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Speaker 1: Regain your privacy, protect yourself online. The following is a

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Speaker 1: prerecorded program. You are entering the Freedom Hunt, a place

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Speaker 1: liberty and patriotism call home, Shoulder to shoulder, need to

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Speaker 1: come together, shield time, you need to protect America. This

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Speaker 1: is the Sexton Show. Buck Sexton joins us now we analyst,

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Speaker 1: former NYPD intelligence officer, Now Buck Sexton. Welcome to the

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Speaker 1: Buck Sexton Show. This is Ben Winegarden in for Buck Sexton.

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Speaker 1: Here on an action packed Thursday from the not so

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Speaker 1: free New York City, but the Freedom Hut hidden high

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Speaker 1: a top Lower Manhattan. Again, this has Ben Winegarden in

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Speaker 1: for Buck Sexton. Been here all week, really had a

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Speaker 1: privilege and it's been an honor and a pleasure to

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Speaker 1: spend this week with you as there are so many

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Speaker 1: things going on in the world of such substance and

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Speaker 1: you know, before we jump in again. I'm a senior

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Speaker 1: contributor at The Federalist, a columnist at Newsweek and The

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Speaker 1: Epic Times, a fellow at the Claremont Institute. You can

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Speaker 1: find all my work at Winegarden dot substack dot com

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Speaker 1: or ben Winegarden dot com, and I encourage you to

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Speaker 1: follow me on Twitter, where I speak too frequently at

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Speaker 1: b H. Winegarden. And before we jump into today's episode,

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Speaker 1: just a programming note as well. The Clay Travis and

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Speaker 1: Buck Sexton Show starts at noon next Monday, the twenty first,

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Speaker 1: and then Jesse Kelly will be filling in Buck Sexton's

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Speaker 1: slot from six to nine pm the following Monday, June

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Speaker 1: twenty eighth. We're going to jump all around the world

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Speaker 1: today and we've got some exceptional guests. We'll be speaking

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Speaker 1: with Congressman Jim Banks, a Republican from Indiana on the

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Speaker 1: chair of the Republican Study Committee, this sort of in

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Speaker 1: house think tank of the GOP in the House about

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Speaker 1: all sorts of issues, from the threat of communist China

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Speaker 1: to January sixth disparate treatment versus sixteen nineteen rioters. We'll

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Speaker 1: be speaking with Christian Witten about Joe Biden's excellent adventure

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Speaker 1: overseas and the misadventure that it really is for America

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Speaker 1: and our national interests. We'll speak with Professor Scott Jenner

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Speaker 1: about taking on critical race theory and what CRT and

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Speaker 1: the cult of diversity, equity, and inclusion are really all about.

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Speaker 1: And last, but not least, will also speak with my

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Speaker 1: friend Rachel Bovard, who's done some exceptional work and reporting

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Speaker 1: on sort of the conservative case for antitrust and taking

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Speaker 1: on big tech and really concentrated power in all of

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Speaker 1: its forms, and in particular woke concentrated power in all

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Speaker 1: of its forms, public and private. To get into these issues,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go an indirect route. But bear with

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Speaker 1: me here because you're listening to someone who listened to

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Speaker 1: sports talk radio since the time he was about five

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Speaker 1: years old. And I'm a huge sports fan, a huge

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Speaker 1: baseball fan, unfortunately, a huge New York Mets fan, and

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Speaker 1: last night I had the pleasure of going to see

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Speaker 1: Jacob deGrom pitch. And bear with me if you're not

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Speaker 1: a sports fan, but Jacob Degram right now is the

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Speaker 1: dominant pitcher in Major League Baseball, having arguably the best

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Speaker 1: season ever, not just in modern era, but in the

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Speaker 1: history of the game, absolutely dominating to an unprecedented extent.

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Speaker 1: Every single start that he makes health provided is just

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Speaker 1: a massive spectacle. The turnout has been tremendous at a

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Speaker 1: stadium in New York where it seems that people are

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Speaker 1: still a little bit fearful with the pandemic sadly, and

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Speaker 1: so turnout has not been exceptional all around. But it's

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Speaker 1: a winning ball club and it's the most dominant pitcher

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Speaker 1: in the game, maybe the most dominant player at any

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Speaker 1: position in the game, and having one of the most

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Speaker 1: dominant seasons, if not the most dominant season of all time.

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Speaker 1: Why do I talk about Jacob deGrom Besides the fact

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Speaker 1: that I love the Mets. Last night was a beautiful

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Speaker 1: night for a ball game. The return to normalcy of

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Speaker 1: going to a ballpark in America is something that we

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Speaker 1: take for granted. I mean, from my perspective, I'd go

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Speaker 1: to about a dozen games a year in a typical year,

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Speaker 1: and it's been over a year since going out to

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Speaker 1: the ballpark and just seeing a scenario of people just

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Speaker 1: generally happy, acting normal. None of this. You know, why

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Speaker 1: aren't you wearing your mask and people dodging you and

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Speaker 1: running to the other side of the stadium. No, it

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Speaker 1: was as if we were America again, a free and

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Speaker 1: independent people, not governed by bureaucrats and technocrats with their

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Speaker 1: asinine decrees on our necks. So hopefully that's a positive

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Speaker 1: little vignette, and I encourage everyone to get out to

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Speaker 1: the ballpark. It just felt liberating. And I know most

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Speaker 1: of you probably live in free America, but here behind

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Speaker 1: the iron curtain in the Northeast, this was a real

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Speaker 1: treat at the baseball game. What we saw on display,

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Speaker 1: and unfortunately only for three innings because Jacob deGrom is

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Speaker 1: battling injuries this season, but what we saw in three

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Speaker 1: innings were told strikeouts of eight of nine batters one

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Speaker 1: person all of one batter put the ball in play

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Speaker 1: against Jacob Degram. We're seeing someone someone who's excellent at

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Speaker 1: what they do, at the absolute pinnacle of their game,

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Speaker 1: with chance of MVP Most Valuable Player raining down from

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Speaker 1: the crowd, and an electric atmosphere from before the first

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Speaker 1: pitch of the game. What does this have to do

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Speaker 1: with all of the issues we're facing as a country

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Speaker 1: right now. Wide contrast Jacob deGrom and athleticism broadly athletics

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Speaker 1: broadly with what we see in our ruling class. Let

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Speaker 1: me explain, in sports, we still celebrate excellence, achievement. The

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Speaker 1: only thing that matters at the end of the day

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Speaker 1: in sports are wins and losses. It's binary. You can't

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Speaker 1: sugarcoat it. You can say a team made a great effort,

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Speaker 1: a player made a great play, had an exceptional season.

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Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, wins and losses

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Speaker 1: are the only thing that matters. And it does not

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Speaker 1: matter who you are, where you're from, what your limitations are.

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Speaker 1: All the matters ultimately is performance. In other words, even

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Speaker 1: though wokeism is pervading all of our sports in ways

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Speaker 1: that are maddening, and yes, at the stadium, you know

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Speaker 1: there's a Coca Cola sign that's in rainbow colors for

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Speaker 1: Pride Month. So you can't escape the politicization even at

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Speaker 1: a sporting event, even if it's not Lebron James telling

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Speaker 1: you to bat down to communist China. Nevertheless, the game

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Speaker 1: is still the game. It's still about results at the

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Speaker 1: end of the day, and excellence and achievement is is

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Speaker 1: something that is loved and cherished and relished at the

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Speaker 1: end of the day. It's also worth noting that excellence

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Speaker 1: can be very fleeting. In the case of a pitcher,

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Speaker 1: pitcher can break down. Jacob Degraham throws one hundred and

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Speaker 1: one miles an hour consistently. No one pretty much in

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Speaker 1: the history of the game has ever done that. He's

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Speaker 1: had some injuries this year. It's incredibly disconcerting as a fan.

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Speaker 1: No matter what team you're root for, greatness is fleeting.

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Speaker 1: It requires constant tending to nurturing, recognizing threats to greatness

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Speaker 1: and competition, and proactively countering them. Cultivating excellence is what

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Speaker 1: sports are all about. There's no affirmative action in sports.

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Speaker 1: There's no equity in sports. If you cultivate excellence, you

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Speaker 1: bring it excellent. If you cultivate mediocrity, you crystallize mediocrity.

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Speaker 1: And what we're seeing across pretty much every domain that

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Speaker 1: a ruling class has its hands on again, setting aside athletics,

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Speaker 1: is the cultivation of anything but excellent and a celebration

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Speaker 1: really at the end of the day of failure. Traditional

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Speaker 1: values like hard work, prudence, humility, virtue, Judeo Christian morality,

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Speaker 1: that is morality traditionally understood civic duty, patriotism. If we

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Speaker 1: instill those values and principles in our people. Nothing can

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Speaker 1: stop America. American greatness will proceed for generations. But American

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Speaker 1: greatness can also be quite fleeting. And we are a

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Speaker 1: very young nation. If you look at world history and

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Speaker 1: our adversaries, be it Communist China or anyone else, they

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Speaker 1: preceded us in some cases by many hundreds of years.

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Speaker 1: They're more patient than we are. In some cases, they've

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Speaker 1: dealt with more hardships than we have. They've experienced tyranny

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Speaker 1: in a way that we haven't, although many of our

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Speaker 1: ancestors may have fled it. The memory of a nation

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Speaker 1: is short. Achieving and maintaining is not written into the stars.

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Speaker 1: We talked earlier in the week about New York and

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Speaker 1: New York is returning to the bad old days, all

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Speaker 1: after the tenure of a single mayor and a bad

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Speaker 1: governor at the same time, too, it took decades to

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Speaker 1: get New York out of its doldrums. And just like that,

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Speaker 1: it can all turn quickly. Just like the career of

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Speaker 1: an excellent athlete, it can fade for any number of reasons,

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Speaker 1: just like you can work a lifetime to build a reputation,

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Speaker 1: and it can be tarnished and destroyed with a single

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Speaker 1: bad tweet or misstatement, But with respect to the country,

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Speaker 1: the surest way to ensure America loses its luster, squanders

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Speaker 1: it's greatness, becomes a decadent and decaying rump of a

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Speaker 1: four leader of Western civilization, of the free world, the

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Speaker 1: last bastion of freedom, the only place in the world

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Speaker 1: where anyone who desires to live in liberty and justice

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Speaker 1: will give anything to immigrate to. The shortest way to

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Speaker 1: mess it all up is to reject, to repudiate, all

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Speaker 1: of those values and principles I just discussed. And if

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Speaker 1: we're taught to hate our country from the commanding heights

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Speaker 1: of society, from our government itself, from our corporations, from

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Speaker 1: our tech companies, from our schools, from all of our

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Speaker 1: civil society institutions, how could we possibly defend that country?

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Speaker 1: Who would want to defend that country? It would be

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Speaker 1: immoral to defend that country to promulgate the vision and

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Speaker 1: the policies necessary necessary to maintain it. If we're taught

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Speaker 1: that measures of excellence, any kind of measure of excellence,

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Speaker 1: are racist and bigoted, we will reward people for everything

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Speaker 1: but excellence. Politics will trump merit. What that's a recipe

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Speaker 1: for are not just individuals failing upward. It's a recipe then,

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Speaker 1: for failure across the board. Our ruling class fails again

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Speaker 1: and again to adequately represent us. It doesn't represent us.

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Speaker 1: It makes us subservient to it. It exists, essentially like

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Speaker 1: all bureaucracies, exist to perpetuate its own power and privilege,

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Speaker 1: to squander the very values and principles that allowed the

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Speaker 1: individuals who can eyes our ruling class to have to rise,

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Speaker 1: to ascend to such a position in society. Isn't it

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Speaker 1: remarkable that the very ruling class responsible for propagating the

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Speaker 1: America Last Agenda, for embracing critical race theory, for embracing

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Speaker 1: racial division, eskewing excellence, not fighting back when standardized tests

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Speaker 1: are called racist. They've been the greatest beneficiaries of this

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Speaker 1: system and cynically, and I think rightly, if you look

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Speaker 1: at all of their actions at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: Yes there's cowardice, Yes there are some true believers. Yes

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Speaker 1: there are people, as we've talked about, who are trying

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Speaker 1: to feed the woke crocodile so it spares them at

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Speaker 1: the end of the day, which will be a recipe

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Speaker 1: of disaster for them, by the way, just so we

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Speaker 1: deserved Ultimately, what are these policies about dividing and conquering

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Speaker 1: so that they crystallize their positions in society? If you

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Speaker 1: want to keep competition at Bay Pit Americans against each other,

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Speaker 1: stop kids in public schools from being able to take

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Speaker 1: advanced classes that allow them to reach their full potential

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Speaker 1: while your own kids can go to private schools and

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Speaker 1: not have to worry about those issues. Put politics over

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Speaker 1: merit to protect your own position in society. Make politics

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Speaker 1: the number one thing because the incumbents and politics have

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Speaker 1: the advantage. So how do I take this back to sports. Well,

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Speaker 1: when you have to defend values and principles that we

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Speaker 1: talked about, it makes you hungry. It keeps you hungry,

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Speaker 1: It keeps you committed to a cause, It keeps you

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Speaker 1: debticated to American greatness. When you become weak and fat

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Speaker 1: and decadent, like the leaders on display at the G seven,

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Speaker 1: you become a rump of a society. It's like a

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Speaker 1: bad athlete resting on his laurels or formerly great athlete

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Speaker 1: resting on its worlds. And oftentimes you see great athletes

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Speaker 1: in retirement completely out of shape, barely a shadow of

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Speaker 1: what they were. A country has to appreciate greatness, cultivate greatness.

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Speaker 1: If it wants to be great, it has to celebrate achievement.

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Speaker 1: It has to prioritize merit above all else. And in

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Speaker 1: particular when all of the adversaries facing that country care

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Speaker 1: at the end of the day about results, about performance,

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Speaker 1: even if they're hobbled by their own corruption and misdeeds,

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Speaker 1: as we'll talk about with Congressman Jim Banks in just

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Speaker 1: a bit teaching the military Ebramex Kendy racist philosophy, an

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Speaker 1: America loathing worldview. How could you possibly defend a country

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Speaker 1: if you're told it's terrible. It's a recipe for mediocrity.

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Speaker 1: We have to cultivate excellent instead of crystallizing mediocrity. They's

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Speaker 1: been wandering in for Buck Sexton back after a short break.

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Speaker 1: President is an experienced statesman. Our one on one conversation

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Speaker 1: took almost two hours. It's not every world leader that

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Speaker 1: I guess this amount of attention. I mean, his predecessor

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Speaker 1: was asked the same question. He evaded this. This President

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Speaker 1: decided to respond to the question directly, and in this

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Speaker 1: he is very different from President Trump. That's wadermer Putin

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Speaker 1: talking about Joe Biden, and I think it's important to

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Speaker 1: note experienced statesmen, experienced statesmen by today's standards, our mediocrities.

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Speaker 1: Experienced statesmen have overseen policies for decades that have put

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Speaker 1: America last and allowed people like Vladimir Putin to run

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Speaker 1: circles around them. All of our adversaries love experienced statesmen.

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Speaker 1: Think about the position that America has squandered since the

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Speaker 1: end of the Cold War, the blood and treasure we've spilled,

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Speaker 1: while our adversaries have enriched and empowered themselves and threatened

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Speaker 1: us in ways that we haven't been threatened in decades.

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Speaker 1: If ever, so, when I go back to excellence or mediocrity,

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Speaker 1: experienced statesmen or the definition of those who have been

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Speaker 1: cultivated in mediocrity on the basis of the results for

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Speaker 1: the country, Are we a richer, stronger, more powerful country

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Speaker 1: as a consequence of our political establishment embodied personified by

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Speaker 1: President Joe Biden. No, we are not. And then the

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Speaker 1: rest of the episode today where we speak with Congressman

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Speaker 1: Jim Banks and Christian Witten and Professor Scott Jenner and

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Speaker 1: Rachel Bovard We're going to touch on national security and

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Speaker 1: foreign policy, domestic policy, big tech, and what's going on

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Speaker 1: in education. And if you look, the running theme through

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Speaker 1: all of these areas is cultivating mediocrity, crystallizing mediocrity, not

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Speaker 1: pursuing excellence and pursuing American greatness and our national interests

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Speaker 1: first and only. This Ben Wangarten in for Buck sex

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Speaker 1: And on the Buck Sex and Show. And we'll be

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Speaker 1: back with Congressman Jim Banks right after this. You're in

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Speaker 1: the Freedom Hunt. Thanks for listening to the Buck Sexton

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Speaker 1: Show podcast. Get the latest from Buck at buck sexton

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Speaker 1: So yes or no Racism in the United States Navy, Admiral,

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Speaker 1: you recommended every sailor in the United States Navy read

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Speaker 1: this book. So yes or no question. I'm not forcing

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Speaker 1: anybody to read the book. It's on a recommended reading list. Admiral,

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Speaker 1: did you read the book? I did, Admiral. Department of

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Speaker 1: Defense undertook the standown because they understand that extremism detracts

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Speaker 1: from military readiness. So if sailors accept Kennedy's argument that

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Speaker 1: America and the United States Navy are fundamentally racist, as

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Speaker 1: you've encouraged them to do, do you expect that to

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Speaker 1: increase or decrease rall and cohesion or even recruiting into

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Speaker 1: the United States Navy. Our strength is in our diversity,

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Speaker 1: and our sailors understand that race is a very Racism

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Speaker 1: in the United States is a very complex issue. That

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Speaker 1: was Congressman Jim Banks, a Republican from Indiana and chairman

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Speaker 1: of the Republican Study Committee, having a somewhat heated exchange,

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Speaker 1: at least on one side of it, with the Chief

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Speaker 1: of Naval Operations Michael Gilday regarding the Navy's endorsement of

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Speaker 1: its leaders reading the likes of ibramex Kendy, and I

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Speaker 1: believe Michelle Alexander as well. And here to talk about

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Speaker 1: that and so much more from China to January sixth

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Speaker 1: and beyond is Congressman Jim Banks. Thanks so much for

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Speaker 1: coming on the program. Hey Ben, good to be with you.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having Me's my pleasure. And let's start right

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Speaker 1: there with that exchange. What was your takeaway? Are you

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Speaker 1: any more confident in the state of our navy and

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Speaker 1: as a particularly as a naval reservist as well. Are

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Speaker 1: you satisfied with that exchange? Far? Far from it? You

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Speaker 1: know it. It's not been a several weeks when I

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Speaker 1: first wrote Admiral guild A, drawing attention to him putting

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Speaker 1: this outrageous and Unamerican book on a reading list that

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Speaker 1: he pushes out to every sailor in the United States

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Speaker 1: Navy and encourages them to read. If you know anything

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Speaker 1: about Abrahm X Kendy, you know that it's not his

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Speaker 1: book How to Be an Anti Racist. It's it's his

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Speaker 1: entire body of work that is inherently just that it

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Speaker 1: is racist. It is Unamerican. And the thought that the

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Speaker 1: most powerful, the highest ranking admiral of the United States

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Speaker 1: Navy would push out a book to every sailor to

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Speaker 1: read that says that America is evil, inherently racist. The

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Speaker 1: United States Navy and other institutions in our country our

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Speaker 1: racist is exactly. It's not just counterproductive, it's completely Unamerican.

