1 00:00:07,910 --> 00:00:11,660 S1: You saw their faces on posters as hostages, and then 2 00:00:11,660 --> 00:00:14,210 S1: you saw them making their way through the jeering Hamas 3 00:00:14,210 --> 00:00:17,780 S1: crowds released after more than a year in captivity. But 4 00:00:17,780 --> 00:00:21,290 S1: what secrets do these Israeli hostages hold? What scars do 5 00:00:21,290 --> 00:00:24,439 S1: they bear? Coming up, we'll get insights from an expert. 6 00:00:24,470 --> 00:00:28,460 S1: Who knows? Plus, our devotional takes you into Hezekiah's famous 7 00:00:28,460 --> 00:00:32,060 S1: water tunnel. And we'll connect with more of your Bible questions, too. 8 00:00:32,090 --> 00:00:35,269 S1: Welcome to the land and the book. I'm John Gager 9 00:00:35,270 --> 00:00:37,400 S1: and our host, Doctor Charlie Dyer, is out of the 10 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:40,790 S1: studio on assignment for the next two weeks, but before 11 00:00:40,790 --> 00:00:43,220 S1: he left, he was kind enough to share his thoughts 12 00:00:43,220 --> 00:00:45,170 S1: with you and me about the headlines coming out of 13 00:00:45,170 --> 00:00:47,120 S1: the Middle East this week, and we'll get to all 14 00:00:47,150 --> 00:00:50,510 S1: of that and more. First, though, Passover will soon be 15 00:00:50,510 --> 00:00:53,570 S1: upon us, right? And one of the traditional Passover questions 16 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:57,500 S1: is what makes this night different from all others? Well, 17 00:00:57,500 --> 00:01:00,410 S1: Passover is an important biblical holiday that has great meaning 18 00:01:00,410 --> 00:01:03,320 S1: for Jewish people and for believers in Jesus. And this 19 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:06,080 S1: is a great question to ask. Now, if you want 20 00:01:06,110 --> 00:01:09,199 S1: to learn more about what makes Passover so very special. 21 00:01:09,230 --> 00:01:12,380 S1: Our friends at Life in Messiah are offering to mail 22 00:01:12,380 --> 00:01:15,679 S1: you a free copy of their Messianic Passover Haggadah. This 23 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:18,529 S1: is a booklet that will lead you through the celebration 24 00:01:18,530 --> 00:01:22,280 S1: of Passover to see the rich connections to Jesus, our Messiah, 25 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,100 S1: and the Last Supper. You'll also receive a link for 26 00:01:25,100 --> 00:01:28,790 S1: an interactive Passover Seder video with the Haggadah and the 27 00:01:28,790 --> 00:01:31,970 S1: video together. You can really celebrate Passover this year with 28 00:01:31,970 --> 00:01:34,760 S1: your family and friends. Now, to get this free offer, 29 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:38,090 S1: just go to Life in messiah.org and click on the 30 00:01:38,090 --> 00:01:40,970 S1: Moody Radio button. You'll see there to learn more and 31 00:01:40,970 --> 00:01:45,860 S1: to request your copy. Again, that's life in messiah.org. All right. 32 00:01:45,860 --> 00:01:47,690 S1: Let's take a look at current events based in the 33 00:01:47,690 --> 00:01:50,420 S1: Middle East. This week. The debate over the future of 34 00:01:50,420 --> 00:01:55,370 S1: Hamas and the Palestinians in Gaza continues, even as negotiations 35 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:58,460 S1: get underway for the next phase of the hostage deal 36 00:01:58,490 --> 00:02:01,160 S1: amid calls for renewed fighting. What do we need to 37 00:02:01,190 --> 00:02:05,090 S1: know about all these discussions? Well, Charlie Dyer suggests we 38 00:02:05,090 --> 00:02:07,730 S1: need to start by saying that when dealing with Hamas, 39 00:02:07,730 --> 00:02:12,619 S1: anything is possible. They've broken virtually every promise they've made 40 00:02:12,620 --> 00:02:15,920 S1: in the hostage negotiations, even trying to pass off the 41 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,160 S1: wrong body for the mother that they had brutally killed 42 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:22,010 S1: along with her two sons. The first phase of the 43 00:02:22,010 --> 00:02:25,250 S1: hostage deal is scheduled to expire today. And and there's 44 00:02:25,250 --> 00:02:27,589 S1: been some concern over whether the second phase will actually 45 00:02:27,590 --> 00:02:31,520 S1: even continue. Now, if no agreement is reached, Israel has 46 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,250 S1: said it will resume the war. However, there's been a 47 00:02:34,250 --> 00:02:37,070 S1: bit of optimism over the past week because of two issues. 48 00:02:37,070 --> 00:02:40,760 S1: The first is Ramadan, which just began Friday night. Now, 49 00:02:40,790 --> 00:02:43,910 S1: Hamas would prefer not to resume fighting right now, since 50 00:02:43,910 --> 00:02:47,420 S1: during Ramadan they're to refrain from eating and drinking during 51 00:02:47,419 --> 00:02:50,059 S1: the day, and this could make it more difficult physically 52 00:02:50,060 --> 00:02:53,240 S1: to fight while also making them more vulnerable to attack 53 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:55,700 S1: at night when they stay up after dark to break 54 00:02:55,730 --> 00:02:58,550 S1: their fast. the second reason that they would like the 55 00:02:58,550 --> 00:03:01,130 S1: cease fire to continue is that they want more aid 56 00:03:01,130 --> 00:03:05,420 S1: convoys into Gaza, including the heavy equipment being sent in 57 00:03:05,450 --> 00:03:08,600 S1: to clear rubble. Well, the hostages are their ace in 58 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,910 S1: the hole, no doubt about that. And the thing that 59 00:03:10,910 --> 00:03:13,610 S1: kept Israel from being more aggressive in trying to root 60 00:03:13,610 --> 00:03:16,340 S1: them out. But right now, Hamas has been willing to 61 00:03:16,340 --> 00:03:19,160 S1: give up at least some hostages to buy time to 62 00:03:19,190 --> 00:03:23,270 S1: regroup and rearm. Still, don't expect them to willingly give 63 00:03:23,300 --> 00:03:27,919 S1: up all hostages or to cede power and control over Gaza. 64 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:31,790 S1: At the same time, Israel's anger over Hamas's brutal murders 65 00:03:31,790 --> 00:03:35,330 S1: of Shiri Bibas and her two young children is palpable. 66 00:03:35,330 --> 00:03:39,080 S1: And if fighting does resume, Israel is strongly united in 67 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:42,800 S1: wanting to eliminate Hamas once and for all. The struggle 68 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,560 S1: over what Gaza will look like the day after all 69 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:48,320 S1: the fighting ends is still very much up in the air. 70 00:03:48,350 --> 00:03:52,070 S1: By and large, Israel embraces President Trump's proposal, while also 71 00:03:52,070 --> 00:03:54,440 S1: surrounding Arab nations and much of the rest of the 72 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:57,320 S1: world does not. Hopefully some of this can even be 73 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,080 S1: sorted out during Ramadan. While most, if not all, of 74 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:05,030 S1: the remaining hostages are released. Story number two Egypt has 75 00:04:05,030 --> 00:04:08,000 S1: been beefing up its armed forces along its border with 76 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:10,070 S1: Israel and Gaza. And you have to wonder, is this 77 00:04:10,070 --> 00:04:13,370 S1: a defensive move on their part or an offensive one? 78 00:04:13,370 --> 00:04:16,700 S1: And how concerned should Israel be? Well, in spite of 79 00:04:16,700 --> 00:04:20,690 S1: some breathless reports suggesting a possible prelude to war, Doctor 80 00:04:20,690 --> 00:04:24,049 S1: Dyer suggests this seems to be something far less ominous. 81 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:28,400 S1: Back in 2018, Israel gave Egypt permission to almost double 82 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,730 S1: its forces in Sinai to put down or fight Islamic 83 00:04:31,730 --> 00:04:35,180 S1: extremists in the area, and at the same time, Egypt 84 00:04:35,180 --> 00:04:38,840 S1: has given Israel permission to conduct airstrikes in the Sinai 85 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,710 S1: at smuggling targets. Two things are likely behind the current 86 00:04:42,710 --> 00:04:46,100 S1: increase in Egyptian forces. First, it might be partly in 87 00:04:46,100 --> 00:04:50,480 S1: response to Israel's occupying of the Philadelphi corridor between Gaza 88 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:54,440 S1: and Egypt, which Israel took over in spite of Egypt's objections. 89 00:04:54,470 --> 00:04:57,979 S1: Moving Egyptian forces closer to the border would be seen 90 00:04:57,980 --> 00:05:01,219 S1: as a popular move by Egyptians to protect their country 91 00:05:01,250 --> 00:05:04,729 S1: should Israel move into Egyptian territory, which, by the way, 92 00:05:04,730 --> 00:05:08,479 S1: Israel isn't planning to do. Second, the force could be 93 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,540 S1: there to guard against any plan to open the border, 94 00:05:11,540 --> 00:05:14,540 S1: to allow hundreds of thousands of Gazans to flee across 95 00:05:14,540 --> 00:05:18,679 S1: into Egypt. Allowing Hamas terrorists into Egypt would pose a 96 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,950 S1: real threat to the current government in Egypt, which overthrew 97 00:05:21,950 --> 00:05:25,940 S1: the previous Muslim Brotherhood Islamic government. Until the issue of 98 00:05:25,940 --> 00:05:29,450 S1: Hamas and the people of Gaza is resolved, the uncertainty 99 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:32,900 S1: will continue to keep Egypt on its toes. But right now, 100 00:05:32,900 --> 00:05:36,349 S1: this isn't a prelude to an Egyptian attack against Israel, 101 00:05:36,350 --> 00:05:39,140 S1: that much we know from Moody Radio. This is the 102 00:05:39,140 --> 00:05:41,539 S1: land and the book. I'm John Geiger. If you joined 103 00:05:41,540 --> 00:05:44,870 S1: us midstream, our host, doctor Charlie Dyer, out on assignment. 