1 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:08,320 S1: Today at the radio backyard fence. It is the return 2 00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:11,520 S1: of a man named Claus. He was born on Thanksgiving Day, 3 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:15,880 S1: 1955 at high noon, and today he shares his heart 4 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:19,080 S1: for Native American people. He is the president of chief, 5 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:23,799 S1: which stands for Christian Hope Indian Eskimo Fellowship. Chief began 6 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:27,800 S1: 50 years ago with the goal of transforming lives and 7 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:31,440 S1: communities through the power of the gospel among Native American 8 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:36,640 S1: and First Nations peoples. There's encouragement. There's some challenge straight 9 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:40,040 S1: ahead on the program as we welcome back Huron Claus. 10 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:42,400 S1: Thanks for joining us today, and thanks to our friends 11 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:44,559 S1: who are helping out behind the scenes. Ryan McConaughey is 12 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:47,879 S1: doing all things technical. Lisa is here. Trish is our producer. 13 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:51,360 S1: Josh will be answering your calls today and if you 14 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:53,880 S1: have given in support of this program, thank you. One 15 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,400 S1: of the best things we do at Moody Radio is 16 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:59,910 S1: expose you to ministries and people and ideas that you 17 00:00:59,910 --> 00:01:04,150 S1: may not encounter elsewhere. So the person who has given 18 00:01:04,150 --> 00:01:07,670 S1: in support of today's conversation may have a direct impact 19 00:01:07,670 --> 00:01:11,270 S1: on some impact on somebody else who's listening, who might 20 00:01:11,270 --> 00:01:14,230 S1: want to get involved in the Ministry of Chief? Let's 21 00:01:14,230 --> 00:01:16,709 S1: see what happens. If you would like to support us. 22 00:01:16,709 --> 00:01:19,390 S1: We have less than two weeks left here in November 23 00:01:19,750 --> 00:01:21,950 S1: in our offer of one of the most fun and 24 00:01:21,950 --> 00:01:25,150 S1: creative thank yous we've ever given. A week ago, Joe 25 00:01:25,150 --> 00:01:28,390 S1: Sutphen talked about his artwork, his creativity, the drawing he 26 00:01:28,390 --> 00:01:31,030 S1: did as a child and that led him now to 27 00:01:31,069 --> 00:01:34,310 S1: become an illustrator of a number of books. And if 28 00:01:34,350 --> 00:01:36,390 S1: you give a gift today, we're going to put the 29 00:01:36,430 --> 00:01:39,910 S1: Little Christmas Carol Coloring and Activity book in the mail 30 00:01:40,190 --> 00:01:43,470 S1: for you or for a child you know, or a grandchild. 31 00:01:43,470 --> 00:01:45,270 S1: I like to think of this as as a way 32 00:01:45,270 --> 00:01:48,270 S1: to move a child away from a screen to a page. 33 00:01:48,550 --> 00:01:52,350 S1: There's just something calming about the mazes and the crossword 34 00:01:52,350 --> 00:01:55,510 S1: puzzles and the word jumbles, as well as the the 35 00:01:55,550 --> 00:01:58,900 S1: coloring with crayons and colored pencils that you can you 36 00:01:58,940 --> 00:02:02,220 S1: kind of get lost in that. Um, well, you call 37 00:02:02,220 --> 00:02:10,780 S1: or click through and support us. Here's the number 8669538669532279. 38 00:02:11,020 --> 00:02:12,700 S1: Or you can go to the website and scroll down. 39 00:02:12,700 --> 00:02:16,140 S1: You'll see that activity book the coloring book right there. 40 00:02:16,180 --> 00:02:23,139 S1: Little Christmas carol. Go to Chris. Chris. Fabbri. Fabbri Chris Fabbri, 41 00:02:23,460 --> 00:02:29,299 S1: Port Huron Claus is president of Chief Incorporated and is 42 00:02:29,300 --> 00:02:32,580 S1: a fifth generation follower of Jesus. He comes from the 43 00:02:32,580 --> 00:02:37,780 S1: Mohawk and Kiowa tribes of New York and then Oklahoma. 44 00:02:38,300 --> 00:02:42,419 S1: The Claus Indian family is administered through evangelism and music 45 00:02:42,419 --> 00:02:48,100 S1: in native communities and villages across North, Central, and South America. 46 00:02:48,620 --> 00:02:51,220 S1: Go to the website. Click through today's information. You can 47 00:02:51,220 --> 00:02:54,620 S1: see a link there to chief and some great information 48 00:02:54,980 --> 00:02:57,170 S1: here on. Welcome back. How are you today? 49 00:02:57,410 --> 00:02:59,930 S2: It's good to be back. It's been a while, but 50 00:02:59,930 --> 00:03:02,610 S2: I always look forward to talking with you, Chris. 51 00:03:02,810 --> 00:03:06,970 S1: I love airing your program on Thanksgiving because we recorded 52 00:03:06,970 --> 00:03:09,169 S1: this in the studio. And you sang a song at 53 00:03:09,169 --> 00:03:12,889 S1: the end. It's like, this is the perfect Thanksgiving program, 54 00:03:13,210 --> 00:03:15,050 S1: but I don't think I knew that you were born 55 00:03:15,050 --> 00:03:18,010 S1: on Thanksgiving Day, right at high noon. 56 00:03:18,290 --> 00:03:21,570 S2: Yes, yes. I always have a story behind that among 57 00:03:21,570 --> 00:03:26,770 S2: our Native American people. Uh, they give names at certain ages. 58 00:03:26,770 --> 00:03:30,450 S2: And when I was about 12 years old, my grandfather, uh, 59 00:03:30,450 --> 00:03:34,250 S2: we all the family came together about 150 of us. 60 00:03:34,490 --> 00:03:37,610 S2: We had teepees, all of that. And they said here 61 00:03:37,650 --> 00:03:41,370 S2: on your English name is Huron Claus. But today we're 62 00:03:41,370 --> 00:03:43,930 S2: going to give you a new name. And your new 63 00:03:43,930 --> 00:03:48,570 S2: name in Kiowa. My mother's language is Kee sa, and 64 00:03:48,570 --> 00:03:52,369 S2: that means at noon. And I think my grandpa said, 65 00:03:52,370 --> 00:03:56,240 S2: you could have called me Turkey, but you called me Kiesau. 66 00:03:57,280 --> 00:03:59,200 S2: So I wear that with honor. 67 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:04,960 S1: Yes. Now, the Mohawk tribe. You spoke at Wheaton College recently. 68 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,240 S1: The Mohawk was one of the first tribes to hear 69 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:08,600 S1: the gospel. Is that right? 70 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:14,400 S2: That's right, that's right. I know it was. In 2021, 71 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:18,080 S2: I was invited in Plymouth, Massachusetts, and there they were 72 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,880 S2: celebrating the 400 year celebration. And that's one of the 73 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:26,320 S2: first contacts of the gospel with native peoples. That was 74 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:30,800 S2: in 1620. It was the Wampanoag Indians. And then back 75 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:35,960 S2: in the 1700s, you started seeing individuals like David Brainard 76 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:39,600 S2: and and others that were really had a heart for 77 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:43,560 S2: native people. And it was there that David Brainard came 78 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:47,600 S2: and shared the gospel among our Mohawk people, one of 79 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:51,400 S2: the eastern tribes. It was also in Canada that the 80 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:54,710 S2: Queen of England built the very first chapel for the 81 00:04:54,710 --> 00:04:58,950 S2: Mohawks and for First Nations people. And it was there 82 00:04:59,110 --> 00:05:02,390 S2: that my great great great grandfather, he was a chief 83 00:05:02,390 --> 00:05:05,310 S2: that came to know the Lord. So for me, I 84 00:05:05,310 --> 00:05:09,070 S2: can look at five generations of those that have put 85 00:05:09,070 --> 00:05:11,990 S2: their trust and faith in the Lord. And it's been 86 00:05:11,990 --> 00:05:16,830 S2: very moving and humbling to see that how God works 87 00:05:16,830 --> 00:05:18,150 S2: within families. 