WEBVTT - Pastors' Perspective-11/03/26 0:00:17.128 --> 0:00:21.160 Hello and welcome to Pastor's Perspective. I'm your host, Brian Perez, 0:00:21.179 --> 0:00:23.900 and it's time once again for the show. Yeah, call 0:00:23.900 --> 0:00:30.460 in 888-564-6173. Phone lines are wide open. If you're standing 0:00:30.460 --> 0:00:33.739 and like to vote right now, you can call in, well, 0:00:33.829 --> 0:00:35.379 they might make you get off your phone. I don't 0:00:35.379 --> 0:00:38.339 know how that works. Make sure you're doing everything legally 0:00:38.339 --> 0:00:40.020 and above board as we do. 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:45.580 Here in the Golden State. 888-564-6173 is the number to call. 0:00:45.778 --> 0:00:48.830 We've got pastors Brian Broderson and Phil Metzger here to 0:00:48.830 --> 0:00:52.359 answer your questions today, so call in. You can also 0:00:52.360 --> 0:00:55.880 watch us live online on Facebook, YouTube and Instagram. You 0:00:55.880 --> 0:01:00.868 can send your questions in online as emails, sorts of things, 0:01:00.920 --> 0:01:03.260 you text that you can send us through. 0:01:03.610 --> 0:01:07.010 Uh, DM on Instagram or Messenger on Facebook or the 0:01:07.010 --> 0:01:11.049 pastor's perspective page at Kwave.com. But since we're a radio show, 0:01:11.400 --> 0:01:14.130 an audio podcast, we like to hear the sound of 0:01:14.130 --> 0:01:15.890 your voice so that it's not just the three of 0:01:15.890 --> 0:01:24.569 us talking. We like variety. 888-564-6173. What's going on, fellas? Brian? Hi. Hi, 0:01:24.850 --> 0:01:28.000 how are you doing? Good to see you. Um, yeah, I, 0:01:28.130 --> 0:01:31.339 I didn't know that was the California state motto. The 0:01:31.339 --> 0:01:32.430 Golden Golden State does it great. 0:01:32.929 --> 0:01:35.328 In politics, is that what it is? Is that what 0:01:35.328 --> 0:01:37.959 I said? I said something about the Golden State. I'm 0:01:37.959 --> 0:01:40.890 developing it. Oh, you're developing it. OK, it a bit further. 0:01:42.670 --> 0:01:46.170 So look at Phil. I don't see Phil's I voted 0:01:46.789 --> 0:01:52.630 badge on, so I'm questioning his patriotism today. No, I 0:01:52.630 --> 0:01:54.479 didn't know. I didn't know we have to wear stickers. 0:01:54.549 --> 0:01:58.570 I didn't know. I mean, gosh, the judgment, it's the real. 0:01:58.710 --> 0:02:00.710 It's the law. You don't have to show an ID, 0:02:00.750 --> 0:02:02.359 but you do have to wear a sticker. I mean. 0:02:03.759 --> 0:02:06.079 Hey, wait, is Brian? Oh, OK, I can, it's coming 0:02:06.079 --> 0:02:07.960 in and out of the screen where I'm at, but 0:02:07.960 --> 0:02:09.799 you know, I swear Brian had one of those on 0:02:09.799 --> 0:02:12.189 last week too, so I'm suspicious. I, we're not gonna 0:02:12.189 --> 0:02:16.620 talk about that right now la la la la la 0:02:16.620 --> 0:02:17.120 la la la listen. 0:02:17.868 --> 0:02:20.868 I live in Chula Vista. Our stickers are in like Tagalo, 0:02:23.749 --> 0:02:25.089 which I love, by the way. 0:02:26.439 --> 0:02:29.960 Yes, multiple languages actually mine, yeah, the bottom looks like 0:02:29.960 --> 0:02:35.240 it's another language it is. It's, uh, yeah, multiple languages 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:37.359 or what do you have? What does that say? I 0:02:37.359 --> 0:02:38.520 could remove mine and find out. 0:02:39.799 --> 0:02:42.799 I mean it's definitely uh some Asian. I say this 0:02:42.799 --> 0:02:46.180 one you vote there I know what that is but 0:02:46.279 --> 0:02:48.900 um but your vote there is on there twice. Why 0:02:48.900 --> 0:02:53.120 I don't know but yeah maybe you voted twice we 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:55.100 could start a controversy right here on K wave. 0:02:57.240 --> 0:02:59.350 Let's not talk about that right now. We're answering Bible 0:02:59.350 --> 0:03:06.719 questions at 888-564-6173. So, as I was saying, Phil, um. 0:03:08.889 --> 0:03:13.049 That, uh, those two episodes on the Hungarian Revolution. Oh, 0:03:13.210 --> 0:03:16.210 I pulled it up. Yeah, listen to him. There. It's really, 0:03:16.290 --> 0:03:19.499 really interesting. Wait, what were you saying? I don't remember this. Well, 0:03:19.650 --> 0:03:22.889 Phil and I were having a conversation where I was 0:03:22.889 --> 0:03:25.770 talking to him, but he couldn't talk back. But I 0:03:25.770 --> 0:03:28.850 was just thumbs up and yes, nodding my head. No, 0:03:28.930 --> 0:03:31.130 I was, I was listening to, you know, Phil and 0:03:31.130 --> 0:03:34.370 I have a Hungarian connection together, so. 0:03:34.840 --> 0:03:37.949 Um, I, I listened to a history podcast where they 0:03:37.949 --> 0:03:41.840 did two episodes on the 1956 revolution. And it was 0:03:41.840 --> 0:03:45.359 just fascinating, yeah, to just kind of hear the whole story. Um, 0:03:45.600 --> 0:03:47.040 you know, you know bits and pieces of it, but 0:03:47.040 --> 0:03:48.859 you kind of hear the whole thing, you're like, wow, 0:03:49.400 --> 0:03:50.199 really interesting. 0:03:51.299 --> 0:03:54.900 Yeah, what podcast was that in case people are interested? 0:03:55.059 --> 0:03:57.520 The rest is History is the name of the podcast. 0:03:58.779 --> 0:04:02.880 Um, which is an absolutely brilliant podcast. I think it's, 0:04:03.100 --> 0:04:06.980 it's definitely the number one history podcast in the whole world, 0:04:07.100 --> 0:04:10.730 but it's right up there for all podcasts. It's, it's very, 0:04:10.799 --> 0:04:11.760 very good. 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:14.480 The rest is history. I guess you can find that 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:15.980 wherever you get your podcasts. 0:04:16.710 --> 0:04:19.150 And um yeah, they have a website too, the rest 0:04:19.150 --> 0:04:24.290 is history.com. All right, let's go to the phones. 888-564-6173. 0:04:24.389 --> 0:04:27.169 We'll begin with Paul, who's got a Halloween question. 0:04:28.109 --> 0:04:29.388 That was a few days ago, but I guess we 0:04:29.389 --> 0:04:30.828 can still talk about it. Hey Paul, I got a 0:04:30.829 --> 0:04:33.469 question for Paul then. You missed it. 0:04:36.219 --> 0:04:39.619 Yeah, it was a few days late. Oh, well, that's 0:04:39.620 --> 0:04:41.030 all right. So what's going on? 0:04:41.909 --> 0:04:46.378 Um, yeah, so, um, I work, uh, for a restaurant, 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:51.609 and let's just say on Halloween, they have an offer, um, 0:04:51.799 --> 0:04:58.078 where it's, uh, discounted entrees. And, uh, recently, they came 0:04:58.079 --> 0:05:01.520 out with an ad that featured a Ouija board. 0:05:02.258 --> 0:05:05.549 And as a Christian, and I wasn't really made aware 0:05:05.549 --> 0:05:11.069 of this until like the day before, pretty much. Um, 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:14.629 and it, it rubs off on me the wrong way 0:05:14.628 --> 0:05:18.109 as a Christian and also as, as someone that worked 0:05:18.109 --> 0:05:23.099 on Halloween, um, that day, um, I helped bring out people, um, 0:05:23.109 --> 0:05:28.430 as a cashier, and the total was $6.66. 0:05:29.568 --> 0:05:35.318 And it's just gotten very like, uh, not, not feeling great. 0:05:35.409 --> 0:05:36.810 I don't know what I should do as a Christian. 0:05:36.849 --> 0:05:39.529 Like I obviously don't think I should ignore this, but 0:05:39.529 --> 0:05:41.650 I would love to. I think you should have added 0:05:41.650 --> 0:05:44.210 a 20% tip automatically, and then that way it would 0:05:44.210 --> 0:05:46.948 have gone, you know, to 7 or 8 bucks. But 0:05:47.289 --> 0:05:49.729 now was, did you say the Ouija board was in 0:05:49.729 --> 0:05:52.710 the store or in an advertisement? 0:05:53.698 --> 0:05:58.400 Right, it was an advertisement. So, um, to my awareness, 0:05:58.419 --> 0:06:02.559 it was like an advertisement, like, uh, uh, one of those, like, 0:06:02.779 --> 0:06:05.069 I don't know if it's AI or maybe it is 0:06:05.099 --> 0:06:09.079 like Chandron or something. It's an animation though. It wasn't like, um, 0:06:09.460 --> 0:06:10.239 in store. 0:06:12.079 --> 0:06:16.039 And, and so, so this was around like advertising for Halloween, 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:16.919 is that what it was? 0:06:17.829 --> 0:06:21.669 Correct, yeah, right, yeah, yeah, so it's not like their 0:06:21.669 --> 0:06:27.349 normal logo is a Ouija board. No, good, that, that 0:06:27.349 --> 0:06:29.000 would be maybe a bit concerning. 0:06:29.789 --> 0:06:36.479 Um, well, look, you know, I, I don't think that 0:06:36.490 --> 0:06:39.460 you need to worry about any of that. I mean, 0:06:39.889 --> 0:06:44.529 you know, lots of people work in industries and places where, 0:06:44.770 --> 0:06:47.049 you know, they, they do things that you don't necessarily 0:06:47.049 --> 0:06:48.180 approve of, but 0:06:48.650 --> 0:06:52.129 Um, you know, you're there, you're a Christian, you're a witness. 0:06:52.198 --> 0:06:55.869 I think the, the 666 thing is, it's nothing. I mean, we, 0:06:56.169 --> 0:06:59.049 we know what that number represents and we know that 0:06:59.049 --> 0:07:01.969 it's coming at a certain point in history, which has 0:07:01.969 --> 0:07:06.490 not arrived yet. And so I think, um, 0:07:07.490 --> 0:07:11.328 You know, you know, I, I remember having like 666 0:07:11.329 --> 0:07:14.849 followers on Instagram or something, you know, you know, everybody 0:07:14.849 --> 0:07:16.729 who does that kind of gets freaked out. I need, 0:07:16.810 --> 0:07:19.490 I need one, I need one more follower, or you 0:07:19.490 --> 0:07:23.690 drop a follower. Yeah. So anyway, it's not, it's not 0:07:23.690 --> 0:07:26.970 anything I don't think, um, Paul, I don't, I don't 0:07:26.970 --> 0:07:29.310 think it's anything that you need to be worried about. 