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Speaker 1: I certainly found that when you're less judgmental of people,

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Speaker 1: you make the world a better place, You make yourself

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Speaker 1: feel better, you see things differently, and I like that.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to off the cup, my personal anti anxiety antidote.

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Speaker 3: Remember when X was Twitter and it was good.

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Speaker 2: Remember when you could have interesting and thoughtful conversations with

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Speaker 2: someone on Twitter. It's such a cessful now, and not

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Speaker 2: just because Elon Musk has run it to the ground,

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Speaker 2: but even before he came along, it was getting corrupted

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Speaker 2: and co opted by bots and trolls and conspiracy theorists

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Speaker 2: and loans.

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Speaker 3: I don't even like going on it now, honestly.

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Speaker 2: But one of my favorite things about Twitter that I

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Speaker 2: really really miss is that there used to be a

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Speaker 2: way to make like unexpected friendships. I quote unquote met

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Speaker 2: so many cool people just engaging on Twitter. I met

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Speaker 2: Richard Marx on Twitter. Eventually we met and hung out.

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Speaker 2: I met a bunch of actors and athletes and authors.

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Speaker 2: I got to tweet with my namesake S. E. Hinton once,

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Speaker 2: and I even became really good friends in real life

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Speaker 2: with people that I first talked to on Twitter.

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Speaker 3: One of the more delightful.

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Speaker 2: And unexpected interactions I had was with Paul Stanley of

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Speaker 2: Kiss years ago. I remember getting into a back and

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Speaker 2: forth with him where we were naming musicals for some reason,

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Speaker 2: and then one day a signed copy of his book

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Speaker 2: Faced the Music arrived at my house. He is such

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Speaker 2: a lovely person. He's so smart and thoughtful and kind

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Speaker 2: and just down to earth. Paul Stanley, Welcome to Off

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Speaker 2: the Cup.

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Speaker 1: I could say all the same about you. You're somebody

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Speaker 1: who I gravitated towards when Twitter was Twitter, and I

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Speaker 1: was so happy that I did it.

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Speaker 3: Well, how did we find each other on Twitter? Do

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Speaker 3: you remember? And do you remember what we were doing

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Speaker 3: with musicals?

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Speaker 1: You know, I think it was something humorous, but I

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Speaker 1: don't remember.

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Speaker 3: We were like spoofing musicals.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, we were coming up with satires.

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Speaker 3: Yes, Oh it was so fun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think things like glenng Gary, Glenn Close.

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Speaker 2: You know, yes, yes, this is exactly what we were doing.

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Speaker 2: We were renaming musicals for something.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Nicholas Nickelback, they're coming back to me.

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Speaker 2: That's yeah, Well we're going to get into musicals because

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Speaker 2: you have a great you have a musical story. And

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Speaker 2: then I remember I did Joe Bonamaso's podcast, and you

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Speaker 2: had done it too right.

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Speaker 3: Yes, he's great.

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Speaker 2: And I really liked talking to him, and he and

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Speaker 2: I talked about you as well. But you know, most

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Speaker 2: people obviously know you as the star child of Kiss,

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Speaker 2: and I want to talk about that, but I really

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Speaker 2: want to talk about out Paul Stanley or Stanley Eisen,

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Speaker 2: the little boy from Manhattan.

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Speaker 3: Tell me what was the city like when you were

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Speaker 3: a kid.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it was because a lack of the Internet and

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Speaker 1: a lack of social media, it seemed safer. I do

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Speaker 1: remember growing up the first six years on two hundred

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Speaker 1: and eleven Street and Broadway, which is inwood and we

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Speaker 1: were basically the only Jews on the block. I mean

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Speaker 1: it was there. There was an enclave of immigrants on

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Speaker 1: Dykman Street, but where we were, it was we were

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Speaker 1: pretty much singular in terms of being Jews. And yet

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Speaker 1: I remember really feeling safe up there. Halloween, I would

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Speaker 1: go trigger treating in apartment buildings three four blocks away,

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Speaker 1: go knocking on doors. Now, either we were lucky and

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Speaker 1: didn't have something horrible happened, or it was just a

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Speaker 1: different like a different world back then. I lived next

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Speaker 1: to the school that I went to the public school

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Speaker 1: and not a happy camper. I wasn't a happy kid.

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Speaker 1: I was deaf on one side, I had a ear deformity.

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Speaker 1: And my parents, like many parents, but maybe more so,

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Speaker 1: we're struggling with their own baggage. You know. I was

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Speaker 1: just explaining to one of my kids a couple of

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Speaker 1: days ago, how we're really products of our parents and

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Speaker 1: what they've been through, and then our choice is either

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Speaker 1: to replicate it and follow it or you know, set

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Speaker 1: out on our own.

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Speaker 3: It's so true.

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Speaker 2: And I'm in therapy now and learning that, you know,

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Speaker 2: some of my past trauma was really just handed down,

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Speaker 2: obviously not intentionally, and that me doing the work now

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Speaker 2: is in hopes of preventing, you know, handing my trauma

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Speaker 2: down to my kids. But I want, I want to

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Speaker 2: get closer to that a little bit, because you write

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Speaker 2: in you write in the prologue of Face the Music,

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Speaker 2: which I have right here.

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Speaker 3: The most searing early.

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Speaker 2: Memories I have are of other kids calling me Stanley,

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Speaker 2: the one eyed monster.

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Speaker 3: It was our one eared monster.

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Speaker 2: Maybe it was often kids I didn't even know, but

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Speaker 2: they knew me, the kid with a stump for an ear.

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Speaker 2: When I was out among people, I felt naked. I

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Speaker 2: was painfully aware of being constantly scrutinized, and when I

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Speaker 2: came home, my family was too dysfunctional to provide any

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Speaker 2: kind of support. What what was dysfunctional about your family?

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Speaker 1: Well, first, you know, I don't want to come across

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Speaker 1: as a victim. That's the worst thing we can do,

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Speaker 1: is because when we see ourselves as victims, the only

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Speaker 1: life that gets compromised is our own right. So once again,

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Speaker 1: and it's up to us to you know, pick ourselves up,

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Speaker 1: roll up our sleeves, and get to work and make

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Speaker 1: our lives what we'd like it to be. It's kind

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Speaker 1: of like a toothache, you know, if you have decay,

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Speaker 1: you can either live with it. If you're willing to

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Speaker 1: put up with a little bit of pain, you can

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Speaker 1: dig it out and then life is that much better.

