Speaker 1: imagine living in a time where six men kill themselves
Speaker 1: every day, and if we walk Basque gonna happen in
Speaker 1: 100 years. It sounds pretty gross, but it's actually
Speaker 1: originally fake. News starts is a critique of news that's
Speaker 1: considered to be inaccurate. It's become a term that's used
Speaker 1: now to dismiss any news that you don't like. And
Speaker 1: Iran wanting to young Australians has a
Speaker 1: provision. They are unwell generation that
Speaker 1: people don't accept. Climate science, if I think about how
Speaker 1: we're going to save the world, are enables us to
Speaker 1: move in it.
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Dr Susan Collins. Welcome to the final installment
Speaker 1: on the reality of renewables in the What Happens next
Speaker 1: podcast in this episode at experts offer up their tips
Speaker 1: for making the best use of Australia's abundant renewable energy.
Speaker 1: Whether that's joining forces with your community or lobbying government
Speaker 1: will have ideas for everyone.
Speaker 1: Roger Dogville has some advice.
Speaker 1: My name's Roger Dartevelle on a senior lecturer in renewable
Speaker 1: energy in the civil engineering department.
Speaker 1: My research focuses on designing optimal renewable energy systems, trying
Speaker 1: to work out how to minimize the variability in the
Speaker 1: output of wind and solar plant when they aggregated over
Speaker 1: very large geographic regions.
Speaker 1: What can the average person that harm due to improve
Speaker 1: the situation for renewables in Australia, particularly, if maybe they can't. Ah,
Speaker 1: they're renting so they can't put solar panels on their
Speaker 1: roof they can't afford or they have nowhere to charge. Ah,
Speaker 1: you know, electric car or can't get a hydrogen car.
Speaker 1: What can the average person do in this regard? Most
Speaker 1: of the decisions that will be made to
Speaker 1: de carbonized the energy system were made at the corporate
Speaker 1: level in terms of investment in new projects and shutting
Speaker 1: down of coal fired power stations so individuals can can
Speaker 1: influence corporate corporations by taking the business away from fossil fuel.
Speaker 1: So if you're buying electricity, you can talk to your retailer,
Speaker 1: and you can get a green energy plan where you
Speaker 1: pay a couple cents more per kilowatt hour and you
Speaker 1: get green electricity, and that encourages your retailer to invest
Speaker 1: in renewables. But probably the most important thing is to
Speaker 1: get the politicians to put the policies in place that
Speaker 1: really make the corporations make the right decisions so that
Speaker 1: the way you vote is probably the single most important
Speaker 1: thing you can do.
Speaker 1: If you're particularly keen, you can write letters to your
Speaker 1: local member and say, I'm
Speaker 1: really concerned about climate change, and I'd like to see
Speaker 1: more action in that space. But politicians want to stay
Speaker 1: in power. If the voters say we want action on
Speaker 1: climate change, then they will make it happen.
Speaker 1: What is one thing you wish? What is one thing
Speaker 1: you wished the average person could understand about renewables? That
Speaker 1: this seems to be a lot of misinformation about?
Speaker 1: That's a good question.
Speaker 1: I don't know what people don't understand.
Speaker 1: What do I not understand? Look, I don't understand much.
Speaker 1: Um,
Speaker 1: you okay, So what? One of the criticisms we have
Speaker 1: in the renewable energy spaces. You can't build a reliable
Speaker 1: energy system with wind and solar line, because obviously when
Speaker 1: the sun sets, it's not. It's died. There are gonna
Speaker 1: be doctors to If the wind isn't blowing, then there's
Speaker 1: no wind power.
Speaker 1: The reality is you build solar farms in sunny places, um, which,
Speaker 1: which
Speaker 1: do not tend to get cloud covers, at least during
Speaker 1: the day that they're almost always producing power. And what
Speaker 1: about it? Not
Speaker 1: so. Our power consumption goes up dramatically during the day
Speaker 1: and actually goes down a lot at night time. Sleeping right,
Speaker 1: I forgot. And and at nighttime wind farms tend to
Speaker 1: produce more power so that the correlation between wind and
Speaker 1: solar works quite nicely.
Speaker 1: And while in a particular location it might not be windy.
Speaker 1: It will always be windy somewhere
Speaker 1: in Australia.
