WEBVTT - Hour 1: Conflict between Israel and Iran and Summer Scripture Study 0:00:09.720 --> 0:00:13.280 We've been riveted to our TV sets, watching the news, 0:00:13.440 --> 0:00:20.240 watching reports of Israel's strike against Iran and Iran's ballistic 0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:24.840 missile attacks against Israel. How should we think about this biblically, 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:27.520 and how should we pray? Stay with me as I 0:00:27.520 --> 0:00:32.159 speak with a friend from Israel, Israel, about all this. Hello, friends. 0:00:32.159 --> 0:00:36.120 Welcome to Open Line, Moody Radio's Bible study Across America. 0:00:36.159 --> 0:00:38.839 My name is Michael Wright. I'm the academic dean and 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:42.280 professor of Jewish studies and Bible at Moody Bible Institute. 0:00:42.640 --> 0:00:45.400 I'm so grateful to be joining you around the radio 0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:49.400 kitchen table. We're sitting around talking about your questions about 0:00:49.400 --> 0:00:53.240 the Bible, God, and the spiritual life. If you have 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:56.520 a question and you'd like to call the phone number 0:00:56.520 --> 0:01:09.210 here 5483675. Let me give you that again. (877) 548-3675. You 0:01:09.209 --> 0:01:15.090 can write it down and uh, (877) 548-3675. You can also 0:01:15.090 --> 0:01:18.290 go to open Line radio.org and click on the link 0:01:18.290 --> 0:01:21.410 that says Ask Michael a question, and your questions will 0:01:21.410 --> 0:01:26.370 be written down and put into the mailbag for future, uh, 0:01:26.690 --> 0:01:31.850 segment on the Febc mailbag to Hera and Lisa are 0:01:31.970 --> 0:01:36.850 producing today. Tricia is away for the day and hoping 0:01:36.850 --> 0:01:42.490 she has a great time. Uh, Omar Mendoza is our 0:01:42.770 --> 0:01:46.610 producer or our engineer today. Uh, and I have a 0:01:46.610 --> 0:01:52.770 special guest again, the phone number (877) 548-3675. Go get yourself 0:01:52.770 --> 0:01:55.570 a cup of coffee and open your Bible. We're going 0:01:55.570 --> 0:01:58.980 to listen to about listen to Israel, the stories about 0:01:58.980 --> 0:02:02.620 what's going on in Israel. But also we're going to 0:02:02.620 --> 0:02:04.780 talk about this biblically. So you need to have your 0:02:04.780 --> 0:02:10.820 Bible ready. Uh, now I want to introduce my friend. He's, uh, 0:02:10.860 --> 0:02:15.660 an expert on all things Israel. He lives in Israel. 0:02:15.860 --> 0:02:20.500 We've been friends for over 50 years. Uh, one of 0:02:20.500 --> 0:02:23.020 my dearest friends. We went to Moody together for a while. 0:02:23.020 --> 0:02:28.380 We went to Dallas Theological Seminary. Uh, and his name 0:02:28.380 --> 0:02:33.060 is Avner. Uh, Avner has lived in the land of 0:02:33.060 --> 0:02:35.860 Israel for about 40 years. I believe I'm going to 0:02:35.860 --> 0:02:39.260 get that straight. And, uh, he is a music ministry 0:02:39.260 --> 0:02:43.260 there and a worship ministry and, uh, a teaching ministry 0:02:43.380 --> 0:02:48.380 in Israel. Uh, his, uh, his kids have at least 0:02:48.380 --> 0:02:50.459 two of them have come to Moody Bible Institute, for 0:02:50.460 --> 0:02:56.579 which we're really grateful, uh, and graduated from Moody Bible Institute. 0:02:57.580 --> 0:03:00.579 He is married to the lovely Rachel, who is one 0:03:00.580 --> 0:03:03.460 of my favorite people. Dearest hearts in the whole world 0:03:03.780 --> 0:03:06.660 are grateful for you being with me. Avner, thank you 0:03:06.660 --> 0:03:07.980 for joining me right now. 0:03:08.540 --> 0:03:11.660 What a joy. Michael, always a joy to be with you. 0:03:12.340 --> 0:03:14.940 Yeah. I appreciate you so much. You know, I, I 0:03:15.060 --> 0:03:18.180 don't know quite how to describe you. You do everything. 0:03:18.180 --> 0:03:21.700 You teach, you sing, you write music, you, uh, you're 0:03:21.700 --> 0:03:26.020 even a tour guide if necessary. So thank you so much, Avner. 0:03:26.940 --> 0:03:27.980 Thank you for joining me. 0:03:27.980 --> 0:03:30.140 I do do juggling and playing the piano at the 0:03:30.139 --> 0:03:31.899 same time, but not successfully. 0:03:32.260 --> 0:03:36.820 Yeah, I know you try that. That's great. Well, thank you, Avner, for, uh, this. 0:03:36.860 --> 0:03:42.420 You know, I have been, uh, become sort of, like, 0:03:42.780 --> 0:03:47.900 frenetic in watching TV news, uh, scrolling on, going on 0:03:47.940 --> 0:03:51.940 to my phone and scrolling constantly for The Jerusalem Post 0:03:51.940 --> 0:03:55.870 and the Times of Israel. Uh, I'm watching my news 0:03:55.870 --> 0:04:01.190 feeds constantly because of the strike against Iran. And then, 0:04:01.190 --> 0:04:09.910 of course, the ballistic missile retaliation by Iran. So people 0:04:09.910 --> 0:04:13.910 are wondering why in the world now, why did Israel 0:04:13.950 --> 0:04:17.830 do this now? Uh, just a couple nights ago and 0:04:17.830 --> 0:04:22.670 start this, uh, strike against the Iranian nuclear facilities. Tell 0:04:22.670 --> 0:04:23.110 me about. 0:04:23.110 --> 0:04:26.470 That. Mike, you and I once had a professor who 0:04:26.470 --> 0:04:29.950 we called Prof. It was Howard Hendricks. Sure. And he. 0:04:29.990 --> 0:04:33.470 He always used to say a text without a context 0:04:33.470 --> 0:04:36.110 is a pretext. He was quoting, I think, probably from 0:04:36.110 --> 0:04:41.309 David Cooper. Um, but the point I'm raising that is 0:04:41.310 --> 0:04:45.830 because a lot of people don't remember what's going on historically. 0:04:46.430 --> 0:04:49.470 They might know the issue of the Prince of Persia 0:04:49.470 --> 0:04:53.350 from the Book of Daniel. And certainly there's a spiritual 0:04:53.350 --> 0:04:58.560 dynamic that one could trace and work on. But basically, um, 0:04:59.520 --> 0:05:03.360 the original perspective that Muhammad had back in the six 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:08.479 hundreds was, uh, to conquer the world, uh, for what 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:13.320 he believed was a revelation from God. It wasn't it 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:16.560 was from a God who didn't have the biblical name, 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:19.640 but that meant to take over the world and to 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:23.320 make everyone believers, whether they like it or not. And 0:05:23.320 --> 0:05:27.120 if not, then to become second class citizens. So even 0:05:27.160 --> 0:05:31.040 though in America most people don't believe that or live 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:34.680 with that awareness, in the Middle East it's very strong. 