Speaker 1: Season five is officially behind us, proving that time really
Speaker 1: flies when you're watching yourself go through puberty on network TV.
Speaker 1: And for as much as we dreaded season five, we
Speaker 1: sure seemed to like it more than we expected. Sure
Speaker 1: we had some starry nights, but we got Eric Hollywood,
Speaker 1: the Scream episode, and another episode that makes an argument
Speaker 1: for the best of the series, Heartbreak Corey. And even
Speaker 1: when it missed, it was fun to talk about, like
Speaker 1: the Ex Girlfriend's Club or if you can't be with
Speaker 1: the one you love. So to wrap up this season,
Speaker 1: we're continuing the tradition of getting the opinions of fans,
Speaker 1: not just of the show, but also our podcast, our
Speaker 1: favorite fan cast in the world, brah Meets World and
Speaker 1: its hosts TC and Siege, have now finished their own rewatch,
Speaker 1: viewing the program thirty years later with a melanin point
Speaker 1: of view, and now they once again will sit down
Speaker 1: with us and ask some of the questions we may
Speaker 1: have missed or something they'd like to know more about.
Speaker 1: So welcome back to pod meets World to John Adams
Speaker 1: transfer students, TC and Siege from brum Meats World.
Speaker 2: Hello, helloy, how's it going, guys doing well, how we
Speaker 2: want are great.
Speaker 3: We're so excited to be here.
Speaker 1: As always, we are so excited to have you two
Speaker 1: with us to recap the season, not only the season
Speaker 1: of Boy Meets World, but the season of Pod Meets World,
Speaker 1: and to hear your thoughts.
Speaker 4: To ask you, once again, are we ruining anything for you?
Speaker 1: Although I think at this point we feel pretty confident
Speaker 1: we're not ruining things for maybe nearly maybe some episodes
Speaker 1: we get a couple of comments here and there that go,
Speaker 1: you guys always ruin the things I love.
Speaker 3: We've got those same comments. Obviously, we're used to it.
Speaker 5: Don't make us watch Storry Night and we'll be fine.
Speaker 6: A lot of people I think do love Storry Night.
Speaker 7: I think it is.
Speaker 6: It's one of those, you know, it's one of those
Speaker 6: Cory Tbeanka Touchstone episodes.
Speaker 3: And I'll say this, I don't think you guys have
Speaker 3: ruined the show for us at all. I kind of
Speaker 3: loved hearing your discussion on season five. Season five is
Speaker 3: so and we're going to get into it, just a
Speaker 3: bit divisive in so many ways that like your debates
Speaker 3: really mimicked some of the debates that me and see chat.
Speaker 3: So I kind of liked having like different perspectives brought
Speaker 3: in asking questions because I feel like there's a lot
Speaker 3: of unanswered questions this season that you know, things just
Speaker 3: have to be brought up, and so I appreciate it
Speaker 3: the commentary.
Speaker 8: In addition to that, it's very much it's validating to know,
Speaker 8: like TC and I spent so much time, you know,
Speaker 8: arguing with each other, debating with people online, and as
Speaker 8: you said, I know there was a point in time
Speaker 8: we were like, are we too hard on this?
Speaker 7: And it's like, no, again, I love this show.
Speaker 8: I love these characters, and it's important to see that
Speaker 8: the show, even through your eyes, takes really wild swings.
Speaker 8: Sometimes those swings really pay off, and then there was
Speaker 8: Sean and then sometimes you get things, you know how
Speaker 8: we feel about non canon episodes.
Speaker 3: So yeah, yes, well I will say this, last time
Speaker 3: we talked, we kind of maybe set some poor expectations
Speaker 3: because we were like, oh, yeah, you love season four,
Speaker 3: don't worry season five, it's up there. It's just as good. However,
Speaker 3: I feel like this might have been a wrong expectation
Speaker 3: set because it is a fan favorite season, but it's
Speaker 3: also so inconsistent compared to how season four was where
Speaker 3: it just kind of delivered a more structured storyline. I
Speaker 3: just think season five has a lot of memorable episodes
Speaker 3: that make it stand out, which is why it's a
Speaker 3: favorite season compared to season four.
Speaker 4: Right, I think you're right. I do.
Speaker 1: We've and we've talked about it on a couple of episodes.
Speaker 1: It feels like there were a lot of new people
Speaker 1: brought in. There were some shake ups, some people leaving,
Speaker 1: Michael coming back, new writers being brought in, and those
Speaker 1: new writers added a lot of like new fresh ideas
Speaker 1: and povs. But also it felt like it could have
Speaker 1: really used a good storyboard before the season got started,
Speaker 1: like there wasn't a proper plan.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it felt like it felt like a trail mix
Speaker 6: with like two or three ingredients that you just can't stand. Yeah,
Speaker 6: but then you're not. You still got the chocolate and
Speaker 6: the things you really love, but you got to pick
Speaker 6: them out.
Speaker 9: You just gotta, you could easily say, I mean, it
Speaker 9: could be argued that the best one of the best
Speaker 9: episode of Boy Meets World ever was in season five,
Speaker 9: and in my opinion, the worst.
Speaker 5: Episode ever of Boy Meets World was in season five,
Speaker 5: So we.
Speaker 9: Can guess Starry Night is the worst. It's not just
Speaker 9: a bad episode, it's the worst thing I've ever seen. No,
Speaker 9: I'm kidding, it's just I thought it missed on all levels.
Speaker 9: It did not feel like our show. I thought it
Speaker 9: felt like.
Speaker 5: A beguine Ricky, but then.
Speaker 7: It is a Plato.
Speaker 9: Yeah, no, I it did not do it for me,
Speaker 9: even slightly so, But then again I and I loved
Speaker 9: And then there was sean great episode. I loved Eric Hollywood,
Speaker 9: great episode, but the not being in the episode and
Speaker 9: just being able to sit back and watch the ski
Speaker 9: cabin episode with Lauren and that that was arguably my
Speaker 9: favorite episode of the entire series. It was just great
Speaker 9: watching that. I thought all the acting was amazing, the
Speaker 9: writing was amazing. It led to moral conversations my wife
Speaker 9: and I were having, well who did this and who
Speaker 9: did that?
Speaker 5: And it just did what television was supposed to do.
Speaker 9: So that, to me is arguably one of the best episodes,
Speaker 9: if not the best episode of the entire series.
Speaker 8: So yeah, I love that you said that because this
Speaker 8: talks to your season five, Pop Meets World season five,
Speaker 8: and to me, the way that you guys handled this
Speaker 8: was perfect giving. And then there was Sean An entire
Speaker 8: week been overkilled, but for us, it was everything we needed.
Speaker 8: I don't know if we shared this story before, but
Speaker 8: and then there was Sean. It's actually how our podcast
Speaker 8: got started into podcasting. We couldn't settle on a topic,
Speaker 8: and we were like, what if we just do like
Speaker 8: a Halloween episode, and we'll do And then there was Sean,
Speaker 8: and the moment we started, we laughed, We got into
Speaker 8: it and we were like, this is it. This is.
Speaker 3: We just knew. We were like, we could talk about
Speaker 3: this show forever, and that's what it kind of led into.
Speaker 4: That's great, that's so cool.
Speaker 8: But and then there was Sean is so important to
Speaker 8: the fandom, and like to have the breakdown and the
Speaker 8: different perspectives and giving the fans the opportunity to share
Speaker 8: their voice. I think you guys brought the fans in
Speaker 8: a lot more this season and that really helps, Like
Speaker 8: the discussions of is it a trap or the heartbreak,
Speaker 8: giving time and actually discussing heartbreak Corey in that way.
Speaker 7: We know that you felt differently.
Speaker 8: About it, but these at the eisodes were really really
Speaker 8: important to the audiences, So we really think that you
Speaker 8: approached those episodes really well.
Speaker 9: Well, one of the things we've talked about, which is
Speaker 9: something that we kind of have been saying over and
Speaker 9: over again, is that we are trying not to forget
Speaker 9: that every single episode of the show is somebody's favorite episode. Yeah,
Speaker 9: so you know, if you go in with that, you've
Speaker 9: got to remember that. Okay, I might destroy Starry Night,
Speaker 9: but for some people, it's their favorite episode of the series,
Speaker 9: and that neither of us are wrong. You know, that's
Speaker 9: just the way that it is. But it's been a
Speaker 9: ton of fun to talk about, that's for sure. But
Speaker 9: we also season five had a lot to do with
Speaker 9: the director too, so bringing in a new director, and
Speaker 9: we remembered him as being a phenomenal guy, which he
Speaker 9: was a phenomenal guy to work with. At least Ryder
Speaker 9: and I had really good experiences with him. I think
Speaker 9: Danielle did as well.
Speaker 1: But I don't have any negative experiences with him. I
Speaker 1: just remember being a little apathetic, like.
Speaker 9: Yeah, yeah, right, where some people did not have the
Speaker 9: best experiences with him, but we remembered him as being
Speaker 9: a phenomenal director. And there's some episodes where it just
Speaker 9: kind of the direction was a little bit lacking. So
Speaker 9: there's stuff that we remember even ourselves that we remembered wrong.
Speaker 5: Frankly, so week to week, and.
Speaker 3: You guys are gonna have a different perspective than like,
Speaker 3: for example, I've watched and then there was Sean every
Speaker 3: years since it aired on Halloween.
Speaker 7: Like you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: I'm just gonna have in neatly a different relationship with
Speaker 3: episodes like that than you guys will. And I again
Speaker 3: love hearing your behind the scenes perspectives.
Speaker 10: You know.
Speaker 3: One of the things, just as we're kind of initially
Speaker 3: starting about season five that I just wanted to touch
Speaker 3: on was that, like obviously there was this push for
Speaker 3: like more mature themes and like almost like this WB
Speaker 3: Dawson's Creek influence that was kind of invading in Like
Speaker 3: throughout the season, you guys were kind of talking about
Speaker 3: this melodramatic shift about I guess we were kind of thinking, like,
Speaker 3: do you feel like this helped the show mature with
Speaker 3: this audience or do you feel like it maybe went
Speaker 3: a step too far at certain points.
Speaker 6: Hmmm, that's a good question.
Speaker 9: I think I can answer it instantly. It went a
Speaker 9: step too far at a certain point. I mean, again,
Speaker 9: Starry Knight is so melodramatic that it was kind of ridiculous.
Speaker 5: It really was young teen soap opera.
Speaker 6: And it just think about season four with the cult
Speaker 6: episode or you know, we've done pretty serious dramatic stuff.
Speaker 5: Before, so dramatic is different than melodramatic.
Speaker 9: And so the drama that Sean went through in season
Speaker 9: four to me was different than like the Corey into
Speaker 9: pangawin Universe and yes, right and Ricky Ferris, which to
Speaker 9: me was just again, no Jonathan Jackson. He did with
Speaker 9: that character what they gave him, so his fault even slightly,
Speaker 9: but the characters are so like you're seventeen in Philly,
Speaker 9: and it just seemed ridiculous. So I think there was
Speaker 9: I think Dawson's Creek did really have an influence on
Speaker 9: our show, and I think, like our show tended to
Speaker 9: do occasionally, we dove in headfirst and then realized maybe
Speaker 9: that was too far and slowly started to pull back occasionally.
Speaker 9: But we haven't seen six and seven yet, so maybe
Speaker 9: it is.
