WEBVTT - Planning for Prosperity: Mature fleabane control with Angus Butterfield 0:00:00.020 --> 0:00:03.500 Controlling mature fleabane is tricky. With funding from the Hugh 0:00:03.530 --> 0:00:07.730 Williamson Foundation and the Australian Government's Future Drought Fund. BCG 0:00:07.760 --> 0:00:11.840 research agronomist Angus Butterfield completed a research project on controlling 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:15.350 mature fleabane, which is up next. The information shared is 0:00:15.350 --> 0:00:18.380 based on research conducted for the purpose of exploring fleabane 0:00:18.380 --> 0:00:22.880 control options, and should not be considered direct advice. Please 0:00:22.880 --> 0:00:26.690 note some herbicide rates and applications discussed may not align 0:00:26.690 --> 0:00:30.770 with registered label requirements or maximum residue limits. We strongly 0:00:30.770 --> 0:00:34.310 encourage you to consult your agronomist or local adviser before 0:00:34.340 --> 0:00:37.790 implementing any of the strategies covered here. They can provide 0:00:37.790 --> 0:00:42.110 guidance tailored to your conditions, ensure compliance with current label requirements, 0:00:42.110 --> 0:00:46.309 and help you adhere to MRL guidelines. This podcast is 0:00:46.310 --> 0:00:54.530 sponsored by Action Steel. Today, I'm speaking with BCG research 0:00:54.560 --> 0:00:58.639 agronomist Angus Butterfield about his research into summer fleabane control, 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:02.120 specifically when it's mature. So not when it's at the 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:06.110 rosette stage, but when it's elongated and it's mature because 0:01:06.110 --> 0:01:10.100 that's when people often have the trouble. So welcome, Angus. Thanks, Janine. 0:01:10.130 --> 0:01:12.170 Just for a start, can you give a little bit 0:01:12.170 --> 0:01:15.470 of a background on you and then why you are 0:01:15.470 --> 0:01:17.509 so interested in researching fleabane? 0:01:17.540 --> 0:01:20.960 I'm originally from the outskirts of Melbourne, just out of 0:01:20.959 --> 0:01:24.200 a town called Hurstbridge. Third year at the Birch Cropping 0:01:24.200 --> 0:01:27.979 Group as a research agronomist. And the reason that I'm 0:01:27.980 --> 0:01:29.900 interested in this stuff is because it has been such 0:01:29.930 --> 0:01:32.000 a big issue for a lot of our growers. There's 0:01:32.000 --> 0:01:36.200 been growers contacting us asking what is the solution for 0:01:36.200 --> 0:01:38.060 this sort of issue, especially with a few of our 0:01:38.060 --> 0:01:41.720 wet summers we've had recently. It's become an issue as 0:01:41.720 --> 0:01:44.360 it's so hard to kill with some of our knockdown herbicides. 0:01:44.390 --> 0:01:46.730 And where are most of those growers from? Angus. 0:01:46.730 --> 0:01:48.740 So most of those growers at the minute are in 0:01:48.770 --> 0:01:51.230 the mallee sort of region. So anywhere from all the 0:01:51.230 --> 0:01:53.660 way up past sort of Balranald, all the way down 0:01:53.660 --> 0:01:55.910 to Birchip, but we are seeing it start to spread 0:01:55.910 --> 0:01:57.800 more and more into the Wimmera as well as the 0:01:57.800 --> 0:01:58.610 North Central. 0:01:58.640 --> 0:02:00.050 And why are we seeing that? 0:02:00.050 --> 0:02:02.390 It's been around for a little while, more of a 0:02:02.390 --> 0:02:05.570 Queensland New South Wales weed, Wade. But a lot of 0:02:05.570 --> 0:02:07.700 guys I've been talking to have said after the floods 0:02:07.700 --> 0:02:10.460 we had about ten years ago, it's come in. And 0:02:10.460 --> 0:02:13.609 just due to how many wet summers we've had recently, 0:02:13.610 --> 0:02:16.010 it's become more and more of an issue. Obviously, if 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:17.540 we're going to dry summer, we're not going to see 0:02:17.540 --> 0:02:19.820 those weeds germinate over that time. So do you. 0:02:19.820 --> 0:02:22.880 Think that the flood water helped disperse the seeds. 