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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily Bloomberg I Heart podcast,

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Speaker 1: And I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg News. It's Monday, August twenty nine. Hi. I'm Annerera,

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Speaker 1: a senior crypto editor for Bloomberg News. In Today for

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Speaker 1: Stacy Marie Ishmael, the frosty winds of crypto winter are

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Speaker 1: still blowing, and yet n f t s are still

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Speaker 1: bringing the heat for many high end products. Non fungible

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Speaker 1: tokens have become super popular with many luxury brands, and

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Speaker 1: they remain a powerful draw for some consumers. High end

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Speaker 1: retailers Gucci and Tiffany are the latest to jump into

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Speaker 1: the fray with new n f T offerings. Caring Scucci

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Speaker 1: says it will accept eighte coin as a legal tender,

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Speaker 1: and select US stores l V, M, H, S, Tiffany

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Speaker 1: and Co also an it's launching what it calls n

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Speaker 1: f TIFFs. These are collectible passes that can be redeemed

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Speaker 1: by owners of crypto punk n f T s for

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Speaker 1: a physical custom pendant. Some two trillion has been wiped

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Speaker 1: off of crypto's market cap, and the demand for n

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Speaker 1: f t s has slumped in recent months along with

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Speaker 1: resell value. So why are these brands so bullish on crypto?

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Speaker 1: With me to discuss why luxury brands have embraced n

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Speaker 1: f T s are Bloomberg journalists, Emily Nicole, You buy

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Speaker 1: one at the top and hope that it holds its

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Speaker 1: value over time and you might be able to sell

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Speaker 1: it for triple the price. Lace around and Tazz actor

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Speaker 1: the building shops, outlets, virtual galleries in the actual metaverse.

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Speaker 1: Emily Tazz, thanks for joining me today. Thanks for having us,

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Speaker 1: Hey Anna, thanks for having thus. Okay, let's get right

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Speaker 1: to it. So when did luxury brands fall in love

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Speaker 1: with n f T s. So luxury brands have been

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Speaker 1: circling around the n f T space for about a year.

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Speaker 1: You know, really is n f T collections themselves started

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Speaker 1: to take off and they began to see it's what

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Speaker 1: younger generations might be interested in in terms of luxury items,

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Speaker 1: because n f T s, if they're successful, aren't cheap.

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Speaker 1: A digital artwork a non fungible token and n f

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Speaker 1: T the name of the artist is people has sold

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Speaker 1: for sixty nine million dollars at Christie's auction House in

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Speaker 1: New York. Older generations are more keen on buying the

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Speaker 1: things that they know, like watches and cars and clothes

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Speaker 1: that younger generations are more open to new product streams,

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Speaker 1: and so an n f T might be something that

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Speaker 1: they can particularly tap into because they're already at a

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Speaker 1: higher price point. Younger generations might be more savvy. They're

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Speaker 1: also massive wealth signalers as well, so for the people

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Speaker 1: who want to look like they have money, n f

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Speaker 1: T s are a really big way to do that.

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Speaker 1: So I think obviously many fashion brands are still in

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Speaker 1: like a very experimental stage right now, so um Dodging

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Speaker 1: Gubano is a very notable brand. They launched their n

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Speaker 1: f T doing the fashion event that they hold every year,

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Speaker 1: and their n f T s particularly well because I've

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Speaker 1: sold for millions and they've also had like a physical

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Speaker 1: item also given to the person that's obviously bought the

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Speaker 1: n f T. What's going on with with Gucci and Tiffany?

