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Speaker 1: recruiter thanks so much for being our partner. Climb Stories

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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel one thirty two.

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Speaker 1: Dahlia de Bolito was just sentenced for trying to hire

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Speaker 1: a hitman to kill her newly wet husband of former escort,

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Speaker 1: now in shackles. This crime is so heinous and so deplorable.

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Speaker 1: Dahlia on tape, hiring a hit man and to kill

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Speaker 1: her husband. You'll find out when you were acting in

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Speaker 1: those names. With police recording the whole thing, they pretended

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Speaker 1: the hit worked, staging an elaborate crime scene and telling

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Speaker 1: Dahlia her husband's Dahlia de Polito, the beautiful bride out

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Speaker 1: of Florida who finds her dream man, only to then

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Speaker 1: be accused by police of hiring a hit man to

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Speaker 1: kill him. That's where to bliss, I guess. Dahlia di

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Speaker 1: Polito has had not one, not too but three jury

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Speaker 1: trials of the taxpayer's expense bringing in a hired gun

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Speaker 1: all the way from California. Who is joining us right now.

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Speaker 1: It's Brian Claypool. Our friend and colleague are slippery friend

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Speaker 1: and colleague and the court room who has tried his

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Speaker 1: best to save Dahlia di Polito from claim she hired

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Speaker 1: hitman to kill her husband. KINDA hard to do when

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Speaker 1: she's caught on video, not just video and audio, but

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Speaker 1: witnesses to haggling with the hit man, who's really, of course,

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Speaker 1: an undercover cop, saying that she's what was it two thousand,

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Speaker 1: not just one, but mathematically and possibly one thousand or

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Speaker 1: two thousand percent sure she wants him dead. Now, hold on, Brian,

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Speaker 1: this is music to your ears. I'm sure, but let's

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Speaker 1: hear Dahlia di Polito is she's told in an undercover

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Speaker 1: sting which I love. Is also on video. I could

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Speaker 1: watch it all day. I could just loop it and

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Speaker 1: watch it. When cops say, ma'am, your husband has been

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Speaker 1: found dead, listen to this, I'm sorry, Ramsey, I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: not want to call you. Thank you for comen. I'm

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Speaker 1: sorry to call you. Listen. We had a report of

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Speaker 1: the disturbance at your house and there were shots fired.

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Speaker 1: Is your husband Michael? Okay, I'm sorry to tell you, mam,

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Speaker 1: he's been killed. He's been killed. Man, try to calm

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Speaker 1: down right now. We need to get we need to

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Speaker 1: get you to station. I can't let man. We have

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Speaker 1: to do our job. If you want to find this killer, Okay,

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Speaker 1: we need you to calm down. I need you to

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Speaker 1: go with these detectives. Okay. Is you have enemies? Is

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Speaker 1: there anyone that would want to hurt Okay, who would

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Speaker 1: want to hurt him? Witness? He said they saw a

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Speaker 1: blackmail running from you. I can't let you see him then, madam,

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Speaker 1: I cannot do this right now. Detective, I need you.

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Speaker 1: I need you to take her to the station. I

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Speaker 1: can't go with these detectives. If you want to help

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Speaker 1: your husband, okay, If you want to help your husband,

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Speaker 1: you need to go to the station with these gentlemen

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Speaker 1: and tell us everything you know about who he knows,

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Speaker 1: who he's connected to. Don't worry. We've already taken care

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Speaker 1: of dogs without well control for right. Know, everything's under control,

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Speaker 1: and we'll take care of everything else. Okay. Now, if

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Speaker 1: you could only see her, she bends over in half

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Speaker 1: and all the pain of learning her husband is dead.

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Speaker 1: After she hires the hitman to kill him. Little does

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Speaker 1: she know, the hitman rated her out and her husband

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Speaker 1: is alive and well waiting for her to get to

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Speaker 1: the police station. Now, let me understand something joining me

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Speaker 1: right now. Nanette Sosa, who is with NPR, Ninette, thank

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Speaker 1: you for being with us. She's had three trials. What

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Speaker 1: were the various defenses at trial? In a nutshell, don't

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Speaker 1: bog me down with all the legal technicalities. What were

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Speaker 1: her defenses at trial? Ninette says. One of the defenses

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Speaker 1: was due to leniency because her attorney said that the

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Speaker 1: detectives in Florida basically railroaded her. And also the other

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Speaker 1: fact that he alleged and said that they were filming

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Speaker 1: a cops episode, So this was done for notoriety. So

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Speaker 1: those are a couple of things that were brought to

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Speaker 1: hold on. Let me let me follow up on what

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Speaker 1: Nnette Sosa is saying. One defense was that the show Cops,

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Speaker 1: you know, Bad Boys, Bad Boy, what you're gonna do?

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Speaker 1: That show it's incredibly popular, uh, and it shows cops

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Speaker 1: in real life making arrests and bust and tracking people

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Speaker 1: down in high speed chases. So they were coming to town.

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Speaker 1: One defense was, oh, the cops made the whole thing up,

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Speaker 1: as if they don't have enough crime, they made up

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Speaker 1: this crime so they could get on cops. Okay, that

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Speaker 1: was one defense. The second defense that I can recall

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Speaker 1: is that no, no, no, she wasn't really hiring a

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Speaker 1: hit man. This was just a script that she wanted

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Speaker 1: to be in a reality show, and she was pitching

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Speaker 1: this script as a reality show script, and she was

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Speaker 1: all acting and those were her quote lines. Okay. Brian Claypool,

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Speaker 1: who was actually want a lot of cases, guys, defended

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Speaker 1: Dahlia to Polito at trial and just got a real

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Speaker 1: blow because after her third conviction, right her third trial,

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Speaker 1: excuse me, she asked the judge for a bond and

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Speaker 1: was turned down. Wow. Can you imagine that the last

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Speaker 1: time they let her have house arrest where she could

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Speaker 1: only go to church in her lawyer's office, she ended

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Speaker 1: up pregnant. I don't know how that happened, but um,

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Speaker 1: of course the judge said, I want an appeal bond.

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Speaker 1: But what was her defense the third time around? Brian Claypool, Well, Nancy,

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Speaker 1: thanks for having me. Let's remind your audience though in

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Speaker 1: the second retrial, I have came to hung jury, and

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Speaker 1: in fact, five out of eight jurs we have three

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Speaker 1: to three, and then both alternitors were in our in

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Speaker 1: our camp for an acquittal. So you alternate jurors don't

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Speaker 1: mean a fig. That doesn't even matter whether alter on

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Speaker 1: a fair playing field house is such a slam dunk.

