Speaker 1: And now.
Speaker 2: Watch my back. You're like that.
Speaker 1: You can strike waters from headquarters behind him to the border. Well,
Speaker 1: if you're just turning in the civic cipher, I'm your host.
Speaker 1: Ramses joh I.
Speaker 2: Go by the name of Q War. But Ramses pointed
Speaker 2: out earlier sometimes my mother, the Reverend Estella Secrets, called
Speaker 2: me Q dirty.
Speaker 1: Yes, indeed to dirty. Uh that's my mom. Uh. Stick around.
Speaker 1: We got a lot more coming your way, not the
Speaker 1: least of which is the way black history fact. This
Speaker 1: time we're going to talk about the Stanford prison experiment,
Speaker 1: which is not necessarily a Black history fact, but I
Speaker 1: think it's going to help us to frame what we're
Speaker 1: talking about in just a moment, which is really defining
Speaker 1: what a bully is and kind of making some connections
Speaker 1: with some stories, some policing stories that we come across
Speaker 1: this week. But first, let's discuss how to become a
Speaker 1: better ally? Shall we? We shall? So I got this
Speaker 1: from beet dot com. I want to read this and
Speaker 1: try to burn through it pretty quick. And just over
Speaker 1: week after Anthony Broadwater was exonerated for the nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: one rape of Alice Sebold, she apologized and labeled the
Speaker 1: secure the Syracuse Man innocent. According to Syracuse dot com.
Speaker 1: Prior to releasing her apology to the public on Tuesday,
Speaker 1: November thirtieth, the best selling author's representative sent a copy
Speaker 1: to Broadwater so he could be the first to read it.
Speaker 1: It comes sincerely from her heart, Broadwater told the news
Speaker 1: outlet before bursting into tears. She knowingly admits what happened,
Speaker 1: and I accept her apology. In her apology, Seabold stated
Speaker 1: that she put her faith as a traumatized eighteen year
Speaker 1: old rape victim in the American legal system. In nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety nine. She launched her career with the memoir Lucky,
Speaker 1: which described her rape in Syracuse's Thorndon Park and going
Speaker 1: through the criminal justice system that led to Broadwater's in
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty two conviction. That's when I was born. Seabold
Speaker 1: now believes Broadwater didn't commit the crime for which he
Speaker 1: was for which he served sixteen years in prison. It
Speaker 1: has taken me these past eight days to comprehend how
Speaker 1: this could have happened, Seabolt wrote in the statement by
Speaker 1: a medium, I will continue to struggle with the role
Speaker 1: that I unwittingly played with an assistant sent an innocent
Speaker 1: man to jail. During the trial, the only two pieces
Speaker 1: of evidence against Broadwater were Seabolt's identification after she picked
Speaker 1: out the wrong man in an earlier police lineup, and
Speaker 1: a microscopic hair analysis, which is now deemed to be
Speaker 1: junk science. Broadwater told Syracuse dot Com that at first
Speaker 1: it was difficult for the apology to sink in, but
Speaker 1: after talking about it with his wife, the emotional weight
Speaker 1: was overwhelming. He cried, said Hammond, one of his lawyers.
Speaker 1: His wife pried too, to become a better ally, own
Speaker 1: your mistakes and make them right moving on. That was crazy, right,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to pretend like there wasn't some gravity there,
Speaker 1: but timed out perfectly. So well. Oh and just so
Speaker 1: you know, she was white and he was black. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so yeah, that's typically. You know what's funny, A lot
Speaker 1: of the audience.
Speaker 3: Knew that part already, okay, even if they're saying, even
Speaker 3: if they're even if they're completely unfamiliar with the story,
Speaker 3: most of them knew that part already, right, exactly.
Speaker 1: All right, So what is a bully? I'm going somewhere
Speaker 1: with this talk about this already all week? Q and
Speaker 1: I so we know just hear me out. A bully,
Speaker 1: according to the Oxford Dictionary, a person who habitually seeks
Speaker 1: to harm or intimidate those they perceive as vulnerable.