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Speaker 1: And in that exchange you can hear that, I mean,

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Speaker 1: my my guess is that some junior officer I thought

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Speaker 1: this was a good idea. Now he's in a position

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Speaker 1: where he has to defend it. When I asked him

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Speaker 1: at the end of the exchange, I mean, did you

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Speaker 1: actually read it? He said, he did. To give me

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Speaker 1: one redeeming quality of this book that makes it something's

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Speaker 1: appropriate to put on the list. He couldn't answer it.

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Speaker 1: He got defensive instead. And you can hear more of

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Speaker 1: that exchange. I know you played it, but throughout the

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Speaker 1: exchange you get a sense that he knows he can't

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Speaker 1: defend it. And it's really remarkable. He goes to the

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Speaker 1: diversity is our strength response, and yeah, of course you

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Speaker 1: need a diversity of opinion when you're talking about dealing

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Speaker 1: with our worst adversaries. You need experts in other languages

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Speaker 1: and other cultures, but there can be no diversity when

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Speaker 1: it comes to love of country and patriotism. There have

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Speaker 1: to be certain unifying values and principles to have the biggest,

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Speaker 1: baddest fighting force in the history of mankind and deal

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Speaker 1: with all these adversaries that we face. Given that, I mean,

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Speaker 1: what are the consequences in terms of moral for future

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Speaker 1: recruitment and for fielding the strongest fighting force given wokeism

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Speaker 1: seemingly pervading not just the military, but also the intelligence

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Speaker 1: community and beyond. Yeah, I mean, you said it well,

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Speaker 1: But for the United States Military to adopt critical race theory,

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Speaker 1: and for the United States Navy, on top of all

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Speaker 1: of the other branches, to instill CRT into the ranks

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Speaker 1: is exactly the opposite of the stand down on extremism,

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Speaker 1: of the mission of the Biden administration to root out

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Speaker 1: extremism in the ranks. It's doing exactly the opposite of

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Speaker 1: what the Democrats with the Biden administration, with Admiral Guilday,

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Speaker 1: what the secretary, what others the leaders at the Pentagons

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Speaker 1: say that they're trying to do with the extremism stand

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Speaker 1: down and I would argue even further, Ben, I mean

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Speaker 1: to that point, how do you recruit the next generation

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Speaker 1: of young men and women of the future leaders in

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Speaker 1: our country to raise their right hand, to defend the

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Speaker 1: constitution and to potentially die for this country out of

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Speaker 1: the next On the other side, on the other hand,

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Speaker 1: or at the other side of your mouth, you're talking

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Speaker 1: about how America endorsing a book. We're talking about how

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Speaker 1: America is racist and evil and inherently um the up

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Speaker 1: the upbringing of our great country is somehow just that

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Speaker 1: evil and racist. I don't I don't think you can

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Speaker 1: do it. I mean this, This affects morale, It affects retention,

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Speaker 1: it affects recruitment. And I hear every day as a

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Speaker 1: member of Congress and as a as a Navy reservist,

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Speaker 1: having served with with hundreds of sailors along the way

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Speaker 1: who are still in uniform and still serving, they feel

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Speaker 1: very uncomfortable with what the what the Navy and what

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Speaker 1: what overall the military is becoming as they take this uh,

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Speaker 1: this this crash course into crt It's unhealthy. It's an

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Speaker 1: American It's got to stop. But with admirals like guil

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Speaker 1: Day in charge of the Navy. I don't have high hopes.

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Speaker 1: And as we saw in the meeting between Secretary of

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Speaker 1: State Anthony B. Lincoln and National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan

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Speaker 1: and their counterparts at Anchor Jawaska, or in the most

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Speaker 1: recent meetings between Vladimir Putin and Joe Biden. Of course

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Speaker 1: this is a propaganda coup for our worst adversaries who

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Speaker 1: loved to guaman to this America loathing sort of narrative.

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Speaker 1: So of course there are national security implications that go beyond, again,

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Speaker 1: just fielding the strongest fighting force. On the subject of China,

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Speaker 1: you've been critical of the US Innovations and Competition Act,

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Speaker 1: which has been framed as a sort of bipartisan anti China,

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Speaker 1: tough on China sort of bill, a layout sort of

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Speaker 1: your critique of it, Well, at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: this is just a massive spending boondoggle that Democrats are

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Speaker 1: really good at this. I hate to admit it, but

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Speaker 1: they're good at at taking an issue like China and

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Speaker 1: then writing a bill has nothing to do with it,

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Speaker 1: but saying it's about China, and then getting a couple

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Speaker 1: of Republicans to come along and make it by partisan

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Speaker 1: and that's what this bill has become. I mean, this

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Speaker 1: is a big boost and funding to universities around the country, who,

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Speaker 1: by the way, don't protect their research from being infiltrated

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Speaker 1: by Chinese espionage their campuses, which happens every day. I

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Speaker 1: wrote a bill about this a few years ago to

428
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: protect sensitive research that that our taxpayer dollars are funding

429
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 1: for national security purposes at universities. We don't protect intellectual property,

430
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 1: but we're gonna go We're gonna go pour billions of

431
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,159
Speaker 1: dollars into these institutions that the China, that the Chinese

432
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 1: Communist Party is already infiltrated, so that it doesn't make

433
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 1: any sense there Also, there are also some pretty strong

434
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 1: pro life concerns about what type of research we are

435
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 1: we are funding, you know, so there are more There

436
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 1: are moral angles to this as well, but at the

437
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:34,040
Speaker 1: end of the day, has nothing to do with holding

438
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:37,159
Speaker 1: China accountable. As absolutely this bill does nothing to hold

439
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: China accountable for what they've done to steal our jobs

440
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 1: where they've done to at least the COVID nineteen and

441
00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: the pandemic, and not just on the United States of America,

442
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 1: but on the rest of the world. It just pours

443
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,719
Speaker 1: a bunch of money into places um that that we

444
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 1: already know where that that that that's not a wise

445
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 1: investment of our taxpayer dollars, at least without the kind

446
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 1: of safeguards that we've been advocating for us. There's there's

447
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,200
Speaker 1: nothing in the bill that does anything to be tough

448
00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: on China or to hold them accountable. And that's why,

449
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: that's why it's been so easy for most conservative Republicans

450
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,480
Speaker 1: on Capital Hell to oppose it. Some of the policy

451
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 1: documents put out by the Trump administration cover something approximating

452
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 1: at least at least the makings of a grand strategy

453
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 1: with respect to taking on the Chinese Communist Party, which

454
00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: I think you agree is the greatest foreign adversary that

455
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:28,160
Speaker 1: we face. What do you believe the legislative branch's role

456
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 1: ought to be in executing such a strategy, and how

457
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 1: do you what do you believe that strategy should consist of. Well,

458
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 1: it's both economic and it's military. And I participated something

459
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 1: called the China Task Force last year that Kevin McCarthy

460
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,680
Speaker 1: set up. It was supposed to be by Parson in

461
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: the beginning, and then Pelosi pulled the Democrats off of

462
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,600
Speaker 1: it because it was before election day and they didn't

463
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 1: want to appear like they were on the same side

464
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 1: of a big issue with Trump because Trump was I

465
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 1: continue to argue, I'll always maintain it's the first president

466
00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 1: that has stood up to China and identified China as

467
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:03,520
Speaker 1: a threat. In fact, the first thing that President Trump

468
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: did when he came to office was rewrite the National

469
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 1: Security the National Defense Strategy, the names China and Russia

470
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 1: as as great great power competition that we need to

471
00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 1: divert away from the Middle East and focus more on

472
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: great power competition with China and Russia. China being the

473
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 1: greatestisential threat that we face economically and militarily. So, but

474
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:24,400
Speaker 1: there's a lot that goes into that. I mean, if

475
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 1: we were serious about combating the China threat, we would

476
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,720
Speaker 1: unwind the massive amount of investments coming from Wall Street,

477
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 1: from from pensions, pension dollars from almost every state in

478
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,480
Speaker 1: the country, and from the federal government that go to

479
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 1: fund our greatest adversary, China's military build up of ships

480
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:48,479
Speaker 1: and fighter planes, of sophisticated weapons and technologies that are

481
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 1: being funded by through through a funnel through through the

482
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 1: Wall Street types I mean, that's one way that we

483
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 1: hold China accountable. You won't find that anywhere in the

484
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 1: so called Endless Frontier Act or the man subspending boondoggle

485
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 1: of the Research Funding Bill. That's that's not designed to

486
00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: do anything to hold them accountable. So that that's one

487
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: area that we've been focused on a Republican study Committee

488
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 1: in my office for a couple of years, sort of

489
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,440
Speaker 1: turning off the spicket of money that goes from the

490
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:20,760
Speaker 1: United States, from taxpayer dollars from pigeons through Wall Street

491
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: to Wall Street's biggest friend in China. If you want

492
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 1: to if you want to hold if you want to

493
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:29,239
Speaker 1: block China's rise, that's that's the first place to go

494
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 1: before we get to sort of the domestic policies that

495
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 1: I want to touch on on the other side, I

496
00:31:33,280 --> 00:31:35,960
Speaker 1: think it's worth stating that, in my view, at least,

497
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 1: the living representation of the way that our political class

498
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: has been compromised with respect to communist China, and it

499
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: also impacts as you speak about the investment aspect of things.

500
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 1: The living personification of the problem is Diane Feinstein, Senator

501
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: from California, and I wrote at length several years back

502
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,440
Speaker 1: and have continued to write about her family's own personal

503
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: interest with respect to communist China and the soft policies

504
00:31:57,640 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 1: that she's promoted throughout her entire career in Washington There,

505
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:02,760
Speaker 1: and of course that it was the alleged spy in

506
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: her office. And I believe you were the only member

507
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:08,480
Speaker 1: of the House that actually put out questions regarding who

508
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 1: this individual in that office was and what the implications were.

509
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:14,480
Speaker 1: Did you ever get a substantial response, a response that

510
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 1: was satisfactory on that question. Yeah, of course not. And

511
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:21,240
Speaker 1: I'm embarrassed that we didn't continue to fight for those

512
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 1: types of answers. I mean we did, We kept reaching

513
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 1: out and and I don't think that you or any

514
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:28,760
Speaker 1: of your listeners would be surprised to know that we

515
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 1: never received any response. In Diane Feinstein's still United States

516
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: Senator today. So what we do know is that for

517
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 1: twenty years she had a high ranking member of her

518
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: staff who was a Chinese. A spark to counse is

519
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: this is, this is why the China threat is so

520
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 1: realist right in front of us. I mean, I could

521
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 1: go on and on with other examples of the Chinese

522
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: Communist Party's tentacles that are spread all over places like

523
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 1: Capitol Hill, Silicon Valley, Wall Street through through their United

524
00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 1: Front efforts. But the fact that Diane Feinstein was never

525
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 1: how held accountable or forced to answer for for keeping

526
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 1: a spy on her staff, a Chinese Communist Party spy,

527
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 1: should tell you should make everyone scratch their head at

528
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: least well more with Congressman Jim Banks right after this

529
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 1: quick break, welcome back to the Buck Sexton Show. Ben

530
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: Winegarden in for Buck Sexton, and we were talking with

531
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: Congressman Jim Banks before the break about US China policy,

532
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 1: and now I want to transition to domestic policy. You

533
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 1: recently wrote a letter to Attorney General Merrick Garland raising

534
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: what you believe to be or reach, the implication being

535
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 1: that there's disparate treatment between the law enforcement's efforts to

536
00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: pursue those associated with the events at the Capitol on

537
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 1: January sixth versus those who participated in the sixteen nineteen

538
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 1: riots of last summer. What do you hope to achieve

539
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 1: from that way? And do you believe there's disparate treatment there? Well,

540
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 1: obviously there is. I mean, as I pointed out in

541
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: the letter been to Merrick Garland, if you if you

542
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:11,799
Speaker 1: just compare the number of charges and the number of

543
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:16,400
Speaker 1: charges that were dropped between the Portland Riders and the

544
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,160
Speaker 1: January six riders. I mean, it sort of tells a

545
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 1: pretty significant story. I mean, three hundred times more often

546
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:28,160
Speaker 1: that charges were dropped against the Portland Riders then against

547
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: the Capitol Writers. So check this out. So Garland charged

548
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: eighty six Portland Riders and he dropped fifty eight out

549
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,560
Speaker 1: of the eighty six cases. That's about sixty percent of

550
00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 1: the cases that he dropped against the Portland Rioters. But

551
00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 1: if you if you look at the four hundred and

552
00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:46,720
Speaker 1: sixty five cases that Garland charged against the Capitol Writers,

553
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:48,920
Speaker 1: He's only dropped in one case, So that's about point

554
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,440
Speaker 1: two percent. So you do the math and you and

555
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 1: you realize that there is there really is a different

556
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 1: set of rules, a different set of standards in both

557
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 1: of these cases. That's not the itemize the rioters on

558
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:04,960
Speaker 1: January sixth. I'm not advocating the charges to be dropped

559
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 1: for either one of them, but it's pretty clear that

560
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:12,799
Speaker 1: the department that Joe Biden's Department of Justice cares not

561
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:17,279
Speaker 1: at all about about the rioters from last summer. In

562
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 1: the sixteen nineteen riots. But they've they're focusing all of

563
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,239
Speaker 1: their resources and attention somewhere else. I think if you

564
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,600
Speaker 1: if you draw that comparison, it's a pretty powerful statement

565
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:30,759
Speaker 1: that the American people deserve to know. January sixth is

566
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 1: cited as one of the events that underpins the administration's

567
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,960
Speaker 1: new Countering Domestic Terror strategy, which I think the Department

568
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,279
Speaker 1: of Homeland Security has actually called for a whole of

569
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,440
Speaker 1: society efforts. I'm not sure they've called for a whole

570
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 1: of society efforts to counter the Chinese Communist Party, but

571
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,800
Speaker 1: that's neither here nor there. There's a really troubling aspect.

572
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 1: I mean, there are many troubling aspects of that document,

573
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 1: but I want to read part of it and get

574
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 1: your take on it. The document reads, in part, tackling

575
00:35:57,480 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: the threat posed by domestic terrorism over the long term

576
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,359
Speaker 1: demand substantial efforts to confront the racism that feeds into

577
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: aspects of that threat. We are therefore prioritizing efforts to

578
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:08,879
Speaker 1: ensure that every component of the government has a role

579
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:12,799
Speaker 1: to play in rooting out racism and advancing equity. So

580
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 1: is this just a backdoor Let's impose effectively critical race

581
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 1: theory on the country via government under the guise of

582
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,880
Speaker 1: national security, And why should we be confident that our

583
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 1: rights are going to be protected with this administration executing

584
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:29,239
Speaker 1: this strategy. Well, you can't be confident of that. You

585
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 1: can't be confident that Joe Biden's Department of Justice can

586
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: be can be trusted at all to impartially define what

587
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:38,920
Speaker 1: domestic terrorism means, because to them, it means that you

588
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:41,479
Speaker 1: supported Donald Trump. It means that you that you have

589
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 1: that views that are on the right and not on

590
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: the left. And that's the that's the bottom line here.

591
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,399
Speaker 1: I mean, this is basically, if you think about it's

592
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,080
Speaker 1: basically what the Biden administration is rolling out of this

593
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: domestic terrorism strategy. It's basically like the Patriot Act, except

594
00:36:56,440 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 1: for instead of targeting foreign terrorists, it targets American citizens.

595
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:03,400
Speaker 1: And it's sort of ironic because if you remember, the

596
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 1: left was always up in arms about how the Patriot

597
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 1: Act would violate foreigners civil liberties, like as if that

598
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:12,600
Speaker 1: was a thing. But they have no issue with violating

599
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 1: Americans constitutional rights or civil liberties as they as they've

600
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:19,839
Speaker 1: rolled out, which is why this is all targeting Trump supporters,

601
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: and that That's why the letter that I wrote to

602
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:26,720
Speaker 1: Meeric Garland about the I mean clearly, clearly the dropping

603
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,800
Speaker 1: all those charges for against Portland rioters, for those on

604
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: the left, but not but the disparity for what for

605
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:37,400
Speaker 1: those who were charged on January six. I mean, you

606
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,959
Speaker 1: see the difference in their approach. This is all about

607
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: targeting Trump supporters, and that that's something that I know.

608
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: I know it is concerning, but it should be concerning

609
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 1: to any American on the center right, which is the

610
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: majority of the country. Conisman Jim Banks, Republican from Indiana

611
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:55,719
Speaker 1: and chairman of the Republican Study Committee, Thanks so much

612
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,279
Speaker 1: for coming on the program today. Really appreciate it. Great

613
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,400
Speaker 1: to be with you. This is the Fuck Sexton Show Podcast.

614
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 1: Join the conversation and message buck on Facebook, Instagram, or

615
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:09,440
Speaker 1: email Team Bucket. iHeartMedia dot com. He may read it

616
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,760
Speaker 1: on the show. Why are you confidence whole? Change his behavior?

617
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:17,400
Speaker 1: Mister president, I'm not change what are you doing? So?

618
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:23,320
Speaker 1: I said it was confidence six. That's kind It's great,

619
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: I said, we will change your behavior. Is the rest

620
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 1: of the world reacts to their name adminishes experience of

621
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,280
Speaker 1: the world. I'm not confident of anything. I'm just stating

622
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,200
Speaker 1: the fact forgetting his past behavior has not changed, and

623
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 1: is that prest conference After sitting down for several hours,

624
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 1: he denied any involvement in cyberd He dail played human

625
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,520
Speaker 1: rights abuses, even produced to say a lesson of all

626
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:51,279
Speaker 1: his name. So how does that account to a constructive

627
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:56,280
Speaker 1: meeting as president? I don't understand that it's just someone

628
00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: with ve who are we come on? Pretty much? I'll

629
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: take your questions, and as usual, folks, they gave me

630
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 1: a list of the people I'm going to call on,

631
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 1: so Jonathan associated Press, Well, those were some of the

632
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:14,040
Speaker 1: sounds of Joe Biden's excellent adventure over to Europe for

633
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,080
Speaker 1: the G seven and then as much bandied about meeting

634
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:20,920
Speaker 1: with a Russian president, Vladimir Putin. And someone has been

635
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 1: keenly attuned to everything going on overseas and including on

636
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:28,800
Speaker 1: issues much bigger than this most recent trip is Christian Witten.

637
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 1: He's senior Fellow for Strategy and Trade at the Center

638
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:33,760
Speaker 1: for the National Interest, and it served as a senior

639
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 1: advisor as well in the George W. Bush and Donald

640
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,000
Speaker 1: Trump administrations. Christian joins us, now, thanks so much for

641
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,440
Speaker 1: coming on the program. Great to be here, Ben. Thanks.

642
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 1: So let's start with this set aside all of the

643
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 1: optics of and really, in my opinion, sort of the

644
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:53,040
Speaker 1: pathetic questions about who should speak first, and you know,

645
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:56,680
Speaker 1: all of the kind of back and forth interplay between

646
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 1: Puddin and Biden, which, if America was in a strong position,

647
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 1: would be asking about the optics, they'd be talking about

648
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 1: the substance, substantive way. Did anything change with respect to

649
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 1: US Russia relations as a consequence of the trip, and

650
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:11,400
Speaker 1: what were your takeaways from the G seven as well?

