1 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:08,639 S1: Let's jump into the deep end of the pool together 2 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:11,000 S1: today on Chris Fabry Live. It's the deep end of 3 00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:14,080 S1: the pool where the water is choppy, and it may 4 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:16,320 S1: be a little hard to keep your head above water. 5 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:21,320 S1: In this end, parents are saying, what happened? I don't understand, 6 00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:24,800 S1: what do we do? And the adult children are saying, 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:28,640 S1: please honor this boundary. This is what I need right now. 8 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:32,199 S1: I can't explain it again to you. What do you 9 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,160 S1: do as a parent who's waiting? What do you do 10 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:38,920 S1: as the adult child who really wants a relationship but 11 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:41,239 S1: just can't keep going the way things have gone all 12 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:44,559 S1: your life? Last month, Doctor Kathy Cook came along. We 13 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:48,000 S1: offered her latest book as our thank you, and something 14 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,440 S1: told me that we needed to offer it more than 15 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,800 S1: one month. And from the response, the depth of the 16 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,520 S1: response and reactions from you, I think it was a 17 00:00:56,520 --> 00:01:00,770 S1: good call to hear in September. Keep offering that. So 18 00:01:00,770 --> 00:01:02,970 S1: if at any point today you say, I need what 19 00:01:02,970 --> 00:01:05,810 S1: you're talking about, I'm in the I'm right in the target. 20 00:01:06,050 --> 00:01:08,930 S1: Whether you're the parent or the adult child. Go to 21 00:01:08,930 --> 00:01:11,009 S1: the website, you'll see how you can support us there 22 00:01:11,010 --> 00:01:13,130 S1: with a gift of any size and receive it. Chris 23 00:01:13,170 --> 00:01:17,929 S1: Fabry live.org is the site. The book is titled resolve, 24 00:01:17,930 --> 00:01:22,050 S1: Conflict and Find Peace and Hope with Adult children. Let 25 00:01:22,050 --> 00:01:25,090 S1: me thank my people who are Ryan McConaughey doing all 26 00:01:25,090 --> 00:01:28,970 S1: things technical. Trish is our producer. Lisa's helping out. Josh 27 00:01:29,209 --> 00:01:30,970 S1: is going to be answering your calls today, and I 28 00:01:30,970 --> 00:01:34,330 S1: do want you to to call us, especially if you 29 00:01:34,370 --> 00:01:37,690 S1: are an adult child, because we focused last month mostly 30 00:01:37,690 --> 00:01:40,690 S1: on the parents. And that's kind of the target audience. 31 00:01:41,050 --> 00:01:43,369 S1: But I also would like to hear from an adult 32 00:01:43,370 --> 00:01:46,210 S1: child who says, okay, here's the, here's a story, here's 33 00:01:46,209 --> 00:01:49,450 S1: what's really going on. So let's get started. We have 34 00:01:49,450 --> 00:01:55,210 S1: a lot to cover today, and the number is (877) 548-3675. 35 00:01:55,570 --> 00:02:00,460 S1: Doctor Kathy Cook, spelled KOCH, is founder of Celebrate Kids Incorporated. 36 00:02:00,460 --> 00:02:03,660 S1: She uses her expertise in educational psychology to help parents 37 00:02:03,660 --> 00:02:08,140 S1: inspire children in their unique strengths and to thrive in 38 00:02:08,180 --> 00:02:13,500 S1: their identity. Prolific author popular podcaster, sought after speaker. Highly 39 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:15,980 S1: recommended are some of her books. Let me just mention 40 00:02:15,980 --> 00:02:20,500 S1: a couple eight great smarts discover and nurture your child's intelligences, 41 00:02:20,900 --> 00:02:24,660 S1: as well as resilient kids, raising them to embrace life 42 00:02:24,660 --> 00:02:28,340 S1: with confidence. You can find out more about her and 43 00:02:28,340 --> 00:02:30,420 S1: some of her books at the website. We have a 44 00:02:30,419 --> 00:02:34,620 S1: link right there, Chris fabry.org. But our featured resource, our 45 00:02:34,620 --> 00:02:37,220 S1: thank you, is resolve conflict and find peace and hope 46 00:02:37,220 --> 00:02:41,500 S1: with adult children. Just go to Chris fabry.org. Doctor Cathy, 47 00:02:41,500 --> 00:02:42,860 S1: welcome back. How are you? 48 00:02:44,020 --> 00:02:46,220 S2: I'm fabulous. It's so good to be here. Thank you 49 00:02:46,220 --> 00:02:48,139 S2: for trusting me with another episode. 50 00:02:48,700 --> 00:02:50,820 S1: I have an email that I want to read you, 51 00:02:50,820 --> 00:02:53,260 S1: but first I want you to indulge me because I 52 00:02:53,260 --> 00:02:57,150 S1: have an opinion about the extremes and then the target 53 00:02:57,150 --> 00:02:59,590 S1: audience that you're writing to. Are you ready for this? 54 00:03:00,669 --> 00:03:01,630 S2: I hope so. 55 00:03:01,870 --> 00:03:04,430 S1: Okay. All right. You tell me if I'm right. There 56 00:03:04,430 --> 00:03:08,990 S1: are adult children who are just plain mean. Maybe they're narcissists, 57 00:03:09,110 --> 00:03:12,430 S1: and they are treating their parents like a pariah. And 58 00:03:12,430 --> 00:03:14,790 S1: at the other end of the extreme are parents who 59 00:03:14,790 --> 00:03:18,350 S1: have abused or neglected or shamed or guilted their children 60 00:03:18,350 --> 00:03:21,390 S1: for decades, and they feel like they never did anything wrong. 61 00:03:21,910 --> 00:03:25,230 S1: And to me, those are the extremes. And you want 62 00:03:25,270 --> 00:03:28,150 S1: to help those people. But that's not the target audience 63 00:03:28,389 --> 00:03:33,350 S1: because in my mind, that's about 5% of the population, 2.5% parents, 2.5% 64 00:03:33,350 --> 00:03:36,990 S1: kids fit those extremes. Not to diminish them, but the 65 00:03:36,990 --> 00:03:40,310 S1: bigger audience of parents and adult children fit somewhere in 66 00:03:40,310 --> 00:03:43,830 S1: the middle, and the parents honestly don't know what they 67 00:03:43,830 --> 00:03:46,190 S1: did wrong to make their son or daughter say, hey, 68 00:03:46,190 --> 00:03:48,670 S1: don't call me, don't text. I need some time. I'll 69 00:03:48,670 --> 00:03:52,350 S1: call you. That just confounds the parent. And the parent 70 00:03:52,350 --> 00:03:54,470 S1: didn't wake up each day when their kids were little 71 00:03:54,470 --> 00:03:57,090 S1: and rub their hands together and say, I wonder what 72 00:03:57,090 --> 00:03:59,050 S1: I can do today to mess up my kids so 73 00:03:59,050 --> 00:04:01,570 S1: they'll shut me out of their life. It didn't happen. 74 00:04:02,010 --> 00:04:04,010 S1: Then on the other side is the adult child who 75 00:04:04,010 --> 00:04:05,970 S1: doesn't wake up and think, oh, how can I hurt 76 00:04:05,970 --> 00:04:08,170 S1: my parents the most today? I know I'll cut them 77 00:04:08,170 --> 00:04:11,010 S1: out of my life. Then the adult child is dealing 78 00:04:11,010 --> 00:04:14,730 S1: with some hurt, some struggles. There's just so much swirling 79 00:04:14,730 --> 00:04:18,130 S1: around inside that they say, I really need a break. 80 00:04:18,130 --> 00:04:20,330 S1: I can't deal with mom or dad right now. And 81 00:04:20,330 --> 00:04:22,970 S1: so they ask for a time out, in a sense. 82 00:04:23,370 --> 00:04:26,490 S1: I think that scenario hits most of the people who 83 00:04:26,490 --> 00:04:28,410 S1: are listening today. But I want you to tell me, 84 00:04:28,410 --> 00:04:30,650 S1: am I right? AM I wrong, close or not? 85 00:04:32,890 --> 00:04:36,810 S2: I think I think you're right, I think there's there 86 00:04:36,850 --> 00:04:41,810 S2: are a few people who are in those minority situations 87 00:04:41,810 --> 00:04:44,850 S2: and they're getting a lot of press. They're getting the headlines. 88 00:04:44,850 --> 00:04:48,130 S2: And so the assumption is that everyone is all adult 89 00:04:48,130 --> 00:04:50,570 S2: children are giving up on their parents. And all parents 90 00:04:50,570 --> 00:04:53,170 S2: of adult children are lost and confused and, you know, 91 00:04:53,210 --> 00:04:54,980 S2: messed up. I don't I don't think that's it at all. 92 00:04:55,020 --> 00:04:57,420 S2: I think there's some who know what they did or 93 00:04:57,420 --> 00:04:59,580 S2: they wonder, but they haven't forgiven, or they haven't known 94 00:04:59,580 --> 00:05:02,060 S2: how to approach the subject. Others, like you're saying, are 95 00:05:02,060 --> 00:05:04,380 S2: just clueless. They don't know. And honestly, Chris, they might 96 00:05:04,380 --> 00:05:06,540 S2: not have done anything. And that's one of the reasons 97 00:05:06,540 --> 00:05:08,380 S2: that in my book, I don't deal with a lot 98 00:05:08,380 --> 00:05:10,740 S2: of what happened. What I deal with is how to 99 00:05:10,740 --> 00:05:13,420 S2: prevent it from happening, and then how to try to 100 00:05:13,420 --> 00:05:18,500 S2: restore the relationship and if in fact, it's gone bad. So, um, yeah, 101 00:05:18,540 --> 00:05:20,219 S2: I think you're exactly right. 102 00:05:21,620 --> 00:05:24,540 S1: It's a real struggle, though, to be in that place 103 00:05:24,540 --> 00:05:28,100 S1: where I don't understand. It's almost like, in a sense, 104 00:05:28,100 --> 00:05:31,260 S1: if you believe in the sovereignty of God. I poured 105 00:05:31,260 --> 00:05:34,580 S1: my life into these kids and I, you know, here's 106 00:05:34,580 --> 00:05:36,820 S1: what I agreed with you to do is you when 107 00:05:36,820 --> 00:05:39,380 S1: they're old, they're not going to depart not only from 108 00:05:39,380 --> 00:05:41,460 S1: your teaching and your truth. They're not going to depart 109 00:05:41,460 --> 00:05:44,460 S1: from me. And here they are turning their backs to 110 00:05:44,500 --> 00:05:45,500 S1: me and leaving. 