Speaker 1: We also don't really know how much of our show
Speaker 1: was really on the bubble for this season and needing
Speaker 1: to get to a point where we had the cliffhanger,
Speaker 1: like when did they know we want Corey and to
Speaker 1: Panga to end this season engaged and on a cliffhanger
Speaker 1: of are they going to get married? Because in order
Speaker 1: if they know that the season has to end there,
Speaker 1: because they're hoping for it to make a decision, for
Speaker 1: it to impact whether or not we get picked up,
Speaker 1: they'd better they have to set that up to be
Speaker 1: a meaningful enough impact. So I think I think the
Speaker 1: season went too far with the I did it at
Speaker 1: least appreciate in the episode where everyone's sitting in the
Speaker 1: boys apartment and it's like, who's.
Speaker 4: Sick of the Corey Intopanga thing?
Speaker 1: And everybody kind of raises their hand, and to me,
Speaker 1: it felt like a little bit of a meta moment,
Speaker 1: like we are honestly all sick of this being the
Speaker 1: topic week after week. So I at least ignite liked
Speaker 1: that we acknowledged that, but it felt like it was
Speaker 1: way too of an adult storyline about a marriage with
Speaker 1: three children than two seventeen year olds who've been together
Speaker 1: for a long time.
Speaker 8: I have a question, like speaking of like the influences
Speaker 8: of like WB Dawson's Creek for Friends.
Speaker 7: Even we talked.
Speaker 8: About these shows we in our mind. We were like, Okay,
Speaker 8: obviously there may be like show notes or like that's
Speaker 8: what's in the atmosphere. However, those shows also have strong
Speaker 8: female characters. One of the things about this season is
Speaker 8: we get the addition of Angela, and so you would
Speaker 8: think that that would give us more storylines. You've mentioned
Speaker 8: there's more women in the writer's room. However, we don't
Speaker 8: seem to have more female characters. Why do you think
Speaker 8: or more strong female characters are in depth female characters.
Speaker 7: Why do you.
Speaker 8: Think like they are pulling from these influences, but like
Speaker 8: not for certain characters leadership.
Speaker 7: Yeah, they just didn't.
Speaker 6: Just didn't.
Speaker 7: That's what it was.
Speaker 9: I mean, you know, Michael Jacobs was it was his show,
Speaker 9: and he was he was writing essentially about himself. You know,
Speaker 9: he was Corey and he was running the room. And
Speaker 9: this is the point of view we're going to go.
Speaker 9: I mean, we just watched the graduation episode and it's
Speaker 9: like Tapanga has the opportunity to finally get up and
Speaker 9: give a nice graduation speech, and it's like, nope, take away.
Speaker 1: Sean and I said in our graduation episode, I said,
Speaker 1: I have a confession to make. I'm really bored by Tapanga.
Speaker 1: I'm bored. I'm bored by her. I honestly, I'm having
Speaker 1: a hard time even caring about where she goes to school,
Speaker 1: her date with with Ricky Boring. I don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't know who Tapega is. I don't know who she is.
Speaker 1: What does she writer said? What does she even want
Speaker 1: to study at Yale? Do we know?
Speaker 6: What do we know about dancing?
Speaker 4: For one episode?
Speaker 1: That's something you know, they they when the random hobbies
Speaker 1: they decide to give us randomly.
Speaker 4: You know, Topanga loves to dance.
Speaker 1: We'll never photographer, Shann's photographer will never hear about that again.
Speaker 1: Sean was really good in marketing. We never heard about
Speaker 1: that again, which, by the way, bring a great weather man.
Speaker 9: Yeah, you know, it's it was what we kind of needed.
Speaker 9: It's that's why this season five just kind of felt
Speaker 9: like a hodgepodge to me. Yeah, and that's why I'm
Speaker 9: dying to know if we were going to get canceled
Speaker 9: halfway through.
Speaker 4: I know, the season of Convenience.
Speaker 6: Yeah, but going back to your original question, we did
Speaker 6: get the script of the original and then there were
Speaker 6: Sean from Jeff Manel and one of the things that
Speaker 6: I noticed is that the opening scene was just to
Speaker 6: Panga and Angela talking for like two pages. It was
Speaker 6: just it was like a scene, and it was like, oh,
Speaker 6: let's cut that, let's just make it. You know, they
Speaker 6: just walked.
Speaker 7: I mean they were never really.
Speaker 5: Talking about but it was.
Speaker 7: It was interesting.
Speaker 6: It was like almost you know, because of course that
Speaker 6: episode is all from Shawn's perspective and Shawn's but they
Speaker 6: had this scene with Angela and Tapanga discussing and it
Speaker 6: was like, oh right, Jeff did write it in his
Speaker 6: original draft. And then it's just like, no, no, we
Speaker 6: don't need that.
Speaker 9: That Bechtel test though, I'm starting to really pay attention
Speaker 9: to that. Like the scene in the graduation episode where
Speaker 9: she sits down with Feenie. I was like, she gonna
Speaker 9: mention Corey, She's gonna mention Corey and she didn't, which
Speaker 9: which I was like, Okay, it has to be two
Speaker 9: women will And I was just hoping, Hey, it's one
Speaker 9: step ahead of us for our show for a female
Speaker 9: character not to be talking about Corey.
Speaker 5: We're one step closer.
Speaker 3: So yeah, speaking of Corey for us, season five kind
Speaker 3: of marked a turning point on Corey for us, Like
Speaker 3: I guess at this point we're struggling to find him likable.
Speaker 3: And I think that you know, during the nineties, like
Speaker 3: you know, me and Sez are talking about how he's
Speaker 3: watching The Sopranos for the first time, and there's like
Speaker 3: this rise of anti hero which kind of like, uh,
Speaker 3: popularized this idea of showcasing a character's flaws but also
Speaker 3: owing like the repercussions of those flaws and the way
Speaker 3: that we didn't feel really happened with Corey a lot
Speaker 3: this season.
Speaker 6: Yeah, no, he's he's emotional, which is understandable, but it's
Speaker 6: the indignance that that that creeps in the righteousness that
Speaker 6: that that bugs me. You know. It's like, you can
Speaker 6: be upset, you can be hurt, you can be freaking
Speaker 6: out about Topango or whatever like that, you can't control
Speaker 6: these things, but you know, there's there's a tone of
Speaker 6: like just righteousness and and and and indignation that anybody
Speaker 6: would ever treat him this way and that all whenever
Speaker 6: whenever a scene dipped into that, I was just like, oh,
Speaker 6: this is hard to do.
Speaker 9: But then we'd also get Corey some Corey's that we loved,
Speaker 9: like Corey with Chickens, in the hallway, you know, we
Speaker 9: get that kind of Corey where he's just and the
Speaker 9: The one thing we talked about with Heartbreak Corey was
Speaker 9: Danielle I think noticed this as well. We were talking
Speaker 9: about the fact that it seemed like both Corey and
Speaker 9: Ben were more of an adult in this scene in
Speaker 9: that episode then we'd seen him before, which is one
Speaker 9: of the reasons all of a sudden people started to
Speaker 9: root for Corey and Lauren because it was like, well,
Speaker 9: look at this version of Corey with this woman as
Speaker 9: opposed to the other version of Corey with me.
Speaker 6: He actually listens to and she influences is thinking and
Speaker 6: changes like, yeah.
Speaker 9: She had conversations and but then yeah, So that was
Speaker 9: what I mean by the hodgepodg is we would see
Speaker 9: occasionally look at each other and be like, oh my god,
Speaker 9: my favorite version of Corey. Look what he's doing. It's
Speaker 9: the best. And then it's like, oh wow, now the
Speaker 9: universes against him, and yeah, it was.
Speaker 5: It was strange.
Speaker 9: Everything was kind of but I guess you could say
Speaker 9: the same thing about Eric. I mean, Eric was went
Speaker 9: like this through the episode, through the episodes as well.
Speaker 5: It just kind of was whatever we needed at the time.
Speaker 1: I think this season had some of my favorite Ben moments.
Speaker 1: Ben Ben performance wise had some great moments. The drinking
Speaker 1: episode had some great moment Ben in Eric Hollywood. Some
Speaker 1: of those moments then as like me.
Speaker 5: Like me, I mean there's some wasn't that this season?
Speaker 5: I know where we are anymore?
Speaker 3: I think will Zach Morris, I think, well, you mentioned
Speaker 3: that during the Scream episode, like it felt like all
Speaker 3: of the kind of gags that were going on during
Speaker 3: the like the rehearsals actually made it onto the screen.
Speaker 3: And it does feel like all of you felt more
Speaker 3: confident in your performances throughout the season.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well except.
Speaker 4: For Tapanga, who's just boring as hell.
Speaker 1: I go from having like personality and quirks and moments
Speaker 1: to every scene with Tapanga for the last like five
Speaker 1: episodes is.
Speaker 4: Like, what do you think I should do? Mister Feeney, Yeah,
Speaker 4: thanks for sharing. I know what I want to do
Speaker 4: with my life.
Speaker 8: I have to say we have like, of course we
Speaker 8: are ahead of you. So we've looked and I've been
Speaker 8: very much. I look forward to seeing what Danielle feels
Speaker 8: about this storyline or because like everything that you're talking about,
Speaker 8: I think it's easy to see. But that being said,
Speaker 8: we also feel like some as you were saying, there
Speaker 8: are high notes. There are certain things where it's like,
Speaker 8: even if we don't like it, it's true to the characters.
Speaker 8: Like when we were looking at a very Topanga Christmas,
Speaker 8: at first we didn't like it, but then we in retrospect,
Speaker 8: we were like, this may be the most accurate.
Speaker 7: Reflection of their relationship. So it's good. It's good to know.
Speaker 7: It's good to have that bag.
Speaker 3: What I said about a very Topanga Christmas was if
Speaker 3: you go back and watch The Grass Is Greener from
Speaker 3: season three, where they're like, hey, maybe we should break
Speaker 3: up before we hate each other, and then you watch
Speaker 3: a very Topanga Christmas, it's almost like, oh, you guys
Speaker 3: are repeating and falling into the same traps that you
Speaker 3: always have, and this seems to just be a pattern
Speaker 3: in your relationship in a way that is very reflective
Speaker 3: of who Corey and Tapana actually are versus who you know,
Speaker 3: we're being told that they are.
Speaker 1: Right exactly versus idealized version of who they think they
Speaker 1: should be together.
Speaker 4: Yeah, going back, just.
Speaker 1: Your point about Corey and some of what writer was
Speaker 1: saying about him, being indignant. There were that episode Things
Speaker 1: Change where it's kind of the whole point of it
Speaker 1: that he is really unlikable, and both writer and I
Speaker 1: and Will we all had notes in our notes about like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, and then when it's revealed, hey, Eric comes
Speaker 1: in and kind of saves the day.
Speaker 4: It says a lot about you.
Speaker 1: And these are things that are good, things that are
Speaker 1: happening for your friends, you need, and that kind of
Speaker 1: becomes the point of it.
Speaker 4: I am so.
Speaker 1: On board for there being an unlikable character when the
Speaker 1: reveal is, hey, bro, you're really unlikable and that's not
Speaker 1: a cool way to be because that is how kids learn.
Speaker 1: Like we all have those thoughts, especially as teenagers where
Speaker 1: it's like me, me, me.
