1 00:00:07,910 --> 00:00:11,210 S1: If ever there was a place of wonder, it's heaven. 2 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:14,600 S1: When was the last time you truly wondered about heaven? 3 00:00:14,630 --> 00:00:17,180 S1: I mean, if heaven is our eternal destiny as believers, 4 00:00:17,180 --> 00:00:19,820 S1: shouldn't we give it more thought, more study? And and 5 00:00:19,820 --> 00:00:21,860 S1: shouldn't our daily agenda be shaped by the need to 6 00:00:21,890 --> 00:00:25,490 S1: prepare for that life to come? Well, coming up, a 7 00:00:25,489 --> 00:00:28,970 S1: fabulous look at heaven. You'll love our sneak preview. By 8 00:00:28,970 --> 00:00:31,580 S1: the way, welcome to the land and the book. Our 9 00:00:31,580 --> 00:00:34,580 S1: host is a man whose heart never leaves Israel. Doctor 10 00:00:34,580 --> 00:00:38,090 S1: Charlie Dyer, and I'm John Gager. You know, we asked 11 00:00:38,090 --> 00:00:40,280 S1: Charlie at this time of year, what does Passover mean 12 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,550 S1: for us as believers in Jesus? Some will remember the 13 00:00:43,550 --> 00:00:45,410 S1: story from the book of Exodus, but there's a lot 14 00:00:45,409 --> 00:00:47,540 S1: more to it. For example, did you know that the 15 00:00:47,540 --> 00:00:50,990 S1: Last Supper was actually a Passover meal? Not only did 16 00:00:50,990 --> 00:00:55,040 S1: Jesus and his disciples celebrate Passover, it also foreshadowed his 17 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:57,500 S1: death on the cross for our redemption, right? 18 00:00:57,530 --> 00:01:00,200 S2: That's right. John, Jewish people have been keeping the feast 19 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,830 S2: of Passover for thousands of years. Understanding the history and 20 00:01:03,830 --> 00:01:07,160 S2: importance of this holiday will help you connect with your 21 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:10,130 S2: Jewish friends and neighbors. And what better way is there 22 00:01:10,130 --> 00:01:14,510 S2: to learn about Passover than to experience a Passover Seder yourself? 23 00:01:14,540 --> 00:01:17,840 S2: If you've never celebrated Passover, our friends at Life in 24 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,810 S2: Messiah would love to partner with you in hosting a 25 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,860 S2: Seder experience. Every year, their staff engage churches and small 26 00:01:24,860 --> 00:01:29,510 S2: groups in an interactive Messiah in the Passover Seder, allowing 27 00:01:29,510 --> 00:01:33,650 S2: participants to taste and see the redemption story. If you're 28 00:01:33,650 --> 00:01:36,620 S2: interested in having someone come lead a Seder in your area, 29 00:01:36,650 --> 00:01:39,919 S2: visit Life in Messiah. Org and click on the Moody 30 00:01:39,950 --> 00:01:44,750 S2: Radio button there to learn more. That's life in messiah.org. 31 00:01:45,050 --> 00:01:47,510 S1: And let's bring our focus now toward current events from 32 00:01:47,510 --> 00:01:50,510 S1: the Middle East. This week, President Trump's plan to have 33 00:01:50,510 --> 00:01:53,810 S1: the people of Gaza relocated to Egypt, Jordan and other 34 00:01:53,810 --> 00:01:57,590 S1: places has been rejected by most countries as nothing more 35 00:01:57,620 --> 00:02:01,250 S1: than ethnic cleansing. What are the legal issues involved and 36 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:02,900 S1: is the plan even workable? 37 00:02:02,930 --> 00:02:05,060 S2: Yeah, let me break that down into a couple bite 38 00:02:05,090 --> 00:02:08,570 S2: sized chunks. First, is this ethnic cleansing and is it 39 00:02:08,570 --> 00:02:12,500 S2: even legal? Well, population movement and resettlement has, at least 40 00:02:12,500 --> 00:02:15,440 S2: until recent times, been seen as a logical way to 41 00:02:15,470 --> 00:02:18,800 S2: resolve ethnic tensions. After the Greek Turkish War, back in 42 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:23,480 S2: 1919 to 1922, a population exchange took place in which 43 00:02:23,510 --> 00:02:26,930 S2: a half million Turks living in Greece were sent to Turkey, 44 00:02:26,930 --> 00:02:29,930 S2: while hundreds of thousands of Greeks and Turkey were sent 45 00:02:29,930 --> 00:02:35,270 S2: to Greece. In 1937, the British Peel Commission recommended transferring 46 00:02:35,270 --> 00:02:39,380 S2: more than 200,000 Arabs from the proposed Jewish state to 47 00:02:39,410 --> 00:02:42,590 S2: the Arab state. Following World War Two, there were an 48 00:02:42,590 --> 00:02:47,060 S2: estimated 40 to 60 million people displaced due to redrawn 49 00:02:47,060 --> 00:02:52,370 S2: borders and ethnic tensions. This ultimately included 650,000 Arabs who 50 00:02:52,370 --> 00:02:56,140 S2: fled their homes in what became Israel, and about 850 51 00:02:56,139 --> 00:02:59,869 S2: to 950,000 Jews who were forced to flee their homes 52 00:02:59,870 --> 00:03:03,680 S2: in the surrounding Arab countries, and in the early 1990s, 53 00:03:03,710 --> 00:03:07,340 S2: after the breakup of Yugoslavia. The war between Bosnia and 54 00:03:07,340 --> 00:03:11,420 S2: Serbia resulted in the displacement of over 2 million refugees. Now, 55 00:03:11,419 --> 00:03:15,109 S2: in that case, several individuals were convicted of war crimes 56 00:03:15,110 --> 00:03:19,040 S2: for the forced transfer and deportation of Bosnians. The bottom 57 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:22,340 S2: line today is that forced population transfer is considered a 58 00:03:22,340 --> 00:03:26,660 S2: war crime. However, President Trump stressed a voluntary transfer to 59 00:03:26,690 --> 00:03:30,440 S2: improve living conditions. That's more of a gray area. Which 60 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:33,800 S2: leads to the second question is this plan even workable? 61 00:03:33,830 --> 00:03:36,500 S2: And my answer is probably not, at least not as 62 00:03:36,500 --> 00:03:39,530 S2: it was described. But it's possible that the very point 63 00:03:39,530 --> 00:03:42,500 S2: of the plan is its absurdity. It's Trump's Art of 64 00:03:42,530 --> 00:03:45,590 S2: the deal, where you start with an extreme demand that 65 00:03:45,590 --> 00:03:48,620 S2: forces everyone to shift the boundaries of what was previously 66 00:03:48,620 --> 00:03:52,760 S2: considered possible. Since his proposal, Arab countries have been meeting 67 00:03:52,790 --> 00:03:55,850 S2: to develop an alternative plan, which is far different than 68 00:03:55,850 --> 00:03:59,030 S2: their earlier position that Gaza must return to. Exactly what 69 00:03:59,030 --> 00:04:02,750 S2: it was before October 7th. One proposal suggests forming a 70 00:04:02,750 --> 00:04:07,910 S2: national Palestinian committee to govern Gaza, replacing Hamas. Jordan offered 71 00:04:07,910 --> 00:04:11,390 S2: to take in several thousand children from Gaza for medical treatment, 72 00:04:11,390 --> 00:04:15,230 S2: and Egypt's president traveled to Saudi Arabia to discuss an 73 00:04:15,230 --> 00:04:18,020 S2: Arab plan that could include up to $20 billion from 74 00:04:18,020 --> 00:04:23,060 S2: the region for reconstruction. Ultimately, however, over $53 billion is 75 00:04:23,060 --> 00:04:25,610 S2: going to be needed over the next ten years. The 76 00:04:25,610 --> 00:04:28,849 S2: initial $20 billion would only cover the first three years. Now, 77 00:04:28,850 --> 00:04:31,070 S2: I have a friend who once described the type of 78 00:04:31,070 --> 00:04:34,670 S2: negotiation technique that President Trump used here as the equivalent 79 00:04:34,670 --> 00:04:37,339 S2: of throwing a hand grenade on a conference table. What 80 00:04:37,339 --> 00:04:39,320 S2: he meant by that was when all sides are so 81 00:04:39,350 --> 00:04:43,220 S2: entrenched and no one's willing to compromise, propose something totally 82 00:04:43,220 --> 00:04:46,310 S2: outrageous and out of the box and suggest it as 83 00:04:46,310 --> 00:04:49,580 S2: your course of action. It forces everyone to scramble for 84 00:04:49,580 --> 00:04:54,140 S2: other alternatives. Now, hopefully, President Trump's plan will get people 85 00:04:54,140 --> 00:04:56,919 S2: to cooperate in reaching an acceptable compromise. 86 00:04:56,950 --> 00:04:59,920 S1: Charlie, quick question about Hamas. I read a headline, didn't 87 00:04:59,920 --> 00:05:03,070 S1: really explore it much from a Hamas representative who stated 88 00:05:03,070 --> 00:05:05,590 S1: that they will not be in charge of whatever becomes 89 00:05:05,589 --> 00:05:08,800 S1: of Gaza in the future. Was that just words, or 90 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:10,180 S1: do you think that might be true? 91 00:05:10,390 --> 00:05:12,400 S2: That, I think, is words. In fact, I believe what 92 00:05:12,430 --> 00:05:15,520 S2: Hamas would say is we'll just be regular Palestinians. And 93 00:05:15,550 --> 00:05:18,159 S2: of course, then there will eventually be elections. And of course, 94 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,080 S2: our people will run in the elections and they'll be 95 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,600 S2: voted into office and and we'll take over again by 96 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:26,110 S2: the ballot box. So don't believe everything Hamas says. 97 00:05:26,110 --> 00:05:29,500 S1: Several news outlets have reported that Israel is planning to 98 00:05:29,500 --> 00:05:33,250 S1: attack Iran's nuclear facilities in the near future. How accurate 99 00:05:33,250 --> 00:05:34,600 S1: are these reports, do you think? 