0:07:29.389 --> 0:07:30.810 I mean, if you don't like working there and you 0:07:30.810 --> 0:07:33.449 want to get a new job, that's, uh, you know, 0:07:33.609 --> 0:07:37.169 totally up to you. But, uh, what do you think, Phil? 0:07:38.169 --> 0:07:40.310 Yeah, I think that's more marketing than it is. Like, 0:07:40.810 --> 0:07:43.960 I mean, listen, you know, the, the devils that, you know, 0:07:44.410 --> 0:07:48.530 working in so many spheres and the, the, the Ouija board, 0:07:48.609 --> 0:07:51.210 that's just a branding marketing kind of a thing. And 0:07:51.210 --> 0:07:54.650 now I'm understanding why Brian kept dropping me from Instagram 0:07:54.650 --> 0:07:57.329 way back when I, I, he kept dropping me, and 0:07:57.329 --> 0:07:59.970 then I'd add, and he'd drop and I'd add, well, 0:08:00.090 --> 0:08:02.849 you were, you were 666. I mean it was like 0:08:02.849 --> 0:08:04.810 I was 666, you know, I just didn't want that 0:08:04.810 --> 0:08:06.250 to be you. 0:08:06.979 --> 0:08:09.549 Yeah, exactly, and, and it's funny that, um, to, to 0:08:09.549 --> 0:08:11.848 Paul's kind of thing, we all get a little creeped out, 0:08:11.930 --> 0:08:14.270 but it's more cultural creeped out than it's actually like 0:08:14.270 --> 0:08:18.179 a biblical, like, in fairness, we all feel weird about 0:08:18.180 --> 0:08:21.190 that kind of stuff, but it's less like an actual 0:08:21.190 --> 0:08:24.430 like demonic biblically biblical issue than it is like a 0:08:24.430 --> 0:08:28.020 kind of a, the way we've like wrapped that those 0:08:28.020 --> 0:08:30.489 terminologies in, in, in our culture. 0:08:32.299 --> 0:08:33.940 Yeah, when you go to the grocery store and your 0:08:33.940 --> 0:08:36.500 total comes to 666, just grab a candy bar off 0:08:36.500 --> 0:08:38.699 the shelf there and say, and, and this too, and 0:08:38.699 --> 0:08:41.939 now it's, did you know there's another, uh, there's another 0:08:41.939 --> 0:08:45.020 reference to 66666 in the Bible. 0:08:46.059 --> 0:08:49.460 Remind us, did you know that? No, it's in, um, 0:08:49.540 --> 0:08:55.499 you mean page 660? No, it's actually, uh, it's in. 0:08:56.739 --> 0:08:58.660 First Kings. 0:08:59.489 --> 0:09:04.739 And it's oh yeah, the gold is Solomon's, uh, wealth, wealth, yes, yes, yes, yep, 0:09:04.970 --> 0:09:07.980 like he made that much per year or, yeah, but 0:09:07.980 --> 0:09:11.889 it is 666, um, you know, talents of gold or 0:09:11.889 --> 0:09:16.378 whatever it is, yeah, the very first Bible I owned, um. 0:09:17.050 --> 0:09:17.819 The 0:09:18.509 --> 0:09:23.270 Old Testament was 664 pages. So there was the middle 0:09:23.270 --> 0:09:25.629 page that had, and then the New Testament started on 0:09:25.629 --> 0:09:31.030 page 667. So, um, I just thought it was they 0:09:31.030 --> 0:09:34.509 did this, they planned it like this. How interesting. But 0:09:34.509 --> 0:09:38.660 the Bible I have now, um, Isaiah 64 is page 0:09:38.660 --> 0:09:42.829 number 666. But uh, yeah, better rip it out. No, 0:09:42.910 --> 0:09:45.309 I'm not gonna do that. So Paul, does this help you? 0:09:46.900 --> 0:09:50.480 Uh, yeah, absolutely. And uh I've, I've seen those uh 0:09:50.869 --> 0:09:56.350 Instagram pages from Brian and I was the 667th like. 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:03.160 Yes, well played, Paul. That's great. Now, Paul, are you 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:04.119 in Chicago? 0:10:05.020 --> 0:10:07.259 I am. Oh, are you living there? 0:10:08.439 --> 0:10:11.720 I am. I just moved out here in August. OK, 0:10:11.879 --> 0:10:12.679 from California. 0:10:13.660 --> 0:10:17.819 From. Oh yeah, um, did you move for a job 0:10:17.819 --> 0:10:20.540 or just you like the weather? What is it? I'm 0:10:20.540 --> 0:10:23.480 in nursing school. Oh yeah, yeah, I love the freezing cold. 0:10:25.340 --> 0:10:28.660 Nursing school. Oh, good for you. Nice. That's great. 0:10:29.999 --> 0:10:33.139 Thank you. Well, cool, I went to school in Chicago 0:10:33.600 --> 0:10:36.610 some years back, but not nursing school, right? Not nursing school, no. 0:10:38.050 --> 0:10:39.809 All right, Paul, thanks for calling us today here on 0:10:39.809 --> 0:10:46.329 Pastor's Perspective, 888-564-6173. Got Brian and Phil answering your questions 0:10:46.328 --> 0:10:51.069 today and now let's go, wow, from Chicago to Nevada. Natalie, 0:10:51.170 --> 0:10:54.650 listening on the KWave app. That is so amazing. We 0:10:54.650 --> 0:10:57.589 have listeners all over the country, all over the world. 0:10:57.809 --> 0:11:00.770 We're based here in Southern California, but our listeners follow 0:11:00.770 --> 0:11:03.929 us everywhere they go. So Natalie, welcome to Pastor's Perspective. 0:11:04.009 --> 0:11:04.550 Thanks for calling. 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:11.389 Yeah, we go from snow to the desert. Yes, um, anyways, 0:11:11.790 --> 0:11:15.470 before I, uh, ask my question, I just want you 0:11:15.470 --> 0:11:20.889 guys to know how much I respect you and, um, 0:11:21.550 --> 0:11:26.309 just love you guys and so and the show and 0:11:26.309 --> 0:11:31.470 just your preaching and whatnot, um, so my question is, well, 0:11:31.550 --> 0:11:33.050 thank you, Natalie, that's very kind. 0:11:34.290 --> 0:11:39.009 Mhm. And but wait here Brian, just a second it's, 0:11:39.090 --> 0:11:39.610 it's 0:11:39.610 --> 0:11:45.129 not good. And so, so I'm frustrated because I get 0:11:45.129 --> 0:11:48.730 in a discussion with a few of my friends and 0:11:48.730 --> 0:11:54.129 they're believers and they're strong and there always comes down 0:11:54.129 --> 0:11:55.590 to this point where 0:11:56.280 --> 0:11:59.920 You know, talking about, um, people, you know, wolves in 0:11:59.920 --> 0:12:03.280 sheep's clothing and people that have gone off the other 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:07.319 side and, and then they start bringing up pastors and 0:12:07.319 --> 0:12:10.800 then your name came up, Greg Laurie's name came up, 0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:13.879 Kurt Cameron came up, and these are all people that 0:12:13.879 --> 0:12:18.939 I highly respect and listen to and it's like what 0:12:18.939 --> 0:12:23.078 do you, and I understand we're supposed to, you know, 0:12:23.280 --> 0:12:25.259 wolves in sheep's clothing, but 0:12:25.650 --> 0:12:28.889 I just felt like sometimes a few people in my 0:12:28.889 --> 0:12:33.090 circle take it too far and what gives them the 0:12:33.090 --> 0:12:39.189 right to judge based on what their opinion. I, I just, 0:12:39.569 --> 0:12:43.389 if you could help me reconcile that and how to 0:12:44.009 --> 0:12:47.488 stand my ground in a conversation like that or if 0:12:47.489 --> 0:12:48.290 I should just 0:12:48.290 --> 0:12:48.929 not. 0:12:49.499 --> 0:12:51.780 I'm just curious what details that they bring up that 0:12:51.780 --> 0:12:53.139 they say specific. It 0:12:53.139 --> 0:12:57.220 actually, it actually makes me mad when they say a 0:12:57.220 --> 0:13:02.689 person's name that I've liked, like my whole Christian life, like, 0:13:03.259 --> 0:13:06.780 you know, I listened to you, Brian, and I listened 0:13:06.780 --> 0:13:10.689 to Greg Laurie when I was living in California and I, 0:13:10.860 --> 0:13:11.829 you know, and 0:13:12.439 --> 0:13:16.970 And Pastor Chuck Smith and it's just, you know, I, I, 0:13:17.069 --> 0:13:20.480 I just get a little bit angry that they. 0:13:21.369 --> 0:13:23.210 You know, and it's not fair. 0:13:23.439 --> 0:13:27.170 Yeah, well, and, and, you know, honestly, I mean, Natalie, this, 0:13:27.530 --> 0:13:30.210 you know, these people are sinning when they do that. 0:13:30.328 --> 0:13:32.730 So of course they, they don't think they are, you know, 0:13:32.850 --> 0:13:37.770 but they are. They're slandering, uh, they're speaking against, you know, 0:13:37.970 --> 0:13:42.780 God's people, they're causing division and, uh, they're 0:13:43.610 --> 0:13:46.809 You know, their claims are not based in anything that's 0:13:46.809 --> 0:13:51.770 real or true. Um, but you know, this is unfortunately, 0:13:51.809 --> 0:13:54.210 this is just kind of the, the day and age 0:13:54.210 --> 0:13:57.770 that we live in, you know, you get, um, slander 0:13:57.770 --> 0:14:00.679 is everywhere and if unless you fit right in with 0:14:00.679 --> 0:14:05.569 somebody's somebody's take on, on something and you deviate from 0:14:05.569 --> 0:14:08.889 that in some way or they think you have, then 0:14:08.889 --> 0:14:11.329 they feel very free to um 0:14:12.090 --> 0:14:16.878 You know, to say things about you that are, are, um, 0:14:16.970 --> 0:14:19.929 not kind, to say the least, and but the, but 0:14:19.929 --> 0:14:22.650 the more important thing is they're not true and that's 0:14:22.650 --> 0:14:26.809 where I think there's a big, big problem. I've heard 0:14:26.809 --> 0:14:29.650 so many crazy things about myself, it's like, wow, I 0:14:29.650 --> 0:14:33.090 didn't know that about me. But you know, it's just, 0:14:33.410 --> 0:14:36.730 it is kind of the the nature of of just 0:14:36.730 --> 0:14:39.249 the time that we live in. So, but I think, 0:14:39.410 --> 0:14:41.660 you know, there's a proverb that says, um, 0:14:42.650 --> 0:14:46.720 Ah, like the north wind drives away the rain, so 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:50.689 an angry countenance drives away a backbiting tongue. 