Speaker 1: Hmm, it's soil Tom. Hello, welcome to it could happen
Speaker 1: here we're talking about we're talking about dirt today, big big,
Speaker 1: big dirt fans here. We love we love dirt, we
Speaker 1: love soil. Um. And to help us talk about soil, dirt, ecology, growing,
Speaker 1: for forging all of this kind of stuff, we have
Speaker 1: Andy from the Poor Pearl's Almanac podcast about you know
Speaker 1: what to do after you know, stuff kind of crumbles
Speaker 1: away slowly, kind of kind of like kind of like
Speaker 1: our podcast. Um. And we're not like our soil hopefully.
Speaker 1: Well I got some bad news for you there. Some
Speaker 1: of us are not great at cultivating soil, which is
Speaker 1: what we are talking about today is how to avoid
Speaker 1: getting a lot of void, Like, how can we help
Speaker 1: help against our soil just blowing away? Um? Yeah, that
Speaker 1: is that is that is our discussion. I I wrapped
Speaker 1: up like a week of research on California's specific climate
Speaker 1: and drought and what all the farmers are doing. Um,
Speaker 1: and a lot of their soil is blowing away and
Speaker 1: so far their solution to that is just spray more
Speaker 1: water on it, which the problem is there's not tons
Speaker 1: of water. Um. So let's talk about dirt. Let's talk
Speaker 1: about soil. I will hand it over to the residents.
Speaker 1: Soy boy, the soil expert here, because I don't know
Speaker 1: what I'm talking about with dirt. My puns are getting famous,
Speaker 1: I know I have. That was that was just that
Speaker 1: I was just ripping, ripping off of a title of
Speaker 1: one of his episodes. So that's not original. Blame him
Speaker 1: for the pond. Sorry, I do that a lot. So
Speaker 1: in terms of building soil, there's it's really a basic
Speaker 1: idea of how to do it, and it generally comes
Speaker 1: down to understanding what a soil needs and how to
Speaker 1: let the soil build through rest. And generally speaking, when
Speaker 1: we plant our annual crops, what happens is you put
Speaker 1: your tomato plants in the ground, whatever it might be.
Speaker 1: You've got a great harvest, you let them die, clear
Speaker 1: them out, and then the next year, maybe you throw
Speaker 1: some more compost on it, or maybe you're like, I
Speaker 1: just don't want time, I won't do it, and you'll
Speaker 1: grow and you might have a pretty decent crop again,
Speaker 1: and then usually by like the third year, you start
Speaker 1: to notice that your plants just aren't doing as well,
Speaker 1: Like all the nutrients and the minerals have started to
Speaker 1: get taken out of the soil, so you can either
Speaker 1: continuously add new material to it which comes from somewhere.
Speaker 1: Doesn't seem very sustainable. Yeah, it's absolutely not sustainable. And
Speaker 1: the alternative is to think about how can I build
Speaker 1: up that soil without doing that, And there's a couple
Speaker 1: of different ways we can do that. The soil can
Speaker 1: get built from things like cover crops, so we can
Speaker 1: add cover crops generally things like nitrogen fixing plants, clovers,
Speaker 1: hairy vetch, and a number of others that we can
Speaker 1: used to help fix nitrogen into the soil, or we
Speaker 1: can add other things to add biomass. So certain grasses
Speaker 1: and things like that can be planted and they'll mind
Speaker 1: deep into the soil to pull up nutrients when they
Speaker 1: die off, or you can cut them down they start
Speaker 1: breaking down, they return those nutrients back, but they're on
Speaker 1: the top soil now, So that's another way we can
Speaker 1: do it. Alternatively, if we're talking about a little bit
Speaker 1: more land, you can take advantage of using animals so chickens, rabbits,
Speaker 1: cheap cows, whatever it might be, reintroduce nutrients back into
Speaker 1: the soil through things like rotational grazing, and there's a
Speaker 1: you know that that's a whole other subject of you know,
Speaker 1: how different methods are better or worse for fixing nitrogen
Speaker 1: and all the other nutrients back into the soil. And um,
Speaker 1: we can talk about it. I don't know if you
Speaker 1: want to spend an hour talking about it. I assume
Speaker 1: that that definitely depends on the scale of your operation.
Speaker 1: I would assume absolutely. And you can do that on
Speaker 1: a smaller scale, not necessarily cows, but like chickens. Chickens
Speaker 1: can be run through chicken tractors, which can be as
Speaker 1: small as you know, three ft by six ft. And
Speaker 1: we were making yeah, we were making some fertilizer a
Speaker 1: few months ago and basically we raked up well I did.