100 00:05:34,630 --> 00:05:37,180 S2: Yeah, when it comes to these reports, everything isn't always 101 00:05:37,180 --> 00:05:40,029 S2: what it seems to be. We do know the International 102 00:05:40,029 --> 00:05:43,300 S2: Atomic Energy Agency believes time is running out for any 103 00:05:43,300 --> 00:05:46,089 S2: kind of a nuclear deal with Iran right now. Iran 104 00:05:46,089 --> 00:05:50,890 S2: has enough highly enriched uranium to eventually construct six nuclear weapons, 105 00:05:50,890 --> 00:05:53,680 S2: and they're apparently exploring ways to more quickly turn that 106 00:05:53,710 --> 00:05:58,360 S2: uranium into crude nuclear bombs. Now, these recent reports suggest 107 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:02,770 S2: Israel is planning to attack Iran's nuclear facilities sometime this year. 108 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,229 S2: But here's the problem. We don't know if those reports 109 00:06:05,230 --> 00:06:09,340 S2: are stories that were uncovered by reporters or stories planted 110 00:06:09,339 --> 00:06:12,670 S2: by the U.S. or Israel. It's possible the U.S. or 111 00:06:12,670 --> 00:06:15,430 S2: Israel want to frighten Iran into being more willing to 112 00:06:15,460 --> 00:06:19,210 S2: negotiate a deal to limit their nuclear program. President Trump 113 00:06:19,210 --> 00:06:22,270 S2: has said this would be his preferred outcome. But in 114 00:06:22,270 --> 00:06:25,539 S2: light of Iran's intransigence, it's also possible the stories were 115 00:06:25,540 --> 00:06:28,539 S2: intended as a final warning to Iran that time is 116 00:06:28,540 --> 00:06:32,350 S2: running out. I suspect the second option is more likely. 117 00:06:32,380 --> 00:06:35,170 S2: Israel and the U.S. are discussing ways to eliminate or 118 00:06:35,170 --> 00:06:40,120 S2: severely degrade Iran's nuclear facilities. The main question is whether 119 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,940 S2: Israel will act alone, or if the U.S. will assist 120 00:06:42,940 --> 00:06:47,770 S2: with technical and logistical support, like providing tankers for refueling planes, 121 00:06:47,770 --> 00:06:50,380 S2: or if the two countries will actually unite in a 122 00:06:50,380 --> 00:06:53,919 S2: joint attack. In the past week, Israel took delivery of 123 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:58,779 S2: 1500 bunker busting bombs from the US. These 200 £0 124 00:06:58,779 --> 00:07:02,169 S2: bombs could damage a great deal of Iran's nuclear facilities, 125 00:07:02,170 --> 00:07:05,230 S2: though it's uncertain if they could reach the underground facilities 126 00:07:05,230 --> 00:07:08,500 S2: at places like Fordow. However, the US has developed a 127 00:07:08,500 --> 00:07:11,980 S2: 30 zero zero £0 bomb that's apparently able to destroy 128 00:07:11,980 --> 00:07:15,790 S2: a facility hundreds of feet underground. If the US and 129 00:07:15,790 --> 00:07:18,790 S2: Israel do conduct a joint strike on Iran, it's likely 130 00:07:18,790 --> 00:07:22,030 S2: they would set back Iran's nuclear program for years and 131 00:07:22,030 --> 00:07:26,170 S2: send a message to other countries as well, like North Korea. Unfortunately, 132 00:07:26,170 --> 00:07:28,630 S2: we won't know if the news stories are real or 133 00:07:28,630 --> 00:07:30,580 S2: planted until later this year. 134 00:07:30,610 --> 00:07:32,980 S1: This is the land and the book from Moody Radio 135 00:07:33,010 --> 00:07:36,700 S1: with Middle East expert Doctor Charlie Dyer. 3000 Years of 136 00:07:36,700 --> 00:07:39,790 S1: Jewish history is now on display in a new exhibit 137 00:07:39,790 --> 00:07:43,480 S1: at Israel's Ben-Gurion airport. What exactly is on display and 138 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:44,830 S1: how long will it be there? 139 00:07:44,860 --> 00:07:48,160 S2: Yeah, those traveling through Ben-Gurion airport can now spend time 140 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:52,510 S2: exploring this new archaeological Illogical exhibition. It's called The Eternity 141 00:07:52,510 --> 00:07:56,410 S2: of Israel, and the exhibit takes visitors through 3000 years 142 00:07:56,410 --> 00:07:59,980 S2: of Jewish history, showing Israel's connection to the land. Now, 143 00:07:59,980 --> 00:08:02,290 S2: part of the reason for the exhibit is to show 144 00:08:02,290 --> 00:08:05,500 S2: how the archaeological history of the land and the history 145 00:08:05,500 --> 00:08:09,580 S2: of Israel and the Jewish people do intertwine. It reinforces 146 00:08:09,580 --> 00:08:13,360 S2: the reality of Israel's historical connection to this strategic piece 147 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:17,440 S2: of real estate. The exhibit includes both photographs and actual discoveries, 148 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:20,710 S2: including a five ton stone from the western wall of 149 00:08:20,710 --> 00:08:23,770 S2: the Second Temple in Jerusalem. It also features a hoard 150 00:08:23,770 --> 00:08:27,100 S2: of coins discovered in the desert, tools from a Hasmonean 151 00:08:27,100 --> 00:08:31,030 S2: era farm near Mount Arbel, ancient weapons and a seal 152 00:08:31,060 --> 00:08:34,720 S2: bearing the name Ahab, the King of Israel, who married Jezebel. 153 00:08:34,750 --> 00:08:37,690 S2: Every display and photo comes with its own QR code 154 00:08:37,690 --> 00:08:40,630 S2: that will allow passengers to access videos filmed at the 155 00:08:40,630 --> 00:08:44,320 S2: excavation sites and other details. Now, the exhibit is scheduled 156 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,679 S2: to run through the end of this year and Lord willing, John, 157 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,320 S2: I'm looking forward to seeing it during my trip in November. 158 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:53,080 S1: And we'll look forward to hearing your report on that exhibit. Well, 159 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:56,320 S1: speaking of Ben Gurion Airport, what's the latest on travel 160 00:08:56,350 --> 00:08:59,740 S1: to Israel? Is the country finally opening for tourism as 161 00:08:59,740 --> 00:09:02,949 S1: we hear about more airlines going ahead with flights? 162 00:09:02,980 --> 00:09:05,679 S2: Yeah, I've got good news and less good news, but 163 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,770 S2: thankfully it's not bad news. Air France did resume flights 164 00:09:08,770 --> 00:09:12,130 S2: from Paris to Tel Aviv on January 25th, and Lufthansa 165 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:16,240 S2: began flying February 1st. Several other major U.S. and international 166 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:19,420 S2: airlines have also announced they'll begin flying in the coming weeks. 167 00:09:19,570 --> 00:09:23,020 S2: United said it will resume flights starting on March 15th, 168 00:09:23,020 --> 00:09:26,260 S2: and Delta will begin flying April 1st. British Air is 169 00:09:26,260 --> 00:09:29,680 S2: scheduled to follow with direct flights from London beginning April 5th. 170 00:09:29,710 --> 00:09:32,470 S2: The one major airline that's still not planning to fly 171 00:09:32,470 --> 00:09:35,980 S2: anytime soon is American Airlines. They've said they won't start 172 00:09:35,980 --> 00:09:39,489 S2: flights until September. Now, the number of daily flights will 173 00:09:39,490 --> 00:09:42,670 S2: start out slowly, which means ticket prices aren't expected to 174 00:09:42,670 --> 00:09:45,160 S2: start falling until later in the summer. And that's one 175 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:48,580 S2: part of the less good news. But as airlines expand flights, 176 00:09:48,580 --> 00:09:51,820 S2: hopefully ticket prices will also begin to drop. The other 177 00:09:51,820 --> 00:09:55,120 S2: less good news is that beginning in January, travelers are 178 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:59,110 S2: now required to obtain an electronic travel authorization prior to 179 00:09:59,140 --> 00:10:01,900 S2: flying to Israel. It's similar to the requirements that are 180 00:10:01,900 --> 00:10:04,870 S2: in place in the UK and other places in Europe 181 00:10:04,870 --> 00:10:06,850 S2: that are going into place this summer, and we have 182 00:10:06,850 --> 00:10:10,059 S2: a similar system for visitors who arrive here from other countries. 183 00:10:10,090 --> 00:10:13,209 S2: Israel's program is going to cost about $7. It's applied 184 00:10:13,210 --> 00:10:15,640 S2: for online and it will be valid for two years. 185 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:17,650 S2: So it's a bit of a hassle, but then it's 186 00:10:17,650 --> 00:10:19,839 S2: a small price to pay to help make sure that 187 00:10:19,870 --> 00:10:22,030 S2: there's no one on that plane who's going to cause 188 00:10:22,059 --> 00:10:23,830 S2: problems once they get to Israel. 189 00:10:23,830 --> 00:10:26,260 S1: And that's a look at current events from the Middle East. 190 00:10:26,260 --> 00:10:28,120 S1: In our next segment, we're going to take a look 191 00:10:28,150 --> 00:10:30,520 S1: at heaven itself. You know, when was the last time 192 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:34,209 S1: you really wondered about heaven? If our eternal destiny is 193 00:10:34,210 --> 00:10:38,080 S1: not here, not now. Shouldn't we give the future more thought, 194 00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:40,719 S1: more study? Well, that's where we're headed in a conversation 195 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,300 S1: you don't want to miss on the land and the book. 196 00:10:43,330 --> 00:10:46,480 S1: Then it's Bible questions and answers and Charlie Dyer's devotional 197 00:10:46,540 --> 00:11:03,760 S1: All Ahead on the land and the book. If ever 198 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:06,520 S1: there was a place of wonder, it's heaven. But when 199 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:09,640 S1: was the last time you actually wondered about heaven? If 200 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:12,190 S1: that's our eternal destiny as believers, shouldn't we give it 201 00:11:12,190 --> 00:11:15,970 S1: some thought, some study, some prep? Even I think so. Hey, 202 00:11:15,970 --> 00:11:18,850 S1: welcome back to the land and the book. I'm John Gager. 203 00:11:18,850 --> 00:11:22,959 S1: We're about to separate what's true about heaven from what's legend. 204 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,570 S1: But while we remain here, we're called to share the 205 00:11:25,570 --> 00:11:28,720 S1: love of Christ and His saving message with everybody. So, hey, 206 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:30,820 S1: what do you say we take another shot of encouragement 207 00:11:30,820 --> 00:11:33,910 S1: for reaching out to our Jewish friends? Have you ever 208 00:11:33,940 --> 00:11:36,790 S1: wondered what the Bible is referring to when it talks 209 00:11:36,790 --> 00:11:40,960 S1: about Israel's spiritual blindness? Let's ask Wes Tabor, who's an 210 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:44,319 S1: ambassador with life in Messiah. What do we mean by that? Well, 211 00:11:44,350 --> 00:11:46,380 S1: all non-believers are blinded by Satan. 