Speaker 1: So let's now just go through workplace.
Speaker 2: You know there is it's the incentive to keep going.
Speaker 2: Just look at like the problems with like pay discrepancies,
Speaker 2: things they did to like for example, with Shena on
Speaker 2: vander Pump Rules. I mean they would do this thing
Speaker 2: with Shena where they every periodically every so years they
Speaker 2: would like demote her to a friend of and you know,
Speaker 2: pay her less per episode because she didn't have enough
Speaker 2: going on in her life right to justify being a
Speaker 2: main cast member. Aka, there's not enough drama going on
Speaker 2: in your life, Like you need to amp it up
Speaker 2: a little bit. Maybe next year you'll get you know,
Speaker 2: full time again.
Speaker 3: Right, So if you're a Luen and you get a dui,
Speaker 3: you get paid more, But if you're Shena and you
Speaker 3: have a boring storyline, you get paid less. So it's
Speaker 3: the upside down that doesn't happen in normal workplace conditions, right.
Speaker 2: So it's like something that like can distiller. Bassett once said,
Speaker 2: like the line is always moving, right, So same thing
Speaker 2: with that, Like you want to be full time again,
Speaker 2: you know, you better have something going on. And that's
Speaker 2: the thing is like I don't think they understand anymore.
Speaker 2: It's like not everybody wants to see it like insane,
Speaker 2: like dark scandal every week. Like when these shows started,
Speaker 2: it was like more fun and like yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: like some light drama, some like stupid shade, you know,
Speaker 2: eating a bow off a cake or you know what
Speaker 2: I mean, stupid stuff like that. Yes, and now it's
Speaker 2: like like super dark driving our cars into a house,
Speaker 2: and you know, like it's gotten crazy and it's you know,
Speaker 2: every year it needs to like push the envelope, push
Speaker 2: the envelope more and more and more.
Speaker 3: So that's such a great point. Yeah, that's a great point.
Speaker 3: That's a great point.
Speaker 2: Well it becomes a situation where like well yeah, so
Speaker 2: I mean just the kind of final thought on that
Speaker 2: Sheena thing. Here you have someone who is an OG
Speaker 2: on the show, like started an integral part of the show.
Speaker 2: I mean, Sheena was like the backbone and vander pump Roules,
Speaker 2: and here she is like seasons in where she should
Speaker 2: be at the same pay level as like the other
Speaker 2: people who are the ogs. But because there were years
Speaker 2: where she was like demoted, she like was making less
Speaker 2: than people who have been on the show years fewer
Speaker 2: than her. You know, so that doesn't really make sense.
Speaker 3: There's a woman on my show that I won't that
Speaker 3: wants to be back on it, so she would I
Speaker 3: won't name her. She's wanted to be back on She
Speaker 3: said she'd always go quiet if she left.
Speaker 1: But she used to say, you get punished like you're
Speaker 1: a child.
Speaker 3: You feel like you were bad, so now you have
Speaker 3: to sit in the corner like you're punished. That's what
Speaker 3: she would say about it. And she has been punished,
Speaker 3: but then she's been rewarded. Like it's a little bit
Speaker 3: of that.
Speaker 2: It's insane too, the way that like, yeah, it is rewarded,
Speaker 2: but like, oh, it's such a it's such a crazy
Speaker 2: thing because you have people and you could speak to
Speaker 2: that being someone who was on the show for years.
Speaker 2: It's like once you've been on for so many years,
Speaker 2: after several years doing these shows, like most of these
Speaker 2: women like don't love it anymore, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: because it's really hard, it's really stressful. You do not
Speaker 2: have peace in your life while you're filming this, while
Speaker 2: you're in production, you know what I mean. But it
Speaker 2: becomes a point to where you need it though, So
Speaker 2: like I mean, case in point, I just did the
Speaker 2: most recent season of Orange County, which covered all of
Speaker 2: Shannon Badoor's DUI fall out. And you know, this woman
Speaker 2: is like going through one of the hardest periods of
Speaker 2: her life, clearly not doing well, and but she is
Speaker 2: now facing all these legal problems and all these lawsuits
Speaker 2: and she needs the money and you need to look.
Speaker 2: I'll just be honest, Shannon Badoor was not like the
Speaker 2: most kind person to me, as wasn't a most pleasant
Speaker 2: person to work with. But I still had immense empathy
Speaker 2: for her because like she was from the very beginning,
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, wow, this woman is in a
Speaker 2: place where she probably should not be on TV right now.
Speaker 2: You know, she's really going through a really hard time.
Speaker 2: She clearly does not want to be doing this in
Speaker 2: my opinion, that's what it looked like, Yes, but she
Speaker 2: just has to because she needs it now. And like,
Speaker 2: so what is what does Bravo do? They decide to
Speaker 2: bring in the woman who's dating her ex boyfriend to
Speaker 2: come and hang out with all of her girlfriends for
Speaker 2: the season, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: So like just to really add it right, throw over
Speaker 3: the edge. That's what happens all the time. That's another
Speaker 3: reason the crew, the crew gets beat down, the sound person,
Speaker 3: the people that people don't think about because you're in
Speaker 3: the line of farts. What the fuck are we doing
Speaker 3: this now? Like, you know what, I don't want to
Speaker 3: say that. I don't want to do that. I don't
Speaker 3: want to talk to her. I don't want to sit
Speaker 3: down with her. Like you guys are right there. Here's
Speaker 3: the other thing, Like this is.