Speaker 3: Okay, so.
Speaker 1: We're going to use this term with respect to I'd
Speaker 1: say we probably had maybe ten videos we saw this week,
Speaker 1: and about seven of them I put the word bully
Speaker 1: under And so actually.
Speaker 2: Your only response to about eighty five percent of them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so seven eight of them. Yeah, something.
Speaker 2: That was when we got into a little deeper than that.
Speaker 2: You were, you know, we were both upset, stick to
Speaker 2: our stomach, all these other emotions, but most of them,
Speaker 2: your singular reply was the term bully.
Speaker 1: All right, Now, another thing I want to do here.
Speaker 1: Let's say you're listening to this show right now and
Speaker 1: you are white. I do this often, and I will
Speaker 1: continue to do this on the radio in person. It's
Speaker 1: just how I feel. If you are white, you are
Speaker 1: still my brother, You are still my sister. However you
Speaker 1: self identify, you are still my family. I love you,
Speaker 1: and I will always love you. That's the only thing
Speaker 1: I got for you, even if you don't have the
Speaker 1: same for me. I'm not carrying that weight around at all.
Speaker 1: I only am given out love and I mean that.
Speaker 1: People that know me know that I mean that, and
Speaker 1: you'll come to know that as well, provided that you
Speaker 1: continue to listen to this program. These stories I'm going
Speaker 1: to share today, I think maybe one of them might
Speaker 1: be a black person. The rest of these stories are
Speaker 1: about white people. I did my best to get all
Speaker 1: those stories and put them in here so that it
Speaker 1: doesn't seem like it's necessarily a white or sorry, a
Speaker 1: white and black thing, or a black versus police police thing,
Speaker 1: but really a police culture thing. And there's a lot
Speaker 1: of folks that continually criticize us because they feel like
Speaker 1: we are anti police, and I don't believe that that
Speaker 1: is true. I do believe that institutions like this one
Speaker 1: are necessary to hold police accountable and to compel them
Speaker 1: to be the best version that they can be. Just
Speaker 1: because something exists and it's the only thing that you
Speaker 1: know and it does good doesn't mean that it can't
Speaker 1: be better. I love the United States. It is flawed.
Speaker 1: It can be better, if that makes sense, right, And
Speaker 1: anybody that doesn't hold the United States to that standard
Speaker 1: obviously doesn't believe that. Because for something to be the best,
Speaker 1: that it can be you know, it has to continually
Speaker 1: evolve and adapt. The only constant is change, right, So
Speaker 1: obviously we don't have enough time to go through each
Speaker 1: of these stories, so we'll try to go through them
Speaker 1: pretty quickly. That is not to say that these stories
Speaker 1: are not worthy of full breakdowns and full examinations. Right now,
Speaker 1: Q and I, we are always going to be black
Speaker 1: and we come from that tribe and that's who we are,
Speaker 1: but right now we're going to be humans because we
Speaker 1: were not relating in a black way. This is a
Speaker 1: human way. So do you recall the story I sent
Speaker 1: Q where there was a seventeen year old girl who
Speaker 1: was having a seizure at the concert and the police
Speaker 1: were called and she woke up from the seizure and
Speaker 1: she was still kind of disoriented and the police tased her.
Speaker 1: Remember that story? Unfortunately, So the crazy part about this
Speaker 1: is after the incident, the officers involved conceded that the
Speaker 1: teenager was not a threat, But the five officers who
Speaker 1: like subdued her and the officer that tased her, none
Speaker 1: of these people were disciplined at all. Right, And I
Speaker 1: think that this is one example that shows that this
Speaker 1: culture of bullying is more prevalent than people know. There's
Speaker 1: a mob mentality there. You know, there was a story
Speaker 1: that we don't have the notes for, but I sent
Speaker 1: it to you. I want to say yesterday, Q, and
Speaker 1: it was a black man. He was jogging and he
Speaker 1: fit the description as you do. And he I think
Speaker 1: there were seven police cars and a police helicopter that
Speaker 1: pulled up on him over time. You know, the first
Speaker 1: officer was there, talked to him really nice, put him
Speaker 1: in handcuffs. That the guy was cool, the officer was cool.