88 00:05:18,150 --> 00:05:22,150 S1: When you read about David Brainerd, his life, his ministry, 89 00:05:22,350 --> 00:05:24,349 S1: what did that do inside you? 90 00:05:25,029 --> 00:05:28,229 S2: Oh, you know, when I was reading, first of all, 91 00:05:28,230 --> 00:05:32,070 S2: I was impressed because he was a young man and 92 00:05:32,070 --> 00:05:36,390 S2: he was just in his teens when he felt God 93 00:05:36,390 --> 00:05:40,750 S2: calling him. And, uh, then to read in his diary 94 00:05:40,790 --> 00:05:45,350 S2: and I'll never forget, it was noted, December 21st that 95 00:05:45,350 --> 00:05:50,150 S2: he prayed that the Mohawks would, uh, understand the glory 96 00:05:50,150 --> 00:05:52,870 S2: of God, that they would receive the glory of God 97 00:05:52,980 --> 00:05:56,060 S2: among their people. And when I read that, I wept 98 00:05:56,060 --> 00:05:59,380 S2: because I, I, like I just said, for five generations 99 00:05:59,380 --> 00:06:03,219 S2: I've seen God's faithfulness. And to see how God took 100 00:06:03,700 --> 00:06:07,539 S2: my dad's life and just really challenged him in the 101 00:06:07,540 --> 00:06:12,500 S2: area of evangelism and discipleship among our native peoples. And today, 102 00:06:12,500 --> 00:06:16,339 S2: now we're reaching tens of thousands of native peoples from 103 00:06:16,339 --> 00:06:20,660 S2: Alaska right down to South America. So it was very moving. 104 00:06:20,940 --> 00:06:25,060 S2: It's an example to people is don't give up on people. 105 00:06:25,060 --> 00:06:28,700 S2: You keep praying for them. And as I share, I 106 00:06:28,700 --> 00:06:31,460 S2: always say, I wish I have a conversation with David 107 00:06:31,500 --> 00:06:35,539 S2: Brainerd and said, thank you for that prayer because it 108 00:06:35,540 --> 00:06:38,940 S2: truly answered among our people, the Mohawks. 109 00:06:39,300 --> 00:06:43,940 S1: And yet, statistically, um, you were mentioning to me just 110 00:06:43,940 --> 00:06:48,500 S1: before we went on the air, statistically, the numbers of 111 00:06:48,540 --> 00:06:52,810 S1: Native American people who have responded positively to the gospel 112 00:06:53,250 --> 00:06:58,250 S1: are relatively I mean, it's something like 5% of of all. 113 00:06:58,370 --> 00:06:59,170 S1: Is that true? 114 00:06:59,650 --> 00:07:03,250 S2: That's right, that's right. It's it's when you stop and think. 115 00:07:03,290 --> 00:07:08,210 S2: And this was what really challenged my father in his 40s, uh, 116 00:07:08,330 --> 00:07:12,610 S2: to realize that our nation, uh, has had the gospel 117 00:07:12,610 --> 00:07:16,690 S2: for hundreds of years and and the banner of Christ 118 00:07:16,690 --> 00:07:20,250 S2: has been lifted up. But why is it that among 119 00:07:20,250 --> 00:07:25,850 S2: our native people, uh, it is less than 95% that 120 00:07:25,850 --> 00:07:30,290 S2: said that they have never embraced Christ? And really, uh, 121 00:07:30,290 --> 00:07:33,770 S2: a key portion of that is the message, the message, 122 00:07:33,890 --> 00:07:39,210 S2: how it was presented. And was it understandable? Was it received? 123 00:07:39,210 --> 00:07:42,930 S2: Was it presented in the picture of the good news 124 00:07:42,930 --> 00:07:43,890 S2: of the gospel? 125 00:07:44,290 --> 00:07:49,330 S1: Well, isn't it partly the messenger to the messengers? Yes, yes. 126 00:07:49,370 --> 00:07:51,560 S1: Got in the way in a lot of ways. Okay. 127 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:53,160 S1: I want to come back and ask you that when 128 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:55,600 S1: we after we take a break. I really hope that 129 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:59,040 S1: there's somebody listening today who has never heard of chief. 130 00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:02,240 S1: You didn't know about this ministry that has now been 131 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:07,320 S1: around for 50 years. Huron Claus is the president of chief. 132 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:10,560 S1: And you can find out more about what they do 133 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:15,000 S1: and how they do it across the US as well as, 134 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:19,280 S1: you know, all of of North America and South America, 135 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:23,880 S1: Alaska as well. And if you go to Chris Fabry lives, 136 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:27,080 S1: click through today's information. You'll see a link right there. 137 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:39,120 S1: Chris Fabry Livorno. Huron Claus is back with us today. 138 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,640 S1: President of chief. You can find out more about him 139 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:43,640 S1: at the website. And I'm going to open the lines 140 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:45,559 S1: to if you have a question or a comment, you 141 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:49,949 S1: have any good news about Native American ministry about people 142 00:08:49,950 --> 00:09:01,030 S1: who are responding to the gospel. (877) 548-3675 our number (877) 548-3675. 143 00:09:01,510 --> 00:09:06,390 S1: That why why is it 95% say no? I don't 144 00:09:06,390 --> 00:09:08,550 S1: want anything to do with the gospel or they haven't 145 00:09:08,550 --> 00:09:15,150 S1: responded to it positively. Uh, and I often wonder if 146 00:09:15,270 --> 00:09:19,710 S1: it's not partly the messenger rather than the message, though 147 00:09:19,710 --> 00:09:23,189 S1: the message to it gets mixed up with, well, that's 148 00:09:23,190 --> 00:09:27,069 S1: Jesus is a white man's God. He's he's not for us. 149 00:09:27,590 --> 00:09:30,589 S1: But I also wonder if the pain of the past 150 00:09:30,590 --> 00:09:33,470 S1: and the trail of tears and all of the injustice 151 00:09:33,470 --> 00:09:37,510 S1: that was done to Native Americans and the, you know, 152 00:09:37,550 --> 00:09:40,590 S1: cheating out of land and putting on reservations and the 153 00:09:40,590 --> 00:09:43,790 S1: Indian schools, you know, take away your heritage. You can't 154 00:09:43,790 --> 00:09:46,870 S1: speak that language anymore. We just go on and on 155 00:09:46,870 --> 00:09:49,460 S1: and on, You know, is, is that one of the 156 00:09:49,460 --> 00:09:53,540 S1: main reasons for people who are Native Americans not to 157 00:09:54,059 --> 00:09:58,059 S1: respond to the, you know, the forgiveness from Jesus? 158 00:09:58,540 --> 00:10:03,180 S2: Yes. Well, it's a powerful message, I would say. There's 159 00:10:03,179 --> 00:10:05,900 S2: a lot of hurt and pain when we talk about that. 160 00:10:05,940 --> 00:10:08,980 S2: And I hear this all the time from our our 161 00:10:09,100 --> 00:10:13,579 S2: people is the history of of the pain that was 162 00:10:13,820 --> 00:10:20,580 S2: upon our people. Uh. But where I'm challenged in, in this, 163 00:10:20,580 --> 00:10:24,220 S2: a lot of the discussion of this is that, uh, 164 00:10:24,220 --> 00:10:29,580 S2: when we stop and realize that, uh, God, our creator 165 00:10:29,940 --> 00:10:33,180 S2: did not just create our Native American people or our 166 00:10:33,179 --> 00:10:39,700 S2: white people where there's differences and divide, but he created all. And, uh, 167 00:10:39,700 --> 00:10:42,900 S2: you see the message of the gospel and, and I 168 00:10:42,900 --> 00:10:46,650 S2: think even to how it has been expressed Breasts is 169 00:10:46,650 --> 00:10:50,370 S2: a big challenge is when we look and realize that 170 00:10:50,370 --> 00:10:53,770 S2: the God that we serve is a God of relationship. 