1 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from how Stuff 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: Works dot Com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 3 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 1: My name is Robert Lamp and I'm Julie Douglas. Julie, 4 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:21,800 Speaker 1: do you ever feel nostalgia creeping into your mind? I do? Yeah, 5 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: What do you What do you get nostalgic for? Well, 6 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:26,799 Speaker 1: you know, every time I hear like the tinny streams 7 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 1: of an old twenties tune, I start feeling like I 8 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: need to do that Charleston remember the days back where 9 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 1: there were talkies. No talkies ruined everything. Oh but I mean, 10 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:40,559 Speaker 1: I mean, it's entirely possible that you could feel nostalgic 11 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 1: for that, say, if you were old, if you were 12 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: introduced to a lot of say old timey movies when 13 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 1: you were younger, you could You're nostalgia could conceivably sort of, um, 14 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:51,240 Speaker 1: skip back through time, and you could have sort of 15 00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 1: an artificial nostalgia of the time from before you existed. 16 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: I do have an affinity for that time period. But 17 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 1: I will say that having a kid, I definitely have 18 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 1: experien areous nostalgia more deeply than I probably have ever 19 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:07,040 Speaker 1: in my life. Because you're you're you're observing the child 20 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: at a certain age, and you're thinking back on your 21 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: own existence at that time, just because time seems to 22 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: pass so quickly and there's so many beautiful moments. And 23 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: then there's this idea actually we're sort of defining nostalgia 24 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 1: right now, but it's that idea that you have a 25 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 1: resurrection of a memory or a feeling that carries with 26 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 1: it sort of a bitter sweet feeling because you know 27 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: that time has passed and you can never retrieve that 28 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:32,199 Speaker 1: moment again, and it was a beautiful moment, right. Yeah. 29 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 1: As a lot of people point out, in nostalgia tends 30 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: to hit you in a way where it it feels 31 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,400 Speaker 1: it feels a little good, but not like whoa amazing, 32 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: It feels a little sad, but not in a like 33 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: a deeply depressive way. It's kind of this ambiguous, overall 34 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 1: positive feeling, but it's it's it's kind of all over 35 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 1: the place, you know. Like, I'll I found myself experiencing nostalgia. Um, 36 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 1: probably a lot more recently, and uh and I'll and 37 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 1: we'll talk about that as we we go here, but 38 00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 1: like I'll find myself like thinking back to music that 39 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: I listened to when I was in high school, Like, 40 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:11,519 Speaker 1: I find myself re exploring Tool albums and I still 41 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: like Tool to this day, but I was really into 42 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: them back in back in high school, back around the 43 00:02:15,480 --> 00:02:18,720 Speaker 1: time Annuma came out, and uh. And so I'm listening 44 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 1: to that, I'm feeling and I'm enjoying the songs, and 45 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: I'm feeling nostalgia and I'm thinking about uh, reading Lovecraft 46 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: for the first time and discovering this music and and 47 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 1: so on one hand, it's like a celebration of these 48 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 1: things that I still love. I still love Lovecraft, I 49 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 1: still love this music. But then I'm also thinking it 50 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 1: also makes me think or even subconsciously go back to 51 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: that time and uh. And it's weird because on one hand, 52 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: it's like I don't really wish I was a high 53 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:46,840 Speaker 1: schooler again, Like that was a weird time and there 54 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 1: are so many things were out of place and uh, 55 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 1: and and yet there's something in me that's kind of 56 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 1: reaching back there or something from the past feels like 57 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 1: it's it's it's phantom limbs or are coming after me 58 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: in the present. Well, we're gonna it to that, We're 59 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 1: gonna get to this idea that this this idea of 60 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:06,239 Speaker 1: first and in nostalgia, because they seem to be pretty 61 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: well connected and perhaps the reason why we continue to 62 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: dwell in this realm of nostalgia. John Tyrny, writing for 63 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:16,359 Speaker 1: The New York Times, says that most people report experiencing 64 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:20,079 Speaker 1: nostalgia at least once a week, and nearly half experience 65 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:23,519 Speaker 1: at three or four times a week. Um Erica Hepper, 66 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:25,960 Speaker 1: she's a psychologist at the University of Surrey and England, 67 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 1: found that nostalgia levels tend to be high among young adults. 68 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 1: This is really interesting too will get into this and 69 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: then dip in middle age and rise again during old age, 70 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 1: and that nostalgia begins as early as age seven. Well, 71 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,280 Speaker 1: what do you have to nostalgic about an age seven? 72 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 1: You do, because I think that you have this awareness 73 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 1: that you're getting older. You're like, oh, man, I was 74 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,160 Speaker 1: just thinking the other day about poop and my pants 75 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: and it was like, well, you know, like even uh, 76 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: my four year old will sometimes say I don't want 77 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 1: to I don't want to get older. I don't want 78 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:01,640 Speaker 1: to grow up. Because she has the sense that she's 79 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:06,720 Speaker 1: moving beyond time and she's moving beyond phases and that 80 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: there are other things in front of her. So it 81 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 1: doesn't surprise me that it's as young as seven that 82 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 1: kids start to look back and pine for some sort 83 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 1: of warm and cozy memory. You know. It's it's interesting 84 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:20,960 Speaker 1: that we are talking about in nostalgia after just recording 85 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 1: an episode on the Oral boris the world consuming serpent, 86 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:27,520 Speaker 1: the eternity snake, uh, the eternity dragon, because that is 87 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 1: a creature that is curving around and consuming its beginnings 88 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: and in and in doing so, creating this the cyclical 89 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,480 