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Speaker 1: Hey, it's fifty cent and I'm Charlie Webster, host of

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Speaker 1: Surviving l Chapo, the Twins who brought down a drug lord.

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Speaker 1: Make sure you listen to the catch up so you're

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Speaker 1: up to date with what happened in season one.

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Speaker 2: If you haven't listened to season one with you been,

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Speaker 2: go back and listen.

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Speaker 1: The story is chronological and follows on from season two.

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Speaker 1: I can't wait to take you on the second part

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Speaker 1: of this ride. We're going to jump straight in where

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Speaker 1: we left off.

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Speaker 3: And when I saw the cards and like all the

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Speaker 3: agents in marshals.

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Speaker 4: Just like staring at us.

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Speaker 3: I think it was the first time I ever felt like,

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Speaker 3: holy shit, I'm.

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Speaker 4: Not just a drug dealer right.

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Speaker 3: My whole time, even though like you might hear me

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Speaker 3: say it now, like oh, that was the biggest drug deer.

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Speaker 4: I had no idea that I was. To me, I

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Speaker 4: was just telling.

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Speaker 5: Drugs when you look at it from on the outskirts,

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Speaker 5: because just in perspective, you can't even fathom what that's.

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Speaker 4: That's like I was just doing what they did. Why

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Speaker 4: are they here?

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Speaker 3: Like you know what I mean, Like it's just us

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Speaker 3: like but it was like reality. It was hard to

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Speaker 3: like take all that in it and not having a

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Speaker 3: chance to deal with your emotional it was really difficult.

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Speaker 1: This is Surviving our chapter It's Twins who Brought Down

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Speaker 1: a Trouble Old season two.

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Speaker 2: It's fifteen, Charlie with you again.

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Speaker 5: Welcome back to Surviving ol chop or The Twins who

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Speaker 5: brought Down the Drug Law Season two. After a twenty

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Speaker 5: year long career in the drug trade, the Flores twins

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Speaker 5: Peter and Jay decided it was time to turn their

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Speaker 5: lives around.

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Speaker 2: But it wasn't going to come easy.

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Speaker 5: This is real. They were deep into the cartel. Old

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Speaker 5: Chopol was like family today. They were caught between the

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Speaker 5: cartel on one side and the actual family or another.

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Speaker 5: Getting out of the life meant that huge betrayal to

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Speaker 5: everything they'd ever known and turning against the man who

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Speaker 5: was the only reason they were both still alive in

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Speaker 5: the first place. It was Chopo that stopped peace execution

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Speaker 5: and who kept the entire family safe.

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Speaker 1: It took eight months of secret recordings working with the

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Speaker 1: US government to bring Chapeo down by recording him on

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Speaker 1: a wire tap. Pete and Jay turned over the recording

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Speaker 1: to the government and handed themselves in ready to take

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Speaker 1: the next step in turning their life around.

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Speaker 5: We left you in season one with Pete and j

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Speaker 5: shackle and landing in the US to a load the

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Speaker 5: police and federal agents.

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Speaker 1: While the brothers were on their way out of Mexico

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Speaker 1: on a US government private jet, their wives and the

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Speaker 1: rest of the family had to make their own way

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Speaker 1: out of the country. Viv, Val, Pete and J's brother Armando,

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Speaker 1: the twins, mother and father, and all the children were

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Speaker 1: left to drive eight hours through enemy territory, across the

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Speaker 1: US border and into relative safety. Just a reminder that

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Speaker 1: we're not going to identify which brother is speaking each time,

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Speaker 1: but I'm sure by now you've got to know them.

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Speaker 6: Jay is a little lighter and happy go lucky.

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Speaker 1: Heat tends to be serious and more of a realist.

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Speaker 1: Jay is married to Val and at this point they

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Speaker 1: have two boys, one just a newborn baby. Heat is

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Speaker 1: married to Viv. They also have a newborn baby, a girl.

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Speaker 3: It was a big deal when we came back, like

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Speaker 3: they had all kinds of marshals and swat team.

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Speaker 4: To bombard as questions.

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Speaker 3: There's a couple of people talking and a lot of faces,

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Speaker 3: and I seen his man. He's kind of tall. He

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Speaker 3: has a briefcase and I automatically ain't know, like, oh,

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Speaker 3: that's the use of attorney. And we went into the

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Speaker 3: They have a business lobby, so they have a big

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Speaker 3: conference room, and we went in there and a few

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Speaker 3: of the agents, including the agent, the DA agent Marsh

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Speaker 3: I think he was from our original cas is there

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Speaker 3: and we get on the call with our attorney and

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Speaker 3: the US Attorney's office from Chicago, and basically they're like, Okay, guys,

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Speaker 3: you know your family's across the borders or and now

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Speaker 3: you guys are here and use guys been cooperating, you know,

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Speaker 3: for Mexico, but now it's time for you guys to

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Speaker 3: finish doing your job. And I'm really, huh, you don't

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Speaker 3: have to finish during your job, and that means it

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Speaker 3: we need you incorporating against all your customers based in

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Speaker 3: the United States. I was like, oh, absolutely not.

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Speaker 4: Hell no, we're not doing that. We're not doing that.

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Speaker 4: Everyone looked like what.

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Speaker 3: And I remember my turning with like, hold on, hold on,

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Speaker 3: I need to speak to my clients. I need to

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Speaker 3: fink my clients in private, Like nah, that's the post

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Speaker 3: you like, because I felt like we just cooperated for nothing,

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Speaker 3: like we have nothing, like where's our end?

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Speaker 4: Just reis my life?

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Speaker 3: I'm here by the bras of God, like, but now

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Speaker 3: where's like you're asking me corporated with Where's like? What

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Speaker 3: was my benefit?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 3: What am I getting? You're asking me to now turn

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Speaker 3: on my customers.

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Speaker 1: As far as the twins were concerned, the deal was

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Speaker 1: to get El Chapo on tape, serve a few years

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Speaker 1: in prison, and be free to start a completely new life.

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Speaker 1: All their conversations with the government so far have been

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Speaker 1: purely focused on El Chapo, but the government had other ideas.

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Speaker 1: J and P would now have to turn in everybody

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Speaker 1: they've ever dealt with, workers, customers, and even their friends

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Speaker 1: if they were ever going to have any chance at freedom.

