1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,320 Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of 3 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election. 4 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade 5 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 2: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent. 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 3: Coverage that is possible. 7 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:18,279 Speaker 2: If you like what we're all about, it just means 8 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,799 Speaker 2: the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that, 9 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 2: let's get to the show. Good morning, everybody, Happy Tuesday. 10 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:44,560 Speaker 2: We have an amazing show for everybody today. 11 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 1: What do we have ristal in Dave, We do a 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 1: lot to get into a very latest coming out of Israel, 13 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: both a extension of that temporary pause and also some 14 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: indications of what is going to come next, So get 15 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 1: into all of that. We also have the White House 16 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: panicking over so called misinformation about the economy. Break that 17 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: one down for you. Some behind the scenes details about 18 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: what may have transpired that triggered the temporary firing of 19 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: Sam Altman before he was brought back at OpenAI says 20 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:14,360 Speaker 1: a lot about the future of AI in the direction 21 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: that that whole industry is going in. We also wanted 22 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: to dig into those violent riots that unfolded in Ireland's 23 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: quite shocking and some of the untold details about what 24 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 1: may have caused that outburst of anger and violence, So 25 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 1: we'll get into that. Also, APAK apparently extremely desperate to 26 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,399 Speaker 1: get Rashida to leave out of office. You now have 27 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:38,639 Speaker 1: multiple candidates who say that they have been offered twenty 28 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:42,120 Speaker 1: million dollars to fund a campaign against Rashida to leave, 29 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 1: coming from APAC affiliated donors. To break that down for you. 30 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 1: Have also got some news about what's going on at 31 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: the RNC not looking good in terms of their finances. 32 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: Maybe they should talk to those other donors. And there's 33 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: pay a lot of money flying around, and George Santos 34 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:57,480 Speaker 1: is going ham on. 35 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 3: His colleagues, going out with a bank sort of. 36 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 1: A Madison Cawthorne kind of vibes. 37 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 2: Maybe he's telling the truth this time. Okay, this is 38 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 2: this might be the most believable thing he is. With 39 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 2: all of that, though, before we get together, we have 40 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 2: our excellent merchandise that's currently on sale for the holiday season. 41 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:17,400 Speaker 2: We've got these cozy socks which I wear all the time. 42 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 2: But of course we've got the sweater, We've got the ornament, 43 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 2: we have the travel coffee mug, all of that, if 44 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:26,119 Speaker 2: you will, all of it available on shop dot Breakingpoints 45 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:28,359 Speaker 2: dot com or at a link just from our website. 46 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 2: And at the same time, you know, as a thank 47 00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 2: you for everybody, and I know it's the holiday season. 48 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 2: And this also includes existing premium subscribers who would like 49 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 2: to gift a subscription. We are currently discounting our yearly 50 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 2: membership at ninety dollars a years. A go ahead and 51 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 2: take advantage of that all of that at Breakingpoints dot com. 52 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:46,959 Speaker 2: It helps support the show, helps really our expansion efforts. 53 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: We're prepping, of course for the twenty twenty four election, 54 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 2: which we're kind of in the middle of a lot 55 00:02:50,919 --> 00:02:53,239 Speaker 2: more new focus groups and other new ideas and cool 56 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 2: stuff that we're able to bring to all of you. 57 00:02:55,280 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 2: So any of those buying merch or signing up for membership, 58 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 2: giving a gift, any of those really does help us 59 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:01,639 Speaker 2: out a lot over here. 60 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 3: But with that, let's get dis. 61 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:04,720 Speaker 1: I also want to say shout out to part who 62 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:09,519 Speaker 1: was wearing Oh Beautiful last night at Ryan Graham's book 63 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,640 Speaker 1: event here in the city and he looked fantastic in it, 64 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 1: and yeah it was Wanda say. 65 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 3: You know, I'm jealous because Kurt, you have a sweater 66 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 3: before I have. 67 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 1: I know that's exactly what I said to you. It 68 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: looked great on him though. So all right, let's go 69 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:23,800 Speaker 1: ahead and get to what is, of course, very serious news. 70 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:25,640 Speaker 1: I want to start with this, even though we do 71 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 1: have the news about the ceasefire temporarily extend. We're going 72 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 1: to break that down for you as well. But as 73 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: a way to set the tone for this segment, we've 74 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: been talking about how Nanyahu is under tremendous pressure. Basically 75 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 1: everyone in Israel wants him gone. He's just been trying 76 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 1: to hold on by you know, the skin of his 77 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: fingertips as long as he possibly can delay, delay, delay, 78 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 1: any sort of accountability to try to maintain his grip 79 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 1: on power. We now have a scoop, this is from 80 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 1: Israeli media about put this up on the screen about 81 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 1: the case he is making to his fellow Lakud party 82 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: members Lacud being you know, his right wing party that 83 00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 1: he has been the head of for some time. He 84 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:06,600 Speaker 1: says he should stay in government because quote, I'm the 85 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: only one who will prevent a Palestinian state in Gaza, 86 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: Judea and Samaria, which is the name that Zionis call 87 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 1: the West Bank. He says, I'm the only one who 88 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 1: can withstand US pressure. He goes on to say it's 89 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:23,480 Speaker 1: because he knows Biden for forty years, which has the 90 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: ring of truth, because Biden is so like relationship based, 91 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 1: very similar to Trump in that way, and I know 92 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 1: how to manage American public opinion. Now, keep in mind 93 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 1: that consistently, from the beginning of this outbreak of conflict, 94 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,160 Speaker 1: the one thing that Biden has always said is I'm 95 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:43,480 Speaker 1: committed to a two state solution. Afterwards, we've got to 96 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: get to a two state solution. So here you have 97 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 1: the head of government actively admitting at this moment not 98 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 1: only is he not interested in peace, he is making 99 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 1: an affirmative case that they should keep him in power 100 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 1: because he will. He is damn short and determined to 101 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:04,280 Speaker 1: make sure that Palestinians never have a state. So incredibly 102 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:07,359 Speaker 1: important context to keep in mind in terms of what 103 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: may unfold and Gaza going forward, what the political dynamics 104 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:13,479 Speaker 1: are going to look like inside of Israel. And also, 105 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 1: I mean, this is just thumbing the nose at the 106 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: US president at a time when we've provided them with 107 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:23,480 Speaker 1: unequivocal and totally unconditional support, including comments that there are 108 00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: no red lines for their operation here. 109 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 2: For me, that was the biggest takeaway because this is 110 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 2: it's obvious. BB has said it many times before about 111 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 2: preventing Palestinian statehood, about how the Likud party another should 112 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,280 Speaker 2: actually be hopeful that Hamas remains in power, because that's 113 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 2: the perfect cudgel to say that there's no reason we 114 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 2: should move forward with the peace process. But I thought 115 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 2: the fact is is that he's willing to say this 116 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 2: to his own party to try and save his own 117 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,280 Speaker 2: skin at the very same time that he's not an idiot. 118 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 2: He knows what we can't read or hit Google translate. 119 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:55,320 Speaker 2: We obviously can see clearly about what is happening. Don't 120 00:05:55,360 --> 00:05:58,479 Speaker 2: forget either, Crystal. We have a pretty good visibility apparently 121 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 2: into Israeli spy networks, because we had those Discord leaks, 122 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 2: and one of the things that came out from those 123 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 2: classified files, which we reported on here on the show, 124 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 2: was specifically about our visibility into Mosad and their efforts 125 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 2: to try and thwart Bebe eventually coming back into power. 126 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 2: So at a spy level, I'm almost certainly we're getting 127 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 2: updates in the same way that we spied on the 128 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 2: Ukrainians about like, hey, what are they actually saying to 129 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:26,360 Speaker 2: each other, and the fact that it's now spilling out 130 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:29,160 Speaker 2: into the Israeli press about what the end state here? 131 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 2: It just shows you how the fundamental long term goal 132 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:35,479 Speaker 2: for bb Netchunyahu and for the United States, and really 133 00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,919 Speaker 2: I think anybody who is legitimately pro Israel is just 134 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:43,560 Speaker 2: diverging to a point where it has to be untenable. 135 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 2: I mean, Bebe should have gone I think really the 136 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 2: day after October seventh, or at the very least at 137 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 2: the beginning of the war, to ensure real coalitional support 138 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:55,119 Speaker 2: inside Israeli society and to give anybody who's pro risual 139 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 2: in the US. 140 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 3: The unequivocal support that they would want. 141 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: But the issue is that while they have that with 142 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 2: the stated goal of US policy going all the way 143 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:08,800 Speaker 2: back to Bill Clinton and honestly even before that is 144 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 2: a two state solution and has remained unchanged. 145 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 3: It now actionably actionable wise. 146 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 2: It wasn't a priority under the Trump administration, the Biden administration, 147 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 2: or the Bush administration, let's all be honest, the. 148 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 3: Same with Obama. 149 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,440 Speaker 2: But it still remains the thing that we're all supposed 150 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 2: to be working towards. And if he is directly opposed 151 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 2: to the desired end state as articulated by the American 152 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 2: President and really by the American Congress, by all of 153 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 2: the Western allies who are supportive of him so far, 154 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 2: then why is he currently you know, getting the one 155 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 2: hundred percent support from the US Congress and from that administration. 156 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 2: So he's putting them in a place where, look, you know, 157 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 2: they can beat the drama of like we support Israel's 158 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:48,920 Speaker 2: ratchter defended himself. I think that'll last up until the 159 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 2: end of the war. But you know, eventually the bombs 160 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 2: will end. Eventually the military campaign has to come to 161 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 2: a close. And at that point, if they're going to 162 00:07:56,840 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 2: you know, already while they're you know, John Kerr has 163 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 2: said there are no red lines. 164 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 3: Secretary Blincoln has been like. 165 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 2: There will be no mass expulsion from the Gaza Strip. 166 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:13,280 Speaker 2: There will be no you know, leaving to Egypt and 167 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 2: never coming back. There will be no mass deportation. They 168 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 2: are going to remain in Gaza and there will be 169 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 2: a state. Now we're a long way away from that, 170 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 2: but that is the stated goal of US policy. So 171 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 2: for me, that's The big story is that he's laying 172 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 2: it out that his only future is one directly opposed 173 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 2: to US policy. In my opinion, US interest, which it 174 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:37,679 Speaker 2: always has been to have a two state solution. 175 00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 1: Well, I would also say it's countered Israeli interest, given 176 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 1: that you know, this direction of denying any sort of 177 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,920 Speaker 1: a state and propping up to US. Has that led 178 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 1: to security for the Israeli people. I think that's clearly 179 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 1: has not worked in that direction. And you know, there's 180 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: a lot to say about this because you always hear 181 00:08:57,320 --> 00:08:59,839 Speaker 1: this rhetoric about how there's no partner for peace on 182 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 1: the Palestinian side, and of course that's always been the 183 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 1: goal of NETNAHUO and people on the right wing of 184 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:07,520 Speaker 1: Israeli politics, which is the majority of the Israeli public 185 00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 1: at this point and have you know, been dominating politics, 186 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 1: always say there's no partner for peace on the Palestinian side. 187 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:16,679 Speaker 1: And you know that has some legitimacy, even though Hamas 188 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 1: actually even Hamas has now at points accepted the nineteen 189 00:09:20,679 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 1: sixty seven borders. But you can look at this, this is 190 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 1: a terrorist organization like all of that. That's fair, okay, 191 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: but this is pretty clear you don't have a partner 192 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 1: for peace on the other side either. And there is 193 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 1: such a fantasy version of Israeli politics that gets articulated 194 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:39,199 Speaker 1: by American politicians and American press. This is not a surprise. 195 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 1: This has been Netanyahu's goal for years and years and years. 196 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:48,400 Speaker 1: He stated it plainly. The continued expansion of settlements in 197 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 1: the West Bank. Just ask that settler that Isaac Chattner 198 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 1: interviewed that we covered here in the show, and she said, yeah, 199 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 1: the settlements are because we don't want a Palestinian state. 200 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:00,439 Speaker 1: And she goes on to say, it's fair very simple 201 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,440 Speaker 1: to understand. It is very simple to understand because the 202 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 1: more you expand those illegal settlements, the more impossible it 203 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: makes it to ever envision a Palingestadian state. The more 204 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,559 Speaker 1: you build up hum Us and the more you keep 205 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 1: the Gaza Strip and the West Bank separate, the more 206 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:18,199 Speaker 1: that you make it impossible to have a Palestinian state. 207 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:20,839 Speaker 1: That has always been the goal of Netnyahoo. That has 208 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 1: always been the goal even more so of his coalitional partners, 209 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 1: who are you know. In a lot of ways, this 210 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:29,079 Speaker 1: is something that Darrel Cooper of Martin made the right 211 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:33,040 Speaker 1: wing of Israeli politics has always been more honest, honestly 212 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: than the left wing or liberal part of Israeli politics. 213 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,559 Speaker 1: They're very upfront about this as a subtler colonial project, 214 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: very upfront about, you know, what we ultimately want to see, 215 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 1: is gazin' suspelled from the strip, any final solution for 216 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:48,280 Speaker 1: us to take back all the land. They are quite 217 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 1: up front about their goals, and here in the US, 218 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: American politicians just like put their thumbs in their ears 219 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: and pretend like they're not hearing it and pretend we 220 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 1: still live in this like fantasy land of the Oslo 221 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:00,000 Speaker 1: Accords and a quote unquote peace. 222 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 2: Prop Yeah, so that's actually I think the big problem 223 00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: is most Americans as usual have a disneyfied version of 224 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 2: basically anything that goes on abroad. If you want to 225 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 2: look to what's going on in Israel, maybe you should 226 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 2: ask people who's live in Israel. If you actually want 227 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:15,080 Speaker 2: to go to Israel, you maybe shouldn't go on an 228 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 2: apac guided. 229 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:17,439 Speaker 3: Tour or your birthright. 230 00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 2: Sorry to break it to you, just going on birthright 231 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 2: doesn't mean you actually know that much. 232 00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:22,760 Speaker 3: You probably should spend some time there. 233 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 4: Now. 234 00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 2: I'm not claiming to be an expert, but I spent 235 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,240 Speaker 2: a decent amount of time and I actually know people 236 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:31,600 Speaker 2: who live there and also have spoken to a pretty 237 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:34,000 Speaker 2: wide array. And then also you look to people who 238 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 2: have spent years and years of their life and you 239 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:40,719 Speaker 2: can what quickly emerges as a very dynamic complex, politically 240 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:45,120 Speaker 2: very split even religiously split in many cases, and ethnically 241 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:47,840 Speaker 2: split society, which is why it is always so difficult 242 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:50,240 Speaker 2: to describe Israel like as a single polity. It's both 243 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 2: a Jewish state, it's a sovereign state, it's you know, 244 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 2: it's an economic miracle, but it's also a security like nightmare, 245 00:11:56,840 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 2: at least for the United States and for the Israeli people. 246 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 2: So to break down really, I think this is what 247 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 2: Daryl also brings out from the Martyr Maide podcast is 248 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 2: he's like, look, the biggest issue is that you have 249 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:09,840 Speaker 2: these very small factions of the Israeli right and of 250 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:13,400 Speaker 2: the Palestinian right who have always at every turn resorted 251 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 2: to violence at critical moments to derail the peace process 252 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:20,559 Speaker 2: and inflame the tensions. And that is a deeply unfortunate reality, 253 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 2: and it reminds you of the power of these single 254 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:26,200 Speaker 2: incendiary you know, even fringe eras of society which are 255 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 2: able to use this violence to then flare things up 256 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 2: to a level where they make it politically impossible. You 257 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: can also read the Hamas attacks in that same vein 258 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 2: which is Hamas and the Palestinians were realizing and the 259 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 2: pa everybody was open and honest about this, that the 260 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 2: Abraham Accords and the normalization of relations between the Gulf 261 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 2: Arab States and Israel was an existential threat because it 262 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 2: meant that the Arab States would no longer even pretend 263 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 2: that Palestinian statehood was a political. 264 00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:56,040 Speaker 3: Priority for them. So what do they do. 265 00:12:56,120 --> 00:12:59,200 Speaker 2: They carried out this heinous political attack. They inflamed the 266 00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:02,760 Speaker 2: tensions of the Golf monarchies and of the actual populations, 267 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:05,960 Speaker 2: which are way more pro Palestine and let's be real 268 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:09,439 Speaker 2: pro terrorists than the actual Golf monarchs. And so now 269 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:11,559 Speaker 2: the monarchs are stuck in a place where they're like, 270 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:12,920 Speaker 2: we can't normalize relations. 271 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 3: Our people hate you. 272 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 2: And so to have them in a scenario where they're 273 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 2: normalizing relations and there's like bilateral agreements and all that stuff, 274 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 2: not even just in secret but out in the open, 275 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 2: impossible now, probably for a generation at this point. So 276 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 2: you have to always remember like what the meta context 277 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:33,599 Speaker 2: of this is, and that's where moving towards a Palestinian 278 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 2: statehood and at least if you wanted to make that 279 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 2: the goal, I think you would conduct your military operation 280 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:39,680 Speaker 2: very very differently. 