Speaker 1: It was a great interaction overall. But the seven police
Speaker 1: officers showing up with the helicopter all on this guy, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: where is he going to go? What is he going
Speaker 1: to do? I think it's like, if you need four cops, hey,
Speaker 1: I get it, you know, but seven I think that
Speaker 1: we need to have that defund the police conversation again, right.
Speaker 2: I just want to I just want to remind you
Speaker 2: or kind of interjected to let you know that we've
Speaker 2: gotten to a place where Okay, he was only handcuffed,
Speaker 2: So it was a pleasant interaction because we're so used
Speaker 2: to it going so much worse than that. Yeah, right,
Speaker 2: I should not be handcuffed for jogging.
Speaker 1: Exactly.
Speaker 2: It shouldn't be and I've gotten so bad that we
Speaker 2: have to say, well, hey, they didn't shoot him, so good.
Speaker 1: Here that's what he said. But you know that that
Speaker 1: interaction and interactions like that where the police show up
Speaker 1: and they're real cool, they're not bullies, they're not cussing,
Speaker 1: they're not overly angry, you know, and they it's kind
Speaker 1: of like the innocent until proven guilty sort of approach
Speaker 1: as opposed to the ready fire aim approach that we
Speaker 1: talked about a few episodes ago. But as far as
Speaker 1: this girl who's having the seizure at the concert, I
Speaker 1: have to imagine, and you're listening to my boy, so
Speaker 1: imagine this with me if instead of police officers coming
Speaker 1: to help her through her seizure, she had maybe just
Speaker 1: some concert goers helping her out. At no point do
Speaker 1: these concert goers need to have this feeling like they
Speaker 1: need to defend themselves or otherwise subdue this woman who
Speaker 1: is recovering from a seizure and is having a reaction
Speaker 1: because she blacked out and woke up in the world.
Speaker 1: You know, there's people in her face and she's you know,
Speaker 1: trying to figure out what's going on right, just like
Speaker 1: I'm not even talking about people with medical training. I'm
Speaker 1: just talking about regular people. I've seen a seizure that's
Speaker 1: very scary. You don't want to leave a person who's
Speaker 1: having a seizure. You want to help, you don't want
Speaker 1: to tase them. Now, the one thing that people will
Speaker 1: say people that love to defend the police. And I
Speaker 1: get that that's necessary too, just like this show is necessary.
Speaker 1: But the one thing that people want to say is,
Speaker 1: you don't know you weren't there. Well. One thing that
Speaker 1: does clear up a lot often, doesn't clear up everything always,
Speaker 1: but it does clear up a lot often is video.
Speaker 1: And all these have videos, and I've seen them, and
Speaker 1: this is the way I'm responding to them. Moving on.
Speaker 1: I got to kind of get through a couple more
Speaker 1: of these. There was one article about a it's called
Speaker 1: a callous cop who was fired for ignoring a dying
Speaker 1: gunshot victims please for help. So this officer Rogers failed
Speaker 1: to give this eighteen year old. His name was Gelante Jones,
Speaker 1: which makes me feel like he might not have been white.
Speaker 1: But I don't know. I didn't see this person, but
Speaker 1: I you know, you could hear the audience.
Speaker 2: Tell you with one thousand certainty that Jelante Jones it's
Speaker 2: from Compton, outside of Chicago, Detroit, or Gary, Indiana or Harlem.
Speaker 2: You guys get what I'm going with this.
Speaker 1: Well, unfortunately Jelante is not here anymore. He was shot
Speaker 1: and as he lay bleeding on the ground for ten minutes,
Speaker 1: he was asking the officer for help, and the only
Speaker 1: thing the officer did was talk on the radio and
Speaker 1: question him do you live here? Do you live here?