Speaker 2: The thing that's the same thing that happened with Tom
Speaker 2: Sandaball at that reunion, you know what I mean, like
Speaker 2: stop filming. You know he was yelling at me that day,
Speaker 2: but I knew it wasn't about me, you know what.
Speaker 1: I's a punching bag in the yes.
Speaker 3: But you also there's that line where you're just like, yeah,
Speaker 3: this isn't good for like humanity and my soul and
Speaker 3: being like a human Like but you have no power,
Speaker 3: Yeah you have a power.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's it is insane and like I
Speaker 2: think one of the reasons that I produced, you know,
Speaker 2: I always produced with a level of empathy, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean. I would always try to go into
Speaker 2: every scene and try to understand what the cast member
Speaker 2: point of view was right so I could properly, like
Speaker 2: tell their story. So I always was very empathetic to
Speaker 2: how they felt about the situation. And I think that
Speaker 2: comes from my experience of being on a reality show
Speaker 2: like this. You know. I was on a show called
Speaker 2: Fire Island. I was back in like twenty sixteen that
Speaker 2: we shot. It's like basically like the Jersey Shore, but
Speaker 2: it's six gay guys living in a sharehouse on Fire Outland,
Speaker 2: and we were shooting that show. I mean, it was
Speaker 2: during the darkesteriod of my life. I was about like
Speaker 2: a year and a half into a serious meth addiction.
Speaker 1: Jesus.
Speaker 2: I actually was going into the bathroom, turning my mic off,
Speaker 2: smoking crystal mess and coming back out and shooting the show.
Speaker 2: You know. I literally was that, you know, and I
Speaker 2: was keeping that a secret from everyone, And I know
Speaker 2: how fucking hard that is. I know how it feels
Speaker 2: to be on one of these shows when you're going
Speaker 2: through a really hard time, when your life is kind
Speaker 2: of crumbling around you and you're trying to hold it
Speaker 2: together for the sake of the fact that you're on
Speaker 2: a television show and you don't want the world to
Speaker 2: know your problems, you know, like you don't you're well,
Speaker 2: maybe you don't want the world to know your secrets, right.
Speaker 1: Which is why you shouldn't go on.
Speaker 3: Also, is mental health, substance abuse, emotional abuse, and sobriety.
Speaker 1: Is it exploited on these shows?
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, no discussion. Yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean that's the addiction and the substance abuse kind
Speaker 4: of storylines or something that always may be a little
Speaker 4: uneasy anytime we were talking about someone's.
Speaker 2: Alcoholism or a drug addiction or any any of that.
Speaker 2: It's so so fragile and something not to be taken
Speaker 2: lightly and to be amplified by by these shows. I
Speaker 2: can't imagine trying to like or stay or get sober
Speaker 2: while being on one of these shows.
Speaker 3: So they should not have people on these shows that
Speaker 3: have have proclivity to addiction. Someone who has had any
Speaker 3: experience of addiction should probably not be on.
Speaker 2: I mean you probably for your own health and well being. No,
Speaker 2: you probably network Maybe I don't know, because then I
Speaker 2: don't know, because then you have like people who are
Speaker 2: in recovery, who like are living great, healthy, balanced lives
Speaker 2: that can tell handle something like that. But I don't know,
Speaker 2: it's it, But it is a situation where people when
Speaker 2: somebody gets sober on one of these shows, it's always like,
Speaker 2: oh god, really okay, Well, I guess there goes the fun,
Speaker 2: the fun version of them, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: It's a bummer to production.
Speaker 2: It's a bummer to production when someone gets sober for sure.
Speaker 2: For sure, Yeah, which is so crazy to think about,
Speaker 2: and like it's like someone who like has been through
Speaker 2: that themselves, like I have been through that, and you know,
Speaker 2: just being caught up in that world that's the commonplace.
Speaker 2: It's like, oh God, they're getting sober, okay, and you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, it's like, no, wait, what that's
Speaker 2: good for them, that's great. So I mean it's like
Speaker 2: similar to the Karen Huger situation. You know, she got
Speaker 2: to see why she's literally sitting in a jail cell
Speaker 2: right now. And her alcohol consumption has been something that
Speaker 2: production has been very well aware of for many years.
Speaker 2: You know, there's been many scenes all cast events like hey,
Speaker 2: we got to make sure we get Karen home, you know.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's on every cast.
Speaker 3: There's ones on ours with drugs, I mean drugs on
Speaker 3: our show. Like definitely the crew knows who's doing drugs
Speaker 3: and who's not doing drugs in the workplace, like again,
Speaker 3: but then they hope that it's going to be discussed
Speaker 3: and brought into scene, that other people are going to
Speaker 3: question that person's drug use.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then when like Kring gets a DUI, everybody
Speaker 2: actsaw like shocked and surprised. Well, I mean it's like
Speaker 2: her third one, you know what I mean? And yeah,
Speaker 2: how many times have we had to have like somebody
Speaker 2: driver home from something, you know, so like.
