You know, there's of course the Holy Trinity,
Speaker 3: Father Will signed the Holy Ghosts and is a very
Speaker 3: patriarchal kind of a canon.
Speaker 2: Let's say.
Speaker 3: You gotta wonder if that was part of why they
Speaker 3: were like pushing for this. Yeah, Father's Day, it's got
Speaker 3: a nice ring to it when did it become the
Speaker 3: Holy Spirit instead of the holy good question. I'm sure
Speaker 3: we could could ask doctor Internet that and it would
Speaker 3: spit it right back.
Speaker 2: Out our chat cheapt Maybe it would make something up.
Speaker 3: That's been my latest interest in the whole chatbot thing
Speaker 3: is it's just we talked about it on stuff that
Speaker 3: I want you to do it. The idea of of
Speaker 3: chatbots hallucinating things out of whole cloth.
Speaker 2: I love it.
Speaker 1: Of making up entire entirely fraudulent court cases.
Speaker 3: Event yeah, exactly, and not not after being asked to
Speaker 3: invent something or tell me a story. Like people are
Speaker 3: using these of this tool to legitimately cheat at homework
Speaker 3: or like you know, writing legal briefs, and it is
Speaker 3: biting them in the butt because apparently old chatty as
Speaker 3: you call them sometimes, is improvising.
Speaker 1: Let's ask chat GPT to make holidays for us and
Speaker 1: report back on it.
Speaker 2: That'd be fun.
Speaker 1: That'd be fun. Let's okay, here's the favorite one though.
Speaker 1: Here's a favorite one, and I think you love this
Speaker 1: one too. Because people couldn't communicate as easily as as
Speaker 1: our research associate Jeff points out, they ran into problems
Speaker 1: figuring out who was first to the postal Father's Day. Yeah. Right,
Speaker 1: So in nineteen fifteen, this guy, uh, the ironically named
Speaker 1: Harry C. Meek says, I am the inventer of Father's Day.
Speaker 1: I'm making it up. It should be on my birthday.
Speaker 2: Cool. Yeah, neither neither Meek nor mild in the eyes
Speaker 2: of the of the Father. Just the hutspah of it.
Speaker 3: On my birthday. I mean, surely it wasn't a self
Speaker 3: aggrandizing request. He just figured, you know, everybody's got that
Speaker 3: same birthday, right, Like, you know, it's just he.
Speaker 1: Pushed the Lions Club to acknowledge that he started Father's Day.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he spent and this was not just like a
Speaker 3: one day, you know, like wild hair that he got,
Speaker 3: Like he made this like a pursuit. You know, he
Speaker 3: pushed this line for quite a few years. And again
Speaker 3: that's what it takes. People that insist upon themselves, people
Speaker 3: that just won't let things go. Those are the people
Speaker 3: that history remembers the most pedantic ones among.
Speaker 1: Us usually, yeah, quite often, you know, the people who
Speaker 1: raised enough of a fuss. And as you said, there
Speaker 1: was this backlash against Father's Day, and part of it,
Speaker 1: this is a really interesting thing brought up in Almanac
Speaker 1: dot com. So when you give a shout out to
Speaker 1: Arelio C. Scott, who wrote this article, she points out,
Speaker 1: know all that the idea of fatherhood fundamentally change. It's
Speaker 1: not viewed as a like a feminine model with flowers,
Speaker 1: but it's a day that celebrates this idea of dadness.
Speaker 1: And a lot of my friends who are fathers, yourself included,
Speaker 1: will say, well, my kids are being very sweet and
Speaker 1: I love them, but how many socks do they think
Speaker 1: I need?
Speaker 3: Hi borderline resent being taken to brunch. That's a woman's meal.