171 00:10:54,130 --> 00:10:57,250 S2: I often say, Chris, if I were to describe our 172 00:10:57,250 --> 00:11:01,250 S2: native people in one word, it would be relationship. We're 173 00:11:01,250 --> 00:11:05,610 S2: very relational people. And so to realize that God is 174 00:11:05,610 --> 00:11:09,449 S2: a God of relationship and and he has built a 175 00:11:09,450 --> 00:11:14,090 S2: relationship with his creation no matter who it is, whether 176 00:11:14,090 --> 00:11:18,770 S2: we're white, black, red, whoever it is. Uh, what has 177 00:11:18,770 --> 00:11:22,650 S2: challenged me as a follower of Christ is to see, uh, 178 00:11:22,650 --> 00:11:27,410 S2: the principles that God teaches us through his word and 179 00:11:27,410 --> 00:11:32,530 S2: how those principles apply for every one of us. And 180 00:11:32,530 --> 00:11:35,730 S2: when I stop and look at that, those things that 181 00:11:35,730 --> 00:11:39,449 S2: are taught in the Word of God, that is what 182 00:11:39,450 --> 00:11:45,440 S2: has really strengthened my walk with the God of relationship. And. 183 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:49,439 S2: And again, the whole picture, the true picture of the 184 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:52,400 S2: Bible is to realize, and I always share this to 185 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:55,600 S2: my people. I says, you can look at creation where 186 00:11:55,640 --> 00:12:00,080 S2: God created all his creation, and it's beautiful and it's 187 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:04,760 S2: diversified in all of this, but it's because of sin. 188 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:08,320 S2: And a lot of times the issue of sin, when 189 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:11,000 S2: we talk about that among our native people, they say 190 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,640 S2: here on you know what? We really don't have a 191 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:17,199 S2: word for sin in our mother tongue. So help us 192 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:21,600 S2: understand what sin is. And I and I know, looking 193 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,280 S2: at the Greek and all, it talks about missing the mark. 194 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:27,920 S2: But again, it seems like it's missed the mark for our, 195 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:30,959 S2: our native people. And when I, when I talk to them, 196 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:33,160 S2: I says, you know, when I look at sin and 197 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:39,120 S2: a God of relationship, it's really talks about separation. Sin 198 00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:42,720 S2: is the great separator. And you can look at it 199 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:46,950 S2: separated us from the creator. I says from after, uh, 200 00:12:46,990 --> 00:12:50,750 S2: Genesis chapter three. You look in the Old Testament and 201 00:12:50,750 --> 00:12:56,070 S2: you see story after story of brokenness, broken relationship. But 202 00:12:56,070 --> 00:12:59,910 S2: when you see the message of Christ, I says, there's 203 00:12:59,950 --> 00:13:04,590 S2: the beauty, because there the creator, God has given his 204 00:13:04,590 --> 00:13:09,030 S2: greatest gift. And we are gift givers among our native people. 205 00:13:09,230 --> 00:13:14,030 S2: But his greatest gift was His son, Jesus Christ. And 206 00:13:14,030 --> 00:13:17,990 S2: as I have conversation with our native people, often they say, 207 00:13:17,990 --> 00:13:21,230 S2: that's the white man's religion, white man's God. I say 208 00:13:21,230 --> 00:13:24,670 S2: to them, you know what? Is it possible that we 209 00:13:24,670 --> 00:13:29,230 S2: have become the greatest offense to the Creator God by 210 00:13:29,230 --> 00:13:34,070 S2: not accepting his gift? Uh, because in our culture, to 211 00:13:34,070 --> 00:13:38,390 S2: honor and to respect, we give gifts. The greatest offense 212 00:13:38,429 --> 00:13:41,550 S2: is to reject a gift. And I'll tell you what 213 00:13:41,550 --> 00:13:46,860 S2: that conversation has led to some outstanding conversations. Seeing people 214 00:13:46,860 --> 00:13:49,219 S2: come to know the Lord among our people. 215 00:13:49,700 --> 00:13:52,620 S1: Now, you didn't have to get over the hurdle. Your 216 00:13:52,620 --> 00:13:55,300 S1: your father was a real strong believer, and we're going 217 00:13:55,300 --> 00:13:58,300 S1: to talk about him in his work because he was 218 00:13:58,300 --> 00:14:02,500 S1: there when chief began 50 years ago. But then 3 219 00:14:02,500 --> 00:14:06,220 S1: or 4 generations before that. Do you have any idea 220 00:14:06,500 --> 00:14:11,860 S1: how your great, great great grandfather got over that hurdle 221 00:14:11,860 --> 00:14:13,340 S1: that you're just talking about? 222 00:14:13,780 --> 00:14:18,380 S2: Well, uh, again, uh, the Lord brought my great great 223 00:14:18,380 --> 00:14:22,980 S2: grandfather through a very spiritual encounter, is what I would say. 224 00:14:22,980 --> 00:14:25,900 S2: That's another another thing among our native people. We're a 225 00:14:25,900 --> 00:14:30,340 S2: very spiritual people. Uh, and, uh, again, dealing with the 226 00:14:30,340 --> 00:14:34,979 S2: spirit world, uh, in our worldview, uh, there is belief 227 00:14:34,980 --> 00:14:38,660 S2: in good and evil and the spirit world. And it 228 00:14:38,660 --> 00:14:43,330 S2: came to a point where, uh, among our people, among 229 00:14:43,330 --> 00:14:49,250 S2: the Mohawks, uh, his wife had passed and, uh, through 230 00:14:49,290 --> 00:14:55,610 S2: an experience he was dealing where, uh, when our native people, uh, 231 00:14:55,610 --> 00:15:00,330 S2: get into extreme traditional beliefs, they are taught to take 232 00:15:00,330 --> 00:15:03,650 S2: the life of a loved one or even a relative. 233 00:15:04,010 --> 00:15:07,130 S2: And he realized he was in that situation. And it 234 00:15:07,130 --> 00:15:10,170 S2: was at that moment that he prayed to the Lord. 235 00:15:10,170 --> 00:15:12,890 S2: And he said, if you are the God of the Bible, 236 00:15:12,890 --> 00:15:15,850 S2: if you are the Holy One, I want to give 237 00:15:15,850 --> 00:15:20,730 S2: my life to you. And that was his point of, uh, 238 00:15:20,770 --> 00:15:24,450 S2: commitment to the Lord. And it was amazing how God 239 00:15:24,490 --> 00:15:29,010 S2: used that experience not only for him personally, but it 240 00:15:29,010 --> 00:15:32,730 S2: was a very powerful example to his people as well. 241 00:15:33,330 --> 00:15:37,130 S1: Every novel that I read, story, film that I watch, 242 00:15:37,130 --> 00:15:40,480 S1: that includes something about Native Americans. If they do it well, 243 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:46,160 S1: usually includes what you just described, some kind of evil spirit, 244 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:49,040 S1: or a nod to the dead who are troubled, who 245 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:53,960 S1: are haunting certain areas or places, or the spirit in 246 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:57,680 S1: the trees in nature. And, you know, in the animal kingdom. 247 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:00,840 S1: And so that's a very much a part of the 248 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:03,240 S1: I'm sure it's different for the, for different tribes, but 249 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:07,200 S1: it's very much a part of just the makeup, the mindset. Right. 250 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:11,400 S2: Right. That's right, that's right. And, and often I have 251 00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:15,160 S2: heard both from young and old that, uh, you know, 252 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:19,560 S2: we need to see the power of God demonstrated, uh, 253 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:24,240 S2: in and through our native people, through different experiences. And 254 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:28,520 S2: we've seen that happen. And again, all praise and glory 255 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:32,680 S2: to the Lord. Uh, for things that take place like that. 256 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:36,120 S1: So a person who's in, uh, who's coming from a 257 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:41,590 S1: background like yours, Um, who who comes to Jesus because 258 00:16:41,590 --> 00:16:44,230 S1: you and we can go into your story as well. 259 00:16:44,230 --> 00:16:46,790 S1: You were a teenager and you believed in God. You 260 00:16:46,790 --> 00:16:49,950 S1: believed what your dad, you know, had taught you, and 261 00:16:49,950 --> 00:16:52,590 S1: you kind of grew up in church. But there was 262 00:16:52,630 --> 00:16:56,229 S1: a point at which you said, wait a minute, I'm 263 00:16:56,670 --> 00:17:00,530 S1: you had prayed for forgiveness a thousand times or a 264 00:17:00,530 --> 00:17:01,430 S1: million times. Yeah. 265 00:17:01,470 --> 00:17:02,830 S2: Every time. Yeah. Yeah, that's. 266 00:17:02,830 --> 00:17:04,750 S1: Right. But there was a time when you was like, no, 267 00:17:04,750 --> 00:17:08,350 S1: wait a minute. If this is true, if this is real, yes, 268 00:17:08,390 --> 00:17:11,150 S1: I need, I need more. God need deserves more than 269 00:17:11,150 --> 00:17:13,110 S1: just a nod from me. Right. 