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Speaker 1: To me, that's what therapy is all about. But back

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Speaker 1: to you know, growing up, and you know, it was

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Speaker 1: difficult also, like I said, because my parents had their

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Speaker 1: own issues. My mom one night in Berlin, she's from Berlin,

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Speaker 1: and one night they got a call that the next

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Speaker 1: day they were going to be arrested, and they fled

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Speaker 1: during the night, left everything behind, went to the train

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Speaker 1: station and went to Amsterdam, and from there they fled

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Speaker 1: once again. So my mom had a very very life

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Speaker 1: that was fraught with upheaval and fear, and she took

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Speaker 1: that with her. I don't think there's anyone who gets

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Speaker 1: away from that. That's her core, that was her foundation.

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Speaker 1: My dad had issues to My dad graduated high school

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Speaker 1: at sixteen and was just a very, very bright and

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Speaker 1: intuitive person. I remember about sixty years ago, more than sixty,

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Speaker 1: he came home one day and said, this is the future,

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Speaker 1: and he had evy on bottles and I looked at

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Speaker 1: him and went, Dad, nobody's going to pay for water.

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Speaker 1: So he had one up on me. So my dad

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Speaker 1: never really attained what he could have. His parents were

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Speaker 1: seemed really good at keeping guilt on him, and he

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Speaker 1: didn't go on to college and instead worked to make

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Speaker 1: money for them. So again, look, we do the best

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Speaker 1: we can. And I told my dad my dad, thank god,

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Speaker 1: lived to one hundred and one and we had an

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Speaker 1: amazing ten last ten years of his life. And I said,

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Speaker 1: you know, you did the best you could. That's all

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Speaker 1: we can ever do. Now. If we can walk away

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Speaker 1: from something and say we honestly did our best. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't mean it's perfect, you know, and then the

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Speaker 1: rest is up to us.

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Speaker 2: Right, how did you at such a young age, For

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Speaker 2: people who don't know, you had something called my croatia,

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Speaker 2: you were born with hearing in one ear, basically, and

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Speaker 2: you got bullied a lot by kids.

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Speaker 3: You know, I have a kid, I deal with bullying.

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Speaker 3: How did you? How did you handle it?

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Speaker 2: How did you survive bullying at the young age that

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Speaker 2: you were.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think the key word you just said was survived.

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Speaker 1: That's what I think. A lot of people just survive you,

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Speaker 1: you know, if you don't have people to support you.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know that support means anything more than

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Speaker 1: saying I hear you. I think that a lot of

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Speaker 1: times in life, all we need is we don't need direction,

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Speaker 1: we don't need advice. We just need to be acknowledged.

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Speaker 1: And certainly in my family, my parents grew up in

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Speaker 1: a time where if you don't talk about something that

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Speaker 1: doesn't exist, well it does exist, you know. So I

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Speaker 1: had a tough time and again, at some point we

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Speaker 1: have to decide for ourselves. I was fifteen years old

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Speaker 1: and I walked into Mount Sinai Hospital and said I

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Speaker 1: need to see somebody. So that was the beginning of

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Speaker 1: therapy for me. And I'm such a big believer in

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Speaker 1: therapy as long as the person who goes in is

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Speaker 1: ready to work, therapy is only as good as the

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Speaker 1: therapist and the person's commitment to working.

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Speaker 3: Totally, I'm just going to go in.

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Speaker 1: There talk about your day or your pets or things

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Speaker 1: like that. Then you're selling yourself short. But if you're

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Speaker 1: really willing to endure, it becomes exciting.

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Speaker 2: I describe it the same way. It's exciting because when

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Speaker 2: you go in ready to work, and maybe that means

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Speaker 2: confronting the bad things that you don't want to confront.

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Speaker 3: Maybe it means examining yourself.

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Speaker 2: Maybe it means saying, you know, I'm going to work

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Speaker 2: on this thing that you just told me about. It's

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Speaker 2: exciting to get to the bottom of what is challenging

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Speaker 2: you or you know. In my case, I deal with

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Speaker 2: severe anxiety. What is really like paralyzing me? It's exciting

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Speaker 2: to work on it and get closer and find new

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Speaker 2: tips and tricks.

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Speaker 1: I just.

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Speaker 2: That's that's how what I tell people too, that it

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Speaker 2: should feel kind of exhilarating, almost ecstatic. To go in

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Speaker 2: and realize I don't have to live like this, and

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Speaker 2: I'm getting help.

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Speaker 1: I'm shaking my head because even as a team. When

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Speaker 1: I started therapy, at the end of each session, I

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Speaker 1: was looking forward to the next week and it was

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Speaker 1: almost a lifeline. I couldn't afford more than going into

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Speaker 1: a clinic at that time, but each time I finished,

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Speaker 1: I was looking forward to progress and also figuring out.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's like pieces of the puzzle and putting

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Speaker 1: this puzzle together, and you know, when they talk about it,

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Speaker 1: it's like the talking cure. It really is kind of

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Speaker 1: magical in that when you can acknowledge something and also

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Speaker 1: absorb it on a level that most people don't even understand,

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Speaker 1: it changes who we are. And so we could talk

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Speaker 1: all day. My friend used to say, it's the best

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Speaker 1: conversation in town, and I'm with them.

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Speaker 3: So it's so true.

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Speaker 2: And I just remember the relief I would get when

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Speaker 2: I first started. I had sort of a nervous breakdown

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Speaker 2: a few years ago, and I first started therapy.

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Speaker 3: I had done it as a.

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Speaker 2: Kid a little bit, but really started in earnest at

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Speaker 2: like forty two or something, which was way too late

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Speaker 2: because by then I was like twenty years into an

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Speaker 2: anxiety disorder that I didn't know about. But the relief

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Speaker 2: I got from just hearing from someone take the pressure

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Speaker 2: off yourself a little bit. I mean, these were things

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Speaker 2: I just needed to hear and no one was telling me.

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Speaker 3: So that was like, it was so great.

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Speaker 2: I want to talk a little bit more about that,

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Speaker 2: but first I want to know we both studied classical

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Speaker 2: music as kids.

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Speaker 3: Were you pushed into that or did you want to

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Speaker 3: do that?

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Speaker 1: I didn't actually study it, but because my parents are

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Speaker 1: European stock, the arts are the arts are bread, it's milk,

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Speaker 1: It's part of your foundation. Not in America, unfortunately. But

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Speaker 1: I grew up in a family where we listened to

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Speaker 1: classical music all the time. We went to museums. I

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Speaker 1: went to art museums on weekends, and it wasn't it

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Speaker 1: wasn't something that was out of the ordinary. It was

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Speaker 1: just what we did. So I grew up with Broadway

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Speaker 1: show tunes and opera going to I went to the

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Speaker 1: original Met and So and heard an amazing version of Tosca.