281 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 3: And same with the US. 282 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 2: Part of why we are just stuck in such a 283 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 2: rock and a hard place between our domestic political support 284 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:48,000 Speaker 2: for Israel and the geopolitical reality of what the future 285 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 2: on the ground. 286 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 3: There is going to look like. 287 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 1: You can't lock people in a cage for decades and 288 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: think there's not going to be some sort of response. 289 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,079 Speaker 1: And there have been attempts, you know, always where's the 290 00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: non violent Palestinian resistance? I mean, there have been real 291 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 1: attempts at at the Great March of Return that happened 292 00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:05,240 Speaker 1: that was met with you know, sniper fire and people 293 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 1: being killed and massacred and their legs shot. That was 294 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: a genuine grassroots attempt in Gaza at nonviolent resistance. And 295 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 1: so you can't think that you're going to lock people 296 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 1: in what has been described by many as an open 297 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:20,960 Speaker 1: air prison and what has been described by some as 298 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 1: a concentration camp and think that there's not going to 299 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 1: be a response. Now as to the US, and I 300 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 1: do want to get to the immediate news here in 301 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: a minute. Biden likes to feign, you know, they're leaking 302 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 1: to the press. Oh, they're really trying behind the scenes, 303 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 1: like he's really pressing baby and he's given them a 304 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: hard time about X and Y and Z and trying 305 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 1: to push more aid and et cetera, et cetera. This 306 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 1: leak also reveals that any sort of gains that have 307 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: been made here in terms of the hostage deal and 308 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 1: the temporary cease fire, this didn't have anything to do 309 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: with us. This was all because of domestic political pressure 310 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: and the grassroots movement and the energy of the families 311 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: of the hostages, and the pressure that they applied from 312 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,040 Speaker 1: day one. Say hey, my family members are in Gaza 313 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 1: and we have to bring them home. That's what he 314 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: was responding to. And then the other piece of this is, 315 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:11,120 Speaker 1: you know, all this feigned impotence, like, oh, well, we 316 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 1: asked him really nicely, like we're really trying behind the scenes. Yeah, 317 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 1: but you're not willing to do the one thing that 318 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:20,480 Speaker 1: would matter, which is to say no, you're not getting 319 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: our weapons, you're not getting our money. We are going 320 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:26,120 Speaker 1: to you know, we're not going to provide you endless 321 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: diplomatic cover at the UN unless you conduct this operation 322 00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 1: in a way that is consistent with trying to achieve 323 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 1: Palestinian statehood and with trying to achieve the minimal amount 324 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: of civilian casualties possible. But you know, instead, the not 325 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: just the words, but the deeds have been no red 326 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 1: lines and unconditional support. The Intercept had a piece about 327 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: how we lifted all the restrictions on our weapons stockpile. 328 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,560 Speaker 1: There's normally a process that involves, you know, really supposed 329 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,840 Speaker 1: careful determination of what weapons goes to whom, trying to 330 00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:01,239 Speaker 1: ensure that they're not going to be used against civilians. 331 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 1: All of that completely lifted in this conflict. Let me 332 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 1: go ahead and get to the very latest in the news. 333 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:09,520 Speaker 1: As I mentioned now a couple times, there has been 334 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: put this up on the screen, a two day extension 335 00:16:11,960 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 1: of the ceasefire as additional hostages are released. Qatar said 336 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 1: mediators had secured that deal to prolong the temporary truce 337 00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: by two days. The US is welcoming that extension and 338 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 1: said it would like to see the pause has extended 339 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:26,880 Speaker 1: further beyond the additional two days. You guys will probably 340 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: remember the deal here was initially fifty hostages for one 341 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty Palestinians were being held in Israeli prisons. 342 00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: For every additional ten hostages that Hamas was able to 343 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 1: locate and release, they were going to extend the pause 344 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,080 Speaker 1: for an additional day. The hostages, they go on to 345 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: say here releases have received near walla wall media coverage 346 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:48,960 Speaker 1: inside of Israel, while thousands of Palestinians have gathered each 347 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: evening outside off prison between Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, letting 348 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: off firecrackers to celebrate the prisoner's release and bolstering Hamas's 349 00:16:56,560 --> 00:16:59,840 Speaker 1: political standing. So this is the absolute focus of at 350 00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:04,120 Speaker 1: times right now in Israel. But again to this question, 351 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,000 Speaker 1: I mean, the US is getting a little uncomfortable, you 352 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,320 Speaker 1: might say, with the level of civilian death and atrocities 353 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:12,960 Speaker 1: that have been committed here, and so there's a push 354 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 1: for let's extend the ceasefire as long as possible. But 355 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:17,919 Speaker 1: the Israelis are very clear that this is not the 356 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: end of their bombing campaign. Israeli Defense Minister, you havev 357 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: Glant go ahead and put this up on the screen, 358 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,879 Speaker 1: says that it will be bigger. The fighting when it 359 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:30,280 Speaker 1: resumes will be bigger and take place around the Gaza Strip. Quote. 360 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: The enemy will meet first the bombs of the air force, 361 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:35,120 Speaker 1: and after the shells of the tanks and the artillery 362 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 1: in the scoops of the D nine bulldozers and finally 363 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 1: gunfire of the infantry troops. We will fight in the 364 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 1: entire strip. So, of course, the initial bombing campaign was 365 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:51,440 Speaker 1: throughout the entire strip, but concentrated on the northern part 366 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:54,159 Speaker 1: of Gaza, which has now been effectively completely destroyed and 367 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: rendered uninhabitable. People are told to flee to the south. 368 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 1: They're now being told to move to what is a 369 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:04,959 Speaker 1: very small part of the south for this expansion, planned 370 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 1: expansion of the bombing campaign. As they've now said, Ohamas 371 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:10,439 Speaker 1: leaders have moved to the southern part of the strip 372 00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: and located in Conunis. So that is the plan for 373 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: the military campaign going forward. Effectively no end in sight 374 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 1: as far as they're concerned. 375 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, And this just kind of brings us 376 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 2: back to what we're talking about in terms of the 377 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:24,679 Speaker 2: political realities of the future. If we can put the 378 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 2: next part please up on the screen. Can the Palestinian 379 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 2: authority really govern Gaza after the war. This was written 380 00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 2: by Stephen Erlinger. He's a fantastic reporter. I've followed him 381 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,880 Speaker 2: for many, many years, the foreign correspondent currently working over 382 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 2: at the New York Times. But what I think he 383 00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 2: hits on correctly is that a boss, the PA have 384 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 2: never had less political legitimacy than at this time. That 385 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 2: the over the goal from two thousand and five onward 386 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:54,080 Speaker 2: to establish the PAS a legitimate governing authority mostly propped 387 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 2: up by the United States and the international community, not 388 00:18:56,920 --> 00:19:00,240 Speaker 2: really by the actual Palestinian people, and then you know, 389 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 2: docilely accepted ish by the Israeli government has actually made 390 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 2: it so that the entire generation that's grown up under 391 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 2: them feels as if they are not advocating for their 392 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 2: interests and are instead either puppets or props of the 393 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 2: West and over or docile companions of these roels, which 394 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 2: I can understand. 395 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 1: I don't think they just feel that way. I think 396 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:21,119 Speaker 1: that is the reality. 397 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 2: I'm only describing how they would put it in the 398 00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 2: kindest possible way. The problem, you know, and this was 399 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 2: the dream really of Oslo to have legitimate political representation, 400 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 2: and then the falling apart of that dream two thousand 401 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 2: and five early onward, has made it so that the 402 00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 2: US dream of simply installing some sort of pa government 403 00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:45,359 Speaker 2: over the Gaza strip really bears any question of whether 404 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 2: the population would accept it, because many of the Gazans 405 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 2: who now have been through this horrific ordeal, and while 406 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 2: they may not support Hamas, and in fact, you know, 407 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,879 Speaker 2: there's a lot of indication about Hamas support and all 408 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 2: of that that it's not nearly as iron clad as 409 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 2: everybody says. You know, Everyone's like, oh, well, they've voted 410 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:04,400 Speaker 2: them in seventeen years ago. I'm like, yeah, well it's 411 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:07,200 Speaker 2: been seventeen years. And they've also been rife with corruption, 412 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 2: They've siphoned off aid for themselves, They've enriched themselves to 413 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 2: the tunes of millions of dollars and built all of 414 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:17,159 Speaker 2: these tunnels. The population, arguably nobody has suffered more than 415 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:20,360 Speaker 2: the actual Gossens who have lived under Hamas rule, many 416 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 2: of whom are not fundamentalist Islamic. You know, they're not 417 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:28,720 Speaker 2: fundamental fundamentalist Muslims either. This is a very very different population. 418 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,920 Speaker 2: So put that all of that aside, they are and 419 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 2: any any sovereign nation wants legitimate political representation. And that 420 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:41,280 Speaker 2: is just where the big question of what can operationalize 421 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 2: the wants and the needs and the desires of these 422 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:46,679 Speaker 2: two point two million which is acceptable to them and 423 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 2: also acceptable to the international community, and that is it 424 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,879 Speaker 2: just does not appear to be what the pile stony 425 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:56,120 Speaker 2: authority is. And then you run into the same Iraq problem, 426 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 2: where any authority which is deemed acceptable to the West 427 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:03,400 Speaker 2: and or to Israel is automatically seen as a puppet 428 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:08,399 Speaker 2: that will have no actual governance capability. And then people 429 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 2: either don't show up to the elections or they support, 430 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,840 Speaker 2: you know, Islamic terrorism like the Sunnis did in Iraq, 431 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,880 Speaker 2: and they had no legitimacy in terms of the Iraqi elections, 432 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:21,840 Speaker 2: and then the only legitimately elected Iraqi leaders end up 433 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:24,880 Speaker 2: being people who are hopelessly corrupt and can only stay 434 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:27,719 Speaker 2: in power by giving the finger to America, even though 435 00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 2: they ones who are pay all of their bills. We 436 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 2: ran into this in Karzai, with Karzai in Afghanistan and 437 00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 2: his eventual successors. We ran into this very basically every 438 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 2: person who ruled over Iraq all the way up until today. 439 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,520 Speaker 2: I think we're running into the same problem right now. 440 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:44,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean Palestime, the PA basically cooperates with the 441 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 1: Israeli security, and so in the West Bank where you 442 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:52,360 Speaker 1: have you know, repeated settler incursions and violence pushing Palestinians 443 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: off their land, and the people who are supposed to 444 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,439 Speaker 1: represent there are nowhere in sight to protect them from this, Like, 445 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 1: of course, how are they going to feel about that? 446 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,680 Speaker 1: And so you do have this dichotomy of you'll see 447 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: some polls that are like, oh, Palstinians overwhelmingly support Hamas, 448 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 1: and then you'll see other indications to your pointing to 449 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,160 Speaker 1: Sagaa's like actually, no, they're very frustrated with Hamas because 450 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,879 Speaker 1: of their failures of governance and just like basic you know, 451 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:17,640 Speaker 1: ability to live your life and you know, be able 452 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 1: to get food and a job for your family, et cetera. Well, 453 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 1: those are basically they're only two political option, putting aside 454 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,480 Speaker 1: a lot of smaller parties. So you've got either Fatah, 455 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 1: which is you know, PA and is effectively an Israeli collaborator, 456 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: or you've got Hamas. I thought this article was really 457 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,760 Speaker 1: interesting because they actually talked to Palestinians about how they 458 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: view the political situation. They spoke with it. A housewife, 459 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:42,879 Speaker 1: a thirty year old housewife from Ramala that's in the 460 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 1: West Bank, asked if the Palestinian authority could run Gaza. 461 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:50,160 Speaker 1: She said absolutely not. The PA is just sitting she said, 462 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:52,600 Speaker 1: with many years without elections. The one who does for 463 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: the people should be in charge of the people, she added, 464 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,600 Speaker 1: referring to Hamas. They also talked about you know the 465 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:02,160 Speaker 1: reason that Hamas gains support because if you look at 466 00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 1: support for violent resistance versus more moderate forces throughout Palestinian history, 467 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,360 Speaker 1: what you see is when peace is being negotiated, it's 468 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:16,399 Speaker 1: the legitimate possibility. You see support for the armed violent 469 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: resistance plummet when there's an actual prospect of real peace. 470 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:23,280 Speaker 1: So this article points out the failure to reach a 471 00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:26,399 Speaker 1: negotiated piece has made the other obvious alternative, that of 472 00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:30,360 Speaker 1: armed Palestinian resistance is really occupation, more acceptable and popular. 473 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 1: Go on to quote a moderate Palestinian who is the 474 00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:36,640 Speaker 1: president of Al Kud's University. From the Palestinian point of view, 475 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 1: he said, October seventh, look like a miracle. This fortress 476 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 1: Israel suddenly seemed vulnerable. This professor goes on to say 477 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:45,879 Speaker 1: that he abhors the violence that was perpetrated, but was 478 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: clear about the impact. Who is Palestinian leadership now it's Hamas, 479 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 1: like it or not. At the moment, Hamas is seen 480 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: by Palestinians as the foremost representative of Palestinian interests and 481 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 1: why because no one else is. The PA does not 482 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:03,639 Speaker 1: figure in people's minds. Another prominent Palestatim Polster, sent his 483 00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: latest survey, not yet published, sixty six percent of pilstatings 484 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,160 Speaker 1: in the West Bank regard the PA as a burden. 485 00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:10,960 Speaker 1: These are the people that we want to put in 486 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:13,960 Speaker 1: charge of everybody. Everyone already hates them. Some eighty five 487 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 1: percent went mak Muda Bas, who is the head, to resign, 488 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 1: and that means more than sixty percent of his own 489 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,560 Speaker 1: rank and file in Fatah want him to go. So 490 00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:25,040 Speaker 1: what they're saying is that one of the only possible 491 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:30,680 Speaker 1: potential political solutions would be an agreement to disarm Humas 492 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 1: and actually bring them in as part of a more 493 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 1: legitimate governing coalition, because the PA has no legitimate legitimacy whatsoever. 494 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 1: And that's all that is left. And in fact, if 495 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:45,680 Speaker 1: you put this next piece up on the screen, there 496 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: are Arab leaders who are trying right now to get 497 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:52,040 Speaker 1: Hummas to lay down their arms. They're saying like, listen, 498 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: you stand no chance. You may as well lay down 499 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 1: your arms now before they are destroyed, before you are destroyed. 500 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:01,160 Speaker 1: And they also suggested that should Humas disarm, they could 501 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:04,560 Speaker 1: join the leadership of the PLO as a purely political party. 502 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 1: So this is an active conversation. There's one other piece, Sagger, 503 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:10,159 Speaker 1: that I want to mention before I get your reaction 504 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:11,919 Speaker 1: to all of this, which is, you know a lot 505 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 1: of people say, oh, who could be the you know, 506 00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,520 Speaker 1: who could be the head who has legitimacy among the 507 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: Palestining people, who's a possible leader here? And the person 508 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,359 Speaker 1: that I keep seeing brought up is Marlon Bargudi, who 509 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,119 Speaker 1: is right now being held in Israeli prison because of 510 00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:30,240 Speaker 1: his involvement with the Second Intifada. But this is someone 511 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: who has, unlike Mankmoudabas, he is not a mus and 512 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:38,639 Speaker 1: he has widespread support and legitimacy among the Palestining people. 513 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:41,760 Speaker 1: So if you're actually serious about a potential you know, 514 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: post war government, he would seem like a logical potential choice. 515 00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 2: Problem with all this is it makes sense on paper, 516 00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:50,880 Speaker 2: and if you were to ask me how this will 517 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 2: eventually end up. Decades from now, It'll probably look like this. 518 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 2: The issue is that through all of human history, it's 519 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 2: the bitterest pill on earth to swallow, to look a 520 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 2: man in the face who's tried to call you and 521 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:01,960 Speaker 2: who ordered people who. 522 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 3: You know, is death. 523 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 2: And the only really way to get there is a 524 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:09,800 Speaker 2: ton more death. And I don't condone it, but that's honestly, 525 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 2: that's the reality. For the Israelis to accept something like that, 526 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,440 Speaker 2: they are going to have to go through a brutal 527 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 2: occupation regime. They're gonna have to exhaust every other possibility 528 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 2: force it. 529 00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:21,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, we a we would have. 530 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:23,680 Speaker 2: Even if we force it, I'm not sure they could 531 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:25,480 Speaker 2: accept it at this current moment or even in the 532 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:27,920 Speaker 2: next year or even two years. The memories of October seventh, 533 00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,360 Speaker 2: ay are just going to be too big to swallow. 534 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 2: But twenty years from now, in the same way, the 535 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 2: US commanders who spent their entire careers trying to kill 536 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 2: the Taliban eventually found I mean, imagine, you know, an 537 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,200 Speaker 2: insane situation where you have the commander of Scentcom whose 538 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 2: entire job was to kill Taliban, then on the phone 539 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,280 Speaker 2: with the Taliban negotiating an exit from Kabble. That's a 540 00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 2: surreal moment, but honestly, that's mostly how those things end up. 541 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 2: Even in the First World War, if you ever look 542 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,040 Speaker 2: at any sort of negotiated solution where you don't have 543 00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 2: unconditional surrender, it just takes like millions and millions of 544 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 2: people to die for people to even entertain the possibility 545 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,680 Speaker 2: of sitting across from people who have tried to kill 546 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:05,400 Speaker 2: you in the past. 547 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 3: Obviously, that's really unfortunate. 