111 00:05:47,140 --> 00:05:50,219 S2: I can only imagine the real heartache, right? Like I 112 00:05:50,220 --> 00:05:53,589 S2: wrote the book. And so I interviewed people I obviously 113 00:05:53,589 --> 00:05:56,150 S2: prayed with my team and it was hard to write 114 00:05:56,150 --> 00:05:58,870 S2: and I. But still, I can only imagine the depth 115 00:05:58,870 --> 00:06:01,550 S2: of the pain and the confusion. Um, you know, we're 116 00:06:01,550 --> 00:06:05,710 S2: not perfect, but we're perfectly chosen, right? You know, and 117 00:06:05,710 --> 00:06:08,070 S2: we might have mentioned this a month ago, Chris, that 118 00:06:08,110 --> 00:06:11,190 S2: God ordains the family before he ordains the church. Um, 119 00:06:11,230 --> 00:06:14,950 S2: whether that be through birth, adoption, fostering, um, whether it's 120 00:06:14,950 --> 00:06:19,430 S2: a step or a blended family or whatever, God ordains that. 121 00:06:19,470 --> 00:06:23,990 S2: And so you're the perfectly imperfect parent for perfectly imperfect children. 122 00:06:24,430 --> 00:06:27,710 S2: And it's hard. The influence that that are upon our 123 00:06:27,710 --> 00:06:31,550 S2: children today are very different from even ten years ago. Um, 124 00:06:31,550 --> 00:06:34,909 S2: the distraction that adults are facing because of the tech 125 00:06:34,950 --> 00:06:37,150 S2: that they're using. You know, I could go on and 126 00:06:37,190 --> 00:06:39,750 S2: on with, you know, legitimate things that are going on 127 00:06:39,750 --> 00:06:42,469 S2: even in the Christian community. Chris, does it break your heart? 128 00:06:42,470 --> 00:06:46,270 S2: Like it breaks my heart that pastors and entire denominations 129 00:06:46,270 --> 00:06:49,150 S2: are saying, oh, those verses are no longer relevant. Yeah. 130 00:06:49,190 --> 00:06:50,870 S2: Like you don't even know for sure if you're going 131 00:06:50,910 --> 00:06:52,840 S2: to a church that's going to preach the gospel of 132 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:55,240 S2: Jesus Christ. So the days are hard. 133 00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:00,479 S1: They really are. And it's hard. Then to one of 134 00:07:00,480 --> 00:07:02,640 S1: the things you say in the book is, don't let 135 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:06,600 S1: your children's confusion confuse you. And I'd say the same 136 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:08,960 S1: thing about the church. Don't let those who are confused 137 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:12,600 S1: the church about the Bible confuse you. Hang on to 138 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:15,320 S1: what is true. But again, that when you're in the 139 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:17,040 S1: deep end of the pool, that's hard to do. 140 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,720 S2: Yes. And so again, who are we listening to and 141 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,160 S2: who are we talking with? Are we in a small group? 142 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,200 S2: Are we attending an adult fellowship where we can be honest? Now, 143 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:32,560 S2: some adult children have said they think prayers at meals. 144 00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:34,600 S2: So we do have to be really careful of who 145 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:36,920 S2: we share the story with and how much of the 146 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:39,120 S2: story we share, how much of it is private, how 147 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:41,400 S2: much of it is public. For instance, you could say 148 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:44,480 S2: to somebody, you know, my adult children have chosen to 149 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:48,400 S2: not listen to me in this particular season. They don't 150 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:50,929 S2: know why. They don't have to know what they've accused 151 00:07:50,930 --> 00:07:52,930 S2: you of, but they could maybe know that there's a 152 00:07:52,930 --> 00:07:55,530 S2: separation that's taking place. We have to make those decisions 153 00:07:55,530 --> 00:07:57,810 S2: really carefully. But who are we talking to? Have we 154 00:07:57,850 --> 00:08:00,570 S2: gone to our pastor and have we asked for support? 155 00:08:00,610 --> 00:08:03,930 S2: Have we even asked that he maybe address family dynamics 156 00:08:03,930 --> 00:08:06,930 S2: in a sermon series? Oh my goodness, don't get me 157 00:08:06,930 --> 00:08:10,330 S2: started on that. But I so wish that there were 158 00:08:10,330 --> 00:08:13,770 S2: more opportunities in the body of believers to learn how 159 00:08:13,770 --> 00:08:16,010 S2: to how to parent and grandparent and be a kid 160 00:08:16,010 --> 00:08:17,330 S2: successfully and effectively. 161 00:08:17,810 --> 00:08:20,809 S1: A lot of hearts are hurting, and I just have 162 00:08:20,810 --> 00:08:22,930 S1: sensed that over the last month. And so I wanted 163 00:08:22,930 --> 00:08:25,730 S1: to have you back again today and this all this 164 00:08:25,730 --> 00:08:28,170 S1: month in September, we're going to offer this book, resolve 165 00:08:28,170 --> 00:08:31,090 S1: Conflict and find peace and hope with adult children. Give 166 00:08:31,090 --> 00:08:34,689 S1: a gift of any size. If you go to chris.org, 167 00:08:34,850 --> 00:08:38,089 S1: or you can call 8669 5th February and speak with 168 00:08:38,090 --> 00:08:41,690 S1: a live person and give them the information. But we 169 00:08:41,690 --> 00:08:45,050 S1: would love to put this in your hands more than 170 00:08:45,050 --> 00:08:47,370 S1: that today, though, I want to hear from you. I've 171 00:08:47,570 --> 00:08:50,300 S1: gotten so much feedback from people who have given in 172 00:08:50,300 --> 00:08:52,459 S1: the last month. I want to hear from you. How 173 00:08:52,460 --> 00:08:56,860 S1: is this touching your own life as an adult, as 174 00:08:56,860 --> 00:09:01,260 S1: a parent? And maybe you're the adult child and you say, 175 00:09:01,300 --> 00:09:03,740 S1: you know, here's here's the situation. I do want a 176 00:09:03,740 --> 00:09:08,420 S1: relationship with my mom, my dad. But right now I can't. 177 00:09:08,620 --> 00:09:11,900 S1: Maybe Doctor Cathy can help you. Here's the number to 178 00:09:11,940 --> 00:09:14,179 S1: call if you want to talk with Doctor Cathy on 179 00:09:14,179 --> 00:09:27,180 S1: the air. (877) 548-3675. That's our on air number right now (877) 548-3675. 180 00:09:27,420 --> 00:09:29,580 S1: You have to hear the email. I'm going to read 181 00:09:29,580 --> 00:09:43,339 S1: straight ahead on Moody radio. Well I hope you're not here, 182 00:09:43,340 --> 00:09:45,780 S1: but if you are Doctor Cathy Cook is going to 183 00:09:45,780 --> 00:09:49,710 S1: walk beside you here today, resolve conflict and find peace 184 00:09:49,710 --> 00:09:52,990 S1: and hope with adult children. Whether you are the parent 185 00:09:52,990 --> 00:09:56,030 S1: or the adult child in the equation. I'd love to 186 00:09:56,030 --> 00:10:02,030 S1: hear from you. Eight. 775483675. If you go to the website, 187 00:10:02,030 --> 00:10:04,150 S1: scroll down. You'll see how if you give a gift 188 00:10:04,150 --> 00:10:07,110 S1: to the program, support us. We'll send this book to you. 189 00:10:07,150 --> 00:10:09,630 S1: We're going to do that again here in September. We 190 00:10:09,630 --> 00:10:13,270 S1: did it in August. And a lot of people have responded. 191 00:10:13,270 --> 00:10:17,510 S1: And I think I think there's more and evidence of 192 00:10:17,550 --> 00:10:20,750 S1: that is an email that I got yesterday, and I'm 193 00:10:20,750 --> 00:10:22,430 S1: going to read this to you, Cathy, and I want 194 00:10:22,429 --> 00:10:25,350 S1: you to take notes and then respond. Um, here's something 195 00:10:25,350 --> 00:10:28,990 S1: I've been struggling with. How do I wait? Well, for 196 00:10:28,990 --> 00:10:33,189 S1: the restoration of relationships with my children while I'm in 197 00:10:33,190 --> 00:10:37,630 S1: this deep valley of feeling the loss. We have biological 198 00:10:37,630 --> 00:10:41,750 S1: and adopted children. Our married biological son has asked us 199 00:10:41,750 --> 00:10:45,069 S1: not to have contact with him anymore and to respect 200 00:10:45,070 --> 00:10:50,290 S1: this boundary. After several tumultuous teenage years with their adoptive children, 201 00:10:50,570 --> 00:10:53,250 S1: they decided to go back to their families of origin. 202 00:10:53,650 --> 00:10:56,290 S1: Our biological son wanted to be there for them, which 203 00:10:56,290 --> 00:11:00,010 S1: we highly respect because of our son's request and the 204 00:11:00,010 --> 00:11:03,530 S1: fracture in relationships with our adopted children. We've not spoken 205 00:11:03,530 --> 00:11:07,370 S1: to any of them in a few years. On most days, 206 00:11:07,370 --> 00:11:12,209 S1: this all consuming sorrow of pain floods in and not 207 00:11:12,250 --> 00:11:15,290 S1: rarely comes with a deep sense of guilt and shame. 208 00:11:15,610 --> 00:11:18,010 S1: My husband and I have a strong, loving marriage, but 209 00:11:18,010 --> 00:11:20,850 S1: we deal with this loss in our own way. We 210 00:11:20,850 --> 00:11:23,090 S1: talk about it at times, but I don't want to 211 00:11:23,090 --> 00:11:26,650 S1: burden him with my sadness. I also don't mention how 212 00:11:26,650 --> 00:11:29,610 S1: I truly feel to friends anymore. People can only handle 213 00:11:29,610 --> 00:11:33,610 S1: so much. Our other children have encouraged us, though we 214 00:11:33,610 --> 00:11:37,050 S1: often don't speak of these deep relational struggles for fear 215 00:11:37,050 --> 00:11:42,410 S1: of alienating them as well. While I wait, I desperately 216 00:11:42,410 --> 00:11:46,020 S1: want to do something. I want to write letters, keep journals, 217 00:11:46,020 --> 00:11:49,300 S1: and surf the internet to find them. But all this 218 00:11:49,300 --> 00:11:53,140 S1: makes me even sadder deep down. And maybe this is 219 00:11:53,140 --> 00:11:56,060 S1: from the Holy Spirit. I feel the need to just 220 00:11:56,059 --> 00:12:00,980 S1: wait the waiting without doing anything. But this is so hard. 221 00:12:01,340 --> 00:12:04,179 S1: I think of heaven and know without a shadow of 222 00:12:04,179 --> 00:12:07,220 S1: a doubt. All things will be made right then. But 223 00:12:07,220 --> 00:12:10,380 S1: I have to wait here. So far from heaven. Some 224 00:12:10,380 --> 00:12:13,500 S1: counselors have told us this might take 10 to 20 years. 