212 00:11:46,380 --> 00:11:50,010 S3: John. Second Corinthians four says, but even if our gospel 213 00:11:50,010 --> 00:11:52,440 S3: is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 214 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:56,310 S3: whose minds the God of this age has blinded, but 215 00:11:56,309 --> 00:11:59,640 S3: God also judicially blinded, rebellious Israel, you know, back in 216 00:11:59,670 --> 00:12:04,170 S3: Isaiah six. Second Corinthians 315 says that there's a veil 217 00:12:04,170 --> 00:12:07,440 S3: on their hearts when the Torah is read. And Paul 218 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:11,130 S3: says in Romans, this blindness is both partial and temporary. 219 00:12:11,130 --> 00:12:14,040 S1: So in light of this spiritual blindness, what can we 220 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:15,270 S1: as believers do? 221 00:12:15,300 --> 00:12:18,060 S3: Well, pray. Pray for the veil to be removed and 222 00:12:18,059 --> 00:12:22,020 S3: for God's Spirit to enliven the truth. Paul prays in 223 00:12:22,020 --> 00:12:24,660 S3: Ephesians one, I pray that the eyes of your heart 224 00:12:24,690 --> 00:12:26,490 S3: may be enlightened. Verse 18. 225 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:28,770 S1: What a great prayer. May the eyes of your heart 226 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:33,810 S1: be enlightened. That's Wes Tabor with life in Messiah. Jennifer 227 00:12:33,809 --> 00:12:37,080 S1: Rothschild cannot see, but that hasn't stopped her from much 228 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:40,050 S1: of anything blind. Since the age of 15. She's written 229 00:12:40,050 --> 00:12:44,760 S1: 19 books and Bible studies, including her video based Bible study, Heaven. 230 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:50,340 S1: When Faith Becomes Sight, Jennifer travels the country offering fresh, sensible, 231 00:12:50,370 --> 00:12:53,850 S1: biblical advice to audiences who, like her, are determined to 232 00:12:53,850 --> 00:12:57,420 S1: pursue healthy and productive lives. Jennifer has shared her inspiring 233 00:12:57,420 --> 00:13:01,290 S1: message to the arena sized audiences of the popular women 234 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:05,100 S1: of Faith conferences and media outlets, including Doctor Phil, Good 235 00:13:05,130 --> 00:13:08,400 S1: Morning America, as well as a Billy Graham television special. 236 00:13:08,429 --> 00:13:11,220 S1: We really enjoyed our last visit. Jennifer. We had to 237 00:13:11,220 --> 00:13:13,470 S1: have you come back and talk about heaven. Thank you 238 00:13:13,470 --> 00:13:14,550 S1: for reconnecting. 239 00:13:14,580 --> 00:13:17,429 S4: Oh, I loved our last conversation and I'm really looking 240 00:13:17,429 --> 00:13:18,900 S4: forward to talking about heaven. 241 00:13:18,929 --> 00:13:21,480 S1: All right, let's give a quick overview, for starters about 242 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:23,910 S1: what this video based Bible study is all about. You're 243 00:13:23,910 --> 00:13:26,160 S1: not the first to tackle the subject of heaven, and 244 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:27,150 S1: it's a big one. 245 00:13:27,210 --> 00:13:30,150 S4: It's such a big one. It was daunting and I 246 00:13:30,150 --> 00:13:32,730 S4: thought it was a great idea until I started writing 247 00:13:32,730 --> 00:13:38,220 S4: the Bible study, and I realized I knew so little. 248 00:13:38,220 --> 00:13:42,030 S4: And the real interesting thing, John, is heaven is this 249 00:13:42,030 --> 00:13:45,300 S4: place we all want to go and some of us 250 00:13:45,300 --> 00:13:48,960 S4: think we're going. And so what I recognized is there's 251 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:53,670 S4: so much misunderstanding about heaven. And in that misunderstanding, people 252 00:13:53,670 --> 00:13:58,020 S4: miss not just going there when they die, but missing 253 00:13:58,020 --> 00:14:01,199 S4: the impact of heaven now. So, oh, listen, I learned 254 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,840 S4: so much about it. It's a six week Bible study 255 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,809 S4: which is video based, and we go through what heaven is, 256 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,900 S4: what heaven is, not, what the Bible says about our 257 00:14:09,900 --> 00:14:13,290 S4: eternal life, our resurrected bodies. But I do it in 258 00:14:13,290 --> 00:14:16,200 S4: such a way that it's like holding the hand of 259 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,170 S4: the reader, because I needed somebody to hold my hand 260 00:14:19,170 --> 00:14:22,680 S4: as I was learning. And so the beautiful thing is, 261 00:14:22,710 --> 00:14:28,229 S4: we learn that God called us to live with him 262 00:14:28,230 --> 00:14:31,410 S4: forever in heaven. That's why Jesus came to bring us 263 00:14:31,410 --> 00:14:35,910 S4: to heaven someday. But even better, it's to bring heaven 264 00:14:35,910 --> 00:14:36,660 S4: to earth. 265 00:14:36,660 --> 00:14:40,590 S1: Now let's ponder a bit of basic theology you write. 266 00:14:40,590 --> 00:14:44,370 S1: Our hope of heaven rests on the resurrection. Yeah. For 267 00:14:44,370 --> 00:14:46,680 S1: somebody who's never given it a thought, why is that 268 00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:47,520 S1: so critical? 269 00:14:47,850 --> 00:14:52,590 S4: Well, if Jesus had not died and risen from the grave, 270 00:14:52,620 --> 00:14:57,060 S4: then according to First Corinthians chapter 15, there would be 271 00:14:57,090 --> 00:15:00,540 S4: zero resurrection. In other words, when we think of heaven, 272 00:15:00,570 --> 00:15:04,110 S4: or at least when I originally thought of heaven, I thought, well, 273 00:15:04,110 --> 00:15:06,570 S4: if I close my eyes to this life right now, 274 00:15:06,570 --> 00:15:08,250 S4: that I'm going to show up in heaven with this 275 00:15:08,250 --> 00:15:11,040 S4: glorified body, and I'm going to be able to see 276 00:15:11,070 --> 00:15:13,980 S4: and dance, and I'll probably have beautiful blonde hair, even 277 00:15:14,010 --> 00:15:15,690 S4: though I don't have it here on earth. I just 278 00:15:15,690 --> 00:15:19,830 S4: pictured this glorified body. Okay. And the more I studied heaven, 279 00:15:19,830 --> 00:15:23,400 S4: the more I realized, no, there is a present heaven 280 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:26,460 S4: where yes, we go when we close our eyes to 281 00:15:26,490 --> 00:15:29,490 S4: this earth. Because to be absent from the body is 282 00:15:29,490 --> 00:15:33,420 S4: to be present with the Lord. But it's not necessarily 283 00:15:33,420 --> 00:15:38,760 S4: the glorified body that we will receive someday when Christ returns. See, 284 00:15:38,760 --> 00:15:41,820 S4: when the Bible talks about heaven. For the most part, 285 00:15:41,850 --> 00:15:45,810 S4: it's it's speaking of our glorious, unending, this new heavens 286 00:15:45,810 --> 00:15:49,110 S4: and new earth. And that's where we will receive this 287 00:15:49,110 --> 00:15:53,610 S4: resurrected body. And the beautiful thing is, John, the Bible 288 00:15:53,610 --> 00:15:56,910 S4: says it will be like Jesus resurrected body. And if 289 00:15:56,910 --> 00:15:59,850 S4: you study what Jesus's body was like when he raised 290 00:15:59,850 --> 00:16:03,300 S4: from the grave, it was a material body. Yes, he ate, 291 00:16:03,330 --> 00:16:06,450 S4: he drank, he laughed. And so heaven is not just 292 00:16:06,450 --> 00:16:13,170 S4: this ethereal place. It will be a material, literal, glorious, unending. 293 00:16:13,170 --> 00:16:14,790 S4: When our faith becomes sight. 294 00:16:14,820 --> 00:16:17,340 S1: We're looking up into heaven as best we can. On 295 00:16:17,340 --> 00:16:20,190 S1: today's edition of The Land and the book leading our 296 00:16:20,190 --> 00:16:23,580 S1: exploration is an adventurer by the name of Jennifer Rothschild. 297 00:16:23,580 --> 00:16:25,290 S1: You know, when it comes to what we'll be doing 298 00:16:25,290 --> 00:16:28,140 S1: in heaven, Jennifer, the Bible is a little thin. Yeah, 299 00:16:28,170 --> 00:16:30,090 S1: I sometimes wish we had more to go on. Part 300 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,610 S1: of me says, you know, if people really understood how 301 00:16:32,610 --> 00:16:35,550 S1: awesome it'll be, they'd step up their game spiritually. They'd 302 00:16:35,550 --> 00:16:38,670 S1: get more excited about heaven. They'd share Jesus more with 303 00:16:38,670 --> 00:16:41,070 S1: their unsaved friends? But the other part of me says 304 00:16:41,070 --> 00:16:44,670 S1: we've already been told I has not seen nor ear heard. 