Speaker 1: Where do you live? Where we going that sort of stuff?
Speaker 1: And no way trying to administer help. And this is
Speaker 1: a civil servant, you know, Officer Rogers, there is a
Speaker 1: civil servant, you know, and they they're trained on first
Speaker 1: aid and all this sort of stuff. But you know,
Speaker 1: and these as isolated incidents go. Each one is an
Speaker 1: isolated incident. So I'm not going to pick on this officer,
Speaker 1: but I'm going to show you a theme, you know,
Speaker 1: And I believe this themed to be very much a
Speaker 1: bullying theme. As I stated in our text conversations throughout
Speaker 1: the week, the one that really hurt the most this week.
Speaker 1: And I hope that you didn't see it, but if
Speaker 1: you did, you know why. I hope that you didn't
Speaker 1: see it. There was an sixty one year old white male.
Speaker 1: These are hard for me because I'm not a fan
Speaker 1: of so there was a video of an older man
Speaker 1: who was in a wheelchair and he was accused of
Speaker 1: shoplifting from a believe it was a Walmart or something
Speaker 1: in Tucson, Arizona. Might have been a Lowser Walmart or
Speaker 1: some sort of place like that.
Speaker 3: And.
Speaker 1: I believe that he might have had a knife on
Speaker 1: him in a wheelchair, might have had a knife on him,
Speaker 1: and he was accused of shoplifting. He turns around to
Speaker 1: go back in the store, refusing to interact with the officer.
Speaker 1: This is the video that I saw. Again. I don't
Speaker 1: know what I don't know, but I do know that
Speaker 1: the officer was fired. As the man in the wheelchair
Speaker 1: approaches the store, the officers telling him to stop going
Speaker 1: toward the entrance of the store, and you know, he
Speaker 1: still might have been a long way away from the store.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm maybe thirty feet from the entrance, and
Speaker 1: the officer just unloads into this guy from behind. And
Speaker 1: I didn't see any de escalate. I didn't see anything,
Speaker 1: you know, and you know, if a person has a
Speaker 1: knife and is intent on doing harm from a wheelchair
Speaker 1: at a grocery store, from something. You know, anybody can
Speaker 1: run away from someone in a wheelchair, even if that's
Speaker 1: the case. If you're a police officer and you want
Speaker 1: to be that hero, there's all these are opportunities for
Speaker 1: people to be heroes, And what I see instead is bullies.
Speaker 1: You know, there's an opportunity to be a hero there.
Speaker 1: You can go and literally take the knife out of
Speaker 1: this dude's hand, and you save the day. No one died.
Speaker 1: You know, you're a hero. Instead, you shot him in
Speaker 1: the face, in the back of the head and the face,
Speaker 1: and then he slumped over it. And I have to
Speaker 1: live with that image in my head, and everyone that
Speaker 1: saw it has to live that man was executed and
Speaker 1: will never know what was he going back to prove
Speaker 1: himself right? Did show hey? Did that I got my receipt?
Speaker 1: Or what? Who knows if that knife was intended for
Speaker 1: a weapon?
Speaker 2: You know some people doesn't.
Speaker 1: Matter, right, This is the point I'm making.
Speaker 2: Thank you, your sentence he received was not just no
Speaker 2: matter what with the circumstance in the things that we.
Speaker 1: Know now now watch this Christian hall a nineteen year
Speaker 1: old Chinese American was standing still with his hands raised
Speaker 1: and his gun pointed up, facing at least ten Pennsylvania
Speaker 1: State Police officers taking cover behind a vehicle when they
Speaker 1: fatally shot him in December twenty twenty, according to unedited
Speaker 1: footage by attorneys representing his family. Now that footage just
Speaker 1: made its way to us, we're just able to finally
Speaker 1: see it, and so we're talking about it. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: then there's another one that I want to talk about
Speaker 1: where there was a man who was riding a motorcycle, right,
Speaker 1: and I believe this was an Arizona somewhere as well,
Speaker 1: which is interesting. But he was riding a motorcycle. He
Speaker 1: got off the motorcycle and walked into it might have
Speaker 1: been a walmart, right, and he was walking around the
Speaker 1: store to get some lunch for the day. He was
Speaker 1: on his way to work, but he didn't take his
Speaker 1: helmet off, and a manager in the store came up
Speaker 1: to him and says, hey, can you take your helmet off?