0:02:22.880 --> 0:02:24.410 As it wasn't really around at the time? That's just 0:02:24.410 --> 0:02:26.510 what I've heard. But yes, I would have thought so. 0:02:26.510 --> 0:02:28.610 It's a windblown and I guess it can be spread 0:02:28.610 --> 0:02:30.830 by water as well. One of the biggest issues that 0:02:30.830 --> 0:02:33.139 they can spread from roadsides and fence lines. 0:02:33.169 --> 0:02:35.179 Okay. So can you tell me a little bit about 0:02:35.180 --> 0:02:37.579 fleabane and why it is so hard to control? 0:02:37.610 --> 0:02:41.630 Yeah. So it's it's a broadleaf weed. So it emerges 0:02:41.660 --> 0:02:46.459 sort of in that 10 to 30 degrees conditions. So 0:02:46.460 --> 0:02:49.460 we often see it emerge in springtime once it gets 0:02:49.460 --> 0:02:51.830 a bit of size about it. Its plant structure and 0:02:51.830 --> 0:02:54.410 phenology makes it really difficult to kill. It's quite tolerant 0:02:54.410 --> 0:02:58.940 to glyphosate, so your standard glyphosate spray won't really get 0:02:58.940 --> 0:03:00.320 into it. And the reason that is because it's got 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:04.610 a low stomata count. It's got quite a waxy plant tissue. 0:03:04.639 --> 0:03:07.370 It's got hairy leaves and they're quite small. So it's 0:03:07.370 --> 0:03:10.279 got all these sort of characteristics that sort of make 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:13.940 it hard for our herbicides to translocate into. So it's 0:03:13.940 --> 0:03:17.810 a surface germinating weed so often. Once upon a time 0:03:17.810 --> 0:03:20.840 in our till systems, we could control it just because 0:03:20.840 --> 0:03:23.480 once it gets buried, it's quite hard to germinate. Germinates 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:27.230 in our 1 to 2cm in depth. And also something 0:03:27.230 --> 0:03:29.270 makes it so hard is that you might only see 0:03:29.300 --> 0:03:32.570 1 or 2 weeds in your paddock because it produces 0:03:32.570 --> 0:03:37.490 about 100,000 weed seeds per plant. You can see that 0:03:37.490 --> 0:03:41.240 is a fair few and one where it can. Obviously, 0:03:41.270 --> 0:03:42.980 it can turn into a blowout in a number of 0:03:42.980 --> 0:03:43.940 years like quickly. 0:03:43.940 --> 0:03:47.450 So why do you think it's important to research fleabane 0:03:47.450 --> 0:03:50.780 control at this stage when it's mature? 0:03:50.810 --> 0:03:55.370 So we often see fleabane germinate in the springtime. So 0:03:55.370 --> 0:03:58.370 that's often under a crop. So it's quite easy to 0:03:58.370 --> 0:04:01.730 kill at those smaller growth stages. But we often don't 0:04:01.730 --> 0:04:04.550 get the chance to target them over those stages. So 0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:06.230 like for our lentils, the only sort of options we've 0:04:06.230 --> 0:04:09.620 got is until the end of harvest, which is desiccating. 0:04:09.620 --> 0:04:11.510 And if they've been sitting in the ground for two months, 0:04:11.510 --> 0:04:14.030 they've put a bit of a taproot in and they'll 0:04:14.030 --> 0:04:16.940 elongate pretty much as soon as it warms up so 0:04:16.970 --> 0:04:20.330 often hard to target them at those stages. Also, there's 0:04:20.330 --> 0:04:23.120 some residual control that you can do. But again, just 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:25.909 due to our love of lentils at the minute and 0:04:25.910 --> 0:04:28.010 our pulses, it's really hard to use any of those 0:04:28.010 --> 0:04:31.039 residual herbicides just due to plant back issues that we 0:04:31.040 --> 0:04:32.300 see with them now. 0:04:32.330 --> 0:04:34.880 Can you tell me about your research project? 0:04:34.910 --> 0:04:38.089 Yeah. So we're looking at during summer because obviously it 0:04:38.089 --> 0:04:40.520 does emerge quite early and we have actually seen it. 0:04:40.550 --> 0:04:43.670 I've seen two months ago at emerging in some crops. 