Speaker 6: Me, hold on, I'm just realizing. Like so, that episode
Speaker 6: is the one before graduation, and that episode ends with
Speaker 6: Corey being like, Eh, everything's going to change.
Speaker 9: Yeah, life, I.
Speaker 6: Guess it's all over. And then the next season, the
Speaker 6: next episode is here, let's celebrate. There's like no re
Speaker 6: yeah or more.
Speaker 5: You could I guess you could.
Speaker 9: You could argue that he's faking it, which is what
Speaker 9: that scene means in the scene where they where he
Speaker 9: says are you really supportive where he's like, Hey, this
Speaker 9: is how it's gonna be, what it's gonna be, I'm
Speaker 9: gonna put on my best face, and chickens in the
Speaker 9: hallway were really inside he's dying. So I mean, I
Speaker 9: guess you could argue that, but I don't know if
Speaker 9: that was necessarily written to or.
Speaker 6: That's the justification like after the fact.
Speaker 8: You know, one of the things that we noticed with
Speaker 8: the enjoyment of Corey and the show overall is that
Speaker 8: the show is best when we are learning with Corey,
Speaker 8: and it seems like we stop learning, like when we
Speaker 8: bring in Fate, it starts to lean on fate and
Speaker 8: believe and like things are supposed to be a certain way,
Speaker 8: and so you don't have to learn anything. And if
Speaker 8: he doesn't have to learn anything, then there are no
Speaker 8: consequences to anything, and that kind.
Speaker 7: Of like effects.
Speaker 8: So you're right, Corey is the most fun when he's
Speaker 8: learning or when there's a lesson to learn, and when
Speaker 8: there isn't and.
Speaker 11: He's just like I know, and when he's teaching. When
Speaker 11: he's teaching, right, he's like Chapanga, you don't know, but
Speaker 11: I do, Sean, you don't know, but I do right, Wow.
Speaker 3: And he becomes a teacher? How about that?
Speaker 12: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Oh you know.
Speaker 11: Uh.
Speaker 3: We like we said we had things that we loved
Speaker 3: about this season, we also had things about the season
Speaker 3: that we didn't really, I don't know, necessarily agree with
Speaker 3: you guys on or different takes that we had, Like,
Speaker 3: for example, you guys really didn't care for brothers the
Speaker 3: kind of season over?
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Eric comes back home and Corey promises to find him
Speaker 1: a place to stay. Things take a strange turn when
Speaker 1: Eric's new roommate turns out to be Sean's half brother
Speaker 1: Jack for.
Speaker 5: No reason at all.
Speaker 3: One of the things that we actually enjoyed about this
Speaker 3: episode was that it showed Chet trying to be a
Speaker 3: better parent while also acknowledging his limitations in the way
Speaker 3: that we found really interesting. We go crazy for any Chet,
Speaker 3: so it's always a standout for us in that way.
Speaker 9: But why why why make him the brother? Like, what
Speaker 9: what do we gain out of him being a hunter?
Speaker 3: This is actually that leads to another question we had
Speaker 3: actually about Matt Lawrence joining the show, because we've loved
Speaker 3: Matt Lawrence h since Missus doutfire See has been in
Speaker 3: love with all the Lawrence Brothers, since it was age
Speaker 3: appropriate by the way, but they bring him in in
Speaker 3: the first half of the season is almost completely dedicated
Speaker 3: to building his relationship with Sean, and then they almost
Speaker 3: completely abandoned that second half to focus on his chemistry
Speaker 3: with Eric. So it just had us thinking, like, could
Speaker 3: they have done something to make his character and storyline
Speaker 3: hit a little bit harder? Like see just saying that,
Speaker 3: like if he started off as more of a rich
Speaker 3: boy snob and softened over time, maybe that would have
Speaker 3: created more character dynamics, where as, like with Will, I agree,
Speaker 3: I think he should have just been brought in as
Speaker 3: a roommate. So I guess, how do you feel about
Speaker 3: Jack as a character being brought into the season and
Speaker 3: introduced to us?
Speaker 2: Not great?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think it's yeah, I mean I think you know, actually,
Speaker 6: I feel like, when you know, we were criticizing those
Speaker 6: first couple episodes, I hadn't remembered the episode where we
Speaker 6: end up moving into each other's or he moves into
Speaker 6: my room and we wrestle and all that that was great,
Speaker 6: Like that kind of conflict and tension between us, I
Speaker 6: thought really actually did work. But for the most part, no,
Speaker 6: I just think unfortunately they were really stoked on going
Speaker 6: for the drama between him and me, and it's just
Speaker 6: a bummer to have that guy come in and have
Speaker 6: basically no character and just have conflict between us that's
Speaker 6: kind of manufactured and it's all backstory and then it's
Speaker 6: like backstory revealed. I don't know, it's just it's and
Speaker 6: I feel bad for Matt Lawrence not having much to
Speaker 6: do for a while, and a lot of these episodes
Speaker 6: he's just plugged in and just there.
Speaker 12: Uh.
Speaker 9: But I think that's almost what they did sometimes, is
Speaker 9: they plug somebody in and then they'd let them find
Speaker 9: where they belong, if that makes sense. So it was like, oh, okay,
Speaker 9: well the scenes with Eric and Jack seem to be
Speaker 9: working better, so now they're going to be It's like
Speaker 9: what happened with Eric and Feenie. It was like, Oh,
Speaker 9: what's gonna be Corey Feenie? Well, the Eric Phoene stuff
Speaker 9: was working. What if we put them together? So it's
Speaker 9: almost like, let's throw them in and then let's see
Speaker 9: where they find their level.
Speaker 6: And I think Matt and I were just too much
Speaker 6: of the same vit like neither one of us were
Speaker 6: funny enough to or characters weren't extreme enough to push
Speaker 6: like to a you know, interesting scene for the most part,
Speaker 6: So I disagree.
Speaker 8: I feel like you've talked about it when he when
Speaker 8: Matthew Lawrence leans into what we call like that Lawrence acting,
Speaker 8: which is like, you know, like you can kind of
Speaker 8: hear Joey yeah, or I think will you called it
Speaker 8: the Tony Danza approach.
Speaker 7: I don't really know her. He's doing that. It's fun
Speaker 7: and I believe.
Speaker 8: I think they just didn't allow or in my mind,
Speaker 8: as you said, maybe if it was storyboarded, it would
Speaker 8: have like they could have had like.
Speaker 7: A through line. One of the fandreies we had is
Speaker 7: that like Chet knew that Jack was in town.
Speaker 8: And like the first episode is like all a setup,
Speaker 8: and that to me is just like a better, more
Speaker 8: interesting story to tell of like, oh, Jack and Chet
Speaker 8: are doing this because Chet knows he can't take in Sean,
Speaker 8: and Sean needs someone. He's gonna need a place to live,
Speaker 8: he's gonna, you know, have something, so like it gives
Speaker 8: him like an anchor while also allowing them to work
Speaker 8: out their brother dynamic. And if that's how you go
Speaker 8: into the show, then it kind of makes more sense
Speaker 8: and it's a little bit more fun.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I did kind of end up changing my opinion.
Speaker 1: When we first started the season, I was very much
Speaker 1: on the team of.
Speaker 4: Why does he need to be Sean's.
Speaker 1: Brother, But seeing how little we mentioned any family for
Speaker 1: Sean after having multiple seasons be fully devoted to his
Speaker 1: home life, the fact that Jack represents Hunter family for
Speaker 1: Sean is so needed.
Speaker 4: Otherwise it would have just been like dropped off.
Speaker 1: Yes, this kid's just out in space, and there's so
Speaker 1: many there's so fewer Matthew's family scenes that involve Sean
Speaker 1: feeling like a member of a family. As a matter
Speaker 1: of fact, there's scenes where Alan says you, you've always
Speaker 1: been the bad influence. If he had no familiar you know,
Speaker 1: stakes and Alan's yelling at him, I think it would
Speaker 1: have been very jarring. So by the time the season ended,
Speaker 1: I was actually really grateful that Jack.
Speaker 4: Was kind of that like family presence for him.
Speaker 1: But when we first started, it made no sense to me,
Speaker 1: and I was surprised by how many references to this
Speaker 1: is my brother, that's my little brother. Why do we
Speaker 1: always end up wrestling because we're brothers? Like we went
Speaker 1: into a thing Amp's never going to be mentioned again,
Speaker 1: but it is, even if very casually. You guys, being
Speaker 1: bonded by blood is.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, Jack's not the only character that we
Speaker 3: get this season. We also get a new character in Angela, who,
Speaker 3: by the way, is maybe our first black student since
Speaker 3: Third Seat Kid number two.
Speaker 6: You're right, yep, but what really is there no black
Speaker 6: guest stars up until I.
Speaker 13: Think there's maybe some here, but not students. Alex is
Speaker 13: air but like, yeah, yeah, but one of the things
Speaker 13: about Angela is like she was brought in to be
Speaker 13: Sean's girlfriend into Penga's best friend.
Speaker 7: But we don't really know if.
Speaker 3: The show succeeded in developing her as either of those things.
Speaker 9: Nope, which is a shame because we've the one thing
Speaker 9: that we've noticed is that the episodes where they give
Speaker 9: her something to do, she's amazing.
Speaker 4: She's such a scar out, she's great.
Speaker 9: And so to look back at it and be like, man,
Speaker 9: they didn't use her already? Again, woman, I don't think
Speaker 9: I know, it sounds terrible. I don't think black or
Speaker 9: white has anything to do with it. It's woman on
Speaker 9: our show. It's that's kind of different. It's just, yeah,
Speaker 9: I know.
Speaker 7: It's white, but it's really important.
Speaker 8: And this is something like we were talking about episodes
Speaker 8: where we wanted to like see things that you missed
Speaker 8: or like we disagreed with.
Speaker 7: In the if you Can't Be the One You.
Speaker 8: Love episode the Drink the Drinking episode, you talk about
Speaker 8: the fact that, like they push Trina against the wall,
Speaker 8: Angela's character is consistently and I was like, whether, like,
Speaker 8: I do know that there are lots of people who
Speaker 8: are like, well Trina was like fine with it, or
Speaker 8: like she thought it was like all in good fine,
Speaker 8: But as a viewer, as a black viewer.
Speaker 7: To see the way that they handle.
Speaker 8: The black character. They don't ever push to peg it
Speaker 8: into a locker. They never shut me. So if you're
Speaker 8: gonna say that, oh, it was a bit and the
Speaker 8: bit worked and that's why they kept doing it, then
Speaker 8: why aren't they doing it any of the other female characters.
Speaker 8: It's this idea that black women are more durable, Black
Speaker 8: women can handle more And as a black viewer, you
Speaker 8: just like it's not to say that it can't be funny,
Speaker 8: but you do notice why are they treating this this
Speaker 8: way and the other characters differently?
Speaker 3: And I mean even in the drinking episode, Sean goes
Speaker 3: above and beyond to apologize to Tapanga and Feenie, and
Speaker 3: I don't know that he ever even says sorry to.
Speaker 4: Angelo for hitting her, not on camera.
Speaker 5: No, we talked about that.
Speaker 9: We talked about that, how strong it would have been
Speaker 9: had Angela turned and said, if you ever put your
Speaker 9: hands on me again.
Speaker 6: We don't do that, don't I say something? We do
Speaker 6: have some moment right.