104 00:05:44,870 --> 00:05:47,690 S1: But he shared his perspectives on the week's news and 105 00:05:47,690 --> 00:05:50,900 S1: headlines that we're sharing with you now. Last weekend and 106 00:05:50,900 --> 00:05:54,850 S1: into this past Monday, Israel experienced another winter storm, this 107 00:05:54,850 --> 00:05:58,270 S1: one named coral. What impact did the storm have on Israel, 108 00:05:58,270 --> 00:06:02,650 S1: you wonder? Well, unfortunately, the impact Israel was hoping for 109 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:07,779 S1: a nice extended soaking rain didn't really happen. Instead, coral 110 00:06:07,779 --> 00:06:12,010 S1: brought mainly unseasonably low temperatures, frost in some areas and 111 00:06:12,010 --> 00:06:15,520 S1: strong winds, but only a little rain and a dusting 112 00:06:15,550 --> 00:06:18,729 S1: of snow up in the higher elevations. Now the Sea 113 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:22,390 S1: of Galilee crept a few inches higher, though it's still 114 00:06:22,390 --> 00:06:25,479 S1: nearly eight feet below the upper red line, which is 115 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:28,570 S1: full capacity. So they're down quite a bit. And while 116 00:06:28,570 --> 00:06:31,270 S1: it's still possible for more rainfall this month, right now 117 00:06:31,270 --> 00:06:33,730 S1: it's looking like this year is turning out to be 118 00:06:33,730 --> 00:06:38,410 S1: significantly below average in terms of rainfall. The impact won't 119 00:06:38,410 --> 00:06:41,560 S1: be as great on Israel because of their desalination plants, 120 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:45,610 S1: but countries like Jordan, countries like Iran, were already experiencing 121 00:06:45,610 --> 00:06:49,450 S1: water shortages. So we'll see what happens there. This winter 122 00:06:49,450 --> 00:06:51,969 S1: has seen the lowest amount of rainfall in Jordan. Get 123 00:06:51,970 --> 00:06:57,370 S1: this now. In 65 years in Iran, rainfall across 29 124 00:06:57,370 --> 00:07:02,140 S1: provinces has dropped by a third since October. This follows 125 00:07:02,140 --> 00:07:05,739 S1: a year of weather extremes, including heavy flooding in the 126 00:07:05,740 --> 00:07:09,580 S1: central and southeastern regions of the country. Egypt has always 127 00:07:09,580 --> 00:07:12,160 S1: been known as the gift of the Nile, right? But 128 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:16,360 S1: they're also experiencing a rapidly increasing gap between the Nile's 129 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:22,510 S1: limited resources and the country's rapidly increasing population. 95% of 130 00:07:22,510 --> 00:07:26,110 S1: Egypt is desert, with virtually all of the country's 114 131 00:07:26,110 --> 00:07:29,920 S1: million people living along both banks of the Nile River. 132 00:07:30,010 --> 00:07:34,870 S1: Ethiopia's Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam is threatening to cut into 133 00:07:34,870 --> 00:07:38,200 S1: Egypt's supply of water from the Nile. Simply put, they're 134 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:41,170 S1: running out of water, and any increase in rainfall in 135 00:07:41,170 --> 00:07:45,640 S1: the region will not really impact Egypt. As someone has observed, 136 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:48,130 S1: the next year in the Middle East could end up 137 00:07:48,130 --> 00:07:53,530 S1: being over water. Stay tuned. Our fourth story, a recently 138 00:07:53,530 --> 00:07:57,940 S1: translated Old Babylonian flood tablet, adds new dimensions to the 139 00:07:57,940 --> 00:08:00,820 S1: debate over Noah's Ark. What, if anything, can we learn 140 00:08:00,820 --> 00:08:03,880 S1: from this tablet? Well, let's start with the most important lesson. 141 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:07,120 S1: Charlie says this tablet, along with others discovered in that region, 142 00:08:07,150 --> 00:08:10,570 S1: align with the Bible in describing a flood that destroyed 143 00:08:10,570 --> 00:08:14,740 S1: the world, apart from those individuals who entered into a boat. Now, 144 00:08:14,740 --> 00:08:16,720 S1: I believe all the stories are pointing back to a 145 00:08:16,750 --> 00:08:20,770 S1: historical reality, that there really was a universal flood that 146 00:08:20,770 --> 00:08:24,190 S1: destroyed all of humanity except Noah and his family. This 147 00:08:24,190 --> 00:08:27,460 S1: new flood tablet had some other details that also align 148 00:08:27,490 --> 00:08:30,610 S1: with the biblical account on two major points. First, it 149 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:34,090 S1: records that God gave the hero of the story detailed 150 00:08:34,090 --> 00:08:37,660 S1: instructions on how to build and waterproof an ark or 151 00:08:37,660 --> 00:08:41,290 S1: ship to survive the flood. And second, it reports that 152 00:08:41,290 --> 00:08:44,410 S1: the animals came into the ark two by two. Now 153 00:08:44,410 --> 00:08:46,570 S1: that's remarkable. But at the same time, we need to 154 00:08:46,570 --> 00:08:50,920 S1: remember one key fact the Bible records the event as 155 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,610 S1: it actually happened. While these other accounts record the event 156 00:08:54,610 --> 00:08:59,110 S1: as it was passed down between subsequent generations, and as 157 00:08:59,110 --> 00:09:02,470 S1: it was passed down, many of the details became corrupted. 158 00:09:02,470 --> 00:09:05,170 S1: For example, the Ark and the new flood tablet is 159 00:09:05,170 --> 00:09:09,940 S1: round and shaped like the small round boats used in Mesopotamia. 160 00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:12,849 S1: That's what they knew as a boat. But this boat 161 00:09:12,850 --> 00:09:17,920 S1: was 230ft in diameter, with 20 foot high walls. It 162 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:21,280 S1: would definitely not have withstood a severe flood with all 163 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:24,040 S1: the wind, the waves and the rain. Well, the best 164 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,580 S1: lesson here is the reality that the multiple flood accounts 165 00:09:27,610 --> 00:09:29,950 S1: serve as a reminder that there must have been an 166 00:09:29,950 --> 00:09:33,790 S1: actual flood that really did occur, in which God saved 167 00:09:33,790 --> 00:09:38,020 S1: individuals and animals by having them build an ark. And 168 00:09:38,020 --> 00:09:40,240 S1: the second lesson is that the details in most of 169 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:44,290 S1: these other accounts depart from reality, as the writers try 170 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:47,979 S1: to visualize the events through their own experiences. Thus, the 171 00:09:48,010 --> 00:09:50,740 S1: arc looks like a giant version of the little boats 172 00:09:50,740 --> 00:09:53,679 S1: that they were using on the water. But the biblical 173 00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:57,130 S1: account describes in great detail a vessel that had never 174 00:09:57,130 --> 00:10:01,390 S1: existed and that wasn't in existence afterward either. But that 175 00:10:01,390 --> 00:10:03,940 S1: is so exact that we can build a replica today 176 00:10:03,940 --> 00:10:06,670 S1: and know that it could float, and that it could 177 00:10:06,670 --> 00:10:10,360 S1: hold Noah and his family and all those animals. When 178 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:12,820 S1: you think about it, it has the ring of reality 179 00:10:12,820 --> 00:10:15,910 S1: to it, doesn't it? And that's a look at current events. 180 00:10:15,940 --> 00:10:18,280 S1: You know, we'd love for you to check out our podcast. 181 00:10:18,309 --> 00:10:20,650 S1: You'll find it at our page, The land and the 182 00:10:20,650 --> 00:10:24,819 S1: book org. That podcast, you can enjoy yourself and share 183 00:10:24,820 --> 00:10:26,679 S1: it with a friend as well. It's a great way 184 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:29,439 S1: to grow this program and and to encourage others about 185 00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:32,710 S1: what you're learning. Our Facebook page is always available to you. 186 00:10:32,740 --> 00:10:35,380 S1: Lots of great photos and things that Charlie posts there 187 00:10:35,380 --> 00:10:37,990 S1: week after week as well. We welcome you to email 188 00:10:37,990 --> 00:10:40,180 S1: your Bible question to us. You know you can't help it, 189 00:10:40,179 --> 00:10:42,460 S1: but open up your copy of the scriptures and bump 190 00:10:42,460 --> 00:10:44,950 S1: into something that makes you wonder. Scratch your head. Makes 191 00:10:44,950 --> 00:10:47,510 S1: you ponder. Why not get an answer to that question 192 00:10:47,510 --> 00:10:52,250 S1: when you email us at The Land and the book@moody.edu. 193 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:56,690 S1: That's the land and the book@moody.edu. And while you're in 194 00:10:56,690 --> 00:10:58,940 S1: the writing mood, we'd love to hear how the program 195 00:10:58,940 --> 00:11:01,849 S1: helps you or encourages you. Again, write to us at 196 00:11:01,850 --> 00:11:07,520 S1: the Land and the book@moody.edu. Well, what do former Israeli 197 00:11:07,550 --> 00:11:11,360 S1: hostages deal with now? So many questions, so many scars, 198 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:13,670 S1: so many things to think about. It's a conversation we're 199 00:11:13,670 --> 00:11:15,620 S1: going to have next here on the land and the book. 200 00:11:15,650 --> 00:11:18,140 S1: You won't hear it anywhere else, so stick around for 201 00:11:18,140 --> 00:11:19,219 S1: more right here on. 202 00:11:19,220 --> 00:11:20,810 UU: The land and the book. 203 00:11:34,910 --> 00:11:39,320 S1: You saw their faces on posters as hostages, and then 204 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:41,900 S1: you saw them making their way through the jeering Hamas 205 00:11:41,900 --> 00:11:45,809 S1: crowds released after more than a year in captivity back 206 00:11:45,809 --> 00:11:49,199 S1: to Israel. But what secrets do they hold? What scars 207 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:52,530 S1: do they bear? We'll get insights from an expert. Who knows? 