WEBVTT - CLASSIC: Wells Fargo's Imaginary Customers 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.880 Folks, welcome back. We've got a classic episode for you. 0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:06.680 This one is proudly not brought to you by Wells Fargo. 0:00:06.880 --> 0:00:07.560 Unless it is. 0:00:08.119 --> 0:00:09.640 Unless it is, and they. 0:00:09.520 --> 0:00:10.280 Haven't heard this. 0:00:11.000 --> 0:00:13.520 The story of one of the most popular retail banks 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:16.920 in the United States definitely gave a couple of US 0:00:17.079 --> 0:00:20.840 Acrossroads come to Jesus moment where we got into the story. 0:00:21.160 --> 0:00:24.960 But back in twenty twenty, we, like so many other people, 0:00:25.160 --> 0:00:28.920 learned that Wells Fargo had an entire side business doing 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:30.600 some highly illegal grifts. 0:00:32.760 --> 0:00:35.520 And when we did this exploration, I vowed to take 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:38.120 my business elsewhere, and I'm still with Wells Fargo to 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:40.400 this day. Out of sheer laziness. 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:45.960 First National Bank of Atlanta into Wakovia, into Wells Fargo exactly. 0:00:46.159 --> 0:00:49.120 And a lot of people ended up in Wells Fargo because, 0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:51.599 like I saying, they just got snapped up by an 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:57.640 increasingly gigantic Leviathan of finance. And I missed Wakovia because 0:00:57.640 --> 0:00:59.160 the name sounded like a sneetz. 0:00:59.280 --> 0:01:01.960 It was nice to say, you're gonna call you. 0:01:03.200 --> 0:01:07.840 These boks were made for COVID and that's just what anyway. Yeah, 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:11.560 we'll get to this classic episode afterword from our sponsors. 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:16.320 From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 0:01:16.440 --> 0:01:20.720 riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 0:01:20.840 --> 0:01:23.760 learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A 0:01:23.880 --> 0:01:25.480 production of Iheartrading. 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:38.800 Hello, Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:40.000 my name is Noah. 0:01:40.040 --> 0:01:42.360 They call me Ben. We are joined as always with 0:01:42.440 --> 0:01:47.080 our super producer Paul. Mission control decands, most importantly, you 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:50.680 are you. You are here, and that makes this stuff 0:01:50.800 --> 0:01:54.280 they don't want you to know. Quick check in. I 0:01:54.280 --> 0:01:57.760 think this is the first time any of us have 0:01:57.920 --> 0:02:00.520 spoken today, or at least Matt, you and Knowle, it's 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:02.440 the first time spoken with you. Paul and I go 0:02:02.520 --> 0:02:05.800 way back today. How's it going, guys, It's. 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:09.840 Going really well. Having all kinds of interesting phone calls 0:02:09.840 --> 0:02:12.520 with people that I've never met until today. So this 0:02:12.639 --> 0:02:14.359 is just a day of new things. 0:02:14.880 --> 0:02:20.120 Really anything to write home about. Not yet, No, I 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:22.679 see very cryptic. 0:02:22.720 --> 0:02:23.360 Matt. I like it. 0:02:23.480 --> 0:02:27.880 I'm intrigued. I too have had some unusual phone calls 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:31.040 with people that I have never met and may never meet. 0:02:31.400 --> 0:02:33.560 Who knows if I'll ever even leave my house again. 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:38.079 But I'd like to think that there is a future 0:02:38.080 --> 0:02:40.120 where I will be able to get on an airplane 0:02:39.919 --> 0:02:43.320 once again, because that's fun. It's fun to go other places. 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:44.760 We'll see what happens. 0:02:45.120 --> 0:02:50.320 Yeah, I'm actually doing some doing some runs later today 0:02:50.880 --> 0:02:55.519 to you know, if people are immunocompromise, it's a tremendously 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:58.080 bad idea for them to leave their house, even if 0:02:58.400 --> 0:03:01.799 they're in an area like George where the local leadership 0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:06.280 is attempting to open up various businesses and institutions. So 0:03:06.320 --> 0:03:08.680 I'm going to go do some no contact drop offs. 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:14.280 If you are immunocompromised, please please, please, still don't go outside, 0:03:14.400 --> 0:03:16.760 even if everything else is open. It's just not worth it. 0:03:17.080 --> 0:03:21.400 Yeah. Guy, I know in Brooklyn who got COVID nineteen. 0:03:21.480 --> 0:03:24.600 It was a mild case, but he just got the 0:03:25.160 --> 0:03:27.720 go ahead from his doctor to leave the house. And 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:30.960 he pos his birthday today. Actually, yeah, so happy birthday. 