0:05:35.240 --> 0:05:40.560 And Iran specifically is the Shiite stream. It's about 20% 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:44.600 of Islam, and they're ruled by people who are actually 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:49.559 geopolitically trying to make something called the Shiite Crescent that 0:05:49.560 --> 0:05:55.690 would go from Iraq, Lebanon, Yemen. Of course, Syria has 0:05:55.690 --> 0:05:59.490 gone through some changes now, but their goal is basically 0:05:59.490 --> 0:06:03.610 to tie down the Middle East. And their second goal 0:06:03.610 --> 0:06:07.049 is to destroy Israel. And they're very, very clear about it. 0:06:07.570 --> 0:06:12.650 Most Americans might not remember that Iran was involved in 0:06:12.650 --> 0:06:16.410 things like the bombing of the US embassy in Beirut, 0:06:16.410 --> 0:06:20.610 where 63 people were murdered, or the bombing of the 0:06:20.610 --> 0:06:24.690 marine barracks where 241 were murdered in Beirut, or the 0:06:24.930 --> 0:06:29.010 Khobar Towers in Saudi Arabia. All these things were done 0:06:29.010 --> 0:06:35.929 by Iranian terrorism. So that same jihadi, uh, evil uh, 0:06:35.930 --> 0:06:40.050 is directed very, very clearly at Israel, where the leaders 0:06:40.050 --> 0:06:43.570 are saying, hey, we're going to eliminate you. You cannot 0:06:43.610 --> 0:06:47.450 win this conflict. We will destroy you. So we've been 0:06:47.450 --> 0:06:51.970 dealing with this since the mid 80s, since the mid 80s, 0:06:52.250 --> 0:06:55.290 and it's gotten worse and worse. And Israel's always been 0:06:55.290 --> 0:06:58.050 telling the world, hey, this is a new Hitler. And 0:06:58.050 --> 0:07:00.130 he's going to start with us, but he's not going 0:07:00.170 --> 0:07:02.610 to end with us. He's going to end with America. 0:07:03.170 --> 0:07:06.250 But a lot of people are not tuned into that 0:07:06.250 --> 0:07:10.170 and forget about that. So to give you two very, 0:07:10.170 --> 0:07:16.690 very short examples here, uh, back in January 2020, America 0:07:16.690 --> 0:07:23.250 took out the head of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, Qassem Soleimani, 0:07:24.010 --> 0:07:31.730 who was involved in his biggest master terrorist in the world, in, um, December, 0:07:32.250 --> 0:07:37.290 just after the October 7th, um, attack on Gaza, the famous, uh, 0:07:37.290 --> 0:07:44.890 infamous Hamas attack, the same Islamic Revolutionary Guard said that 0:07:44.890 --> 0:07:50.300 we're attacking Israel with this huge, uh, uh, ballistic missile 0:07:50.300 --> 0:07:58.540 attacks in revenge for America killing Qassem Soleimani. Now, Israel's 0:07:58.540 --> 0:08:02.900 not upset about the fact that America killed Soleimani. We 0:08:02.900 --> 0:08:06.620 were very happy about that. He was an enemy. And 0:08:06.740 --> 0:08:11.460 Psalm 139 talks about what God feels about the enemies 0:08:11.460 --> 0:08:16.420 of Israel. But here we are with the same enemy. 0:08:16.460 --> 0:08:21.660 America and Israel. And the enemy doesn't understand the Bible, 0:08:22.180 --> 0:08:26.780 doesn't understand Psalm 83 or Ezekiel 38 and 39, where 0:08:27.260 --> 0:08:30.980 Iran is mentioned, at least in the second passage, as 0:08:30.980 --> 0:08:37.180 having a factor. So what's happened basically is they are 0:08:37.179 --> 0:08:40.020 trying to destroy us and have done so for years. 0:08:40.059 --> 0:08:44.699 They've sent all the money to Hamas. They've sent money 0:08:44.700 --> 0:08:48.220 to Hezbollah in Lebanon. They've sent money to the Houthis, 0:08:48.220 --> 0:08:53.030 who are, uh, rocketing American ships. They sent money to Iraq, 0:08:53.030 --> 0:08:56.710 which has been attacking US bases. So this is a 0:08:56.750 --> 0:09:00.230 big problem. And Israel basically got got to the point 0:09:00.230 --> 0:09:02.830 where we said we have to deal with this because 0:09:02.830 --> 0:09:06.469 they were close to completing a primitive nuclear device and 0:09:06.470 --> 0:09:08.790 had about eight more in the pipeline. 0:09:09.630 --> 0:09:12.150 You know, uh, a lot of people think that Israel 0:09:12.150 --> 0:09:18.070 started this assault on Iran, uh, this strike. However, I 0:09:18.070 --> 0:09:22.750 believe that the violent assault actually began on October 7th 0:09:22.870 --> 0:09:28.110 when a proxy of Iran attacked Israel and committed the 0:09:28.110 --> 0:09:32.350 worst atrocities since the Holocaust. That was the attack by Hamas. 0:09:32.550 --> 0:09:37.229 And then immediately afterwards, Hezbollah, the northern uh, from Lebanon, 0:09:37.429 --> 0:09:43.949 that proxy of Iran, began to fire rockets and missiles 0:09:43.950 --> 0:09:47.640 into Israel. And then, of course, the Houthis are involved. 0:09:47.679 --> 0:09:51.439 They're firing missiles into Israel. All these things are happening. 0:09:51.760 --> 0:09:55.320 And there was a seven front war that began. But 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:59.319 only one of those fronts is Iran. But this began 0:09:59.360 --> 0:10:04.120 more than two years ago. This began or almost two 0:10:04.120 --> 0:10:09.440 years ago, uh, in October of 23. That's when it began. 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:13.120 When the most recent assault. I agree with you about 0:10:13.120 --> 0:10:18.160 the broader context, but this recent assault was begun when 0:10:18.200 --> 0:10:21.640 Iran began the strike. And now, with Iran so close 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:24.720 to getting nuclear weapons, I don't think Israel could have 0:10:24.720 --> 0:10:27.960 helped by not striking that it would have been no 0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:31.120 good not to strike the the head of the snake, 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:34.559 so to speak, that wants to see the destruction of Israel. Now, 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:39.280 you and I, we both are linked to the Holocaust. 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:43.880 I know both my parents survived and I lost half 0:10:43.880 --> 0:10:49.040 brothers and a sister. Mr.. Uh uh uh uh uh 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:51.480 uh uh uh uh, did you, uh, have family? 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:57.480 Yeah, from my Polish family. 92 of 95, uh, were, uh, 0:10:58.160 --> 0:10:59.480 murdered in the camps. 0:10:59.920 --> 0:11:03.520 Yeah. See, this is why I think people don't realize 0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:07.720 that now Israel has a solemn duty to protect the 0:11:07.720 --> 0:11:12.360 Jewish people, and they cannot abide by Iran getting a 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:15.679 nuclear weapon and then committing a second Holocaust. So it 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:20.320 is Israel's government's responsibility to protect the nation of Israel, 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:25.040 the Jewish state, from this kind of genocidal attack that 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:28.720 that Iran is planning. I think that's so important that 0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:33.040 we recognize this. Anyway, uh, Avner, can you stay with me? 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:33.880 Another segment? 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:34.800 Sure. 0:11:35.440 --> 0:11:39.480 Okay. Uh, we're going to be right back, folks. We're 0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:41.960 going to take a break here. And, uh, when we 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:44.080 come back, we're going to talk about some ways to 0:11:44.250 --> 0:11:50.290 think biblically about this continuing war between Iran and Israel, 0:11:50.570 --> 0:11:53.730 and also how we can pray. What should we be 0:11:53.730 --> 0:11:57.010 praying about this? My guest is Avner Boesky. I'm Michael Redlick. 