208 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:56,250 S1: Next from Moody Radio. This is the land and the book. 209 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:58,859 S1: I'm John Gager. Glad you've joined us for the second 210 00:11:58,860 --> 00:12:01,620 S1: segment of our broadcast. I want to introduce you to 211 00:12:01,650 --> 00:12:05,429 S1: today's guest. Rabbi Steven Weil began his career as a 212 00:12:05,429 --> 00:12:08,760 S1: pulpit rabbi, first serving at the Young Israel of Oak 213 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:12,960 S1: Park in Detroit, Michigan, and then at Congregation Beth Jacob 214 00:12:12,960 --> 00:12:16,979 S1: in Beverly Hills, California. In 2009, he assumed the position 215 00:12:16,980 --> 00:12:20,910 S1: of Senior Managing Director of the Orthodox Union, leading their 216 00:12:20,910 --> 00:12:25,559 S1: institutional advancement and community engagement efforts. In 2020, he was 217 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:28,439 S1: appointed Chief Executive Officer of the friends of the Israel 218 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:33,569 S1: Defense Forces as an internationally recognized scholar and lecturer. Rabbi 219 00:12:33,570 --> 00:12:37,110 S1: Weil has lectured in over 50 communities throughout North America 220 00:12:37,110 --> 00:12:40,470 S1: and more than 15 countries across Europe, the Middle East 221 00:12:40,470 --> 00:12:43,560 S1: and South Africa. Well, we're really glad to have you 222 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:46,530 S1: join us today on the land and the book. Welcome, 223 00:12:46,530 --> 00:12:47,520 S1: Rabbi Weil. 224 00:12:47,670 --> 00:12:49,800 S2: It's an honor to be with you on the land 225 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:52,170 S2: in the book. And I want to thank you very much. 226 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,330 S1: Well, I have to ask right off the bat. You, 227 00:12:54,330 --> 00:12:57,510 S1: I understand, have a child that is in the Israel 228 00:12:57,510 --> 00:13:00,570 S1: Defense Forces right now. What is that like to be 229 00:13:00,570 --> 00:13:03,870 S1: a parent of somebody who's involved with the IDF? 230 00:13:04,140 --> 00:13:08,160 S2: It's been a challenging two years. In fact, my daughter's 231 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:11,130 S2: roommate was actually killed during the war. Good friend and 232 00:13:11,130 --> 00:13:14,820 S2: a roommate, a young woman from Dunwoody, Georgia. So it's 233 00:13:14,820 --> 00:13:15,900 S2: been very challenging. 234 00:13:15,929 --> 00:13:16,980 S3: Yeah. For sure. 235 00:13:17,010 --> 00:13:20,670 S1: How have your perspectives been changed, or at least influenced 236 00:13:20,670 --> 00:13:23,490 S1: by first hand accounts that you hear from having a 237 00:13:23,490 --> 00:13:24,750 S1: soldier in the family? 238 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:26,160 S3: Well, I would. 239 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:28,950 S2: Say the following. I think that the challenge they face, 240 00:13:28,950 --> 00:13:32,850 S2: even though what we've seen in Lebanon and Syria, is 241 00:13:32,850 --> 00:13:35,400 S2: nothing short of miraculous in terms of what they've been 242 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:38,280 S2: able to accomplish and the way they've been able to 243 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:43,020 S2: respond and rebound from October 7th, 2023. That's on the 244 00:13:43,020 --> 00:13:46,050 S2: one hand, but I think the challenge is moving forward 245 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:49,530 S2: are twofold. One is, is that you're going to have 246 00:13:49,530 --> 00:13:54,090 S2: a lot of these young people that will have PTSD issues, 247 00:13:54,090 --> 00:13:57,720 S2: all kinds of challenges, because the brutality of this war, 248 00:13:57,750 --> 00:14:02,160 S2: the way Hamas uses human shields, the activities that they 249 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:06,480 S2: did on October 7th that are undescribable. And that's going 250 00:14:06,510 --> 00:14:09,390 S2: to be a challenge for them. Yeah, that's one factor. 251 00:14:09,420 --> 00:14:11,760 S2: I think the other factor is, is that you're going 252 00:14:11,790 --> 00:14:15,360 S2: to go from an army that was relying on intelligence 253 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:18,689 S2: and technology, and you saw the success of that in 254 00:14:18,690 --> 00:14:23,460 S2: Lebanon and Syria. But there's no substitute for foot soldiers. 255 00:14:23,460 --> 00:14:26,610 S2: If there had been one brigade on the Gaza border. 256 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,520 S2: October 7th, there were a couple of battalions, but had 257 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,670 S2: there been an additional brigade, that would have never happened. 258 00:14:32,850 --> 00:14:36,240 S2: And it's going to change the need, for instance, going 259 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:39,060 S2: from two years and eight months of mandatory service to 260 00:14:39,090 --> 00:14:42,870 S2: three years, young men and young women in their 20s 261 00:14:42,900 --> 00:14:45,660 S2: and early 30s. In 2025 are going to have to 262 00:14:45,660 --> 00:14:48,870 S2: be doing two months of reserves. Now think about that 263 00:14:48,870 --> 00:14:51,900 S2: as an employer, right? You're going to be missing your 264 00:14:51,900 --> 00:14:55,740 S2: young staff for a significant part of the year. So 265 00:14:55,770 --> 00:14:59,820 S2: there are some real challenges ahead. On the other hand, 266 00:14:59,850 --> 00:15:03,000 S2: Israel is probably safer today than it's been in the 267 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:04,680 S2: last 20, 25 years. 268 00:15:04,710 --> 00:15:05,130 S3: Sure. 269 00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:09,030 S1: Yeah, absolutely. Well, we're here to talk about the hostages 270 00:15:09,060 --> 00:15:12,390 S1: as our main focus, 251 of them who have been 271 00:15:12,420 --> 00:15:15,660 S1: at the epicenter of a drama that began, as you say, 272 00:15:15,660 --> 00:15:20,280 S1: back on October the 7th, 2023. What do you think, Rabbi? 273 00:15:20,310 --> 00:15:25,380 S1: Americans maybe not quite understand about the taking of those hostages. 274 00:15:26,250 --> 00:15:30,300 S2: The brutality and the abuse in terms of how they 275 00:15:30,300 --> 00:15:34,170 S2: were treated is very significant. I'll give you just a 276 00:15:34,170 --> 00:15:38,280 S2: couple of statistics. The hostages that were released during a 277 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:44,700 S2: temporary cease fire in November of 23 of those hostages, 80% 278 00:15:44,700 --> 00:15:48,840 S2: of them were not sexually or physically abused. 20% were, 279 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:53,550 S2: but 100% of them were emotionally abused in just some 280 00:15:53,550 --> 00:15:58,770 S2: very evil, horrific ways. And the ramifications of that, you know, 281 00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:01,470 S2: in terms of how they lead their lives moving forward 282 00:16:01,500 --> 00:16:03,780 S2: and have had the chance to sit with many of them, 283 00:16:03,780 --> 00:16:06,270 S2: as well as to sit with the team of psychologists 284 00:16:06,270 --> 00:16:09,330 S2: that's working with them to try to mainstream them back 285 00:16:09,330 --> 00:16:12,900 S2: into regular civilian life. Those are things that are going 286 00:16:12,930 --> 00:16:14,430 S2: to bear with them for years. 287 00:16:14,460 --> 00:16:15,060 S3: Yeah. 288 00:16:15,180 --> 00:16:18,300 S1: Rabbi Steven Weil is the chief executive officer of the 289 00:16:18,300 --> 00:16:21,690 S1: friends of the Israel Defense Forces. I'm John Geiger. This 290 00:16:21,690 --> 00:16:24,540 S1: is the land and the book. We hear bits and 291 00:16:24,540 --> 00:16:27,810 S1: pieces of information about the lives of the hostages while 292 00:16:27,810 --> 00:16:30,660 S1: living in Gaza. But specifics have been very few and 293 00:16:30,660 --> 00:16:33,330 S1: far between. I can only assume that's because this is 294 00:16:33,330 --> 00:16:36,090 S1: very much an active, hostile action underway. 295 00:16:36,090 --> 00:16:38,160 S3: Your thoughts? Yeah. 296 00:16:38,460 --> 00:16:42,480 S2: Just one other fact that's interesting is that those hostages 297 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:47,070 S2: that have transitioned back to any sense of normalcy, the 298 00:16:47,070 --> 00:16:49,950 S2: ones that have done the best, is when they were 299 00:16:49,950 --> 00:16:53,280 S2: held as a group, not as an individual, in isolation. 300 00:16:53,940 --> 00:16:55,800 S2: None of them were allowed to speak. I'll give you 301 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,230 S2: an example. Many of the hostages who've been released in 302 00:16:58,230 --> 00:17:02,910 S2: 23 hostages have been released now in 2025. Many of 303 00:17:02,910 --> 00:17:06,120 S2: them took 4 or 5 days before they stopped whispering. 304 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,040 S2: They weren't allowed to speak out loud. 305 00:17:08,070 --> 00:17:08,429 S3: Wow. 306 00:17:08,460 --> 00:17:11,010 S2: Some of them were not allowed to speak in Hebrew. 307 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:13,830 S2: You know, but those who at least were in captivity 308 00:17:13,830 --> 00:17:17,520 S2: with others, they had each other to strengthen each other. 309 00:17:17,670 --> 00:17:21,570 S2: One of the young women who was released in 2025, 310 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:24,750 S2: you know, she observed, the fast of Yom Kippur, the 311 00:17:24,750 --> 00:17:28,080 S2: holiest day of the year. She observed the fast on 312 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:30,119 S2: the ninth of AV. How she was able to keep 313 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:32,790 S2: a calendar and know the days is also shows something 314 00:17:32,820 --> 00:17:36,450 S2: incredible for a 19 year old young woman. And so 315 00:17:36,450 --> 00:17:39,630 S2: those have done better as well. Believe it or not, 316 00:17:39,630 --> 00:17:42,450 S2: I think we've all heard that term the Stockholm syndrome. 