0:03:31.760 --> 0:03:34.000 I'm not gonna say his name because he may not 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:36.480 want people to know that he had the thing, but 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:40.240 happy birthday to you, my friend, and really glad to 0:03:40.240 --> 0:03:41.680 see you get out. And he had he had a 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:44.560 mask on, was keeping it super safe. But yeah, it's 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:48.600 gotta be tough, you know, just like having that level 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:52.120 of isolation, especially if someone lives by themselves. 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:58.520 And speaking of crises, it's safe to say that our 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:02.760 current financial system, like many individuals in the world today, 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:07.120 is in a state of crisis. This is yet another 0:04:07.480 --> 0:04:10.480 crisis for the financial system. By the way, I think, 0:04:10.840 --> 0:04:13.760 by the time people reach the age of let's say, 0:04:14.400 --> 0:04:18.960 I don't know, arbitrarily eighteen, they've already experienced several huge 0:04:19.320 --> 0:04:23.960 behamoths of financial crisis. But individuals in countries around the 0:04:23.960 --> 0:04:26.680 world right now are being told to shore up their 0:04:26.760 --> 0:04:32.120 finances and they're being chastised for quote unquote poor financial planning, 0:04:32.360 --> 0:04:36.400 while at the same time, billion dollar corporations are getting 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:40.719 bailed out left, right, over and under. Some people would 0:04:40.720 --> 0:04:42.720 call this the way of the world. Some would call 0:04:42.760 --> 0:04:46.120 it a series of conspiracies. Yet the world of finance 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:50.960 and conspiracy, they're inextricably intertwined. You know, you could even 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:55.160 say the concept of money itself is a conspiracy. As 0:04:55.200 --> 0:04:58.479 a matter of fact, we have said that on previous episodes, 0:04:58.960 --> 0:05:01.600 and I stick to my guns on banks have been 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:07.200 accused of multitudes of financial crimes, many conspiracies, and even 0:05:07.240 --> 0:05:11.360 at times assisting with things like government overthrows or cup d'tas. 0:05:12.040 --> 0:05:14.279 This is not to say that all banks are all 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:18.320 bad right for now, they are a necessity. Billions and 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:21.320 billions of people rely on banks in some way, and 0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:25.400 in turn, those banks rely on those billions of customers. 0:05:26.040 --> 0:05:28.800 That's the official story. If this were a mural or 0:05:28.800 --> 0:05:32.440 a portrait, that's the background, that's where that's happening. But 0:05:32.560 --> 0:05:36.800 there's more to the episode, of course, and to get 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:39.320 you to the point of today's episode, we have to 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:43.960 first briefly explain how banks work. It sounds super simple, 0:05:44.040 --> 0:05:47.320 but there are a few misconceptions we need to bust 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:50.080 and there's some things that we'll discuss that might surprise you, 0:05:50.480 --> 0:05:53.040 but don't take our word for it. Here are the facts. 0:05:54.160 --> 0:05:57.960 Yes, the bank itself, the institution, the thing that we 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:03.359 all rely on, really is one big trust fall. A 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:06.760 bank is really only a thing, an idea concept that 0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:10.280 works as long as everyone believes it does what it 0:06:10.320 --> 0:06:13.640 does right. It's a lot like currency in general. If 0:06:13.680 --> 0:06:16.560 you don't believe that thing in your pocket perhaps or 0:06:16.800 --> 0:06:19.839 laying in a drawer somewhere, that weird paper like substance 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:22.039 that has some images on it, If you don't believe 0:06:22.040 --> 0:06:24.800 that thing is worth what it's worth, then it is 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:25.240 in a thing. 0:06:25.400 --> 0:06:27.320 Yeah, it's like fairies. Like if you don't believe in 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:29.120 tinker Bell, then she dies, you know. 