Speaker 1: I I watched as people did this because I was lazy.
Speaker 1: I watched people just rake up tons of sheep shit um,
Speaker 1: because there we have there's a little sheep set up. Um.
Speaker 1: And they were just raking up all the ship and
Speaker 1: putting into a pile of dirt. And now it's been
Speaker 1: like a it's been like a month or two, and
Speaker 1: we should have some okay fertilizer by now, which we
Speaker 1: can you know, use however we see fit. But chickens, chickens,
Speaker 1: chickens as well not not everyone probably has sheep or
Speaker 1: access to sheep um, but chickens are surprisingly easy to get. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and depending on the city or in h you can
Speaker 1: live in pretty dense places and still legally have chickens.
Speaker 1: You might have to get comfortable with the idea of
Speaker 1: slaughtering a rooster, but other than that, you know, there's
Speaker 1: it's funny because what you'll see is like in the
Speaker 1: early spring, everyone gets chickens and then by like July
Speaker 1: u on on Craigslist or Facebook or Instagram, everyone's like,
Speaker 1: free rooster to good home because they can't slaughter themselves. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've had I've had to watch a few roosters get
Speaker 1: the get the old old acts. There was there was
Speaker 1: this one rooster that would always wake up as we
Speaker 1: were all going to bed. We would have like we
Speaker 1: have like a movie night um, and we're like going
Speaker 1: to bed at four am, and that's when the rooster starts.
Speaker 1: We're like no, we're trying to sleep, and we're like
Speaker 1: we need to kill that rooster. It's only time one
Speaker 1: bad day to be like I cannot listen to that
Speaker 1: sound again at least at least it went to some
Speaker 1: good use. Yeah. Anyway back to dirt. Yeah, let's see
Speaker 1: where were were talking talking about reintroducing stuff via you know,
Speaker 1: chemical means I mean, or or just using animals and stuff,
Speaker 1: or or rotating plants. Yeah. So there's a bunch of
Speaker 1: different ways you can do it, and obviously it's all
Speaker 1: defined by what your site needs. You know, the way
Speaker 1: we're talking at this point has been mostly about like,
Speaker 1: you already have a garden and that soil needs to
Speaker 1: be amended to improve it. But if you're working with,
Speaker 1: say a site that has almost no top soil. So
Speaker 1: for example, a friend of mine out in California lives
Speaker 1: near a highway and they had scraped all the top
Speaker 1: soil around the highway to build up the highway. So
Speaker 1: now there's no top soil, it's just garbage. So how
Speaker 1: do you build that soil up? And there's a bunch
Speaker 1: of different ways we can do that, whether it's through
Speaker 1: taking advantage of free resources like um mulch. Like if
Speaker 1: you see a tree getting cut down and they chip
Speaker 1: it all up, those guys have to pay to get
Speaker 1: rid of it most of the time, or they get
Speaker 1: paid just enough to cover their gas. So if you
Speaker 1: see it down the street and say, hey, you want
Speaker 1: to drop it off in my house, they'll happily do it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: We we just found out there is this business in
Speaker 1: Portland that you can email them to do a chip
Speaker 1: drop where they take all of their mulchion wood chips
Speaker 1: and drop them off in your driveway and it's completely
Speaker 1: free you you you you don't need to pay for it.
Speaker 1: You can just schedule them to drop it off anywhere.
Speaker 1: And a short aside, we also found out that they
Speaker 1: don't require address verification, so you can do this as
Speaker 1: a prank. Um. You can find out where the mayor lives.
Speaker 1: Um or where I don't know a particularly bad person lives.
Speaker 1: Let's say he wears armor and he brutalizes people and
Speaker 1: threatens them with guns while having a badge. You can
Speaker 1: find out if you know where it lives, you can
Speaker 1: just deliver tons of wood chips right right on this driveway. Um.
Speaker 1: And and they have a rule on their website is
Speaker 1: once a delivery has been initiated, it's like once the
Speaker 1: truck leaves you know, their office, it cannot be stopped.
Speaker 1: There's no way, there's no way preventing it, And they
Speaker 1: don't contact the house beforehand, no way preventing it. Just
Speaker 1: a random, random wood chip drop anywhere in any driveway.
Speaker 1: It's a magical system. But you can also just use
Speaker 1: this for you know, getting wood chips to help grow things. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and we'll just such an underrated medium. It's like really
Speaker 1: good for like water retention and helping soil not dry
Speaker 1: out too fast. It's it's not just like aesthetically nice
Speaker 1: looking and accessible. It's also like really good for the plants.
