WEBVTT - Give our love to Sandra with John Wayne Troxell 0:00:09.560 --> 0:00:11.799 Welcome to the Good Stuff. I'm Jacob Shick and I'm 0:00:11.880 --> 0:00:14.440 joined by my co host and wife, Ashley Schiff. 0:00:15.000 --> 0:00:17.439 Jacob is a third generation combat Marine and I'm a 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:21.200 gold Star granddaughter, and we work together to serve military veterans, 0:00:21.200 --> 0:00:24.600 first responders, frontline healthcare workers, and their families with mental 0:00:24.600 --> 0:00:28.000 and emotional wellness through traditional and non traditional therapy. 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:30.360 At One Tribe Foundation, we. 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:33.000 Believe everyone has a story to tell, not only about 0:00:33.000 --> 0:00:35.320 the peaks, but also the valleys they've been through to 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:36.600 get them to where they are today. 0:00:36.960 --> 0:00:38.800 And each week we invite a guest to tell us 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:41.360 their story, to share with us the lessons they've learned 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:43.239 that shape who they are and what they're doing to 0:00:43.280 --> 0:00:44.640 pay it forward and give back. 0:00:45.560 --> 0:00:47.480 Our mission with this show is to dig deep into 0:00:47.479 --> 0:00:50.640 our guest's journey so that we can celebrate the hope 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:52.640 and inspiration their story has to offer. 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:55.080 We're thrilled you're joining us again. 0:00:55.520 --> 0:00:56.640 Welcome to the Good Stuff. 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:01.720 You might have heard of our guests today, John Wayne Troxall. 0:01:01.880 --> 0:01:04.240 He was the senior enlisted advisor to the Chairman of 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:07.160 the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the senior non commissioned 0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:09.399 officer in the US Armed Forces. 0:01:10.080 --> 0:01:12.520 You retired in twenty nineteen after thirty eight years of 0:01:12.560 --> 0:01:15.039 service for our Greek country, and we have the honor 0:01:15.040 --> 0:01:17.920 of hearing him tell part of his story, the successes 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:20.520 and hardships that accompanied a life of service. 0:01:21.040 --> 0:01:23.720 Even though this was our first time meeting him via zoom, 0:01:24.120 --> 0:01:25.800 we really enjoyed getting to know John. 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:31.759 First. 0:01:31.760 --> 0:01:34.399 We just want to welcome you to the show. John 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:36.759 Wayne Troxall, thank you so much for joining us here 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:39.160 on the good Stuff. We haven't had the pleasure of 0:01:39.200 --> 0:01:40.520 meeting you in person yet. 0:01:40.800 --> 0:01:43.640 Yes, absolutely, Jack and Ashley, it's an honor to meet 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:46.240 you all, but more of an honor that I'm allowed 0:01:46.240 --> 0:01:48.360 to come on here and share my story with you all. 0:01:48.920 --> 0:01:52.320 Absolutely, and we're so excited to dig In born in 0:01:52.400 --> 0:01:56.840 Iowa and then served our great country for over thirty 0:01:56.840 --> 0:01:57.440 seven years. 0:01:57.440 --> 0:02:01.520 He's a couple of minutes. Yeah, Yeah, how do I 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:05.440 address you? I mean, mister secretary? 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:06.080 What do you do? 0:02:06.560 --> 0:02:09.000 Because look, I got out of the Marine Corps with 0:02:09.120 --> 0:02:12.600 well more than one page eleven. I'm just gonna guess 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:15.920 means you and I could get along just fine. 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:18.920 I prefer you to call me John. I try not 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:22.040 to be lost in my museum. I was the SAAC, 0:02:22.120 --> 0:02:24.919 I was a sergeant major and everything. I'm a retired 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:27.600 guy now and so I just try to be who 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:29.399 I am and what I'll always be, and that's John 0:02:29.400 --> 0:02:32.359 Wayne Troxel. So John would be fine. 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:33.720 I dig it awesome. 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:35.960 Well, the joy of this show is getting to share 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:38.280 amazing stories with our audience. But today Jake and I 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.400 are truly part of the audience ourselves, because you know, 0:02:41.440 --> 0:02:43.720 we aren't yet familiar with you or your story. So 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:45.799 if you would do us the honor, just start from 0:02:45.840 --> 0:02:46.280 the beginning. 