Speaker 1: My name is Eva Longoria and I am Ma de
Speaker 1: Gomez Racon and welcome to Hungry for History.
Speaker 2: A podcast that explores our past and present through food.
Speaker 1: On every episode, we'll talk about the history of some
Speaker 1: of our favorite dishes, ingredients, and beverages from our culture.
Speaker 2: So make yourself at home. Ewhen we are halfway through
Speaker 2: the season, and the great thing about doing this show
Speaker 2: is the more we dig into the history of food,
Speaker 2: the more we learn about how layered all the influences
Speaker 2: are and how all countries are intertwined.
Speaker 3: Today we're not just covering a dish. We're talking about
Speaker 3: the Chinese contribution to Mexican and American history through the
Speaker 3: food lens. Of course, we've learned that when people plant
Speaker 3: their flag in a new country, they do it first
Speaker 3: through food. This is how they preserve their family memories
Speaker 3: and how they make a new place feel like home.
Speaker 2: So today we are taking you from China to San
Speaker 2: Francisco to Mexicali.
Speaker 4: In rods because it's a lot generally generally speaking, yeah no,
Speaker 4: but I feel like the history of Chinese and Mexico
Speaker 4: is so significant and so unknown.
Speaker 2: There were a few waves beginning obviously in the colonial period,
Speaker 2: and a larger wave like sixty thousand arrived at the
Speaker 2: end of the nineteenth century beginning of the twentieth century,
Speaker 2: fleeing you know, obviously poverty and hardships in southern China's
Speaker 2: Cantone region. But today so many young Chinese Mexicans are
Speaker 2: searching for their roots and kind of reclaiming their history.
Speaker 2: And so I don't think a lot of people know this,
Speaker 2: but there's like seventy thousand Chinese living in Mexico, mainly
Speaker 2: in La Chinesca in Mexicali and in the Barriochino in
Speaker 2: Mexico City.
Speaker 3: There is in Mexicali in Baja was Chinese before it
Speaker 3: was Mexican, which is so interesting. It's a city of
Speaker 3: about one million, ninety miles south of San Diego, and
Speaker 3: it's hated. Was nineteen twenty to nineteen thirty three Chinese
Speaker 3: first came to Mexicali run nineteen hundred. Most of them
Speaker 3: were brought over from China by the Colorado River Company
Speaker 3: to work on railroad and irrigation construction. And this was
Speaker 3: this partnership between the US and Mexican government. So anyhow,
Speaker 3: by nineteen twenty there were more Chinese in the region
Speaker 3: than Mexicans, and both communities were part of a workforce
Speaker 3: that took care of cotton fields, so many were farmers.
Speaker 3: They opened up canals for the introgrationion of water, and
Speaker 3: some of them started opening up businesses such as grocery stores,
Speaker 3: clothing stores, butcher shops, and of course restaurants and bars,
Speaker 3: and so they were it's so interesting. They were the
Speaker 3: first to open up laundromats, establishing this concept of the bilogne.
Speaker 3: And I always do you know this, this concept of
Speaker 3: the bilan the few extra, like if you'll you know,
Speaker 3: you'll buy cookies or something, and then they'll give you
Speaker 3: a bilon the extra, the free extra, and it was
Speaker 3: sort of this incentive for customers to come back for more.
Speaker 3: Chinese immargrants are considered pioneers and Mexicali's social, economic and
Speaker 3: cultural development right. So Ginesca, I've never been, but I'm
Speaker 3: dying to go. And it's not too far from us.
Speaker 3: It's the largest Chinese enclave in Mexico. And if you
Speaker 3: ask people in Mexicali what their most notable regional cuisine is,
Speaker 3: they won't say that goes. They'll say Chinese food. They're
Speaker 3: over three hundred Chinese restaurants in the city.
Speaker 2: And then what's bancino? Are they pandulcee.