Speaker 1: So I'll add two caveats to that, And the first
Speaker 1: is that it's really important to know what species you're
Speaker 1: dealing with that are the woodchips, because certain species have
Speaker 1: chemicals on them that will reduce growth or stop it completely.
Speaker 1: So like black walnuts are really well known on the
Speaker 1: East Coast as having what's called juglone, And there's a
Speaker 1: bunch of different species that again are probably unique to
Speaker 1: where you live that you should just be aware of.
Speaker 1: And the second one is that mulch and wood chips
Speaker 1: are fantastic for your garden. However, the one drawback is
Speaker 1: that for the wood chips to break down, they actually
Speaker 1: utilize a lot of the nitrogen in the soil. So
Speaker 1: that's just so you may have a bit of a
Speaker 1: nitrogen problem or some kind of nitrogen fixing, So it
Speaker 1: would be more important to think about cover crops and
Speaker 1: either adding fresh compost or whatever it might be help
Speaker 1: offset some of that nitrogen absorption. So so it's not
Speaker 1: it's a great resource. It's just not perfect. You just
Speaker 1: have to be aware of the limitations. I would like
Speaker 1: to touch on why we're in a bit of a pickle,
Speaker 1: like what what what what have we done agriculturally to
Speaker 1: kind of make our soil so unfragile? Like what what
Speaker 1: did we do wrong? Um on? Like even on like
Speaker 1: a larger scale, and how how might someone like me
Speaker 1: who just has a small set up, you know, not
Speaker 1: make the same mistakes in my own personal garden. Sure,
Speaker 1: so the beginning of the food system becoming what it
Speaker 1: is today really started with oil. Access to things like
Speaker 1: petrochemicals allowed us to start rethinking about how we grew
Speaker 1: food and forgetting about traditional methods pummarily things like using
Speaker 1: the newer I mean you think about it, You eat,
Speaker 1: all the nutrients go out the sewer and then they
Speaker 1: never go back into the soil. And we're constantly taking
Speaker 1: from the same soils year after year, and the only
Speaker 1: way we continue to produce is because we're dumping chemicals
Speaker 1: and forcing the soil, which is just a medium at
Speaker 1: this point, just dirt. It's not soil, and we're just
Speaker 1: making it grow food because we're adding the chemicals the
Speaker 1: plants need. But we've destroyed things like the bacterial community,
Speaker 1: the fungag community, all these different things that are so
Speaker 1: crucial for our food systems to be resilient in terms
Speaker 1: of how can we move forward. Building that soil is
Speaker 1: super important and understanding these cycles of where our food
Speaker 1: comes from. The biggest challenge really is that we're trying
Speaker 1: to create ethical food systems under an inethical economic model. Sure, so,
Speaker 1: like you'll see, like perma culture is like a really
Speaker 1: big thing today and for a lot of good reasons
Speaker 1: because it challenges that methodology. However, because of things like capitalism,
Speaker 1: we can't really have an honest conversation about the fact
Speaker 1: that a lot of people will tell you can make
Speaker 1: money doing perma culture, and you some people do, but
Speaker 1: it's not it's not really what people think, Like there's
Speaker 1: no way to ethically grow food and not have the
Speaker 1: problems of yeah, you're you're facing or competing with somebody
Speaker 1: that doesn't have any ethical guidelines or framework that you
Speaker 1: have to compete with. And I mean there's plenty of
Speaker 1: things we can say that there are problems with perman culture,
Speaker 1: and if you want, we can talk about that further.