Speaker 1: Um, so if we have a large transmission networks, which
Speaker 1: we actually already do, have connecting the grid together,
Speaker 1: you can move renewable energy around from the places where
Speaker 1: it's windy and sunny to the places where it's not so.
Speaker 1: Just because one place doesn't have wind and solar at
Speaker 1: a particular point in time doesn't mean it's not available
Speaker 1: somewhere else.
Speaker 1: You still need to be a bit clever. You can't
Speaker 1: run it just with wind and solar, because there still
Speaker 1: will be times when it's calm over much of the
Speaker 1: the Eastern Seaboard and cloudy. So you need storage and pumped.
Speaker 1: Hydro is the best form of storage for folks during energy.
Speaker 1: We've already got eight gigawatts of conventional hydropower in the
Speaker 1: snowy scheme and in Tasmania, so harnessing that will be
Speaker 1: really critical as well. But a cleverly designed strategic placement
Speaker 1: of wind and solar farms. Energy system can provide very
Speaker 1: reliable energy,
Speaker 1: and it's it's not any more expensive than the current
Speaker 1: fossil fuel driven system. Roger, I have to say you
Speaker 1: make it sound very easy and realistic. Why does it
Speaker 1: not seem that way? Why does it feel so hard?
Speaker 1: It does involve rebuilding a system in a fashion that
Speaker 1: that doesn't exist yet. So it's a no in the
Speaker 1: world has as a wind and solar 100% renewable energy system.
Speaker 1: We have countries that have close to 100% for hydropower
Speaker 1: 100 powers. Avery, well understood in mature technology, said this.
Speaker 1: There's nothing dangerous about that, but not no one's tried
Speaker 1: to build 100% wind and solar system before. So there's
Speaker 1: there's fear of the unknown.
Speaker 1: We're transitioning from a system that's been built over 100 years.
Speaker 1: It's very well established,
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of money invested in in it,
Speaker 1: so so moving away from that infrastructure is going to
Speaker 1: be somewhat costly.
Speaker 1: But in fact, the renewable technologies and especially solar PV,
Speaker 1: have come down and cost so much that building
Speaker 1: infrastructure to make electricity from from the sun, and the
Speaker 1: wind is now cheaper than doing it from from fossil fuel.
Speaker 1: And that's true even for some coal fired power stations
Speaker 1: that have already been paid for. So just the cost
Speaker 1: of the cold going into the system is more than
Speaker 1: what it costs toe produce power from a new solar phone.
Speaker 1: I guess there's, Ah, we need to work on the
Speaker 1: wheel side of things. Roger, Thank you so much. That
Speaker 1: was really interesting.
Speaker 1: Let's see from lame Smith.
Speaker 2: I'm Lee and Mitt. I'm the director of behavior. What's Australia?
Speaker 2: High Boots Australia
Speaker 1: Deployed
Speaker 1: five. Change research network, government and problems and projects.
Speaker 2: You change behavior into
Speaker 1: beautiful, such a good
Speaker 1: Liam Smith. Welcome.
Speaker 2: Great, Great to be here.
Speaker 1: All right, let's have a think about what individuals Condo's.
Speaker 1: What can we do to make a change? So what
Speaker 1: role do you think an individual has to play in
Speaker 1: making Australia you know, 100% renewable power?
Speaker 2: There's there's certainly a few things, and then I guess
Speaker 2: you can
Speaker 2: divide them up into different types of behaviour. There was
Speaker 2: a really, really interesting work done, actually, in towns will
Speaker 2: probably close to a decade ago. Now,
Speaker 2: with AH
Speaker 2: 200 where there was a question of what can individuals
Speaker 2: doing their homes Teoh try to
Speaker 2: reduced energy consumption and Burgess carbon emission.
Speaker 2: And there were 240 identified behind his 240 different things.
Speaker 2: And the question is, will which won the a target. Because,
Speaker 2: you know, behavioral
Speaker 2: scientists are applied behavioral researchers. We typically like focusing on
Speaker 2: one thing, not 240. And in fact, we know if
Speaker 2: you tell people to under 40 things that they get
Speaker 2: choice overload don't do much at all people to miniaturize
Speaker 2: get stagnated, and it stuck
Speaker 2: you is the best example that is Netflix thinking
Speaker 1: tonight is
Speaker 2: cruising and choosing nothing.
Speaker 2: Um, so, yeah, but in the top behavior that was
Speaker 2: that that they arrived at in this particular instance, was
Speaker 2: it was done in the city of Townsville, was the point.