Speaker 3: Same thing, same thing on same thing. We had a
Speaker 3: statistic recently that had like twenty five percent of all
Speaker 3: housewives have had like in car serrations or arrests or
Speaker 3: you know, financial illegal activity. And in my friend group,
Speaker 3: like in anyone's normal circle, you don't have twenty five
Speaker 3: percent of people you know that have not just had
Speaker 3: a brush with the law, but like have been in jail, arrested,
Speaker 3: have a dui, have defrauded the government. And then there's
Speaker 3: also the financial foreclosure Like does that speak volumes?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean yeah, it's definitely, like any an exaggerated version,
Speaker 2: and it's definitely an amplified world, you know. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: in what world would you sit there and go have
Speaker 2: dinner with the woman who's like now engaged to your
Speaker 2: experts en who's suing you. You would never ever ever
Speaker 2: do that, right, But because in this situation you are
Speaker 2: forced to, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Well, the networks, so this whole hierarchy and structure is
Speaker 3: designed like the mafia. This is going to sound crazy
Speaker 3: or like what happens is the network pays talent as
Speaker 3: independent and and crew as independent contractors. And the reason
Speaker 3: for that is so they're not actual technical employees. Because
Speaker 3: employees or union members have certain guidelines and can go
Speaker 3: run up the flagpole and say I just saw someone
Speaker 3: you know, break their sobriety or do drugs at work.
Speaker 3: I just saw someone abuse someone else, or verbally abuse
Speaker 3: someone else, or or emotionally abuse someone else.
Speaker 1: Which is literally the basis of these shows.
Speaker 3: So the payment structure is designed so nobody's holding the
Speaker 3: bag where the top person is always protected, and they're.
Speaker 2: Staying that because it's like, oh, well it's not us,
Speaker 2: that's the production company.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying, okay, which is.
Speaker 2: Literally interesting, Sorry to interrupt you, but literally, there was
Speaker 2: an article that came out today it's like Daily Mail
Speaker 2: or something, and that they had a comment from a
Speaker 2: Bravo in cyber you know about the video that I posted,
Speaker 2: and it was basically like this has nothing to do
Speaker 2: with Bravo. They have nothing to do with production company hiring.
Speaker 2: That's all done at a production company level, you know,
Speaker 2: like very like flipping like this has nothing to do
Speaker 2: with the network, like you know, let them cake kind
Speaker 2: of thing.
Speaker 3: So the production in each case, whether it's over consumption
Speaker 3: or any of these situations, or with us it was
Speaker 3: Columbia Cartagena where we almost all like died in the
Speaker 3: boat where there were only two life fest I mean,
Speaker 3: there are a lot of things like that that are
Speaker 3: a different version of liability. There's mental health, there's substances.
Speaker 3: Then there's like danger liability. Like so have you experienced
Speaker 3: a bit of that too, where you're like, what the hell?
Speaker 3: This is not safe?
Speaker 1: On trips?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, absolutely. My very first international cash trip, my first
Speaker 2: cast trip was the first international cash trip I took.
Speaker 2: Was for Real Housewoives of Atlanta spinoff called Porsche's Family Matters.
Speaker 2: It was about Porscha's family. She was getting married, you know,
Speaker 2: to this guy named Simon who she's now going through
Speaker 2: a divorce with. But yeah, we took the cast to
Speaker 2: Mexico for this healing retreat. You know how we love
Speaker 2: we love a healing retreat on these Housesolives shows, which
Speaker 2: are everything butt healing obviously, And we're at a cast
Speaker 2: a dinner where a brawl broke out between her entire family.
Speaker 2: I found myself having to pry a metal pole out
Speaker 2: of Porsche's hand that she was trying to use to
Speaker 2: bash another cast member's face in with who happened to
Speaker 2: be the father father of her child. Yes, during that brawl,
Speaker 2: I mean it went on for quite some time. There
Speaker 2: were not only was she swinging this metal pole around
Speaker 2: which could have hit anyone at any time, And this
Speaker 2: was all on the show. You see me grab this, pull,
Speaker 2: restle it out of her hand and take.
Speaker 1: It away the crew.
Speaker 2: They aired a very very watered down version of it.
Speaker 2: It would go to black. I would occasionally go to
Speaker 2: black so they didn't have to show it. You know,
Speaker 2: I happened to be wearing a Lady Gaga T shirt
Speaker 2: at that scene. And then I don't know, someone online
Speaker 2: like anyway was commentary on it, calling me Gaga. But
Speaker 2: but yeah, so there, I mean, not only is she
Speaker 2: like using this metal pole to try to hit people
Speaker 2: with swinging in around crew members with no you know,
Speaker 2: not a care in the world about anyone throwing clay pots,
Speaker 2: throwing plates that are breaking over cameraman's heads, throwing knives.