0:04:43.670 --> 0:04:46.790 And if you've got something like lentils in or any 0:04:46.790 --> 0:04:49.909 sort of pulses apart from maybe chickpeas, there's no residual control. 0:04:49.910 --> 0:04:51.589 You can't spray it on top of it. You've sort 0:04:51.620 --> 0:04:55.190 of got to wait until you're desiccation stage. Same with 0:04:55.190 --> 0:04:57.799 your wheat. There's like there is some options, but then 0:04:57.830 --> 0:05:00.500 you're in terms of residual control, but then you're restricted 0:05:00.500 --> 0:05:03.110 to your rotation. And there's not much flexibility there. 0:05:03.140 --> 0:05:07.460 Right. So your research project is about fleabane control in 0:05:07.490 --> 0:05:11.719 that summer wheat period after harvest but before you put 0:05:11.720 --> 0:05:12.380 your next crop in. 0:05:12.410 --> 0:05:14.419 Yes. Over that summer fallow period. 0:05:14.450 --> 0:05:15.890 Okay. So what did you find? 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:19.040 So our research was a number of trials, but looking 0:05:19.040 --> 0:05:22.909 at that elongated fleabane. So when they mature a bit 0:05:22.910 --> 0:05:25.370 more natural tolerance to glyphosate and difficult to kill. We 0:05:25.370 --> 0:05:29.060 looked at a few different trials. First we looked at 0:05:29.240 --> 0:05:31.400 our first pass in the double knock situation. So we 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:34.339 looked at a bunch of Group four herbicides mixed with 0:05:34.339 --> 0:05:38.510 glyphosate with a standard paraquat terrador double knock. And then 0:05:38.510 --> 0:05:42.500 we looked at another trial with pretty standard sort of 0:05:42.500 --> 0:05:46.310 first passes with a range of different double knock options, 0:05:46.310 --> 0:05:48.830 usually a mixer with paraquat. Okay. 0:05:48.830 --> 0:05:52.279 So generally speaking, most people would control this. Not in 0:05:52.279 --> 0:05:54.140 one pass. They would do the double knock. 0:05:54.170 --> 0:05:56.989 As far as I can see, I don't think there's 0:05:56.990 --> 0:05:59.090 any sort of chemistry that we can use that will 0:05:59.089 --> 0:06:00.620 get it done in one go. Out of all the 0:06:00.620 --> 0:06:04.190 research I've seen and we've done, just a single pass 0:06:04.190 --> 0:06:06.080 is just not effective. Okay. 0:06:06.110 --> 0:06:07.280 So what did you find? 0:06:07.490 --> 0:06:10.100 Um, so we found a few interesting things. We found 0:06:10.100 --> 0:06:12.529 that a lot of our group four herbicides that are 0:06:12.529 --> 0:06:14.780 commonly used in the summer. Fallow didn't actually give us 0:06:14.779 --> 0:06:22.130 much more control than glyphosate, so starring dicamba and 240 ester, 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:24.739 we naturally see. And these are all rates that are 0:06:24.770 --> 0:06:28.430 that were recommended by agronomists. We didn't actually see any 0:06:28.430 --> 0:06:34.219 differences between using those chemistries with glyphosate and using glyphosate alone. 0:06:34.279 --> 0:06:37.580 So what are the symptoms we saw were the burn 0:06:37.610 --> 0:06:40.429 off symptoms from our paraquat. So it's suggesting that we 0:06:40.430 --> 0:06:43.400 maybe those chemistries aren't quite getting into the plant. And 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:47.210 then we saw also two at 240 amine was better 0:06:47.210 --> 0:06:51.020 than our ester. So we looked at about 85% control. 