651
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 1: I'd say probably not. You know, there are two things

652
00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:17,719
Speaker 1: that came out of it was a working group on

653
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: cyber attacks and the agreement to send ambassadors back to

654
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: each country. John Sullivan, or ambassador, was back in the

655
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 1: United States after Putin recalled his ambassador after Biden flippantly

656
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:34,160
Speaker 1: called Putin the killer. So they're sending him back, but

657
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:37,520
Speaker 1: it's up to each country to decide whether that's real

658
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:42,399
Speaker 1: or not. Will those ambassadors have access to a foreign

659
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:44,920
Speaker 1: minister in Russia, the Secretary of State here, or if

660
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 1: need be, the head of government, or are they just

661
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 1: going to go and preside over irrelevant bureaucracies as they

662
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:53,560
Speaker 1: did before? They put the working group on cyber attacks.

663
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,239
Speaker 1: I have very low expectations for that. You know, it's

664
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 1: a very important issue, but it's one that Biden has

665
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 1: already fumbled early in his administration, and he, his National

666
00:41:02,719 --> 00:41:06,040
Speaker 1: Security advisor others said basically, we were going to retaliate

667
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 1: in cyberspace, have a cyber counter attack for the solar

668
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 1: winds hack in the United States that has been attributed

669
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:15,920
Speaker 1: to Russia. Well that never came. I mean the National

670
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 1: Security Advisor Sullivan said there would be seen and unseen consequences.

671
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,800
Speaker 1: Well the consequences were so unseen that no discerned them anywhere.

672
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:27,200
Speaker 1: So not high expectations. They give some credit for at

673
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 1: least trying to restore some relations with Russia after the

674
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,280
Speaker 1: Democrats spent the last five years trying to tank them successfully.

675
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:38,319
Speaker 1: And then on the G seven, I thought that was

676
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:41,560
Speaker 1: just a complete joke. The G seven itself is obsolete.

677
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: It's the economic powers of the world as they appeared

678
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:47,800
Speaker 1: in the mid nineteen seventies. I mean, Italy and Canada

679
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:51,239
Speaker 1: are really going to throw their economic weight around and

680
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 1: make a difference in the world. And if you just

681
00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: juxtaposed people like Jijin King the strong man in China.

682
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:59,240
Speaker 1: Are Putent, who has been on the job for twenty years,

683
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 1: is at the top of this game, knows what he's doing,

684
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:06,080
Speaker 1: compared to Boris Johnson fist bumping Trudeau, the sock model

685
00:42:06,200 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 1: turned Prime Minister of Canada, and Bojo up there with

686
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:14,000
Speaker 1: President Biden saying that we're going to build back better

687
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,120
Speaker 1: and greener and more feminine and more gender neutral. It's

688
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 1: just a joke that the idea that these people are

689
00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:24,919
Speaker 1: in charge of our fate is just very depressing. Yeah,

690
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:27,799
Speaker 1: I think it's a perfect representation of the sort of

691
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 1: decadent and decaying West that are purported leaders are overseeing.

692
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,000
Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be that way, but of course

693
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: ideas have consequences. My take, and I'm curious what you

694
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 1: think about this, is that the G seven was in

695
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:43,799
Speaker 1: effect and really the whole trip when you look at

696
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 1: the NATO communicate as well, that was put out which

697
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:49,319
Speaker 1: we talked about on this program on a previous day

698
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 1: this week, which has a couple of lines regarding China. Basically,

699
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,040
Speaker 1: the G seven was a pep rally for communist China.

700
00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 1: If we're going to go down the Enviro radicalism agenda,

701
00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 1: hamstring areomy, of course, outsourced European energy to Russia and beyond.

702
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:08,279
Speaker 1: China stands to be one of the greatest beneficiaries of

703
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 1: America being back so called that is back to what

704
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:15,160
Speaker 1: I would term an America last strategy policy. I wonder

705
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 1: what your take is on that. You're right, you know,

706
00:43:18,040 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 1: the G seven and NATO both padded themselves on the

707
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:25,759
Speaker 1: back for including statements about China. You know, when has

708
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:28,720
Speaker 1: a statement from a G seven ever made a difference

709
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,160
Speaker 1: in the real world. It's sort of sad. You have

710
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 1: diplomats from all these countries, different ministries who travel around

711
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 1: the world. It's a whole lot of diplo tourism, but

712
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:43,720
Speaker 1: they work on changing colons, the semi colons, and words

713
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:47,040
Speaker 1: going and words go out of these enormously long statements,

714
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 1: and you're called. During the Trump administration, not having one

715
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:53,840
Speaker 1: of these statements was seen as some huge transgression, like,

716
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:55,759
Speaker 1: you know, will the sun come up tomorrow because we

717
00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:59,000
Speaker 1: don't have a statement from the G seven. I think

718
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 1: as soon as the ink dry on these things, as

719
00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,200
Speaker 1: soon as the door was closed on Air Force seven,

720
00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:07,840
Speaker 1: the G seven statement was gone, forgotten, irrelevant, And the

721
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:10,840
Speaker 1: same with NATO. NATO it seems basically to have become

722
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,040
Speaker 1: a mechanism. I mean, it's always a mechanism to keep

723
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:16,319
Speaker 1: the Americans in, as it was called, Americans in, the

724
00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 1: Russians out, the Germans down. That mission became obsolete in

725
00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:22,240
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one with the collapse of the Soviet Union.

726
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 1: I mean, will this make any difference in the real world.

727
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 1: Are we going to see France's aircraft carrier applying the

728
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:32,000
Speaker 1: waters of the Western Pacific to give us some relief

729
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:36,560
Speaker 1: for it to butcherous American power? It just seems extremely unlikely.

730
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:39,360
Speaker 1: In the meanwhile, NATO, what does it do. It seems

731
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 1: to continually draw in our power. I mean, we have

732
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:47,160
Speaker 1: thirty five thousand, five hundred troops in Germany, Wish armies

733
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:50,799
Speaker 1: between Russia in Germany. It's just this tremendous waste of money,

734
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 1: but I think distracts us from the real mission at

735
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:54,880
Speaker 1: hand with China. Yeah, and to segue a little bit

736
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:58,360
Speaker 1: further into China, I think it's always worth remembering that

737
00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:01,960
Speaker 1: the Obama Biden ad Ministry had an agreement a sort

738
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:06,080
Speaker 1: of no cyber warfare pact with General Secretary she and

739
00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 1: that pack of course, was not worth the paper it

740
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 1: was printed on. So why we would think that Vladimir

741
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,960
Speaker 1: Putin would be any more respectful of whatever comes out

742
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:17,240
Speaker 1: of a strategic dialogue. I think we should be beyond

743
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:21,160
Speaker 1: skeptical of it. And you've been writing and speaking often

744
00:45:21,719 --> 00:45:26,000
Speaker 1: about the Chinese Communist Party is Malian efforts worldwide, including

745
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 1: in Hong Kong. I believe you had a substack post

746
00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:31,240
Speaker 1: today on what's going on with respect to Apple Daily,

747
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:36,239
Speaker 1: a news periodical in Hong Kong, and efforts to persecute

748
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:39,560
Speaker 1: and prosecute its owner as well. Tell us a little

749
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 1: bit about that and why it's relevant for everyday Americans. Well,

750
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 1: it speaks to the point that you just can't trust

751
00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:50,160
Speaker 1: China on an agreement, whether it's that twenty fifteen agreement

752
00:45:50,200 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 1: not to attack us in cyberspace, for the agreement they

753
00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:54,920
Speaker 1: had with the Brits that was enrolled at the United

754
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:59,400
Speaker 1: Nations to respect Hong Kong's autonomy and the freedoms that

755
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 1: they had under the British, including freedom of the press.

756
00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 1: With Apple Daily, which is basically like the New York

757
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 1: Post of Hong Kong, very pro democracy, boisterous tabloidy, but

758
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:14,280
Speaker 1: also serious news and very starting support from the people

759
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:19,279
Speaker 1: of Hong Kong and a very profitable business. Heretofore, that

760
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:21,400
Speaker 1: is something that the Chinese wanted to do away with,

761
00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 1: so they have under this sony national security law charged

762
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 1: Jimmy Lay, the publisher. Jimmy has been through this before

763
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,920
Speaker 1: with the Chinese. He arrived in Hong Kong as a

764
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:34,799
Speaker 1: poor kid, basically was just a shirt on his back.

765
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 1: He made it and got rich in men's apparel with Georgiano,

766
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 1: sided with the students in Cenim and Square in nineteen

767
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 1: eighty nine and was pushed out of his business as

768
00:46:43,160 --> 00:46:45,800
Speaker 1: a result of that. Then became a huge success and

769
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 1: entirely different business media and is now you know, basically

770
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:53,399
Speaker 1: being being pushed out of that. And it's not just him.

771
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:58,240
Speaker 1: It's overnight this morning Hong Kong Time, the Chinese rounded

772
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 1: up all of the top editorial staff of Apple Daily.

773
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,799
Speaker 1: So it really is a strong move against the free

774
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:10,360
Speaker 1: press there. And it was just laughing. City Bank upgraded

775
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 1: HSBC recently saying they have great prospects for wealth management

776
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,319
Speaker 1: in Hong Kong, and I think this is City Bank

777
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: just covering its own decision to go very deep in

778
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:21,920
Speaker 1: Hong Kong, hiring thousands of bankers there now, And that's

779
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:24,359
Speaker 1: a ludicrous decision because anyone who can move money out

780
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 1: of Hong Kong's it's not a torrent, but it's a

781
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:30,400
Speaker 1: steady drip. And as far as wealth management on the mainland,

782
00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 1: no one on the mainland who's using City Bank or HSBC.

783
00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 1: But I think there's a naive to tay about how

784
00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: this movement against freedom is somehow going to be just

785
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:42,959
Speaker 1: limited to the elected pandemocrats in Hong Kong or the

786
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:45,560
Speaker 1: pro democracy media. It's going to be bigger than that.

787
00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: If you're an equity analyst and you write something bad

788
00:47:47,719 --> 00:47:50,480
Speaker 1: about the state owned enterprise on the mainland, how do

789
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 1: you know these guys aren't going to come a knocket.

790
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:55,680
Speaker 1: I think the chances are they probably will. That economic

791
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:59,719
Speaker 1: freedom is also deteriorating rapidly in Hong Kong. Got just

792
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:01,279
Speaker 1: about a minute and a half before we have to

793
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,719
Speaker 1: seek a quick break and before we get there. If

794
00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 1: you could summarize it, what do you make of President

795
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:10,680
Speaker 1: Biden's China policy to date and the personnel he's selected

796
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:15,080
Speaker 1: to implement and executing. It's a mixed bag so far.

797
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:17,920
Speaker 1: I don't think we really know that China policy. You know,

798
00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:22,000
Speaker 1: it's sort of described that you have super doves like

799
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:24,880
Speaker 1: John Kerry the climates are who eventually is going to

800
00:48:24,960 --> 00:48:27,920
Speaker 1: want some deal of the century on climate out of China.

801
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 1: And will you know, they say ludicrous things like climate

802
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:34,640
Speaker 1: change is a national security issue. No, no, no, it isn't.

803
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:38,799
Speaker 1: It just isn't. But the idea there is that you

804
00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:44,440
Speaker 1: will basically subsume all other issues beneath below climate change.

805
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:46,720
Speaker 1: You know, on the flip side, you have Kurt Campbell,

806
00:48:46,800 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 1: who is a long time Democrat but from the Hillary

807
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:51,799
Speaker 1: Clinton wing of the party, considered more of a hawk.

808
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: I think the jury's out on that. Over at USTR,

809
00:48:56,920 --> 00:49:01,919
Speaker 1: Katherine Tie at Taiwan, he's American who is I think

810
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:05,239
Speaker 1: the eyes wide open. And it's very interesting so far,

811
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 1: almost all across the Biden administration they want to pretend

812
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 1: like twenty sixteen that never happened, the Trump administration didn't occur.

813
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:15,160
Speaker 1: With China policy, they're not quite willing to do that yet.

814
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:18,440
Speaker 1: But we haven't really seen sort of the coherent policy

815
00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 1: on trade in defense, and we certainly haven't seen any

816
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:26,800
Speaker 1: defense increase in naval aviation histill nuclear presence in the Pacific.

817
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 1: To follow some of the rhetoric from both parties of Arshington,

818
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:31,919
Speaker 1: and I do think it's worth noting on that point

819
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:35,560
Speaker 1: about maintaining many of the Trump administration's policies that when

820
00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:39,160
Speaker 1: I interviewed President Trump last week, he noted that Biden

821
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:41,760
Speaker 1: can't take the tariffs off from China. They're too politically

822
00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 1: popular and they're too effective. So it's interesting how he

823
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:47,480
Speaker 1: was boxed in certain of these areas. We're speaking with

824
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 1: Christian Witten, Senior Fellow for Strategy and Trade at the

825
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 1: Center for the National Interest and wove more with him

826
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 1: right after a quick break. You're listening to the Buck

827
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,160
Speaker 1: Sexton Shoe podcast. Make sure you subscribe to the podcast

828
00:49:59,200 --> 00:50:02,560
Speaker 1: on the iHeart Brade Eat or wherever you get your podcasts.

829
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 1: Back with Christian Widden here on the Buck Sexton Show.

830
00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 1: Van weine Garden in for Buck Sexton, and before the break,

831
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:14,040
Speaker 1: we're talking about US China policy, and obviously something that

832
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:18,719
Speaker 1: ought to loom hugely bigly over US China policy are

833
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 1: the origins of the coronavirus and ultimately what the response

834
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:25,279
Speaker 1: is and really what the response should be, regardless of

835
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: whether or not it came from a wet market, which

836
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:30,120
Speaker 1: I think is pretty clear is becoming less and less

837
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:32,719
Speaker 1: legitimate and less and less viable, or it was a

838
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:35,319
Speaker 1: lab leak, and whether or not that lab leak, whether

839
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 1: or not it was intentional or unintentional with respect to

840
00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:41,560
Speaker 1: the leak of the pandemic out of that U Hunt

841
00:50:41,640 --> 00:50:46,359
Speaker 1: Institute of Virology, one question that I have is how

842
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,640
Speaker 1: could we possibly find any smoking guns now? And should

843
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 1: it really matter either way whether we find those smoking

844
00:50:52,080 --> 00:50:55,360
Speaker 1: guns given China's acts subsequent to the spread of the virus,

845
00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:58,640
Speaker 1: then I think it'll be very difficult. Now we have

846
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:01,760
Speaker 1: an intelligence bureau for steed, that costs US eighty billion

847
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:05,600
Speaker 1: dollars a year, who you know, really ought to be

848
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:08,160
Speaker 1: able to get to the bottom of this, you'd think

849
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:13,160
Speaker 1: with their mass combination of signals intelligence and human intelligence,

850
00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 1: which I'm dubious of as far as the quality of

851
00:51:16,520 --> 00:51:19,799
Speaker 1: what they may have um So hopefully we can get

852
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:22,799
Speaker 1: more information that's available, but you're right, the Chinese aren't

853
00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:25,440
Speaker 1: going to make it easy likely, as you also I

854
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 1: think implied that is a very strong symbol and signal

855
00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:35,160
Speaker 1: of guilt. After all, if this really was something that

856
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:38,759
Speaker 1: happened naturally, or even if it was just negligence, as

857
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 1: opposed to crimes of commission that had leaked, the Chinese

858
00:51:43,080 --> 00:51:47,520
Speaker 1: would have an interest in making that known, because if

859
00:51:47,560 --> 00:51:51,319
Speaker 1: it's the alternative, then I mean they're they're they're on

860
00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 1: the hook potentially for damages that result from this. But

861
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:56,880
Speaker 1: if they were innocent, they would be making the staff available,

862
00:51:56,880 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 1: they would be making the medical records of the people

863
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:03,600
Speaker 1: who became sick in late twenty twenty excuse me, in

864
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:06,480
Speaker 1: late twenty nineteen available, And they haven't done any of that.

865
00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:08,799
Speaker 1: They've done quite the opposite. In fact, one person who

866
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:13,919
Speaker 1: filed a patent for a coronavirus vaccine who worked at

867
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:18,160
Speaker 1: this lab died under very mysterious circumstances didn't die from

868
00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:21,719
Speaker 1: COVID nineteen incidentally, so you know the implication he was

869
00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:26,960
Speaker 1: bumped off by the Chinese. You know. Basically, I think

870
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 1: the onus of proof is on China to show where

871
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:31,839
Speaker 1: this came from, and the assumption is that it came

872
00:52:31,880 --> 00:52:34,839
Speaker 1: from them otherwise. But I think many in the West

873
00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 1: are just just hesitant because they're frankly afraid to understand

874
00:52:39,120 --> 00:52:42,520
Speaker 1: and to pursue where that conclusion would go, which is

875
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:45,279
Speaker 1: that China owes the world and owes us trillions and

876
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:49,120
Speaker 1: trillions of dollars of compensation, and given the ambiguity that

877
00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:52,600
Speaker 1: the intelligence community typically gives when asked for an assessment

878
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 1: on something as major as this, I mean, should we

879
00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 1: have any confidence that punting to the ICA wasn't anything

880
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 1: but a political decision to take it sort of out

881
00:53:01,640 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 1: of the hands of Joe Biden essentially? Right, Well, it was,

882
00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:08,399
Speaker 1: and partly it was a political decision by Biden. You're right,

883
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:13,239
Speaker 1: because Pompeo, terms Secretary of State, had an investigation. I'm

884
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:16,319
Speaker 1: just going you know, State issued a grant from the

885
00:53:16,440 --> 00:53:20,759
Speaker 1: NIH too, this Wuhan Institute. State had a diplomat go

886
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 1: and take a look around. He was not impressed by

887
00:53:22,960 --> 00:53:25,520
Speaker 1: the security procedures and sent a cable back to main

888
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:28,279
Speaker 1: State in twenty eighteen to that effect. But Biden put

889
00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: the kibosh on that investigation, and the political blowback from

890
00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:34,799
Speaker 1: that is why he turned it over to the intelligence bureaucracy.

891
00:53:35,160 --> 00:53:37,719
Speaker 1: You're right, you know, I think Biden even already telegraphed

892
00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:40,200
Speaker 1: when he announced this that some agencies think one thing.

893
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:44,880
Speaker 1: Some agencies searched together with you know, so called moderate confidence,

894
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:48,640
Speaker 1: which means they're guessing it's sad that our intelligence gacacy

895
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:53,000
Speaker 1: is is this ineffective on something so important? But it

896
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:56,399
Speaker 1: goes back to this deep state, this intelligence garacacy. It's

897
00:53:56,600 --> 00:54:01,719
Speaker 1: chief virtue, it's chief capability is covering its own But

898
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 1: rather than helping the president do his job, and rather

899
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:08,840
Speaker 1: than getting the truth out to the American people in

900
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:10,840
Speaker 1: thirty seconds. And this is a tough one to do

901
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:13,120
Speaker 1: in that short period of time. But is there any

902
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:17,360
Speaker 1: alternative ultimately to decoupling from China, at least in every

903
00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:21,240
Speaker 1: strategically significant area, if we are to ultimately not become

904
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 1: a vassal of communist China or at least continue to

905
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:28,960
Speaker 1: be compromised to devastating effect. I think not. I think

906
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:33,440
Speaker 1: we need to choke off technology, know how, in capital.

