S1: Ordinarily, you ask the questions on open line and I
S1: do my best to answer them, but today will be
S1: a little different. Thanks for joining me at the Radio
S1: Kitchen table for our Bible study across America. This is
S1: open line with me. Doctor Michael Ray Zelnick, academic dean
S1: of Moody Bible Institute and professor of Jewish Studies and Bible.
S1: Today's program is prerecorded so I could share a special
S1: conversation with you that I had with Doctor George Sweeting.
S1: He was the sixth president of Moody Bible Institute. Doc,
S1: as I called him, would have turned 100 on October 1st, 2024.
S1: He passed away on September 10th. And I thought a
S1: good way to honor this man, whom I respect and
S1: view as my role model was to re-air a conversation
S1: we had back in 2019 when he was 95 years old.
S1: We talked about his book, The Pursuit of Excellence, which
S1: you can learn more about on our website, openline radio.org.
S1: Our team included producer Tricia McMillan and engineers Joel Swan
S1: and Courtney Young. I recommend you get yourself a cup
S1: of coffee and settle in with your Bible for a
S1: very special open line. My guest today is no stranger
S1: to Moody Radio. In fact, the first time I ever
S1: was on Moody Radio was a program back in 1974.
S1: I was a student, and he had me share my
S1: faith story on his radio program called Moody Presents. I
S1: am so grateful and happy to have Doctor George Sweeting
S1: join me right now. As I said, he was the
S1: sixth president of Moody as well as the Chancellor of
S1: the school. Today he is Chancellor Emeritus. He's an author,
S1: a Bible teacher and preacher. He's my role model and
S1: to my amazement and truly my delight. He is my
S1: dear friend. Welcome, doc.
S2: Well, thank you, Doctor Redelmeier. Wonderful to be with you.
S1: I don't think you've ever called me that before. It's
S1: just Michael.
S2: All right. I'll call you Michael. That's great.
S1: I'm so glad. So, so very glad to have you
S1: with me today. Because there's. You wrote a book recently,
S1: and I think it is so special. I've really enjoyed
S1: reading it. It's a wonderful Bible study resource. It's called
S1: The Pursuit of Excellence. And even before I read it,
S1: I was struck by the title. And the reason the
S1: title struck me is that when you were president of
S1: Moody and I was a student, you would frequently remind
S1: us that there was a reason for the very high
S1: demand that Moody education had of us. You would tell us,
S1: pressure produces. Do you remember saying?
S2: Oh, I do. Pressure from the book of James?
S1: Yeah. I always thought when I was a student, I thought,
S1: pressure produces a straitjacket or something. You know, there was
S1: a lot of pressure, but you were reminding us that
S1: the demand and expectation of excellence is produced through pressure.
S1: God brings pressure into our lives to develop us into
S1: what we need to be, to make us the people
S1: he wants us to be so that we can pursue
S1: excellence for him. And so, uh, pressure produces that, and
S1: I so appreciate it. As I looked at your book,
S1: that's what it was going. So let's if it's okay,
S1: we can talk about your book.
S2: Yes. Well, you were talking about pressure and that's James,
S2: one of the trying of your faith works. Patience. Let
S2: patience have her perfect work, her complete work. So that's
S2: really where the idea of pressure produces comes from. So yes,
S2: the book is all about excellence and how to achieve it.
S2: And the first or second.
S1: Let me just ask you, what prompted you? I mean, doc,
S1: you've written a lot of books. Uh, and I know
S1: I spoke last. Oh, almost two years ago, when you
S1: were stepping down from being the director of seniors, uh,
S1: Chain of Lakes Community Bible Church, and. And you were
S1: the pastor of seniors there. And I said to you,
S1: you're going to retire. What are you going to do?
S1: And you said, I got some books to write. And
S1: I thought, other people just go and relax. And you
S1: went and wrote a book. And what made you think
S1: that this is a book you needed to write?
S2: Well, I love to serve. I love to work. Uh,
S2: work is to me a wonderful privilege. God made us
S2: to work, and so I can't ever think of retirement.
S2: In fact, I don't believe in retirement. I'm 95 years
S2: old now. 95 years young now. And very grateful that
S2: I can still find something to do to serve and
S2: honor the Lord. So.
S1: And why was this topic so, uh, important to you?
S2: Well, it was one of my themes, really, while I
S2: was president of Moody Bible Institute. I remember I had
S2: a little sketch made of D.L. Moody, and across it
S2: I had him put in the word excellence. And I said,
S2: I would like that in every area of the work here.
S2: We strive to excel for the glory of God. So
S2: it was a theme that was in my mind and heart,
S2: and I felt necessary in doing the work of the Lord,
S2: that we do it the best way humanly possible to
S2: bring credit and honor to him.