Speaker 1: Cause where you said, you say you don't like it
Speaker 1: when I drink, I don't. You don't like me when
Speaker 1: I drink. I don't either, And she says, great because
Speaker 1: I really like you when you don't. And then you
Speaker 1: kiss her on the cheek and you guys walk in together.
Speaker 1: There's no actual apology.
Speaker 3: Thanks ye.
Speaker 8: This brings up the fact a lot of this series
Speaker 8: tends to tell, not show. And that's kind of one
Speaker 8: of the things that we noticed that you noticed, is
Speaker 8: that very often things will happen off camera, And I
Speaker 8: guess like that begs the question what would you have
Speaker 8: liked to see? Like, what scenes do you think are
Speaker 8: like missing or on the cutting room for that would
Speaker 8: actually help some of these storylines we just talked.
Speaker 1: About one in the graduation episode. That the missed opportunity
Speaker 1: for there not to be a scene between Sean and
Speaker 1: Turner where him making the decision that he's why he's
Speaker 1: going to do right, why he's going to do the project,
Speaker 1: and what these years have meant to him. Turner would
Speaker 1: would have been the perfect person. Sean could have even
Speaker 1: sought him out wherever.
Speaker 4: He was teaching.
Speaker 1: Now he's in a new location or he's doing something else,
Speaker 1: but he goes to him and he has the conversation
Speaker 1: about how he realizes he didn't live up to his
Speaker 1: potential like that could have been.
Speaker 4: That was definitely a missed opportunity.
Speaker 6: I think anything with Angela and the idea that you
Speaker 6: have two couples, right, like you have a Corey and
Speaker 6: a Sean, or two pairs of friends who are dating
Speaker 6: each other, right, it means that you had the opportunity
Speaker 6: to have to Panga and Angela be their own Corey
Speaker 6: and Sean, and they could have been scheming to do things,
Speaker 6: or making mistakes or miscommunicat you know, And they did
Speaker 6: a little bit of that with a dancing episode, right,
Speaker 6: but I wanted more that, Like any scene with the
Speaker 6: two of you making decisions or having your own anything
Speaker 6: separate from us, it would have been great. And like
Speaker 6: especially watching in the Starry Night episode when you guys
Speaker 6: had scenes were you talking and you know, you're still
Speaker 6: talking about Korey and guys, but it was funny and
Speaker 6: Trina was hysterical and you had like banter and like
Speaker 6: also with the letter, like these were great scenes. So
Speaker 6: if you guys had been given your own B plot,
Speaker 6: C plot, anything that then we had to react to
Speaker 6: as opposed to us always you know, Corey and Sean
Speaker 6: always initiating whatever the conflict was, would have been so
Speaker 6: easy and so fun and appreciated. But you know, so
Speaker 6: I think anything with Angela.
Speaker 3: Because I think at one point they're like, oh, we're
Speaker 3: best friends, and I was like, when did that happen?
Speaker 7: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, now it's exactly I think.
Speaker 9: If I had to pick something, it would have been
Speaker 9: it would have been a massive change to the show.
Speaker 9: But when I think that was necessary or needed, which
Speaker 9: is the they totally missed the boat on the will
Speaker 9: they won't they?
Speaker 5: I think they should.
Speaker 9: Corey and Tapanga should have broken up, and they should
Speaker 9: have been broken up for a season, and they should
Speaker 9: have dated other people and they should have seen what
Speaker 9: else was out there, and it would have led to
Speaker 9: whole different groups of storylines. Wow, I did meet somebody
Speaker 9: I like different, or oh it's and then are they
Speaker 9: going to get back together?
Speaker 3: What happens?
Speaker 5: Are they going to kiss this night?
Speaker 9: I think they just left a whole bunch of stories
Speaker 9: on the table.
Speaker 6: By now also would have forced the writers to include
Speaker 6: Topanga in a way that she's not just the girlfriend,
Speaker 6: because you know, if they if they were broken up,
Speaker 6: but she is still a regular on the show, they
Speaker 6: would have had to account for this person's presence on
Speaker 6: the show and in our lives, which would have been
Speaker 6: great because it would have been an opportunity to be like, oh,
Speaker 6: Corey and Tobanka actually do have a friendship, They actually
Speaker 6: do talk about these things, Sean and Tapanga actually talk
Speaker 6: about things other than corn like. Any of that would
Speaker 6: have just made the show richer and better, and Topanga
Speaker 6: richer character.
Speaker 8: Yeah, you talk about it in Eric Hollywood about by
Speaker 8: the way, I agree with you. We've just done the
Speaker 8: rewatch and I completely forgot that the subplot or the
Speaker 8: b plot of Eric Hollywood is chicken pox. But in
Speaker 8: that episode we actually do get one on one with
Speaker 8: Sean and Topanga, and it's like, that's that's a great thing,
Speaker 8: and we want more of that. You want to see
Speaker 8: more dynamics. And I think, like, I look to you
Speaker 8: guys like Pod meets World. I love listening to you
Speaker 8: because it also gives me an insight to television, which
Speaker 8: I love and I grew up watching. And I think
Speaker 8: that as I look at other ensemble casts, you're like, Oh,
Speaker 8: what makes it magical is when you do get time
Speaker 8: with different unexpected pairings.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you're right.
Speaker 9: I'm just thinking about now. My head is going to
Speaker 9: where all the stories could have gone. I mean an
Speaker 9: episode down the line where maybe Tonga starts dating Jack,
Speaker 9: like you never know. You could have done so because
Speaker 9: friend groups, when you're all in a friend group, you know,
Speaker 9: people hook up, you go, this one goes with this one.
Speaker 7: That's so.
Speaker 9: I mean, they're each Tapanga secretly as a boyfriend, and
Speaker 9: it's a whole conversation with Angelo, it's a whole thing.
Speaker 9: Why should I I can't tell Corey, It's like, you're single,
Speaker 9: What do you mean you can't. They could have done
Speaker 9: so much with it, which then would have also established
Speaker 9: the women as characters on their own, which then when
Speaker 9: we all get into college, then we're all together, and
Speaker 9: then you know, everybody, we're all separate characters. We've all got,
Speaker 9: you know, really distinguished personalities, and now you go from there.
Speaker 9: It would have I think they left a lot on
Speaker 9: the table, and they did it all for the fact
Speaker 9: that we have to be together. The universe wants us together.
Speaker 9: We can't spend more than two episodes apart. And I
Speaker 9: think they they really drop the ball on that.
Speaker 7: Is that what it is?
Speaker 8: And I asked that question because one of the things
Speaker 8: that we've always wanted to know is like what what
Speaker 8: do you think the motivation is it? Is it the showrunner,
Speaker 8: is it the network? What is like keeping these things protected?
Speaker 8: And like like down to we've talked about this before.
Speaker 8: The story seems to like bend over backwards to keep
Speaker 8: Corey in good light. Like in the drinking episode, for example,
Speaker 8: Corey brings the liquor and the story isn't about Hey, Corey,
Speaker 8: you brought liquor. And by the way, you know that
Speaker 8: your best friend's father has a history with alcohol and
Speaker 8: you're aware, Like if that's not the lesson, the lesson
Speaker 8: at the end of it is Sean, you have a
Speaker 8: drinking problem, and you're like what, And then the same
Speaker 8: thing with the breakup. The breakup happens, and the the
Speaker 8: story arc itself is like Topanga, you ruined us.
Speaker 7: So we were like, is that is that? Showrunners?
Speaker 8: Is that network? What keeps the main character protected? And
Speaker 8: do you think that there was anything that like could
Speaker 8: have helped the show.
Speaker 1: Expand I think overall there is a There is definitely
Speaker 1: a network desire, at least to a certain degree, a
Speaker 1: network desire to keep all of the main characters somewhat likable.
Speaker 1: They can have flaws, but you have to be able
Speaker 1: to understand why they have those flaws, like, oh, Sean
Speaker 1: is a tortured soul, but we know why and we
Speaker 1: have empathy for him. So you have to be able
Speaker 1: to have empathy for your lead characters.
Speaker 4: But I think the.
Speaker 1: Very straightforward answer for who's protecting Corey is it's Michael Jacobs.
Speaker 1: It was Michael Jacobs writing a show from his POV
Speaker 1: and he is supposed to represent the Cory character. And
Speaker 1: I don't know that Michael necessarily takes blame for you know,
Speaker 1: takes blame for anything.
Speaker 7: Does that apply to Jack too?
Speaker 8: And I asked because Jack, as you said earlier, I
Speaker 8: feel like I think one of you mentioned it in
Speaker 8: the beginning, if Jack was allowed to be flawed, if
Speaker 8: he was allowed to like be hated a little bit,
Speaker 8: a little too snobby or one of the things that
Speaker 8: I and this isn't like much of a spoiler, but
Speaker 8: like a head cannon in me, it's like Jack doesn't
Speaker 8: like Corey.
Speaker 7: They and it would be great to get like.
Speaker 8: An outside perspective of like someone who's not as endeared
Speaker 8: to Corey, doesn't have the history so he can kind
Speaker 8: of see things objectively.
Speaker 7: And I feel like there are preto times where we're like, well, why.
Speaker 8: Didn't we make Jack a little bit more unlikable? And
Speaker 8: then again this story, Oh god, it.
Speaker 6: Would have been so good if he was like wearing
Speaker 6: a three piece suit and has all this money and
Speaker 6: like it's really nice to Sean but also just lives
Speaker 6: this completely different lifestyle that they will never understand each other,
Speaker 6: and then they're constantly trying to like it would have been.
Speaker 6: It could have created so many great fireworks and sparks,
Speaker 6: and yeah, I don't know. I think they just didn't.
Speaker 6: They just didn't have an idea. They just came in.
Speaker 6: You know, it's like, oh, we got to get him
Speaker 6: on the show. And I think they were Yeah, I
Speaker 6: think they were worried that he would be unlikable. But
Speaker 6: that's such a mistake, such a mistake.
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, nobody's unlikable. But I mean, when you think
Speaker 5: about it, nobody on the show is unlikable, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Okay, So I have a question just because we're
Speaker 3: talking about Michael Jacobs. You guys shared a few stories
Speaker 3: of Michael just maybe just giving you guys a little
Speaker 3: bit too hard of a time on set or during
Speaker 3: script readings, seemingly to like provoke a certain performance or
Speaker 3: teach a lesson, like the Shakespeare incident with Will or
Speaker 3: like killing off jenniferluff Hewitt just to make a point,
Speaker 3: Like do you think these were I mean, these seemed
Speaker 3: like they were unnecessary challenges, And I guess I would say, like,
Speaker 3: in today's acting world, how do you think you could
Speaker 3: like challenge actors without going to such extremes?