907
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,080
Speaker 1: This is the chief threats in the world today. You know,

908
00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 1: Russia dous things we don't like, and certainly Iran is

909
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:41,040
Speaker 1: a very serious throat in the broader Middle East. But

910
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:44,880
Speaker 1: China is the big tahuna. It's the chief competitor economic

911
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,000
Speaker 1: model to ours and in political model, and it's great

912
00:54:48,040 --> 00:54:52,120
Speaker 1: at political warfare, economic warfare. We don't know about military warfare,

913
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:55,480
Speaker 1: but they're sertainly good at buying everything that money can buy,

914
00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 1: so I think you're right. The implication is that we

915
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:01,399
Speaker 1: have to get much more serious about the Christian Thanks

916
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:03,200
Speaker 1: so much for coming on the program. Really appreciate it,

917
00:55:04,640 --> 00:55:07,279
Speaker 1: my pleasure. Thank you, and well Moore right after this,

918
00:55:07,880 --> 00:55:11,239
Speaker 1: we're happy to have abandoned in Florida. It's not going

919
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:15,040
Speaker 1: to be allowed in Florida classrooms. Spending tax dollars to

920
00:55:15,080 --> 00:55:20,440
Speaker 1: teach kids that America is a rotten place is absolutely unacceptable.

921
00:55:20,920 --> 00:55:23,759
Speaker 1: If you'll look at how some of this stuff manifests

922
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:27,000
Speaker 1: itself in classrooms that we have seen examples of. It's

923
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:31,080
Speaker 1: not a conspiracy theory, dividing kids based on race, trying

924
00:55:31,120 --> 00:55:34,040
Speaker 1: to say some are oppressors and some are oppress based

925
00:55:34,080 --> 00:55:38,560
Speaker 1: on race, attacking law enforcement and saying law enforcement attack

926
00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 1: people based on race, those things are poison. That is

927
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:44,360
Speaker 1: not what we should be doing. What we should be

928
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:48,400
Speaker 1: doing is solid curriculum based on the actual facts of

929
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:51,360
Speaker 1: American history and teaching kids what it means to be

930
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:53,520
Speaker 1: an American and part of what it means to be

931
00:55:53,520 --> 00:55:56,680
Speaker 1: an American as we judge people not on the color

932
00:55:56,719 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 1: of their skin, but on the content of their character.

933
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 1: That was Governor Ronda Santis, Republican from Florida speaking about

934
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:08,920
Speaker 1: critical race theory and its infiltration of classrooms around the country.

935
00:56:08,960 --> 00:56:10,799
Speaker 1: And you can't really put it much better than that

936
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:16,360
Speaker 1: taxpayer funded anti americanism is intolerable. Should be roundly rejected

937
00:56:16,360 --> 00:56:20,560
Speaker 1: by everyone, as should the idea that content of character

938
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 1: should not trump anything else, including color of skin. And

939
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:27,200
Speaker 1: this goes back to my running theme of excellence versus mediocrity.

940
00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:31,480
Speaker 1: If you want mediocrity, place anything but content of character first.

941
00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:36,600
Speaker 1: But really, the racialists, the racial Marxists, the imbibers of

942
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,600
Speaker 1: critical race theory and diversity, equity and inclusion, I mean

943
00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:44,640
Speaker 1: the true believers, the ideoogs here, they fundamentally reject the

944
00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:49,000
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King ethos of content of character over color

945
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:51,680
Speaker 1: of skin. And we could talk about this in the abstract,

946
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:55,320
Speaker 1: and with our next guest, we will talk at length

947
00:56:55,640 --> 00:56:57,319
Speaker 1: about what is going on in our school is what

948
00:56:57,400 --> 00:57:03,400
Speaker 1: these ideologies are actually all about. How conservatives, patriots, traditional Americans,

949
00:57:03,880 --> 00:57:06,480
Speaker 1: anyone who's a gas at what they're witnessing in our

950
00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:10,920
Speaker 1: schools can go about combatting them practically. There's a story

951
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:12,960
Speaker 1: that caught my eye this week on a micro level

952
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 1: that just speaks to the effects of the brainwashing that

953
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:21,400
Speaker 1: we've seen, and it comes from teachers, and of course

954
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:23,480
Speaker 1: the teachers are far more radical than the parents on

955
00:57:23,520 --> 00:57:28,560
Speaker 1: the average. So you've got that inbuilt disadvantage in academia

956
00:57:28,600 --> 00:57:32,680
Speaker 1: of academics being disproportionately leftist, or at least and not

957
00:57:32,720 --> 00:57:36,120
Speaker 1: only disproportionately leftist, but then having a percentage a minority

958
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:39,800
Speaker 1: of those disproportionate leftists who are really radically leftists. There's

959
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 1: an article at the Post millennial white Spanish teacher cancels

960
00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:48,680
Speaker 1: herself because quote unquote white isn't right. Subtitle dismantling white

961
00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:52,040
Speaker 1: supremacy in society looks like dismantling in my heart. First

962
00:57:52,160 --> 00:57:55,120
Speaker 1: it means I'm not going to teach Spanish. Accountability is

963
00:57:55,120 --> 00:57:59,120
Speaker 1: ongoing because there is not end to the process. So

964
00:57:59,160 --> 00:58:01,840
Speaker 1: this teacher, during what can only be described as a

965
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:05,400
Speaker 1: struggle session there's actually a women in Gender Studies conference

966
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:10,200
Speaker 1: for professors. Her name is Jessica Bridges, shared that she

967
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:12,840
Speaker 1: stopped teaching Spanish to K through twelve students because it

968
00:58:12,880 --> 00:58:15,040
Speaker 1: wasn't right for a white woman to teach Spanish. I

969
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:18,400
Speaker 1: guess that's cultural appropriation. But stop right there for a second.

970
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:22,000
Speaker 1: What the hell it does it matter? Your skin color,

971
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:25,320
Speaker 1: your background, or anything else. If you are a competent teacher,

972
00:58:26,280 --> 00:58:29,800
Speaker 1: shouldn't our schools be about getting the best education, which

973
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:34,040
Speaker 1: means not only learning a non Marxian version of history,

974
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:38,120
Speaker 1: but learning how to think. Clearly, the leftist don't believe

975
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 1: that they want you to think what they want you

976
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 1: to think, and they don't want you to have their

977
00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:45,400
Speaker 1: critical reasoning skills to see right through it. This article

978
00:58:45,480 --> 00:58:48,360
Speaker 1: goes on to say that this teacher had this revelation

979
00:58:48,520 --> 00:58:50,760
Speaker 1: after taking a course she found on Instagram about how

980
00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 1: to become a better white ally and anti racist co conspirator.

981
00:58:54,960 --> 00:58:58,000
Speaker 1: And this is the language that the left speaks. They

982
00:58:58,040 --> 00:59:02,000
Speaker 1: talk about toxic word and you're allowed to fight toxic

983
00:59:02,040 --> 00:59:06,560
Speaker 1: if not harmful, actually harmful words with actual violence justifiable.

984
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:09,640
Speaker 1: They talk about being an ally. The way to be

985
00:59:09,720 --> 00:59:11,440
Speaker 1: an ally to a person is to treat them as

986
00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 1: a human being, regardless of identity. Explicitly, the left needs

987
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 1: to bake identity in everything because they need to pit

988
00:59:19,120 --> 00:59:21,840
Speaker 1: us against each other because that's part of their political strategy.

989
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:23,320
Speaker 1: And at the end of the day, that's what this

990
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:26,600
Speaker 1: is really all about. What is CRT. It's not just

991
00:59:26,640 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 1: about brandwashing kids, demoralizing generation, turning kids against their parents

992
00:59:31,040 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 1: and their country, and basically, in effect a revolution of

993
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:38,040
Speaker 1: the mind that will lead to a revolution in the country. Ultimately,

994
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 1: it's about tearing us apart at the seams. It's about

995
00:59:42,120 --> 00:59:45,400
Speaker 1: indoctrination and creating an army of social justice warriors in

996
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:48,200
Speaker 1: perpetuity that gets worse every single generation. And it has

997
00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:51,440
Speaker 1: gotten works every single generation because what was considered incredibly

998
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:54,880
Speaker 1: radical forty years ago then becomes, you know, thirty years ago,

999
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:57,040
Speaker 1: the norm, and it continues on and on. It's only

1000
00:59:57,040 --> 00:59:59,960
Speaker 1: accelerating with social media. So our next guest will take

1001
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:03,360
Speaker 1: this micro example and move to the macro of what

1002
01:00:03,480 --> 01:00:06,800
Speaker 1: is CRT and diversity, equity inclusion all about how do

1003
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:08,640
Speaker 1: you combat it? And then after that we'll talk about

1004
01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:12,000
Speaker 1: another area of concentrated woke power in big tech with

1005
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:15,560
Speaker 1: Rachel Bovard. We're back right after this. When we look

1006
01:00:15,600 --> 01:00:17,600
Speaker 1: at what these laws are doing, you know a lot

1007
01:00:17,640 --> 01:00:20,320
Speaker 1: of people kind of scoffed at them when you read

1008
01:00:20,320 --> 01:00:23,400
Speaker 1: the language of them, they appear very silly, But when

1009
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:25,720
Speaker 1: you think about what this is actually trying to do,

1010
01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:29,240
Speaker 1: we know that it is narrative that allows us to

1011
01:00:29,360 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 1: enact really dangerous policies. It is narrative that allows citizens

1012
01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:36,000
Speaker 1: to kind of accept these erosions of civil rights. So

1013
01:00:36,040 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 1: it's not incidental that the same states that are introducing

1014
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:43,760
Speaker 1: these anti critical race theory, anti sixteen nineteen project laws

1015
01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:46,960
Speaker 1: are also introducing voter suppression laws. These things are going

1016
01:00:47,040 --> 01:00:49,520
Speaker 1: hand in hand. Well, you just heard the dulcet tones

1017
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:55,800
Speaker 1: of Nicole Hannah Jones, creator of the Insidious sixteen nineteen Project,

1018
01:00:55,840 --> 01:00:58,880
Speaker 1: talking with Joy Read and trying to equate the efforts

1019
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:02,280
Speaker 1: to root outtical race theory in schools across this country

1020
01:01:02,320 --> 01:01:05,240
Speaker 1: and anti American critical race theory with the broader efforts

1021
01:01:05,240 --> 01:01:07,880
Speaker 1: to quote unquote suppress the vote, or as we talked

1022
01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:11,520
Speaker 1: about yesterday, Stacy Abrams saying, voter integrity efforts are part

1023
01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:14,800
Speaker 1: of the rolling insurrection. So this is the state of

1024
01:01:14,920 --> 01:01:17,200
Speaker 1: rhetoric on the left today, and I'm pleased to be

1025
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:20,920
Speaker 1: joined by someone who's countering that rhetoric and the policies

1026
01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:24,160
Speaker 1: as well. Professor Scott Jenner. He is the professor of

1027
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:27,200
Speaker 1: political science at Boise State and a Washington Fellow at

1028
01:01:27,200 --> 01:01:30,240
Speaker 1: the Claremont Institute, where phot disclosure, I too, am a

1029
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:32,440
Speaker 1: fellow and do some work as well. He's also the

1030
01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:36,160
Speaker 1: author of the book The Recovery of Family Life, Exposing

1031
01:01:36,320 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 1: the limits of modern ideologies. Scott, thanks so much for

1032
01:01:39,360 --> 01:01:41,520
Speaker 1: coming on the program today. Thanks for having me. It's

1033
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:43,520
Speaker 1: a pleasure to be here. Well, pleasure to have you.

1034
01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:48,000
Speaker 1: And let's start right there with the left's recent freak

1035
01:01:48,000 --> 01:01:50,800
Speaker 1: out about and this is in the media and beyond

1036
01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:54,520
Speaker 1: as well academics as well. This freak out over conservatives

1037
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:58,640
Speaker 1: having the goal to seek to educate, legislate critical race

1038
01:01:58,720 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 1: theory out of our public school is. What do you

1039
01:02:00,720 --> 01:02:03,160
Speaker 1: make of that freak out? Well, I mean, it seems

1040
01:02:03,160 --> 01:02:05,080
Speaker 1: like they're really trying to just make it the official

1041
01:02:05,120 --> 01:02:10,360
Speaker 1: ideology of the country, and any effort to fight against

1042
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:14,000
Speaker 1: social justice ideology, critical race theory, any kind of critical

1043
01:02:14,040 --> 01:02:19,560
Speaker 1: theory is trying to be labeled as an Americans as

1044
01:02:19,680 --> 01:02:25,000
Speaker 1: a basis for hate speech and canceling those people. So

1045
01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:27,760
Speaker 1: it's all the more important to really fight back against

1046
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:29,720
Speaker 1: it because they're trying to rule it out as a

1047
01:02:29,840 --> 01:02:33,640
Speaker 1: legitimate position in politics. And it is a legitimate position

1048
01:02:33,680 --> 01:02:37,040
Speaker 1: in politics, darn't it. I Mean, the idea that all

1049
01:02:37,160 --> 01:02:40,160
Speaker 1: disparities between all groups are traceable to some sort of

1050
01:02:40,200 --> 01:02:45,360
Speaker 1: systematic discrimination is just bunk. And if we can't say

1051
01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 1: that it's bunk and a disgusting line meant to silence us,

1052
01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:52,440
Speaker 1: then we're really in position where we, you know, we

1053
01:02:52,480 --> 01:02:56,160
Speaker 1: can't govern ourselves and we have to submit. So it

1054
01:02:56,160 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 1: looks to me like part of a long term strategy

1055
01:02:59,720 --> 01:03:03,560
Speaker 1: to at a new ideology governing the country and everyone

1056
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:06,960
Speaker 1: to submit to it. I think the simplest summary of

1057
01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:12,600
Speaker 1: what critical race theory is essentially racial Marxism, not even racialists,

1058
01:03:12,680 --> 01:03:15,720
Speaker 1: or you could call it racist Marxism, racial Marxism, or

1059
01:03:15,840 --> 01:03:18,960
Speaker 1: racialist Marxism. But you come at this from the perspective

1060
01:03:19,080 --> 01:03:22,480
Speaker 1: of an academic. What's your best explanation as to what

1061
01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:26,120
Speaker 1: CRT consists of and what does it am ultimately to achieve.

1062
01:03:26,560 --> 01:03:29,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I think CRT is part of a larger

1063
01:03:29,680 --> 01:03:32,760
Speaker 1: movement that's been going on for about fifty years. It's

1064
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:37,520
Speaker 1: a late child of multiculturalism, and it's an attempt to

1065
01:03:37,560 --> 01:03:42,640
Speaker 1: try to explain differences between groups in terms of discrimination,

1066
01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:47,240
Speaker 1: not in terms of group difference. So it began in

1067
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:54,600
Speaker 1: the late sixties with multicultural education and the attempt to

1068
01:03:54,880 --> 01:04:00,200
Speaker 1: stop assimilation, to stop holding all groups to the same

1069
01:04:00,280 --> 01:04:04,520
Speaker 1: standards of behavior, and to start respecting what it's called

1070
01:04:04,560 --> 01:04:10,200
Speaker 1: cultural difference. Some groups don't achieve as well in school,

1071
01:04:10,920 --> 01:04:13,080
Speaker 1: we're not supposed to try to raise them to the

1072
01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:17,920
Speaker 1: level of achievement, but rather to respect their difference. And

1073
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:21,800
Speaker 1: you know that ends up having this kind of paternalistic

1074
01:04:21,960 --> 01:04:24,760
Speaker 1: aspect to it, but it also ends up taking the

1075
01:04:24,840 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 1: standard that we have used as a country and undermining

1076
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:31,200
Speaker 1: it or making it not a standard. And so I

1077
01:04:31,280 --> 01:04:34,440
Speaker 1: just look at critical race theory as totally in line

1078
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:40,800
Speaker 1: with this long line of ideological positions that include multiculturalism,

1079
01:04:40,840 --> 01:04:45,960
Speaker 1: affirmative action, set asides as policies, but just the latest

1080
01:04:46,040 --> 01:04:50,040
Speaker 1: flower of it. The difference in critical race theory seems

1081
01:04:50,080 --> 01:04:52,960
Speaker 1: to be that they really don't believe that progress can

1082
01:04:53,000 --> 01:04:56,480
Speaker 1: be made on any of these avenues. It's just a

1083
01:04:56,520 --> 01:05:01,640
Speaker 1: permanent struggle between groups, and it's not necessary to stigmatize

1084
01:05:01,680 --> 01:05:03,800
Speaker 1: one group in order to so that it will lose

1085
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:07,080
Speaker 1: its confidence so that a different group can rule and

1086
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:11,600
Speaker 1: set set the tone. And so critical race here, I

1087
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:15,360
Speaker 1: think adds to the idea that all discrimination is traced,

1088
01:05:15,560 --> 01:05:19,439
Speaker 1: all disparities are traceable to discrimination. With this idea that

1089
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:23,680
Speaker 1: no progress can be made on it, and that different

1090
01:05:23,920 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 1: different groups in the case in our case, I think

1091
01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:31,640
Speaker 1: it means blacks and women need the rule, and whites

1092
01:05:31,680 --> 01:05:35,600
Speaker 1: and men need to submit to that rule. And so

1093
01:05:36,240 --> 01:05:38,680
Speaker 1: so I think it's not didn't just come out of nowhere.

1094
01:05:38,920 --> 01:05:41,160
Speaker 1: It's been growing for a long time, but it's just

1095
01:05:41,280 --> 01:05:45,080
Speaker 1: added certain accesses over the course of the last few years.