S1: So now the book has nine marks of excellence, and
S1: I found it. Let me just say to anyone listening,
S1: this is a great book to get the pursuit of excellence.
S1: It's a book to study. It's a book to put
S1: some quality time in reading and to apply it. Uh,
S1: they just it's it's today we're only going to touch
S1: on a bit of the wisdom of this book, but
S1: I just am so grateful that it's there for us
S1: to study. You know, I've read other books of yours
S1: that have been very meaningful to me, but this one,
S1: I thought, this is a great Bible study guide. And
S1: so I'm really grateful for it. So let's start with
S1: the first mark of Christian excellence that you talk about.
S1: And you say that we have to begin our walk
S1: with the Lord by faith. Uh, we have to put
S1: faith in the Lord Jesus as our Redeemer. And you
S1: challenge us to faith as one of the marks of excellence. Uh,
S1: so I guess what I want to know is, why
S1: is faithful faith so essential for, uh, excellence? And why
S1: is Caleb such a great role model?
S2: The second chapter is faith, the power to move mountains.
S2: And of course, the Bible says in Romans ten, faith
S2: comes by hearing the message. And the message is heard
S2: through the word about Christ. And so we start by faith.
S2: That's the starting point for the Christian life. It was
S2: true in my family. My father and mother immigrated from
S2: Scotland to Haledon, new Jersey in 1923. I was born
S2: in 1924. My older brother and sister were born in Scotland,
S2: but I was born in the United States. It was
S2: a little joke in the family that I was the
S2: first one eligible in the family to be president of
S2: the United States someday, and we'd all laugh heartily. Well,
S2: you got to.
S1: Be president of Moody, so that's.
S2: Good. But I thank the Lord. Uh, the Lord was
S2: very gracious to me, but, uh, uh, They came from
S2: Scotland and things were going so well. They thought it
S2: was the land of milk and honey. And then in
S2: 1928 the Great Depression began. My father was a builder,
S2: an engineer, builder of bridges and large buildings, and so
S2: he immediately lost his job. All building stopped in 1928
S2: and 29, and no major building went on for years.
S2: He couldn't find work, even. In fact, the only job
S2: he could find was as a night watchman. So we
S2: would read about the children of Israel. We'd read about
S2: their journeys of faith. We'd read about how God led
S2: them from place to place. We read about people like Caleb,
S2: Caleb the Conqueror, Caleb and Joshua believed God. They had
S2: faith in God. the other ten of the people who
S2: went to look over the land, they said, we can't
S2: go there. It's too difficult. The people are big. We're
S2: like grasshoppers in their sight. We can't do it. But
S2: Caleb and Joshua said, we can't do it, but God can.
S2: And so they trusted the Lord. And they said, by
S2: faith we're going to take the land. And God blessed them.
S2: And God did that. He gave them the land. So
S2: we begin by faith.
S1: Let me ask you. The Bible teaches that faith can
S1: be a spiritual gift. I mean, we're all supposed to
S1: have faith, but some people have a special measure of
S1: faith to to see great things. I think D.L. Moody
S1: was a man of great faith. Uh, as an example
S1: of that, who saw all the great things that God
S1: could do. How do you feel? Do you think that
S1: God has given you that as a spiritual gift?
S2: Yes, I think so. Hebrews says, without Faith. It's impossible
S2: to please God. You can build a house without faith.
S2: You can get married. Without faith, you could earn thousands
S2: of dollars. Without faith. But without faith you can't please God. Period. Yeah.
S2: And so it begins by faith, and it continues by faith,
S2: and it concludes by faith. It's faith from beginning to end.
S1: I agree. Trusting in what God can do, not what
S1: we can accomplish. Yeah. Yes.
S2: It's not what we can do. It's what God can do.
S1: Exactly. Okay. Now, one of the things I think has
S1: been lacking in many people. I think that's why we
S1: have a problem with with excellence in the body of
S1: Christ today, is that sometimes we have too many people
S1: who are pursuing grandiose schemes and big ideas without character.
S1: And you say the second mark of excellence. The second
S1: essential is character. Character always follows faith. It's the fruit
S1: of our desire to please God. So let's talk about character. What's.
S1: What is character? What's the role that it plays?
S2: Going back to D.L. Moody and D.L. Moody had some
S2: very wonderful sayings, but he used to say, this character
S2: is what you are in the dark. In other words,
S2: he was saying characters. The real you. I had another
S2: professor at Moody and Moody Bible Institute has always excelled.
S2: Our faculty excelled. It does today. It always has. But P.B. Fitzwater,
S2: who was one of the great teachers at Moody, he said,
S2: character is the sum and total of a person's choices.