305 00:16:44,670 --> 00:16:46,590 S1: Neither has it entered into the heart of man. The 306 00:16:46,590 --> 00:16:49,320 S1: things that God has prepared for those who love him. 307 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:52,410 S1: So oddly. Heaven itself is a trust issue even after 308 00:16:52,410 --> 00:16:54,900 S1: we've trusted Christ for our salvation. How do you react 309 00:16:54,900 --> 00:16:55,470 S1: to that? 310 00:16:55,860 --> 00:16:58,230 S4: Well, you know the same way I react every time 311 00:16:58,230 --> 00:17:00,480 S4: I get on an airplane. And here's what I mean 312 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:03,030 S4: by that. When I get on an airplane, I am 313 00:17:03,030 --> 00:17:06,660 S4: not a licensed pilot. I am a passenger. And I 314 00:17:06,660 --> 00:17:09,690 S4: will sit on the airplane and I will buckle up. 315 00:17:09,690 --> 00:17:14,399 S4: And I trust the pilot. Yes, I trust things I 316 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,310 S4: don't understand, and I literally put my life in that 317 00:17:17,310 --> 00:17:21,570 S4: pilot's hands, knowing that he knows more than me. You 318 00:17:21,570 --> 00:17:24,480 S4: know the Apostle Paul in second Corinthians 12, he had 319 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,510 S4: this experience where he was caught up to what he 320 00:17:27,510 --> 00:17:31,530 S4: called the third heaven Paradise. It would be like what 321 00:17:31,530 --> 00:17:36,180 S4: we consider today the present heaven where God dwells, where 322 00:17:36,180 --> 00:17:40,080 S4: our deceased loved ones in Christ are right now. And 323 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:43,590 S4: so Paul said, I have this experience. And he said 324 00:17:43,590 --> 00:17:45,209 S4: several times, whether it was in the body or out 325 00:17:45,210 --> 00:17:48,660 S4: of the body, I do not know. God knows. That's 326 00:17:48,660 --> 00:17:52,410 S4: how we deal with heaven. But God does, and we 327 00:17:52,410 --> 00:17:56,250 S4: can trust him. And really, the point of heaven is 328 00:17:56,250 --> 00:18:00,690 S4: Christ Himself. All of the questions we may have, all 329 00:18:00,690 --> 00:18:05,580 S4: the longing. Those are pointers. They're not the destination. They're 330 00:18:05,609 --> 00:18:08,909 S4: the pathway to get to the ultimate point of heaven, 331 00:18:08,910 --> 00:18:13,200 S4: which is oneness with Christ, which we were created for. 332 00:18:13,230 --> 00:18:17,820 S4: Heaven is our ultimate home because Jesus is our Savior, 333 00:18:17,820 --> 00:18:20,340 S4: and so he's the point of heaven. Everything else just 334 00:18:20,340 --> 00:18:21,120 S4: points to it. 335 00:18:21,150 --> 00:18:22,080 S5: Yes. 336 00:18:22,290 --> 00:18:27,119 S1: Jennifer Rothschild founded Women's Ministry Net back in 1998, an 337 00:18:27,150 --> 00:18:31,409 S1: online leadership resource providing tools for women in the local church. 338 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,270 S1: She talks with us today on the land and the 339 00:18:33,270 --> 00:18:36,000 S1: book about her book, Heaven when Faith Becomes Sight, which 340 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:38,790 S1: is also partnered with a video series. You got to 341 00:18:38,790 --> 00:18:41,429 S1: check it out. We'll have a link at our website. Jennifer, 342 00:18:41,430 --> 00:18:44,939 S1: there's no shortage of legends and mistruths about heaven. What 343 00:18:44,940 --> 00:18:47,280 S1: are the first 1 or 2 that come to your mind? 344 00:18:47,730 --> 00:18:51,600 S4: Well, as a little girl, John, I remember singing that song. 345 00:18:51,630 --> 00:18:55,560 S4: I've got a mansion just over the hilltop and I 346 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:57,810 S4: literally thought, okay, I have got a mansion. I have 347 00:18:57,810 --> 00:19:00,480 S4: been decorating it in my mind's eye since I was 348 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:03,869 S4: eight years old. And then that's based on, of course, 349 00:19:03,869 --> 00:19:07,889 S4: John chapter 14, where Jesus says in the King James Version, 350 00:19:07,890 --> 00:19:11,190 S4: in my father's house are many mansions. Well, a more 351 00:19:11,190 --> 00:19:16,619 S4: accurate rendering is many rooms, many dwelling places. So it's interesting. 352 00:19:16,619 --> 00:19:23,910 S4: I had a very, oh gosh, self-centered, Jennifer centric view 353 00:19:23,910 --> 00:19:26,399 S4: of heaven. It was about me. I can't wait to 354 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,159 S4: get there. I'm blind now, but I'm going to be 355 00:19:29,190 --> 00:19:31,949 S4: able to see there that is heaven, or I'm going 356 00:19:31,980 --> 00:19:34,170 S4: to have a mansion. I'm going to have freedom. Oh, 357 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:37,460 S4: that's heaven, or I'm going to get to see my dad, 358 00:19:37,670 --> 00:19:41,570 S4: who I miss so much. Oh that's heaven. And the 359 00:19:41,570 --> 00:19:46,850 S4: more I realized and unlearned what Scripture says about heaven, 360 00:19:46,850 --> 00:19:50,390 S4: I realized, no, that's not the point of heaven. If 361 00:19:50,390 --> 00:19:53,119 S4: I've got nothing, if I'm just a doorkeeper in the 362 00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:55,850 S4: house of the Lord, and I get to see Jesus 363 00:19:55,850 --> 00:20:00,680 S4: face to face, which I will. That's heaven enough right there. 364 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:02,330 S4: And so I think if we can move from a 365 00:20:02,330 --> 00:20:05,600 S4: self-centered view of heaven to a Christ centered view of heaven, 366 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:07,910 S4: then we're going to really begin to experience the reality 367 00:20:07,910 --> 00:20:09,260 S4: of heaven here on this side. 368 00:20:09,290 --> 00:20:09,830 S5: You know, it really. 369 00:20:09,830 --> 00:20:11,629 S1: Seems to me that the issue is how much do 370 00:20:11,630 --> 00:20:14,570 S1: we love Jesus? I mean, as you've correctly pointed out, 371 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:18,770 S1: heaven is essentially being with Jesus. It's not necessarily the 372 00:20:18,770 --> 00:20:21,110 S1: place and all of its accoutrements, although I'm sure those 373 00:20:21,109 --> 00:20:25,070 S1: will be mind blowing. Heaven is Jesus. It's presence with Jesus, 374 00:20:25,070 --> 00:20:27,919 S1: living with Jesus, worshiping with Jesus. That either excites us 375 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:29,270 S1: or it doesn't. Seems to me. 376 00:20:29,300 --> 00:20:33,830 S4: Yeah, yeah. You know, unfortunately, on this side of eternity, 377 00:20:33,830 --> 00:20:37,820 S4: Unless Christ returns, we have to die to get to heaven. 378 00:20:37,820 --> 00:20:41,180 S4: And so sometimes we're still afraid of death, that we 379 00:20:41,180 --> 00:20:43,369 S4: make that the period at the end of our sentence like, well, 380 00:20:43,369 --> 00:20:45,770 S4: there's nothing, you know. Yes, heaven is good, but it's 381 00:20:45,770 --> 00:20:49,400 S4: an afterthought. And what I'm learning is, no, death is 382 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,619 S4: not like the period at the end of a sentence. 383 00:20:51,650 --> 00:20:53,780 S4: It's not like the end of our story. It's the 384 00:20:53,780 --> 00:20:58,100 S4: comma that transitions us to the forever story of our 385 00:20:58,100 --> 00:21:03,080 S4: life this side of eternity. It's beautiful, but it's the prologue. 386 00:21:03,230 --> 00:21:07,070 S4: The better story is part of the better country. And 387 00:21:07,070 --> 00:21:09,739 S4: so when, when we can consider it that way, we 388 00:21:09,740 --> 00:21:12,590 S4: look at it almost like C.S. Lewis did, like this 389 00:21:12,590 --> 00:21:16,669 S4: is the Shadowland, but there's going to be a greater substance. 390 00:21:16,670 --> 00:21:20,119 S4: And when it comes to longing for heaven, I mean, 391 00:21:20,150 --> 00:21:22,429 S4: he even talked about death, that we have one of 392 00:21:22,430 --> 00:21:26,480 S4: three ways that we experience it. We either fear it, 393 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,869 S4: we ignore it, which he contends, most of us in 394 00:21:29,869 --> 00:21:32,990 S4: culture do even Christian culture. And then he said, or 395 00:21:32,990 --> 00:21:36,140 S4: we desire it. And I don't really none of us 396 00:21:36,140 --> 00:21:39,170 S4: listening right now would desire death. But I think what 397 00:21:39,170 --> 00:21:41,900 S4: he's referring to is what Paul did, you know, that 398 00:21:41,900 --> 00:21:45,680 S4: I would rather I would more desire to be with Christ. 399 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:48,859 S4: And that's that longing that you're talking about seeing that 400 00:21:48,890 --> 00:21:52,790 S4: heaven is about Jesus. And I remember one day, John, 401 00:21:52,790 --> 00:21:54,590 S4: I was in the kitchen with my daughter in law. 402 00:21:54,619 --> 00:21:57,650 S4: She was new in our family, and with blindness, it's 403 00:21:57,650 --> 00:22:01,700 S4: really hard to do a lot of things. Yeah, my cooking. 404 00:22:01,700 --> 00:22:04,070 S4: But I was convinced I was going to impress her 405 00:22:04,070 --> 00:22:08,060 S4: and make Thanksgiving dinner by myself. So she's sitting there 406 00:22:08,060 --> 00:22:09,949 S4: at the kitchen bar and she's like, can I help you? 407 00:22:09,950 --> 00:22:12,740 S4: I'm like, no, I got this. Well, it was clear, John, 408 00:22:12,740 --> 00:22:14,960 S4: after a little bit, I did not have it. Like 409 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:17,090 S4: I left the microwave open and banged into it in 410 00:22:17,090 --> 00:22:20,030 S4: my face. I burned my hand and she keeps saying, 411 00:22:20,060 --> 00:22:21,530 S4: can I help you? And I'm like, no, I got it, 412 00:22:21,530 --> 00:22:26,330 S4: I got it. Well, finally she pauses and she goes, man, 413 00:22:27,020 --> 00:22:32,300 S4: blindness must be really hard. And I paused and it 414 00:22:32,300 --> 00:22:34,580 S4: was like the kindness of the Lord. He just echoed 415 00:22:34,580 --> 00:22:37,250 S4: this phrase in my heart, and I've clung to it 416 00:22:37,250 --> 00:22:39,889 S4: ever since. I looked at my daughter in law and 417 00:22:39,890 --> 00:22:44,810 S4: I said, yes, blindness is hard, but earth is. 418 00:22:44,810 --> 00:22:45,740 S5: Short. 419 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:49,790 S4: And heaven is long. And I think, John, that was 420 00:22:49,790 --> 00:22:52,340 S4: the kindness of God to me. And I say it 421 00:22:52,340 --> 00:22:54,140 S4: to you, and I say it to all of us 422 00:22:54,140 --> 00:22:58,100 S4: right now who are listening, that our true home is 423 00:22:58,100 --> 00:23:02,540 S4: heaven and earth is short, but heaven is long. And 424 00:23:02,540 --> 00:23:06,260 S4: if we can attach our hope and our treasure to heaven, 425 00:23:06,380 --> 00:23:09,440 S4: then even the hard things here on earth, they begin 426 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:13,790 S4: to work within us that far greater weight of glory. 