1096
01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:48,920
Speaker 1: And it's tactically brilliant to try to cover the agenda

1097
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:52,880
Speaker 1: that you always wanted with the patna of sort of

1098
01:05:53,200 --> 01:05:57,800
Speaker 1: racial justice and defending those who are perceived to be

1099
01:05:57,960 --> 01:06:00,280
Speaker 1: the underdog or treated as the underdog, but in case

1100
01:06:00,280 --> 01:06:02,600
Speaker 1: a perpetual underdog that can only be helped through the

1101
01:06:02,640 --> 01:06:05,800
Speaker 1: implementation of these sorts of policies. I mean, it's technically

1102
01:06:06,480 --> 01:06:09,000
Speaker 1: very smart. And you've sort of, in your own wife

1103
01:06:09,040 --> 01:06:11,760
Speaker 1: fought fire with fire. What have you been aiming to

1104
01:06:11,800 --> 01:06:16,200
Speaker 1: do to combat CRT in your home state of Idaho. Well,

1105
01:06:16,240 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 1: I'm not acting as a professor at Boise State, but

1106
01:06:19,160 --> 01:06:22,720
Speaker 1: rather just as a citizen. We've tried to write some

1107
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:28,800
Speaker 1: reports on how far the ideology of critical theory, or

1108
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:32,760
Speaker 1: social justice as we call it, has penetrated our universities

1109
01:06:33,400 --> 01:06:37,480
Speaker 1: and here with another group called the Ido Freedom Foundation,

1110
01:06:37,760 --> 01:06:41,000
Speaker 1: I have helped to write a couple of reports, one

1111
01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:45,120
Speaker 1: on Boise State University and another on Idaho University, Idaho,

1112
01:06:45,760 --> 01:06:49,880
Speaker 1: about how the structure of diversity, inclusion and equity is

1113
01:06:49,920 --> 01:06:52,680
Speaker 1: beginning to be built and to infiltrate all of the

1114
01:06:52,760 --> 01:06:56,240
Speaker 1: policies at the school. We're not as far built out

1115
01:06:56,280 --> 01:06:59,320
Speaker 1: as other schools like Berkeley or Ohio State, but we're

1116
01:06:59,360 --> 01:07:01,600
Speaker 1: still in the earth early stages of the building what

1117
01:07:01,640 --> 01:07:06,160
Speaker 1: we call the adolescence of the of the attempt to

1118
01:07:06,200 --> 01:07:09,360
Speaker 1: build a structure on the university. And this is happening,

1119
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:11,640
Speaker 1: you know, under the nose of the legislature. No one

1120
01:07:11,720 --> 01:07:15,640
Speaker 1: knows that it's happening. It's it's not really under the

1121
01:07:15,680 --> 01:07:19,040
Speaker 1: purview of the legislature normally to pay attention to these things.

1122
01:07:19,480 --> 01:07:22,600
Speaker 1: But if we think that this ideology is something that

1123
01:07:22,640 --> 01:07:25,160
Speaker 1: really undermines the ability for us to have a common

1124
01:07:25,200 --> 01:07:27,560
Speaker 1: good and for us to have representative government and for

1125
01:07:28,040 --> 01:07:32,040
Speaker 1: all groups to thrive in the United States, it needs

1126
01:07:32,080 --> 01:07:33,800
Speaker 1: to be you know, it needs to be rooted out

1127
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:37,600
Speaker 1: or prevented from taking over our public institutions. So here

1128
01:07:37,600 --> 01:07:41,240
Speaker 1: in Idaho, you know, with the help somewhat of our reports,

1129
01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:46,680
Speaker 1: there have been laws that are passed that prevent indoctrination

1130
01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:51,000
Speaker 1: on the basis of the social justice ideology. And also

1131
01:07:51,160 --> 01:07:54,600
Speaker 1: there's been some defunding of the universities that has absolute

1132
01:07:54,640 --> 01:08:00,160
Speaker 1: cuts in their budgets from the state and all and

1133
01:08:00,280 --> 01:08:03,160
Speaker 1: in the name of this, because this is being built,

1134
01:08:03,560 --> 01:08:07,760
Speaker 1: the legislature has cut the budget. And you know, I

1135
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:10,080
Speaker 1: think that's one of the only ways that only tools

1136
01:08:10,120 --> 01:08:13,320
Speaker 1: that a legislature has to do something about this, and

1137
01:08:13,600 --> 01:08:15,960
Speaker 1: here in Idaho at least some of the legislators have

1138
01:08:16,400 --> 01:08:19,360
Speaker 1: found it necessary to start using that tool. And I

1139
01:08:19,439 --> 01:08:22,240
Speaker 1: take it the rationale for developing those reports was to

1140
01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:25,960
Speaker 1: just first get the basic facts of how widespread these

1141
01:08:26,000 --> 01:08:29,000
Speaker 1: efforts are, how deep they go, to sort of quantify

1142
01:08:29,080 --> 01:08:33,519
Speaker 1: and qualify the problem before using whatever remedies necessary to

1143
01:08:34,439 --> 01:08:37,839
Speaker 1: overcome that problem. Yes, I mean that's exactly the rationale.

1144
01:08:37,840 --> 01:08:41,799
Speaker 1: And the places we looked in the university are, for instance,

1145
01:08:41,960 --> 01:08:44,320
Speaker 1: what are the strategic plans in the university say about

1146
01:08:44,320 --> 01:08:48,240
Speaker 1: their efforts to build diversity, equity and inclusion infrastructure. Who

1147
01:08:48,280 --> 01:08:51,440
Speaker 1: have they hired to build it, What kinds of policies

1148
01:08:51,479 --> 01:08:54,920
Speaker 1: have they adopted as they've attempted to build out the infrastructure,

1149
01:08:55,680 --> 01:08:58,360
Speaker 1: What kinds of policies when it comes to hiring or

1150
01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:03,200
Speaker 1: contracts at the university, grant or free speech policies, for instance,

1151
01:09:03,240 --> 01:09:06,519
Speaker 1: bias response teams and things on campus. How far has

1152
01:09:06,560 --> 01:09:10,559
Speaker 1: it infiltrated the curriculum, the general ed which departments are

1153
01:09:10,600 --> 01:09:15,120
Speaker 1: really taken over by this social justice ideology? How is

1154
01:09:15,120 --> 01:09:18,479
Speaker 1: it infiltrated into student life and residence halls? Is it

1155
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:21,240
Speaker 1: the basis for hiring residence hall directors? How does it

1156
01:09:21,280 --> 01:09:24,720
Speaker 1: affect university programming? I mean, who has a chance to

1157
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:30,120
Speaker 1: overlook all of those things? So our reports just encapsulated

1158
01:09:30,160 --> 01:09:34,320
Speaker 1: all of those aspects into one tight, little twenty four

1159
01:09:34,360 --> 01:09:40,040
Speaker 1: page document and well sourced here in Idaho, and it's

1160
01:09:40,080 --> 01:09:44,519
Speaker 1: being you know, it's being reproduced in other states as

1161
01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:47,719
Speaker 1: people have seen the importance of having a good factual

1162
01:09:47,800 --> 01:09:50,720
Speaker 1: basis for understanding what is going on in universities. Other

1163
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:54,160
Speaker 1: states have approached us to write such report. And I

1164
01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:57,599
Speaker 1: think it's a good basis, a factual basis from which

1165
01:09:57,880 --> 01:10:00,720
Speaker 1: good criticisms of universities can be made. What are the

1166
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:04,600
Speaker 1: lessons from your experiences thus far for the rest of

1167
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:07,439
Speaker 1: the country, if you're going to encapsulate them, well, I mean,

1168
01:10:07,479 --> 01:10:11,040
Speaker 1: first of all, it's difficult, I think to root out something,

1169
01:10:11,520 --> 01:10:15,439
Speaker 1: it's easier to stop it from growing. That legislators can

1170
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:20,559
Speaker 1: affect the behavior of universities if they use the tools

1171
01:10:20,600 --> 01:10:23,800
Speaker 1: that they have at their disposal, the most important of

1172
01:10:23,800 --> 01:10:26,720
Speaker 1: which are the levers of budget. Not so much, I

1173
01:10:26,760 --> 01:10:30,960
Speaker 1: think the regulation of universities, which universities can get around

1174
01:10:31,400 --> 01:10:35,040
Speaker 1: by just naming things differently or such. You have to

1175
01:10:35,080 --> 01:10:37,679
Speaker 1: make it so that universities don't want to do this

1176
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:40,960
Speaker 1: or pay a price if they do it, and so

1177
01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:44,200
Speaker 1: I think those are important lessons. Also, I think it's

1178
01:10:44,240 --> 01:10:48,120
Speaker 1: crucial informed legislators do not have tons of time to

1179
01:10:48,160 --> 01:10:53,840
Speaker 1: do this themselves. Just a concentrated effort to provide a

1180
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:56,960
Speaker 1: systematic account, well sourced account of what's going on on

1181
01:10:57,080 --> 01:11:00,559
Speaker 1: universities can have an effect on how legislation there's view

1182
01:11:00,640 --> 01:11:04,840
Speaker 1: the public institutions. And I guess the fourth thing I

1183
01:11:04,840 --> 01:11:08,160
Speaker 1: would say is that it's also true that state boards

1184
01:11:08,200 --> 01:11:12,799
Speaker 1: are pretty useless when it comes to overseeing universities because

1185
01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:18,080
Speaker 1: state boards themselves are pretty much captured by the education establishment.

1186
01:11:18,120 --> 01:11:21,920
Speaker 1: In any particular place, they come from the education establishment

1187
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:24,960
Speaker 1: and they're there to protect it. So really only political

1188
01:11:25,000 --> 01:11:29,280
Speaker 1: institutions can have an effect, and those political institutions are

1189
01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:32,439
Speaker 1: the executive and the legislature. It's probably best to have

1190
01:11:32,479 --> 01:11:35,120
Speaker 1: executive leadership. This would be a fifth point instead of

1191
01:11:35,200 --> 01:11:38,840
Speaker 1: legislative leadership. But in the absence of executive leadership, and

1192
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:41,920
Speaker 1: I don't think we have effective executive leadership here in Idaho,

1193
01:11:42,520 --> 01:11:46,439
Speaker 1: the legislature can you can step in and at least

1194
01:11:46,439 --> 01:11:51,000
Speaker 1: prevent budgets from passing, and that only requires half of

1195
01:11:51,040 --> 01:11:55,280
Speaker 1: a bicameral legislature. They're prevented from going forward. So if

1196
01:11:55,280 --> 01:11:58,599
Speaker 1: there's a conservative House, the Conservative House can stop things

1197
01:11:58,680 --> 01:12:02,000
Speaker 1: from happening. And that's what happened here. Well more with

1198
01:12:02,080 --> 01:12:05,680
Speaker 1: Professor Scott Yenner. Right after a quick break, Welcome back

1199
01:12:05,680 --> 01:12:09,799
Speaker 1: to the Buck Sexton Show. Ben Weingarten in for Buck Sexton,

1200
01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:14,240
Speaker 1: and we're talking with Professor Scott Yenner. He teaches political

1201
01:12:14,280 --> 01:12:16,880
Speaker 1: science at Boise State and he's a Washington Fellow at

1202
01:12:16,920 --> 01:12:19,920
Speaker 1: the Claremont Institute, where I too am a fellow and

1203
01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:23,120
Speaker 1: the author recently of the book The Recovery of Family Life,

1204
01:12:23,400 --> 01:12:27,200
Speaker 1: Exposing the limits of modern ideologies. And before that break,

1205
01:12:27,240 --> 01:12:31,240
Speaker 1: we were talking about critical race theory and they're sort

1206
01:12:31,280 --> 01:12:35,040
Speaker 1: of an related area in the sort of cult of

1207
01:12:35,080 --> 01:12:38,559
Speaker 1: wokedom taking over, of course, like every bad idea starts

1208
01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:40,960
Speaker 1: in the schools, but then takes over every other aspect

1209
01:12:40,960 --> 01:12:44,839
Speaker 1: of our culture and society, obviously our corporate boardrooms and beyond.

1210
01:12:45,200 --> 01:12:48,840
Speaker 1: And that's the notion of diversity, equity, and inclusion. And

1211
01:12:48,840 --> 01:12:52,440
Speaker 1: you've written at some length about what these words actually

1212
01:12:52,840 --> 01:12:57,280
Speaker 1: mean translated into woke speak, what our diversity, equity and

1213
01:12:57,360 --> 01:13:01,280
Speaker 1: inclusion really about. Yeah, I mean, I try to provide

1214
01:13:01,280 --> 01:13:07,080
Speaker 1: just very simple translation of these words. Equity is the

1215
01:13:07,120 --> 01:13:11,520
Speaker 1: idea that each group should be represented in its population

1216
01:13:12,600 --> 01:13:17,559
Speaker 1: population proportion in each institution. So since blacks make up

1217
01:13:17,600 --> 01:13:20,759
Speaker 1: thirteen percent of the population, they should be thirteen percent

1218
01:13:20,800 --> 01:13:24,719
Speaker 1: of engineering students. Whites are fifty five percent of the population,

1219
01:13:24,760 --> 01:13:27,799
Speaker 1: they should make up fifty five percent of the engineering students.

1220
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:29,320
Speaker 1: I don't know if that number is right, but I

1221
01:13:29,360 --> 01:13:34,880
Speaker 1: know thirteen percent is right. So equity is proportionality, Diversity

1222
01:13:35,120 --> 01:13:42,280
Speaker 1: is equity is a step forward. Diversity. Diversity is the

1223
01:13:42,400 --> 01:13:47,439
Speaker 1: values of the university. We are made so that underrepresented

1224
01:13:47,479 --> 01:13:52,960
Speaker 1: minorities can succeed and set the tone. And you can

1225
01:13:53,040 --> 01:13:56,599
Speaker 1: never have quite an set the tone and the forms

1226
01:13:56,680 --> 01:14:01,639
Speaker 1: of rule on the university. And then include the pleas

1227
01:14:01,920 --> 01:14:07,320
Speaker 1: that are necessary in order for diversity to happen. So

1228
01:14:07,560 --> 01:14:13,640
Speaker 1: things like going after what is called unconscious bias, offering training,

1229
01:14:14,439 --> 01:14:19,879
Speaker 1: trying to solicit more community partnerships with left wing groups

1230
01:14:20,360 --> 01:14:24,320
Speaker 1: will help diversify the university. That as make the forms

1231
01:14:24,479 --> 01:14:31,160
Speaker 1: and rule of those underrepresented minorities more and ever more

1232
01:14:31,320 --> 01:14:35,439
Speaker 1: the ruling doctrine of whatever institution you're talking about. So,

1233
01:14:35,520 --> 01:14:40,960
Speaker 1: equity is proportionality, inclusion. Our policies to be friendly to diversity.

1234
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:47,240
Speaker 1: Diversity is underrepresented groups set a tone and rules in

1235
01:14:47,320 --> 01:14:51,800
Speaker 1: the institution. So what is your best explanation If a

1236
01:14:51,920 --> 01:14:54,400
Speaker 1: friend or colleague comes to you and says, what's your

1237
01:14:54,439 --> 01:14:57,479
Speaker 1: beef with diversity, equity and inclusion? Are you some kind

1238
01:14:57,479 --> 01:14:59,920
Speaker 1: of racist and bigot? How do you respond to them?

1239
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:02,560
Speaker 1: Give us some news you can use here? Yeah, I

1240
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:06,479
Speaker 1: mean I think that I would respond with things like this.

1241
01:15:07,120 --> 01:15:09,759
Speaker 1: That is, if we're going to rule ourselves as a people,

1242
01:15:11,120 --> 01:15:14,960
Speaker 1: we can't have administrative agencies setting the rules. The people

1243
01:15:15,040 --> 01:15:18,880
Speaker 1: need to speak that there is no way that all

1244
01:15:18,960 --> 01:15:22,920
Speaker 1: of the differences between groups are traceable to discrimination. The

1245
01:15:23,040 --> 01:15:26,960
Speaker 1: groups are different. Men and women have different values, Blacks

1246
01:15:26,960 --> 01:15:30,800
Speaker 1: and whites have different values and customs. So we should

1247
01:15:30,880 --> 01:15:33,920
Speaker 1: expect there to be differences between the groups. So the

1248
01:15:33,920 --> 01:15:38,720
Speaker 1: whole project of trying to equalize according to group outcomes

1249
01:15:39,200 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 1: is a preposterous one given what we know about the

1250
01:15:42,200 --> 01:15:47,960
Speaker 1: differences in groups. That it's impossible to get from critical

1251
01:15:48,040 --> 01:15:51,759
Speaker 1: race theory or social justice ideology to the point where

1252
01:15:51,800 --> 01:15:56,800
Speaker 1: all citizens are welcomed equally in a political community and

1253
01:15:57,080 --> 01:16:01,960
Speaker 1: can be friends with one another. The ideology itself is

1254
01:16:02,040 --> 01:16:06,519
Speaker 1: corrosive to civic friendship. It creates suspicion, it creates anger

1255
01:16:06,640 --> 01:16:10,000
Speaker 1: and resentment in all of the groups. And when you

1256
01:16:10,040 --> 01:16:12,439
Speaker 1: have a country that is defined by those things, that

1257
01:16:12,479 --> 01:16:14,880
Speaker 1: country will not be able to act. It will not

1258
01:16:14,880 --> 01:16:16,639
Speaker 1: be able to act on the world stage, it will

1259
01:16:16,680 --> 01:16:19,400
Speaker 1: not be able to act internally, and will end up

1260
01:16:19,400 --> 01:16:26,200
Speaker 1: being governed by unaccountable bureaucrats who who are imposing some

1261
01:16:26,200 --> 01:16:30,240
Speaker 1: sort of foreign vision on our society. So I think

1262
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:33,160
Speaker 1: it's bad for republican government. I think it's bad for

1263
01:16:33,200 --> 01:16:37,559
Speaker 1: common citizenship and bad for national action. And it's based

1264
01:16:37,600 --> 01:16:41,559
Speaker 1: on a lie about the nature of group outcomes, and

1265
01:16:41,600 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 1: of course to execute it, and that's all, you know,

1266
01:16:44,880 --> 01:16:47,600
Speaker 1: not that big a deal, And of course to execute it,

1267
01:16:47,640 --> 01:16:49,840
Speaker 1: and it's implicit in your answer, but you have to

1268
01:16:49,880 --> 01:16:53,559
Speaker 1: impose totalitarianism essentially on the country, leaving aside that the

1269
01:16:53,560 --> 01:16:56,559
Speaker 1: country would collapse by tearing itself apart in the interim,

1270
01:16:56,720 --> 01:16:59,760
Speaker 1: as the totalitarianism is being imposed upon the country a

1271
01:17:00,040 --> 01:17:02,400
Speaker 1: real quick in thirty seconds or so, can you burn

1272
01:17:02,479 --> 01:17:05,640
Speaker 1: down the strawman argument being raised about how taking on

1273
01:17:05,720 --> 01:17:08,840
Speaker 1: CRT in schools as an attack on academic freedom. Yeah,

1274
01:17:08,840 --> 01:17:11,519
Speaker 1: I mean the purpose of academic freedom is to serve

1275
01:17:11,560 --> 01:17:15,560
Speaker 1: the common good. If there is an ideology that undermines

1276
01:17:15,640 --> 01:17:20,640
Speaker 1: the common good, like CRT, it's crucial to show that

1277
01:17:20,720 --> 01:17:24,920
Speaker 1: there is a limit to academic freedom. Academic freedom is

1278
01:17:25,000 --> 01:17:28,200
Speaker 1: only valued because it serves the common good, and if

1279
01:17:28,240 --> 01:17:32,360
Speaker 1: we have certain kinds of ideologies that undermine it, academic

1280
01:17:32,400 --> 01:17:35,479
Speaker 1: freedom must at some point give way to a concern

1281
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:39,000
Speaker 1: that the public has to make sure that its institutions

1282
01:17:39,040 --> 01:17:41,880
Speaker 1: actually serve the common good. We've been speaking with Professor

1283
01:17:42,000 --> 01:17:45,040
Speaker 1: Scott Jenner of Boise State, where he teaches political science.