0:06:51.020 --> 0:06:53.779 So it did improve control. But we're like like I 0:06:53.779 --> 0:06:57.979 said before 85%. You're getting 15% through. So we saw 0:06:57.980 --> 0:07:02.630 the symptoms from those treatments were more of the contact 0:07:02.660 --> 0:07:05.660 herbicides that we'd put on the seven days after. So 0:07:05.660 --> 0:07:09.260 we're saying that paraquat and our territorial spray in these 0:07:09.260 --> 0:07:13.490 trials were doing most of the work. Those treatments were 0:07:13.490 --> 0:07:16.700 pretty much similar to glyphosate. Still getting a fair big 0:07:16.700 --> 0:07:19.130 seed set there for the next season, but the standout 0:07:19.130 --> 0:07:22.820 in this trial was really another product. I mixed with glyphosate, 0:07:22.820 --> 0:07:24.170 which was drop zone. 0:07:26.900 --> 0:07:31.160 Compliant chemical storage sheds are important infrastructure for cropping enterprises 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:34.970 from a safety point of view and for a sustainability certification. 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:38.990 BCG gold sponsors action the Big Shed people have developed 0:07:38.990 --> 0:07:41.360 a range of standard chemical shed designs to help you 0:07:41.360 --> 0:07:44.540 meet these requirements. The designs include details such as lock 0:07:44.570 --> 0:07:49.340 up storage areas, bonded concrete floors, ventilation and sprayer bays. 0:07:49.370 --> 0:07:53.750 Head to action steel. Com.au to learn more about the designs, 0:07:53.750 --> 0:07:55.400 sizes and prices. 0:07:57.680 --> 0:08:01.370 So it's a 240 amine product so similar to a amine. 0:08:01.370 --> 0:08:04.970 But it has some some sort of surfactant package that 0:08:04.970 --> 0:08:07.520 makes it translocated into the plant better, which we saw. 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:11.450 So it actually was 98% control. I think from seeing 0:08:11.450 --> 0:08:14.570 those results, it might suggest that our biggest issue is 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:18.309 actually getting the herbicide into the plant. So the translocation. 0:08:18.310 --> 0:08:22.239 So all of these herbicides like 24D amine can kill it. 0:08:22.270 --> 0:08:25.300 It's just getting it in which is what we've seen. Wow. 0:08:25.300 --> 0:08:26.800 So that's a group for again. 0:08:26.830 --> 0:08:29.800 Yeah. Yeah. So all these chemistries in our first pass 0:08:29.800 --> 0:08:33.189 trial were all Group four chemistries. Okay. 0:08:33.220 --> 0:08:34.840 So that was the first pass. So you found that 0:08:34.840 --> 0:08:38.559 the first pass the best was glyphosate with drop zone. 0:08:38.559 --> 0:08:41.319 That was the best. And then the second best was. 0:08:41.320 --> 0:08:44.109 So our sort of two 4D amines as well. So 0:08:44.140 --> 0:08:47.500 out of our three different two 4D products you've got 0:08:47.530 --> 0:08:50.079 drop zone with their best control. And then we've got 0:08:50.110 --> 0:08:52.599 amine at our middle sort of and then our ester 0:08:52.630 --> 0:08:55.900 at the end, which was surprising because especially because ester 0:08:55.900 --> 0:08:58.420 has that bit of kick that most people. And yeah, 0:08:58.420 --> 0:09:00.370 it is a pretty standard sort of product that a 0:09:00.370 --> 0:09:01.300 lot of people would use. 0:09:01.300 --> 0:09:03.790 So you said that trial that you were talking about, Angus, 0:09:03.790 --> 0:09:08.410 that was with the first pass being those specific differences. 0:09:08.410 --> 0:09:10.059 And then what was the second pass? 0:09:10.090 --> 0:09:12.100 The second pass for all those treatments I just talked 0:09:12.100 --> 0:09:16.450 about was, um, two liters of paraquat and 20g of terrador. 0:09:16.480 --> 0:09:19.540 Okay, so onto the second trial. Angus, can you talk 0:09:19.540 --> 0:09:20.439 to me about that? 0:09:20.470 --> 0:09:23.650 Yep. So the second trial that we did looked at 0:09:23.770 --> 0:09:26.350 again in a double knock situation, instead of looking at 0:09:26.350 --> 0:09:28.750 the first spray that we do in that we looked 0:09:28.750 --> 0:09:30.699 at the second spray. So the one that's done ten 0:09:30.700 --> 0:09:34.390 days after the initial spray. So our first pass sprays 0:09:34.390 --> 0:09:37.630 were pretty standard at a glyphosate with a common mixer. 