0:11:57.050 --> 0:12:19.690 Stay with me. We'll be right back. Welcome back to 0:12:19.730 --> 0:12:23.370 Open Line. I'm Michael Rey. Dominik. Joining me for this 0:12:24.130 --> 0:12:27.090 first half hour of the program is my friend Avner 0:12:27.090 --> 0:12:31.850 Boesky from Israel. Avner is an expert on all things 0:12:31.850 --> 0:12:37.690 Israel and scripture and uh, also, uh, what God is, 0:12:37.730 --> 0:12:41.170 how God is moving in the land of Israel. So, uh, Avner, 0:12:41.170 --> 0:12:43.540 thank you for for being with us at short notice. 0:12:43.540 --> 0:12:45.980 I really appreciate it. We're talking about what's going on 0:12:46.500 --> 0:12:49.500 with Iran. I want to know how has Israel responded? 0:12:49.500 --> 0:12:53.220 How are the people of Israel responding to the retaliation 0:12:53.220 --> 0:12:56.900 with the ballistic missiles that are landing around Israel? Tell 0:12:56.900 --> 0:12:57.860 me about that. 0:12:58.540 --> 0:13:01.219 Yes. Sometimes people call me up and they say, is 0:13:01.220 --> 0:13:03.380 it safe to come to Israel? I say, I don't know, 0:13:03.380 --> 0:13:06.180 I just live here. Uh, one of the things that 0:13:06.179 --> 0:13:09.620 happens here is that we've been going through wars. We've 0:13:09.620 --> 0:13:14.980 been birthed in war since 1948. And so every Israeli 0:13:14.980 --> 0:13:17.780 goes into the army for 2 to 3 years, depending 0:13:17.780 --> 0:13:21.459 if they're a man or a woman. So we've seen this, uh, 0:13:21.580 --> 0:13:26.020 we haven't seen missiles landing on civilians. The first time 0:13:26.020 --> 0:13:28.900 that happened, I was in the Israeli army, and I 0:13:28.900 --> 0:13:34.020 was in 91 from Saddam Hussein, the desert storms. But 0:13:34.020 --> 0:13:38.700 right now we have, uh, you know, people with the 0:13:38.740 --> 0:13:43.590 2000 missiles in their inventory shooting at us. And, uh, 0:13:44.070 --> 0:13:46.829 we found that if we go into shelters in our house, 0:13:46.830 --> 0:13:49.350 every house has a shelter. If you go into the 0:13:49.350 --> 0:13:53.350 shelter 99 times out of 100, you're going to be fine. 0:13:54.230 --> 0:13:58.069 2 or 3 people were killed. Murdered yesterday by an 0:13:58.070 --> 0:14:01.270 Iranian missile. And they weren't in a shelter in their 0:14:01.309 --> 0:14:05.030 in their safe room, I guess you would call it. Uh, so, yeah, 0:14:05.030 --> 0:14:11.310 but Israelis really feel that, uh, we are, um, we 0:14:11.309 --> 0:14:14.030 can deal with it, but we know all of us, uh, 0:14:14.030 --> 0:14:18.189 a great sobriety because we know that, uh, these, uh, 0:14:18.190 --> 0:14:23.470 £1,000 bombs can really do a lot of damage when 0:14:23.470 --> 0:14:27.230 they hit. And, uh, Israel right now, of course, is, uh, 0:14:27.550 --> 0:14:32.430 controlling the skies over Iran. And that's an amazing thing. 0:14:32.910 --> 0:14:36.430 100 drones were shot at us just a day ago. 0:14:36.710 --> 0:14:41.680 And we, with some American help, shut down nearly all 0:14:41.680 --> 0:14:46.680 of the 100 drones, something unheard of in military history. 0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:51.720 But we're talking about the largest ballistic missile attacks that 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:53.560 Israel is facing in the world in the history of 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:58.520 the world. Happened yesterday. And, uh, so, yeah, but there's 0:14:58.520 --> 0:14:59.960 a great sobriety. 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:06.120 So people are wondering, uh, I know believers are saying, 0:15:06.120 --> 0:15:08.360 is this Armageddon? Is this the end of the world? 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:11.320 Is this the last battle? Where does this fit prophetically, 0:15:11.320 --> 0:15:12.040 do you think? 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:17.800 Well, again, if we're looking at Armageddon, you know, we're looking, uh, 0:15:18.120 --> 0:15:21.760 not just to, let's say Ezekiel 38 and 39, where 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:25.960 Persia is mentioned, uh, in verse five. So Persia is 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:27.680 going to be around, Iran is going to be around 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.320 for a while. They're not out of the picture. Uh, 0:15:30.440 --> 0:15:34.560 but the principle of Psalm 83, the people who make 0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:37.560 shrewd plans against your people and say, let's wipe them 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:41.520 out as a nation, That's what we're dealing with. Armageddon 0:15:41.520 --> 0:15:44.800 talks about all the nations of the world. And so 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:47.560 we're not dealing with that. We're dealing with one nation 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:50.880 primarily at this point with 5 or 6 proxies. 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:53.960 You know, one of the things I say, people ask 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:56.640 me all the time, are we in the last battle? 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:59.160 And I point out the very same thing. But I 0:15:59.160 --> 0:16:02.720 do think that what we're seeing as more and more 0:16:02.720 --> 0:16:07.520 nations turn against Israel, even Western nations that were supposed 0:16:07.520 --> 0:16:14.200 to be supportive. Correct? Yes. I think that we're seeing 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:18.840 it getting closer and closer to those days when all 0:16:18.840 --> 0:16:22.240 nations will gather against Jerusalem. Thank God it's not happening 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:25.480 just yet. But we do see they're gathering in the U.N., 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:26.400 so to speak. 0:16:26.640 --> 0:16:28.400 Uh, yeah. And there's. 0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:28.600 Two. 0:16:28.600 --> 0:16:31.160 Things, I think if you go to Psalm 83, verse 0:16:31.160 --> 0:16:34.720 six through eight, you'll see that just about all of 0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:40.970 those nations are right now involved in attacking Israel. That's very, 0:16:40.970 --> 0:16:44.730 very close to what Psalm 83 is talking about. But 0:16:44.730 --> 0:16:49.370 the other side to us is, uh oh. Now, what 0:16:49.370 --> 0:16:50.930 was I about to say on that? 0:16:50.970 --> 0:16:54.850 It's okay. Here's here's the question. I do think that 0:16:54.890 --> 0:16:59.610 the the nations will gather against Israel. Uh, I tell you, 0:16:59.810 --> 0:17:04.770 today I got a very encouraging, uh, uh, picture and 0:17:04.770 --> 0:17:07.649 text message from a professor at Moody who happens to 0:17:07.650 --> 0:17:11.210 be in Seoul, Korea. And what he sent me was 0:17:11.210 --> 0:17:14.050 a a sign. I don't even know where the sign was. 0:17:14.050 --> 0:17:20.370 A big banner was hanging up, and, uh, it says, uh, 0:17:20.690 --> 0:17:23.690 thank you, Israel, for fighting for the free world. And 0:17:23.690 --> 0:17:27.889 then Korea stands with Israel and had an Israeli flag 0:17:28.090 --> 0:17:30.129 that was encouraging. I think it was at a church 0:17:30.130 --> 0:17:32.690 that they did this. So, uh, I think that it's 0:17:32.690 --> 0:17:36.700 important I think this is what a believer's response should be, 0:17:37.020 --> 0:17:40.380 in my opinion. What would you encourage believers to think 0:17:40.380 --> 0:17:42.260 about these kinds of events today? 