548 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:11,400 Speaker 2: I however, though, in the same way that those those 549 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 2: conflicts were easily foreseen as how they would eventually end up, 550 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,119 Speaker 2: this one also just seems very very obvious to me. 551 00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:19,800 Speaker 3: It just seems that politically it's going to be incredibly difficult. 552 00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:21,680 Speaker 2: It would take America to force it, and it would 553 00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:25,359 Speaker 2: take Israel honestly suffering a tremendous loss either in soldiers 554 00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:28,360 Speaker 2: or in economic costs, and possibly both before they could 555 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,320 Speaker 2: entertain it. And of course Natanyahu would have to be 556 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:32,760 Speaker 2: long long gone ye before you could get to it, 557 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:34,679 Speaker 2: which is part of why I think it's you know, 558 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,960 Speaker 2: it's even worse because you just know how much of 559 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 2: a Gordian knot that this is going to remain and around, 560 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 2: I think all of international politics for honestly decades, decades 561 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:44,160 Speaker 2: to come. 562 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:45,600 Speaker 3: Well, i'll see how it can end. 563 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 1: Unfortunately, I agree with you that it seems impossible to imagine, yeah, 564 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 1: that out of this just I actually get a peace 565 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 1: broad and we actually get a two state solution and 566 00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:57,160 Speaker 1: you know, rights for Palestinians. But there's also no doubt 567 00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,200 Speaker 1: in my mind that even if you're just if, even 568 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 1: if you just care about security for israelis that's the 569 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: direction we should go in, because you can't keep people 570 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: locked up, you know, you can't keep them in this 571 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 1: apartheid system in the West Bank with settler violence and 572 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 1: continued incursions on their land. You can't keep the indefinite blockade. 573 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: You can't keep destroying them and mowing them and mowing 574 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 1: the grass and these horrific wars and think that this 575 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,760 Speaker 1: is going to provide peace and security for your own people. 576 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,840 Speaker 1: At the same time, there's new reporting about internal dissent 577 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,879 Speaker 1: within the White House about the way that they have 578 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:36,280 Speaker 1: provided unconditional support to Israel, both publicly and through their actions. 579 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,800 Speaker 1: As we were saying before, this was a really interesting 580 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,440 Speaker 1: and revealing piece of reporting. Put this up on the 581 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: screen from the Washington Post. They start off by talking 582 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: about how earlier this month, a group of about twenty 583 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:51,320 Speaker 1: distressed White House staffers requested a meeting with Biden's top advisors. 584 00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,400 Speaker 1: The diverse group had three main issues they wanted to discuss, 585 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 1: and this was with White House Chief of Staff Jeff Science, 586 00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 1: Senior Advisor and Needed Done Deputy National Secure Already Advisor 587 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:04,120 Speaker 1: John Feiner. They wanted to know the administration's strategy for 588 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 1: curbing the number of civilian deaths, the message it plans 589 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 1: to send on the conflict, and its post war vision 590 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 1: for the region. The aides, they say, listen respectfully, but 591 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,160 Speaker 1: participants felt that they fell back on familiar talking points 592 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: and basically did nothing to alleviate their concerns in this 593 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 1: private meeting. There's some interesting details here about why Biden 594 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: has gone in the direction that he's gone, and it 595 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:28,240 Speaker 1: harkens back to what Boebe was saying about a I've 596 00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:30,200 Speaker 1: known this guy for forty years. I can control him. 597 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:31,760 Speaker 1: Don't worry about it. That's why you got to keep 598 00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,479 Speaker 1: me in place. Biden went and visited Israel back in 599 00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy three and met with then Prime Minister Goldemeier. 600 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:43,680 Speaker 1: And at the time, you know, Israel was a very 601 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 1: different state politically, it was basically left leaning. It was 602 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,600 Speaker 1: you know, much less of a sort of military behemoth 603 00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 1: as than it is now. Now it is this incredibly 604 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:56,600 Speaker 1: right wing state with the you know, the occupation war, 605 00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,560 Speaker 1: vicious and brutal than it's ever been. But he still 606 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,280 Speaker 1: has this like nostalgic view of his trip there and 607 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:06,360 Speaker 1: meeting with gold in my ear. So that's part of 608 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,280 Speaker 1: I mean, this classic Biden, right, that's part. 609 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 3: Of my life think. But it's not funny. 610 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, right, he has not updated his view since nineteen 611 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: seventy three, is basically the view that you come away with. 612 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,560 Speaker 1: Biden aids are admitting that this is kind of a disaster. 613 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 1: The division inside the White House is to some degree 614 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:27,680 Speaker 1: between Biden's senior longtime aids, they say, in an array 615 00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 1: of younger staffers of diverse backgrounds. But even top advisors 616 00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 1: say they recognize the conflict has hurt America's global standing. Quote, 617 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 1: we are taking on a lot of water on Israel's behalf. 618 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,000 Speaker 1: So even the people who are most inclined to back 619 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 1: Biden's support of this war on Gaza, even they know 620 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:49,360 Speaker 1: this has been really bad for us. And there's one 621 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 1: other piece here that I wanted to lay out that 622 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: got a lot of attention. You guys might remember Biden 623 00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: called into question the debt counts coming out of Gaza, 624 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: and you know, really trying to un the idea that 625 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,600 Speaker 1: there has been just mass civilian death in this indiscriminated 626 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,160 Speaker 1: bombing campaign, including seventy percent women and children who'd been 627 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:11,840 Speaker 1: killed here. Apparently he has, they say, at times, wrestled 628 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 1: with his own emotions regarding the war. On October twenty fifth, 629 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: he voice skepticism about that Gaza death toll. He says, 630 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,160 Speaker 1: I have no notion about the Palace about that the 631 00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 1: Palestinans are telling the truth about how many people are killed. 632 00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:26,280 Speaker 1: The very next day, Biden met with five prominent Muslim 633 00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,000 Speaker 1: Americans who protested what they saw is his insensitivity to 634 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,640 Speaker 1: the civilians who were dying. All spoke of people they 635 00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 1: knew who had been affected by the suffering and gods, 636 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,760 Speaker 1: including a woman who had lost one hundred members of 637 00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:40,760 Speaker 1: her family, and he appeared to be affected by their account. 638 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 1: He said, I'm sorry, I'm disappointed in myself, he told 639 00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 1: the group, accordinated to people familiar with the meeting, I 640 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,800 Speaker 1: will do better. Meeting was supposed to be thirty minutes, 641 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: ended up lasting for an hour or so. Even behind 642 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: the scenes, even he admitted that he was wrong to 643 00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,280 Speaker 1: call into question the rate of civilian death that is 644 00:31:58,360 --> 00:31:59,240 Speaker 1: unfolding in Gaza. 645 00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 2: Well, I mean the thing is is, instead of trusting 646 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 2: the Gaza health Ministry or any of that, we have 647 00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,960 Speaker 2: just looked to what Israeli sources are saying. And these 648 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:09,880 Speaker 2: Raelies are like, yeah, it's between ten to twenty thousand. 649 00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 2: That's what these rerely military says. So even if you 650 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,360 Speaker 2: don't believe them, you should believe the others. And you know, 651 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 2: my thing is, I instinctally am in a distrust most 652 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,720 Speaker 2: of what is put out by either of these parties. 653 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 2: But one of the things that reporting wise was Ryan 654 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 2: Graham just going and checking the names of people who 655 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 2: acclaimed dead and then going, I think that's actually a 656 00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:29,640 Speaker 2: journalistic possibility, and. 657 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 3: The others it's not sure why more people haven't looked 658 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:31,880 Speaker 3: into that. 659 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:34,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, I mean, yeah, leave it to Ryan, just like, 660 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,360 Speaker 1: let me make this actually shack oh. Turns out it 661 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: was accurate, if anything was understating the deaths. Yeah, and 662 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:42,680 Speaker 1: you can also look at past conflicts where the same 663 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,880 Speaker 1: Gaza health ministry run by Humas was accurate more or 664 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,760 Speaker 1: less in their accounts. So you know, we have history 665 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,360 Speaker 1: to judge by. So in any case, it shows you 666 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:55,080 Speaker 1: that even within the White House, despite their bluster and 667 00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 1: their continued insistence on like staying the course with unconditional support, 668 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,360 Speaker 1: even the people who most support this direction know that 669 00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,840 Speaker 1: in terms of world standing and in terms of the politics, 670 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:07,040 Speaker 1: it's been an utter disaster. 671 00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 3: Yeah. 672 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 2: Well, you know, referencing earlier book that I had had 673 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 2: here in the work of John Meyerscheimer, he called all 674 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:15,960 Speaker 2: of this a long, long time ago. He's actually done 675 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 2: a couple of podcasts working on trying to get it. 676 00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, we'd like to have I really would like to. 677 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,360 Speaker 2: I haven't said with him because he was a a big, 678 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 2: a big influence on my thinking around this subject and 679 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:25,840 Speaker 2: has basically on every subject for a long time. 680 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: So at the same time, we wanted to give you 681 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 1: an update out of Vermont. You may have been following 682 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,640 Speaker 1: the story already put this up on the screenect. A 683 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 1: suspect has been arrested in the shooting of three men 684 00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: of Palestiniane Descent. This occurred near the University of Vermont. 685 00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 1: That suspect has already now pled not guilty to the shooting. 686 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 1: Two of the victims here are in stable condition. The 687 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,160 Speaker 1: third is being treated for more serious injuries. The suspect 688 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 1: who was arrested is named Jason Eaton. He is forty 689 00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 1: eight years old. Made his initial court appearance. This is 690 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 1: now being investigated as a hate crime. The FBI and 691 00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:08,080 Speaker 1: the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives are assisting 692 00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:13,000 Speaker 1: Vermont authorities in that investigation. And basically what happened here 693 00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:16,640 Speaker 1: is these three men who are from Palestine, from the 694 00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,359 Speaker 1: West Bank. They were actually out walking in Burlington. They 695 00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,280 Speaker 1: were going to one of their grandmother's house for Thanksgiving dinner. 696 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,319 Speaker 1: They'd gone bowling, they were just coming back. Two of 697 00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 1: them were wearing the Kafia scarves, which are synonymous with 698 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:34,799 Speaker 1: Palestine and with the Palestinian liberation struggle as well, so 699 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 1: they were easily identifiable as Palestinian or Arab. They were speaking, 700 00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:42,200 Speaker 1: they said a mix of sort of Arab and English, 701 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:47,120 Speaker 1: and this person came out and shot them. We now 702 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: have a little bit of details about I mean, you know, 703 00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 1: everybody goes in scripts social media accounts to see what 704 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:54,359 Speaker 1: they can figure out about who this person is, and 705 00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 1: you know what possible motive you could potentially discern here 706 00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 1: from their actions. Put this up on the screen. In 707 00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:06,320 Speaker 1: a now locked account on x, Jason Eaton described himself 708 00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:12,040 Speaker 1: as a radical system citizen who patrols democracy misspelled with 709 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:17,600 Speaker 1: a K, and capitalism for oath creepers. His banner image 710 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:23,080 Speaker 1: features bold texts saying libertarians want trans furries to be 711 00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:27,680 Speaker 1: able to protect their cannabis farms with unregistered machine guns. Okay, 712 00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:29,560 Speaker 1: I don't know what to make of any of that. 713 00:35:30,600 --> 00:35:35,000 Speaker 1: His archive posts are apparently a little more moderated. He's 714 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:37,000 Speaker 1: got a lot of criticism of the IRS and the FED, 715 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,120 Speaker 1: describes himself as a libertarian, expresses support for both democratic 716 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:44,120 Speaker 1: and Republican lawmakers. He also had a substack, the one 717 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: that remains up. There is apparently some long dissertation on 718 00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:52,120 Speaker 1: how restaurants can keep dishwashers employed. But there were a 719 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,839 Speaker 1: lot of previous substack posts that were apparently deleted. Some 720 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,520 Speaker 1: of them were anti vacs. There was one that was 721 00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:02,920 Speaker 1: titled thought crime that Weis describes as an anti vax 722 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: screed that labels COVID nineteen as a government conspiracy, the 723 00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,359 Speaker 1: scale and the scope of this operation with the next level, 724 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:11,560 Speaker 1: he wrote. They also were able the Daily Beast was 725 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 1: able to talk to his mother, and there were a 726 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:16,319 Speaker 1: lot of headlines that were all about like how is mom. 727 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: Sophy's a great guy, which was not a great way 728 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 1: to leave these pieces, but anyway, she said they just 729 00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:24,359 Speaker 1: spent Thanksgiving together, saw nothing amiss with her son. Made 730 00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,120 Speaker 1: no reference to the Israel Hamas conflict, which has of 731 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,480 Speaker 1: course been sharply polarizing, but she did say that he 732 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,360 Speaker 1: had struggles with mental health in the past and described 733 00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,760 Speaker 1: him as a quote very religious person who regularly reads 734 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,840 Speaker 1: the Bible and finds connection to various religious figures. So 735 00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 1: that's kind of everything we know at this. 736 00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 3: That's what we know. 737 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 2: I mean, we don't yet have a motive that has 738 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:47,200 Speaker 2: been released by Burlington PD. Really what struck out to me, Crystal, 739 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,520 Speaker 2: is everything about this and we were actually finally talking 740 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:51,680 Speaker 2: about this before the show. Anytime you're in a position 741 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,279 Speaker 2: like this, you're kind of a magnet for schizophrenia. I 742 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:57,520 Speaker 2: can't tell you how many times I've received a scribbled 743 00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:00,919 Speaker 2: of dossier's in the mail and other things with delusions 744 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,200 Speaker 2: of connections, and you know, I've seen it all from 745 00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:05,920 Speaker 2: QAnon to others, and really what stuck out to me 746 00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:09,280 Speaker 2: was this quote religiously reads the Bible and finds connections 747 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,799 Speaker 2: to various religious figure figures. Nothing wrong at that per se, 748 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 2: but it's also a textbook symptom of schizophrenic or schizophrenic 749 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:20,479 Speaker 2: type behavior, especially when he's got exactly when the mom says, 750 00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 2: you have mental health issues. Maybe he's been undiagnosed, but 751 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:29,040 Speaker 2: belief in conspiracy, the ramblings, unable to hold a job 752 00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:31,839 Speaker 2: if he indicates he was a dishwasher, and the best 753 00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,320 Speaker 2: way to treat them, these are exactly the type of 754 00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:35,360 Speaker 2: people will float. 755 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,680 Speaker 1: He was Actually he was actually a like financial consultant 756 00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:40,799 Speaker 1: in some way, and so he was giving advice to 757 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: business owners in that stop Dac post. He wasn't coming 758 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,360 Speaker 1: from the perspective of the dishwasher. I don't know, I 759 00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 1: didn't read the post. That's just how it was characterized 760 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,880 Speaker 1: in this piece. But you know, when you have three 761 00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:54,920 Speaker 1: men college students who two of them are wearing the Kafia, 762 00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:58,520 Speaker 1: just walking down the street talking to each other, going 763 00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:01,479 Speaker 1: to Grandma's house with Thanksgiving, and someone comes out and 764 00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:03,759 Speaker 1: you know, wantonly tries to kill them. Of course, this 765 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:05,640 Speaker 1: is going to raise questions about whether this was a 766 00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:10,480 Speaker 1: targeted hate because of their race and because of their religion. 767 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:13,560 Speaker 1: So that's what it's being investigated as. And that's effectively 768 00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:15,600 Speaker 1: what we know about it at this point. And thank goodness, 769 00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:17,480 Speaker 1: they're all three alive, although as I said, one of 770 00:38:17,520 --> 00:38:19,080 Speaker 1: them is in really serious condition. 771 00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:21,359 Speaker 2: One of them is a serious condition. Yeah, and will 772 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,440 Speaker 2: bear out the investigation. Is what we said yesterday. By 773 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,440 Speaker 2: the way, is you know, with all these things, probably 774 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,680 Speaker 2: just better to wait for information and to characterize it 775 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:31,400 Speaker 2: responsibly rather than just rushing to judgment, unlike Fox News 776 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:34,919 Speaker 2: with their Canadian terrorist attack that ended up just being 777 00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:38,640 Speaker 2: a high speed car crash. Let's move on to the economy. 778 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:41,480 Speaker 2: There's a lot going on in the world, not only 779 00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:43,839 Speaker 2: of inflation of grocery prices and all of that, but 780 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,560 Speaker 2: of course around the election, because how people feel about 781 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:49,560 Speaker 2: the economy is usually the single biggest determinant of how 782 00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,560 Speaker 2: they will eventually end up voting and or not voting. 783 00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,640 Speaker 2: So for President Biden, the economy remains a problem. What 784 00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,680 Speaker 2: have they done for that? Have they instituted policies or 785 00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:02,560 Speaker 2: spent a lot of time talking and thinking about it. No, instead, 786 00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:06,360 Speaker 2: there is a new it seems effort. Let's put this 787 00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:08,800 Speaker 2: up there on the screen. Actually reported by our friend 788 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 2: Jeff Stein, where in response to a viral sixteen dollars 789 00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:17,680 Speaker 2: McDonald's meal that is explaining voter anger at Biden, they 790 00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:20,120 Speaker 2: say a White House official says, the administration is now 791 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:25,360 Speaker 2: working with TikTok creators to tell positive stories of Biden's 792 00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:29,279 Speaker 2: economic stewardship, while also working with the social media platforms 793 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:34,280 Speaker 2: to quote counter misinformation. And so anytime we see government 794 00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,520 Speaker 2: working with social media platforms counter misinformation, we have course 795 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,200 Speaker 2: have to ask what in misinformation? And it brings me 796 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 2: back to Ken Klippenstein's report about the Department of Misinformation 797 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:47,880 Speaker 2: within the DHS, where they would both they would try 798 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,880 Speaker 2: and label in the same bucket of misinformation stuff about 799 00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:56,680 Speaker 2: COVID having microchips, with criticism of the Afghan withdrawal. And 800 00:39:56,719 --> 00:39:58,799 Speaker 2: you're like, well, hold on a second here, one of 801 00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:02,360 Speaker 2: those may be misinformation, the other one is a legitimate 802 00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 2: political critique. And having watched now the viral TikTok with you, Crystal, 803 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,520 Speaker 2: what does the guy say, He goes, can you believe this. 804 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 3: Here's my receipt of McDonald's. 805 00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 2: Here's a burger, a soda, and some fries that costs 806 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:18,520 Speaker 2: me sixteen dollars. 