Speaker 3: I'm just joking. I am very much joking a brunch,
Speaker 3: A big fan of brunch. But no, it's funny, right
Speaker 3: because the fact that even has to be explained, or
Speaker 3: it's it's it's inherently absurd, right, It's like, it doesn't
Speaker 3: have to be. It's it's not the same, and and
Speaker 3: and it's about the person. What if your dad likes flowers, right,
Speaker 3: give the man flowers, Give the man.
Speaker 2: What do you want? If your dad wants a spa day,
Speaker 2: send him to a spa.
Speaker 3: I will be the first one to admit I get
Speaker 3: pretty regular pedicures and I love a good massage or
Speaker 3: a spa day.
Speaker 2: No, and it's it's very true.
Speaker 3: But this idea of this feminine model, you know, this
Speaker 3: this precursor you know in Mother's Day being problematic for
Speaker 3: like or somehow challenging the masculinity of you know, fathers
Speaker 3: is absurd to me. But you know, we got to
Speaker 3: think about the time, right.
Speaker 1: Sure, Yeah, And I guess there were more of what
Speaker 1: we're often called traditional gender roles, right there were. There
Speaker 1: weren't as many women in the workplace. The modern role
Speaker 1: of the father, you could argue, as does Aureliacy Scott,
Speaker 1: has changed more of a partnership, which I think is
Speaker 1: probably healthier for everybody. Sure, right now we're co parenting,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Now it's not just some
Speaker 1: guy working nine to five or whatever coming home and saying,
Speaker 1: where's dinner? Why does this kid have a seat? This
Speaker 1: thing is dirty, I'm getting drunk and going to sleep.
Speaker 3: So I think what we're saying, what this article is saying,
Speaker 3: is that it evolved in a positive direction, yes, to
Speaker 3: to look at mothers and fathers on more of an
Speaker 3: equal playing field. So what I was railing against was
Speaker 3: sort of the initial backlash of like, how dare you
Speaker 3: celebrate me, you know, in the same way as you
Speaker 3: would have a mere woman.
Speaker 1: And that's that's so vawd. That's part of it because
Speaker 1: we know people. Okay, I'm a little torn about this.
Speaker 1: So the initial people objecting to Father's Day, we're doing
Speaker 1: exactly what we're talking about. They said, this is a
Speaker 1: sentimental attempt to emasculate us almost with flowers and with giving.
Speaker 3: Of gifts, which is crazy Mechagin, gifts are awesome inherently
Speaker 3: I love free stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's great, and it's also thoughtful gifts. That's that's
Speaker 2: the key, right.
Speaker 3: I Really I'm against kind of like holidays that require
Speaker 3: some sort of like pat you know, the expected gifts
Speaker 3: like flowers, you know, I mean, you know, flowers are cool,
Speaker 3: and if you want to get somebody flowers, get them
Speaker 3: something based on like a color you know they love,
Speaker 3: or like a particular flower you know that makes them happy.
Speaker 3: Don't just grab the nearest bouquet and shove it in
Speaker 3: their face. I would typically. I mean, I just think
Speaker 3: gift giving is such an opportunity to show somebody that
Speaker 3: you think about them and that you're aware of aspects
Speaker 3: of their personality.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and also, I don't think you should have to
Speaker 1: tie it to a holiday. No. I think the coolest
Speaker 1: gifts are, you know, in the for no reason at all,
Speaker 1: not because you're in trouble, not because someone decided it
Speaker 1: should be an official day for something. Do something nice
Speaker 1: for people you love.
Speaker 3: I get my kid and my partner and friends' gifts
Speaker 3: all the time, you know, just because, And honestly, for
Speaker 3: holidays and stuff. I'm typically the guy that's stopping at
Speaker 3: the grocery store on the way home to grab something
Speaker 3: because I'm fulfilling that expectation, and I frankly kind of
Speaker 3: resent that.