0:14:51.819 --> 0:14:53.999 So I think you can just look at them and say, 0:14:54.910 --> 0:14:57.590 Don't go any further with that because I don't wanna 0:14:57.590 --> 0:15:01.470 hear it, you know. Yeah, what's that passage again? Proverbs 14, uh, 0:15:01.629 --> 0:15:04.270 I can't, I can't remember the why you forgot actually. Well, 0:15:04.540 --> 0:15:07.030 we were just talking about. He gets street names, not, not, 0:15:07.189 --> 0:15:10.069 not numbers, right? That's right. That's this. I got like 0:15:10.069 --> 0:15:13.689 the city. Proverbs is the city. It's located somewhere in 0:15:13.689 --> 0:15:16.550 Proverbs on 14th Street, but no, I don't know if 0:15:16.550 --> 0:15:17.230 it's 14th. 0:15:18.069 --> 0:15:20.199 Oh, you're not sure if it's Proverbs 14. I thought 0:15:20.199 --> 0:15:22.800 you said no, it's, it is Proverbs, but I don't know. 0:15:22.879 --> 0:15:25.360 I don't think it's Proverbs 14, but it's the north 0:15:25.360 --> 0:15:28.199 wind driving by the rain, so you know, I mean. 0:15:29.639 --> 0:15:32.179 So Phil, well, Phil's not on the false teacher list. 0:15:32.550 --> 0:15:34.900 Phil wasn't on the false teacher list. I mean, you know, 0:15:35.270 --> 0:15:37.790 you could next time you're in a conversation like that, 0:15:37.860 --> 0:15:39.949 you could just bring up another guy and you could 0:15:39.949 --> 0:15:42.489 throw Phil's name in there just for the, you know, 0:15:43.189 --> 0:15:45.420 just for the fun of it, because I know a 0:15:45.420 --> 0:15:48.139 few people that think the same thing about Phil. So 0:15:48.139 --> 0:15:51.069 it's true, it's just more like small. I'm small time. 0:15:51.160 --> 0:15:55.110 Brian's in the big leagues of that. Greg Laurie, Kurt Cameron, apparently, yeah. 0:15:55.650 --> 0:15:58.660 I mean, I agree, and it's, you know, especially when 0:15:58.660 --> 0:16:00.449 you can say that and you're on the list, but, 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:03.179 and I'm not, um, but certainly, you know, it's like 0:16:03.179 --> 0:16:05.569 anywhere you go, somebody won't like what you're doing, and, 0:16:05.780 --> 0:16:07.979 and I think everybody has a right to have thoughts, 0:16:08.059 --> 0:16:10.559 but it, it is slander. It's like it's, it's different 0:16:10.559 --> 0:16:13.319 to be like, hey, I don't appreciate that kind of 0:16:13.369 --> 0:16:16.559 like that teaching or whatnot, but let's be honest, that 0:16:16.699 --> 0:16:18.980 when we, when we move from, oh, I, I might just. 0:16:19.059 --> 0:16:21.220 I disagree with a particular teaching point. I can't think 0:16:21.220 --> 0:16:23.340 of anything. I'm just using that as an example. And 0:16:23.340 --> 0:16:25.939 we move it into like this person is a wolf 0:16:25.939 --> 0:16:29.499 in sheep's clothing. That's a heavy, that's a big thing 0:16:29.499 --> 0:16:32.340 to say, and I feel like it's gonna require more 0:16:32.340 --> 0:16:35.340 people like our caller and other people who, who hear 0:16:35.340 --> 0:16:38.300 these kinds of things to, as Brian pointed out in 0:16:38.300 --> 0:16:42.480 the Proverbs, that we need to speak and share and um. 0:16:42.780 --> 0:16:44.619 You know, it's not enough to just hear these things and, 0:16:44.699 --> 0:16:47.819 and privately be like, I disagree. I think it's important 0:16:47.819 --> 0:16:50.300 for us to like in love and with kindness, just say, hey, 0:16:50.379 --> 0:16:53.480 you know, respectfully, I disagree with you on that, or 0:16:53.619 --> 0:16:56.179 even to question, where are you getting this from? I've 0:16:56.179 --> 0:16:59.020 listened to Greg Laurie and Brian Broderson since I was 0:16:59.020 --> 0:17:02.819 about 16 years old, and so we're talking decades and 0:17:02.819 --> 0:17:06.600 decades and decades of teaching, and I'm not the, um, 0:17:06.610 --> 0:17:09.300 the standard of like what is good or not good. 0:17:09.340 --> 0:17:10.499 I'm not trying to claim that. 0:17:10.869 --> 0:17:13.070 But I've, I've, I've put enough of my life into 0:17:13.070 --> 0:17:15.469 like being a Berean, which is in Acts 17, right? Uh, 0:17:15.670 --> 0:17:17.790 the Bereans heard Paul and then they, they searched out 0:17:17.790 --> 0:17:20.389 the scriptures for themselves. I spent enough time listening to 0:17:20.388 --> 0:17:23.030 Brian Broderson and Greg Laurie, and then thought, I'm gonna 0:17:23.030 --> 0:17:24.869 search that out. I'm curious, where, where is that in 0:17:24.869 --> 0:17:27.190 the Bible and what does that, and um, 0:17:28.058 --> 0:17:30.977 I've never heard a heresy taught, not one time. And 0:17:30.978 --> 0:17:33.379 all those episodes of Growing Pains with Kirk Cameron, there 0:17:33.379 --> 0:17:36.678 was no heresy. Well, there, you know, definitely no, nothing there. 0:17:37.338 --> 0:17:40.098 I mean, come on, yeah, exactly. But you just think 0:17:40.098 --> 0:17:42.937 like there's never been any of that. And so it, 0:17:43.019 --> 0:17:45.977 it really comes down to when people don't like their, their, 0:17:46.078 --> 0:17:48.727 when they wanna say that they're not actually attacking. I 0:17:48.728 --> 0:17:51.458 would argue for the most part, they're not attacking their 0:17:51.458 --> 0:17:54.418 theology or their teaching as much as they just want 0:17:54.418 --> 0:17:55.138 to attack. They don't. 0:17:55.270 --> 0:17:59.708 Like maybe a cultural perspective or a social, social perspective, 0:17:59.869 --> 0:18:02.379 there's nothing, and that has nothing to do with the 0:18:02.379 --> 0:18:06.249 scriptures like that. So it's unfair, it's unwarranted, and um 0:18:06.310 --> 0:18:08.800 we need to speak that out. And you know, um, 0:18:09.030 --> 0:18:12.450 one last thing, you know, Matthew 7:1, you know, Jesus says, 0:18:12.670 --> 0:18:17.419 judge not lest you be judged, for with the measure 0:18:17.420 --> 0:18:19.869 that you measure, it will be measured back to you. 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:23.550 And you know, people just, uh, you know, it's amazing 0:18:23.550 --> 0:18:27.509 how many Christians just completely ignore that statement or ignorant 0:18:27.509 --> 0:18:31.429 of it. You know, Jesus is saying something pretty, pretty 0:18:31.430 --> 0:18:34.869 strong there, you know, basically says, hey, you're gonna be 0:18:34.869 --> 0:18:37.759 judged with the same, um, 0:18:38.790 --> 0:18:41.909 Measure that you that you have measured other people, you know, 0:18:42.030 --> 0:18:44.349 the way you, the standard you've set, you're gonna be, 0:18:44.589 --> 0:18:46.719 that's a standard that's gonna be set for you. Yeah, 0:18:47.469 --> 0:18:51.550 I found that passage. It's Proverbs 25:23. Like a north 0:18:51.550 --> 0:18:54.670 wind that brings unexpected rain is a sly tongue which 0:18:54.670 --> 0:18:59.259 provokes a horrified look. Um, so yes, Matthew 7:1. 0:18:59.888 --> 0:19:02.129 Judge not, lest ye be judged. But then there's also 0:19:02.129 --> 0:19:05.208 passages that talk about, you know, I mean, what did 0:19:05.209 --> 0:19:08.209 they say specifically? Call out the false teacher or maybe 0:19:08.209 --> 0:19:10.969 that's not the wording, but so maybe people look at 0:19:10.969 --> 0:19:15.450 both passages and say, well, if I'm 100% certain that 0:19:15.450 --> 0:19:19.489 they're false teachers, which how can you be 100% certain? Well, 0:19:19.609 --> 0:19:23.070 you know, I think the standard, of course, is scripture. So, 0:19:23.089 --> 0:19:27.050 you know, if you have somebody who's who's obviously deviating 0:19:27.050 --> 0:19:27.469 from 0:19:28.050 --> 0:19:30.310 The Orthodox. 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:34.810 position on scripture. Uh, you know, we were talking about 0:19:34.810 --> 0:19:38.409 this the other day, just how, you know, orthodoxy is 0:19:38.410 --> 0:19:43.609 much broader than your particular, uh, view of things. You know, 0:19:43.729 --> 0:19:48.089 we might hold a strong view about something, um, maybe 0:19:48.089 --> 0:19:50.409 let's just say, for example, because it's an easy one, 0:19:50.489 --> 0:19:52.749 you know, we might, we might hold a strong view 0:19:52.749 --> 0:19:56.020 about eschatology, we might hold a strong view about uh 0:19:56.609 --> 0:19:59.339 the end times, and we might hold to a 0:19:59.650 --> 0:20:04.869 Um, pre-tribulational rapture view, or we might be, you know, a, 0:20:05.209 --> 0:20:12.540 a post-tribulational rapture view. And so there's, there's a variation in, 0:20:12.650 --> 0:20:16.619 in views there for one person to say to the 0:20:16.619 --> 0:20:21.129 one with the varying position, you're heretical or you're a 0:20:21.129 --> 0:20:22.209 false teacher. 0:20:22.790 --> 0:20:27.150 Uh, that is to fail to understand that within orthodoxy, 0:20:27.229 --> 0:20:32.349 there is room for more than your particular opinion on something. 0:20:32.670 --> 0:20:35.040 You know, there are things in scripture that aren't as 0:20:35.040 --> 0:20:38.270 clear as we would like them to be. And so 0:20:38.270 --> 0:20:43.050 when they're not clear, and, uh, you know, obviously, um, 0:20:43.499 --> 0:20:47.540 You know, dogmatic, we can't be dogmatic either. I, you know, 0:20:47.619 --> 0:20:50.780 we can be dogmatic about the resurrection of Jesus. Jesus 0:20:50.780 --> 0:20:53.879 rose from the dead. Jesus died on the cross, a 0:20:53.879 --> 0:20:58.459 vicarious death. We can be absolutely dogmatic on that, uh, 0:20:58.580 --> 0:21:00.739 and there, you know, there are things that we can be, 0:21:01.180 --> 0:21:04.300 we can be dogmatic on. But even when we're dogmatic 0:21:04.300 --> 0:21:07.199 on things, we should be, uh, 0:21:08.020 --> 0:21:12.219 Gracious and, you know, try to, uh, we want to 0:21:12.219 --> 0:21:15.800 try to persuade people who have fallen into real error 0:21:16.180 --> 0:21:19.820 in disbelieving, you know, things that really do matter. 