Speaker 8: Because that said, I will we joke about it often,
Speaker 8: but there does seem to be a difference in the
Speaker 8: way that like child actors act. Now it seems like
Speaker 8: people look at acting and studying acting differently, so we
Speaker 8: are like, how do you get it to where like
Speaker 8: the child actor understands the joke and like you are
Speaker 8: embracing the humor or like the spirit of the humor
Speaker 8: without having to be like this is how you say it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you empower them, I mean you, you you you
Speaker 6: support them and you empower them to take risks, and
Speaker 6: it will always be better, like, it will always be
Speaker 6: better if if an actor gets to make it their own,
Speaker 6: no matter how young they are, if they get to
Speaker 6: you know. And the reality is, even if you have
Speaker 6: the perfect line reading in your in your mind a
Speaker 6: rhythm that a joke probably is best delivered in, you
Speaker 6: can wait all week and do that. When the cameras
Speaker 6: are rolling, just be like, oh, by the way, for
Speaker 6: this next take, try it this way, or I want
Speaker 6: to hear it this way, just once for me, because
Speaker 6: this is the way I wrote it. You can do
Speaker 6: that respectfully and and and and still empower people to feel,
Speaker 6: you know, because the result is actors make less choices
Speaker 6: when they feel that they're going to make the wrong
Speaker 6: choice and be told that they're they did they did
Speaker 6: a bad performance, and they did the wrong thing, and
Speaker 6: they the point, and why didn't you read it this way?
Speaker 6: That's the way, the only way that this works. It's
Speaker 6: my way, and you have to say it just like this.
Speaker 6: Eventually you're gonna have actors who just show up and
Speaker 6: say tell me how to do it, which is what
Speaker 6: happened to me. I mean, you know when I left,
Speaker 6: by the time I left Boyban's world, that was that
Speaker 6: was a kind of actor. I was kind of proud
Speaker 6: of that. I was like, hey, just tell me what
Speaker 6: to do. I'll do it, you know, like basically I'm
Speaker 6: an instrument. Use me and I'll just you know. And
Speaker 6: what that meant was that I wasn't creative on my own.
Speaker 6: I wasn't making my own choices, which as an adult
Speaker 6: actor I can be like, oh my god, that's like
Speaker 6: that's what makes a great actor is when you know,
Speaker 6: especially as a director or writer, when you're opposite somebody
Speaker 6: who's bringing their own energy the way that like I
Speaker 6: think will brought all the time, like we'll always have this,
Speaker 6: you know, and and I think, but you know, for
Speaker 6: for the rest of us, it was I felt beat down,
Speaker 6: you know, like by the end of the boy.
Speaker 9: As an actor, it truly is a bad decision is
Speaker 9: better than no decision at all, right, you know, and
Speaker 9: and you know, again I've talked about this. I had
Speaker 9: a different relationship with Michael, A slightly different relationship with Michael.
Speaker 9: But Michael is very very family oriented. So in his mind,
Speaker 9: especially Danielle ryder Ben, those were his kids. That's how
Speaker 9: he looked at it. These are my children. And so
Speaker 9: I think it came it came from a place and
Speaker 9: again I'm not trying to speak for Michael. I do
Speaker 9: not know, but I think it came from a place
Speaker 9: of he genuinely believed, he thought he was doing the
Speaker 9: right thing for them and their careers. I think it
Speaker 9: came from a place of now, if you do it
Speaker 9: this way, you're gonna get the laugh, You're gonna understand
Speaker 9: the laugh, and people are gonna like you more, and
Speaker 9: your career is going to be better. Like that's where
Speaker 9: Michael was coming from. Again, not the best way to
Speaker 9: handle young actors or children at all. And it's funny
Speaker 9: because you were talking about the differences in how child
Speaker 9: acting has changed Shameless Plug. But other podcasts I do,
Speaker 9: Magical Rewind. We just interviewed Christopher Knight, who played Peter Brady,
Speaker 9: on The Brady Bunch, and I asked him, I was like, well,
Speaker 9: was it like being a child actor in the seventies
Speaker 9: and sixties and seventies is like, Oh, we didn't exist.
Speaker 9: He's like, we didn't have dressing rooms, they didn't give
Speaker 9: us parking spots. They didn't care if we were the
Speaker 9: ones who signed our contracts. We did not matter. We
Speaker 9: were there to say the lines the way we were
Speaker 9: supposed to say the lines, and we were supposed to
Speaker 9: be We're still from an age where children are supposed
Speaker 9: to be seen and not heard. And that He's like,
Speaker 9: that was how it was as an actor too, to
Speaker 9: the point where he said he didn't even audition with
Speaker 9: lines for The Brady Bunch. He said, I sat down
Speaker 9: at the desk with the guy with Sherwood Schwartz who
Speaker 9: created the show, and he put some toys on the
Speaker 9: table in front of me, and we started playing and
Speaker 9: I walked out and I had the part, Like it.
Speaker 5: Wasn't even about acting.
Speaker 9: So we see the changes of how they're they're coming.
Speaker 9: And now obviously you get child actors that come out
Speaker 9: that are multi talented.
Speaker 5: You get a Sabrina Carpenter.
Speaker 6: Who I think, yeah, child acting has gotten so much
Speaker 6: better in general.
Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly who I think.
Speaker 6: Yeah, your average child actor now is like so much different,
Speaker 6: so much better.
Speaker 9: Because it's getting better all the time. It's getting better
Speaker 9: all the time. We were right in the middle there
Speaker 9: where we weren't the seventies and eighties kids were. Thankfully,
Speaker 9: it seemed like the days of robbing the liquor stores
Speaker 9: and really having terrible times and serious, horrible drug app
Speaker 9: problems were it did happen. We're slowly starting to decrease,
Speaker 9: and now I think it's even better than it was.
Speaker 9: But it's you know, it's a process all the way through.
Speaker 9: And Michael was in the cusp of being one of
Speaker 9: those producers from back in the day and one of
Speaker 9: those producers now.
Speaker 5: So yeah, it was a strange dynamic, especially for these three.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's funny that you say that.
Speaker 8: It reminds me of I don't know if you saw
Speaker 8: Andrew McCarthy's documentary.
Speaker 7: Brats, but he talks about how like in.
Speaker 8: The nineteen eighties, late nineties, like young Hollywood is a
Speaker 8: new thing, like the idea that like the child or
Speaker 8: the teen could be the start or new So you
Speaker 8: like you're giving contacts that like, oh, the nineties is
Speaker 8: this transition period of like admitting that children can And
Speaker 8: so I guess they obviously weren't going to get it
Speaker 8: right on the first go around, and it's good to
Speaker 8: hear that, like it's changing now and that like actors
Speaker 8: have different child actors have a better chance at like
Speaker 8: the craft. But to that, I want to say, you
Speaker 8: already got your praises from the cast. But we also
Speaker 8: watched Eric Hollywood, and in that episode we were like,
Speaker 8: Will can do anything, And I just think that it's
Speaker 8: important because knowing that you know what your experience was
Speaker 8: in acting, we want to reaffirm that, like you could
Speaker 8: do anything, like the.
Speaker 7: Talent that you have, like the I think in that.
Speaker 8: Same episode you made like an occidental joke and like
Speaker 8: I'm for five minutes.
Speaker 7: Straight because I'm like, that's all the top of its head.
Speaker 8: But like the ability to like then witch into drama
Speaker 8: is amazing, And so I think what we want more
Speaker 8: than anything is for the Wills of the future to
Speaker 8: like know that they can, you know, do anything and
Speaker 8: like not feel trapped by the system.
Speaker 9: Well that's very sweet, and I will say, yes, it
Speaker 9: was that was a that was a tough week for me.
Speaker 9: But for the most part, unlike Writer and Danielle and Ben,
Speaker 9: Michael gave me a lot of freedom. He really did,
Speaker 9: which is which is was why it was sometimes so
Speaker 9: strange to see how different it was with with writer,
Speaker 9: Ben and Danielle. And it's also because they were carrying
Speaker 9: the show. I mean they were, you know, at least
Speaker 9: they you know, at least we thought they were. And
Speaker 9: now we look back in it and it really was
Speaker 9: rider show. But it was you know, writer was carrying
Speaker 9: a lot of it.
Speaker 5: And the character you were changing.
Speaker 6: I think a lot of it is too just age.
Speaker 6: You know, you just came in older, and I think
Speaker 6: that there was less pressure on the character of Eric
Speaker 6: to be a certain thing, so there was you got
Speaker 6: to define it, and they, you know, Michael saw you
Speaker 6: discover it and then followed where you were going as
Speaker 6: an actor, which is the way ideally it should go, right,
Speaker 6: is that you get a cast and then you start working.
Speaker 6: And I think for me he did the same thing.
Speaker 6: It was just towards this dramatic, less comedic side, which
Speaker 6: you know, I think he saw that I could do
Speaker 6: and kept kept you know, writing towards, which I thought
Speaker 6: was cool in a lot of ways. But yeah, I
Speaker 6: think especially when it came to comedy, like I feel
Speaker 6: like I gave up after season four. You know, it's
Speaker 6: just like I just don't even try to make jokes.
Speaker 6: I don't even try to be funny. I'm just like
Speaker 6: kind of half asking any of the comedy stuff, taking
Speaker 6: the drama seriously. But I and I think that's in part,
Speaker 6: you know, because when I watched those first three or
Speaker 6: four seasons, I was like, oh, I was actually funny
Speaker 6: at times, like I couldn't do very but but but
Speaker 6: don't you feel like by the by the end of
Speaker 6: the show, like we all sort of Writer doesn't do comedy.
Speaker 6: Writer is not a comedy guy, which is strange because
Speaker 6: you're yeah, weird, Yeah I should have I don't know.
Speaker 5: You got the brunt of the Dawson's Creek.
Speaker 7: Push is a problem.
Speaker 5: You You became the star of our Dawson's Creek, and
Speaker 5: that was how they went.
Speaker 9: Yeah, you had the hair, so and you had the
Speaker 9: and you were in all the teen magazines and you
Speaker 9: were the kid.
Speaker 6: So because I should have been on Dawson's Creek, let's
Speaker 6: just be Dawson's Creek.
Speaker 9: You just didn't want to wait rider, I don't run away.
Speaker 3: Okay, So this actually transitions a little bit into my
Speaker 3: next question, which is, you know, we talked about Eric Hollywood,
Speaker 3: which you guys loved, we actually felt differently about, Like.
Speaker 7: There's so many episodes this season where we were like
Speaker 7: is this canon or not?
Speaker 3: Like did the Salem Cats show up or not? Like
Speaker 3: where are we? And and like the Cannon aspect. And
Speaker 3: I guess, like you guys do a lot of experimental episodes.
Speaker 3: What makes an experimental episode like and then the Rashan
Speaker 3: or like Eric Holly would work and what makes it
Speaker 3: not work? And you know what kind of experimental episodes
Speaker 3: do you think would have fit into the show. Do
Speaker 3: you think you should have done like a real hardcore
Speaker 3: Dawson's Creek parody episode, or what other episodes are themes
Speaker 3: do you think you could have played with?
Speaker 9: I personally think they work. That's that's how I even
Speaker 9: wanted to do. No, No, that one didn't work. You're right,
Speaker 9: I know that one, But that's a that was a
Speaker 9: forced episode.
Speaker 5: Had to do that because of this Salem Witch.
Speaker 6: Salem Witch worked for you? That yes, that totally worths Witches.
Speaker 9: It was such a funny and but one of the
Speaker 9: reasons is because you were so funny in that one rider.
Speaker 9: You were hysterical and like, hey I'm here with the coven, like,
Speaker 9: oh god, it was great.
Speaker 5: But yeah, it's I.
Speaker 6: Think it's best when when when it's clear what we're
Speaker 6: parody parodid, you know, like I think like and then
Speaker 6: there were Sean, It's like it's set up, we're doing
Speaker 6: this genre thing with the World War two one. I'm like,
Speaker 6: are we making fun of World War two movies? I
Speaker 6: think we're you know, And they were trying to do
Speaker 6: this like dramatic mellow you know, to Panga Cory thing,
Speaker 6: but that just didn't connect. I wanted it to be
Speaker 6: like referencing specific things. So I think, like, don't we
Speaker 6: do a Casablanca episode down the line, Like I think
Speaker 6: something like that is better than just like completely unhinged.
