1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:09,000 S1: She has an amazing story of transformation, and I have 2 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,440 S1: been waiting a long time to have a conversation with 3 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:15,440 S1: Laura Perry Smalls. She speaks into a culture drowning in 4 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:19,840 S1: the lives of the born that way ideology that claims, 5 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:24,880 S1: desires and feelings cannot change or be overridden. She chronicles 6 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:28,960 S1: her story in the book Transgender to Transformed, which came 7 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:31,920 S1: out in 2019. So even though I'm late to the party, 8 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:35,000 S1: we're going to hear from her today. Perhaps something she 9 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:37,559 S1: shares is going to be helpful for you in a 10 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:41,800 S1: relationship with someone you love and care about. That's our hope. 11 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:44,040 S1: Let's get going first with a thank you to our team. 12 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:47,320 S1: Ryan McConaughey doing all things technical. Trish is our producer. 13 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:50,800 S1: Our program is recorded today. Laura came through Chicago in 14 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,360 S1: late February, and we were able to sit down and 15 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,960 S1: have this conversation. So don't call our live number today, 16 00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:01,000 S1: but please get in touch if you value conversations like 17 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:04,080 S1: this at the radio backyard fence, I choose a thank 18 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:07,200 S1: you each month, and this month we're offering the new 19 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,440 S1: book by our friend Colleen Chow. She was diagnosed several 20 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:14,680 S1: years ago with terminal cancer, and we've had several conversations 21 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:17,440 S1: through the years. And I want to send you perhaps 22 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,959 S1: her most important book. It's titled On Our Way Home. 23 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:24,240 S1: It is so encouraging, so uplifting. You're going to hear 24 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:27,759 S1: her smile as you read, uh, in this book about 25 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,880 S1: what heaven's going to be like. What experiencing the hope 26 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:34,560 S1: of heaven now can do to your soul. Give a 27 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:36,720 S1: gift of any size. Will send you a copy of. 28 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:46,399 S1: On Our Way Home, call 86695438669532279 or just go to 29 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:51,840 S1: Chris Fabry live.org. Chris Fabry live and thank you for 30 00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:57,560 S1: your support of the radio backyard fence. Laura Perry Smoltz 31 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:00,000 S1: is an author and speaker who shares her story of 32 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:04,160 S1: how Jesus rescued her from a transgender identity. She is 33 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:08,880 S1: co-founder with her husband, Perry Smalls of Eden's Redemption. She 34 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:12,279 S1: also speaks and teaches on a variety of topics related 35 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:16,600 S1: to transgenderism and God's design of human beings as male 36 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:19,960 S1: and female. She's had the privilege to tell her story 37 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,919 S1: on a variety of platforms radio, video, TV. She was 38 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:28,480 S1: in the documentary in his image. Her story is told 39 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:34,160 S1: in the autobiography Transgender to Transformed a story of transition 40 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,359 S1: that will truly set you free. It's our featured resource. 41 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:41,760 S1: Just go to the website. Chris. Org. Laura, welcome to 42 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:43,320 S1: the program. How are you doing today? 43 00:02:44,120 --> 00:02:45,799 S2: Great. Thank you so much for having me on. 44 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:51,679 S1: It seems to me the tide is turning in our culture. 45 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,680 S1: And I want you to tell me if you see 46 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,520 S1: what I'm seeing, because I feel like more people are 47 00:02:56,680 --> 00:03:02,520 S1: questioning the transgender ideology. AM I reading the social cues? Well? 48 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:06,280 S3: Yeah, absolutely. And it's interesting that you use that analogy. Uh, 49 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:09,440 S3: last year we went to the country of Chile, which 50 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,520 S3: in South America, you know, has a very long coastline. 51 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:15,679 S3: And the Lord just put on my heart that analogy 52 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:19,359 S3: that there was a great tide coming in that was 53 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:23,600 S3: sweeping the you know, when you watch the tide, it 54 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:26,000 S3: sweeps the sand into the sea. And I just felt 55 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:28,360 S3: like the enemy was trying to drag so many of 56 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,040 S3: our children into the sea. But the Lord put on 57 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:33,520 S3: my heart. And I told the churches there, um, that 58 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,440 S3: if we will pray and seek the Lord and we 59 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,000 S3: will repent, you know, the, the verse that everyone knows, 60 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,360 S3: if my children, which are called by my name, will 61 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,360 S3: turn from their wicked ways and seek my face. Um, 62 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:48,200 S3: that I will forgive their sin and heal their land. 63 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:51,200 S3: And I said, the tide will turn. And when you 64 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,800 S3: watch the tide, um, come back. And then it's dragging 65 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:57,050 S3: some of the sand from the sea back onto the shore. 