Speaker 1: And the guy with the helmet just kind of blazes
Speaker 1: by him and gets his stuff, goes and pays for
Speaker 1: it and then is leaving. And at some other point
Speaker 1: the manager kind of like approached him again from his side,
Speaker 1: but you know, based on the camera angles, you know,
Speaker 1: those motorcycle hemets, you can't see out the side, you know,
Speaker 1: and he was kind of over his shoulder a bit,
Speaker 1: so he couldn't really see him anyway. Manager calls the police,
Speaker 1: please show up immediately. This guy was white as well,
Speaker 1: and they stop him on his way out of the store.
Speaker 1: And these police officers were so angry. They were so
Speaker 1: angry already, and you know what happened. So the guy
Speaker 1: says he takes his helmet off when he's talking to
Speaker 1: the police officers and they're like, yore, why do you
Speaker 1: have your helmet on. He's like, oh, my music's playing
Speaker 1: in my helmet. I was listening to my phone. It's connected.
Speaker 1: So I just I just came to get some lunch.
Speaker 1: He's like, well, the manager asked you to take your
Speaker 1: helmet off in the store. He's like, right, couldn't hear
Speaker 1: the manager music. He's like, well, he came right up
Speaker 1: to you and like when you first walked in and
Speaker 1: looked you in the face, he was talking to you.
Speaker 1: He's like, I didn't know he was talking to me.
Speaker 1: He had a headset on I figured he was talking
Speaker 1: to the headset, Wasn't you know? The aggressive people in
Speaker 1: this interaction were the police. This guy, it's like they
Speaker 1: want you to bow down before them, like worship me,
Speaker 1: you insignificant peon. This is the attitude that I saw
Speaker 1: as a theme underscoring these videos this week. Remember the
Speaker 1: definition a person who habitually seeks to harm or intimidate
Speaker 1: those whom they perceive as vulnerable Oxford Dictionaries, definition of
Speaker 1: a hero. And none of these encounters, none of these
Speaker 1: And Kelly, did I see you of a hero?
Speaker 2: Segan the definition of a bully?
Speaker 1: You said, of a hero of a bully? That's what
Speaker 1: I meant, thank you. And so this aggression, it's like,
Speaker 1: are these guys on steroids? You know, there's there's this
Speaker 1: wildly alarming statistic that comes up so often that you know,
Speaker 1: like you're more likely to be abused by your husband
Speaker 1: if your husband is a police officer. Like these guys
Speaker 1: just like just love wailing on their lives. Not all
Speaker 1: of them, of course, you know, but that's something that happens.
Speaker 1: These people are like maybe people that want this job,
Speaker 1: A good amount of them are predisposed to violence, and
Speaker 1: they feel like this badge and this gun gives them
Speaker 1: the respect that they never got when they were in
Speaker 1: high school or whatever whatever it might be. Who knows. Again,
Speaker 1: we're talking about some but these are the ones that
Speaker 1: make stories. These are the ones that make statistics. These
Speaker 1: are the ones that really affect people, families and communities,
Speaker 1: you know. And again I saw the one officer that
Speaker 1: stopped the man that was jogging in the story earlier,
Speaker 1: they were looking for someone who stole a lawnmower who
Speaker 1: was wearing a white tank top and dark shorts and
Speaker 1: he was jogging. He happened to have a white tank top.
Speaker 1: And the officer was real cool. He's like, listen, man,
Speaker 1: I know what's going on out here. I don't want
Speaker 1: you to think this is that if we could just
Speaker 1: get this taken care of. You need to make sure
Speaker 1: that's not you. I don't think it's you, but we
Speaker 1: need to make sure and then you're free to go.