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Speaker 1: Why did why did they make the news recently? So

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Speaker 1: for Gucci, it was that they wanted to expand the

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Speaker 1: number of cryptocurrencies that they accept as a means of

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Speaker 1: payment in their stores. At the moment, it's just stores

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Speaker 1: in the US, and there's a few there's a few

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Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies that are involved. The one that we reported on

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Speaker 1: was ape coin, which is a cryptocurrency that is affiliated

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Speaker 1: with a popular n f T project called the board

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Speaker 1: ape Yok Club. UM. It's not necessarily linked to it,

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Speaker 1: so it's not necessarily like a win for one is

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Speaker 1: a win for both UM. But in the case of Gucci,

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Speaker 1: the way that they accept these cryptocurrencies is quite interesting

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Speaker 1: because for a big company like Gucci would be a

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Speaker 1: big deal if they were to be taking those cryptocurrencies

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Speaker 1: directly onto their balance too, and that would mean you know,

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Speaker 1: a lot of tax implications, a lot of accounting implications,

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Speaker 1: and the regulatory hurdles for that would just be insane.

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Speaker 1: So they do it via third party provider that basically

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Speaker 1: gives Gucci the dollars. Once the crypto comes in, it

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Speaker 1: gets um converted and then put into the into Gucci's

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Speaker 1: bancout as a dollar UM. So whether or not that

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Speaker 1: counsels accepting crypto, I guess is up to you. For

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Speaker 1: Tiffany as well, it was also another area where it's

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Speaker 1: a bit of like, you know, playing both sides. They

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Speaker 1: decided to launch an n f T collection for holders

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Speaker 1: of the Crypto Punk n f T. So if you

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Speaker 1: own a crypto Punk nty, which by the way, it

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Speaker 1: isn't to do with tiffany um, you could buy an

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Speaker 1: an f tiff which is a Tiffany n f t

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Speaker 1: UM and then that would basically be a digital pass

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Speaker 1: to then convert that into a physical Tiffany necklace in

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Speaker 1: the likeness of your crypto Punk. So again you're buying

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Speaker 1: something digital, but really you're getting something physical out of it.

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Speaker 1: So who are they going after with this, right because

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Speaker 1: you said that they are not going to accept the

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Speaker 1: actual coin, and how many people have that coin and

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Speaker 1: do want to spend it to buy like bags? Like

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Speaker 1: what is the deal here? Is it for a marketing

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Speaker 1: like you know, you mentioned younger generations trying to you

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Speaker 1: know them, trying to attract them, like, what what's the deal?

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm a little bit on the skeptic side.

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Speaker 1: So in my mind, it's always a marketing point. It's

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Speaker 1: a it's a it's a way to show that you

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Speaker 1: as a brand are keeping up with the times and

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Speaker 1: keeping up with you know, what's hip among the young people,

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Speaker 1: which is crypto at present um but i'd be interesting

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Speaker 1: to see, you know, how many people are really spending

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Speaker 1: with crypto. And actually there was a story that Tas

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Speaker 1: wrote earlier this year where she went to visit a

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Speaker 1: store in London, the Philip Line. Yeah, yeah, and they

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Speaker 1: actually accepted what was it like quite a lot and

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Speaker 1: there was they started to accepting crypto. So it's like

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Speaker 1: a web three crypto concept store opened in like old

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Speaker 1: Bond Street. Um, really flashy and yeah, I mean some

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Speaker 1: of the sneakers were priced sorry ridicularly surprised. Sorry Philip Blind.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure they're worth it, but um, and then they

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Speaker 1: had like QR colds, they had like, you know, really

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Speaker 1: trendy s type n f T s that they were

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Speaker 1: giving away with purchases. And I think that Philip Line

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Speaker 1: store is the first in London to accept crypto as well. Um,

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Speaker 1: yeah it is, isn't. Yeah, So I'm just looking back

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Speaker 1: at the article you wrote then, which was in April,

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Speaker 1: um and back then that Philip Pline said that last year,

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Speaker 1: payments in crypto accounted for around three percent of its

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Speaker 1: roughly one hundred million euros and online revenue, which isn't

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Speaker 1: a large amount, but it's also not nothing and so

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Speaker 1: there's a I guess that arguments that we had for

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Speaker 1: some of these companies. This obviously was online revenue compared

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Speaker 1: to instore revenue. And how many of us are being

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Speaker 1: like trying to spend crypto in a physical way when

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Speaker 1: you enter a store as another matter. But it's definitely

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Speaker 1: also a revenue stream that brands don't want to ignore.