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:33.080 Kind of yes, So let's talk about what we all 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:36.840 believe a bank is and does. Officially, it's a quote 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:40.400 institution that deals in money, and it substitutes and provides 0:06:40.480 --> 0:06:44.880 other financial services. So really think about it this way. 0:06:45.279 --> 0:06:48.840 Banks take in deposits money and then they loan out 0:06:49.000 --> 0:06:52.200 money and drive a profit from the difference in the 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:55.680 interest rates that are paid and charged respectively. So when 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:57.640 you think about that, like how much money they can 0:06:57.680 --> 0:07:01.320 make by lending money out and then charging interest on 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:03.520 that money they're lending. But the big thing here to 0:07:03.600 --> 0:07:05.920 remember is that in order to have money to lend out, 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:07.479 they have to be taking money in. 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:11.120 But make no mistake, I mean, the bank isn't really 0:07:11.360 --> 0:07:14.920 built for you. I mean it's a business. It's designed 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:20.200 to make money for the shareholders. So it's primary function 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:24.239 really isn't to be some sort of you know, safe 0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:27.840 haven for your money. That's almost like an afterthought. You're 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:31.120 really just feeding the machine with your money and then 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:34.280 they're investing it as they see fit. Essentially, that's an 0:07:34.320 --> 0:07:37.760 oversimplified view of it. But yeah, you deposit money. When 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:40.559 you do, your money goes into this massive pool along 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:43.920 with everybody else's money, and then your account is credited 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:47.080 with the amount of your deposit, so you're able to 0:07:47.240 --> 0:07:50.400 draw on that account to pay bills and write checks, 0:07:50.400 --> 0:07:52.360 et cetera. Who still writes checks. I had to get 0:07:52.400 --> 0:07:54.200 a single check the other day because I had to 0:07:54.200 --> 0:07:55.760 pay off my car and I had to go to 0:07:55.840 --> 0:07:58.360 the bank to get one check. It's the weirdest thing. 0:07:58.920 --> 0:08:02.320 But yeah, that amounts to deducted from your account balance, 0:08:02.720 --> 0:08:07.760 and you can, you know, theoretically earn interest on that balance. Uh, 0:08:07.840 --> 0:08:10.480 and that can actually be added back to your account. 0:08:10.480 --> 0:08:14.280 This is all kind of one oh one banking basics here. 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:18.520 Yeah, I called it day one stuff because that's the 0:08:18.560 --> 0:08:22.760 primary misconception that I want to bust here. The primary 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:26.960 function of a bank is not you as an individual customer. 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:29.880 And although it may sound basic, it may sound like 0:08:30.000 --> 0:08:33.080 day one stuff, it is a huge misconception that is 0:08:33.240 --> 0:08:37.679 very distressingly common. The bank's primary purpose, as far as 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:41.200 you are concerned, is just to take money from you, 0:08:41.480 --> 0:08:44.440 whether that's money you deposit, whether that's money that you 0:08:44.600 --> 0:08:48.160 pay on a loan in principle or in interest where banks, 0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:52.000 you know, want to make more more revenue. That's what 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:54.520 that's what you are. You know, that's what you are, 0:08:54.800 --> 0:08:58.199 and you can We've talked about this in previous episodes. 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:00.720 If you'd like to learn more about the nuts and 0:09:00.760 --> 0:09:03.480 bolts of this the banking system, especially here in the US, 0:09:03.800 --> 0:09:07.040 do check out our earlier explorations of the FED the 0:09:07.040 --> 0:09:12.000 Federal Reserve for more details. That's the gist. The amount 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:15.040 of interest that you get on your checking account or 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:19.240 your savings account. In the big picture, it's peanuts. It's 0:09:19.280 --> 0:09:23.480 better than nothing, but it's peanuts. Bank customers matter the 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:26.720 absolute most when we take out loans and pay interest 0:09:26.760 --> 0:09:29.760 on those, or in a panic situation, in a worst 0:09:29.800 --> 0:09:32.480 case scenario for a bank, when every customer of a 0:09:32.480 --> 0:09:35.760 bank wants their money back in cash all at once, 0:09:36.080 --> 0:09:39.719 because you see, yeah, you see, the banks won't have it. 0:09:40.160 --> 0:09:41.640 They just won't have it. 0:09:41.760 --> 0:09:45.840 I mean, it's essentially I mean not to be de 0:09:45.920 --> 0:09:49.000 reductionist about it, but it reminds me of a Ponzi scheme. 