Speaker 2: You're what?
Speaker 2: And that was chosen on two grounds on two criteria.
Speaker 2: The first waas, what impact does make and there were
Speaker 2: very distant. But certainly I'm a few degrees cooler in
Speaker 2: your house if you have a pile roof rather than
Speaker 2: the back dot crews. I was feeling clearly a benefit
Speaker 2: to it, but also the likelihood that people would do
Speaker 2: that idea
Speaker 1: because
Speaker 2: of the relatively cheap one off behavior. Then it was
Speaker 2: into the Philly card priority
Speaker 2: of your choice. But I guess in your household in
Speaker 2: Victoria we might be a little bit different. So I'm
Speaker 2: not sure we might need this
Speaker 2: changing color roofs here because sometimes women a boy and
Speaker 2: sometimes we need black and certainly
Speaker 2: the cool of winter is quite problematical. Their deployment change. Clearly,
Speaker 2: we're gonna get more.
Speaker 2: So so That's one thing. But always self argue. There
Speaker 2: is some other types of behaviour not just household and particularly,
Speaker 2: like sort of more advocacy behavior. And I think one
Speaker 2: of the things that is gaining some real momentum at
Speaker 2: the moment is trying to lobby. Ah, large holders of funds,
Speaker 2: whether they be business. Also granulated companies on the like
Speaker 2: to invest in
Speaker 2: sustainable options, particularly carbon for a year or not coal
Speaker 2: options
Speaker 2: specifically. And I thought, I think that there is real
Speaker 2: value in people
Speaker 2: switching efforts to more sustainable
Speaker 2: outcomes or sustainable investment story, and I think from those,
Speaker 2: but there will be two things that I think immediately
Speaker 2: that would that people can do now and start to
Speaker 2: make a difference. Insistent signals the policy makers.
Speaker 2: I guess the question is longer term. Yes, there's got
Speaker 2: to be different thing. Todo then we've talked about some
Speaker 2: of those already in terms of battery storage in your energies.
Speaker 1: I love the idea of painting your roof right. I
Speaker 1: think as soon as you gave that example, I remembered
Speaker 1: when I was traveling through Morocco. And there's this little
Speaker 1: town called Schiff Shaolin, where the entire town is blue.
Speaker 1: You by by decree, everyone has to paint all of
Speaker 1: their house, all of the fence blues. Theo entire town
Speaker 1: is blue. It's phenomenal to go to. And so I'm
Speaker 1: and I remember when I went there, my husband, I like,
Speaker 1: could have anything like this in Australia. Would people do it?
Speaker 1: What if we made like as an environmental statement, Melbourne
Speaker 1: or Sydney? Or whichever city? It's a white city for
Speaker 1: an environmental reason. You get hate more tourists because you
Speaker 1: don't know. The Instagram has come to have their photos
Speaker 1: in front of all these white buildings, and it's an
Speaker 1: environmental statement.
Speaker 1: You can have the idea for free, actually later
Speaker 1: study. I really check it out. Check out Shift Chauhan
Speaker 1: in Morocco and
Speaker 2: white, Blue
Speaker 1: Blue. What's really interesting is it wasn't always blue For
Speaker 1: a while, it was a different color, but for some
Speaker 1: reason it became a thing that the city did. And
Speaker 1: now it's so important for tourism. It's the only reason
Speaker 1: people go because it's not like the other biggest cities,
Speaker 1: like Americare Shore, Casablanca or fairs. But because everything's blue,
Speaker 1: it's this iconic place to visit.
Speaker 1: It brings in. A lot of tourists are now you
Speaker 1: have to. Everyone has to have a blue house.
Speaker 1: So
Speaker 2: there you go.
Speaker 1: I think we should look at it.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna send you peaches.
Speaker 2: Certainly in town feel now that it wasn't poultry. Andi
Speaker 2: constantly could make it more compulsory. But if you fly
Speaker 2: over town, so now and I have been on Google
Speaker 2: Earth and taking snapshots from, you know, off Townsville on
Speaker 2: particularly new developments are a white Ruutel for my store.
Speaker 2: What room?
Speaker 2: 15 development. That a lot of
Speaker 2: water power colors.
Speaker 2: So I think there have been quite successful actually convincing
Speaker 2: people to do that.
Speaker 1: All right. It's happening I'm sending you a photo right now.