0:21:20.550 --> 0:21:23.159 Um, but when it comes to things that don't matter, 0:21:23.320 --> 0:21:30.239 secondary issues, uh, tertiary issues, then we have to be 0:21:30.239 --> 0:21:33.440 content to just agree to disagree, Phil. 0:21:34.209 --> 0:21:38.248 I just, I don't, I don't disagree. I totally agree 0:21:38.249 --> 0:21:41.330 with that. I, uh, I, I, I like to like 0:21:41.330 --> 0:21:43.969 remind people like a lot of, a lot of Christian 0:21:43.969 --> 0:21:47.530 teaching right now, and kind of in all spheres of 0:21:47.530 --> 0:21:49.968 like any denomination or whatnot, and, and this isn't true 0:21:49.969 --> 0:21:52.570 of every, but in, in quite a few, it seems 0:21:52.570 --> 0:21:57.570 like every theological position is an exclamation point. It's like 0:21:57.570 --> 0:22:01.249 we're shouting every theological position, right? So, Jesus rose from 0:22:01.249 --> 0:22:02.770 the dead! exclamation point. 0:22:03.550 --> 0:22:04.119 Um, 0:22:05.050 --> 0:22:08.169 You know, this is our eschatological view, exclamation point, and 0:22:08.170 --> 0:22:11.089 it's like, wait, hold on, we need to separate between 0:22:11.089 --> 0:22:14.520 the exclamation points in the Bible. Uh, the gospel, as 0:22:14.520 --> 0:22:17.170 Brian pointed out, the death and burial and resurrection of 0:22:17.170 --> 0:22:20.520 Jesus is an exclamation point for us. Uh, but then 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:23.489 there are other issues that don't carry an exclamation point, 0:22:23.530 --> 0:22:25.450 and so we need to, when it's not that, 0:22:25.859 --> 0:22:29.800 We need to pull back our, our dogmatism and recognize 0:22:29.800 --> 0:22:32.609 that the kingdom is bigger than that, and we need to, 0:22:32.739 --> 0:22:34.060 we just need to, like you said, I think it's 0:22:34.060 --> 0:22:35.780 a great word, and I've heard you say this many, 0:22:35.820 --> 0:22:38.259 many times. We need to not just teach grace, but 0:22:38.259 --> 0:22:39.940 we need to be gracious people. We need to learn 0:22:39.940 --> 0:22:40.780 to be gracious. 0:22:42.070 --> 0:22:44.170 Natalie, does this help you? What you're gonna do now? 0:22:45.499 --> 0:22:48.979 Yeah, I'm a very outspoken person, so when it comes 0:22:48.979 --> 0:22:52.700 to stuff like this, I'm not afraid. But, and I 0:22:52.700 --> 0:22:56.780 liked what you said, Brian, about because that's what I 0:22:56.780 --> 0:23:01.780 do is I take like the non-negotiables like creation, the 0:23:01.780 --> 0:23:05.939 birth of Jesus, and that's how I kind of base 0:23:05.940 --> 0:23:10.129 it on if somebody's kind of, uh, you know, not 0:23:10.129 --> 0:23:11.440 speaking the word, but. 0:23:12.099 --> 0:23:15.020 Is that a good approach? Like that's what I got 0:23:15.020 --> 0:23:18.139 into it with them was, you know, you guys are 0:23:18.138 --> 0:23:22.219 looking at some of the nonessentials and maybe taking one 0:23:22.219 --> 0:23:26.580 that was like put in the media and taken overboard and, 0:23:27.060 --> 0:23:29.420 you know, just saying they're off the rails, and I'm 0:23:29.420 --> 0:23:30.180 like that's not 0:23:30.180 --> 0:23:30.619 fair. 0:23:30.780 --> 0:23:33.459 Yeah, right, yeah, and I think it's a good, like 0:23:33.459 --> 0:23:35.450 Phil said, and I know Phil has done this with, 0:23:35.540 --> 0:23:37.080 with people, um. 0:23:37.849 --> 0:23:40.889 To ask them specifically, OK, well, you know, if they're 0:23:40.888 --> 0:23:43.709 a wolf in sheep's clothing, give me like an example 0:23:43.709 --> 0:23:47.030 of where you see that or or how you could 0:23:47.030 --> 0:23:50.530 justify that kind of a statement. Now, you know, bringing 0:23:50.530 --> 0:23:54.359 up me and bringing up Greg, um, you know, we've 0:23:54.359 --> 0:23:58.409 both been in the spotlight as of late because of 0:23:58.410 --> 0:24:02.790 certain accusations and so forth that have been against us. Um, 0:24:03.009 --> 0:24:06.190 but to just default and believe that that is true. 0:24:06.580 --> 0:24:09.489 Um, I think, you know, that's a, that's a serious 0:24:09.489 --> 0:24:12.570 issue too. I think, you know, the Paul says in 0:24:12.570 --> 0:24:15.869 1 Corinthians 13, love believes all things. So you're going 0:24:15.869 --> 0:24:20.540 to believe the best, not the worst. And, um, you know, 0:24:20.700 --> 0:24:23.180 neither Greg or or I can't speak totally for Greg, 0:24:23.259 --> 0:24:25.920 but I know him well enough to know that, you know, 0:24:26.700 --> 0:24:29.300 we're not going to spend our lives out there defending 0:24:29.300 --> 0:24:32.699 ourselves against every person who comes up with some, you know, 0:24:33.479 --> 0:24:36.680 Whatever it is, accusation, you know, and so forth. It's 0:24:36.680 --> 0:24:40.440 like it's, it's just we don't have time to do it. Um, 0:24:40.560 --> 0:24:43.879 and so we're just, uh, putting it in God's hands. 0:24:43.999 --> 0:24:47.879 God knows, God knows what's true. And, uh, so anyway. 0:24:48.609 --> 0:24:54.699 Natalie, great hearing from you today on Pastor's Perspective at 888-564-6173. 0:24:54.930 --> 0:24:57.649 Now we'll talk to Noah in Huntington Beach who listens 0:24:57.650 --> 0:24:59.810 to us on the KWave app. Hey there, Noah, what's 0:24:59.810 --> 0:25:01.410 your question for Brian and Phil today? 0:25:03.060 --> 0:25:09.270 Hey guys, so my question is regarding John. I'm, uh, 3:13. Uh, 0:25:09.339 --> 0:25:11.379 no one has ascended to heaven, but he came down 0:25:11.379 --> 0:25:13.149 from heaven and. 0:25:13.940 --> 0:25:16.728 In parallel or like it's in regards to Genesis 5, 0:25:16.780 --> 0:25:18.699 because the question got brought up the other night in 0:25:18.700 --> 0:25:22.580 a Bible study, you know, cause God took Noah, and 0:25:22.580 --> 0:25:25.389 it says in John 3:13, no one's descended into heaven 0:25:25.859 --> 0:25:28.499 except Jesus, and then I know in 2 Kings it 0:25:28.499 --> 0:25:31.849 talks about Elijah, right? He was taken to heaven. 0:25:32.680 --> 0:25:34.649 The way that I reconciled it is that like. 0:25:35.859 --> 0:25:39.300 You know, Jesus himself, he ascended to heaven, but God 0:25:39.300 --> 0:25:41.900 took them, and I just want to know what your guys' 0:25:41.900 --> 0:25:43.719 perspective was on the matter. 0:25:44.670 --> 0:25:45.959 All right, Phil, start with you. 0:25:47.150 --> 0:25:50.849 Um, were you, were you thinking of Enoch and Elijah? 0:25:50.869 --> 0:25:52.290 Is that who you were thinking of? 0:25:53.249 --> 0:25:55.359 In the Old Testament, Enoch was 0:25:56.400 --> 0:25:58.400 The Bible says he was and then he, he was not, 0:25:58.479 --> 0:25:59.839 he was taken to be with the Lord. 0:26:00.680 --> 0:26:02.759 Is, is that who you meant to say instead of Noah? 0:26:03.650 --> 0:26:04.718 No, his name is Noah. 0:26:07.520 --> 0:26:09.209 I, I don't see anything on my screen. I don't 0:26:09.209 --> 0:26:12.509 have the, uh, OK, I don't know. I don't know. 0:26:12.560 --> 0:26:15.300 I don't see anything. OK, so Enoch and, uh, Elijah. 0:26:15.359 --> 0:26:17.759 So when, when John writes, no one has ever gone 0:26:17.759 --> 0:26:20.359 to heaven and returned, remember, both of those people in 0:26:20.359 --> 0:26:24.468 the Old Testament, they did not return. They went to heaven. Uh, 0:26:24.599 --> 0:26:27.440 they were, uh, they were there on earth and then 0:26:27.440 --> 0:26:29.320 they were taken up. So Elijah went up to be 0:26:29.320 --> 0:26:33.759 with the Lord, and so did Enoch, and, um, and, um. 0:26:34.849 --> 0:26:36.770 You know, and so now here Jesus is saying, I've 0:26:36.770 --> 0:26:39.409 come from heaven and I'm coming down here to earth, 0:26:39.609 --> 0:26:41.488 and he's the only one that who has done that. 0:26:43.070 --> 0:26:45.359 I think that's the, you know, so those two did 0:26:45.359 --> 0:26:48.030 not come back down. They, they, they stayed up, they're 0:26:48.030 --> 0:26:48.550 with the Lord. 0:26:49.530 --> 0:26:50.489 What do you think, Noah? 0:26:51.879 --> 0:26:55.159 That's perfect. Thank you very much. Anything to add, Brian? 0:26:56.400 --> 0:27:02.050 Um, anything to add, um, that's true, and you know, 0:27:02.729 --> 0:27:07.748 let's just add, no, none of your heresy, none of your, yeah, yeah, no. 0:27:10.849 --> 0:27:12.869 No, there was, I did have a thought, but it 0:27:13.330 --> 0:27:16.770 escaped me. We ruined it for you. Sorry. I don't 0:27:16.770 --> 0:27:20.468 know about Enoch, Elijah, Moses. 0:27:21.739 --> 0:27:26.179 No, and our guy Noah, OK, um, no, no, I, 0:27:26.259 --> 0:27:28.499 I wouldn't even bring it up because it's, it's something 0:27:28.499 --> 0:27:30.738 else about the text, but it doesn't matter. I mean, 0:27:30.820 --> 0:27:33.540 and Phil's answer is great, and Noah's got, he's, he's happy, 0:27:33.700 --> 0:27:36.940 so Noah's happy. So let's move, let's move on. 0:27:38.030 --> 0:27:38.849 Noah, are you good? 0:27:40.229 --> 0:27:42.219 Yes sir, thank you guys for all you guys do. 0:27:42.459 --> 0:27:45.229 All right, thanks, Noah. Yes, thank you for calling us 0:27:45.229 --> 0:27:53.790 today here on Pastor's Perspective at 888-564-6173. 888-564-6173 is the 0:27:53.790 --> 0:27:55.708 number to call us today. We're going to be here. 0:27:55.910 --> 0:27:59.759 Until 4 o'clock and we would love to hear from you. We, 0:27:59.940 --> 0:28:03.680 meaning me, Brian Perez, along with pastors Brian Broderson and 0:28:03.680 --> 0:28:07.478 Phil Metzger. Did Jesus go descend into hell after he 0:28:07.479 --> 0:28:09.520 died on the cross to preach to the lost in 0:28:09.520 --> 0:28:13.520 hell prior to the resurrection? Gina's asking that question on 0:28:13.520 --> 0:28:17.119 the pastor's perspective Facebook Messenger. She's in Covina. What do 0:28:17.119 --> 0:28:17.679 you say, Brian? 