317 00:17:42,660 --> 00:17:46,650 S2: There were a few cases where, because most hostages were 318 00:17:46,650 --> 00:17:49,320 S2: not kept in large groups, they were either kept in 319 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,440 S2: isolation or they were kept in small groups of three. 320 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:56,070 S2: And what happened was there were a few cases where 321 00:17:56,070 --> 00:18:00,240 S2: it was there were Hamas affiliated civilians that were controlling them, 322 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,930 S2: and a couple of cases where they actually treated them 323 00:18:03,930 --> 00:18:06,570 S2: like a pseudo human being. They didn't treat them worse 324 00:18:06,570 --> 00:18:10,290 S2: than you would treat an animal. And in those cases, 325 00:18:10,290 --> 00:18:15,660 S2: they also transitioned a little bit better. They transitioned to 326 00:18:15,690 --> 00:18:20,160 S2: a greater degree because their sense of of humanity, you know, 327 00:18:20,190 --> 00:18:23,760 S2: at least existed during their time of captivity. That's not 328 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:25,050 S2: true for most of them. 329 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:28,350 S1: Last March, our host, Charlie Dyer and his wife Kathy, 330 00:18:28,350 --> 00:18:31,290 S1: along with me and my wife Diana, we traveled to Israel, 331 00:18:31,290 --> 00:18:34,440 S1: and there we met with the families of several hostages 332 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:38,010 S1: and the agony on their faces and in their voices 333 00:18:38,010 --> 00:18:41,129 S1: made it difficult to sleep. And ever since then, you know, 334 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:45,060 S1: to most Americans, these hostages were just faces. But to us, 335 00:18:45,060 --> 00:18:48,480 S1: they were. They were like friends. Every news report, every update, 336 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,230 S1: every photo or video that we saw. We looked for 337 00:18:52,230 --> 00:18:55,830 S1: our loved ones and we prayed for them. Talk about 338 00:18:55,830 --> 00:18:59,580 S1: the role of of connection in understanding the hardships that 339 00:18:59,580 --> 00:19:02,010 S1: these families have gone through as they wait for their 340 00:19:02,010 --> 00:19:02,910 S1: loved ones. 341 00:19:03,540 --> 00:19:06,090 S2: I'll give you an example. We've you know, we've met 342 00:19:06,090 --> 00:19:08,700 S2: with many of the parents or spouses of those who 343 00:19:08,730 --> 00:19:12,480 S2: are being held, you and I, if the phone rings. Okay. 344 00:19:12,510 --> 00:19:14,730 S2: The phone is ringing. You know, if I'm in a meeting, 345 00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:18,300 S2: we'll return the call later. Every time the phone rings, 346 00:19:18,300 --> 00:19:21,629 S2: they're in a state of trauma. Because is this going 347 00:19:21,630 --> 00:19:25,170 S2: to be the army notifying them that their loved one 348 00:19:25,170 --> 00:19:27,600 S2: is no longer alive? In the case of the Army, 349 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:30,000 S2: they don't do that. They do that in person. But 350 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:32,640 S2: just a phone ringing that you and I take for 351 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:36,260 S2: granted is a traumatic experience for them every time that 352 00:19:36,260 --> 00:19:37,220 S2: it happens. 353 00:19:37,430 --> 00:19:40,520 S1: What kind of secrets about Hamas do you think these 354 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,379 S1: former hostages hold? 355 00:19:43,550 --> 00:19:44,090 S3: Um. 356 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:48,080 S2: Little children, you know, 4 or 5, seven, eight year 357 00:19:48,109 --> 00:19:52,280 S2: old children in Gaza. Every time they mention the word 358 00:19:52,310 --> 00:19:56,060 S2: Jew or Israel, they spit. You know, you've got little 359 00:19:56,060 --> 00:19:59,810 S2: children treating hostages, you know, worse than you treat the 360 00:19:59,810 --> 00:20:04,070 S2: most wild animal that exists. It's just, you know, no 361 00:20:04,070 --> 00:20:07,070 S2: human being is prepared for something like that. And no 362 00:20:07,100 --> 00:20:09,740 S2: human being is prepared to see that another human being 363 00:20:09,740 --> 00:20:13,370 S2: is so bereft of decency of humanity that they act 364 00:20:13,369 --> 00:20:17,119 S2: that way, and that they've so poisoned the next generation, 365 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:20,660 S2: the children of Gaza, you know, they subscribe. Not all 366 00:20:20,660 --> 00:20:24,110 S2: of them, but I would say 70% of the population 367 00:20:24,230 --> 00:20:29,060 S2: believes in a dimension of Islam known as the Muslim Brotherhood. 368 00:20:29,090 --> 00:20:33,350 S2: What is the Muslim Brotherhood? That any Christian or Jew 369 00:20:33,380 --> 00:20:37,969 S2: who's on a land that at one time was islamically controlled. 370 00:20:37,970 --> 00:20:42,470 S2: For instance, the Balkan states, for instance, southern Spain, Andalusia, 371 00:20:42,500 --> 00:20:46,460 S2: central Spain, Castile. That has to be Muslim land. It's 372 00:20:46,460 --> 00:20:49,850 S2: not just Israel. And they don't believe that in a 373 00:20:49,850 --> 00:20:53,119 S2: theoretical sense. They believe that in an active sense that 374 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:55,670 S2: the most important thing they can do on this earth 375 00:20:55,700 --> 00:20:59,480 S2: is rid infidels, rid Jews and Christians from land that 376 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:02,570 S2: they deemed to be Muslim land. And that's their religion. 377 00:21:02,570 --> 00:21:07,160 S2: That's not the typical Sunni Muslim on this earth. It isn't. 378 00:21:07,490 --> 00:21:10,100 S2: But that is the theology of the Muslim Brotherhood, which 379 00:21:10,100 --> 00:21:12,980 S2: is why they've been expelled from Saudi Arabia, expelled from 380 00:21:12,980 --> 00:21:17,810 S2: the Emirates. They're illegal in Egypt, but yet in Gaza, 381 00:21:17,810 --> 00:21:19,969 S2: with the support of Qatar and with the support of 382 00:21:19,970 --> 00:21:23,389 S2: Turkey in Gaza, that is the theology. And that's what 383 00:21:23,390 --> 00:21:26,660 S2: they believe in. And it's a vicious, vicious theology. 384 00:21:26,750 --> 00:21:29,390 S1: This is the land and the book. I'm John Gager, 385 00:21:29,390 --> 00:21:32,240 S1: and if you joined us midstream, we're talking with Rabbi 386 00:21:32,270 --> 00:21:36,379 S1: Steven Weil about the state of the Israeli hostages taken 387 00:21:36,380 --> 00:21:38,480 S1: by Hamas. What do you think will be the greatest 388 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:43,310 S1: factors in determining the success of their transition back, to quote, 389 00:21:43,340 --> 00:21:46,400 S1: normal life? I mean, can it ever be that way again? 390 00:21:47,210 --> 00:21:50,390 S2: I would say there's two factors. One thing about Israel, 391 00:21:50,390 --> 00:21:53,510 S2: it's a big family. It's a small country, but it's 392 00:21:53,510 --> 00:21:56,150 S2: a big family. And the love there that they have 393 00:21:56,180 --> 00:21:59,210 S2: for each other and the support, you know, whether it's 394 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,350 S2: the extended family structure, whether it's the community structure, it's 395 00:22:03,350 --> 00:22:07,040 S2: very significant in America. You don't see that outside of 396 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:10,730 S2: a church or outside of a synagogue community. But in Israel, 397 00:22:10,730 --> 00:22:14,030 S2: it's just part of life. So there's an incredible network 398 00:22:14,030 --> 00:22:16,730 S2: and support system. And the other part of it is, 399 00:22:16,730 --> 00:22:21,440 S2: is that they have psychologists who are designated for each 400 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:25,820 S2: of the hostages to do serious therapy to support them. 401 00:22:25,820 --> 00:22:30,770 S2: And many of these hostages have transitioned fairly well. Now, 402 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:35,150 S2: the hostages that are coming out in 2025. We don't 403 00:22:35,150 --> 00:22:37,160 S2: have data yet. And we you know, we won't know 404 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:41,090 S2: that for months and months. But, um, there is an 405 00:22:41,090 --> 00:22:46,580 S2: incredible support system, an incredible network and incredible love. And 406 00:22:46,580 --> 00:22:48,590 S2: that love is so tangible. 407 00:22:48,619 --> 00:22:48,919 S3: Yeah. 408 00:22:48,950 --> 00:22:52,429 S2: And faith is a major factor. The faith is a 409 00:22:52,430 --> 00:22:56,090 S2: major factor. And it's a country where the majority of 410 00:22:56,090 --> 00:22:59,660 S2: the people have a very serious faith in God, very 411 00:22:59,660 --> 00:23:04,460 S2: serious tradition of religion. And in that sense, those will 412 00:23:04,460 --> 00:23:07,760 S2: help in a very significant way over the course of 413 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:08,600 S2: the years. 414 00:23:09,109 --> 00:23:12,410 S1: In addition to that, what kinds of tools do caregivers, 415 00:23:12,410 --> 00:23:16,609 S1: professional and non-professional, have to help in the recovery process? 416 00:23:17,690 --> 00:23:20,660 S2: Probably I you know, and please push. If I'm not 417 00:23:20,660 --> 00:23:23,270 S2: being clear, I would say it's it's the therapy. I 418 00:23:23,270 --> 00:23:26,090 S2: think it's the ability to listen. I think it's the 419 00:23:26,090 --> 00:23:29,840 S2: ability to give space to the hostages. You know, everyone 420 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,399 S2: deals with trauma in a different way. And part of 421 00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:37,820 S2: the challenge, and this is true in general of survivor 422 00:23:37,820 --> 00:23:41,450 S2: is survivor always asks, why me? In other words, think 423 00:23:41,450 --> 00:23:44,149 S2: about a Holocaust survivor where the whole family was killed. 424 00:23:44,180 --> 00:23:47,210 S2: They're haunted the rest of their life with this guilt. 425 00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:50,480 S2: You know, why did I survive? I wasn't the most righteous. 