S2: In other words, you're making choices every day and you
S2: are what you choose to be. Character is the sum
S2: and total of a person's choices. So it's not what
S2: you dream. It's not dreams, but it's choices that counts.
S2: Proverbs 423 says, above all else, guard your heart, because
S2: all you do flows from your heart. Joseph made the
S2: right choices. He chose first to be pure. Potiphar's wife
S2: had evil designs on him and she tried to seduce
S2: him to immorality. And when you face the flesh, there's
S2: one thing to do and that is to retreat. That's
S2: to flee. And Joseph is the example. He grabbed his
S2: hat and ran. And that's how you treat the flesh.
S2: But left.
S1: His coat.
S2: Apparently some people think it's you do it with the
S2: head or you. You do it with your affections, the heart.
S2: But it's not the head. It's not the heart, it's
S2: your heels. And the Bible says Paul, writing to Timothy, said,
S2: flee lusts. Flee. So when it comes to the flesh,
S2: you flee. You know, if you were on a railroad
S2: track and the train's coming down at you, you don't
S2: bulge your biceps and say, I'm ready. Come on. You
S2: get off the track. Yeah. And so the Bible simply
S2: tells us that we're to have nothing to do with
S2: the flesh. We're to put on Christ and make no provision,
S2: no plans for the lust of the flesh. That was
S2: the verse, by the way, that the Lord used to
S2: win Augustine to himself. He was immorally involved, and a
S2: friend spoke to him about Christ. And he was reading
S2: the book of Romans. And he read Romans 1314, put
S2: on Jesus, and don't make plans to fulfill the lusts
S2: of the flesh, and that was his solution.
S1: Well, that's one part of character we're going to pick
S1: up and talk a little bit more about character in
S1: just a moment. Uh, but what we're doing now is
S1: I am having the great privilege of talking with Doctor
S1: George Sweeting. My name is Michael Reinicke. You're listening to
S1: Open Line, and there's much, much more to talk about,
S1: so stay with us. More great conversation about the pursuit
S1: of excellence will follow. Don't go away. Open line is
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S1: honest answers from Scripture about the things that matter most.
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S1: Open Line radio.org. When autumn rolls around, people are always
S1: interested in the Jewish Fall Holy days, that's why. Chosen
S1: People Ministries is offering a free booklet titled Celebrate Israel's
S1: High Holidays. This booklet explores the fall Jewish High holidays
S1: of Rosh Hashanah, the Feast of Trumpets in the Bible
S1: called the New Year today, Yom Kippur, the Day of Atonement,
S1: and Sukkot, the Feast of Booths. Don't miss out, just
S1: go to the Openline website, Openline radio, or scroll down
S1: and click on the link that says A Free gift
S1: from Chosen People Ministries that will take you to a
S1: page where you can sign up for your very own
S1: copy of Celebrate Israel's High Holidays. Welcome back to Open
S1: Line with me, Michael Ray Dolnick. This is a special
S1: pre-recorded program from 2019 when I talked with the sixth
S1: president of Moody Bible Institute, Doctor George Sweeting. He was
S1: a dear friend of mine, but much more. He was
S1: my ultimate role model of a great husband, dad, godly
S1: leader and servant of the Lord. He passed away on
S1: September 10th and would have turned 100 on October 1st.
S1: You can learn more about Doctor Sweeting, his book The
S1: Pursuit of Excellence, and also link to a special radio program,
S1: Remembering Doc at our website Openline radio.org. You can also
S1: find past programs and leave your Bible question there. Openline radio.org.
S1: Now I am having the great fun and privilege of
S1: talking with Doctor George Sweeting, the Chancellor Emeritus of Moody
S1: Bible Institute and the author of The Pursuit of Excellence.
S1: We're going through different marks of excellence that God calls
S1: us to so we can serve him better. And, doc,
S1: you were just talking about, uh, the issue of character
S1: and that Joseph exemplifies character. Now we know he was
S1: a man that was committed to purity and and God
S1: used that. But he also had other qualities of character
S1: that came out.
S2: Yes. Well, I'd begin with the character of purity because
S2: Joseph chose to be pure. So many people say when
S2: they're involved in some sinful situation. Well, I'm not hurting anyone.
S2: That's false. You are hurting someone. You're hurting yourself. But
S2: you're hurting God because Joseph said, how could I do
S2: such a thing and sin against God? So in all
S2: of these situations, you are hurting yourself and it's sin
S2: against God. We do hurt others and we hurt ourselves.
S2: Joseph decided to flee and he was not only one
S2: who wanted to be pure, but he determined that he
S2: would be honest. Proverbs 11 three says, the honesty of
S2: the godly will guide them, but dishonesty will destroy them.