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:52.240 The whole thing is like a paying Peter to robbing 0:09:52.280 --> 0:09:54.880 from Peter to pay Paul scenario. Although it's all under 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:57.160 the guise of being legitimate. I mean, if you go 0:09:57.280 --> 0:09:59.240 back and say I want my money, shouldn't you be 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:01.319 able to get your mind? But if everyone does it 0:10:01.320 --> 0:10:02.960 at the same time, then it's not going to work out. 0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:05.880 And yet we trust in this system because it's somehow 0:10:06.200 --> 0:10:08.920 backed by some kind of promise by the government or 0:10:08.960 --> 0:10:10.319 the FDIC or what have you. 0:10:10.520 --> 0:10:13.560 Yeah, and that's what's happening in Russia right now as 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:16.679 we record this, which is just for peak behind the 0:10:16.720 --> 0:10:20.000 curtain right at the very end of April twenty twenty. 0:10:21.160 --> 0:10:24.480 So this can happen again countries around the world. Has 0:10:24.480 --> 0:10:26.600 happened in the US as well. So you might be 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:29.920 asking yourself rightly, Okay, guys, if this is all true, 0:10:30.200 --> 0:10:33.640 and we assure you it is, then why am I, 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:38.680 as an individual checking account holder important at all? Right? 0:10:38.760 --> 0:10:40.360 If I don't have a loan, if I don't have 0:10:40.400 --> 0:10:44.079 a mortgage, why do I matter? Well there are two reasons. First, 0:10:44.120 --> 0:10:48.559 as we established earlier, banks are using your money, specifically 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:52.440 your money sometimes even if you're not working with the bank, 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.800 which is weird but true. And second, and this is 0:10:55.880 --> 0:11:00.319 just basic sales psychology. Once people choose a bank, they 0:11:00.360 --> 0:11:03.440 tend to stick with that bank. So if you're the 0:11:03.559 --> 0:11:06.160 average person with a checking account at one bank, you 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:09.000 are far far more likely to have a credit card 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:11.679 account with them, a savings account or alone with them 0:11:11.679 --> 0:11:14.680 as well. And these accounts all have differing terms, and 0:11:14.720 --> 0:11:18.319 depending on a ton of mitigating factors, one person may 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:21.480 have a much better deal than another. Right, some people 0:11:21.559 --> 0:11:25.400 have credit cards with maybe what like nine percent interests, 0:11:25.400 --> 0:11:27.560 and other people have credit cards with like twenty five 0:11:27.640 --> 0:11:30.560 point nine to nine percent interests. There's a lot in play, 0:11:30.720 --> 0:11:32.840 and we should add a customer with a line of 0:11:32.880 --> 0:11:36.239 credit and a line of savings. From the bank's perspective, 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:40.120 you are far more profitable than an ordinary Jenny or 0:11:40.240 --> 0:11:42.200 Jack who just has a checking account. 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:45.559 Yeah, it's true. And it's also people often are a 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:48.360 little bit lazy, and they might not shop around for 0:11:48.400 --> 0:11:51.000 a better rate, or you know, they might get that 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:55.320 zero interest, you know, introductory deal and then forget to 0:11:55.400 --> 0:11:57.640 pay it off when the rate gets jacked up to 0:11:57.760 --> 0:12:02.080 like twenty percent or some ungodly And honestly, I'm not 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:04.440 to that degree, but I'm one of those in terms 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:08.960 of laziness. I have had a bank account that has 0:12:09.120 --> 0:12:13.199 changed hands like three times throughout the course of my 0:12:13.200 --> 0:12:16.320 my financial life, and I'm just kind of stuck with 0:12:16.360 --> 0:12:20.400 whatever it ended up being, you know, just because it's 0:12:20.440 --> 0:12:22.040 a pain in the butt to like close your bank 0:12:22.040 --> 0:12:24.679 account and start over and redo all your cards and 0:12:24.720 --> 0:12:26.400 all that stuff. And I think the banks are kind 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:30.280 of a they're sort of capitalizing on that, right, people 0:12:30.920 --> 0:12:33.280 being stuck in a routine and being a one stop 0:12:33.320 --> 0:12:35.719 shop and just being easier to stick with what they 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:37.720 know than to go maybe shop for a better deal. 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.000 I yes, and you know, I'm in actually a pretty 0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:44.480 similar situation. Tool. And the last time I had to 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:48.440 go into the bank, I noticed something, and it was 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:50.920 that the person I was speaking with it wasn't just 0:12:50.960 --> 0:12:53.320 a teller, it was, you know, a banker. You know, 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:55.160 if you, if anyone has ever had that experience where 0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:55.600 you want. 0:12:55.480 --> 0:12:58.360 One you go in the office or on a desk. 