0:28:19.259 --> 0:28:23.080 Well, um, yeah, I mean, it depends on what you 0:28:23.080 --> 0:28:28.239 mean by hell. So, um, you know, hell, there's different, 0:28:28.900 --> 0:28:34.458 there's different terms, um, that sometimes get translated with the same. 0:28:35.180 --> 0:28:38.889 Uh, English word hell, and that's usually in the older translations. 0:28:38.940 --> 0:28:42.940 I think the newer translations have clarified. Um, one that's 0:28:42.940 --> 0:28:48.979 translated hell is, uh, from the word, um Gehenna, which 0:28:48.979 --> 0:28:51.820 is like the place of fire. It's like when you 0:28:51.820 --> 0:28:54.540 think of hell, this is, this is the word Gehenna, 0:28:54.979 --> 0:28:59.580 that's translated hell, but then there's also, um, the word Hades, 0:29:00.020 --> 0:29:03.560 which is more properly understood to be the grave. 0:29:03.950 --> 0:29:06.450 Um, or, you know, kind of the. 0:29:07.550 --> 0:29:10.450 Underworld, if you will. That's what Hades originally referred to. 0:29:10.869 --> 0:29:17.709 And there is the passage in Luke 16, where uh Jesus, 0:29:18.030 --> 0:29:20.450 you know, he tells a story and he speaks of 0:29:20.450 --> 0:29:21.060 um 0:29:22.389 --> 0:29:25.749 Lazarus, who dies and he goes to uh the place 0:29:25.749 --> 0:29:28.389 of comfort, the bosom of Abraham, and then the rich man, 0:29:28.430 --> 0:29:32.509 he died and he went into a place of torment. 0:29:33.129 --> 0:29:37.670 And um so we'll have to finish answering this when 0:29:37.859 --> 0:29:40.700 we get back from the break, right? Right, cause it 0:29:40.700 --> 0:29:46.339 is break time on Pastor's perspective 888-564-6173. Gina, thank you 0:29:46.339 --> 0:29:50.509 for sending in your question through the Pastor's Perspective Facebook 0:29:50.739 --> 0:29:56.540 page using messenger, but we wanna hear from you. 888-564-6173. 0:29:56.660 --> 0:30:00.259 More calls and questions coming up right here on Pastor's Perspective. 0:30:18.670 --> 0:30:24.450 We're back on Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is the number to call. 0:30:24.869 --> 0:30:28.810 Pastors Brian Broderson and Phil Metzger here until 4 o'clock. 0:30:28.940 --> 0:30:33.550 So call in. We'd love to hear from you at 888-564-6173. 0:30:33.660 --> 0:30:35.589 0 yeah, before we go to the phones, we were 0:30:35.589 --> 0:30:39.389 finishing up our discussion with Gina. Yes, and um, OK, 0:30:39.550 --> 0:30:42.270 so I'm, I'm just, I wanna get to this part, um. 0:30:42.889 --> 0:30:47.849 Some people teach, which is, this is incorrect, that Jesus 0:30:47.849 --> 0:30:53.889 went to hell and he battled the demons and so 0:30:53.889 --> 0:30:57.509 forth and, you know, conquered Satan in hell, and then, 0:30:57.849 --> 0:31:01.248 you know, that that's how he got the victory and 0:31:01.249 --> 0:31:04.410 then then he rose. That that's not right. That's not true. 0:31:04.489 --> 0:31:08.170 There's nothing biblically to support that. But again, that if you, 0:31:08.249 --> 0:31:09.930 if you have just the word hell, 0:31:10.270 --> 0:31:12.690 And you know, if your theology is a little bit 0:31:12.690 --> 0:31:15.070 cloudy when it comes to like what is hell like 0:31:15.070 --> 0:31:17.190 and who's in hell, and you think like, oh, the 0:31:17.190 --> 0:31:19.389 devil's in hell and Jesus goes down there and and 0:31:19.389 --> 0:31:25.540 fights with him, uh, to to free the captives, that's incorrect. 0:31:26.030 --> 0:31:31.520 So Jesus doesn't go to preach to the lost. The so. 0:31:32.099 --> 0:31:35.259 If you take Luke 16 and you, you take it 0:31:35.259 --> 0:31:40.219 as a description of of what goes on in the 0:31:40.219 --> 0:31:45.099 afterlife before Jesus comes, you've got the place of the 0:31:45.099 --> 0:31:45.940 righteous dead. 0:31:46.690 --> 0:31:49.609 The bosom of Abraham, you've got the place of the 0:31:49.609 --> 0:31:53.129 wicked dead. That's the place where the the rich man 0:31:53.129 --> 0:31:57.989 is in torment. So Jesus goes to the bosom of Abraham, 0:31:58.259 --> 0:32:01.530 the place of the righteous dead, and there he doesn't 0:32:01.530 --> 0:32:02.869 preach to them like 0:32:03.530 --> 0:32:06.170 Let me give you an evangelistic message, and then you 0:32:06.170 --> 0:32:07.930 need to respond to it so you can get saved 0:32:07.930 --> 0:32:10.580 and get out of here. He proclaims to them because 0:32:10.580 --> 0:32:12.739 they're the righteous dead, they're the ones who trusted in 0:32:12.739 --> 0:32:16.080 God already. He proclaims to them that he is the, 0:32:16.219 --> 0:32:19.570 you know, the deliverer, and he delivers them. So, um, 0:32:19.580 --> 0:32:24.170 Ephesians 4 says that he led captivity captive. He he 0:32:24.170 --> 0:32:27.040 gave gifts to people. He, he 0:32:27.084 --> 0:32:30.384 descended into, now this is where the problem comes. Uh, 0:32:30.494 --> 0:32:32.645 he descended into the lower parts of the earth. Some 0:32:32.645 --> 0:32:36.655 people say, OK, that's where he goes down into Hades. Well, like, 0:32:37.084 --> 0:32:39.805 like the NIV for example, says he descended into the 0:32:39.805 --> 0:32:43.363 lower regions, speaking of the earth, talking about the incarnation, 0:32:43.464 --> 0:32:45.884 talking about him coming down. So this is an area 0:32:45.884 --> 0:32:52.285 where there's a little bit of theological disagreement or debate. So, um, 0:32:52.364 --> 0:32:55.565 but I think it's safe to say that Jesus did proclaim. 0:32:56.139 --> 0:33:00.099 Uh, when it, you know, the prophecy from, um, Isaiah 0:33:00.099 --> 0:33:04.619 61 that is, uh, Jesus actually quotes himself in Luke 0:33:04.619 --> 0:33:09.119 chapter 4 in the synagogue, is that he came to, uh, 0:33:09.820 --> 0:33:12.780 To set free the captives, and I think that that's 0:33:12.780 --> 0:33:16.339 a reference to the righteous dead at that point. Phil Metzger, 0:33:16.580 --> 0:33:17.229 anything to add? 0:33:18.810 --> 0:33:21.359 No, good stuff. Yes, indeed, Gina, thank you so much 0:33:21.359 --> 0:33:24.729 for sending in your question through the pastor's perspective Facebook 0:33:24.729 --> 0:33:27.889 page using Messenger. Now we're gonna talk to Raul in 0:33:27.889 --> 0:33:31.129 San Jacinto, who listens to us on K-wave. Hello, what's 0:33:31.129 --> 0:33:31.989 your question, Raul? 0:33:34.280 --> 0:33:36.629 Hey guys, how are you doing? Doing well. Thanks for 0:33:36.629 --> 0:33:39.379 calling 888-564-6173. 0:33:41.499 --> 0:33:46.280 So I've always been a Calvary Chapel student of the Bible, um, 0:33:46.339 --> 0:33:49.920 raised at Calvary Chapel close to Mesa with Pastor Chuck, um, 0:33:50.550 --> 0:33:53.580 and I recently started going to a Calvary Chapel out 0:33:53.580 --> 0:33:57.780 towards my house and me and my wife noticed that 0:33:57.780 --> 0:34:02.780 they kept bringing up Calvary Chapel Association and Calvary Chapel Global. 0:34:03.780 --> 0:34:05.459 Can you tell me a little bit more of what 0:34:05.459 --> 0:34:07.660 the difference is? What do you mean they kept bringing 0:34:07.660 --> 0:34:09.379 it up, like from the stage or what? 0:34:10.959 --> 0:34:14.879 Um, no, and, and because we're part of leadership. We're, we're, 0:34:15.050 --> 0:34:17.729 we're the leaders over the marriage couples, and during our 0:34:17.729 --> 0:34:22.130 leadership meetings, they would bring up, um, Calvary Chapel Global 0:34:22.130 --> 0:34:26.890 being separate, uh, and we're Calvary Chapel Association, and I'm 0:34:26.890 --> 0:34:30.810 just kind of confused. I know we're Calvary Chapel. I 0:34:30.810 --> 0:34:33.509 know we've been taught verse by verse, book by book. 0:34:34.998 --> 0:34:38.520 Can, can I ask one more question, Raul, um, like what, I, 0:34:38.600 --> 0:34:41.279 I'm just curious, like why would that come up in 0:34:41.280 --> 0:34:45.629 a conversation during a staff meeting? Like what, what's the 0:34:45.630 --> 0:34:48.959 context for that even being a topic? 0:34:50.330 --> 0:34:52.939 That's why I'm confused. We were going to, we were 0:34:52.939 --> 0:34:57.759 going through the distinctive Gary Chapo distinctives when they came up. OK, 0:34:57.979 --> 0:34:58.380 got you. 0:34:59.359 --> 0:35:00.099 All right, well, 0:35:00.978 --> 0:35:03.948 Um, I think Phil can answer that question. 0:35:06.860 --> 0:35:12.899 The El Presidente of the global network. Oh, it was 0:35:12.899 --> 0:35:14.669 perfect timing for that right there, huh. 0:35:16.489 --> 0:35:19.620 Yeah, I mean, golly, that really, it really does confuse 0:35:19.620 --> 0:35:22.419 me why that would come up in any kind of a, 0:35:22.580 --> 0:35:26.590 you know, um, context of like church like that, um. 0:35:27.759 --> 0:35:29.509 If I could be frank, and I will, and I'm, 0:35:29.560 --> 0:35:32.209 I'm OK with what people will say or whatnot, is 0:35:32.479 --> 0:35:34.959 there tends to be a, uh, careful, you might be 0:35:34.959 --> 0:35:35.979 branded a false teacher. 0:35:36.759 --> 0:35:39.640 Yeah, yeah, hey, I'll, I'll be joining a good club. 0:35:39.679 --> 0:35:44.109 It's like, uh, yeah, there, there, you know, there are 0:35:44.110 --> 0:35:48.080 two different groups that are Calvary Chapel, and, um, since 0:35:48.080 --> 0:35:50.748 Pastor Chuck had passed away, there's just kind of like, and, 0:35:50.840 --> 0:35:54.439 and honestly, there's been multiple expressions of Calvary Chapel throughout 0:35:54.439 --> 0:35:56.880 the years of just different people with different, you know, 0:35:57.120 --> 0:35:59.439 great people, great men that God's called that are doing 0:35:59.439 --> 0:36:01.959 a good work, and they're, they're doing it the way 0:36:01.959 --> 0:36:03.199 that they feel like they're supposed to do it. They 0:36:03.199 --> 0:36:05.060 got a different name, they just go in their own direction. 