Speaker 2: There were cameramen that were there at this thing that
Speaker 2: like chimed in on the on these videos online like
Speaker 2: I was there, Yes, that happened, wow, but yeah, and
Speaker 2: so just complete chaos ensued. We were kicked out of
Speaker 2: the restaurants that we were shooting in and the police
Speaker 2: impounded all of our crew vehicles. So all of the
Speaker 2: crew vehicles were taken. So the entire crew and cast
Speaker 2: is left scrambling like scattered about the streets of Mexico,
Speaker 2: like wandering around trying to find our way back to
Speaker 2: our hotel because we kicked out of our location because
Speaker 2: of this crazy fight that sent you. I mean, it
Speaker 2: was pure chaos, you know.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And the next day, like Porsa didn't even talk about it.
Speaker 2: She she come we had learned later that day Porscha
Speaker 2: reached out to her entire family and told them, don't
Speaker 2: talk about this on the show because if we don't
Speaker 2: talk about it, they can't air the fight. So obviously
Speaker 2: that did happen Wow. So they eventually started talking about it.
Speaker 2: But like then a week or so later, we were back
Speaker 2: in the in the States and I was shooting a
Speaker 2: scene with her cousin and her aunt or something, and
Speaker 2: you know, in the beats, it's like we're talking to
Speaker 2: about what happened on the trip, you know, and so
Speaker 2: like that's I'm telling the cast like, Okay, well maybe
Speaker 2: we should touch based on how we're feeling after everything
Speaker 2: that happened on the trip, and so they start talking
Speaker 2: about the stuff that happened.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Anyway, it gets back to Porsche, and Porsche caused a
Speaker 2: production company that I'm trying to like coerce them to
Speaker 2: talking about this, you know, on camera.
Speaker 3: So you're really primarily here to represent the crew I think,
Speaker 3: I mean, just an entire culture.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I well, I'm not living in that environment anymore,
Speaker 2: and now that I'm out of it, I don't know,
Speaker 2: it just kind of felt like I just felt like
Speaker 2: it needed to be said, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2: There's these are things that have been discussed and complained
Speaker 2: about since I started working on these shows, the crews
Speaker 2: complaining about being overworked, specifically like on those cast trips,
Speaker 2: those cast trips are nightmares, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: and they're non stop. And yeah, I was just like,
Speaker 2: you know, this has been happening for so long, people
Speaker 2: have been complaining about it for so long. I'm on
Speaker 2: my way out of here. I have no desire to
Speaker 2: come back, so like, why not take this opportunity to
Speaker 2: shed a little light on this like huge issue in
Speaker 2: this industry and maybe initiate some change as I you know,
Speaker 2: see myself out the door.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's courageous, and I think your voice will be
Speaker 3: stronger than anyone's because you they have nothing you want
Speaker 3: and you're not asking for anything. So no one's going
Speaker 3: to come and say this guy has ulterior motives and
Speaker 3: you're begrudged.
Speaker 1: You've a good life. You like me.
Speaker 3: I mean I was the scariest housewife because I became
Speaker 3: the one who needed it the least, and so I
Speaker 3: was always willing to walk and I walk twice.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and honestly too, that's I think that me doing,
Speaker 2: you know, me starting my only fans and kind of
Speaker 2: like taking my power into my own hands, taking my
Speaker 2: finances into my own hands, and just like taking control
Speaker 2: of all of that. It does take away you know
Speaker 2: that that's uh need to stay loyal to the realm.
Speaker 2: Like you say, you know what I mean, you're.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like even a thread where you're like wondering if
Speaker 3: you're burning the last bridge and if it matters, and
Speaker 3: you're just like, I don't care about that bridge. I'm
Speaker 3: never going back there. They have nothing I want. It's
Speaker 3: so powerful.
Speaker 2: That had been something I'd been toying with for a while.
Speaker 2: Like you know, I've been interested in doing only fans
Speaker 2: for a while. I have many friends. My boyfriend is
Speaker 2: a huge content creator.
Speaker 3: First of all, I hope a lot of my followers,
Speaker 3: if any you know, if any of you are our
Speaker 3: go on all the only fans follow him, watch him,
Speaker 3: support him. Because this is courageous. I have to say
Speaker 3: this guy, you know you're not in the same financial
Speaker 3: position as I am, and you decided to speak up.
Speaker 3: And I think that's extremely courageous because you speak to
Speaker 3: the person. It doesn't matter if you are doing OnlyFans,
Speaker 3: you speak. The crew needed a voice because the crew
Speaker 3: is the every man and woman, and that everyone in
Speaker 3: the country can relate to someone who's living paycheck to paycheck.
Speaker 3: Something happens, a strike happens, They literally can't feed their kids,
Speaker 3: they don't know what's going to happen to them. They
Speaker 3: think they're going to be evicted, and they're doing things
Speaker 3: they don't want to do. So you're speaking up for
Speaker 3: people that still are on shows right now that have
Speaker 3: to do that every day. So you're speaking up for them.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, well, thank you. I appreciate that. But yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean I've had many people who are working on
Speaker 2: shows with many of the showrunners that I reference in
Speaker 2: the video or allude to in the video, who thanks
Speaker 2: me for speaking.
Speaker 1: Out, you know, because they can't and they won't.
Speaker 2: Right Well, yeah, because they need to work. You know.
Speaker 2: That's like what ninety percent of the messages have been, like,
Speaker 2: thank you for saying this. My god, so someone finally
Speaker 2: said this. Y no good, because like it's it's not
Speaker 2: just like a singular problem, like this is just happening
Speaker 2: on you know, Real Housewives of whatever. You know, this
Speaker 2: isn't on one show. This is across the board. You know.