427 00:23:14,210 --> 00:23:18,050 S1: Jennifer, talk to that listener right now who has up 428 00:23:18,050 --> 00:23:20,270 S1: to this point thought they're going to get to heaven 429 00:23:20,300 --> 00:23:22,700 S1: on their own. They're going to try hard enough. They've 430 00:23:22,700 --> 00:23:24,679 S1: got this just like you in that kitchen. You're going 431 00:23:24,710 --> 00:23:27,800 S1: to do this. You're going to. And frankly, they've banged 432 00:23:27,830 --> 00:23:31,710 S1: their head and they've burned their hands and and they're 433 00:23:31,710 --> 00:23:34,380 S1: not headed for heaven, and they don't know what to do. 434 00:23:34,410 --> 00:23:36,870 S1: Would you explain real simply what they need to do 435 00:23:36,869 --> 00:23:39,180 S1: to receive the gift of eternal life? 436 00:23:39,330 --> 00:23:42,990 S4: Well, you know, when Jesus was talking to his disciples, 437 00:23:42,990 --> 00:23:45,720 S4: the guys who loved him, and he was saying, you know, 438 00:23:45,750 --> 00:23:48,389 S4: don't let your heart be troubled. You know, you believe 439 00:23:48,390 --> 00:23:51,239 S4: in God. You believe also in me. And that's when 440 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,670 S4: he started talking about heaven. And he said, in my 441 00:23:53,670 --> 00:23:56,340 S4: father's house there are many rooms. And if it were 442 00:23:56,340 --> 00:23:59,310 S4: not so well, then I would have told you so 443 00:23:59,340 --> 00:24:02,220 S4: I'm going to prepare a place for you. So then 444 00:24:02,220 --> 00:24:05,820 S4: these guys who are trust in Jesus, they say like 445 00:24:05,820 --> 00:24:08,820 S4: one of them named Thomas. He says, okay, that's good Jesus. 446 00:24:08,820 --> 00:24:10,709 S4: But like, how do we know the way? 447 00:24:10,740 --> 00:24:11,130 S5: Yeah. 448 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:13,320 S4: And that's essentially what you're saying because that's what we 449 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:15,750 S4: want to know. How do we know the way? And 450 00:24:15,750 --> 00:24:19,620 S4: Jesus said the most simple and profound way. He didn't say, well, Thomas, 451 00:24:19,619 --> 00:24:22,710 S4: you work hard enough. You please me, you make me happy. 452 00:24:22,710 --> 00:24:25,470 S4: You be a good guy, a great citizen. You go 453 00:24:25,470 --> 00:24:29,660 S4: to church, you love your people. No. All he said was, Thomas, 454 00:24:29,690 --> 00:24:33,350 S4: I am the way, I am the truth, and I 455 00:24:33,380 --> 00:24:36,020 S4: am the life. And nobody comes to the father except 456 00:24:36,020 --> 00:24:38,690 S4: through me. So if you've been banging your head and 457 00:24:38,690 --> 00:24:43,189 S4: burning your hands trying to get to heaven, that's because 458 00:24:43,190 --> 00:24:45,889 S4: you're trying to make a way. When Jesus is the way. 459 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,470 S4: So to go to heaven simply means you say, Jesus, 460 00:24:48,470 --> 00:24:51,500 S4: I trust that you are the way. You are the truth. 461 00:24:51,530 --> 00:24:54,229 S4: It's not my truth. It's not anybody else's truth. It's 462 00:24:54,230 --> 00:24:57,410 S4: your truth. And because you died on the cross, that 463 00:24:57,410 --> 00:25:01,940 S4: cross became the bridge that I can walk across. When 464 00:25:01,940 --> 00:25:06,380 S4: I trust you to walk from my sin into your salvation. 465 00:25:06,380 --> 00:25:10,550 S4: From my sad, sinful ending to the glorious, unending of 466 00:25:10,550 --> 00:25:12,050 S4: being with you forever. 467 00:25:12,350 --> 00:25:15,890 S1: You know, if you have given that thought and right now, 468 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,109 S1: or even praying that prayer, we'd love to connect with you. 469 00:25:18,109 --> 00:25:22,670 S1: You can email us at The Land and the book@moody.edu, 470 00:25:22,700 --> 00:25:24,560 S1: if you would like to talk with a real human 471 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:26,720 S1: being right now, who knows Jesus, who knows the way 472 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,510 S1: to heaven and they'll be glad to pray with you. 473 00:25:29,660 --> 00:25:34,909 S1: Call 888. Need him. 888. Need him. Jennifer. Our time 474 00:25:34,910 --> 00:25:38,150 S1: is gone, man. It's a blast. Always to connect. Thank 475 00:25:38,180 --> 00:25:39,800 S1: you for your work on this book. Thank you for 476 00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:40,790 S1: sharing with us. 477 00:25:40,820 --> 00:25:43,250 S4: Yeah. My pleasure. Thank you John. Bless you. 478 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:45,770 S1: And again, a link to Jennifer's book about heaven when 479 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:50,570 S1: Faith Becomes Sight at our website, the land and the book.org. 480 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:52,790 S1: What are you wondering about when you read the Bible? 481 00:25:52,790 --> 00:26:07,040 S1: We'll talk about it next on the land and the book. Hey, 482 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:09,080 S1: thanks for listening to the land and the book. If 483 00:26:09,109 --> 00:26:12,080 S1: you weren't listening, then probably nobody would be listening. I mean, 484 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,510 S1: come on, it takes all of us, right? Thanks for 485 00:26:14,510 --> 00:26:17,389 S1: your company. Appreciate knowing you're out there. I'm John Geiger, 486 00:26:17,390 --> 00:26:20,570 S1: by the way. Segment three is devoted to questions and 487 00:26:20,570 --> 00:26:24,680 S1: answers from Doctor Gerald Peterman, our resident Bible expert here 488 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,130 S1: on the Moody Bible Institute faculty. How's your day going today, Jerry? 489 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:30,530 S6: Ah, I haven't got frostbite, so I'm doing really well. 490 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,530 S1: Okay, well, you know, I'm going to get to our 491 00:26:33,530 --> 00:26:37,070 S1: first question after I focus for a moment on Passover itself. 492 00:26:37,100 --> 00:26:40,490 S1: What does Passover mean for us as believers in Jesus? 493 00:26:40,490 --> 00:26:43,070 S1: Some might remember the story from the book of Exodus, 494 00:26:43,070 --> 00:26:45,860 S1: but there's so much more to it. Did you know 495 00:26:45,859 --> 00:26:48,890 S1: that the Last Supper was actually a Passover meal? Not 496 00:26:48,890 --> 00:26:52,639 S1: only did Jesus and his disciples celebrate Passover, it also 497 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,790 S1: foreshadowed his death on the cross for our redemption. And 498 00:26:55,790 --> 00:26:58,340 S1: Jewish people have been observing the feast of Passover for 499 00:26:58,369 --> 00:27:02,090 S1: thousands of years and understanding the history. The importance of 500 00:27:02,090 --> 00:27:04,460 S1: this holiday will help you and me better connect with 501 00:27:04,460 --> 00:27:07,609 S1: our Jewish friends and neighbors and coworkers. Hey, what better 502 00:27:07,609 --> 00:27:11,600 S1: way is there to learn about Passover than to experience 503 00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,480 S1: a Passover Seder yourself? We did this last year. It 504 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:18,050 S1: was awesome. And if you've never celebrated Passover well, our 505 00:27:18,050 --> 00:27:20,540 S1: friends at Life in Messiah would love to partner with 506 00:27:20,540 --> 00:27:24,590 S1: you in hosting a Seder experience. Every year their staff 507 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,800 S1: engaged churches and small groups in an interactive Messiah in 508 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:33,000 S1: the Passover Seder, allowing participants to taste and to see 509 00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,360 S1: the redemption story firsthand. If you're interested, and I bet 510 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,030 S1: you are in having somebody come lead a Seder in 511 00:27:39,030 --> 00:27:45,090 S1: your area, just head to life in messiah.org. Life in messiah.org. 512 00:27:45,090 --> 00:27:47,879 S1: Click on the Moody Radio button there to learn more. Again, 513 00:27:47,910 --> 00:27:52,170 S1: that's life in messiah.org. All right. He's got a lot 514 00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:54,810 S1: of time invested in your questions, and I'm looking forward 515 00:27:54,810 --> 00:27:57,300 S1: to hearing some of those answers. Ready for this first one. 516 00:27:57,300 --> 00:27:58,020 S6: Yes, sir. 517 00:27:58,050 --> 00:28:00,480 S1: All right Gerald Peterman never breaks a sweat. Here he 518 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:02,820 S1: is with a question from Ken who takes us to 519 00:28:02,850 --> 00:28:06,720 S1: Daniel 11. Verse 37 says the Antichrist will have no 520 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:09,990 S1: interest in women. I've heard various opinions on what this means, 521 00:28:09,990 --> 00:28:12,300 S1: but I'm wondering if he will be gay. What is 522 00:28:12,300 --> 00:28:13,050 S1: your opinion? 523 00:28:13,050 --> 00:28:16,619 S6: Well, good. Let's go to Daniel 1137 and read it. 524 00:28:16,650 --> 00:28:20,190 S6: We see two things that the Antichrist will pay no 525 00:28:20,190 --> 00:28:24,040 S6: attention to. It says he shall pay no attention to 526 00:28:24,070 --> 00:28:27,129 S6: the gods of his fathers. So gods is the first thing. 527 00:28:27,130 --> 00:28:31,390 S6: He's anti-God. Further, it says he will pay no attention 528 00:28:31,390 --> 00:28:35,680 S6: to the one who is loved by women. So it's 529 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:39,700 S6: not ignoring women, but ignoring the one loved by women. 530 00:28:39,700 --> 00:28:43,060 S6: I think Doctor Michael Dolnick has it right when in 531 00:28:43,060 --> 00:28:46,390 S6: the Moody Bible Commentary he says this is a reference 532 00:28:46,390 --> 00:28:49,420 S6: to the longing of Jewish women to give birth to 533 00:28:49,450 --> 00:28:53,860 S6: the Messiah. So in other words, it's not a romantic reference, 534 00:28:53,860 --> 00:28:57,820 S6: but a spiritual one. The Antichrist, as his name tells us, 535 00:28:57,850 --> 00:29:00,160 S6: is opposed to the Christ. 536 00:29:00,670 --> 00:29:01,300 S5: Lorna. 537 00:29:01,330 --> 00:29:04,000 S1: Wants to know about. First Chronicles two seven and first 538 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:07,540 S1: Chronicles four, verse one, that mention Karmi as a descendant 539 00:29:07,540 --> 00:29:10,330 S1: of Judah who was Karmi, and also who was the 540 00:29:10,330 --> 00:29:12,310 S1: father of her and Shobal. 