Speaker 1: Hey guys, Steve here, you are listening to one of
Speaker 1: our original twenty six episodes. If you listen to any
Speaker 1: of our new episodes, you're gonna notice that we're sounding
Speaker 1: a little different in these ones. Yeah, there's a reason
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Speaker 1: remastered because they had a really annoying hum. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean a huge thanks to listener James for doing almost
Speaker 1: all of the legwork on this thing. They'll also notice
Speaker 1: if you had listened to what we're calling the last
Speaker 1: twenty six episodes before and you're re listening now, the
Speaker 1: music and sound effects are gone. Yes, we've we've gone
Speaker 1: back to straight audio, so be warned. We sound a
Speaker 1: little different today than we do in what you're about
Speaker 1: to listen to. Yeah, bye bye, Thinking Sideways. I don't understand.
Speaker 1: You never know stories of things. We simply don't know
Speaker 1: the answer too. So Hi everyone, this is Thinking Sideways
Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Devin, I'm Steve, I'm Joe, and we're
Speaker 1: going to talk about a mystery and unsolved mystery I know,
Speaker 1: and it's actually my favorite kind of unsolved mystery. It
Speaker 1: turns out I'm seeing a pattern and the unsolved mysteries
Speaker 1: I bring, like the ones where people die. They're all
Speaker 1: cases where like apparently healthy middle aged men die under
Speaker 1: weird circumstances. That's really disconcerned. So I don't know what
Speaker 1: that says about the future of your guys lives. Run
Speaker 1: a story ideas going to be like, oh gosh, we
Speaker 1: have a perfect story because Joe disappeared the other day.
Speaker 1: Sound so weird. Sound hung from a tree but there
Speaker 1: was no rope. Well how did that happen? Okay, anyways,
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the lead mass case today.
Speaker 1: We're in Rio Rio de Janeiro, Brazil in nineteen sixty six.
Speaker 1: It's Auguste and Uh to TV repairman tell their relatives
Speaker 1: that they need to go buy supplies for work. UM
Speaker 1: and some accounts say that they also mentioned they want
Speaker 1: to buy a car for work. Uh And they're close friends.
Speaker 1: They travel a lot together. They're always seen together. They
Speaker 1: had money for a vehicle maybe, but they definitely had
Speaker 1: money for the supplies with them. The men who are
Speaker 1: Miguel who Jose and Manuel Uh later stop at a
Speaker 1: bar to get a bottle of water and they get
Speaker 1: a receipt for a deposit. You know, nineteen sixty six.
Speaker 1: You get like a glass bottle or something that you
Speaker 1: bring it back, You put a deposit on it, you
Speaker 1: bring it back there we use it ten cents twenty cents,
Speaker 1: which it was real money. You know, it's not like
Speaker 1: millions of dollars, but it's real money. It's worth the return.
Speaker 1: The bartender said that Miguel appeared to be in a
Speaker 1: hurry because he was frequently checking his watch. Some accounts
Speaker 1: I've read said that the bartender said that he looked nervous.
Speaker 1: I think it's just you know, semantics. At that point,
Speaker 1: somebody's retelling it to make it more mysterious and inviting. Okay,
Speaker 1: bounce around. The tailor is really told, you know, things
Speaker 1: get embellished a little bit too. So that's the last
Speaker 1: time either of them were seen alive. Well that's a
Speaker 1: quick story. Wait, okay, so there's gotta be more here.
Speaker 1: There's more here. So a boy flying a kite found
Speaker 1: their bodies three days later on Vintem Hill in re Aditionary.
Speaker 1: Both men were dressed in suits and wearing waterproof coats,
Speaker 1: which wasn't really out of the ordinary because it had
Speaker 1: apparently according to most accounts, most reasonable accounts it had
Speaker 1: been pouring rain recently, so it makes sense. You know. Again,
Speaker 1: there are definitely accounts that say it was weird because
Speaker 1: it was sunny, but I suspect that it probably was rain.