Speaker 1: So what do you think the governments or institutions could
Speaker 1: do to make it easier for individuals to take action?
Speaker 1: Should there be subsidies, for example, like if you paint
Speaker 1: your roof white, I don't know, 50 bucks off your
Speaker 1: tax bill that year. Something like that. Free old dog attack.
Speaker 1: The paint itself would be a tax write off.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, certainly there are, uh our intent is options,
Speaker 2: and they're typically one of the tools that policy makers use.
Speaker 2: I always worry a little bit about incentives and determine
Speaker 2: season Piper economics called money for nothing, which is that
Speaker 2: you could you would people have done it anyway? Or indeed,
Speaker 2: could we have people to do it for non financial reasons.
Speaker 2: And there is a bit of an issue with mo
Speaker 2: dividing people financial reasons,
Speaker 2: Um, which is that if you if you take, for example,
Speaker 2: you put solar panels on your roof, um,
Speaker 2: to save money,
Speaker 2: then in many ways it might predispose you to do
Speaker 2: other things that are in line with saving money and
Speaker 2: given another environmental choice, one that costs more.
Speaker 2: Sorry. Another situation where an environmental choice costs more and
Speaker 2: a left environment went one costless it maybe not the
Speaker 2: environmental consideration, but rather
Speaker 1: than among the
Speaker 2: factors in your decision making.
Speaker 2: And so we call that crowding out or or extrinsic
Speaker 2: motivations around the desired behaviour. So if we, yeah, the
Speaker 2: preference would clearly be to avoid incentives if we possibly could,
Speaker 2: can work and they certainly do work.
Speaker 2: But equally, I'd be thinking, Can we will be a
Speaker 2: bit more targeted in who they go to each other.
Speaker 2: It's more just trying to convince the Lakers leg to
Speaker 2: get them across the line rather than riot to everybody.
Speaker 1: So the more powerful messages do this because it's the
Speaker 1: right thing to do Environmentally.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of working in the Bible sciences,
Speaker 2: that sort of target, you know, had heady convince someone
Speaker 2: in particular. Often there are divisions between lettering on watering
Speaker 2: or individuals more collectivist viewpoint head. He convince them to
Speaker 2: act in private iconic trying
Speaker 2: to do in environmental action that would support harmonized medications.
Speaker 2: And you know there are ways to do that, and
Speaker 2: particularly the social norms or speaking to community based activities
Speaker 2: can be quite a powerful way of you know, everyone
Speaker 2: else is in your blood communities during the
Speaker 2: or do it for your local community. Those messages cannot
Speaker 2: work on both sides,
Speaker 2: including for people that don't even think. Comet stranger.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that message agony
Speaker 1: Liam Smith. Thank you so much for your time.
Speaker 2: You're welcome.
Speaker 1: Joining us now is Barry's Barani.
Speaker 1: My name is Dr Behrooz back. Ronnie. I'm a lecturer
Speaker 1: at Electrical and Computer System Engineering Department at Monash University.
Speaker 1: My main field of research and expertise.
Speaker 1: Renewable energy integration,
Speaker 1: converters, power electronics, converted control and their application into by
Speaker 1: their area off great
Speaker 1: Barry's Barani. Welcome. Thank you so much. What can the
Speaker 1: average person at home due to improve things in terms
Speaker 1: of renewables?
Speaker 1: Well,
Speaker 1: living green and living green has all sorts of actually
Speaker 1: aspects into it. Do you have solar panels on your house?
Speaker 1: I unfortunately don't because I am renting that car. But
Speaker 1: this will be one of my four years. As soon
Speaker 1: as I buy a house that it can do that.
Speaker 1: But I think you probably touched on something. A lot
Speaker 1: of people feel it. A lot of people are renting,
Speaker 1: so they can't like they come puts all the pedals.
Speaker 1: Is there anything else in terms of renewables? People who
Speaker 1: dart are no harm can do well at the moment for, um, individuals. Well,
Speaker 1: one way, as you mentioned, would be solar panels. Another
Speaker 1: way would be driving an electric car, but unfortunately, electric
Speaker 1: cars a pretty expensive at the moment. But it will change, actually.
Speaker 1: Can I bring it back to me again?
Speaker 1: I would love to get electric cops, but I live
Speaker 1: in a city where no one has garages and everyone
Speaker 1: has to park on the street.