807 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,400 Speaker 3: Where is the misinformation in that? Nothing? 808 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 2: And in fact, you know, I see these sometimes too, 809 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:25,640 Speaker 2: just because I also, I guess this is where my 810 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,480 Speaker 2: mind goes around. Like egg prices in the grocery store. 811 00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:33,040 Speaker 2: That's not misinformation. And when people make reels or tiktoks 812 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:35,239 Speaker 2: or whatever about them, it's because they feel as I do. 813 00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:37,320 Speaker 2: When have you ever seen eggs that cost ten dollars 814 00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,440 Speaker 2: before in your whole life. I just saw it yesterday, 815 00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:41,920 Speaker 2: ten dollars and ninety two cents. It's burned into my memory. 816 00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:43,959 Speaker 2: They're pastor raised eggs. To be fair, they're the most 817 00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:45,960 Speaker 2: expensive of whatever ones on the shelf. 818 00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:46,920 Speaker 3: But I'm skipping them. 819 00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,080 Speaker 2: I'm like, no way, I'm not paying eleven dollars for 820 00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,080 Speaker 2: twelve and that's almost a dollar an egg. That's insane. 821 00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:54,200 Speaker 2: I mean the cheaper ones were like four bucks, I 822 00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:57,280 Speaker 2: think something like that. And the same thing. I mean, look, 823 00:40:57,560 --> 00:41:00,959 Speaker 2: I understand the prices can go up, you know, over time, 824 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,920 Speaker 2: but we're talking about in the rapid, in a rapid 825 00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 2: period of three years, you saw a year over year 826 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:09,040 Speaker 2: inflation come to like forty fifty sixty percent in the 827 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:12,560 Speaker 2: case of some goods, especially whenever it comes to staples 828 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:18,080 Speaker 2: like beef, and especially like beef eggs, and then many 829 00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:21,200 Speaker 2: other animal based products which for a variety of supply 830 00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,200 Speaker 2: based constraint reasons and inflation and all of that have 831 00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,480 Speaker 2: just gone way up, combined with restaurant bills which have 832 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 2: skyrocketed from both the input costs going up and labor. 833 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 2: So the point of all of this is to say, 834 00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:37,560 Speaker 2: it's not misinformation, it's a real concern, and actually just 835 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:39,919 Speaker 2: to show you what I guess they're trying to push 836 00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:40,520 Speaker 2: back against. 837 00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,759 Speaker 3: There was a TikTok that went very viral of a nurse. 838 00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,239 Speaker 2: Who's living in Pennsylvania who described, I think of what 839 00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:51,279 Speaker 2: a lot of Americans are feeling currently at this moment, 840 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,200 Speaker 2: which is why I touched a lot of people. 841 00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:54,359 Speaker 3: Here's what she had to say. 842 00:41:54,960 --> 00:42:00,239 Speaker 5: I feel like my husband and I are doing everything right. 843 00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,040 Speaker 5: We both have good jobs. I'm a nurse. I'm a 844 00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:08,960 Speaker 5: registered nurse who worked full time. He works full time. 845 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:14,839 Speaker 5: We just got paid this past Friday, right, we paid 846 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:24,440 Speaker 5: the mortgage, bought some groceries. Put some gas in the car. Guys, 847 00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:29,040 Speaker 5: it is Tuesday, and we have like two or three 848 00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:32,960 Speaker 5: to last does until next Friday. I don't I don't 849 00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:38,320 Speaker 5: know what to do. I'm in school full time, I 850 00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:42,200 Speaker 5: work full time. He works more than full time. He 851 00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:45,960 Speaker 5: works overtime every week. This isn't how it's supposed to be. 852 00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:51,120 Speaker 5: Growing up, we were told, you know, go to college, 853 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:56,440 Speaker 5: get a degree, work to support your family. Here we 854 00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:57,640 Speaker 5: are did that. 855 00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:01,440 Speaker 2: Now what I feel a lot of sympathy for her, because, 856 00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:04,040 Speaker 2: you know, let's think about some of the line items 857 00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:06,600 Speaker 2: in this woman's budget. She's talking about mortgage. Now, she 858 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:10,080 Speaker 2: lives in Pennsylvania. It's not even a particularly expensive state, 859 00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,560 Speaker 2: at least if you compare it to other people in 860 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:14,919 Speaker 2: the East Coast. I just looked it up gas There 861 00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:17,880 Speaker 2: is three dollars and fifty six cents a gallon on average, 862 00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,319 Speaker 2: which is quite high. It's on the higher end for 863 00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,760 Speaker 2: the United States. Then, really, what she mentioned she mentioned 864 00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:27,040 Speaker 2: her schooling, and I think why that hits a nerve 865 00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:30,320 Speaker 2: is she probably works in one of the best industries 866 00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:33,400 Speaker 2: that you can work in in the United States, nursing. Nursing, 867 00:43:33,560 --> 00:43:35,720 Speaker 2: there's a shortage of nurses right now. They get paid 868 00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:38,200 Speaker 2: all kinds of money. And what she's talking about is, 869 00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:40,560 Speaker 2: I'm going to assume on her part, her and her 870 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:43,960 Speaker 2: husband a six figure income, two working adults, and I 871 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:46,720 Speaker 2: think it just bears really out the entire two income 872 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:49,960 Speaker 2: trap from that we Elizabeth Warren wrote about a long 873 00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:55,960 Speaker 2: time ago, but of runaway inflation, cost for housing, for schooling, 874 00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,480 Speaker 2: and then food, and you put those three cores of 875 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,600 Speaker 2: society together and you get a breaking point of like 876 00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,520 Speaker 2: what that woman felt like and again, why it went 877 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:07,640 Speaker 2: off and took viralis I just think millions of people 878 00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,120 Speaker 2: feel exactly the same. And you know, it's not right. 879 00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:13,239 Speaker 2: It's not like she doesn't look like a profligate spent. Look, 880 00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:15,600 Speaker 2: we don't know our financial situation, right, but if what 881 00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:17,360 Speaker 2: she's saying is true, and she's just you know, those 882 00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:19,560 Speaker 2: are the major line items in there, I'm just gonna 883 00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:21,759 Speaker 2: have to assume schooling is taking out a ton of that, 884 00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:22,400 Speaker 2: and that's wrong. 885 00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:23,640 Speaker 3: It's not supposed to be that way. 886 00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:25,960 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I mean, even if you put the current 887 00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:33,840 Speaker 1: inflation aside, school, healthcare, housing, and kids, how guy rocketed 888 00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:37,719 Speaker 1: in costs and those are like the basic bedrocks of 889 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:43,280 Speaker 1: feeling like you have a stable, potentially middle class life, 890 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:46,279 Speaker 1: and so yeah, people are stretch incredibly thin. And even 891 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:48,680 Speaker 1: if she's lying and she's acting and this isn't true 892 00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:51,560 Speaker 1: or whatever, even if this is technically fake news, you 893 00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:53,400 Speaker 1: can just go and look and look at the statistics 894 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,400 Speaker 1: and know that there are millions and millions of Americans 895 00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,759 Speaker 1: who are working two jobs, or a husband and a 896 00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:01,919 Speaker 1: wife for both working, and they're trying to raise the kids, 897 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:04,560 Speaker 1: and they're trying to do everything right and they're still 898 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,200 Speaker 1: barely making it paycheck to paycheck. And you know, to 899 00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,359 Speaker 1: get back to Jeff Stein's piece about the sixteen dollars 900 00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,319 Speaker 1: McDonald's meal and the White House effort to combat misinformation 901 00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:16,080 Speaker 1: about the economy, et cetera, et cetera, it really gets 902 00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:20,759 Speaker 1: to this core debate of like, are Americans how what 903 00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:24,640 Speaker 1: is the reality of the economy? Are Americans being influenced 904 00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:28,040 Speaker 1: by social media to think it's really bad? Or is 905 00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:31,880 Speaker 1: there something real here? And if you just look at 906 00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:34,400 Speaker 1: the course of the Biden administration, and I've said this 907 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:37,400 Speaker 1: a million times, let me just say it again. The beginning, 908 00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:40,239 Speaker 1: some relief gets passed for COVID. If you look at 909 00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,000 Speaker 1: the statistics in terms of during the COVID period, when 910 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:46,000 Speaker 1: you had this much larger social safety net that was erected, 911 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:48,000 Speaker 1: and you had child tax credits going out, you had 912 00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:51,120 Speaker 1: direct checks going out, you had beefed up unemployment insurance, 913 00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:55,279 Speaker 1: et cetera. Guess what, those things really helped people. The 914 00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:58,480 Speaker 1: student loan debt pause, those things really really help people. 915 00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:01,239 Speaker 1: And the story of the Biden Ma instration has been 916 00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:05,440 Speaker 1: deconstructing all of that social safety net. So is it 917 00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:08,839 Speaker 1: any wonder then that people then look and say, I'm 918 00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:11,879 Speaker 1: doing worse off now. Of course you are because all 919 00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:13,799 Speaker 1: of the things that were helping you and that we're 920 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:16,120 Speaker 1: bolstering your income and giving you a little bit extra 921 00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,280 Speaker 1: in your savings account, all of those things are gone. 922 00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:23,600 Speaker 1: And in addition, prices have gotten much higher. So to me, 923 00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:26,799 Speaker 1: I'm like, it's no mystery. And I'm sure you can 924 00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:30,160 Speaker 1: find things that are inaccurate that are being told online 925 00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:32,880 Speaker 1: about the economy, et cetera, et cetera. But there's a 926 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:36,279 Speaker 1: reason why people feel the way they do, and it's 927 00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:39,560 Speaker 1: not because they're crazy or because they are brainwashed. And 928 00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:41,640 Speaker 1: in fact, you know, we have this piece that we 929 00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:44,040 Speaker 1: can show you with some of the numbers here. Americans 930 00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:47,000 Speaker 1: are getting very close to maxing out their credit cards. 931 00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:49,840 Speaker 1: Because this is one of the mysteries is people say, oh, well, 932 00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:52,719 Speaker 1: we know that they're really like they're lying about the 933 00:46:52,719 --> 00:46:55,600 Speaker 1: economy or they're fooled about the economy because they're still 934 00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:58,480 Speaker 1: spending a lot of money. Well, perhaps this will help 935 00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:01,120 Speaker 1: you solve the mystery. Bracking up a lot of debt 936 00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:04,400 Speaker 1: to continue to spend that money. American borrowers are getting 937 00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:07,160 Speaker 1: closer to maxing out. This is per the Wall Street Journal. 938 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:09,920 Speaker 1: They say all of this highlights that some Americans spending 939 00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:12,279 Speaker 1: habits might not be sustainable, at least when it comes 940 00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:14,600 Speaker 1: to their credit cards. Some people might be starting to 941 00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:17,319 Speaker 1: consume more of their available credit from month to month 942 00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:20,800 Speaker 1: could hit the wall once those lines are exhausted. Recent 943 00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:23,600 Speaker 1: note published by the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston found 944 00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:27,600 Speaker 1: that as of July, consumers with annual household incomes of 945 00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:31,359 Speaker 1: less than fifty K whose accounts were delinquent we're on 946 00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,680 Speaker 1: average utilizing eighty to ninety percent of their available credit. 947 00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:38,279 Speaker 1: Of course, that leaves them with a tiny cushion, and 948 00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:41,640 Speaker 1: across all cardholder income groups, as of July, the ratio 949 00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:44,000 Speaker 1: of outstanding card account balance to the account's credit limit 950 00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:47,840 Speaker 1: was way was above February twenty twenty levels. So you 951 00:47:47,920 --> 00:47:50,560 Speaker 1: have this indication that people are having to use more 952 00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,880 Speaker 1: of their available credit and effectively max out their credit 953 00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:56,719 Speaker 1: cards to be able to maintain what they have been 954 00:47:56,760 --> 00:47:57,840 Speaker 1: doing over this time period. 955 00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:00,440 Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, and that just means more keying up with 956 00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:03,480 Speaker 2: the Joneses, and then more feeling like that paying the 957 00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:06,000 Speaker 2: minimums and feeling perpetually like well. 958 00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:07,799 Speaker 1: May not even keeping up with the jones is just 959 00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:08,799 Speaker 1: being able to keep up. 960 00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:11,120 Speaker 2: I think it's ahead about the wall probably makes it well, 961 00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:12,880 Speaker 2: depending on the income strata that they were looking at. Here, 962 00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:14,600 Speaker 2: if you're one hundred k and you're starting to lose 963 00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:17,560 Speaker 2: use a lot more, although you know, I'm assuming that 964 00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:20,480 Speaker 2: the to nurse and somebody else is working more than 965 00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:23,480 Speaker 2: full time is probably making somewhere in that range. Whenever 966 00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,120 Speaker 2: you start to feel like that and the walls close in, 967 00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:29,400 Speaker 2: that's whenever you make desperate decisions, and that's really whenever 968 00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:33,040 Speaker 2: you can make life changing financial decisions that will have 969 00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,560 Speaker 2: a massive impact on you for decades to come. This 970 00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:38,279 Speaker 2: is always be my biggest beef, which student debt. Most 971 00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:40,480 Speaker 2: of the people have no idea what they're even signing 972 00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:42,120 Speaker 2: up for, and many of their parents are you know, 973 00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:45,319 Speaker 2: didn't experience the same cost and so emotionally can't really 974 00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:47,080 Speaker 2: understand what it means to have twenty five years of 975 00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:47,760 Speaker 2: debt hanging. 976 00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:49,480 Speaker 1: Over you and you're told like this is the way 977 00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:51,440 Speaker 1: to do it. Yes, like this, I get it to 978 00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:53,840 Speaker 1: you're you know, to you making it and being in 979 00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:54,440 Speaker 1: the middle class. 980 00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:58,000 Speaker 2: I don't blame anybody involved except for the government and 981 00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:01,640 Speaker 2: the debt preveyer. So it's not the actual people taking 982 00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:03,400 Speaker 2: it out, although a lot of people do like to 983 00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:05,880 Speaker 2: switch that. The overall lesson of this, though, is that 984 00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:08,239 Speaker 2: when you're getting closer and closer to maxing out is 985 00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:11,239 Speaker 2: you eventually do face some sort of penalty. And so 986 00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:13,759 Speaker 2: the way the Wall Street Journal posts this is like, oh, 987 00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:15,919 Speaker 2: it could be good for retailers because it's like, yeah, 988 00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:18,279 Speaker 2: in the short term, but what about six months from now? 989 00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:20,319 Speaker 3: What about a year from now, Like, whenever you're max 990 00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:21,479 Speaker 3: to the max, what. 991 00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:23,359 Speaker 2: Are you gonna do, maybe you're not gonna get any 992 00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,719 Speaker 2: more credit? What about next holiday season? And look, I'm 993 00:49:26,719 --> 00:49:29,080 Speaker 2: not naive, I know in America, eventually, you know, things 994 00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:32,320 Speaker 2: usually move around and full blown collapse and all that stuff. 995 00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:34,680 Speaker 2: But every piece that you look at at a consumer level, 996 00:49:34,920 --> 00:49:36,960 Speaker 2: the government is like, you're doing better off than ever. 997 00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,520 Speaker 2: Everyone just yesterday was talking making fun of Americans for 998 00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:45,480 Speaker 2: feeling bad because yesterday Sunday was the biggest travel day. 999 00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:47,560 Speaker 3: In the history of the United States. According to TSA. 1000 00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:49,799 Speaker 2: It's as if they haven't heard of putting a flight 1001 00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:51,600 Speaker 2: on a credit card, right just because you know it 1002 00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:54,920 Speaker 2: just maybe this spent three years locked in home and 1003 00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:57,440 Speaker 2: you have a relative across the country. Actually met some 1004 00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:00,120 Speaker 2: people like this when I was in San Diego for Thanksgiving, 1005 00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:01,920 Speaker 2: and they were like, you know what, now's the time. 1006 00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,000 Speaker 2: And it's not necessarily because you have the money. It's 1007 00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,040 Speaker 2: because you've been separated from your relatives or your family, 1008 00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:08,080 Speaker 2: or you wanted to go do something for so long 1009 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,759 Speaker 2: until you decide that now is the appropriate time. 1010 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:11,920 Speaker 3: Money can be a constraint. 1011 00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:14,160 Speaker 2: But don't forget also about the trauma that I think 1012 00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:16,160 Speaker 2: a lot of Americans have been through over the last 1013 00:50:16,200 --> 00:50:18,960 Speaker 2: couple of years. So long wave of saying it's not misinformation, 1014 00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:24,719 Speaker 2: White House, it's an actual economic problem. Let's move on 1015 00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:26,360 Speaker 2: to the next part here, a topic I know so 1016 00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:28,759 Speaker 2: many of you are so interested in let's put this 1017 00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:30,000 Speaker 2: police up there on the screen. 1018 00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:32,719 Speaker 3: An indication at the very basic level, and a lot. 1019 00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:35,640 Speaker 2: Of what we'll actually talk about today about economic feeling 1020 00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:40,000 Speaker 2: and others is housing, and the housing market right now 1021 00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:43,280 Speaker 2: is just the worst of all worlds. You have high 1022 00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:47,280 Speaker 2: prices and high interest rates. You have also a feeling 1023 00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:50,120 Speaker 2: for a lot of people of being trapped because home 1024 00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:54,960 Speaker 2: sales have now fallen to a thirteen year low in October, 1025 00:50:55,200 --> 00:51:01,160 Speaker 2: the lowest since two thy eleven. And from these economic forecasts, 1026 00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:04,279 Speaker 2: what you're seeing is that while there has been a 1027 00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:08,719 Speaker 2: slight dip in price, high rates have predominantly had the 1028 00:51:08,719 --> 00:51:12,640 Speaker 2: effect not of pushing down prices, but instead of locking 1029 00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:16,440 Speaker 2: home owners in to where they currently are and refusing 1030 00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:16,920 Speaker 2: to move. 1031 00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:18,640 Speaker 3: This has a lot of issues. 1032 00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:22,240 Speaker 2: One, if you are in the entry of the housing market, 1033 00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:24,400 Speaker 2: there's probably never been a worst time to try and 1034 00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:26,839 Speaker 2: buy a house with a high, high interest rate and 1035 00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:30,520 Speaker 2: with a high price. Two, So you decide to rent 1036 00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:33,200 Speaker 2: a couple more years than you would have in the 1037 00:51:33,239 --> 00:51:35,680 Speaker 2: past when you had if you had the down payment 1038 00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:37,719 Speaker 2: and the ability to buy, well, what does that do 1039 00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:41,200 Speaker 2: That causes rent inflation to continue to go up? And 1040 00:51:41,239 --> 00:51:43,880 Speaker 2: lo and behold, every single time you look at the CPI, 1041 00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:47,960 Speaker 2: rent and housing inflation remains one of the top drivers 1042 00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:53,160 Speaker 2: of the overall consumer price index. So the housing crunch 1043 00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:56,160 Speaker 2: both at a price level in terms of the inability 1044 00:51:56,160 --> 00:51:58,960 Speaker 2: to sell, and then the massive pressure on the rental market, 1045 00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:01,920 Speaker 2: combined with if you're a developer right now, why are 1046 00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:04,080 Speaker 2: we building a house exactly if I can't sell it 1047 00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:06,280 Speaker 2: and if I, you know, have to pay eight percent 1048 00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:09,120 Speaker 2: interest on my construction loan. So you have a supply crunch, 1049 00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:12,600 Speaker 2: a rent crunch, and a housing crunch all wrapped in 1050 00:52:12,719 --> 00:52:14,480 Speaker 2: to the same time. I honestly think this is like 1051 00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:18,080 Speaker 2: on par with the nineteen seventies, you know, level stagflation, 1052 00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:20,520 Speaker 2: where at that point it was unemployment that was getting 1053 00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:23,160 Speaker 2: all the attention. But here housing just floats under the rug. 1054 00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:25,680 Speaker 2: People just don't talk about it as much. And yet 1055 00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:28,960 Speaker 2: we have seen a tremendous amount of audience interest because 1056 00:52:28,960 --> 00:52:31,040 Speaker 2: I think this is probably at the top of so 1057 00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:33,319 Speaker 2: many of your heads, especially if you're younger. You know, 1058 00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:35,480 Speaker 2: for a lot of the boomers, they've got what they need. 1059 00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:37,600 Speaker 2: But you know, and I guess that's why cable news 1060 00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:39,359 Speaker 2: and others would ignore it. And if you're rich, you know, 1061 00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:41,640 Speaker 2: none of this really applies to you. But if you 1062 00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:44,759 Speaker 2: are even upper middle class or lower, you're having a 1063 00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:47,160 Speaker 2: tough time out there right now trying to buy a house, 1064 00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:49,880 Speaker 2: especially with average home price in a major metro area 1065 00:52:50,080 --> 00:52:51,600 Speaker 2: has crossed half a million dollars. 