Speaker 1: Then here's the valid here's the valid part of the
Speaker 1: argument for people who had a backlash against Father's Day
Speaker 1: that I think we both can agree with. They said,
Speaker 1: we know about Mother's Day, it's a grift, and Father's
Speaker 1: Days no different. These holidays are proliferating and they're all
Speaker 1: just a gimmick to sell more stuff. And hey, we
Speaker 1: the fathers are also paying for the Father's Days as
Speaker 1: the sole breadwinners of our family.
Speaker 2: Am I paying for flowers for myself?
Speaker 1: They said, Uh, so, I get the I get the
Speaker 1: anti capitalist part about it, The anti commodification. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I think maybe people were a little insecure or a
Speaker 1: little caught in their preconceptions about masculinity.
Speaker 2: They were in their feelings.
Speaker 3: They were in their feelings a little bit. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: but not in like a touchy feely.
Speaker 2: Kind of way.
Speaker 3: No, No, in a very emotionally damaged way. And I
Speaker 3: didn't kind of think I caught this in the Mother's
Speaker 3: Day episode. But this idea, I mean maybe maybe it
Speaker 3: came up briefly specifically for Mother's Day, But in the
Speaker 3: nineteen twenties and thirties, there was actually a movement to
Speaker 3: get rid of both of these holidays entirely in favor
Speaker 3: of combining them into a into one Parents' Day.
Speaker 2: How that go that take off? I only I've heard
Speaker 2: of Parents Day.
Speaker 1: It's around in other countries. Maybe, yeah, you know, parents
Speaker 1: are generally a good thing, So you're right, though it
Speaker 1: did not encounter near the success of Father's Day, let
Speaker 1: alone Mother's Day. It's strange to me that for a
Speaker 1: while during that time period, during the twenties and thirties,
Speaker 1: every year the Mother's Day occurred, these groups would protest it.
Speaker 1: They would be pro Parents' Day groups, and they would
Speaker 1: go to Central Park because they liked having problems, I.
Speaker 2: Guess seems so.
Speaker 3: I mean, the idea of there being a Parents Day activist,
Speaker 3: this guy Robert Spear who said that both parents should
Speaker 3: be loved and respected together, like at the same time,
Speaker 3: I don't know about it. You know, it's I guess
Speaker 3: that's sort of like a killing two birds with one
Speaker 3: stone situation, you know, one holiday to rule them all.
Speaker 4: But it feels like this guy just want to be
Speaker 4: mad about something.
Speaker 2: It's a little bit of what about.
Speaker 3: As I completely agree and as we know that did
Speaker 3: not take off, you know, because what about you know,
Speaker 3: parents who are divorced. Yeah, maybe it's a good thing
Speaker 3: that you can honor them separately.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: I think maybe if there is a debate or a
Speaker 3: question around it, is it is the gendered aspect of it.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Maybe, But how who cares? Here's what happened the Great Depression.
Speaker 1: That's one of the reasons Father's Day is still a
Speaker 1: big thing, because think about it, you're a business, you're
Speaker 1: an ad company, and you have to somehow get out
Speaker 1: of the red and into the black ink. So they
Speaker 1: double down to try to make Father's Day what they
Speaker 1: thought of as a second Christmas for dudes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because you know, all these cliche ideas of gifts
Speaker 3: are supposed to get your dad. Those hold true for
Speaker 3: any gift giving opportunity. You know, socks in these days, pipes,
Speaker 3: you know, like slippers, ties, ties, but then nobody really
Speaker 3: even wants and that if you're gonna get it, you're
Speaker 3: gonna get one for yourself because these are like things
Speaker 3: that require you to have a little bit of awareness of,
Speaker 3: like your own personal style. The joke around these gifts
Speaker 3: is often people are giving you these things and you
Speaker 3: will never wear them, right.
Speaker 1: Right, Like, thank you for this shar truce and green
Speaker 1: polka dotted ascot. I'll treasure it forever.
Speaker 4: That sounds really nice, just being frank right here. I
Speaker 4: really like if you guys got that for me, I
Speaker 4: would appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Oh god, now we have to remember what I described. Okay,
Speaker 1: shartruse and green polka dot.