0:17:43.140 --> 0:17:46.500 I would say compare it to what happened in Germany 0:17:46.500 --> 0:17:49.419 in the 30s. We're dealing with people who wanted to 0:17:49.420 --> 0:17:53.420 destroy not only Israel, but the whole world. The chant 0:17:53.420 --> 0:17:55.900 that goes on in Iran all the time is death 0:17:55.900 --> 0:18:00.340 to Israel, death to America. And then the Houthis add 0:18:00.340 --> 0:18:03.820 on a third line and cursed be Israel. Which brings 0:18:03.820 --> 0:18:06.820 us right into Genesis 12 three. That those who curse 0:18:06.859 --> 0:18:10.420 Israel will themselves be cursed by the God of Israel. 0:18:10.859 --> 0:18:13.940 So I think it's real important to be praying. It's 0:18:13.940 --> 0:18:17.859 important for us if you pray. So if the listeners 0:18:17.859 --> 0:18:22.620 are listening, do pray for Israel's safety and protection. And 0:18:22.619 --> 0:18:24.780 that the Lord would give us, like he gave to 0:18:24.820 --> 0:18:27.660 King David, victory on the battle, and that he would 0:18:27.700 --> 0:18:32.460 bring us to know the God of Israel personally. Mhm. 0:18:32.859 --> 0:18:35.590 Yeah, I think that's true. I think we need to 0:18:35.590 --> 0:18:37.350 be praying. You know, when we say pray for the 0:18:37.350 --> 0:18:39.910 peace of Jerusalem, I pray for the peace of Jerusalem 0:18:39.910 --> 0:18:43.109 all the time. But I at this point, as there's 0:18:43.150 --> 0:18:48.950 war with Hamas, uh, continuing and this war now with, uh, Iran, 0:18:48.950 --> 0:18:51.190 I pray for the victory of Israel. And that's how 0:18:51.190 --> 0:18:54.030 there will be peace. Now, it's not the final peace 0:18:54.070 --> 0:18:56.710 that will come when the Prince of Peace returns, but 0:18:56.710 --> 0:19:01.070 at least temporal peace, uh, and that peace will come 0:19:01.070 --> 0:19:05.590 through the surrender of Hamas and, uh, the the final 0:19:05.590 --> 0:19:10.429 defeat of this nuclear program at, uh, in Iran. I 0:19:10.430 --> 0:19:14.470 think that that's crucial to understand. Uh, so we're praying 0:19:14.470 --> 0:19:19.470 for peace in that way. Uh, any other areas specifically 0:19:19.470 --> 0:19:21.030 that we should be praying for Israel? 0:19:22.390 --> 0:19:26.270 David's son Solomon said there's a time for peace and 0:19:26.270 --> 0:19:27.350 a time for war. 0:19:28.030 --> 0:19:28.670 And of course. 0:19:29.150 --> 0:19:32.030 The birds. The birds sang that in their famous, uh, 0:19:32.030 --> 0:19:36.270 Pete Seeger song. turn, turn, turn. Yeah. I think it's so, so, 0:19:36.270 --> 0:19:41.150 so important, uh, to really be praying for the salvation 0:19:41.150 --> 0:19:44.510 and the protection of Israel. Uh, to me, that's just 0:19:44.510 --> 0:19:47.550 about the most important thing. One good thing and might 0:19:47.550 --> 0:19:52.629 be encouraging to people is that because of pressure, C.S. 0:19:52.630 --> 0:19:55.670 Lewis used to say, God whispers in our pleasures, and 0:19:55.670 --> 0:19:59.149 he shouts in our pains. It's his megaphone to raise 0:19:59.150 --> 0:20:04.790 a deaf world. There is greater openness spiritually in Israel 0:20:04.790 --> 0:20:09.550 today across the board. People are seeking, you know, they 0:20:09.550 --> 0:20:15.190 say there are no atheists in foxholes. That's happening in Israel. Uh, 0:20:15.190 --> 0:20:18.389 it's not overwhelming. And we're not seeing, you know, a 0:20:18.430 --> 0:20:22.310 Billy Graham meeting here, uh, in terms of amounts of people. 0:20:22.310 --> 0:20:24.950 But there is a much greater openness. And so that's 0:20:24.950 --> 0:20:28.870 worth praying for, that people will find the God who 0:20:28.910 --> 0:20:31.230 they've been looking for and his Messiah. 0:20:31.880 --> 0:20:37.040 Yeah. You know, yesterday, uh, a mom of a of 0:20:37.080 --> 0:20:40.199 a there's a Jewish believer who has sent several of 0:20:40.200 --> 0:20:43.360 her children to Moody. One is coming this fall. In fact, 0:20:43.560 --> 0:20:47.480 several are graduates already, three, I believe. Uh, she sent 0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:52.960 me a link to a CBN report. News report, uh, 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:57.320 where they were there was a video that they showed 0:20:57.600 --> 0:21:01.920 and then interviewed someone of a group of Jewish believers 0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:08.600 gathering in a shelter during the ballistic missile assault. And 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:13.040 they were engaged in singing and worship. And I saw 0:21:13.040 --> 0:21:17.880 three moody grads in that video. Um, and they they 0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:21.280 were there in Israel and, and worshiping and I, I 0:21:21.480 --> 0:21:27.199 pray that these young people that they will continue to 0:21:27.240 --> 0:21:32.609 speak up with other Israelis, uh, that the Israelis who are, 0:21:32.650 --> 0:21:35.730 I think it's fair to say, pretty stressed with this war. 0:21:36.450 --> 0:21:43.010 We'll find peace and and rest and emotional well-being through 0:21:43.010 --> 0:21:46.130 the Prince of Peace by coming to know Yeshua Jesus. Yeah. 0:21:46.570 --> 0:21:47.490 I think I think. 0:21:47.490 --> 0:21:50.570 One really good point is the issue of the heart, 0:21:50.890 --> 0:21:53.650 that it's not just a chess game, of course, with 0:21:53.650 --> 0:21:59.050 various pieces, Israeli pieces, Iranian pieces, but God's heart in 0:21:59.050 --> 0:22:03.410 Isaiah 62 and 63 is bound to the Jewish people. 0:22:03.410 --> 0:22:07.090 And when they suffer, it says he suffers. And so 0:22:07.090 --> 0:22:10.410 that's so important. We're touching something very precious and deep 0:22:10.410 --> 0:22:13.609 to the heart of God. And as we pray and intercede, 0:22:13.890 --> 0:22:17.570 it's not only for prophetic fulfillment, but it's for something 0:22:17.570 --> 0:22:20.090 which is really touching the love and the passion and 0:22:20.090 --> 0:22:20.970 the heart of God. 0:22:22.290 --> 0:22:24.810 Yeah. You know, that's a verse that I find very 0:22:24.810 --> 0:22:27.410 helpful when people ask me and they I'm sure they 0:22:27.410 --> 0:22:31.660 ask you this where was God during the Holocaust? I 0:22:31.660 --> 0:22:36.500 always tell them, uh, in Isaiah 63 nine, in all 0:22:36.540 --> 0:22:40.180 their suffering and all their afflictions, he was afflicted. And 0:22:40.180 --> 0:22:45.460 I think that when Israel suffers, God suffers with Israel. Um, and, uh, 0:22:45.460 --> 0:22:48.260 I think that sometimes we lose sight of that, that 0:22:48.300 --> 0:22:51.580 what breaks the heart of God. Uh, I don't know 0:22:51.580 --> 0:22:54.260 if you know this story, but, uh, you know, the 0:22:54.260 --> 0:22:57.139 person I'm going to tell you about, uh, your daughter 0:22:57.140 --> 0:22:58.700 in law, uh. 0:22:59.100 --> 0:23:00.340 When she was not your daughter. 0:23:00.340 --> 0:23:00.419 In. 0:23:00.420 --> 0:23:00.780 Law. 0:23:01.460 --> 0:23:04.699 She, uh, she said to me she was going to 0:23:04.700 --> 0:23:07.500 study this summer. Uh, it was a summer a number 0:23:07.500 --> 0:23:10.500 of years ago. Uh, and she said, I'm going to 0:23:10.500 --> 0:23:13.859 study on my summer break. She was a student at Moody, 0:23:13.859 --> 0:23:18.100 and I'm going to see what breaks the heart of God. And, uh, 0:23:18.900 --> 0:23:21.300 so she came back, and she was not a Jewish 0:23:21.300 --> 0:23:23.860 studies major. She came and she said, I discovered what 0:23:23.900 --> 0:23:26.300 breaks the heart of God. And that's the ministry I'm 0:23:26.340 --> 0:23:28.830 going to be in. And I said, what's that? And 0:23:28.830 --> 0:23:32.710 she said, I saw the two places where Yeshua wept 0:23:32.710 --> 0:23:35.470 in the Gospels, and both places it was over the 0:23:35.470 --> 0:23:36.629 unbelief of Israel. 