Speaker 6: And I think even Eric Hollywood had a focus of
Speaker 6: we're making fun of ourselves and that it's like it's
Speaker 6: like the audience is invited in to know what the
Speaker 6: absurdity is sort of about. So yeah, I would say
Speaker 6: that that like if you know, and I think like
Speaker 6: the nineteen fifties episode did work for me, mostly because
Speaker 6: I didn't know Happy Days. I didn't get the I
Speaker 6: don't get why these guys are walking in and asking
Speaker 6: about Potzy or what. I don't even know what any
Speaker 6: of that was. That's right, but you know that's where
Speaker 6: I go like, what are we referencing? So I think
Speaker 6: the more you're clear, like what what it is that
Speaker 6: we are making fun of, or what what heightened world
Speaker 6: we're entering, I think it's fine to do it, but
Speaker 6: we just sometimes had a little muddled entry into those
Speaker 6: those worlds.
Speaker 1: I think some of what we're missing though, is that
Speaker 1: it worked at the time on the night when you
Speaker 1: were watching all four shows you normally watch from eight
Speaker 1: to ten participate in the same thing.
Speaker 4: When you watch them out of that.
Speaker 1: Situation thirty years later and you're like, what, why would
Speaker 1: they do this episode? But if you think about the
Speaker 1: fact that they were not thinking about what's this episode
Speaker 1: going to be like thirty years from now, they're thinking
Speaker 1: it's going to be fun for everyone who tunes in
Speaker 1: to their normal ABC night and there going to see
Speaker 1: all four shows doing a slight crossover like Synergy is
Speaker 1: going to be. You know, it makes sense then, and
Speaker 1: I think That's that's part of why it's harder to
Speaker 1: judge fairly now because I know we got that response
Speaker 1: a lot when we were like, this makes no sense
Speaker 1: and people were like, listen, you have to put yourself
Speaker 1: in our shoes.
Speaker 4: When we tuned in.
Speaker 1: This was thrilling. It was great. Like even the Disney
Speaker 1: World episode. Yeah, they were like we loved these, the promos,
Speaker 1: the shows all going there, and we were like, right,
Speaker 1: it would have felt different in nineteen ninety six.
Speaker 6: Go hang Out with Dolphins, Yes, can't wait to just
Speaker 6: get to that tank after that much.
Speaker 4: Training exactly put in that much effort.
Speaker 5: But no, it is you can't.
Speaker 9: It's these these episodes have a difficult time existing in
Speaker 9: a vacuum, and I still believe that the personally. I
Speaker 9: think the reason that and then there were Seawan worked
Speaker 9: so well is because we were just making each other laugh.
Speaker 9: That's why we were That's was our audience that week
Speaker 9: was each other.
Speaker 5: And to me, that shows, and.
Speaker 8: It does show on camera whenever, like like there's just
Speaker 8: like a chemistry or like something that comes through on camera.
Speaker 8: But it's very clear that like you all feel comfortable.
Speaker 8: You talk very often about like the director made you
Speaker 8: feel comfortable, like and it.
Speaker 7: Just comes through and it's great to see. Yeah.
Speaker 8: And then Danielle to your point, one of the things
Speaker 8: that Tony and I talked about was, even with the
Speaker 8: mellow drama, like the fact that it gets very soap
Speaker 8: operay or it gets serious, I'm not gonna lie for
Speaker 8: the audience and for us at the time, being the
Speaker 8: age or like slightly younger than the age of these characters,
Speaker 8: there was nothing more important than the Lauren story arc.
Speaker 8: There was nothing more engaging than Corey and Tapanga getting engaged.
Speaker 8: Like I will admit, like in a vacuum thirty years
Speaker 8: later you're like, what are you doing? But the time
Speaker 8: that we were there, nothing else could have been more
Speaker 8: important to our totally Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, and we did talk about that a little bit,
Speaker 1: that that some of what maybe people loved so much
Speaker 1: about the show is that the inner feelings and monologues
Speaker 1: and stories teenagers were feeling but not expressing. They were
Speaker 1: watching teenagers express them and getting to live out a
Speaker 1: bit of a fantasy of like, oh, this is a
Speaker 1: couple who is saying the things out loud that I'm
Speaker 1: not saying.
Speaker 4: My boyfriend love, our love is true love. Are we
Speaker 4: gonna spend forever together? What kind of a house do
Speaker 4: you want to live in? How many children do you
Speaker 4: want to have? I have those racing, hormonal thoughts.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying them because I know that that feels
Speaker 1: kind of crazy at sixteen, But watching them do it,
Speaker 1: I'm going, yes, look at it.
Speaker 4: It's working.
Speaker 1: They're gonna do the things I'm dreaming about, And so
Speaker 1: maybe that is part of what was so engrossing about it.
Speaker 4: Do you guys?
Speaker 1: Do you guys remember hearing about there being the voting
Speaker 1: at the time, about voting whether or not Corey and
Speaker 1: Tepega should get married.
Speaker 7: We found the website?
Speaker 1: Is it the website of voting about whether or not
Speaker 1: they should get married?
Speaker 4: Or is it of a wedding web s?
Speaker 3: We found the wedding website website?
Speaker 7: Didn't someone?
Speaker 8: I feel like one of our listeners sent us like
Speaker 8: there was like a whether a poll a poll or
Speaker 8: like a print out or something in TV guide where
Speaker 8: it was like call and let us know, ye, But
Speaker 8: I did not. I can't remember at the time, but
Speaker 8: I do remember that like Boy meets World appointment television,
Speaker 8: what's going to happen? Like I that is so vividly
Speaker 8: like inside me of like that finale, in those finalis
Speaker 8: and the proposal in general.
Speaker 5: Would voted what would you have vote? What would you
Speaker 5: have voted? Would you have voted to get married? Would
Speaker 5: you vote they wouldn't go.
Speaker 8: As a child or sorry, as a tween? They are
Speaker 8: getting married, and I understand why that happened as someone
Speaker 8: who is older. And this is actually like one of
Speaker 8: the things that with the proposal and every and the
Speaker 8: breakup story arc, we kind of agree with you on
Speaker 8: and we want to know, like, what do you think
Speaker 8: the show could have done to like show the relationship
Speaker 8: ups and downs that we have, like the breakup story art,
Speaker 8: and make it work in a healthy way. Because while
Speaker 8: I still think that it's great that they break up,
Speaker 8: or even that as we talked about the idea that
Speaker 8: they are faded to be together and she proposes, that's
Speaker 8: fine as long as you explore what went wrong and
Speaker 8: you actually show the conversation of like, hey, this is
Speaker 8: what we broke up about, this is why we broke up,
Speaker 8: this is why we were deciding to get back together,
Speaker 8: Like you know, those things actually really influence as a
Speaker 8: mature person watching the exact same.
Speaker 10: Storyline yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, I just think the
Speaker 10: love as faith like logic is just really self serving,
Speaker 10: you know, and so and it reduces, it removes any
Speaker 10: conflict resolution that might have been productive.
Speaker 6: Right because the idea of like Corey did a bad
Speaker 6: thing and then Topanga, you know, maybe trapped him, you know,
Speaker 6: all the things that they do to each other. If
Speaker 6: you actually look at it, you're like, yeah, this is
Speaker 6: kind of the stuff. But the but the fix, the
Speaker 6: solution is always but we're destined and I have to
Speaker 6: just have faith in this and I have to overlook
Speaker 6: my partner's flaws and my flaws in the name of
Speaker 6: this you know love, which is just pure faith and
Speaker 6: that you know, to me, that is that's the danger, right, Like,
Speaker 6: because you could very easily say all the things, according
Speaker 6: to Banka, say about a truly abusive relationship, a stalking
Speaker 6: abusive relationship could be the arguments for why they should
Speaker 6: be together would be exactly the same, and that that
Speaker 6: makes it a pretty bad argument.
Speaker 1: In mind, and it and it gives you a real
Speaker 1: easy out to not have to develop attributes about the
Speaker 1: other people. Like We've talked multiple times about how Tapanga
Speaker 1: has said early on in the show. There were there
Speaker 1: were things about we're in a rut. They used to
Speaker 1: have those discussions, we're in a rut, we're not having
Speaker 1: fun together anymore. Then that conversation completely stopped and we
Speaker 1: no longer knew what even what does We had a
Speaker 1: whole discussion what does Topanga find attractive about Corey?
Speaker 4: What the things?
Speaker 1: Why does she love him so much? She never names them?
Speaker 1: She mentions that he's cute. She often mention She mentions
Speaker 1: that he's cute, that he's sexy, little Corey.
Speaker 4: Like, we get that Tapanga is physically.
Speaker 1: Attracted to Corey, and we also commented, but so is
Speaker 1: every woman who comes onto the show. Tapanga is irresistible.
Speaker 1: Corey is irresistible to females. But there's never anything that's like.
Speaker 1: He challenges me, he pushes me, he encourages me, he
Speaker 1: supports me, he loves me. He's so funny. His journalistic experience, Yes,
Speaker 1: what we never We don't ever know what those things are.
Speaker 4: And truly I don't know that Corey.
Speaker 1: There's we have the jelly bean scene, but even in
Speaker 1: that jelly bean scene, there's no specifics. There's I can
Speaker 1: talk to Tapanga about anything. What if you Actually, if
Speaker 1: we had developed their relationship enough, and I think writer
Speaker 1: is the one who made this point, if we had
Speaker 1: developed their relationship enough by showing us exactly who those
Speaker 1: two people were and what they meant to each other,
Speaker 1: we would have very specific things to mention, like that
Speaker 1: time Topanga and I discussed this and she told me
Speaker 1: and that took a light bulb on and I had
Speaker 1: never thought of that, and like, but we didn't have
Speaker 1: any of those.
Speaker 6: It was just monkey bars.
Speaker 3: One of the biggest things that we felt was overlooked
Speaker 3: at this season was the fact that Tapanga is clearly
Speaker 3: afraid to be a small fish in a big pond,
Speaker 3: and that's never really addressed. That could have been a
Speaker 3: great way for Corey to support her in the graduation episode,
Speaker 3: but like, no one ever challenges I mean, I guess
Speaker 3: we'll go into season six and we'll learn more about this,
Speaker 3: but no one really challenges to Panga on why she
Speaker 3: doesn't want to go to Yale. It's seemingly for Corey,
Speaker 3: but it's not. Actually when you think about it, you say, she.
Speaker 1: Doesn't want to be a small fish in a big pond,
Speaker 1: and yet that is probably something I'll pick up on
Speaker 1: in season six, based on what I've heard, because there's zero,
Speaker 1: in my opinion, zero hinting of that.
Speaker 6: Oh well, she said, you said in the scene with
Speaker 6: PHOENI I'm scared that then I have to be somebody
Speaker 6: who goes to Yale. Remember there is an imposter scenery speech.
Speaker 4: No, it's about my speech about.