270 00:17:13,150 --> 00:17:15,990 S2: That's right, that's right. Well, again, it was a point 271 00:17:15,990 --> 00:17:18,550 S2: where I had to recognize even even though I came 272 00:17:18,550 --> 00:17:23,790 S2: from a Christian background and it was a personal decision, uh, 273 00:17:23,790 --> 00:17:26,629 S2: to know, to really make a commitment to the Lord. 274 00:17:26,869 --> 00:17:30,590 S2: And for me, it was when I was a young man, uh, 275 00:17:30,590 --> 00:17:35,869 S2: that I made that commitment, uh, that conversion to the Lord. Uh, 276 00:17:35,869 --> 00:17:39,980 S2: I think even more so when I was involved in ministry, 277 00:17:40,220 --> 00:17:46,100 S2: and there was a life threatening experience that I experienced 278 00:17:46,300 --> 00:17:50,620 S2: in Peru, which was, uh, quite a story, but it 279 00:17:50,619 --> 00:17:54,899 S2: was really literally to the point where, uh, individuals were 280 00:17:54,900 --> 00:17:58,340 S2: coming to take the lives of the native people there, 281 00:17:58,460 --> 00:18:03,180 S2: and myself included. And I had to ask myself, Huron, 282 00:18:03,220 --> 00:18:07,340 S2: you've talked this, you've preached this. Do you really believe this? 283 00:18:07,660 --> 00:18:09,859 S2: And I'll tell you, it was a it was a 284 00:18:09,859 --> 00:18:13,740 S2: life changing moment for me. And I said, yes, Lord, 285 00:18:13,780 --> 00:18:17,139 S2: even if this is the day that I'm going to 286 00:18:17,180 --> 00:18:20,460 S2: be in your presence, I want you to know that 287 00:18:20,460 --> 00:18:23,899 S2: I've given it all. I've submitted it all to you, 288 00:18:24,619 --> 00:18:27,940 S2: and I'll tell you that that was just life changing 289 00:18:27,940 --> 00:18:33,379 S2: for me. Uh, and and now. And you experiencing it 290 00:18:33,380 --> 00:18:38,490 S2: right now is where I experience these tender moments with 291 00:18:38,490 --> 00:18:42,250 S2: the Lord, and I see his presence, and I see 292 00:18:42,290 --> 00:18:47,610 S2: his power, and I see the change of native lives. 293 00:18:48,050 --> 00:18:52,010 S2: And all that does is just strengthen my faith in 294 00:18:52,050 --> 00:18:54,410 S2: who the Lord is and what he says he's going 295 00:18:54,450 --> 00:18:57,210 S2: to do in our lives and in the lives of 296 00:18:57,210 --> 00:19:02,409 S2: all peoples. So, uh, it's just it's it's amazing. It's amazing. 297 00:19:02,450 --> 00:19:04,890 S1: Who was who was trying to get you in Peru? 298 00:19:04,930 --> 00:19:05,570 S1: Who was after. 299 00:19:05,609 --> 00:19:09,850 S2: Well, again, that was. That's a story. Uh, there is 300 00:19:09,850 --> 00:19:13,450 S2: a dear brother, uh, Quechua, and they are the largest 301 00:19:13,490 --> 00:19:18,490 S2: native tribe in, uh, the Western Hemisphere. There are 30 302 00:19:18,490 --> 00:19:23,930 S2: million within four countries of South America. And there was 303 00:19:23,930 --> 00:19:26,370 S2: a young man that was about my age. His name 304 00:19:26,369 --> 00:19:30,409 S2: was Romulo San. And back in the 80s, there, there 305 00:19:30,570 --> 00:19:35,080 S2: the gospel came to that people. Missionaries came. The native 306 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:40,920 S2: people responded tremendously. But also in the 80s, communism came 307 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:44,959 S2: and there was a teaching in the universities from China, 308 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:48,960 S2: and there was a revolution that took place within that country. 309 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:55,000 S2: The missionaries, a number of mission organizations, encouraged their missionaries 310 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:58,960 S2: to leave the country. And it was there that my 311 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:05,400 S2: friend Romolo Sani, he, uh, was impacted by Wycliffe translators 312 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,919 S2: that had come to that country teaching them to translate 313 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:12,440 S2: the Word of God. He fell in, fell in love 314 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,440 S2: with the Word of God and with his people. He 315 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:21,320 S2: translated the scriptures. Long story short, Billy Graham used him, uh, 316 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:26,000 S2: in crusades in Peru. Uh, Bill bright used him, uh, 317 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:31,880 S2: for the Jesus film. Hcjb used him. And, uh, it 318 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:36,629 S2: was back in 82, chief had a leadership conference. Over 319 00:20:36,630 --> 00:20:41,430 S2: 300 leaders come from north central South America. I met him, 320 00:20:41,430 --> 00:20:44,190 S2: I had a chance to talk to him, and I 321 00:20:44,230 --> 00:20:47,830 S2: found out he was telling me about his people. He says, Huron, 322 00:20:47,830 --> 00:20:50,590 S2: pray for me. Pray for the salvation of our people. 323 00:20:50,869 --> 00:20:53,750 S2: And I found out he was the number one marked 324 00:20:53,750 --> 00:20:58,590 S2: man to be killed by this group, the Shining Path. 325 00:20:58,830 --> 00:21:02,150 S2: So he says, pray for me. And I said, Romolo, 326 00:21:02,310 --> 00:21:06,950 S2: how can you live knowing that you could die any moment? 327 00:21:07,190 --> 00:21:09,709 S2: He says two things I have to know that I 328 00:21:09,750 --> 00:21:14,390 S2: am right before Almighty God every day. And then secondly, 329 00:21:14,390 --> 00:21:17,869 S2: he says, I have learned that I am immortal up 330 00:21:17,869 --> 00:21:21,550 S2: to the minute that God chooses to take me home. 331 00:21:22,070 --> 00:21:25,990 S2: And man, again, that was something that just challenged me, 332 00:21:26,190 --> 00:21:30,550 S2: challenged my life. Uh, through the Ministry of Chief, we 333 00:21:30,550 --> 00:21:35,260 S2: have met different native individuals like this and they have 334 00:21:35,580 --> 00:21:40,460 S2: changed not only individuals lives, but they've changed nations for 335 00:21:40,460 --> 00:21:43,620 S2: the Lord. And it's just a joy to know some 336 00:21:43,619 --> 00:21:45,140 S2: of these dear folk. 337 00:21:45,540 --> 00:21:46,900 S1: What happened to Romolo? 338 00:21:47,580 --> 00:21:52,540 S2: He was martyred. Eventually he was martyred in 1982. We 339 00:21:52,540 --> 00:21:56,540 S2: had another or 92. We had another conference. Uh, after 340 00:21:56,540 --> 00:21:59,659 S2: that conference, we went to Israel. I was in chief, 341 00:21:59,660 --> 00:22:04,220 S2: was invited to Israel, uh, by the, uh, the leader 342 00:22:04,220 --> 00:22:07,820 S2: there within the country. And we took ten native leaders 343 00:22:07,820 --> 00:22:12,580 S2: from ten different countries in there. We shared Christ with them. 344 00:22:12,580 --> 00:22:15,899 S2: That was an incredible experience. Nobody told us we couldn't 345 00:22:15,900 --> 00:22:19,180 S2: lift up Jesus. We did it. Okay. As Native Americans 346 00:22:19,180 --> 00:22:22,660 S2: in our regalia and all of our songs and things 347 00:22:22,660 --> 00:22:29,580 S2: like that. And it was in September of, uh, 92 that, uh, 348 00:22:29,690 --> 00:22:35,050 S2: Man was killed back in Peru. He had, uh, food, 349 00:22:35,050 --> 00:22:38,650 S2: clothing he was taking to his people in the village 350 00:22:38,690 --> 00:22:42,290 S2: of the high Andes areas. And when he came back. 351 00:22:42,290 --> 00:22:45,730 S2: And I've experienced this when I've been to Peru. But 352 00:22:45,730 --> 00:22:49,490 S2: you'll have soldiers that will stop and check your your passport, 353 00:22:49,490 --> 00:22:53,889 S2: your papers. And he was in a church bus with 354 00:22:53,890 --> 00:22:57,689 S2: a number of people coming back from the, uh, the 355 00:22:57,730 --> 00:23:02,450 S2: villages in, uh, they're in Peru to Ayacucho. One of 356 00:23:02,450 --> 00:23:07,129 S2: the hometowns. There were over 200 soldiers that stopped them. 357 00:23:07,290 --> 00:23:10,370 S2: And when they checked their papers, they found Romulo. And 358 00:23:10,369 --> 00:23:13,290 S2: it was at that point that they shot Romulo and 359 00:23:13,290 --> 00:23:18,090 S2: several of his family, 23 young people in that village 360 00:23:18,330 --> 00:23:23,450 S2: after his, uh, death. At his funeral service, there were 361 00:23:23,450 --> 00:23:28,010 S2: over 5000 people that came. A lot of his own people, 362 00:23:28,250 --> 00:23:32,680 S2: the guerrillas and even the government leaders. And the mother 363 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:37,520 S2: said that was Romulo's most powerful message he ever preached 364 00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:40,239 S2: was when he gave his life for the sake of 365 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:40,959 S2: the gospel. 