0:23:36.950 --> 0:23:37.470 In. 0:23:38.270 --> 0:23:42.229 Luke 19 and in John 11. And the unbelief of 0:23:42.230 --> 0:23:45.510 Israel is what breaks God's heart and breaks my heart. 0:23:45.510 --> 0:23:49.030 And and lo and behold, she listened to that leading 0:23:49.030 --> 0:23:53.070 of the Holy Spirit through his word and and ended 0:23:53.070 --> 0:23:55.270 up wisely marrying your son. 0:23:57.150 --> 0:23:57.630 And that's how. 0:23:58.310 --> 0:24:00.669 She's listening to this broadcast right now. 0:24:01.510 --> 0:24:05.989 Yeah. Now that to me, uh, that understanding that the 0:24:05.990 --> 0:24:09.550 Lord is with Israel and all their afflictions and, uh, 0:24:09.590 --> 0:24:13.990 that he is, uh, he, he cares deeply and weeps 0:24:13.990 --> 0:24:17.630 at the unbelief of Israel. Avner. Uh, what last things 0:24:17.630 --> 0:24:20.830 can you tell me, uh, tell our audience. How would 0:24:20.830 --> 0:24:23.910 you like them to? What kind of action? What kind 0:24:23.910 --> 0:24:27.270 of steps can they take? At this point. 0:24:27.950 --> 0:24:32.429 I would say two things, even three things. One is, uh, 0:24:32.750 --> 0:24:37.869 we're probably, uh, in for, uh, some very heavy ballistic 0:24:37.869 --> 0:24:41.910 missile attacks, uh, usually at night. They only come out 0:24:41.910 --> 0:24:45.110 at night. They can refuel better at night. So I 0:24:45.109 --> 0:24:49.350 think it's very worth praying for Israel's safety and for 0:24:49.350 --> 0:24:54.510 the Israeli and American soldiers, airmen who are interdicting these things. 0:24:54.550 --> 0:24:59.189 The third missiles. The arrow missiles. That's the first point. 0:24:59.470 --> 0:25:03.230 The second point is it says in Romans 116, don't 0:25:03.230 --> 0:25:05.630 leave the gospel out. It's supposed to go to the 0:25:05.630 --> 0:25:09.469 Jewish people. It's our Messiah. Bring it with priority first 0:25:09.470 --> 0:25:14.030 to the Jew. And third of all, uh, one of 0:25:14.030 --> 0:25:19.550 the signs you mentioned, uh, Michael, is anti-Semitism increasing, and 0:25:19.550 --> 0:25:23.430 it doesn't only increase on the media, it increases next door. 0:25:24.109 --> 0:25:26.359 And so when you run into that, it's time to 0:25:26.400 --> 0:25:29.240 speak up and to stand for your Jewish neighbors. And 0:25:29.240 --> 0:25:31.800 when you know Jewish people, let them know that you're 0:25:32.000 --> 0:25:33.440 not buying into that. 0:25:34.880 --> 0:25:35.280 Hey. 0:25:36.200 --> 0:25:40.480 Thank you so much for joining me on Open Line. Uh, it's, uh, 0:25:40.480 --> 0:25:44.359 very insightful, very helpful. We'll be praying for you. Uh, friends, 0:25:44.359 --> 0:25:46.720 we're going to be right back with the Febc mailbag, 0:25:46.720 --> 0:25:49.600 so stay with us. This is open line with Michael Radonich. 0:25:49.600 --> 0:26:06.639 And that was my guest, Avner Boesky. And we're back. 0:26:07.119 --> 0:26:10.399 So glad to be with you this Saturday morning. And 0:26:11.040 --> 0:26:15.000 I'm really grateful to the Far Eastern Broadcasting Company for 0:26:15.000 --> 0:26:19.040 partnering with Open Line to bring the weekly Febc mailbag. 0:26:20.240 --> 0:26:24.890 Febc far Eastern Broadcasting Company is a terrific organization, and 0:26:24.890 --> 0:26:27.449 they bring the gospel to people all over the world 0:26:27.450 --> 0:26:32.729 through media and through personal engagement. I think that's so crucial. Yeah, 0:26:32.890 --> 0:26:37.570 to to see what they're doing. Check out the Febc podcast. 0:26:37.609 --> 0:26:40.410 It's called Until All Have Heard. You'll find it at 0:26:40.450 --> 0:26:46.090 their website, febc. Uh, check that out. Well, joining me 0:26:46.130 --> 0:26:50.970 right now with the Febc mailbag is Tricia McMillan. She's 0:26:50.970 --> 0:26:54.850 the queen of the questions. The person that puts all 0:26:54.890 --> 0:26:58.010 those questions into the mailbag. And you know, the way 0:26:58.010 --> 0:27:01.729 these questions come, Tricia, is, I mean, people send them 0:27:01.730 --> 0:27:03.850 all different ways, but I want to encourage people. The 0:27:03.850 --> 0:27:07.250 best way to send a question is to go to 0:27:07.290 --> 0:27:12.169 our website, openline radio.org. Click on that, and when you 0:27:12.170 --> 0:27:16.090 get there, there's a link that says Ask Michael a question. 0:27:16.090 --> 0:27:19.010 That's a great way to get your question in. So 0:27:19.530 --> 0:27:23.820 yes it is. And the the reason is, you know, 0:27:23.859 --> 0:27:26.939 it's so hard when people are sending it to Facebook 0:27:26.980 --> 0:27:31.859 or to different kinds of things. Instagram. The the result 0:27:31.859 --> 0:27:33.740 is that that you're trying to drag it from all 0:27:33.740 --> 0:27:34.619 over the place. 0:27:34.619 --> 0:27:37.220 Which I do. So if you do send it there, 0:27:37.340 --> 0:27:40.420 I do see those, just not maybe not quite as 0:27:40.420 --> 0:27:42.780 instantly as I do because the other ones go straight 0:27:42.780 --> 0:27:47.140 to my email inbox. Yeah. And so it's just easier. 0:27:47.140 --> 0:27:48.980 But I do find the others if you have put 0:27:48.980 --> 0:27:50.060 one there. Yeah I will. 0:27:50.100 --> 0:27:51.740 It may take a time. And that's why people write 0:27:51.740 --> 0:27:54.300 me and say, I asked this question about a month ago, 0:27:54.300 --> 0:27:55.140 but I haven't, you know. 0:27:55.180 --> 0:27:55.660 That's right. 0:27:55.900 --> 0:27:59.660 So I'm just looking out for you, Tricia. Thank you. Uh, well, 0:27:59.700 --> 0:28:01.100 let's go ahead with the question. 0:28:01.140 --> 0:28:03.660 All right. Our first question is from Mike in Indiana. 0:28:03.700 --> 0:28:09.460 Listens to. Could you please explain the dietary prohibitions found in. 0:28:09.500 --> 0:28:15.980 He gives three different references. Exodus 2319, Exodus 3426, and 0:28:15.980 --> 0:28:20.020 Deuteronomy 1421. Many thanks for your faithfulness and help in 0:28:20.020 --> 0:28:23.660 our biblical growth and understanding. Now, the first two Exodus 0:28:23.660 --> 0:28:29.060 verses are both very similar, almost identical, but they say 0:28:29.380 --> 0:28:31.580 something to the effect of bring the best of the 0:28:31.580 --> 0:28:33.619 firstfruits of your land to the house of the Lord 0:28:33.619 --> 0:28:36.660 your God. You must not boil a young goat in 0:28:36.660 --> 0:28:42.980 its mother's milk. And then the Deuteronomy 1421 passage includes 0:28:43.260 --> 0:28:45.739 the part about do not boil a young goat in 0:28:45.740 --> 0:28:48.580 its mother's milk. But before that it says, you are 0:28:48.580 --> 0:28:51.380 not to eat any carcass. You may give it to 0:28:51.420 --> 0:28:53.980 a temporary resident living within your gates, and he may 0:28:53.980 --> 0:28:56.300 eat it, or you may sell it to a foreigner. 