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Speaker 1: Grew up listened to Beethoven. My first recollection of music

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Speaker 1: was the Emperor Concerto, so that's really at my core,

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Speaker 1: and it's so much a part of who I am.

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Speaker 1: So whatever my parents did, I always say I am

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Speaker 1: who I am because of and in spite of my parents.

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Speaker 1: So they they gave me music, they gave me art,

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Speaker 1: they opened, you know, pathways for me that in some

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Speaker 1: ways were life savers.

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Speaker 3: You know, I.

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Speaker 2: Did ballet growing up, and so I was around classical

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Speaker 2: music all the time, and then I did I did

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Speaker 2: study it in school, and then after this breakdown, I

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Speaker 2: found classical music was the only music I could listen to.

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Speaker 2: Maybe the lyrics of other songs were just too much

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Speaker 2: for me, they were a little bit overwhelming, or maybe

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Speaker 2: it was just that it was so familiar, these these songs,

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Speaker 2: you know, listening to Gershwin and Smetna and Chopin, and

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Speaker 2: they were just comforting and familiar. And I've fallen back

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Speaker 2: in love with it now. I listened to Symphony Hall

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Speaker 2: like all day long. Do you find that music evokes

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Speaker 2: a feeling of home, comfort, familiarity for you?

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Speaker 1: I think music is exhilarating. It's life affirming. And I

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Speaker 1: remember as a child hearing nessun dorma and just tears

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Speaker 1: in my eyes, not knowing what was being sung, but

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Speaker 1: the music itself just has a way of pushing in

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Speaker 1: emotional buttons. The power of music is incredible, I think,

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Speaker 1: much more so than lyrics because music can be universal,

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Speaker 1: and I think what people relate to in different countries

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Speaker 1: when they hear music that's sung in English is not

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Speaker 1: the lyric, it's the melody against the chords. So that's

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Speaker 1: really the true power of music. So for me, there's

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Speaker 1: only two kinds of music, goodn't bad. So you know,

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Speaker 1: the idea that concerts now, particularly rock concerts, have become

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Speaker 1: a three course meal of the same course is a shame.

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Speaker 1: You know. I hate to say. When I was growing up,

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Speaker 1: but I remember going to concerts where you might have

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Speaker 1: led Zeppelin with Woody Herman and his orchestra, you might

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Speaker 1: have you know, you had diversity, so it really was

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Speaker 1: like a meal. You've got different things, and you also

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Speaker 1: got exposed to different kinds of music. Whereas now, unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: I think people say I like this kind of music

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Speaker 1: or that kind of music, and it's it's unfortunate, it's

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Speaker 1: it limits people and shuts them off when there's beauty

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Speaker 1: and all kinds of music. My gosh, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: you talk about could Order. You know, you talk about Gershwin,

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Speaker 1: you talk about mahl or Beethoven, you talk about the Beatles.

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Speaker 2: Copland, the Beatles. The Beatles are the best. But like, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm with you. I can be moved by virtually any

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Speaker 2: genre of music if the song is good and it's

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Speaker 2: got some minor chords.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, minor cords they hit you.

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Speaker 3: Right here, right there, exactly right.

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Speaker 2: Talk about the star Child and how how that became

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Speaker 2: a literal and figurative mask, an escape from who you were.

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Speaker 1: I guess what I did was create who I wasn't.

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Speaker 1: I guess I created who I wanted to be when

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Speaker 1: I was younger. You know, certainly I found myself thinking,

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Speaker 1: one of these days, everyone's going to regret not being

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Speaker 1: my friend. Now backstory, a lot of people weren't my

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Speaker 1: friends because I made myself unfriendly and somebody who you know,

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Speaker 1: if you push people, then you can't be you know,

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Speaker 1: surprised that they leave. So anyway, so I created the

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Speaker 1: star Child, I guess, and I became a lot of

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Speaker 1: things that I wasn't and ultimately became those things. Although

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Speaker 1: I think the good parts of it, and it also

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Speaker 1: again led me to see that success wasn't the answer.

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Speaker 1: Success gave me the opportunity to find the answer. But

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Speaker 1: you know, I created this, this persona that I became,

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Speaker 1: and and not to get deep again, but.

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Speaker 3: No, you can get deep.

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Speaker 1: One of the things I found was that even though

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Speaker 1: I created this this persona that people loved and the

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Speaker 1: agulation I got, I still felt the same inside. So

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Speaker 1: that was, you know, a revelation for an epiphany. But

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Speaker 1: I created something that has led me to where I

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Speaker 1: am now, which is amazing.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's so profound the way in the book and

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Speaker 2: even just now, the way you describe creating this character

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Speaker 2: to be someone you weren't yet. Did you know you

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Speaker 2: were doing that at the time or only in looking back?

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Speaker 1: Only in looking back. I had a lot of a

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Speaker 1: lot of eye opening experiences when I did Phantom of

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Speaker 1: the Opera.

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Speaker 3: Oh good, yeah, I want to talk about that perfect.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. The first time I saw a Phantom of the

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Speaker 1: Opera was in London and eighty eight in the West End,

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Speaker 1: and I had this epiphany.

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Speaker 3: So you were a grown up, Yes, I was a

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Speaker 3: grown up, okay.

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Speaker 1: And I had this epiphany during one of the scenes.

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Speaker 1: And it wasn't unlike the same epiphany I had when

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Speaker 1: I saw the Beatles. And I was a kid, and

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Speaker 1: I was a kid who couldn't play an instrument and

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Speaker 1: a kid who had whatever issues. But I saw them

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Speaker 1: on Ed Sullivan and this crazy voice in me said,

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Speaker 1: I can do that. Didn't mean I can be the Beatles. Somehow,

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Speaker 1: it was like I can touch that nerve. Now it

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Speaker 1: took a long time to figure out how. But backstory,

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Speaker 1: So when I saw Phantom, I was sitting in the

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Speaker 1: audience and all of a sudden something happened on stage

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Speaker 1: and I said, I get it. I can do that.