426 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,120 S2: I wasn't the kindest, you know. And there's that. We 427 00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:55,940 S2: call it survivor guilt. And I think you'll see that'll 428 00:23:55,970 --> 00:23:57,409 S2: be a factor as well. 429 00:23:57,950 --> 00:24:00,439 S1: I want to go back to a figure. You used 430 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:02,750 S1: to talk about some of the hostages that have previously 431 00:24:02,750 --> 00:24:07,310 S1: been released, 80% not sexually or physically abused, but 20% 432 00:24:07,310 --> 00:24:10,640 S1: of them certainly sexually abused. Physically abused. Do you think 433 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:13,070 S1: those numbers are going to be typical for the entire 434 00:24:13,070 --> 00:24:16,010 S1: group of hostages yet to be released? 435 00:24:16,580 --> 00:24:19,460 S2: I think the numbers will be much worse of those 436 00:24:19,490 --> 00:24:20,510 S2: yet to be released. 437 00:24:20,540 --> 00:24:21,649 S3: Why do you say that? 438 00:24:21,710 --> 00:24:24,470 S2: Because of the duration of time that they're there. And 439 00:24:24,470 --> 00:24:28,460 S2: as the first group that was released were either liberated 440 00:24:28,460 --> 00:24:31,520 S2: by the army or in a cease fire. Those were 441 00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:35,780 S2: 50 some days we're looking at. Hostages came out in 442 00:24:35,780 --> 00:24:39,680 S2: January and came out in February that were in captivity 443 00:24:39,710 --> 00:24:46,280 S2: for 470, 480, 490 days. Very, very different situation. 444 00:24:46,310 --> 00:24:46,909 S3: Yeah. 445 00:24:47,330 --> 00:24:50,119 S1: Well, in 30s, what do you think listeners could or 446 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:53,420 S1: should do to help in this situation? We feel helpless, 447 00:24:53,420 --> 00:24:56,030 S1: but our hearts go out to these families. What can 448 00:24:56,060 --> 00:24:56,750 S1: we do? 449 00:24:57,470 --> 00:25:01,160 S2: Well, you know, your prayers are very crucial. Number one. 450 00:25:01,580 --> 00:25:06,740 S2: Number two is being an advocate for Israel, because Israel 451 00:25:06,740 --> 00:25:08,900 S2: is not just about Israel, and it's not just about 452 00:25:08,900 --> 00:25:11,750 S2: the Jews. It's really on the front line of what 453 00:25:11,750 --> 00:25:14,209 S2: the 21st century is going to look like. Will it 454 00:25:14,210 --> 00:25:18,409 S2: be a century of barbarism, of the justification of evil, 455 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,230 S2: or will it be a century of justice, of decency 456 00:25:21,230 --> 00:25:24,410 S2: and morality? And that is what Israel is, and that's 457 00:25:24,410 --> 00:25:28,820 S2: what Israel represents. But in many media and many campuses 458 00:25:28,820 --> 00:25:32,510 S2: across America. There's such a perversion of facts, such a 459 00:25:32,510 --> 00:25:35,750 S2: perversion of the truth. And to be an advocate is very, 460 00:25:35,750 --> 00:25:37,100 S2: very significant. 461 00:25:37,250 --> 00:25:41,210 S1: That's Rabbi Steven Weil, chief executive officer of the friends 462 00:25:41,210 --> 00:25:43,910 S1: of the Israel Defense Forces. A link to his website. 463 00:25:43,910 --> 00:25:47,210 S1: When you visit ours at the land and the book. Org. 464 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:48,500 S1: Thanks for your time, sir. 465 00:25:48,619 --> 00:25:50,240 S2: Thank you very much, John. 466 00:25:50,270 --> 00:25:52,310 S1: And we're looking at a brand new set of Bible 467 00:25:52,310 --> 00:25:55,010 S1: questions and answers that's coming up in our next segment 468 00:25:55,010 --> 00:26:08,510 S1: right here. There's just no two ways about it. The 469 00:26:08,510 --> 00:26:12,230 S1: Bible is an absolutely amazing book. You could read it 470 00:26:12,230 --> 00:26:14,899 S1: and reread it and read it 400 times in a 471 00:26:14,900 --> 00:26:18,440 S1: row and not run out of wonder and more importantly, 472 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:20,840 S1: perhaps not run out of questions. What do you do 473 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,210 S1: with them? Well, we suggest you shove them our way. 474 00:26:23,210 --> 00:26:25,940 S1: This is the land and the book. I'm John Gager 475 00:26:25,970 --> 00:26:28,790 S1: joined in studio now by Doctor Gerald Peterman, who's about 476 00:26:28,790 --> 00:26:31,910 S1: to answer some questions that have come in via email. First, though, 477 00:26:31,910 --> 00:26:35,030 S1: this quick thought what does Passover mean for us as 478 00:26:35,030 --> 00:26:37,970 S1: believers in Jesus? Some might remember the story from the 479 00:26:37,970 --> 00:26:40,340 S1: book of Exodus, but there's so much more to it. 480 00:26:40,369 --> 00:26:42,230 S1: Did you know that the Last Supper was actually a 481 00:26:42,230 --> 00:26:46,459 S1: Passover meal? Not only did Jesus and his disciples celebrate Passover, 482 00:26:46,460 --> 00:26:49,970 S1: it also foreshadowed his death on the cross for our redemption. 483 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,429 S1: Jewish people, of course, have been observing the feast of 484 00:26:52,430 --> 00:26:56,780 S1: Passover for thousands of years. Understanding the history and importance 485 00:26:56,780 --> 00:26:58,580 S1: of this holiday will help you better connect with your 486 00:26:58,580 --> 00:27:01,430 S1: Jewish friends and neighbors. And boy, what better way is 487 00:27:01,430 --> 00:27:05,300 S1: there to learn about Passover than to experience a Passover 488 00:27:05,330 --> 00:27:09,530 S1: Seder yourself if you have never celebrated Passover? Our friends 489 00:27:09,530 --> 00:27:11,960 S1: at Life in Messiah would love to partner with you 490 00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:15,650 S1: in hosting a Seder experience. Every year, their staff engage 491 00:27:15,650 --> 00:27:19,220 S1: churches and small groups in an interactive Messiah in the 492 00:27:19,220 --> 00:27:23,990 S1: Passover Seder, allowing participants to taste and see the redemption story. 493 00:27:24,020 --> 00:27:26,570 S1: If you're interested in having somebody come to lead a 494 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:30,439 S1: Seder in your area, visit Life in Messiah. Org and 495 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,600 S1: click on the Moody Radio button there to learn more. 496 00:27:32,630 --> 00:27:36,800 S1: That's life in messiah.org. Well, it's always good to see 497 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,830 S1: the very smiling, very competent Doctor Gerald Peterman, professor of 498 00:27:39,830 --> 00:27:42,500 S1: Bible at the Moody Bible Institute in our studio. Ready 499 00:27:42,500 --> 00:27:43,610 S1: to go, are you, sir? 500 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,369 S4: Yes. And I'm giving a big amen to your encouraging 501 00:27:46,369 --> 00:27:48,980 S4: people to go to a Seder. It's wonderful. All right. 502 00:27:49,010 --> 00:27:51,080 S1: Good for that. You know, we had a Seder at 503 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,100 S1: our church, and boy, what an awesome experience that was. 504 00:27:55,100 --> 00:27:58,100 S1: So anyway, yeah, I agree with you. Let's get to 505 00:27:58,130 --> 00:28:00,919 S1: Avis's question. She says. I'm asking about the locations of 506 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,459 S1: the four rivers of the Garden of Eden. Tigris and 507 00:28:04,460 --> 00:28:07,430 S1: Euphrates are familiar. The East of the Eden study by 508 00:28:07,430 --> 00:28:11,150 S1: Sandra Richter shows the pishon in Arabia next to Egypt. 509 00:28:11,180 --> 00:28:14,930 S1: My Harpercollins dictionary says the Gihon and Kush, which is 510 00:28:14,930 --> 00:28:18,139 S1: now Ethiopia. My Bible class was surprised by that. To 511 00:28:18,170 --> 00:28:20,630 S1: think that the Garden of Eden was that large. And, 512 00:28:20,660 --> 00:28:22,879 S1: you know, I have no problem with it extending to Ethiopia. 513 00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:25,780 S1: But can you confirm the locations of the rivers or 514 00:28:25,780 --> 00:28:27,880 S1: add any comments from my Bible class? 515 00:28:27,910 --> 00:28:30,129 S4: Oh yeah, I'm so glad you're looking into this. You 516 00:28:30,130 --> 00:28:34,540 S4: have your rivers, correct? Pishon, Gihon, Tigris and Euphrates and 517 00:28:34,540 --> 00:28:37,720 S4: the rivers do cover a lot of territory. Let's go 518 00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:39,940 S4: back to Genesis two and we're going to start at 519 00:28:39,940 --> 00:28:43,150 S4: verse eight. It says, and the Lord God planted a 520 00:28:43,150 --> 00:28:46,840 S4: garden in Eden in the east. And there he put 521 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:50,320 S4: the man whom he had formed. So there is the garden. 522 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:53,710 S4: It is in Eden, and Eden is said to be 523 00:28:53,710 --> 00:28:55,930 S4: in the east. So it looks like Eden is actually 524 00:28:55,930 --> 00:28:59,740 S4: larger than the garden, because the garden is planted in Eden, 525 00:28:59,770 --> 00:29:03,190 S4: not said to be Eden. And if we keep reading on, 526 00:29:03,190 --> 00:29:05,290 S4: here's what we find in verse ten. And the river 527 00:29:05,290 --> 00:29:08,350 S4: flowed out of Eden to water the garden, and there 528 00:29:08,350 --> 00:29:11,170 S4: it divided and became four rivers. And then in verses 529 00:29:11,170 --> 00:29:13,690 S4: 11 to 14 we read about the places where the 530 00:29:13,690 --> 00:29:17,440 S4: four rivers go, including Havilah, Cush, Assyria. So rather than 531 00:29:17,470 --> 00:29:20,890 S4: saying that the garden itself extends as far as javelin, 532 00:29:20,890 --> 00:29:22,510 S4: Kush and Assyria, I think it's better to say that 533 00:29:22,510 --> 00:29:25,840 S4: we don't know how much land the garden covered, but 534 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:29,620 S4: that the river that flowed through it watered a vast territory. 535 00:29:29,830 --> 00:29:31,719 S1: So we're talking about a big chunk of land. The 536 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:33,219 S1: Garden of Eden was not a little thing. 537 00:29:33,220 --> 00:29:34,300 S4: Not a little thing. 