0:28:56.340 --> 0:28:58.660 For you are a holy people belonging to the Lord 0:28:58.660 --> 0:29:01.180 your God. You must not boil a young goat in 0:29:01.180 --> 0:29:06.300 its mother's milk. So we have two different prohibitions that 0:29:06.340 --> 0:29:08.820 don't eat any carcass, but you can give it to 0:29:08.820 --> 0:29:11.940 a temporary resident. And don't boil a young goat in 0:29:11.940 --> 0:29:12.740 its mother's milk. 0:29:13.380 --> 0:29:17.060 Right? Okay, so there's a lot to say about this. 0:29:17.060 --> 0:29:21.550 First of all, there's a whole aspect of kashrut or 0:29:21.590 --> 0:29:27.670 Jewish kosher law based on this, uh, this law. It's 0:29:27.670 --> 0:29:30.910 why Jewish people don't mix milk with meat because they thought, 0:29:30.950 --> 0:29:33.550 don't take a baby goat. This is how the rabbis 0:29:33.550 --> 0:29:36.910 developed this. Don't take a baby goat and boil it 0:29:36.910 --> 0:29:39.710 in its mother's milk. But then you might take, uh, 0:29:40.350 --> 0:29:44.550 another goat and baby goat. And it's not its own 0:29:44.550 --> 0:29:46.990 mother's milk. You think that's what it is? So it's okay, 0:29:46.990 --> 0:29:48.510 but it turns out to be it's mother's milk. You 0:29:48.510 --> 0:29:51.470 make a mistake. So they built a fence. No goat? No. 0:29:51.590 --> 0:29:54.110 No mother's milk at all. And then they said, well, 0:29:54.150 --> 0:29:56.470 you may think you're bringing a calf, not a goat. 0:29:56.990 --> 0:29:59.150 Turns out it is a goat, or it is, you know, 0:29:59.190 --> 0:30:01.870 and the next thing you know, they're building further and 0:30:01.870 --> 0:30:07.110 further out. Uh, no meat, no milk together. And then 0:30:07.110 --> 0:30:13.190 even more, even poultry and milk, you know? No. No 0:30:13.190 --> 0:30:17.270 chicken and milk at all. And you can't eat them together. 0:30:17.630 --> 0:30:20.200 If you eat meat, you have to wait a certain 0:30:20.200 --> 0:30:22.680 amount of hours for it to digest before you can 0:30:22.680 --> 0:30:25.920 eat a dairy product. Jewish people based on this law 0:30:26.560 --> 0:30:32.600 have separate sets of dishes, dairy dishes and meat dishes. 0:30:32.600 --> 0:30:36.719 And then of course, at Passover you have Passover dairy 0:30:36.760 --> 0:30:43.080 dishes and Passover meat dishes and utensils and things like that. 0:30:43.200 --> 0:30:50.440 So many Orthodox Jewish homes have like two ovens, two refrigerators. 0:30:50.480 --> 0:30:52.960 They cook them separately. 0:30:53.200 --> 0:30:56.360 To keep dairy and meat separately. 0:30:56.400 --> 0:30:58.320 Okay. Pots and pans? 0:30:58.840 --> 0:30:59.320 Yes. 0:30:59.360 --> 0:30:59.840 Okay. 0:31:00.040 --> 0:31:00.960 Absolutely. 0:31:01.080 --> 0:31:01.560 Okay. 0:31:01.880 --> 0:31:05.000 And so, uh, that's a whole set of laws which 0:31:05.040 --> 0:31:09.600 is filling out the rabbinic law of building fences around 0:31:09.600 --> 0:31:12.000 the law. The idea is you build a fence so 0:31:12.000 --> 0:31:15.760 that you can't break the actual law. You build more 0:31:15.760 --> 0:31:19.450 laws and laws and laws outside of it. And and 0:31:19.450 --> 0:31:21.330 so that's going on. I don't think that's the right 0:31:21.330 --> 0:31:25.850 way to interpret this verse. Many people think, I think mistakenly, 0:31:25.850 --> 0:31:28.690 that this is a verse that about not boiling a 0:31:28.690 --> 0:31:33.730 baby goat in its mother's milk is about, uh, a 0:31:33.810 --> 0:31:39.810 Canaanite practice that's pagan, and that, uh, what Moses was 0:31:39.810 --> 0:31:45.210 forbidding here was to engage in Canaanite worship practices. The 0:31:45.210 --> 0:31:48.890 problem is that the earliest record we have of a 0:31:48.890 --> 0:31:52.610 pagan using this kind of baby goat, or baby animal 0:31:52.610 --> 0:31:55.810 in its own mother's milk, goes to the seventh century BC. 0:31:55.850 --> 0:32:01.290 Moses is writing at 1400 BC, and so it's unlikely 0:32:01.290 --> 0:32:03.810 that that was in his mind. I think the best 0:32:03.810 --> 0:32:10.130 interpretation of that verse is as part of your worship practice, 0:32:10.490 --> 0:32:14.450 you know, firstfruits. People think, okay, I bring my first fruit. Uh, 0:32:14.450 --> 0:32:19.610 maybe I would bring the firstborn baby. Uh, also as 0:32:19.610 --> 0:32:25.970 a sacrifice. Mhm. And basically what that is saying don't 0:32:25.970 --> 0:32:29.530 boil a baby goat and it uses an idiom in 0:32:29.530 --> 0:32:35.650 its mother's milk, meaning unweaned still nursing. Don't bring a 0:32:35.650 --> 0:32:40.650 baby goat that is unweaned as a sacrifice. And the 0:32:40.650 --> 0:32:44.890 reason is to show compassion on both the well. Compassion 0:32:44.890 --> 0:32:47.930 primarily on on the mother goat. You don't rip the 0:32:47.930 --> 0:32:52.850 baby from her and offer it. And so that to 0:32:52.850 --> 0:32:55.530 me is what I think is the best interpretation of that. 0:32:56.730 --> 0:33:02.330 And then the, the principle that would abide is to 0:33:02.370 --> 0:33:06.130 show compassion and concern for animals, not just treat them 0:33:06.130 --> 0:33:10.490 as as nothing or not having concern for them. Uh, 0:33:10.490 --> 0:33:13.410 a person cares for the life of his beast. That's 0:33:13.410 --> 0:33:18.420 the Proverbs teach. And so that's the principle, I think, 0:33:18.420 --> 0:33:23.780 that governs us. As for the animal, there's a based 0:33:23.780 --> 0:33:29.180 on the, the, the carcass of an animal. If an 0:33:29.220 --> 0:33:33.740 animal dies of its own accord, the law prohibited eating it. 0:33:34.820 --> 0:33:37.180 And it's still today in Judaism. You cannot eat an 0:33:37.220 --> 0:33:40.540 animal that that died some other way other than through 0:33:40.660 --> 0:33:45.340 ritual slaughter. And so that's always been the case. And 0:33:45.860 --> 0:33:50.540 the reason was for protection, health of the individual not 0:33:50.540 --> 0:33:56.180 to use a carcass. And, uh, there has to be 0:33:56.180 --> 0:33:59.620 also concern for the animal with the ritual slaughter done 0:33:59.620 --> 0:34:04.300 in the most humane possible way and most humane way possible. 0:34:04.300 --> 0:34:07.260 And so. But God does say like. And you. I 0:34:07.260 --> 0:34:10.020 think when we were talking about this once, Tricia, you 0:34:10.020 --> 0:34:14.270 said so, uh, Israel would not have been allowed to eat. Uh. 0:34:15.150 --> 0:34:15.990 What did you say? 0:34:16.270 --> 0:34:18.509 A deer? A deer that got hit by a car 0:34:18.510 --> 0:34:19.510 on the side of the road. 0:34:20.030 --> 0:34:22.149 Yeah, couldn't do that. But if someone else hits a deer, 0:34:22.150 --> 0:34:24.910 they get to pack it up and. Yeah. And so 0:34:25.190 --> 0:34:26.989 it was against the law for Israelites. 0:34:27.030 --> 0:34:32.270 Okay. And even I think within that verse in Deuteronomy 1421, 0:34:32.270 --> 0:34:35.190 it says, for you are a holy people belonging to 0:34:35.230 --> 0:34:38.230 the Lord your God, that there is this is why, 0:34:38.710 --> 0:34:41.950 you know, it's not just a random rule that God 0:34:41.950 --> 0:34:44.870 was putting into place, but there was a reason for 0:34:44.870 --> 0:34:48.029 this specific law. And even all of the laws that 0:34:48.030 --> 0:34:49.070 he was giving them. 0:34:49.310 --> 0:34:53.790 All the kosher laws were designed to make Israel distinct 0:34:54.070 --> 0:34:57.070 in how they ate. That's where we get the verse 0:34:57.070 --> 0:35:00.750 in Leviticus 11. After the kosher laws were given, you 0:35:00.750 --> 0:35:03.229 are to be holy, for I am holy. So it's 0:35:03.270 --> 0:35:07.950 it was. You're to be distinct. Different because I am separate. 