66 00:03:57,250 --> 00:04:00,090 S3: The other interesting point about that is that there were 67 00:04:00,090 --> 00:04:04,410 S3: these huge boulders on this one particular coastline, and where 68 00:04:04,410 --> 00:04:07,610 S3: these boulders were, the sand was not being dragged into 69 00:04:07,610 --> 00:04:10,210 S3: the sea. It was protected behind the rocks. And so 70 00:04:10,210 --> 00:04:12,970 S3: the Lord just put it on my heart that when 71 00:04:12,970 --> 00:04:16,570 S3: we are standing firmly planted on the rock, that we 72 00:04:16,610 --> 00:04:19,729 S3: are going to protect so many that are going, being deceived. 73 00:04:20,050 --> 00:04:23,650 S3: But but yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I'm beginning 74 00:04:23,650 --> 00:04:26,410 S3: to see the tide turn. It has been years of 75 00:04:26,650 --> 00:04:29,810 S3: sowing and putting the information out, me and many others, 76 00:04:30,290 --> 00:04:33,570 S3: but just seeing such hard, rocky ground for a long 77 00:04:33,570 --> 00:04:37,050 S3: time and we're really beginning to see people question now, 78 00:04:37,330 --> 00:04:40,450 S3: beginning to see a lot of information come out. And 79 00:04:40,450 --> 00:04:42,850 S3: I really do believe the tide is turning, but I 80 00:04:42,850 --> 00:04:45,690 S3: think the enemy is also ramping up his efforts. You know, 81 00:04:45,730 --> 00:04:50,130 S3: he does not like this conversation. Um, he wants people 82 00:04:50,130 --> 00:04:53,330 S3: deceived into this. And so we need to keep praying 83 00:04:53,330 --> 00:04:55,250 S3: and keep putting the truth out there. 84 00:04:55,850 --> 00:04:59,650 S1: You know, the other thing that I see is lawsuits 85 00:04:59,650 --> 00:05:04,450 S1: that are coming against medical providers who for kids, you know, 86 00:05:04,490 --> 00:05:09,010 S1: who went through the transition or surgery that that has, 87 00:05:09,330 --> 00:05:12,890 S1: that's one way that the, you know, the mental, the 88 00:05:12,890 --> 00:05:16,050 S1: synapses are clicking. It's like, well, wait a minute. Now 89 00:05:16,170 --> 00:05:19,729 S1: we're opening ourselves up. And so they're, they're shutting some 90 00:05:19,730 --> 00:05:21,010 S1: of those doors, aren't they? 91 00:05:21,050 --> 00:05:24,610 S3: Yeah, they are. And it really is effective. I mean, um, 92 00:05:24,650 --> 00:05:27,970 S3: sometimes you have to, to go after their God. You know, 93 00:05:28,010 --> 00:05:30,849 S3: they worship money for a lot of these people. I'm 94 00:05:30,850 --> 00:05:34,290 S3: sure there are some people that have, you know, motives. 95 00:05:34,290 --> 00:05:37,690 S3: They think this is good for these children. They're deceived 96 00:05:37,770 --> 00:05:40,210 S3: as well. But I think for a lot of them, 97 00:05:40,210 --> 00:05:43,090 S3: it's about money. And I think hitting them in the 98 00:05:43,089 --> 00:05:47,130 S3: pocketbook and making them scared that they're going to get sued. Right? I, 99 00:05:47,170 --> 00:05:51,010 S3: I think it's been highly effective, but there's also, um, 100 00:05:51,050 --> 00:05:53,729 S3: it's not just 1 or 2 cases that people might 101 00:05:53,730 --> 00:05:58,130 S3: hear of. There's a Reddit forum that's publicly available. It's. 102 00:05:58,130 --> 00:06:00,370 S3: You can't join it unless you are either a D 103 00:06:00,410 --> 00:06:03,890 S3: transitioner or somebody that's questioning whether you want a D transition, 104 00:06:03,890 --> 00:06:06,570 S3: but you can read it publicly and it's called D 105 00:06:06,570 --> 00:06:08,930 S3: transit is D e t r a n s and 106 00:06:08,930 --> 00:06:11,610 S3: you can read all kinds of stories of hundreds and 107 00:06:11,610 --> 00:06:14,530 S3: hundreds of kids that regret it and are angry. They're like, 108 00:06:14,529 --> 00:06:16,690 S3: why didn't anybody tell me? Why did somebody let me 109 00:06:16,730 --> 00:06:19,050 S3: do this? I heard so many kids on there that 110 00:06:19,050 --> 00:06:22,330 S3: said like things like, I was 14. Why did a 111 00:06:22,330 --> 00:06:26,570 S3: doctor let me cut off my breasts? It's so heart wrenching. 112 00:06:26,810 --> 00:06:29,930 S3: And last time I looked, there was over 50,000 members. 113 00:06:30,490 --> 00:06:30,890 S2: Wow. 114 00:06:31,930 --> 00:06:34,610 S1: Well, and that is just evidence. And I want to 115 00:06:34,610 --> 00:06:36,650 S1: talk more about that. And I also want to talk 116 00:06:36,650 --> 00:06:40,770 S1: about your story though, because you you have your story 117 00:06:40,770 --> 00:06:44,370 S1: to tell. Other people have their stories. The other aspect 118 00:06:44,370 --> 00:06:47,049 S1: you just mentioned at the church, you know, you're talking 119 00:06:47,050 --> 00:06:49,970 S1: in Chile to the church. I feel like the church 120 00:06:49,970 --> 00:06:55,370 S1: has been slow with this as well. Slow both in 121 00:06:55,610 --> 00:07:00,289 S1: responding to the truth claims, you know, and the ideology, 122 00:07:00,290 --> 00:07:04,130 S1: but also slow with compassion. Because it seems like when 123 00:07:04,130 --> 00:07:06,810 S1: we have an issue like this, it's either, you know, 124 00:07:06,930 --> 00:07:13,690 S1: these are the evil people over here and them and us. And, uh, 125 00:07:13,770 --> 00:07:18,010 S1: we need to be more welcoming to those who are really, 126 00:07:18,010 --> 00:07:21,930 S1: really struggling. And I wonder what your position is on 127 00:07:21,970 --> 00:07:23,530 S1: that or how you see that. 128 00:07:23,570 --> 00:07:26,730 S3: Yeah, absolutely. It's like there's one extreme or the other 129 00:07:26,730 --> 00:07:30,130 S3: in the church. Uh, there's a verse in Proverbs that says, uh, 130 00:07:30,130 --> 00:07:33,570 S3: bind truth and love around your neck. And I, we 131 00:07:33,570 --> 00:07:36,330 S3: really have to learn to walk both of those out. 132 00:07:36,570 --> 00:07:39,369 S3: I think Jesus was not just a loving person. He's 133 00:07:39,370 --> 00:07:42,730 S3: the very source of love himself. And he also said, 134 00:07:42,770 --> 00:07:45,290 S3: I'm the way, the truth, and the life. And even 135 00:07:45,290 --> 00:07:47,610 S3: though he did all these miracles and he fed the crowds, 136 00:07:47,610 --> 00:07:49,450 S3: he said the crowds were just following him because he 137 00:07:49,450 --> 00:07:53,930 S3: filled their bellies. What really impacted people were the conversations 138 00:07:53,930 --> 00:07:56,610 S3: he had. People. And you see these lives transformed, like 139 00:07:56,610 --> 00:07:59,210 S3: the woman at the well, the woman caught in adultery. 140 00:08:00,090 --> 00:08:04,250 S3: Jesus used his words. And I think sometimes we're so afraid. 141 00:08:04,410 --> 00:08:06,170 S3: For a lot of us, we're so afraid to speak 142 00:08:06,170 --> 00:08:08,730 S3: the truth. And there's other people that are so angry 143 00:08:08,730 --> 00:08:12,610 S3: at the agenda that they don't see the person. And 144 00:08:12,610 --> 00:08:14,770 S3: I think we have to look at these people. Now 145 00:08:14,770 --> 00:08:18,210 S3: I do. I have fought the agenda in certain arenas, 146 00:08:18,210 --> 00:08:22,810 S3: in in political situations, but for the most part, we 147 00:08:22,810 --> 00:08:27,370 S3: have to look at people as individuals. There's reasons that 148 00:08:27,370 --> 00:08:30,650 S3: people get deceived into this. I find that underneath all 149 00:08:30,690 --> 00:08:34,650 S3: the gender confusion, the identity, the anger, the pride underneath 150 00:08:34,650 --> 00:08:37,610 S3: all of that is a person that's just hurting, a 151 00:08:37,610 --> 00:08:41,610 S3: person that is deceived, a person that really hates themselves. 