366 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:47,400 S1: Just that story right there shows the power of of 367 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:51,800 S1: of the gospel. It shows how because after after he died, 368 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:55,800 S1: there was this resurgence. You think you're going to kill 369 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,320 S1: the movement by killing the messenger and you do not. 370 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,160 S1: And I think part of that is because of what 371 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:06,560 S1: he truly believed in. It was the power of the 372 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:10,400 S1: Word of God for the people you know who are 373 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,440 S1: reading it, to take that in and then to live 374 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:14,639 S1: it out. Right? 375 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:18,280 S2: Yes, yes, that is so true. And you know what? 376 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,720 S2: I just shared that you know this, Chris, I was 377 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:25,240 S2: at Wheaton College, uh, speaking to 2000 students, and this 378 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:30,070 S2: was after, uh, Charlie Kirk had been killed. And I said, 379 00:24:30,230 --> 00:24:32,469 S2: and I said to the students, I says, you know, 380 00:24:32,710 --> 00:24:36,630 S2: after 50 years of ministry, seeing what God's done, I 381 00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:39,910 S2: can see where God has come full circle and he 382 00:24:39,910 --> 00:24:43,950 S2: could do that. The same thing in the young people's 383 00:24:43,990 --> 00:24:48,350 S2: today within our nation. But we need individuals that their 384 00:24:48,350 --> 00:24:51,870 S2: faith and their hope is in Jesus Christ and the 385 00:24:51,910 --> 00:24:55,150 S2: work of Christ in the Bible. And God will do 386 00:24:55,190 --> 00:24:57,669 S2: mighty things for us in our nation. 387 00:24:58,109 --> 00:25:02,189 S1: What I hear you saying is that you need more. 388 00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:04,950 S1: And as I've looked at your website, you need more 389 00:25:04,950 --> 00:25:08,470 S1: Native American leaders. But that doesn't mean that there aren't 390 00:25:08,510 --> 00:25:12,070 S1: others on the outside that can't come alongside and help, 391 00:25:12,070 --> 00:25:16,150 S1: because even your even your life has been informed by 392 00:25:16,190 --> 00:25:19,830 S1: Tory Johnson, who was at a church in Chicago and 393 00:25:19,869 --> 00:25:23,109 S1: who helped your dad. You talked about Billy Graham and 394 00:25:23,310 --> 00:25:27,500 S1: his idea, his vision for the Native American people. So 395 00:25:27,500 --> 00:25:29,220 S1: when we come back, I want to talk more about 396 00:25:29,220 --> 00:25:34,260 S1: that history, about what God is doing today. Signs that 397 00:25:34,260 --> 00:25:38,380 S1: you see that he is moving among your people. And 398 00:25:38,540 --> 00:25:40,540 S1: if you have a question or comment, I'd love to 399 00:25:40,540 --> 00:25:49,060 S1: hear from you. (877) 548-3675. Go to the website Chris Livorno. 400 00:25:49,340 --> 00:25:52,740 S1: You'll see more about chief and the President of Chief 401 00:25:52,780 --> 00:26:07,740 S1: Huron Claus, Chris Livorno. Here on Claus from chief is 402 00:26:07,740 --> 00:26:10,020 S1: with us today. We'll get right back to the celebration 403 00:26:10,020 --> 00:26:13,860 S1: of 50 years of gospel outreach through that ministry, and 404 00:26:13,859 --> 00:26:15,780 S1: you can find out more about it when you go 405 00:26:15,780 --> 00:26:21,540 S1: to our website. Chris Livorno, another that's celebrating 50 years 406 00:26:21,540 --> 00:26:25,410 S1: in the Pro Abundant Life ministry is Carenet. Cabinet. They 407 00:26:25,450 --> 00:26:29,770 S1: have been for more than a million lives. They have 408 00:26:29,810 --> 00:26:34,050 S1: been instrumental in saving more than a million lives and 409 00:26:34,090 --> 00:26:37,490 S1: have seen that kind of changed life as well. Because 410 00:26:37,490 --> 00:26:41,010 S1: of their work as part of their pro Abundant Life vision, 411 00:26:41,010 --> 00:26:45,290 S1: they are offering you absolutely free a devotional titled Praying 412 00:26:45,290 --> 00:26:48,770 S1: through Advent this Christmas, as you make all the preparations 413 00:26:48,770 --> 00:26:52,210 S1: in the celebrations about the word made flesh. You will 414 00:26:52,210 --> 00:26:55,650 S1: be reminded through this devotional that God meets us right 415 00:26:55,650 --> 00:26:58,730 S1: there in the middle of our uncertainty. He writes redemption 416 00:26:58,730 --> 00:27:02,890 S1: into our stories. If you go to Chris. Org, click 417 00:27:02,930 --> 00:27:07,970 S1: the green connect link and you can download praying through advent. 418 00:27:08,290 --> 00:27:12,570 S1: Experience the wonder of God's greatest story and join in 419 00:27:12,570 --> 00:27:16,290 S1: praying for life and hope through him. Click the Green 420 00:27:16,290 --> 00:27:24,520 S1: Connect link at Chris dot to download Praying Advent. Chris Fabbri, Livorno, 421 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,120 S1: where you'll also find out about chief if this is 422 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:28,840 S1: the first time you're hearing about it, you got to 423 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,560 S1: go to their website, you got to click the link, 424 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:34,479 S1: you got to see the faces, uh, and the and 425 00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:38,359 S1: the ministry that has gone on again for 50 years. 426 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:42,040 S1: Huron is president of. Chief. Let me throw a couple 427 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,040 S1: of things at you here. You mentioned the power of 428 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,480 S1: God's Word. Um, there are there are Bibles that have 429 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:55,000 S1: been translated into to speak specifically to the Native American reader. 430 00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:57,919 S1: What do you think about those translations? 431 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:01,840 S2: Well, there there are a number of Bibles, of course, 432 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:06,120 S2: that have been translated in languages, uh, to our people. 