0:35:08.469 --> 0:35:08.989 That's it. 0:35:09.030 --> 0:35:11.000 And you are to be separate also. 0:35:11.040 --> 0:35:12.759 Let's do another one. All right. Let's see if we. 0:35:12.760 --> 0:35:16.080 Can get one more question here. Let's try. Um, Lois 0:35:16.120 --> 0:35:20.080 in Illinois listens to WNBA. Uh, this summer, we will 0:35:20.080 --> 0:35:23.240 be having a family reunion weekend for our large family. 0:35:23.239 --> 0:35:26.799 Two of the couples attending are believers in Jesus, but 0:35:26.800 --> 0:35:31.200 living together without the benefit of marriage. I read first 0:35:31.200 --> 0:35:34.400 Corinthians five nine through 11, and I want to know 0:35:34.400 --> 0:35:38.200 how I should handle this situation in light of that 0:35:38.200 --> 0:35:40.879 which says, I wrote to you in a letter not 0:35:40.880 --> 0:35:44.160 to associate with sexually immoral people. I did not mean 0:35:44.160 --> 0:35:46.399 the immoral people of this world, or the greedy and 0:35:46.400 --> 0:35:51.160 swindlers or idolaters. Otherwise you would have to leave the world. 0:35:51.360 --> 0:35:53.680 But now I am writing you not to associate with 0:35:53.680 --> 0:35:56.600 anyone who claims to be a believer, who is sexually 0:35:56.600 --> 0:36:00.680 immoral or greedy, an idolater or verbally abusive, a drunkard 0:36:00.880 --> 0:36:04.120 or a swindler do not even eat with such a person. 0:36:05.120 --> 0:36:09.330 Yeah, I think it would be. It's important, I important. 0:36:09.330 --> 0:36:13.250 I think I would be slow to answer this on 0:36:13.250 --> 0:36:16.850 the radio. I'll give some opinions, but I think mostly 0:36:16.850 --> 0:36:19.450 this is a question to talk about with someone personally, 0:36:19.450 --> 0:36:22.930 like a pastor, because I would ask more questions, I 0:36:22.930 --> 0:36:25.690 would want to know more. But first of all, I 0:36:25.690 --> 0:36:28.969 think when Paul gives this limitation, it's believers who are 0:36:28.969 --> 0:36:32.650 openly professing their faith in church, and they're now under 0:36:32.650 --> 0:36:37.650 church discipline for their behavior. As far as I can tell, 0:36:38.530 --> 0:36:43.689 these people that are being spoken of, that are living 0:36:43.730 --> 0:36:47.130 together are not in church, and they are not under 0:36:47.130 --> 0:36:51.609 church discipline. So that's one thing. Also, when you read 0:36:51.610 --> 0:36:55.610 that verse in first Corinthians five, it says, anyone professing 0:36:56.010 --> 0:36:59.850 to be a believer, anyone who claims to be a believer. 0:36:59.890 --> 0:37:02.129 Now she says, I think they're believers, but are they 0:37:02.130 --> 0:37:06.850 claiming it any longer? I don't know, that's a question 0:37:06.850 --> 0:37:10.650 I would ask. And also, if all those things were true, 0:37:10.650 --> 0:37:13.650 I'm not sure that it applies to family. It may 0:37:13.650 --> 0:37:16.490 apply to someone that you go to church with, but 0:37:16.489 --> 0:37:20.690 not necessarily a family member that there are. You know, 0:37:20.730 --> 0:37:23.010 we have to engage with family in a different way, 0:37:23.010 --> 0:37:27.290 for example, than we would with just general people in 0:37:27.290 --> 0:37:30.330 the church. And so there are a lot of questions 0:37:30.330 --> 0:37:34.049 that I would have. And just on the surface, I 0:37:34.050 --> 0:37:36.690 would say that it's okay to go to the wedding 0:37:36.730 --> 0:37:40.330 because I'm not sure this verse applies in this circumstance or. 0:37:40.330 --> 0:37:43.170 To the family reunion. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:37:43.210 --> 0:37:46.130 A wedding or whatever event that they're going to go to. 0:37:46.170 --> 0:37:46.650 Okay. 0:37:47.170 --> 0:37:48.450 All right. Family reunion. 0:37:48.570 --> 0:37:49.089 All right. Okay. 0:37:49.130 --> 0:37:51.130 Thank you. Well, listen, thank you for being part of 0:37:51.130 --> 0:37:54.410 the team. I think it's one of my favorite aspects 0:37:54.410 --> 0:37:56.729 of doing Open Line is doing it together with you 0:37:56.730 --> 0:38:00.930 and others. It's such a great benefit and blessing to me. 0:38:01.130 --> 0:38:03.969 And I love every member of the team. Everyone that listens. 0:38:04.010 --> 0:38:07.259 I appreciate meeting our kitchen table partners. I was in 0:38:07.260 --> 0:38:09.620 an event last week with a bunch of people and 0:38:09.620 --> 0:38:11.940 they all said that, oh, not all, but many of 0:38:11.940 --> 0:38:14.700 them there said, I'm a kitchen table partner. I'm a 0:38:14.700 --> 0:38:18.500 kitchen table partner, and I appreciate everyone. That is, people 0:38:18.500 --> 0:38:21.299 who give monthly to be part of the team so 0:38:21.300 --> 0:38:25.060 we can be on the air weekly. And if you're 0:38:25.060 --> 0:38:28.460 interested in becoming a kitchen table partner, I'd appreciate it. 0:38:28.500 --> 0:38:34.620 All you'd have to do is call (888) 644-7122 or go 0:38:34.620 --> 0:38:37.700 to open line radio.com. And you can become a kitchen 0:38:37.700 --> 0:38:42.219 table partner there. And as a special blessing and benefit 0:38:42.219 --> 0:38:44.180 and a gift that we want to give to those 0:38:44.180 --> 0:38:47.940 of you who are kitchen table partners, we prepare a 0:38:47.980 --> 0:38:50.259 Bible study moment, Tricia and I, and we send it 0:38:50.260 --> 0:38:54.300 out every other week. It's about a ten minute digital 0:38:54.340 --> 0:38:56.660 Bible study, audio Bible study that you can hear in 0:38:56.660 --> 0:38:59.620 your your email. You click on it in your email 0:38:59.620 --> 0:39:01.460 and you get to hear it. And I hope you 0:39:01.460 --> 0:39:03.940 enjoy those. Uh, again, if you want to become a 0:39:03.940 --> 0:39:13.390 kitchen table partner. Uh, call (888) 644-7122 or go to open 0:39:13.390 --> 0:39:19.430 line radio.org. Well, thanks for bringing those questions in, Tricia. 0:39:19.430 --> 0:39:21.230 And being part of the team, we're going to be 0:39:21.230 --> 0:39:25.390 back next hour with more questions. This is that was 0:39:25.390 --> 0:39:27.870 Tricia McMillan. I'm Michael Rudnick, and we'll be back with 0:39:27.870 --> 0:39:31.070 more of your questions in just a moment. Stay with us. 0:39:49.830 --> 0:39:52.790 Welcome back to Open Line. I'm Michael Rey Dominik, glad 0:39:52.790 --> 0:39:55.029 to be with you. A couple of things I need 0:39:55.030 --> 0:39:56.830 to mention before we go back to the phones. I 0:39:56.830 --> 0:39:59.029 just want to mention real quickly, it's the end of 0:39:59.030 --> 0:40:02.750 the fiscal year for Moody Bible Institute and your help 0:40:02.750 --> 0:40:06.560 at this time with your generous gift will be go 0:40:06.600 --> 0:40:11.319 a long way to making Moodie solvent and strong for 0:40:11.320 --> 0:40:15.839 the future. Really appreciate all the generosity, but the main 0:40:15.840 --> 0:40:19.480 reason I appreciate gifts is because I get to send 0:40:19.480 --> 0:40:24.960 you something. Our current resource is just so terrific. Uh, 0:40:25.480 --> 0:40:28.560 it's called the Ultimate Bible Dictionary. When you are reading 0:40:28.560 --> 0:40:31.640 the Bible and you see a name or a place 0:40:31.640 --> 0:40:34.320 or an event and you think, what's that about? Everyone 0:40:34.320 --> 0:40:38.080 should have a Bible study library. And the Ultimate Bible 0:40:38.080 --> 0:40:42.000 Dictionary is a real handy little book that you can 0:40:42.000 --> 0:40:46.040 look those things up, you can find those items, and 0:40:46.080 --> 0:40:47.960 it's what we want to send you as a thank 0:40:48.000 --> 0:40:50.080 you for any gift that you send. And we're so 0:40:50.080 --> 0:40:53.480 appreciative of your your generosity that we want to give 0:40:53.480 --> 0:40:55.440 you this as a thank you. If you'd like to 0:40:55.480 --> 0:40:57.759 give a gift for a gift of any size, we'll 0:40:57.760 --> 0:41:04.600 send you the Ultimate Bible Dictionary. Just call 44. 