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:48.640 I grew up in a loving household, and as I 0:02:48.680 --> 0:02:51.720 got older, although it was a loving household, I was 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:55.120 a mediocre athlete. I was a wrestler. I was a 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:58.320 pretty good student until I started discovering girls and beer. 0:02:58.600 --> 0:03:00.800 And then I think, Jake, you know how that goes 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:02.560 all of a sudden, can go south in a hurry. 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:06.400 No, but I know how that never happened. 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:11.320 I was looking for purpose and direction, and as I 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:13.880 was going through high school, I wrestled until I was 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:16.560 a junior, and then my senior year, I said, look, 0:03:16.919 --> 0:03:18.720 this is I'm not going to be an athlete. I 0:03:18.800 --> 0:03:22.640 know that, so let me focus on other things. And 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:26.440 I started seeing guys in my neighborhood that were coming 0:03:26.520 --> 0:03:29.840 back from the military, recruit training and everything. And when 0:03:29.880 --> 0:03:32.560 they left, they were just like me, a guy that 0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:35.640 didn't have purpose and direction and was going through life 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:39.040 doing the things that teenagers do, skirting the edge of 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:41.440 the law. And when they came back, though they were 0:03:41.480 --> 0:03:45.920 sinewy muscular, their chest was out, their shoulders were back, 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:49.640 their voice was booming. They were confident, and they didn't 0:03:49.680 --> 0:03:52.800 just walk anymore. They kind of saunters that air of 0:03:52.960 --> 0:03:55.840 confidence that they had, And I thought to myself, I 0:03:55.840 --> 0:03:58.880 don't know what they're feeding them in the military, but 0:03:58.960 --> 0:03:59.880 I want some of that. 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:02.720 John, Were you the first one in your family to serve? 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:06.360 We didn't have a lot of military presence, but my 0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:09.560 grandfather was in World War Two. I had two uncles, 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:12.200 one uncle that was in the Navy and a Vietnam veteran, 0:04:12.640 --> 0:04:15.000 and I had another uncle that was a career sailor 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:18.440 and retired as a Chief Petty officer. But they didn't 0:04:18.480 --> 0:04:20.360 have a lot of influence on what I was doing. 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:24.840 My older brother Tom joined the Army reserves, and he 0:04:24.920 --> 0:04:26.560 was kind of one of those guys I saw that 0:04:26.640 --> 0:04:30.279 came back and were transformed. But seeing guys like him 0:04:30.560 --> 0:04:33.599 and other guys that had joined the Marine Corps, seeing 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:36.520 them come back, that was kind of what influenced me 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:38.599 to say, I want to do this. 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:41.359 And how did your family react when you came in 0:04:41.400 --> 0:04:43.359 and told them that you were going to join the military. 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:48.360 Oh, they were supportive. They knew my mom, my sister, 0:04:48.839 --> 0:04:52.640 my older brothers. They knew that living in the west 0:04:52.720 --> 0:04:55.040 end of Davenport, Iowa, which there's not a lot of 0:04:55.040 --> 0:04:58.320 opportunities there other than to get in trouble, that I 0:04:58.480 --> 0:05:01.640 was doing something that was going to better myself, but 0:05:01.680 --> 0:05:05.799 more importantly, make me a part of something bigger than myself, 0:05:06.320 --> 0:05:09.599 and then I could reach any untapped potential that I 0:05:09.680 --> 0:05:13.560 had for success in my life. I got into the Army, 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:16.920 and as Forrest Gump would say, I was kind of 0:05:16.960 --> 0:05:19.800 like one of those round pegs. I just fit right 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:23.000 into the Army. And as I got through my recruit training, 0:05:23.080 --> 0:05:26.600 my basic training at Advanced Individual training, and I went 0:05:26.640 --> 0:05:29.960 to my first duty station, I thought, this is what 0:05:30.000 --> 0:05:32.159 I'm going to do for my four year tour, and 0:05:32.200 --> 0:05:35.400 I'm going to get out. And less than a month 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:39.320 after I got there, I met a girl named Sandra Jimenez. 