541 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,720 S6: From first Chronicles, it's clear that Karmi is a descendant 542 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:20,290 S6: of Judah, but it's difficult to know exactly how Karmi 543 00:29:20,290 --> 00:29:25,930 S6: is remembered as the father of aCaa, or sometimes spelled akin, 544 00:29:25,930 --> 00:29:30,040 S6: who defied Israel by stealing and hiding in his tent. 545 00:29:30,070 --> 00:29:33,280 S6: Things taken from Jericho. I'll go back and read that story. 546 00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:36,580 S6: It's well worth reading. That event takes place in Joshua nine, 547 00:29:36,580 --> 00:29:39,580 S6: but we should keep in mind that Genesis 46 tells 548 00:29:39,580 --> 00:29:42,970 S6: us Judah and his brothers and their families went into Egypt, 549 00:29:42,970 --> 00:29:47,050 S6: and then 400 years later, out comes Joshua with the 550 00:29:47,050 --> 00:29:49,480 S6: people of God for the conquest of the land. So 551 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,930 S6: there's a very large gap of time between Judah and 552 00:29:52,930 --> 00:29:56,470 S6: his descendant Carmi. Now, wait, there's a second part of 553 00:29:56,470 --> 00:29:59,740 S6: this question, and that's about her and Shobal. Her and 554 00:29:59,740 --> 00:30:03,190 S6: Shobal are mentioned in First Chronicles four one. They're descendants 555 00:30:03,190 --> 00:30:05,890 S6: of Judah, but in both cases it's difficult to know 556 00:30:05,890 --> 00:30:08,980 S6: where to place them. Exactly. I think probably they're from 557 00:30:08,980 --> 00:30:12,100 S6: the family of Caleb, from the Tribe of Judah. 558 00:30:12,130 --> 00:30:15,460 S1: Gina is reading Charlie Dyer's book, Who Owns the Land? 559 00:30:15,460 --> 00:30:18,760 S1: And she says. In it, Doctor Dyer describes the rise 560 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,870 S1: of Christian animosity toward Jews in the Byzantine era as 561 00:30:22,900 --> 00:30:26,980 S1: assassins of God and their authority being more merciless than 562 00:30:26,980 --> 00:30:29,920 S1: their heathen enemies. She wants to know what events led 563 00:30:29,950 --> 00:30:32,500 S1: to the decline of the early church under Peter to 564 00:30:32,530 --> 00:30:35,710 S1: allow such hatred toward the Jews. Aside from their perception 565 00:30:35,710 --> 00:30:39,700 S1: of being assassins, surely the apostles and their students taught otherwise. 566 00:30:39,700 --> 00:30:43,090 S6: You are right to wonder how the apostles and the 567 00:30:43,090 --> 00:30:46,900 S6: early church leaders thought about Jews. And we don't need 568 00:30:46,900 --> 00:30:51,370 S6: to speculate. We can go right to Romans and Romans nine, 569 00:30:51,370 --> 00:30:54,489 S6: verses three and four. Paul says, I could wish that 570 00:30:54,490 --> 00:30:57,370 S6: I myself were cursed and cut off from Christ for 571 00:30:57,370 --> 00:31:00,280 S6: the sake of my brothers, those of my own race, 572 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,610 S6: the people of Israel. And then he begins chapter 11. 573 00:31:03,610 --> 00:31:07,420 S6: He's asking questions. Did God reject his own people? And 574 00:31:07,420 --> 00:31:13,300 S6: his answer is by no means so clearly, Paul, the 575 00:31:13,300 --> 00:31:16,690 S6: early church. The book of acts. They're not anti-Jewish. They're 576 00:31:16,690 --> 00:31:20,410 S6: not anti-Semitic. So the question is, what happened. A key 577 00:31:20,410 --> 00:31:23,080 S6: turning point was the rise of the allegorical method of 578 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:27,190 S6: interpreting Scripture, which happened during the time of origin. He 579 00:31:27,190 --> 00:31:31,360 S6: was a Christian theologian in the second century. This allegorical 580 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:34,120 S6: reading of scripture was adopted by Jerome. You might recognize 581 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,270 S6: that name and by Augustine, and it became prominent well 582 00:31:37,270 --> 00:31:41,050 S6: up into the Reformation era. Why does that matter? It 583 00:31:41,050 --> 00:31:46,120 S6: matters because in the allegorical interpretation, all the kingdom promises 584 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:50,170 S6: made to Israel in the Old Testament were transferred to 585 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:53,830 S6: the church. And then once the church, or at least 586 00:31:53,830 --> 00:31:57,400 S6: some people in church, were thinking of themselves as a 587 00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,800 S6: replacement for Israel as the people of God, it opened 588 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,130 S6: the door for the church to meld together with the 589 00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:07,930 S6: anti-Semitism of the secular Roman Empire, which was evident following 590 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:09,880 S6: the Jewish revolt in the first century and then in 591 00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,090 S6: the second century. So that's that's kind of a quick 592 00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:14,800 S6: history of how this happened. 593 00:32:14,830 --> 00:32:17,230 S1: From Moody Radio. This is the land and the book. 594 00:32:17,230 --> 00:32:20,320 S1: I'm John Gager with our Bible answer man, Doctor Gerald 595 00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,890 S1: Peterman of Moody Bible Institute faculty. We're glad to have 596 00:32:23,890 --> 00:32:26,530 S1: you on board with us. Since we've already brought Peter 597 00:32:26,530 --> 00:32:29,290 S1: into the conversation. Let's continue with this question from Betty. 598 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,260 S1: She says in acts two, when the Holy Spirit came 599 00:32:32,260 --> 00:32:35,800 S1: and enabled the apostles to speak in other languages, thus 600 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,670 S1: spreading the gospel message, did the apostles change the language 601 00:32:39,670 --> 00:32:42,250 S1: as they spoke to different peoples, or did some speak 602 00:32:42,250 --> 00:32:46,150 S1: in one dialect and others in another? And when Peter spoke, 603 00:32:46,150 --> 00:32:49,180 S1: did the Holy Spirit act as a universal translator, so 604 00:32:49,180 --> 00:32:52,060 S1: that Peter spoke in one language? But the people gathered, 605 00:32:52,060 --> 00:32:54,520 S1: each heard in their own language? Well, I. 606 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:57,580 S6: Really appreciate that question. We go to acts two four 607 00:32:57,610 --> 00:33:00,310 S6: and here's what we're told. And they were all filled 608 00:33:00,310 --> 00:33:02,530 S6: with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other 609 00:33:02,530 --> 00:33:06,760 S6: tongues as the spirit gave them utterance. Now this word 610 00:33:06,790 --> 00:33:09,550 S6: tongue is a typical word in the New Testament for 611 00:33:09,580 --> 00:33:14,800 S6: a language or a dialect. Revelation five nine. Revelation seven nine. 612 00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,970 S6: So the spirit gave this supernatural ability to speak in 613 00:33:18,970 --> 00:33:23,200 S6: other languages, namely the languages of the people who had 614 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:26,350 S6: all gathered together for the festival in Jerusalem, its people 615 00:33:26,350 --> 00:33:30,070 S6: from all over Parthians and Medes and Elamites, and residents 616 00:33:30,070 --> 00:33:34,420 S6: of Mesopotamia. It's a stunning work of God. So I 617 00:33:34,420 --> 00:33:38,530 S6: take it that the spirit enables the people in the 618 00:33:38,530 --> 00:33:41,890 S6: church to speak the languages they don't know. So the 619 00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:46,630 S6: gospel is spread. It's a spirit given utterance. But I 620 00:33:46,630 --> 00:33:49,990 S6: take it later when Peter preached his first sermon, acts two, 621 00:33:50,020 --> 00:33:54,490 S6: verses 14 to 36, he preaches a language he knew, 622 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:58,270 S6: probably Aramaic, although it might have been Greek, and gave 623 00:33:58,270 --> 00:34:03,310 S6: that first gospel message and 3000 people came forward. Stunning stuff. 624 00:34:03,340 --> 00:34:03,730 S1: Yeah. 625 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:04,690 S5: For sure. 626 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:08,380 S1: All right, let's head to Thessalonians. Todd asks if the 627 00:34:08,380 --> 00:34:12,010 S1: church's removal is the next event on the prophetic calendar. 628 00:34:12,010 --> 00:34:15,609 S1: Why did Paul not tell the Thessalonians the fact that 629 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,580 S1: they were still here to hear his letter was proof 630 00:34:18,580 --> 00:34:20,529 S1: that the day of the Lord had not come. Instead, 631 00:34:20,530 --> 00:34:23,680 S1: he says, the proof was that the man of lawlessness 632 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:27,040 S1: had not appeared in Second Thessalonians chapter three. Wouldn't the 633 00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:29,859 S1: fact that the Thessalonians were still there have been the 634 00:34:29,860 --> 00:34:30,850 S1: greatest evidence? 