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: Is that cool? And a guy? He was also cool too,
Speaker 1: because you know, there's there's ways to play this. You know,
Speaker 1: sometimes you just got to be humble. Sometimes you you know,
Speaker 1: your your pride has to go out the window.
Speaker 2: But heck, you once again, and you were starting to
Speaker 2: say it. Your pride has to go out of the window.
Speaker 2: If you're digging out of a window, your self respect
Speaker 2: has to go out of the window because you don't
Speaker 2: want to die here. Even your rights have to go
Speaker 2: out of the window because you don't want to die here.
Speaker 2: So I didn't do anything wrong. You're not entitled to
Speaker 2: a rest and or handcuff me because I have a
Speaker 2: white shirt on. However, I don't want to die today,
Speaker 2: So yes, sir, right.
Speaker 1: And the craziest part is, you know, let's say it's me.
Speaker 1: I'm jogging in my community where I live, right, I
Speaker 1: these people know me. My hair is all over the place.
Speaker 1: They see me at the grocery store. I have a
Speaker 1: yellow corvette, you know, like these, and it's convertible, so
Speaker 1: they know it's me. Right, I walk with my son.
Speaker 1: You know, this is where I live. If the police
Speaker 1: came where I live and put me in handcuffs, I
Speaker 1: couldn't even begin to tell you the amount of embarrassment
Speaker 1: me being black. And you know, I already feel like
Speaker 1: some people that don't know me personally have preconceived notions,
Speaker 1: you know, so to have the police, Hey, look, can
Speaker 1: we stop you here for a second. Blah blah. Listen, man,
Speaker 1: can I can we go behind this thing or whatever?
Speaker 1: You know, there was a story about actually I think
Speaker 1: this is the next one. Let me read it. Oh no,
Speaker 1: I didn't make it in here. Okay, I'm sorry. But
Speaker 1: there's another story of a man who was driving. He
Speaker 1: was at work. He was a counselor who's going to
Speaker 1: go visit one of his clients, and the police turned
Speaker 1: on their lights to pull them over, and he wanted
Speaker 1: to go somewhere where he was He felt a little
Speaker 1: bit more comfortable pulling over his car where people could
Speaker 1: see the interaction. And the officer ended up arresting him
Speaker 1: for fleeing from the police and failing to stop right
Speaker 1: and they called, of course all these other police out
Speaker 1: and blah blah blah. So dignity is one of those
Speaker 1: things where no matter what you do, even if you
Speaker 1: know you're innocent, you know, I get some folks have
Speaker 1: to make those decisions. But I do want to say this.
Speaker 1: Seeing police as heroes makes it difficult to see them
Speaker 1: as prone to fear, prejudices and wrongdoing. And I'm not
Speaker 1: saying that we can't, you know, see them as heroes,
Speaker 1: provided that they are doing something heroic, but just kind
Speaker 1: of carte blanche assigning that. I think that it doesn't
Speaker 1: leave room for the reality that we all live in.
Speaker 1: And I wanted to make those that point, using those
Speaker 1: examples of mostly non black people, so that folks know
Speaker 1: that it's not a black people versus police thing as
Speaker 1: much as it is something that we just need to
Speaker 1: continue to talk about, and this is the place for that.
Speaker 1: Moving on here and now you start to understand why
Speaker 1: for our way black history fact, I wanted to discuss
Speaker 1: the Stanford Experiments, so for those that don't know, and
Speaker 1: my sources come from Britannica dot com with the same
Speaker 1: Britannica from the Encyclopedia Britannica and Stanford dot edu so
Speaker 1: Stanford University. So the Stanford Prison Experiment is a social
Speaker 1: psychology study in which college students become became prisoners or
Speaker 1: guards in a simulated prison environment. Funded by the US
Speaker 1: Office of Naval Research. Took place at Stanford University in
Speaker 1: August of nineteen seventy one. That means that it's had
Speaker 1: a lot of time to really settle into the right circles,
Speaker 1: and it's not without flaws. It's not. You know, there's
Speaker 1: some legitimate challenges to the way the experiment was done.