1066 00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:54,080 Speaker 1: I'll never forget that poll that we looked at that 1067 00:52:54,200 --> 00:52:56,560 Speaker 1: was like people were praying for a housing crash because 1068 00:52:56,600 --> 00:52:58,080 Speaker 1: they were like, how else am I ever going to 1069 00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:01,320 Speaker 1: afford a house? And instead, the worst of all worlds, 1070 00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:04,759 Speaker 1: mortgage rates have gone way up and housing prices have 1071 00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:08,080 Speaker 1: still gone up, and so yeah, the market is just 1072 00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:13,840 Speaker 1: completely frozen. Rents are still wildly expensive, and people just 1073 00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:16,680 Speaker 1: feel like I will never be able to make it. 1074 00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:19,360 Speaker 1: This will never be sustainable. I will never be able 1075 00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:22,040 Speaker 1: to be in like a stable position as a homeowner 1076 00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:24,680 Speaker 1: building something. And that's why I put this next piece 1077 00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:27,440 Speaker 1: up on the screen. You have so many people saying 1078 00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:30,160 Speaker 1: in a new Wall Street Journal poll that the American 1079 00:53:30,239 --> 00:53:33,520 Speaker 1: dream is dead. It's slipping out of reach. Fewer people 1080 00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:37,080 Speaker 1: believe that anyone who works hard can get ahead. Only 1081 00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:40,360 Speaker 1: thirty six percent of voters in this poll say that 1082 00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,840 Speaker 1: the American dream still holds true. That is way fewer 1083 00:53:44,040 --> 00:53:47,000 Speaker 1: than the fifty three percent majority who said that just 1084 00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:49,520 Speaker 1: back in twenty twelve and the forty eight percent who 1085 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:52,520 Speaker 1: set it back in twenty sixteen in similar surveys asked 1086 00:53:52,520 --> 00:53:55,040 Speaker 1: by a different polster. There was also a Wall Street 1087 00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:57,759 Speaker 1: Journal poll last year that asked whether people who work 1088 00:53:57,800 --> 00:53:59,759 Speaker 1: hard were likely to get ahead, and some sixty eight 1089 00:53:59,800 --> 00:54:02,919 Speaker 1: percent and actually said yes, nearly twice the share as 1090 00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:05,920 Speaker 1: in this American Dream pool. Now, those are slightly different questions, 1091 00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:09,160 Speaker 1: but it shows you still there has been a deterioration 1092 00:54:09,320 --> 00:54:12,080 Speaker 1: even in the past year. The American dream, they say, 1093 00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:15,399 Speaker 1: seem most remote to young adults and women. Some forty 1094 00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:17,760 Speaker 1: six percent of men were actually like, okay, yeah, American 1095 00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:20,839 Speaker 1: dreams still real. Only twenty eight percent of women said 1096 00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:23,480 Speaker 1: the ideal of advancement for hard work still holds true, 1097 00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:26,480 Speaker 1: as did forty eight percent of voters age sixty five 1098 00:54:26,600 --> 00:54:30,520 Speaker 1: or older, but only twenty eight percent of those under 1099 00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:33,360 Speaker 1: age fifty. And I would be curious to see, you know, 1100 00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:36,040 Speaker 1: under age thirty. What are those numbers? I thought, it's 1101 00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:39,000 Speaker 1: even lower than twenty eight percent who feel like the 1102 00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,239 Speaker 1: American dream is still even a possibility. 1103 00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:44,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, so to have it just flip completely in the 1104 00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:47,720 Speaker 2: span of us not even a single generation, but really 1105 00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:52,319 Speaker 2: in a decade is one of the more profound economic 1106 00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:56,640 Speaker 2: stories of all American history. There have been very few 1107 00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:00,719 Speaker 2: as transformative times as we're in right now. This is 1108 00:55:00,800 --> 00:55:03,960 Speaker 2: on par with the Great and really I think extension 1109 00:55:04,040 --> 00:55:07,520 Speaker 2: of the Great Recession and the attendant like social fallout. 1110 00:55:07,600 --> 00:55:09,640 Speaker 2: We had the Great Depression, which is really the only 1111 00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:13,279 Speaker 2: other previous time in modern industrial society that we've seen 1112 00:55:13,600 --> 00:55:16,719 Speaker 2: anything like this, and we instead don't. We try to 1113 00:55:16,719 --> 00:55:19,080 Speaker 2: pretend and we live with the day to day, and 1114 00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:21,000 Speaker 2: of course, you know, we're talking about Israel and open 1115 00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:22,479 Speaker 2: Ai in Ireland and all. 1116 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:24,279 Speaker 3: This other stuff. But this is by and large the 1117 00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:25,480 Speaker 3: single biggest. 1118 00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:26,640 Speaker 2: Determinant of how you're going to live your life, how 1119 00:55:26,680 --> 00:55:28,319 Speaker 2: you're going to get a job, whether you're able to 1120 00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:30,880 Speaker 2: get married, what it actually looks like, what your prospects 1121 00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,200 Speaker 2: are to the future, if you have and want to 1122 00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:35,080 Speaker 2: even work to anything in the future. 1123 00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:37,200 Speaker 3: Or like, why you. 1124 00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:39,680 Speaker 2: Would even choose to go into debt to get some schooling. 1125 00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:41,680 Speaker 2: You only do that if you think that you're going 1126 00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,600 Speaker 2: to come out better on the other side. And the 1127 00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:46,359 Speaker 2: same holds true for really any investment they're going to make, 1128 00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:51,640 Speaker 2: so nihilism has a really downstream terrible impact economically, and 1129 00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:54,160 Speaker 2: then of course on a personal and life level, it's 1130 00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:56,439 Speaker 2: just it's an awful way to live. And the way 1131 00:55:56,440 --> 00:55:59,640 Speaker 2: that that comes out in politics is the primal screams. 1132 00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:02,200 Speaker 2: You have Trump, you have Bernie, you have all these 1133 00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:06,040 Speaker 2: like a flash in the pan moments. They establishment panics. 1134 00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:08,160 Speaker 2: It tries to co opt and all of that. But 1135 00:56:08,360 --> 00:56:11,879 Speaker 2: I think at this point they have failed so dramatically 1136 00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:15,200 Speaker 2: to grapple all the way from two thousand and one 1137 00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:19,080 Speaker 2: onward that they don't deserve a single ounce of trust anymore. 1138 00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:22,799 Speaker 2: And it's really a generational gap between people who are 1139 00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:24,520 Speaker 2: our age Crystal and then people who are twenty five 1140 00:56:24,560 --> 00:56:27,640 Speaker 2: thirty years older who can remember the nineteen nineties, who 1141 00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:30,320 Speaker 2: were adults at that time and who were living large, 1142 00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:32,520 Speaker 2: whereas for the rest of us that's a distant memory. 1143 00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:34,719 Speaker 2: It's like something that exists in the past. I've been 1144 00:56:34,719 --> 00:56:38,520 Speaker 2: rewatching friends recently. It isn't amazing. It's like a time capsule. 1145 00:56:38,800 --> 00:56:40,879 Speaker 2: And I think one of the reasons why people love 1146 00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:43,040 Speaker 2: the show so much is, man, what an awesome time 1147 00:56:43,480 --> 00:56:46,800 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety eight. They sad cell phones the stock market 1148 00:56:46,840 --> 00:56:49,239 Speaker 2: was going like twenty No nine to eleven, and just 1149 00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:51,520 Speaker 2: like the care free like nature in which you could 1150 00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:54,120 Speaker 2: just watch six people screw off at a coffee shop. 1151 00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:57,960 Speaker 3: It really does show you what America. 1152 00:56:57,719 --> 00:56:59,960 Speaker 2: Was like at that time as opposed to what's popular 1153 00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:01,960 Speaker 2: now for most people. 1154 00:57:02,080 --> 00:57:05,000 Speaker 1: I mean, it was an exactulate, exactly, an accurate. 1155 00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:07,479 Speaker 3: Individd why did it hit to the court? 1156 00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:12,920 Speaker 1: Well, and not only then, but it's it still Mistah, 1157 00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:16,080 Speaker 1: fifteen year old watched the whole thing and was obsessed 1158 00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:19,080 Speaker 1: with it and whatever you know on the American dream piece. 1159 00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:21,280 Speaker 1: There's a great book that I've mentioned on the show before, 1160 00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:23,240 Speaker 1: and we've actually had the author, justin guest on the 1161 00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:25,640 Speaker 1: show as well, called The New Minority, and it's a 1162 00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:28,440 Speaker 1: look at the white working class, and part of one 1163 00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:31,400 Speaker 1: of the sections, it's actually comparison of the white working 1164 00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:34,880 Speaker 1: class in the US in Youngstown, Ohio and the white 1165 00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:39,240 Speaker 1: working class in a working class of London. And they 1166 00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:42,120 Speaker 1: actually found that in some ways the belief in the 1167 00:57:42,160 --> 00:57:45,400 Speaker 1: American dream was kind of insidious. And the reason why 1168 00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:49,200 Speaker 1: is because if you have this pervading mythology of like, 1169 00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:51,840 Speaker 1: if you work hard, you can make it, and it's 1170 00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:56,880 Speaker 1: all about you, right, your individual work, ethic and agency 1171 00:57:56,920 --> 00:57:59,920 Speaker 1: and all of that. Then it leads people to blame 1172 00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:04,000 Speaker 1: themselves when like that nurse that we played earlier, when 1173 00:58:04,040 --> 00:58:06,520 Speaker 1: they're going through it and they're struggling, and I mean 1174 00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:09,080 Speaker 1: she says something, She's like, I did everything right, Like 1175 00:58:09,160 --> 00:58:12,480 Speaker 1: I did everything right, and there's all this shame wrapped 1176 00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:16,760 Speaker 1: up in it. And what he found through, you know, 1177 00:58:16,880 --> 00:58:20,960 Speaker 1: like a statistical analysis, is that that belief, that persistent 1178 00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:24,520 Speaker 1: belief in the American Dream actually undercut activism because it 1179 00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:27,240 Speaker 1: led people more to look inward and be like, I 1180 00:58:27,320 --> 00:58:29,760 Speaker 1: must be doing something wrong. I must be a failure. 1181 00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:31,560 Speaker 1: And anyone can look at their life and find like, 1182 00:58:31,600 --> 00:58:33,360 Speaker 1: oh I shouldn't have bought that, or I shouldn't have 1183 00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:35,480 Speaker 1: made that decision, or maybe I'm doing this wrong, or 1184 00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:37,800 Speaker 1: maybe I'm doing that wrong. Everybody can do that right. 1185 00:58:38,320 --> 00:58:41,440 Speaker 1: But it led them to focus inward rather than engaging 1186 00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:45,120 Speaker 1: in collective action to actually change government policy, which I 1187 00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:47,880 Speaker 1: thought was a really you know, a really interesting insight. 1188 00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,520 Speaker 1: So with regards to American Dream, something I've been thinking about. 1189 00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:53,120 Speaker 1: We've actually had the author of this book The New Minority, 1190 00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:55,440 Speaker 1: on the show, which looks at the white working class, 1191 00:58:55,480 --> 00:58:58,480 Speaker 1: and he did an analysis comparing the white working class 1192 00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:01,040 Speaker 1: in Youngstown and the white working class in a suburb 1193 00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:03,640 Speaker 1: of London, and one thing that he found is that 1194 00:59:03,720 --> 00:59:06,480 Speaker 1: the idea of the American dream is actually, in a 1195 00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:10,240 Speaker 1: sense kind of insidious, because if the idea is you know, 1196 00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:13,320 Speaker 1: if you work hard, you can make it, then if 1197 00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:16,800 Speaker 1: you don't make it, the natural instinct is to say, well, 1198 00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:19,400 Speaker 1: I must have done something wrong. And so in a sense, 1199 00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:22,800 Speaker 1: sagas sort of short circuits the type of collective action 1200 00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:26,960 Speaker 1: that could push the government to make different policy decisions. 1201 00:59:27,000 --> 00:59:29,240 Speaker 1: So on the one hand, while of course it's bad 1202 00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:30,680 Speaker 1: that people feel like they can't make it in the 1203 00:59:30,680 --> 00:59:34,320 Speaker 1: American dream is dead, I'm actually for establishing some new 1204 00:59:34,400 --> 00:59:37,600 Speaker 1: mythology that's not all about like if you don't make 1205 00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:40,280 Speaker 1: it, it's your fault. You should feel shame, you should feel horrible, 1206 00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:42,919 Speaker 1: you should examine everywhere that you went wrong in your life, 1207 00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,280 Speaker 1: and instead looks at not only personal agency we can 1208 00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:49,080 Speaker 1: keep still, you know, hold open some piece of personal agency, 1209 00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:52,960 Speaker 1: but also looks at the manifest ways that elites and 1210 00:59:53,080 --> 00:59:56,480 Speaker 1: our government have completely failed the American people over decades. 1211 00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:58,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the story of the US just to 1212 00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:00,840 Speaker 2: tie a bone on. It is a battle between rugged 1213 01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:05,720 Speaker 2: individualism and then labor capitalism, and so the transition of 1214 01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:09,000 Speaker 2: the expansion West, and you know, it's like the California 1215 01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:11,280 Speaker 2: gold Rush. You can go out there, you can make 1216 01:00:11,320 --> 01:00:13,320 Speaker 2: it on your own. Oops, a bunch of people go bust. 1217 01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:17,280 Speaker 2: And then we have like financialization and we have mass industrialization, 1218 01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:19,560 Speaker 2: and you have if anybody ever watched the TV show 1219 01:00:19,600 --> 01:00:21,760 Speaker 2: one of my favorite shows, The Gilded Age, the current 1220 01:00:21,800 --> 01:00:24,320 Speaker 2: season is actually really working through some of this where 1221 01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:27,280 Speaker 2: you have these titans of like Robber Baron type capitalism, 1222 01:00:27,440 --> 01:00:30,280 Speaker 2: but you also have union union officials that are emerging 1223 01:00:30,320 --> 01:00:32,280 Speaker 2: in a movement at the same time. And there's a 1224 01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:34,800 Speaker 2: scene where one of the guys starts to buy one 1225 01:00:34,840 --> 01:00:36,400 Speaker 2: of the union leaders off and he's like, you don't 1226 01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:38,040 Speaker 2: really get what's going on here, do you? 1227 01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:39,440 Speaker 3: And whenever he goes. 1228 01:00:39,240 --> 01:00:42,160 Speaker 2: Back, and then that struggle is really the story of 1229 01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:45,280 Speaker 2: the modern industrial economy. It played out here, it played 1230 01:00:45,280 --> 01:00:48,120 Speaker 2: out all across Europe. And the way that US and 1231 01:00:48,240 --> 01:00:52,960 Speaker 2: Britain really separated themselves from Germany and from Russia and 1232 01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:55,680 Speaker 2: others that went in a much more communist direction is 1233 01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:58,760 Speaker 2: that their elites recognized that you have to treat and 1234 01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:01,360 Speaker 2: pay people better and try their rights into law, and 1235 01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:05,080 Speaker 2: they basically acquiesced, whereas the Russian and the German monarchies 1236 01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:07,160 Speaker 2: were like, yeah, we're not doing basically any of that. 1237 01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:09,919 Speaker 2: And what happened to there if their society's collapsed, broke 1238 01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:13,280 Speaker 2: down and they had massive revolutions. So if we don't 1239 01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:15,720 Speaker 2: want to repeat the mistakes that they made, we have 1240 01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:18,160 Speaker 2: to do what really I think saved capitalism in a 1241 01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:22,520 Speaker 2: lot of ways, which is what FDR and his predecessors did, 1242 01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:26,360 Speaker 2: is recognized those rights and incorporated both into the rugged 1243 01:01:26,520 --> 01:01:30,320 Speaker 2: American story as well as recognizing that structural factors are 1244 01:01:30,320 --> 01:01:33,840 Speaker 2: of course going to impact everyday people's lives. And so anyway, 1245 01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:36,640 Speaker 2: I think the reason that we are currently in the 1246 01:01:36,680 --> 01:01:39,959 Speaker 2: scenario that we are is that we've swung much more 1247 01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:42,800 Speaker 2: back in that direction and have really forgotten, i think, 1248 01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:44,880 Speaker 2: a cherished part of our history which has been missing 1249 01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:45,720 Speaker 2: now for a long time. 1250 01:01:48,520 --> 01:01:51,000 Speaker 1: So last week we covered all kinds of turmoil over 1251 01:01:51,080 --> 01:01:54,040 Speaker 1: at open AI. Sam Altman, the CEO, he was out 1252 01:01:54,160 --> 01:01:57,080 Speaker 1: kicked down by the board, He's brought on by Microsoft, 1253 01:01:57,240 --> 01:01:59,720 Speaker 1: then he was brought back in Over at open AI, 1254 01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,000 Speaker 1: a lot of questions about what is going on and 1255 01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:04,720 Speaker 1: why is this happening right now? Raiter's got to look 1256 01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:09,200 Speaker 1: at a potential reason for why this action was taken 1257 01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:11,280 Speaker 1: at this moment. Let's put this up on the screen, 1258 01:02:11,320 --> 01:02:13,960 Speaker 1: so they say. Ahead of open ai CEO Sam Altman's 1259 01:02:13,960 --> 01:02:17,680 Speaker 1: four days in exile, several staff reacher researchers wrote a 1260 01:02:17,760 --> 01:02:20,640 Speaker 1: letter to the board of directors warning of a powerful 1261 01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:25,760 Speaker 1: artificial intelligence discovery that they said could threaten humanity. This 1262 01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:28,040 Speaker 1: was according to two people familiar with the matter. That's 1263 01:02:28,080 --> 01:02:32,520 Speaker 1: what they told Reuters. That previously unreported letter and AI 1264 01:02:32,760 --> 01:02:37,160 Speaker 1: algorithm were key developments before the board's ouster of Altman, 1265 01:02:37,440 --> 01:02:41,320 Speaker 1: according to those two sources. So open ai declined to comment, 1266 01:02:41,360 --> 01:02:44,160 Speaker 1: but they did acknowledge in an internal message to staffers 1267 01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:48,600 Speaker 1: a project called q Star. The open ai spokesperson said 1268 01:02:48,600 --> 01:02:51,320 Speaker 1: the message, sent by a longtime executive, alerted staff to 1269 01:02:51,320 --> 01:02:55,600 Speaker 1: certain media stories, without commenting on their accuracy. Some open 1270 01:02:55,800 --> 01:02:58,440 Speaker 1: Ai believed that q star could be a breakthrough in 1271 01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:02,240 Speaker 1: the startup search for what's known as artificial general intelligence. 1272 01:03:02,560 --> 01:03:05,680 Speaker 1: One of the people told Reuters open ai defines AGI 1273 01:03:05,760 --> 01:03:11,000 Speaker 1: as autonomous systems that surpass humans in most economically valuable tasks. 1274 01:03:11,440 --> 01:03:13,680 Speaker 1: So we have a lot of details about what this 1275 01:03:13,760 --> 01:03:17,240 Speaker 1: alleged breakthrough is or even you know, additional reporting about 1276 01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,400 Speaker 1: whether this is in fact accurate. But the reason that 1277 01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:24,160 Speaker 1: this potentially tracks Soger is because the divide in the 1278 01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:27,959 Speaker 1: AI community, as reflected in the divide within Open Ai, 1279 01:03:28,520 --> 01:03:32,000 Speaker 1: is between the tech optimists who are basically like letterrip, 1280 01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:34,480 Speaker 1: let's go make tons of money, let's just like develop 1281 01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:36,840 Speaker 1: this like crazy, let's see what we can do, let's 1282 01:03:36,880 --> 01:03:40,560 Speaker 1: push the boundaries here, and more of the you know, 1283 01:03:40,600 --> 01:03:42,880 Speaker 1: it's actually a lot of like effective altruists, but that 1284 01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:45,600 Speaker 1: side of the tech community that is very worried about 1285 01:03:45,640 --> 01:03:49,840 Speaker 1: the risks of AI development, what it could mean for humanity, 1286 01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:51,960 Speaker 1: what it can mean for jobs, what it could mean 1287 01:03:52,000 --> 01:03:55,240 Speaker 1: for you know, potential dangers for the future. And with 1288 01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:59,760 Speaker 1: Sam Altman being brought back in effectively his side of 1289 01:03:59,760 --> 01:04:02,880 Speaker 1: the TI tech optimist piece one out and the people 1290 01:04:02,920 --> 01:04:04,960 Speaker 1: who want to just you know, profit as much as possible, 1291 01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:06,960 Speaker 1: put it in the hands of corporations like Microsoft and 1292 01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:09,920 Speaker 1: develop it to its fullest extent. Right now with a 1293 01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:12,960 Speaker 1: few guardrails, that side of the equation seems to be 1294 01:04:13,040 --> 01:04:13,480 Speaker 1: winning out. 1295 01:04:13,560 --> 01:04:17,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I have complicated feelings on this because I understand 1296 01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:19,000 Speaker 2: that that's a useful framework. But the thing is about 1297 01:04:19,040 --> 01:04:22,840 Speaker 2: Sam and these effective altruists and others is that, yeah, 1298 01:04:22,960 --> 01:04:25,560 Speaker 2: they believe in the profit and all of that, but 1299 01:04:25,880 --> 01:04:30,440 Speaker 2: really what they believe is it's like responsible AI, and 1300 01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:34,720 Speaker 2: what they mean by that is pairing with giant corporations 1301 01:04:34,760 --> 01:04:38,640 Speaker 2: like Microsoft and regulation and control so that they're the 1302 01:04:38,680 --> 01:04:41,240 Speaker 2: only ones that really get to use the technology. So 1303 01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:43,560 Speaker 2: I kind of find myself in a more anarchist position 1304 01:04:43,920 --> 01:04:47,320 Speaker 2: with AI where my deepest suspicion doesn't actually come through, 1305 01:04:48,040 --> 01:04:49,680 Speaker 2: you know, like, oh, they're going to replace us in 1306 01:04:49,720 --> 01:04:52,720 Speaker 2: all this. My fear is exactly what's happening right now, 1307 01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:57,280 Speaker 2: which is total corporate capture and control, where effectively we're 1308 01:04:57,320 --> 01:05:02,760 Speaker 2: watching Microsoft develop the world's greatest office enterprise technology and 1309 01:05:02,960 --> 01:05:06,439 Speaker 2: all of the money being funneled into how to make 1310 01:05:06,640 --> 01:05:11,240 Speaker 2: word Excel and Skype calls and teams more efficient, which 1311 01:05:11,320 --> 01:05:13,080 Speaker 2: is in my opinion, the. 1312 01:05:12,880 --> 01:05:16,120 Speaker 3: Worst use of research dollars and other things. 1313 01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:19,880 Speaker 2: As opposed to actually helping people and so watching really 1314 01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:22,880 Speaker 2: what it is is the titans of Google and Facebook 1315 01:05:23,080 --> 01:05:27,320 Speaker 2: and Microsoft now basically capture the entire stream of AI 1316 01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:30,760 Speaker 2: developments and others makes me more worried about the future 1317 01:05:31,120 --> 01:05:35,400 Speaker 2: than any sort of AI breakthrough that's going to replace 1318 01:05:35,640 --> 01:05:37,920 Speaker 2: all of our jobs and other this. So some of 1319 01:05:37,920 --> 01:05:40,760 Speaker 2: this was captured in the CNBC interview where they talk 1320 01:05:40,840 --> 01:05:44,800 Speaker 2: here about how Microsoft sat Jawnadella really is the true winner. 