Speaker 2: I've heard from many, many colleagues that I've worked with,
Speaker 2: and many people in the industry that I've never even met,
Speaker 2: you know, and it's all the same thing. I think
Speaker 2: that a lot of these like incidents that happened could
Speaker 2: be corrected by having like standards and practices person present
Speaker 2: on set. You know, I don't know what the term
Speaker 2: for it would be because it doesn't exist.
Speaker 3: I've said that like a COVID compliance person that was
Speaker 3: there making sure that things were taking exactly.
Speaker 2: It doesn't exist on these shows, so I don't even
Speaker 2: know what to call it. But there should be someone
Speaker 2: put there in place by the network or maybe a
Speaker 2: third party or something, no, a third reality.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like a COVID compliance.
Speaker 2: I said, exactly, exactly, just like making sure hey, like, hey, cameraman,
Speaker 2: when was the last time you got a bathroom break care?
Speaker 2: If you need a You know what I mean.
Speaker 3: The upside down. It's the upside down of any other workplace.
Speaker 2: So is you can either have peace and have a
Speaker 2: well balanced life or you can be like a successful housewife.
Speaker 1: Exactly exactly.
Speaker 3: So let's talk about the after effects, like, because I
Speaker 3: remember it takes months to years to get over having
Speaker 3: been during this experience. For me, it's like almost when
Speaker 3: you have a baby six months later, you still don't
Speaker 3: feel right, like you just live in a different reality.
Speaker 3: You think that it's normal and that it's what everybody
Speaker 3: goes through and that people care about it in the
Speaker 3: normal world, and then you realize like they don't, like
Speaker 3: don't It's like an ex that I never I don't
Speaker 3: think of that often. Like That's why when I saw
Speaker 3: your video, I was like, oh wait different. Okay, So
Speaker 3: how does it affect the crew working in this environment
Speaker 3: physically and mentally? And how does it feel like a workplace?
Speaker 3: And you worked on Union shows and this is so
Speaker 3: markedly different, Like what does it feel like from the
Speaker 3: crew's perspective?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I've spent three years working in CBS,
Speaker 2: like a live daytime television show, you know. I've worked
Speaker 2: on many movies and stuff before I got injur rear.
Speaker 2: I've worked in the scripted space, in the union space,
Speaker 2: where things are much more you know, by the book
Speaker 2: and on the up and up, you know. Okay, I
Speaker 2: think that I'll speak specifically on these cash trips because
Speaker 2: I think those are the places where the most infractions
Speaker 2: and the most violations happen. Ah okay, because it's such
Speaker 2: a concentrated like pressure cooker.
Speaker 3: I just did a video on TikTok saying these are
Speaker 3: the trip, this is the trips are when you have
Speaker 3: to fit twenty five pounds of emotional and dramatic shit
Speaker 3: in a five pound bag. And they've spent money, and
Speaker 3: they've spent money, and you better fucking make a meal
Speaker 3: out of it. They need everything to pop off on
Speaker 3: the trip. It's the arc of the season. It gets
Speaker 3: you right into the reunion, and so it's a pressure cooker.
Speaker 3: That's what I've said, And that's why they liked on
Speaker 3: New York that we'd go just to the Berkshire's or
Speaker 3: just to Miami because it costs nothing, and yet we'd
Speaker 3: still deliver the same disaster. That's what my point of
Speaker 3: view is. So you're validating my point of view.
Speaker 2: I mean, the pressures that are put upon the crews
Speaker 2: and producers are just insane. I spoke about this. I'm
Speaker 2: going to reiterate some of the things I said in
Speaker 2: the video, Like, you know a lot of times, you know,
Speaker 2: all these cash trips, you'll go like a week long trip.
Speaker 2: There was a trip where I traveled twenty two hours.
Speaker 2: Me and a group of crew members traveled twenty two
Speaker 2: hours to an international location. You know, travel days a
Speaker 2: work day, you're changing planes, you're collecting gear, you're like
Speaker 2: communicating with your crew, you know what I mean, you're
Speaker 2: doing logistics, you're talking to the people that are already
Speaker 2: there like you're working, you know. And then so we
Speaker 2: get to this location after having worked and traveled for
Speaker 2: twenty two hours straight, and we're told when we got
Speaker 2: to the hotel, we got a text that said, hello, welcome,
Speaker 2: Please drop your bags and get freshened up in your
Speaker 2: room and be back in the lobby within the hour
Speaker 2: for a day of scouting. So we were expected, although
Speaker 2: we had just finished working a twenty two hour day,
Speaker 2: we were expected to begin yet another twenty two hour
Speaker 2: day without like a literal wink of sleek. So I mean,
Speaker 2: and that's happened more than once on these shows.
Speaker 3: Basically, you're saying that there should be a reasonable I'm
Speaker 3: saying in a workplace, there are shifts, and you're saying
Speaker 3: that people should be working in reasonable shifts with a
Speaker 3: little bit.