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Speaker 1: And I love Broadway and I loved theater. And about

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Speaker 1: ten years later, my agent's a CAAA, called and said,

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Speaker 1: do you have any interest in theater? And I said,

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Speaker 1: well sure, And they said, well you'd have to go

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Speaker 1: to New York and audition and you know, for help

337
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Speaker 1: Princess people on and on, and I said, well, what's

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Speaker 1: it for and they said Phantom of the Opera and

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Speaker 1: I said, book the ticket, yeah, And I went to

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Speaker 1: New York did a full on audition with blocking which means,

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Speaker 1: for those who don't know, you know, positioning where you

342
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:04,840
Speaker 1: are different points in a scene, and singing and they

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Speaker 1: said kind of. I don't want to draw the analogy

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Speaker 1: to American Idol, that's not a good one. But you're

345
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:15,719
Speaker 1: going to Toronto. And Toronto was a fandom had been

346
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Speaker 1: running almost ten years and raked in over five hundred

347
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Speaker 1: million dollars. It was really an institution there, and I

348
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Speaker 1: went up there and became Originally I was going to

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Speaker 1: be the next to the last phantom before the show closed,

350
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Speaker 1: and it was such a success with me that they

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Speaker 1: bought out the person who was supposed to replace me,

352
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Speaker 1: and I became the last phantom. But I didn't realize

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Speaker 1: at that point the depth of my connection to to

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Speaker 1: that show or to that character. During one of my

355
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Speaker 1: breaks between the matinee and the evening show, I was

356
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:01,679
Speaker 1: reading some male that I got, and one letter was

357
00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:05,359
Speaker 1: from a woman who headed an organization called about Face

358
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Speaker 1: that dealt with children with facial differences. And she said,

359
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Speaker 1: you seem to be bringing something to the role, and

360
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Speaker 1: very complimentary and I wrote her back that yes, you

361
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Speaker 1: know I have this difference, and not to minimize what

362
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Speaker 1: other children deal with, because children deal with things far

363
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Speaker 1: more horrific and problematic than I did. But she said,

364
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Speaker 1: would you come and speak and now I never spoken

365
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Speaker 1: about this, and I never told anybody about this. And

366
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Speaker 1: I was always lucky enough in my teen years and

367
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Speaker 1: onward to have long hair. Not not by coincidence either.

368
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Speaker 2: Right, So she didn't know that you had this, but

369
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Speaker 2: she I think what I read was she noticed that

370
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Speaker 2: you had a connection to this character that seemed, you know,

371
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Speaker 2: interesting to her, and she wanted to know, like, why

372
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Speaker 2: why you felt so connected to phantoms?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, she was moved.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think which says a lot about your

375
00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,879
Speaker 2: performance as well as probably what was, you know, a

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Speaker 2: deep connection to this masked character.

377
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: Yeah. And interestingly I wound up speaking to children and

378
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:22,359
Speaker 1: to their parents, and both were really cathartic because in

379
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Speaker 1: talking to children, I could say, look, I haven't walked

380
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Speaker 1: a mile in your shoes. And some of these children

381
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Speaker 1: had much more challenging differences than I did, And I said,

382
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Speaker 1: the playing fields not always level, life's not always fair,

383
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Speaker 1: but you can make it. You know, it's not easy,

384
00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:47,120
Speaker 1: and you know I did it. I think you can,

385
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 1: and it's not an easy road. And I would speak

386
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Speaker 1: to parents and say, you know, in a case like that,

387
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 1: there's no tough love. I don't believe there's only love. Yeah,

388
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Speaker 1: And when you're you're trying to tell your kid he's

389
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,080
Speaker 1: just like everyone else or she's just like everyone else,

390
00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: they're not. So let's acknowledge that, you know, and start

391
00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:13,919
Speaker 1: with that you're not like everyone else. And maybe my

392
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 1: being able to talk about it and also having them

393
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:21,240
Speaker 1: acknowledge that was very, very healing for me. Plus I

394
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 1: began to realize that the character and Phantom, is somebody

395
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:30,440
Speaker 1: with this facial difference on half of his face and

396
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 1: he wants the love of this young woman, and once

397
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 1: he gets it, he doesn't know how to embrace it. Yeah,

398
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: And I suddenly went wow, you know, and very interestingly,

399
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,680
Speaker 1: I just thought of the analogy and the parallel that

400
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,479
Speaker 1: every night and every day that I did Phantom, I

401
00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:59,640
Speaker 1: look forward to the next show because I was finding myself,

402
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: was delving into, you know, who I was and and

403
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:08,440
Speaker 1: what this was all about. So it was a continuation

404
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:13,159
Speaker 1: of work and it was very free. There were so

405
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 1: many moments where afterwards I realized, and I think I

406
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,280
Speaker 1: said in my book, you know, the less secrets you have,

407
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,160
Speaker 1: the more free you are. If you can free yourself

408
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:27,200
Speaker 1: of secrets, you're free. And back to therapy, I think

409
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,000
Speaker 1: one of the great things about therapy is that it's

410
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:33,439
Speaker 1: like a life school where you realize that some of

411
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 1: your preconceived ideas of other people are not accurate, that

412
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 1: there are a lot of people just like you, and

413
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:44,680
Speaker 1: that what you think other people are like, or what

414
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 1: you want to attain or emulating other people is not

415
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 1: really what's there. So Phantom was a wonderful, wonderful experience,

416
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 1: probably one of the greatest and my life and oh,

417
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know something I certainly don't have time

418
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 1: to do with four kids three three at home.

419
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it was.

420
00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:14,479
Speaker 1: It was life changing. That's what life's about, is is

421
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 1: finding moments that you don't expect that are going to

422
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 1: help define who you are.

423
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you had time, what's another role you'd like

424
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 2: to play.

425
00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 3: In a musical? Wow, I could see you as a

426
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 3: great javert.

427
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:35,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that would be wonderful. I loved I loved King Arthur.

428
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 3: And Camelot, you know, yeah, yeah.

429
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 1: So you know, Camelot had had its flaws, but that

430
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 1: character for me seemed so noble. And the idea of

431
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 1: seeing the woman he loves in love with his best friend, yeah,

432
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 1: that's you know.

433
00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:00,560
Speaker 2: So I got to see, this just came to mind.

434
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 2: I could see you in Man of La Mancha as well.

435
00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 2: I saw Raul Julia in Man of La Mancha, which

436
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,240
Speaker 2: was great, but I could see that's a great that

437
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 2: would be a great role for you too.

438
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 1: Well.

439
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:11,680
Speaker 2: I'm hoping that you get some time because I would

440
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 2: love to see you in all of these musicals in

441
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 2: my fantasy.