Speaker 1: If it's Readian arrow, the weather is, I mean, it's
Speaker 1: subtropical areas and the weather goes back and forth. It's
Speaker 1: it's known for storms. It's out of the coast. A
Speaker 1: lot of yeah, a lot of areas like like you know,
Speaker 1: when I was in South America, like they had the
Speaker 1: rainy season, and the rainy season is usually pretty nice,
Speaker 1: but then for about a half hour to an hour
Speaker 1: out of every day, it just dumps, you know, and
Speaker 1: so and then and then it clears up and it's
Speaker 1: nice again. Yeah and yeah, and so that's probably what
Speaker 1: the case we're down there. Yeah, So the rain jackets
Speaker 1: weren't really out of the ordinary. However, the lead eyemasks,
Speaker 1: which were like sunglasses almost but made out of lead
Speaker 1: with no holes poked in them, But that was a
Speaker 1: little out of the ordinary. That's a little different. And
Speaker 1: by the way, I soon pictures of them, and then
Speaker 1: they appeared to be handmade. Apparently they made them themselves
Speaker 1: vaguely handmade. I don't know they were there. I've read
Speaker 1: accounts that said they made them themselves and just for
Speaker 1: everybody to to picture what these look like. Because when
Speaker 1: I first saw this, it was really weird because the
Speaker 1: first article or two I read didn't show the photo.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't until I saw the photo that I
Speaker 1: understood what they meant by lead imasks. They look vaguely
Speaker 1: like like goggles, like scientific goggles like the A band.
Speaker 1: Have you ever went to the top of the eye
Speaker 1: doctor and then they give you they dialate plastic on
Speaker 1: your face. That's exactly what they look like. Yeah, or
Speaker 1: they look like safety glasses kind of like that. You know,
Speaker 1: they're beat out of lead and they have no eye
Speaker 1: holes poked in them. Um. They said that it's the
Speaker 1: sort of thing that someone would wear to protect their
Speaker 1: eyes from radiation, which was from common at the time
Speaker 1: when people were working with radiation. It was common at
Speaker 1: the time to wear that they have. They found the
Speaker 1: empty water bottle with these men um. They had two
Speaker 1: towels with them, which I don't really understand. Galaxy, Well,
Speaker 1: so the thing is about the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, right,
Speaker 1: it does say to always bring a towel. But the
Speaker 1: Hitchhiker's Guide wasn't written for more than ten years, obviously obviously, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: and and and correctly if I'm wrong, But in at
Speaker 1: least one account that I read, they had a plastic
Speaker 1: bag with them, and they had soaked the towels in water.
Speaker 1: I didn't read that. I don't. I didn't see that.
Speaker 1: I really didn't see that. So in one account that
Speaker 1: I read, they had a plastic bag and they had
Speaker 1: two towels in there, which they had when already moistened,
Speaker 1: and that that accounts for the need for the water.
Speaker 1: But I'll talk about that later. Okay. Is this your theory,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's a possible theory, all right, so we'll
Speaker 1: read visit that great. They also found a notebook which
Speaker 1: just confused everything further. It was written in Portuguese, and
Speaker 1: the translation read, uh, sixteen thirty b at a greed place,
Speaker 1: eighteen thirty swallow capsules after effect, protect metals, wait for
Speaker 1: mask signal, wait for masks a single signal. And that
Speaker 1: was it, just those two lines protect metal. Yes, and okay,
Speaker 1: and to add you know to it, the money that
Speaker 1: these men supposedly had wasn't found on them. You know,
Speaker 1: whether or not the kid who found them took the money,
Speaker 1: whether or not somebody else took the money, whether they
Speaker 1: just didn't have the money, that's maybe they spent it all,
Speaker 1: and maybe they did. I mean, water in Brazil is
Speaker 1: very expensive, so yeah, probably probably that the whole kiddie
Speaker 1: right there, that's the story. So we can get into
Speaker 1: theories now if you guys want, Well, I was gonna,
Speaker 1: I was gonna. I wanted to point out is that
Speaker 1: I know that the kid that found him, of course,
Speaker 1: turned around and called the authorities. And everybody's remember this
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty six, don't have a cellphone, so we had
Speaker 1: to run to the town and it probably didn't probably walked.