1321 01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:46,040 Speaker 3: Here's what they had to say. 1322 01:05:46,400 --> 01:05:50,880 Speaker 6: The Golden child Altman is ultimately really in Microsoft's hands. 1323 01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:53,400 Speaker 6: And I think the way they played this was a 1324 01:05:53,440 --> 01:05:56,000 Speaker 6: poker move for the ages from Nadella, and I think 1325 01:05:56,040 --> 01:05:58,720 Speaker 6: as it plays out, you had the little kids playing 1326 01:05:58,800 --> 01:06:01,160 Speaker 6: checkers at the kids table in terms of the open 1327 01:06:01,200 --> 01:06:05,440 Speaker 6: AI board, and then the master chess master came in 1328 01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:08,960 Speaker 6: here and I think, right now it's Microsoft just that 1329 01:06:09,160 --> 01:06:11,280 Speaker 6: much more of a flex the muscles on AI. What 1330 01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:14,280 Speaker 6: you want to see from jasse and Aws, Okay, what 1331 01:06:14,320 --> 01:06:17,680 Speaker 6: do you bring it? Show us the technology. How could 1332 01:06:17,680 --> 01:06:20,760 Speaker 6: I have confidence from a share perspective that you're not 1333 01:06:21,240 --> 01:06:25,280 Speaker 6: going to be potentially the third player behind Microsoft, behind Google. 1334 01:06:25,680 --> 01:06:27,800 Speaker 6: This is an arms race plan out and right now 1335 01:06:27,880 --> 01:06:31,000 Speaker 6: Microsoft and they're popping Champagne and Redmond because of the 1336 01:06:31,000 --> 01:06:32,320 Speaker 6: way the Della played this. 1337 01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:36,280 Speaker 7: Out cap profit structure that Sam instituted in twenty nineteen, 1338 01:06:36,640 --> 01:06:39,680 Speaker 7: the idea here was to cap investors profits at one 1339 01:06:39,720 --> 01:06:44,800 Speaker 7: hundred times their original investor investment, because he suggested that 1340 01:06:45,120 --> 01:06:49,480 Speaker 7: if OpenAI could get to so called artificial generalized intelligence, 1341 01:06:49,520 --> 01:06:52,080 Speaker 7: which is this sort of more sophisticated AI that we 1342 01:06:52,080 --> 01:06:54,919 Speaker 7: seem to be moving toward quickly, that it could be 1343 01:06:55,040 --> 01:06:58,400 Speaker 7: so powerful and so lucrative that he wanted these investors 1344 01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:01,000 Speaker 7: not to sort of hold all of the in the world. 1345 01:07:01,000 --> 01:07:03,640 Speaker 7: In fact, he spoke at one of my events for 1346 01:07:03,720 --> 01:07:06,440 Speaker 7: strictly VC, which is now subsidiary of TechCrunch, and he 1347 01:07:06,520 --> 01:07:09,640 Speaker 7: said that if OpenAI manages to crack this particular nut, 1348 01:07:09,680 --> 01:07:12,840 Speaker 7: it could quote maybe capture the light cone of all 1349 01:07:12,920 --> 01:07:15,560 Speaker 7: future value in the universe. And that for sure is 1350 01:07:15,600 --> 01:07:18,120 Speaker 7: not okay for one group of investors to have. 1351 01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:21,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, so the future value of all who's going to 1352 01:07:21,040 --> 01:07:25,400 Speaker 2: own that? Open Ai and Microsoft? So really, again, let's 1353 01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:27,600 Speaker 2: look at who he actually replaced the board with. Let's 1354 01:07:27,600 --> 01:07:30,360 Speaker 2: put this please up there on the screen that Kevin 1355 01:07:30,440 --> 01:07:33,560 Speaker 2: Russwright wrote about AI belongs to the capitalists. You have 1356 01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:37,200 Speaker 2: freaking Larry Summers here on the board, I mean, like 1357 01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:41,680 Speaker 2: a cartoonish figure of quote unquote responsible corporate capitalism. And 1358 01:07:41,720 --> 01:07:44,960 Speaker 2: then you have a former Dropbox executive and Adam D'Angelo 1359 01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:48,560 Speaker 2: of Quorra. So if you put all this together, Crystal, 1360 01:07:48,840 --> 01:07:51,640 Speaker 2: where I look at it is I am most afraid 1361 01:07:51,720 --> 01:07:55,400 Speaker 2: of exactly what's happening right now, where AI is becoming 1362 01:07:55,560 --> 01:08:00,000 Speaker 2: a corporate tool of white collar of not only white 1363 01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:04,400 Speaker 2: collar industry, but just like plussing up any sort of 1364 01:08:04,720 --> 01:08:08,680 Speaker 2: HR and other stuff, as opposed to funneling towards technology 1365 01:08:08,680 --> 01:08:12,920 Speaker 2: that would actually help most Americans in their daily lives. 1366 01:08:12,920 --> 01:08:16,240 Speaker 2: They're trying to focus on reducing HR costs and legal 1367 01:08:16,280 --> 01:08:18,400 Speaker 2: fees on it. Listen, I support all of that, but 1368 01:08:18,760 --> 01:08:22,240 Speaker 2: should that really be the sole driver of our innovation? 1369 01:08:22,400 --> 01:08:24,120 Speaker 2: This is why I think some of the conversation around 1370 01:08:24,120 --> 01:08:25,120 Speaker 2: this can get really muddled. 1371 01:08:25,160 --> 01:08:27,400 Speaker 1: Well, there's a lot of different levels. Yeah, So the 1372 01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:30,960 Speaker 1: piece you're pointing to, you know, what are corporations incentivized 1373 01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:34,120 Speaker 1: to develop Their incentivized to develop anything that's going to 1374 01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:37,439 Speaker 1: be profitable to them. There will be many applications, potential 1375 01:08:37,479 --> 01:08:41,479 Speaker 1: applications of AI that would benefit humanity that would not 1376 01:08:41,560 --> 01:08:44,559 Speaker 1: be particularly profitable. Yes, those are not going to be developed, 1377 01:08:44,680 --> 01:08:47,720 Speaker 1: Like that's the reality. On the other hand, what are 1378 01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:51,040 Speaker 1: corporation's left to do eliminate human beings and their usefulness 1379 01:08:51,080 --> 01:08:54,040 Speaker 1: and their are jobs because human beings cost a lot 1380 01:08:54,080 --> 01:08:56,479 Speaker 1: of money, and they take sick days, and they have babies, 1381 01:08:56,520 --> 01:08:59,320 Speaker 1: and they're complicated and whatever. So let's get rid of them. 1382 01:08:59,439 --> 01:09:01,599 Speaker 1: Let's get rid of their jobs. And so there will 1383 01:09:01,600 --> 01:09:04,680 Speaker 1: be huge incentive to develop AI that can enable the 1384 01:09:04,840 --> 01:09:08,920 Speaker 1: elimination of jobs. So that's the corporate piece that you're 1385 01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:12,080 Speaker 1: pointing to. But you know, my feelings about AI sort 1386 01:09:12,120 --> 01:09:14,680 Speaker 1: of ranges from terror to comedy. I don't know if 1387 01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:18,320 Speaker 1: you guys saw there's a story about was that ESPN 1388 01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:23,000 Speaker 1: or supports sports illustry Sports Illustrated that got caught using 1389 01:09:23,080 --> 01:09:26,960 Speaker 1: these AI generated articles and they were preposterous, Like they 1390 01:09:26,960 --> 01:09:30,439 Speaker 1: were so bad. The writing was so weird and clunky. 1391 01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:32,880 Speaker 1: It was like an alien, you know, trying to write 1392 01:09:32,920 --> 01:09:36,000 Speaker 1: about volleyball or whatever it was. And then on the 1393 01:09:36,040 --> 01:09:38,559 Speaker 1: other hand, you have this story reported out by The 1394 01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:42,599 Speaker 1: New York Times that the deployment of AI controlled drones 1395 01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:46,040 Speaker 1: that can make autonomous decisions about whether to kill human 1396 01:09:46,080 --> 01:09:50,960 Speaker 1: targets is moving closer to reality. Lethal autonomous weapons that 1397 01:09:51,080 --> 01:09:56,759 Speaker 1: can select targets using AI are being developed by the US, China, 1398 01:09:57,000 --> 01:10:00,880 Speaker 1: and Israel. Killer robots that can autonomous decide whether you're 1399 01:10:00,920 --> 01:10:04,479 Speaker 1: going to live or die. So and obviously for the 1400 01:10:04,520 --> 01:10:07,840 Speaker 1: military industrial complex, that is very profitable as well. So 1401 01:10:07,880 --> 01:10:11,000 Speaker 1: that's like the nexus of both the terror of what 1402 01:10:11,040 --> 01:10:14,639 Speaker 1: this could mean for humanity and also the profit motive. 1403 01:10:15,080 --> 01:10:18,439 Speaker 1: So that's why it's troubling that the people it's not 1404 01:10:18,520 --> 01:10:20,800 Speaker 1: just who was put on the board. The people who 1405 01:10:20,800 --> 01:10:23,360 Speaker 1: were taken off the board were the people who were, 1406 01:10:23,400 --> 01:10:27,240 Speaker 1: like you know, the War of the academics, the technologists, 1407 01:10:27,560 --> 01:10:31,320 Speaker 1: who were concerned with some of the direction, both in 1408 01:10:31,400 --> 01:10:33,720 Speaker 1: terms of the corporate capture and also in terms of 1409 01:10:33,720 --> 01:10:35,559 Speaker 1: what this could mean for jobs and what this could 1410 01:10:35,600 --> 01:10:38,120 Speaker 1: mean for the future of humanity. Those people are taken 1411 01:10:38,160 --> 01:10:39,880 Speaker 1: out and freaking Larry Summers. 1412 01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:42,120 Speaker 3: Brought Yeah, I know the Summer's piece is particularly offensive 1413 01:10:42,160 --> 01:10:42,360 Speaker 3: to me. 1414 01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:44,960 Speaker 2: And also though part of what I get the most 1415 01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:48,439 Speaker 2: skeptical about are all these AI safety advocates or I'm like, 1416 01:10:48,439 --> 01:10:49,679 Speaker 2: what are we saying here? 1417 01:10:49,760 --> 01:10:51,559 Speaker 3: Like what are you trying to program in here? 1418 01:10:51,600 --> 01:10:54,080 Speaker 2: And I see the government and Biden stepping in being like, 1419 01:10:54,120 --> 01:10:56,200 Speaker 2: we need an AI Bill of Rights, and I'm like, 1420 01:10:56,439 --> 01:10:59,439 Speaker 2: well maybe conceptually, but I don't honestly trust you to 1421 01:10:59,479 --> 01:11:02,000 Speaker 2: be able to implement this into the technology at all. 1422 01:11:02,040 --> 01:11:04,880 Speaker 2: I think there needs to be some level of democratic input. 1423 01:11:04,920 --> 01:11:07,439 Speaker 2: So I'm genuinely the democratic input. I mean that's what 1424 01:11:07,479 --> 01:11:08,200 Speaker 2: the government is. 1425 01:11:08,520 --> 01:11:10,639 Speaker 3: Yes, well not but the White House. That's the idea. 1426 01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:12,800 Speaker 1: White House the government is supposed to be where the 1427 01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:13,759 Speaker 1: democratic interusts. 1428 01:11:13,880 --> 01:11:15,559 Speaker 2: But I think it needs to come through Congress and 1429 01:11:15,600 --> 01:11:17,360 Speaker 2: not from the White House and top down. And actually 1430 01:11:17,400 --> 01:11:19,720 Speaker 2: my bigger fear is less about the government at least 1431 01:11:19,760 --> 01:11:21,040 Speaker 2: right now, because they're not doing anything. 1432 01:11:21,080 --> 01:11:23,879 Speaker 3: It's all these fake nonprofits that are out there being. 1433 01:11:23,720 --> 01:11:26,920 Speaker 2: Like we're developing the AI code about this, and that 1434 01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:30,839 Speaker 2: there's already been problems with chat GPT around political bias 1435 01:11:30,880 --> 01:11:33,559 Speaker 2: and all these other things. And that's where the again, 1436 01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:37,200 Speaker 2: where I fear is the concentration of AI in basically 1437 01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:43,240 Speaker 2: woke capitalism, where through Microsoft, Amazon, Google and Facebook applied 1438 01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:47,280 Speaker 2: almost entirely to enterprise technology and you're just going to 1439 01:11:47,360 --> 01:11:51,639 Speaker 2: have software rule your drone cubical life if you happen 1440 01:11:51,680 --> 01:11:55,080 Speaker 2: to even make the cut for afterwards. And I genuinely 1441 01:11:55,120 --> 01:11:57,160 Speaker 2: think that is what the future of this is going 1442 01:11:57,200 --> 01:11:59,680 Speaker 2: to look like, as opposed to know all of our 1443 01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:02,360 Speaker 2: daily lives changing. I just think white collar work is 1444 01:12:02,400 --> 01:12:06,320 Speaker 2: the only thing which will marginally change, but in my opinion, 1445 01:12:06,400 --> 01:12:09,840 Speaker 2: probably in a worse direction where things are more automated. 1446 01:12:10,120 --> 01:12:12,960 Speaker 2: But the hope that I have here is that in 1447 01:12:13,000 --> 01:12:16,280 Speaker 2: every case, like the Sports Illustrated and others, these things 1448 01:12:16,520 --> 01:12:19,120 Speaker 2: have turned out to be so clownish that it just 1449 01:12:19,160 --> 01:12:21,880 Speaker 2: reveals to us how in some ways it's so far away, 1450 01:12:22,160 --> 01:12:25,400 Speaker 2: Like we're not even close to AI being able to 1451 01:12:25,400 --> 01:12:26,919 Speaker 2: replace a human journalist. 1452 01:12:27,200 --> 01:12:29,320 Speaker 3: It would take five to maybe ten years. 1453 01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:33,320 Speaker 2: And we heard for years about car development. I talk 1454 01:12:33,360 --> 01:12:35,720 Speaker 2: about the self driving car thing a lot. Yeah, you know, 1455 01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:40,439 Speaker 2: automated autopilot is cool, but can it turn left really 1456 01:12:40,479 --> 01:12:40,960 Speaker 2: well yet? 1457 01:12:41,120 --> 01:12:41,240 Speaker 8: No? 1458 01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:44,160 Speaker 2: And it's taken them what Tesla's been around since two 1459 01:12:44,200 --> 01:12:47,120 Speaker 2: thousand and eight, you know, working on this technology and 1460 01:12:47,160 --> 01:12:49,920 Speaker 2: they have billions and billions of dollars that they've thrown 1461 01:12:49,960 --> 01:12:51,920 Speaker 2: into it, and they still haven't really mastered it. So 1462 01:12:52,240 --> 01:12:54,240 Speaker 2: and you know, we saw the Austin example about all 1463 01:12:54,240 --> 01:12:56,880 Speaker 2: those self driving cabs that come like this, this is 1464 01:12:56,880 --> 01:12:59,920 Speaker 2: a really really difficult problem. So I'm less worried as some. 1465 01:13:00,439 --> 01:13:06,000 Speaker 1: A military application to me is really scary because let's imagine, 1466 01:13:06,040 --> 01:13:08,519 Speaker 1: I mean, we can already see like what Israel is 1467 01:13:08,560 --> 01:13:10,360 Speaker 1: doing in Gaza right now, that there isn't a lot 1468 01:13:10,360 --> 01:13:13,040 Speaker 1: of concern for who's a civilian and who's a combatant, 1469 01:13:13,080 --> 01:13:15,040 Speaker 1: and who's a woman and a child, and who's an 1470 01:13:15,080 --> 01:13:19,080 Speaker 1: actual Hamas militant, et cetera. So while the technology may 1471 01:13:19,080 --> 01:13:21,480 Speaker 1: not be all the way there in terms of discriminating, 1472 01:13:22,080 --> 01:13:25,120 Speaker 1: they may not really care. I don't think that there's 1473 01:13:25,120 --> 01:13:28,040 Speaker 1: any evidence that they would really care. And so if 1474 01:13:28,040 --> 01:13:31,559 Speaker 1: it's an autonomous drone that's murdering people, like where there's 1475 01:13:31,720 --> 01:13:34,840 Speaker 1: no chance of accountability, at least if it's a human operator, 1476 01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:37,080 Speaker 1: there's some sort of a chain of command, at least 1477 01:13:37,080 --> 01:13:41,640 Speaker 1: there's a possibility of holding some sort of human being accountable. 1478 01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:45,480 Speaker 1: If you have drones that are able to themselves decide 1479 01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:48,000 Speaker 1: who gets to live and who gets to die. And 1480 01:13:48,040 --> 01:13:51,679 Speaker 1: this is active, actively in development by US, China and 1481 01:13:51,920 --> 01:13:55,160 Speaker 1: Israel and getting closer and closer to fruition. Yeah, that's 1482 01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:58,200 Speaker 1: something I'm very concerned about right now in the near term. 1483 01:13:58,280 --> 01:13:58,960 Speaker 3: I think that's fair. 1484 01:13:59,400 --> 01:14:01,040 Speaker 2: I just love humans are always going to have to 1485 01:14:01,080 --> 01:14:02,639 Speaker 2: make some sort of decision. So this is if something 1486 01:14:02,680 --> 01:14:04,080 Speaker 2: I talked about with Mark and reasons, like at the 1487 01:14:04,160 --> 01:14:05,640 Speaker 2: end of the day, like humans are going to have 1488 01:14:05,720 --> 01:14:08,439 Speaker 2: a level of a tremendous level of input, and you know, 1489 01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:11,479 Speaker 2: we can think about that, what is there true difference 1490 01:14:11,520 --> 01:14:13,880 Speaker 2: between where we are right now, where Israel decides where 1491 01:14:13,920 --> 01:14:16,919 Speaker 2: to bomb and yet they use a jadam, a guided 1492 01:14:17,120 --> 01:14:20,360 Speaker 2: precision bomb, which where we pick the target and then 1493 01:14:20,760 --> 01:14:24,080 Speaker 2: the missile and computer targeting systems work to hit that. 1494 01:14:24,479 --> 01:14:26,400 Speaker 3: There will always be some level. 1495 01:14:26,200 --> 01:14:29,439 Speaker 2: Of decision making that gets programmed into it from what 1496 01:14:29,560 --> 01:14:31,240 Speaker 2: the actual want of the person is. 1497 01:14:31,360 --> 01:14:33,599 Speaker 3: So what truly separates that is it just that. 1498 01:14:33,560 --> 01:14:36,000 Speaker 2: We can deliver the bomb in a quicker manner because 1499 01:14:36,120 --> 01:14:37,799 Speaker 2: at the end of the day, like the human discretion 1500 01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:40,559 Speaker 2: and the political determination of how and what it will 1501 01:14:40,600 --> 01:14:41,000 Speaker 2: be used. 1502 01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:42,760 Speaker 3: I don't think that's going away anytime soon. 1503 01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:45,320 Speaker 2: Maybe the AI can roll this clip of me one 1504 01:14:45,360 --> 01:14:47,240 Speaker 2: hundred years from now and make fun of me while 1505 01:14:47,280 --> 01:14:49,040 Speaker 2: you know, my grandchildren are living in the matrix. 1506 01:14:49,080 --> 01:14:51,400 Speaker 3: But we'll see. Let's move on to Ireland. 1507 01:14:51,439 --> 01:14:54,200 Speaker 2: There's been a lot happening in Ireland that you might 1508 01:14:54,240 --> 01:14:56,400 Speaker 2: have seen this broken out over the last week or so, 1509 01:14:56,920 --> 01:15:00,479 Speaker 2: riots and violence exploding in downtown Dublin. 1510 01:15:00,560 --> 01:15:02,760 Speaker 3: Let's go ahead and play some of this footage. 1511 01:15:02,840 --> 01:15:10,360 Speaker 2: Absolutely crazy crazy stuff. This midir a Western European capital, 1512 01:15:10,800 --> 01:15:13,000 Speaker 2: and of course there's been a lot of i think 1513 01:15:13,080 --> 01:15:17,160 Speaker 2: media misinformation and reporting around all of this has even 1514 01:15:17,280 --> 01:15:22,040 Speaker 2: ensnared the k UFC King Connor McGregor, and so anyway, 1515 01:15:22,360 --> 01:15:25,800 Speaker 2: what exactly is going on behind the scenes here? So 1516 01:15:26,200 --> 01:15:29,879 Speaker 2: at a very very basic level, here is what happened. 1517 01:15:29,960 --> 01:15:36,240 Speaker 2: There was a stabbing incident which involved a foreign national, whoever, 1518 01:15:36,320 --> 01:15:39,840 Speaker 2: though had actually lived in Ireland since two thousand and three. 1519 01:15:39,920 --> 01:15:41,960 Speaker 2: So let's please put this tear sheet up there on 1520 01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:45,120 Speaker 2: the screen, which from the Times of England, which actually 1521 01:15:45,200 --> 01:15:48,000 Speaker 2: has some of the best reporting that we've seen on 1522 01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:48,479 Speaker 2: the subject. 1523 01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:49,040 Speaker 3: Quote. 1524 01:15:49,120 --> 01:15:51,599 Speaker 2: The suspect arrived in Ireland in two thousand and three 1525 01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:56,639 Speaker 2: applied for asylum. His application was rejected, his deportation ordered, 1526 01:15:56,760 --> 01:15:59,160 Speaker 2: but he successfully challenged it and he now. 1527 01:15:59,040 --> 01:16:00,559 Speaker 3: Has full residency rights. 1528 01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:03,719 Speaker 2: There are suggestions that his mental health had deteriorated after 1529 01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:06,240 Speaker 2: he was diagnosed with a brain tumor about two years ago, 1530 01:16:06,439 --> 01:16:08,639 Speaker 2: and his friends had told the police that his behavior 1531 01:16:08,720 --> 01:16:11,679 Speaker 2: was changing radically afterwards. He was then arrested in possession 1532 01:16:11,680 --> 01:16:14,000 Speaker 2: of a knife in Dublin last May and appeared before 1533 01:16:14,040 --> 01:16:16,680 Speaker 2: the District Court in June. The outcome is unclear. He 1534 01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:20,920 Speaker 2: went on to stab multiple small children in Ireland. The 1535 01:16:21,000 --> 01:16:25,320 Speaker 2: riots essensibly then were set off with anti immigrant sentiment. However, 1536 01:16:25,439 --> 01:16:28,439 Speaker 2: Christal and I we were talking about this and I 1537 01:16:28,439 --> 01:16:31,559 Speaker 2: think they have really mischaracterized a lot of what is 1538 01:16:31,560 --> 01:16:35,240 Speaker 2: happening here. Yes, a lot of this is downstream of immigration, 1539 01:16:35,560 --> 01:16:40,679 Speaker 2: but Ireland is facing a very very serious housing crisis 1540 01:16:40,760 --> 01:16:43,559 Speaker 2: right now, which has a huge part to do not 1541 01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:47,440 Speaker 2: only with Islamic refugees but also a lot of Ukrainians. 1542 01:16:47,600 --> 01:16:49,479 Speaker 2: So let's please put this up there. And I'm also 1543 01:16:49,560 --> 01:16:53,599 Speaker 2: going to read some statistics. Quote ireland demography has been 1544 01:16:53,640 --> 01:16:57,439 Speaker 2: transformed in decades. A fifth of the five million people 1545 01:16:57,479 --> 01:17:00,879 Speaker 2: now living in Ireland were born elsewhere, and a recent 1546 01:17:01,080 --> 01:17:05,439 Speaker 2: increase in refugees from Ukraine and other countries has fueled 1547 01:17:05,479 --> 01:17:10,880 Speaker 2: a backlash amid concern over housing shortage and straining public services. 1548 01:17:11,000 --> 01:17:13,679 Speaker 2: The number that is housed by the state has jumped 1549 01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:17,320 Speaker 2: from seventy five hundred and twenty twenty one to seventy 1550 01:17:17,400 --> 01:17:19,760 Speaker 2: three thousand in twenty twenty two. 1551 01:17:20,120 --> 01:17:20,400 Speaker 8: Quote. 1552 01:17:20,439 --> 01:17:22,880 Speaker 2: Ireland has received more than one hundred and forty one 1553 01:17:22,920 --> 01:17:25,720 Speaker 2: thousand immigrants in the last twelve months through April. That 1554 01:17:25,800 --> 01:17:28,400 Speaker 2: is the highest total in Irish society since two thousand 1555 01:17:28,439 --> 01:17:31,120 Speaker 2: and seven, and the influx of migrants is driven an 1556 01:17:31,160 --> 01:17:35,320 Speaker 2: eleven percent increase in Irish population over the last eleven years, 1557 01:17:35,439 --> 01:17:38,280 Speaker 2: which has contributed to a steady increase in housing crist 1558 01:17:38,400 --> 01:17:41,080 Speaker 2: in housing prices. So really, what I think this is 1559 01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:44,519 Speaker 2: crystal is a story not only of mass immigration, but 1560 01:17:44,600 --> 01:17:48,760 Speaker 2: of frankly Ukrainian refugees and other refugees from around the 1561 01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:52,879 Speaker 2: world that are flooding into Western Europe as these Western 1562 01:17:52,920 --> 01:17:58,040 Speaker 2: European capitals have to grapple with their tremendous social safety 1563 01:17:58,040 --> 01:18:02,840 Speaker 2: in it their Western liberal politics, but frankly disregarding and 1564 01:18:02,880 --> 01:18:04,960 Speaker 2: this is what I think the reason that this really 1565 01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:09,519 Speaker 2: touched here was their own domestic population, whose houses are 1566 01:18:09,560 --> 01:18:13,720 Speaker 2: getting so unaffordable as they're watching foreigners get housed in 1567 01:18:13,800 --> 01:18:17,200 Speaker 2: state housing, as you have Irish citizens and others who 1568 01:18:17,200 --> 01:18:20,639 Speaker 2: are homeless on the street. That was like the core 1569 01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:23,960 Speaker 2: of the spark here, and I haven't seen that particularly 1570 01:18:23,960 --> 01:18:27,320 Speaker 2: well articulated in Western media as to what's happening. And 1571 01:18:27,320 --> 01:18:28,960 Speaker 2: we'll get to the crackdown and in the second if 1572 01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:30,280 Speaker 2: you want to comment on any of this. 1573 01:18:30,479 --> 01:18:33,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean and listen to state the obvious just 1574 01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:35,880 Speaker 1: is when we're analyzing what happened in October seventh, it's 1575 01:18:35,920 --> 01:18:38,840 Speaker 1: not a justification. And as we're analyzing what happened with 1576 01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:42,559 Speaker 1: these rides, also not a justification. But yeah, when you 1577 01:18:42,640 --> 01:18:47,000 Speaker 1: couple the highest homelessness that Ireland has ever seen, yeah, 1578 01:18:47,400 --> 01:18:52,080 Speaker 1: massive housing crisis, Ireland's they were one of the countries 1579 01:18:52,080 --> 01:18:54,519 Speaker 1: that got the most screwed in the two thousand and 1580 01:18:54,560 --> 01:18:57,479 Speaker 1: eight financial crisis and have in some ways never recovered. 1581 01:18:57,840 --> 01:19:00,559 Speaker 1: So when you couple this, but I think the piece 1582 01:19:00,600 --> 01:19:03,160 Speaker 1: seems to be really central. You know, based on the 1583 01:19:03,280 --> 01:19:05,800 Speaker 1: analysis that we were able to read, and like I said, 1584 01:19:05,840 --> 01:19:09,640 Speaker 1: the very high homelessness rate, when you couple that with 1585 01:19:10,400 --> 01:19:13,640 Speaker 1: you know, a large influx of people from other countries, 1586 01:19:14,080 --> 01:19:17,400 Speaker 1: you have created a tinderbox in which, yeah, the easiest 1587 01:19:17,439 --> 01:19:20,479 Speaker 1: thing for people to do is going to be and 1588 01:19:20,520 --> 01:19:24,200 Speaker 1: for you know, cynical politicians and influencers and whoever is 1589 01:19:24,280 --> 01:19:28,160 Speaker 1: to blame the immigrants, and you know, it's classic scapegoating, 1590 01:19:28,439 --> 01:19:32,120 Speaker 1: that's very common to see what unfolded here, and you know, 1591 01:19:32,160 --> 01:19:35,120 Speaker 1: and there was like misinformation about who this person actually 1592 01:19:35,200 --> 01:19:37,120 Speaker 1: was the context of actually the dude's been here for 1593 01:19:37,120 --> 01:19:39,760 Speaker 1: twenty years, by the way, was not in there whatsoever, 1594 01:19:40,160 --> 01:19:44,560 Speaker 1: but it lit the spark that explodes in these unbelievable 1595 01:19:44,880 --> 01:19:49,120 Speaker 1: riots that unfolded. Also worth mentioning that the man who 1596 01:19:49,200 --> 01:19:52,519 Speaker 1: disrupted the attack, who hit the dude who was stabbing 1597 01:19:52,600 --> 01:19:56,800 Speaker 1: children over the head with his helmet, was a recent immigrant. 1598 01:19:56,479 --> 01:19:59,400 Speaker 3: From Persia, from Brazil. He was actually thanked by Connor McGregor. 1599 01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:00,960 Speaker 3: So let's let me tie it in. 1600 01:20:01,400 --> 01:20:04,200 Speaker 1: Just to be clear. But but yeah, I think you know, 1601 01:20:04,280 --> 01:20:08,519 Speaker 1: it's it's we have had this idea of you know, 1602 01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:11,800 Speaker 1: the Ukraine War and that it's obviously beautiful that all 1603 01:20:11,800 --> 01:20:14,679 Speaker 1: these countries have taken in refugees, and we covered yesterday 1604 01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:17,000 Speaker 1: how the US is really central, I mean, the reason 1605 01:20:17,040 --> 01:20:19,120 Speaker 1: that this war has gone on on and on and on, 1606 01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:21,720 Speaker 1: and we can't deny the fact that, especially in a 1607 01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:25,559 Speaker 1: time when countries' safety nets are stretched, when inflation is tough, 1608 01:20:25,560 --> 01:20:28,680 Speaker 1: when people all over the world are feeling very stretched economically, 1609 01:20:29,120 --> 01:20:32,600 Speaker 1: that this is the type of politics that oftentimes results. 1610 01:20:32,280 --> 01:20:33,479 Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I just looked it up. 1611 01:20:33,520 --> 01:20:35,840 Speaker 2: The average sale price of a home in Dublin is 1612 01:20:35,920 --> 01:20:39,719 Speaker 2: one point three million euro as of last month. 1613 01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:42,439 Speaker 1: And people feel like they can no longer afford to 1614 01:20:42,479 --> 01:20:44,880 Speaker 1: live in the neighborhoods where they grew up and where 1615 01:20:44,920 --> 01:20:47,479 Speaker 1: their family is, et cetera. They feel like, you know, 1616 01:20:47,600 --> 01:20:49,400 Speaker 1: and like they have no hope and all of this 1617 01:20:49,520 --> 01:20:53,000 Speaker 1: again not justification, but just to understand. These things don't 1618 01:20:53,040 --> 01:20:57,000 Speaker 1: come out of nowhere. And so instead of focusing classic 1619 01:20:57,160 --> 01:21:00,559 Speaker 1: like you know, sort of neoliberal political moved so, rather 1620 01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:03,360 Speaker 1: than focusing on those core problems, well what should they do? Instead, 1621 01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:05,080 Speaker 1: they're going to crack down on the misinformation. 