442
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 1: Yes, me too, you know. Unfortunately, in life, I was

443
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:22,120
Speaker 1: just saying to my daughter yesterday, anything you do takes

444
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: you away from something else, so you have to.

445
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 3: Prioritize constant trade off.

446
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, you have to prioritize, Yeah, because time is precious,

447
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: and as you get older, you begin to realize more

448
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 1: and more. Yeah, I tend to say, you know, I've

449
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,640
Speaker 1: always seen life kind of like a moving sidewalk, and

450
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:44,359
Speaker 1: I used to be at the beginning of the line

451
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 1: and everyone was in front of me. Now I look

452
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,640
Speaker 1: behind and everyone's behind me. Yeah, you begin to realize

453
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 1: that that time is fine ight and so precious. I mean,

454
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 1: it's certainly a something that is a cliche, but yeah,

455
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:04,440
Speaker 1: time becomes precious and the idea of being away from

456
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: home to do something else, yeah, I'm not sure at

457
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 1: this point. I don't think it benefits me, and I

458
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: don't think it benefits my kids.

459
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, was there going to be a kiss musical at

460
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 2: one point?

461
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: Oh? There, I'm sure there will be.

462
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:21,239
Speaker 3: Do you think there will be?

463
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:21,639
Speaker 1: Oh?

464
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there's I was going to say, like, it

465
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:27,679
Speaker 2: feels pretty obvious, like you you'd lean into this idea.

466
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:32,000
Speaker 1: Well, there's a film that's very much in the works.

467
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 1: I'll tell you the story of this band and Gene

468
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:40,720
Speaker 1: and I is better than fiction. It really is something

469
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: that I can't quite describe. You know. I met Gene

470
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: probably about fifty eight years ago. Fifty seven years ago.

471
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: Didn't like them and why not? He was full of himself. Gee,

472
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: it isn't not a surprise.

473
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, but.

474
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:03,480
Speaker 1: At that point it was pragmatism. I realized that I

475
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: was better off with him than without him, because I

476
00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: wanted to succeed, and to succeed in things you have

477
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:16,960
Speaker 1: to prioritize once again, prioritize him. So I was better

478
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:20,719
Speaker 1: with him than without him. And over the years, I

479
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: think again, I learned a lot about myself. I think,

480
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: if you and he's been a wonderful brother to me,

481
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: and certainly I think it early on we were like

482
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 1: two rocks with a lot of hard edges. But if

483
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: you keep hitting rocks together, they get round.

484
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 3: Yeah smooth, Yeah, yeah, to get smooth.

485
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 1: And I think sometimes you look at somebody and things

486
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:48,280
Speaker 1: about them annoy you, and really at some point you

487
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: have to go, why that's about you, not about them,

488
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 1: so that you know, look, I can turn into Yoda.

489
00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 1: But life is full of you know, all kinds of

490
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: educational experiences and you know, epiphanies and revelations. And you know,

491
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:14,959
Speaker 1: I came to painting twenty years ago, never thinking I

492
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 1: was going to do that, and yeah, I painted five

493
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 1: days a week. I couldn't imagine not painting. It's cathartic

494
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: and something that I didn't I never would have missed

495
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: it unless I started it. And once I started it,

496
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:33,440
Speaker 1: you know, well.

497
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 3: I mean you mentioned Yoda.

498
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:40,160
Speaker 2: You're so you're so zen and you see you seem

499
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:45,240
Speaker 2: so self aware. But I was reading you wrote about

500
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 2: like your attitude earlier in your career where you were

501
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 2: just really defensive and you kind of had like this

502
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 2: chip on your shoulder and you wrote that your feeling

503
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 2: was hit me once and I'll hit you twice. How

504
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 2: did you get from that this sort of angry man.

505
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 2: Uh to this, this like enlightened, you know, seemingly very

506
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,560
Speaker 2: like I said, very zen guy.

507
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 1: There's a saying is it all too soon? Smart? Too late?

508
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:23,440
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know. I I think basically it

509
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: comes down to do you like yourself? At the end

510
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 1: of the day, You've got to look at yourself in

511
00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:31,080
Speaker 1: the mirror and do you like who you see? And

512
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:36,040
Speaker 1: there were times I didn't like myself and lashing out

513
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 1: at other people or being you know, hard to be around,

514
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: or defensive or all those things. Again, they're they're designed

515
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 1: to reinforce the worst, and if you can let those go,

516
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 1: life gets much better. You know, when you're less judgmental

517
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:59,400
Speaker 1: and I still have opinions about things, and that's those

518
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,200
Speaker 1: tend to be based on fact and based on experience

519
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 1: as opposed to just blindly. You know, everybody's entitled to

520
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 1: an opinion. I don't know about that. You know, opinions

521
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: have to be backed up. But I certainly found that

522
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 1: when you're less judgmental of people, you make the world

523
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:20,400
Speaker 1: a better place, You make yourself feel better, you see

524
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 1: things differently, and I like that. I like that.

525
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 3: It felt good.

526
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, you know, you know you're you're on

527
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: this this journey, journey, you know, that's the word that

528
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 1: always comes up. But you know, I admire that in you.

529
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 1: What I saw early on that I really thought was

530
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: admirable and connected to was you had a stance on

531
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:50,960
Speaker 1: automatic and semi automatic weapons. I remember you saying that

532
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: you were you know, NRA and that you you you

533
00:32:55,360 --> 00:33:00,080
Speaker 1: had guns and supported that. But now I see that

534
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: this is and you went from there, and I was like,

535
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 1: and I went, that's that's commendable. And and just somebody

536
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 1: who can reach a point where they say I was wrong.

537
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

538
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:17,560
Speaker 1: Again, I try to tell my kids that being able

539
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,360
Speaker 1: to say you're wrong doesn't make you weaker, makes you stronger.

540
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:24,320
Speaker 2: Oh and it's such a relief too, to just be

541
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 2: you know, I don't have to stand my ground constantly.

542
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 2: I can re examine, I can say you're right, there's

543
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 2: a problem here.

544
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 3: It's a relief. It's a relieving feeling to be able

545
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 3: to do that.

546
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,600
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, I you know, I know the kind of

547
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 1: person you are, and that's what I initially connected with.

548
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 1: I just remember seeing you doing a piece and going, wow,

549
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: I like this person, you know. Yeah, so, and then

550
00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 1: in following you after that, I've seen struggles and things

551
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:06,000
Speaker 1: that you go through, and you know, again, in sharing them,

552
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 1: I think we free ourselves and we also allow other

553
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: people to say, hey, I'm like.