433 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:09,600 S2: There have been English versions that have been printed, uh, 434 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:14,119 S2: most recently is a Bible that has been used as 435 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:18,920 S2: an evangelism tool, uh, for our native people. Uh, I 436 00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:24,070 S2: think of another one in ministry, uh, where the missionary had, uh, 437 00:28:24,070 --> 00:28:29,710 S2: worked with the Alaska Natives. And it is probably the most, uh, received, uh, 438 00:28:29,710 --> 00:28:33,190 S2: the New Life Version Bible. And it's more of a 439 00:28:33,190 --> 00:28:37,950 S2: study Bible. So it, uh, a lot of times I'm asked, 440 00:28:37,990 --> 00:28:41,390 S2: you know, about these Bibles, what do you think about them? Uh, 441 00:28:41,390 --> 00:28:46,310 S2: you know, and, uh, just like, uh, any Bible and, uh, 442 00:28:46,310 --> 00:28:50,670 S2: it is translated in the language. To keep in mind, though, 443 00:28:50,710 --> 00:28:55,310 S2: that we have over 574 languages. So we're talking about 444 00:28:55,310 --> 00:29:00,950 S2: 574 nations just in the US. And, uh, so how 445 00:29:00,950 --> 00:29:05,390 S2: it's communicated, I think, uh, is what's really important, uh, 446 00:29:05,550 --> 00:29:09,870 S2: without compromising, I think the names and the stories of 447 00:29:09,870 --> 00:29:13,190 S2: the Bible and really most important, like I said, is 448 00:29:13,190 --> 00:29:17,550 S2: the principles. The truth of the Bible, uh, is, is 449 00:29:17,590 --> 00:29:22,420 S2: and how it is applied to the nations All over. Uh, 450 00:29:22,420 --> 00:29:26,740 S2: that's what I think is, uh. So I would say 451 00:29:26,980 --> 00:29:29,620 S2: when you look at, uh, and you might the question 452 00:29:29,620 --> 00:29:32,420 S2: that might be asked me is, what Bible Huron would 453 00:29:32,420 --> 00:29:36,300 S2: you use for native people? Well, I would say a 454 00:29:36,300 --> 00:29:42,180 S2: Bible that communicates the word of God, the message of God. And, uh, 455 00:29:42,180 --> 00:29:46,580 S2: and in story form, uh, you know, telling the stories 456 00:29:46,580 --> 00:29:50,900 S2: of the Bible. But most important, lifting up the person 457 00:29:50,900 --> 00:29:54,820 S2: and the work of Christ that, uh, we can't compromise 458 00:29:54,820 --> 00:29:55,780 S2: is what I would say. 459 00:29:56,580 --> 00:29:58,700 S1: You took the question right out of my mouth. That's 460 00:29:58,700 --> 00:30:01,060 S1: what I was going to ask you. So thank you 461 00:30:01,060 --> 00:30:05,420 S1: for doing that. Some of the problems then, uh, that 462 00:30:05,420 --> 00:30:10,340 S1: have plagued the Native American communities, reservations. Or you told 463 00:30:10,340 --> 00:30:14,260 S1: me before, uh, a lot of urban areas have Native 464 00:30:14,260 --> 00:30:18,180 S1: Americans living in there. There's not on a reservation, but 465 00:30:18,180 --> 00:30:22,210 S1: right there in urban areas like in Chicago, but there 466 00:30:22,210 --> 00:30:25,810 S1: aren't really outreaches and ministries to them, right? 467 00:30:25,850 --> 00:30:29,050 S2: That's right, that's right. You know, again, when we think 468 00:30:29,050 --> 00:30:34,170 S2: of Native American First Nations people, again, we have stereotypes, 469 00:30:34,170 --> 00:30:39,450 S2: just like with everybody because we don't know, uh, people group. 470 00:30:39,450 --> 00:30:43,410 S2: We might have a picture in our mind of that group. 471 00:30:43,650 --> 00:30:47,730 S2: But and that picture often is the movies where they're 472 00:30:47,770 --> 00:30:52,970 S2: out on the reservation, they're riding horses and teepees. And yet, uh, 473 00:30:52,970 --> 00:30:57,850 S2: there are diversity of, of nations. There's diversity of foods 474 00:30:57,850 --> 00:31:04,410 S2: and stories and tribes, things like that. But in reality, to, uh, majority, 475 00:31:04,410 --> 00:31:09,570 S2: over 70% of our native people now live in the cities. 476 00:31:09,890 --> 00:31:15,810 S2: I am from Phoenix, Arizona. There are over 140,000 native 477 00:31:15,810 --> 00:31:21,320 S2: peoples in Phoenix. There are probably about 15 to 20 churches. 478 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:24,960 S2: And when we get together, whether it be Christmas or Easter, 479 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:31,920 S2: we we may draw 2 to 3000 native Christians. So 480 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:36,120 S2: in my own city, that shows the need of the 481 00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:42,000 S2: gospel for Phoenix, uh, in Chicago. I mentioned to you, Chris, uh, 482 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:47,160 S2: there's 60,000 and this is where we've partnered alongside of 483 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:53,840 S2: different colleges, Wheaton, uh, Judson Moody and seeing ways of getting, uh, 484 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:57,560 S2: reaching out to the native communities in the city or 485 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:04,000 S2: drawing the youth, uh, for education. Uh, those are other examples. 486 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:08,080 S2: So those are pictures that we don't hear or see much. 487 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:10,760 S2: And if I were to ask the person, the listener 488 00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:13,440 S2: to pray, that would be one of the main prayer 489 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:18,110 S2: prayers is how can we reach the need of peoples 490 00:32:18,110 --> 00:32:20,870 S2: in our own cities, our own backyards. 491 00:32:21,510 --> 00:32:25,150 S1: Does it take, though? You know, because a doctor and 492 00:32:25,150 --> 00:32:27,270 S1: I have talked a lot about this, about, you know, 493 00:32:27,310 --> 00:32:33,150 S1: reaching out to Jewish people with the gospel and a 494 00:32:33,190 --> 00:32:36,469 S1: lot of times a, a Jewish person who's come to 495 00:32:36,510 --> 00:32:40,710 S1: Jesus has an entree to a Jewish person that another, 496 00:32:40,750 --> 00:32:46,350 S1: you know, someone who's not from a Jewish background who can, can, uh, 497 00:32:46,670 --> 00:32:49,310 S1: move in there and have have a conversation because there's 498 00:32:49,310 --> 00:32:53,350 S1: so much culture that is involved in, in that, you know. Right. 499 00:32:53,430 --> 00:32:55,830 S1: So is that is it the same thing with a 500 00:32:55,830 --> 00:33:00,390 S1: Native American? If somebody who comes from a European background 501 00:33:00,390 --> 00:33:04,990 S1: like I do, would they listen to someone like me 502 00:33:05,030 --> 00:33:08,190 S1: who cares about them, or would that be a stumbling block? 503 00:33:08,550 --> 00:33:13,630 S2: Well, what I my message to you as a quote, uh, 504 00:33:13,630 --> 00:33:18,100 S2: the white person or Hard Caucasian is that we need 505 00:33:18,100 --> 00:33:23,020 S2: to really demonstrate the kingdom of God going into our communities. 506 00:33:23,420 --> 00:33:27,340 S2: And it's because, again, as I mentioned so often, our 507 00:33:27,340 --> 00:33:30,180 S2: native people say that's the white man's religion. That's the 508 00:33:30,180 --> 00:33:33,060 S2: white man's god. But you know what? The gospel is 509 00:33:33,060 --> 00:33:36,900 S2: not the white man's religion. The gospel is for all nations. 510 00:33:37,180 --> 00:33:40,620 S2: And so I think and this is this, I love this, 511 00:33:40,660 --> 00:33:44,740 S2: and I welcome when I talk with different individuals, I said, 512 00:33:44,740 --> 00:33:48,460 S2: we need to show the light of Christ to our 513 00:33:48,460 --> 00:33:51,340 S2: native people. And what do I mean by that? Uh, 514 00:33:51,340 --> 00:33:54,620 S2: I think of case in point, the Jewish people, the 515 00:33:54,620 --> 00:33:58,820 S2: Jewish people have traditions and customs just like our Native 516 00:33:58,820 --> 00:34:02,940 S2: American people. The Jewish people are a very spiritual people, 517 00:34:02,940 --> 00:34:07,340 S2: just like our Native Americans. But again, that is there 518 00:34:07,340 --> 00:34:11,100 S2: is a group that are is very similar. Are the 519 00:34:11,100 --> 00:34:16,050 S2: Asian people. I've been to Mongolian. I've been to Korea 520 00:34:16,050 --> 00:34:19,930 S2: and I'm amazed of the similarities of our people. I 521 00:34:19,930 --> 00:34:26,130 S2: was in Africa in January ministering to tribal people and again, 522 00:34:26,170 --> 00:34:31,170 S2: the similarities. So I would say the next time you 523 00:34:31,210 --> 00:34:36,129 S2: come to our Native American people, I would encourage the 524 00:34:36,130 --> 00:34:39,969 S2: diversity of the kingdom of God to come to our people. 525 00:34:40,210 --> 00:34:45,370 S2: And that's where we see lives changed, because they then 526 00:34:45,410 --> 00:34:49,730 S2: see the similarities of those people. They then see the 527 00:34:49,730 --> 00:34:53,730 S2: challenges that those people have made and how God has 528 00:34:53,730 --> 00:34:58,250 S2: lifted them up when they lift up Christ. So, uh, 529 00:34:58,250 --> 00:35:02,690 S2: so that would be my word, uh, to missions today, uh, 530 00:35:02,690 --> 00:35:05,529 S2: with our type of, of group of people. 