152 00:08:41,970 --> 00:08:45,370 S3: There's a lot of self-hatred and a lot of jealousy, 153 00:08:45,410 --> 00:08:48,530 S3: a lot of bitterness towards God sometimes about how their 154 00:08:48,530 --> 00:08:51,220 S3: life has worked out. Um. There's things I don't like 155 00:08:51,260 --> 00:08:55,100 S3: about themselves. They're insecure and all that's underneath all of that. 156 00:08:55,100 --> 00:08:56,700 S3: And we have to get to the heart of the 157 00:08:56,700 --> 00:08:58,939 S3: person we do. 158 00:08:58,940 --> 00:09:01,339 S1: And I'm so glad that you've told your story. The 159 00:09:01,340 --> 00:09:05,579 S1: book is transgender two transformed a story of transition that 160 00:09:05,580 --> 00:09:11,179 S1: will truly set you free. It's our featured resource@kris.org, written 161 00:09:11,179 --> 00:09:14,020 S1: by Laura Perry Smoltz. You're going to hear more of 162 00:09:14,020 --> 00:09:26,459 S1: her story straight ahead on Moody Radio. Thanks for joining 163 00:09:26,460 --> 00:09:29,380 S1: us today at the Radio Backyard Fence. Special guest is 164 00:09:29,380 --> 00:09:33,500 S1: Laura Perry Smoltz. Our program is recorded. Don't call us today, 165 00:09:33,980 --> 00:09:36,699 S1: but I'm going to try to answer or ask. She's good, 166 00:09:36,740 --> 00:09:38,540 S1: but Laura's going to answer. I'm going to try to 167 00:09:38,580 --> 00:09:41,339 S1: ask some of the questions that you would ask if 168 00:09:41,380 --> 00:09:44,900 S1: you were able to call in today. And if you 169 00:09:44,900 --> 00:09:48,540 S1: go to the website, Chris Fabry live.org, you'll see Laura's 170 00:09:48,540 --> 00:09:53,660 S1: excellent book that tells her story transgender to transformed. Just 171 00:09:53,660 --> 00:09:58,700 S1: go to chris.org. We're going to talk about this organization 172 00:09:58,700 --> 00:10:02,700 S1: that you co-founded with your husband, Eden's Redemption in a minute. 173 00:10:02,700 --> 00:10:06,459 S1: But tell me your story. So start wherever you want 174 00:10:06,500 --> 00:10:10,420 S1: or wherever you usually start, Laura. And lay it out 175 00:10:10,420 --> 00:10:11,180 S1: here for us. 176 00:10:11,380 --> 00:10:14,380 S3: Yeah. I grew up in a Christian home, and we 177 00:10:14,420 --> 00:10:16,780 S3: were one of those families that we were there every 178 00:10:16,780 --> 00:10:19,020 S3: time the door was open. We were involved in all 179 00:10:19,059 --> 00:10:22,100 S3: the little programs. My my dad was a deacon, my 180 00:10:22,100 --> 00:10:24,340 S3: mom was a church pianist and did a lot of 181 00:10:24,340 --> 00:10:26,780 S3: other things at the church. And so we were super 182 00:10:26,780 --> 00:10:30,020 S3: involved and people were shocked. Years later, when they realized, 183 00:10:30,059 --> 00:10:32,980 S3: you know, what I had been living in and they 184 00:10:32,980 --> 00:10:35,380 S3: thought we were the perfect family because we looked like 185 00:10:35,380 --> 00:10:37,300 S3: we had it all together. You know, we looked like 186 00:10:37,300 --> 00:10:40,780 S3: the perfect Christian family. Um, but there were just, you know, 187 00:10:40,820 --> 00:10:44,180 S3: like everybody. We're, uh, we were broken. And I think 188 00:10:44,179 --> 00:10:47,140 S3: that we forget that we're all sinners raising other sinners. 189 00:10:47,140 --> 00:10:49,260 S3: And even on our best day and our best efforts, 190 00:10:49,260 --> 00:10:52,100 S3: we still make mistakes. And my poor mom, which I 191 00:10:52,100 --> 00:10:54,460 S3: have so much grace for now, I love so much. 192 00:10:54,460 --> 00:10:57,500 S3: We've reconciled and forgiven. And now I have a much 193 00:10:57,500 --> 00:11:01,980 S3: different perspective than I did as a child. But she 194 00:11:01,980 --> 00:11:04,020 S3: said she always felt like she was on this performance 195 00:11:04,020 --> 00:11:06,740 S3: treadmill for God, never being good enough, never doing enough. 196 00:11:07,220 --> 00:11:10,020 S3: And so she was extremely stressed out and burned out 197 00:11:10,020 --> 00:11:13,460 S3: as a kid. And it really began to give me, um, 198 00:11:13,580 --> 00:11:16,020 S3: kind of a warped view of Christianity because I'm hearing 199 00:11:16,020 --> 00:11:17,860 S3: about the love of Jesus, but I'm just seeing all 200 00:11:17,860 --> 00:11:20,620 S3: this stress and frustration. But there was this part of 201 00:11:20,620 --> 00:11:22,540 S3: me that just didn't want to obey the rules, didn't 202 00:11:22,540 --> 00:11:25,220 S3: want to serve. God, got tired of hearing about Jesus 203 00:11:25,220 --> 00:11:27,340 S3: all the time, and I didn't know that. I didn't 204 00:11:27,340 --> 00:11:31,580 S3: know him and throughout my life was always jealous. My brother, 205 00:11:31,580 --> 00:11:34,540 S3: always more comfortable around boys, didn't feel like I fit 206 00:11:34,540 --> 00:11:37,179 S3: in with the girls. Um, but I was having a 207 00:11:37,179 --> 00:11:40,260 S3: lot of health problems. I always struggled with my weight 208 00:11:40,260 --> 00:11:44,220 S3: and was always really angry at God because I just 209 00:11:44,220 --> 00:11:46,620 S3: felt like, okay, God made my body. And even when 210 00:11:46,620 --> 00:11:48,780 S3: I would try really hard, I'd exercise a lot. Still 211 00:11:48,780 --> 00:11:51,460 S3: having trouble and I just really began to blame God 212 00:11:51,460 --> 00:11:54,900 S3: because I had so much rejection and I just didn't 213 00:11:54,900 --> 00:11:58,699 S3: like being a girl, didn't like my body, and instead 214 00:11:58,700 --> 00:12:00,860 S3: I turned away from God and I started getting into 215 00:12:00,860 --> 00:12:03,060 S3: a lot of sexual sin. I thought I would find 216 00:12:03,100 --> 00:12:05,780 S3: happiness and freedom if I would give myself away sexually, 217 00:12:05,780 --> 00:12:09,460 S3: then maybe I would be accepted. Um. And instead I 218 00:12:09,460 --> 00:12:11,700 S3: was used and abused and dumped and rejected over and 219 00:12:11,700 --> 00:12:14,180 S3: over and over and over again. And I just hated myself. 220 00:12:14,179 --> 00:12:18,140 S3: I had no self-worth or value. And instead of turning 221 00:12:18,140 --> 00:12:20,579 S3: back to the Lord, I thought, you know the reason 222 00:12:20,580 --> 00:12:22,699 S3: this never works out. The reason I'm never happy is 223 00:12:22,700 --> 00:12:24,819 S3: because I was supposed to be a man. And I 224 00:12:24,820 --> 00:12:27,380 S3: was like, this all makes sense. And I found a 225 00:12:27,380 --> 00:12:30,699 S3: support group, um, in Tulsa, Oklahoma, where I was living. 226 00:12:30,900 --> 00:12:32,740 S3: And within five minutes they were like, oh, you are 227 00:12:32,740 --> 00:12:35,819 S3: definitely transgender. It's like, I knew it. I knew this 228 00:12:35,820 --> 00:12:38,300 S3: was me and I was worried I would never look 229 00:12:38,300 --> 00:12:40,620 S3: like a man. And they said, oh, don't worry about it. 230 00:12:40,620 --> 00:12:42,819 S3: After a year or so of hormones, no one will 231 00:12:42,820 --> 00:12:46,339 S3: ever know you were a girl. So many people that 232 00:12:46,340 --> 00:12:49,740 S3: go into these lifestyles, there's something they don't like about themselves. 