Speaker 3: Bancinos are bandulces that are sort of like conchas and biscuits,
Speaker 3: and but they're denser and more moist and they're steamed
Speaker 3: and then they're baked. This is something that we see
Speaker 3: a lot in Mexico City. There's a lot of these
Speaker 3: cafes chinos, and even Cossafina velasque ze Leon, who we've
Speaker 3: talked about before. She has a whole book on pancino.
Speaker 3: They may have learned this type of pastry working in
Speaker 3: the railroads in the nineteenth century or working for French
Speaker 3: or English families, and so it's basically steamed then baked
Speaker 3: van dulces.
Speaker 2: Oh, well, I know that hole Sepina Velaskaz de Leon.
Speaker 2: We've talked about her on the podcast. She wrote a
Speaker 2: book only about foncino, or she mentioned fancino in a book.
Speaker 3: Only about flancino. She wrote a whole book on how
Speaker 3: to make blancino. I haven't tried making it because it's
Speaker 3: pretty complicated, but I need to check it out. I
Speaker 3: need to try it.
Speaker 2: Well. After the break, we'll take you back to the beginning.
Speaker 3: And explore Chinese immigration in Mexico and the US.
Speaker 2: Look, I feel like the Chinese influence in Mexico is
Speaker 2: important and is historic, and I don't think a lot
Speaker 2: of people know about it, and especially the Chinese influence
Speaker 2: obviously in the United States, but you know, in Mexico.
Speaker 2: I guess it began roughly about four hundred fifty years
Speaker 2: ago when Spanish trading ships like the Manila galleons, they
Speaker 2: brought fine silk and porcelain and tea and all these
Speaker 2: Eastern goods to the western coast of Mexico, mainly in
Speaker 2: exchange for silver. And so these trade links have long
Speaker 2: been established between Spanish and Chinese merchants.
Speaker 3: The Spanish had their base of operations in Manila where
Speaker 3: their goods would be unloaded and sent to Mexico from
Speaker 3: these ships sailed twice a year a Kapuico and we're
Speaker 3: distributed mainly to wealthy Spaniards. We've talked about these.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we talked about this in another episode.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, And the first Chinese to arrive in
Speaker 3: Mexico were actually servants of Spanish merchants after they paid
Speaker 3: their dues. If they decided to stay in Mexico. Many
Speaker 3: became tradesmen, barbers, and shopkeepers, and they started to build
Speaker 3: networks with other Chinese. And so the ones that arrived
Speaker 3: first became the wealthiest. And these networks grew and they
Speaker 3: were able to climb up the ladder and others followed.
Speaker 3: So the ones that arrived first served as a support network,
Speaker 3: helping others back home. So it became a very tight
Speaker 3: knit community. It was tight ennit for many, many centuries,
Speaker 3: and this sort of tight knitness eventually was seen as
Speaker 3: a threat. So but you know, all immigrants communities really
Speaker 3: are tight and they're drawn to each other for support.
Speaker 3: But as the centuries progress, this community was seen as
Speaker 3: a threat. They were very industrious, they were hard working.
Speaker 3: They were neither rich nor poor, and they eventually would
Speaker 3: become a middleman between the rich and the poor. So
Speaker 3: eventually they became really the only middle class in Mexico.
Speaker 3: So yeah, it is really really quite interesting. They lived
Speaker 3: in their own communities and which became chinatowns, right or
Speaker 3: barrio chinos.
Speaker 2: I feel like the most iconic chinatown though, is in
Speaker 2: San Francisco, don't you think absolutely?
Speaker 3: It's a beautiful Let's go to California before we come
Speaker 3: back to America. Let's go to California.
Speaker 2: Okay, So China to San Francisco. Was that because of
Speaker 2: the gold rush?