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Speaker 3: The prosecutor gets on the phone and the other prosecutors

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Speaker 3: just looking at something basically says, guys, to work.

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Speaker 4: It's gonna be all or nothing. You don't get to

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Speaker 4: the side.

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Speaker 7: How did that make you feel?

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Speaker 4: I felt like that hurt, that felt trapped.

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Speaker 8: Like I felt stupid for sure, And at that moment,

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Speaker 8: that's how I felt like what I was angry?

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Speaker 9: I just.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I just said it was that moment it

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Speaker 3: was those like those initial moments where I felt like

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Speaker 3: I was angry to use a turn off. I felt

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Speaker 3: like it was a trap to me and I felt

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Speaker 3: like I hadn't got nothing in return and.

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Speaker 4: To them, and they're like, oh, you're a diructed what

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Speaker 4: you respect. You're getting a chance.

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Speaker 3: And to me, I'm like, I'm risking my life every

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Speaker 3: day forgiving you what you asked me for.

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Speaker 4: You didn't ask for that.

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Speaker 3: You said that you wanted this, We offered, We put

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Speaker 3: everything on the table, and that's what you wanted. And

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Speaker 3: that's not just trait works. So basically he said, listen,

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Speaker 3: it's all or nothing. If you guys want to decided,

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Speaker 3: you would change your mind and you want to spend

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Speaker 3: the rest of your life in prison for all your

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Speaker 3: customers are gonna end up cooperating against you anyway, like

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Speaker 3: they are. Now that's up to you, you guys think

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Speaker 3: about it. And when he said that, was like, kind

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Speaker 3: I had a point there, you know.

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Speaker 4: Like.

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Speaker 3: I do remember asking could we do anything about this?

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Speaker 3: And he's like, you don't get to pick and choose.

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Speaker 3: Chase doesn't work that way. Now you go do the

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Speaker 3: right thing. Remember what got your hair?

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Speaker 4: You don't put no one in front of your family,

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Speaker 4: and he was right.

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Speaker 3: I didn't want to be the responsible person for that,

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Speaker 3: like I guess, you know, like I didn't wanna be

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Speaker 3: responsible for everyone's life changing.

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Speaker 4: I just wanna be responsible for my life changing, right like.

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Speaker 4: And I think that it's just it was a lot,

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Speaker 4: you know what I mean?

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Speaker 3: That night they wanted to do uh what you call

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Speaker 3: control deliveries, so you'd call, you know, a call a

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Speaker 3: customer and tell ma'mas and go kill 'em drugs and

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Speaker 3: they're arrest 'em. But there was too much to do

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Speaker 3: in them a few hours, like to be sitting there

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Speaker 3: and it was getting lad to finding they they we

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Speaker 3: made a couple of calls and that was her fault

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Speaker 3: for them to be sitting in front of you, like here,

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Speaker 3: make the call, call this person and they're sitting in

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Speaker 3: front of you. And we had to lie, and we

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Speaker 3: had to call customers that we had for many years

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Speaker 3: and be like and basically settlement.

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Speaker 7: So it could be arrested.

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Speaker 9: M H.

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Speaker 7: How did that feel?

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Speaker 4: It's like.

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Speaker 3: It's gonna be one of those define moments a team

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Speaker 3: in my life where you know, there was really high

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Speaker 3: highs and really low loads we made up eat a

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Speaker 3: few of those calls, and it was getting late in

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Speaker 3: the night and they decided that we were.

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Speaker 4: Gonna end there. The team remember Belt, like, I just

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Speaker 4: can't believe just what we did.

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Speaker 1: The first off was Kenosha County Jail in Wisconsin and

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Speaker 1: a change in identity for protection, they could no longer

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Speaker 1: use or be referred to by their real names.

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Speaker 3: It took us to a county jail, to Kenosha County Jail,

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Speaker 3: and that's when reality was and start standing in a

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Speaker 3: little bit. Took us and uh, they changed their name,

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Speaker 3: they changed their name, and they gave us the last

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Speaker 3: name for Maris. My name was gonna be Mark Ramers

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Speaker 3: and Peter was Quant Rumors. And in Kenosha there's a

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Speaker 3: federally like a federal holdover, and uh, this is a

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Speaker 3: county jail. They made us change and you know the

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Speaker 3: thirty years, they give you orange socks with wholes in

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Speaker 3: them and slippers, shower shows, and they put us in

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Speaker 3: a in this one unit, it's like down twenty three

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Speaker 3: hours a day. And uh, I remember walking seeing the

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Speaker 3: phone like, am I gonna be able to use phone? Yeah,

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Speaker 3: when it's your turn. So basically that one person out

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Speaker 3: an hour a day just in that little unit.

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Speaker 4: So they go down the l down the line.

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Speaker 3: So I remember just observing, like I'm asking questions.

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Speaker 4: People were like, oh, where are you from? You know,

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Speaker 4: asking those questions.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna guess that some of them are cooperator as well,

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Speaker 3: cause they're they're there, and it looks like they've been

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Speaker 3: there for a long time too, cause they're settled in in.

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Speaker 4: This ugly place.

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Speaker 3: The doors steel wire crisscross kind of a through their

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Speaker 3: seat through so and like you get privacy. They can

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Speaker 3: see right through your and it's just old. Everything's old.

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Speaker 7: And yes, the door on the shut it's so wired.

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Speaker 3: It's like a you know, it has a like almost

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Speaker 3: like a gate on it stealav.

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Speaker 4: And they it's separated. So they put my brother in one.

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Speaker 3: It's one bad one bunk and they put my brother

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Speaker 3: in one. They put me in the other. I remember

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Speaker 3: me and brother's like like Jay, like don't go to sleep.

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Speaker 3: So we uh the doors like here, and I basically

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Speaker 3: just sat down on the door and.

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Speaker 4: He sat down in the door. So you lean against

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Speaker 4: it against the door and we're just talking. We don't

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Speaker 4: have to talk a lot because you know, it's.

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Speaker 7: Open, you're right next to each of them, and just.

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Speaker 4: I remember it.

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Speaker 3: Just I was like, what did we do? And she's like,

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Speaker 3: you know, wondering about our family. That's gonna be like

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Speaker 3: the beginning of the stress of wondering.