Speaker 4: I mean, Ben, It's not like we have a like,
Speaker 4: you know, recorded version of you saying it or anything.
Speaker 1: Oh that's right, never mind, why are we even bothering
Speaker 1: with long term memory?
Speaker 2: So yeah, who needs it? Yeah? Who needs it? Soon
Speaker 2: we'll have implants that'll do it all for us.
Speaker 4: Or we can just ask chat GPTMM, pair it.
Speaker 3: With a nice voice mimicking software, and you know we're
Speaker 3: we're relevant at that point.
Speaker 2: Oh come on, maybe not irrelevant.
Speaker 3: We still have to like talk at the bot to
Speaker 3: train it to sound more like us.
Speaker 1: Oh boy, yeah, I mean, you know you're talking about
Speaker 1: aims transforming over time, and that's what I happened over Father's.
Speaker 2: Day saying no attention to the man behind the.
Speaker 1: What do you think before we get to the end
Speaker 1: of Father's Day? I think we'll still be around.
Speaker 2: I doing some gallows humor here. I do think we'll
Speaker 2: be right.
Speaker 3: I mean me personally as a consumer of podcasts, and
Speaker 3: it's of culture. Like if I found out that someone
Speaker 3: had replaced my you know, Folger's crystals with Taster's choice
Speaker 3: and didn't tell me, I'd be pretty pissed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I would also be really suspect I'd be
Speaker 1: I'd also be sad if I was listening to a
Speaker 1: show that I was a fan of and I learned
Speaker 1: that with like the darkest version of that is, a
Speaker 1: legendary host passes away and then AI is used to
Speaker 1: just keep making episodes of them after death.
Speaker 2: People are kind of losing their their stuff over the
Speaker 2: headline saying that Paul McCartney is it was it was
Speaker 2: a date through his support by AI technology being used
Speaker 2: to create a quote unquote final Beatles. So what if
Speaker 2: you read below the headline, you really They actually just
Speaker 2: used AI as a restoration tool to lift out a
Speaker 2: vocal that John Lennon made as a demo while playing
Speaker 2: the piano and singing on like a pretty low fire
Speaker 2: recording setup. So they cleaned it up, separated it from
Speaker 2: the piano, and allowed it to be used in a
Speaker 2: multi track recording capacity. Is the song going to be
Speaker 2: any good?
Speaker 3: I don't know, irrelevant, but they didn't like do a
Speaker 3: Tupac hologram version John Ryan's voice, And I frankly think
Speaker 3: most people who are actual fans of art and culture
Speaker 3: won't stand for that. You know, I would like to
Speaker 3: think that, I would like to I would like to
Speaker 3: think that as well. And you know I mean full disclosure, folks. Yes,
Speaker 3: this episode is entirely created and hosted by chat Chipet.
Speaker 2: Yep, where were we gonna go with that?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 2: Well, segue did a segue? Okay?
Speaker 1: So things changing Father's Day got tainted. People would say,
Speaker 1: you know it, it became a money grab.
Speaker 3: I think you set it up perfectly, this idea of
Speaker 3: it being a second Christmas, you know, to buy a
Speaker 3: lot of these, like frankly, you know, sharper image type objects,
Speaker 3: you know, for dads that they probably don't even want,
Speaker 3: and it's just obligatory kind of gift giving and that
Speaker 3: suits the companies more than it does the dads, frankly.