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:01.600 Yeah, exactly. And what I was attempting to do was 0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:04.160 open a new account with them, because I've been an 0:13:04.160 --> 0:13:06.560 account holder for a while and I wanted to open 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:11.600 a new specialized checking account. And what happened was, rather 0:13:11.720 --> 0:13:15.360 than just having that conversation opening that account, having that 0:13:15.400 --> 0:13:19.880 one transaction, they were attempting to get me to open 0:13:19.920 --> 0:13:22.320 a credit card with them. They were attempting to get 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:24.360 me to change over a mortgage to them and do 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:29.120 all these other things and insurance. Yes, and it's something 0:13:29.160 --> 0:13:32.240 that I'm assuming is pretty common throughout the banking world. 0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:33.280 Yes. 0:13:33.360 --> 0:13:34.080 Selling. 0:13:34.160 --> 0:13:39.319 Yeah, the concept is so common that there is a 0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:42.920 name for it in the industry. It's called cross selling. 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:46.240 It started out as an internal term, but now, for 0:13:46.320 --> 0:13:49.760 reasons that will will become abundantly clear in a few minutes, 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:52.840 it is a term that is in the public sphere. 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:58.560 Success for okay, so Wells Fargo or Wacovia or you know, 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:02.040 five Thirds Bank or whatever, any bank that you used, 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:05.199 any bank that you walk into and have a checking 0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:09.280 account with and so on. Those are what's called retail banks. 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:12.720 And for a long time, success at retail banks was 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:18.319 measured by how successful the bankers or even the people 0:14:18.360 --> 0:14:21.560 on the phone were at cross selling. And that's encouraging 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:24.600 a customer, Remember our Jenny or Jack with one checking 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:28.360 account to open up multiple other accounts to be fair. 0:14:28.720 --> 0:14:31.000 This also happens if you have like a credit card 0:14:31.040 --> 0:14:33.200 with Bank of America or something, they're like, hey, make 0:14:33.240 --> 0:14:35.680 a savings account with us right ever thought of buying 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:40.160 a boat, et cetera. This idea is an invention credited 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:45.040 to a single man. His name is Richard Kovikchik's he 0:14:45.240 --> 0:14:48.160 was a Wells Fargo CEO. He's a guy who reputedly 0:14:48.200 --> 0:14:50.640 came up with the idea of cross selling during his 0:14:50.720 --> 0:14:56.680 time as a CEO at Northwest Corporation. And we've got 0:14:57.280 --> 0:15:01.120 a thing from an interview he had in nineteen ninety eight, 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:06.560 I think with Vanity Fair maybe where he summarizes his 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:11.880 idea and it sounds normal now, but when he said it, 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:13.040 it was pretty innovative. 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:18.600 Yeah, he really kind of changed the lingo of banking. 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:24.400 He started referring to branch employees or the idea of tellers. 0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:28.760 I called them salespeople, and consumers referred to them as 0:15:28.880 --> 0:15:33.040 customers rather than clients. And another one that I've heard 0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:35.640 that I have no doubt sprang from the same kind 0:15:35.640 --> 0:15:39.400 of shift was all of the various products that the 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:43.720 bank can sell you, you know, like these credit cards are products. 0:15:43.760 --> 0:15:46.120 All of these up cells or these cross sells you're 0:15:46.120 --> 0:15:49.000 talking about are referred to as products, which I find 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:52.320 very strange. You know, it's such a non tangible thing. 0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:54.880 Like insurance being a product. 