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Speaker 1: So obviously this isn't happening in a void, right, Like

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Speaker 1: there's a market around n f T s and there's

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Speaker 1: a market around crypto, So so what's happening there? And

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Speaker 1: how do the Gucci and Tiffany lot drops as people say,

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Speaker 1: in the sector fall within that? Emily, do you want

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Speaker 1: to give us a sense At the moment, particularly this year,

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Speaker 1: we've seen a bit of a slump in demand for

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Speaker 1: n f T s, a lot of the performance of

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Speaker 1: even some of the top n f T collections sometimes

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Speaker 1: we call them blue chip collections, like crypto punks, like

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Speaker 1: board apes, um, those have been falling. Four prices are

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Speaker 1: lower than they used to be, and there's even just

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Speaker 1: little demand for things once they've already been minted. The

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Speaker 1: secondary sales market isn't doing that well. I think our

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Speaker 1: colleague Olga Cry for a really great story earlier this

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Speaker 1: year that said that, you know, one in three n

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Speaker 1: f t s has little to no secondary trading after

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Speaker 1: it's been born. Once red hot, n f t s

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Speaker 1: are now cooling off a bit. The secondary market for

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Speaker 1: the majority of people's paintings today is down from the peak,

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Speaker 1: as is most an ft art. So kind of shows

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Speaker 1: that n f t s are performing in line with

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Speaker 1: the same way the rest of crypto is. At the minute.

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Speaker 1: Nothing is really you know, booming. Nothing's going to the

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Speaker 1: moon in general. It's pretty much just subdued slump. I

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Speaker 1: guess it's how you could put it. And so when

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Speaker 1: these brands have come in, we expected to see a

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Speaker 1: bit of a bounce, and I guess we did see

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Speaker 1: a little bit of a of an uptick and some

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Speaker 1: of the floor prices of these n f t s,

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Speaker 1: you know, on the day of the announcements, but those

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Speaker 1: bounces haven't really held since then. We'll be right back

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Speaker 1: with more from Bloomberg reporters Emily Nicole and taz Aktar

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Speaker 1: on how big brands are getting into the cryptosphere. So

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Speaker 1: I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this. I've been

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Speaker 1: hearing that you know, in a sense, the n f

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Speaker 1: T world is a bit disconnected from the broader like

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Speaker 1: crypto markets in the sense of crypto prices of bitcoin.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that in a way, you know, it's

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Speaker 1: become its parallel thing because it's more connected to reality

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Speaker 1: because we have these brands and these companies coming in,

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Speaker 1: or do you see it as always intertwined in that

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Speaker 1: you know, if one goes badly, the other one will

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Speaker 1: go badly too. If we look at this purely from

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Speaker 1: a market's perspective, crypto has been very volatile over the

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Speaker 1: last year, as it as it always has been. We

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Speaker 1: haven't really seen that improving en T s haven't been

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Speaker 1: as volatile, and so in that way, they're not really

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Speaker 1: a parallel because they do operate slightly different. It is

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Speaker 1: more of a kind of store of value in a sense,

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Speaker 1: because you buy one at the top and hope that

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Speaker 1: it holds its value over time and you might be

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Speaker 1: able to sell it for triple the price later on,

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Speaker 1: compared to crypto, where people are you know, making quick

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Speaker 1: arbitrage trades and trying to make money off the pennies,

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Speaker 1: and difference between prices on different exchanges um but that's

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Speaker 1: not to say that they don't also get affected by

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Speaker 1: the same things. You know, if you were a crypto

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Speaker 1: trader and you were seeing losses elsewhere in your portfolio,

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Speaker 1: you might sell an enterty to make some money back,

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Speaker 1: and vice versa if you if your n f T

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Speaker 1: s were crashing, which to be honest, doesn't happen very often.