233 00:12:49,780 --> 00:12:52,699 S3: There's been some kind of pain or trauma, whatever it is, 234 00:12:52,700 --> 00:12:55,460 S3: some kind of brokenness. And it's like, I can just 235 00:12:55,460 --> 00:12:59,060 S3: throw that person away and I can reinvent myself. It's 236 00:12:59,059 --> 00:13:02,179 S3: such a counterfeit of being born again. Jesus said, no 237 00:13:02,179 --> 00:13:04,819 S3: one can enter the kingdom of heaven unless he's born again. 238 00:13:04,820 --> 00:13:09,100 S3: People know there's something desperately wrong and there is. But 239 00:13:09,100 --> 00:13:12,900 S3: Satan gives them the wrong solution. We can't reinvent ourselves 240 00:13:12,900 --> 00:13:15,140 S3: to reinvent ourselves as to say that I am God 241 00:13:15,140 --> 00:13:18,340 S3: and I'm my own creator. But what the Lord wants 242 00:13:18,340 --> 00:13:20,180 S3: is for us to come to him and let him 243 00:13:20,179 --> 00:13:23,620 S3: heal us, because we can't get rid of that old person. 244 00:13:24,100 --> 00:13:26,420 S3: But we can come to Jesus and let him heal it. 245 00:13:26,660 --> 00:13:29,460 S1: How old were you at that point when you found 246 00:13:29,460 --> 00:13:31,660 S1: folks who said, oh, you're definitely transgender? 247 00:13:31,700 --> 00:13:35,100 S3: I was 25. I was in middle school and high 248 00:13:35,100 --> 00:13:38,180 S3: school in the 90s. So if I had grown up, 249 00:13:38,220 --> 00:13:40,940 S3: you know, a decade or two later, um, I would 250 00:13:40,980 --> 00:13:43,780 S3: have been saying that I was transgender at a very 251 00:13:43,780 --> 00:13:46,860 S3: young age. But I started living that way at 25. 252 00:13:47,860 --> 00:13:50,220 S3: And as I did, I started taking hormones and I 253 00:13:50,220 --> 00:13:53,020 S3: started to look more like a man and started dressing 254 00:13:53,020 --> 00:13:56,220 S3: like a man. And the more affirmation I got, the 255 00:13:56,220 --> 00:13:59,939 S3: more it seemed to make that real. And how people 256 00:13:59,940 --> 00:14:02,339 S3: are affirming me and people are celebrating me. And I 257 00:14:02,340 --> 00:14:05,620 S3: felt like this really brave person, and I had this 258 00:14:05,620 --> 00:14:08,860 S3: new identity, and I could just completely forget all the 259 00:14:08,860 --> 00:14:11,860 S3: pain and brokenness of my life. And I was very 260 00:14:11,860 --> 00:14:14,220 S3: aware that this was all kind of artificial. Like, the 261 00:14:14,220 --> 00:14:16,300 S3: only reason I'm looking like a man is because I'm 262 00:14:16,300 --> 00:14:19,820 S3: injecting myself with testosterone. But a couple of years into it, 263 00:14:19,820 --> 00:14:22,700 S3: I went and had a double mastectomy and had my 264 00:14:22,700 --> 00:14:27,060 S3: breasts removed. And I remember, um, I was very excited 265 00:14:27,060 --> 00:14:29,100 S3: at first, just thought this was the greatest thing ever. 266 00:14:29,100 --> 00:14:32,820 S3: The surgery made me legally male, but a few weeks later, 267 00:14:32,820 --> 00:14:36,100 S3: I got really depressed because I realized this surgery hadn't 268 00:14:36,100 --> 00:14:39,140 S3: made me a man and I felt stupid. I thought, well, 269 00:14:39,460 --> 00:14:41,820 S3: why did I think this would make me a man? 270 00:14:41,940 --> 00:14:45,620 S3: It made me legally male. But I thought, well, women 271 00:14:45,620 --> 00:14:48,580 S3: have mastectomies for medical reasons. That doesn't make them men. 272 00:14:49,220 --> 00:14:52,340 S3: And so I thought, well, maybe it's because I have 273 00:14:52,340 --> 00:14:54,980 S3: all these female hormones and all these female organs. Once 274 00:14:54,980 --> 00:14:56,540 S3: I get rid of all of that, then it will 275 00:14:56,540 --> 00:14:59,220 S3: be real. So I had a hysterectomy and I had 276 00:14:59,220 --> 00:15:02,180 S3: the ovaries removed and that still didn't make it real. 277 00:15:02,860 --> 00:15:05,700 S3: And then I started looking into more surgeries, and I 278 00:15:05,700 --> 00:15:08,780 S3: was horrified when I started looking at what they call 279 00:15:09,020 --> 00:15:13,780 S3: genital reassignment surgeries that really should be called genital mutilation surgeries. 280 00:15:13,820 --> 00:15:16,700 S3: None of this was real. They're completely artificial. I realized 281 00:15:16,700 --> 00:15:19,260 S3: I would never function as a man, and things started 282 00:15:19,260 --> 00:15:21,460 S3: to dawn on me that I just never thought of. 283 00:15:21,620 --> 00:15:23,940 S3: Like the fact that I would never father a child. 284 00:15:24,420 --> 00:15:28,140 S3: And I just realized that this was all a lie. 285 00:15:28,580 --> 00:15:34,340 S3: And I remember at one point, um, almost, maybe not hearing, 286 00:15:34,340 --> 00:15:37,220 S3: but just in my thoughts, almost feeling like the enemy 287 00:15:37,220 --> 00:15:40,830 S3: was gloating over me. Like you fell for this and 288 00:15:40,830 --> 00:15:44,190 S3: I knew that this was a lie I had believed. 289 00:15:44,190 --> 00:15:46,750 S3: And the whole time over those years, this was maybe 290 00:15:46,750 --> 00:15:48,830 S3: about five years into it, out of nine years that 291 00:15:48,830 --> 00:15:52,230 S3: I lived as trans. And that whole time I remember 292 00:15:52,230 --> 00:15:56,190 S3: so much conviction from the Holy Spirit. And I really 293 00:15:56,190 --> 00:16:00,070 S3: hadn't known Jesus, but I knew the truth and I 294 00:16:00,110 --> 00:16:02,750 S3: knew what I had been taught. I knew this was wrong, 295 00:16:03,190 --> 00:16:06,630 S3: but I kept suppressing the truth. That's what Romans one says, 296 00:16:06,630 --> 00:16:09,990 S3: that they suppress the truth and unrighteousness, and all the 297 00:16:10,030 --> 00:16:13,270 S3: affirmation and things that people gave me, and affirming this 298 00:16:13,270 --> 00:16:16,710 S3: identity would help me suppress the voice of the Holy Spirit. 299 00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:20,630 S3: But over time, I began to realize that this was 300 00:16:20,630 --> 00:16:25,150 S3: all a lie that, um, that I couldn't actually become 301 00:16:25,150 --> 00:16:29,230 S3: another person. And I fell into a deep depression. But 302 00:16:29,230 --> 00:16:32,110 S3: during those years, God was really drawing me. And I 303 00:16:32,110 --> 00:16:36,950 S3: hadn't wanted God. I'd really rejected God. But, um, I 304 00:16:36,990 --> 00:16:40,270 S3: began to God began to show himself to me through 305 00:16:40,270 --> 00:16:43,710 S3: other people, through. I heard so much on the radio. 306 00:16:43,750 --> 00:16:46,070 S3: I was listening to a lot of radio back then. 307 00:16:46,110 --> 00:16:48,950 S3: I was even listening to like, I got into conservative 308 00:16:48,950 --> 00:16:52,230 S3: political radio, which is just another long story of how 309 00:16:52,230 --> 00:16:54,070 S3: I got into that. But they would talk about God 310 00:16:54,070 --> 00:16:56,510 S3: once in a while, and it just drew me little 311 00:16:56,550 --> 00:17:00,590 S3: by little. And as I started to open my heart 312 00:17:00,590 --> 00:17:03,350 S3: to God, I also began to see that during those years, 313 00:17:03,350 --> 00:17:08,109 S3: my parents had been totally transformed. They had always known Jesus, 314 00:17:08,150 --> 00:17:10,750 S3: you know, since they were young. But all of a sudden, 315 00:17:10,790 --> 00:17:14,430 S3: my parents just began to love Jesus even more than me, 316 00:17:14,630 --> 00:17:17,750 S3: and they stopped chasing me. They still loved me. The 317 00:17:17,750 --> 00:17:20,550 S3: door was still open. They would still reach out. But 318 00:17:20,550 --> 00:17:22,590 S3: for so many years, I kept trying to fix me 319 00:17:22,590 --> 00:17:24,830 S3: and all their efforts, all their energy, all their thoughts 320 00:17:24,830 --> 00:17:27,310 S3: were always about me and worrying about every little thing. 