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:42.360 On the first of February nineteen eighty three. I'm going 0:05:42.400 --> 0:05:44.520 to he won in a club with a fake ID, 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:47.479 and all of a sudden, I asked this girl to 0:05:47.560 --> 0:05:49.839 dance and she turned me down. The other Joe that 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:51.760 I was with a friend of mine, who was a 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:54.360 brand new private, I asked her like three times and 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:56.479 she turned me down. So he went and asked her, 0:05:56.520 --> 0:05:59.479 and so she danced with him, and I was like, no, 0:05:59.720 --> 0:06:03.880 she you know. So now I mean, I'm pounding beers 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:07.159 and whiskeys and everything, and I'm watching her dance with 0:06:07.240 --> 0:06:09.240 my buddy. And it was on an elevated dance floor, 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:10.960 and all of a sudden, he backed up doing his 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:14.359 move and he fell off the dance floor. So me, 0:06:14.520 --> 0:06:17.080 being the true battle buddy that I am, I raced 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:20.599 over there, jumped on the stage, took his place, and 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:24.120 after that, you know, the rest was history. We started 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:27.400 dating my wife and I. We got married six months 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:30.039 after I met her. She was pregnant soon after with 0:06:30.120 --> 0:06:33.640 our first child, and I realized in a hurry that 0:06:34.040 --> 0:06:35.720 this is what I need to do to take care 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:39.400 of my family. It's not individual responsibility. I have a wife, 0:06:39.560 --> 0:06:42.039 and I have a son on the way, and so 0:06:42.800 --> 0:06:44.839 I said, I'm going to put my effort into being 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:48.120 the best soldier I can be. And little did I 0:06:48.160 --> 0:06:51.599 know that from then on my career would span almost 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:54.080 thirty eight years. And I never thought that I would 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:57.239 reach the pinnacle of the enlisted ranks in the Department 0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:00.200 of Defense. But I just kept pushing forward, and my 0:07:00.200 --> 0:07:03.320 focus was the better soldier I am, the better leader 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:05.800 I am, the better off the men and women in 0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:08.160 my span of control are going to be, but more importantly, 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:09.560 the better I'm going to be able to take care 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:11.520 of my family. So that was kind of how I 0:07:11.560 --> 0:07:16.120 got started and how I pursued my career was always 0:07:16.120 --> 0:07:19.160 striving to be better the next day than I was 0:07:19.240 --> 0:07:21.280 that day. And so if I wanted to be an 0:07:21.280 --> 0:07:23.040 airborne ranger, I went out and did it. I wanted 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:25.080 to be a jump master, I went out and did it. 0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:27.880 I wanted to be a pathfinder, all these things. Wanted 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:29.840 to get a college degree. I went and did it. 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:31.760 All the things that I thought would make me a 0:07:31.800 --> 0:07:35.080 better person, better husband, a better father, but more importantly, 0:07:35.360 --> 0:07:37.400 a better soldier and a better leader. That's what I 0:07:37.480 --> 0:07:38.200 was focused on. 0:07:38.520 --> 0:07:40.800 And That's something that so many young people need to 0:07:40.840 --> 0:07:44.880 hear too, because it's not self focused, that's not self 0:07:44.920 --> 0:07:47.800 inter self gain, that's greater good all around. I want 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:51.720 to do X, y Z to make everything and everyone better, 0:07:51.800 --> 0:07:57.520 not just myself but everyone around me. That way, we're bigger, stronger, faster, 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:01.440 more effective. Absolutely, it's a beautiful thing. No wonder you 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:04.800 achieved what you've achieved, but you also did it with conviction. 0:08:05.080 --> 0:08:08.120 You set a goal and nothing was going to stop you. 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:15.600 So you've got this long list of accolades, titles that 0:08:15.640 --> 0:08:18.880 you've held, even conflicts that you've been involved in. Can 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:21.240 you think back to early in your career, was there 0:08:21.320 --> 0:08:24.680 a tipping point that really kind of changed you or 0:08:24.760 --> 0:08:27.320 shifted your experience in the military. 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:31.400 I had been in the Army almost five years, you know, 0:08:31.440 --> 0:08:34.400 I had just re enlisted and I got assigned to 0:08:34.440 --> 0:08:37.360 the eighty second Airborne Division and Fort Bragg, North Carolina. 