S2: Very simply put. Honesty builds. Dishonesty destroys. A Proverbs four
S2: again says, keep your heart carefully, for out of it
S2: spring the issues of life. Joseph found favor with his
S2: owner and with God because he could be trusted. He
S2: was an honest person and the Lord used him. He
S2: was also a humble person. His life was one of serving.
S2: He found grace in the eyes of his owner. As
S2: a boy. He served his dad, Jacob, and then he
S2: served Potiphar. And then he served Pharaoh. But you see,
S2: most of all, he was serving God. He determined that
S2: God was the one that he wanted to please. And
S2: so Joseph was not only pure, he chose to be pure,
S2: but he also chose to be honest.
S1: You know, one of the most interesting things, as I
S1: read the Joseph story to me is that it goes
S1: from his brother Solomon to slavery, and then he gets
S1: falsely accused by Potiphar's wife, and then he gets thrown
S1: in jail. And every time it gets worse, there's this
S1: interesting phrase that the Bible says of him, and the
S1: Lord was with him. And I am so struck by that,
S1: that so often we think that God's not with us
S1: and when bad things are happening. But Joseph was always
S1: aware of it, and that's why I think he was
S1: such a man of character.
S2: Because, yes, because he.
S1: Knew God was with him and everything.
S2: It's really amazing. But, uh, trial after trial, his brothers
S2: were half brothers. And so you can understand how jealousy
S2: comes into that Situation, but they didn't like him. They
S2: called him the dreamer. They wanted to get rid of him. They.
S2: They threw him into a pit. They sold him to
S2: the Ishmaelites. So really, uh, everything seemed to go wrong
S2: for Joseph. He was accused by his master's wife. He
S2: was thrown into jail. And yet, as you just said
S2: a moment ago, repeatedly, it says the Lord was with him.
S2: With him all the way. Yeah. And what a remarkable
S2: thing it is to know that Joseph excelled because he
S2: was pure, because he chose to be honest, because he
S2: chose to serve. He was a humble, God filled man
S2: who wanted to please the Lord.
S1: So one of the funnier things I once read in
S1: a book on how to interpret the Bible, it said,
S1: you know, if you read the story of Joseph and
S1: you think Joseph is a role model, you're not reading
S1: the story, right? I think First Corinthians ten says, God
S1: has given us all these stories for our education, for
S1: our instruction. These things are written for your instruction. And
S1: of course, Joseph is a role model of excellence, of
S1: excellent character. And I'm so glad you included him. But, uh,
S1: there's another aspect of excellence. And one of the things
S1: that that one step that people take is they say,
S1: I want to develop my character. Yes. But then they
S1: don't do anything. And you say it's not enough to
S1: have excellent character to be to pursue excellence, we have
S1: to take action. I have a quote here. Scripture challenges us,
S1: challenges us to act. We must be doers of the
S1: word and not hearers only. In turn, God promises that
S1: a doer of the word will be blessed in what
S1: he does. Why do so many people who really love
S1: the Lord, uh, fail to be people of action? What
S1: do you what do you think can motivate people to action?
S2: Sometimes it's fear. It's hard to know exactly what it is.
S2: I think of Henrietta mears. She used to say it's
S2: hard to steer a parked car, but once you get
S2: it moving, it's easy to steer it. And so she
S2: calls for action. She calls for us to do what
S2: James 122 says. Do not merely listen to God's word,
S2: but do what it says. Ecclesiastes 122 whatever your hand
S2: finds to do, do it. Do it how? Do it
S2: with all your might. Joshua 2415. Choose for yourself today,
S2: this day, whom you will serve. You see, Joshua called
S2: for a decision. Choose today. Choose now. Action. There has
S2: to be a place Moody used to say. People are saying,
S2: I'm aiming to do this, he said. You've been aiming
S2: all your life. It's time to fire. And so there's
S2: a time for action. And so after observing thousands of
S2: college students for many decades, I've noticed a common trait
S2: that makes those who excel, and that is this a
S2: burning desire to do something that will make a difference
S2: in their life and in the lives of others.
S1: It's like that sometimes it's it's just time to get
S1: off your chair and go do something. That's right. Yeah.
S2: Now is the day of salvation.
S1: Start doing something for the Lord. Uh, I think that
S1: that activity for the Lord. I mean, we don't want
S1: to just have lots of motion, but we do want
S1: to serve God towards a goal. And action is crucial. Uh, now,
S1: here's this is this strikes me so much of you personally.
S1: You point out that single mindedness for a lifetime is
S1: a must. Single minded. I want to know. You say
S1: single mindedness is is a, uh, a characteristic of excellence?
S1: What are you single minded about, doc?