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Speaker 4: Are they okay? I have the kids, okay, I wonder

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Speaker 4: what they're doing.

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Speaker 3: I want you know, I think anybody in prison always

224
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Speaker 3: thinks about those things at this very moment, you know.

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Speaker 4: And we didn't sleep. They bring breakfast like a fight

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Speaker 4: during in the morning. It was terrible. It was like

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Speaker 4: rits and who knows what we we didn't need.

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Speaker 3: I don't think me and my brother didn't eat, probably

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Speaker 3: for the next five days, and.

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Speaker 4: We would drink like water something or juice.

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Speaker 3: And I probably lost those first two weeks, probably lost

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Speaker 3: thirty pounds.

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Speaker 1: After a brief stay in Kenosha, Pete and Jay, now

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Speaker 1: under a different alias, were moved to the Metropolitan Correctional

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Speaker 1: Center in Chicago, sixty two miles away.

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Speaker 3: The team came first, and you know, they took us

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Speaker 3: to Chicago. It was a caravan, like a big caravan

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Speaker 3: of Marshalls. That's gonna be the normal from that point.

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Speaker 3: And they take me to together what you just.

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Speaker 4: It's me and my brother.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, together, we're like a a special hold where we

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Speaker 3: have a three men hold. So it said one lieutenant

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Speaker 3: and two officers every time we get moved, so that

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Speaker 3: mean that there's me and my brother. So at first

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Speaker 3: it was hard because they needed two lieutenants, you know,

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Speaker 3: four officers, and we're talking on a place that doesn't

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Speaker 3: have that many guards. So it didn't take long before

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Speaker 3: we couldn't start being o paining their asses. They take

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Speaker 3: us to use the training's office, put us in a

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Speaker 3: conference room, and that's why. Actually first for the first time,

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Speaker 3: I meet Thomas Shaksha, I meet Michael Ferar, who are

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Speaker 3: gonna be the lead. It was a training in the case.

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Speaker 3: I meet the agents that we've been speaking to. That's

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Speaker 3: Eric Doronte, who was the agent in charge of the case.

255
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Speaker 4: We meet Tim Janelli.

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Speaker 1: The twins were now face to face with the government

257
00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:11,360
Speaker 1: team behind the l Chapo case, the people who would

258
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Speaker 1: ultimately decide the twins' future. Sam Janelle was the first

259
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Speaker 1: agent Pete and Jay ever spoke to. If you remember,

260
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Speaker 1: it was back in that sixteen person shower that they

261
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Speaker 1: had in Mexico. Janelle worked alongside Eric Durante, the DA's

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Speaker 1: special agent assigned to the case, who had also been

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Speaker 1: working on it from the beginning. With them were the

264
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Speaker 1: assistant US attorneys, Michael Ferrara and Thomas Shakeshaft.

265
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Speaker 6: Shake Shaft was the lead prosecutor.

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Speaker 1: He first met Pete in that secret hotel room meeting

267
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Speaker 1: back in Mexico.

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Speaker 6: That started everything.

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Speaker 3: They're my attorneys there, they need us, probably talked for

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00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:57,360
Speaker 3: twenty minutes and then they're like, we need you to

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Speaker 3: continue on with this corporation.

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Speaker 4: We started working.

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Speaker 3: And going into a grand jury to in day chapel that.

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Speaker 4: Day, and me and my brother got it.

275
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Speaker 3: That's what they want from us, Like, that was our

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Speaker 3: bargaining to us, and that's.

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Speaker 4: The first thing that they want. Can they basically.

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Speaker 3: You know when they took our phones from us, what happened,

279
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Speaker 3: whether people were calling their phone and the ages are

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Speaker 3: there sending back messages pretending to be yeah, like basically

281
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Speaker 3: like oh listen, so and so been calling.

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Speaker 4: He said he needs twenty five keys.

283
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Speaker 1: Cooperating isn't what you might expect. It doesn't stop happening

284
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Speaker 1: just because you go to prison. At this point, the

285
00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,920
Speaker 1: twins had no idea that this would carry on for years,

286
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Speaker 1: and so the US government could put El Chapo behind bars.

287
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Speaker 6: For the first eight months, it.

288
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,639
Speaker 1: Was all day, every single day, calling and setting up

289
00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:08,360
Speaker 1: their customers and friends.

290
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Speaker 3: I do feel responsible for like making decisions for a

291
00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:16,400
Speaker 3: lot of people, like not just my family, I made

292
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Speaker 3: a decision for a lot of people that went to jail.

293
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Speaker 7: How many people went to jail because of what you did,

294
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Speaker 7: Like how many roughly.

295
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,160
Speaker 4: I want to sit in totally over one hundred people

296
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Speaker 4: for sure.

297
00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:34,680
Speaker 1: When they were finished for the day, they would head

298
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Speaker 1: back in a big convoy to mcc Chicago. MCC Chicago

299
00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:42,280
Speaker 1: is not what you might think a normal prison looks like.

300
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:47,080
Speaker 1: It's a skyscraper in the middle of the city. It's

301
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:50,600
Speaker 1: one big triangle designed that way to be easier to

302
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:54,240
Speaker 1: keep an eye on everyone. The roof of the giant

303
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:58,719
Speaker 1: triangle is used as the recreation yard. While you're shooting hoops,

304
00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:00,720
Speaker 1: you can kind of look out on the amazing views

305
00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:05,040
Speaker 1: of downtown Chicago. It's used as a holding prison for

306
00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,840
Speaker 1: those that have not yet been sentenced. Because of the

307
00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:11,640
Speaker 1: danger of what the twins were doing. They couldn't simply

308
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Speaker 1: be held with.

309
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Speaker 6: All the other prisoners.

310
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Speaker 1: They were a part of the WITSEC program, basically in

311
00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,840
Speaker 1: prison witness protection, which meant they had to be kept

312
00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:26,800
Speaker 1: in the SHU special housing unit known as the Shoe.

313
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Speaker 6: The shoe is a bit like solitary confinement.

314
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Speaker 1: Because they were helping the government, Pete and j were

315
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:37,600
Speaker 1: given a few special privileges. They were allowed to be

316
00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:39,960
Speaker 1: together in the shoe.