Speaker 1: nature of itself. And in a sense, nostalgia is that 90 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:42,880 Speaker 1: we are reaching back into the past and feasting on 91 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,720 Speaker 1: our beginnings and it seems to uh to fill us 92 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: with us with some sort of energy. Well, and we're 93 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:50,839 Speaker 1: recycling our memories. That's interesting because I was thinking about 94 00:04:50,920 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: this in terms of materialism like that when this is 95 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 1: one of the reasons I think that nostalgia has taken 96 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: such a hold in the United States, at least in 97 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 1: the US fifty years or something. You never since Coke 98 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: started serving up this idea of Santa Claus and all 99 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: these sort of classic warm memories post World War two, 100 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: because that's that's a way that you can easily access 101 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 1: that nostalgia, right, the music, it could be merchandise. And 102 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:18,840 Speaker 1: I was starting to think about how, in some ways 103 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 1: our existence for each of us, it's almost like we're 104 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 1: living on a movie lot and we just kind of 105 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: roll in all these props that kind of make us 106 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:30,799 Speaker 1: feel more connected to whatever it was or is important 107 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: to us in our lives. And a lot of that 108 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:34,720 Speaker 1: has to do with nostalgia. Yeah, certainly. I mean, like 109 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:37,840 Speaker 1: you said, the advertisements constantly changing the culture, at least 110 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: the visuals of it and to us, and also the 111 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:43,720 Speaker 1: technology of it constantly changing, and and therefore we have 112 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:49,520 Speaker 1: all of these obtainable physical, uh and or visual symbols 113 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: that we can call to to to feed that nostalgic 114 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: hunger in us. Yeah. I was thinking about the new 115 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:59,279 Speaker 1: iPhone commercial. Have you seen this? It's basically just people 116 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 1: hanging out with their phones and going through um old 117 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 1: texts or conversations or um pictures and feeling nostalgic. And 118 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 1: I thought, well, this is interesting because they've they've taken 119 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:16,240 Speaker 1: this phone and sort of made it a stand in 120 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:20,120 Speaker 1: for the repository of your memories or nostalgia and connected 121 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: it that way. It sounds like a horrifying episode of 122 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:27,280 Speaker 1: Black Mirror. It's it's supposed to be poignant, Well, it 123 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 1: sounds dark. Um. In fact, you might even say that 124 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: it sounds a little sick, and you would You wouldn't 125 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: be the first person to think that nostalgia sounds a 126 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: little bit like some variant of mental illness. So yeah, 127 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 1: I didn't realize this until I started doing research that 128 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: nostalgia was actually considered a psychiastric disorder at one time. 129 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:48,520 Speaker 1: According to Dr Clay Rutledge writing for Scientific American, there's 130 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 1: a Swiss physician named Johannes Hoefer who coined the term 131 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:57,039 Speaker 1: nostalgia in to describe what he considered a cerebral disease 132 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 1: you need to Swiss mercenaries fighting wars far from home. 133 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:06,159 Speaker 1: He thought that nostalgia caused anxiety, insomnia, irregular heartbeat, and 134 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 1: disordered eating. And he also thought it was caused by 135 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 1: continuous vibrations of animal spirits through fibers in the middle brain. Yeah, 136 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 1: and it was like this big mystery. I mean, people 137 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:18,560 Speaker 1: were like, oh, this this nostalogy. You've gotta be careful here. 138 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 1: Let's let's not play in ay these tunes because our 139 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: soldiers are going to go into a deep depression or 140 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: find what's the matter with these guys. Something must be 141 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 1: wrong that they're not enjoying fighting this war and risking 142 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,040 Speaker 1: life and death far away from home. Why did they 143 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: keep getting all sentimental about a simpler time back in 144 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: a place that they know and loved. Yes, sick, this 145 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: was this is really interesting. This is New York Times 146 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 1: article UM called nostalgia? What is it good for? It 147 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 1: says that military physicians thought that it had to do 148 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 1: with the soldiers ear drums and brain cells being damaged 149 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:54,239 Speaker 1: by the unremitting clanging of cow bells in the Alps. 150 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: So it was you know, obviously this was not a 151 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 1: well studied area. UM. I like to imagine the study 152 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 1: that might have happened, though, where you have two test groups, 153 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: one exposed to alpine cow bells and the other not. Right, 154 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: I know, So was it the cow bells? No, it's 155 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,880 Speaker 1: not at all. Um in this persisted this idea really 156 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: into the twentieth century and professor of history at Weber 157 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:21,119 Speaker 1: State University, her name is Susan J. Matt. She said 158 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,440 Speaker 1: that this disease of nostalgia was known about in the 159 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: United States during the Civil War and there were seventy 160 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 1: four deaths from it on the Union side, in more 161 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 1: than cases in the Surgeon General's records, and it became 162 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: such a problem that they banned army bands from playing 163 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 1: Home Sweet Home. Now. Now here's one of the something 164 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 1: that occurs to me out of these examples for starters. Okay, 165 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 1: nostalgia the things I feel nostalgic about, like, and I 166 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: think a lot of people do. Like nostalge atends to 167 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 1: apply to things that by and large don't matter in 168 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 1: and of themselves, Like you like the feeling you feel for, 169 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: say a departed loved one that has died, like that. 170 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:03,560 Speaker 1: It's not nostalgia that is, that's like a deeper, more 171 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 1: close emotion, you know. But but nostalgia is a little 172 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:10,320 Speaker 1: harder to classific. It seems like two things need to 173 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:13,920 Speaker 1: happen for you to feel nostalgia. Either your your physical 174 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: surroundings have to change. You have have to travel somewhere 175 00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:20,200 Speaker 1: and and in in olden times, whine would you travel 176 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 1: a long distance, especially if you were not particularly into 177 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 1: the idea you would do so because you were engaged 178 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 1: in the military conquest of some kind. Or what has 179 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:32,320 Speaker 1: to happen is the world around you has to change. 