0:36:05.919 --> 0:36:10.399 Uh, Calvary Global Network is a, is Calvary Chapel, and, um, 0:36:10.479 --> 0:36:12.270 but for some who are not a part of the 0:36:12.270 --> 0:36:16.600 Calvary Global Network, they feel like, you know, they're, they're, they're, they're, 0:36:16.699 --> 0:36:20.060 they're maybe wanting to draw out the distinctions, uh, or 0:36:20.060 --> 0:36:23.719 the separation between two groups more than, um, they probably 0:36:23.719 --> 0:36:26.120 should be. And frankly, I think it comes down to 0:36:26.120 --> 0:36:29.479 being divisive. I don't see any value in it. 0:36:29.840 --> 0:36:33.790 Um, we have nonstop conversations within Calvary Global Network and 0:36:33.790 --> 0:36:35.719 we do it to the whole world all the time 0:36:35.719 --> 0:36:38.479 to say, hey, we know some people hear these things. 0:36:38.560 --> 0:36:42.189 Let's talk about it because, um, you know, frankly, it's 0:36:42.189 --> 0:36:44.479 usually not true, and, or if it is, let's have 0:36:44.479 --> 0:36:47.080 a conversation so that you can hear it right from 0:36:47.080 --> 0:36:51.589 the source. Um, I don't know in what world the 0:36:51.590 --> 0:36:56.399 distinctions would have separated, uh, Calvary's. Uh, I'm kind of 0:36:56.399 --> 0:36:58.549 where you're at too, dude. I'm, I think we're just 0:36:58.550 --> 0:36:59.479 like Calvary Chapel. 0:36:59.890 --> 0:37:02.729 And, um, for better and worse, right? We are who 0:37:02.729 --> 0:37:05.489 we are and um we're just asking for God to 0:37:05.489 --> 0:37:08.439 bless and God to work, but we do have some differences, 0:37:08.649 --> 0:37:12.290 but those differences are in the secondary and tertiary areas, 0:37:12.370 --> 0:37:16.109 nothing of any like, um, theological significance. 0:37:16.550 --> 0:37:18.659 Um, what's really important, if I could just say this, 0:37:18.669 --> 0:37:20.909 and then I'll, I'll stop talking, what's really important for 0:37:20.909 --> 0:37:24.070 us in the Calvary Global Network is the importance of, um, we, 0:37:24.169 --> 0:37:27.390 we love, we wanna continue to take risks, um, for 0:37:27.390 --> 0:37:29.590 the sake of the gospel, for reaching people, so we 0:37:29.590 --> 0:37:32.350 have an open hand as it relates to the kingdom 0:37:32.350 --> 0:37:34.270 of God towards believers. 0:37:34.649 --> 0:37:37.299 And so we have our perspectives, right? We hold to 0:37:37.300 --> 0:37:40.540 a particular eschatological, which is the, the view of the 0:37:40.540 --> 0:37:44.090 end times. We have our kind of our perspective, but 0:37:44.090 --> 0:37:46.219 as we were saying earlier, we recognize there's a lot 0:37:46.219 --> 0:37:49.100 of great and godly people that have a different perspective 0:37:49.100 --> 0:37:51.520 than we do. In the Calvary Global Network, we say, 0:37:51.630 --> 0:37:54.209 God bless you, we love you, you are not an enemy, 0:37:54.540 --> 0:37:57.259 we're thankful for you. And so we have a lot 0:37:57.259 --> 0:38:00.140 of freedom in the Calvary Global Network, and um we 0:38:00.140 --> 0:38:00.640 love that. 0:38:00.969 --> 0:38:03.810 And we don't wanna push that freedom to say others 0:38:03.810 --> 0:38:05.649 are bad or wrong, but this is who we are 0:38:05.649 --> 0:38:09.209 and we like who we are. So I'm, that's, that's 0:38:09.209 --> 0:38:12.050 kind of disappointing, and I'm sorry for you. Um, you 0:38:12.050 --> 0:38:14.159 shouldn't have to deal with that stuff now. If these 0:38:14.159 --> 0:38:18.729 are secondary and tertiary issues, why do they try to 0:38:18.729 --> 0:38:20.968 make them primary, would you say? 0:38:22.649 --> 0:38:25.549 Well, I, you know, honestly, I think some people don't. 0:38:26.669 --> 0:38:30.169 Recognize that that that they are not primary issues. I think, 0:38:30.219 --> 0:38:32.449 I think for some people that they, they have become 0:38:32.449 --> 0:38:34.499 primary issues. I think, I think it's hard for them 0:38:34.498 --> 0:38:40.100 to see that, um, you know, no, this isn't a 0:38:40.100 --> 0:38:43.498 hill to die on kind of an issue, you know. And, 0:38:43.580 --> 0:38:47.100 and so, I mean, I think when you're kind of 0:38:47.100 --> 0:38:50.630 like when it's like any theology, so you know, Calvary 0:38:50.630 --> 0:38:55.040 Chapel has a a kind of a loose theological position. 0:38:55.610 --> 0:38:57.850 That you could kind of go through and just, you know, 0:38:58.009 --> 0:39:00.209 kind of say, yeah, Calvary believes this and Calvary believes 0:39:00.209 --> 0:39:04.669 that and so forth. Um, and it's fine. But when you, 0:39:04.890 --> 0:39:08.189 but when you take your theological position, whether you're Calvary 0:39:08.189 --> 0:39:11.449 Chapel or anybody else for that matter, when you take 0:39:11.449 --> 0:39:16.109 your theological position and you kind of just entrench yourself 0:39:16.110 --> 0:39:18.890 in it, and you see it as like this is 0:39:18.890 --> 0:39:21.409 the right position, um, 0:39:22.270 --> 0:39:26.149 It's hard for you to sort of navigate people with 0:39:26.149 --> 0:39:29.439 a different position, you know, it's hard for you to like, well, no, 0:39:29.520 --> 0:39:32.320 this is right. And uh, you know, and some, some 0:39:32.320 --> 0:39:35.399 people are just like that, you know, they just, they can't, 0:39:35.719 --> 0:39:39.479 they just can't really handle like 0:39:40.270 --> 0:39:41.060 That maybe 0:39:41.939 --> 0:39:45.550 I could be wrong about something or, or, or, you know, 0:39:45.590 --> 0:39:49.770 that this isn't, this isn't a deal that, that is, uh, 0:39:49.830 --> 0:39:52.219 you know, something that we, we should go to war over. 0:39:52.509 --> 0:39:54.340 And listen, I mean, this is the history of the church, 0:39:54.429 --> 0:39:56.689 you know, it's sadly, I mean, this is nothing new. 0:39:56.770 --> 0:40:02.759 This is like church history is replete with these all 0:40:02.759 --> 0:40:07.969 history all church history is, you know, people just get 0:40:07.969 --> 0:40:09.550 entrenched in a view. 0:40:10.030 --> 0:40:12.959 And then they hunker down in it and it's like 0:40:12.959 --> 0:40:16.719 they're gonna be immovable and then they, they, they tend 0:40:16.719 --> 0:40:20.040 to isolate because, you know, we're right and other people 0:40:20.040 --> 0:40:23.110 are wrong and you know, as Phil was saying that, 0:40:23.140 --> 0:40:27.159 you know, there's I, I think there's a um. 0:40:27.939 --> 0:40:29.949 I think you could be movement minded. 0:40:31.860 --> 0:40:34.419 So much so that you, you kind of lose the 0:40:34.419 --> 0:40:41.590 big picture of kingdom. And, um, I think our position is, 0:40:41.739 --> 0:40:46.739 is really, we, we intentionally are kingdom-minded. We want to 0:40:46.739 --> 0:40:49.729 think beyond the movement. Think, we praise the Lord for 0:40:49.729 --> 0:40:53.739 the movement, you know, we're like, I've never been anything 0:40:53.739 --> 0:40:57.419 but Calvary Chapel, neither has Phil. So, you know, it's 0:40:57.419 --> 0:40:59.218 like this is, this is who we are. It is, 0:40:59.300 --> 0:41:00.520 it is our DNA. 0:41:01.120 --> 0:41:07.899 Um, but I recognize the kingdom of God is, it's vast, 0:41:08.370 --> 0:41:13.209 and I wanna, I wanna be able to freely move 0:41:13.209 --> 0:41:18.130 within the kingdom and not be restricted or judged because 0:41:18.130 --> 0:41:20.689 I'm moving within the kingdom, so. 0:41:21.969 --> 0:41:24.489 And what are these distinctives, oh, go ahead, Phil. 0:41:25.290 --> 0:41:26.959 No, no, no, I just, then I'll be quick on this. 0:41:27.009 --> 0:41:28.530 I was just gonna say like to the point that 0:41:28.530 --> 0:41:30.570 we were talking earlier, this is what it looks like 0:41:30.570 --> 0:41:35.199 when you make every theological perspective an exclamation point. Right? 0:41:35.770 --> 0:41:37.890 So then somebody has a little bit of a different 0:41:37.890 --> 0:41:40.610 view on something that really the church has been questioning 0:41:40.610 --> 0:41:40.850 and one. 0:41:41.300 --> 0:41:44.340 for 2000 years and you're like, no, this is the 0:41:44.340 --> 0:41:47.379 view and um and that creates that kind of division. 0:41:47.429 --> 0:41:49.919 So yeah, sorry, Brian, go ahead. Now it's just kind 0:41:49.919 --> 0:41:52.669 of because we hear about the Calvary distinctives and and 0:41:52.669 --> 0:41:54.299 what are those? I mean we don't have to go 0:41:54.300 --> 0:41:55.899 through all of them or anything, but why is that 0:41:55.899 --> 0:41:59.540 brought up as if you don't follow this as you know, 0:41:59.580 --> 0:42:02.419 the 67th book in the Bible then. 0:42:02.810 --> 0:42:05.408 There's something wrong. Yeah, and you know, I mean, that 0:42:05.409 --> 0:42:08.810 was certainly never the intention of the Calvary distinctives and 0:42:08.810 --> 0:42:11.120 there there were some people even back when Pastor Chuck 0:42:11.120 --> 0:42:15.130 was alive. OK, so the Calvary Distinctive, um, it is 0:42:15.130 --> 0:42:22.770 a book that was basically transcriptions from a class that 0:42:22.770 --> 0:42:27.609 Pastor Chuck taught, uh, at the Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa 0:42:27.610 --> 0:42:28.409 School of Ministry. 