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Speaker 1: If I, if I almost have cameed an acquittal on

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Speaker 1: the second trial, what happened in the third almost that's

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Speaker 1: like almost ringing a basket in a basketball game. Well, now,

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Speaker 1: you you said, what did you say, five to eight?

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Speaker 1: Five out of in the second trial, five out of

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Speaker 1: five out of Now are you including how many gars

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Speaker 1: were they were? There were six jurors and two alternatives, Well,

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Speaker 1: five out of eight, okay, so let's talk about the

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Speaker 1: actual gurars the six. What was the vote amongst the six? Well,

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Speaker 1: on the second trial, it was three to three. Oh,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't really sound like a slam dunk to me.

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Speaker 1: That sounds like right down the middle, right, So three

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Speaker 1: three right. But the whole world has portrayed this as

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Speaker 1: such as such a slam dunk. Just look at the

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Speaker 1: video tape and let's send her to prison for the

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Speaker 1: next twenty thirty years. But that's not that's not how

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Speaker 1: it unfolded. And okay, should I believe you are my

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Speaker 1: lying eyes because I saw the video about a hundred times.

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Speaker 1: But what most people are not aware of when they

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Speaker 1: followed this case is that the first phone call made

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Speaker 1: to the police department by a gentleman named Mohammed, who

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Speaker 1: was the confidential informant. His first phone call to the

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Speaker 1: police station was quite this is a quote. I think

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Speaker 1: this woman said either she's going to die or he's

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Speaker 1: going to die, and that there were some allegations of

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Speaker 1: domestic abuse the police depart our argument was Nancy in

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Speaker 1: a nutshell. The police department didn't do anything to investigate

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Speaker 1: the domestic abuse. They didn't look into whether she was suicidal.

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Speaker 1: They simply is she a hook? Her? Because apparently her

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Speaker 1: husband hired an quote escort and it was her. Is

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Speaker 1: that how they mett No, No, Nancy. They met the

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Speaker 1: same place you and I've been waiting for our coffee

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Speaker 1: days for years, he spurred me about a dozen times.

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Speaker 1: They met at the place I want to meet you

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Speaker 1: for our first get together, Starbucks, plain and simple, no

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Speaker 1: escort involved. I know that, and isn't it true? Speaking

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Speaker 1: of Starbucks, her husband says that she first tried to

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Speaker 1: poison him with some Starbucks chi t and that didn't work.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought up Starbucks. Well, thank you, because

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Speaker 1: I'm glad. I'm glad you brought up because I'm sure

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Speaker 1: you are. That is going to be the sole reason

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Speaker 1: why this kid, this conviction will be reversed on appeal.

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Speaker 1: It was reversible air for the judge to allow the

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Speaker 1: jury to hear about this. This fantastic, salacious allegation unfounded

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Speaker 1: by the way, about Dahlia trying to kill Mike with

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Speaker 1: uh with anti freeze in the so what about her

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Speaker 1: on video hiring a hitman to kill her husband and

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Speaker 1: telling him where to go and what time to go

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Speaker 1: so she wouldn't be there? And um, speaking of her

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Speaker 1: being a hooker if you didn't know that already, advise

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Speaker 1: you to read the Brower Palm Beach New Times where

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Speaker 1: they actually go through texts that she has sent lining

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Speaker 1: up John's okay, go ahead, well the the the next

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Speaker 1: messages really in the third trial, these text messages did

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Speaker 1: nothing more then show that she was trying, allegedly trying

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Speaker 1: to have Mike charged with violating his probation there was

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Speaker 1: and that she did have a romantic relationship with the

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Speaker 1: Southern guy named Mike Stanley. What we argued was, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't prove that she was trying to kill Mike Depolito

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Speaker 1: because nothing in those text messages suggested that she had

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Speaker 1: wanted to uh to kill Mike Depolito. But by getting

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Speaker 1: back to your other question about the videotape, our whole

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Speaker 1: argument was that that the the the the undercover police

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Speaker 1: officer was the one that was initiating all the phone calls.

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Speaker 1: He was the one that was pushing this along. We're

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Speaker 1: not denying what's on the tap, but Dolly didn't didn't

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Speaker 1: pick up the phone Nancy and say, hey, hey, Mr

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Speaker 1: undercover guy. She didn't know he's undercover, but hey Mr

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Speaker 1: get Men, can you meet me at Denny's tomorrow so

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Speaker 1: we could set up a hit. She wasn't making the

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Speaker 1: phone calls. The police were, and that's what we tried

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Speaker 1: to impart to the jury. I just realized I was

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Speaker 1: completely wrong, Brian Claypole. I'm gonna have to admit I

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Speaker 1: was wrong on the facts because she didn't say that

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Speaker 1: she was two thousand percent sure she wanted her husband dad.

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Speaker 1: On video, she said quote she tells the undercover cop

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Speaker 1: on video, I'm five thousand percent sure I want my

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Speaker 1: husband dead. Five thousand Seriously, I thought you were going

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Speaker 1: to say you were wrong in the facts about being

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Speaker 1: a caramel machiato instead of the so you had to

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Speaker 1: bring up on camera, and that long story short. She

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Speaker 1: then gets taken to the jail house as part of

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Speaker 1: the sting. But see, she thinks she's going to Police

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Speaker 1: HQ because her husband has been found shot dead. So

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Speaker 1: she gets there and it's only later that she, while

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Speaker 1: like the police station, never says anything about guys, this

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Speaker 1: was just a script for a reality show. My husband

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Speaker 1: was was in on it, my friend was in on it.

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Speaker 1: The c I confidential informant was in on it. She

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Speaker 1: never said any of that. I mean, if I found

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Speaker 1: myself under questioning at Place headquarters on an attempted murder,

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Speaker 1: I would complain right then and there. She never said

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Speaker 1: a word that was only cooked up in front of

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Speaker 1: a jury. Now let me go to forensic psychiatrist Dr

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Speaker 1: Daniel Bober. Dr Bober, so many people men mostly have

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Speaker 1: been taken in by Dahlia de Pilato, and I will

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Speaker 1: say she is beautiful. Her body looks like a model.