531 00:35:05,770 --> 00:35:06,650 S3: It's a great word. 532 00:35:06,690 --> 00:35:09,650 S1: Huron Claus again. President of chief. Find out more at 533 00:35:09,650 --> 00:35:14,240 S1: Chris Fabry lives. Brad is in Saint Louis. Hi, Brad. 534 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:15,040 S1: Go right ahead. 535 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,000 S4: Chris, thank you so much for your program. You're doing 536 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:22,080 S4: a great job of interviewing our friend here on, um. Again, 537 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:23,960 S4: my name is Brad. I'm a pastor here in Saint 538 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:26,960 S4: Louis working a lot with university students. And Huron has 539 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,759 S4: been so helpful for us. Saint Louis is known as 540 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:33,279 S4: the Mound City Cahokia mounds. Uh, and a lot of 541 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:37,480 S4: discussions with our students, both Native American and university students 542 00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,000 S4: here in Saint Louis. Huron, related to the Crazy Horse 543 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:45,480 S4: Memorial in South Dakota. Uh, seems like people seem to 544 00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:49,799 S4: like to gravitate toward that. And, um, so could you 545 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:53,320 S4: give a little background about who Crazy Horse was, the memorial, 546 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:57,160 S4: and maybe how you would go about sharing the gospel 547 00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,040 S4: through that illustration? 548 00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:03,680 S2: Yes. Uh, well, there are many chiefs, I think, of 549 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:08,520 S2: his history that have great history, great heritage, and great 550 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,719 S2: Crazy Horse is one of those, I think, of Sitting Bull. Now, 551 00:36:11,830 --> 00:36:17,550 S2: these are all Sioux chiefs or Red cloud. And, uh, again, 552 00:36:17,550 --> 00:36:21,469 S2: to hear their stories of how they came to know 553 00:36:21,469 --> 00:36:24,790 S2: the Lord, some of them have accepted Christ. I have 554 00:36:24,790 --> 00:36:29,030 S2: a dear friend that actually is a descendant, I believe, 555 00:36:29,030 --> 00:36:33,750 S2: of Sitting Bull. And, uh, when we were, when this, uh, 556 00:36:33,750 --> 00:36:39,870 S2: celebration that we had in Massachusetts in 2021 of the Thanksgiving, uh, 557 00:36:39,870 --> 00:36:43,509 S2: this brother came and he had a Bible, and it's 558 00:36:43,510 --> 00:36:46,589 S2: a big Bible, and he says, I'm a relative of 559 00:36:46,590 --> 00:36:50,990 S2: Sitting Bull. And he showed me the Bible, his Bible, 560 00:36:50,989 --> 00:36:57,830 S2: and it was a blood stained Bible, and it was amazing. But, uh, again, 561 00:36:57,870 --> 00:37:03,109 S2: example of these men that have come to know the Lord. So, uh, 562 00:37:03,110 --> 00:37:07,110 S2: they've gone through much they've I think of the sioux's, uh, 563 00:37:07,310 --> 00:37:10,660 S2: the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. It is one 564 00:37:10,660 --> 00:37:16,740 S2: of the most neediest areas within all the different reservations. Uh, 565 00:37:16,739 --> 00:37:23,819 S2: they have been, uh, they have struggles, challenges, alcoholism and, uh, 566 00:37:23,820 --> 00:37:28,299 S2: drug addictions and just things like that. But, uh, and 567 00:37:28,300 --> 00:37:31,220 S2: I've seen the government go in and help. I've seen 568 00:37:31,219 --> 00:37:35,540 S2: even churches do their best to help. But where I've 569 00:37:35,540 --> 00:37:39,620 S2: seen it's been most received is when they have seen 570 00:37:39,620 --> 00:37:43,140 S2: native Christians come to know the Lord and share their 571 00:37:43,140 --> 00:37:49,219 S2: stories of hope, or share their stories of change. And, uh, again, 572 00:37:49,219 --> 00:37:52,900 S2: like I'm saying, it's not just our native people serving 573 00:37:52,900 --> 00:37:57,700 S2: native people, but where they are going alongside with the 574 00:37:57,700 --> 00:38:03,580 S2: Hispanics and with the Asian groups and serving in those communities. Uh, 575 00:38:03,739 --> 00:38:08,300 S2: it might be just serving the elders or serving, uh, 576 00:38:08,380 --> 00:38:13,009 S2: the tribal council there, demonstrating the love of Jesus to 577 00:38:13,050 --> 00:38:16,850 S2: those people. And when they see that that has been 578 00:38:16,850 --> 00:38:19,969 S2: an open door for many of our people to really 579 00:38:19,969 --> 00:38:21,930 S2: embrace Christ into their lives. 580 00:38:21,969 --> 00:38:23,529 S1: One of the things that one of the things that 581 00:38:23,530 --> 00:38:25,569 S1: I wanted to come out of this program here on 582 00:38:25,570 --> 00:38:27,649 S1: is that people would go to your website and they 583 00:38:27,650 --> 00:38:31,130 S1: would start to just begin to pray about the things 584 00:38:31,130 --> 00:38:34,050 S1: that you're talking about, to raise up leaders, to raise 585 00:38:34,050 --> 00:38:38,050 S1: up those who would tell their stories, share their stories 586 00:38:38,290 --> 00:38:42,570 S1: with other Native Americans about their the change that they've 587 00:38:42,570 --> 00:38:44,730 S1: had and to and to break down some of these 588 00:38:44,730 --> 00:38:48,969 S1: walls and the relationships that you're talking about. Huron Claus, again, 589 00:38:48,969 --> 00:38:52,130 S1: is president of chief. If you've never heard about it, 590 00:38:52,130 --> 00:38:55,169 S1: go to Chris Fabry lives. We've got a link. Click 591 00:38:55,170 --> 00:39:01,530 S1: through today's information. You'll find it right there at Chris. Moore. 592 00:39:01,530 --> 00:39:04,690 S1: Questions and comments from Huron Claus are coming up straight 593 00:39:04,690 --> 00:39:20,440 S1: ahead here on Moody Radio. Huron Claus is joining us today. 594 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:23,160 S1: And maybe that's one thing that you can do. I 595 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,600 S1: know you're not listening to the radio to find more 596 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,120 S1: things for you to do and to put on your list. 597 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,960 S1: But what if, especially as we we come at this 598 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:37,239 S1: time of year when we're thinking about, you know, Thanksgiving 599 00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:39,560 S1: and you see, what is the history of what's the 600 00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:42,719 S1: real history of Thanksgiving? And what about Native Americans? What 601 00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:45,879 S1: are they? I wonder if on your prayer list, you 602 00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:48,800 S1: could add something that Huron is talking about here today. 603 00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,320 S1: If you go to the website, you'll find it. You'll 604 00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:54,719 S1: find something that you can pray about there. At the 605 00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:58,320 S1: chief website, click through today's information. You'll see the link 606 00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:04,359 S1: right there under Huron's picture at, uh, Chris Livorno. And 607 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,310 S1: I apologize, Huron, I didn't ask you. I gave you 608 00:40:07,350 --> 00:40:10,070 S1: your age away at the very beginning of the program 609 00:40:10,070 --> 00:40:13,390 S1: because I said, you're born on Thanksgiving 1955, so people 610 00:40:13,390 --> 00:40:15,350 S1: who do math can figure that out, can't they? 611 00:40:15,390 --> 00:40:18,470 S2: Yes. Yes they can. They're they'll they'll do it. 612 00:40:19,989 --> 00:40:23,110 S1: All right. I want you to talk with my friend Heidi. Heidi, 613 00:40:23,150 --> 00:40:24,150 S1: what's your question? 