321 00:17:27,950 --> 00:17:30,630 S3: But when they started to love Jesus so radically and 322 00:17:30,630 --> 00:17:32,790 S3: love Jesus more than anything else in the world, and 323 00:17:32,790 --> 00:17:36,190 S3: he was worth everything, it was such a huge testimony 324 00:17:36,190 --> 00:17:39,750 S3: to me and I ended up giving my life to 325 00:17:39,790 --> 00:17:42,110 S3: the Lord largely because of that and because of other 326 00:17:42,109 --> 00:17:44,950 S3: things God put in my life. Um, but that was 327 00:17:44,950 --> 00:17:49,390 S3: a huge influence. And I remember, um, when I saw 328 00:17:49,390 --> 00:17:52,550 S3: the change in my mother, I'll say this, um, she 329 00:17:52,590 --> 00:17:55,950 S3: had really surrendered me into the Lord's hands and she 330 00:17:55,950 --> 00:17:58,990 S3: began to just pursue Jesus. And like, at that moment, 331 00:17:58,990 --> 00:18:01,869 S3: I knew the gospel was true. I knew that Christ 332 00:18:01,869 --> 00:18:04,470 S3: was alive when I saw the change in my mother. 333 00:18:04,470 --> 00:18:06,790 S3: And God really opened my eyes to it. I knew 334 00:18:06,830 --> 00:18:09,790 S3: this was real. And that's, um, part of the reason 335 00:18:09,790 --> 00:18:12,190 S3: that I gave my life to Jesus. And when I did, 336 00:18:12,190 --> 00:18:14,590 S3: I was so excited. I was so on fire for Jesus. 337 00:18:14,590 --> 00:18:17,150 S3: The Lord really met me there and began to change 338 00:18:17,150 --> 00:18:19,550 S3: my heart. But I wanted to be a man of God. 339 00:18:19,790 --> 00:18:22,869 S3: And God was so patient with me, but he didn't 340 00:18:22,869 --> 00:18:25,350 S3: leave me there. He loves us where we are, but 341 00:18:25,350 --> 00:18:27,629 S3: he loves us too much to leave us there. And 342 00:18:27,630 --> 00:18:30,389 S3: so God began to draw me and he began to 343 00:18:30,430 --> 00:18:32,190 S3: challenge my beliefs. 344 00:18:33,869 --> 00:18:37,950 S1: Laura, that's that's a sweeping Story. And as you say, it's, 345 00:18:37,990 --> 00:18:42,550 S1: you know, nine years and then a big change for you. Um, 346 00:18:42,550 --> 00:18:45,590 S1: did you when you said that your parents wanted to 347 00:18:45,630 --> 00:18:49,790 S1: try to fix you, did you feel condemnation from them 348 00:18:49,790 --> 00:18:51,590 S1: or from other people in the church? 349 00:18:51,950 --> 00:18:54,470 S3: You know, I did at times, but honestly, I look 350 00:18:54,470 --> 00:18:57,590 S3: back at the time I said there were being so hateful. 351 00:18:57,630 --> 00:19:00,590 S3: They were so mean. You know, Bible thumpers and things 352 00:19:00,590 --> 00:19:04,669 S3: like that. The truth is, I was mad at God. 353 00:19:04,910 --> 00:19:07,950 S3: I knew they loved me. And I think this is 354 00:19:07,950 --> 00:19:10,510 S3: so true. I think sometimes what's going on behind the 355 00:19:10,510 --> 00:19:15,550 S3: scenes is so different from what's actually, um, being portrayed. 356 00:19:16,270 --> 00:19:18,990 S3: And Jesus said, if they hate you, it's because they 357 00:19:19,030 --> 00:19:21,550 S3: hated me. If they reject your message, it's because they've 358 00:19:21,550 --> 00:19:24,790 S3: rejected my message. We have to remember that as Christians, 359 00:19:24,950 --> 00:19:28,630 S3: when we approach someone in love and truth, God knows 360 00:19:28,630 --> 00:19:31,990 S3: our motives. He knows our heart. People are not always 361 00:19:31,990 --> 00:19:35,429 S3: going to receive our message. Well, that doesn't mean we're wrong. 362 00:19:36,350 --> 00:19:38,390 S3: You think about Jesus. He was not only I said 363 00:19:38,390 --> 00:19:40,550 S3: this earlier, but I want to reiterate he was not 364 00:19:40,550 --> 00:19:43,990 S3: just a loving person. He was the very source of love. 365 00:19:44,270 --> 00:19:46,550 S3: But they tried. They tried to stone him. They tried 366 00:19:46,550 --> 00:19:48,630 S3: to throw him off a cliff. Ultimately, they nailed him 367 00:19:48,630 --> 00:19:52,510 S3: to a cross. You know, sometimes love is not always 368 00:19:52,510 --> 00:19:56,190 S3: received as love. But I've heard so many stories of 369 00:19:56,190 --> 00:20:00,150 S3: people who initially reject it and then later are so 370 00:20:00,150 --> 00:20:03,550 S3: grateful that someone shared. So my parents during those years 371 00:20:03,550 --> 00:20:05,790 S3: took a lot of abuse from me. I was very 372 00:20:05,790 --> 00:20:08,190 S3: angry at them. I wouldn't talk to them for long 373 00:20:08,190 --> 00:20:12,070 S3: periods of time. But the truth is, I was angry 374 00:20:12,070 --> 00:20:15,229 S3: because I knew they were right. I kept trying to 375 00:20:15,270 --> 00:20:18,390 S3: convince myself that this was okay, that God was totally 376 00:20:18,390 --> 00:20:20,910 S3: okay with me living this way, but I knew they 377 00:20:20,910 --> 00:20:23,510 S3: were right. But in the end, they're the ones that 378 00:20:23,510 --> 00:20:25,790 S3: I turned to when I got tired of all the lies. 379 00:20:26,070 --> 00:20:28,750 S3: I didn't go to the people that had affirmed and 380 00:20:28,750 --> 00:20:30,950 S3: celebrated this lie. I turned to the people that told 381 00:20:30,950 --> 00:20:35,350 S3: me the truth, and my parents held that line even 382 00:20:35,390 --> 00:20:38,070 S3: though they. I knew they loved me. They had proven 383 00:20:38,070 --> 00:20:40,750 S3: they loved me. But I also knew they loved me 384 00:20:40,750 --> 00:20:43,149 S3: too much to affirm that lie over me. 385 00:20:43,950 --> 00:20:46,310 S1: Okay, so there's there's a lot in there. Let me 386 00:20:46,310 --> 00:20:49,710 S1: ask you about the people then who affirmed you in. 387 00:20:49,750 --> 00:20:52,790 S1: You know, becoming Jake is the name that you chose. 388 00:20:52,830 --> 00:20:54,510 S1: Why did you choose Jake? 389 00:20:54,869 --> 00:20:58,310 S3: It was a name. I wrote stories a lot about 390 00:20:58,310 --> 00:21:00,510 S3: me as a boy. Um, when I was growing up 391 00:21:00,510 --> 00:21:02,710 S3: and I had a couple of different characters that I 392 00:21:02,710 --> 00:21:05,750 S3: would use. And Jacob was one of those names. Um, 393 00:21:06,750 --> 00:21:09,350 S3: and so I, but I wanted one of the reasons 394 00:21:09,350 --> 00:21:12,110 S3: I wanted a, um, because some names are a little 395 00:21:12,109 --> 00:21:15,270 S3: bit androgynous. Um, I wanted a name that no one 396 00:21:15,270 --> 00:21:18,590 S3: would ever mistake as a girl name because I wouldn't, 397 00:21:18,630 --> 00:21:21,149 S3: I wasn't like, you know, some people identify as maybe 398 00:21:21,150 --> 00:21:24,190 S3: somewhere in between a little female, a little male or whatever. 