538 00:29:34,330 --> 00:29:35,860 S1: You know, we go to Israel and we go to 539 00:29:35,890 --> 00:29:39,520 S1: the Garden of Gethsemane. Well, the Garden of Eden was way, 540 00:29:39,550 --> 00:29:42,010 S1: way bigger than that, you're saying? Right. Possibly hundreds of. 541 00:29:42,010 --> 00:29:43,840 S4: Miles. Possibly hundreds of miles. 542 00:29:43,870 --> 00:29:46,720 S1: Nancy has a question for us. How did God provide 543 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:51,130 S1: the very rare ingredients for incense ordered in Exodus 30, 544 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,430 S1: verse 40? She says, I looked it up and found 545 00:29:54,430 --> 00:29:58,120 S1: that Ankia comes from sea snails. I know with God 546 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,490 S1: all things are possible, but sea snails. 547 00:30:00,850 --> 00:30:06,310 S4: Isn't God amazing? The best theory about the incense mentioned 548 00:30:06,340 --> 00:30:08,740 S4: there in Exodus 30 is that stoked is probably from 549 00:30:08,740 --> 00:30:12,490 S4: the sap of the storax tree, and Galbanum is a 550 00:30:12,490 --> 00:30:16,210 S4: gum resin that comes from Ferula gummosa plants. And these 551 00:30:16,210 --> 00:30:19,090 S4: are all native to the Mediterranean, so they'd be easy 552 00:30:19,090 --> 00:30:22,040 S4: to find. Now let's go to Annika. This is a 553 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:25,640 S4: species of marine mollusk. As you mentioned, they're called Strombus. 554 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:27,980 S4: And they can be found in one, I guess the 555 00:30:27,980 --> 00:30:31,670 S4: Red sea. So that's the eastern border of Egypt. And 556 00:30:31,700 --> 00:30:34,010 S4: of course, the Israelites had to pass through the Red 557 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,340 S4: sea with no water, right, to get to the Promised Land. 558 00:30:37,340 --> 00:30:40,040 S4: Maybe they even picked some up on the way. So 559 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:41,990 S4: God provided. 560 00:30:42,020 --> 00:30:46,550 S1: Interesting. Ali is question. We toured Israel 18 months ago. 561 00:30:46,580 --> 00:30:49,580 S1: Our tour guide spoke of living in Ashdod with no 562 00:30:49,580 --> 00:30:53,720 S1: bomb shelter because that's all he could afford. Here's the question. 563 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:57,410 S1: With so many Jews migrating to Israel, where are they 564 00:30:57,410 --> 00:30:58,190 S1: all living? 565 00:30:58,700 --> 00:31:00,590 S4: It's a great question. I'm going to read an answer 566 00:31:00,590 --> 00:31:02,870 S4: provided by Charlie Dyer and it goes like this. The 567 00:31:02,870 --> 00:31:06,740 S4: short answer is Israel is living all over. Okay. Ashkelon. 568 00:31:06,770 --> 00:31:10,610 S4: Ashdod have expanded greatly. Some of the older apartment buildings 569 00:31:10,610 --> 00:31:13,430 S4: in some towns don't have bomb shelters, but most of 570 00:31:13,430 --> 00:31:16,459 S4: the new construction does. And when John and I were 571 00:31:16,460 --> 00:31:18,950 S4: in Israel in March, we visited the apartment of a 572 00:31:18,950 --> 00:31:21,490 S4: friend who lives in Ascalon, just seven miles from the 573 00:31:21,490 --> 00:31:24,490 S4: Gaza border. And we actually did some recording in the 574 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:27,340 S4: so-called safe room in their apartment, which had a blast 575 00:31:27,340 --> 00:31:30,040 S4: door and a heavy metal plate that could slide over 576 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:33,550 S4: the window. Older apartments don't have this, but newer ones do. 577 00:31:33,580 --> 00:31:37,330 S4: Other modern towns have developed in Israel all over the place, 578 00:31:37,330 --> 00:31:40,630 S4: with safe rooms and bomb shelters. These include small cities 579 00:31:40,630 --> 00:31:46,210 S4: like Har Gilo, Har Homa, Ma'aleh Adumim, Givat Shaul, Pisgat 580 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:49,900 S4: Ze'ev which are really bedroom communities to Jerusalem. And we 581 00:31:49,900 --> 00:31:52,150 S4: could go on and on and on. Israel is doing 582 00:31:52,150 --> 00:31:55,390 S4: a lot of building furiously to keep up with its 583 00:31:55,390 --> 00:31:59,620 S4: population growth. And while some towns along the border of Gaza, 584 00:31:59,650 --> 00:32:02,500 S4: like Ashkelon and Ashdod, were impacted by the war, many 585 00:32:02,500 --> 00:32:05,920 S4: others were not. In the north, there's been much growth 586 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:10,390 S4: around the area of Haifa, Jezreel Valley, Nazareth, Tiberius and 587 00:32:10,390 --> 00:32:13,330 S4: other towns. So Israel is a really small country, and 588 00:32:13,330 --> 00:32:15,940 S4: it's under a lot of pressure to build because the 589 00:32:15,940 --> 00:32:18,340 S4: population is expanding and expanding. 590 00:32:18,370 --> 00:32:20,620 S1: Yeah, people sometimes think of Israel and they equate it with, 591 00:32:20,650 --> 00:32:23,410 S1: you know, O little town of Bethlehem, you know thy 592 00:32:23,410 --> 00:32:28,150 S1: dreamless streets. Well, there aren't too many dreamless streets these days. Right. 593 00:32:28,390 --> 00:32:31,420 S1: They're alive with jackhammers and cranes and construction workers. And 594 00:32:31,420 --> 00:32:35,470 S1: everywhere you turn, you're seeing something new being built. So that's. 595 00:32:35,470 --> 00:32:38,260 S1: That's the short answer to that question. Thank you. You're 596 00:32:38,260 --> 00:32:41,110 S1: listening to The Land and the book from Moody Radio. 597 00:32:41,140 --> 00:32:44,590 S1: I'm John Gager. Doctor Gerald Peterman welcomes your questions any 598 00:32:44,620 --> 00:32:49,240 S1: time at the land and the book at Moody dot. Edu. 599 00:32:49,270 --> 00:32:53,170 S1: That's the land and the book at Moody dot. Edu. 600 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,140 S1: Eric takes us to Second Chronicles 20, verse 12, where 601 00:32:56,140 --> 00:32:59,230 S1: it says, we do not know what to do, but 602 00:32:59,230 --> 00:33:02,590 S1: our eyes are on you. Well, how does a person 603 00:33:02,590 --> 00:33:05,410 S1: keep their eyes on the Lord? Is this simply a 604 00:33:05,410 --> 00:33:07,240 S1: matter of praying? What's the deal here? 605 00:33:07,270 --> 00:33:08,980 S4: Well, this is a really good thing for us to 606 00:33:09,010 --> 00:33:13,030 S4: think about. So let's go to Second Chronicles 20. In 607 00:33:13,030 --> 00:33:16,330 S4: verse one, we find that a large army of Moabites 608 00:33:16,330 --> 00:33:21,310 S4: and ammonites. Ammonites come to fight against Jehoshaphat, king of Judah, 609 00:33:21,310 --> 00:33:23,680 S4: and the king prays, and the last part of the 610 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:27,370 S4: prayer he says, God, we are powerless before this vast 611 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,800 S4: number that comes to fight against us. We do not 612 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:33,730 S4: know what to do, but we look to you. So 613 00:33:33,730 --> 00:33:36,700 S4: I take it that, as Eric said, looking to God 614 00:33:36,700 --> 00:33:39,370 S4: entails praying to God. But looking to God, I think, 615 00:33:39,370 --> 00:33:44,770 S4: also entails anticipating that he will help us because we 616 00:33:44,770 --> 00:33:48,520 S4: need his help. I'm reminded of something very similar in 617 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:53,170 S4: Psalm 123. It says, behold, as the eyes of servants 618 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,360 S4: look to the hand of their master, as the eyes 619 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:57,190 S4: of the maid, servant to the hand of her mistress. 620 00:33:57,190 --> 00:34:00,760 S4: So our eyes look to the Lord our God, till 621 00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:03,460 S4: he has mercy on us. I think looking to the 622 00:34:03,460 --> 00:34:06,820 S4: Lord means trusting him and anticipating his work on our behalf. 623 00:34:06,850 --> 00:34:09,790 S1: You know this phrase, anticipating his help takes me to 624 00:34:09,820 --> 00:34:12,730 S1: Ephesians chapter six, where we're given the list of the 625 00:34:12,730 --> 00:34:15,040 S1: armor that we're supposed to be wearing. And one of 626 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:17,680 S1: the pieces, of course, is the helmet of Salvation. Doctor 627 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:20,770 S1: Fred Dickerson, who is the former chairman of the theology 628 00:34:20,770 --> 00:34:23,680 S1: department here at Moody Bible Institute, said to me that 629 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,410 S1: that this is a lot more than just knowing you're saved. 630 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,740 S1: He's saying the helmet of salvation should cue us to 631 00:34:29,770 --> 00:34:31,660 S1: expect his deliverance. 