Speaker 2: People should be working in shift. People should be working
Speaker 2: in shifts. Correct. So some shows did that, and I
Speaker 2: said this in the video. Vander pump Rose, for example,
Speaker 2: was a show that staggered really well. That was a
Speaker 2: very well run show by the showrunner Jeremiah Smith. That's
Speaker 2: a testament that his leadership, he was always very very
Speaker 2: aware of, you know, the needs of the crew, was
Speaker 2: very in touch with the needs of the crew.
Speaker 1: Amazing, Like right, shout out to Jeremiah Smith. Okay, Yes.
Speaker 2: And there are some people on the other hand who
Speaker 2: run the trips, like you know, tyrants. You know, they'll
Speaker 2: expect every producer to be at that cast villa or
Speaker 2: the cast rooms at like seven or eight a m.
Speaker 2: To start shooting producer cam before one of the big
Speaker 2: cameras get up. So we're coming in on iPhones shooting
Speaker 2: them waking up, you know what I mean, before the
Speaker 2: before the crews get up.
Speaker 3: How many hours in a row are you working without
Speaker 3: sleep and food like that?
Speaker 2: On those ships, you're working like sometimes like thirteen fourteen
Speaker 2: fifteen hour days at that time, depending on your position.
Speaker 2: And then these loggers then they'll work that shoot day
Speaker 2: and then they have to go back to their room
Speaker 2: and write a summary. So then they're writing for like
Speaker 2: three hours, you know, and then they have to be
Speaker 2: back to working like two hours. Your car times eight am,
Speaker 2: your car times am. We're running late.
Speaker 3: I had this experience on a show that I was
Speaker 3: on and my name was on. And there was a
Speaker 3: moment when I looked at the producer I won't name her.
Speaker 3: There were two producers and I said, is this legal?
Speaker 3: Was freezing. We had been working. It was two o'clock
Speaker 3: in the morning. They had jammed everything in to this
Speaker 3: one location that we had to get done on this day,
Speaker 3: and like the pivotal point was still hadn't been accomplished.
Speaker 1: And I said, is this legal?
Speaker 3: And they said, well, it's not union, it's not illegal,
Speaker 3: but it's not right. And I called up the head
Speaker 3: of the production company and was like what And it's
Speaker 3: one of them that you actually know, and I said,
Speaker 3: what the fuck? And I freaked out. And the next
Speaker 3: time I met with this entire crew, I said, I
Speaker 3: just want you guys to know that what that was.
Speaker 3: And one part, one of the sound person quit. I
Speaker 3: was acutely aware of it was wrong. And somebody from
Speaker 3: your world too was working with me on it, and
Speaker 3: I was and he was just used to it because
Speaker 3: he's used to what you're talking about. And I said
Speaker 3: to the crew, this is not This will never happen again.
Speaker 3: My name cannot be on something that cannot be a
Speaker 3: reflection of me. Like you just know when it's inhumane.
Speaker 3: And so you're speaking for the crew from the physical
Speaker 3: the lack of breaks, lack of you.
Speaker 2: Know, you're in these tropical locations, right and sometimes the
Speaker 2: women's cast. The rooms can be like different parts of
Speaker 2: these resorts, right, so they're very far away sometimes from
Speaker 2: each other. So you'll have a crew that's you know,
Speaker 2: carrying several heavy cameras, tons of equipment, lighting all that.
Speaker 2: You just manually, they're just firing you off to different
Speaker 2: places and then they're like, nope, go back to Bethany's room.
Speaker 2: And then we're headed there and they're like, what the hell,
Speaker 2: why aren't you have Bethany's room? And we need to
Speaker 2: get this scene shut, you know, and it's like, well,
Speaker 2: they're carrying all the stuff to try to get it
Speaker 2: from the last movie made, you know, and they're just no,
Speaker 2: and they're like, okay, well I'm giving my cameraman like
Speaker 2: a water break because we just like walked three miles
Speaker 2: to get here, so like we're gonna need a second.
Speaker 2: You know. There's no consideration of those kind of things,
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, They don't.
Speaker 1: Care And is there any hr there.
Speaker 2: Are definitely no HR representatives on site on these trips.
Speaker 2: That's what I mentioned in the video. I think that
Speaker 2: Bravo should send someone from human resources, some kind of
Speaker 2: compliance officer to these to these trips to ensure that
Speaker 2: the cast, crew and everyone involved are given their like
Speaker 2: adequate break times, are given rest, everyone's being treated humanely
Speaker 2: and not being you know, forced to like sit on
Speaker 2: a hot boat for four hours. You know what I'm saying, Like, No.
Speaker 3: This is what I said the first time around. I said,
Speaker 3: there are no guard rails, there's no lifeguard, there's no
Speaker 3: principle in the office. It's just a free free for all.
Speaker 3: And it's just a free for all. So what about
Speaker 3: the And then the last thing I want to talk
Speaker 3: about is like what about the mental health of the
Speaker 3: crew and how the crew feels about the subject matter
Speaker 3: about the Porsche fight, about the Morocco Brandy Caroline incident,
Speaker 3: about the Shannon Badour, about the Scary Island, Like what
Speaker 3: is the crew's moral dilemma or are they just machines
Speaker 3: that are just don't they don't you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Like, I mean I can speak to the Porsche fight.