1284
01:17:45,040 --> 01:17:47,680
Speaker 1: He's also Washington Fellow at the Cremin Institute. Thank you

1285
01:17:47,680 --> 01:17:49,559
Speaker 1: so much for coming on the program. Really appreciate it.

1286
01:17:49,720 --> 01:17:53,200
Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. Have you ever wanted to

1287
01:17:53,200 --> 01:17:55,000
Speaker 1: invest in real estate? But you don't have the time

1288
01:17:55,040 --> 01:17:57,240
Speaker 1: to do it on your own. I thought exactly the

1289
01:17:57,280 --> 01:17:59,360
Speaker 1: same way as you until about a year ago. I've

1290
01:17:59,400 --> 01:18:01,519
Speaker 1: always loved the idea of real estate investments, but I

1291
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:03,479
Speaker 1: didn't know how to invest in real estate. While staying

1292
01:18:03,479 --> 01:18:06,360
Speaker 1: committed to my professional I do five hours of original

1293
01:18:06,400 --> 01:18:09,360
Speaker 1: programming and content every day. How could I possibly take

1294
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:11,360
Speaker 1: the time to invest in real estate on my own?

1295
01:18:11,880 --> 01:18:14,200
Speaker 1: Then I met my friends at Done for You real Estate.

1296
01:18:14,479 --> 01:18:16,120
Speaker 1: They took all of the guests work out of it

1297
01:18:16,240 --> 01:18:18,599
Speaker 1: for me. They found me an awesome property, they rented

1298
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:20,719
Speaker 1: it out for me right away, They managed the tenant

1299
01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:22,639
Speaker 1: for me, and now I get a check every month

1300
01:18:22,720 --> 01:18:25,559
Speaker 1: like clockwork. Don't wait another second to see if my

1301
01:18:25,600 --> 01:18:27,760
Speaker 1: buddies It Done for You real Estate can do for

1302
01:18:27,800 --> 01:18:30,360
Speaker 1: you what they did for Mets. It done for you

1303
01:18:30,439 --> 01:18:33,040
Speaker 1: Buck dot com to see how it works. Is it

1304
01:18:33,080 --> 01:18:35,720
Speaker 1: done for you Buck dot com? Today? You will not

1305
01:18:35,800 --> 01:18:48,920
Speaker 1: be sorry. Welcome back to the Buck Sexton Show. This

1306
01:18:49,080 --> 01:18:53,960
Speaker 1: is Ben Weingarten in for Buck Sexton. And while we've

1307
01:18:54,000 --> 01:18:57,080
Speaker 1: covered a lot this week in the way of the

1308
01:18:57,080 --> 01:19:00,280
Speaker 1: woke takeover of pretty much every aspect of our society,

1309
01:19:00,439 --> 01:19:02,280
Speaker 1: I guess we've gone a little bit soft so far

1310
01:19:02,360 --> 01:19:04,880
Speaker 1: on big tech. We haven't given it its due yet.

1311
01:19:04,920 --> 01:19:08,120
Speaker 1: And someone who's been keenly focused on the ways in

1312
01:19:08,160 --> 01:19:11,320
Speaker 1: which concentrated private power in the way of big tech,

1313
01:19:11,360 --> 01:19:14,640
Speaker 1: which I've called sort of an auxiliary of the administrative

1314
01:19:14,640 --> 01:19:18,080
Speaker 1: state being used hand in hand with the federal government

1315
01:19:18,280 --> 01:19:22,080
Speaker 1: at times, and also of course federal officials cajoling big

1316
01:19:22,120 --> 01:19:24,479
Speaker 1: tech to do its bidding with respect to speech. It

1317
01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:27,920
Speaker 1: does not like someone who's been keenly focused on these issues,

1318
01:19:27,920 --> 01:19:32,080
Speaker 1: in particular again that concentration of power in the public

1319
01:19:32,120 --> 01:19:35,920
Speaker 1: and private spheres, is Rachel Bovard. She's senior director of

1320
01:19:35,960 --> 01:19:40,479
Speaker 1: Policy at the Conservative Partnership Institute, formerly served in roles

1321
01:19:40,560 --> 01:19:43,320
Speaker 1: under the likes of Senators Rand Paul and Mike Lee.

1322
01:19:43,439 --> 01:19:45,599
Speaker 1: She's a senior tech columnist at the Federalists, and we'll

1323
01:19:45,600 --> 01:19:47,880
Speaker 1: talk about one of her recent articles there in just

1324
01:19:47,920 --> 01:19:50,639
Speaker 1: a second. And also, I should say a co panelist

1325
01:19:50,640 --> 01:19:53,679
Speaker 1: of mine on the weekly show the nat Con Squad,

1326
01:19:53,720 --> 01:19:56,680
Speaker 1: which is a project of the Edmund Burke Foundation, and

1327
01:19:56,720 --> 01:19:58,800
Speaker 1: I urge everyone to check that out for all the

1328
01:19:58,880 --> 01:20:03,160
Speaker 1: latest and greatest and policy politics and ideas in this

1329
01:20:03,240 --> 01:20:06,960
Speaker 1: sort of new national conservatism movement. Rachel, thanks so much

1330
01:20:06,960 --> 01:20:10,360
Speaker 1: for coming on the program today. My pleasure. Thanks for

1331
01:20:10,400 --> 01:20:14,960
Speaker 1: having me. Sure. So first let's do some level setting here.

1332
01:20:15,400 --> 01:20:19,160
Speaker 1: You've been writing at length about antitrust. You had a

1333
01:20:19,200 --> 01:20:22,679
Speaker 1: great peace in the American Conservative which sort of goes

1334
01:20:22,720 --> 01:20:27,200
Speaker 1: into in part practically how antitrust ought to be wielded

1335
01:20:27,680 --> 01:20:31,080
Speaker 1: given the concentrated power in big tech and elsewhere, but

1336
01:20:31,120 --> 01:20:34,920
Speaker 1: also that it really is a conservative policy at core.

1337
01:20:35,040 --> 01:20:39,639
Speaker 1: So what are the conservative underpinnings of antitrust rightly used?

1338
01:20:42,120 --> 01:20:46,400
Speaker 1: So our antitrust statutes in America are over a century old,

1339
01:20:46,479 --> 01:20:49,360
Speaker 1: and they grew out of this you know, shared concern

1340
01:20:49,880 --> 01:20:52,599
Speaker 1: for concentrated power in the market, you know, born out

1341
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:55,040
Speaker 1: of this idea that it's you know, to have a

1342
01:20:55,080 --> 01:20:57,479
Speaker 1: free market that works, you know, it has to be

1343
01:20:57,960 --> 01:21:02,320
Speaker 1: vigilantly protected. And that was really a conservative impulse. You know.

1344
01:21:02,400 --> 01:21:05,280
Speaker 1: John Sherman, the Senator who gave his name actually to

1345
01:21:05,320 --> 01:21:08,320
Speaker 1: the founding anti trust lawsuit or grounding Antstrius Statute, was

1346
01:21:08,360 --> 01:21:12,040
Speaker 1: a Republican signed by Benjamin Harrison, also a Republican president,

1347
01:21:12,640 --> 01:21:15,160
Speaker 1: and it really grew out of this classical liberal traditional

1348
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:20,120
Speaker 1: conservative tradition which says, look concentrated power wherever it exists,

1349
01:21:20,240 --> 01:21:23,800
Speaker 1: can be a threat to liberty. I went into a

1350
01:21:24,040 --> 01:21:26,559
Speaker 1: recent essay I wrote into sort of the thinking of

1351
01:21:26,600 --> 01:21:30,200
Speaker 1: Friedrich Hyak around this concept. And you know, we usually

1352
01:21:30,200 --> 01:21:33,680
Speaker 1: think of Hyaks as the great champion of the unfettered marketplace,

1353
01:21:33,800 --> 01:21:37,120
Speaker 1: but even Hyak was very aware that, you know, a

1354
01:21:37,160 --> 01:21:41,880
Speaker 1: concentrated corporate power, particularly when it fused with government power,

1355
01:21:42,120 --> 01:21:44,160
Speaker 1: could be a tremendous threat. And you know, that was

1356
01:21:44,200 --> 01:21:47,839
Speaker 1: the fascism that he fled from, you know, in Europe

1357
01:21:48,680 --> 01:21:50,880
Speaker 1: at the dawn of World War two. So there really

1358
01:21:50,960 --> 01:21:53,320
Speaker 1: is a conservative impulse, I think, to be wary of

1359
01:21:53,360 --> 01:21:57,840
Speaker 1: concentrated power wherever it resides. And that was initially how

1360
01:21:57,960 --> 01:22:01,360
Speaker 1: conservative's approach to anti trust. You know, that changed over

1361
01:22:01,479 --> 01:22:05,560
Speaker 1: time as progressives began to use antitrust to sort of

1362
01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:08,759
Speaker 1: impose their own values on the market. The jurisprudence around

1363
01:22:09,160 --> 01:22:11,639
Speaker 1: how anti trust was interpreted began to sort of swing

1364
01:22:11,720 --> 01:22:14,439
Speaker 1: in all kind of ideological directions, and so you had

1365
01:22:14,479 --> 01:22:18,360
Speaker 1: conservatives that said, look, antitrust needs an anchoror it needs

1366
01:22:18,360 --> 01:22:20,439
Speaker 1: something that makes a coherent and so that was the

1367
01:22:20,479 --> 01:22:23,720
Speaker 1: birth of the consumer Welfare Standard, which fuses sort of

1368
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:27,160
Speaker 1: economic metrics around how anti trust should be enforced. So

1369
01:22:27,200 --> 01:22:29,960
Speaker 1: it says, you know, enforcers should look at things like

1370
01:22:30,080 --> 01:22:34,120
Speaker 1: our prices changing, how is innovation doing, Is it being harmed,

1371
01:22:34,520 --> 01:22:37,840
Speaker 1: Is you know, quality of goods being harmed? Consumers have

1372
01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:40,400
Speaker 1: adequate choice in the market. So it's a framework that

1373
01:22:40,479 --> 01:22:43,559
Speaker 1: makes sense. But I think over time, you know, has

1374
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:47,240
Speaker 1: become so narrowed as to be interpreted as just this

1375
01:22:47,479 --> 01:22:51,439
Speaker 1: exclusive focus on price, and that's really diminished the role

1376
01:22:51,479 --> 01:22:54,839
Speaker 1: of antitrust because it becomes so difficult to even enforce

1377
01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:57,519
Speaker 1: anti trust in the marketplace as it exists. So I

1378
01:22:57,520 --> 01:22:59,880
Speaker 1: think some conservatives are now waking up to the fact

1379
01:23:00,120 --> 01:23:02,920
Speaker 1: that hey, maybe we should broaden the mandate back to

1380
01:23:02,960 --> 01:23:06,519
Speaker 1: that original aperture that the consumer Welfare Standard had when

1381
01:23:06,520 --> 01:23:09,600
Speaker 1: it was implemented in the eighties and late seventies and

1382
01:23:10,320 --> 01:23:13,920
Speaker 1: go back to that interpretation. But as you might imagine,

1383
01:23:13,960 --> 01:23:16,439
Speaker 1: there's a pretty big establishment consensus built up around the

1384
01:23:16,439 --> 01:23:19,160
Speaker 1: way things that are currently being done. So there's a

1385
01:23:19,160 --> 01:23:21,599
Speaker 1: lot of debate and dissent around this idea. Yeah, So

1386
01:23:21,640 --> 01:23:25,760
Speaker 1: with respect to that establishment consensus versus growing on the

1387
01:23:25,840 --> 01:23:29,400
Speaker 1: left and right and really generally on the more ideological

1388
01:23:29,479 --> 01:23:33,599
Speaker 1: members of Congress on either side, and beyond Congress, as well,

1389
01:23:34,360 --> 01:23:38,759
Speaker 1: one of the cynic might say, well, are politicians leveraging

1390
01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:42,439
Speaker 1: the big tech issue essentially to extort these companies into

1391
01:23:42,479 --> 01:23:45,879
Speaker 1: giving them paying them more money for their campaigns, increasing

1392
01:23:45,880 --> 01:23:49,040
Speaker 1: contributions to pay for the protection of the federal government,

1393
01:23:49,080 --> 01:23:51,879
Speaker 1: or do you think that there's been a genuine shift

1394
01:23:52,200 --> 01:23:57,360
Speaker 1: among our legislators. So, of course, you know, there's always

1395
01:23:57,360 --> 01:24:00,960
Speaker 1: a level of cynicism, I think in politics, but I

1396
01:24:01,000 --> 01:24:04,400
Speaker 1: do think, you know, there is a genuine effort among

1397
01:24:04,840 --> 01:24:08,080
Speaker 1: some Republican lawmakers to actually look at this problem as

1398
01:24:08,080 --> 01:24:10,240
Speaker 1: it exists, not even just in the big tech space,

1399
01:24:10,360 --> 01:24:13,560
Speaker 1: but across the economy at large. It was really fascinating

1400
01:24:13,560 --> 01:24:16,960
Speaker 1: to watch last week when Senator Mike Lee, former boss

1401
01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:19,040
Speaker 1: of mine but also very well known, you know, with

1402
01:24:19,200 --> 01:24:23,040
Speaker 1: the libertarian in the sort of more libertarian leaning legal

1403
01:24:23,080 --> 01:24:27,400
Speaker 1: movement itself, he even acknowledged, you know that across the economy,

1404
01:24:27,920 --> 01:24:31,320
Speaker 1: it's possible that's you know, our anti trust enforcement enforcement

1405
01:24:31,439 --> 01:24:34,400
Speaker 1: isn't working. And again this goes back to this idea.

1406
01:24:34,560 --> 01:24:37,920
Speaker 1: You know, I think oftentimes people on the right unfairly

1407
01:24:38,080 --> 01:24:41,120
Speaker 1: and perhaps you know, with an agenda, conflate anti trust

1408
01:24:41,240 --> 01:24:45,000
Speaker 1: enforcement with regulation, but the two are very very distinct.

1409
01:24:45,200 --> 01:24:47,679
Speaker 1: And I think Senator Lee makes this distinction well anti

1410
01:24:47,720 --> 01:24:51,040
Speaker 1: trust enforcement his law enforcement right, It's not illegal to

1411
01:24:51,080 --> 01:24:53,920
Speaker 1: be a monopoly, but it's illegal to be predatory. You know,

1412
01:24:53,920 --> 01:24:56,760
Speaker 1: it's illegal to undercut competition in the marketplace. And if

1413
01:24:56,760 --> 01:24:59,760
Speaker 1: that's not being adequately policed, that's a problem because again,

1414
01:24:59,800 --> 01:25:02,720
Speaker 1: then you don't actually have the free market working as intended.

1415
01:25:03,200 --> 01:25:06,080
Speaker 1: So you know, even he I think, is acknowledging that

1416
01:25:06,120 --> 01:25:09,200
Speaker 1: there's the status quo is not working here, and that's

1417
01:25:09,200 --> 01:25:12,360
Speaker 1: really the debate to be had. You know. Of course,

1418
01:25:12,400 --> 01:25:14,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's there's people motivated by cynicism, but I

1419
01:25:14,800 --> 01:25:17,120
Speaker 1: would say, more than any other issue I've seen recently,

1420
01:25:17,400 --> 01:25:20,639
Speaker 1: there is really a genuine effort to adjust this here. Yeah.

1421
01:25:20,640 --> 01:25:22,640
Speaker 1: And of course, and we've dowed into this on that

1422
01:25:22,760 --> 01:25:27,360
Speaker 1: con squad at length, there's ample legal and historical precedent

1423
01:25:27,400 --> 01:25:30,240
Speaker 1: for this. Justice Thomas has probably written the most succinctly

1424
01:25:30,640 --> 01:25:33,719
Speaker 1: and clearly sort of the reasons leading up towards maybe

1425
01:25:33,720 --> 01:25:37,439
Speaker 1: a potential rolling down the road that would justify treating,

1426
01:25:37,520 --> 01:25:40,680
Speaker 1: for example, big tech like under a common carrier a

1427
01:25:40,800 --> 01:25:43,559
Speaker 1: sort of regime. And of course there's been a number

1428
01:25:43,600 --> 01:25:46,479
Speaker 1: of bills put up in Congress lately, and you've written

1429
01:25:46,520 --> 01:25:48,920
Speaker 1: about them at length. Tell us a little bit about

1430
01:25:48,920 --> 01:25:52,320
Speaker 1: the substance of the legislative proposals on the table and

1431
01:25:52,360 --> 01:25:57,120
Speaker 1: how it's relevant to the everyday lives of Americans. Yeah,

1432
01:25:57,160 --> 01:26:00,400
Speaker 1: so this is a really interesting development out of House

1433
01:26:00,479 --> 01:26:04,559
Speaker 1: Judiciary Committee run by Democrats, who have over the last

1434
01:26:04,880 --> 01:26:10,920
Speaker 1: year and a half embarked on this legislative investigation into Apple, Amazon, Google,

1435
01:26:10,920 --> 01:26:13,200
Speaker 1: and Facebook. And they this resulted in like a six

1436
01:26:13,320 --> 01:26:16,920
Speaker 1: hundred page report on all of the areas in which Democrats,

1437
01:26:17,000 --> 01:26:19,280
Speaker 1: you know, found these companies to be acting in non

1438
01:26:19,320 --> 01:26:23,439
Speaker 1: competitive way. Days now, no Republican joined that report, although

1439
01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:26,880
Speaker 1: you did see the Republican ranking member of the Antitrust Subcommittee,

1440
01:26:26,960 --> 01:26:29,360
Speaker 1: Kent Buck, put out his own report saying, you know,

1441
01:26:29,400 --> 01:26:32,120
Speaker 1: I don't really agree with my Democratic callings on what

1442
01:26:32,120 --> 01:26:34,120
Speaker 1: they want to do, but I do think that there

1443
01:26:34,120 --> 01:26:37,920
Speaker 1: are some issues here. There's definitely some flashing red lights.

1444
01:26:37,960 --> 01:26:41,040
Speaker 1: And as a result of that investigation, the Subcommittee's put

1445
01:26:41,040 --> 01:26:44,599
Speaker 1: out five legislative proposals. And this is a big deal

1446
01:26:44,680 --> 01:26:47,439
Speaker 1: because you know, for a long time, you know, all

1447
01:26:47,479 --> 01:26:50,040
Speaker 1: we saw from people concerned about big tech was sort

1448
01:26:50,040 --> 01:26:53,080
Speaker 1: of these hearings where members would go and yell about

1449
01:26:53,080 --> 01:26:57,080
Speaker 1: things or you know, letters, but no real substantive legislative effort.

1450
01:26:57,760 --> 01:26:59,439
Speaker 1: And so I want to highlight it in that regard

1451
01:26:59,520 --> 01:27:01,400
Speaker 1: that this is this is a pretty big next step.

1452
01:27:02,080 --> 01:27:05,519
Speaker 1: And so these five different bills deal with different parts

1453
01:27:05,560 --> 01:27:09,040
Speaker 1: of the market that lawmakers feel big tech has been

1454
01:27:09,160 --> 01:27:13,920
Speaker 1: unfairly entrenched, and they really go into how big tech competes.