Speaker 1: But now it's a speech that because he says your
Speaker 1: speech is going to be fine, give yourself a break,
Speaker 1: and I say yeah, but now it's a speech by
Speaker 1: someone who's going to Yale, which means fine isn't going
Speaker 1: to be enough. So that's about my speech in high school,
Speaker 1: and now I have there is zero hinting. As a
Speaker 1: matter of fact, the minute Corey says two different times
Speaker 1: in the in the in the Things Change episode, I
Speaker 1: think is the first time he maybe says and to
Speaker 1: Pang is going to go to Yale, and you see
Speaker 1: my face go hmm okay. But definitely in the graduation episode.
Speaker 1: The way it comes across to me is the minute
Speaker 1: she is convinced he really does he really does support
Speaker 1: her going, she gets lighter and she goes, wow, thanks Corey,
Speaker 1: Like I feel so good knowing you support me doing
Speaker 1: this and that and the only it appears that the
Speaker 1: only thing weighing her down is the idea that she
Speaker 1: doesn't want to disappoint Corey, and once that's taken away,
Speaker 1: she brightens up.
Speaker 4: Now I did mention in the.
Speaker 1: Graduation episode, It's possible what I'm seeing is her actually thinking, Wow,
Speaker 1: he passed a test. Him supporting me was what I
Speaker 1: wanted to see. Will he support me even though it's
Speaker 1: not what's best for him? And when he does, I go,
Speaker 1: that's the kind of man I'm willing to give everything
Speaker 1: up for. And so I don't know, But all I
Speaker 1: know is that what I what I see happen in
Speaker 1: front of me is that she brightens up like Wow,
Speaker 1: thank you. And it to me, seeing just the graduation
Speaker 1: episode and not season six, yet, I think that's a
Speaker 1: woman who wants to go to Yale.
Speaker 7: Do you think Corey Topenga.
Speaker 1: I don't think Corey listens to tapegaever, And so to me,
Speaker 1: the answer is no, if you don't listen to the
Speaker 1: person you are with, ever, no, And and you know
Speaker 1: we've we've often joked about the fact that he is
Speaker 1: a very hard time staying faithful to her when she's
Speaker 1: ever not in the same room. No, I don't necessarily think.
Speaker 1: I don't think he he knows Tapanga. I don't think
Speaker 1: he listens to her. I don't think he knows her.
Speaker 5: And no, no, we don't know who Tapanga is.
Speaker 3: So correct.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's kind of hard to fault him for that. Yeh.
Speaker 9: And he spent all night listening to another woman. I
Speaker 9: mean that was the whole crux of the episode, is
Speaker 9: that they really talked and got to know each other,
Speaker 9: and you know, yeah, it was. It's so it's kind
Speaker 9: of sad to go back and watch it a little bit,
Speaker 9: which is the thing, because you do when you are younger.
Speaker 9: I have to imagine and I'm sure I was seventeen
Speaker 9: when it started, but when you are twelve thirteen, in
Speaker 9: your watch it, it does probably seem like it's fate
Speaker 9: and they're supposed to be to get it. And it
Speaker 9: almost is kind of an interesting look at the dynamics
Speaker 9: between childhood love quote unquote. And I would never say
Speaker 9: real love, because you are really in love when you're
Speaker 9: twelve or thirteen.
Speaker 7: It might be an.
Speaker 9: Adolescent love, but it's a real love that needs to
Speaker 9: be respected compared to an adult love that also comes
Speaker 9: with responsibility and so it looks like it's almost healthy
Speaker 9: when you're twelve or thirteen, but looking back at it
Speaker 9: now that I'm forty eight, I'm looking kind of going like, wow,
Speaker 9: this is this is not a good relationship at least
Speaker 9: at this point. This is not a good relationship. And
Speaker 9: it really hit me during the Heartbreak Corey episode because
Speaker 9: it was like, Wow, I should not instantly be rooting
Speaker 9: for Corey to be with Lauren. And if Corey and
Speaker 9: Tapango were a strong couple that we've got really gotten
Speaker 9: to know and really gotten.
Speaker 5: To see how much they were in love, I wouldn't instantly.
Speaker 9: Be going, Huh, Corey might have something here with this
Speaker 9: Lauren character. So it really made me kind of look
Speaker 9: at the whole thing differently. And I don't know what
Speaker 9: happens in six and seven. I can't wait to Maybe
Speaker 9: it does get deeper.
Speaker 6: In, but it goes to show if you think about
Speaker 6: when to Pang is first introduced, right, the idea is
Speaker 6: that she is this very developed character, this very unique,
Speaker 6: interesting person, the same way that even I mean, she's
Speaker 6: not as extreme, But Lauren is given a character to
Speaker 6: seduce Corey for so Corey is going to fall in
Speaker 6: love with a very interesting character. But the second that
Speaker 6: character actually joins the cast becomes a regular No, we're
Speaker 6: gonna you know, she's going to become a two dimensional
Speaker 6: sort of stand in for femininity, like you know.
Speaker 9: But at least when we first met Lauren, she had
Speaker 9: a full character. When we met to Pangas, she had
Speaker 9: a full character. When we meet Ricky, they's nothing. So
Speaker 9: that's what I mean. It's like, well when whenst just
Speaker 9: dum like.
Speaker 7: It doesn't It's just like.
Speaker 5: Lauren was so real.
Speaker 9: That's what I loved about Lauren and Corey is was
Speaker 9: so real, where Ricky was like a cartoon character.
Speaker 5: And it was once again, what is to Panga see
Speaker 5: in him?
Speaker 9: Much like I say what is to Pangasy and Corey, Like,
Speaker 9: you know, I would love to have you meet Topanga's guy.
Speaker 9: You want to you want to see that at some point,
Speaker 9: and you never just never did.
Speaker 8: So it's so funny that you say that because I
Speaker 8: remember you asked, like, what was the influence of seeing
Speaker 8: Corey in Tapanga as children and then growing up with
Speaker 8: this idea of like this is love? And I think
Speaker 8: that that's kind of like what I always come back
Speaker 8: is like when we grew up, we watched this as
Speaker 8: a template like it was boy Mes World was the
Speaker 8: show that taught you about life while also entertaining you.
Speaker 8: And so to watch this, I know Tony himself has
Speaker 8: like confessed he marked a lot of like life goals
Speaker 8: or like relationship norms based on the behavior of Koreyan
Speaker 8: to Panga, and so that, Yeah, geez, it is important
Speaker 8: to just kind of know the weight of these actions,
Speaker 8: which is why I agree. I would have loved to
Speaker 8: see like Cory date Lauren and actually see, you know
Speaker 8: what what habits that he has with Tipanga kind of
Speaker 8: transfer over. And he's been like, oh, maybe I'm the problem.
Speaker 8: Maybe there are things that I need to work on
Speaker 8: for Tapanga to date Ricky even and see where that goes.
Speaker 8: And I think you have talked about it before, but
Speaker 8: like maybe if we like shuffle the episodes a little
Speaker 8: bit even, it makes little bit more sense. Yeah, just
Speaker 8: time wise and give us that breath of like actually
Speaker 8: having that breakup mean something and having them come back
Speaker 8: as two characters who've grown.
Speaker 5: Ross and Rachel were apart for like six seasons.
Speaker 9: That's what made it so amazing, is oh my god,
Speaker 9: are were gonna get another Ross, Rachel arc what's happening here?
Speaker 9: Oh my god, she's dating Joey. Now, how's that gonna affect?
Speaker 9: There was so much that they could mine from that
Speaker 9: that they just well, no, two episodes they're not together,
Speaker 9: and now they're together again.
Speaker 3: It's like, Okay, see this is what we mean. Season
Speaker 3: five is divisive.
Speaker 7: Really quickly.
Speaker 8: We had the when we were talking about Lauren, one
Speaker 8: of like the spin off ideas we had was like,
Speaker 8: Lauren sees these Like one of the reasons why we
Speaker 8: felt Lauren was so comfortable with hitting on Corey is
Speaker 8: she works at this place, she has schools coming in
Speaker 8: and out all the time. She's guys like, you know,
Speaker 8: with their high school loves. So we were like, this
Speaker 8: idea of Lauren just like in the cabin and watching
Speaker 8: the Men of the Week, or like having her have
Speaker 8: to do with all these other stuff is a great
Speaker 8: little spinoff idea.
Speaker 7: That we.
Speaker 1: People Lauren could fall the cute bunny, this cute ski
Speaker 1: Bunny and all the people she falls in love with.
Speaker 5: Ski Bunny nights.
Speaker 1: As I'm sure you guys can tell, we can talk
Speaker 1: to you for hours.
Speaker 4: Sure, So what are some of the.
Speaker 1: Vital questions you want to ask us as we round
Speaker 1: out season five today.
Speaker 3: You know, we've hit on a lot of them already.
Speaker 3: You know, I guess as the show kind of progresses
Speaker 3: into the later seasons, we've noticed that your memories are
Speaker 3: becoming more vivid about what was happening behind the scenes
Speaker 3: or what was going on, Like, do you find season
Speaker 3: five and probably going forward, is it more difficult to
Speaker 3: separate you're on your personal experiences on set from the
Speaker 3: characters that you're watching. It felt like in seasons one
Speaker 3: and two, you guys were a little bit more disconnected
Speaker 3: and you were able to just watch it as a show,
Speaker 3: whereas now it feels maybe more difficult.
Speaker 7: To do that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's funny. I hadn't quite thought about it that way.
Speaker 9: You Know what I'm noticing as the older I get
Speaker 9: on the show is the more I remember what was
Speaker 9: going on in my personal life at the time as
Speaker 9: opposed to what was actually going on in the set.
Speaker 9: And then occasionally an episode will pop up where I'll remember, oh, yeah,
Speaker 9: this week, what But normally I'm watching now and like,
Speaker 9: you know, the necklace I'm wearing or something that's happening.
Speaker 9: I'm then going into what was happening in my real life,
Speaker 9: and that I'm remembering more than anything else.
Speaker 6: That's so that's exactly the way I feel like thinking
Speaker 6: about those The first season is I remember so many
Speaker 6: lines and so many like the blocking and shooting, And
Speaker 6: I think what that was is that it felt like
Speaker 6: having the job of being on a TV show, Like
Speaker 6: the show was this established thing and there were authority
Speaker 6: figures who knew what they were doing and we were
Speaker 6: sort of lucky to be there and excited and like
Speaker 6: the job itself was so cool. Yeah, by fifth season,
Speaker 6: all I cared about was I had midterms, I had,
Speaker 6: I was in college, I was dating. I was like
Speaker 6: my I like nothing about boring betore. And at that point,
Speaker 6: I also think I had seen behind the curtain a
Speaker 6: little bit and realized, like, these adults don't have any
Speaker 6: more authority over the show than I do. Really like
Speaker 6: I'm a big part of this, So I didn't feel
Speaker 6: that sense of like, oh, I have to show up
Speaker 6: to do my job. It was like, no, no, we're
Speaker 6: all in this together as a team, and that's a
Speaker 6: different approach. And so I actually I actually remember on
Speaker 6: set less, but I do remember my personal life more.
Speaker 6: Actually that's not true. I remember being on set, but
Speaker 6: for the behind the scenes conversations in the fun greed
Speaker 6: the actual shooting, I'm like, what I you know, I
Speaker 6: was just not yeah, safe, so easy.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm exactly the same way I remember.
Speaker 1: I know now that like by the time we're at
Speaker 1: the end of this episode, I'm almost about to be seventeen.