S2: Well, very early in life, I wrote out my first goals,
S2: and I wrote first. Bring glory to God. I was
S2: on my knees in my bedroom, an unheated bedroom, and I.
S2: That night I had yielded my life to Christ. And
S2: so I wrote down, first of all, bring glory to God. Secondly,
S2: I wrote down, uh, develop the inner life. Now, I
S2: don't know what I know about the inner life, but
S2: I knew it was important. I knew it was more
S2: important than the outer life. And so I wrote down
S2: cultivate the Inner Life, and then I wrote down thirdly,
S2: disciple as many other people as humanly possible. And I
S2: don't know where all of that came from. I'm sure
S2: it was the lessons I heard many times, consciously and subconsciously.
S2: And then I wrote down, fourthly, when as many to
S2: Christ as humanly possible. Those four goals were written when
S2: I was about 15. I'll never forget them. I still
S2: refer to them and I still go back and repeat them.
S1: Yeah, that's your single minded in your determination to serve God.
S1: And it's it's one of the reasons why now, at 95,
S1: you remain my role model because I want to be
S1: like you when I grow up.
S2: Well thank you. You know, Moody himself said.
S1: We're going to take a break here and then we're
S1: going to come back. But, uh, if you're listening, I
S1: hope you are. I'll be back with Doctor Sweeting in
S1: just a moment. We're talking about the pursuit of excellence
S1: for the Lord. So stay right where you are. There's
S1: more of this important discussion coming up straight ahead. Don't
S1: go away. We're so glad that Febc partners with Open
S1: Line with Doctor Michael Radonich, bringing the Febc mailbag every week.
S1: Learn how Far East Broadcasting Company is taking Christ to
S1: the world at febc. Org on their weekly podcast. Until
S1: all have heard with Ed Cannon, you'll hear stories of
S1: lives changed by Messiah all across the globe. Again, you
S1: can hear the podcast when you visit febc.org that's febc. Org.
S1: Welcome back to Open Line. So glad that you're listening today.
S1: It's it's one of my great joys today that I
S1: get to talk with Doctor George Sweeting about his wonderful book,
S1: The Pursuit of Excellence. It's a great biblical study. It
S1: covers in this book nine qualities, nine Characteristics of excellence
S1: and this. Thus far we've covered faith and character and
S1: action and single mindedness. And now we're coming to one
S1: that I think doc has, uh, really epitomized your ministry
S1: more than anything else through the years. And that is love. Uh,
S1: it's one of the essential qualities that are needed for excellence.
S1: And I think you even wrote a whole book about
S1: love once. The greatest of these. Right? Uh, and I've
S1: always I remember that was the first sermon I ever
S1: heard you preach. Uh, you you spoke about the importance
S1: of love. And so I think you're right. It is
S1: one of the essential qualities of excellence. Why? Why is
S1: that so important?
S2: Well, early in life, I read a book by John
S2: James McConkie on the power of God's love. And as
S2: I read it, I fell in love with First Corinthians
S2: 13 one through 13, and it just, uh, spoke to
S2: me so much. And then I think of what Jude
S2: had to say. Jude says, and it's only one chapter.
S2: Verse 21, keep yourselves in God's love as you wait
S2: for the mercy of our Lord Jesus to bring you
S2: to eternal life. So we're we're we have a responsibility
S2: of keeping ourselves in God's love. Uh, I write the
S2: sixth chapter, call it Love the Mender of Souls. And
S2: the theme of this book is excellence. And Paul calls
S2: God's love the excellent way, in fact, that first Corinthians 12,
S2: verse 31, he says, and now I show unto you
S2: a more excellent way. And then he begins to define
S2: that excellent way. It's the way of God's love. And
S2: in verses one through three he points out the need
S2: for it. He said, it's greater than speaking eloquently. It's
S2: greater than faith, it's greater than understanding mysteries. And the
S2: verses four through eight, he mentions the traits of this love.
S2: So this love is patient. This love is kind. This
S2: love is not self-seeking. This love doesn't behave itself unseemly.
S2: This love bears all things. This love believes all things.
S2: This love never fails. And then he says, and now
S2: abideth faith, hope, love. But the greatest, the greatest, the
S2: greatest of these is love. So God's love in you
S2: and in me is a major trait that he wants
S2: us to have. It's a trait of excellence. It was
S2: true of D.L. Moody. God's love transformed D.L. Moody and
S2: changed his life completely.
S1: I think when I meet people more than any other
S1: issue in their life, I think people would like to
S1: be assured of unconditional love. And and I think that's
S1: why it's such a key to ministry, to actually love
S1: people when you're ministering to them. It leads to an
S1: excellent ministry because people are desperate for authentic love might
S1: be confronting, love might be unconditional and unconditionally loving people,
S1: even correcting them. But always loving I just I that
S1: strikes me as such an important part of effective ministry.