Speaker 1: Is that a viable from someone like me to get
Speaker 1: an electric car? Because don't you have to plug it
Speaker 1: in overnight?
Speaker 1: You have to plug it in overnight, Correct. But that
Speaker 1: is only if you want to charge it with your
Speaker 1: own electricity at home, and that is called like slow charging.
Speaker 1: But they're fast charging solution for electric cars that you can,
Speaker 1: for example, charge your car in 15 to 20 minutes,
Speaker 1: where at least go from 10% State of charge to
Speaker 1: 80 90 s state of charge of your battery, which
Speaker 1: is good enough for your day to day travel of course.
Speaker 1: So where do you do that? Well, yet the infrastructure
Speaker 1: is not there. So that's another thing that government could
Speaker 1: do to expand the infrastructure for electric vehicles Because, look,
Speaker 1: for example, um, how do you do for your normal
Speaker 1: petrol card, there is a gas station. You go there,
Speaker 1: you don't have gas and your home, you go to
Speaker 1: a gas station, you actually have access to guess you
Speaker 1: could have
Speaker 1: charging station fast charging stations. And that would require a
Speaker 1: lot of infrastructure, a lot of actually investment from the
Speaker 1: government to have fast charging um stations. So you don't
Speaker 1: have to wait more than 10 20 minutes.
Speaker 1: Now that we mentioned electric cars. Let's mention another technology
Speaker 1: here which can hopefully be. Also, I some sort of,
Speaker 1: you know, alternative to petrol cars, and that would be
Speaker 1: hydrogen cars.
Speaker 1: Our decision cars are actually in terms of because many
Speaker 1: people have these range anxiety with electric vehicles. And they say,
Speaker 1: What if you know I don't have access to any
Speaker 1: charging point comes from half phones, and we're always so
Speaker 1: worried about our phones going flat and needing to charge
Speaker 1: him that we kind of big of rechargeable cars as
Speaker 1: like big mobile phones with terrible batteries. It's a good analogy,
Speaker 1: and I think many people year there because they're very
Speaker 1: much actually concerned about the cell phone. This is more
Speaker 1: or less the same scene because what if I don't
Speaker 1: have access to a you know, charging station every day?
Speaker 1: And that's actually a legitimate concern. If, for example, as
Speaker 1: you mentioned, if you live in a city and if
Speaker 1: you don't have I access to charge or you don't have,
Speaker 1: for example, renting an apartment cannot actually charge it, the
Speaker 1: it's difficult and it adds to the problem. So one
Speaker 1: solution would be hydrogen cars, hydrogen cars. You can imagine well,
Speaker 1: the way they've work. Imagine that you've got exactly like
Speaker 1: a petrol car. But instead of like gas, it has ah,
Speaker 1: hydrogen as the you know, instead of electricity or anything else,
Speaker 1: it just hydrogen, and you can
Speaker 1: you probably can charge him in a matter of minutes
Speaker 1: similar to a gas station. But again it requires a
Speaker 1: lot of investment and infrastructure, and, ah, you know, investment
Speaker 1: from the government or different developers of car manufacturing companies
Speaker 1: to come along and install these things, so we're yet
Speaker 1: not really ready for hydrant. At least in Australia. Some
Speaker 1: other countries are doing much better when it comes to hydrogen. Japan,
Speaker 1: I think, is the leader. When it comes to Hardison,
Speaker 1: cars fuel fill cars. They're great, but that could be
Speaker 1: another solution. And the way I see it, I see
Speaker 1: the future B 2030 years from now, a mixture of
Speaker 1: electric and hydrogen cars because while hydrogen cars you one
Speaker 1: of that and, uh, range anxiety because you know that
Speaker 1: you've got access to a station, you know you go
Speaker 1: in and get it charged. And not a good point
Speaker 1: about hydrogen cars
Speaker 1: is that
Speaker 1: Well,
Speaker 1: let's talk about the problem of electric cars and charging stations,
Speaker 1: because if you want it for example, charge a few
Speaker 1: cars simultaneously in your charging station, that high speed or
Speaker 1: fast charger it requires a lot of it puts a
Speaker 1: lot of burden on the electricity grid. We've already talked
Speaker 1: about that struggling so exactly So the good point about
Speaker 1: hydrogen is that it is disconnected, right? It is like
Speaker 1: hydrogen liquid hydrant. Probably you actually go to your
Speaker 1: station and hydrogen stations, your local hydrogen dely. Exactly, And
Speaker 1: then you don't have the problem. Don't have that impact
Speaker 1: on your electricity greet. So that's another good point about hydrogen. Another, actually,
Speaker 1: Good point is that hydrogen
Speaker 1: can actually be makes the renewable energies. How well for
Speaker 1: hydrogen generation you need energy. You need energy for the
Speaker 1: chemical reactions to actually generate hydrogen. That energy could come
Speaker 1: from a solar farm in the middle of the desert
Speaker 1: without any access to any transmission line or anything to
Speaker 1: transmit power to the city. You can use energy locally
Speaker 1: in the desert, where it is the perfect place for
Speaker 1: solar plant. Fill a farm,
Speaker 1: generate electricity. They're used electricity to generate hydrogen and then
Speaker 1: bring hunters into the city and few and use it
Speaker 1: of the fuel for your car. That that could be
Speaker 1: a very nice use of renewable energies, and that can
Speaker 1: actually help us a lot to combat climate change and
Speaker 1: the problems they have. The
Speaker 1: conventional combustion engine cars Behrooz reassure me that this is
Speaker 1: not a hydrogen bomb because that's
Speaker 1: a ha Jin and creating Hadron. It's all I'm envisioning.