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Speaker 1: Let me just say she's a workout enthusiast and she's

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Speaker 1: very pretty and kind of an exotic way. Why is

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Speaker 1: it that so many people keep falling for her stories?

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Speaker 1: She she changes her story every time you turn around.

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Speaker 1: We see this a lot, Nancy. We see this in

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Speaker 1: Casey Anthony and Jodi Arius. People tend to find, for

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Speaker 1: some reason, attractive women are more credible. They don't want

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Speaker 1: to believe that they're capable of evil acts the same

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Speaker 1: way they do uh sort of people that are sort

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Speaker 1: of normal running the mill looking people. It's it's sort

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Speaker 1: of a it's a form of look is um and

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Speaker 1: it is an interesting phenomenon. You see it in politics,

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Speaker 1: you see it in all areas of life that people

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Speaker 1: that are judged to be more attractive are often get

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Speaker 1: cut a break or they get special favors for people.

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Speaker 1: Explain to me, Bryan Claypole, why after a conviction she

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Speaker 1: thought she should have a bond. Well, But the reason why,

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Speaker 1: Nancy is because remember remember in her first trial, she

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Speaker 1: was convicted because she adopted this reality show defense, and

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Speaker 1: after the conviction, the judge in that case did allow

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Speaker 1: Dahlia to be on house arrest. Wearing an ankle monitor.

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Speaker 1: So so so she is that the judge that called

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Speaker 1: her pure evil? Yeah, thats right, exactly right, so so

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Speaker 1: so so our argument, so I think about I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to answer your That fact alone was a platform for

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Speaker 1: us to argue in our recent brief. There was a

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Speaker 1: hearing about a week ago. We argued, wait a minute,

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Speaker 1: why shouldn't she be granted bond pending appeal again? Because

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Speaker 1: two reasons the first judge allowed it. Number one, Number two,

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Speaker 1: she's been she's been a model inmate, Nancy for eight

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Speaker 1: plus years. She's not had a similar fraction while on

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Speaker 1: house arrest. One would think that if she was a

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Speaker 1: flight risk she would have tried to flee the country

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Speaker 1: while she was on house arrest, as opposed to being

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Speaker 1: in a concrete building trying to escape out of a

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Speaker 1: out of a you know, a maximum security prison. So

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Speaker 1: those are the arguments we're making. There's no evidence of

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Speaker 1: her being a flight risk. And Nancy, do you remember

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Speaker 1: can I ask can I ask you why your client

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Speaker 1: tried to convince her husband to put his town house

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Speaker 1: in her name only just before the Yeah, that's that's

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Speaker 1: a that's that's another misnomer. That that the public doesn't

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Speaker 1: know about the real evidence at trial. Well, I'm raiding

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Speaker 1: her text, real email. The trial was that we produced

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Speaker 1: an email. We produced. I cross examined Mike Dippolito. I

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Speaker 1: showed him an email between doubt to refresh his recollection.

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Speaker 1: It was an email between Doubt and my It was

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Speaker 1: between There was an email that that Mike had sent

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Speaker 1: to the real estate agent where he had given his

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Speaker 1: acquiescence to having the condo or the house townhouse refinanced.

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Speaker 1: So that proved that Mike did Palito was actually on

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Speaker 1: board with refinancing at home and keeping it in in

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Speaker 1: Dari's name. So there was no gun put to Mike's fadd.

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Speaker 1: Well what I'm reading or the text that she sent

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Speaker 1: to her lover. Uh. She is rejoicing in her text

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Speaker 1: after persuading her soon to be dead husband to put

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Speaker 1: their townhouse in her name only. But yet in another text,

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Speaker 1: she's complaining bitterly that when she learned she still couldn't

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Speaker 1: sell it without his signature. You know what, it ain't

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Speaker 1: over yet with Dahlia di Polito. But that's so. So

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Speaker 1: the bond that she had asked for was disallowed. What

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Speaker 1: happens now and that she's going to the big house stasickly,

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Speaker 1: she's just going to be in prison. She has uh

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Speaker 1: she's hoping to be reunited obviously with her sixteen month

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Speaker 1: old son, but that is not happening. It was a

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Speaker 1: twenty four page order that the judge gave and the

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Speaker 1: reason was, and I quote to be clear, the court

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Speaker 1: does not seek in any way to punish the defendant

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Speaker 1: for having a child. But the fact was the judge said,

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Speaker 1: escape with her child is a significant temptation and risk.

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Speaker 1: And let me add also, Nancy, that there was a

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Speaker 1: phone call that Dahlia made from jail to the father

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Speaker 1: of the child, Robert Davis, who by the way, lives

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Speaker 1: with her mom and the child, and she was talking

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Speaker 1: with him about this uh prison escaped by a convict

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Speaker 1: in South Carolina, and she was describing how everybody was

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Speaker 1: pumped up, you know when they heard about the breakout. Now,

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Speaker 1: and you have her attorney there that he argued that

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Speaker 1: he she wouldn't. It just wasn't a smart call, basically,

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Speaker 1: but you know the call that that happens, but she

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Speaker 1: would never think to make an escape. Brian Claypool, You've

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Speaker 1: won so many cases, but and I hate to bid

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Speaker 1: a due to you in this cold manner, but just

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Speaker 1: to refresh your recollection using your words, take a listen

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Speaker 1: to your client, Dhlia to Polito. Right now we need

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Speaker 1: to we need to get Two toddlers are dead. Two

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Speaker 1: toddlers taughts die. One of the most unimaginable deaths. You

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Speaker 1: can't imagine burning, literally baking in scorching heat. I mean, see, Grace,

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Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 1: I want justice. It's one thing to forget, as bad

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Speaker 1: as that may be, to forget your child is in

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Speaker 1: the car. It's one thing to forget. But this mom

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Speaker 1: sent the MRI. Randolph Cindy recounted to investigators a mother's nightmare.

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Speaker 1: She had been folding laundry and watching TV while her

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Speaker 1: son and daughter, ages two and sixteen months, played in

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Speaker 1: a sunroom on the back porch. She went to check

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Speaker 1: on them in half an hour, but they were gone.

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Speaker 1: I'm using air quotees on that gone, she said. After

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Speaker 1: a half hour of searching, now we've got an hour gone.