554
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 2: You for sure, for sure, So tell me why or

555
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 2: how you came to the decision I want to take

556
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 2: the makeup off.

557
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:22,520
Speaker 3: I want to take the mask off.

558
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:28,720
Speaker 1: We initially did it because the band was at a point,

559
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,319
Speaker 1: and this was in eighty one eighty two. I think

560
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 1: people had grown tired of the way we looked, and

561
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:39,560
Speaker 1: also we had changed members in the band, and where

562
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 1: once it was organic, we were creating them in nagerie.

563
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 1: I mean, we might as well have had Giraffe Boy

564
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 1: or Turtle Man. You know, it just it just it

565
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:55,760
Speaker 1: lost the essence of what it once was. I said

566
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 1: to Jeane, you know, people are listening with their eyes

567
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 1: because we were doing some good music. And I mean

568
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 1: we've done some music I think is just junk. But

569
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:13,839
Speaker 1: we were trying our best. You know, again, when you're

570
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,280
Speaker 1: finished with something, can you say you did your best?

571
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:20,239
Speaker 1: And any times we did our best, and in hindsight,

572
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:25,280
Speaker 1: Boyd said falls short. But when we took off the makeup,

573
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,760
Speaker 1: I just thought, we're either going to sink or swim.

574
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 1: You know, either we're good enough to continue or not.

575
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 1: And it took seem a little bit more persuading, but

576
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:39,759
Speaker 1: we took it off, and nobody's going to be able

577
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:43,800
Speaker 1: to compete with those four iconic characters. We couldn't. We swam.

578
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:47,919
Speaker 1: We kept our heads above the water and endured long

579
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 1: enough to go back to it. But we needed to

580
00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 1: do that. We needed to step away to be able

581
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 1: to go back to it, you know. So that's really

582
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:02,680
Speaker 1: why we took it off, is when people aren't buying

583
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,360
Speaker 1: your albums, it's it's not their fault.

584
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 2: No, yeah, yeah, you said recently that you haven't wanted

585
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 2: to pick up a guitar for fear that it will

586
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:18,280
Speaker 2: make you miss Kiss in the band. All of that

587
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 2: that really resonates with me. You know, we have different

588
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 2: careers but similar similar in so many ways. And when

589
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 2: what you do is public facing and people have ideas

590
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,400
Speaker 2: about where you should be or who you should be

591
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 2: or what you should be doing, it's really hard to

592
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 2: disassociate that from what you want to be doing.

593
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 3: And you know, people might want to see me in

594
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 3: a certain.

595
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 2: Way, but I might be ready to leave that behind,

596
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,200
Speaker 2: or I might be ready, I want to go back

597
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 2: to something that you know, people don't really want me

598
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 2: to go back to either.

599
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:53,920
Speaker 3: It's really hard navigating that.

600
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 2: How do you deal mentally with those pangs of wanting

601
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 2: it to be ten or twenty years ago, but also

602
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 2: being like, no, here, I'm here now.

603
00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:05,800
Speaker 3: I've evolved to this place, and this place is great.

604
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 1: I think in the last year I've come to articulate

605
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: it as life's a one way street.

606
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,759
Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, there's no going back, and it.

607
00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:20,960
Speaker 1: Gets narrower and again, time is precious. And do I

608
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:24,360
Speaker 1: miss being on stage in front of fifty thousand people

609
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:29,720
Speaker 1: one hundred thousand people? Hell yeah? Does Michael Jordan miss

610
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:34,560
Speaker 1: what he did? Everybody who's attained that kind of success,

611
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,760
Speaker 1: Sure you miss it, but there's a difference between missing

612
00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 1: and yearning. You know, I miss it, but there's no

613
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:48,080
Speaker 1: going back to it. Practically, I mean, yeah, you know,

614
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 1: you can't physically do as an athlete, and what I've

615
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 1: done was athleticism, whether vocally or physically.

616
00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:57,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, totally.

617
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 1: You're reach a point where you can and that's something

618
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:05,879
Speaker 1: you have to come to grips with And Okay, now

619
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:10,440
Speaker 1: what you know, I'm blessed to have done what I've done,

620
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 1: and it will go forever. We sold Kiss, which is

621
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 1: something that's unheard of, that doesn't even exist in the

622
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:23,680
Speaker 1: lexicon of music. We sold Kiss about five months ago,

623
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: and I mean everything, the logo, the makeup, the music,

624
00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:38,240
Speaker 1: and there'll be an incredible immersive musical experience that'll debut

625
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: in twenty seven that George Lucas is involved in and

626
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 1: those characters will live forever.

627
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:46,439
Speaker 3: So oh very cool.

628
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:49,520
Speaker 1: And we're involved, Jane and I are involved in that.

629
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:51,720
Speaker 1: So yeah, it lives forever.

630
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,799
Speaker 3: But yeah, I can't the star child can right.

631
00:38:55,800 --> 00:39:00,799
Speaker 1: You know, you can fight it, but I'd rather accept it.

632
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: You know, if I had the luxury of going on

633
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 1: stage in pseudo street clothes, yeah I could be up

634
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,360
Speaker 1: there standing in front of a microphone and doing this forever.

635
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,320
Speaker 1: But that's not what kisses. That's not why I created

636
00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:21,320
Speaker 1: what we created. So you know, I think that intellectually,

637
00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:24,560
Speaker 1: I know why we stopped and that we had to

638
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:28,839
Speaker 1: stop amost Like, sure, it's got all kinds of you know, pangs,

639
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 1: but yeah, that's life.

640
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:48,720
Speaker 2: I want to do a sort of a lightning round

641
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:57,640
Speaker 2: of questions, so we'll start at the top.

642
00:39:57,880 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 3: What's the best musical.

643
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:08,239
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, you know it's tough. I know. Wow. Interestingly,

644
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:11,719
Speaker 1: I kind of phantomed out because I saw it. So

645
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 1: I saw it about seventeen times before I did it,

646
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: because I just loved it. Yeah. I saw a revival

647
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 1: before COVID, which unfortunately didn't run after a West Side

648
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: Story that was absolutely brilliant.

649
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:32,760
Speaker 3: That was a great one. It was just just yeah,

650
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 3: I mean just so good. Yeah.

651
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 1: Yeah. So I think West Side Story done properly, it's

652
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:44,360
Speaker 1: dated if done as it was right, but it's relevant

653
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:49,839
Speaker 1: and when it's staged properly, it's beautiful. I remember seeing Raw.