225 00:12:13,940 --> 00:12:16,900 S1: I have heard this from others too. I feel time 226 00:12:16,900 --> 00:12:20,460 S1: slipping away and worry we will never have an answer 227 00:12:20,460 --> 00:12:24,099 S1: on this side of heaven. Do you have any suggestions 228 00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:28,020 S1: for how to wait in a God honoring manner? 229 00:12:30,860 --> 00:12:35,020 S2: First, let me say that, um, I'm honored and I 230 00:12:35,059 --> 00:12:36,980 S2: know you are as well of the trust that this 231 00:12:36,980 --> 00:12:40,340 S2: woman has had in you and your show. And, um, boy, 232 00:12:40,340 --> 00:12:43,790 S2: she's eloquent in the way that she expresses that. You know, 233 00:12:43,830 --> 00:12:47,429 S2: we we wait. How do we wait? Well, Psalm 46 234 00:12:47,429 --> 00:12:50,070 S2: came to mind, Chris. And I don't I don't say 235 00:12:50,070 --> 00:12:53,430 S2: this flippantly at all, but Psalm 46, verse ten, and 236 00:12:53,429 --> 00:12:57,390 S2: the Psalm begins, you know, the mountains are quaking and 237 00:12:57,390 --> 00:13:01,070 S2: the ocean is roaring and there are wars. It's just 238 00:13:01,110 --> 00:13:05,309 S2: a terrible picture of how terrible things can get. And 239 00:13:05,309 --> 00:13:07,830 S2: then when you get to the 10th verse, it says, 240 00:13:07,870 --> 00:13:11,870 S2: be still and know that I am God. Um, and 241 00:13:11,870 --> 00:13:14,110 S2: that's what this woman needs to do. She needs to 242 00:13:14,110 --> 00:13:17,429 S2: be still, which in the original language means that you 243 00:13:17,429 --> 00:13:19,230 S2: put your hands down to your side and you breathe 244 00:13:19,230 --> 00:13:23,430 S2: deeply so you don't wring your hands. You don't again, 245 00:13:23,429 --> 00:13:26,550 S2: maybe you search the web for every practical idea of 246 00:13:26,550 --> 00:13:30,390 S2: the day, but to be still, to breathe deeply, to 247 00:13:30,429 --> 00:13:33,950 S2: put your hands on your side. And why? Because you 248 00:13:33,950 --> 00:13:35,470 S2: know that God is God and the way that I 249 00:13:35,510 --> 00:13:38,310 S2: love to read the verse, Chris, is to say, be 250 00:13:38,309 --> 00:13:42,110 S2: still and know that I am God. So again, I'm 251 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,600 S2: assuming she really knows the ones you got and it 252 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:46,679 S2: sounds from her email like she does. So. So be 253 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:49,000 S2: in touch with that. Who are you waiting for? You're 254 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:51,800 S2: not waiting for reconciliation with your children. You're waiting for 255 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:55,200 S2: God to move in your life and their lives. We're 256 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:58,160 S2: waiting on God. Be still and know that I am God. 257 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:01,040 S2: Be still and know that I am. Be still and 258 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:08,920 S2: know that. Be still and know. Be still, be. And 259 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:12,720 S2: what this woman is, is so much more than a 260 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:16,560 S2: mom waiting for reconciliation with adult children. She's a wife. 261 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:18,720 S2: She is a mom of other kids that she does 262 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,200 S2: have a relationship with. And I praise God for that. 263 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:23,920 S2: She is perhaps a grandmother. She is perhaps a member 264 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,360 S2: of a church choir and a volunteer. And, and she's 265 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:28,680 S2: a daughter and she's an aunt and she's a sister. And, 266 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:31,840 S2: you know, she's, she's creative and she's, you know, she's 267 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:33,360 S2: all the other things that I want her to get 268 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:35,520 S2: in touch with. And I, I don't again, I don't 269 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:38,160 S2: say that lightly. This is the bigger pain is obviously 270 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:41,730 S2: when the family is dysfunctional. But man, it's hard. That's 271 00:14:41,730 --> 00:14:44,090 S2: that's the first insight I have. I also want to 272 00:14:44,090 --> 00:14:46,690 S2: say that waiting in the valley is really hard, but 273 00:14:46,690 --> 00:14:49,050 S2: it's in the valley that the the grass grows and 274 00:14:49,050 --> 00:14:50,890 S2: the water flows, and I don't. Again, if you look 275 00:14:50,890 --> 00:14:54,010 S2: at Psalm 23, you know where green pastures and quiet 276 00:14:54,010 --> 00:14:56,890 S2: water and God leads, Jesus leads us to shepherd, guides 277 00:14:56,890 --> 00:14:59,570 S2: us and restores us and anoints us, and we walk 278 00:14:59,570 --> 00:15:01,370 S2: through the valley. Don't sit down. We walk through the 279 00:15:01,370 --> 00:15:03,850 S2: valley on the way to the mountaintop. And why does 280 00:15:03,850 --> 00:15:06,330 S2: God take us through valleys? That's where we grow. Like 281 00:15:06,370 --> 00:15:08,090 S2: this woman and her husband. They have a chance to 282 00:15:08,090 --> 00:15:11,370 S2: become extremely mature because they are going to have a 283 00:15:11,370 --> 00:15:14,810 S2: season of deep growth, right where they're going to really 284 00:15:14,810 --> 00:15:17,930 S2: know what's going on with Jesus in their lives, if 285 00:15:17,930 --> 00:15:21,450 S2: that makes sense. I'd like her to have some mountaintop experiences. 286 00:15:21,890 --> 00:15:26,090 S2: She can't rely just on these children to be her joy. 287 00:15:26,130 --> 00:15:28,450 S2: Jesus needs to be her joy, which means she can 288 00:15:28,450 --> 00:15:31,130 S2: go to the mountaintop. She can have great days, she 289 00:15:31,130 --> 00:15:34,410 S2: can have laughter with friends, and she can have celebrations 290 00:15:34,410 --> 00:15:36,410 S2: of friends, birthdays, and all the kinds of things that 291 00:15:36,410 --> 00:15:39,620 S2: go on with life and not feel guilt for being happy, 292 00:15:39,620 --> 00:15:42,180 S2: even though this tragically has happened in her family. 293 00:15:42,700 --> 00:15:46,380 S1: What about the part where she says, I don't mention 294 00:15:46,380 --> 00:15:49,340 S1: how I truly feel to friends anymore? People can only 295 00:15:49,340 --> 00:15:50,500 S1: handle so much. 296 00:15:51,300 --> 00:15:55,340 S2: Yeah, I hear that. And I understand that, um, they're 297 00:15:55,340 --> 00:15:57,460 S2: going to turn away if they see her coming. If 298 00:15:57,460 --> 00:15:59,460 S2: it's always, how are you? Oh, I still haven't heard 299 00:15:59,460 --> 00:16:01,900 S2: from my kids. So again, she needs to be really 300 00:16:01,900 --> 00:16:04,660 S2: careful who she addresses that with. Like, who's the one 301 00:16:04,660 --> 00:16:06,860 S2: or who are the 1 or 2 people that are 302 00:16:06,900 --> 00:16:09,220 S2: going to be able to be really with her in 303 00:16:09,260 --> 00:16:11,500 S2: that and maybe she asks for permission. You know, I 304 00:16:11,500 --> 00:16:13,940 S2: need someone to vent to, not just my husband, you know, 305 00:16:14,020 --> 00:16:16,580 S2: could you be that friend? And would you understand that 306 00:16:16,580 --> 00:16:19,540 S2: if I'm talking with you about difficulties with these kids, 307 00:16:19,540 --> 00:16:21,140 S2: it doesn't mean that that's the only thing going on 308 00:16:21,140 --> 00:16:23,940 S2: in my life. So don't judge me for that. I do, 309 00:16:23,980 --> 00:16:26,460 S2: I do understand that, and yet she'll explode if she 310 00:16:26,460 --> 00:16:28,500 S2: doesn't have an opportunity to get it out. This is 311 00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:31,420 S2: why we pray. This is why we journal. Um, she 312 00:16:31,420 --> 00:16:34,140 S2: could write conversations that she would love to have one 313 00:16:34,140 --> 00:16:36,380 S2: day with her kids. She could write those out. There's 314 00:16:36,420 --> 00:16:39,350 S2: ways to maybe get ideas out of her head. But again, 315 00:16:39,390 --> 00:16:41,910 S2: I love the idea that she doesn't have to think 316 00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:44,510 S2: about it constantly. I like that she and her husband 317 00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:47,110 S2: don't talk about it constantly. There is more to life 318 00:16:47,110 --> 00:16:49,030 S2: than this tragedy that's going on. 319 00:16:49,190 --> 00:16:53,150 S1: Yeah, I not to gild the lily or put a 320 00:16:53,150 --> 00:16:57,270 S1: silver lining, but I would like to ask anybody who's 321 00:16:57,270 --> 00:17:02,190 S1: in this situation is what is has been the upside 322 00:17:02,190 --> 00:17:04,550 S1: of this valley that you've been through. 323 00:17:04,750 --> 00:17:05,109 S2: Mhm. 324 00:17:05,150 --> 00:17:10,070 S1: Because my guess is that she has she has grown 325 00:17:10,070 --> 00:17:13,790 S1: closer to God. She has seen, you know, she has 326 00:17:13,790 --> 00:17:18,110 S1: been still and she does know that he is exalted. 327 00:17:18,590 --> 00:17:21,710 S1: At the same time, she's still struggling. What do you 328 00:17:21,710 --> 00:17:22,430 S1: think of that? 329 00:17:22,910 --> 00:17:24,950 S2: I think you're right. And I've heard that testimony from 330 00:17:24,950 --> 00:17:27,670 S2: many people just even today, talking to somebody at lunch 331 00:17:27,670 --> 00:17:30,950 S2: that she wouldn't wish what she's been through on anybody. 