Speaker 3: And then once that becomes really really clear, it does
Speaker 3: start to have a bit of a taint to it,
Speaker 3: doesn't the Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1: Just just send your dad a text and say something
Speaker 1: that you think is cool about him, and make sure
Speaker 1: it's sincere. Don't You don't have to wait for a
Speaker 1: specific day to do that, you know. And of course,
Speaker 1: like all of these holidays, like we learn with Mother's Day,
Speaker 1: Father's Day is not just celebrated in the US, and
Speaker 1: it's not just celebrated at the same time. People all
Speaker 1: around the world celebrate something like Father's Day at different
Speaker 1: periods in the year. Have you heard of this practice
Speaker 1: of wearing a red rose if your father's alive and
Speaker 1: a white one if he's dead. Not that seems frankly, invasive,
Speaker 1: it does.
Speaker 3: I mean, cool, let's have a conversation about our dead
Speaker 3: dads as I was, I supposed to ask.
Speaker 2: Me about my dead dad's you know what that would say?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I don't think they thought that one threw
Speaker 1: all the way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was just not aware of this as a custom.
Speaker 3: But what about you know, maybe non traditional male role
Speaker 3: models or or you know, frankly father figures, you know, like,
Speaker 3: you know, my dear dear friend Harry, he's actually coming
Speaker 3: to visit over Father's Day weekend. It occurred to me
Speaker 3: like he's the closest thing I have to a father,
Speaker 3: and I'm gonna he's going to the same brunch that
Speaker 3: I'm going to. And it was just kind of a
Speaker 3: happenstance that occurred that way. But I'm kind of glad
Speaker 3: that it did, because I do think of him in
Speaker 3: that same way.
Speaker 2: Are you going to get him a card? Hell? No?
Speaker 2: Are you going to get him a tie? No, he
Speaker 2: doesn't aware a tie. I'll get him a hair tie.
Speaker 2: What's the situation? Unclear?
Speaker 3: But I am going to take him to brunch and
Speaker 3: then host him my house and cook him a barbecue
Speaker 3: and spend some good time with him. Because he's a
Speaker 3: true friend and someone that I've always looked up to
Speaker 3: in that way, you know, without an actual living father.
Speaker 3: So that's that's an interesting role too, is like what
Speaker 3: about the uncles, the uncles, the grandfathers, the families of
Speaker 3: the world, you know, Yeah, they.
Speaker 1: Also get honored on that day sometimes because you know you,
Speaker 1: as you go through life, you do run into people
Speaker 1: who fulfill some of those roles.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: You may not be able to speak with your biological mother,
Speaker 1: you may not be on the best terms with her,
Speaker 1: but you might have a mother figure in your life.
Speaker 1: And the same goes with parents, with siblings, with all
Speaker 1: all the loved ones you can imagine, so they should
Speaker 1: be celebrated as well. And I think that's I think
Speaker 1: that's kind of cool. I think that's inclusive. I do
Speaker 1: think it's interesting that there's a Father's Day thing tied
Speaker 1: to Roman Catholicism.
Speaker 3: Yeah, celebrated in countries like Spain and Portugal, observed on
Speaker 3: the feast of Saint Joseph. It's the central if the
Speaker 3: patron saint of fathers, manly men.
Speaker 1: We cut some off air time where we decided to
Speaker 1: look up the Saint Saint Joseph why why is that
Speaker 1: Father's Day? Saint Joseph the Worker is patron saint of
Speaker 1: a couple of different things. They always are, right, Let's
Speaker 1: see the patron saint of fathers nailed it?
Speaker 2: Got it?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 2: He is also vibes you said, the worker? You know
Speaker 2: he is also a work patron state of workers.
Speaker 1: Anybody who's married, anybody who's been exiled.
Speaker 2: Wait a minute, what's that? Last? Yeah?
Speaker 1: All right, last one was a was a shyamalan for us? Uh,
Speaker 1: the sick and the dying and patron saint of a
Speaker 1: holy death? Wait?
Speaker 2: What's holy death? You know that a spell? And like
Speaker 2: elden ring? That really does sound like is.
Speaker 4: That like dying with honor? If you're a cleon, I'm.
Speaker 1: You know, you guys are onto some great things here.