S2: Oh yes. And D.L. Moody had that when he stood
S2: before the people in the old Moody church. It wasn't
S2: called the Moody Church then it was the LaSalle Street Church.
S2: But they said, you felt God's love. You. You just
S2: couldn't escape it. They they called it a house of
S2: love back in the early days because they they loved God,
S2: but they loved each other. And then that love moved
S2: out to a lost world that needed to know God's love.
S2: And so this. This dominated the life of Moody. And
S2: he prayed earnestly that the Lord would make him a
S2: man who would overflow with his love. God's love became
S2: his main concern.
S1: Well, I think that if more people knew how much
S1: God loved them, it would just revolutionize people's lives. And
S1: that's why it's such an important mark. But I have
S1: to move on because I want to hit all these
S1: nine marks of excellence. And so you've we've talked about
S1: a number of them, but one other mark of excellence
S1: is one that we don't want. None of us looks
S1: for it. It's called suffering. You say how in the
S1: world suffering is. Sometimes you write God's way of bringing
S1: us back. How? I mean, none of us wants to suffer.
S1: How could that be a mark of excellence?
S2: And yet it's all through Scripture, isn't it? Yes. Peter
S2: says in first Peter 510, The God who called you
S2: to his eternal glory, after you have suffered a little while,
S2: will restore you and make you strong. And make you
S2: firm and make you steadfast. And I've often thought if
S2: God exempted Christians from suffering, Christianity would be an insurance
S2: policy for a pain free ride. And that's not so.
S2: We're going to know something about suffering. Uh, the great
S2: British preacher, Baptist preacher, Charles Haddon Spurgeon said, I owe
S2: more to the fire and to the hammer and to
S2: the file than anything else in the Lord's workshop, and
S2: so suffering was part of it. Here's second Corinthians four, where,
S2: hard pressed, Paul said on every side. He said, but
S2: we're not crushed. He said, we're perplexed, but we're not
S2: in despair. Persecuted but not abandoned. Struck down, but not destroyed.
S2: Paul experienced much suffering, and yet it is through suffering.
S2: The Lord teaches us, and through suffering that we're made usable.
S2: God allows us to suffer. So.
S1: In my experience, a person I love and esteem more
S1: than probably anyone else. There's a person and this person
S1: has had cancer three times. Yeah. Uh, and I always wondered,
S1: you know, someone once said, uh, what doesn't kill us
S1: makes you stronger, right? And then I heard someone else say,
S1: what doesn't kill us makes you bitter. That's not true.
S1: But what? What this I found is this is a
S1: person who is more determined to do the will of
S1: God and pursue him. And it's because of saying God
S1: has given me life. I've suffered, but he's given me life.
S1: And now I want to do all I can for him.
S1: There's no other person like that. And it's the suffering,
S1: I think, that has brought that out. It's hard for
S1: us to imagine, but I think it's true.
S2: No. It's true. Personally, in my experience, while I was
S2: a student at Moody, I was afflicted with testicular cancer
S2: and went to the Swedish Covenant Hospital, had two major
S2: surgeries and a doctor, Titus Johnson, the school doctor who,
S2: and doctor Titus Johnson was a great missionary doctor. He said, George,
S2: I don't think you'll see the year out. And then
S2: he said to me, he said, I don't think you'll
S2: ever have children. I said, well, you're a cheerful guy.
S2: And but I remember in the hospital I said, Lord,
S2: this bed is my altar. And I want to take
S2: the flesh hooks of, of of discipline and determination and
S2: lay it into the sacrifice and adjusted to the center
S2: of the altar. I want what you have. If you
S2: want me to live, fine. If you want me to die, fine.
S2: I want what you want. And I'll never forget that
S2: time of suffering. But it was part of the Lord
S2: teaching me things that I needed to learn. It's amazing what.
S1: God did, though. I mean, how many kids, how many grandchildren?
S2: 14.
S1: 14 grandkids. And your four kids, right?
S2: Yeah. That's right. Four sons. I'll never forget when Hilda
S2: thought she was pregnant and I said, well, honey, it
S2: can't be, but I'll call Doctor Johnson. And I called him.
S2: I was a student at Gordon-conwell Seminary. Then I said,
S2: Doctor Johnson, my wife thinks she's pregnant. He said, well,
S2: take her to a doctor. I said, but you said
S2: she would never have children. So he said, what do
S2: I know? I'm just a doctor. I'm practicing. And and
S2: we we laughed. But the Lord has been good. God was.
S1: So gracious. Wow.
S2: And we're grateful.