Speaker 1: He probably walked, and then he had to make the
Speaker 1: phone call and correct me if I'm wrong. But because
Speaker 1: of the conditions and where was that in the time
Speaker 1: of day, the police didn't go there till the next day.
Speaker 1: It wasn't as if they were in a hurry to
Speaker 1: get him. And these guys were already dead. Well and well,
Speaker 1: but and these guys have been missing for three days,
Speaker 1: so they've been gone for three days. That granted the
Speaker 1: boy didn't know who they were, But it's it's kind
Speaker 1: of odd that it took so long. To me, you
Speaker 1: would think, well, well, we've got to go get these
Speaker 1: people that are lost up there just fairly fairly terrain
Speaker 1: and there were no roads leading up to where their
Speaker 1: bodies were. They did all of the pictures of the
Speaker 1: crime scene. They had to carry the bodies out some things.
Speaker 1: I don't know what time he found them. I didn't
Speaker 1: find a record of that. You know, if it were
Speaker 1: later in the evening and it was getting dark out,
Speaker 1: I would expect that, you know, it was muddy, train
Speaker 1: it had been raining. Okay, that then that makes more sense.
Speaker 1: It would just seems strange to me that nobody rushed
Speaker 1: up there should take care of it. Okay. There are
Speaker 1: a couple theories, some mundane, some fantastical. Fantastical is exactly
Speaker 1: the word I was. One of the theories is that
Speaker 1: the lead masks suggest that the men were expecting radio activity,
Speaker 1: which is fair, um, but there was no radio activity
Speaker 1: found on the hill where they were found, which kind
Speaker 1: of brings up the idea that, um, these men not
Speaker 1: may not have been found at the reference to agreed
Speaker 1: upon place that might not have been where the agreed
Speaker 1: upon place was so that they may have gone and
Speaker 1: done their business elsewhere that these little notes reference. And
Speaker 1: to be fair, even there's no proof that says that
Speaker 1: this note reference to you know, that day. You know,
Speaker 1: they could have gone and done all of their business
Speaker 1: that had their little notes and then you know, run
Speaker 1: into a murderer who killed them and was like, whoa,
Speaker 1: there's lead masks, you know, takes the cash, puts the
Speaker 1: lead masks on and just walks away. But so for
Speaker 1: all we know, this is you know, there's still a
Speaker 1: mystery here, but it doesn't actually pertain to their deaths.
Speaker 1: Well that's we know the cause of death and days,
Speaker 1: so they were in somewhat deteriorate. What happened was they
Speaker 1: were found three days after they had disappeared or that
Speaker 1: they had been seen last. But the corner in de
Speaker 1: jan Eiro at the time was really busy, so when
Speaker 1: they were performing the autopsies, he left all their organs
Speaker 1: out a room temperature for just like hours at a time.
Speaker 1: So by the time he got around so just secting
Speaker 1: them to see if there was anything in them, they
Speaker 1: were just spoiled. There was no telling what was going on. Okay,
Speaker 1: so no, you couldn't un any ten so they couldn't
Speaker 1: run any kind of time, okay, And there was no
Speaker 1: outward signs of what it wasn't as if you know,
Speaker 1: there was not There wasn't like a bullet hole in
Speaker 1: their head or anything. Yeah, so robbery it seems unlikely.
Speaker 1: So robbery does seem unlikely. I mean, you don't really
Speaker 1: poison people. But they did reference capsules, right, yeah, they did.
Speaker 1: They didn't find any capsules, so they must have taken them.