Speaker 3: It is it started in the gold rush. So it
Speaker 3: started in Mexico, way way, way earlier. California became part
Speaker 3: of the US in eighteen forty eight, and then around
Speaker 3: this time over two million Chinese immigrated internationally as part
Speaker 3: of this global diaspora, and they were fleeing civil unrest
Speaker 3: and violence, silver, population, poverty. There were opium wars, there
Speaker 3: was floods, famine, just political instability sort of generally. So
Speaker 3: you know, they were fleeing for a better life. And
Speaker 3: so this coincides with gold being found in San Francisco
Speaker 3: and so drawn by the silure of gold and employment
Speaker 3: opportunities in the railroad construction and of course in mining.
Speaker 3: We see about three hundred thousand Cantonese immigrants come to
Speaker 3: the US between eighteen forty eighty and eighteen eighty two,
Speaker 3: and most of them were from the same.
Speaker 2: Region than this little region. But you know what region.
Speaker 2: What's crazy. Even though we abolished slavery in eighteen sixty five, well,
Speaker 2: because we abolished slavery in eighteen sixty five, there was
Speaker 2: a high demand for Chinese labor because wherever these Chinese
Speaker 2: immigrants went, they were preyed upon. And I think ninety
Speaker 2: percent of the workers that built the Central Pacific Railroad
Speaker 2: were Chinese, and they received fifty percent less pay than
Speaker 2: whites for the same job. The Chinese held an eight
Speaker 2: day strike in eighteen sixty seven to demand equal wages,
Speaker 2: and they used their collective strength and they did scare
Speaker 2: the company leaders. But at first they were they were
Speaker 2: deemed two week for this dangerous, strenuous job for the
Speaker 2: railroad work. But the director at the time of the
Speaker 2: Central Pacific Railroad, I think his name was Charles Crocker,
Speaker 2: recommended hiring them after a job posting that resulted in
Speaker 2: only a few hundred responses from white laborers. So white
Speaker 2: people did not want to build these railroads, and so
Speaker 2: they had to look to a different talent pool. And
Speaker 2: then there was this court case in eighteen fifty four
Speaker 2: that ruled that Chinese, like Black Americans, like Native Americans,
Speaker 2: they weren't allowed to testify in court, and so it
Speaker 2: really made it impossible for these Chinese immigrants to seek
Speaker 2: justice against the you know, the people who ran the
Speaker 2: railroads to get equal pay against the violence that was
Speaker 2: a you know, that was mounted against them. And so
Speaker 2: this case People versus Hall in eighteen fifty four, which
Speaker 2: was a California Supreme Court case, it made it legal
Speaker 2: for people to bash Chinese people and get away with it.
Speaker 2: It's crazy.
Speaker 3: It's horrible, horrible, horrible. And then we see the Chinese
Speaker 3: Exclusion Act in eighteen eighty two, so just a couple
Speaker 3: of decades later, meant to curb the influx of Chinese
Speaker 3: immigrants to the US, particularly to California. So it suspended
Speaker 3: Chinese immigration for ten years and required Chinese people traveling
Speaker 3: in or out of the US to carry a certificate
Speaker 3: identifying his or her status, whether it's the labor or scholar, diplomat, merchant.
Speaker 3: On the other coast, right in New York, Ellis Island
Speaker 3: opened around this same time, and many still arrived.
Speaker 2: But the crazy thing about that, what you just said,
Speaker 2: is like we needed them, and yet we were like,
Speaker 2: don't come. You know, it's so crazy how history repeats itself.
Speaker 2: And I feel like that's still the case now. You know,
Speaker 2: we need There are a lot of industries dependent upon
Speaker 2: immigrant labor today, agriculture, manufacturing, you know, the jobs that
Speaker 2: a lot of people don't want, and immigrant labor always
Speaker 2: fills those jobs. So the fact that this, you know,
Speaker 2: historically happens like there's like an influx of immigrants and
Speaker 2: then there's fear mongering and xenophobia and then we're like
Speaker 2: go home, and then it's just like this push and
Speaker 2: pool that does not make our borders pores like they
Speaker 2: should be.