399 00:21:24,390 --> 00:21:29,869 S3: I wanted to be like, completely erase the existence of Laura. And, um, 400 00:21:29,869 --> 00:21:33,560 S3: so here, uh, one of the cool stories that the 401 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:37,240 S3: Lord put on my heart. A lot of people ask 402 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:40,280 S3: me about names and pronouns, and whether we should affirm 403 00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:42,760 S3: somebody's name and pronouns that they want. And I can 404 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:46,560 S3: tell you, at the time I was angry at my mom. Uh, 405 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:48,959 S3: most of the time they called me honey or sweetie 406 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:51,560 S3: or something. They didn't. But there were times that she 407 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:54,160 S3: called me Laura, and I would get so angry and, oh, 408 00:21:54,560 --> 00:21:56,359 S3: you know, that's not my name. And you need to 409 00:21:56,359 --> 00:22:00,560 S3: call me Jake and all of this. Well, um, I remember, 410 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:06,119 S3: I remember I can't it's really hard to explain what 411 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:09,840 S3: happened because there was something so deeply spiritual that would happen. 412 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:11,760 S3: But I'll do my best to put it in words. 413 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:16,160 S3: The closest analogy I've come up with is it's like 414 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:18,840 S3: I was trying to drown Laura, and when I would 415 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,760 S3: hear my name, something so deep inside, it almost felt 416 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,480 S3: like something would come alive and it felt like Laura 417 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,239 S3: would breathe again. So I was angry, but at the 418 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,240 S3: same time, it was life giving and it would remind me. 419 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,720 S3: And it's like my mom was this tethered to reality 420 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,359 S3: of who I was that I kept trying to kill. 421 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:39,600 S3: And Satan was certainly trying to kill. But it was 422 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:42,880 S3: like that moment of, yes, that's the truth, even though 423 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,920 S3: I hated it. And that's the thing, you know, people, 424 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,520 S3: when they turn away from God, they hate God. They're 425 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:52,680 S3: angry at God for whatever reason. But, um, but the 426 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:56,640 S3: truth is still life giving. Yeah. We have to remember that. 427 00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:59,640 S1: And isn't it, you know, isn't it interesting that Jesus said, 428 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:03,160 S1: I came to give life and to give it abundantly, right? 429 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,600 S1: And you weren't experiencing that. And real quickly, before we 430 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,680 S1: take a break, what about the people who affirmed you 431 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:14,720 S1: in your transition when you decided, no, this is not 432 00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:18,399 S1: the right way to go? Did they say, great, we'll 433 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,919 S1: call you Laura again? Were they with. Did they walk 434 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:22,840 S1: with you through that transition? 435 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,240 S3: No. A lot of them honestly just didn't even talk 436 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:29,000 S3: to me anymore. Um, you know, and some of that 437 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:32,280 S3: I had not been real involved in the community anymore. 438 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,880 S3: I kept cutting everybody out of my life that knew 439 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:38,800 S3: the truth. Everybody but my partner. Um, because I didn't 440 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:40,920 S3: want anyone to know that I had actually been a girl. 441 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:43,440 S3: I didn't even like being in the LGBT community after 442 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,840 S3: a while, because I didn't want to be reminded that 443 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:49,400 S3: this was a choice of this lifestyle. And so that 444 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,120 S3: was part of the reason. But I did reach back 445 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:53,760 S3: out to them, uh, after I became a Christian and 446 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,080 S3: I left that lifestyle and most of them didn't even 447 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,760 S3: respond to me. But I know the Lord still gave 448 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,520 S3: me an opportunity to share. Um, I went back to 449 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,800 S3: my coworkers and a lot of them just didn't know 450 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,080 S3: what to do with it. Yeah, you get all this 451 00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:09,399 S3: affirmation and all this celebration. And then when when I 452 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,639 S3: came out of it, they just they're gone. And the 453 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,320 S3: people who affirmed and celebrated and made me feel good, 454 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:19,760 S3: they are all gone out of my life. My parents 455 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,359 S3: who held the line, who took so much abuse, they're 456 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:24,119 S3: the ones that are still in my life and we 457 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,320 S3: have a far better relationship. There's a verse in Proverbs 458 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,000 S3: that says, he that rebukes a man in the end, 459 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,640 S3: finds more favor than he that flatters with the tongue. 460 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,320 S3: And again, that has to be done in love and 461 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:39,520 S3: compassion to see the person, uh, to try to get 462 00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:43,000 S3: at the heart underneath. You know, what are they really, um, 463 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,920 S3: going through? But at the same time, to be willing 464 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,160 S3: to share the truth. I've, I've heard so many stories 465 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:53,600 S3: of people that were, um, that really hard things were 466 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:58,560 S3: shared with them. Uh, just another encouragement. They, there was 467 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,360 S3: a girl that called me maybe a few months ago 468 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,719 S3: and she said, I haven't talked to my dad in 469 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,040 S3: seven years because he wouldn't use the name and pronouns 470 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:10,719 S3: I want, but. And she said I was angry. But 471 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,000 S3: lately God has been drawing my heart. And she said, 472 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:16,080 S3: I called him last week to ask him about Jesus. 