180 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 1: It has to the music changes, the advertisements change, the 181 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: technology changes, etcetera. And then and then you you feel 182 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: this nostalgic link to a place that doesn't really exist anymore. So, 183 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 1: I wonder to what extent in previous ages it was 184 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,960 Speaker 1: harder to feel nostalgia because you weren't necessarily going to 185 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,440 Speaker 1: ever leave the area in which you lived. You know, 186 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:58,200 Speaker 1: you'd be more or less surrounded by the same places 187 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: and uh, and the the level of technology, the level 188 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 1: you know, the basic aesthetics of the world around you 189 00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: would more or less remain intact. Now that's interesting, especially 190 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,880 Speaker 1: for a grarian based societies. Right, so ten thousand years on, 191 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:15,679 Speaker 1: we primarily have just been in the same place, except 192 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,679 Speaker 1: for when you begin to think about place like the 193 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,439 Speaker 1: United States of America, which is a very young country 194 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: and in a country that many people immigrated to and 195 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: people continue to move around. And that's sort of an 196 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: American thing, is that you, um, you find your survival 197 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:35,800 Speaker 1: by sort of picking up and going and uh doing 198 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: something for yourself that's new in a new area, new possibilities, right, 199 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 1: the gold Rush, so on and so forth. We encountered 200 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:43,840 Speaker 1: that on Facebook all the time we all have that 201 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: have that friend who's had a tough time. They're like, 202 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: I said, I'm moving, leaving to a different city, going 203 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 1: to start over somewhere new. And that's that's the the 204 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 1: idea in itself. You know, I'm going to change my 205 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: physical surroundings and in doing so, I will change who 206 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 1: I am. Well the Susan J. Matt, the professor of 207 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 1: history UM, she was actually saying in that way that 208 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 1: nostalgia became a very un American emotion because not only 209 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 1: did it have this association with the psychiatric disorder of 210 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,200 Speaker 1: people who had come back from war, but it was 211 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: this idea that was opposed this whole like manifest destiny, 212 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: that you need to not feel homesick, that you need 213 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 1: to pick up and move and begin your life and new. 214 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 1: And so she was saying that it was very interesting 215 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 1: to see the ways that it's represented in American culture, 216 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:36,280 Speaker 1: and really in American culture that, uh, nostalgia doesn't truly 217 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:39,880 Speaker 1: get embraced until after World War Two, and she says 218 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 1: that much of that can be attributed to the fact 219 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 1: that during World War One they began to better understand 220 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: nostalgia and they began to better understand that people who 221 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 1: came home who were depressed and who had anxiety had 222 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:58,359 Speaker 1: signs of the newly established syndrome of shell shock, not nostalgia. 223 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 1: You know, in a sense, the idea of nostalgia as 224 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 1: a negative force, it does make a lot of sense 225 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 1: because in a sense, it is looking back to the past, 226 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: clinging to the past, instead of moving forward and uh 227 00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:11,680 Speaker 1: and welcoming new things. So I can I can easily 228 00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 1: see where it could it could be interpreted as a 229 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 1: negative force. And if you were nostalgic for things that 230 00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:20,080 Speaker 1: are harmful, either like say, hey man, I really miss 231 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 1: cocaine or something, you know, like that would be bad nostalgia. 232 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: Or when you see like people who are really in 233 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 1: to say, images of sort of an imagined anti Bellum South, 234 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: you know that that can be kind of disturbing as well, 235 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 1: Like you're kind of nostalgic for a thing that didn't 236 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:39,680 Speaker 1: quite exist the way you think it did and was 237 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: really kind of a horrific time, right, which kind of 238 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 1: gives you that whole idea that again, memory and the 239 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:48,200 Speaker 1: way that we construct our world is unique to every 240 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 1: single person, right, we just sort of all agree on 241 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,760 Speaker 1: a set of conditions to say, hey, this is how 242 00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,319 Speaker 1: we're defining the world. But everything else is up for interpretation. 243 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:58,679 Speaker 1: But it does turn out, and we'll talk about this 244 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:01,280 Speaker 1: after the break, but it does for now that nostalgia 245 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:04,720 Speaker 1: actually is a good thing by and large because it 246 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 1: helps to regulate our emotions. That being said, I'm gonna 247 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:16,240 Speaker 1: go get nostalgic for for some talkies and the carton cigarettes. Kids. 248 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:28,240 Speaker 1: All right, we're back. We've been talking about nostalgia. We 249 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 1: talked a little bit about the toxic nostalgia, but for 250 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 1: the most part, this is a positive force in our lives. 