Speaker 1: We'll talk about those as well, but I do think
Speaker 1: it kind of paints a picture. It was intended to
Speaker 1: measure the effect of role playing, labeling, and social expectations
Speaker 1: on behavior over a period of two weeks. However, mistreatment
Speaker 1: of prisoners escalated so alarmingly that principal investigator Philip Gzimbardo
Speaker 1: terminated the experiment after only six days. More than seventy
Speaker 1: young men responded to an advertisement about a quote psychological
Speaker 1: study of prison life in Quote, and experimenters selected twenty
Speaker 1: four applicants who were judged to be physically and mentally healthy.
Speaker 1: The paid subjects were divided randomly into equal numbers of
Speaker 1: guards and prisoners. Guards were ordered not to physically abuse
Speaker 1: prisoners and were issued mirrored sunglasses that prevented any eye contact.
Speaker 1: Prisoners were arrested by actual police and handed over to
Speaker 1: the experimenters in a mock prison in the basement of
Speaker 1: a campus building. Prisoners were then subjected to indignities that
Speaker 1: were intended to simulate the environment of real life prison
Speaker 1: in keeping with Zimbardo's intention to create a very to
Speaker 1: create very quickly an atmosphere of oppression. Each prisoner was
Speaker 1: made to wear a dress as a uniform and to
Speaker 1: carry a chain padlocked around one ankle. All participants were
Speaker 1: observed and videotaped by the experimenters. On only the second day,
Speaker 1: the prisoner staged a rebellion. Guards then worked out a
Speaker 1: system of rewards and punishments to manage the prisoners. Within
Speaker 1: the first four days, three prisoners had become so traumatized
Speaker 1: that they were released. Over the course of the experiments,
Speaker 1: some of the guards became cruel and tyrannical, while a
Speaker 1: number of the prisoners became depressed and disoriented. However, only
Speaker 1: after an outside observer came upon the scene and registered
Speaker 1: shock it, Zimbardo conclude the experiment less than a week
Speaker 1: after it had started. Our way black history fact. Now,
Speaker 1: The reason that I wanted to talk about that was
Speaker 1: because I think that despite again some of the challenges
Speaker 1: to the efficacy of the tactics, and how sterile the
Speaker 1: environment was, and whether or not the pool and the
Speaker 1: candidates were, you know, the right people for this type
Speaker 1: of experiment, and so forth and so on, I do believe,
Speaker 1: and many people would agree that this does give a
Speaker 1: glimpse into the human condition. There's a statement that is
Speaker 1: certainly much older than I am. This says, a slute
Speaker 1: power corrupts absolutely right now. Of course, we know that
Speaker 1: that's not always true in all cases, but it's something
Speaker 1: that we have to address if we're going to really
Speaker 1: challenge policing the way it's done to become better, to evolve.
Speaker 1: There's a whole group of people that view the police
Speaker 1: like the police are there to protect them. We are
Speaker 1: not that group of people. We actively avoid the police
Speaker 1: at all costs. You know, Well, certainly we do. But
Speaker 1: a lot of people you know, who subscribe to our culture,
Speaker 1: you know, social circle, you know, and so forth, that
Speaker 1: we don't really feel like the police are for us.