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:40.360 And when I got there, I had been in heavy 0:08:40.400 --> 0:08:44.120 mechanized units and we were a peacetime military. So we 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.520 talked all the time about facing the Soviet military and 0:08:47.559 --> 0:08:50.480 the East Germans, but it was never a reality. It 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:53.160 was like a star that you could see, but you 0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:55.880 knew you were never going to touch And I got 0:08:55.920 --> 0:08:58.480 to Fort Bragg, North Carolina, and my wife and I 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:00.839 were driving on the base just to check things out 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:03.079 because we'd never been there before, and we saw this 0:09:03.600 --> 0:09:08.240 five ton truck with a bunch of grimy paratroopers with 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:10.559 camouflage on their face sitting in the back of it. 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:13.600 Obviously they had just come from a drop zone conducting 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:16.720 a parachute jump. And Sandra even looked at these guys 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:20.720 and said, Wow, these guys are serious. And she looks 0:09:20.720 --> 0:09:22.520 at me, Are you sure that you want to do this? 0:09:23.120 --> 0:09:26.440 And I said, absolutely, you know. But then I got 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:29.480 into the unit and I realized all we talked about 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:32.640 was being prepared to go to war. That's all we 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:35.560 talked about, even though we were a peacetime military. But 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:38.240 we're a rapid deployment force. When we go on Division 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:40.320 Ready Force one, you got to be ready within an 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:45.000 hour to come in alert marshall, deploy and go to 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:48.320 combat in less than eighteen hours from notification. And so 0:09:48.960 --> 0:09:51.240 even then, being a part of a peacetime military, it 0:09:51.280 --> 0:09:55.520 refocused me and it caused me to start being the 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:58.200 best that I could be because of the level of 0:09:58.200 --> 0:10:01.560 physical fitness that we required there, and then the level 0:10:01.720 --> 0:10:05.040 of additional skills that required, like being a jump master. 0:10:05.559 --> 0:10:09.599 And I still even in nineteen eighty eight, the Sandinista 0:10:09.720 --> 0:10:14.840 guerrillas from El Salvador invaded Honduras and we got alerted. 0:10:15.040 --> 0:10:16.760 I was in jump master school at the time, but 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:19.079 I didn't go. But we did a jump into Honduras 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:23.280 to show support for the Honduran forces. That was still 0:10:23.360 --> 0:10:27.079 not a combat deployment. It was Operation Golden Pheasant. But 0:10:27.400 --> 0:10:29.320 that kind of set a light off on me that hey, 0:10:29.520 --> 0:10:33.319 this could happen anytime. But even still I wasn't completely 0:10:33.480 --> 0:10:37.000 convinced that we would actually go to combat. Nineteen eighty nine, 0:10:37.480 --> 0:10:39.880 I'm on Division Ready one Force, but it's the start 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:44.199 of half day holiday schedule. So I kissed my wife 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:47.199 and my two sons goodbye, and I said, hey, han, 0:10:47.280 --> 0:10:49.880 i'll be back at noon and we'll go Christmas shopping 0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:52.400 for the boys. And so I kissed her goodbye, and 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:54.640 I got in to the base. And as soon as 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:57.199 I got on the base, it was open posts then, 0:10:57.760 --> 0:10:59.760 but there was an MP all of a sudden at 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:02.200 the ends under the base now and they were checking 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:05.080 ID cards. They said, hey, what's going on. They said, oh, 0:11:05.440 --> 0:11:08.280 we're in hand security or whatever. So I got to 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:12.040 my headquarters and they said, hey, glad you're here. We 0:11:12.120 --> 0:11:16.199 were just exercising the alert roster. We've been alerted. And 0:11:16.360 --> 0:11:18.840 even then me and my teammates thought, are they going 0:11:18.920 --> 0:11:22.920 to make us do an emergency deployment readiness exercise during 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:25.920 half day schedule? What kind of bullshit is that We 0:11:26.080 --> 0:11:29.520 still weren't convinced that we were being alerted to go 0:11:29.600 --> 0:11:32.040 to combat. Because if you in Panama at that time, 0:11:32.840 --> 0:11:36.400 Manuel Noriega, the dictator that was running Panama, had lost 0:11:36.440 --> 0:11:39.040 the election, but he did not concede. As a matter 0:11:39.080 --> 0:11:41.920 of fact, his thugs ended up beating up the guy 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:45.240 that actually won, and there was a Navy lieutenant who 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:47.559 was killed because of the unrest down there. There was 0:11:47.640 --> 0:11:50.440 a Marine Corps family and service member that were assaulted 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:53.040 and everything. And now all of a sudden, Americans had 0:11:53.080 --> 0:11:56.360 Fort Chairman and elsewhere were at risk, and so we 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:59.960 got alerted. We were sent to the personnel holding area. 