S1: Yeah. Okay. Uh, we're going to we're going to take
S1: a little break, uh, and we're going to come right
S1: back with more of our discussion about the pursuit of excellence.
S1: Lots of great stories in here, biblical stories and stories
S1: from Doctor Sweeting. You're listening to Open Line with Michael
S1: Radonich and my guest today, Doctor George Sweeting. Stay with us.
S1: Sometimes we want to read the Bible but don't know
S1: how to get the most out of it. My friend,
S1: Moody Professor Doctor Jim Coakley, has written 14 Fresh Ways
S1: to Enjoy the Bible, a book that helps us understand
S1: the full riches of Scripture by giving 14 practical principles
S1: to bring them to life. Request your copy today with
S1: a gift of any amount to open line, call (888) 644-7122
S1: or visit Open Line radio.org. Welcome back to a special
S1: pre-recorded edition of Open Line. My name is Michael Ray Dolnick.
S1: I'm so glad you're listening. Today we're re-airing a 2019
S1: conversation I had with Doctor George Sweeting, the sixth president
S1: of Moody Bible Institute. He was president when I was
S1: a student. He passed away on September 10th at age
S1: 99 and is someone I considered a dear friend and
S1: role model. Thank you Michael, I am so glad for
S1: this book, The Pursuit of Excellence, one of the great
S1: Bible study books that you could ever have. We're going
S1: over nine characteristics of Excellence, and so far we've covered faith,
S1: character and action, single mindedness, love. And then the hard
S1: part suffering. And there's three more. And I don't think
S1: we're going to have time to cover each of these
S1: three in depth. So the seventh is prayer. And the
S1: eighth is wisdom. But this is the one. The final
S1: characteristic that you mention is staying power endurance of ending. Well,
S1: and again, this makes me think of another book of
S1: yours that I found very encouraging, which is you wrote
S1: a book, How to Begin the Christian Life, and you
S1: wrote a book on how to grow.
S2: How to continue the Christian life. Yeah.
S1: And then the last one that I found when I
S1: turned 60, I read it.
S2: Finish the Christian.
S1: How to Finish the Christian Life. And that's with staying power.
S1: So here's what I'm wondering. Why is staying power so important?
S1: But more importantly, we figure it's important. I also want
S1: to know how do I get it? So how do
S1: I get staying power. So let's start with why is
S1: it so important? Yes.
S2: Well, I take it from Scripture, of course, and of
S2: the early church it says in acts 242 they continued
S2: steadfastly in the apostles doctrine and fellowship, and the breaking
S2: of bread and of prayers. And you see how the
S2: early church, step by step, faithfully followed those principles there. Again,
S2: first Corinthians four two. It is required, not suggested, not
S2: just recommended. It is required that those who have been
S2: given a trust, a position of confidence that they must
S2: prove themselves faithful. The Apostle Paul said, I have fought
S2: a good fight. He said, I finished the race. He said,
S2: I've kept the faith. Staying power. The endurance to end Well,
S2: when Jesus had received the sour vinegar and wine on
S2: the cross, he said, it is finished. He said, the
S2: work my father gave me to do, it's done. And
S2: it says he bowed his head and he gave up
S2: his spirit. Staying power. The crowd said, come down from
S2: the cross. If you're the Son of God, prove it.
S2: But the Lord Jesus stayed on the cross. He didn't
S2: come down. It's human to come down. It's human to quit.
S2: It's divine to hang there. It's divine to be faithful,
S2: to have that staying power. He persevered, not quitting, but
S2: doing the will of his father. And that's what God
S2: calls us to do today.
S1: What makes people quit, do you think?
S2: Fear. Tiredness. Others. Uh, but I think if we have
S2: a vision of God and especially as expressed in the
S2: Lord Jesus, uh, he was out to finish what the
S2: Lord the Heavenly Father gave him to do. And his
S2: purpose statement in life was, I've come to seek and
S2: to save the lost. And so he knew he had
S2: to go to the cross. Peter didn't want him to
S2: go to the cross, but he knew he had to
S2: go to the cross. He was to die there for
S2: the sins of the world. And finally on the cross
S2: he said, it's done. I've done what my father has
S2: asked me to do. The veil of the temple was
S2: rent in twain. He completed the purpose for which he
S2: came to earth.
S1: Okay, so now, doc, you've already mentioned that you're 95
S1: years old. You don't believe in retirement. You're still serving God.
S1: You're still. How many years? Are you married now?
S2: 72.
S1: Only 72. So you got a lot more years there? Uh,
S1: a very patient wife, I guess. Right?
S2: Very patient. She's. I owe everything to her. Apart from
S2: the Lord, she's been the most important person. Even greater
S2: than my mother and father. And I love them dearly.