251 00:13:35,360 --> 00:13:38,480 Speaker 1: It is, and we should probably scratch at what exactly 252 00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: actually characterizes the experiences of nostalgia. Dr Clay Rutledge, who 253 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: I talked about before, his research focuses on how they 254 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:50,800 Speaker 1: need to perceive life as meaningful, impacts mental and physical health, 255 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: close relationships, and intergroup relations. So of course he's very 256 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,960 Speaker 1: interested in nostalgia, and he says that these memories tend 257 00:13:57,960 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 1: to be focused on momentous or perly meaningful life events 258 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: that prominently feature close others, so friends, family, romantic partners, 259 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 1: family vacations, road trips with friends, weddings, graduation, uh birthday, parties, 260 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:18,520 Speaker 1: gatherings for the holidays, all these sorts of things are 261 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: these cherished experiences. Yeah, I can see that, like just 262 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: thinking about family trips, Like I instantly think of family 263 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:30,080 Speaker 1: trips to the beach, and like oysters, like raw oysters 264 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 1: with cocktail sauce and salting crackers. There you go. See. So, now, 265 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 1: if you are one of the participants in one of 266 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: his studies, that's probably what you are. One of the 267 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,480 Speaker 1: things that you might have written about. And one of 268 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 1: the things that were Ledge found with the participants is 269 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 1: that when they were writing about their nostalgic experiences, um, 270 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 1: and when someone went through and sort of weeded out 271 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 1: everything else, they found that there were many more positive 272 00:14:56,080 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 1: emotion related words used than negative emotion from related words, 273 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: which I thought was interesting because it's come up before 274 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: that we tend to have better recall and use of 275 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: negative words than positive ones in general. But here's this 276 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: case where you have just a outflowing of positive words. UM. 277 00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 1: Kind of giving you a hint as to where this 278 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 1: is going in terms of your mindset. Yeah. So, researchers 279 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,800 Speaker 1: have looked at the causes of nostalgia and they found 280 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 1: that there are a number of things that can kick 281 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:29,120 Speaker 1: it off. Social interactions, So like you're getting together with 282 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: an old friend and you're talking, hey, remember that that 283 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: teacher we had in college, And the next thing, you know, 284 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 1: an nostalgic or some either a particular experience or some 285 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 1: sort of fragment of that time. UM sensory inputs music, 286 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 1: you hear an old song and you're like, oh, man, 287 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:46,600 Speaker 1: I haven't listened to this in forever. Nostalgia or a smell, 288 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:49,920 Speaker 1: And we talked before about how would smell that kind 289 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 1: of undercuts our conscious labeling of experiences. So we'll smell 290 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 1: something and will suddenly be so nostalgic for something, and 291 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:00,120 Speaker 1: we don't even necessarily remember what we're being nostalgic for, 292 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 1: but that smell will take us back to sort of 293 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 1: a general time frame. Tangible objects of course, old photographs, 294 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: you know, somebody's old watch, somebody's old wedding ring. You 295 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,119 Speaker 1: handle that and it'll take you back. And the iPhone. 296 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: I mean, people do get nostalgic about their technology. Like 297 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 1: one of the nostalgic trips that um I have found 298 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 1: a musing I interviewed a guy who is really into 299 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 1: it for the blogs and uh and I've gotten into 300 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: it a bit too. Is VHS nostalgia, Like we know, 301 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 1: when when we were done with VHS is and we 302 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 1: moved to two DVDs, like we couldn't have most people 303 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: just couldn't get rid of those VHS tapes soon enough, 304 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 1: just dump that we have a better technology around. But 305 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,760 Speaker 1: now people were really filling this, uh, this flood of 306 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: nostalgia for and in my case is a lot of 307 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: it is the films of that time and the kind 308 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 1: of looking sound that they had the digital film scores. 309 00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 1: But then some people are like really hardcore nostalgic and 310 00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:00,320 Speaker 1: and even obsessive about the technology itself. They're like they're 311 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 1: they're buying old VCRs, fixing them up, They're collecting tapes 312 00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: sometimes spending uh kind of crazy amounts of money on 313 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:09,639 Speaker 1: on what to any other I would be a just 314 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: a beat up piece of discarded technology. Well you you 315 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:14,320 Speaker 1: hear the same sort of thing in the recordings of 316 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:18,359 Speaker 1: music sometimes, like people prefer to hear the scratchiness or 317 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 1: just that the imperfections as opposed to everything that's eded 318 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:24,159 Speaker 1: out and so clean. Um, you know, I think that 319 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:26,600 Speaker 1: was one of the chief complaints of going from a 320 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 1: record player to a cassette player. Yeah, the distortions and 321 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,199 Speaker 1: the imperfections of the sound become a part of what 322 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 1: we loved about them. Uh. Two artists, in particular musical artists. 323 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 1: There's a musical artist named Tycho. And then of course 324 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 1: Boards of Canada. Both of these groups, especially Boards of Canada, 325 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:49,680 Speaker 1: really employ uh, this nostalgic, audible nostalgia for for sounds 326 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 1: that are sort of distorted, old electronic soundtracks, this kind 327 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:55,520 Speaker 1: of thing. And uh, and they weave all these things together, 328 00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:57,639 Speaker 1: like take the things we're nostaluted for and boil them 329 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: down to their basics and then reassemble them into two 330 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,400 Speaker 1: a new um sonic form. And then so you're you're 331 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 1: taking it in. It's a it's a new thing, but 332 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 1: at the same time it is is heavily nostalgic. You 333 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: have to stay with an accordion. I just feel that, 334 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: I mean and growing a theremin and I'm just a puddle. 