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:02.480 We were trying to figure out what was going on, 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:05.480 and there was a freezing rainstorm going on too, and 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:07.640 we didn't have any heaters in the tents. We were in. 0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:11.400 So now not only are we clueless on what's going on, 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:14.000 but we're pissed off because we're freezing our asses off 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:16.920 and we still think this is some kind of exercise 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:18.880 that we're going through and we're not getting our half 0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:21.760 day schedule. So my platoons are Dave Freeman and I 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.400 finally said, screw this, let's go find out what's going on. 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.719 We walked into the brigade headquarters and as we walked in, 0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:33.400 we saw officers around this table laminating maps of Panama. 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:35.800 And we looked each other and said, I guess we 0:12:35.920 --> 0:12:37.880 know what we're doing now, And all of a sudden 0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:40.280 we not real there's our answer. And then when we 0:12:40.400 --> 0:12:44.360 got back to our tent, we were issuing ammunition, live grenades, 0:12:44.400 --> 0:12:46.400 claim wars, all of that stuff, and all of a 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:49.200 sudden we knew this was real. We were packing all 0:12:49.240 --> 0:12:52.160 of our ammunition in our combat gear, and the chaplain 0:12:52.200 --> 0:12:55.000 walks into the tent. Hey, look, no pressure, but if 0:12:55.000 --> 0:12:57.839 anybody wants to say a prayer, come on over here. 0:12:58.320 --> 0:13:01.320 The entire tent went up with the Yeah it's funny 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:04.640 how that works, right, Yeah, it's funny. How if you 0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:06.720 have the guys that are like nah, I'm not going 0:13:06.800 --> 0:13:09.920 to go to chapel. I'm too hungover or I'm still drunk. 0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:13.160 And then you get the call and it's like, hey, 0:13:13.360 --> 0:13:15.880 oh yeah, we're going. Hey yeah, I'll make it. I'm 0:13:15.880 --> 0:13:17.920 gonna go. You guys send me see it. I'll be there. 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:20.840 Well, like they say, the phrase is there's no atheist 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:24.240 in foxholes. So that kind of changed. And so think 0:13:24.320 --> 0:13:26.600 of this. There were no cell phones back then. They 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:28.880 cut the phone lines, so I didn't have the ability 0:13:28.960 --> 0:13:30.480 to call my wife and let her know what was 0:13:30.559 --> 0:13:33.719 going on. Oh man, And I just said, well, sooner 0:13:33.800 --> 0:13:35.360 or later, she's going to figure out that I'm not 0:13:35.480 --> 0:13:38.600 coming home and then I'm going to combat. Next thing, 0:13:38.640 --> 0:13:42.160 you know, we loaded up on those on that frozen 0:13:42.800 --> 0:13:46.800 tarmac at Pope air Force Base and we took off 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:49.240 and we're on our way to combat, you know. And 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:53.720 at one am we started parachuting in to Rio's airport. 0:13:53.800 --> 0:13:57.880 The Rangers were jumping on the military airfield, Document Airfield. 0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:01.720 We were jumping on the military airport. And little did 0:14:01.760 --> 0:14:03.800 I know that my wife found out I wasn't coming 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:06.719 home by watching the news that night and seeing that 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.760 American forces were conducting a combat parachute assault into Panama 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:17.280 to toppol Noriega and to reinstate or in state the 0:14:17.640 --> 0:14:22.760 rightful government and to protect American lives and innocent Panamanians. 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:26.120 And that's how my combat started. And for the next 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:30.240 week we secured all of our assault objectives, we expanded 0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:34.000 our lodgment area out, and we started taking down targets. 