Speaker 1: But you know the evidence of those would of course
Speaker 1: be in internal organs, which were spoiled because the corner
Speaker 1: was really busy that day, he might have been maybe
Speaker 1: that was he's part of the conspiracy. Yeah, um. And
Speaker 1: then you know there there are claims of UFO activity stuff,
Speaker 1: and there are a couple around this because these two
Speaker 1: men were UFO enthusiasts and the place that they were
Speaker 1: found was known as a UFO hot spot quote unquote,
Speaker 1: there were there were reports of UFOs being sighted the
Speaker 1: day before they were found, or I guess the night
Speaker 1: before they were found in the area, and it didn't
Speaker 1: none of the articles I could find made clear if
Speaker 1: these were reports that came before or after. There you
Speaker 1: know discovery, you know, and that's we talked about this before, right,
Speaker 1: that's a big problem if they come after they're not really,
Speaker 1: but it was this area was known as a UFO hotspot.
Speaker 1: UFOs were reported pretty frequently in this area. So there
Speaker 1: was a theory that since they were UFO enthusiasts, they
Speaker 1: went to this area to perform a suicide pact that
Speaker 1: coincidentally was at the same time that a mother ship
Speaker 1: would come, and so if they killed themselves on Earth,
Speaker 1: the mothership would beam up their souls and they would
Speaker 1: be able to travel with aliens the whole heavens gape
Speaker 1: actually like that. Actually they referenced it. You know, the
Speaker 1: joke was, well, maybe these guys were wearing nikes, but
Speaker 1: do you think these six so they in Brazil, so
Speaker 1: they probably weren't. But but why But in that case,
Speaker 1: if they're just going to kill themselves, and why they lead?
Speaker 1: Why they lead sunglasses? You know, maybe they were misinformed,
Speaker 1: maybe they thought they had to wear those could be
Speaker 1: like the old thing of when was it that they
Speaker 1: used to put pennies on your eyes for the boatman.
Speaker 1: So so they figured that the aliens were short unlead,
Speaker 1: and so they've just thought they could have been that.
Speaker 1: But it's you know, it's it's one of those weird
Speaker 1: things where there's a lot of cultural oddities around. When
Speaker 1: someone dies, eyes always come up. There's always you always
Speaker 1: place something on their eyes. And I don't know why
Speaker 1: that is. You just reoccurring a lot of things, and
Speaker 1: so it strikes the chord here. Doesn't make sense, no,
Speaker 1: but it strikes a chord that I can't help it.
Speaker 1: I can't ignore, you know. And the towel thing is
Speaker 1: is weird to me. You know, they say, well, in
Speaker 1: the case, they were expecting moisture, and it's like, well, yeah,
Speaker 1: it was raining, but you wear a raincoat. You don't
Speaker 1: bring a towel like you've gone swimming right when you
Speaker 1: get home. Yeah, So I don't know. The towel thing
Speaker 1: is still super weird to me. I don't know. So
Speaker 1: my thinking about the whole the whole towel thing, I said,
Speaker 1: is that if they were up there, supposing, supposing they
Speaker 1: were expecting to make contact with a UFO up there,
Speaker 1: they don't know exactly what to expect, but they're thinking,
Speaker 1: probably it's entirely possible. We can expect like intense light,
Speaker 1: intense heat, and so that was why they made themselves
Speaker 1: some lead spectacles because they thought, well, you know, we
Speaker 1: can go buy sunglasses, but no sunglasses we buy are
Speaker 1: probably going to be adequate, you know. There, So it's
Speaker 1: kind of a worst case scenario kind of thing. So
Speaker 1: they've had the towels along and might understand I read
Speaker 1: one account of this the paper there that the towels
Speaker 1: were in a plastic bag and they had been they
Speaker 1: had been pre soaked, they were wet. So by thinking
Speaker 1: is that their plan was that when the UFO showed up,
Speaker 1: that they would put on the lead shades to protect
Speaker 1: their their vision from intense light. Should there be intense light,
Speaker 1: and should there be very intense heat, they could pick
Speaker 1: up the towels and hold the towels in front of them,
Speaker 1: and the towels and kind of the moisture and the
Speaker 1: towels would actually absorb some of that he give it
Speaker 1: off in steam and protect them from the intense heat.