335 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 1: You're before this is through, you will tell us something 336 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 1: you're actually nostalgic for. I'm not kidding. I'm not kidding 337 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: about that at all. All right, maybe you are a 338 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:29,160 Speaker 1: time traveler, time lord, even everybody, all right, So those 339 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: are some of the things that cause of nostalgia. But 340 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:35,879 Speaker 1: in these studies, a negative mood was the most commonly 341 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:40,240 Speaker 1: reported cause of nostalgia and uh and and generally loneliness 342 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,240 Speaker 1: was the most frequently listed negative emotion that led to 343 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: nostalgia yeah, which led to the researchers positing that psychological 344 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,239 Speaker 1: threat was the culprit for digging into the past and 345 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:54,080 Speaker 1: using nostalgia as a kind of bomb. And of course, 346 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:56,400 Speaker 1: how did they do this or bear this out? They 347 00:18:56,440 --> 00:19:00,400 Speaker 1: triggered a sense of loneliness in their participants. They had 348 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: one group who, after completing a questionnaire, were told that 349 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: they scored high on loneliness. And then they had a 350 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: second control group which they said that you don't rate 351 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 1: very high on loneliness. And then they asked all the 352 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,359 Speaker 1: participants to complete a measure of nostalgia. And it turns 353 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,800 Speaker 1: out the participants in loneliness condition reported being significantly more 354 00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: nostalgic than participants in the control group. And then, just 355 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:26,720 Speaker 1: just to make sure that this was really going on, 356 00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: they had another study in which some volunteers read a 357 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 1: story by a supposed Oxford philosopher who wrote that life 358 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: is meaningless because any single person's contribution to the world 359 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: is quote paltry, pathetic, and pointless. And of course the 360 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 1: idea here is that there's a theme that threatens perceived 361 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:48,399 Speaker 1: meaning in our lives. And then they had another group 362 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,680 Speaker 1: read a neutral story. Again, it was those people who 363 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 1: read about life being meaningless who indulged in nostalgic thoughts 364 00:19:57,280 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: and feelings. Well, you know, I I compared this to 365 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:03,919 Speaker 1: my own experiences because right now I'm not I'm not 366 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: in a lonely state of mind or a depressed state 367 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:10,320 Speaker 1: of mind. But um, tomorrow evening on, my wife and 368 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 1: are flying to China. We're gonna pick up our son, 369 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:14,680 Speaker 1: and it's gonna we're gonna be there for two weeks, 370 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 1: and it's gonna be kind of stressful, and it's gonna 371 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,720 Speaker 1: be like a life changing event. Uh. And so I 372 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: feel a certain amount of anxiety about that, and I 373 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,120 Speaker 1: feel a lot of intense excitement about it. And then 374 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:28,720 Speaker 1: and then also just like you know, seven siultaneous heart 375 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: attacks here and there, as I as I think about it, 376 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: and so I can only assume that a lot of 377 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 1: my recent nostalgia, as opposed to do sort of general 378 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 1: in nostalgia, has maybe risen out of that. It's possible. 379 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 1: I mean, do you find yourself kind of not that now, 380 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: not that we need to get you on the psychologists 381 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,360 Speaker 1: couch here or anything, but do you find yourself kind 382 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 1: of accessing childhood memories? And yeah, definitely. I mean when 383 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 1: especially when it comes to purchasing books for the child 384 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: and looking at toys, and then you know, I'll say, oh, 385 00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 1: I have this book. He's like, oh my goodness, I 386 00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:00,680 Speaker 1: don't have a copy of the star Belt Sneeches in 387 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: the house. Yeah. I had that as a kid. And 388 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,240 Speaker 1: and then and maybe that's why the Starbid Sneeches have 389 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 1: come up in like three different podcasts recently, because I 390 00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:10,119 Speaker 1: keep thinking back to the things that influenced me as 391 00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 1: a child as I consider this child coming into my life. Yeah, 392 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: it's possible. Your son is very lucky. By the way, Sorry, 393 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: well try Yeah alright, Um, No, I didn't mean to 394 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:24,920 Speaker 1: get all of a clemp fish. Um. So, I mean, 395 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,400 Speaker 1: as you we can tell, there are definitely benefits here 396 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 1: to indulging in nostalgia because it does kind of make 397 00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:34,680 Speaker 1: you feel as though perhaps you are re centering your 398 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: universe of meaning just by accessing this information and reframing 399 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:42,840 Speaker 1: what's going on in your current life? Right? Um? Now 400 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 1: from the journal Current Directions and Psychological Science, paper by 401 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:50,320 Speaker 1: Clay Rutledge again says that nostalgist serves at least four 402 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 1: key psychological functions. I'm talking about generating positive effect, elevating 403 00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:59,399 Speaker 1: actual self esteem, which I was sort of surprised to me, 404 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:05,640 Speaker 1: fostering social connectedness, and alleviating that existential threat that there's 405 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 1: no meaning in life. Right. Indeed, the social connectedness thing 406 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 1: really interests me because of course you think about nostalgias, 407 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: and other people are inevitably going to share your nostalgia. 408 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 1: And I mean, I dare anyone to give me an 409 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: example of something they're nostalgic for that nobody else on 410 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 1: the planet feels that pull towards like uh, you know, 411 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,520 Speaker 1: I mentioned like the VHS thing. Uh, people feel nostalgia 412 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: for that, and so their whole communities where they talk 413 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: about trading these tapes, they talk about the technology. Uh. 414 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 1: And certainly with any kind of music or media or art, 415 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,639 Speaker 1: people are going to gather around it. They're going to 416 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,959 Speaker 1: draw these uh, sometimes forgotten artists back from obscurity and 417 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,440 Speaker 1: celebrate them again. So no matter what your nostalgia is 418 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 1: you're gonna find a community of people, especially online that 419 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:50,200 Speaker 1: share it, and you're going to feel this intense connection 420 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: with people like, hey, weird team VHS or weird team. Um, 421 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: I don't know old Beatles albums, I don't know. Whatever 422 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,359 Speaker 1: you're nostalgia is, it's true, right, Yeah, you're you're right. 