614 00:40:24,989 --> 00:40:29,149 S5: Hey, Huron. Hey, Heidi. For you. Hey, my question for 615 00:40:29,150 --> 00:40:33,230 S5: you is you've seen a lot during those years. And 616 00:40:33,230 --> 00:40:38,710 S5: what's one of your favorite memories or experiences where you've 617 00:40:38,710 --> 00:40:42,150 S5: seen God at work, in your life or among the 618 00:40:42,150 --> 00:40:44,709 S5: American Native people? 619 00:40:45,830 --> 00:40:49,270 S2: I think, uh, that's a good question. And my mind 620 00:40:49,310 --> 00:40:56,110 S2: just goes, because there's so many examples. Uh, I think, uh, to, 621 00:40:56,150 --> 00:40:59,310 S2: to kind of give a future of where chief is 622 00:40:59,310 --> 00:41:04,620 S2: going is to see native peoples catch the vision And 623 00:41:05,060 --> 00:41:09,739 S2: of nations coming to know the Lord. And I think 624 00:41:09,900 --> 00:41:15,140 S2: a real highlight for me was back in the 90s. Uh, 625 00:41:15,140 --> 00:41:20,620 S2: it was in 1990 that a communism fell in Berlin, Germany. 626 00:41:20,660 --> 00:41:25,940 S2: The wall fell. Okay. Um, we had gotten a visit 627 00:41:25,940 --> 00:41:31,780 S2: from a missionary in Canada, and he had actually gone to, uh, 628 00:41:31,780 --> 00:41:36,340 S2: research a country that we had never heard about called Mongolia. 629 00:41:36,900 --> 00:41:40,100 S2: And come to find out, after we had a conversation 630 00:41:40,100 --> 00:41:43,260 S2: with him, the people there were just like our Native 631 00:41:43,260 --> 00:41:47,779 S2: American people, uh, in the Gobi desert, in the desert areas. 632 00:41:47,780 --> 00:41:51,900 S2: They lived in homes like our Navajos, the round Gers, 633 00:41:51,940 --> 00:41:57,140 S2: they call them, or hogans among our native people up 634 00:41:57,140 --> 00:42:02,700 S2: in the beautiful mountains. Uh, they they were the reindeer people. 635 00:42:02,700 --> 00:42:07,770 S2: And they lived like our planes do in teepees. And 636 00:42:07,770 --> 00:42:15,490 S2: and we were invited. When communism fell, communism ruled within Mongolia. And, uh, 637 00:42:15,570 --> 00:42:19,490 S2: they he invited us. He said, uh, would you come? 638 00:42:19,530 --> 00:42:23,490 S2: He says, I believe the Native American First Nations people 639 00:42:23,489 --> 00:42:26,890 S2: would be the most effective people in all the world 640 00:42:26,890 --> 00:42:30,649 S2: to share the gospel to these people. We went and 641 00:42:30,650 --> 00:42:34,969 S2: it was an incredible experience. We shared the gospel. We 642 00:42:34,969 --> 00:42:38,810 S2: were dressed in our native regalia. We sang our native hymns, 643 00:42:39,090 --> 00:42:44,530 S2: and we were received like never before. Uh, we shared 644 00:42:44,690 --> 00:42:48,410 S2: to the very first church in that country. There were 645 00:42:48,410 --> 00:42:54,050 S2: only about 35 believers. Uh, and within ten years, we 646 00:42:54,050 --> 00:43:00,410 S2: saw over 100,000 believers established within that country. We saw 647 00:43:00,410 --> 00:43:04,200 S2: the power in the move of God. But what challenges 648 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:08,600 S2: my heart is that the need of individuals that were 649 00:43:08,600 --> 00:43:13,680 S2: traveling with us. They saw what God did. They came back. 650 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:16,400 S2: And I'll tell you what, it was like a fire 651 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:20,760 S2: among our native people to see God begin to work 652 00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,480 S2: within our own people, within our own churches, within our 653 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:28,160 S2: own tribes. That was one of many of them. But 654 00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:30,520 S2: that that stirred my heart that day. 655 00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:36,480 S1: Your father has passed away. So if what would he 656 00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:40,839 S1: think about chief today and what you're seeing and what 657 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:45,000 S1: is moving forward? Because when he was in 1973, you know, 658 00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,520 S1: 52 years ago, he went to Lausanne, Switzerland, that great 659 00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:52,879 S1: conference there, and he was the only native in attendance, 660 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:53,359 S1: wasn't he? 661 00:43:53,360 --> 00:43:55,919 S2: That's right, that's right. He was. He that was the 662 00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:00,000 S2: only he was the only North American native. It was 663 00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:03,750 S2: a year later in Albuquerque, Doctor Graham had a crusade 664 00:44:03,910 --> 00:44:12,470 S2: in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Dad invited 100 leaders, pastors, tribal chairman, educators, 665 00:44:12,469 --> 00:44:16,750 S2: all Christians. And, uh, it was there that Billy said 666 00:44:16,750 --> 00:44:20,069 S2: that the Native Americans like a sleeping giant. And one 667 00:44:20,070 --> 00:44:26,029 S2: day the Native American will arise and bring a national revival, 668 00:44:26,030 --> 00:44:30,710 S2: even a global revival. And you know what? Today we're 669 00:44:30,710 --> 00:44:35,870 S2: seeing that in my latter years of ministry, I have 670 00:44:35,870 --> 00:44:39,230 S2: seen young men come up to me and they said, Huron, 671 00:44:39,270 --> 00:44:42,430 S2: I sense God's call on my life, but I've never 672 00:44:42,430 --> 00:44:46,110 S2: gone this way. I've never gone this journey. Would you 673 00:44:46,150 --> 00:44:49,790 S2: would you help me? Okay. And so, as I've shared, 674 00:44:49,830 --> 00:44:53,390 S2: we've I've gotten different opportunities to go to share the 675 00:44:53,430 --> 00:44:58,350 S2: gospel to similar groups, tribal people. Uh, I've been in, 676 00:44:58,390 --> 00:45:04,020 S2: in Africa in in last January in the Philippines. And 677 00:45:04,020 --> 00:45:07,819 S2: now what I see is those young leaders carrying the 678 00:45:07,820 --> 00:45:12,260 S2: torch to the next generation. So yes, my dad would 679 00:45:12,260 --> 00:45:15,459 S2: be happy, he would be proud. He would be praising 680 00:45:15,460 --> 00:45:20,140 S2: God because our native people are seeing the glory of 681 00:45:20,140 --> 00:45:22,220 S2: God to the nations. 682 00:45:23,219 --> 00:45:26,420 S1: May God raise them up, raise up more and more, 683 00:45:26,580 --> 00:45:31,460 S1: and keep that fire going. Not just of the emotion 684 00:45:31,460 --> 00:45:36,020 S1: of the feeling, but the power, the the visible power 685 00:45:36,020 --> 00:45:39,580 S1: of the Holy Spirit in the middle of the living 686 00:45:39,580 --> 00:45:41,859 S1: that's going on. And I know there's a lot of 687 00:45:41,860 --> 00:45:46,300 S1: hurt and there's a lot of struggle. Absolutely everybody feels that. 688 00:45:46,540 --> 00:45:51,300 S1: But God can reach into that heart and that life. Um, and, Huron, 689 00:45:51,340 --> 00:45:54,020 S1: you're just such a treat to get to, uh, to 690 00:45:54,060 --> 00:45:56,979 S1: talk with again. If we had more time here, I'd 691 00:45:56,980 --> 00:45:58,850 S1: have you sing. You come back and we'll do that 692 00:45:58,850 --> 00:46:00,050 S1: again the next time, okay? 693 00:46:00,090 --> 00:46:03,250 S2: Sounds good. I'll look forward to that. Chris. You take care, brother. 694 00:46:03,410 --> 00:46:06,570 S1: I'll do it. You're on Claus again, boy. I believe 695 00:46:06,570 --> 00:46:11,250 S1: in the ministry of Chief. 50 years old now and 696 00:46:11,250 --> 00:46:16,690 S1: growing and growing because people have been faithful to pray 697 00:46:16,850 --> 00:46:20,010 S1: and to support and to come alongside. And maybe today 698 00:46:20,010 --> 00:46:23,569 S1: is the first time you're hearing about chief. Go to 699 00:46:23,570 --> 00:46:28,570 S1: the website Chris Fabry, Livorno and click through today's information. 700 00:46:28,570 --> 00:46:33,570 S1: You can see more right there. Chris Fabry, Livorno tomorrow 701 00:46:33,570 --> 00:46:37,730 S1: on the program, you've heard about his groundbreaking book boundaries. 702 00:46:37,730 --> 00:46:41,370 S1: Doctor Henry Cloud wants to come along and talk about 703 00:46:41,370 --> 00:46:44,890 S1: how to have an intimate relationship with Jesus, right here 704 00:46:44,890 --> 00:46:48,090 S1: on Chris Fabry live production of Moody Radio, a ministry 705 00:46:48,090 --> 00:46:49,890 S1: of Moody Bible Institute.