317
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Speaker 4: Walking to the shore, I was like, oh, of shit,

318
00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:49,320
Speaker 4: like this is this is prison?

319
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:49,760
Speaker 2: Like what.

320
00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:54,959
Speaker 3: There's like a little gay indigal bunch of self nor

321
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:58,040
Speaker 3: where it's like just hardway inter is a bunch of cells,

322
00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,040
Speaker 3: these weird it's like a triangle and they have two

323
00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:10,240
Speaker 3: sides and they take us to a back cell. It's

324
00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:13,760
Speaker 3: two bucks and like it's ugly dirty, you know, paint chripping.

325
00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:15,919
Speaker 3: It's so fucking cold.

326
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Speaker 8: You know.

327
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Speaker 3: It was the first time. I think I really like

328
00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,440
Speaker 3: took it in, like all the other things. So much

329
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:27,280
Speaker 3: going on. I remember they close chuckhold and we remember

330
00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:28,280
Speaker 3: stands the orange.

331
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Speaker 4: We just like look at each other. They're in shit

332
00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:37,760
Speaker 4: in there, like yo, what the fuck do we do now?

333
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:40,679
Speaker 3: We're getting anxious, like no communication. We haven't talked to

334
00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,800
Speaker 3: our family. I think our Lord told they're okay. They've

335
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:46,119
Speaker 3: been calling or something like that, but that wasn't good

336
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,919
Speaker 3: enough for us, Like, okay, what it was this I

337
00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:55,280
Speaker 3: wanna tell you, like this torture in us, like we

338
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:58,960
Speaker 3: f say, if we draws of bones or withdraws of

339
00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:02,760
Speaker 3: all are what we were used to for others. You're

340
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:05,400
Speaker 3: just now we're sitting in a fucking town. They were

341
00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:06,320
Speaker 3: nothing in there.

342
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Speaker 6: The life of a drug dealer is twenty four to seven.

343
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Speaker 1: And if you remember, Pete and j had fifty phones

344
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:17,880
Speaker 1: each constantly ringing. They were heavily involved in the day

345
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,160
Speaker 1: to day running of the business and made sure they

346
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:21,280
Speaker 1: never missed a phone call.

347
00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,400
Speaker 4: You know, it's scary to hear phones ringing when they're

348
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:33,840
Speaker 4: not ringing, could you hear? Yeah, I think, And you

349
00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:35,919
Speaker 4: know how messed up your brain.

350
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 6: Getting in the quiet of a prison cell.

351
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 1: Pete was still hearing phones ringing inside his head.

352
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:10,879
Speaker 3: The first night was like terrible, and it was a

353
00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 3: while before we even saw a guard, I think, and

354
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 3: they'll come just looking and we're just like sitting there

355
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 3: like like this fucking place is nasty. It was hard

356
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 3: that first nights, talking about it is freezing. We have

357
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:37,240
Speaker 3: no blanket, we have nothing, you know, we have like

358
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 3: a T shirt on, like a small T shirt and

359
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 3: just a jump shore and we're freezing. I'm talking about

360
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:46,840
Speaker 3: like shaky. It has to be like forty degrees and

361
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:52,320
Speaker 3: we're shaky. Night there's icicles on the wall. They shut

362
00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:55,919
Speaker 3: the lights off at ten o'clock and I remember you

363
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,840
Speaker 3: could see the roaches come out, just shining.

364
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:06,640
Speaker 4: Roaches or where they came early for us.

365
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:11,600
Speaker 3: The next day turned six, there's the marshals come for us,

366
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:14,560
Speaker 3: and they.

367
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,080
Speaker 4: Put it like you know, we go through the process.

368
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 3: It will be like quite a few marshals and they'll

369
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 3: they'll pick us up in like a bult of cud,

370
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 3: take us down the back to the federal building.

371
00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:26,879
Speaker 4: And that was kind of became a routine.

372
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:32,200
Speaker 1: So you basically we're in the shoe and then they

373
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,840
Speaker 1: transported you down the road to the federal building to.

374
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 3: The federal building where we'd go and they start off

375
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 3: like at a conference room or you know, an office

376
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 3: and then they take you back to.

377
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:50,439
Speaker 10: Yeah, it will bring the laptop for us to like

378
00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:56,840
Speaker 10: review whatever document, whatever the case is, and you have

379
00:23:56,880 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 10: the battup.

380
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 11: Then they end up starting to stop something. I was

381
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,560
Speaker 11: like doing something else to use to try allegiance I

382
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:05,440
Speaker 11: have a look. I've seen that they had windows open

383
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 11: in the computer and I hit the window.

384
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 4: You don't want me to say that story? What's woman?

385
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 1: Don't forget Pete and j haven't seen each other much

386
00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 1: since they were in prison together, so there's occasionally some

387
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,840
Speaker 1: brotherly tension in the room. Some of this stuff is

388
00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:25,600
Speaker 1: being spoken about between them for the very first time.

389
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 1: It's Jay's wife file that you can hear in the background.

390
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 4: I mean, you could story what I was saying. You

391
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,960
Speaker 4: went to the funding agents fucking for pure and hit window. Legion.

392
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 12: You don't want to go be like, oh, you're manipulating

393
00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 12: the age you said in this fucking interview.

394
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 4: Don't say that, but.

395
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 2: Say a word.

396
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 4: Computer I did.

397
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 12: It's not for you to go through that's the crime.

398
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 12: Come on, man, Yeah, it's part of the story. Is

399
00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 12: that seeing that parts not important? Okay, I'm just saying that.

400
00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 12: You don't want to open a cain of words over it.

401
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 11: So yeah, you really were saying here talking about tons

402
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:05,240
Speaker 11: of drugs and that's gonna be all that's the issue.

403
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,879
Speaker 10: Oh yeah, hold on, let's go viborated that on.

404
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:10,440
Speaker 7: Tell us what you saw.

405
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,160
Speaker 13: You can open up issue part issue just one day

406
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 13: you're going to a federal government ages for Windows computerity

407
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:19,800
Speaker 13: that you're staking around it.

408
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,960
Speaker 12: You could have changed information about something not but before

409
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:25,920
Speaker 12: it doesn't sit well, like I don't know you understand,

410
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 12: I just chilling, just said, did.