423 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: There's sort of a more universal we all feel this 424 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: way and we're all connected in that way. But there's 425 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: also like, you know, maybe someone was involved, uh in 426 00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 1: watching this movie, this particular of VHS movie with you, 427 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 1: and then you think back about your connectedness to that 428 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: person as well. But I thought it was interesting too 429 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 1: that self esteem was involved in that relige. Did a 430 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,119 Speaker 1: number of studies that bore out that self esteem again, 431 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:28,240 Speaker 1: perhaps this connectedness or the sense of accomplishment was underlying 432 00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:31,159 Speaker 1: reason for that self esteem. And it again brings me 433 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: back to this idea that we no longer reside in 434 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:37,600 Speaker 1: like the same community in the same place and share 435 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,919 Speaker 1: the same uh sort of general social group anymore. We 436 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:42,919 Speaker 1: move out, we moved to new places that are in 437 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:47,879 Speaker 1: those places themselves are constantly changing, so you you reach 438 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:51,320 Speaker 1: to things like like old VHS tapes or old music, 439 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: and those become sort of the social connection with a 440 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: surrounding that the earlier people would have had just by 441 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 1: being in the place that they call home. That they 442 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: were right, which makes me think about embodied cognition. We 443 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,639 Speaker 1: talked about this embodied cognition UM, this idea that things, 444 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,040 Speaker 1: or even um putting on a certain kind of clothes 445 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,520 Speaker 1: would affect the way that your your brain behaves and 446 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,480 Speaker 1: the way that you think. And so then I was 447 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:24,240 Speaker 1: reminded of the study that we came upon about feeling 448 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:30,040 Speaker 1: warm when you indulge in nostalgic thoughts. And this was 449 00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:33,919 Speaker 1: a study or rather an experiment in the Netherlands by J. J. M. 450 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:38,440 Speaker 1: Winger Hoots of Tilburg University. Uh. He and his colleagues 451 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: found that listening to songs made people feel not only nostalgic, 452 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:46,200 Speaker 1: but warmer physically. And then this is this is where 453 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 1: it gets kind of even crazier. Uh The New Zoo 454 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: of sun yat Sen University tracks students over the course 455 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,479 Speaker 1: of a month and found that feelings of nostalgia were 456 00:24:55,520 --> 00:25:00,000 Speaker 1: more common on cold days. And they found that people 457 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 1: in a cool room around sixty eight degrees fahrenheit were 458 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 1: more likely to engage in nostalgia than people in warmer rooms, 459 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,399 Speaker 1: and of course as a result, they felt warmer. Well. 460 00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: I wonder if that has anything to do with the 461 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: fact that every time October rolls around. I also I 462 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,879 Speaker 1: often feel like a lot of nostalgia because I'm getting 463 00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: the Halloween season, So I'm getting nostalgic about Halloween, uh, 464 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:25,040 Speaker 1: celebrations of the past and all bits of Halloween themed media. 465 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:28,439 Speaker 1: But also the temperature is changing, so yeah, and I 466 00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 1: and I actually start to think about certain foods and 467 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:35,199 Speaker 1: experience as too, thinking about fall foods and winter foods 468 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:38,320 Speaker 1: and all that. This is an interesting perspective. Psychologist Tim 469 00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:40,840 Speaker 1: Wilsheit says that if you can recruit a memory to 470 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:44,200 Speaker 1: maintain physiological comfort, this idea that you would feel warm 471 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 1: through this memory. Um. He said that at least subjectively, 472 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 1: that could be an amazing and complex adaptation. It could 473 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 1: contribute to survival by making look for food and shelter 474 00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 1: that much longer. So presumably he's talking about in an 475 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 1: evolutionary sense. So one might be out in the wilderness 476 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 1: trying to find a place that can sustain them, and 477 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,919 Speaker 1: they are in the process sustained by nostalgia. For a 478 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 1: place that sustained them, or even just a thing that 479 00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: sustained You're right. It doesn't even have to be like O, 480 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: our our ancestors needed, you know, they were out in 481 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,280 Speaker 1: the wild. It could just be that you were on 482 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,719 Speaker 1: say a long hiking trip, and he didn't pack as 483 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:20,919 Speaker 1: much water as you needed to our food, and you 484 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 1: needed to go back into your memories to to get 485 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 1: that sort of warmth and again that idea that there 486 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: is rhyme and reason for what you're doing. There's some 487 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,879 Speaker 1: sort of grand master plan, and nostalgia helps to recenter 488 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:38,159 Speaker 1: that reason for living and meaning. And it's so crazy 489 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,439 Speaker 1: how some of the things we feel nostalgic for. I mean, 490 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:42,280 Speaker 1: there are things that we're nostalgic for that at the 491 00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:45,200 Speaker 1: time we were kind of been different to like VHS 492 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 1: distortion disorted sound or distorted uh you know imagery that 493 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:51,600 Speaker 1: was just part of watching a VHS tape. No, we 494 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 1: known't not anything special about it. You might think, oh, 495 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 1: that's kind of weird or neat, but now it's the 496 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:58,800 Speaker 1: thing we feel the pool towards. Or I think back 497 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 1: to going to church, going to a Baptist church when 498 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 1: I was a kid, and we were seeing all these hymns, 499 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 1: and I hated the most of the hymns. I means 500 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:07,480 Speaker 1: have some of them are fun to sing, I guess, 501 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,200 Speaker 1: but but for the most part, I did not have 502 00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: a lot of love for Leaning on the Everlasting Arms. 503 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: But now I hear it and I get kind of 504 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:17,480 Speaker 1: nostalgic for it. And even even though it's not something 505 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,040 Speaker 1: that I like consciously had had a lot or any 506 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:22,280 Speaker 1: love for at the time, so we had it's and 507 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 1: I think there are a lot of examples of that 508 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:26,679 Speaker 1: in people's lives. You're suddenly nostalgic for something that really 509 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 1: didn't matter all that much back in the day. So 510 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:32,159 Speaker 1: I have an example of that too, and it's hearing 511 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 1: football on a Sunday. I hated hearing it around was 512 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:37,320 Speaker 1: little because it usually meant that my dad was going 513 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 1: to be sort of like tents and like perhaps even 514 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:43,080 Speaker 1: yelling at the screen sometimes. But now I hear it 515 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,240 Speaker 1: and it just makes me feel again like fall is 516 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: upon us. There's gonna be popcorn, you know, there's there's 517 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:53,160 Speaker 1: comforts and security there and all these delicious foods too, 518 00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:59,120 Speaker 1: like cocktail leanings in the Red Side. Oh yeah, that's 519 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,920 Speaker 1: what made me become agittarian. Yeah. So along those lines, 520 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:07,359 Speaker 1: there is of course the nostalgic bump, the reminiscence bump, 521 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: to consider an kind of a cultural sense. Yeah, this 522 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:15,240 Speaker 1: is an interesting article by Katie Walden writing for Slate magazine. 