Speaker 1: But this is the primary reason why we can't really
Speaker 1: fundamentally rethink our food system until things either fall apart
Speaker 1: or capitalism no longer exists, or there are major subsidies
Speaker 1: for these alternatives, whatever it might be. Yeah, let's see,
Speaker 1: Like is even something like would you even say, just
Speaker 1: like someone buying pre made fertilizers should be avoided in
Speaker 1: that case, Like would you would you rather you know,
Speaker 1: someone trying to make it ourselves? And like what's cheaper
Speaker 1: you know, like is just buying fertilizer or cheaper than
Speaker 1: I would to actually make it yourself. There's another kind
Speaker 1: of problem with these types of things that it turns out,
Speaker 1: you know, the way to make things better might cost
Speaker 1: some people more money, you know than people who don't
Speaker 1: really have as many resources, you know, just like a
Speaker 1: regular person who's trying to do this, you know, they
Speaker 1: don't have as much money, and would would just buying
Speaker 1: pre made chemicals be you know, easier and cheaper than
Speaker 1: doing work to kind of build it up more like
Speaker 1: ute unquote naturally, I mean obviously, I think under capitalism,
Speaker 1: anything that's efficient in terms of time and um, taking
Speaker 1: advantage of things like scalability, which you know, mining nutrients
Speaker 1: is always going to be more efficient when you're doing
Speaker 1: it on a massive global scale, Like you really can't
Speaker 1: compete dollar for dollar. And that's at least with what
Speaker 1: I do with the poor pros almanac. We don't really
Speaker 1: focus on that and instead say this is how things
Speaker 1: should be, and how do we do that and when
Speaker 1: do we need to start doing that if we know
Speaker 1: that what exists today isn't sustainable and that ultimately this
Speaker 1: is gonna fall apart in some capacity. Yeah, you talked
Speaker 1: more about like trees specifically, and I would love to
Speaker 1: love to hear more about that, you know, outside of
Speaker 1: just you know, making your own like edible garden, doing
Speaker 1: doing other kind of ecology related related work. Sure, so
Speaker 1: trees have you know, so many benefits outside of the
Speaker 1: fact that they can produce food. Um, we could look
Speaker 1: at things like how they can manage a landscape and
Speaker 1: reduce temperature extremes the way they can maintain soil quality
Speaker 1: because of UM reducing things like runoff from major storms,
Speaker 1: which are happening more and more frequently. Further, like I said,
Speaker 1: they do produce food, and they sometimes they produce food
Speaker 1: for us, sometimes they produce food for our livestock. Um. Additionally,
Speaker 1: there's a process called silvil pasture, which is essentially when
Speaker 1: you think of a farm, you think of a cow
Speaker 1: walking around in a field. Instead that cows walking around
Speaker 1: and a managed forest and the forest floor gets enough
Speaker 1: sunlight to grow grass, so you're getting the benefits of
Speaker 1: the grass as well as the trees. And you can
Speaker 1: either be using those trees for lumber or for food
Speaker 1: crops or whatever it might be, and you're getting the
Speaker 1: best of both worlds. And in a lot of ways,
Speaker 1: the civil pasture system more accurately represents the way the
Speaker 1: landscape had been managed, especially here in the northeast and
Speaker 1: generally the East coast by indigenous people. Um. You know,
Speaker 1: they weren't using cows, they were doing prescribed burns and
Speaker 1: things like that. But those environments are actually better for
Speaker 1: things like a deer, which like like to exist on
Speaker 1: like the margins of forests where they're getting the best
Speaker 1: of both worlds. So that was how they managed a
Speaker 1: wild Essentially they're wild grazing the native species. Yeah. We
Speaker 1: just I'm just trying to think there's like we we
Speaker 1: don't really have anything like that on a on a
Speaker 1: large scale anymore. We've we've just jumped right into like
Speaker 1: the the field and pasture thing. Yeah, I mean, you
Speaker 1: think about it, it it makes sense that we haven't because
Speaker 1: of the fact that to do that requires individuality. In
Speaker 1: terms of how we manage a landscape. You can't run
Speaker 1: a machine through you sbo pasture. You can't just make
Speaker 1: like a template and apply to every situation. Everything is
Speaker 1: much more unique based on their individual environment and ecosystem. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then it becomes less efficient to manage in terms
Speaker 1: of how we manage things as a successional thing where
Speaker 1: we have you go through the field and you seat
Speaker 1: it with a giant machine, because you can do it
Speaker 1: faster that way, you can add whatever amendments you need
Speaker 1: more quickly. When it's just a flat piece of land
Speaker 1: with nothing in the way, so on and so on.
Speaker 1: It's just it doesn't It goes right in the face
Speaker 1: of how we think of efficiency despite the fact through
Speaker 1: it's diversity, it's more resilient to what's coming in terms
Speaker 1: of climate change, especially the logs run. Yeah. Um, in
Speaker 1: the last episode we talked a bit about grilling gardening.
Speaker 1: Can this like intersect with with this idea of like
Speaker 1: growing in the forest? Um? Is there? You know? I
Speaker 1: assume there's like a decent cross over there. Absolutely. So
Speaker 1: generally speaking, a lot of people that are into silvil
Speaker 1: pasture are also thinking about things like tree crops. And
Speaker 1: one of the things that I really focus on is
Speaker 1: thinking about foods that we don't traditionally think of as foods,
Speaker 1: or at least not as like staple crops. So like
Speaker 1: while people might be familiar with kind of the odd
Speaker 1: fruits like per simmons, you might know what a persimmon is.