Speaker 1: And I think it was kind of a worst case
Speaker 1: scenario kind of thing for them to have wet towels handy,
Speaker 1: just in case there was they were experiencing intense that's
Speaker 1: really planned out, it is. I was also going to say,
Speaker 1: that's like one of the smartest theories I've heard out
Speaker 1: of you. Um So I think that explains the water bottle. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean they probably wanted to drink a little bit
Speaker 1: of a hiking but yeah, And my other thing is
Speaker 1: that is that why they died, is that if they
Speaker 1: were expecting possible radiation, they might have thought it would
Speaker 1: be a good precaution to take idine pills to protect
Speaker 1: their thyroid if they if they had pills that were
Speaker 1: a much stronger mix of idon than what they believed
Speaker 1: they were taking than iodine poisoning actually can kill you.
Speaker 1: And it's also possible that they could have gotten tainted
Speaker 1: drugs also, and they were just poisoned by the tainting drugs. Well,
Speaker 1: this idine poisoning kill you relatively quickly. No, not really,
Speaker 1: it's a slow process. Well it's not. It's not weaks
Speaker 1: or anything like that. But my understanding eyeim poisoning takes
Speaker 1: it's not an instant sort of but it's kind of pain.
Speaker 1: Kind it's a bit painful. You you're you're sick or not,
Speaker 1: you should throw up, you get diarrhea and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: So that's a mark against that theory. But well, I
Speaker 1: was gonna say, is one of the things that is
Speaker 1: reported about these guys when they when they were found
Speaker 1: is that the grass around them was undisturbed. So that
Speaker 1: means if they were sick and they were flailing and
Speaker 1: they remove around, you have thought that they would have
Speaker 1: beat the grass down and after a couple of days
Speaker 1: that grass isn't gonna have stood itself back really resilient.
Speaker 1: But yeah, not likely now. And and I don't know
Speaker 1: how thoroughly they examined the bodies. And of course my
Speaker 1: research and idem poisoning is indicate that it affects different
Speaker 1: people differently, So not everybody's going to have diarrhea, for example,
Speaker 1: but and it is kind of it's going to take
Speaker 1: a few days probably at least to die. Um, so
Speaker 1: that would lend credence if they were right on capsules,
Speaker 1: if they were taking for that reason, that they were
Speaker 1: just painted and so they just were poisoned by bad drugs,
Speaker 1: and which which happens even today, I mean and modern
Speaker 1: in sixty six obviously controls, especially in the Third World,
Speaker 1: thank yeah, in Brazil. Uh So it's entirely possible that
Speaker 1: they got just got a bad bade. Yeah, that's definitely true.
Speaker 1: Um so the other kind of well, one of the
Speaker 1: other fantasy theories out there is that these guys were
Speaker 1: time travelers. What yeah, so okay, And so this is
Speaker 1: the thing, right, is that like my reaction to is
Speaker 1: like what, I don't actually understand how that explains anything,
Speaker 1: except for I found one reference to one scientist who
Speaker 1: was also supposedly a time traveler that wore a raincoat
Speaker 1: and lead eye protection. But I couldn't find any reference
Speaker 1: to this, so like this apparent scientists time traveler anywhere else.