1455
01:27:13,960 --> 01:27:17,160
Speaker 1: So probably the two biggest proposals would that would really

1456
01:27:17,240 --> 01:27:20,200
Speaker 1: change how things work are One is a straight up

1457
01:27:20,240 --> 01:27:24,000
Speaker 1: merger band, so specific to these big tech companies. You know,

1458
01:27:24,200 --> 01:27:27,200
Speaker 1: instead of the government having to prove that when they

1459
01:27:27,200 --> 01:27:29,320
Speaker 1: buy up their competitors, the government having to say, no,

1460
01:27:29,439 --> 01:27:32,679
Speaker 1: that's anti competitive, the presumption has flipped. The big tech

1461
01:27:32,720 --> 01:27:34,559
Speaker 1: companies would have to prove to the government that what

1462
01:27:34,600 --> 01:27:37,679
Speaker 1: they're doing is not anti competitive. And then the second

1463
01:27:37,720 --> 01:27:39,960
Speaker 1: big bill that I think would have really long ranging

1464
01:27:39,960 --> 01:27:44,400
Speaker 1: effects is a structural separation about self preferencing. And this

1465
01:27:44,600 --> 01:27:47,919
Speaker 1: really gets at the idea that you know, Google can

1466
01:27:48,040 --> 01:27:51,760
Speaker 1: promote its own products and in its massive platform and

1467
01:27:51,880 --> 01:27:55,200
Speaker 1: downgrade its competitors. And you know that really is a

1468
01:27:55,240 --> 01:27:57,720
Speaker 1: problem when Google is the only game in town, right

1469
01:27:57,760 --> 01:28:00,479
Speaker 1: when Google filters information for ninety percent of the world.

1470
01:28:01,880 --> 01:28:04,479
Speaker 1: When they downgrade a competitor, it really sort of has

1471
01:28:04,880 --> 01:28:07,680
Speaker 1: a large impact on their business. So those are the

1472
01:28:07,720 --> 01:28:10,320
Speaker 1: two really big bills that I think, of the five

1473
01:28:10,360 --> 01:28:13,639
Speaker 1: would have the longest ranging effects. You've written at Lance

1474
01:28:13,760 --> 01:28:15,240
Speaker 1: as well. We've got about a couple of minutes and

1475
01:28:15,240 --> 01:28:17,760
Speaker 1: then we'll be up against the commercial break. But you've

1476
01:28:17,760 --> 01:28:22,120
Speaker 1: written as well and certainly spoken about Facebook's oversight board.

1477
01:28:22,240 --> 01:28:24,880
Speaker 1: And you look at the composition of this I guess

1478
01:28:24,880 --> 01:28:27,599
Speaker 1: Supreme Court on Speech or sort of the anti Supreme

1479
01:28:27,640 --> 01:28:29,880
Speaker 1: Court on speech in some respects. And you look at

1480
01:28:29,920 --> 01:28:34,200
Speaker 1: the composition and a disproportionate percentage of the members of Facebook,

1481
01:28:34,280 --> 01:28:40,400
Speaker 1: supposedly impartial and neutral objective a technocratic board, are not Americans.

1482
01:28:40,680 --> 01:28:42,720
Speaker 1: And of course the rest of the world has a

1483
01:28:42,840 --> 01:28:47,240
Speaker 1: very different standard in terms of free speech and conceptions

1484
01:28:47,280 --> 01:28:49,760
Speaker 1: of what is beyond the pale and what is acceptable

1485
01:28:50,360 --> 01:28:53,599
Speaker 1: in terms of the content of speech. Do you believe

1486
01:28:53,680 --> 01:28:57,080
Speaker 1: that essentially we are being subjected to, and are supposedly

1487
01:28:57,479 --> 01:29:03,880
Speaker 1: free digital public square foreign conceptions of speech. I think

1488
01:29:03,920 --> 01:29:06,760
Speaker 1: that's exactly what the Facebook Oversight board is. You know,

1489
01:29:06,800 --> 01:29:11,800
Speaker 1: it's made up of largely foreign members, right, people who

1490
01:29:11,840 --> 01:29:15,920
Speaker 1: aren't raised in our speech traditions making decisions about what, how,

1491
01:29:16,000 --> 01:29:17,960
Speaker 1: you know, how speech should be carried out in America.

1492
01:29:18,000 --> 01:29:21,760
Speaker 1: I think it's entirely inappropriate, particularly when you know Facebook

1493
01:29:22,120 --> 01:29:25,320
Speaker 1: oversight board has placed itself over and above the speech

1494
01:29:25,360 --> 01:29:28,720
Speaker 1: of democratically elected government officials, you know, President Trump being

1495
01:29:28,720 --> 01:29:31,160
Speaker 1: probably the most famous example of this. I think it's

1496
01:29:31,280 --> 01:29:34,400
Speaker 1: highly inappropriate and really kind of has a chilling effect

1497
01:29:34,880 --> 01:29:37,439
Speaker 1: in our public square when you consider that Facebook, with

1498
01:29:37,560 --> 01:29:40,960
Speaker 1: its two point seven billion global users, really does not

1499
01:29:41,040 --> 01:29:44,240
Speaker 1: only represent a public square for voter engagement for many

1500
01:29:44,240 --> 01:29:47,080
Speaker 1: elected officials, but it's also a market access point for

1501
01:29:47,200 --> 01:29:49,720
Speaker 1: millions of small businesses in America. So it's much much

1502
01:29:49,720 --> 01:29:51,920
Speaker 1: more than just a speech platform, and I think when

1503
01:29:51,960 --> 01:29:54,880
Speaker 1: it wields its power ideologically, it has a long ranging

1504
01:29:54,880 --> 01:29:57,120
Speaker 1: effect not only on the speech, but on the marketplace

1505
01:29:57,520 --> 01:29:59,960
Speaker 1: the marketplace as well. So we're going to take a

1506
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:02,280
Speaker 1: a quick commercial break in just a second, but I

1507
01:30:02,320 --> 01:30:04,800
Speaker 1: think it's worth emphasizing a couple of things before you

1508
01:30:04,840 --> 01:30:09,679
Speaker 1: were talking Rachel about the corporate wealth. The essentially lowest

1509
01:30:09,720 --> 01:30:12,240
Speaker 1: price is all that matters when it comes to anti trust,

1510
01:30:12,320 --> 01:30:14,639
Speaker 1: how it's been interpreted over time. But of course we've

1511
01:30:14,640 --> 01:30:17,840
Speaker 1: paid a substantial price for these falling costs, which is

1512
01:30:18,040 --> 01:30:22,439
Speaker 1: our privacy, our most personal information, and of course we've

1513
01:30:22,520 --> 01:30:24,880
Speaker 1: essentially sacrificed our right to free speech to save the

1514
01:30:24,880 --> 01:30:27,040
Speaker 1: public square of free speech. And I think that that's

1515
01:30:27,080 --> 01:30:30,800
Speaker 1: something that's worth emphasizing every time that rationale comes up

1516
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:34,240
Speaker 1: for not using anti trust in a prudent and measured

1517
01:30:34,280 --> 01:30:36,920
Speaker 1: and proper way given what we're facing today. This has

1518
01:30:36,920 --> 01:30:39,320
Speaker 1: been wagering in for Buck sexon well More with Rachel Bovard.

1519
01:30:39,479 --> 01:30:42,960
Speaker 1: Right after this, we're back with Rachel Bovard, senior director

1520
01:30:42,960 --> 01:30:46,720
Speaker 1: of Policy at the Conservative Partnership Institute, senior tech columnists

1521
01:30:46,840 --> 01:30:48,600
Speaker 1: at the Federalist or I should know it. I'm a

1522
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:51,320
Speaker 1: senior contributor as well, and someone who's worked under the

1523
01:30:51,320 --> 01:30:54,040
Speaker 1: likes of Senators Rand Paul and Mike Lee, which have

1524
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:57,120
Speaker 1: sort of become at least at the high level you

1525
01:30:57,160 --> 01:30:59,880
Speaker 1: would think kind of strange bedfellows at least Senator Lee

1526
01:31:00,160 --> 01:31:04,200
Speaker 1: with respect to the conversation today, which is using government

1527
01:31:04,240 --> 01:31:08,719
Speaker 1: power against concentrated corporate power, and I think it's worth noting,

1528
01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:12,840
Speaker 1: you know, sort of high level context of that conversation,

1529
01:31:13,320 --> 01:31:16,760
Speaker 1: of course, power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely, whether

1530
01:31:16,760 --> 01:31:20,040
Speaker 1: it's in the public or private spheres. It's just human nature.

1531
01:31:20,400 --> 01:31:22,679
Speaker 1: And it's also worth noting that there's a difference between

1532
01:31:23,160 --> 01:31:28,479
Speaker 1: free enterprise and business and free enterprise and corporatism. And

1533
01:31:28,920 --> 01:31:32,400
Speaker 1: businesses start out small and grow as a consequence of

1534
01:31:32,439 --> 01:31:35,639
Speaker 1: an open and free marketplace. But as businesses grow bigger,

1535
01:31:35,640 --> 01:31:39,240
Speaker 1: of course, they always want to halt their competition, buy

1536
01:31:39,320 --> 01:31:41,760
Speaker 1: up their competition if they need to cement their place

1537
01:31:41,840 --> 01:31:44,240
Speaker 1: as dominant powers. And so I think we always have

1538
01:31:44,280 --> 01:31:45,840
Speaker 1: to keep that in the back of our mind when

1539
01:31:45,880 --> 01:31:48,879
Speaker 1: we talk about how we think about protecting and preserving

1540
01:31:48,960 --> 01:31:53,879
Speaker 1: a true free marketplace versus protecting and preserving corporatist positions.

1541
01:31:53,880 --> 01:31:55,400
Speaker 1: I wonder if you had any thoughts on that sort

1542
01:31:55,439 --> 01:32:00,000
Speaker 1: of deeper, more philosophical point. Yeah. I think this gets

1543
01:31:59,880 --> 01:32:05,519
Speaker 1: to the you know, intellectual sort of ideological positioning of

1544
01:32:05,600 --> 01:32:08,240
Speaker 1: the right over the last you know, thirty years years,

1545
01:32:08,320 --> 01:32:12,080
Speaker 1: because you know, as I referenced earlier, the conservative tradition

1546
01:32:12,080 --> 01:32:14,960
Speaker 1: and classical liberalism has always acknowledged that threats to liberty

1547
01:32:14,960 --> 01:32:17,760
Speaker 1: can reside in concentrated power wherever it is, right in

1548
01:32:17,800 --> 01:32:21,479
Speaker 1: the corporate space or in the government. But over time,

1549
01:32:21,520 --> 01:32:24,679
Speaker 1: I think conservatives have come to believe that the only

1550
01:32:24,720 --> 01:32:26,760
Speaker 1: threat to liberty is in the government itself, and they've

1551
01:32:26,760 --> 01:32:30,080
Speaker 1: ignored this the free market, you know, and then they've

1552
01:32:30,080 --> 01:32:32,240
Speaker 1: just assumed everything is fine and then there's nothing to

1553
01:32:32,240 --> 01:32:34,760
Speaker 1: see here. But I think what we're seeing now is

1554
01:32:34,800 --> 01:32:37,360
Speaker 1: that vigilance is required there as well, because I think,

1555
01:32:37,560 --> 01:32:40,880
Speaker 1: you know, especially when government policies are prioritizing certain things

1556
01:32:40,880 --> 01:32:43,400
Speaker 1: about business, because that's the real reality of the marketplace,

1557
01:32:43,479 --> 01:32:46,280
Speaker 1: right it reflects the policies that we are selves set

1558
01:32:46,360 --> 01:32:48,519
Speaker 1: for it. So when we talk about the tech companies,

1559
01:32:48,560 --> 01:32:51,000
Speaker 1: for instance, they often get, you know, well, why would

1560
01:32:51,040 --> 01:32:54,200
Speaker 1: you interfere with a private business? These businesses benefit from

1561
01:32:54,439 --> 01:32:58,280
Speaker 1: tremendous government policy across the board, you know, the likes

1562
01:32:58,280 --> 01:33:00,720
Speaker 1: of which of Section two thirty for instance, which is

1563
01:33:00,720 --> 01:33:05,200
Speaker 1: its big carve out a big immunity from liability, which

1564
01:33:05,200 --> 01:33:08,519
Speaker 1: it's tantamount to a huge financial substitute to these companies,

1565
01:33:08,680 --> 01:33:11,040
Speaker 1: you know, their First Amendment actors, but their activity is

1566
01:33:11,040 --> 01:33:15,400
Speaker 1: privileged over and above other First Amendment actors like newspapers

1567
01:33:15,439 --> 01:33:18,400
Speaker 1: and movies and things that would be subject to lawsuits.

1568
01:33:18,400 --> 01:33:21,120
Speaker 1: So we do really need, I think, to change this

1569
01:33:21,280 --> 01:33:23,880
Speaker 1: binary way of looking at things where it's only the

1570
01:33:23,880 --> 01:33:27,160
Speaker 1: government's the problem, and you know, massive corporate power is

1571
01:33:27,240 --> 01:33:29,559
Speaker 1: never a problem. That's just not true. And I think

1572
01:33:29,560 --> 01:33:32,519
Speaker 1: we're seeing that very very well demonstrated in this moment.

1573
01:33:33,240 --> 01:33:37,360
Speaker 1: If you were drafting up the next contract with America

1574
01:33:37,479 --> 01:33:39,720
Speaker 1: or whatever, that document may or may not end up

1575
01:33:39,760 --> 01:33:41,759
Speaker 1: being called to the extent the party is even thinking

1576
01:33:41,760 --> 01:33:44,719
Speaker 1: this way, which is of course always questionable. What would

1577
01:33:44,760 --> 01:33:48,320
Speaker 1: your principles look like and your sort of campaign look

1578
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:51,920
Speaker 1: like for taking on big tech to ensure that the

1579
01:33:51,960 --> 01:33:55,000
Speaker 1: pre am vota section two thirty is actually served by

1580
01:33:55,000 --> 01:33:58,280
Speaker 1: our laws, which is promoting free and open discourse and

1581
01:33:58,320 --> 01:34:03,639
Speaker 1: intellectual inquiry. You know, I think a guiding heuristic here

1582
01:34:03,840 --> 01:34:06,760
Speaker 1: is actually something very Goldwater set a long time ago,

1583
01:34:06,800 --> 01:34:10,639
Speaker 1: which is that, you know, the champions of freedom will

1584
01:34:10,960 --> 01:34:14,559
Speaker 1: you fight against concentrated power wherever it resides. They will

1585
01:34:14,600 --> 01:34:18,639
Speaker 1: take on monopolies, corporate and union. And so I think

1586
01:34:18,680 --> 01:34:20,920
Speaker 1: that has to be the guiding heuristic for how we

1587
01:34:21,000 --> 01:34:23,599
Speaker 1: do things in both the government and in the private sector,

1588
01:34:23,680 --> 01:34:27,320
Speaker 1: because one of both of these transact on each other

1589
01:34:27,360 --> 01:34:30,080
Speaker 1: in very powerful ways, and I think it's a mistake

1590
01:34:30,160 --> 01:34:32,880
Speaker 1: to put them into separate spheres when they aren't anymore when,

1591
01:34:33,000 --> 01:34:35,439
Speaker 1: especially with these big tech tech companies, we now see

1592
01:34:35,479 --> 01:34:39,480
Speaker 1: them working hand in glove with, you know, a democratic

1593
01:34:39,520 --> 01:34:42,799
Speaker 1: ideology to use the levers of power to shut down dissent,

1594
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:45,800
Speaker 1: to shut down criticism, and to shut down speech in

1595
01:34:45,840 --> 01:34:48,920
Speaker 1: the public square. We are in a situation now where

1596
01:34:49,320 --> 01:34:51,840
Speaker 1: the government does have a role, and it is, like

1597
01:34:51,920 --> 01:34:56,960
Speaker 1: you said, to preserve this open space for ideas, for

1598
01:34:57,160 --> 01:35:00,000
Speaker 1: small business, for all these things that we as republic

1599
01:35:00,000 --> 01:35:03,599
Speaker 1: aikins cherish, but we're so hesitant to say the government

1600
01:35:03,640 --> 01:35:06,880
Speaker 1: has any role here. But that limited role for the

1601
01:35:06,920 --> 01:35:09,400
Speaker 1: government is now, and so I think that has to

1602
01:35:09,439 --> 01:35:12,320
Speaker 1: be a guiding principle for Republicans going forward in a

1603
01:35:12,360 --> 01:35:14,599
Speaker 1: way that it hasn't really been for the last thirty years.

1604
01:35:15,040 --> 01:35:17,040
Speaker 1: And I think it's worth knowing again that there, of

1605
01:35:17,080 --> 01:35:20,080
Speaker 1: course national security implications to this as well. We spoke

1606
01:35:20,120 --> 01:35:23,879
Speaker 1: at length on yesterday's episode about the Biden administration countering

1607
01:35:23,920 --> 01:35:28,040
Speaker 1: domestic terrorism strategy, and of course the administration talks about

1608
01:35:28,080 --> 01:35:31,679
Speaker 1: partnering with private sector actors, including and they've intimated this before,

1609
01:35:32,120 --> 01:35:35,040
Speaker 1: big tech, to police their platforms for whatever the thought

1610
01:35:35,080 --> 01:35:37,720
Speaker 1: police of the Biden administration deemed to be legitimate to

1611
01:35:37,760 --> 01:35:41,440
Speaker 1: be policing, and that strategy also talks about combating disinformation

1612
01:35:41,439 --> 01:35:44,720
Speaker 1: and misinformation, which you can only believe in practice will

1613
01:35:44,760 --> 01:35:50,759
Speaker 1: mean more filtering and bands and censorship of any opinion

1614
01:35:50,840 --> 01:35:53,639
Speaker 1: that is just not above board according to the party line.

1615
01:35:53,720 --> 01:35:56,080
Speaker 1: So it's something that we'll have to be quite vigilant about.

1616
01:35:56,120 --> 01:35:58,639
Speaker 1: We'll have to demand that our lawmakers are vigilant about

1617
01:35:58,640 --> 01:36:00,599
Speaker 1: it as well. And I know that you, Joe Bovard,

1618
01:36:00,760 --> 01:36:02,600
Speaker 1: will be on top of this and urge everyone to

1619
01:36:02,680 --> 01:36:04,519
Speaker 1: check out all of your writings wherever they're found in

1620
01:36:04,560 --> 01:36:08,599
Speaker 1: federal as USA Today, American Conservative, American conservative and beyond.

1621
01:36:08,920 --> 01:36:10,519
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming on the program today

1622
01:36:10,520 --> 01:36:12,920
Speaker 1: and for all your exceptional work. Really appreciate it. Thanks

1623
01:36:12,920 --> 01:36:15,639
Speaker 1: so much, Ben, Thanks and Wolf more on the buxx

1624
01:36:15,720 --> 01:36:29,519
Speaker 1: and show right after this on Sunday, June twentieth, Joe

1625
01:36:29,520 --> 01:36:33,000
Speaker 1: Biden will have been president for exactly five months. And

1626
01:36:33,120 --> 01:36:38,160
Speaker 1: in these five months, we've seen crisis after crisis after crisis.