Speaker 1: You might have one or two, or maybe make per
Speaker 1: simmon bread. That's not usually a large part of anyone's diet, no,
Speaker 1: And that's like, that's the challenge that we really have
Speaker 1: is while people like to incorporate these types of things
Speaker 1: in permaculture into you know, how they think about their
Speaker 1: relationship with the environment, Like nobody's giving up their toast
Speaker 1: in the morning and that's you know, a third of
Speaker 1: your diet or whatever it might be, and that's where
Speaker 1: we need to fundamentally shift how we think about food.
Speaker 1: So you're saying that we need to change in order
Speaker 1: to address these large systemic issues that have caused many problems.
Speaker 1: We need to change the way we extract resources from
Speaker 1: the earth and maybe reevaluate how much we do. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it's it's no small feet, is
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. I know, I'm just saying, like, you know,
Speaker 1: that's the this specific thing around like food and diet
Speaker 1: is the same route problem we have with climate change
Speaker 1: on a larger scale of like just doing you know,
Speaker 1: progress for progress's sake without realizing that this is not
Speaker 1: a sustainable way to do things. And infinite growing and
Speaker 1: like infinite expansion, maybe it is a bad idea and
Speaker 1: maybe it has some consequence. Who has some costs? Who
Speaker 1: would have thought that infinite growth on a finite planet
Speaker 1: wasn't sustainable? Oops? Yeah, The point that I'm really trying
Speaker 1: to drive home is that we really need to rethink
Speaker 1: what food looks like and it has to be in
Speaker 1: a meaningful way that it can't just be those odds
Speaker 1: and ends. And that the thing I think people forget
Speaker 1: is that food is a huge component of our culture
Speaker 1: and our identity. Absolutely think about food and identity. The
Speaker 1: reason why our identity is surrounded around food is because
Speaker 1: food is the byproduct of the environment that we live in.
Speaker 1: And it's you know, for it's been a couple of generations.
Speaker 1: And we went from the reason why Italians eat x
Speaker 1: y z s because that's what grows there. Two I
Speaker 1: eat this because my family does, but I don't know why.
Speaker 1: And that's the way those things relate to one another
Speaker 1: is have been completely lost, and we need to figure
Speaker 1: out how to do that again. Can you point to
Speaker 1: any examples of these things you're talking about of like
Speaker 1: you know, of systems existing now or in the past
Speaker 1: that of kind of shown these methods of viewing food
Speaker 1: and viewing you know, growing and soil cultivation, so like
Speaker 1: any indigenous practice. And like we say indigenous, and we
Speaker 1: usually mean like North America or South America or Australia.
Speaker 1: But even if you look across Europe, you know, before
Speaker 1: capitalism kind of got its clause into the rest of
Speaker 1: Europe or all of Europe, like there were plenty of
Speaker 1: indigenous practices and in some places they continue and the
Speaker 1: way that people lived um reflected the needs of their
Speaker 1: ecology and how people could relate to that ecology. The
Speaker 1: reason why Nordic countries have high amounts of meat in
Speaker 1: their diet is because of what grows there and what
Speaker 1: how they can utilize what grows there to feed themselves
Speaker 1: through animals and things like that. Hmm, yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: that is that is generally what we we hear is
Speaker 1: you know, look at the various indigenous methods of growing
Speaker 1: um and how they how they fed people in their
Speaker 1: media area, and thinking like, how can we take those
Speaker 1: similar ideas and scale it up? Because I mean, they
Speaker 1: weren't growing food for seven billion people. But I know,
Speaker 1: like we grow way too much food for what for
Speaker 1: many people, maybe not too much food, just we distribute
Speaker 1: it in a very unefficient way because we don't do
Speaker 1: it for what we need. We do it for profits,
Speaker 1: and like we we we throw away so much food
Speaker 1: that we grow as you know, globally UM. But I
Speaker 1: you know, when I think of these more like older
Speaker 1: methods of growing food, it's it's harder for me to
Speaker 1: picture that, you know, feeding an entire city, right, And
Speaker 1: I don't know what the solution is here. This isn't
Speaker 1: really the thing I focus on a lot. But is
Speaker 1: there a way to kind of scale up these like
Speaker 1: smaller scale things that you know, people can do in
Speaker 1: their own yards on any kind of mass level or
Speaker 1: is that just kind of rely back on the same thing.