Speaker 1: You know, there's a popular chant that we learned in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty. Who keeps us safe? We keep us safe? Right,
Speaker 1: And that has largely been my experience experience. It's not
Speaker 1: to say that, you know, bad turns to worse, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm not grateful. There's a number you can call where
Speaker 1: some people that you know are more equipped to deal
Speaker 1: with and injustice show up, you know, And I have
Speaker 1: to really try to walk that line a little bit
Speaker 1: more closely, because again I don't want this show or
Speaker 1: people to really think that I'm anti police. I think
Speaker 1: that police could be better. And the way that, you know,
Speaker 1: you get that is by challenging the areas in which
Speaker 1: they could use some improvement and really addressing this culture
Speaker 1: of bullying that we saw in the Stanford experiment. You know,
Speaker 1: we saw it. It just rose to the top. These
Speaker 1: are all students that go to the same classes, you know,
Speaker 1: just like all of us. If you're listening to me
Speaker 1: and Q right now, you know that we're all brothers
Speaker 1: and sisters, and we're all trying to find our way,
Speaker 1: and we all love our families, and we all love
Speaker 1: our babies, and we all want tomorrow to be better
Speaker 1: than today. Doesn't matter what color you are, where you
Speaker 1: come from, where you were born, with, what under what circumstance,
Speaker 1: none of that. Those are all universally true for everyone.
Speaker 1: Right But we're noticing that if you give a badge
Speaker 1: and a gun to people, a lot of times that
Speaker 1: that modicum of authority goes to their head and they
Speaker 1: feel like they can exert control over human beings in
Speaker 1: a way that violates their civil liberties, civil liberties and
Speaker 1: their civil rights. And this is why a lot of
Speaker 1: these stories that we're talking about today have lawsuits attached
Speaker 1: to them, you know, and addressing that and getting rid
Speaker 1: of things like qualified immunity and getting rid of things
Speaker 1: like that blue wall of silence, and having you know,
Speaker 1: a demerit system in place where people could conceivably lose
Speaker 1: their job if they abuse their power, and not treating
Speaker 1: policing like it's a union. There's some jobs you cannot
Speaker 1: be bad at, especially if you have the right to
Speaker 1: execute a man in a wheelchair after you approached him
Speaker 1: and accused him of stealing. Right, because if he left
Speaker 1: the store and he's on his way, then he's on
Speaker 1: his way. I'm sure whatever if in fact he did
Speaker 1: steal something from the store deliberately, right, because things like
Speaker 1: that happen on accident. I got a little kid. Sometimes
Speaker 1: he just doesn't put his candy back after I tell
Speaker 1: him too, because he forgets, and then I gotta go
Speaker 1: back and pay. Right. But if that was true, should
Speaker 1: it have cost him his life? To your point, Que,
Speaker 1: and I think that my answer is no. So we
Speaker 1: got about a minute. Your final thoughts, que, what do
Speaker 1: you think?
Speaker 2: I mean? I think everybody's answer would be no right.
Speaker 2: There's just so many things that we're all so much
Speaker 2: more like minded about, but in defense of some ideals,
Speaker 2: we pretend that we're not right from vigilanti justice, which
Speaker 2: we've talked about on a couple of previous shows. Like
Speaker 2: all of us agree that that's not cool. But to
Speaker 2: maintain a certain point of you people are going to
Speaker 2: stand on their Bibles and on their Second Amendment right
Speaker 2: and defend you know, teenagers taking to the street and
Speaker 2: murdering people. Well, there's certain things that we just know
Speaker 2: aren't okay. But this country has gotten divided to a
Speaker 2: point that there's no nuance anymore. And I have to
Speaker 2: agree with everything that this side feels is right, even
Speaker 2: though I know it's not, because I have to make
Speaker 2: sure that I'm against this side. It's got about it.
Speaker 2: I think that's what I shouldn't die on the street
Speaker 2: by execution, even if I stole something from the store.
Speaker 1: Sure, and I think that, you know, the reason why
Speaker 1: courts exist is so people can have their day in court,
Speaker 1: if in fact that's where it goes. But that's all
Speaker 1: the time we have for civic ciphers. So thank you
Speaker 1: for joining us. I'm your host rams this josh I
Speaker 1: go by the name of q ward Fit the website
Speaker 1: civiccipher dot com to download this in any previous episodes.
Speaker 1: Be sure to make a donation if you can, and
Speaker 1: follow us on all social media at civic Cipher until
Speaker 1: next week.
Speaker 2: I'll peace