473 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:16,800 S2: Wow. 474 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,440 S1: Okay. That's a great place to to end this segment 475 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,240 S1: because I want to hear more of those stories. And 476 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:26,080 S1: there's somebody listening. There's a parent listening right now who 477 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,320 S1: is hanging on every word that you're saying. Laura Perry 478 00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:33,400 S1: Smoltz is our special guest today at the back fence. 479 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:37,239 S1: Our programs recorded Don't Call Us Today. Featured resource. If 480 00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:42,320 S1: you go to Chris fabry.org is transgender to transform the 481 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:46,520 S1: story of transition that will truly set you free. You'll 482 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,679 S1: also find out about Eden's redemption there. We're going to 483 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:52,320 S1: talk about that and a whole lot more straight ahead 484 00:25:52,359 --> 00:26:07,800 S1: on Moody Radio. Thanks for joining us today at the 485 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:11,479 S1: Radio Backyard Fence. Special guest is Laura Perry Smoltz. You 486 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:13,600 S1: can find out more about her. You can find out 487 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,880 S1: about Eden's redemption there. And we have a link to 488 00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:21,160 S1: the book transgender to transform the story of transition that 489 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,800 S1: will truly set you free. Just go to Chris favorite dot. 490 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,320 S1: You mentioned your partner at the time. Now when your 491 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:33,400 S1: partner then through this transition, was that a female? 492 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,440 S3: It was actually a male. He was living as transgender. 493 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,479 S3: The truth is, I was longing for a man to 494 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,760 S3: love me, but I felt so rejected by men. I'd 495 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,040 S3: been so abused by men and so. And part of 496 00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:49,440 S3: that was my own sin. I was giving myself away 497 00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:52,480 S3: sexually and putting myself in so many bad situations. I 498 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,560 S3: blame them for so long until I started seeing my 499 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,240 S3: own part in that. Not that it excuses their behavior, 500 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:00,240 S3: but at the same time I was putting myself in 501 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,679 S3: really bad situations. I think I was trying to become 502 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,879 S3: what I felt like I couldn't find, but this guy 503 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,000 S3: who was living as trans at the time, he was 504 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:13,480 S3: living as a woman and he really pursued me. But 505 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,880 S3: after I came out of the lifestyle, it really had 506 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,520 S3: a big impact on him. He ended up detransitioning about 507 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:20,359 S3: a year later. 508 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:20,880 S1: Really? 509 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:23,679 S3: Yeah, he kept trying to get back together and I 510 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,730 S3: knew that the Lord. I've seen some stories where God 511 00:27:26,730 --> 00:27:30,050 S3: reconciles both and they they stay together. But I really 512 00:27:30,050 --> 00:27:33,490 S3: felt like the Lord just wanted me to completely separate 513 00:27:33,490 --> 00:27:35,810 S3: and not be tied to that identity for the rest 514 00:27:35,810 --> 00:27:40,010 S3: of my life. And so he did detransition. So I 515 00:27:40,010 --> 00:27:42,450 S3: prayed for him. I hope he comes to know Jesus. Yeah. 516 00:27:42,490 --> 00:27:43,250 S3: But yeah. 517 00:27:43,450 --> 00:27:46,409 S1: Okay. I want you to talk to the parent who's listening, 518 00:27:46,450 --> 00:27:50,250 S1: who has gone through everything that your parents went through. 519 00:27:50,290 --> 00:27:53,610 S1: And it's like, how do we communicate? And I want 520 00:27:53,650 --> 00:27:55,330 S1: to give a book. I want to get, you know, 521 00:27:55,369 --> 00:27:59,250 S1: Laura's book and give it to my son or my daughter. Um, 522 00:27:59,609 --> 00:28:03,930 S1: what is your best advice for a parent who has 523 00:28:04,090 --> 00:28:06,890 S1: a son or daughter who is going through that kind 524 00:28:06,930 --> 00:28:07,810 S1: of transition? 525 00:28:08,170 --> 00:28:11,609 S3: Yeah, we actually have a lot of information on this. Um, 526 00:28:11,609 --> 00:28:14,770 S3: we just started a podcast for parents. So go to 527 00:28:14,810 --> 00:28:18,530 S3: Eden's Redemption org and look up our podcast there. You 528 00:28:18,530 --> 00:28:22,250 S3: can find it on the major podcast platforms. It's called 529 00:28:22,250 --> 00:28:26,330 S3: redeeming parents. Um, because we really have a heart for parents. 530 00:28:26,330 --> 00:28:28,930 S3: We want to help parents through this journey. Uh, we 531 00:28:28,930 --> 00:28:32,210 S3: also have a support group. So if you're interested, um, 532 00:28:32,210 --> 00:28:35,450 S3: there's a Facebook group and then there's a, we have 533 00:28:35,450 --> 00:28:37,850 S3: a support group on Zoom. You know, we want to 534 00:28:37,850 --> 00:28:40,930 S3: fix our children, but especially when we're talking about adult 535 00:28:40,930 --> 00:28:43,210 S3: children now, it's very different if we're talking about a 536 00:28:43,210 --> 00:28:46,370 S3: young child, but as adult children or when we have 537 00:28:46,370 --> 00:28:50,690 S3: adult children, we can't fix them. We can't make them change. 