632 00:34:31,690 --> 00:34:35,980 S4: Right, right, exactly. We have our mind set on anticipating 633 00:34:35,980 --> 00:34:37,180 S4: his deliverance for us. 634 00:34:37,210 --> 00:34:40,089 S1: That's great. That's a much broader picture. Thanks for bringing 635 00:34:40,090 --> 00:34:45,100 S1: that to our attention. Let's go to Diana's question. Josiah's son, Jehoahaz, 636 00:34:45,130 --> 00:34:49,000 S1: is his youngest son. According to first Chronicles 315, he 637 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:52,299 S1: became king when he was 23. Yet Zedekiah, who was 638 00:34:52,300 --> 00:34:58,330 S1: older than Jehoahaz, became king 11.5 years after Jehoahaz. And 639 00:34:58,330 --> 00:35:00,640 S1: he was 21 years old when he became king. The 640 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:03,549 S1: math doesn't work. Can you untie this for me? 641 00:35:03,580 --> 00:35:06,129 S4: Well, the genealogies are really difficult. And I should say 642 00:35:06,130 --> 00:35:08,859 S4: up front. I've pondered over this one and prayed over it, 643 00:35:08,860 --> 00:35:11,380 S4: and I don't have a really good answer, but let 644 00:35:11,380 --> 00:35:13,330 S4: me just mention a couple of things along the way. 645 00:35:13,330 --> 00:35:16,420 S4: We can start with First Chronicles 315 and we find 646 00:35:16,450 --> 00:35:23,440 S4: King Josiah's sons Johanan, Jehoiakim, Zedekiah, and Shallum. Now Shallum 647 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,529 S4: is also called Jehoahaz. Now to get details on when 648 00:35:26,530 --> 00:35:28,629 S4: they reigned and how many years. We go to two 649 00:35:28,660 --> 00:35:31,779 S4: Kings 23 and 24, and we find out. We put 650 00:35:31,780 --> 00:35:33,969 S4: all those numbers together, and we find that there was 651 00:35:33,969 --> 00:35:39,009 S4: reigns of 19.5 years. So indeed, it's rather strange. We 652 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:42,790 S4: don't have enough information to draw the conclusion. Why did 653 00:35:42,790 --> 00:35:44,890 S4: this happen? But I'll just point out one thing that's 654 00:35:44,890 --> 00:35:47,620 S4: a little bit odd. Here you have the youngest son 655 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,379 S4: who is the first to become king. That's a very 656 00:35:50,380 --> 00:35:52,780 S4: strange thing. So I'm not quite sure how to put 657 00:35:52,780 --> 00:35:55,810 S4: this together. It's a great question. Um, I haven't quite 658 00:35:55,810 --> 00:35:56,739 S4: solved it yet. 659 00:35:56,770 --> 00:35:58,600 S1: All right. And there are some questions that are just 660 00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:00,250 S1: plain like that. We're not going to try and tell 661 00:36:00,250 --> 00:36:02,379 S1: you we've got the answers if we don't. But your 662 00:36:02,380 --> 00:36:05,560 S1: question is welcome when you email us at The Land 663 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:12,220 S1: and the book@moody.edu the land and the book@moody.edu, we'd love 664 00:36:12,219 --> 00:36:14,460 S1: for you to visit our website. The land and the book. 665 00:36:14,700 --> 00:36:17,010 S1: Org and when there, we'd really like it. If you 666 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:18,870 S1: checked out our podcast, it's a great way for you 667 00:36:18,870 --> 00:36:21,239 S1: to listen to this program again at your own convenience, 668 00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,790 S1: and it's a great tool for introducing us to your 669 00:36:23,790 --> 00:36:26,730 S1: friends who maybe don't live anywhere near a radio station 670 00:36:26,730 --> 00:36:28,710 S1: that carries the land in the book. So look for 671 00:36:28,739 --> 00:36:31,859 S1: that podcast, use it yourself, and share it with a friend. 672 00:36:31,890 --> 00:36:33,989 S1: Would you do that? Thank you for doing that at 673 00:36:33,989 --> 00:36:38,520 S1: the land and the book.org. Well, it's Charlie Dyer's devotional 674 00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:41,069 S1: and it's coming up next right here on the land 675 00:36:41,070 --> 00:36:56,670 S1: and the book. Welcome back to the land and the book. 676 00:36:56,670 --> 00:36:59,640 S1: I'm John Gager, and for a whole lot of Israel travelers, 677 00:36:59,670 --> 00:37:03,600 S1: a visit through Hezekiah's tunnel is a truly memorable moment, 678 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,660 S1: I think. Speaking of memorable moments, Charlie, one of our 679 00:37:06,660 --> 00:37:10,230 S1: more unusual interviews ever on this broadcast took place when 680 00:37:10,230 --> 00:37:13,379 S1: Dan Anderson and I were walking through Hezekiah's tunnel with 681 00:37:13,380 --> 00:37:16,890 S1: a guide and sloshing through that water. We just recorded 682 00:37:16,890 --> 00:37:19,950 S1: a conversation, even in the dark at times. But your 683 00:37:19,950 --> 00:37:22,440 S1: devotional is taking us there today as well. Is that true? 684 00:37:22,469 --> 00:37:24,030 S5: It is exactly right. In fact, we're all going to 685 00:37:24,030 --> 00:37:25,770 S5: head to Hezekiah's tunnel today. 686 00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:27,540 S1: All right, so we all get to take that walk. 687 00:37:27,540 --> 00:37:29,670 S1: I look forward to that after we pause for a 688 00:37:29,670 --> 00:37:33,000 S1: testimony from a traveler who has these thoughts about their 689 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:34,200 S1: visit to Israel. 690 00:37:38,100 --> 00:37:43,230 S6: This is Val from Texas, and it has been so 691 00:37:43,260 --> 00:37:47,310 S6: enlightening to be here in the Holy Land to see 692 00:37:47,340 --> 00:37:53,069 S6: just exactly how Jesus could have traveled from town to town, 693 00:37:53,070 --> 00:37:58,470 S6: and been welcomed by the people who were hospitable to 694 00:37:58,500 --> 00:38:02,669 S6: him and stay in their homes to see this just 695 00:38:02,670 --> 00:38:06,210 S6: made it so real. And then to be on the 696 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:11,040 S6: Sea of Galilee and think of Jesus Just walking on 697 00:38:11,070 --> 00:38:15,060 S6: that water out to a boat, and in the evenings 698 00:38:15,060 --> 00:38:19,080 S6: we would have these quick winds that would come up, 699 00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:23,850 S6: and you would definitely see a difference in how that 700 00:38:23,850 --> 00:38:28,469 S6: could happen. On the Sea of Galilee when Jesus was 701 00:38:28,469 --> 00:38:33,120 S6: there in the boat, asleep. So, so many things that 702 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:37,500 S6: I've read in the Bible for years started really making 703 00:38:37,500 --> 00:38:41,400 S6: sense and coming together for me. And that's been thrilling. 704 00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:42,720 S6: Just thrilling. 705 00:38:44,430 --> 00:38:48,720 S1: Hezekiah's tunnel. Boy, it's a fascinating achievement. And Charlie, I'm 706 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,520 S1: looking forward to what you have to share with us. 707 00:38:50,550 --> 00:38:53,430 S5: Well, thanks, John. This is week three. In my 11 708 00:38:53,460 --> 00:38:57,360 S5: week series, I've called 11 inscriptions to the Bible. We're 709 00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:01,470 S5: exploring written inscriptions uncovered by archaeologists that give us new 710 00:39:01,469 --> 00:39:04,350 S5: insight into our understanding of the Bible. And this week, 711 00:39:04,350 --> 00:39:06,960 S5: I hope you brought along your bathing suit, flip flops, 712 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,709 S5: and flashlight because our journey today is taking us through 713 00:39:10,710 --> 00:39:14,940 S5: a 2700 year old tunnel carved under the city of Jerusalem, 714 00:39:14,940 --> 00:39:18,060 S5: and our watery trek begins at the Gihon Spring, the 715 00:39:18,060 --> 00:39:21,540 S5: original water supply for the city. Now watch your step 716 00:39:21,540 --> 00:39:24,270 S5: getting into the water. It'll feel cold at first, but 717 00:39:24,270 --> 00:39:28,020 S5: you'll quickly get used to it. The rectangular opening looks small, 718 00:39:28,020 --> 00:39:30,450 S5: and there are a few places inside where the ceiling 719 00:39:30,450 --> 00:39:32,729 S5: is a bit low and where the water will be 720 00:39:32,730 --> 00:39:35,220 S5: mid thigh deep, but most of the way it won't 721 00:39:35,219 --> 00:39:38,370 S5: be that high. Okay, it's time to turn on your flashlights. 722 00:39:38,370 --> 00:39:41,100 S5: Here we go. Now, as we slosh our way through 723 00:39:41,100 --> 00:39:43,320 S5: the tunnel, let me tell you a little bit about it. 724 00:39:43,350 --> 00:39:46,439 S5: It snakes under the original city of David, and comes 725 00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:48,840 S5: out in the Central Valley between the original part of 726 00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,540 S5: the city and the larger hill to the west that 727 00:39:51,540 --> 00:39:54,540 S5: became part of the city during the reign of King Hezekiah. 728 00:39:54,570 --> 00:39:57,660 S5: In fact, the tunnel and a major wall placed around 729 00:39:57,660 --> 00:40:01,410 S5: the western hill were part of Hezekiah's preparations to help 730 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,649 S5: fight off an attack against Jerusalem by the Assyrian army. 731 00:40:04,650 --> 00:40:07,110 S5: But I'm getting ahead of myself. The purpose for the 732 00:40:07,110 --> 00:40:09,880 S5: tunnel was to block off the original entrance to the 733 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:13,089 S5: Gihon Spring, and then to divert the water inside the 734 00:40:13,090 --> 00:40:15,969 S5: city to the Pool of Siloam to provide an easily 735 00:40:15,969 --> 00:40:19,989 S5: accessible water supply for the people of Jerusalem. The project 736 00:40:19,989 --> 00:40:23,649 S5: was actually an amazing engineering feat. Two teams of workers 737 00:40:23,650 --> 00:40:27,700 S5: started on opposite ends and snaked their way toward each other, 738 00:40:27,730 --> 00:40:32,170 S5: ultimately digging a channel that was 1800 feet long. In fact, 739 00:40:32,170 --> 00:40:35,590 S5: the compiler of Second Kings summarized the reign of Hezekiah 740 00:40:35,620 --> 00:40:38,500 S5: this way. Now, the rest of the acts of Hezekiah 741 00:40:38,500 --> 00:40:40,839 S5: and all his might, and how he made the pool 742 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,719 S5: and the conduit, and brought water into the city, are 743 00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,000 S5: they not written in the book of the Chronicles of 744 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,910 S5: the Kings of Judah? And the Book of Second Chronicles 745 00:40:48,910 --> 00:40:52,330 S5: repeats that theme. It was Hezekiah who stopped the upper 746 00:40:52,330 --> 00:40:55,000 S5: outlet of the waters of Gijon and directed them to 747 00:40:55,030 --> 00:40:57,910 S5: the west side of the city of David. This tunnel 748 00:40:57,910 --> 00:41:01,270 S5: was an amazing engineering feat, built to provide security for 749 00:41:01,270 --> 00:41:03,850 S5: the city. It was part of a series of elaborate 750 00:41:03,850 --> 00:41:08,640 S5: preparations to protect Jerusalem from attack by Assyria. The same 751 00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:12,450 S5: chapter of Second Chronicles records the other defensive measures taken 752 00:41:12,450 --> 00:41:16,650 S5: by King Hezekiah and his military advisers. Now, when Hezekiah 753 00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:19,140 S5: saw that Sennacherib had come and that he intended to 754 00:41:19,170 --> 00:41:22,410 S5: make war on Jerusalem, he decided with his officers and 755 00:41:22,410 --> 00:41:25,080 S5: his warriors to cut off the supply of water from 756 00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,469 S5: the springs which were outside the city, and they helped him, 757 00:41:28,469 --> 00:41:30,960 S5: and he took courage and rebuilt all the wall that 758 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:33,660 S5: had been broken down, and erected towers on it, and 759 00:41:33,660 --> 00:41:36,810 S5: built another outside wall, and made weapons and shields in 760 00:41:36,810 --> 00:41:40,830 S5: great number. You can see the checklist of military preparations. 