411
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 4: You basically see all the all the it's just information

412
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 4: where it would tasty.

413
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 7: It sounds like when you've been no it was your.

414
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:42,160
Speaker 13: Personal Please, they no right to a personal feeling, saying

415
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 13: now you they had personal themes that they will be

416
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 13: writing messages to each other email emails and saying he's

417
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:49,440
Speaker 13: fucking insulting.

418
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 11: Yeah, if he's saying the agent and they're prosecute.

419
00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:57,400
Speaker 1: The brothers didn't want to go into any more detail

420
00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:00,159
Speaker 1: on the record, so I stopped the tape and we

421
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:03,080
Speaker 1: took a short break. We picked up the story with

422
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 1: the twins back in the conference room cooperating with the

423
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:07,120
Speaker 1: agents in Chicago.

424
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:10,679
Speaker 4: It was the second day when when we had like

425
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:11,119
Speaker 4: a break.

426
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:16,040
Speaker 3: I remember the use attorney he said, so, I know, guys,

427
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 3: like you know, up to this point, you know, you

428
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,919
Speaker 3: guys seemed like you guys are all right guys, and

429
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,720
Speaker 3: you know, over the time we've been talking a lot

430
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,360
Speaker 3: and being familiar with each other like you could.

431
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:32,440
Speaker 4: Feel it, but not everyone in this office feels that way.

432
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 3: And I was like, huh, you're gonna, you know, we're

433
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 3: gonna introduce you to some agents that I don't really like.

434
00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 3: You guys, so you know, just be patient and just

435
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:49,600
Speaker 3: like you know, they might be a little bit hard.

436
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 4: And I remember that's when I first started.

437
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 14: Just like.

438
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:54,360
Speaker 4: Hard what.

439
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 3: Basically giving me a warning like they might not be nice.

440
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 3: I'm get a ship, it's already bothered me.

441
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 4: Here comes six.

442
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:14,399
Speaker 3: Seven ages walking in there, and I could see that

443
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 3: they're they don't seem cool, they don't seem nice, I

444
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 3: could see. And I guess they were mad at the

445
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 3: case because they were people that were, you know, the

446
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 3: time when I was cooperating, they're you know, they're doing investigation.

447
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 4: They felt like it should have been their case.

448
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 3: And you know, different ages got the case.

449
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 4: I understand.

450
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:37,320
Speaker 3: I said, you guys have been like after us for

451
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 3: a long time, right, kind of made a joke out

452
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 3: of there, and now we're here, right, so I know

453
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,159
Speaker 3: you guys have like you guys could be upset, but

454
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 3: you guys, you know, for a.

455
00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:54,600
Speaker 4: Long time, you know, we were winning, but now you

456
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 4: got us.

457
00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,679
Speaker 3: You won we're here, We're here, We're gonna help you

458
00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 3: in you know, however we could help you. We're going

459
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:05,119
Speaker 3: to help you and just leave any personal shites to

460
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,399
Speaker 3: the side or whatever. They kind of just nodded their

461
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,199
Speaker 3: head in and then that's when I think we spoke

462
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:14,879
Speaker 3: up by said I'm going to help you guys.

463
00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:18,160
Speaker 4: And now that we are just well, am I going

464
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 4: to ask for one deep?

465
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 9: Like?

466
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:26,240
Speaker 4: What's that? I said? Saoul Rodriguez?

467
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:34,160
Speaker 1: Yes, that Saul, remember the one that kidnapped Pete in Chicago,

468
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 1: Pete's first kidnapping. Saoul Rodriguez pretended to be a cop

469
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,720
Speaker 1: and took Pete into a basement where the floor was

470
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 1: covered with plastic and there was that random parrot.

471
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 3: When they just smiled, So roduis kidnapped? You kidnapped my brother.

472
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 1: At the time, the brothers didn't retaliate against Seoul for

473
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:01,520
Speaker 1: kidnapping Pete, but they were finally able to get their revenge.

474
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,080
Speaker 1: Saul was one person they were more than happy to

475
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: turn into the government.

476
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 3: And he has a file on his hand and he

477
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 3: just started freaking up pictures and my brother was able

478
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 3: to identify everyone in the pictures, and that kind of

479
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 3: just like I think can change their views a little bit.

480
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 3: But it's gonna be like, this is gonna be a routine,

481
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 3: you know, it's gonna go on for the next seven months.

482
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 7: So for seven months you did that. What was it like?

483
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 4: It wasn't easy.

484
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 3: We had up and downs, you know, you know, and

485
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 3: every day it was like it was just a reminder

486
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,720
Speaker 3: of like we're doing this, Like why are we doing this?

487
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 3: How did we get here? And there was a lot

488
00:29:56,200 --> 00:30:03,320
Speaker 3: of questions about our future every day probably and everything

489
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 3: going on with our families. Don't forget they're picked up

490
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 3: and you had to start all over and all these

491
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 3: things going on.

492
00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: The tearful goodbye back in Mexico was the last time

493
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 1: Pete and j had seen their families. All they knew

494
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 1: was that they'd crossed the border into the US safely.

495
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: While Pete and j were sat in a conference room

496
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 1: in Chicago, Val and Pete's wife viv were stranded at

497
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 1: the border with the rest of the family.

498
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 6: They didn't know where their husbands were being held.

499
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 1: The responsibility of what to do next and where to

500
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 1: go fell on VAL's shoulders.

501
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 9: We stood there hours at the border. Hours.

502
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 4: It was already morning time.

503
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 7: It's like, where are we going?

504
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 9: Were going to Chicago, and I'm like, we're just gonna

505
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:11,640
Speaker 9: keep going. So she just looked like and it was

506
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 9: just like emotionally drained. She looked exhausted, she looked tired.

507
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 9: And I was like, we're just we're not gonna stop

508
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 9: work and keep going. And then we kept driving, and

509
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 9: I remember we hit I think it was San Antonio

510
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 9: and San Antonio in Texas. Yeah, we hit San Antonio.

511
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 9: Now our phones don't work because all of our phones

512
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 9: are from Mexico and there's no phone service. And I

513
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 9: remember we went to a hotel. We check in, and

514
00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 9: I remember I said my nephews to go with the phones.

515
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 9: They come back. I start calling the attorneys. I start calling,

516
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 9: like we're here, We're in the US.