1622 01:21:05,200 --> 01:21:07,400 Speaker 2: And let's get to that, because this is what the 1623 01:21:07,439 --> 01:21:09,840 Speaker 2: response of the Irish government has been, which is, no, 1624 01:21:10,080 --> 01:21:13,519 Speaker 2: we don't need to maybe reconsider our refugee resettlement population, 1625 01:21:13,760 --> 01:21:16,960 Speaker 2: or we don't need to reconsider our housing policy. We 1626 01:21:17,080 --> 01:21:20,240 Speaker 2: need to crack down on hate speech, which is what 1627 01:21:20,400 --> 01:21:24,480 Speaker 2: incited these riots, which is why Connor McGregor is under investigation. 1628 01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:27,200 Speaker 2: Here is the Prime Minister laying some of this out 1629 01:21:27,400 --> 01:21:28,719 Speaker 2: as a response to the riots. 1630 01:21:28,880 --> 01:21:31,160 Speaker 4: In addition to that, I think it's now very obvious 1631 01:21:31,520 --> 01:21:34,759 Speaker 4: to anyone who might have doubted it that our incitement 1632 01:21:34,840 --> 01:21:37,280 Speaker 4: hatred legislation is just not up to date. It's not 1633 01:21:37,360 --> 01:21:39,720 Speaker 4: up to date for the social media age, and we 1634 01:21:39,760 --> 01:21:42,040 Speaker 4: need that legislation through. We need to through within a 1635 01:21:42,080 --> 01:21:45,599 Speaker 4: matter of weeks, because it's not just the platforms who 1636 01:21:45,640 --> 01:21:48,360 Speaker 4: have a responsibility here, and they do. There's also the 1637 01:21:48,400 --> 01:21:52,840 Speaker 4: individuals who post messages and images online that stir a 1638 01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:55,200 Speaker 4: hatred in violence, and we need to be able to 1639 01:21:55,320 --> 01:21:57,519 Speaker 4: use laws to go after them individually as well. 1640 01:21:57,960 --> 01:21:59,960 Speaker 2: Got to go after the people who were talking about 1641 01:22:00,160 --> 01:22:02,720 Speaker 2: it's bs that Ukrainians are getting free housing when an 1642 01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:05,040 Speaker 2: average home price is one point three million. Yeah, that 1643 01:22:05,120 --> 01:22:07,320 Speaker 2: sounds like the right thing to do. Here is one 1644 01:22:07,320 --> 01:22:09,719 Speaker 2: of their Green Party senators. This is a very viral clip, 1645 01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:13,679 Speaker 2: but it really represents this ideology that's prevailed all throughout 1646 01:22:13,680 --> 01:22:17,360 Speaker 2: Western Europe about what freedom of speech actually means to them. 1647 01:22:17,560 --> 01:22:18,360 Speaker 3: Basically nothing. 1648 01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:21,880 Speaker 9: Take a listen when you think about it, all law, 1649 01:22:22,439 --> 01:22:26,360 Speaker 9: all legislation is about the restriction of freedom. That's exactly 1650 01:22:26,400 --> 01:22:29,160 Speaker 9: what we're doing here is we are restricting freedom, but 1651 01:22:29,240 --> 01:22:30,719 Speaker 9: we're doing it for the common good. 1652 01:22:31,040 --> 01:22:31,839 Speaker 3: You will see. 1653 01:22:31,640 --> 01:22:35,519 Speaker 9: Throughout our constitution. Yes you have rights, but they are 1654 01:22:35,560 --> 01:22:40,000 Speaker 9: restricted for the common good. Everything needs to be balanced. 1655 01:22:40,520 --> 01:22:44,760 Speaker 9: And if your views on other people's identities go to 1656 01:22:45,200 --> 01:22:51,000 Speaker 9: make their lives unsafe, insecure and cause them such deep 1657 01:22:51,240 --> 01:22:55,000 Speaker 9: discomfort that they cannot live in peace, then I believe 1658 01:22:55,040 --> 01:22:58,679 Speaker 9: that it is our job as legislators to restrict those 1659 01:22:58,720 --> 01:22:59,920 Speaker 9: freedoms for the common good. 1660 01:23:00,320 --> 01:23:02,280 Speaker 3: There you go. Safety ism in a nutshell. 1661 01:23:02,360 --> 01:23:04,519 Speaker 1: Sounds like a bunch of conservatives right now talking about 1662 01:23:04,520 --> 01:23:06,720 Speaker 1: anti semitism in college Cansas. 1663 01:23:07,320 --> 01:23:10,320 Speaker 3: No, I mean, not wrong. True, it's true. But here's 1664 01:23:10,360 --> 01:23:12,400 Speaker 3: the thing this is leading to now. 1665 01:23:12,439 --> 01:23:16,240 Speaker 2: Connor McGregor's investigation for this following tweet, let's put this 1666 01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:17,960 Speaker 2: up there on the screen. I'm gonna read it to 1667 01:23:17,960 --> 01:23:21,320 Speaker 2: you directly. He says, innocent children ruthlessly stabbed today by 1668 01:23:21,439 --> 01:23:24,519 Speaker 2: mentally deranged non national Dublin in Ireland today. Our chief 1669 01:23:24,560 --> 01:23:26,160 Speaker 2: of Police had this to say on the riots of 1670 01:23:26,160 --> 01:23:26,719 Speaker 2: the aftermath. 1671 01:23:26,920 --> 01:23:27,519 Speaker 3: Not good enough. 1672 01:23:27,520 --> 01:23:29,880 Speaker 2: There's grave danger among us in Ireland that should never 1673 01:23:29,880 --> 01:23:31,679 Speaker 2: be here in the first place. There has been zero 1674 01:23:31,760 --> 01:23:33,880 Speaker 2: action done to support the public in any way, shape 1675 01:23:33,960 --> 01:23:36,760 Speaker 2: or form with this frightening fact. Not good enough, make 1676 01:23:36,840 --> 01:23:39,200 Speaker 2: change or make way Ireland for the victory. 1677 01:23:39,400 --> 01:23:42,519 Speaker 3: God blessed those attack today. We pray that's what he said. 1678 01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:46,479 Speaker 2: And they're claiming that he glorified violence, and yet they're 1679 01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:51,519 Speaker 2: ignoring that he thanked the Brazilian immigrant. But Brazilian Irish 1680 01:23:51,680 --> 01:23:55,120 Speaker 2: immigrant who actually stopped the violence. He says, I don't 1681 01:23:55,120 --> 01:23:57,680 Speaker 2: condone last night's riots. I don't condone attacks on our 1682 01:23:57,720 --> 01:23:59,120 Speaker 2: first responders in their line of duty. 1683 01:23:59,240 --> 01:24:00,439 Speaker 3: I don't condone looting. 1684 01:24:00,600 --> 01:24:03,600 Speaker 2: Last night's scenes achieved nothing towards fixing this issue. I 1685 01:24:03,720 --> 01:24:07,840 Speaker 2: do understand the frustrations, however, and I understand a move 1686 01:24:07,920 --> 01:24:10,000 Speaker 2: must be made to ensure the change that we need 1687 01:24:10,320 --> 01:24:10,960 Speaker 2: is ushered in. 1688 01:24:11,200 --> 01:24:13,280 Speaker 3: That's what he said. What's wrong with that exactly? 1689 01:24:13,439 --> 01:24:16,040 Speaker 1: Even if he did say something wrong and heinous, terrible. 1690 01:24:16,200 --> 01:24:16,800 Speaker 3: Let's put that asta. 1691 01:24:17,000 --> 01:24:19,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, but then he still should be able to say 1692 01:24:19,240 --> 01:24:21,400 Speaker 1: those things. And it's such a dodge to just be like, oh, 1693 01:24:21,400 --> 01:24:23,400 Speaker 1: we're going to crack down on the misinformation, as if 1694 01:24:23,400 --> 01:24:26,280 Speaker 1: that's going to solve the underlying problems. I was just like, 1695 01:24:26,479 --> 01:24:27,320 Speaker 1: very similar to here. 1696 01:24:27,439 --> 01:24:30,000 Speaker 3: You don't want to admit the actual problem here. And 1697 01:24:30,160 --> 01:24:32,519 Speaker 3: you know, Iron's a small country. They got five million people. 1698 01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:34,800 Speaker 3: One hundred and forty thousand people is a lot of. 1699 01:24:34,760 --> 01:24:38,639 Speaker 2: People, and twenty percent of your population being foreign born. 1700 01:24:38,680 --> 01:24:40,599 Speaker 2: And I'll press the red button and I'll go to 1701 01:24:40,600 --> 01:24:43,280 Speaker 2: what Margaret Thatcher said of her own country. Europe is 1702 01:24:43,280 --> 01:24:46,280 Speaker 2: about history, America is about an idea. It's like, these 1703 01:24:46,320 --> 01:24:50,760 Speaker 2: are very different populations with very different understandings of immigration. They, 1704 01:24:51,080 --> 01:24:54,479 Speaker 2: I think, behave in a completely responsible manner whenever it 1705 01:24:54,520 --> 01:24:57,280 Speaker 2: comes to refugee resettlement in all of this, and you 1706 01:24:57,360 --> 01:25:01,600 Speaker 2: combine that with their generous welfare states neglecting their own population. 1707 01:25:01,960 --> 01:25:04,280 Speaker 2: I mean, I just think, Crystal, the more I did 1708 01:25:04,520 --> 01:25:07,160 Speaker 2: research into this, I was honestly shocked at the way 1709 01:25:07,160 --> 01:25:08,480 Speaker 2: that it has been portrayed. 1710 01:25:08,840 --> 01:25:12,560 Speaker 1: It's when you look at you know, political science analyzes 1711 01:25:12,840 --> 01:25:19,040 Speaker 1: of countries with large immigrant populations. When things are going well, 1712 01:25:19,120 --> 01:25:22,120 Speaker 1: it's fine. You know, when people feel like I can 1713 01:25:22,160 --> 01:25:24,120 Speaker 1: buy a house, I can have a family, I can 1714 01:25:24,160 --> 01:25:26,479 Speaker 1: have a job, I can have a good income. But 1715 01:25:27,160 --> 01:25:29,799 Speaker 1: when things are not going well, then guess what again, 1716 01:25:29,960 --> 01:25:33,040 Speaker 1: You're going to look for scapegoats. And this is the 1717 01:25:33,080 --> 01:25:36,439 Speaker 1: tale as old as time. So so in any way, 1718 01:25:36,720 --> 01:25:38,960 Speaker 1: in any case, the idea that you're going to fix 1719 01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:42,800 Speaker 1: it by like cracking down on social media and Connor McGregor. 1720 01:25:42,439 --> 01:25:44,080 Speaker 3: Is silly, not going to happen. 1721 01:25:46,560 --> 01:25:49,559 Speaker 1: All right, let's talk about some domestic politics here. This 1722 01:25:50,640 --> 01:25:55,080 Speaker 1: is stunning. This is brazen, even for the pretty brazenly 1723 01:25:55,360 --> 01:25:59,960 Speaker 1: typical corrupt state of American politics. You now have two 1724 01:26:00,000 --> 01:26:03,200 Speaker 1: two candidates who are right now in the Democratic primary 1725 01:26:03,240 --> 01:26:07,240 Speaker 1: for Senate in Michigan, who have been offered separately twenty 1726 01:26:07,320 --> 01:26:11,600 Speaker 1: million dollars by a donor to drop out, and primary 1727 01:26:11,840 --> 01:26:15,839 Speaker 1: Rashida Taled, who of course has come under incredible fire 1728 01:26:16,200 --> 01:26:20,720 Speaker 1: for her public stance in favor of Palestinians and Palestinian 1729 01:26:20,800 --> 01:26:23,880 Speaker 1: humanity and calling for a ceasefire. Let's take a listen 1730 01:26:23,920 --> 01:26:26,160 Speaker 1: to We actually talked to this candidate and NASA on 1731 01:26:26,240 --> 01:26:29,880 Speaker 1: this show recently about how he was approached and offered 1732 01:26:29,880 --> 01:26:32,479 Speaker 1: twenty million dollars to draw out and primary Rashida to leave. 1733 01:26:32,520 --> 01:26:33,000 Speaker 1: Take a listen. 1734 01:26:33,439 --> 01:26:38,519 Speaker 10: I was offered twenty million dollars to withdraw from the 1735 01:26:38,560 --> 01:26:42,840 Speaker 10: senatorial race and run against my friend Rashida Talib. The 1736 01:26:42,880 --> 01:26:47,519 Speaker 10: pro Israel lobby will go to any link to remove 1737 01:26:47,760 --> 01:26:53,240 Speaker 10: anybody from the US Congress that has any opposition to 1738 01:26:53,320 --> 01:27:00,519 Speaker 10: their agenda and their total unequivocal support for Israel, good, bad, 1739 01:27:00,720 --> 01:27:05,760 Speaker 10: or indifferent. We need to make sure that money is 1740 01:27:05,840 --> 01:27:09,800 Speaker 10: not the main catalyst to get people elected, because the 1741 01:27:09,840 --> 01:27:14,720 Speaker 10: pro Israel lobby is only tool, and what they use 1742 01:27:14,920 --> 01:27:19,080 Speaker 10: to threaten politicians is the amount of money they're going 1743 01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:22,800 Speaker 10: to spend against them or for them. America, let's come 1744 01:27:22,840 --> 01:27:26,200 Speaker 10: together and elect people who truly represent our values. 1745 01:27:26,680 --> 01:27:30,200 Speaker 1: So the other candidate was a gentleman named Hill. Harper 1746 01:27:30,240 --> 01:27:32,800 Speaker 1: put this up on the screen. Another Senate candidate in 1747 01:27:32,920 --> 01:27:36,760 Speaker 1: Michigan who Politico originally got this report that he was 1748 01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:40,240 Speaker 1: offered twenty million dollars to drop out and run against 1749 01:27:40,320 --> 01:27:43,040 Speaker 1: Rashida to leave. He confirmed the story, says, I didn't 1750 01:27:43,040 --> 01:27:44,920 Speaker 1: intend for a private phone call to turn public, but 1751 01:27:44,960 --> 01:27:47,640 Speaker 1: now that it has, here's the truth. One of apak's 1752 01:27:47,680 --> 01:27:50,320 Speaker 1: biggest donors offered twenty mil if I dropped down a 1753 01:27:50,439 --> 01:27:52,599 Speaker 1: US Senate race to run against Rashida. To leave, I 1754 01:27:52,640 --> 01:27:56,160 Speaker 1: said no. I won't be bossed, bullied, or bought. One 1755 01:27:56,160 --> 01:27:59,200 Speaker 1: of the crazy things here too. By the way, an 1756 01:27:59,200 --> 01:28:01,559 Speaker 1: APAC deny, as I should add, he says, the group 1757 01:28:01,600 --> 01:28:03,639 Speaker 1: was absolutely not involved in any way in this matter. 1758 01:28:03,680 --> 01:28:06,320 Speaker 1: Our records indicate this individual has not contributed to APAC 1759 01:28:06,400 --> 01:28:08,559 Speaker 1: in over a decade. So that's their side of the story. 1760 01:28:08,560 --> 01:28:10,519 Speaker 1: But one of the really crazy things about this saga 1761 01:28:11,200 --> 01:28:16,000 Speaker 1: is that both Hill Harper and naserbay Dun, they both 1762 01:28:16,080 --> 01:28:19,840 Speaker 1: are like calling for a ceasefire and standing up for 1763 01:28:20,040 --> 01:28:24,080 Speaker 1: Palestinian civilians being killed right now. And I think the 1764 01:28:24,160 --> 01:28:27,400 Speaker 1: idea is just you know, they know with Rashida to leave, 1765 01:28:27,640 --> 01:28:31,320 Speaker 1: that she is a tireless advocate, they know she's outspoken, 1766 01:28:31,960 --> 01:28:33,840 Speaker 1: they know she's been a leader in this moment of 1767 01:28:33,880 --> 01:28:37,559 Speaker 1: calling for a ceasefire. I mean, she's Palestinian American here, 1768 01:28:37,720 --> 01:28:39,960 Speaker 1: and so they sort of feel like, we don't care 1769 01:28:40,080 --> 01:28:43,240 Speaker 1: who it is, we'll take anyone other than Rashida to 1770 01:28:43,320 --> 01:28:45,799 Speaker 1: leave because of her dedicated commitment on the issue. 1771 01:28:45,960 --> 01:28:46,240 Speaker 3: Yeah. 1772 01:28:46,360 --> 01:28:48,599 Speaker 2: I mean I think that this is really just a 1773 01:28:48,640 --> 01:28:50,960 Speaker 2: matter of we do it because we can, and it's 1774 01:28:50,960 --> 01:28:52,880 Speaker 2: one of those where they want to take her out 1775 01:28:53,439 --> 01:28:55,400 Speaker 2: just to show that it is possible as well. 1776 01:28:55,400 --> 01:28:56,559 Speaker 3: To teach a US warning shot. 1777 01:28:56,640 --> 01:28:56,840 Speaker 5: Yeah. 1778 01:28:56,880 --> 01:28:58,800 Speaker 3: Absolutely, Well, I don't like Rashita to leave. 1779 01:28:58,840 --> 01:29:01,720 Speaker 2: I think she's actually incredibly I think she's done a 1780 01:29:01,720 --> 01:29:04,080 Speaker 2: disservice to her own Palestinian cause we could talk about 1781 01:29:04,560 --> 01:29:07,080 Speaker 2: in a different wildly disagree with Well. I mean, she's 1782 01:29:07,120 --> 01:29:09,439 Speaker 2: just conducted herself in a ridiculous manner and she's honestly 1783 01:29:09,479 --> 01:29:12,120 Speaker 2: just fulfilled, like, in my opinion, the worst characteristics of 1784 01:29:12,240 --> 01:29:13,640 Speaker 2: I totally totally. 1785 01:29:13,240 --> 01:29:16,640 Speaker 1: Being no, that is not true. I mean she's condemned. 1786 01:29:16,760 --> 01:29:19,680 Speaker 1: She's condemned the homoc atrocity. That's not what she's been 1787 01:29:19,680 --> 01:29:23,559 Speaker 1: standing up for. Ceasefire in Palestinian civilians. I think it's 1788 01:29:23,600 --> 01:29:24,880 Speaker 1: been incredibly courageous. 1789 01:29:25,400 --> 01:29:28,040 Speaker 3: The record on the hospital attack just fulfilled. 1790 01:29:28,120 --> 01:29:30,879 Speaker 1: The witch still still in dispute. 1791 01:29:30,920 --> 01:29:33,160 Speaker 3: By the way, what is the Human Rights Watch came 1792 01:29:33,160 --> 01:29:34,960 Speaker 3: out yesterday and claims. 1793 01:29:34,560 --> 01:29:36,719 Speaker 1: They bombed like every triaging hospital in Gaza. 1794 01:29:36,840 --> 01:29:39,000 Speaker 2: I am only going to say that she did herself 1795 01:29:39,080 --> 01:29:42,120 Speaker 2: no favors by doing that, and by putting herself out 1796 01:29:42,120 --> 01:29:45,000 Speaker 2: there and in my opinion, fulfilling the worst dreams of 1797 01:29:45,040 --> 01:29:47,320 Speaker 2: her critics. If you're a politician, you should know whenever 1798 01:29:47,320 --> 01:29:50,120 Speaker 2: you're going up against the wildest lobby in all of 1799 01:29:50,160 --> 01:29:52,320 Speaker 2: American politics, you should probably not just hand them on 1800 01:29:52,320 --> 01:29:54,840 Speaker 2: a silver platter. But look, that's her life. She can 1801 01:29:54,880 --> 01:29:57,280 Speaker 2: do what she wants. I'm saying I don't like her. 1802 01:29:57,320 --> 01:29:59,599 Speaker 2: I think don't think she's done herself with any real 1803 01:29:59,640 --> 01:30:01,400 Speaker 2: service for a propole stand and cause. 1804 01:30:01,800 --> 01:30:04,280 Speaker 3: But I don't support. 1805 01:30:04,040 --> 01:30:09,320 Speaker 2: Primarying her or getting her taken out by a major 1806 01:30:09,720 --> 01:30:12,880 Speaker 2: lobby for a foreign government. To me, I find that 1807 01:30:12,920 --> 01:30:16,759 Speaker 2: particularly offensive. So anyway, I'm looking at this and APAC 1808 01:30:16,800 --> 01:30:18,920 Speaker 2: and all their influence, and it's just shocking to me, 1809 01:30:19,240 --> 01:30:21,240 Speaker 2: you know, with the John Fetterman case as well, to 1810 01:30:21,320 --> 01:30:24,559 Speaker 2: watch how they have co opted so many of these 1811 01:30:24,600 --> 01:30:28,600 Speaker 2: Democratic politicians in recent times, even people who had expressed 1812 01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:32,120 Speaker 2: different differing views, whenever they would come over the top 1813 01:30:32,160 --> 01:30:35,439 Speaker 2: and help them in some of their primary processes. So 1814 01:30:35,720 --> 01:30:37,200 Speaker 2: Ryan's done a lot of great work on this. I 1815 01:30:37,200 --> 01:30:38,599 Speaker 2: know we've covered it here on the show as well. 1816 01:30:38,760 --> 01:30:41,200 Speaker 2: The Democratic Majority for Israel for example, coming in. 1817 01:30:41,240 --> 01:30:42,719 Speaker 3: I mean, I think, didn't they think that work against 1818 01:30:42,800 --> 01:30:44,400 Speaker 3: Nina Turner? Oh if I remember. 1819 01:30:44,479 --> 01:30:47,160 Speaker 1: So Ryan has all these details in his new book 1820 01:30:47,200 --> 01:30:50,320 Speaker 1: The Squad, which I recommend, and it's actually incredible how 1821 01:30:50,439 --> 01:30:55,519 Speaker 1: much reporting he has on Apak, Democratic Majority for Israel 1822 01:30:55,720 --> 01:30:58,800 Speaker 1: and other sort of allied groups. And he said when 1823 01:30:58,800 --> 01:31:00,439 Speaker 1: he was writing the book, he was like, I'm crazy 1824 01:31:00,439 --> 01:31:02,439 Speaker 1: for including so much of this, but it ended up 1825 01:31:02,439 --> 01:31:07,280 Speaker 1: being so central to shaping the Democratic Caucus and trying 1826 01:31:07,280 --> 01:31:11,200 Speaker 1: to mold uniform views on Israel and Palestine. And so 1827 01:31:11,360 --> 01:31:13,760 Speaker 1: he has the behind the scenes story of Fetterman who 1828 01:31:13,840 --> 01:31:16,840 Speaker 1: sees all this money coming in to crush Nanna Turner. 1829 01:31:16,960 --> 01:31:20,320 Speaker 1: The first expenditures were actually against Bernie in Iowa. You know, 1830 01:31:20,400 --> 01:31:23,679 Speaker 1: coming in against Summer League, who's able barely to survive 1831 01:31:23,760 --> 01:31:26,160 Speaker 1: the onslaught. He sees all this coming in and he 1832 01:31:26,240 --> 01:31:28,000 Speaker 1: just goes and was like, tell me what I should say. 1833 01:31:28,320 --> 01:31:31,280 Speaker 1: And they had drafted a position paper and they sent 1834 01:31:31,320 --> 01:31:33,760 Speaker 1: it in to Democratic Majority for Israel and were like 1835 01:31:33,800 --> 01:31:35,479 Speaker 1: how's this and they're like, oh, we'll make some changes, 1836 01:31:35,520 --> 01:31:36,879 Speaker 1: and they're like, good done, undusted. 1837 01:31:36,960 --> 01:31:37,360 Speaker 3: Here you go. 1838 01:31:37,439 --> 01:31:38,920 Speaker 1: We're going to this is what we're going to stand 1839 01:31:38,920 --> 01:31:41,839 Speaker 1: for now. Some are lee on the other hand, because 1840 01:31:41,880 --> 01:31:45,559 Speaker 1: she had previously sent some really basic I think it 1841 01:31:45,600 --> 01:31:48,919 Speaker 1: was during the Great March of Return, some really basic 1842 01:31:49,000 --> 01:31:52,720 Speaker 1: tweets in support of like, hey, maybe Israel shouldn't be 1843 01:31:54,360 --> 01:31:58,439 Speaker 1: killing innocent civilians who were trying to peacefully protest. She 1844 01:31:58,520 --> 01:32:00,280 Speaker 1: knew she was going to be a target. There was 1845 01:32:00,320 --> 01:32:02,320 Speaker 1: no way out of it, and she was open with 1846 01:32:02,400 --> 01:32:04,920 Speaker 1: Ryan about that, like in her head, if there was 1847 01:32:04,960 --> 01:32:07,680 Speaker 1: a way of doing the pulling the John fetterman. It 1848 01:32:07,760 --> 01:32:09,599 Speaker 1: wasn't that she was like, oh, I would never do that. 1849 01:32:09,600 --> 01:32:11,519 Speaker 1: She was like, I knew it wouldn't work because I 1850 01:32:11,600 --> 01:32:15,520 Speaker 1: was already a target. And so yeah, this was determinative 1851 01:32:15,640 --> 01:32:18,040 Speaker 1: in a number of races, and they you know, secured 1852 01:32:18,080 --> 01:32:23,519 Speaker 1: the obviously very outspoken support now of Senator John Fetterman. 1853 01:32:24,400 --> 01:32:27,160 Speaker 1: And now they've said that they're going to spend even 1854 01:32:27,200 --> 01:32:31,280 Speaker 1: more money going forward, and we see these incredibly clumsy 1855 01:32:31,320 --> 01:32:33,679 Speaker 1: and naked attempts and by the way, potentially illegal because 1856 01:32:33,680 --> 01:32:36,639 Speaker 1: you can't you can't just give a candidate twenty million dollars, 1857 01:32:37,320 --> 01:32:38,960 Speaker 1: and so if it's going to go through a super pack, 1858 01:32:39,000 --> 01:32:40,920 Speaker 1: you also can't coordinate with them. And then there's a 1859 01:32:41,000 --> 01:32:42,960 Speaker 1: question of whether these are like straw donations. 1860 01:32:43,000 --> 01:32:44,160 Speaker 3: Wait, I didn't even think about it. 1861 01:32:44,240 --> 01:32:47,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's also like not really legal to do this. 1862 01:32:47,600 --> 01:32:52,160 Speaker 1: But anyway, it just shows you how disturbed they are 1863 01:32:52,320 --> 01:32:56,200 Speaker 1: that there is any descent on the issue. And the 1864 01:32:56,240 --> 01:32:58,320 Speaker 1: other thing that comes through in Ryan's book, which is 1865 01:32:58,360 --> 01:33:01,519 Speaker 1: really interesting too, is this is the one time when 1866 01:33:01,520 --> 01:33:05,120 Speaker 1: the squad has actually really stood up to democratic leadership 1867 01:33:05,120 --> 01:33:08,240 Speaker 1: in President Biden. And a lot of it is because 1868 01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:10,560 Speaker 1: you know, Rashidias leave. Obviously this is an issue she 1869 01:33:10,600 --> 01:33:13,160 Speaker 1: was passionate about Ilhanomer, obviously an issue she was passionate about. 1870 01:33:13,160 --> 01:33:15,320 Speaker 1: AOSC really didn't know a thing about Israel and Pales 1871 01:33:15,360 --> 01:33:17,840 Speaker 1: Diamond ad Many. She admitted to that of coming in 1872 01:33:18,280 --> 01:33:20,400 Speaker 1: and some release same things. This wasn't like a major 1873 01:33:20,439 --> 01:33:24,799 Speaker 1: focus of her, but because the adversaries were so fierce, 1874 01:33:24,880 --> 01:33:27,679 Speaker 1: it really sort of hardened them in their positions because 1875 01:33:27,720 --> 01:33:29,920 Speaker 1: they know they're never going to win those over them over, 1876 01:33:30,000 --> 01:33:31,559 Speaker 1: so they're like, well, why not just say what I 1877 01:33:31,640 --> 01:33:34,640 Speaker 1: actually think since there's no way I'm going to keep 1878 01:33:34,680 --> 01:33:37,160 Speaker 1: these people from trying to primary me and destroy my 1879 01:33:37,160 --> 01:33:37,760 Speaker 1: political gres. 1880 01:33:37,760 --> 01:33:39,640 Speaker 2: Absolutely, and I actually, I mean I think it's a 1881 01:33:39,720 --> 01:33:41,920 Speaker 2: human thing. On any level, someone's gonna be like, hey, 1882 01:33:41,920 --> 01:33:44,240 Speaker 2: screw you. You're like, well, hold on a second, I'm 1883 01:33:44,280 --> 01:33:46,559 Speaker 2: maybe gonna think a little bit for myself. And if 1884 01:33:46,560 --> 01:33:48,439 Speaker 2: you're going to come out oppositional from the gate, I mean, 1885 01:33:48,479 --> 01:33:51,880 Speaker 2: remember that horrible what was it, the AOC firing line interview. 1886 01:33:51,880 --> 01:33:53,679 Speaker 3: This happened like right after she was elected. She looked 1887 01:33:53,680 --> 01:33:55,680 Speaker 3: like such an idiot. Yeah, throughout it. 1888 01:33:55,760 --> 01:33:58,439 Speaker 2: But to underscore your point, we have this tweet from 1889 01:33:58,479 --> 01:34:01,160 Speaker 2: Mark Pokan, the congressman who's from the Progressive Caucus. 1890 01:34:01,240 --> 01:34:02,040 Speaker 3: Let's put it up there. 1891 01:34:02,200 --> 01:34:04,360 Speaker 2: He says, quote, the truth is that APAK is a 1892 01:34:04,360 --> 01:34:07,200 Speaker 2: conservative org raising money from rich Republicans and tries to 1893 01:34:07,200 --> 01:34:10,640 Speaker 2: buy Democratic primaries with it distorts campaign finance law in 1894 01:34:10,680 --> 01:34:13,920 Speaker 2: the worst way. Their big money influence is toxic to democracy. 1895 01:34:13,960 --> 01:34:17,280 Speaker 2: Forget what they claim, look at their record toxic money. 1896 01:34:17,320 --> 01:34:20,960 Speaker 2: And that's extraordinary coming from a Democratic congressman. I'd be 1897 01:34:21,000 --> 01:34:23,599 Speaker 2: remiss too if I didn't mention Thomas Massey, who's been 1898 01:34:23,640 --> 01:34:26,599 Speaker 2: putting them also on blast. Were running ads against him 1899 01:34:26,840 --> 01:34:28,519 Speaker 2: because he has a consistent policy. 1900 01:34:28,520 --> 01:34:30,160 Speaker 3: He is a libertarian where he says, I. 1901 01:34:30,160 --> 01:34:32,439 Speaker 2: Don't vote for foreign aid period and he said, I 1902 01:34:32,439 --> 01:34:34,080 Speaker 2: don't do it for Israel, I don't do it for 1903 01:34:34,120 --> 01:34:36,600 Speaker 2: Saudi Arabia, I wouldn't do it for Palestine. 1904 01:34:36,640 --> 01:34:38,760 Speaker 3: He's like, this is just not something that I do. 1905 01:34:38,840 --> 01:34:41,479 Speaker 2: And they're running millions of dollars of ads against him 1906 01:34:41,680 --> 01:34:45,759 Speaker 2: in Kentucky. So look, if anything, actually I support people 1907 01:34:45,760 --> 01:34:48,559 Speaker 2: coming out and breaking with APAC kind of publicly because 1908 01:34:48,640 --> 01:34:51,920 Speaker 2: I think they saved all this political capital and all 1909 01:34:52,000 --> 01:34:54,240 Speaker 2: this and they blew it on the Iran Deal. It's 1910 01:34:54,280 --> 01:34:56,880 Speaker 2: the single biggest mistake they ever made because they put 1911 01:34:56,880 --> 01:34:59,559 Speaker 2: themselves in direct opposition with the President of the United States, 1912 01:35:00,120 --> 01:35:03,920 Speaker 2: put all this ideological space open for people who agreed 1913 01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:06,280 Speaker 2: with the Iran Deal and Democrats, and then they tarred 1914 01:35:06,320 --> 01:35:08,320 Speaker 2: them as anti Israel, and they're like, well, if you're 1915 01:35:08,320 --> 01:35:10,240 Speaker 2: gonna tar me as anti Israel, I'm gonna say. 1916 01:35:10,040 --> 01:35:10,800 Speaker 3: What I actually think. 1917 01:35:10,920 --> 01:35:13,800 Speaker 11: And anti Simitis, anti Sydrill that came a little bit later, 1918 01:35:13,800 --> 01:35:16,400 Speaker 11: and that came now, and now we have Rashida tale 1919 01:35:16,479 --> 01:35:19,160 Speaker 11: ilhan Omar and others, and you have an entire generation 1920 01:35:19,200 --> 01:35:22,519 Speaker 11: of younger people too, who you know, it drives me crazy. 1921 01:35:23,120 --> 01:35:26,160 Speaker 2: People are like, she's pro Hamas. Okay, as I just 1922 01:35:26,240 --> 01:35:28,679 Speaker 2: laid out here. I think she conducts herself like a fool. 1923 01:35:29,120 --> 01:35:32,839 Speaker 2: I don't think she's pro Hamas. That's a ridiculous statement. 1924 01:35:33,160 --> 01:35:35,559 Speaker 2: When you say you're pro Hamas, you say I support 1925 01:35:35,600 --> 01:35:38,880 Speaker 2: the terrorists attack of October seventh. So like words have 1926 01:35:38,960 --> 01:35:44,960 Speaker 2: lost meaning on anti semi anti Israel, anti Zionism, pro Hamas, 1927 01:35:44,960 --> 01:35:48,479 Speaker 2: pro Palestinian. And they've tried, you know, with great success, 1928 01:35:48,520 --> 01:35:50,439 Speaker 2: I think, to use that in the pat for their 1929 01:35:50,479 --> 01:35:52,960 Speaker 2: tactics of the past in the modern age, though, people 1930 01:35:53,000 --> 01:35:54,960 Speaker 2: just see right through it. It's just totally ridiculous. 1931 01:35:55,040 --> 01:35:57,360 Speaker 1: Maybe, but that amount of money, because remember, it's not 1932 01:35:57,560 --> 01:35:59,959 Speaker 1: like when they're spending that money that every. 1933 01:35:59,720 --> 01:36:01,519 Speaker 3: Apple is about, right, it's about all this stuff. 1934 01:36:01,600 --> 01:36:04,599 Speaker 1: It's about whatever they can find to try to dislodge 1935 01:36:04,600 --> 01:36:06,960 Speaker 1: this person from power. So you know, I mean ilhan Omar. 1936 01:36:07,040 --> 01:36:08,880 Speaker 1: Actually they kind of messed up last time around because 1937 01:36:08,880 --> 01:36:10,519 Speaker 1: they didn't really spend a lot of money against her, 1938 01:36:10,520 --> 01:36:11,559 Speaker 1: and she narrowly won. 1939 01:36:11,680 --> 01:36:13,720 Speaker 2: I was going to say, so if I remember she 1940 01:36:13,840 --> 01:36:16,400 Speaker 2: ran eighteen points behind Biden in her distripation. 