Speaker 3: You know, history keeps repeating itself, right, And this law
Speaker 3: was this Chinese Exclusion Act was the first restricting immigration
Speaker 3: into the US, and so many Americans on the West
Speaker 3: Coast attributed to declining wages and economic ills to Chinese workers,
Speaker 3: even though they only composed of point zero zero two
Speaker 3: percent of the nation's population, right, so nothing and Congress
Speaker 3: passed an act to playcate workers demand and calm concerns
Speaker 3: about maintaining white racial purity. These are the words that
Speaker 3: they used. And so tens of thousands went to Cuba,
Speaker 3: South America, to Mexico. Instead, many settled along the US
Speaker 3: Mexican border, becoming grocers and merchants and restaurant owners. But
Speaker 3: you know, many stayed in San Francisco, you know, not
Speaker 3: everybody could could leave, you know, going back to San Francisco.
Speaker 2: Specifically, like when when Chinatown was founded, it was called
Speaker 2: Little Kenton because that's lead the community of where they
Speaker 2: were coming from, and it was you know, port of
Speaker 2: entry for all these Chinese immigrants, and a lot of
Speaker 2: them obviously opened up restaurants and they were called chou
Speaker 2: chow houses. And you know, the American restaurant system, I think,
Speaker 2: especially in San Francisco, was so underdeveloped, and these Chinese
Speaker 2: immigrant restaurant tours kind of knew what they were doing,
Speaker 2: and so they offered, you know, cheap prices hospitality to
Speaker 2: poor American All these people were coming to San Francisco
Speaker 2: in this moment, did not have money, they were looking
Speaker 2: to make money, and so you know, it was they
Speaker 2: offered kind of a better restaurant experience. And so when
Speaker 2: the when the gold rush ended, then these restaurants were
Speaker 2: mostly frequented by Chinese patrons and obviously they served like
Speaker 2: traditional Chinese dishes, salted fish, salted duck feet, fish heads,
Speaker 2: and then it just kind of became this place where
Speaker 2: the old country lives inside a new one and it's
Speaker 2: well together. And so for me, it was it's like,
Speaker 2: I love to learn the his This is why we
Speaker 2: do this podcast. I love knowing where things began. And
Speaker 2: then you go, well, it kind of began here, No
Speaker 2: it didn't really. I mean it's so cyclical, it is
Speaker 2: so evolutional, like it's still evolving, and so it's so
Speaker 2: fun to discover all of these new things.
Speaker 3: Totally and it's so fun to discover Oh, this was
Speaker 3: happening in San Francisco. Oh this was happening in Mexico
Speaker 3: right at the same time. And it's just how everything
Speaker 3: is so intertwined. So in nineteen o six, there was
Speaker 3: a huge earthquake and fire that devastated San Francisco. So
Speaker 3: the city government they were like, oh great, this is
Speaker 3: the time to get the Chinese out, the Chinese residents.
Speaker 3: They wanted to move them out of San Francisco proper,
Speaker 3: moved them closer to you know, Oakland. But then they
Speaker 3: were like, oh, wait a minute. They were a vital
Speaker 3: part of the city's economy. We need them, we need
Speaker 3: their taxes, we need them to rebuild. So this is
Speaker 3: not to say that the racism didn't exist still, but
Speaker 3: they let them rebuild because they needed their taxes. Because
Speaker 3: it became this tourist attraction eventually, and today San Francisco's
Speaker 3: Chinatown is one of the city's most popular attractions. It
Speaker 3: is the backbone of the city.
Speaker 2: And I remember the first time I went to San Francisco,
Speaker 2: I was like, how we have to visit China. Debt
Speaker 2: like it was one of the reasons I went, Yeah,
Speaker 2: me too.
Speaker 3: It's the first time I had dinsum was in San
Speaker 3: Francis China that really.
Speaker 2: Need to know. It was all like eye opening, like
Speaker 2: I've eaten this bond now I feel part of the community.
Speaker 3: I know, I had never even heard of it before.