Speaker 1: We'll have to learn more about it. I am not Catholic,
Speaker 1: I'm not a Christian, nor I don't know what to
Speaker 1: say about it.
Speaker 3: I do know what to say about the Taiwanese celebration
Speaker 3: of Father's Day. Much like our pal who wanted it
Speaker 3: to be on his birthday, this celebration is in fact
Speaker 3: on my actual birthday, August the eighth, fifth day of
Speaker 3: the eighth month, which is a fun, you know, little
Speaker 3: little thing with.
Speaker 2: My birthday's eight, eight eighty three. Fun to stay out loud.
Speaker 3: But yeah, immediately saw this and thought of that guy
Speaker 3: that like wanted to have Father's Day beyond his birthday.
Speaker 2: I'm like, we are not the same.
Speaker 3: It's not my idea, but like the cut of whom's
Speaker 3: ever jib in Taiwan decided to hold it on that day. Well,
Speaker 3: actually sounds like it was because the Mandarin Chinese word
Speaker 3: for eight sounds like the word papa. Well, do you know,
Speaker 3: you know, I know, you know a bit of Mandarin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I know, I know a little bit.
Speaker 3: It's bash. Thanks Jatgypt, You're the best bah. And so
Speaker 3: the eighth day, eighth month.
Speaker 2: Got it? You said twice it becomes papa.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, And uh look here we have to
Speaker 1: do it, noel Uh. It's our first time in uh
Speaker 1: in the new studio. The Man, the myth, the legend, himself,
Speaker 1: our resident rock star, Matt Frederick wearing he's wearing his
Speaker 1: sunglasses inside. He's got a fresh haircut. Hey, Matt fresh, Matt,
Speaker 1: you got something to say to the people.
Speaker 2: Can even hear us high over? He's so cool? He's
Speaker 2: so cool. Listen to that. Yeah, the swagger, the swagger
Speaker 2: in that voice. We have to figure out a way
Speaker 2: to get Matt back.
Speaker 3: Well, obviously he's here. It's easier to accomplish. We can
Speaker 3: just you know, invite him in.
Speaker 2: But yeah, do you want to come in?
Speaker 3: Come in for the second episode. We're about to do
Speaker 3: another one. He's like, no, I've got a battle.
Speaker 2: I got He's gonna surf.
Speaker 1: He's got a skate. I think he surf on a phone. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: that guy is too cool for school. Really, And like Taiwan,
Speaker 1: Thailand has their own Father's Day and Thailand is tied
Speaker 1: to the birthday of a former king whose name I'm
Speaker 1: going to attempt and mess up. It's cool, let's both
Speaker 1: try it. So boom.
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't boom ball sound like a Mario character, like,
Speaker 3: you know, like the giant bomb guy with the crown
Speaker 3: I forget his or it feels.
Speaker 1: Like the big sport in like a children's sci fi
Speaker 1: show We got to play?
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, dude. I discovered a new sports when I
Speaker 3: was in Philly. There were these like weird curved tables
Speaker 3: with a it's just like a ping pong table. But
Speaker 3: they're curved and apparently you kick a ball on it
Speaker 3: and bounce it. It's like ping pong or pickleball, but you
Speaker 3: play it with your feet. And apparently it is from
Speaker 3: from Spain or that's cool. And I've never seen these
Speaker 3: tables anywhere. They look kind of like in your skate rams.
Speaker 3: So anybody out there that knows what the hell this
Speaker 3: thing is, let let us know.
Speaker 1: And anyone who can help us with pronunciation of names
Speaker 1: the tyroyal family, let us know, because I have to
Speaker 1: learn that stuff.
Speaker 2: I have to go.
Speaker 1: I don't think I told you I'm going to I
Speaker 1: have to. I have to go to Thailand, have to
Speaker 1: go to Tylober.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry. That's rough. That's awesome, that's really exciting.
Speaker 3: Godspeed, and yeah, just you know, surely there's a chat
Speaker 3: GPT out that.