635 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:34,120 S6: Well, thanks, Tony, I appreciate that question. Basically, I think 636 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:37,000 S6: what Paul did was he answered the way he did 637 00:34:37,030 --> 00:34:41,560 S6: because the question the church asked didn't focus specifically on 638 00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,100 S6: rapture or why they were still there. Paul went back 639 00:34:45,100 --> 00:34:47,950 S6: to a teaching he had given them previously in First 640 00:34:47,950 --> 00:34:52,120 S6: Thessalonians chapter four. But apparently the believers in Thessalonica had 641 00:34:52,150 --> 00:34:55,870 S6: either received a fake letter supposedly written by Paul, or 642 00:34:55,870 --> 00:34:58,330 S6: a verbal report from someone who claimed to have heard 643 00:34:58,330 --> 00:35:02,830 S6: from Paul. Because we come to Second Thessalonians chapter two, 644 00:35:02,860 --> 00:35:06,009 S6: we find this concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus 645 00:35:06,010 --> 00:35:08,680 S6: and our being gathered to him. We ask you, brothers, 646 00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:12,100 S6: not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy 647 00:35:12,100 --> 00:35:15,629 S6: or report or letter supposed to have come from us 648 00:35:15,630 --> 00:35:18,450 S6: saying that the day of the Lord had already come. Now, 649 00:35:18,450 --> 00:35:21,719 S6: I suspect that the persecution they were experiencing added to 650 00:35:21,750 --> 00:35:26,970 S6: their emotional distress, making this fake news even more plausible 651 00:35:26,969 --> 00:35:30,870 S6: to them. The fact that they were still there, experiencing 652 00:35:30,900 --> 00:35:34,800 S6: terrible persecution, was what was causing them to doubt the 653 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,500 S6: order of events that Paul had previously taught. So he 654 00:35:37,500 --> 00:35:40,680 S6: takes them back to what he previously taught. He chose 655 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:44,460 S6: one piece of teaching that could help them be confident 656 00:35:44,460 --> 00:35:46,799 S6: that they were not in the day of the Lord, 657 00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:48,690 S6: and that fact was the reality that the day of 658 00:35:48,690 --> 00:35:51,780 S6: the Lord would not come until the rebellion came first 659 00:35:51,780 --> 00:35:55,440 S6: and the man of lawlessness was revealed, the man doomed 660 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,830 S6: to destruction. It was clear that that man had not 661 00:35:58,830 --> 00:36:01,529 S6: showed up yet. So because that was the fact that 662 00:36:01,530 --> 00:36:04,410 S6: he had previously told them, he reminds them of it 663 00:36:04,410 --> 00:36:06,899 S6: so they can be confident that the day had not 664 00:36:06,900 --> 00:36:07,740 S6: yet come. 665 00:36:07,770 --> 00:36:09,900 S1: And that's a look at some of the Bible questions 666 00:36:09,900 --> 00:36:12,930 S1: that have come our way. And if you didn't hear yours, well, 667 00:36:12,930 --> 00:36:15,480 S1: it's either in the queue or you didn't ask it. 668 00:36:15,510 --> 00:36:18,000 S1: All right, now the fun part is on us. The 669 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:19,710 S1: other is on you. If you didn't ask it, you 670 00:36:19,710 --> 00:36:22,320 S1: still can. Why not send an email to Doctor Gerald 671 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:28,410 S1: Peterman in care of the land and the book@moody.edu. The 672 00:36:28,410 --> 00:36:31,590 S1: land and the book at Moody dot. Edu. How long 673 00:36:31,590 --> 00:36:33,630 S1: does it take to get an answer? Typically from you. 674 00:36:33,660 --> 00:36:35,310 S6: Anywhere from 2 to 3 days. 675 00:36:35,340 --> 00:36:37,110 S1: Okay, so it's not horrible. You're not waiting a week. 676 00:36:37,110 --> 00:36:39,540 S1: Two weeks. No. Thanks for your good work on that. 677 00:36:39,540 --> 00:36:41,760 S1: Thank you for being a part of the land and 678 00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,580 S1: the book. We're up next. We're opening up our Bibles. 679 00:36:44,580 --> 00:36:46,740 S1: We're going to somewhere in the Holy Land. We're going 680 00:36:46,739 --> 00:36:49,440 S1: to somewhere in Scripture. Charlie Dyer will weld them together. 681 00:36:49,440 --> 00:37:05,520 S1: You'll never forget it in his devotional. Next. His name 682 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:08,790 S1: was Uzziah. And believe it or not, an inscription that 683 00:37:08,790 --> 00:37:11,730 S1: has everything to do with his life and death. Well, Charlie, 684 00:37:11,730 --> 00:37:14,580 S1: that's the subject of your devotional coming up. Is that right? 685 00:37:14,610 --> 00:37:17,609 S1: That's exactly right, John. And we're headed for Second Chronicles, 686 00:37:17,610 --> 00:37:20,640 S1: chapter 26. Welcome back to this final segment of The 687 00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,220 S1: land and the book. By the way, before we head 688 00:37:23,219 --> 00:37:26,070 S1: to Charlie's devotional, let's pause for a thought from somebody 689 00:37:26,070 --> 00:37:28,530 S1: who's traveled to the Holy Land and has this reflection 690 00:37:28,530 --> 00:37:29,490 S1: for you and me. 691 00:37:33,630 --> 00:37:38,219 S7: The highlight for me was today at Mount Nebo. Whenever 692 00:37:38,219 --> 00:37:41,850 S7: we've been to a site, a biblical site that is 693 00:37:41,850 --> 00:37:46,500 S7: for certain site and not are we really think it's 694 00:37:46,500 --> 00:37:54,690 S7: been overwhelming. And to stand there and visualize Moses looking 695 00:37:54,690 --> 00:37:58,739 S7: over the promised land where God in his grace let 696 00:37:58,739 --> 00:38:03,360 S7: him see it. But even for a godly man like that, 697 00:38:03,390 --> 00:38:09,960 S7: disobedience had consequences. It was a tremendous learning experience and reminder. 698 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:15,450 S7: Very sobering reminder. And then our moody faculty teacher in 699 00:38:15,450 --> 00:38:19,800 S7: reading the Scripture, said something I had never thought about, 700 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:23,670 S7: and that was that. On the Mount of Transfiguration, God 701 00:38:23,670 --> 00:38:28,530 S7: showed his grace to Moses by letting him stand in 702 00:38:28,530 --> 00:38:31,049 S7: the Promised Land. I had never thought of that in 703 00:38:31,050 --> 00:38:31,860 S7: my life. 704 00:38:31,890 --> 00:38:35,969 S8: What was important to me was time on Mount Arbel 705 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,419 S8: to be able to look over all of the land 706 00:38:39,420 --> 00:38:45,030 S8: where Jesus walked and preached, and for me, it was 707 00:38:45,030 --> 00:38:51,270 S8: a real time of spiritual rejuvenation recommitment, and it was 708 00:38:51,270 --> 00:38:54,960 S8: extremely emotional and moving to be able to have that 709 00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:55,890 S8: time there. 710 00:38:57,660 --> 00:39:00,029 S1: All right, Charlie, you've got a continuing devotional series here. 711 00:39:00,030 --> 00:39:01,200 S1: What's our theme again? 712 00:39:01,230 --> 00:39:01,620 S5: Well, it's. 713 00:39:01,650 --> 00:39:04,650 S2: Actually going to focus on 11 inscriptions that connect us 714 00:39:04,650 --> 00:39:07,200 S2: with the Word of God. And and in this series, 715 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,620 S2: we're examining this inscription uncovered by archaeologists. That will give 716 00:39:10,620 --> 00:39:14,370 S2: us additional insight into our understanding of God's Word and 717 00:39:14,370 --> 00:39:17,190 S2: today's journey. Well, it might seem just a bit ghoulish 718 00:39:17,190 --> 00:39:20,910 S2: because we're heading to a tomb. Well, not actually a tomb, 719 00:39:20,910 --> 00:39:23,400 S2: but to an inscription that was once affixed to the 720 00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:26,310 S2: entrance of a tomb. The stone plaque is rather small. 721 00:39:26,310 --> 00:39:28,859 S2: It's about a foot square, and it's now in the 722 00:39:28,860 --> 00:39:31,680 S2: Israel Museum. But it was discovered by an archaeologist in 723 00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:35,940 S2: 1931 at the Russian Orthodox Church on the Mount of Olives. 724 00:39:35,940 --> 00:39:38,670 S2: The plaque, written in a Hebrew script that was in 725 00:39:38,670 --> 00:39:41,640 S2: use about the time of Jesus, says rather simply and 726 00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:45,150 S2: yet directly to this place were brought the bones of Uzziah, 727 00:39:45,180 --> 00:39:49,050 S2: king of Judah, not to be opened the bones of 728 00:39:49,050 --> 00:39:52,710 S2: King Uzziah buried somewhere on the Mount of Olives, but 729 00:39:52,710 --> 00:39:56,009 S2: with a plaque dating to the time of Jesus. That's 730 00:39:56,010 --> 00:39:59,219 S2: a mystery worthy of the legendary Sherlock Holmes. And to 731 00:39:59,250 --> 00:40:02,580 S2: solve it, we need to visit Jerusalem during the reign 732 00:40:02,610 --> 00:40:05,640 S2: of this amazing monarch. So join me on a journey 733 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:09,240 S2: to discover the triumphs and tragedies of one of Judah's 734 00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:12,690 S2: longest reigning monarchs. The story of Uzziah is found in 735 00:40:12,690 --> 00:40:15,989 S2: the Books of Kings and Chronicles, but relatively few know 736 00:40:15,989 --> 00:40:18,720 S2: any of the details concerning his life. Here's what the 737 00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,080 S2: Book of Second Chronicles tells us about him. Uzziah was 738 00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:24,870 S2: 16 years old when he became king, and he reigned 739 00:40:24,870 --> 00:40:28,919 S2: 52 years in Jerusalem. The only king who ruled for 740 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:32,820 S2: a longer period of time was Manasseh. But more significant 741 00:40:32,820 --> 00:40:35,790 S2: than the length of his reign was the spiritual quality 742 00:40:35,790 --> 00:40:39,240 S2: of it. The writer of Chronicles summarized it this way, 743 00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:42,029 S2: and he did right in the sight of the Lord. 744 00:40:42,210 --> 00:40:46,440 S2: He was one of the good kings militarily. Uzziah strengthened 745 00:40:46,469 --> 00:40:49,410 S2: the kingdom. He prevailed over the Philistines on the west, 746 00:40:49,410 --> 00:40:52,680 S2: and the ammonites, Mennonites and Arabian kingdoms to the east. 747 00:40:52,710 --> 00:40:56,790 S2: His reign saw an emphasis on national defense. He fortified 748 00:40:56,790 --> 00:41:00,060 S2: the walls of Jerusalem, and he built defensive structures in 749 00:41:00,060 --> 00:41:02,640 S2: the wilderness. In fact, the Bible goes out of its 750 00:41:02,670 --> 00:41:07,000 S2: way to focus on all his military preparations. Patients. Much 751 00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:10,540 S2: like modern Israel, Uzziah developed a trained army that could 752 00:41:10,540 --> 00:41:13,210 S2: be called up for battle at a moment's notice, and 753 00:41:13,210 --> 00:41:16,240 S2: he also focused on making sure his defenses included the 754 00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:20,470 S2: most advanced weapons of the day. Moreover, Uzziah prepared for 755 00:41:20,469 --> 00:41:24,940 S2: all the army shields, spears, helmets, body armor, bows, and 756 00:41:24,940 --> 00:41:28,510 S2: sling stones, and in Jerusalem he made engines of war, 757 00:41:28,510 --> 00:41:31,210 S2: invented by skilled men, to be on the towers and 758 00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:33,850 S2: on the corners for the purpose of shooting arrows and 759 00:41:33,850 --> 00:41:38,560 S2: great stones. But Uzziah focused on more than just the military. 