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Speaker 1: By TikTok, TikTok. She finally found their bodies unresponsive inside

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Speaker 1: her Honda Cross to her part in the driveway. It

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Speaker 1: was hot, hot in Weatherford, Texas. It was ninety six

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Speaker 1: degrees outside the car. It sounds like a tragic mistake, right, No,

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Speaker 1: we now out learn that monster mom put the tots

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Speaker 1: in the hot car. To quote, teach them a lesson.

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Speaker 1: Teach them a lesson? What joining me? Crime Stories contributor

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Speaker 1: investigative reporter Paul Chambers, What happened Nancy? Year old Cynthia

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Speaker 1: Randolph has had several stories that she told police since

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Speaker 1: the incident happened on make do you say? Whoa? Whoa? Sorry? Paul?

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Speaker 1: Did you say? She has told several different stories? Oh?

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Speaker 1: You know you couldn't have made me happier. Paul Brian Claypool,

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Speaker 1: defense attorney out of l A is with me and

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Speaker 1: special guest Dr. Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist. Guys, please make

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Speaker 1: a note of what Paul just said, different stories. I'm

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Speaker 1: making it out of a jackie. Make a note. Alan,

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Speaker 1: you have a cup of coffee. Go ahead, Paul Chambers

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Speaker 1: back to you, all right. And her two children, two

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Speaker 1: year old Juliette Ramirez in sixteen month old Kabitall Ramirez

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Speaker 1: were the victims and they were both inside the car

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Speaker 1: outside her residence. The two year old, apparently, according to

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Speaker 1: her testimony for her interview with the Texas Rangers, uh,

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Speaker 1: the two year old refused to come out of the car,

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Speaker 1: so she locked the two kids in the car, as

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Speaker 1: you said, Nancy, to teach them a lesson. She went

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Speaker 1: inside according to her own right, is this the two

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Speaker 1: year old or the sixteen year old? I mean, excuse me,

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Speaker 1: the sixteen month old. They've got two tots in the car.

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Speaker 1: Was the sixteen month old or the two year old?

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Speaker 1: This was the two year old that was giving the

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Speaker 1: mother problems and she refused to come out of the car.

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Speaker 1: She uh. So the mother left them both in the car,

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Speaker 1: went inside, and according to her interview with the Texas

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Speaker 1: Rangers that's in the arrest warrant. She smoked marijuana and

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Speaker 1: then took a nap for two to three three hours.

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Speaker 1: Got up, started to look for the children, went out

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Speaker 1: to the car, saw them lying unresponsive. Juliette. The two

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Speaker 1: year old was in the driver's seat. The toddler, the

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Speaker 1: boy Kavanaugh, was in the floorboard of the car. She

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Speaker 1: uh took them out of the car, brought them into

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Speaker 1: the kitchen, laid them out on a table, then She

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Speaker 1: went back out to the car, got her cell phone,

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Speaker 1: which had run out of gas, and brought the cell

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Speaker 1: phone inside, plugged it into a charger, called the medics. Survived.

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Speaker 1: It was too late. The paramedics declared that the kids

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Speaker 1: were dead at the scene. Hold on, wait a minute,

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Speaker 1: Wait a minute, you're I'm like drinking out of a

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Speaker 1: fire hydrant. I can't take it all in. Hold on,

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Speaker 1: coming fast and furious. We are talking about what looks

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Speaker 1: to be a soccer mom. She looks like one of

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Speaker 1: those uh, Brian Claypool. You and Alan are living the

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Speaker 1: life out in l A, the Hollywood area. Alan, you

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Speaker 1: know those headed uh they're the new Kardashians, those hadded sisters.

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Speaker 1: This one right here that we're talking about that killed

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Speaker 1: her children looks like one of had D girls. She's

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Speaker 1: all like kind of like blonde ish with um perfectly

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Speaker 1: done dark eyebrows. She's she looks like hadded model slash

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Speaker 1: soccer mom. She's not gonna look too good in leg

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Speaker 1: i or as I can tell you that, Claypool. So

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Speaker 1: this woman, let me understand what you were just saying,

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Speaker 1: Paul Chambers. So she's got a two year old Juliette

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Speaker 1: and she's got the sixty month old little boy Kavanaugh.

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Speaker 1: You know, Mama, how much I'd love to have two

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Speaker 1: more children, how much I would love to how many

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Speaker 1: people in this country would want to have these two

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Speaker 1: little babies. So, you know a lot of times on

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Speaker 1: the way home to Dr Daniel Bober forensic psychiatrists joining

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Speaker 1: me out of Florida. Dr Bober, again, thank you for

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Speaker 1: being with us, um Dr Bober. So many times when

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Speaker 1: I pick up the children from school, we'll be having

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Speaker 1: such a good time in the car. We leave the

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Speaker 1: minivan running and we just sit in the car before

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Speaker 1: we come in and we keep talking and we're eating

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Speaker 1: snacks and we're having a good time. I mean the

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Speaker 1: car can we have a good time in there? And

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Speaker 1: the children love being in cars with um my little nephew.

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Speaker 1: We would go sit in the car in my parents

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Speaker 1: garage and we would pretend we were driving to Savannah,

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Speaker 1: where he was born, and he would in my my

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Speaker 1: parents car and we would stay out in the car

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Speaker 1: in the garage for like two hours, quote driving to Savannah,

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Speaker 1: and he would be driving and I would be in

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Speaker 1: the back seat. Okay, And just haven't children love the

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Speaker 1: security that feeling of being in the car and going somewhere.

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Speaker 1: What happened to her? Why do you have to get

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Speaker 1: all bent up about them not wanting to get out

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Speaker 1: of the car. Well, you know, Nancy, and you need

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Speaker 1: a license to drive a car, but only need a

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Speaker 1: license to be a parent. And thirty over thirty six

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Speaker 1: kids die a year in hot cars. But this is

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Speaker 1: something very different. I mean, this was clearly intentional, um,

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Speaker 1: and it's you know, it's just a shame that these kids,

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Speaker 1: who are completely helpless and defenseless, had a mother like

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Speaker 1: this who completely, you know, shirked her duties as a parent.

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Speaker 1: It's horrible. Well, I think it's more than that, Dr Bober.

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Speaker 1: You know I've noticed, Dr Bober. I'm not sure this

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Speaker 1: is just anecdotal, but it seems to me. I haven't

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Speaker 1: done any statistical study on you, Dr Daniel Bober, but

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Speaker 1: it seems to me that every time it's a good

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Speaker 1: looking woman, it kind of you said, shirk her responsibilities.