Speaker 1: I could just uh, I could have like a little
Speaker 1: thing around my neck.
Speaker 2: It's just chat gpt.
Speaker 1: Instead of like a slate with some chalk, you know, right,
Speaker 1: But that day entirely, the December fifth day is always
Speaker 1: Father's Day, and.
Speaker 2: I like that December fifth. Leave it at that.
Speaker 1: It doesn't have even that third or fourth thing, you know.
Speaker 1: That's that's too complicated.
Speaker 3: Same with the Taiwanese deal. A boom remembered it easy.
Speaker 3: Is also my birthday eighty eight also is good luck?
Speaker 3: Hey cool, no wonder I've been coasting through life. I
Speaker 3: think these many years four as bad. Okay, I said
Speaker 3: it's visible by four. I know, but it's double Oh,
Speaker 3: it's double four. So it's good.
Speaker 2: You know. We might have to come back to their south,
Speaker 2: we might have to workshop. We might want to leave
Speaker 2: this one alone. We don't want to uncover any Pandora's
Speaker 2: box type situ.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but we do want to wish everybody a halfy
Speaker 1: belated Father's Day, A happy Father's Day to you know,
Speaker 1: a happy Father's Day to your entire family.
Speaker 2: Max, Max, your cat dad. I think you've described yourself as.
Speaker 4: I am a cat dad. And also sometimes I feel
Speaker 4: like I'm y'all's parent, y'all, like I'm more of a
Speaker 4: parent's day than a Father's Day to y'all. But I
Speaker 4: get that feeling a lot of times, especially when it's like,
Speaker 4: you know, trying to find Noel and getting into the
Speaker 4: right studio.
Speaker 3: Somebody are always smacking me in the back of the
Speaker 3: head and calling me a giant disappointment.
Speaker 4: Yes, n let's hr is listening to this episode and.
Speaker 2: Don't listen our show. Also, I'm older than you.
Speaker 4: Bro, you both are older than me, but I'm still
Speaker 4: your father, all right, you're.
Speaker 2: You know what?
Speaker 1: Big thanks to super producer Max Williams, Yeah aka Dad, Big, Big,
Speaker 1: thanks to uh Big, Thanks to Alex Williams, who composed
Speaker 1: the track. Big thanks to pal Matt who just uh
Speaker 1: just has such infectious energy.
Speaker 2: He does he does.
Speaker 3: He is a walking plague of a human in the
Speaker 3: positive sense, positive play, positivity play. Thanks to uh Chris
Speaker 3: frosciontas here in spirit he's Jeff Coates, Jonathan Strickland. I
Speaker 3: bet you we can get him here in person too. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you can press to digitate him from one of these
Speaker 3: nice you know and deployment of that word.
Speaker 2: Into one of these mic positions. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Also, I owe him an email, so that'll be good time.
Speaker 2: Don't sleep on that, man, I gotta stop. I gotta
Speaker 2: wake up.
Speaker 1: I can't keep sleeping on responding to those emails, and
Speaker 1: we can't keep sleeping on this new studio. No, this
Speaker 1: has been such a fun time. I feel like we
Speaker 1: portrayed ourselves a little because we're both all three of us.
Speaker 2: Max to came in and saying, all right, this is
Speaker 2: gonna be short.
Speaker 1: When you know what I mean. We got and we got,
Speaker 1: we condensed our research. We're gonna make it a punchy
Speaker 1: thing about Father's Day and still punchy.
Speaker 3: Uh not in the like lack of sleepway, but like
Speaker 3: in the listen to these punchy characters have a good
Speaker 3: time talking about stuff.
Speaker 2: And so we liked that and I'm excited.
Speaker 3: It sort of feels like we're opening a new chapter
Speaker 3: of the show being here in person with each other and.
Speaker 2: Out with you. We'll see you next time.
Speaker 1: FOS.
Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.