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Speaker 1: We don't see crashes that often in floor prices. What

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Speaker 1: did we learn about Gucci while we were reporting this

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Speaker 1: Emily and that that's also connected to n f t s,

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Speaker 1: but not necessarily just n f T s. So when

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Speaker 1: we were looking into this story, we were kind of

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Speaker 1: trying to position how these most recent drops in enterty

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Speaker 1: collections or accepting more crypto payments is situated within their

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Speaker 1: broader push into web three UM, and for Gucci, it's

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Speaker 1: something they've been working on for a while. Speaking to

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Speaker 1: a representative at Gucci, we learned that, you know, this

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Speaker 1: is part of a push they've been doing for about

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Speaker 1: a year and a half and they have this new

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Speaker 1: unit within the business um that they hope to become

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Speaker 1: a little bit like a startup that is more free

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Speaker 1: to do what it wants within crypto and web three

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Speaker 1: without the constraints of the big parent behind Gucci carrying,

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Speaker 1: you know, tapping over its shoulder. And one of those

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Speaker 1: things is to hire a head of Web three, like

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Speaker 1: a global manager that can oversee the operation stions and

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Speaker 1: push the brand forward in this digital space. But they

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Speaker 1: advertise for that role in January and it's still accepting

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Speaker 1: applications in August um, so you know how successful that

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Speaker 1: push has been is a matter of a guest looking

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Speaker 1: at whether or not this drop takes off, will find

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Speaker 1: out in results whether or not, how like how much

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Speaker 1: they accept every quarter and crypto payments, and if they

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Speaker 1: ever fill this role, you know what that person's strategy

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Speaker 1: will be and what their goals will be, because that

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Speaker 1: would be quite interesting to see how that how they

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Speaker 1: plan to take the Gucci brand forward in a digital world.

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Speaker 1: They've also bought like a plot of digital land in

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Speaker 1: the sandbox as well, is a gaming virtual world built

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Speaker 1: on the Ethereal block chain where players can build on

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Speaker 1: and monetize their gaming experiences using non stopes and crissies

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Speaker 1: of experimenting with similar as well. They're building shops, outlets,

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Speaker 1: virtual galleries in the actual metaverse, right, so everything is yeah,

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Speaker 1: virtual alright, so we do have to go back to

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Speaker 1: the real world, in our real desks to do some

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Speaker 1: you know, reporting of the world that's not in the

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Speaker 1: metaverse for now, so amazing. Thank you both for joining me.

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Speaker 1: You can find more of Emily and taz is reporting

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Speaker 1: on the Bloomberg terminal on Bloomberg dot com and on

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Speaker 1: Twitter at Emily J. Nicole and at Tanzil Underscore Actor.

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Speaker 1: On the next episode of Bloomberg Crypto. Even if you

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Speaker 1: haven't ever heard the phrase the merge before, you should

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Speaker 1: know that it's one of the most important upcoming developments

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Speaker 1: in the world of crypto. We'll tackle this long awaited

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Speaker 1: software upgrade to the Ethereum blockchain and what might happen next.

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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily podcast from Bloomberg and

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Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. For more shows from I Heart Radio,

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Speaker 1: visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

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Speaker 1: you get you our podcast. Send us your comments, questions

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Speaker 1: or suggestions for the show to Crypto at Bloomberg dot

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Speaker 1: net or find us on Twitter. We're at Crypto. The

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Speaker 1: supervising producer Bloomberg Crypto is Vicky very Galina. Our senior

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Speaker 1: producer is Janet Babin. Our producer is Mohammed Farup, Associate

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Speaker 1: producer is Mosses and Um Desta wonder At is our engineer.

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Speaker 1: Original music by Leo Sidrin. I'm Stacy Marie Schmal We'll

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Speaker 1: be back tomorrow.