Speaker 1: It was just in this one thing I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: It's just it's one of those things on the internet
Speaker 1: that you find the blurb. Yeah, and you know in
Speaker 1: this article that particularly that I was reading, he was
Speaker 1: making all these pop culture references, and it was kind
Speaker 1: of like, well, maybe I've just missed out on this
Speaker 1: on this particular reference. Maybe somebody out there listening can
Speaker 1: tell me what you know that reference was too, But
Speaker 1: I don't know, we we don't know at all, And
Speaker 1: I couldn't like googling it didn't give me any insights. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, so that so, how does this theory work?
Speaker 1: So these guys went off, they traveled in time a bit,
Speaker 1: they popped back into in our time on the top
Speaker 1: of this hill, and the experience killed them. That how
Speaker 1: is that? I don't know that they thought that they
Speaker 1: had glimpsed something into the wrinkle of time and they
Speaker 1: took this these capsules to help them travel transition, transition
Speaker 1: or something, and it failed catastry orophically and they've died.
Speaker 1: So I you know, again, this is one of those
Speaker 1: like little blurb theories that I thought i'd throw in
Speaker 1: there because it's vaguely interesting. Yeah, it's like it's fun.
Speaker 1: That's it's really kind of fun to read the stuff
Speaker 1: that people come up with, even though it's obviously some
Speaker 1: of the landish. Yeah, so, um, that's all of the
Speaker 1: UFO theories. Um. There's one other kind of blurb that
Speaker 1: I kind of talked about already that was, um that
Speaker 1: we don't know that these notes are actually pertaining to
Speaker 1: the day that they died or to their death at all.
Speaker 1: The thing that none of these theories really explain is
Speaker 1: there's a little blurb in their note that says protect
Speaker 1: the metals. Yeah, I remember seeing. Yeah, so what does
Speaker 1: protect metals mean? I don't know, we don't know one
Speaker 1: of the other theories, which I think is probably the
Speaker 1: most reasonable, since they were UFO enthusiasts. They were kind
Speaker 1: of into the elect tronics of the time, and you know,
Speaker 1: they said, we're going to go buy a car, which
Speaker 1: would be the reason that they might have a lot
Speaker 1: of money. So the relatives weren't questioning, you know, why
Speaker 1: did you leave with all this money, why did you
Speaker 1: take your life savings, but that they were going to
Speaker 1: do a deal that had to do with radioactive medals
Speaker 1: or materials of some kind, and that perhaps they did
Speaker 1: take iodine or something of that nature to protect them
Speaker 1: from the radio activity of the metal. And they went
Speaker 1: and they did the deal and got these metal and
Speaker 1: then you know, died for whatever reason from the iodine.
Speaker 1: And who knows where they got these capsules. It may
Speaker 1: have been the person who was doing the deal. Anyways,
Speaker 1: it may have been like it could have been a
Speaker 1: way to make a quick buck, right, Oh, I have
Speaker 1: these radioactive materials you guys are looking for. Here, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna send you some pills to help protect you from
Speaker 1: the radio activity. And then you know, take the money
Speaker 1: and just follow them for a day while they die slowly,
Speaker 1: and then take your radioactive material back. I don't know
Speaker 1: the other like theoretically radioactive material. But so that's really
Speaker 1: one of my big problems. You know, they were waiting
Speaker 1: for someone to tell them to put the mask on,
Speaker 1: some kind of signal to put the mask on, and
Speaker 1: they talk about protecting the metal, you know, kind of
Speaker 1: in an The feeling that I get of it is
Speaker 1: like protected at all costs. Right, Those are two things
Speaker 1: that none of these theories really speak to. The fact
Speaker 1: that it implied their notes imply that there are other
Speaker 1: people involved, and that there's something that's they're trying to
Speaker 1: you know, get I guess the metals they're trying to protect, well,
Speaker 1: this whole thing from the outside it. As we've said,
Speaker 1: there's there's these elements that seem so far fetched. But
Speaker 1: if these guys are TV repairman and they're into electronics,
Speaker 1: probably the you know, the big technology that everybody get
Speaker 1: was like a ham radio or something at that time.