Speaker 1: Tell me how it's different. It's actually well, I'm not
Speaker 1: an expert in that field. So I don't wanna talk
Speaker 1: too much about the way hard vision Qarth work. The
Speaker 1: fuel fill works, but no, it's totally different. Totally safe.
Speaker 1: A proven technology, already. Some manufacturers. Well, I don't know
Speaker 1: if it's we can. That way we can say that
Speaker 1: this is in the eye bay. Say you can say
Speaker 1: whatever brand you. Yes, I think he and I if
Speaker 1: I'm not wrong, they already have a feel self FC
Speaker 1: re fuel cell vehicle. Um, I think, um, some of
Speaker 1: the Japanese manufacturers are actually very much into that. And
Speaker 1: then they told you Japan is the leader in this
Speaker 1: field at the moment.
Speaker 1: So it is a very proven technology. Very safe once exploded. Good.
Speaker 1: You know the beauty of that, is that Okay? Your
Speaker 1: combustion engine cause the out of your exhaust system is
Speaker 1: Theo to hear the out. The output of your exhaust
Speaker 1: system is water H 20 That's the fantastic thing about
Speaker 1: your fcv. What? It does it just come out of
Speaker 1: viper
Speaker 1: like a like a hose. It's just fantastic and clean. Clean.
Speaker 1: Imagine that. Imagine that solar form in the middle of
Speaker 1: the desert generating what we solar energy with renewable energy
Speaker 1: generating hydrogen for you and that hard to use it.
Speaker 1: And it turns into
Speaker 1: water so
Speaker 1: clean,
Speaker 1: so that I I see that as the future. So again,
Speaker 1: I see a mixture of electric vehicles and feel still vehicles. Ah,
Speaker 1: but I see a higher chance for fuel cell, although
Speaker 1: they're not yet
Speaker 1: very much common in many countries. But then you look
Speaker 1: at it. If you put all of these pieces of
Speaker 1: a puzzle together because it doesn't put any burden on
Speaker 1: your electricity network, that is actually fantastic. And you can
Speaker 1: very easily achieve, you know, ah, retiring combustion engine cause
Speaker 1: by fuel fill cars. So I see does as the future.
Speaker 1: Um Well,
Speaker 1: I cannot predict 100% but I think that in probably
Speaker 1: 10 to 20 years, we'll see a massive shift
Speaker 1: towards fuel fill and electric vehicles
Speaker 1: in many countries. And I hope we see that in
Speaker 1: Australia sooner,
Speaker 1: as do I. But who is? This has been really interesting.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your time. There were thanks
Speaker 1: so much for having me
Speaker 1: some really practical advice there from all our experts. Thanks
Speaker 1: to all our guests today and that is it for
Speaker 1: this topic. More information on what we discussed can be
Speaker 1: found in the show. Notes. We'll catch you next time
Speaker 1: in Siris. Three of what happens next, where we will
Speaker 1: be exploring space, the future of health care, higher education
Speaker 1: and research and a lot more. Make sure you subscribe,
Speaker 1: so you catch the new Siri's when it drops, I