760 00:41:38,590 --> 00:41:41,200 S2: The writer of Second Chronicles goes on to say he 761 00:41:41,230 --> 00:41:44,440 S2: hewed many cisterns, for he had much livestock, both in 762 00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:47,320 S2: the lowland and in the plain. He also had plowmen 763 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:50,140 S2: and vine dressers in the hill country and the fertile fields, 764 00:41:50,140 --> 00:41:53,259 S2: for he loved the soil. In an age when water 765 00:41:53,260 --> 00:41:56,680 S2: and food weren't things taken for granted, Uzziah worked to 766 00:41:56,680 --> 00:42:00,460 S2: ensure a steady supply of both for his people. King 767 00:42:00,460 --> 00:42:05,259 S2: Uzziah was militarily and economically strong. He was smart, talented 768 00:42:05,260 --> 00:42:10,050 S2: and godly. And then he made one incredibly stupid decision. 769 00:42:10,050 --> 00:42:13,140 S2: He started to believe all the accolades and praise being 770 00:42:13,140 --> 00:42:16,710 S2: heaped on him by the people. I really am amazing. 771 00:42:16,710 --> 00:42:20,700 S2: In fact, I'm indispensable. God needs me and it's time 772 00:42:20,700 --> 00:42:23,670 S2: I approached him on a more equal basis. Other kings 773 00:42:23,670 --> 00:42:26,790 S2: get to lead worship in their nations, why can't I? 774 00:42:26,820 --> 00:42:28,589 S2: I have a right to go to the temple and 775 00:42:28,620 --> 00:42:30,989 S2: offer incense to God. And that's just what I'm going 776 00:42:31,020 --> 00:42:34,920 S2: to do. Uzziah went to the temple to burn incense 777 00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,950 S2: on the altar. The high priest, along with 80 other 778 00:42:37,950 --> 00:42:41,669 S2: courageous priests, tried to block his way. It is not 779 00:42:41,670 --> 00:42:44,340 S2: for you, Uzziah, to burn incense to the Lord, but 780 00:42:44,340 --> 00:42:47,730 S2: for the priests, the sons of Aaron. Were it not 781 00:42:47,730 --> 00:42:51,630 S2: so tragic? This scene would almost be comical. Picture it. 782 00:42:51,630 --> 00:42:54,120 S2: The doorway to the holy place of the temple is 783 00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,779 S2: open and standing at the threshold as King Uzziah censer 784 00:42:57,810 --> 00:43:01,560 S2: in hand, ready to offer the burning incense. Behind him 785 00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:05,149 S2: on the steps are the palace guard, his royal secret service, 786 00:43:05,150 --> 00:43:08,210 S2: while inside the temple is the High priest, and filling 787 00:43:08,210 --> 00:43:11,719 S2: the space behind him are 80 other priests, all trying 788 00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:15,530 S2: to block his path. The Bible says Uzziah became enraged 789 00:43:15,530 --> 00:43:17,840 S2: at the priests. Who do you think you are? Don't 790 00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:20,390 S2: you know I'm the king? I can do whatever I want. 791 00:43:20,420 --> 00:43:23,780 S2: The priest took their lives in their hands to oppose Uzziah, 792 00:43:23,780 --> 00:43:26,660 S2: and I suppose it really was a frightening moment for them. 793 00:43:26,660 --> 00:43:30,110 S2: But they needn't have worried, because God was about to 794 00:43:30,140 --> 00:43:33,110 S2: step out from behind the curtain to resolve the issue. 795 00:43:33,110 --> 00:43:35,960 S2: And he did it in a most dramatic way. As 796 00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:40,339 S2: Uzziah screamed at the priests, leprosy broke out on his forehead. 797 00:43:40,370 --> 00:43:43,490 S2: Leprosy was seen as a sign of God's displeasure. And 798 00:43:43,489 --> 00:43:46,939 S2: just like God did to Moses's sister Miriam. So now 799 00:43:46,940 --> 00:43:50,600 S2: he extended his hand of judgment against King Uzziah. The 800 00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:52,850 S2: king was forced to flee from the temple, and the 801 00:43:52,850 --> 00:43:57,230 S2: Bible records the sad conclusion to an otherwise amazing life. 802 00:43:57,260 --> 00:43:59,810 S2: And King Uzziah was a leper to the day of 803 00:43:59,810 --> 00:44:02,660 S2: his death, and he lived in a separate house, being 804 00:44:02,660 --> 00:44:04,610 S2: a leper, for he was cut off from the house 805 00:44:04,610 --> 00:44:07,430 S2: of the Lord. So Uzziah slept with his fathers, and 806 00:44:07,430 --> 00:44:09,350 S2: they buried him with his fathers in the field of 807 00:44:09,350 --> 00:44:12,440 S2: the grave which belongs to the kings. For they said, 808 00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:16,400 S2: he is a leper. Uzziah went from triumph to tragedy. 809 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:19,549 S2: In one dramatic moment, the king, who thought so highly 810 00:44:19,550 --> 00:44:22,340 S2: of himself that he could barge into God's house and 811 00:44:22,340 --> 00:44:25,460 S2: presume on God, ended up being barred from his own 812 00:44:25,460 --> 00:44:28,549 S2: royal palace, and when he died, they buried him in 813 00:44:28,550 --> 00:44:31,430 S2: the field where the royal tomb was located, but not 814 00:44:31,430 --> 00:44:34,190 S2: in the tomb itself. And the last word spoken about 815 00:44:34,190 --> 00:44:37,969 S2: him in Second Chronicles 36 tells us why he is 816 00:44:37,969 --> 00:44:41,150 S2: a leper. Fast forward to the time of Jesus. New 817 00:44:41,150 --> 00:44:44,480 S2: construction is taking place in Jerusalem, and during the construction 818 00:44:44,510 --> 00:44:47,960 S2: a tomb is uncovered, the separate tomb hewn for leprous 819 00:44:47,989 --> 00:44:51,260 S2: King Uzziah. The bones need to be moved. The grave 820 00:44:51,260 --> 00:44:55,490 S2: relocated outside the expanding city. The likely location is on 821 00:44:55,489 --> 00:44:57,739 S2: the Mount of Olives and the grave is about to 822 00:44:57,739 --> 00:45:01,040 S2: be sealed up. A small plaque is placed at the entrance, 823 00:45:01,070 --> 00:45:04,730 S2: a plaque that reminds visitors about the tomb's occupant. To 824 00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:08,510 S2: this place were brought the bones of Uzziah, king of Judah. 825 00:45:08,540 --> 00:45:11,899 S2: Not to be opened. So what lesson can we learn 826 00:45:11,900 --> 00:45:15,799 S2: from this small limestone plaque? And the king it commemorates? 827 00:45:15,830 --> 00:45:21,860 S2: Perhaps it's this many start well, but far fewer finish well. 828 00:45:21,890 --> 00:45:25,010 S2: However far along you are in your walk with Christ, 829 00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:28,489 S2: don't ever let yourself reach a point where you forget 830 00:45:28,489 --> 00:45:32,000 S2: that he is indispensable to you, and start thinking that 831 00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:35,930 S2: you are indispensable to him. It only takes one foolish 832 00:45:35,930 --> 00:45:39,350 S2: mistake to ruin a life. That's the real message of 833 00:45:39,350 --> 00:45:42,260 S2: the inscription on Uzziah's tomb. And it ought to be 834 00:45:42,260 --> 00:45:45,860 S2: a flashing warning light to all of us. Now, if 835 00:45:45,890 --> 00:45:48,080 S2: you'd like to see a photo I took of this plaque, 836 00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:50,750 S2: which is now in the Israel Museum, be sure to 837 00:45:50,780 --> 00:45:53,210 S2: head over to our land in the book Facebook page 838 00:45:53,210 --> 00:45:55,010 S2: where I'll be posting that photo. 839 00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:58,040 S1: Thank you Charlie. And maybe as you listen to this 840 00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:03,290 S1: whole conversation, this arrogant king you're saying to yourself, quite frankly, 841 00:46:03,290 --> 00:46:06,020 S1: I've been calling the shots in my life. I've been 842 00:46:06,020 --> 00:46:09,529 S1: the king and it hasn't been God himself. And maybe 843 00:46:09,530 --> 00:46:11,630 S1: you've come to the place where you realize you need 844 00:46:11,630 --> 00:46:14,870 S1: the Lord in your life. You. You need a Savior. Well, 845 00:46:14,900 --> 00:46:18,020 S1: today is your day to take action on that. Charlie, 846 00:46:18,020 --> 00:46:20,450 S1: we've we've got a volunteer at a phone number. We're 847 00:46:20,450 --> 00:46:24,049 S1: going to give out. It's called eight, eight, eight. Need him? Eight. Eight. 848 00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:26,930 S1: Eight need him. And listeners can call there. And right now, 849 00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:29,960 S1: talk to a real volunteer who knows Jesus and who 850 00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:32,420 S1: can help them know Jesus. Seems to me this is 851 00:46:32,420 --> 00:46:34,219 S1: something we ought to take care of today, right? 852 00:46:34,250 --> 00:46:36,710 S2: Oh, I agree completely. And there's no pressure on the individual. 853 00:46:36,710 --> 00:46:39,890 S2: But if you want to find solid answers to life's questions, 854 00:46:39,890 --> 00:46:41,240 S2: that's where you need to go right now. 855 00:46:41,270 --> 00:46:45,470 S1: Again, that toll free number is 888. Need him. Always 856 00:46:45,469 --> 00:46:48,319 S1: great to visit with our host, Charlie Dyer. I'm John Gager, 857 00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:50,899 S1: thanking you for listening to the Land and the book, 858 00:46:50,930 --> 00:46:55,040 S1: a production of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.