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Speaker 1: Because Brian Claypool, defense attorney out of the l A jurisdiction,

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Speaker 1: she didn't just shirk her responsibility, She actively intentionally locked

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Speaker 1: them in the car and left them. The little two

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Speaker 1: year old girl, Juliette, even climbing up into her mom's

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Speaker 1: driver's seat trying to get them out of the car.

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Speaker 1: She had crawled up there trying to get out of

426
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,879
Speaker 1: the car, and they died of heat stroke. You know

427
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:09,080
Speaker 1: how awful that is, Brian Claypole, what your body goes

428
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:13,359
Speaker 1: through a lot of people just claw claw at themselves.

429
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:18,400
Speaker 1: They're so hot, they vomit, they defecate. It's horrible. It's

430
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: a horrible way to die. Nancy, you weren't. You weren't

431
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,640
Speaker 1: suggesting that because she's an attractive woman, that that I'm

432
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: representing Dali di Pilito is also an attractive woman. You

433
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: eatn't Was that just a slipper? You didn't mean that intentional.

434
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,480
Speaker 1: I don't even know if that was even a question.

435
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 1: Dahlia di Polito is not attractive to me. She is

436
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,400
Speaker 1: a would be killer, and when she gets out of jail,

437
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,639
Speaker 1: which she will, she'll probably kill somebody. If I were

438
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 1: you to stay away from her, and whatever you do,

439
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:46,560
Speaker 1: don't drink anything she gives you. Okay, forget that diet coke. Alright,

440
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 1: but that's a whole another can of worms. I want

441
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,399
Speaker 1: to talk about her, but I also don't find attractive

442
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: at all. Yeah, but let's she is very beautiful. But

443
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:56,120
Speaker 1: let's put aside the beauty in both. When I look

444
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:57,920
Speaker 1: at her, I just want to snap a little nose

445
00:26:57,960 --> 00:26:59,880
Speaker 1: off her face. I just want to twist it right off.

446
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 1: But have you seen the pictures of her children. They're gorgeous,

447
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,400
Speaker 1: you know, but sadly now they're in heaven. Clay Pool.

448
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 1: Let me get you back in the middle of the road.

449
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 1: This wasn't an accident that Bober was trying to talk about.

450
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 1: The thirty six children die in a hot car every year. Uhuh,

451
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,960
Speaker 1: Mommy put them out there and left them locked in

452
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 1: the car with the windows up. This was clearly a

453
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,359
Speaker 1: different situation, Nancy. This was obviously cold blood and intentional.

454
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: But yes, I agree, it's more than her shirking her responsibilities.

455
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 1: She intentionally murdered them. Yeah, I don't think I don't

456
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,679
Speaker 1: think it's I don't think it's so simple, Daniel. Bober

457
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,920
Speaker 1: is coming around so simple, Daniel and Nancy in Texas.

458
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 1: In order for her to be convicted of the first

459
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,639
Speaker 1: degree felony, she has to, as you said, knowingly and

460
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 1: intentionally done this. Now, if I'm representing her, the defense

461
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,920
Speaker 1: you make is her mental state, if if if she

462
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,919
Speaker 1: I think, I think Alan had mentioned her having smoked

463
00:27:55,960 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 1: marijuana has occurred. Yeah, but that's but that's but that's

464
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: but that's but that's voluntary intoxication. She chose to smoke pot,

465
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:10,480
Speaker 1: So that's voluntary intoxication. That's not some medicine the doctor gave.

466
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,479
Speaker 1: But she made the decision to smoke pot. Number one,

467
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: number two, she said, I'm going to teach them a lesson,

468
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:19,280
Speaker 1: So clearly this was to punish them. That actually, Daniel,

469
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 1: that actually supports my argument. If she's saying I want

470
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:24,880
Speaker 1: to teach them a lesson, that means that she's had

471
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,679
Speaker 1: some some ongoing issues with her children. It might have

472
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: affected her mental mental stage to a point where she snapped.

473
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 1: So this wasn't an operation. Wait a minute, wait wait

474
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: wait wait wait, wait time out, wait a minute. Is

475
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: that I have not had diminished capacity, not with my children,

476
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: maybe with my husband. But wait a minute, just because

477
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 1: your child won't do what you tell it to do,

478
00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 1: when you say that she snapped, what she did was

479
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 1: walk in the house, get high and take a nap,

480
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 1: Probably had a little snack, probably got a case. Never

481
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: heard of this self defense? Did you ever? Have you

482
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: ever heard of self defense? It's called I'm too young

483
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 1: to be a mom self defense? Have you heard of

484
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 1: that now? And I wish you'd tried that in front

485
00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 1: of a jury. That's what's going on here. This woman

486
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: is overwhelmed. I'm not making an excuse, and but let's

487
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: be clear, I'm not making an excuse for what happened.

488
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: My job is, is this first degree felony a child

489
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:28,160
Speaker 1: in child uh? Endangerm with murder? Or is it? Or

490
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,760
Speaker 1: is enganger with thank you? Or is it second degree?

491
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: Second degree is where the mom doesn't intend to do it.

492
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,400
Speaker 1: My argument is because she has diminished capacity which engaged

493
00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:42,200
Speaker 1: for your for your audiences, Brian, because she's high on weed.

494
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:47,800
Speaker 1: Marijuana is not gonna fly. That's what I'm saying. She's

495
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 1: high on weed because she's having trouble. She can't handle

496
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 1: being a parent of two young kids as a young woman. Okay, guys,

497
00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: hold on, let me go back to Paul Chambers. Paul Chambers,

498
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: I think we can exclude the mommy is a pothead?

499
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 1: Defense Number one voluntary use of drugs or alcoholis Daniel

500
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,960
Speaker 1: Bober has said it's not a defense, but more important

501
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:17,720
Speaker 1: than the law is the fact she made the decision

502
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: I'm going to teach them a lesson and locked them

503
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:22,920
Speaker 1: in the car and went inside before she choked up.