517
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 4: Where's J M P.

518
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 9: They're like, we don't know. I'm like, where are they

519
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:33,960
Speaker 9: take Where are they taking it? I'm assuming they're gonna

520
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 9: come either to Milwaukee or to Chicago. And I'm like,

521
00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 9: so what do I do if I go to Chicago?

522
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:50,920
Speaker 9: And he's like, I don't think it's a good idea

523
00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 9: that you guys come. And I'm like, if that's where

524
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 9: they're taking a husband, that's where we're going. He's like,

525
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 9: I don't think you guys should be nowhere near Chicago.

526
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 9: But I'm like, I'm sorry, but that's exactly where we're going.

527
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 7: That's why you knew as well, right.

528
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:16,480
Speaker 9: Yeah, it's I mean, we didn't have a plan. We

529
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,680
Speaker 9: didn't know what where to go, or we didn't even

530
00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 9: think about, like what do we do when we need

531
00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 9: back to go? We weren't ready to go, so I

532
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,640
Speaker 9: got in the cars and we'd throw straight there.

533
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 7: We don't stop.

534
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:44,400
Speaker 15: When we were in Chicago, we went straight to a

535
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 15: hotel called the Attorney, and then a few agents from

536
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 15: Witness Protection came out to speak to me and Fez

537
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 15: and basically told us that they wanted our family to

538
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:03,400
Speaker 15: go into the program and that we wouldn't be able

539
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 15: to speak to our husbands until their release.

540
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,840
Speaker 9: Whenever that was released from prison.

541
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 7: Yeah, so we could have been talking at that point.

542
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,200
Speaker 7: You've got no idea exactly.

543
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,000
Speaker 6: When the twins turned themselves into the US authorities.

544
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,280
Speaker 1: No one had any idea how long they would ultimately

545
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,800
Speaker 1: spend in prison. It would end up being years before

546
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 1: they'd be sentenced, and despite their cooperation, the possibility of

547
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:36,000
Speaker 1: spending decades behind bars was still on the table.

548
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 6: Entering the witness protection program.

549
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: That was offered to them by the government meant the

550
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 1: family would be split up. Val and Viv wouldn't be

551
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: able to speak to or visit their husbands until the

552
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,280
Speaker 1: day they were released from prison.

553
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 15: They even said that me and Viv couldn't even be together,

554
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:55,920
Speaker 15: our kids couldn't be together.

555
00:34:57,800 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 9: She had got at one part of the country. I

556
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:00,279
Speaker 9: had got another part.

557
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:01,839
Speaker 4: Of the country, no communication, no.

558
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 15: Communication with us, with our families, with their husbands, with anyone,

559
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 15: with no one, no one, our parents, no one.

560
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 9: I said, I'm gonna speak for me and Viv, and

561
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 9: I said, we'd just absolutely not. We will not be

562
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 9: going into the program. She put fear in us.

563
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 15: I know that she told us that they were there

564
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:27,400
Speaker 15: to help us, and that there's no way we could be,

565
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 15: you know, on our own, especially with their husbands cooperating

566
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 15: with their cooperation, and we weren't safe in Chicago.

567
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:39,520
Speaker 9: That if we weren't.

568
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:41,160
Speaker 15: Gonna go into the program, that we should leave the state.

569
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:46,919
Speaker 15: You shouldn't even be in Illinois. And we're like, where

570
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:49,399
Speaker 15: do we go. She's like, the only way we can

571
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 15: help you is if you enter a witness protection if not,

572
00:35:52,040 --> 00:36:00,080
Speaker 15: we can't assist you in any way. And we're like, okay,

573
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:03,000
Speaker 15: I just kind of went started going by the attorneys

574
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 15: what they were telling me to do, and the attorneys

575
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 15: they hired twenty four hour security for our men. Two

576
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:22,480
Speaker 15: SUV's blacked out and they start in front of the

577
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 15: house twenty four to seven.

578
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 7: In Chicago. Yeah, to that point, you got a house.

579
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 15: Yeah, we went there, and then that they slept there.

580
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:37,760
Speaker 15: They were there twenty four to seven.

581
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:44,200
Speaker 1: The decision not to enter the government's witness protection program

582
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: so they could stay together meant.

583
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,240
Speaker 6: The family were completely on their own.

584
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 1: Val Viv and the kids moved into one big house

585
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 1: in Chicago where they could have the protection of around

586
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 1: the clock private security team.

587
00:36:58,040 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 6: Across town.

588
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:01,520
Speaker 1: J and P were also under around the clock protection,

589
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 1: but they weren't in a big house. They were in

590
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:07,760
Speaker 1: a tiny cell in the shoe, no bigger than a cupboard,

591
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:09,760
Speaker 1: under twenty four hour lockdown.

592
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 3: For the first few months, it was straight locked. I

593
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 3: couldn't even get a shower. I don't think we took

594
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 3: a shower for three weeks. They just they didn't have

595
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 3: the manpower. We didn't take a shower for three weeks.

596
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:26,239
Speaker 3: It got to a point something where like we would

597
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 3: be so embarrassed where we stunk. So that was our

598
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:36,399
Speaker 3: first real los sting of the shoe, just wondering where

599
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 3: I was living. I was she okay with my rest

600
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 3: of my family. I think we didn't have not one word.

601
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,759
Speaker 3: We didn't hear nothing from them, Like I couldn't even

602
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:51,120
Speaker 3: tell her where I was at. I can't tell you

603
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:56,240
Speaker 3: how miserable that was. Oh, I had my first major

604
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,959
Speaker 3: panic attacke. I was like para life I couldn't bring

605
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 3: and I felt like I wanted to cry and scream

606
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 3: and weird at the same time where I couldn't Just

607
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 3: you know, remember the first day night in prison and

608
00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 3: tell my brother, please on fall asleep, man, talk to me,

609
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 3: like take please, don't fall asleep, bro, like stay up,

610
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:20,960
Speaker 3: talk to me because I'm not like I'm going crazy.

611
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:24,760
Speaker 7: Did you get quite a lot with panic attacks in prison?

612
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:30,359
Speaker 4: I had my share, but nothing like those, Nothing like those.

613
00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 4: I could tell you.

614
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:34,919
Speaker 7: Yeah, the first one the first time, and for.