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:58.800 Well, and just from personal experience, there are so many 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:04.200 different kinds of products that these retail banks offer customers 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:08.640 that seem extremely similar. But there's like seven different kinds 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:11.200 of checking account, there's like six different kinds of savings 0:16:11.200 --> 0:16:13.520 accounts and all this other stuff. And it's also that 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:17.840 you can offer exactly what the customer needs or the Yeah, 0:16:17.920 --> 0:16:20.200 the customer or not the client. 0:16:20.760 --> 0:16:22.200 I don't think it's pre convenience. 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:25.080 No, it's definitely not. You guys. It reminds me of 0:16:25.160 --> 0:16:27.360 when I got my car loan a handful of years 0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:30.640 ago and like they made me, you know, this this 0:16:30.920 --> 0:16:33.920 offer of this interest rate and it was like higher 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:36.000 than I thought I should be offered because I have 0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:38.960 really good credit. And then I was gonna walk away, 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:40.880 and they said, oh ho ho, wait a minute, now, 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:42.680 we didn't know you. If we just told us you 0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:45.960 wanted it low, that we would have I'm like, what, like, 0:16:46.440 --> 0:16:50.000 just offer me the rate that I am do based 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:52.280 on my score, Like why are you trying to nickel 0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:53.840 and die me. It's the same thing. And this was 0:16:53.840 --> 0:16:56.280 through a small community bank, but it was all like, 0:16:56.320 --> 0:16:57.960 you know, at the hands of these kind of sleazy 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:00.560 car dealers. Not not to malign all card dealer. I'm 0:17:00.560 --> 0:17:02.720 sure many of you are great, most of you even, 0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:05.879 but this one in particular, I felt very kind of 0:17:05.920 --> 0:17:07.399 bent over a bearl a little bit, and I got 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:09.320 them down to where I wanted to be, but I 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:11.280 felt kind of ichy. The whole thing made me feel 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:13.800 like I didn't want to do business with them anymore. 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:17.560 Yeah, yeah, it's gonna The anecdote I always think of 0:17:17.680 --> 0:17:21.040 is like, imagine you walk into a fast food restaurant 0:17:21.560 --> 0:17:26.520 and you order, I don't know, a cheeseburger, and they're like, 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:30.360 all right, do you want poop on your cheeseburger? Why? 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:33.680 Why is that part of the conversation now, I don't 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:35.119 even want the burger cheez. 0:17:35.200 --> 0:17:36.840 Well, look, we got to get rid of all this 0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:40.239 poop somehow, and you know, if you'll accept it on 0:17:40.280 --> 0:17:43.000 your burger, then you know we're getting rid of it 0:17:43.040 --> 0:17:44.480 in that way and you're getting what you want. 0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:47.120 We'll give you a loyalty card, how about an Amazon 0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:51.159 gift card? So that's I mean, it's true. No, you know, 0:17:51.560 --> 0:17:55.239 I had to I had to interject a little like 0:17:55.280 --> 0:17:58.359 I think it could be advertised as convenience this plethora 0:17:58.680 --> 0:18:02.520 of options I'm using over correctly. Yeah, but I think 0:18:02.560 --> 0:18:04.720 what it's I think what it's really meant to do 0:18:05.280 --> 0:18:09.120 is to make things inconvenient, to make it more difficult 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:14.160 to find the right deal. The options are are cane 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:18.480 by design, you know, just like a life insurance or 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:21.400 just like a A lot of medical insurance or health 0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:24.879 insurance plans function that way. That's just a that's just 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:29.600 a byproduct of private industry trying to maximize profit because 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:33.000 a lot of people won't do the research. Well's fargo. 0:18:34.040 --> 0:18:36.960 It was really really good at this. They were considered 0:18:37.480 --> 0:18:40.879 for some time and not insignificant amount of time, the 0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:44.399 best cross seller in the retail banking game. But there 0:18:44.480 --> 0:18:46.840 was one problem, I know, just one. 