654
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 1: I knew Ralph Julia, so I saw him. I saw

655
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:57,360
Speaker 1: him do nine and yeah, I remember that time of

656
00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 1: all the British Mega music where they had to have

657
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 1: a stunt. So Miss Saigon had a helicopter come down.

658
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:07,400
Speaker 1: I love Miss I mean that's a really great question.

659
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:10,960
Speaker 1: I don't really hard. Yeah, I don't know what the answer.

660
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,880
Speaker 2: What's your I know, well, I love Bouobil Schomberg, so

661
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 2: I love le Mis, I love Miss Saigon. There was

662
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 2: another one called Martin Gahre that didn't become as popular,

663
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 2: but it was great and it.

664
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:23,919
Speaker 1: Was a they did a movie they.

665
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,360
Speaker 3: Did called Summers Be with Richard Here and Jodi Foster.

666
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:29,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a great story and actually some great music.

667
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 2: So I really love those three. But I mean, I

668
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 2: love a chorus line is a perfect musical.

669
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:37,359
Speaker 3: I love it.

670
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 2: I love like I said, Mani Lamanha is great. I

671
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 2: love Chicago. I mean it's really it's hard. It's hard,

672
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:45,319
Speaker 2: Yeah it is.

673
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:49,680
Speaker 1: There's so many amazing, amazing musicals, and there's nothing worse

674
00:41:49,719 --> 00:41:51,080
Speaker 1: than a bad one.

675
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 3: Let me tell you.

676
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 2: I won't name it, but I've only walked out of

677
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:56,360
Speaker 2: one musical, and it's a very popular one.

678
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 3: But I wasn't alone.

679
00:41:57,560 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 2: I was with my mom and she loves musicals too,

680
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:01,799
Speaker 2: and she was like, this is not good, and we

681
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,279
Speaker 2: walked out, and yeah, there is nothing worse. I get

682
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:09,120
Speaker 2: a pit in my stomach when I'm watching a bad musical.

683
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:16,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, becomes doctor Phil, What were you thinking? So true?

684
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:18,759
Speaker 1: That's like you look at the person next to you

685
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:20,360
Speaker 1: and go, does this stink?

686
00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:22,719
Speaker 3: What are we doing here? Yeah?

687
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:26,799
Speaker 2: Okay, this is another very controversial question. I've gotten in

688
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,800
Speaker 2: trouble on Twitter for it which decade had the best music?

689
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:36,879
Speaker 1: My gosh, Well, if you ask somebody today they'll tell

690
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:38,280
Speaker 1: you the music today.

691
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 3: That's well, that's the wrong answer. That is incorrect.

692
00:42:42,680 --> 00:42:49,680
Speaker 1: Yes, of course it's incorrect. Well, classical music and all

693
00:42:49,719 --> 00:42:52,640
Speaker 1: that aside. If we're talking about popular music, Yeah, I

694
00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:57,319
Speaker 1: would have to say the sixties.

695
00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:59,879
Speaker 3: You're correct, that is the correct answer. Thank you very much.

696
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:06,920
Speaker 1: What right you win a Chevy Nova? No?

697
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 2: I agree, And I don't know how you could think

698
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:13,120
Speaker 2: any differently when you had, like the Beatles for the

699
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:17,240
Speaker 2: entire second half of that decade, plus so many others.

700
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:20,919
Speaker 1: You know, I always say, you know, music is one thing,

701
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:27,359
Speaker 1: but phenomenons impact society, and the Beatles and everything that

702
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:31,319
Speaker 1: they brought with them. The amount of groups that came

703
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:35,080
Speaker 1: out of England is like saying seventy five of the

704
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 1: greatest bands came out of Rhode Island.

705
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just right.

706
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:40,640
Speaker 1: It's how did this happen?

707
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 3: Happen?

708
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:45,040
Speaker 1: You know? So I used to stay up when the

709
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:49,800
Speaker 1: Beatles first came out. I was I don't know, maybe twelve.

710
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 1: I would stay up sometimes all night with a little

711
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:58,040
Speaker 1: transistor radio, just listening to this music that celebrated youth

712
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:03,680
Speaker 1: and had this quality to it, this vitality. So yeah,

713
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:08,720
Speaker 1: I have to say I saw Hendrix twice. What started

714
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:11,920
Speaker 1: with the Beatles led to a real diversity of music

715
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 1: that could that could have a band like Traffic, a

716
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 1: band like the Moody Blues, Sli in the Family, Stone

717
00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:21,239
Speaker 1: Otis Redding, you know it was.

718
00:44:21,719 --> 00:44:27,560
Speaker 2: Janis Joplin, I mean Woodstock. It just epitomized the decade totally.

719
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: So yes, we're on.

720
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 2: The same page. Make a super group guitarist, bassist, lead vocalist,

721
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:38,839
Speaker 2: and drummer, and what would you call it?

722
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:44,800
Speaker 1: Okay? On guitar you'd have Jimmy Page, okay, because nobody

723
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:50,640
Speaker 1: it's it's Jimmy. On vocals you'd have Robert Plant okay,

724
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:54,200
Speaker 1: On bass you would have John Paul Jones. And on

725
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: drums you would have John Bonham and you'd call it

726
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:57,240
Speaker 1: led Zeppelin.

727
00:44:58,400 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 3: So good, that's good.

728
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:00,360
Speaker 1: Okay?

729
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 3: Can I tell you mine?

730
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:06,880
Speaker 2: Yes, I'm a little nervous because this is your this

731
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 2: is your house obviously, but okay, no. So my guitarist

732
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:15,920
Speaker 2: would be Clapton. My bassist would be Phil why not?

733
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:19,880
Speaker 2: But also he would be on lead vocals, okay, because

734
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:23,560
Speaker 2: I just think his his his voice is.

735
00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:24,919
Speaker 3: So good and that double guitar is just so fun.

736
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 2: Maybe Stevie ray Vaughan also on vocals because his voice

737
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 2: is awesome. And then Sheila on drums.

738
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:34,840
Speaker 3: Well, that's well, that is very eclectic for fun.

739
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:40,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'd call it the anxiety yours mine, it's

740
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 2: my anxiety.

741
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:45,120
Speaker 3: Would that be fun those four people together?

742
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:45,720
Speaker 1: Sure?

743
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:47,160
Speaker 3: If they were all alive.

744
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, some of them are and you wouldn't know it.

745
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 3: Okay. What is your thought on Kiss tribute bands?