0:42:28.820 --> 0:42:31.859 So he taught a class and then, you know, they 0:42:31.860 --> 0:42:34.380 would record what he taught in the class. It was 0:42:34.380 --> 0:42:37.819 a class for people in ministry and at some point 0:42:37.820 --> 0:42:42.259 somebody took those uh those tapes, I can say tapes 0:42:42.259 --> 0:42:45.339 because I think they probably weren't tapes back then, um, 0:42:45.780 --> 0:42:49.939 and they transcribed them and then somebody had the idea, let's, 0:42:50.020 --> 0:42:51.580 you know, let's put them in a book and call 0:42:51.580 --> 0:42:53.459 them the distinctives and 0:42:53.959 --> 0:42:58.860 So they're, they're basically just in one sense, they are 0:42:59.399 --> 0:43:03.550 a kind of a theological position of Calvary Chapel. Um, 0:43:03.699 --> 0:43:07.130 but in another sense, they're they're almost um 0:43:08.130 --> 0:43:14.310 An expression of Pastor Chuck's conviction over certain things. And um, 0:43:14.570 --> 0:43:17.719 so I look, I was, I was in, um, you know, 0:43:17.810 --> 0:43:20.520 I was in conversations and meetings with Pastor Chuck where 0:43:20.520 --> 0:43:26.290 people actually would try to insist that the distinctives had 0:43:26.290 --> 0:43:30.290 to become like the um 0:43:31.870 --> 0:43:34.630 You know what the 39 articles are to Anglicanism, the 0:43:34.630 --> 0:43:37.948 distinctives had to become to Calvary Chapel. This is, this 0:43:37.949 --> 0:43:44.239 is the, um, kind of, um, this is the guide for, 0:43:44.350 --> 0:43:47.509 for Calvary Chapel or the Westminster confession. What the Westminster 0:43:47.509 --> 0:43:50.630 confession is to Presbyterianism, the distinctives are going to be 0:43:50.630 --> 0:43:54.929 that to Calvary Chapel. In other words, you gotta swear 0:43:54.929 --> 0:43:56.049 to uphold. 0:43:56.719 --> 0:44:00.158 Uh, the distinctives if you want to really be a 0:44:00.159 --> 0:44:02.880 coward Chapel. And I was in a number of meetings 0:44:02.880 --> 0:44:04.949 where people would suggest that and Chuck would shoot it 0:44:04.949 --> 0:44:07.030 down in a second. I mean he would, he wouldn't 0:44:07.030 --> 0:44:09.540 even entertain it, you know, for him, it was just like, 0:44:10.540 --> 0:44:12.780 That's a stupid idea. Uh, let's move on to the 0:44:12.780 --> 0:44:16.499 next topic, you know, so, uh, but some people have 0:44:16.498 --> 0:44:20.669 actually done that with it. And I think that that is, um, 0:44:21.509 --> 0:44:24.429 Unfortunate, you know, it's, it's fine to look at it 0:44:24.429 --> 0:44:27.049 and say, yeah, there's some good stuff in here, and 0:44:27.350 --> 0:44:30.590 generally speaking, yeah, this is what Calvary believe. But when 0:44:30.590 --> 0:44:32.549 it comes to some of the practices, you know, one 0:44:32.550 --> 0:44:34.469 of the things in there, Pastor Chuck had a really 0:44:34.469 --> 0:44:37.469 difficult time with anybody standing during worship. I mean, it 0:44:37.469 --> 0:44:40.229 just like drove him out of his mind if you 0:44:40.229 --> 0:44:42.550 stood up during worship. He couldn't. 0:44:43.350 --> 0:44:47.520 He just wasn't able to believe that you could do 0:44:47.520 --> 0:44:51.320 that without trying to draw attention to yourself somehow. And 0:44:51.320 --> 0:44:53.679 this is partially because of his upbringing, you know, he 0:44:53.679 --> 0:44:55.899 grew up in the Pentecostal Church and that's what they did. 0:44:55.959 --> 0:44:58.800 And I, you know, Chuck was my father-in-law, so I, 0:44:58.959 --> 0:45:01.248 you know, plenty of conversations with him. And I even 0:45:01.310 --> 0:45:02.830 I said to him at times, I said, look, I said, 0:45:02.909 --> 0:45:05.589 you know, look, this is really just your opinion because you, 0:45:05.830 --> 0:45:08.029 I mean, do you, do you know for sure that 0:45:08.030 --> 0:45:11.870 everybody who's standing is really saying deep down inside, look 0:45:11.870 --> 0:45:15.649 at me. Don't look at Jesus, look at me, you know, so, 0:45:15.909 --> 0:45:18.669 but he expressed that and then it got written in 0:45:18.669 --> 0:45:22.270 the book and I know people who literally took it 0:45:22.270 --> 0:45:27.780 as this is gospel. You can't have anybody standing during worship. Wow. So, 0:45:28.030 --> 0:45:28.350 you know. 0:45:29.689 --> 0:45:33.459 But yet there's probably these CCA churches where they do 0:45:33.459 --> 0:45:36.540 stand during worship, or maybe not. I don't know. That's 0:45:36.540 --> 0:45:38.658 just crazy. Yeah, but there's some that would say all 0:45:38.659 --> 0:45:40.219 the distincts just say not to do that. But there 0:45:40.219 --> 0:45:42.620 are some that just say, well, you know, with that 0:45:42.620 --> 0:45:45.580 point they would just say, well, you know, we kind 0:45:45.580 --> 0:45:46.199 of just 0:45:46.515 --> 0:45:48.834 Don't pay attention to that all of a sudden. So, 0:45:48.873 --> 0:45:52.554 you know, a little change the rules. That's actually been expressed. That's, that's, I've, 0:45:52.755 --> 0:45:55.284 that's been expressed like, well, that one is a different one, 0:45:55.314 --> 0:45:58.274 and that's the point. Once you do that, once you 0:45:58.274 --> 0:46:01.554 do that, and I, I, I respect people that at 0:46:01.554 --> 0:46:02.955 least said that because that's. 0:46:03.419 --> 0:46:06.020 I would put it, the very nature of a distinctive 0:46:06.020 --> 0:46:08.919 is that this is more in the area of secondary 0:46:08.919 --> 0:46:12.779 and tertiary. It's clearly not, you know, it's not a, 0:46:12.899 --> 0:46:16.020 it's not a theological gospel like this is about salvation 0:46:16.020 --> 0:46:18.540 kind of an issue. And you gotta remember like, and 0:46:18.540 --> 0:46:22.199 I mean, I've read the distinctives many, many times, and 0:46:22.929 --> 0:46:26.449 They're not distinct even from that many other churches, and 0:46:26.449 --> 0:46:28.850 I'm not, this is not a putdown, but like, when 0:46:28.850 --> 0:46:31.040 we make, um, when we say, for instance, and I, 0:46:31.090 --> 0:46:33.330 I so loved the chapter that Chuck would do on 0:46:33.330 --> 0:46:36.610 like the supremacy of love, but we're not the only 0:46:36.610 --> 0:46:39.009 church movement in the history of the world that has 0:46:39.009 --> 0:46:41.569 decided that love should be supreme in our movement. 0:46:42.370 --> 0:46:45.239 But Chuck is saying, and he never even claimed that, 0:46:45.300 --> 0:46:47.890 what he is saying is, I want it to be 0:46:47.890 --> 0:46:51.089 important to our movement. He's never said we are the 0:46:51.090 --> 0:46:53.169 only ones. So once you make this like it's some 0:46:53.169 --> 0:46:57.149 kind of an exclusive book to our movement, rather than 0:46:57.239 --> 0:47:01.870 it's a great expression of some particular perspectives or distinctives 0:47:02.050 --> 0:47:03.409 for Calvary, and um, 0:47:04.748 --> 0:47:07.419 Brian and I both like we're cutting Calvary Chapel, like 0:47:07.419 --> 0:47:10.669 that's all we've ever known, and, um, probably hold to 0:47:10.669 --> 0:47:13.029 the distinctives more than maybe a lot of Calvary guys 0:47:13.030 --> 0:47:16.140 do if we're honest, um, but also we want to 0:47:16.140 --> 0:47:19.229 have the ability to say, but the kingdom is greater 0:47:19.229 --> 0:47:22.209 than all distinctives, it's the kingdom of God first. 0:47:23.290 --> 0:47:28.009 So Raul, does, I mean, he's probably more confused than ever. Yeah, 0:47:28.090 --> 0:47:31.609 we're just rambling on here. Are we, are we helping 0:47:31.610 --> 0:47:34.810 you at all? OK, good. 0:47:35.580 --> 0:47:38.870 Well, good, we do, we wanna be an encouragement. So, 0:47:39.259 --> 0:47:43.020 but don't necessarily take this information and, and what like 0:47:43.020 --> 0:47:45.299 don't go to the next staff meeting and start saying 0:47:45.300 --> 0:47:47.300 you guys are all wrong, or should he like our 0:47:47.300 --> 0:47:50.060 previous caller Natalie from Nevada who was like, well, you know, 0:47:50.100 --> 0:47:51.939 the funny standing up for you guys, you know, people 0:47:51.939 --> 0:47:55.299 would ask me because, you know, CGN, you know, I 0:47:55.300 --> 0:47:58.459 started CGN 10 years ago and um. 0:47:58.770 --> 0:48:02.149 People, uh, you know, for some people it just became 0:48:02.149 --> 0:48:04.330 like the, the biggest deal in the world, you know, 0:48:04.439 --> 0:48:07.649 and it was, I mean, talked about in churches and 0:48:07.649 --> 0:48:10.489 from the pulpit and, you know, sometimes people would have 0:48:10.489 --> 0:48:12.860 pictures of me up on the stage saying beware of 0:48:12.860 --> 0:48:14.890 this guy, you know, he's really a bad guy and 0:48:14.890 --> 0:48:17.729 all of this kind of stuff. And, and then people 0:48:17.729 --> 0:48:20.659 would come to Calvary Costa Mesa and they would go like, yeah, well, 0:48:20.729 --> 0:48:23.360 like what about CGN and stuff? And people in Costa 0:48:23.360 --> 0:48:27.158 Mesa are like, uh, what's CGN? Uh we don't know 0:48:27.159 --> 0:48:28.370 anything about that. We've never heard of it. 0:48:28.860 --> 0:48:31.340 You know, we didn't make it a big deal. I mean, 0:48:31.380 --> 0:48:33.290 it was, you know, it, it wasn't a big deal. 0:48:33.459 --> 0:48:35.219 We're just, we're just, 0:48:35.830 --> 0:48:35.840 Like. 0:48:38.949 --> 0:48:41.270 I don't want to pull the Chuck card, but I will. Uh, 0:48:41.350 --> 0:48:45.790 we're just doing what Chuck taught us, which was basically, hey, 0:48:45.909 --> 0:48:50.149 just let the spirit lead and stick in, you know, stay, 0:48:50.380 --> 0:48:52.979 stay firmly in scripture and let the spirit lead and 0:48:52.989 --> 0:48:54.988 everything will be good. And that's, that's what we're doing. 0:48:56.040 --> 0:48:57.408 I had a, I had a guy in my church, 0:48:57.489 --> 0:49:00.130 he's like, hey, I, I heard you became like, I 0:49:00.130 --> 0:49:02.739 don't know, the president of something. Are you leaving this church? 