332 00:17:30,950 --> 00:17:34,790 S2: But she understands with gratitude the benefit of her having 333 00:17:34,790 --> 00:17:37,490 S2: been through a really negative experience. So do we have 334 00:17:37,490 --> 00:17:40,490 S2: the perspective that the Lord would want us to have? 335 00:17:41,570 --> 00:17:44,770 S1: You mentioned Psalm 46. I've been going through Psalm 40 336 00:17:44,810 --> 00:17:48,010 S1: at the very beginning, just the first few verses. I 337 00:17:48,050 --> 00:17:52,610 S1: waited patiently for the Lord. He inclined to me and 338 00:17:52,609 --> 00:17:55,730 S1: heard my cry. He drew me up from the pit 339 00:17:55,770 --> 00:17:58,930 S1: of destruction out of the miry bog, and set my 340 00:17:58,930 --> 00:18:03,929 S1: feet upon a rock, making my steps secure. And just 341 00:18:03,930 --> 00:18:07,810 S1: that imagery and psalm of David. You can tell what 342 00:18:07,810 --> 00:18:10,770 S1: in the world was going on in David's life. You know, it's. Yeah, 343 00:18:10,770 --> 00:18:13,010 S1: it's life and death and that's what it feels like. 344 00:18:13,210 --> 00:18:16,330 S1: And then he says, he put a new song in 345 00:18:16,369 --> 00:18:21,649 S1: my mouth, a song of praise to our God. Many 346 00:18:21,650 --> 00:18:26,170 S1: will see and fear and put their trust in the Lord. 347 00:18:26,690 --> 00:18:30,210 S1: And I wonder if that's not a partially a really 348 00:18:30,210 --> 00:18:34,490 S1: good prayer to God. Would you use this to cause 349 00:18:34,530 --> 00:18:37,820 S1: people to turn to you, especially my children. Or, you know, 350 00:18:37,859 --> 00:18:41,100 S1: if it's your child talking about the parent, would you 351 00:18:41,140 --> 00:18:45,540 S1: cause people to turn to you because of what I'm 352 00:18:45,580 --> 00:18:49,380 S1: going through? Use. That's what you want to do. I'm in. 353 00:18:49,380 --> 00:18:50,139 S1: What do you think? 354 00:18:50,700 --> 00:18:53,100 S2: I love that. And as you know, Chris, the last 355 00:18:53,100 --> 00:18:55,340 S2: chapter in my book is a whole chapter about hope. 356 00:18:55,540 --> 00:18:57,820 S2: And I make the point, I think pretty strongly that 357 00:18:57,820 --> 00:19:00,580 S2: we must hope in God, not in ourselves, not in 358 00:19:00,580 --> 00:19:03,020 S2: our ability to turn the situation around. We don't put 359 00:19:03,020 --> 00:19:05,500 S2: our hope in our kids. We put our hope in God. 360 00:19:05,500 --> 00:19:08,460 S2: He's worthy of it, and he is capable and able 361 00:19:08,460 --> 00:19:12,580 S2: and chooses to act in what would be our best interest. 362 00:19:12,580 --> 00:19:14,380 S2: And we have to. We have to believe that we 363 00:19:14,380 --> 00:19:17,500 S2: get to believe that we honor him by believing that. 364 00:19:18,060 --> 00:19:20,859 S1: The other word that she used here that I want 365 00:19:20,859 --> 00:19:26,700 S1: you to talk about is respect because. And here's our number. 366 00:19:26,700 --> 00:19:29,139 S1: If you have a question right now, some of you 367 00:19:29,180 --> 00:19:36,230 S1: were saying, oh, what was that number 3675. If this 368 00:19:36,230 --> 00:19:38,709 S1: is where you are as a parent or as the 369 00:19:38,710 --> 00:19:46,750 S1: adult child. Eight. 775483675. Our son has biological son has 370 00:19:46,750 --> 00:19:51,510 S1: asked us to respect this boundary. And then she says 371 00:19:51,510 --> 00:19:55,710 S1: that he wanted to be there for the adoptive kids 372 00:19:55,710 --> 00:19:58,710 S1: who went back to their families of origin, which we 373 00:19:58,750 --> 00:20:03,870 S1: highly respect. Talk about that respect and disrespect. 374 00:20:04,670 --> 00:20:07,510 S2: I appreciate you bringing that up. It was alarming to 375 00:20:07,550 --> 00:20:11,070 S2: me how many adult children specifically said to me in 376 00:20:11,070 --> 00:20:15,390 S2: conversation that their parents were not respecting them, things like 377 00:20:15,390 --> 00:20:18,550 S2: they would stop by without calling first, which I don't 378 00:20:18,550 --> 00:20:20,149 S2: think we do to a friend. So why do we 379 00:20:20,150 --> 00:20:22,790 S2: do that to family unless we think that family is special? 380 00:20:22,790 --> 00:20:25,310 S2: But they're really not in this regard. And I heard 381 00:20:25,310 --> 00:20:27,750 S2: things like, you know, I text and then my mom 382 00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:30,310 S2: knows I have my phone. So then she calls and 383 00:20:30,310 --> 00:20:32,270 S2: I love to tell people that when a young person 384 00:20:32,270 --> 00:20:35,080 S2: texts you, That's not giving you permission to call. That's. 385 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,680 S2: And if you if you play that, if they'll stop 386 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:42,040 S2: texting you because they're texting and not calling on, on purpose. 387 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:47,199 S2: And so yeah, respect asking for permission, um, praying and 388 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:51,119 S2: pondering and not always talking with them. I think what's 389 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:54,920 S2: hard is, um, do we, do we know the boundary clear? Like, 390 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:58,040 S2: have they made their boundary clear? We might violate a 391 00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:00,080 S2: boundary that we don't even know is in place. And 392 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,520 S2: that's on the adult children. They need to be specific. 393 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:04,960 S2: The other thing that's really hurtful and hard is that 394 00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:06,880 S2: we don't know if the boundary has changed. We don't 395 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:11,000 S2: know if an adult child has softened, has an adult child, 396 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:13,520 S2: you know, thought of a new memory from childhood. And 397 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:17,440 S2: do they realize that they've reinvented something that actually did 398 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,000 S2: not happen? And we don't have a chance to ask 399 00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:22,520 S2: that if we're given no permission to talk. So it's 400 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:27,040 S2: very difficult. But respect is to honor one another. It 401 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:31,080 S2: is to know them and to be honest with them, 402 00:21:31,609 --> 00:21:34,930 S2: to follow through to to act on your agreement. So 403 00:21:34,970 --> 00:21:37,370 S2: if somebody says, you know, please honor my boundary. And 404 00:21:37,369 --> 00:21:41,810 S2: you say, okay, I will now you will. And if 405 00:21:41,850 --> 00:21:44,210 S2: you don't, then I think you start that communication with, 406 00:21:44,250 --> 00:21:47,250 S2: you know, six months ago, I said I'd honor the boundary. 407 00:21:47,250 --> 00:21:50,330 S2: And I believe I've done that. I'm reaching out because 408 00:21:50,330 --> 00:21:52,370 S2: your Aunt June is ill. And I thought you might 409 00:21:52,369 --> 00:21:54,810 S2: want to know. And you know, your mom and I 410 00:21:54,810 --> 00:21:57,770 S2: are wondering if anything's changed. Are you going to give 411 00:21:57,770 --> 00:21:58,730 S2: us another chance? 412 00:21:59,810 --> 00:22:06,250 S1: Yeah. That is that's encapsulates the struggle. And I see 413 00:22:06,250 --> 00:22:10,489 S1: some calls here with some really deep issues. And we're 414 00:22:10,490 --> 00:22:13,129 S1: going to get to your calls, resolve conflict and find 415 00:22:13,130 --> 00:22:16,770 S1: peace and hope with adult children. Featured resource. Actually, I 416 00:22:16,770 --> 00:22:19,810 S1: thank you today. If you go to Chris fabry.org, it'll 417 00:22:19,850 --> 00:22:23,129 S1: be there all this month. But jump in the pool 418 00:22:23,130 --> 00:22:26,250 S1: with us here today. If you want to support us 419 00:22:26,250 --> 00:22:29,210 S1: and get a copy of the book. Chris Fabry live.org. 420 00:22:29,490 --> 00:22:32,540 S1: Patsy is on the line before we take a break here. Patsy, 421 00:22:32,780 --> 00:22:34,619 S1: what's what's your situation? 422 00:22:35,859 --> 00:22:39,820 S3: Um, I'm a widow of almost 16 years. I have 423 00:22:39,820 --> 00:22:45,700 S3: four kids, but one of them lives 20 minutes away, and, um, 424 00:22:45,740 --> 00:22:49,540 S3: he just totally broke off all contact over four and 425 00:22:49,540 --> 00:22:54,260 S3: a half years ago. I have six grandkids. Like I said, 426 00:22:54,300 --> 00:22:57,500 S3: 20 minutes away. I never see. I've never been allowed 427 00:22:57,500 --> 00:23:00,460 S3: to be a grandma. I, I, I, I've not seen 428 00:23:00,460 --> 00:23:03,900 S3: them for that long. And even before that, it was 429 00:23:03,900 --> 00:23:06,580 S3: like maybe a couple of times a year when they 430 00:23:06,580 --> 00:23:09,500 S3: would invite me over. Never, I never call, I never 431 00:23:09,500 --> 00:23:11,940 S3: stop over without calling, but I don't, I don't even 432 00:23:11,940 --> 00:23:14,460 S3: think I know their phone number. I mean, it, it's just, it's, 433 00:23:15,660 --> 00:23:19,580 S3: it's just tragic. And I love my son. Yeah. 434 00:23:19,859 --> 00:23:22,580 S1: And I can hear that emotion. I can hear it. 435 00:23:22,580 --> 00:23:26,260 S1: When you first started to tell the the story. Patsy. 436 00:23:26,540 --> 00:23:26,940 S2: Yeah. 437 00:23:27,260 --> 00:23:31,070 S1: And and the loss that you've already been through. And 438 00:23:31,070 --> 00:23:34,310 S1: then this for four and a half years, it just it, 439 00:23:34,310 --> 00:23:35,910 S1: it compounds, doesn't it? 440 00:23:37,150 --> 00:23:40,990 S2: It does. And I, I'm just. Patsy. I just want 441 00:23:41,030 --> 00:23:44,030 S2: to say, um, don't stop loving like I'm really proud 442 00:23:44,030 --> 00:23:49,750 S2: of you. Like, don't let his decision cause you him 443 00:23:49,750 --> 00:23:52,030 S2: from your heart. Like you are being very wise, very 444 00:23:52,030 --> 00:23:55,790 S2: mature and a good mom to love. And the love 445 00:23:55,790 --> 00:23:58,550 S2: compels you to pray, I imagine, for him and his 446 00:23:58,550 --> 00:24:03,469 S2: entire family. Again, it's painful, especially because of 20 minutes away. Um, 447 00:24:03,510 --> 00:24:06,670 S2: you might never know this side of heaven why it's happening. 