746
00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 1: Oh? I hate to say that imitation is the greatest

747
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:10,640
Speaker 1: form of flattery, but I think to have impacted so

748
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:14,799
Speaker 1: many people, I think it's amazing to see all these

749
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:18,879
Speaker 1: Kiss tribute bands. Surprisingly there's no good me in any

750
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:19,239
Speaker 1: of them.

751
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:22,280
Speaker 3: No, what are they not getting?

752
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 1: It's mimicry without commitment and conviction. Physicality is one thing,

753
00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 1: but why you do something is what makes the difference.

754
00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:40,279
Speaker 1: The analogy may not hold up, but anybody can say Shakespeare,

755
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: anybody can read a script. But to immerse yourself in it,

756
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 1: I guess the more you can commit yourself to something,

757
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:52,320
Speaker 1: if you're crazy enough to feel that you're like somebody,

758
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:57,000
Speaker 1: then you probably will be like them. So and then

759
00:46:57,040 --> 00:47:01,600
Speaker 1: you have people like Garth Brooks and Lenny Kravitz and

760
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 1: Pearl Jam and all these bands who cite us. So

761
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:10,240
Speaker 1: I think the idea of being able to influence people

762
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:15,200
Speaker 1: without having to mimic you is also an incredible, incredible compliment.

763
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:18,919
Speaker 3: Oh it must be wild. Yeah, what's your favorite TV show?

764
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:29,000
Speaker 1: Ah, that's interesting. That's I don't watch that much TV.

765
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 1: The last show that I watched that was more than

766
00:47:33,840 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 1: you know, a typical series was The Morning Show, and

767
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:43,760
Speaker 1: I really liked that. I I kind of suffer from

768
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:48,239
Speaker 1: lost fever. I got suckered into watching Lost for.

769
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 3: All those yeah, and then at the end, I just went.

770
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:56,920
Speaker 1: That's it. I've been watching it all this time and

771
00:47:58,680 --> 00:48:01,520
Speaker 1: they didn't even know. I mean, they clearly wrote wrote

772
00:48:01,560 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 1: a story and didn't know how they were going to

773
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:08,520
Speaker 1: end it. I'm breaking bad. Was fantastic, But I'm kind

774
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:14,000
Speaker 1: of leery of long term commitments because I think you

775
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: stand a chance of having wasted your.

776
00:48:17,040 --> 00:48:20,760
Speaker 3: Time, yeah, and then being let down totally.

777
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:24,839
Speaker 1: You know, Lost was like that was a start to

778
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,640
Speaker 1: this day. You know, if I smell that in any

779
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:29,280
Speaker 1: show that I watch, it's.

780
00:48:29,160 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 3: Off traumatized you.

781
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like I'm not getting suckered into this.

782
00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 3: Again for me once.

783
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:41,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, don't tell me about polar bears in the in

784
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,560
Speaker 1: the you know, on the beach, and you know, smoke

785
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:47,080
Speaker 1: monsters and all this stuff, and then at the end

786
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 1: you can't tell me what they were or why.

787
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,799
Speaker 3: They were you know, smell practice. It really is.

788
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:55,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, the people on the internet came up with better

789
00:48:55,200 --> 00:49:01,479
Speaker 1: explanations than the writers of the show. Yeah, so so yeah,

790
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:04,399
Speaker 1: so much for you know TV. For me, I don't

791
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: have the patience. I just don't.

792
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:08,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

793
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:10,440
Speaker 2: Okay, And this last question is very important to me

794
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 2: because this is part of my culture when is iced

795
00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 2: coffee season, as.

796
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:23,320
Speaker 3: We both hold up our iced coffees. So what's your answer.

797
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:29,320
Speaker 1: My earliest memories of ice coffee were my mom making

798
00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:33,839
Speaker 1: ice coffee. Same and so funny that I woke up

799
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 1: this morning and I was in the kitchen and I

800
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 1: just went, I think I'll have some ice coffee. And yes,

801
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 1: and I mean it's just hysterical there there it is.

802
00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:51,560
Speaker 2: Well, Paul Stanley, this was so lovely because you are

803
00:49:51,560 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 2: so lovely and you are so thoughtful, and I just

804
00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 2: want to thank you for sharing all your wisdom and

805
00:49:57,080 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 2: your stories with me and my audience on off the

806
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 2: cop It was it was really really fun.

807
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:06,520
Speaker 1: Well, you're wonderful and I admire what you what you

808
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 1: do and how you live and how you share with people.

809
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:13,320
Speaker 1: And you know, I've said it before, don't be tough.

810
00:50:13,120 --> 00:50:15,719
Speaker 3: On yourself, you know, I mean that's hard for me.

811
00:50:16,200 --> 00:50:19,279
Speaker 1: You know that's there's enough people who will do that.

812
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:23,719
Speaker 1: You know, give yourself a break, and also know when

813
00:50:23,719 --> 00:50:26,800
Speaker 1: you're not being honest. But you know, don't be brutal

814
00:50:26,840 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 1: with yourself. It's it's it's not good.

815
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:31,560
Speaker 3: That's really nice advice.

816
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:34,880
Speaker 2: I will I will remember that Paul Stanley told me

817
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:40,879
Speaker 2: don't be too hard on yourself. Coming up next week,

818
00:50:41,160 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 2: I talked to talk show Queen Daytime's Funniest host Sherry Shepherd.

819
00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:49,200
Speaker 4: My own family is like, we can't believe that this

820
00:50:49,400 --> 00:50:52,959
Speaker 4: is Sherry is a success like this because we thought

821
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 4: she would be the They thought I would be the

822
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:57,960
Speaker 4: one in jail girl, because as I got into my

823
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:01,319
Speaker 4: teenage years, I was hot to trot. Yeah, but I

824
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:03,360
Speaker 4: did not think it would be What did you ask me?

825
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 2: Girl?

826
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:04,160
Speaker 3: What this means?

827
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:06,080
Speaker 4: Another minute pause, staying that foggy days.

828
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:07,239
Speaker 3: What did you ask me?

829
00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:14,319
Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as

830
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:17,359
Speaker 2: part of the recent Choice network. I'm Your Hostess Cupp.

831
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:21,000
Speaker 2: Editing and sound designed by Derek Clements. Our executive producers

832
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 2: are Me Si Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Aufler. If

833
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:26,960
Speaker 2: you like Off the Cup, please rate and review wherever

834
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 2: you get your podcasts, follow, or subscribe for new episodes

835
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:36,000
Speaker 2: every Wednesday,