0:49:02.919 --> 0:49:05.850 And I'm like, No, I'm not leaving the church. And what, 0:49:05.949 --> 0:49:07.850 what is this? I never heard of this. Like what, 0:49:07.969 --> 0:49:11.770 what is it, you know, so, and which I love 0:49:11.770 --> 0:49:13.209 because we've never made. 0:49:13.310 --> 0:49:15.469 That's what I've loved about Calvary my whole life. It's 0:49:15.469 --> 0:49:17.979 like we've never made it about the titles that we have. 0:49:18.229 --> 0:49:20.428 We've never made it about the education that we have 0:49:20.429 --> 0:49:23.229 or don't have. We've never made it about the, you know, 0:49:23.310 --> 0:49:25.709 it's not about these things. It's not about what group we're, 0:49:25.780 --> 0:49:28.189 it's just, we just wanted people to know Jesus, and I, 0:49:28.270 --> 0:49:31.790 I've always loved that about Calvary. Yeah, Raul, thanks for 0:49:31.790 --> 0:49:34.830 your question today on Pastor's perspective. Now we'll talk to 0:49:34.830 --> 0:49:40.549 Genevieve and Temecula. Thanks for calling us today at 888-564-6173. 0:49:41.719 --> 0:49:45.439 Hi, greetings, Talia. Anyways, uh, my question, um, it's more 0:49:45.439 --> 0:49:49.658 of a curiosity. Since we are presently living in the 0:49:49.709 --> 0:49:55.439 biblical world today, and everything is happening the way it 0:49:55.439 --> 0:49:59.840 says it's gonna happen, during the thousand-year reign, do you 0:49:59.840 --> 0:50:01.879 think there'll be another Bible written? 0:50:03.070 --> 0:50:03.540 Hm 0:50:04.498 --> 0:50:07.790 You know, Genevieve, that's a, that's a great question. Just 0:50:07.790 --> 0:50:11.259 because it's a question that that's a question that I've 0:50:11.259 --> 0:50:14.409 never heard anybody ask, right? So I saw that. I thought, wow, 0:50:14.469 --> 0:50:17.819 that's a good, that's a good thought. Um, I don't 0:50:17.820 --> 0:50:19.689 think so, but 0:50:20.270 --> 0:50:23.939 So for example, in Isaiah. 0:50:25.729 --> 0:50:29.449 This this beautiful promise in Isaiah, um, is it chapter 0:50:29.449 --> 0:50:34.509 1 or 2? It might be chapter 2, where, um, 0:50:34.850 --> 0:50:38.310 you know, that, that wonderful promise where the, um, 0:50:39.979 --> 0:50:44.949 The Lord, um, you know, nation will beat their swords 0:50:44.949 --> 0:50:47.989 into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks, and nation 0:50:47.989 --> 0:50:52.679 will not study war anymore. And, and it says there that, um, 0:50:52.790 --> 0:50:54.830 the people will say, come and let us go to 0:50:54.830 --> 0:50:58.030 the mountain of the Lord and to the house of 0:50:58.030 --> 0:51:02.310 our God, for He will teach us His ways, and 0:51:02.310 --> 0:51:05.830 we shall walk in its paths, for out of Zion. 0:51:06.239 --> 0:51:10.120 I shall go forth the the law of the Lord 0:51:10.120 --> 0:51:12.640 and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem. 0:51:13.459 --> 0:51:15.699 So I think, you know, you have a couple of 0:51:15.699 --> 0:51:19.520 things happening. So during the millennium, you have glorified people, 0:51:20.060 --> 0:51:24.259 you have those who, you know, have live in their 0:51:24.259 --> 0:51:27.620 resurrected bodies, and they rule and reign with Jesus. And 0:51:27.620 --> 0:51:30.658 then you have those that they rule and reign over, 0:51:31.070 --> 0:51:35.089 who are human beings who have either survived, you know, 0:51:35.169 --> 0:51:37.659 the final judgments and everything, uh, 0:51:38.199 --> 0:51:41.919 Or and gone into the kingdom, or they are actually 0:51:41.919 --> 0:51:46.199 born during this time of the kingdom. And I think, um, 0:51:46.360 --> 0:51:50.600 you know, with the glorified people, of course, there's no 0:51:50.600 --> 0:51:54.320 need for instruction. They're at that place, they're in the 0:51:54.320 --> 0:51:58.319 role of instructors. Um, but for the people on the earth, 0:51:58.399 --> 0:52:02.270 I think that there will be still instruction that's given. 0:52:02.320 --> 0:52:04.560 It says right there in that Isaiah passage that there 0:52:04.560 --> 0:52:05.919 will be instruction that's given. 0:52:06.560 --> 0:52:08.830 But I think I, this is just 0:52:09.770 --> 0:52:13.009 Speculation on my part. I mean, obviously, it will be 0:52:13.009 --> 0:52:16.780 modified to some extent because it won't, uh, you know, 0:52:17.179 --> 0:52:20.449 they're just things in the scripture that would not have 0:52:20.449 --> 0:52:23.319 application during that time. So I would just imagine that 0:52:23.459 --> 0:52:26.219 um it will be modified. But I don't think it'll 0:52:26.219 --> 0:52:27.419 be like a new Bible. 0:52:28.370 --> 0:52:32.439 Phil, what say you? Curious? No, I totally agree, and I, 0:52:32.949 --> 0:52:35.249 great question, great, great question, but I agree. I don't 0:52:35.248 --> 0:52:38.489 think there'll be a new, a new scripture, but it's 0:52:38.489 --> 0:52:41.290 gonna probably, you know, like, like the Bible already does 0:52:41.290 --> 0:52:43.929 for us for these thousands of years, it comes into 0:52:43.929 --> 0:52:45.850 like a new, we see it in an, we see 0:52:45.850 --> 0:52:47.759 it in a fresh way all of a sudden again, like, 0:52:47.800 --> 0:52:50.810 oh my gosh, I didn't, we didn't even imagine that yet, 0:52:50.890 --> 0:52:52.409 and now here we are, and I get, and I 0:52:52.409 --> 0:52:53.909 think too, Phil, from, um. 0:52:55.110 --> 0:52:57.350 From the Old Testament to the New Testament, you sort 0:52:57.350 --> 0:52:59.908 of have that kind of a thing, right? The Old 0:52:59.909 --> 0:53:02.429 Testament is still with us, and it's still valid, and 0:53:02.429 --> 0:53:05.870 it's still God's word. But we know that uh much 0:53:05.870 --> 0:53:09.899 of it has already been fulfilled. So we're not leaning 0:53:09.899 --> 0:53:13.699 on it or looking back to it or or necessarily, um, 0:53:14.030 --> 0:53:17.890 you know, following it in regard to certain aspects of it. 0:53:19.770 --> 0:53:20.770 Sounds good. 0:53:21.179 --> 0:53:26.299 Yeah, good thought. Thanks for calling. Yep, 888-564-6173. Got one 0:53:26.300 --> 0:53:28.729 from Facebook. I think we can squeeze this one in 0:53:28.739 --> 0:53:31.749 in the next two minutes. Dina wants to know why 0:53:31.748 --> 0:53:34.290 would the demon who possessed the slave girl cause her 0:53:34.290 --> 0:53:37.489 to follow the apostles and shout that they are servants 0:53:37.489 --> 0:53:39.620 of the Most High God who are telling the people 0:53:39.620 --> 0:53:40.998 the way to be saved. 0:53:41.498 --> 0:53:44.299 Was it done in a mocking tone or to try 0:53:44.300 --> 0:53:48.199 to sway the people following the apostles to also listen 0:53:48.199 --> 0:53:52.449 to her so the demon could ultimately deceive them? What 0:53:52.449 --> 0:53:52.899 do you think? 0:53:54.509 --> 0:53:56.159 Ah, no, I don't, I don't think it was done 0:53:56.159 --> 0:53:58.979 in a mocking way. I think it was just, um. 0:54:00.300 --> 0:54:02.949 Uh, it was an annoying thing for sure, because it 0:54:02.949 --> 0:54:07.499 actually says literally that Paul was annoyed. So, you know, 0:54:07.550 --> 0:54:10.830 it's just like a disruptive kind of a thing. But 0:54:10.830 --> 0:54:13.310 the irony, of course, is what she's saying is true. 0:54:13.669 --> 0:54:15.830 You know, so, yeah, it's a, it's a weird one. 0:54:15.939 --> 0:54:16.770 What do you think, Phil? 0:54:17.959 --> 0:54:21.669 I mean, it's completely bizarre and, and it's almost like I, 0:54:21.800 --> 0:54:23.479 I kind of have a sense that I definitely agree 0:54:23.479 --> 0:54:26.080 with you that this was not mockery. I don't believe 0:54:26.080 --> 0:54:28.880 the demons can do that, um, like in that way. 0:54:28.919 --> 0:54:30.860 I don't think they have that kind of authority, you know, 0:54:31.040 --> 0:54:32.859 and I actually think it's kind of more of a, 0:54:33.239 --> 0:54:35.800 I think we're kind of seeing into a spiritual world 0:54:35.800 --> 0:54:36.479 where it's like. 0:54:37.459 --> 0:54:41.580 The power of God is so great, right? So that, 0:54:41.949 --> 0:54:46.989 you know, the, that this demon possessed person couldn't but 0:54:46.989 --> 0:54:49.270 help to say what she was saying. It was like, 0:54:49.509 --> 0:54:51.989 It's like this, like you, you're, you're compelled, you know, 0:54:52.030 --> 0:54:54.669 it's as if this demon was compelled to acknowledge, I'm 0:54:54.669 --> 0:54:57.729 in the presence of, you know, this, this, and, uh, 0:54:58.070 --> 0:54:59.949 and then, but I love, I think the funny, the 0:54:59.949 --> 0:55:02.270 best part about it is Paul's like gets annoyed by it. I, 0:55:02.390 --> 0:55:05.350 I love that he's like, hey, knock it off, you know, 0:55:05.390 --> 0:55:06.939 it's kind of a, kind of an irony, but I 0:55:06.939 --> 0:55:09.229 definitely don't think it's mockery. I certainly believe it was 0:55:09.229 --> 0:55:12.509 more about like the demons didn't have options. They don't 0:55:12.509 --> 0:55:14.729 have a choice. They're gonna acknowledge the work of God. 0:55:15.600 --> 0:55:17.998 Dina, thanks for sending us your question through the pastor's 0:55:17.998 --> 0:55:23.659 perspective page, pastor's perspective Facebook page, I should say, using messenger. 0:55:23.748 --> 0:55:25.759 That's one of the ways you can get your questions 0:55:25.759 --> 0:55:27.600 to us, but uh we love to hear the sound 0:55:27.600 --> 0:55:30.799 of your voice, so call us tomorrow. Laura, here is 0:55:30.800 --> 0:55:33.280 a fast pass, it's good for tomorrow. Call us and 0:55:33.280 --> 0:55:36.229 we'll try to put you on as soon as possible. 0:55:36.439 --> 0:55:37.899 And uh Phil Metzger. 0:55:38.709 --> 0:55:40.949 We'll see you. Well, no, you'll be here on Thursday. 0:55:41.070 --> 0:55:43.310 I won't be here on Thursday. I'll be on assignment 0:55:43.310 --> 0:55:46.419 and then you'll go on assignment for a couple of weeks, 0:55:46.429 --> 0:55:48.390 and I'm sure you'll tell us about, all about that 0:55:48.390 --> 0:55:51.890 on Thursday. And then, uh, Brian, you'll be back tomorrow. 0:55:52.229 --> 0:55:54.270 That's right. Yes, yes. So we'll talk to you then. 0:55:54.390 --> 0:55:57.290 Thanks for watching and listening to Pastor's Perspective.