761 00:41:40,860 --> 00:41:45,839 S5: New pool ready? Check. Tunnel almost complete? Check. New walls 762 00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:50,760 S5: and towers. Ready? Check. Bows, arrows, sling stone shields and swords. 763 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:54,390 S5: All prepared? Check. Once the tunnel was finished and its 764 00:41:54,420 --> 00:41:57,569 S5: water flowing into the city, they would be ready. They 765 00:41:57,570 --> 00:42:00,030 S5: were so excited when the two groups of workers finally 766 00:42:00,030 --> 00:42:02,790 S5: connected with one another, that they chiseled a plaque into 767 00:42:02,790 --> 00:42:06,029 S5: the tunnel recording the event. The water flowed from the 768 00:42:06,030 --> 00:42:09,719 S5: source of the pool for 1200 cubits, and 100 cubits 769 00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:11,910 S5: was the height of the stone over the head of 770 00:42:11,910 --> 00:42:16,200 S5: the stonecutters. This plaque was discovered in the 1800s, cut 771 00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:19,950 S5: from the rock and taken to the Istanbul Archaeology Museum, 772 00:42:19,950 --> 00:42:23,520 S5: where it is still on display today. A replica has 773 00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:26,850 S5: since been fashioned and placed inside the tunnel to show 774 00:42:26,850 --> 00:42:30,299 S5: visitors where the original carving was discovered. The people of 775 00:42:30,300 --> 00:42:33,090 S5: Judah had done everything possible to get ready for the 776 00:42:33,090 --> 00:42:36,270 S5: coming battle with the Assyrians, or at least that's what 777 00:42:36,270 --> 00:42:39,300 S5: they thought. But then the prophet Isaiah stood to address 778 00:42:39,300 --> 00:42:42,000 S5: the crowd. He first took note of the arrival of 779 00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:46,109 S5: the Assyrian forces with their chariots and horses. Your choices. 780 00:42:46,110 --> 00:42:48,690 S5: Valleys are full of chariots, and the horsemen take up 781 00:42:48,690 --> 00:42:52,739 S5: fixed positions at the gate. Isaiah then reminded them that 782 00:42:52,739 --> 00:42:55,740 S5: a large number of Judah's cities and towns had already 783 00:42:55,739 --> 00:42:59,730 S5: been captured by the Assyrians, and he removed the defenses 784 00:42:59,730 --> 00:43:03,690 S5: of Judah. But Isaiah reserved his greatest rebuke for how 785 00:43:03,690 --> 00:43:07,640 S5: the people had responded to the impending threat. In that day, 786 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:10,190 S5: you depended on the weapons of the house of the forest, 787 00:43:10,190 --> 00:43:12,200 S5: and you saw that the breaches in the wall of 788 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:14,630 S5: the city of David were many, and you collected the 789 00:43:14,630 --> 00:43:17,569 S5: waters of the lower pool. Then you counted the houses 790 00:43:17,570 --> 00:43:21,440 S5: of Jerusalem, and you tore down houses to fortify the wall, 791 00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:24,050 S5: and you made a reservoir between the two walls for 792 00:43:24,050 --> 00:43:27,410 S5: the waters of the old pool. What exactly are you 793 00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:31,100 S5: trusting in to protect yourself from the Assyrians, your weapons, 794 00:43:31,100 --> 00:43:35,960 S5: your new walls, your updated water supply. Isaiah ends by 795 00:43:35,989 --> 00:43:39,710 S5: focusing on the one item that people hadn't thought to strengthen. 796 00:43:39,950 --> 00:43:42,229 S5: But you did not depend on him who made it. 797 00:43:42,260 --> 00:43:45,410 S5: Nor did you take into consideration him who planned it 798 00:43:45,410 --> 00:43:48,620 S5: long ago. They had been so busy focusing on how 799 00:43:48,620 --> 00:43:51,410 S5: they could stop the Assyrians, they forgot to turn to 800 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:54,410 S5: the Lord to ask for his help. In fact, it 801 00:43:54,410 --> 00:43:58,100 S5: wasn't until the Assyrians reached the outskirts of Jerusalem and 802 00:43:58,100 --> 00:44:01,310 S5: handed their terms of surrender to Hezekiah that he finally 803 00:44:01,310 --> 00:44:05,220 S5: went to the temple to seek God's assistance, and in response, 804 00:44:05,250 --> 00:44:09,569 S5: God sent the angel of the Lord to kill 185,000 805 00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:14,070 S5: Assyrian soldiers. The city was saved, but it wasn't because 806 00:44:14,070 --> 00:44:18,780 S5: of their weapons or their walls or their new water supply. Well, 807 00:44:18,780 --> 00:44:21,480 S5: we've reached the spot where the original inscription was carved 808 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,060 S5: into the wall of the tunnel. As you can see, 809 00:44:24,060 --> 00:44:26,790 S5: they've placed this copy of the original, along with an 810 00:44:26,790 --> 00:44:30,630 S5: explanatory plaque here on the wall. We're almost to the 811 00:44:30,630 --> 00:44:32,550 S5: end of the tunnel, but as we get ready to 812 00:44:32,580 --> 00:44:35,610 S5: climb out, dry off our feet and look over the 813 00:44:35,610 --> 00:44:39,180 S5: I hiked Hezekiah Tunnel t shirts that are offered for sale. 814 00:44:39,210 --> 00:44:42,690 S5: What spiritual lesson can we carry away with us from 815 00:44:42,690 --> 00:44:46,320 S5: our time here in the tunnel? Looking at the reproduction 816 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,910 S5: of the inscription carved by Hezekiah's workers more than 2700 817 00:44:50,910 --> 00:44:54,270 S5: years ago, perhaps the key lesson for us is the 818 00:44:54,270 --> 00:44:58,710 S5: one raised by Isaiah in chapter 22. Everyone faces problems, 819 00:44:58,710 --> 00:45:02,840 S5: difficulties and challenges in life, but what sets people apart 820 00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:06,170 S5: is where they turn for answers to those problems. They 821 00:45:06,170 --> 00:45:08,390 S5: can try to do it all by themselves. We just 822 00:45:08,390 --> 00:45:12,650 S5: need more weapons, bigger walls, more dependable water. Or they 823 00:45:12,650 --> 00:45:14,989 S5: can choose to seek out the God of the universe 824 00:45:14,989 --> 00:45:18,560 S5: who has promised to never leave us nor forsake us. 825 00:45:18,620 --> 00:45:21,740 S5: It took a while, but thankfully Hezekiah and the people 826 00:45:21,739 --> 00:45:25,520 S5: of Jerusalem finally turned to God and discovered he didn't 827 00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:29,600 S5: need their weapons, walls, or water to fight his battles. 828 00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:33,050 S5: So how about you? What enemy are you facing today? 829 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:35,719 S5: You can choose to wear yourself out, hoping you can 830 00:45:35,719 --> 00:45:38,750 S5: do enough to make it through the crisis. Or you 831 00:45:38,750 --> 00:45:40,730 S5: can choose to turn your troubles over to the God 832 00:45:40,730 --> 00:45:44,060 S5: of the universe and let him handle them. The choice 833 00:45:44,060 --> 00:45:47,060 S5: is yours, but the plaque on the wall of Hezekiah's 834 00:45:47,090 --> 00:45:50,000 S5: tunnel is a good reminder to let God resolve your 835 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:54,320 S5: problems and spare yourself a lot of pain, aggravation, and 836 00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:57,320 S5: heartache in the process. And if you'd like to see 837 00:45:57,350 --> 00:46:00,710 S5: photos of the original plaque in the Istanbul Museum or 838 00:46:00,710 --> 00:46:04,759 S5: photos of the copy from inside Hezekiah's tunnel in Jerusalem. Well, 839 00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,009 S5: just head over to the land and the book Facebook 840 00:46:07,010 --> 00:46:09,710 S5: page where I've posted them, and you'll be able to 841 00:46:09,710 --> 00:46:10,850 S5: see what they look like. 842 00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,520 S1: Nothing like seeing that for yourself. Thank you for posting 843 00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:16,670 S1: those photos, Charlie, for doing that research and bringing this 844 00:46:16,670 --> 00:46:19,430 S1: story to life for us. Our website is The Land 845 00:46:19,430 --> 00:46:21,710 S1: and the book org, and we're anxious for you to 846 00:46:21,739 --> 00:46:24,589 S1: visit there because that's the gateway to everything we have 847 00:46:24,590 --> 00:46:27,590 S1: to offer you, including our podcast. It's a great way 848 00:46:27,590 --> 00:46:29,900 S1: to stay connected, to share us with friends who aren't 849 00:46:29,900 --> 00:46:33,050 S1: able to listen to the broadcast on a traditional radio station, 850 00:46:33,050 --> 00:46:34,850 S1: and a neat way for you to hear it all 851 00:46:34,850 --> 00:46:38,060 S1: again yourself. Check out the podcast at the Land and 852 00:46:38,060 --> 00:46:41,900 S1: the book.org. Looks like our time is just about up. 853 00:46:41,900 --> 00:46:43,670 S1: I want to say thank you to you for listening 854 00:46:43,700 --> 00:46:46,280 S1: to this station, for carrying the broadcast to our host, 855 00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:49,730 S1: Charlie Dyer, and to our producer, Dan Anderson. I'm John Geiger. 856 00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:52,580 S1: The land and the book is a production of Moody Radio, 857 00:46:52,610 --> 00:46:55,040 S1: a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.