0:14:34.040 --> 0:14:36.680 But an hour into the first patrol I went in, 0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:41.520 we lost our first American specialist in Alexandro Manrique Lozano 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:44.840 from second Italian five or fourth Parisheet Infantry Regiment. I'm 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:48.120 thinking to myself at that time, twenty four hours before this, 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:50.600 this young man was thinking about going home with his 0:14:50.720 --> 0:14:53.280 family or spending time with his family over the holidays. 0:14:53.680 --> 0:14:55.680 Twenty four hours later he gave his life in defense 0:14:55.720 --> 0:14:59.440 of our country. And that told me that we've got 0:14:59.480 --> 0:15:01.920 to dig in, We've got to get through this, and 0:15:02.040 --> 0:15:05.640 we can't allow you know that we've lost an American 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:07.600 to kind of drag us down, and so we've re 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.680 We continued to focus and get after the enemy and everything, 0:15:11.920 --> 0:15:15.560 and by the Christmas Eve, we had lost four paratroopers, 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:18.920 two on an assault on what I call Tinaheatus Hill, 0:15:19.000 --> 0:15:21.640 which was this huge hill that we were taking down 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:25.640 the lt Grays, which were an elite force of Panamanians. 0:15:25.840 --> 0:15:29.360 But at about Christmas Eve, the fighting started dying down 0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:34.240 and I found myself pulling security around the Papal Nuncia, 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:36.880 the religious chapel that was in the heart of the 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:40.080 town where Noriega had holed up in trying to get 0:15:40.120 --> 0:15:44.720 religious protection from being captured by us. And so as 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:49.280 I pulled perimeter security out there with my team on 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:53.240 our shared and armored reconnaissance vehicle, there was a Marriott 0:15:53.280 --> 0:15:58.080 hotel across the street, and so I told my guys, 0:15:58.120 --> 0:15:59.480 I said, hey, I'm going to go check it out 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:02.200 and see if there's any payphones in there, and we'll 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:04.960 see if we can contact our families. So I grabbed 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:06.480 one of my guys and we went over there, and 0:16:06.560 --> 0:16:08.800 sure as shit, there were some phones in there. So 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:11.920 I picked up the phone and called collect to Sandra, 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:13.960 and that was the first conversation I had with her 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:17.040 since I had left, and it was a very emotional conversation. 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:19.680 I mean, the hair is rising up on my arms now. 0:16:20.600 --> 0:16:24.560 It was the first time one I've had my baptism 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:27.720 by fire ending up in two point ambushes and stuff 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:31.240 like that. I've seen Americans killed, We've killed enemy fighters. 0:16:31.360 --> 0:16:34.400 But now I'm having a conversation with my wife and 0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:39.120 our children. And within that three minute call there was 0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:42.400 a bit of solace in peace. But then after that call, 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.800 I had to go right back out into the combat zone. 0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:48.480 But that there, Ashley, was the turning point that told 0:16:48.600 --> 0:16:54.200 me that living this military life and this warrior ethos life, 0:16:54.680 --> 0:16:57.160 regardless of what service you're into, what you do, that 0:16:57.320 --> 0:16:59.800 on any given day, your life could change in a heartbeat, 0:17:00.280 --> 0:17:02.640 and all of a sudden you could find yourself against 0:17:02.640 --> 0:17:06.560 an armed enemy and combat as brutal and unforgiving as 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:10.479 it is. Unfortunately, good men and women perish in battle, 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:15.320 and we have to be best prepared to deal with 0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:19.120 that brutality and unforgiveness in combat. And I told myself 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:21.320 as a leader, I'm going to make sure the men 0:17:21.359 --> 0:17:24.520 and women in my charge are going to be always ready, 0:17:24.920 --> 0:17:27.399 regardless of how long I stay in the military. That 0:17:27.600 --> 0:17:31.840 was the point that changed me to now being always 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:35.240 wired for combat, even though we were still a peacetime military. 