0:09:37.630 --> 0:09:40.329 But we looked at a range of different mixes, usually 0:09:40.330 --> 0:09:42.130 with paraquat in this trial. 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:43.630 What were some of those mixes? 0:09:43.809 --> 0:09:45.219 So there was from this trial, there was a few 0:09:45.220 --> 0:09:49.450 interesting things from the second pass trial. So we looked 0:09:49.450 --> 0:09:53.380 at a range of different group 14 herbicides. So Terrador 0:09:53.410 --> 0:09:57.160 Rackstraw as well. We also looked at some camera sprayer rates. 0:09:57.160 --> 0:10:00.700 So we bumped up rates to four liters as well. 0:10:00.700 --> 0:10:03.010 So some of our better ones that we saw in 0:10:03.010 --> 0:10:06.640 the second pass trial were some of the camera sprayer rates. 0:10:06.670 --> 0:10:09.790 So higher rates of paraquat we fight with the higher 0:10:09.790 --> 0:10:13.750 rates that you're able to put through a camera sprayer. 0:10:13.780 --> 0:10:16.420 We got better control. So we saw that our best 0:10:16.420 --> 0:10:21.010 control was with a very expensive brew. It had four 0:10:21.010 --> 0:10:24.729 rows of paraquat, foreign mils of amatol and 40g of toradol, 0:10:24.730 --> 0:10:28.240 which is very high, but we only saw 93% control. 0:10:28.240 --> 0:10:31.480 So we're looking at a quite an expensive spray versus 0:10:31.510 --> 0:10:33.400 what we what we talked about before with the drop 0:10:33.400 --> 0:10:36.640 zone is that it's probably about half the cost. Another 0:10:36.640 --> 0:10:39.189 interesting thing, we had a bit of a curveball treatment 0:10:39.190 --> 0:10:42.699 in here, and it was aiming for 52l, as well 0:10:42.700 --> 0:10:46.120 as star rain at 500 mils just with a paraquat. Terrible. 0:10:46.120 --> 0:10:49.450 And we got 90% control. And that actually was the 0:10:49.450 --> 0:10:51.910 second best performer. So we're saying that there is a 0:10:51.910 --> 0:10:53.679 lot of different options and they can get quite expensive 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.829 in the second pass. But by what I've seen, your 0:10:56.830 --> 0:10:59.560 first pass is the most critical stage. So you sort 0:10:59.590 --> 0:11:01.929 of want to put your money in your first pass 0:11:01.929 --> 0:11:05.079 and just run the standard second pass. So we're seeing 0:11:05.080 --> 0:11:07.840 that glyphosate is not really working at all with our fleabane, 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:10.480 because there's two group fours mixed together with just a 0:11:10.480 --> 0:11:14.170 standard double knock. We're getting very good control. We also 0:11:14.170 --> 0:11:17.470 saw that Pteridophytes are like it's a massive thing now 0:11:17.470 --> 0:11:20.590 in our summer spraying. It's a great bit of chemistry, 0:11:20.590 --> 0:11:23.290 but in terms of fleabane, we didn't see any differences 0:11:23.290 --> 0:11:27.580 between using that and with and without with paraquat either. 0:11:27.610 --> 0:11:32.260 So the drop zone in the first pass was how effective? 0:11:32.530 --> 0:11:34.179 98%. 0:11:34.179 --> 0:11:37.360 And then in the second pass trial, what was the 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:38.319 most effective? 0:11:38.320 --> 0:11:39.340 93%. 0:11:39.340 --> 0:11:41.530 But that was with the really expensive brew. 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:43.599 Yeah. And that was through a camera spray as well. 