Speaker 1: It makes me wonder if they weren't doing what a
Speaker 1: lot of people do these days, the equivalent of getting
Speaker 1: on a form. We're getting on a chat channel and
Speaker 1: chatting and somebody realizing that way these guys are kind
Speaker 1: of naive and I could make a couple of bucks
Speaker 1: on him. And whether it was they intended to, you know,
Speaker 1: give him these pills and they were just knockout pills
Speaker 1: and they just intended to knock him out and take
Speaker 1: their stuff, or they intended to kill him. I don't
Speaker 1: know which way. They didn't and it went bad, or
Speaker 1: they did, who knows, But it seems like that that's
Speaker 1: the most plausible thing that I can get out of this,
Speaker 1: is that somebody was stringing them along and then when
Speaker 1: they died, just for to add to it, to make
Speaker 1: it seem weirder, to throw the police off the case,
Speaker 1: they took those silly little glasses and put them on
Speaker 1: the faces when they when they left him dead. But
Speaker 1: that's that's the only thing that I can ever see
Speaker 1: that that makes any coherent sense in this whole thing.
Speaker 1: That's the problem that it's none of it is coherent.
Speaker 1: It's kind of just like slapped on there. You know.
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, two guys found dead for no real reason. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's a mystery. Oh. Also, they had towels, okay. Also
Speaker 1: they were wearing these weird lead masks. Okay. Also they
Speaker 1: had a note in their pocket. That was like totally
Speaker 1: an explainable oh okay. Oh. And also on top of that,
Speaker 1: you know, my problem with the suicide pact, right is
Speaker 1: that they bought a refundable bottle, right, so they seem
Speaker 1: to intend to return. It's not like they went out
Speaker 1: there with the intention of never coming back. I mean,
Speaker 1: maybe they did, but surely there there's an option to
Speaker 1: just say, oh, no, we just want a glass of water,
Speaker 1: or no, we'll take the non we won't you know,
Speaker 1: pay the deposit. We're just gonna we know, for the
Speaker 1: receipt for your bottle if you're not coming back. Well yeah.
Speaker 1: At the same time, though, I mean, haven't you gotten
Speaker 1: a receipt and stuffed it in your pocket and then
Speaker 1: you know, at the end of the day you take
Speaker 1: it out and then you throw it away. The impression
Speaker 1: that I had was that it was like you had
Speaker 1: to really say you know that they would say, okay,
Speaker 1: do you want their seat to return this or are
Speaker 1: you just going to take it with you? That was
Speaker 1: my impression. And you know, that could be totally wrong.
Speaker 1: It could be that they just printed out a receipt
Speaker 1: and you know that that could totally be the case.
Speaker 1: But you know, in my in my little world, these
Speaker 1: two men who are like super excited about getting something
Speaker 1: trapes out into the wild with there. They're like, we're
Speaker 1: gonna come back tomorrow and it's gonna be perfect, and
Speaker 1: we're gonna return this for ten cents, which is going
Speaker 1: to be enough for bus back to our home. Now
Speaker 1: in the bus that they had to ride the bus
Speaker 1: like three hours. Yeah, it was three hours. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: that's that's a heck of a commute. Yeah, because a
Speaker 1: hundred and six from Yeah, so you know, and it's
Speaker 1: true they were UFO enthusiasts. Maybe they were going out
Speaker 1: to see if they could find a UFO or something,
Speaker 1: but obviously something went horribly wrong. It might be that
Speaker 1: they were just swindled, like Steve was saying, they were
Speaker 1: just if somebody, somebody gave him some knockout pills so
Speaker 1: he could take their money and flee, and then hops
Speaker 1: he gave them a little bit too much and they
Speaker 1: just sort of died. It's entirely possible, all right, It's
Speaker 1: just you know, a weird one that it's got. I
Speaker 1: have to say, so far in the shows that we've
Speaker 1: done that probably has the most clues left behind so
Speaker 1: far that make no sense. It's just like a menagerie
Speaker 1: of weirdness. I am. I am giving this one the
Speaker 1: menagerie war. Yeah, but you should know, like the possibility
Speaker 1: that that maybe these guys decided to just check out
Speaker 1: and they decided to commit suicide, and they thought, well,
Speaker 1: what can we do to make sure our names live on?