Speaker 2: I mean they were all extremely upset after that they
Speaker 2: were like this is so fucked up, Like we can't
Speaker 2: work like this, We shouldn't be having to do this,
Speaker 2: you know. And and the real kicker for that was
Speaker 2: like Porscha didn't even like acknowledge it, you know, until
Speaker 2: she was like made to like because there was like
Speaker 2: day a day went by and Porsche had said nothing
Speaker 2: to the crew or anything until they like, like you
Speaker 2: have to say something. She gave us like very very
Speaker 2: very quick little apology that she really clearly wanted to
Speaker 2: like breeze through like check. Yeah. So they were very
Speaker 2: like put off by that. And yeah, I mean I
Speaker 2: can't tell you how many times I've been like that's
Speaker 2: been late night at a trip going back to do
Speaker 2: producer Cam, like all right, we gotta go back and
Speaker 2: get the ladies having fun in their rooms, and like
Speaker 2: these ladies are so exhausted a lot of times, like
Speaker 2: they just traveled, you know, twenty something hours to get
Speaker 2: there too, they haven't gotten a lot of rest. And
Speaker 2: I've literally had to tell them like all right, ladies,
Speaker 2: I eat everybody up dancing, Let's take some you know,
Speaker 2: like who who wants drinks, Let's get some drinks, Let's
Speaker 2: have some fun. Get the energy up here, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean? Told to tell them, you.
Speaker 1: Know, does exhaustion help drama?
Speaker 2: Tired, they're like all dead and they're like okay, they
Speaker 2: get up and dance. It's like dance, pony dance. You know.
Speaker 3: Is there any aspect of it where the exhaustion helps
Speaker 3: the drama? The alcohol helps the drama like that production
Speaker 3: knows that, Like they're tired, so they're going to do
Speaker 3: and say stupid shito percent.
Speaker 2: I think that the model of these trips to pack
Speaker 2: so much into such a short amount of time, I
Speaker 2: think was designed to uh be very exhausting and very uh.
Speaker 2: I think they were designed to push people to their limits.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean, to push these cast members
Speaker 2: to their limits, these long days, long events where a
Speaker 2: lot of alcohol is happening.
Speaker 3: Yet it's the residual aspect of that is the trips
Speaker 3: are designed to push people to their limits. So somebody
Speaker 3: has to be filming that creuse not making the same money,
Speaker 3: getting the same fame, having the same decisions, power and relevance,
Speaker 3: is experienced the same exhaustion, but with no upside. Absolutely, absolutely,
Speaker 3: that's what you're saying, because I was trying. I'm trying
Speaker 3: to get to you what overall this is for the crew,
Speaker 3: and that's what I've now at the end of this
Speaker 3: interview come to you are basically saying that all of
Speaker 3: this drama that goes on that is making housewives cry
Speaker 3: ruin their lives, the desperation, the circular reference. The crew
Speaker 3: is experiencing all of it and more because they're lugging
Speaker 3: equipment and having to capture it and have to stay
Speaker 3: in shitty hotel rooms. But they get none of the upside.
Speaker 2: And dodging plates and knives by their faces, you know,
Speaker 2: and can be replaced at a moment's notice without.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so it's all downside while you're watching these other
Speaker 3: people drive in rolls royces and you guys are there
Speaker 3: to produce it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's very I feel like I get it.
Speaker 3: I feel like I want to know if there's anything
Speaker 3: you have to say that you haven't said.
Speaker 1: They said that you got everything.
Speaker 3: So one discussion has been NDAs because they've been loosely
Speaker 3: interpreted and sort of weaponized theoretically, so no one can
Speaker 3: talk about their experience, and Bravo says, oh, the NDAs
Speaker 3: are not so someone doesn't discuss problems in the workplace.
Speaker 3: They're just to protect storyline. But cast members and crew
Speaker 3: members are scared that they're on a gag order and
Speaker 3: that they'll be sanctioned and punished if they talk because
Speaker 3: they're under NDA. But NDAs are not designed so if
Speaker 3: someone has a me too incident or experience, is something
Speaker 3: that is problematic in the workplace, that you're not supposed
Speaker 3: to tell about it. NDAs are supposed to be for
Speaker 3: like proprietary information, you know, like don't give our recipe
Speaker 3: for the secret sauce or our story exactly. So the
Speaker 3: NDA is a discussion, and have you been nervous about that?
Speaker 3: You'll be signed an NDA along the way.
Speaker 2: I'm not nervous about that because everything I've been saying
Speaker 2: is the truth, you know. So while that may be
Speaker 2: a concern for some people, it's just not a concern
Speaker 2: of mine quite frankly. Yeah, I think that nothing changes
Speaker 2: if nothing changes, So I mean, somebody's got to speak
Speaker 2: up and say these things. Somebody's got to bring these
Speaker 2: things to light from the point of view of the
Speaker 2: producers and the crew members that are seeing this, because
Speaker 2: nobody believes the housewife who's you know, been like spiraling
Speaker 2: out of control who's been like or been has this
Speaker 2: reputation of being difficult or being a slut, or being
Speaker 2: stupid or being you know, whatever it is. Whatever reason
Speaker 2: you don't like a real housewife for, it's a reason
Speaker 2: for you not to believe them when they come out
Speaker 2: and say, hey, I've been mistreated. You know. So, I
Speaker 2: don't care if you like somebody or not. I don't
Speaker 2: care if you agree with their lifestyle. I don't care
Speaker 2: if you agree with what they do. And I'm talking
Speaker 2: about people in front of the camera talking about people
Speaker 2: behind the camera. They should that that just shouldn't happen.