S1: So here's my question. What is the key? I mean,
S1: I have never seen anyone with as much staying power
S1: and serving God and loving God as you. And so
S1: what do you think prompted that? What's the key that
S1: you found for staying power in your life?
S2: I think it comes from the scriptures, from the Word
S2: of God, because as I see it from beginning to end,
S2: whether it was the early church or whether it was
S2: the ministry of Jesus, uh, the work was to be done.
S2: And The. The Lord at that right moment said, it's finished,
S2: the work is done. And then, of course, he was
S2: buried and ascended, and then appeared to his disciples and
S2: outlined what they were to do. He said, you're here's
S2: what you're to do. You're to be witnesses unto all
S2: of what you've seen and heard. And so that's what
S2: we're doing. Did you ever.
S1: Want to quit?
S2: Well, if so, it wasn't for long. Yeah. That's it.
S2: Maybe a few seconds. And then I said, Lord help me. Uh,
S2: rebuild my faith. Give me a vision of. And help
S2: me to be one that perseveres and serves you to
S2: the end.
S1: I think that's the thing that we're all going to
S1: get discouraged sometimes. Yeah. And want to quit. But I
S1: think if we keep remembering our Redeemer, that's what kept me.
S1: There was a point where I wanted to quit serving God,
S1: and I heard a song on Moody Radio of all things, uh,
S1: early in the morning, and it was Steven Curtis Chapman
S1: singing My Redeemer is faithful and true.
S2: Faithful and.
S1: True. And I heard that, and I thought, he is faithful.
S1: I have to be faithful. And that was a transforming
S1: moment for me.
S2: Oh, yeah. And Paul, you know, he says, I fought
S2: a good fight. It's a fight. Yeah. And he said,
S2: I've kept the faith. Yeah. And then he said, I
S2: finished the course that God had marked out for him. Yeah.
S2: What words? I threw me. And I said, Lord, I'd
S2: just like to have a little bit of that. I'd
S2: like to be a little like Paul was like Jesus was.
S2: I'd like to reflect him. Yeah.
S1: You you have a chapter in the book as D.L. Moody,
S1: as an example of someone who followed excellence, pursued excellence.
S1: So could you talk a little bit about D.L. Moody?
S1: Because so often, you know, people hear Moody Bible Institute
S1: or Moody Radio and they think it means the radio
S1: station for Grumpy people or the Grumpy Bible Institute. It's
S1: not that it's named after a very famous man, D.L. Moody. Uh,
S1: and so, uh. Yeah. Yeah.
S2: D.L. Moody used to say, give me a man who
S2: says this one thing I do, and not these 50
S2: things I dabble in. And that was his singleness of
S2: of purpose. But listen to Emma Dryer. Emma Dryer really
S2: knew D.L. Moody better than most people knew him. And
S2: she said this organization was not pre-eminently. D.L. Moody's gift founding, evangelizing,
S2: and quick execution were emphatically his gifts. Wow. He was
S2: an Elijah. He was a divinely equipped flying artillery on
S2: life's battlefield. I mean, that's how she describes D.L. Still moody. Wow.
S2: An RA Tory working with D.L. Moody said millions of
S2: dollars passed into Mr. Moody's hands, but they passed through.
S2: They did not stick to his fingers. You see, Moody
S2: was a person who was giving his all to serve
S2: others and to serve Jesus Christ. Uh, Dale Moody's life's
S2: verse was the world and its desires pass away. But
S2: whoever does the will of God lives forever. Now, he
S2: only lived to be 62 years of age. But here,
S2: these years afterward, and thousands of students are being trained
S2: through the Moody Bible Institute and the radio program that
S2: goes out. Moody would have loved radio goes out day
S2: after day, all over the nation, all over the world.
S2: And that message still goes forward. And the.
S1: Colportage society, which became Moody Publishers, Moody.
S2: Publishers.
S1: All the books that.
S2: I think, I think Moody Publishers, in many ways, uh,
S2: shows Moody's passion maybe more than any other way. Yeah. Uh,
S2: thousands will study at a school. Millions will read his books.
S2: And so the work goes on.
S1: Well, that's the fastest hour I have ever passed. Thank you,
S1: Doctor Sweeting, for joining me today. And thanks for listening, everyone.
S1: You know, if you want to get a copy of
S1: The Pursuit of Excellence, probably the best way is to
S1: go to the Open Line Radio org website. There's a
S1: link there that you can click on for the Pursuit
S1: of Excellence. It's a featured resource. You can click on that.
S1: It will take you to the web page where you
S1: can order your very own copy. Open line with Doctor
S1: Michael Ray Zelnick is a production of Moody Radio, a
S1: ministry of Moody Bible Institute.