Speaker 1: And so they just decided to put together a whole
Speaker 1: pastiche of weird stuff. I'm explainable stuff. Let's write a
Speaker 1: cryptic little note, let's let's hammer up and lead sunglass.
Speaker 1: Not that's not the behavior of people who are intending
Speaker 1: to do themselves in that. That doesn't hold That doesn't
Speaker 1: hold true to any case that I've ever heard of
Speaker 1: somebody who's playing ending plotting their own demise. Never heard
Speaker 1: of anybody saying, well, I'm gonna make this as weird
Speaker 1: as possible. Yeah, And you know, we talked about recently
Speaker 1: that guy who disappeared under mysterious circumstances, and you know,
Speaker 1: he was uphone enthusiast and he you know, for you know,
Speaker 1: we talked about the theory that maybe he faked his
Speaker 1: own death and there was you know, he wanted to
Speaker 1: go out with a bang, and that's fine. That even
Speaker 1: seems more reasonable to me as like I'm gonna kill
Speaker 1: myself but also fake a UFO thing than this. You know,
Speaker 1: travel a hundred sixty miles when you're like pretty broke anyways, go,
Speaker 1: you know, make lead masks, which couldn't have been easy,
Speaker 1: you know, And I want to I want to speak
Speaker 1: to the lead masks. Yeah, I've read a number of these,
Speaker 1: and I was doing and I started thinking, well, are
Speaker 1: they lead mass? Are they really lead mess? And that's
Speaker 1: that's what I was trying to figure out what they
Speaker 1: look like. And then I started doing a bunch of
Speaker 1: looking around. And I've seen accounts of city weren't actually lead,
Speaker 1: but they were tin, which would be much easier to
Speaker 1: get ahold of than lead. Yeah, and you can kind
Speaker 1: of out with pair of tin snips. Well know, these
Speaker 1: things look like they were hammered out. I mean, it
Speaker 1: looks like somebody hammered them out. But I don't think.
Speaker 1: I don't know that they were really lead. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: might have been. Everybody said, well those look like the
Speaker 1: glasses you put over. I don't know, you know, And
Speaker 1: then and I can't really tell they do like hand hammered.
Speaker 1: I think. But but if you go, if you go
Speaker 1: to like your your local fishing store, you can buy
Speaker 1: those weights that come in like their cylindrical like you
Speaker 1: can buy Yeah, you can buy those ones that are
Speaker 1: in a long sort of cord of lead, and you
Speaker 1: can just you could basically pound that with a slush
Speaker 1: that was flat and then just cut out your sunglasses
Speaker 1: from it. So it's entirely feasible to do something like that. Well,
Speaker 1: it's just I've seen accounts to go both ways. It's
Speaker 1: another was like, Okay, well, if they're going to protect
Speaker 1: radiation in their tin, yeah sense, Yeah, I though they're
Speaker 1: going to protect from super intense light and that radiation
Speaker 1: ten works just fine, Yes it does unless there's a
Speaker 1: lot of heat, and then maybe again again we're going
Speaker 1: down the same rabbit hole. Yeah, and I don't have
Speaker 1: any more theories, you know, anything else you want to
Speaker 1: talk about with this? Well, so if you have any
Speaker 1: theories or you know, have anything to correct us or
Speaker 1: any more insight into this um, you can email us
Speaker 1: at Thinking Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com. Check out
Speaker 1: our website. We've got links. Probably will post a couple
Speaker 1: of pictures of the lead masks and that's thinking Sideways
Speaker 1: podcast dot com, so thanks for listening. Thanks everybody dot