615
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,359
Speaker 3: Some reason, it was weird because it made me think

616
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 3: that your body, the beautiful thing about your mind and body,

617
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:49,759
Speaker 3: that a panic attack usually followed some peace. I don't

618
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:53,640
Speaker 3: know it felt like afterwards, you know, I cried, got

619
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 3: back to know and then I kind of felt like okay,

620
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 3: and it felt like like almost like a release of

621
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,799
Speaker 3: emotions and that, and there was like a soothing little

622
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:11,520
Speaker 3: face set like a self soothing for a little while.

623
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 3: And all these things are like, well, how are you

624
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:18,280
Speaker 3: supposed to feel.

625
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 4: When you're going through that?

626
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,800
Speaker 3: Like, I don't care if you If I am guilty

627
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 3: of those crimes, that doesn't mean I don't feel these things.

628
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 4: They're normal, real human emotions.

629
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 3: If someone doesn't feel sad to be going through something

630
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:34,239
Speaker 3: like that, there's something wrong with them. If you don't,

631
00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:36,439
Speaker 3: you know, if it doesn't hurt you to be apart

632
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:39,080
Speaker 3: from your family, see your babies crying for you, see

633
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:46,200
Speaker 3: your mother cry for you, do something wrong with you.

634
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 3: You know, you're not scared to spend the rest of

635
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:51,759
Speaker 3: your life in prison. You haven't done any real time

636
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 3: in prison. If you're in prison for two years or

637
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:01,239
Speaker 3: a year three months, that's nothing compared to the reality

638
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 3: of fighting for your life. It literally felt like I

639
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 3: had a life sentence. I was trying to fight off,

640
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:13,279
Speaker 3: you know, which I was.

641
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:34,880
Speaker 4: I couldn't see my family.

642
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 3: I would get like a phone call here and there,

643
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 3: and my brother and I were like pissed off, like, look,

644
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 3: man nowhere proffering or debriefing whatever. But I wanted to say,

645
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:48,799
Speaker 3: right as every other person, I want to be able to.

646
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:49,440
Speaker 4: See my family.

647
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:52,840
Speaker 3: And it was like a humongous headache for them because

648
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:54,080
Speaker 3: of the security issues.

649
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 9: Finally we're able to see our husband after three weeks.

650
00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:03,440
Speaker 15: We had to go like under a like an underground

651
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 15: tunnel into the US Attorneys into the federal building, and

652
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:11,920
Speaker 15: then they took us up the back elevators to the

653
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 15: offices and that's where we saw Jay and Peter for

654
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:17,520
Speaker 15: the first time.

655
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:19,200
Speaker 9: We had the kids with us.

656
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 4: Do you remember that day we were in that office. Yeah.

657
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:26,760
Speaker 4: I didn't expect to see them.

658
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 3: I remember the door open, like the office door opened,

659
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:32,920
Speaker 3: and I was able to plans down the.

660
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 4: Hallway and I seen her like standing right there.

661
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 9: Yeah, and we walked in and I remember my son

662
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 9: just ran Patty. He's just like honey, crying.

663
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 4: Like everything.

664
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:49,760
Speaker 9: We were all crying again.

665
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:50,320
Speaker 4: Of course.

666
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 9: It was just so emotional and just looking at j

667
00:41:56,520 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 9: and p and they were like just small, they were skinny,

668
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:01,040
Speaker 9: they were.

669
00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:04,400
Speaker 4: I'm sorry you got to smell. I'm sorry.

670
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:08,000
Speaker 9: Smile. I took a shower for three weeks, like it's okay,

671
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:09,840
Speaker 9: you don't smile, you keep.

672
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 7: Your head up.

673
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 9: I kept lifting his chin up like you're look handsome.

674
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 9: I'm like, don't do that, keep your head up. And

675
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:25,879
Speaker 9: he's like, okay, mess you. We love. It's just west

676
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 9: like so many things like we're fine, we're safe, we're okay,

677
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:30,760
Speaker 9: we're okay.

678
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,480
Speaker 3: It was like I wanted to ask questions, but it

679
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:34,919
Speaker 3: was more like we didn't.

680
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 9: In that moment, we didn't talk about what he went through.

681
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:43,479
Speaker 9: We didn't talk about what I went through he went through.

682
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,640
Speaker 9: It was just about our kids, you know, if we're

683
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 9: okay and we were safe, and that was it.

684
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 4: It was I was like vocals, like the biggest he

685
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:56,440
Speaker 4: was okay if.

686
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 9: If he was eating, He's like, now that we're here

687
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:02,880
Speaker 9: in the offices, when they bring us, they bring us

688
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 9: food or whatever they're eating, we eat and we're like,

689
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 9: why can't you take a shower? It was just like

690
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:12,040
Speaker 9: it's so weird, like how do you get here? Like

691
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 9: aren't you like across the street because they have like

692
00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 9: the MCC, the Metropolitan Correctional Center. He's like they move

693
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 9: us and like these like bulletproof suburbans, and like with

694
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:28,880
Speaker 9: all these marshals and not much change, right, And it

695
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:30,759
Speaker 9: was when Obama.

696
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 3: Was Obama and had just won the election and he

697
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 3: had I guess they had his office was in the

698
00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 3: Federal Building, right, they have an office there. And what

699
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:45,240
Speaker 3: happened was that I guess they had the Secret Service.

700
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 3: The Secret Service would sometimes be there and you know,

701
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:54,960
Speaker 3: the marshals, and it would be those like they're protecting us,

702
00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:57,319
Speaker 3: and it would be like elevators like hold on, hold on,

703
00:43:57,400 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 3: Like it.

704
00:43:57,960 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 4: Was like always a problem.

705
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:03,640
Speaker 3: At the same time, Lukovich, the Illinois governor, had just

706
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 3: been indicted, so it was like always on media frenzy

707
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:10,080
Speaker 3: out there and we'd be in these you know, I

708
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 3: guess you know Obama's security detour or us.

709
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 4: It kind of was like they couldn't tell what was what.

710
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,360
Speaker 15: Right to them, media was obviously saying that J and

711
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:23,239
Speaker 15: P was like that was Obama. They were taking him

712
00:44:23,280 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 15: and moving him around the city, and it was.