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:50.280 Maybe you know why there's a problem then, yes, why 0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:55.240 because imagine if you're the best seller at something, now, 0:18:55.320 --> 0:19:00.240 imagine your numbers are on a really nice trajectory upwards. Now, 0:19:00.480 --> 0:19:05.160 in order for you to maintain profitability and to increase 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:09.240 year over year, like increase, you have to continue your 0:19:09.280 --> 0:19:13.240 track rate as the best seller, right, and then over achieve. 0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:15.000 Not to mention, you want to get that set of 0:19:15.040 --> 0:19:19.040 steak knives, you know, and the coffee is for closers. 0:19:19.119 --> 0:19:21.280 So you want to get coffee, you don't want to 0:19:21.320 --> 0:19:24.400 get cut off. You need that stuff to sell, right. 0:19:24.560 --> 0:19:31.640 It's the unsustainable, unsustainable growth model, exponential growth model of 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:34.160 capitalism year over year, and it applies to a lot 0:19:34.200 --> 0:19:36.639 of industries. So I mean, that's what I was going 0:19:36.720 --> 0:19:39.080 to say. I said there was one problem, but really 0:19:39.119 --> 0:19:42.800 there were millions of problems. You see Wells Fargo and 0:19:42.960 --> 0:19:46.280 other banks. We're getting a lot of new accounts, getting 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:50.120 a lot of new customers, cross selling. But these accounts, 0:19:50.119 --> 0:19:53.840 it turns out, were made up out of thin air. 0:19:54.480 --> 0:19:57.120 What are we talking about. We'll tell you after we'd 0:19:57.200 --> 0:20:08.240 from our sponsor. Here's where it gets crazy. So let's 0:20:08.280 --> 0:20:12.120 say you don't have enough accounts, Well, well, why don't 0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:16.040 you make them up? As early as twenty eleven, still 0:20:16.440 --> 0:20:20.120 like nine years ago, easily, outfits like the Wall Street 0:20:20.200 --> 0:20:25.439 Journal started noting this enormous internal pressure that Wells Fargo 0:20:25.680 --> 0:20:31.000 was exerting on everybody from the bank manager level on down. 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:36.680 They were supposed to measure up to these incredibly difficult 0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:42.720 sales quotas, these cross selling quotas. These were cartoonishly implausible. 0:20:43.200 --> 0:20:46.119 Vanity Fair in fact noted that several of these goals 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:54.840 were proven to be literally mathematically impossible to achieve. That's nuts. Like, 0:20:54.920 --> 0:21:00.320 even if you pitched everything to everyone, every single customer 0:21:00.480 --> 0:21:03.720 got every single offer possible and they all said yes, 0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:06.760 you still wouldn't meet the quota at some points. 0:21:07.680 --> 0:21:08.440 That's crazy. 0:21:08.640 --> 0:21:12.320 That's crazy, It really is so so. Imagine that you 0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:16.560 are let's say a bank manager or one of the 0:21:16.600 --> 0:21:22.280 main salespersons at you know, bankers, or just salesperson at 0:21:22.359 --> 0:21:26.080 the bank. Imagine that you are aware that you are 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:30.240 expected to sell x number of new accounts or open 0:21:30.480 --> 0:21:33.480 x number of new accounts, and you only you know, 0:21:33.920 --> 0:21:39.000 you see, like you literally physically see x minus fifty 0:21:39.680 --> 0:21:43.720 people a day, right, so you know that there's no 0:21:43.800 --> 0:21:46.200 way you're going to do that, There's no possible way. 0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:49.359 What do you do when you know your job is 0:21:49.400 --> 0:21:52.600 on the line. That number is directly related to how 0:21:52.640 --> 0:21:54.520 well you do, if you can get a raise at 0:21:54.520 --> 0:21:58.439 some point, if you can keep your job even well. 0:21:58.920 --> 0:22:03.040 They started doing something that they weren't supposed to do, 0:22:03.160 --> 0:22:06.800 and that's just opening new accounts that would count towards 0:22:06.840 --> 0:22:11.000 their quota but wouldn't actually be tied to somebody who 0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:12.000 wanted an account. 0:22:12.119 --> 0:22:14.800 Wait a minute, Wait a minute, isn't that called fraud? 0:22:16.040 --> 0:22:20.560 Ding ding ding? Yes, it is. Indeed there was. There's 0:22:20.560 --> 0:22:24.240 a guy named Dennis Hambeck who once upon a time 0:22:24.720 --> 0:22:28.159 was an employee at Wells Fargo. Now this guy had 0:22:28.280 --> 0:22:33.360 extensive banking experience, was his career. He got into banking 0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:38.920 as a young cat before all these massive consolidations, right 0:22:39.040 --> 0:22:43.040 before the financial whales starts swallowing the other smaller financial fish, 0:22:43.520 --> 0:22:46.560 and well, whales are mammals. But you get it, you 0:22:46.600 --> 0:22:50.200 know what I'm talking about. So he said this in 0:22:50.280 --> 0:22:54.640 a quote, just to hammer home that point that you made, Matt, 0:22:54.720 --> 0:22:58.840 about how intense this pressure was. He said, every morning 0:22:58.960 --> 0:23:01.399 we had a conference call all with the managers. You 0:23:01.440 --> 0:23:03.600