Speaker 3: I was in San Francisco Chinatown. I was like, what
Speaker 3: is this? The little carts and I'm like, this is perfection.
Speaker 3: This is so interesting. It's like I want to know more.
Speaker 3: I want to know more. My experience with Chinese food
Speaker 3: was China Bow and Laredo. That was just you know,
Speaker 3: egg rolls and orange chicken. This is American, you know
Speaker 3: Chinese food.
Speaker 2: Egg Rolls were a big part of my childhood. Don't
Speaker 2: go anywhere. When we come back with diving into the
Speaker 2: fusion between Mexican and Chinese.
Speaker 3: Cuisines, we turn our eyes back on Mexico when we
Speaker 3: come back. So the border I don't know this.
Speaker 2: I don't know this.
Speaker 3: Sorry, go ahead, go ahead, Sorry, it's all connected. The
Speaker 3: border patrol was created to keep Chinese immigrants from entering
Speaker 3: the US. At the same time, the Mexican government welcomed
Speaker 3: Chinese immigrants to populate northern Mexico to work on farms
Speaker 3: and in mines and canals.
Speaker 2: All right. So while the Chinese Exclusion Act was happening
Speaker 2: in the US, it was the Portfrio in Mexico.
Speaker 3: The Portfridiato. So just briefly, the Portfidiato era was this
Speaker 3: period of about thirty years when Portfridio Dias, he was
Speaker 3: from Wajatka. He was a Francophile, and he opened the
Speaker 3: door to foreign investment. So this is when we see
Speaker 3: a lot of French moving into into Mexico and open
Speaker 3: Americans and just opening up businesses. We see this beautiful
Speaker 3: construction like ve Jasarts and all of these very beautiful
Speaker 3: sort of buildings, but we see a very small percentage
Speaker 3: of people getting very very very very rich, and then
Speaker 3: we have most of the population is very very very
Speaker 3: very poor, and eventually we have the Mexican Revolution. Porfiias
Speaker 3: fled and is buried in Paris. During the Portfidiato, the
Speaker 3: Mexican government was trying to modernize the country and Mexico
Speaker 3: became seen as this land of opportunity. One of his
Speaker 3: programs called for Europeans to work and populate the north.
Speaker 3: He was especially interested in building railway roads. But Mexico
Speaker 3: couldn't attract enough European immigrants to the north, same thing
Speaker 3: that happened here. So they decided to allow Chinese migrant workers.
Speaker 3: So this coincided with the Chinese Exclusion Act, so they
Speaker 3: began leaving the US coming into Mexico. When the AS
Speaker 3: granted permission to the Colorado River Land Company in the US,
Speaker 3: it was it was an LA owned company to build
Speaker 3: a canal in the Imperial Valley. So the plan was
Speaker 3: to connect the region's dry basin to the Colorado River
Speaker 3: for agricultural irrigation. Right, So we see Chinese coming, you know,
Speaker 3: into Mexico, which is eventually why we have so many
Speaker 3: Chinese in MEXICALI.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Also a lot of the a lot of
Speaker 2: the Chinese men that came married Mexican women.
Speaker 3: They did, yes, they married Mexican women. And they weren't
Speaker 3: supposed to stay own communities or mixed with the Mexican population.
Speaker 3: They were supposed to eventually return to China, And at
Speaker 3: first both Chinese were in the north. By the earliest
Speaker 3: twenty century, where there were in all parts of the
Speaker 3: country including Mexico City, Tampico, Mas Atlanta, Manzanillo. So there
Speaker 3: were about ninety eight percent men between the ages of
Speaker 3: fifteen and twenty nine. You know, they weren't supposed to
Speaker 3: build their communities or they weren't supposed to stay. But like,
Speaker 3: asking them to return to China is like okay, wait,
Speaker 3: you're you're asking me to come and do all the
Speaker 3: work and then and then go back, Like what what
Speaker 3: is this? You know, this is horrible. But they, you know,
Speaker 3: went from laborers to merchants. They started their own businesses
Speaker 3: and by the time of the Mexican Revolution they had
Speaker 3: created this sort of middle class. And at the time
Speaker 3: the Mexican society was divided into rich and poor. Chinese
Speaker 3: were the middleman. They had a strong work ethic, they
Speaker 3: lived frugally, they gained business mone knowledge, they had these
Speaker 3: really strong social networks. They had adopted Mexican names, some
Speaker 3: of them learned Spanish. Most of them married Mexican women,
Speaker 3: and during the Mexican Revolution there was this desire to
Speaker 3: mexicanize the country and a lot of Mexicans resented them.