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:46.900 So do you have any data, Angus, on how much 0:11:46.929 --> 0:11:48.520 fleabane takes out of the soil? 0:11:48.550 --> 0:11:51.580 I haven't got any data on it necessarily, but yes, 0:11:51.700 --> 0:11:54.490 it's got a taproot. So evaporation will happen in your 0:11:54.490 --> 0:11:57.699 top 20 to 30cm, so you'll lose it anyway. But 0:11:57.700 --> 0:12:00.730 your stored water is underneath that. And it does have 0:12:00.730 --> 0:12:03.609 a taproot and can tap into that. So that's with 0:12:03.610 --> 0:12:06.610 any of our summer weed stuff. And because it's so hot, 0:12:06.640 --> 0:12:10.000 it matures so quickly and can suck that water out quickly, 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:12.579 you can just see even this year, different sort of 0:12:12.610 --> 0:12:16.060 summer spraying approaches, um, can make the difference between having 0:12:16.059 --> 0:12:17.470 a crop and not having a crop in a year 0:12:17.470 --> 0:12:19.990 like this, just because it's been a heavy reliance on 0:12:20.020 --> 0:12:21.640 that subsoil moisture. 0:12:21.640 --> 0:12:24.910 So what would your advice be, Angus to farmers that 0:12:24.910 --> 0:12:27.910 are dealing with. Or they're seeing fleabane popping up now 0:12:27.910 --> 0:12:28.900 in their paddocks. 0:12:29.140 --> 0:12:30.550 Oh, the first thing you'd have to do would be 0:12:30.550 --> 0:12:32.380 monitor it as close as you can, make sure you 0:12:32.410 --> 0:12:35.199 know it's there. So if you've got any opportunities to 0:12:35.230 --> 0:12:37.930 control it when it's small, do that. That's your best 0:12:37.929 --> 0:12:41.620 bet is controlling it when it's at that immature stage 0:12:41.770 --> 0:12:43.870 like most don't get the opportunity to do that and 0:12:43.870 --> 0:12:45.760 you have to come back, come up with a strategy. 0:12:45.760 --> 0:12:48.250 If there's any sort of options, you can do lentils. 0:12:48.250 --> 0:12:50.860 If you've got some issues in that desiccating would be 0:12:50.860 --> 0:12:52.660 definitely the way to go. And even a double knock 0:12:52.690 --> 0:12:56.200 desiccation in cereals. Depending on what your rotation is like, 0:12:56.230 --> 0:12:58.600 there is a bit of residual control options, but it's 0:12:58.600 --> 0:13:01.270 probably a bit late in the season now. Um, but yeah, 0:13:01.300 --> 0:13:02.679 just monitor it and get on as quick as you 0:13:02.679 --> 0:13:04.990 can because as soon as they start getting a bit 0:13:05.020 --> 0:13:06.819 in size, they are very hard to kill. Even with 0:13:06.820 --> 0:13:09.069 those herbicides that I talked about, you still want to 0:13:09.070 --> 0:13:11.470 get them early and can be saving some dollars there 0:13:11.470 --> 0:13:12.940 as well. You've just got to stay on top of 0:13:12.940 --> 0:13:17.110 it because as I said before, it's a windblown weed. 0:13:17.110 --> 0:13:20.110 So regardless if you control your paddocks, if it's on 0:13:20.110 --> 0:13:21.790 a fence line or if it's in a neighbour's paddock 0:13:21.790 --> 0:13:23.920 or it's on a roadside, it can still blow over 0:13:23.920 --> 0:13:26.320 into your paddock as well. So it's just constantly being 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:28.599 on top, like a lot of our summer words. Just 0:13:28.600 --> 0:13:31.990 making sure you can just stop that set, that seed 0:13:32.020 --> 0:13:34.840 set as much as you can. Like any way, depleting 0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:37.120 the seed bank is your most important thing because all 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.670 of these can stay around your soil for years, and 0:13:39.700 --> 0:13:42.100 the chemistry you use in the first pass seem to 0:13:42.100 --> 0:13:44.920 be more important in controlling it, rather than trying to 0:13:44.950 --> 0:13:47.830 make up for it in the second pass. So spend 0:13:47.830 --> 0:13:49.780 your money in your first pass rather than your second pass. 0:13:49.780 --> 0:13:52.090 Based off the research we did over the summer, that 0:13:52.090 --> 0:13:53.860 would be my recommendation. 0:13:54.580 --> 0:13:56.980 If you love the podcast and would like to show 0:13:56.980 --> 0:14:00.429 your support, please rate us five stars. Wherever you listen 0:14:00.429 --> 0:14:03.189 to your podcasts and share it with your friends. 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