Speaker 2: So it doesn't matter who the message is coming from.
Speaker 2: It's like, let's believe these people. Let's start believing some
Speaker 2: of these people, you know what I mean. Let's start
Speaker 2: working at what some of these people are saying and
Speaker 2: maybe set aside your feelings about what they did in
Speaker 2: their storyline on their show and maybe like taking the consideration, Okay,
Speaker 2: maybe two things can be true at one time.
Speaker 3: You are a great messenger, like you actually are doing
Speaker 3: so much for the crew and for these women, because I,
Speaker 3: as a viewer would be like Daniel Staub, but when
Speaker 3: she reached out to me and said, do you know
Speaker 3: how many times prostitution whore has been said?
Speaker 1: Said on watch Rappens.
Speaker 3: Live that it was at Bravo Khan that it was
Speaker 3: like played over and over, like it's like the girl
Speaker 3: who was promiscuous in high school or who slept with
Speaker 3: half the hockey team, but then is like abused, like
Speaker 3: fully abused, you know, or physical abused, or becomes not
Speaker 3: a person anymore. That's the thing that I think is
Speaker 3: going on. It's all the girls that have made mistakes,
Speaker 3: done stupid things, said stupid things, drank too much, but
Speaker 3: too many people weren't you know, gotten many tattoos, look
Speaker 3: a certain way that people judge. You know, these are
Speaker 3: the girls that I do think are also kind of discarded,
Speaker 3: so their message gets muddled. And I think that that's
Speaker 3: what you've just said, like that you are the voice
Speaker 3: of those people, and that I think is something interesting.
Speaker 3: Does that make Does that make s that's the difference,
Speaker 3: Yeah or not?
Speaker 2: It does because you know, those people have been like
Speaker 2: cast out, you know what I mean, So like a
Speaker 2: lot of the time, you know, the viewership will turn
Speaker 2: on those people because they're not spoken up positively on
Speaker 2: the show anymore. Whatever reason. But it's like this thing
Speaker 2: where we're going to keep you. We're gonna keep you here,
Speaker 2: We're gonna keep you in a nice car, and we'll
Speaker 2: keep you you know what I mean. But you're staying
Speaker 2: the right you know what I mean? Yes, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: In the midst of hearing from all these people, I've
Speaker 2: also heard from cast members who are currently on shows
Speaker 2: that are going through this ship right now in real time,
Speaker 2: you know, realching out saying like I'm going through this
Speaker 2: on my show right now for X y Z. So
Speaker 2: it's like it's nothing has changed, you know.
Speaker 3: No, A big one said it to me too. People
Speaker 3: reached out to me and then but then they got
Speaker 3: scared and they wouldn't say anything, and they like said
Speaker 3: publicly the opposite. And I got annoyed because I was like, no,
Speaker 3: now you're like you called me or you reached out
Speaker 3: to me to say what I was doing is amazing,
Speaker 3: but then you got nervous and hid behind it, and
Speaker 3: when asked in the media what you thought, and you
Speaker 3: like denounced it. But you called me privately. That has
Speaker 3: happened a lot people have called privately. But yeah, but
Speaker 3: that that's that's their privacy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you understand. I understand, like you got to like
Speaker 2: make a living, you know, even people, this is what's
Speaker 2: paying your bills. This is why none of the crew
Speaker 2: has been speaking out because this is paying their bills,
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. So I also don't blame
Speaker 2: the crew, the cast members who don't want to speak publicly.
Speaker 2: Obviously they have a job to keep.
Speaker 3: You know, I think you can actually make a difference,
Speaker 3: and I'm going to connect you to people, like there
Speaker 3: were conversations where SAG and AFTRA validated everything I was
Speaker 3: saying and saying that the door was opened, the bridge
Speaker 3: was never linked. But we have a lot, we have
Speaker 3: contacts and respect there and you could probably be instrumental
Speaker 3: in like helping production crews get the treatment they deserve.
Speaker 3: This also, I remember when I had this going on
Speaker 3: with the reckoning, teachers were talking about it, like you know,
Speaker 3: plumbers were talking about it. People and other industries start
Speaker 3: to hear things that start in one industry. So I
Speaker 3: actually think you can you can make an impact because
Speaker 3: it's more you know, it's a it's more of a
Speaker 3: middle class uprising that that you could represent that I
Speaker 3: obviously couldn't. So anyway, I just want to thank you Patrick.
Speaker 3: Have a great rest of your time in Thailand. Patrick
Speaker 3: is joining us from Thailand. It's the middle of the night,
Speaker 3: so go get some rest and breathe easy. I think
Speaker 3: you did a great job.
Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you, thanks. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Awesome.
Speaker 2: Thank you. What that? What that? What that? What that?
Speaker 4: Hap