448 00:24:06,670 --> 00:24:09,870 S2: I pray that you have a vibrant, dynamic relationship with 449 00:24:09,869 --> 00:24:12,990 S2: Jesus Christ anyway, and that there are others in your 450 00:24:12,990 --> 00:24:16,590 S2: life who minister their hope and healing to you, and 451 00:24:16,590 --> 00:24:18,870 S2: that you don't sit around and twiddle your thumbs and 452 00:24:18,869 --> 00:24:21,109 S2: wait for him to call. I just I don't want 453 00:24:21,150 --> 00:24:23,469 S2: him to have that much power over you, that he 454 00:24:23,470 --> 00:24:27,070 S2: would destroy the life that God has caused you or 455 00:24:27,170 --> 00:24:29,890 S2: created you to live in these moments. So grieve well 456 00:24:30,690 --> 00:24:34,929 S2: and and live life without apology. You can have joy 457 00:24:35,250 --> 00:24:38,570 S2: and you can have relationships and you can be a 458 00:24:38,570 --> 00:24:42,330 S2: positive person, even though this is a difficult situation. And I, 459 00:24:42,369 --> 00:24:44,450 S2: I don't want that to sound flippant, like this is 460 00:24:44,450 --> 00:24:47,090 S2: real and I am really proud of you. I'm so 461 00:24:47,090 --> 00:24:48,050 S2: glad you love him. 462 00:24:48,490 --> 00:24:50,730 S1: Do you have people in your life, Patsy, that you 463 00:24:50,770 --> 00:24:54,409 S1: can talk with about this? You know, a community of 464 00:24:54,410 --> 00:24:55,369 S1: people at all? 465 00:24:55,930 --> 00:24:59,730 S3: Not a lot. There were yeah, I can't I really 466 00:24:59,730 --> 00:25:02,930 S3: don't want to go into that. But things happened at 467 00:25:02,930 --> 00:25:07,370 S3: my church and I don't know, so I yeah, I'm trying. 468 00:25:07,410 --> 00:25:09,850 S3: I'm I'm going back to church. 469 00:25:10,170 --> 00:25:13,570 S1: Yeah. Good for you. Well, that's what the enemy will do. 470 00:25:13,770 --> 00:25:17,050 S1: The enemy will isolate you in that in the pain. 471 00:25:17,050 --> 00:25:20,370 S1: And then it compounds, as I said a minute ago. So, Patsy, 472 00:25:20,410 --> 00:25:21,929 S1: hang on. I want to send you a copy of 473 00:25:21,930 --> 00:25:24,770 S1: this book, Doctor Kathy Cook. And if you have a 474 00:25:24,770 --> 00:25:27,300 S1: question or a comment, We've got a few lines open 475 00:25:27,300 --> 00:25:34,619 S1: still at (877) 548-3675. The book is resolve, conflict and Find 476 00:25:34,619 --> 00:25:39,780 S1: peace and hope with adult children. Strategies and conversations that work. 477 00:25:40,140 --> 00:25:43,100 S1: Let's go to Chris Fabry live.org. Scroll down. You'll see 478 00:25:43,100 --> 00:25:48,220 S1: it right there. Chris Fabry live dot more help. And 479 00:25:48,260 --> 00:25:50,780 S1: a lot of hope is coming up straight ahead here 480 00:25:50,780 --> 00:26:07,459 S1: on Moody Radio. We're talking with the founder of Celebrate Kids, 481 00:26:07,460 --> 00:26:10,820 S1: Doctor Cathy Cook today. And really what I think is 482 00:26:10,820 --> 00:26:13,100 S1: a really important book. And a few months ago when 483 00:26:13,100 --> 00:26:15,020 S1: I saw this is coming out, I said, we've got 484 00:26:15,020 --> 00:26:18,780 S1: to give this away. But not just one month, but two. 485 00:26:18,980 --> 00:26:22,060 S1: And it's titled resolve, conflict and Find Peace and Hope 486 00:26:22,060 --> 00:26:25,510 S1: with Adult children. You can find out more at Chris 487 00:26:25,510 --> 00:26:30,550 S1: Fabry live.org. Chris fabriclive.org. Go back to the calls. Cathy. 488 00:26:30,590 --> 00:26:34,070 S1: Real quickly, though, I'm thinking of Patsy and any other 489 00:26:34,070 --> 00:26:37,790 S1: parent who's wondering kind of machinating, well, why? Why is 490 00:26:37,790 --> 00:26:40,310 S1: this happening? Did they read a book? Did they see 491 00:26:40,310 --> 00:26:43,830 S1: a TV show? Did they listen to a podcast? Is 492 00:26:43,830 --> 00:26:47,830 S1: it their spouse who's turning my son against me? You know, 493 00:26:47,869 --> 00:26:50,550 S1: all those machinations that you do to try try to 494 00:26:50,550 --> 00:26:52,750 S1: figure out why is that helpful or not? 495 00:26:53,670 --> 00:26:55,990 S2: Well, it can be, you know, they may never know. 496 00:26:55,990 --> 00:26:57,629 S2: And I, I know that's the story of a lot 497 00:26:57,630 --> 00:27:00,990 S2: of people, but one advantage of pondering that is that 498 00:27:00,990 --> 00:27:03,750 S2: it might help us not feel personal guilt. It may 499 00:27:03,750 --> 00:27:06,630 S2: not be anything that the adult parents did, which was 500 00:27:06,630 --> 00:27:10,910 S2: maybe actually more irritating. Um, we do have evidence that 501 00:27:10,910 --> 00:27:13,629 S2: often it's someone they're following on social media. Um, it 502 00:27:13,630 --> 00:27:15,710 S2: could be a TikTok star. It could be even the 503 00:27:15,710 --> 00:27:19,230 S2: lyricist of songs that is proclaiming that families are relevant 504 00:27:19,230 --> 00:27:21,750 S2: and that, you know, parents don't matter. Once you reach 505 00:27:21,750 --> 00:27:23,919 S2: a certain age, there could be. It could be a 506 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:25,680 S2: family member. It could be somebody at work. You know, 507 00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:27,720 S2: we don't know for sure, but it may not be 508 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:30,000 S2: that the adult parent did anything wrong. It may be 509 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,680 S2: that the adult children are getting a message about parents 510 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:35,959 S2: that is false and not biblical, and they're choosing to 511 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,480 S2: believe it, which of course is really sad. I will 512 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,080 S2: also say, and this is a sad statement, there are 513 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:44,879 S2: counselors out there who are siding with the adult children 514 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:47,280 S2: who are. And they're going to the counselors are going 515 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:48,840 S2: to tell them, hey, you don't need your parents anymore. 516 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,000 S2: You know, you're 21 or you're living on your own 517 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,160 S2: and you know, you're good. You don't you don't need 518 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,439 S2: to follow their expectations anymore. Now that I think that's 519 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,080 S2: more rare, I hope it's more rare. I think most 520 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,040 S2: Christian counselors would not do that. But the reason that's 521 00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,040 S2: relevant is you got to ask yourself, if you're going 522 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:06,199 S2: to go into counseling or recommend that your kids do, 523 00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:07,760 S2: who are you going to see, and how are you 524 00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,320 S2: going to vet the people that you're putting in influence 525 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:11,880 S2: over your kids and over yourself? 526 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,919 S1: With Doctor Cathy, here is Anne Marie. Hi, Anne. Marie. 527 00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:16,680 S1: Go right ahead. 528 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:22,610 S4: Hi. I just appreciate Cathy's voice in these days so much. 529 00:28:23,170 --> 00:28:24,770 S2: Um, thank you myself. 530 00:28:24,770 --> 00:28:27,690 S4: Just saying. Amen. Amen as you talk. So I had 531 00:28:27,690 --> 00:28:29,970 S4: to pull over to be able to call. I don't 532 00:28:29,970 --> 00:28:33,490 S4: usually do this, but your voices just makes me want 533 00:28:33,530 --> 00:28:36,929 S4: to cry because it is so relevant. So thank you. Um, 534 00:28:37,250 --> 00:28:40,210 S4: and pointing people to Jesus that he's teaching all of 535 00:28:40,210 --> 00:28:43,810 S4: us during these times, whatever our struggle is. And we 536 00:28:43,810 --> 00:28:45,729 S4: always want to look at the situation. And I have 537 00:28:45,730 --> 00:28:48,010 S4: a friend who says, where are your eyes? Where are 538 00:28:48,010 --> 00:28:51,890 S4: your eyes? And who are you looking to? And, um, 539 00:28:52,370 --> 00:28:54,330 S4: but I wanted to share that my husband and I 540 00:28:54,370 --> 00:28:57,850 S4: lead a group for, um, we are grateful that at 541 00:28:57,850 --> 00:29:00,210 S4: this point, our children are not in this situation, but 542 00:29:00,210 --> 00:29:03,050 S4: we lead a group of parents that's children are and 543 00:29:03,050 --> 00:29:06,370 S4: also have some gender dysphoria issues that they're trying to 544 00:29:06,370 --> 00:29:08,810 S4: figure out how to manage. And they had such a 545 00:29:08,810 --> 00:29:12,410 S4: sweet idea that I wanted to share it for your listeners. Um, 546 00:29:12,450 --> 00:29:17,530 S4: they have begun books like a little journal, um, for 547 00:29:17,530 --> 00:29:20,370 S4: their children. Some of them unfortunately have several children that 548 00:29:20,460 --> 00:29:23,620 S4: this is happening to, and they are writing to these children, 549 00:29:24,460 --> 00:29:29,580 S4: and they're writing letters and thoughts and love and care 550 00:29:30,300 --> 00:29:33,860 S4: so that if their children's children do not come back 551 00:29:33,860 --> 00:29:38,380 S4: before they're gone into heaven, that they're leaving something for them. 552 00:29:38,380 --> 00:29:42,100 S4: And I just thought it was a beautiful opportunity for 553 00:29:42,100 --> 00:29:44,420 S4: the parents to get out love and care that they 554 00:29:44,420 --> 00:29:48,060 S4: have for them during this time. And maybe truth that 555 00:29:48,420 --> 00:29:50,700 S4: we don't know if they're going to turn back, but 556 00:29:50,700 --> 00:29:53,060 S4: that it would be there for them if they did. 557 00:29:53,460 --> 00:29:53,820 S1: Wow. 558 00:29:55,220 --> 00:29:59,900 S2: Yes, yes, yes and yes. Um, I love that. And 559 00:29:59,900 --> 00:30:02,700 S2: if the kids do come back while the parents are 560 00:30:02,700 --> 00:30:05,460 S2: still alive, what a gift for the parent to hand 561 00:30:05,460 --> 00:30:07,820 S2: that off to a son or daughter or daughter in 562 00:30:07,820 --> 00:30:10,660 S2: law and say, if you're interested, this is how I've 563 00:30:10,660 --> 00:30:13,180 S2: been thinking of you over the last year or two. 564 00:30:13,380 --> 00:30:15,700 S2: So I love it for the reason that you stated, 565 00:30:15,700 --> 00:30:17,620 S2: I love it for all that and it's so good 566 00:30:17,620 --> 00:30:20,920 S2: for the parent. I think it helps the parent be 567 00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,840 S2: positive as they think of these children, and that's essential 568 00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:27,840 S2: and that's God honoring. So really appreciate your call, Anne Marie, 569 00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:30,120 S2: and thank you very much for your kind words about 570 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,360 S2: the ministry that I have. I appreciate that a lot. 571 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:34,400 S1: I have a question for you, Anne Marie. Have you 572 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,719 S1: read any of those letters to the to the children 573 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:38,920 S1: who were estranged? 