523 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:18,640 Speaker 1: The article is called The Mysterious Memorable Twenties, and it's 524 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 1: an interesting article because it talks about a person's twenties 525 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:26,560 Speaker 1: being a no man's land between childhood and stable adulthood 526 00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 1: and perhaps the reason why there is something called that 527 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,320 Speaker 1: reminiscence bump where you have a ton of these memories 528 00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 1: and nostalgia packed into that time period. Okay, so as 529 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:38,840 Speaker 1: you as you move forward, you think back to that, 530 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:41,160 Speaker 1: that your twenties, and that's an area that's just rich 531 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 1: in influences. Yeah, because it turns out that we we 532 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: just remember more events from late adolescents in early adulthood 533 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 1: than from any other stage of our lives. So there 534 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:54,479 Speaker 1: are a couple of theories about that. There's a nineteen 535 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:58,320 Speaker 1: study by Cohen and Faulkner that found that of vivid 536 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 1: life memories concern unique or first time events, and between 537 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: the ages of ten and thirty there are a lot 538 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: of first right, So that's that buys into this idea 539 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 1: that you're encountering the first time that you wrote a bike, 540 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,800 Speaker 1: the first time that you drove a car, that you 541 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: kissed a girl, that kissed a boy, that you had pizza, 542 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,040 Speaker 1: that you know, all these are first. But then after 543 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: age thirty, it all kind of gets a bit wrote, right, like, 544 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,920 Speaker 1: kind of you still have experienced you didn't check off 545 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 1: the list during that first period. I guess it's true, 546 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 1: but most things that you encounter just in living become wrote, 547 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,360 Speaker 1: So you really do have to go after those new 548 00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: experiences after that certain age. Right, and you're thirty, you've 549 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,080 Speaker 1: kind of done most of what everybody else is done. 550 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,880 Speaker 1: But the idea there is that you just chock full 551 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: of first and that perhaps is the reason why, uh, 552 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: we have so many memories or nostalgia available to us. Then, 553 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,400 Speaker 1: but then you have this guy David C. Rubin who 554 00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 1: comes along in his book Remembering Our Past, and he 555 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 1: says on a small portion of the memories that constitute 556 00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:07,160 Speaker 1: the bump, this reminiscence bump, relate to novel experiences. So 557 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,600 Speaker 1: that gets you to this idea. Another theory that jumps 558 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 1: in here that it's identity based, and that there's a 559 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:19,560 Speaker 1: narrative perspective here, and that it's kind of all flowing 560 00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,720 Speaker 1: into the story that we make of ourselves. And this 561 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 1: story is really right between those ages because that's when 562 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 1: we are becoming who we are becoming, right, and we're 563 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: thinking about the person we're going to become. We're looking 564 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 1: back in the roof of a mirror on the person 565 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,120 Speaker 1: we've been. Yes. Yeah, And in fact, Katie Walden, the 566 00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: writer of that article, sites and study by Judith Gluck 567 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: and Susan Bluck. Yeah, and they have proposed that there's 568 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,360 Speaker 1: a convergence of three qualities that make an event invalliable 569 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 1: in our minds. So the first one is that it 570 00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,560 Speaker 1: has to be joyous. Two is that it allows us 571 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 1: to exert control. So again, this identity making this is 572 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:04,240 Speaker 1: the thing that makes me who I am. This is 573 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 1: like a part of me. Yes. In three we perceive 574 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,760 Speaker 1: it to be highly influential over the course of our lives. 575 00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 1: So that kind of fits into this narrative identity, a 576 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,920 Speaker 1: based account of ourselves. Right, Like on some level, like 577 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: when I'm thinking back on these different things of nostotic 578 00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 1: for I'm saying, hey, I'm a tool guy, i am 579 00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:28,800 Speaker 1: a VHS guy, I am a leaning on the everlasting arms. 580 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 1: I mean in a sense. I mean, I guess I'm 581 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 1: nostalgic for it because I do look back on the 582 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: things about being raised in a Baptist church that have 583 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:38,680 Speaker 1: shaped me and and some of the aspects of that 584 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:40,880 Speaker 1: that remain with me to this day. See. And I 585 00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:43,040 Speaker 1: think that that theory really does kind of line up 586 00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:45,640 Speaker 1: really well with why we concentrate so many of our 587 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,800 Speaker 1: memories and nostalgia during that time period, because there's you know, 588 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 1: I have some friends who could have cared less about 589 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 1: high school, but I have other friends who are like, oh, 590 00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:59,719 Speaker 1: that's great, and for them during that time, there were 591 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 1: certain things that really helped to identify who they were 592 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: as a person. Yeah, so it kind of makes sense. Well, 593 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: I guess that's it. I'm already feeling nostalgic. Yeah, we 594 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 1: only just finished it. And then that's the way it 595 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 1: is with nostalgia. Something happens and then before you know what, 596 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:18,960 Speaker 1: you're nostalgic about it. It seems like just the other day. 597 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:22,160 Speaker 1: It was a new experience, that's right, one that built 598 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,320 Speaker 1: our identities and made us feel a worm and cozy 599 00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 1: and gave us little uptick in our self esteem. Yeah, 600 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,440 Speaker 1: and again, it's like the Aora bors it's the snake. 