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:40.960 But then seven months later, Saddam Hussein invades Iraq and 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:44.720 I find myself back in a combat zone. But this time, 0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:48.680 I think mentally and emotionally, myself and all of the 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:52.640 paratroopers I were with in my company, we were prepared 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:56.639 for it because we had already experienced combat. That's what 0:17:56.920 --> 0:17:59.600 changed me into being somebody that was always going to 0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:03.359 be folkscus on being best prepared for the conditions we 0:18:03.440 --> 0:18:06.560 could face on the worst day of our life in combat. 0:18:07.440 --> 0:18:09.640 That's one of the blessings in the military. I mean, 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:12.600 there's no better way than just to get in and 0:18:12.720 --> 0:18:16.960 do it. That's the best way to understand and prepare 0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:20.280 for the next thing, whatever that is. And that's regardless 0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:24.000 of Army, Marines, Air Force, Navy, coast Guard. That's the 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:26.240 best way to know. When you talked about that with 0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:29.520 your wife, that's crazy to think about because we didn't 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:33.640 have the modern conveniences that we have today to be hey, haun, 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:36.080 I'm not gonna make it, I'm gonna be gone. Don't 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:38.440 know what I'm gonna get back. You didn't have any 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:40.960 of that. To not be able to have that effective 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:44.760 communication with your loved ones before you go employ what 0:18:44.920 --> 0:18:48.520 you've trained day in and day out to do. That 0:18:48.640 --> 0:18:50.560 brings in a whole different element that I've never really 0:18:50.600 --> 0:18:51.080 thought about. 0:18:51.800 --> 0:18:55.479 Yeah, and we had what we called family support groups 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:58.840 back then, but they were I mean they were about 0:18:58.920 --> 0:19:02.040 doing bake sales and stuff like that and trying to 0:19:02.200 --> 0:19:07.240 build morale, never with the thought that we might actually 0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:10.119 go to combat. And so when I got back and 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:13.879 I was talking to my wife, but also other military spouses, 0:19:14.280 --> 0:19:17.720 they talked about the first meeting the spouses had with 0:19:17.880 --> 0:19:22.880 the command, the rear detachment command, and they talked about, hey, 0:19:23.280 --> 0:19:27.119 your husbands were in combat. They parachuted into combat on 0:19:27.200 --> 0:19:30.080 the evening of the twentieth of December, and they will 0:19:30.119 --> 0:19:33.680 stay there and continue to fight until you know, Noriega 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:37.840 capitulates and Panamanian forces surrender. And in one of the 0:19:37.880 --> 0:19:42.640 spouses even asked, so there's potential that they could get killed. 0:19:43.440 --> 0:19:47.720 I mean it was an innocent enough question, but as 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:51.680 a peacetime military with peacetime families, you still hadn't put 0:19:51.720 --> 0:19:55.520 it together that, as you just described, Jake, the level 0:19:55.560 --> 0:19:59.879 of brutality, the violence of action equates to people get killed. 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:02.720 And so this in it is enough question, and the commander, 0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:06.040 the redetachment commander, said yes, some may not come back, 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:11.000 and I was so happy to hear from other spouses 0:20:11.640 --> 0:20:14.080 on how my wife was deemed as one of the 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:17.640 strong ones. Now, Sandra grew up as a first generation 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:21.600 Mexican American. Her dad was from Chihuahua, Mexico, her mom 0:20:21.720 --> 0:20:27.040 was from southern Texas. They had nineteen kids, wow, nineteen 0:20:27.119 --> 0:20:30.119 kids in twenty three years. She grew up poor, but 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:33.159 she had to be resilient through her childhood and everything 0:20:33.160 --> 0:20:36.760 and as she grew up. So I think this kind 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:40.000 of upbringing prepared her. And she used to say this 0:20:40.080 --> 0:20:42.880 all the time, and through my multiple combat tours, I've 0:20:42.920 --> 0:20:45.600 got three sons I have to worry about, and I 0:20:45.760 --> 0:20:49.200 can't sit around and talk gloom and doom or you know, 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:51.399 feel sorry for myself. I've got to be here for 0:20:51.560 --> 0:20:56.159 my kids. And so that's nobody prepared her for that 0:20:56.440 --> 0:20:59.680 other than her upbringing. But that was the focus she had, 0:21:00.000 --> 0:21:03.000 and in it she knew I was in combat. She said, 0:21:03.040 --> 0:21:05.280 I can't control what's going to happen with my husband, 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.200