574 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:43,520 S4: I have not, but when I heard Patty's voice and 575 00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:47,000 S4: her heartache, I heard some of our parents. And I thought, 576 00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,800 S4: you know, even if she's doing what Kathy's recommending with 577 00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:54,560 S4: like interests outside of the home, you know, just telling 578 00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:57,880 S4: them I worked in my garden today, the the crape 579 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,280 S4: myrtles are blooming. Um, you know, when I thought of you, 580 00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:05,440 S4: when I, whatever it may be. And, um. Yes. What 581 00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:08,080 S4: a beautiful gift. If they are still living. And that's 582 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:10,760 S4: of course what we're praying for. But I just thought 583 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:15,959 S4: it would provide some hope and also some action as moms, especially. Bingo. 584 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:16,800 S1: Yeah. 585 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:19,770 S4: We want to nurture and it gives away to nurture. 586 00:31:19,770 --> 00:31:21,290 S4: That's not invasive. 587 00:31:21,730 --> 00:31:24,050 S1: I thought of you today, or you were on my 588 00:31:24,050 --> 00:31:28,930 S1: heart today when I saw this or that just springs. 589 00:31:29,290 --> 00:31:32,450 S1: That's so positive. And it's not. I just want you 590 00:31:32,450 --> 00:31:35,370 S1: to know now that we're gone, that you're we forgive 591 00:31:35,370 --> 00:31:39,010 S1: you for abandoning, you know, it's like, no, no, that's 592 00:31:39,010 --> 00:31:42,890 S1: not it. That's not it. It's it's it's enveloping. It's 593 00:31:42,890 --> 00:31:44,770 S1: it's pulling them closer. Right. Kathy. 594 00:31:45,730 --> 00:31:47,690 S2: I love that. And it's such a neat example, as 595 00:31:47,690 --> 00:31:51,090 S2: you're both saying of the small things, elevating the small things. 596 00:31:51,090 --> 00:31:54,050 S2: It is often small things like the my daughter love 597 00:31:54,050 --> 00:31:55,890 S2: the crape myrtles and they're blooming and I'm going to 598 00:31:55,890 --> 00:31:57,810 S2: write that down. Like, I just think that's honoring and 599 00:31:57,810 --> 00:32:00,570 S2: that's beautiful. And it puts a smile on everybody's face. 600 00:32:00,570 --> 00:32:02,970 S2: So that's fabulous. Really proud of you and your husband 601 00:32:02,970 --> 00:32:06,210 S2: for leading in that way. And wouldn't it be a 602 00:32:06,210 --> 00:32:09,330 S2: beautiful thing if more churches chose to? I'm assuming this 603 00:32:09,330 --> 00:32:11,570 S2: is maybe a church driven thing. And if not, and 604 00:32:11,570 --> 00:32:14,290 S2: introduce the Lord as well, just to get together and 605 00:32:14,330 --> 00:32:17,580 S2: offer people the support of the community. It's really, really good. 606 00:32:17,620 --> 00:32:20,660 S1: Yeah. Brenda is on the line. Brenda, you're on with 607 00:32:20,660 --> 00:32:22,100 S1: Doctor Kathy. Go ahead. 608 00:32:23,180 --> 00:32:27,460 S5: Hello. Yes, I agree with the caller that just talked. 609 00:32:27,540 --> 00:32:30,660 S5: That sounds like a great thing to do. But in 610 00:32:30,660 --> 00:32:36,980 S5: my situation, my grandson has, uh, decided that this was 611 00:32:36,980 --> 00:32:41,180 S5: four years ago, that him and my great granddaughter were 612 00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:44,860 S5: not going to be part of our family anymore. Just 613 00:32:44,860 --> 00:32:48,100 S5: up out of the blue. It's like they decided. And 614 00:32:48,100 --> 00:32:53,020 S5: then I being me, uh, got a, like a bitterness 615 00:32:53,060 --> 00:32:57,140 S5: in me or a resentment, like, where does this come from? 616 00:32:57,140 --> 00:33:00,700 S5: And why do they disrespect their parents and grandparents? So 617 00:33:00,740 --> 00:33:04,980 S5: we're in my generation, I'm 68 and my generation, you 618 00:33:04,980 --> 00:33:08,180 S5: would have never have seen that as something that you 619 00:33:08,180 --> 00:33:12,219 S5: didn't hear of. But now it's like it's a common thing. 620 00:33:12,540 --> 00:33:15,310 S5: So I'm wanting to know, where is this coming from? 621 00:33:15,350 --> 00:33:18,750 S5: I know it's from Satan. And it's like. MM. But 622 00:33:18,750 --> 00:33:23,070 S5: what do we do? I to keep from getting the 623 00:33:23,110 --> 00:33:26,510 S5: bitterness in me. I love them still. And every time 624 00:33:26,510 --> 00:33:29,190 S5: I see him in the store, I'll tell him I 625 00:33:29,190 --> 00:33:32,670 S5: love him. But that doesn't break his heart, you know. 626 00:33:33,070 --> 00:33:33,590 S1: Yeah. 627 00:33:33,630 --> 00:33:34,030 S5: So. 628 00:33:34,350 --> 00:33:38,350 S2: Well, again, praise God that your love has not dissipated. 629 00:33:38,350 --> 00:33:40,350 S2: And I'm grateful that you have a chance to communicate 630 00:33:40,350 --> 00:33:43,670 S2: that even if it's very rare. You know, I wonder 631 00:33:43,670 --> 00:33:45,469 S2: if back in the day this was happening, but we 632 00:33:45,470 --> 00:33:47,710 S2: didn't know about it because social media was not telling 633 00:33:47,710 --> 00:33:51,470 S2: us that it was happening. So I think in every generation, 634 00:33:51,470 --> 00:33:54,190 S2: there's been family dysfunction all the way back to the Bible. 635 00:33:54,390 --> 00:33:58,470 S2: I think in every generation there have been parents, grandparents, 636 00:33:58,990 --> 00:34:02,830 S2: children and grandchildren who have taken things deeper than they 637 00:34:02,830 --> 00:34:05,230 S2: should have taken them. They didn't forgive. They became bitter. 638 00:34:05,230 --> 00:34:08,549 S2: They gave up, but we didn't know about it. So 639 00:34:08,550 --> 00:34:10,469 S2: we think this is new now. I think it's more 640 00:34:10,469 --> 00:34:14,719 S2: prevalent now because the culture is chaotic. I will I 641 00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:17,200 S2: will be honest with you to say that social media 642 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:21,200 S2: influence is huge. We can't, um, you know, raise our 643 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:26,280 S2: children to have an isolated perspective about values and Christianity 644 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:28,440 S2: and all of that. And another thing that I write 645 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:31,600 S2: about in my book that's really sad is that if 646 00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:33,919 S2: we over parent our children, and I don't say this lightly, 647 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:36,240 S2: I don't want anyone listening to feel badly about this. 648 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,000 S2: But if we over parent our children, they liked it 649 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:41,239 S2: when they were young. They liked that we protected them 650 00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:44,160 S2: from spilling their juice. We liked that we reminded them 651 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:46,319 S2: that there was a test they should study for. But 652 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,399 S2: as they aged up, got older. They didn't want us 653 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:52,319 S2: to be in their business quite to that level. They 654 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,560 S2: might maybe wanted us to know about their business, but 655 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:56,839 S2: not direct their business. And they didn't think we could 656 00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:00,160 S2: parent any other way. So they chose to cut us off. 657 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:02,520 S2: Whereas if they would have had a conversation with the 658 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:04,800 S2: mom to say, hey mom, you know, I don't, I can't, 659 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,400 S2: you just can't be that controlling. I'm an adult now. 660 00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:09,520 S2: This is why I write in my book that you'll 661 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,000 S2: always have the noun parent, but you can't parent an 662 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:16,450 S2: adult child. You can guide, coach, cheer, support, help, mentor, 663 00:35:16,450 --> 00:35:19,250 S2: but you can't parent unless they ask to be parented. 