1941 01:36:16,120 --> 01:36:18,439 Speaker 1: I I don't remember the numbers she won, but it 1942 01:36:18,479 --> 01:36:22,360 Speaker 1: was much closer than they expected. And so a lot 1943 01:36:22,439 --> 01:36:26,840 Speaker 1: of these members who have supported a ceasefire, they have 1944 01:36:26,920 --> 01:36:29,040 Speaker 1: a target on their back. And you know, they're denying 1945 01:36:29,040 --> 01:36:31,040 Speaker 1: the one hundred million number that got reported of the 1946 01:36:31,080 --> 01:36:33,280 Speaker 1: amount of money that they're going to flood into these races, 1947 01:36:33,320 --> 01:36:36,680 Speaker 1: but you know, it's not something to sneeze at. And 1948 01:36:36,760 --> 01:36:40,160 Speaker 1: clearly they're making an aggressive effort to try to make 1949 01:36:40,240 --> 01:36:44,240 Speaker 1: sure that there is no sentiment in favor of Palestinian 1950 01:36:44,320 --> 01:36:47,880 Speaker 1: statehood or criticism of the Israeli government or certainly you know, 1951 01:36:47,960 --> 01:36:51,479 Speaker 1: the current moment calling for a ceasefire. And it is 1952 01:36:51,960 --> 01:36:54,400 Speaker 1: remarkable because you remember ilhan Omar put out that tweer. 1953 01:36:54,439 --> 01:36:56,960 Speaker 1: Remember it's all about the Benjamins with regard to APAC money, 1954 01:36:57,000 --> 01:36:58,680 Speaker 1: and she was centered for that, and it was the 1955 01:36:58,720 --> 01:37:01,559 Speaker 1: whole thing, and so to now see Mark Polkan, who's 1956 01:37:01,640 --> 01:37:04,840 Speaker 1: much less of like a radical than she is, saying 1957 01:37:04,840 --> 01:37:08,439 Speaker 1: effectively the same thing and potentially more polished terms. But 1958 01:37:08,520 --> 01:37:10,799 Speaker 1: you're right, the mask is kind of off and people 1959 01:37:10,800 --> 01:37:13,639 Speaker 1: now feel more comfortable calling out exactly what's happening. 1960 01:37:13,720 --> 01:37:16,000 Speaker 2: Carry all just now acknowledge it was like a temporary 1961 01:37:16,000 --> 01:37:17,360 Speaker 2: insanity and American Party. 1962 01:37:17,400 --> 01:37:20,160 Speaker 3: He's obviously right, and she's still right today. She was right. 1963 01:37:20,240 --> 01:37:23,800 Speaker 1: Yes, that's a whole justice for il Han. Okay, let's 1964 01:37:23,800 --> 01:37:26,160 Speaker 1: talk about the R and C funding, all right. So 1965 01:37:26,200 --> 01:37:27,960 Speaker 1: there was this moment in the debate. You guys probably 1966 01:37:27,960 --> 01:37:30,639 Speaker 1: remember the last debate that everyone hated, nobody watched and whatever. 1967 01:37:30,680 --> 01:37:33,519 Speaker 1: But the bate came out out of the gates swing 1968 01:37:33,520 --> 01:37:35,920 Speaker 1: in and it was a bit of an unusual target 1969 01:37:36,040 --> 01:37:39,880 Speaker 1: that he's selected here in RNC RONA Romney McDaniel were 1970 01:37:39,880 --> 01:37:40,960 Speaker 1: supposed to drop the Romney. 1971 01:37:40,960 --> 01:37:43,400 Speaker 3: Now Trump, we should the route. 1972 01:37:43,479 --> 01:37:46,679 Speaker 1: Okay, Anyway, here's what candidate for president of vager Amason 1973 01:37:46,680 --> 01:37:47,360 Speaker 1: only had to say. 1974 01:37:47,439 --> 01:37:49,800 Speaker 12: We've become a party of losers. At the end of 1975 01:37:49,840 --> 01:37:52,520 Speaker 12: the day, is a cancer the Republican establishment. 1976 01:37:52,960 --> 01:37:53,800 Speaker 13: Let's speak the truth. 1977 01:37:53,880 --> 01:37:56,600 Speaker 12: I mean, since Ronal McDaniel took over as chairwoman of 1978 01:37:56,640 --> 01:37:59,479 Speaker 12: the rn C in twenty seventeen. We have lost twenty eighteen, 1979 01:38:00,080 --> 01:38:03,080 Speaker 12: twenty twenty twenty two. No red wave that never came. 1980 01:38:03,120 --> 01:38:06,680 Speaker 12: We got trounced last night in twenty twenty three. And 1981 01:38:06,720 --> 01:38:09,519 Speaker 12: I think that we have to have accountability in our party. 1982 01:38:09,880 --> 01:38:11,320 Speaker 12: For that matter, ron if you want to come on 1983 01:38:11,360 --> 01:38:13,760 Speaker 12: stage tonight, you want to look the GOP voters in 1984 01:38:13,840 --> 01:38:16,200 Speaker 12: the eye and tell them you resign, I will turn 1985 01:38:16,240 --> 01:38:19,040 Speaker 12: over my yield my time to you, and frankly, look 1986 01:38:19,080 --> 01:38:21,439 Speaker 12: the people they're cheering for losing in the Republican Party. 1987 01:38:21,880 --> 01:38:25,200 Speaker 12: Think about who's moderating this debate. This should be Tucker Carlson, 1988 01:38:25,280 --> 01:38:28,640 Speaker 12: Joe Rogan and Elon Musk. We'd have ten times the viewership, 1989 01:38:28,880 --> 01:38:32,320 Speaker 12: asking questions that GOP primary voters actually care about and 1990 01:38:32,360 --> 01:38:35,160 Speaker 12: bringing more people into our party, getting the Democrats, and 1991 01:38:35,160 --> 01:38:36,400 Speaker 12: we've got Christian Walker here. 1992 01:38:37,000 --> 01:38:41,240 Speaker 1: I think it's preposterous to blame Roni McDaniel for the 1993 01:38:41,320 --> 01:38:45,160 Speaker 1: losses in Virginia, for you know, the losses on all 1994 01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:49,960 Speaker 1: the abortion ballot measures, the underperformance in the midterm. I mean, 1995 01:38:49,960 --> 01:38:53,360 Speaker 1: it's very clear what the big factors were here. But 1996 01:38:54,400 --> 01:38:58,280 Speaker 1: there is some interesting recording about something that you know 1997 01:38:58,400 --> 01:39:00,160 Speaker 1: is going on behind the scenes. I don't think as 1998 01:39:00,160 --> 01:39:01,639 Speaker 1: a point, but anyway, put this up on the screen 1999 01:39:01,640 --> 01:39:04,040 Speaker 1: from the Washington Post with regard to the rnc's funding, 2000 01:39:04,160 --> 01:39:08,800 Speaker 1: Apparently the Republican Party's finances are incredibly worrisome to party members, 2001 01:39:08,840 --> 01:39:11,879 Speaker 1: advisors to former President Donald Trump, and other operatives involved 2002 01:39:11,880 --> 01:39:15,120 Speaker 1: in the twenty four election effort. They just disclose they 2003 01:39:15,160 --> 01:39:17,960 Speaker 1: have nine point one million dollars in cash on hand 2004 01:39:18,000 --> 01:39:21,160 Speaker 1: as of October thirtieth. That is the lowest amount for 2005 01:39:21,200 --> 01:39:23,880 Speaker 1: the rn C in any Federal Election Commission report since 2006 01:39:23,920 --> 01:39:27,639 Speaker 1: February of twenty fifteen. Compares with about twenty million at 2007 01:39:27,640 --> 01:39:29,920 Speaker 1: the same point in the twenty sixteen election cycle. So 2008 01:39:29,960 --> 01:39:32,080 Speaker 1: they've got less than half of what they had at 2009 01:39:32,080 --> 01:39:35,519 Speaker 1: that point in twenty sixteen and about sixty one million 2010 01:39:35,760 --> 01:39:38,000 Speaker 1: four years ago when Trump was in the White House. 2011 01:39:38,240 --> 01:39:42,040 Speaker 1: The DNC has a lot more money, roughly double seventeen 2012 01:39:42,080 --> 01:39:46,000 Speaker 1: point seven million as of October thirtieth. And as to 2013 01:39:46,120 --> 01:39:48,879 Speaker 1: what's going on here, there isn't a lot of insight. 2014 01:39:49,439 --> 01:39:52,559 Speaker 1: You've got a Tennessee RNC member who said, is just 2015 01:39:52,560 --> 01:39:54,479 Speaker 1: a revenue problem. We're going through the same efforts we 2016 01:39:54,520 --> 01:39:57,080 Speaker 1: always go through to raise money the same donor meetings retreats, 2017 01:39:57,080 --> 01:39:59,479 Speaker 1: digital advertising, direct mail, but the return is much lower 2018 01:39:59,520 --> 01:40:01,040 Speaker 1: this year. If you know the answer, I'd love to 2019 01:40:01,040 --> 01:40:02,640 Speaker 1: know what the staff has managed to tighten down and 2020 01:40:02,720 --> 01:40:05,960 Speaker 1: expenses to keep the party from going into the red. 2021 01:40:06,680 --> 01:40:08,519 Speaker 1: Donors have not cut as many large checks of the 2022 01:40:08,680 --> 01:40:10,719 Speaker 1: R and C in recent years, and the party small 2023 01:40:10,760 --> 01:40:14,800 Speaker 1: donor program has also suffered. I wonder what your analysis 2024 01:40:15,040 --> 01:40:19,160 Speaker 1: of what is going on here because my guess is that, 2025 01:40:19,360 --> 01:40:22,400 Speaker 1: I mean, Trump is the Republican Party, so and we 2026 01:40:22,479 --> 01:40:25,800 Speaker 1: know the way that he really burns through his fundraising 2027 01:40:25,880 --> 01:40:30,599 Speaker 1: lists and exhaust donors with just constant, repeated requests, and 2028 01:40:30,680 --> 01:40:34,080 Speaker 1: so I think he's burned their donor base. And also 2029 01:40:34,479 --> 01:40:37,040 Speaker 1: is just like it is him that is the party, 2030 01:40:37,160 --> 01:40:39,439 Speaker 1: so there's less incentive to then give to like the 2031 01:40:39,479 --> 01:40:40,840 Speaker 1: official party apparatus. 2032 01:40:40,840 --> 01:40:42,960 Speaker 2: I'll bring it back to where I was talking about 2033 01:40:42,960 --> 01:40:44,519 Speaker 2: with vague A. I think had a point in terms 2034 01:40:44,520 --> 01:40:46,680 Speaker 2: of partnering with NBC, which I think is stupid. But 2035 01:40:46,760 --> 01:40:49,519 Speaker 2: let's put that aside and let's think about the rn 2036 01:40:49,600 --> 01:40:50,800 Speaker 2: C as is constructed. 2037 01:40:51,040 --> 01:40:54,320 Speaker 3: You were right macro level, it's never going to change anything. 2038 01:40:54,560 --> 01:40:56,360 Speaker 2: But I know a lot of people actually worked at 2039 01:40:56,360 --> 01:40:58,479 Speaker 2: the R and C and they were very proud because 2040 01:40:58,479 --> 01:40:59,880 Speaker 2: of a lot of money that they brought in into 2041 01:40:59,880 --> 01:41:03,479 Speaker 2: they twelve is that they invested a ton of the 2042 01:41:03,600 --> 01:41:05,960 Speaker 2: Romney money and all the other things in that time 2043 01:41:06,240 --> 01:41:10,680 Speaker 2: for a voter outreach system which dramatically outperformed the DNCS 2044 01:41:10,720 --> 01:41:15,200 Speaker 2: similar technology in twenty sixteen, which again it's mostly because 2045 01:41:15,200 --> 01:41:19,480 Speaker 2: of Trump. But for these party apparatuses, it's all about infrastructure. 2046 01:41:19,560 --> 01:41:23,479 Speaker 2: For smaller organization refer and candidates like Act Blue, it's 2047 01:41:23,479 --> 01:41:26,840 Speaker 2: been a massive success for Democrats, and Win Red has 2048 01:41:26,840 --> 01:41:29,920 Speaker 2: been ish, not not as good. I think what Vivic 2049 01:41:30,120 --> 01:41:31,960 Speaker 2: the legitimate point I think he makes here, and also 2050 01:41:32,000 --> 01:41:35,120 Speaker 2: that this shows is that bad stewardship of the party 2051 01:41:35,439 --> 01:41:39,120 Speaker 2: really is about investment at the party level, where you're 2052 01:41:39,200 --> 01:41:42,760 Speaker 2: able to help people in you know, BS in some 2053 01:41:43,160 --> 01:41:45,519 Speaker 2: race nobody's ever heard of. You can put some money 2054 01:41:45,560 --> 01:41:48,080 Speaker 2: in at the last minute, you can give them technology, 2055 01:41:48,120 --> 01:41:51,000 Speaker 2: you can connect people with volunteers, and that stuff just 2056 01:41:51,080 --> 01:41:55,880 Speaker 2: costs tremendous, tremendous amounts of money. So Roni McDaniel has also, 2057 01:41:56,120 --> 01:41:58,840 Speaker 2: I think been a bad RNC chairwoman a because she 2058 01:41:58,880 --> 01:42:00,559 Speaker 2: hasn't investor hasn't been a to raise. 2059 01:42:00,400 --> 01:42:04,080 Speaker 3: Money properly be she can't pick a lane? Are you 2060 01:42:04,160 --> 01:42:05,160 Speaker 3: either pro Trump or not? 2061 01:42:05,600 --> 01:42:05,680 Speaker 5: Like? 2062 01:42:05,720 --> 01:42:07,160 Speaker 3: What are we doing here? Are we going to do? 2063 01:42:07,800 --> 01:42:10,000 Speaker 2: You know, we're endorsing a primary process. We're putting on 2064 01:42:10,040 --> 01:42:12,160 Speaker 2: debates which Trump is not showing up to. So in 2065 01:42:12,200 --> 01:42:14,840 Speaker 2: some ways she's oppositional to him, but she's also going 2066 01:42:14,920 --> 01:42:17,640 Speaker 2: to be supportive of him if he eventually becomes the nominee. 2067 01:42:17,640 --> 01:42:20,639 Speaker 2: She's tried to govern in this very like middling direction, 2068 01:42:20,800 --> 01:42:23,720 Speaker 2: and I think that has both led to lack of fundraising, 2069 01:42:23,880 --> 01:42:28,040 Speaker 2: lack really of also a lack of relationship management with Trump. 2070 01:42:28,320 --> 01:42:31,000 Speaker 2: Where why don't we have like the ground apparatus? Where 2071 01:42:31,080 --> 01:42:33,360 Speaker 2: are we not sharing the mailing list and all these 2072 01:42:33,400 --> 01:42:35,599 Speaker 2: other things. I know this can sound boring, but the 2073 01:42:35,640 --> 01:42:38,720 Speaker 2: party itself has not performed at a good level. A 2074 01:42:38,760 --> 01:42:40,640 Speaker 2: lot of that is due to Trump, abortion, you know, 2075 01:42:40,920 --> 01:42:43,320 Speaker 2: all this other stuff, but in stuff that they can control. 2076 01:42:43,520 --> 01:42:46,559 Speaker 2: At least from what I understand, even the consultants and 2077 01:42:46,600 --> 01:42:49,599 Speaker 2: all these other people are very dissatisfied with her leadership. 2078 01:42:49,640 --> 01:42:50,680 Speaker 3: I may have that to you. 2079 01:42:51,240 --> 01:42:54,320 Speaker 1: It's entirely possible that she's been a terrible leader. But 2080 01:42:54,360 --> 01:42:57,120 Speaker 1: I also would say, like I think The biggest problem 2081 01:42:57,120 --> 01:43:00,040 Speaker 1: for them is probably structural. There's been a drop in 2082 01:43:00,080 --> 01:43:05,720 Speaker 1: grassroots fundraising across the board, Democrats, Republicans, you know, independent organizations. 2083 01:43:05,760 --> 01:43:08,400 Speaker 1: There's been a huge shop in grassroots fundraising. There may 2084 01:43:08,400 --> 01:43:10,400 Speaker 1: be a variety of reasons for that. One is people 2085 01:43:10,439 --> 01:43:13,599 Speaker 1: feeling really stretched. Another is they feel sort of like, 2086 01:43:13,720 --> 01:43:16,200 Speaker 1: you know, nihilistic, like why would I give my money 2087 01:43:16,240 --> 01:43:18,160 Speaker 1: at this point? There may be a whole host of reasons, 2088 01:43:18,160 --> 01:43:20,280 Speaker 1: but that's kind of been an across the board phenomena 2089 01:43:20,920 --> 01:43:23,880 Speaker 1: in terms of the big donors. If you're thinking about it, 2090 01:43:23,960 --> 01:43:26,720 Speaker 1: like if you're a Trump person, you're going to give 2091 01:43:26,760 --> 01:43:29,880 Speaker 1: to Trump. If you're an anti Trump person, you're going 2092 01:43:29,960 --> 01:43:32,040 Speaker 1: to give to Nikki Haley, or you're going to give 2093 01:43:32,080 --> 01:43:35,240 Speaker 1: to Chris Christy. Why would you give to the RNC 2094 01:43:36,560 --> 01:43:39,080 Speaker 1: if your project is either Because Trump is a central 2095 01:43:39,120 --> 01:43:42,960 Speaker 1: dividing line in our politics and certainly in the Republican Party. 2096 01:43:43,320 --> 01:43:47,120 Speaker 1: So if you're a pro Trump person, he is effectively 2097 01:43:47,160 --> 01:43:50,240 Speaker 1: the party that's where you're going to invest your resources. 2098 01:43:50,360 --> 01:43:53,040 Speaker 1: And if you're an anti Trump person, like Ronna McDaniel, 2099 01:43:53,120 --> 01:43:56,000 Speaker 1: is effectively his you know, he supports her and supported 2100 01:43:56,040 --> 01:43:58,360 Speaker 1: her staying in as R and c chair, So it 2101 01:43:58,400 --> 01:44:00,320 Speaker 1: doesn't make a lot of sense to give the money there, 2102 01:44:00,760 --> 01:44:02,679 Speaker 1: and you know, and then you also have hanging over 2103 01:44:02,720 --> 01:44:04,240 Speaker 1: all of this, like all of the stuff that was 2104 01:44:04,240 --> 01:44:06,200 Speaker 1: happening in the House, and they can't get a speaker 2105 01:44:06,320 --> 01:44:09,000 Speaker 1: and they can't pass any legislation, and they're just sort 2106 01:44:09,000 --> 01:44:11,280 Speaker 1: of like in chaos and aimless and kind of a 2107 01:44:11,280 --> 01:44:14,080 Speaker 1: mess over there as well. So it also doesn't inspire 2108 01:44:14,080 --> 01:44:17,480 Speaker 1: a lot of confidence in the organization of the Republican 2109 01:44:17,520 --> 01:44:20,800 Speaker 1: Party institution itself. But I really think the key thing, 2110 01:44:21,040 --> 01:44:23,479 Speaker 1: if I had to guess, is just the fact that 2111 01:44:23,800 --> 01:44:26,640 Speaker 1: Trump has subsumed the party. You know, he is a 2112 01:44:26,720 --> 01:44:30,040 Speaker 1: much larger like it's no longer about the Republican Party, 2113 01:44:30,240 --> 01:44:33,320 Speaker 1: it's about the person of Donald Trump. And so to me, 2114 01:44:33,479 --> 01:44:34,880 Speaker 1: that's probably the bigger story. 2115 01:44:35,040 --> 01:44:38,080 Speaker 2: That's definitely of course that overlays it. I'm more saying, 2116 01:44:38,280 --> 01:44:40,120 Speaker 2: like terms of what she can control. There was also 2117 01:44:40,160 --> 01:44:43,360 Speaker 2: an interesting moment last night on lower Ingram Show where 2118 01:44:43,439 --> 01:44:47,160 Speaker 2: ron DeSantis was pressed on Ronald McDaniel whether she should 2119 01:44:47,160 --> 01:44:49,920 Speaker 2: stay and he was tripping all over himself on this answer. 2120 01:44:50,000 --> 01:44:51,080 Speaker 3: Let's take a listen to that. 2121 01:44:51,040 --> 01:44:51,760 Speaker 13: We'll be able to say. 2122 01:44:51,800 --> 01:44:53,599 Speaker 3: I think there should be no change and they aren't 2123 01:44:53,600 --> 01:44:56,360 Speaker 3: aren safe. Actually it's working out. Actually, I. 2124 01:44:57,880 --> 01:45:00,280 Speaker 13: Called for change after the midterms. I was the only 2125 01:45:00,320 --> 01:45:03,639 Speaker 13: presidential candidate running that called for change. I wasn't running 2126 01:45:03,640 --> 01:45:05,920 Speaker 13: at the time. But my ewer wife, we've lost all 2127 01:45:05,920 --> 01:45:08,200 Speaker 13: these elections in a row. Why are we continue to 2128 01:45:08,240 --> 01:45:10,400 Speaker 13: do it? But here's the thing. As the nominee, I 2129 01:45:10,479 --> 01:45:12,880 Speaker 13: will be responsible for doing it, and I will get 2130 01:45:12,880 --> 01:45:15,920 Speaker 13: the job done, regardless of who the chairman of it is. 2131 01:45:16,000 --> 01:45:18,960 Speaker 13: I led the drive in Florida. I'll lead the drive nationally. 2132 01:45:19,000 --> 01:45:20,600 Speaker 13: We can do it. We just need leadership. 2133 01:45:21,000 --> 01:45:23,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, we need a Republican party that has a message 2134 01:45:23,760 --> 01:45:27,040 Speaker 2: beyond just you know, Biden bad. So anyway, I think 2135 01:45:27,040 --> 01:45:28,880 Speaker 2: what Laura is reflecting there is there is a lot 2136 01:45:28,880 --> 01:45:31,840 Speaker 2: of activist energy that I see that is against R 2137 01:45:31,880 --> 01:45:33,760 Speaker 2: and C. And the fact that DeSantis kind of has 2138 01:45:33,800 --> 01:45:36,479 Speaker 2: to pick and choose his way through interesting to me, 2139 01:45:36,880 --> 01:45:37,479 Speaker 2: very interesting. 2140 01:45:37,960 --> 01:45:42,200 Speaker 1: I just lasting on this. The focus on Ronald McDaniel 2141 01:45:42,280 --> 01:45:44,080 Speaker 1: just to me seems like cope because they don't want 2142 01:45:44,120 --> 01:45:46,280 Speaker 1: to say it's Trump's fault or abortion. They don't want 2143 01:45:46,280 --> 01:45:48,920 Speaker 1: to say it's abortion, like those things are uncomfortable because 2144 01:45:48,960 --> 01:45:50,280 Speaker 1: then you have to deal with, like, you know, a 2145 01:45:50,320 --> 01:45:52,120 Speaker 1: core part of your base or a core part of 2146 01:45:52,120 --> 01:45:54,160 Speaker 1: the party platform, or you got to deal with the 2147 01:45:54,479 --> 01:45:56,639 Speaker 1: guy Donald Trump, which almost all of them are afraid 2148 01:45:56,680 --> 01:46:00,000 Speaker 1: to do. And so she's like, you know, a useful 2149 01:46:00,160 --> 01:46:02,360 Speaker 1: scapegoat here, and you know, you look at the fundraiser 2150 01:46:02,360 --> 01:46:04,200 Speaker 1: and you're like, oh, it's your fault. That must be 2151 01:46:04,240 --> 01:46:08,920 Speaker 1: the reason that we're losing. Maybe it's like tenth down 2152 01:46:09,000 --> 01:46:12,880 Speaker 1: the list of important factors in these elections, but a 2153 01:46:12,920 --> 01:46:15,040 Speaker 1: lot of it's this is a dodge to avoid dealing 2154 01:46:15,040 --> 01:46:16,200 Speaker 1: with the real central problems. 2155 01:46:16,240 --> 01:46:20,720 Speaker 2: Absolutely all right, let's move on to the next part. 2156 01:46:20,920 --> 01:46:25,320 Speaker 2: George Santos. He's facing possibly an expulsion vote in Congress 2157 01:46:25,360 --> 01:46:26,599 Speaker 2: sometime this week, but he is. 2158 01:46:26,600 --> 01:46:28,360 Speaker 3: Going out with a bang. 2159 01:46:28,520 --> 01:46:32,759 Speaker 2: He did a X of Spaces formerly known as Twitter, 2160 01:46:33,360 --> 01:46:36,600 Speaker 2: in which he really went off on some of his colleagues, 2161 01:46:36,840 --> 01:46:40,160 Speaker 2: alleging some pretty debaucherous behavior behind the scenes. 2162 01:46:40,200 --> 01:46:43,320 Speaker 3: Now, look, he's a proven liar. Should we believe him? Maybe? 2163 01:46:43,320 --> 01:46:46,559 Speaker 2: Maybe not, although I suspect this may be the truest 2164 01:46:46,560 --> 01:46:47,400 Speaker 2: thing that he's ever said. 2165 01:46:48,600 --> 01:46:51,920 Speaker 14: I have co a colleague who are more worried about 2166 01:46:51,960 --> 01:46:55,000 Speaker 14: getting drunk every night with the next lobbyists that they're 2167 01:46:55,040 --> 01:46:57,600 Speaker 14: going to screw and pretend like none of us know 2168 01:46:57,680 --> 01:47:01,080 Speaker 14: what's going on and sell off the American people not 2169 01:47:01,200 --> 01:47:04,160 Speaker 14: show up to vote because they're too hungover or whatever 2170 01:47:04,280 --> 01:47:06,920 Speaker 14: the reason is, or not show up to vote at all, 2171 01:47:06,960 --> 01:47:09,559 Speaker 14: and just give their card out like fucking candy for 2172 01:47:09,680 --> 01:47:10,920 Speaker 14: someone else to vote for them. 2173 01:47:11,120 --> 01:47:16,040 Speaker 15: This shit happens every single week. Reporters don't care to 2174 01:47:16,040 --> 01:47:19,160 Speaker 15: write about adultery anymore. And trust me, there's been plenty 2175 01:47:19,200 --> 01:47:21,840 Speaker 15: of this Congress and nobody writes about it anymore because 2176 01:47:21,880 --> 01:47:24,479 Speaker 15: Joey Santas is here. They should look at it this way. Look, 2177 01:47:24,960 --> 01:47:27,320 Speaker 15: with George being around, a lot of this shit's gonna 2178 01:47:27,320 --> 01:47:29,120 Speaker 15: go under the ruck because none of the reporters write 2179 01:47:29,160 --> 01:47:32,439 Speaker 15: about it anymore. Just putting that out there because I 2180 01:47:32,479 --> 01:47:37,559 Speaker 15: think it's relevant. Who has no real track record of trading. 2181 01:47:38,560 --> 01:47:46,600 Speaker 15: This member has been able to outperform every single pointed 2182 01:47:47,080 --> 01:47:51,200 Speaker 15: measure of stock trading this year so far. I mean 2183 01:47:51,439 --> 01:47:55,240 Speaker 15: talk about insider trading, and there's so much a there's 2184 01:47:55,240 --> 01:48:00,000 Speaker 15: so much, there's so much proof to just pinpoint today 2185 01:48:00,280 --> 01:48:06,280 Speaker 15: and times of when trades happen and when information was 2186 01:48:06,320 --> 01:48:09,839 Speaker 15: bought in front of that specific committee. He is going 2187 01:48:09,880 --> 01:48:13,920 Speaker 15: to be undermined all throughout this election process by the 2188 01:48:14,040 --> 01:48:19,080 Speaker 15: very people that should be supporting him. These people will 2189 01:48:19,520 --> 01:48:23,479 Speaker 15: undermine him, they will get in his way, they will 2190 01:48:24,720 --> 01:48:32,040 Speaker 15: redirect voters from him to others. Make no mistake, there 2191 01:48:32,120 --> 01:48:35,360 Speaker 15: is a lot of members in this body who hate 2192 01:48:35,680 --> 01:48:36,439 Speaker 15: Donald Trump. 2193 01:48:36,920 --> 01:48:40,520 Speaker 2: So this has been his strategy, is to wrap himself 2194 01:48:40,640 --> 01:48:42,720 Speaker 2: in the shroud of Trump and be like, I'm on 2195 01:48:42,760 --> 01:48:44,599 Speaker 2: Trump's side. That's why he shouldn't take me out as 2196 01:48:44,600 --> 01:48:45,400 Speaker 2: if it's why. 2197 01:48:45,439 --> 01:48:46,800 Speaker 1: Care so deeply about adultery. 2198 01:48:46,920 --> 01:48:48,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, he cares a lot about adults. 2199 01:48:48,400 --> 01:48:50,639 Speaker 2: That's why he had an OnlyFans account that he paid 2200 01:48:50,640 --> 01:48:54,280 Speaker 2: for with his campaign finance funds. My favorite is when 2201 01:48:54,280 --> 01:48:55,920 Speaker 2: he went what he went on TV and he claimed 2202 01:48:55,920 --> 01:48:58,720 Speaker 2: you didn't know what OnlyFans was, and then as exposed 2203 01:48:58,760 --> 01:49:02,679 Speaker 2: to have been having it out. Okay, certainly and interesting. 2204 01:49:02,880 --> 01:49:05,120 Speaker 2: Reminds us a little bit of the Madison Cawthorne event. 2205 01:49:05,200 --> 01:49:07,439 Speaker 2: Let's put this up there on the screen, don't forget. 2206 01:49:07,479 --> 01:49:11,519 Speaker 2: Whenever he alleged that there were GOP lawmakers engaged in 2207 01:49:11,800 --> 01:49:14,960 Speaker 2: orgies and who did key bumps of cocaine in front 2208 01:49:15,000 --> 01:49:19,360 Speaker 2: of him, he drew a huge ire from Kevin McCarthy 2209 01:49:19,360 --> 01:49:22,639 Speaker 2: and others who forced him to apologize again as possible, 2210 01:49:22,720 --> 01:49:25,519 Speaker 2: he was telling the truth too. But all of this 2211 01:49:25,560 --> 01:49:29,400 Speaker 2: is in the backdrop of Santos facing a expulsion vote. 2212 01:49:29,439 --> 01:49:32,640 Speaker 2: Let's go and put Axios please up there where it 2213 01:49:32,760 --> 01:49:36,519 Speaker 2: currently looks like Santos says that he will not resign, 2214 01:49:37,240 --> 01:49:41,000 Speaker 2: that he will not resign, but is facing a vote 2215 01:49:41,000 --> 01:49:45,120 Speaker 2: of expulsion. After that Ethics Committee report was released, which 2216 01:49:45,160 --> 01:49:47,840 Speaker 2: was the thing that Kevin McCarthy and Mike Johnson and 2217 01:49:47,920 --> 01:49:50,880 Speaker 2: others had held onto. Johnson said that he spoke with 2218 01:49:51,160 --> 01:49:53,840 Speaker 2: Santos yesterday and that they're, you know, looking at a 2219 01:49:53,920 --> 01:49:56,400 Speaker 2: variety of options. That he's kind of thinking about what 2220 01:49:56,439 --> 01:49:58,680 Speaker 2: he wants to do. But Santos has been pretty unequivocal 2221 01:49:58,920 --> 01:50:01,200 Speaker 2: that he won't resign. Of course, you know, it'd be 2222 01:50:01,240 --> 01:50:04,439 Speaker 2: pretty humiliating to get expel expelled from Congress. 2223 01:50:04,479 --> 01:50:07,200 Speaker 3: He would be the only sixth person in American history. 2224 01:50:07,280 --> 01:50:11,280 Speaker 1: This man is impervious to humiliation, That's true. Congressman tells 2225 01:50:11,320 --> 01:50:13,720 Speaker 1: everybody what they want to hear. Whenever they Oh you 2226 01:50:13,760 --> 01:50:18,000 Speaker 1: played volleyball, I played volleyball. Oh you're Jewish, I'm chewish. 2227 01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:20,280 Speaker 1: Oh you have a connection to the world trip to 2228 01:50:20,360 --> 01:50:23,000 Speaker 1: the nine to eleven. Oh my mom was killed in 2229 01:50:23,000 --> 01:50:26,439 Speaker 1: that attack. So listen for him from Madison Cathine whatever. 2230 01:50:26,520 --> 01:50:29,080 Speaker 1: We are all prepared to believe the most saalacious things 2231 01:50:29,120 --> 01:50:31,400 Speaker 1: you have to say about your colleagues there. But you 2232 01:50:31,520 --> 01:50:34,439 Speaker 1: got to bring some receipts, okay, especially at this point, 2233 01:50:34,840 --> 01:50:38,320 Speaker 1: credibility is not exactly at a high water mark, shall 2234 01:50:38,360 --> 01:50:40,920 Speaker 1: we say, right at this moment. So you know, if 2235 01:50:40,920 --> 01:50:44,400 Speaker 1: you're going to spill the tea good, bring some receipt receipts. 2236 01:50:44,600 --> 01:50:45,400 Speaker 1: Tell us who. 2237 01:50:45,400 --> 01:50:49,679 Speaker 3: Take video, Yeah, go ahead, send me the videos. 2238 01:50:49,080 --> 01:50:51,880 Speaker 1: The truth, expose the truth. We're all cheering for you, buddy. 2239 01:50:51,920 --> 01:50:52,280 Speaker 3: Anyway. 2240 01:50:52,360 --> 01:50:55,360 Speaker 2: So will he get expelled or not? You know, we'll see. 2241 01:50:55,520 --> 01:50:58,559 Speaker 2: It remains to be seen. If the vote will likely 2242 01:50:58,640 --> 01:51:01,280 Speaker 2: happen sometime this week. I mean, the Democrats are almost 2243 01:51:01,280 --> 01:51:03,880 Speaker 2: one hundred percent on board. There have been some dear 2244 01:51:03,960 --> 01:51:06,639 Speaker 2: colleague letters that have been circulating of Republicans being like, hey, 2245 01:51:06,640 --> 01:51:08,960 Speaker 2: we shouldn't maybe we shouldn't kick him out. But the 2246 01:51:09,000 --> 01:51:12,000 Speaker 2: biggest issue for Santos is that even his Republican party 2247 01:51:12,040 --> 01:51:14,400 Speaker 2: remember this at home, They want him to go, They 2248 01:51:14,400 --> 01:51:17,840 Speaker 2: want him to resign. The people who are in his 2249 01:51:18,240 --> 01:51:20,559 Speaker 2: office stay that they won't work with him, the mayor 2250 01:51:20,600 --> 01:51:24,080 Speaker 2: and other state that I absolutely refuse, so the local apparatus, 2251 01:51:24,080 --> 01:51:27,840 Speaker 2: the population, the Republican Party and now House leadership. 2252 01:51:27,479 --> 01:51:28,679 Speaker 3: And others. I don't see. 2253 01:51:28,800 --> 01:51:30,400 Speaker 2: I don't think he's gonna last if it comes to 2254 01:51:30,439 --> 01:51:32,160 Speaker 2: a vote, of which is very possible. 2255 01:51:32,320 --> 01:51:34,200 Speaker 3: I think I don't think he's got it. 2256 01:51:34,240 --> 01:51:37,080 Speaker 1: Looks like looks like the Swan song days for our 2257 01:51:37,479 --> 01:51:39,200 Speaker 1: great times with George Sands. 2258 01:51:38,920 --> 01:51:41,800 Speaker 3: Oh missus fashion and his slip filler, and so many 2259 01:51:41,800 --> 01:51:43,120 Speaker 3: other things he was maybe. 2260 01:51:44,240 --> 01:51:45,599 Speaker 1: I still don't know about that one. 2261 01:51:45,640 --> 01:51:47,880 Speaker 3: Maybe husband, whether it's true or not. 2262 01:51:48,160 --> 01:51:51,639 Speaker 2: There's so many, so many things among the mysteries about 2263 01:51:51,640 --> 01:51:54,960 Speaker 2: mister George Santos, as you said, America's congressman. Okay, guys, 2264 01:51:55,120 --> 01:51:56,880 Speaker 2: thank you so much for watching. I know it's been 2265 01:51:56,880 --> 01:52:00,360 Speaker 2: a long show today. We've got the merchandise on for sale. 2266 01:52:00,360 --> 01:52:03,759 Speaker 2: We of course have our discount going for our yearly subscription. 2267 01:52:03,840 --> 01:52:05,360 Speaker 2: We appreciate, we love all of you. We have a 2268 01:52:05,360 --> 01:52:07,400 Speaker 2: great counterpoint show for everyone tomorrow, and we'll see you 2269 01:52:07,439 --> 01:52:08,160 Speaker 2: all on Thursday. 2270 01:53:19,000 --> 01:56:05,640 Speaker 8: Shot shout didn't