Speaker 3: They resented their hard earned economic success and were treated
Speaker 3: in Mexico as they had been in California in the
Speaker 3: second half of the nineteenth century. So, you know, they
Speaker 3: were initially welcomed into these unpopular areas which heated, she
Speaker 3: played her labor, and then they were resented and accused
Speaker 3: of competing unfairly for jobs.
Speaker 2: So ingredients like soy sauce, they're a big part of
Speaker 2: Mexican culture today. You know, we have Maggie, which is
Speaker 2: like an evolution of probably this original soy sauce that
Speaker 2: has become a staple in our diets. And because I
Speaker 2: think a lot of ingredients became a staple in Sinaloa
Speaker 2: because the port was on the trade route from Asia
Speaker 2: to the Philippines to Mexico, like we talked about, and
Speaker 2: those that influence can still be filt in those dishes
Speaker 2: like piscato zaran, the yabo how do you say that
Speaker 2: that on the yadow sarandioso. Yeah, and that's a sin
Speaker 2: a classic and then tacos and egg rolls are basically
Speaker 2: the same thing, right.
Speaker 3: Basically, and banadas.
Speaker 2: And bananas dumpling, Taco egg rolls and banadas dumplings, Ramen,
Speaker 2: which we just talked about in our Food in a
Speaker 2: Cup episode, avocado and Chriso on fried rice always with
Speaker 2: lime on the side. Like there's so much fusion with
Speaker 2: you know, both cultures are pretty large and diverse. I mean,
Speaker 2: if you look at China, it's very diverse. I mean
Speaker 2: the food in the north and East and wet it's
Speaker 2: all very just like Mexico, they're very large, diverse cultures
Speaker 2: with ancient histories. Everything revolves around family, like Mexico and Chile,
Speaker 2: like Chile's imported to China and the seventeen hundreds were
Speaker 2: popularized in the eighteen hundreds obviously in Sheshwan food sarata,
Speaker 2: I mean you can't eat Chinese food without having some
Speaker 2: spicy sauce on the side. Insects are popular in both countries.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's so many similarities, you know, so many. So Tomoi.
Speaker 3: We talked about Tamoi in our in our Candy episode
Speaker 3: last season, But that's a snack that that that's something
Speaker 3: that came also from the Chinese. So there's so many
Speaker 3: things in our in our cuisine that is that is
Speaker 3: influenced by by Chinese food.
Speaker 2: I for one, am so so happy about the Chinese
Speaker 2: influence in Mexican food. We have a lot of similarities,
Speaker 2: but at the same time, like we both both of
Speaker 2: our cuisines compliment each other. I think in a way
Speaker 2: more in a way than any other culture. And I
Speaker 2: don't know if it's because I'm I'm I, you know,
Speaker 2: live here in Mexico and I feel the influence, but
Speaker 2: I definitely I have a great appreciation for this particular
Speaker 2: melding of cultures. Thanks for listening and see you guys
Speaker 2: next week.
Speaker 3: If you have any dishes or foods that you want
Speaker 3: to hear about, leave us a message. We love hearing
Speaker 3: from you all.
Speaker 2: Bye. Hungary for History is a Hyphene media production in
Speaker 2: partnership with Iheart's Michael Tura podcast network.
Speaker 1: For more of your favorite shows, visit the iHeartRadio app,
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