Speaker 1: Like when this episode aired, I've just turned seventeen, so
Speaker 1: I know. The last year of my life has been
Speaker 1: driving my own car, which I couldn't wait to do,
Speaker 1: leaving set to go eat lunch, which I also thought
Speaker 1: was the greatest thing ever. Like all of the I'm
Speaker 1: finally feeling more like an adult. Although I'm not an
Speaker 1: official adult, I'm very close and I'm feeling more adult like,
Speaker 1: and I'm being able to after work go to my
Speaker 1: boyfriend's house and just having a life out rather than
Speaker 1: as a twelve, thirteen, fourteen year old, my entire life
Speaker 1: felt like the show, and every moment was just waiting
Speaker 1: to go back to the show. Now I'm I have
Speaker 1: a thriving life outside of the show, and I remember
Speaker 1: being on set, but mostly because of like writer said,
Speaker 1: the ways our outside lives were tying into us being
Speaker 1: all there together.
Speaker 9: Well, it's just one of those things where and it's
Speaker 9: such a magical thing that we did, but it was
Speaker 9: our job. And after a while, when you're five years
Speaker 9: at a job, even if it's the most amazing job
Speaker 9: in the world, you're still just going to work that day.
Speaker 9: I'm going to work, So hey, what am I doing
Speaker 9: after work? What am I doing?
Speaker 10: Hey?
Speaker 9: When am I meeting up with my friends? When are
Speaker 9: we doing this? That becomes the crux of your day,
Speaker 9: not like what I did at work, and I again
Speaker 9: had the most amazing job in the world, but it
Speaker 9: was still.
Speaker 7: Just a job.
Speaker 3: We know, we can we can't talk to you guys
Speaker 3: all day, So I want to just quickly just like
Speaker 3: bang out some of your season five superlatives if possible,
Speaker 3: Can each of you tell me what your favorite and
Speaker 3: least favorite. I know we kind of know this for
Speaker 3: Will favorite and least favorite episodes of the season were.
Speaker 6: Raging, Corey favorite, Yeah, I loved it.
Speaker 3: Which one was.
Speaker 6: The airplane?
Speaker 7: Yes?
Speaker 6: The market?
Speaker 3: Great episodes? Yeah, great episodes. Do you think that's one
Speaker 3: of the better ones of the series? By the way,
Speaker 3: great so good?
Speaker 7: Great?
Speaker 1: And maybe I think writer thinks it's his favorite episode
Speaker 1: of the series.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's definitely top five for me. So say, chick
Speaker 6: like me that those are, you know, some of the
Speaker 6: best episodes. Worst episode of the season, I guess is
Speaker 6: Starry Night. No, I really didn't like Brothers Man. I
Speaker 6: really don't started off with such a yeah, just yeah.
Speaker 6: And you know, I guess maybe a lot of that
Speaker 6: is my performance in it too.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Also Fraternity Rowe. I mean, I'm gonna I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: out on a limb and say, I think Fraternity Row
Speaker 1: is maybe one of is maybe my uh.
Speaker 4: Least favorite of the season. I did.
Speaker 1: I did not love Starry Night the same way it's
Speaker 1: the same way a lot of.
Speaker 5: Other people do.
Speaker 1: But I also feel like it's almost I couldn't possibly
Speaker 1: name it as my least favorite when I know how
Speaker 1: strongly Wilfredell feels about it. So I feel like I
Speaker 1: have to take something else, and so I think I'm
Speaker 1: gonna take Fraternity Row that that'd be.
Speaker 4: The beginning of season five was really rough for me.
Speaker 1: I just felt kind of like, are we gonna, Are
Speaker 1: we gonna get somewhere good?
Speaker 4: And we did. We ended up hitting a really nice ride.
Speaker 12: I think my.
Speaker 1: Favorite episode is Gosh, it's so hard because you know what,
Speaker 1: Storry Night. The one thing I will say, Storry Night
Speaker 1: is my favorite Angela showing she's so strong.
Speaker 4: Otherwise it would have just been I know.
Speaker 1: But I think my favorite episode is Heartbreak Corey. It's
Speaker 1: to me, it's such a great episode. I love I
Speaker 1: love meeting the Lauren character. I love that it was
Speaker 1: Rusty's first episode. We have a lot of behind the
Speaker 1: scenes memories of it, so I think Rage and Corey
Speaker 1: is an incredible episode. But I think I'm going to
Speaker 1: say my favorite of the season is Heartbreak Corey.
Speaker 5: You know mine already.
Speaker 9: Yeah, Starry Night by far my least favorite, probably possibly
Speaker 9: of the entire series. There's the good ones this season
Speaker 9: were great, so I mean for personal reasons. And then
Speaker 9: there was Sean Is. It will always be just because
Speaker 9: it was arguably my favorite week of work I've ever.
Speaker 5: Had in my entire life. Yeah, it was just an
Speaker 5: incredible week.
Speaker 9: So for a personal reason that for as a television fan,
Speaker 9: just watching Heartbreak Corey was great. As another week worth
Speaker 9: of work that I was really proud of. I would
Speaker 9: say Rage and Corey, so those were I mean, just
Speaker 9: working with Rusty and jumping out of the plane and
Speaker 9: doing all the fun stuff.
Speaker 5: All that was a ton of fun. So yeah, so good.
Speaker 3: We have a quick last minute like rapid fire of
Speaker 3: some of the great debates that have happened in this season.
Speaker 3: So if you can just quickly give us your thoughts
Speaker 3: on some of these, we would love to just settle
Speaker 3: the score. Finally, quick answers only, Quick answers only. Was
Speaker 3: Louren wrong for pursuing Corey?
Speaker 6: Yes, no, you're.
Speaker 9: Going You're going Cory and Tapanga or Cory and Lauren
Speaker 9: co l Lauren.
Speaker 3: Lor Cory and Tapanga or Sean and Angela.
Speaker 5: Sean and Angela Angela?
Speaker 3: Did Topanga trap Coy?
Speaker 1: Yes, no, no Trapanga.
Speaker 6: Yes.
Speaker 3: This might be a little bit hard to do a
Speaker 3: rapid fire up. But at what point in the Ski
Speaker 3: Lodge episode was Corey wrong?
Speaker 9: The minuity lied, lied, lied, but maybe emotionally a little
Speaker 9: bit before the lie.
Speaker 3: I get and you're just quickly Why didn't Tepenga go
Speaker 3: to Yale.
Speaker 5: To get to the other side?
Speaker 7: Wait? I did that?
Speaker 1: Rob to Pega didn't go to Yale from what I
Speaker 1: think out here right now, because she thinks she has
Speaker 1: to choose between Corey and college, and she does not
Speaker 1: want to lose Corey.
Speaker 6: I seriously think that Corey guilts her and she feels
Speaker 6: like she needs to make a sacrifice that is, in
Speaker 6: her mind equivalent to the sacrifice that Corey is making
Speaker 6: by allowing her to go to Yale. And I just
Speaker 6: that's such a false equivalency to me. But yeah, so
Speaker 6: I think she's chopping off her own arm, you know,
Speaker 6: so sort of like, I look how much I love you.
Speaker 6: That's ridiculous.
Speaker 9: I think that's what they're going for. But I think
Speaker 9: at the end of the day, it's just going to
Speaker 9: be fear.
Speaker 7: I love it.
Speaker 8: I love like you guys hit on everything. Writer, you
Speaker 8: were like offended that we asked you if to choose
Speaker 8: between Corey and Topega and Sean and Angela.
Speaker 6: You were like, obbousana, that's so funny, all of those parents.
Speaker 6: We chose the non Corey to Panga option.
Speaker 8: So for season six, you guys are coming up on
Speaker 8: season six, we have guests and let us know that
Speaker 8: we hope excited. Well don't know who you can get.
Speaker 8: Will you be having maitland Ward, Bonnie, we get Tommy back,
Speaker 8: Nobody's Angels.
Speaker 3: Is what you can Nobody's Angels Reunion episode.
Speaker 6: We just saw Josh keaton sister. Yeah, we could probably
Speaker 6: get to his sister through through that. Yeah, that'd be great.
Speaker 7: And then also to Panga's first set of parents.
Speaker 1: Our goal is always to get everybody that we see
Speaker 1: a lot of the comments too of people who are like,
Speaker 1: get this person. I promise you there's no one you
Speaker 1: guys have suggested to us that we haven't asked who
Speaker 1: hasn't either already said no, or who we are still
Speaker 1: trying to work out scheduling stuff. There are season five
Speaker 1: guests Cherry Levine said, no.
Speaker 3: Oh that's right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're trying to get Jennifer love Hewett.
Speaker 4: We've been trying to get Linda Cardellini.
Speaker 1: There are people we have definitely been trying and it's
Speaker 1: either a scheduling thing or you know, trying to get
Speaker 1: through some managers and publicists is sometimes you have to
Speaker 1: find a different, more creative way around. We will definitely,
Speaker 1: assuming she still wants to come on, we will definitely
Speaker 1: be extending the invitation to maitland Ward of course, and
Speaker 1: all those people you mentioned we would we would plan
Speaker 1: to have on.
Speaker 7: So yeah, love to hear that's the hope.
Speaker 3: Well, thank you guys so much for having us again.
Speaker 3: We had such a great time talking with you about
Speaker 3: season five. It was again like we knew the season
Speaker 3: was gonna save and we loved hearing the debates, having
Speaker 3: the debates with you guys, and of course it's just
Speaker 3: it's always a privilege to be brought on to to
Speaker 3: talk to you guys and ask you our questions.
Speaker 9: Okay, and rapid fire back to the two of you,
Speaker 9: yes or no very quickly.
Speaker 5: Are we gonna like season six?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 7: No comment? Geez.
Speaker 3: Okay, I'll say this for you, and this is just us.
Speaker 3: You guys have your own experience. When we did, like
Speaker 3: our series review, going season by season, season six ended
Speaker 3: up being our least favorite season. Okay, just because it's
Speaker 3: very dark.
Speaker 8: Okay, we lean into that melodramatic side that we were
Speaker 8: talking about earlier.
Speaker 1: So yeah, we so appreciate you guys coming on at
Speaker 1: the end of every season and every single time we
Speaker 1: talk to you, you guys point something out to us
Speaker 1: that from a POV that we just haven't had and
Speaker 1: we appreciate it and value it so much. So thank
Speaker 1: you as always for coming to share your wisdom and
Speaker 1: your expertise and your opinions with us.
Speaker 4: We adore you both so much.
Speaker 1: We look forward to doing this again with you at
Speaker 1: the end of the Worst Season season.
Speaker 4: Six, and we will see you then. Thank you both,
Speaker 4: Thank you so much.
Speaker 7: Bye.
Speaker 1: Thank you all for joining us for this episode of
Speaker 1: Podmeets World. As always, you can follow us on Instagram
Speaker 1: Podmeets World Show. You can send us your emails Podmeets
Speaker 1: Worldshow at gmail dot com, and we have merch.
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Speaker 6: We love you all, pod dismissed. Podmeets World is an
Speaker 6: iHeart podcast producer hosted by Danielle Fischel, Wilfridell and Ryder Strong.
Speaker 6: Executive producers Jensen Carp and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge
Speaker 6: of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor, Tarasubach, producer, Maddie Moore,
Speaker 6: engineer and Boy Meets World Superman Easton Allen. Our theme
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