Speaker 1: We've need to like re reevaluate how much we consume
Speaker 1: and how we consume it. So I think there's a
Speaker 1: little bit of both. I think we do need to
Speaker 1: reevaluate what we're consuming and the volume that we're consuming,
Speaker 1: as well as um, you know, the the waste specifically
Speaker 1: in terms of those two things that we tend to
Speaker 1: lose a lot of food that otherwise is useful um.
Speaker 1: But also there is a lot of opportunity and wild
Speaker 1: places like maybe New York City because of the development
Speaker 1: around the city, might not there might not be any
Speaker 1: way possible to grow food like within the metropolitan or
Speaker 1: even the region. We know that, like, and this is
Speaker 1: something I probably should have checked before the staff, But
Speaker 1: it's something like there's four acres of arable land for
Speaker 1: every person on Earth, and four acres is like that's plenty,
Speaker 1: that's plenty, That's absolutely plenty. UM. But like, one of
Speaker 1: the things that's really important is to start thinking about
Speaker 1: how we can decentralize these systems in order to have
Speaker 1: those clusters of places where those things are more um
Speaker 1: capable of growing and handling the production that's necessary. And
Speaker 1: so maybe rethink about what what urbanization really should be
Speaker 1: and what it should look like. And you know, in
Speaker 1: the future, while things might seem like, well, you can't
Speaker 1: ask people to leave New York City as climate change
Speaker 1: worsens in our food systems start to fall apart, that
Speaker 1: might be a much easier conversation to have, while today
Speaker 1: that seems kind of radical. Yeah, and at the very least,
Speaker 1: maybe we should maybe we shouldn't make any more New
Speaker 1: York cities absolutely. Um, is there any like resources online
Speaker 1: that you can point to that talks more about these
Speaker 1: types of topics, or like books or like anything in
Speaker 1: this general was growing on the growing side of things
Speaker 1: and then like the more like ecology side of things.
Speaker 1: So Tom Wessels has this really great book called The
Speaker 1: Myth of Progress, which talks about complex system science and
Speaker 1: essentially what that is is decentralization and um, the benefits
Speaker 1: of having diversity within a community and in fact that
Speaker 1: any any power that's you know, centered in one specific
Speaker 1: place ends up having imbalances and has less resiliency, and
Speaker 1: that plays until it's focused around ecology. But I think
Speaker 1: it's really helpful, especially if you're an anarchist. I think
Speaker 1: you can through the lens. Yeah. Yeah, so that that's
Speaker 1: definitely one place to look in terms of like growing food.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's really any books that really
Speaker 1: address it from this perspective of climate change and decentralization,
Speaker 1: but there's plenty of work online about silver pasture and
Speaker 1: you know, food force, any of these types of things.
Speaker 1: YouTube has like a vast array of resources, and of
Speaker 1: course if you're interested in this kind of stuff, you
Speaker 1: can come check us out on our podcast or proslamanac
Speaker 1: we Uh, the entire show is pretty much around this
Speaker 1: subject matter, So you want to learn more about it
Speaker 1: and check it out. Yeah, absolutely definitely. UM if this
Speaker 1: specific topic, you have a wonderful catalog of stuff discussing this.
Speaker 1: UM and I just want to thank you they and
Speaker 1: thank you so much for coming on this show to
Speaker 1: kind of talk about these topics. You know, me and
Speaker 1: Robert and you know Chris, we more of like a
Speaker 1: background and like history and that kind of thing. We
Speaker 1: are we are not super avid to plant people like
Speaker 1: we're trying to start growing more stuff to our ourselves personally.
Speaker 1: But I'm definitely not educated to talk on this, and
Speaker 1: I'm very very happy that you were able to when
Speaker 1: you're generous with your time and knowledge. So thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you so much. Yeah, definitely check out their show
Speaker 1: on you know, wherever you get your podcasts, and you
Speaker 1: can follow the show Twitter, on Instagram at cool zone
Speaker 1: Media and happen here pod um any any any final
Speaker 1: final notes? Grow some food? Yeah, grow some food. Grow
Speaker 1: some food. That is one if I've I've asked that
Speaker 1: question a lot and that answer has come up many times.
Speaker 1: Just growth growth food. Okay, you go grow here. It
Speaker 1: could happen here as a production of cool Zone Media.
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website
Speaker 1: cool zone media dot com or check us out on
Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
Speaker 1: listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It could
Speaker 1: Happen Here, updated monthly at cool zone Media dot com
Speaker 1: slash sources. Thanks for listening