7122 0:41:04.880 --> 0:41:10.200 or go to our website openline. radio.org. And as I 0:41:10.200 --> 0:41:13.759 mentioned in the first and second segments of the program today, 0:41:13.760 --> 0:41:16.840 if you didn't listen to it, my interview with Avner Boesky, 0:41:17.239 --> 0:41:19.680 you can go back and listen to the podcast or 0:41:19.719 --> 0:41:21.960 listen on the Moody Radio app, or go online and 0:41:21.960 --> 0:41:25.719 listen by going to Openline radio org. There's all sorts 0:41:25.719 --> 0:41:28.000 of ways you can catch those first two segments. But 0:41:28.080 --> 0:41:31.319 Israel's in a war, a war that the nation didn't want. 0:41:31.400 --> 0:41:36.000 And as I see the images of Iranian ballistic missiles 0:41:36.040 --> 0:41:41.000 landing in Tel Aviv, it breaks my heart. And I wonder, 0:41:41.000 --> 0:41:44.600 what's the future? Well Chosen People Ministries, one of our partners, 0:41:44.600 --> 0:41:48.760 is offering a book called Israel's Glorious Future. The book 0:41:48.800 --> 0:41:52.640 shows God's faithfulness to Israel as found in the Bible, 0:41:52.800 --> 0:41:55.920 and gives a great picture of what the future holds 0:41:56.320 --> 0:41:59.880 for Israel, despite its current difficulties. If you'd like a 0:41:59.880 --> 0:42:03.570 free copy of Israel's Glorious Future. Just go to Open 0:42:03.570 --> 0:42:07.969 Line radio.org. That's our website, Open Line radio.org. Click on 0:42:08.010 --> 0:42:11.610 the link that says a free gift from Chosen People Ministries, 0:42:11.770 --> 0:42:13.690 and you'll be sent to a page where you can 0:42:13.730 --> 0:42:17.730 sign up for your own copy of Israel's Glorious Future. 0:42:17.730 --> 0:42:20.570 We're going to talk to Dan in Scottsdale, Arizona, listening 0:42:20.570 --> 0:42:24.770 on Wmbi. Well, online. Welcome to Open Line. Dan, how 0:42:24.770 --> 0:42:25.810 can I help you today? 0:42:26.530 --> 0:42:31.810 Yes. My question is about the Pentateuch, the Torah. Um, 0:42:31.969 --> 0:42:35.250 is that the only book that the Jewish people have, 0:42:35.290 --> 0:42:37.689 or do they have more of, like the books from 0:42:37.730 --> 0:42:40.089 the Old Testament of the Bible? 0:42:40.770 --> 0:42:44.210 Yeah, Jewish people have the Hebrew Bible, the Old Testament, 0:42:44.210 --> 0:42:47.410 we call it, uh, Jewish people call it the Hebrew 0:42:47.410 --> 0:42:50.890 Bible or the Tanakh. They take the first part of it, 0:42:50.890 --> 0:42:55.529 the Torah, take the T from that. Uh, then prophets 0:42:55.570 --> 0:42:58.770 Nevi'im is the Hebrew word. Take the n from that, 0:42:58.770 --> 0:43:02.819 and then to Veeam. And that's the writings. And they 0:43:02.820 --> 0:43:05.620 say they take those three letters and they make the 0:43:05.620 --> 0:43:08.819 word Tanakh, and that's the Hebrew Bible. In addition, they 0:43:08.820 --> 0:43:13.779 have the Mishnah and the Gemara, which are that's rabbinic literature. Uh, 0:43:13.780 --> 0:43:18.020 they have the Midrash, which are rabbinic commentaries. Uh, they 0:43:18.020 --> 0:43:23.980 have many other books, targums which are rabbinic paraphrases of 0:43:23.980 --> 0:43:28.060 the Hebrew Bible. So there's a great deal. That's why 0:43:28.060 --> 0:43:32.980 the Jewish people are obviously the people of the book. Okay. Dan. 0:43:33.660 --> 0:43:36.820 Okay. And they do have the book of Isaiah, too. 0:43:37.980 --> 0:43:39.820 Absolutely, absolutely. 0:43:39.860 --> 0:43:41.459 Okay. Yeah. Okay. 0:43:41.500 --> 0:43:41.860 Great. 0:43:42.860 --> 0:43:49.860 Yeah. That's why Dan, uh uh, we I often will 0:43:49.860 --> 0:43:53.180 point out messianic prophecy in the Hebrew Bible to my 0:43:53.180 --> 0:43:56.500 Jewish family and friends. Uh, it shows them that it 0:43:56.540 --> 0:44:00.270 reveals Yeshua Jesus as the Messiah, and I use the 0:44:00.270 --> 0:44:03.230 Hebrew Bible to do that. Uh, thanks for your call, Dan. 0:44:03.230 --> 0:44:07.230 We're going to talk to Tanya and Joel, two people, uh, 0:44:07.670 --> 0:44:11.350 listening in Ohio. Welcome to Open Line, Tanya. How can 0:44:11.350 --> 0:44:12.110 I help you today? 0:44:12.469 --> 0:44:13.910 So Joel's talking to you. 0:44:13.950 --> 0:44:15.230 Okay, great. Okay. 0:44:15.710 --> 0:44:21.310 What's our proper understanding of Mordecai and Hadassah? Um, are 0:44:21.310 --> 0:44:26.430 they heroes of the faith? Are they functional atheists in 0:44:26.430 --> 0:44:30.710 a pagan society that manages to be used by God anyway? 0:44:31.350 --> 0:44:34.030 Why would you think that they're atheists? 0:44:34.790 --> 0:44:37.589 That's what our pastor is preaching through right now in 0:44:37.590 --> 0:44:38.510 the book of Esther. 0:44:38.790 --> 0:44:40.070 And that's what he said. 0:44:40.630 --> 0:44:41.230 Yes. 0:44:42.310 --> 0:44:45.589 Uh, you know what your dear pastor, I think is 0:44:45.590 --> 0:44:54.069 misunderstanding the book. Uh, the point of this book. The 0:44:54.070 --> 0:44:57.469 point of the book is to teach the providence of God. 0:44:58.430 --> 0:45:03.230 Providence is God's care and protection and action on behalf 0:45:03.230 --> 0:45:07.950 of those who who love him. Working everything out even 0:45:08.710 --> 0:45:13.470 when he's using normal human events. It's the great coincidences 0:45:13.469 --> 0:45:19.230 of life. Like Mordecai overhearing about the plot against the king, 0:45:19.390 --> 0:45:23.790 or Esther finding favor and all those different ways. So 0:45:24.790 --> 0:45:28.070 if they were functional atheists, she would not have called 0:45:28.070 --> 0:45:31.750 for a fast. Mordecai would not have called for her 0:45:31.750 --> 0:45:37.350 to take a stand for her people. Esther's people. So, uh, 0:45:38.230 --> 0:45:40.870 the thing is, it's a literary device to leave God's 0:45:40.870 --> 0:45:43.149 name out, that even when the nation of Israel had 0:45:43.150 --> 0:45:47.109 forgotten God, and generally speaking, the people in captivity were 0:45:47.110 --> 0:45:50.549 assimilating and not really being a tight, tight in their 0:45:50.550 --> 0:45:54.750 following of the Lord. Even when that happens, God still 0:45:54.750 --> 0:45:58.359 stays with his people when people forget God. God does 0:45:58.360 --> 0:46:01.640 not forget them when he's got covenant promises. So that's 0:46:01.640 --> 0:46:05.000 the point of the book. But don't make spiritual judgments 0:46:05.000 --> 0:46:09.920 about Mordecai and Esther because no, they they were obviously 0:46:10.480 --> 0:46:14.080 committed followers of the God of Israel. Well, that's the 0:46:14.080 --> 0:46:17.120 first hour, folks. Second hour of Open Line is coming 0:46:17.120 --> 0:46:20.080 up on most of these stations. Hope you can listen in. Uh, 0:46:20.120 --> 0:46:23.080 if if you can't on your station, you can always 0:46:23.080 --> 0:46:26.960 check out Open Line radio.org or or the Moody Radio app. 0:46:27.239 --> 0:46:31.440 The Bible study across America will continue in just a moment, 0:46:31.440 --> 0:46:34.640 so stay with us. Open line with Doctor Michael Melnick 0:46:34.880 --> 0:46:38.920 is a production of Moody Radio, the ministry of Moody 0:46:38.920 --> 0:46:42.760 Bible Institute. We'll be right back. So stay right there.