601 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:31,960 Speaker 1: It's moving forward in time, and then at some point 602 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 1: it turns back around and it goes back to its 603 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: point of beginning, and in that sense, becomes eternal. Here's 604 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: here's my little outro question to you. Do you think 605 00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 1: on a generation ship? And I think I've seen this 606 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:44,960 Speaker 1: depicted somewhere, says this is not an original thought. I'm 607 00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: on a spaceship that's we're headed off to a distant planet. 608 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 1: It's going to take generations of generations of generation lives 609 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 1: to get there. How how much nostalgia and what types 610 00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,800 Speaker 1: of nostalgia. Let's say the generation ship leaves tomorrow, do 611 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,040 Speaker 1: you think we'll be on board? Just Beyonce may it? Well? 612 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:05,320 Speaker 1: Beyonce is easy to bring, either in musical form or frozen. 613 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,480 Speaker 1: She will have her own generation ship, thank you very much. 614 00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 1: I could see, I mean a sense, some of these 615 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,360 Speaker 1: cultural figures they would kind of become like gods. And 616 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,560 Speaker 1: I mean you could argue they already are or modern 617 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:21,240 Speaker 1: gods in our modern, modern avatars. So I could see 618 00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 1: them being important. But I wonder if you're on a 619 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 1: generation ship, particularly if it was a generation ship that 620 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 1: wasn't particularly earthy in its design, we would quickly become 621 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:34,120 Speaker 1: far more nostalgic for the many details of of life 622 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 1: here on Earth, some of the simple things you know, um, 623 00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: and not necessarily the big things like you know, mountains 624 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:43,480 Speaker 1: and gravity, but the smaller things like you know, pigs, 625 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:46,680 Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, And would you start would it 626 00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 1: become just completely ridiculous, like instead of just going to 627 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 1: the coffee maker on the generationship, like there was such 628 00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:54,320 Speaker 1: a nostalgia for coffee that you'd have your own beings 629 00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 1: that you would grind, that you would pick out of 630 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: civic cats poop. Yeah, possibly so, or would become maybe 631 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 1: nostalgic for things like pencils. You know, why would you 632 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 1: have a pencil in a generation ship? Would be something 633 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 1: you could never have again? Like when would you get 634 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,480 Speaker 1: around to recreating pencils on another world? You wouldn't. I 635 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 1: think you're right, and I think there would be this 636 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,920 Speaker 1: whole like pencil economy on that ship. You know, it 637 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 1: would be like people would have them in class cases 638 00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: because yeah, you have to make them from scratch. That 639 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,280 Speaker 1: would be it would require a crazy amount of effort 640 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,239 Speaker 1: or just print them out or print them out. But 641 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 1: that's the thing too, if you had three D printing 642 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,960 Speaker 1: and nostalgia coming together, that would be almost a dangerous 643 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 1: combination because every little nostalgia trip you'd be like, oh 644 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: my man, I remember, I remember pencils and pens. I'm 645 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 1: going to print out every possible variation of pencil and 646 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:42,319 Speaker 1: pen and I encounter. Gotta do the mechanical, I got 647 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,399 Speaker 1: to do the normal that do the thick one, got 648 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 1: to do the color pencils, Gotta do the the ink 649 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:47,880 Speaker 1: pen that had three different heads in it and you 650 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: would click them, the one with a flashlight in the rear. Well, 651 00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,520 Speaker 1: what else are you gonna do on a generations ship anyway? Right, 652 00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: And which means that that generation ship, I see how 653 00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:57,439 Speaker 1: this is going, is going to be completely weighted down 654 00:34:57,440 --> 00:34:59,480 Speaker 1: with junk and it's not even gonna make its destination 655 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:02,400 Speaker 1: because we've all turned into a bunch of hoarders or 656 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:07,320 Speaker 1: we're having to jettison nostalgia junk like every like every 657 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,840 Speaker 1: week or so. So the flight from Earth to a 658 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,239 Speaker 1: planet X becomes just this trail, this rat trail of 659 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,680 Speaker 1: droppings like nostalgia drop pics, just floating in space to 660 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:19,880 Speaker 1: mark our passage. Yeah, that would be more likely. I 661 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 1: see that. Well, there you go. Nostalgia, What it is, 662 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 1: what drives it, some of the science behind it. Obviously 663 00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:30,920 Speaker 1: everyone out there listening to this episode has something to 664 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:34,320 Speaker 1: contribute on this. What what are you missed doubting for? Particularly? 665 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,200 Speaker 1: Is it? What's what is the nostalgic force that is 666 00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: either most interesting to us or most sort of weird 667 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,560 Speaker 1: to you? Like, what's something you're nostalgic for that you 668 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:45,880 Speaker 1: again didn't even really like all that much back in 669 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: the day, but now you've identified as a part of 670 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 1: who you are. Let us know about all that. You 671 00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 1: can find us in all the general places. We're on Facebook, 672 00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:55,600 Speaker 1: We're on tumbler on Twitter. Our homepage is stuffed tobow 673 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,240 Speaker 1: your mind dot com and there you'll find our blog posts, 674 00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:01,239 Speaker 1: our videos are audio podcast as well as links out 675 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 1: to all of our social media uh embodiments. And you 676 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,120 Speaker 1: can always drop his line at below the mind at 677 00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:15,320 Speaker 1: Discovery dot com. For more on this and thousands of 678 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:23,600 Speaker 1: other topics, visit how staff works dot com.