1627
01:36:39,080 --> 01:36:42,559
Speaker 1: We've experienced a gas crisis where we had gas lines

1628
01:36:42,840 --> 01:36:46,559
Speaker 1: and skyrocketing energy prices. We're on the verge of an

1629
01:36:46,600 --> 01:36:52,080
Speaker 1: inflation crisis. We're everywhere we look, prices are rising on food,

1630
01:36:52,200 --> 01:36:56,120
Speaker 1: on housing, on lumber. We've already had a war in

1631
01:36:56,160 --> 01:37:00,160
Speaker 1: the Middle East, and we've got a border crisis that

1632
01:37:00,200 --> 01:37:03,760
Speaker 1: has been raging so intensely that we're on pace to

1633
01:37:03,920 --> 01:37:08,360
Speaker 1: see two million illegal immigrants come through our unsecured border

1634
01:37:08,439 --> 01:37:12,280
Speaker 1: this year. Just last month, one hundred and eighty thousand

1635
01:37:12,760 --> 01:37:17,479
Speaker 1: and thirty four illegal immigrants crossed the border. To put

1636
01:37:17,479 --> 01:37:20,880
Speaker 1: that in perspective, that number is a six hundred and

1637
01:37:21,080 --> 01:37:26,480
Speaker 1: seventy four percent increase over the number of illegal immigrants

1638
01:37:26,479 --> 01:37:30,880
Speaker 1: that crossed the border last May, a six hundred and

1639
01:37:31,040 --> 01:37:35,839
Speaker 1: seventy four percent increase, and that number is a twenty

1640
01:37:35,880 --> 01:37:39,920
Speaker 1: one year high. The reason for this is simple. The

1641
01:37:39,960 --> 01:37:45,240
Speaker 1: crisis that has unfolded is the direct result of political

1642
01:37:45,280 --> 01:37:50,519
Speaker 1: decisions made by Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. That was

1643
01:37:50,840 --> 01:37:55,960
Speaker 1: Senator Ted Cruz lambasting the Biden administration. And it goes

1644
01:37:56,000 --> 01:37:59,480
Speaker 1: back to the running theme that we open this episode

1645
01:37:59,479 --> 01:38:04,439
Speaker 1: with has run through the substance of the various interviews

1646
01:38:04,439 --> 01:38:09,000
Speaker 1: we've had on big tech, on the schools, on US

1647
01:38:09,120 --> 01:38:14,400
Speaker 1: China policy, dealing with Russia, energy, and on and on

1648
01:38:15,200 --> 01:38:19,920
Speaker 1: Ted Cruz talking about massive money printing and spending in

1649
01:38:19,960 --> 01:38:22,800
Speaker 1: effect in terms of the massive inflation and prices that

1650
01:38:22,800 --> 01:38:24,280
Speaker 1: we've seen, and if you look at a chart of

1651
01:38:24,320 --> 01:38:27,439
Speaker 1: the money supply, it's absurd. What's happened over the last year,

1652
01:38:28,400 --> 01:38:31,720
Speaker 1: the explosion in the Middle East with respect to I

1653
01:38:31,840 --> 01:38:38,320
Speaker 1: ran back, to proxies attacking Israel, the border crisis. What

1654
01:38:38,640 --> 01:38:44,559
Speaker 1: unifies these policies or these outcomes? Rather, these outcomes are

1655
01:38:44,600 --> 01:38:52,559
Speaker 1: a direct consequence of rejecting basic, fundamental, core American values

1656
01:38:52,560 --> 01:38:59,360
Speaker 1: and principles. If you reject those values and principles, you

1657
01:38:59,400 --> 01:39:05,160
Speaker 1: get these kind of results. You cultivate mediocrity. Massive money

1658
01:39:05,160 --> 01:39:09,360
Speaker 1: printing and spending. What is that a reflection of, beyond

1659
01:39:09,800 --> 01:39:14,120
Speaker 1: the self imposed economic suicide that we committed over the

1660
01:39:14,200 --> 01:39:20,920
Speaker 1: last year, arguably needlessly not wanting to deal with reality.

1661
01:39:21,560 --> 01:39:24,400
Speaker 1: Money printing is done to paper over problems and to

1662
01:39:24,479 --> 01:39:27,240
Speaker 1: kick the can down the road on dealing with those problems.

1663
01:39:27,280 --> 01:39:29,720
Speaker 1: The massive spending is about a government that can't live

1664
01:39:29,800 --> 01:39:34,440
Speaker 1: within its means, and it's a reflection of a percentage

1665
01:39:34,439 --> 01:39:36,439
Speaker 1: of the public that believes we shouldn't live within it

1666
01:39:36,600 --> 01:39:39,360
Speaker 1: within our means as a nation that does not, I

1667
01:39:39,400 --> 01:39:42,760
Speaker 1: guess care about the consequences ultimately of massive debt and

1668
01:39:42,800 --> 01:39:44,880
Speaker 1: the interest on that debt and the money printing that's

1669
01:39:44,880 --> 01:39:47,200
Speaker 1: going to be used to try to inflate it away,

1670
01:39:47,280 --> 01:39:50,720
Speaker 1: so that of course prudent people and then of course

1671
01:39:50,720 --> 01:39:53,400
Speaker 1: those who are unfixed income are left with the bill.

1672
01:39:55,120 --> 01:40:01,000
Speaker 1: It's irresponsibility that's inherent to the massive money renting and

1673
01:40:01,120 --> 01:40:04,160
Speaker 1: spending on a government that can't even do, can't even

1674
01:40:04,160 --> 01:40:06,800
Speaker 1: execute its most basic functions, but it sure as heck

1675
01:40:06,880 --> 01:40:10,080
Speaker 1: weaponizes itself against anyone who dares call the government on

1676
01:40:10,120 --> 01:40:14,120
Speaker 1: those issues. What about the explosion in the Middle East.

1677
01:40:15,360 --> 01:40:18,240
Speaker 1: I've done a big monologue on this, which you can google.

1678
01:40:18,280 --> 01:40:21,240
Speaker 1: It's on YouTube and elsewhere, I believe as well. On

1679
01:40:21,520 --> 01:40:25,200
Speaker 1: the method to the Biden Administration's Middle East madness, the

1680
01:40:25,240 --> 01:40:29,719
Speaker 1: Biden administration basically reversed the Trump administration policy with respect

1681
01:40:29,720 --> 01:40:34,040
Speaker 1: to the world's greatest state sponsor of jihad, Iran. Biden

1682
01:40:34,160 --> 01:40:38,680
Speaker 1: reverts America's back. Biden reverts the Obama Biden agenda of

1683
01:40:38,840 --> 01:40:41,479
Speaker 1: seeking to make the world's leading state sponsor of jihad,

1684
01:40:41,640 --> 01:40:43,800
Speaker 1: the strong course in the Middle East, the dominant power.

1685
01:40:45,240 --> 01:40:48,040
Speaker 1: What does Joe Biden do? It basically says, without preconditions,

1686
01:40:48,040 --> 01:40:50,240
Speaker 1: we're going to go back to the so called negotiating

1687
01:40:50,280 --> 01:40:52,360
Speaker 1: table and we want to get back into the Iran

1688
01:40:52,439 --> 01:40:56,680
Speaker 1: nuclear deal, which made that regime flush with well over

1689
01:40:56,720 --> 01:40:59,800
Speaker 1: one hundred billion dollars in cash to fund its malign

1690
01:41:00,400 --> 01:41:04,720
Speaker 1: while it's people suffered. What is it rooted in? What

1691
01:41:04,840 --> 01:41:07,800
Speaker 1: is the policy rooted in of the Biden administration of appeasement,

1692
01:41:09,360 --> 01:41:15,719
Speaker 1: cowardice or self loathing, both traits that, of course result

1693
01:41:16,560 --> 01:41:20,880
Speaker 1: in mediocrity, in failure the border crisis. What is the

1694
01:41:20,920 --> 01:41:26,400
Speaker 1: border crisis all about? It's not just an unwillingness to

1695
01:41:26,560 --> 01:41:31,280
Speaker 1: defend sovereignty. Again, one of the most basic duties that

1696
01:41:31,360 --> 01:41:36,400
Speaker 1: are purported. Representatives are charged with ensuring, protecting, defending. You know, obviously,

1697
01:41:36,880 --> 01:41:39,599
Speaker 1: as the Vice president Trump said any number of times,

1698
01:41:39,720 --> 01:41:41,400
Speaker 1: if you don't have borders, you don't have a country.

1699
01:41:41,680 --> 01:41:49,800
Speaker 1: So basic, so core should transcend ideology and politics. But

1700
01:41:49,920 --> 01:41:55,960
Speaker 1: it doesn't. Why Well, of course, the Biden administration advertised

1701
01:41:55,960 --> 01:42:02,519
Speaker 1: open borders well before its election. What is that open

1702
01:42:02,560 --> 01:42:05,240
Speaker 1: borders policy rooted in? Well, the true believers, of course,

1703
01:42:05,280 --> 01:42:08,639
Speaker 1: will say, I guess that sovereignty is racist and bigod

1704
01:42:08,720 --> 01:42:10,960
Speaker 1: and that everyone should be able to come in, and

1705
01:42:11,240 --> 01:42:16,160
Speaker 1: that our laws are essentially optional. And some of them

1706
01:42:16,400 --> 01:42:20,760
Speaker 1: call ice a tyrannical terrorist like entity and want to

1707
01:42:20,760 --> 01:42:26,840
Speaker 1: abolish it. Think about that those tests with ensuring our

1708
01:42:26,920 --> 01:42:30,439
Speaker 1: sovereignty are the bad guys, not the people whose first

1709
01:42:30,479 --> 01:42:33,040
Speaker 1: act if they step foot in the country is breaking

1710
01:42:33,040 --> 01:42:37,200
Speaker 1: our laws and violating our sovereignty and spitting in the

1711
01:42:37,200 --> 01:42:42,560
Speaker 1: face of our people. The cynical aspect, of course of

1712
01:42:42,640 --> 01:42:45,719
Speaker 1: the border crisis is never let a crisis go to waste.

1713
01:42:45,760 --> 01:42:49,120
Speaker 1: In fact, create a crisis which you can ultimately use

1714
01:42:49,240 --> 01:42:52,040
Speaker 1: to leverage for political power. And as I've talked about

1715
01:42:52,040 --> 01:42:56,240
Speaker 1: before guest hosting this show, even just having illegal aliens

1716
01:42:56,240 --> 01:42:58,920
Speaker 1: in the country, even if they're not mass amnestied, and

1717
01:42:59,479 --> 01:43:03,000
Speaker 1: thus a major voting voc for the people supporting the amnesty,

1718
01:43:03,240 --> 01:43:08,640
Speaker 1: namely Democrats. Population numbers matter. Population numbers are counted in

1719
01:43:08,680 --> 01:43:12,160
Speaker 1: the census, even illegal aliens, and that leads to direct

1720
01:43:12,439 --> 01:43:16,200
Speaker 1: increased representation for those areas with large illegal alien populations

1721
01:43:16,200 --> 01:43:20,000
Speaker 1: and billions of dollars being allocated to those areas as well.

1722
01:43:21,400 --> 01:43:25,320
Speaker 1: So how does this tie into again, cultivating mediocrity or failure? Well,

1723
01:43:25,320 --> 01:43:27,600
Speaker 1: when you reject an American value and principle, when you

1724
01:43:27,640 --> 01:43:30,519
Speaker 1: reject a principle of any nation that wants to survive

1725
01:43:30,640 --> 01:43:33,679
Speaker 1: on this earth of sovereignty and respect for the rule

1726
01:43:33,760 --> 01:43:41,000
Speaker 1: of law, you get failure and disaster. Once again, if

1727
01:43:41,000 --> 01:43:44,439
Speaker 1: you reject, you repudiate American values and principles, you are

1728
01:43:44,479 --> 01:43:52,480
Speaker 1: actively cultivating not just mediocrity, but failure. Excellent countries, serious countries,

1729
01:43:53,479 --> 01:43:59,679
Speaker 1: are frugal, they're responsible, they treat the laws with respect,

1730
01:43:59,760 --> 01:44:05,880
Speaker 1: and they make the laws respectable. Their leaders don't lord

1731
01:44:06,000 --> 01:44:08,519
Speaker 1: over the people, and they don't hold themselves to a

1732
01:44:08,560 --> 01:44:10,680
Speaker 1: separate standard from everyone else. We're not supposed to have

1733
01:44:10,720 --> 01:44:12,679
Speaker 1: a class system in this country, but the ruling quass

1734
01:44:12,720 --> 01:44:16,360
Speaker 1: shore has created one and seeks to do everything it

1735
01:44:16,439 --> 01:44:21,120
Speaker 1: can to insulate itself cement its position. And of course,

1736
01:44:21,120 --> 01:44:24,840
Speaker 1: when you cement essentially a monopoly power, of course it

1737
01:44:24,880 --> 01:44:31,120
Speaker 1: becomes deconent and decayed and mediocre and fails. Ultimately, our

1738
01:44:31,200 --> 01:44:35,679
Speaker 1: ruling class is a failure. And again, seventy four million

1739
01:44:35,720 --> 01:44:39,760
Speaker 1: plus people voted against that failed ruling class last time.

1740
01:44:39,800 --> 01:44:43,479
Speaker 1: And that is why the effort is being pursued right now,

1741
01:44:43,520 --> 01:44:45,919
Speaker 1: as we talked about in this episode and past episodes

1742
01:44:45,960 --> 01:44:50,320
Speaker 1: as well, to target smere chill, censor, and potentially use

1743
01:44:50,400 --> 01:44:52,479
Speaker 1: the full force not just of the government but all

1744
01:44:52,520 --> 01:44:57,600
Speaker 1: of society to try to scare into submission. The population

1745
01:44:57,920 --> 01:45:01,720
Speaker 1: that sees through it, all sees through the gas, understands

1746
01:45:01,720 --> 01:45:05,559
Speaker 1: when they're being propagandized too, and lord it over and

1747
01:45:05,720 --> 01:45:08,439
Speaker 1: cause the failure out for what it is. And that's

1748
01:45:08,479 --> 01:45:10,639
Speaker 1: why they have to go so hard at anyone who

1749
01:45:10,760 --> 01:45:14,080
Speaker 1: dares break from the narrative. Akin to the Chinese Communist Party,

1750
01:45:14,400 --> 01:45:21,919
Speaker 1: cannot allow dissenting viewpoints, cannot allow alternative narratives, cannot account

1751
01:45:21,920 --> 01:45:26,640
Speaker 1: for facts that would dare threaten the hollow facade of

1752
01:45:26,760 --> 01:45:31,439
Speaker 1: legitimacy that a rolling class has. And earlier in the week,

1753
01:45:31,479 --> 01:45:34,240
Speaker 1: by the way, we talked about just a brief side note,

1754
01:45:34,280 --> 01:45:36,320
Speaker 1: we talked about what was going on in Georgia with

1755
01:45:36,400 --> 01:45:39,759
Speaker 1: this audit on topic you are forbidden to talk about.

1756
01:45:39,800 --> 01:45:42,759
Speaker 1: And you'll probably find many people being censored on social

1757
01:45:42,760 --> 01:45:44,960
Speaker 1: media as they continue to follow what's going on in Georgia.

1758
01:45:45,040 --> 01:45:47,439
Speaker 1: And wait on Arizona, and we'll actually talk to a

1759
01:45:47,520 --> 01:45:52,320
Speaker 1: legislator from Arizona who's been instrumental in pushing forth the

1760
01:45:52,360 --> 01:45:54,320
Speaker 1: audit that's going on there. We'll talk to him about

1761
01:45:54,360 --> 01:45:59,160
Speaker 1: what's going on there. Just the news reported today Georgia

1762
01:45:59,200 --> 01:46:03,479
Speaker 1: audit document expose significant election failures in state's largest County.

1763
01:46:03,520 --> 01:46:06,679
Speaker 1: Of course, Fulton County records suggest more than one hundred

1764
01:46:06,680 --> 01:46:09,880
Speaker 1: batches of absentee ballots in Fulton County could be missing.

1765
01:46:10,760 --> 01:46:12,639
Speaker 1: One hundred batches. In each of those batches, I believe

1766
01:46:12,720 --> 01:46:15,160
Speaker 1: may have at least one hundred ballots. Some experts see

1767
01:46:15,200 --> 01:46:18,720
Speaker 1: quote unquote election tabulation malpractice as state officials seek to

1768
01:46:18,760 --> 01:46:23,600
Speaker 1: remove county's top election supervisors, and I'd urge you to

1769
01:46:23,680 --> 01:46:27,320
Speaker 1: check out this article to see what's going on there. Basically,

1770
01:46:27,360 --> 01:46:30,719
Speaker 1: some of the administrators there argue that you really can't

1771
01:46:30,800 --> 01:46:35,879
Speaker 1: have confidence in the results because what they're auditing itself

1772
01:46:36,000 --> 01:46:40,000
Speaker 1: is an incomplete data set. As this official says, an

1773
01:46:40,000 --> 01:46:42,439
Speaker 1: audit is only good as good as the data that's input.

1774
01:46:42,479 --> 01:46:45,120
Speaker 1: And in this case, Fulton Counties records are so problematic,

1775
01:46:45,200 --> 01:46:47,720
Speaker 1: I'm not sure a reasonable person can trust them. When

1776
01:46:47,760 --> 01:46:50,200
Speaker 1: you add in the reports of ballots magically appearing under

1777
01:46:50,200 --> 01:46:53,400
Speaker 1: tables or being moved out of the counting center, they're legitimate,

1778
01:46:53,439 --> 01:46:58,200
Speaker 1: outstanding questions. You want to ensure that a country is

1779
01:46:58,240 --> 01:47:02,719
Speaker 1: not only mediocre, but fails erode the consent of the governed,

1780
01:47:03,960 --> 01:47:07,000
Speaker 1: destroy the integrity of elections, make it so that no

1781
01:47:07,000 --> 01:47:12,040
Speaker 1: one can trust that they're adequately represented by their purported leaders.

1782
01:47:12,960 --> 01:47:16,719
Speaker 1: The running theme ought to be overturning this ruling class

1783
01:47:16,880 --> 01:47:19,160
Speaker 1: or making it live up to the standards that we

1784
01:47:19,280 --> 01:47:22,439
Speaker 1: all love and believe in, and that's how we cultivate

1785
01:47:22,479 --> 01:47:27,479
Speaker 1: excellence instead of mediocrity and failure. There has been Ben

1786
01:47:27,479 --> 01:47:30,160
Speaker 1: Weingarten in for Buck Sexon on The Buck Sexton Show,

1787
01:47:30,280 --> 01:47:33,000
Speaker 1: and we'll close out the week tomorrow. Have a great evident.

1788
01:47:34,320 --> 01:47:39,000
Speaker 1: This is the Buck Sexton Show podcast. Follow Buck on Facebook,

1789
01:47:39,120 --> 01:47:40,599
Speaker 1: Instagram and Twitter.