504
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 1: So the whole being high on pot thing happened after

505
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 1: she made the conscious decision, So that would not serve

506
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 1: as a defense under any legal framework. Isn't that the

507
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:39,280
Speaker 1: way the facts unfolded as we know them now, Paul Chambers. Well,

508
00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 1: according to that interview that she gave the Texas Rangers,

509
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 1: she smoked marijuana after she made the decision to leave

510
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: the kids in a locked car. So, yes, Paul Chambers,

511
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: I want to get back to the different stories. You

512
00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:55,600
Speaker 1: are intimately familiar with the facts. What were this mom's

513
00:30:55,840 --> 00:31:02,440
Speaker 1: different stories as her children literally baked did in her car? Well,

514
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:06,880
Speaker 1: one of the versions that she allegedly told investigators is

515
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 1: that the kids were playing, they got into the car

516
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: and locked themselves in, and according to the prosecutor in

517
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: Parker County, she broke out a window. She admitted to

518
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:24,880
Speaker 1: breaking a window uh into the Honda vehicle to get

519
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: the kids out like it was a rescued and uh.

520
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 1: And she apparently admitted to the investigator that she intentionally

521
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 1: broke the window to corroborate her own story. So that's

522
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 1: one that's one of the versions that she gave investigators initially.

523
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 1: The one they're going with the arrest warrant, of course,

524
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 1: is is the one that we've been talking about where

525
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 1: she left them in the car and then went in

526
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:51,240
Speaker 1: and had pot. So, Alan, do you joining me out

527
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: of l A Alan? It's about nineties six outside the

528
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: car and inside the car. I would assume it's about

529
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 1: a hundred one two degree he's inside the car. Yeah,

530
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 1: it it heats up really really quick. And if we're

531
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: talking about Texas, I mean it is hot there and

532
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: Texas in the summer, is it's like l H double two. Kids,

533
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 1: you're talking about a twenty degree increase in ten minutes?

534
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: Is that? Dr bober YEP, twenty degrees increase in ten minutes.

535
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 1: So then we're talking about a hundred and fifteen to

536
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 1: eighteen degrees inside the car. I mean, I don't even

537
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: know you know what, Dr bober I should have asked

538
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: you that to start with, you're a psychiatrist. It means

539
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 1: you had to go to med school to start with

540
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:34,840
Speaker 1: what happens during a heat stroke? I mean everything you've

541
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: said before, I mean total dehydration. Body temperature rises in children,

542
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:42,000
Speaker 1: their physiology is different than adults. Their body temperature can

543
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 1: increase three it's five times faster than in an adult.

544
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 1: So kids are particularly vulnerable to the effects of extreme temperatures.

545
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,720
Speaker 1: So it's really a horrific, awful death that child experience.

546
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:56,320
Speaker 1: You know, I really learned a lot about it, you know,

547
00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: from a lay person's point of view anyway, And I

548
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 1: like you a medical octor. When we did uh baby

549
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:08,200
Speaker 1: Cooper's death, the dad justin Ross Harris was convicted a

550
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 1: murder one um by leaving leaving intentionally leaving baby Cooper

551
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: in the car so he could be with other women

552
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 1: and live a single life. That's when I learned what

553
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: I do know about heat stroke, what brings on a

554
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:28,959
Speaker 1: heat stroke, because a friend of ours, boss, had been

555
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: out playing tennis, came in, she took a shower and

556
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:36,280
Speaker 1: had a heat stroke in the shower. That was several

557
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: years ago, and she's still I think paralyzed on one

558
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:43,920
Speaker 1: side of her body, right, So she experienced a permanent

559
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: neurological their current permanent neurological injury from her body heating

560
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 1: up and lack of oxygen to the brain, which can happen.

561
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:54,400
Speaker 1: There's your body has several mechanisms to regular temperature, including

562
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:59,400
Speaker 1: you know, vasodilation and sweating, which is but once those

563
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: mechanisms become overwhelmed that your body temperature increases, there are

564
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 1: several irreversible injuries that occur due to the accessition. So

565
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: not only that, Brian Claypool, hold on Paul Chambers once

566
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,359
Speaker 1: and Paul, what are the charges right now? And where

567
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 1: is she? Well, she's been in the Parker County jail

568
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:23,239
Speaker 1: since June. The incident occurred May. The grandjury indictment came

569
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 1: last week and the medical examiner made their ruling earlier

570
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:31,839
Speaker 1: this month that the deaths were homicides and that, uh

571
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 1: the so she is remains on in jail on the

572
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 1: first degree felony injury to a child charges and uh

573
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,840
Speaker 1: there is a bond set of two hundred thousand dollars

574
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 1: in each case. She has a public defender according to reports,

575
00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:54,279
Speaker 1: and so she's just doing time right now in the

576
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 1: Parker County jail. I'm now getting reports right now. The

577
00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:01,319
Speaker 1: temperatures went up to around a hundred agrees that day,

578
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: and according to Dr Bober in the car. It would

579
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,920
Speaker 1: have been a hundred and twenty degrees. Washington Township, Pennsylvania.

580
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:15,480
Speaker 1: A woman places a Craigslist ad for a hit man,

581
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,879
Speaker 1: a hit man, and you think you're not gonna get

582
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 1: caught posting it on Craigslist. Let me go out to

583
00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,800
Speaker 1: our special guest joining us right now, senior crime reporter

584
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: at huff Post. You know him. Well, everybody reads off post,

585
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 1: David Lord, thank you for being with us. Sadly, there's

586
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,720
Speaker 1: never a lack of business. Would you agree at least

587
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,320
Speaker 1: with that, never a lack of business? That that's certainly true. Nancy.

588
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:41,719
Speaker 1: What did the ad say? Well, Dad said, you know,

589
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 1: I'm scared to death of this man. I moved on

590
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:46,920
Speaker 1: with my life, and you know he's been threatening me,

591
00:35:47,000 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 1: causing me problems. And she was asking for someone if

592
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:51,800
Speaker 1: they could beat the crap out of him or possibly

593
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,240
Speaker 1: kill him. WHOA Now, how common is something like that

594
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,000
Speaker 1: to pop up on Craigslist? All right? You know what,

595
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,040
Speaker 1: in the twenty some years I've been doing this, I

596
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 1: can't think of anyone using Craigslist for a hitman. We

597
00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:07,399
Speaker 1: know Craigslist has been um in the middle of a

598
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,520
Speaker 1: lot of crimes and a lot of murders and a

599
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 1: lot of setups on robberies, carjackings, for instance, placing an

600
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,360
Speaker 1: ad for a car to sell a car on Craigslist,

601
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,720
Speaker 1: the person shows up, they get carjacked, they get shot,

602
00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: they get robbed. I've reported on several of those and more.