713
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:32,320
Speaker 9: You two, yeah, yeah.

714
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 7: So how long were you there for?

715
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:32,520
Speaker 4: Then?

716
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 7: Seven months?

717
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 4: Yeah.

718
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:39,719
Speaker 1: If you were in Chicago in late two thousand and

719
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:43,480
Speaker 1: eight and thought you saw Obama's motorcade, chances are it

720
00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:48,120
Speaker 1: was probably the Flores twins cooperating meant so much more

721
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 1: than the one phone called Pete recorded on the phone

722
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:55,919
Speaker 1: to l Chapo. The daily motorcade continued every single day

723
00:44:56,120 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 1: for another seven months. The twins were finally allowed to

724
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:06,440
Speaker 1: see their family, but there was one person who wouldn't

725
00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:10,319
Speaker 1: visit them, their father. Pete and Jay were able to

726
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:12,359
Speaker 1: get the government to give him a visa to live

727
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 1: in the United States for his own protection. The government

728
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,239
Speaker 1: felt it would be too dangerous for him to live

729
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 1: in Mexico because of what the twins had done, but their.

730
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 6: Father felt otherwise. He wanted his life in his homeland

731
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:27,320
Speaker 6: of Mexico.

732
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: He headed to the bus station to get on a

733
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:31,920
Speaker 1: bus to cross the Mexican border.

734
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:35,799
Speaker 6: Val tried to stop him getting on the bus. It

735
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:36,440
Speaker 6: didn't work.

736
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:40,960
Speaker 1: In the midst of their daily cooperation, the twins received

737
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:47,200
Speaker 1: some awful news. Within days of their father, Margarito Floris Senior,

738
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:51,920
Speaker 1: arriving in Mexico, he was kidnapped and was never seen again.

739
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 1: All that was left was his burnt out car and

740
00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:59,840
Speaker 1: a note that said, tell those fuckers to shut.

741
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:01,560
Speaker 6: Up, or will send you his head.

742
00:46:03,239 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 1: The last time Pete and j had seen their father

743
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:08,920
Speaker 1: was back in Mexico when they told him they've been

744
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:13,280
Speaker 1: cooperating with the US government, the very thing he'd always

745
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:16,799
Speaker 1: told them never to do. He called them cowards and

746
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 1: told them they weren't his sons.

747
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:23,640
Speaker 7: How did you feel when you found out that he'd.

748
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:31,719
Speaker 4: Died there.

749
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 3: I don't think that, even to this day, that I've

750
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 3: been able to like really like take it on you

751
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:42,759
Speaker 3: put in the back of my mind at turns, because.

752
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:46,040
Speaker 4: I guess just not.

753
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 3: Facials were continue to face those feelings of guilt.

754
00:46:54,080 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 14: You know, when I see my mom, I can see

755
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:10,799
Speaker 14: her loaning as I feel even worse, but like moving forward, like.

756
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:10,960
Speaker 4: Like all those things he felt like.

757
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:16,400
Speaker 3: I wish I had, like the story, I feel like

758
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:18,400
Speaker 3: to be able to tunnel like that I did the

759
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 3: right thing, you know.

760
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 4: But he told me, like.

761
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:28,920
Speaker 3: His eyes were like, don't trust the government. Don't they're

762
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,760
Speaker 3: gonna usual throw you away.

763
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:34,720
Speaker 4: And he said, and these people are never gonna forget

764
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:35,800
Speaker 4: what you did.

765
00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:41,360
Speaker 3: And I had the idea to think that, you know,

766
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:46,239
Speaker 3: like that you're wrong, you know, and the situation I'm

767
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 3: in today doesn't feel like he was wrong. You know,

768
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 3: he's taking someone outside ranch. They found his vehicle and.

769
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:06,440
Speaker 4: Yeah, mm hmm.

770
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 8: That was it. That was a threat. And to me

771
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 8: it was like a threat, you know, but a threat,

772
00:48:16,680 --> 00:48:21,799
Speaker 8: asked me, you know, it wasn't It was more of a.

773
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 4: Statement right for him. Mm hmmm.

774
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:37,640
Speaker 8: I don't think it's ten from what it was. But

775
00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:41,520
Speaker 8: I guess we understand. I knew one person it was

776
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 8: a cartle.

777
00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 4: Chapel m. Yeah, for sure.

778
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 8: I don't recall it the exact words, but I know

779
00:48:57,680 --> 00:48:59,720
Speaker 8: it was something about us talking.

780
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 4: I was called prayer.

781
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 7: So you're angry, You're angry that what they did.

782
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:24,840
Speaker 4: No, I'm not angry. I think I blame myself.

783
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 8: I blame myself like or I take responsibility for it

784
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 8: as I have, you know, incoing present for my actions.

785
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:39,800
Speaker 8: And I think that was a consequence of my actions.

786
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 8: I think that we like try to like just put

787
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:50,400
Speaker 8: on this face. And I think it was the situation

788
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:53,840
Speaker 8: where in the and I try to remember, I remember

789
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:55,000
Speaker 8: sitting there thinking.

790
00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 3: If this is what happened because of this, then I

791
00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:02,880
Speaker 3: wouldn't make this work there like I'm not gonna like

792
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,440
Speaker 3: come here and just start, you know, second guessing.

793
00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 4: It's like.

794
00:50:10,440 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 3: We're gonna stand for something that's meaningful to hours in

795
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 3: the stuff from Pintro. I Still here, We're still going.

796
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 1: Surviving El Chapo, The Twins Who Brought Down a Drug Lord.

797
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 1: Season two is hosted by Curtis fifty cent Jackson and

798
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:41,040
Speaker 1: me Charlie Webster, produced by myself and Jackson mcclennan, Assistant

799
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 1: producer and research support by Katie Hurtz. Edit and sound

800
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 1: designed by Nico Polella. Theme music and original score by

801
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 1: Ryan Sorenson. It's executive produced by Curtis fifty.

802
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:56,520
Speaker 6: Cent Jackson and Me Charlie Webster.

803
00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:00,719
Speaker 1: Curtis fifty cent Jackson presents a lions It Sound, a

804
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:04,759
Speaker 1: G unit audio production exclusively for IHET Podcasts.

805
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:06,680
Speaker 8: H