664 00:35:19,250 --> 00:35:22,489 S2: This is what happens. That's always been true. We've never 665 00:35:22,489 --> 00:35:25,290 S2: needed to state it as clearly as today because of 666 00:35:25,290 --> 00:35:28,569 S2: the dysfunction that's prevalent. But that's that's part of what's 667 00:35:28,570 --> 00:35:31,489 S2: going on is we have had a generation of parents 668 00:35:31,810 --> 00:35:34,850 S2: who over controlled and over parented, didn't give their kids 669 00:35:34,850 --> 00:35:38,370 S2: much freedom, which has caused kids to be fragile because 670 00:35:38,370 --> 00:35:42,930 S2: they didn't experience enough traumatic stuff to overcome. This is 671 00:35:42,930 --> 00:35:45,690 S2: why the scripture teaches us that we find our endurance 672 00:35:45,690 --> 00:35:48,210 S2: and our hope and our character when we walk through valleys. 673 00:35:48,210 --> 00:35:51,170 S2: You find that in Romans five and in James chapter one. 674 00:35:51,489 --> 00:35:54,970 S2: So what I wish the adult children would do is 675 00:35:54,969 --> 00:35:57,730 S2: recognize that that's the pain point. Look at a mom 676 00:35:57,730 --> 00:36:00,250 S2: and say, hey, mom, could you back off a little bit? 677 00:36:00,530 --> 00:36:03,690 S2: And then the mom, then you guys, you got, you 678 00:36:03,730 --> 00:36:07,250 S2: got to believe that the kid might be right. And 679 00:36:07,250 --> 00:36:09,210 S2: you don't have to think badly, right? Chris? You don't 680 00:36:09,210 --> 00:36:10,609 S2: have to go back. Oh, for 30 years, I've been 681 00:36:10,610 --> 00:36:12,980 S2: a terrible mom. No, you were actually an excellent mom 682 00:36:13,900 --> 00:36:16,860 S2: in many cases. But now you listen to the child 683 00:36:17,100 --> 00:36:20,220 S2: and you understand that the child from the child's perspective, 684 00:36:20,540 --> 00:36:22,899 S2: you now are in their business and they don't want 685 00:36:22,900 --> 00:36:25,939 S2: you there because they actually want to grow up. So again, 686 00:36:25,980 --> 00:36:29,100 S2: that might be relevant, not necessarily Brenda, to your situation, 687 00:36:29,100 --> 00:36:33,379 S2: but in general. So again, I wouldn't waste a lot. 688 00:36:33,420 --> 00:36:36,020 S2: I would ask you to not waste too much energy 689 00:36:36,020 --> 00:36:39,660 S2: trying to figure it out. You may never know. Pray 690 00:36:39,660 --> 00:36:42,620 S2: that your grandson will figure it out so that he 691 00:36:42,620 --> 00:36:45,140 S2: can repent of any sin that's been involved, and that 692 00:36:45,140 --> 00:36:48,819 S2: he can decide to come back to you. But you know, 693 00:36:48,860 --> 00:36:52,779 S2: pray for hope in God. Pray that he'll pursue Christ. 694 00:36:52,780 --> 00:36:56,020 S2: Because you know what, you guys, if every adult child 695 00:36:56,060 --> 00:37:00,100 S2: who is not in relationship with the parent would pursue Christ, 696 00:37:00,900 --> 00:37:04,339 S2: then all of this goes away because Christ would want 697 00:37:04,340 --> 00:37:07,219 S2: it to. Right? So what if we prayed? And again, 698 00:37:07,260 --> 00:37:09,879 S2: I speak. I love the church, Chris. You know this 699 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:13,919 S2: about me. The body of believers is a really significant. However, 700 00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:17,440 S2: there's so many people I talk with where their emphasis 701 00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,640 S2: is the church. My kid isn't going to church. Well, 702 00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,759 S2: have you prayed about the relationship your kid has with Jesus? 703 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:27,520 S2: How's their prayer life? How are they devoted to the Scripture? 704 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,359 S2: Are they meditating upon the the the food, the Word 705 00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:34,239 S2: of God? Are they worshiping the one true God? Are 706 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,640 S2: they serving God? Are they glorifying God? I would ask 707 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:41,560 S2: that our listeners think more about the pursuit of Christ 708 00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,359 S2: in hopes that that would solve some of the problems. 709 00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:48,240 S1: I love that Brenda brought up, though, that personal thing 710 00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:51,959 S1: that's going on in her. It's like the word bitterness. 711 00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,720 S1: I don't want this bitterness in my. And. And that 712 00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:59,040 S1: is a clue. That struggle is a clue that God 713 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,040 S1: is at work in your life. Brenda, even in the 714 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:06,520 S1: middle of this estrangement of a grandson. And I'd love 715 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:08,529 S1: to be in the store one day when he comes 716 00:38:08,530 --> 00:38:10,450 S1: up and gives you a big hug. I don't know 717 00:38:10,450 --> 00:38:14,210 S1: that it'll happen, but boy, if you get that bitterness 718 00:38:14,210 --> 00:38:17,370 S1: out of there, that's a really good thing to have happened. 719 00:38:17,410 --> 00:38:20,770 S1: Doctor Kathy Cook. One final segment coming up straight ahead. 720 00:38:29,930 --> 00:38:32,410 S1: Well I'm seeing it again. The pain is real. The 721 00:38:32,410 --> 00:38:36,090 S1: hurt is real. The help and the hope is real 722 00:38:36,130 --> 00:38:41,370 S1: as well. And God's design to to eradicate whatever it 723 00:38:41,370 --> 00:38:44,969 S1: is that's going on in your soul. The bitterness that 724 00:38:44,969 --> 00:38:47,930 S1: we just heard Brenda talk about, that's a real thing. 725 00:38:47,930 --> 00:38:50,210 S1: And that's a work of that the spirit can do 726 00:38:50,250 --> 00:38:52,290 S1: in your heart. And it's one of the reasons why 727 00:38:52,530 --> 00:38:55,609 S1: Doctor Kathy Cook wrote, resolve conflict and find peace and 728 00:38:55,610 --> 00:38:59,009 S1: hope with adult children. So thank you. Those of you 729 00:38:59,050 --> 00:39:03,250 S1: who've gone to chris.org, you're going to get a copy 730 00:39:03,250 --> 00:39:06,210 S1: of this as you support the program. And I say 731 00:39:06,210 --> 00:39:08,340 S1: this every now and then. Even if you can't support 732 00:39:08,340 --> 00:39:10,700 S1: the program, if you can't do that, I'd love to 733 00:39:10,700 --> 00:39:13,060 S1: put this in your hands, especially if this is exactly 734 00:39:13,060 --> 00:39:16,180 S1: where you are. And the financial thing. I have enough 735 00:39:16,180 --> 00:39:18,380 S1: faith to believe somebody else will give in your stead. 736 00:39:18,700 --> 00:39:24,420 S1: So just go to chris.org or 866953. Most of the 737 00:39:24,420 --> 00:39:28,460 S1: callers here today, Kathy, have been female. And I wonder, 738 00:39:28,780 --> 00:39:32,460 S1: does this. And even in the email I read, do 739 00:39:32,500 --> 00:39:36,180 S1: men and women handle this kind of pain differently? 740 00:39:37,739 --> 00:39:41,180 S2: I believe so. I think the mom, the moms tend 741 00:39:41,180 --> 00:39:44,540 S2: to be closer to their kids from birth to death. 742 00:39:44,660 --> 00:39:48,180 S2: There is that nurture component of the mom. Moms are 743 00:39:48,180 --> 00:39:51,780 S2: more involved making more of the decisions. Typically, they know 744 00:39:51,820 --> 00:39:54,819 S2: their children usually more intimately. And I say, usually there 745 00:39:54,860 --> 00:39:57,620 S2: are some dads, certainly who are very involved and very aware, 746 00:39:58,060 --> 00:40:00,219 S2: but dads have an easier time. Men, I think, have 747 00:40:00,219 --> 00:40:03,220 S2: an easier time putting things in compartments and shutting the door, 748 00:40:03,780 --> 00:40:06,069 S2: and then they go on with their life, if you will. 749 00:40:06,070 --> 00:40:09,550 S2: They go to work and they have a very different life. 750 00:40:09,550 --> 00:40:12,469 S2: So I think dads often hurt silently, which I think 751 00:40:12,469 --> 00:40:15,950 S2: is really hard. And many dads and men have parents 752 00:40:15,950 --> 00:40:17,870 S2: have said to me that they need to be strong 753 00:40:17,910 --> 00:40:20,790 S2: to support their wife. You know, the mom of the 754 00:40:20,790 --> 00:40:24,069 S2: kids who have gone astray. And so I think it's 755 00:40:24,070 --> 00:40:26,710 S2: a combination of things. Dads are hurting. They just might 756 00:40:26,710 --> 00:40:28,190 S2: not verbalize it quite as much. 757 00:40:28,430 --> 00:40:30,790 S1: For the dads, though, it's going to leak out somewhere. 758 00:40:30,830 --> 00:40:33,070 S1: You know that pain and that hurt. You shove it down. 759 00:40:33,110 --> 00:40:36,030 S1: You know it'll come out in some way. So listen 760 00:40:36,030 --> 00:40:39,629 S1: to that. Uh, Heather is on the line. Heather, what 761 00:40:39,630 --> 00:40:40,870 S1: do you have to say today? 762 00:40:42,550 --> 00:40:47,230 S6: Hi, Chris. Thank you for taking my call. Um, I 763 00:40:47,390 --> 00:40:52,390 S6: am a mom of three kids, but I am having 764 00:40:52,390 --> 00:40:56,590 S6: a difficult relationship with my oldest son. Um, it hasn't 765 00:40:56,590 --> 00:40:59,830 S6: always been that way, but in the last year and 766 00:40:59,830 --> 00:41:04,520 S6: a half, um, his partner has cut me off from 767 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:08,120 S6: him and, um, my grandkids. I've always had a close 768 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:12,239 S6: relationship with my grandkids, kept them overnight, you know, take 769 00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:15,200 S6: them shopping, do all those things grandmas love to do 770 00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,880 S6: by spoiling them. But in the last couple of months, 771 00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:24,520 S6: I haven't seen my son or spoken to him. It's 772 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:28,719 S6: as if he's just disappeared and we don't live that 773 00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:32,040 S6: far from each other, maybe ten minutes from each other. 