603
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 1: I mean, of course, there's the Craigslist killer. We all

604
00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 1: know about that one. But this one very very unusual

605
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:36,840
Speaker 1: because what happened is the woman actually is so brazen

606
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:40,680
Speaker 1: she places an ad for a hit man. It's there

607
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: in Washington Township where this wife goes on Craigslist to

608
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:50,280
Speaker 1: find a hitman. Let's talk about what really happened. Who

609
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: was actually behind the Craigslist advertisement, David lore Well, according

610
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:59,399
Speaker 1: to police, it was the strange husband, thirty year old

611
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:02,960
Speaker 1: Christian coach uh is who they've identified, and he actually

612
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:05,839
Speaker 1: was the individual who went to police to complain about

613
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: the ad in the first place. Well, White, what now,

614
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:10,719
Speaker 1: So what are you telling me that he places the

615
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:16,239
Speaker 1: ad posing as his estranged wife to kill himself and

616
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,680
Speaker 1: then he walks in the police station complaining that his

617
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:22,839
Speaker 1: wife's trying to have him killed. What an idiot? Oh yeah,

618
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 1: that's that's exactly what he did. Nancy Okay, So he

619
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,400
Speaker 1: goes to the police station and complains, look at this

620
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 1: Craigslist ad. So he's trying to frame her with police

621
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 1: get her put in jail. Huh. So how did police

622
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 1: figure out she didn't place the Craigslist ad. Well, from

623
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,480
Speaker 1: the onset, it did kind of point at her because

624
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 1: the authority said it was in fact, her email address

625
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:52,040
Speaker 1: that was used in the post was created in the

626
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:54,719
Speaker 1: Waynesboro area. So what they did is they went to

627
00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 1: talk to her. They said she just totally flipped out,

628
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:00,759
Speaker 1: started crying, said she couldn't leave, he would do this

629
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,319
Speaker 1: to her. And so as police dug into it a

630
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:06,000
Speaker 1: little more, they found out that, you know, in order

631
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:08,839
Speaker 1: to post a message to Craigslist, you have to get

632
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 1: a text verification. Well, he screwed up when he used

633
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 1: his own cell phone number to do that text verification. Okay, wait,

634
00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:17,759
Speaker 1: whit whit? What? What? Hold on? Hold on? What are

635
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 1: you saying about a text verification? How did he screw up? Well,

636
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,440
Speaker 1: when you post an ad to Craigslist, they ask you

637
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: for a cell phone number where they can send you

638
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,799
Speaker 1: a text message and then you would write into confirmation

639
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:29,880
Speaker 1: code and this is how they try to do away

640
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 1: with a lot of the scammers and spamming that happens

641
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: on the website, and he had used his cell phone

642
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:38,440
Speaker 1: to send that verification. Okay, I've never placed a Craigslist

643
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,319
Speaker 1: ad yet or how to hit man to kill my

644
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:45,680
Speaker 1: husband yet, so this is all Greek to me. So

645
00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:50,080
Speaker 1: you're saying, when you place a Craigslist ad, they verify

646
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:52,880
Speaker 1: it back to you. Is that what you're saying? Yes, correct,

647
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: you have to give them a cell phone number. And

648
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: you know that the ad wasn't just asking someone to

649
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,040
Speaker 1: do them a favor. Was also us saying that the

650
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 1: individual who did this could be entitled do insurance money?

651
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,439
Speaker 1: What what? What kind of insurance money are we talking about?

652
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: I didn't know the insurance money aspect. Yeah, there, you

653
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 1: know obviously you know if there was life insurance, I

654
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 1: assume on this gentleman, that's what they were going to

655
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,720
Speaker 1: get over give to the person who was to commit

656
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 1: the crime. And you know, obviously we know at this

657
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,880
Speaker 1: point that he did that himself, but this was just

658
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,799
Speaker 1: his way of adding another level to it to try

659
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,799
Speaker 1: to show that his wife had done level, to show

660
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,160
Speaker 1: his wife had done it. So then with all armed

661
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,720
Speaker 1: with all of this, they go and they confront the woman.

662
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,719
Speaker 1: They're in the little township. She nuts up. So what

663
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 1: leads them to investigate and figure out that it's not her?

664
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:46,200
Speaker 1: What was her demeanor? She acted genuinely and I mean

665
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 1: what made them suspect it wasn't for real? Well, you know,

666
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:51,279
Speaker 1: you have to keep in mind too that this guy

667
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 1: had has a prior criminal record, So this, you know,

668
00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 1: and she she's apparently had issues with him in the

669
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: past to the point where she's taken her kids and

670
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: placed them somewhere else. Is what she had told police. Okay,

671
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:09,400
Speaker 1: that's pretty persuasive for me. That is very persuasive for me.

672
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,480
Speaker 1: So here you've got him with a criminal record, and

673
00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 1: her I assume pure as the driven snow and she's

674
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 1: actually had two Are you saying take the children and

675
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:20,360
Speaker 1: hide them? Is that what? That's what she told police?

676
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:25,439
Speaker 1: WHOA So the whole thing starts out as a from

677
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: what I understand, a domestic violence incident. Wasn't he already

678
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 1: on probation as you're saying for domestic violence? He was

679
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 1: on probation for an assault. The court documents that I've

680
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 1: seen don't don't go into how he obtained that charge.

681
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: But what we know is an assault. So he's already

682
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: on probation, and then he marches in and complains his

683
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 1: wife's trying to kill him. Okay, so there are children involved.

684
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 1: That's another fact I didn't know. So here's the guy

685
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:55,520
Speaker 1: who creates a Craigslist ad for his own murder, all

686
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: in an attempt to frame his estranged wife. Now I

687
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: understand ei there is strange. I get it if. I

688
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: mean if we and you and I David Lor Senior,

689
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:07,799
Speaker 1: Crime reported with huff Post, are sitting here talking about it,

690
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 1: and we're a thousand miles away from this guy, no

691
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 1: telling what This woman has endured in her marriage and

692
00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:17,160
Speaker 1: has actually given birth to this guy's kids. So what

693
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,279
Speaker 1: do we know about him other than he has a

694
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 1: criminal history. That's kind of not surprising me, David Lore.

695
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:29,800
Speaker 1: He's only thirty. He's only thirty, Yeah, exactly, Okay, go ahead.

696
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:31,319
Speaker 1: What else do we know about this guy? You know?

697
00:41:31,400 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 1: We we know they've spent some sort of a history

698
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,080
Speaker 1: of troubled relationship between he and his wife, and certainly

699
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 1: putting perfume on the pig a troubled relationship. To me,

700
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 1: that sounds like you forgotten to buy an anniversary card.

701
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 1: This is a lot more David Lore, you married? Okay, Well,

702
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 1: I would say troubled relationship. You know, he may have

703
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 1: a spat here and there. I think this goes way

704
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:55,680
Speaker 1: beyond a troubled relationship. David Lor Hey, I'm gonna go

705
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 1: check Craig's. Listen. See, there's a hit out on David

706
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 1: Lore on Craigsby. So a probabled relationship, as you so

707
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,719
Speaker 1: euphemistically refer to it. Go ahead. What else do we know? Well,

708
00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 1: like I said, we know they had a troubled relationship,

709
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 1: and one of the things he complained to police about

710
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 1: was that they never listened to him. They never take

711
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,960
Speaker 1: his side, and you know, so that's what prompted him

712
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: to take this action. Never listened to me. Yeah, he's

713
00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:22,040
Speaker 1: not talking to his family's talking to police. You never

714
00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:25,400
Speaker 1: listen to me. Listen to this, David Lord huff Post.

715
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: So he marches into the police station with his you

716
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: told us a picture of the ad that he's so

717
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:35,320
Speaker 1: conveniently provided for them. But he also says a friend

718
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 1: told him there's a price on his head. Yeah, he

719
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:43,279
Speaker 1: makes up a friend, his imaginary friend, who tells him

720
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:46,879
Speaker 1: about the ad for a hit man. Okay, so could

721
00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 1: they confirm the pretend friend. The pretend friend is not

722
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 1: referenced in the court documents, so I think it's unlikely

723
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 1: that he exists. David, I think we need a shrink

724
00:42:57,680 --> 00:42:59,759
Speaker 1: on this, and one won't work. We need to hold

725
00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:03,799
Speaker 1: team from Vienna. Because the ad is written from a

726
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: woman's perspective. It talks about needing someone to quote do

727
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,239
Speaker 1: a job about her marriage, makes other allegations about him.

728
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:15,560
Speaker 1: Quote I'm scared to death of this man, and I've

729
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:20,759
Speaker 1: already moved on and dot dot dot someone else. What

730
00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 1: I'm looking for is someone to either beat the complete

731
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 1: crap out of my husband were separated hint hint, I'm single,

732
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:31,120
Speaker 1: or kill him. The ad further states if the man died,

733
00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:35,080
Speaker 1: the writer would use an insurance policy to pay the hitman.

734
00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:39,360
Speaker 1: The alleged author claims not only was this request for

735
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:43,520
Speaker 1: her own well being, but for the safety of her children. Oh,

736
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:46,360
Speaker 1: she's so noble. It's not even her, it's him. And

737
00:43:46,400 --> 00:43:48,880
Speaker 1: it ends with the writer giving a phone number to

738
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:52,399
Speaker 1: call and the best time to contact the wife. He

739
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:56,720
Speaker 1: gives his wife's phone number, So then I guess David

740
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,040
Speaker 1: Lor from huff Post Police then try to get info

741
00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:01,880
Speaker 1: about the add from Chris egslist, and that's the info

742
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 1: that showed the email address used to create the ad

743
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:09,239
Speaker 1: was the wife's email. So he actually hacks into her

744
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:13,120
Speaker 1: email to do this. It appears so nancy. They said

745
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,440
Speaker 1: it was made using her email address. And you know

746
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:18,359
Speaker 1: he went so far as when he told police about this,

747
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 1: Uh he said, quote, I'm wrecked, and uh, I know

748
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:24,960
Speaker 1: that she's going to blame this entire thing on me.

749
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:30,439
Speaker 1: Talk about a confession. I'm wrecked. She's gonna blame this somebody.

750
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 1: Why didn't even go to police? But I guess that

751
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 1: was part of his scheme. But he needs to also

752
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 1: be charged with hacking into her computer? Freak. Do we

753
00:44:37,719 --> 00:44:39,920
Speaker 1: know if this had anything to do with custody of

754
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:43,640
Speaker 1: the children or is he just angry she finally left him?

755
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:47,040
Speaker 1: And lady, I don't blame you? So is he is?

756
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 1: He was he ever charged with actually hacking in because

757
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:57,720
Speaker 1: the investigating the posted after me technical angle police also

758
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 1: spoke with him and her about it, and he said

759
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:05,200
Speaker 1: at that time he wasn't sure his wife had really

760
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:08,760
Speaker 1: done it or if she had somebody else do it.

761
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,320
Speaker 1: His plot is thickening. It's now turned into a big conspiracy.

762
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 1: So bottom line was this guy looking at Oh yeah,

763
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,040
Speaker 1: the phone number provided by the person who created the

764
00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:22,800
Speaker 1: ad was different, as you reported, David Lore. It turns

765
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 1: out to be his cell phone. Okay, When cops and

766
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: meet with Colch and show him the IP address and

767
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:35,280
Speaker 1: phone number, it turns out it's his, not hers. At first,

768
00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:37,799
Speaker 1: he seemed to be nodding as if he understood, but

769
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 1: he didn't say anything. He just kind of stood there dumbfounded.

770
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 1: Long story short, he says, I did it for protection

771
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 1: from the police in the d a's office. What is

772
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:50,920
Speaker 1: he talking about, David? From what I gather, he has

773
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 1: a bit of a criminal record leading up to this,

774
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:58,360
Speaker 1: and uh, he'd actually supposedly followed a lawsuit against law enforcement.

775
00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:01,320
Speaker 1: So I think he he's trying to say he feels

776
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 1: like he's always the bad guy, you know, and for

777
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:04,879
Speaker 1: once he wanted to be the good guy, even if

778
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,520
Speaker 1: it meant him fabricating a crime to do so. This

779
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 1: guy just got twenty three months for this to run

780
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 1: concurrent or at the same time, is his probation revocation

781
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:20,680
Speaker 1: on twenty three months, he might maybe do two or

782
00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 1: three months. I'm talking eight to twelve weeks behind ours.

783
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:30,160
Speaker 1: Man I gotta tell you, I can't believe that. Nancy

784
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 1: Grace Crime Stories, signing off goodbye friend,