774 00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:35,640 S6: And it's just heartbreaking, you know? I don't have a 775 00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:39,399 S6: very good relationship with my own mother, so I, I 776 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:43,200 S6: sometimes feel guilty about that. Um, she and I have 777 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:46,800 S6: come to an agreement to exist in each other's lives, 778 00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:50,759 S6: but not in an overbearing situation. But my relationship with 779 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:54,920 S6: my son has always been close. And it's just it 780 00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:58,200 S6: I just don't know sometimes how to handle that. I 781 00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:01,560 S6: want to fix it, but I just don't know how. 782 00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,010 S1: Yeah. Ten minutes. See, that comes back to me. Just 783 00:42:06,050 --> 00:42:09,210 S1: ten minutes away or 20 minutes away. And grandkids, it's just. 784 00:42:09,210 --> 00:42:10,330 S1: Here's your heart out. 785 00:42:11,130 --> 00:42:13,810 S2: Oh, definitely. Oh my goodness. First, I want to say 786 00:42:14,090 --> 00:42:16,690 S2: I really respect what you and your mom have decided 787 00:42:16,690 --> 00:42:20,210 S2: to coexist and yet to have to not be overbearing, 788 00:42:20,250 --> 00:42:23,010 S2: like not demand a lot from each other, not smother 789 00:42:23,010 --> 00:42:26,129 S2: each other with hugs and kisses. That's so wise that 790 00:42:26,130 --> 00:42:29,489 S2: you've agreed to that. And what a lesson for all 791 00:42:29,489 --> 00:42:32,210 S2: of us to wonder if, if we could be satisfied 792 00:42:32,210 --> 00:42:35,890 S2: with something smaller than what we want and start there, 793 00:42:35,890 --> 00:42:38,330 S2: and maybe something would grow from there. So again, I 794 00:42:38,330 --> 00:42:41,370 S2: really appreciate that. And I'm sad with you, for you, 795 00:42:41,410 --> 00:42:44,569 S2: with your older son and this decision, it sounds to 796 00:42:44,570 --> 00:42:47,290 S2: me like jealousy is the issue. I think in many cases, 797 00:42:47,290 --> 00:42:51,850 S2: there's a partner that's jealous of the attention that his 798 00:42:51,850 --> 00:42:56,170 S2: partner gives the family, the mom, the dad, or the siblings. 799 00:42:56,170 --> 00:43:01,489 S2: So this partner is protecting, um, his relationship. It's selfish. 800 00:43:01,860 --> 00:43:04,259 S2: It's self-centered. I mean, I would call this out if 801 00:43:04,260 --> 00:43:06,420 S2: I was looking in the eye. I've been known to 802 00:43:06,460 --> 00:43:09,100 S2: challenge people if this is what they're doing. What are 803 00:43:09,100 --> 00:43:11,739 S2: you afraid of? Does does the partner do you do 804 00:43:11,739 --> 00:43:13,580 S2: you love this person and you don't think he has 805 00:43:13,580 --> 00:43:16,100 S2: enough love to go around? So you have to cut 806 00:43:16,100 --> 00:43:18,060 S2: off his love from the family so that he has 807 00:43:18,060 --> 00:43:20,819 S2: more love for you. But is that your place? Is 808 00:43:20,820 --> 00:43:23,859 S2: that what love is? It doesn't love endure? Again, if 809 00:43:23,900 --> 00:43:25,859 S2: you're not if you're not a Bible reader, you can't 810 00:43:25,860 --> 00:43:28,819 S2: use the Bible. But you know, first Corinthians 13, let's 811 00:43:28,820 --> 00:43:30,900 S2: get it out of the marriage ceremony and let's leave 812 00:43:30,900 --> 00:43:33,420 S2: it in the marriage ceremony and add it elsewhere. You know, 813 00:43:33,460 --> 00:43:35,779 S2: love endures and love, you know, as honest and true 814 00:43:35,780 --> 00:43:38,020 S2: and all those things. So again, I think there's jealousy. 815 00:43:38,020 --> 00:43:39,939 S2: I think there's protection going on. And I think that's 816 00:43:39,940 --> 00:43:42,739 S2: really sad and it's unnecessary. So what do you do? 817 00:43:42,780 --> 00:43:45,739 S2: You know, it's I you pray and you hope and 818 00:43:45,739 --> 00:43:49,660 S2: you endure and you find other people to love well, 819 00:43:49,980 --> 00:43:52,219 S2: and you don't let this destroy you. Don't let it 820 00:43:52,219 --> 00:43:56,100 S2: rob you of your joy. Don't let his decision destroy 821 00:43:56,219 --> 00:43:59,940 S2: the opportunities that you have to love other people. Well. 822 00:43:59,940 --> 00:44:02,880 S2: And I know it's not the same like I respect. 823 00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:04,720 S2: It's not the same. It sounds like you do have 824 00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:07,919 S2: two other kids that maybe you're in positive relationships with. 825 00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,200 S2: That's great news and hopefully you can support them and 826 00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:14,440 S2: they support you. And you won't just be in that 827 00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:17,040 S2: negative space every day because that doesn't do anybody any good. 828 00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:19,239 S1: Yeah. Heather, I want to send you a copy of 829 00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:22,080 S1: the book. So hang on. We'll get your information. What 830 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:27,320 S1: if the fracture or fissure is of the political stripe, 831 00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,520 S1: and there's an awful lot of that going, or the 832 00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:34,399 S1: child has gone away to a different religion. Maybe they 833 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,359 S1: become an evangelical Christian. And the parent, you know, is, 834 00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:40,239 S1: is not with some other religion or was an atheist. 835 00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:43,800 S1: And there's a fracture or fissure in a political or 836 00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:46,640 S1: the religious end of things. What do you say to that? 837 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:50,160 S2: Yeah, I wrote a whole chapter on that. Well, there's 838 00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,160 S2: a whole chapter on the faith division and a whole 839 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:54,640 S2: chapter on issues like politics. I think we don't talk 840 00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:57,120 S2: about certain things. You know, we don't talk about them. 841 00:44:57,160 --> 00:45:00,489 S2: Like we can be sad that they've chosen other values politically, 842 00:45:01,170 --> 00:45:03,250 S2: but they have a right to do that again. Who 843 00:45:03,290 --> 00:45:05,810 S2: have they been persuaded by, and have we really put 844 00:45:05,810 --> 00:45:09,810 S2: on display the reasons behind our decisions? Or have you 845 00:45:09,850 --> 00:45:12,570 S2: always been a quote unquote Republican, but you've never really 846 00:45:12,570 --> 00:45:15,489 S2: taught your kids why? So again, we're we're we need 847 00:45:15,489 --> 00:45:18,170 S2: to be responsible for the things that we're responsible for 848 00:45:18,370 --> 00:45:20,890 S2: and not place blame only on the adult kids. But again, 849 00:45:20,930 --> 00:45:23,330 S2: we can choose not to talk about that. And we 850 00:45:23,330 --> 00:45:25,770 S2: can love people who don't agree with us politically. So 851 00:45:25,810 --> 00:45:28,290 S2: we cancel each other's votes. I mean, in reality, and 852 00:45:28,290 --> 00:45:30,930 S2: that's really sad. But I think, you know, I think 853 00:45:30,930 --> 00:45:34,330 S2: we can love. Um, I don't see biblically that, you know, 854 00:45:34,370 --> 00:45:36,850 S2: love you love people who believe what you believe. No, 855 00:45:36,850 --> 00:45:39,210 S2: you love people because God is love and we're called 856 00:45:39,210 --> 00:45:41,810 S2: to love. And so it's frustrating. But have we taught 857 00:45:41,810 --> 00:45:44,529 S2: this is why I teach people who have younger children 858 00:45:44,530 --> 00:45:47,250 S2: to teach your values. Don't don't assume that living with 859 00:45:47,250 --> 00:45:48,810 S2: you is going to teach them who you want them 860 00:45:48,810 --> 00:45:51,089 S2: to be. So if somebody's listening today and you've got 861 00:45:51,090 --> 00:45:53,649 S2: kids who are 18 and under, you can teach them 862 00:45:53,650 --> 00:45:56,370 S2: certain things now that will help them launch better and 863 00:45:56,370 --> 00:45:59,540 S2: hopefully stay connected to you again. If it's a faith division, 864 00:45:59,540 --> 00:46:03,140 S2: pray them to Jesus, not to the church. And please 865 00:46:03,140 --> 00:46:05,739 S2: understand that there are kids who have acted like they're 866 00:46:05,739 --> 00:46:08,220 S2: saved and they've never been saved. I have met them. 867 00:46:08,219 --> 00:46:09,580 S2: They've looked me in the eye and they've said, yeah, 868 00:46:09,580 --> 00:46:11,819 S2: I said yes to. I faked it, yes to get 869 00:46:11,820 --> 00:46:14,580 S2: my dad off my back. So let's pray them to 870 00:46:14,580 --> 00:46:18,859 S2: Jesus and let's witness Christ. Let's be vibrant in our 871 00:46:18,860 --> 00:46:21,380 S2: relationship with God so that we make God look good. 872 00:46:21,700 --> 00:46:24,100 S2: And hopefully they would come back. And if not, then 873 00:46:24,100 --> 00:46:26,259 S2: we talk about all the other things we have in common. 874 00:46:26,660 --> 00:46:29,460 S2: And we grieve because it's big and we pray, but 875 00:46:29,460 --> 00:46:30,380 S2: we don't lose hope. 876 00:46:31,300 --> 00:46:34,180 S1: Here's what I like most about you, Cathy, and the 877 00:46:34,180 --> 00:46:36,860 S1: book that you've written is the hope that is there, 878 00:46:36,900 --> 00:46:39,060 S1: that you end with hope. And we give that to 879 00:46:39,060 --> 00:46:42,779 S1: you today, friend. Go to Chris Fabry live.org. We'd love 880 00:46:42,780 --> 00:46:45,220 S1: to send you a copy of this. Thanks for listening. 881 00:46:45,219 --> 00:46:48,180 S1: Chris Fabry live production of Moody Radio, a Ministry of 882 00:46:48,180 --> 00:46:49,980 S1: Moody Bible Institute.