538 00:28:50,690 --> 00:28:54,010 S3: We can't make them see the truth. After talking to 539 00:28:54,050 --> 00:28:56,970 S3: hundreds of parents over the years, the Lord always brings 540 00:28:56,970 --> 00:28:59,690 S3: the conversation around to what he wants to do in 541 00:28:59,690 --> 00:29:02,130 S3: the parent. The parent is so concerned with what their 542 00:29:02,130 --> 00:29:06,370 S3: child's doing, but what is God doing in you? I 543 00:29:06,370 --> 00:29:08,410 S3: think so many times when we have children, we forget 544 00:29:08,410 --> 00:29:11,650 S3: that God had a calling on our life. Um, what 545 00:29:11,650 --> 00:29:15,250 S3: did God create you for and what is God wanting 546 00:29:15,290 --> 00:29:17,290 S3: to do in your heart? My mom said that she 547 00:29:17,290 --> 00:29:19,650 S3: was so angry at everything I was doing, but she 548 00:29:19,650 --> 00:29:22,890 S3: realized that she was full of unconfessed sin. She was 549 00:29:22,890 --> 00:29:26,290 S3: full of, you know, jealousy and bitterness and being critical 550 00:29:26,290 --> 00:29:28,770 S3: of others and all these other things that she hadn't 551 00:29:28,770 --> 00:29:31,890 S3: dealt with. And she said, as she began to surrender 552 00:29:31,930 --> 00:29:34,890 S3: me into the Lord's hands, and she said she climbed 553 00:29:34,890 --> 00:29:37,330 S3: up on the potter's wheel every day and allowed the 554 00:29:37,330 --> 00:29:40,210 S3: Lord to change her. So all these years that she 555 00:29:40,210 --> 00:29:43,730 S3: was trying to force me to change, I resented her 556 00:29:43,930 --> 00:29:45,570 S3: and I would get angry. I always felt like my 557 00:29:45,570 --> 00:29:47,850 S3: mom was trying to hold on my onto my collar 558 00:29:47,850 --> 00:29:50,610 S3: and force me to come back, but it's like she 559 00:29:50,610 --> 00:29:54,130 S3: turned around and just started to pursue Jesus. Now that 560 00:29:54,130 --> 00:29:56,969 S3: seems opposite in our human nature. That seems opposite of 561 00:29:56,970 --> 00:29:59,970 S3: what we should do. But often our our thoughts and 562 00:29:59,970 --> 00:30:02,530 S3: our ways are upside down from God's. You know, he 563 00:30:02,570 --> 00:30:05,810 S3: says as the. In Isaiah, I think it's. 55 he said, 564 00:30:06,130 --> 00:30:08,410 S3: as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are 565 00:30:08,410 --> 00:30:10,690 S3: my thoughts higher than your thoughts and my ways than 566 00:30:10,730 --> 00:30:13,969 S3: your ways. But as she started to pursue Jesus, it 567 00:30:13,970 --> 00:30:17,890 S3: was such an incredible testimony to me. I knew how 568 00:30:17,890 --> 00:30:21,210 S3: bad she wanted the relationship with me. But when Jesus 569 00:30:21,290 --> 00:30:25,090 S3: became more important to her, I began to wonder why 570 00:30:26,330 --> 00:30:30,850 S3: Jesus said. He was asked, what is the greatest commandment? 571 00:30:31,570 --> 00:30:33,810 S3: And Jesus said, love the Lord your God with all 572 00:30:33,810 --> 00:30:35,330 S3: your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, 573 00:30:35,330 --> 00:30:38,690 S3: and with all your strength. The second is like it 574 00:30:38,690 --> 00:30:40,690 S3: to love your neighbor as yourself. But we have to 575 00:30:40,690 --> 00:30:42,850 S3: get that in the right order. If we love our 576 00:30:42,850 --> 00:30:45,330 S3: children more than God, then our children are an idol. 577 00:30:45,930 --> 00:30:48,090 S3: We have to make sure that God is our number 578 00:30:48,090 --> 00:30:52,050 S3: one and that Christ is worth everything. In most countries, 579 00:30:52,050 --> 00:30:55,810 S3: if you claim the name of Christ, your family rejects you. 580 00:30:55,850 --> 00:30:58,130 S3: You may lose your friends. You may lose your job, 581 00:30:58,130 --> 00:31:01,050 S3: you may be beaten, you may be tortured, you maybe 582 00:31:01,050 --> 00:31:04,490 S3: go to jail. I mean, I've heard of like people 583 00:31:04,490 --> 00:31:07,130 S3: going to jail for many, many, many years and being 584 00:31:07,130 --> 00:31:10,770 S3: separated from their family. We are so spoiled in this 585 00:31:10,770 --> 00:31:13,810 S3: country that we think that it won't cost us to 586 00:31:13,850 --> 00:31:17,410 S3: follow Christ. The reality is it does. But I promise you, 587 00:31:17,450 --> 00:31:21,850 S3: when we are willing to suffer for Christ. The gospel 588 00:31:21,850 --> 00:31:24,610 S3: flourishes everywhere that Christians are persecuted. 589 00:31:25,490 --> 00:31:28,530 S1: What you said about your mom, and I totally agree 590 00:31:28,530 --> 00:31:31,930 S1: with you that you know God. God used you to 591 00:31:31,970 --> 00:31:38,010 S1: draw her closer to him. But that's not prescriptive for everybody. 592 00:31:38,050 --> 00:31:40,930 S1: You know, if I get closer to God than my 593 00:31:41,090 --> 00:31:42,970 S1: son or daughter is going to do what I want 594 00:31:42,970 --> 00:31:45,730 S1: them to do, that was your decision you still had 595 00:31:45,730 --> 00:31:49,170 S1: agency with whether you're going to keep going down that 596 00:31:49,170 --> 00:31:50,490 S1: road or not, right? 597 00:31:50,530 --> 00:31:53,850 S3: Yeah, and that's a good point. Yeah, that's what God used. 598 00:31:54,210 --> 00:31:56,770 S3: But during that time, she was praying for me. She 599 00:31:56,770 --> 00:31:59,130 S3: had a lot of other people praying for me. And 600 00:31:59,130 --> 00:32:01,970 S3: God did so many other things in my life. That 601 00:32:01,970 --> 00:32:05,330 S3: was just one thing that God used that was really powerful. 602 00:32:05,770 --> 00:32:07,610 S3: But I ended up at a job where my boss 603 00:32:07,610 --> 00:32:10,930 S3: was a Christian and she had a huge influence on me. 604 00:32:10,930 --> 00:32:13,970 S3: I heard so many things over the radio. So God 605 00:32:13,970 --> 00:32:16,130 S3: worked in my life. But I think the reason that 606 00:32:16,130 --> 00:32:19,090 S3: I talked so much about my mom is because the 607 00:32:19,090 --> 00:32:21,970 S3: change in her was so radical, and God used her 608 00:32:21,970 --> 00:32:24,930 S3: as a witness of how he could change someone's life. 609 00:32:25,530 --> 00:32:28,370 S3: And so, yeah, good point. That doesn't mean that that's 610 00:32:28,370 --> 00:32:31,730 S3: going to happen in every situation. But even if it doesn't, 611 00:32:32,130 --> 00:32:34,450 S3: if you get close to Jesus like that and you 612 00:32:34,490 --> 00:32:37,010 S3: are radically on fire for Jesus, if you allow the 613 00:32:37,010 --> 00:32:40,290 S3: Lord to change you, the more he changes us, the 614 00:32:40,330 --> 00:32:44,290 S3: better vessel will be. So sometimes I think as parents, 615 00:32:44,290 --> 00:32:46,770 S3: we're only concerned with our child and all our thoughts, 616 00:32:46,770 --> 00:32:49,930 S3: all our prayers are so consumed with the child. But 617 00:32:49,930 --> 00:32:53,450 S3: what about the millions of souls around you that need Jesus? 618 00:32:53,850 --> 00:32:56,850 S3: There's so many people that God wants you to reach. 619 00:32:57,090 --> 00:32:59,890 S3: And so I think that's where the focus needs to be, 620 00:33:00,170 --> 00:33:01,970 S3: is I'm going to keep praying for my child. I'm 621 00:33:01,970 --> 00:33:04,890 S3: going to keep trusting God with their life, but I'm 622 00:33:04,890 --> 00:33:07,130 S3: going to do what Jesus has called me to do. 623 00:33:07,170 --> 00:33:08,810 S3: And I think that's what's important. 624 00:33:09,490 --> 00:33:12,729 S1: Laura Perry Smoltz is joining us today. If you go 625 00:33:12,730 --> 00:33:16,250 S1: to Chris Fabry live.org, click through today's information. You'll see 626 00:33:16,290 --> 00:33:19,180 S1: links right there. One of them is to the book 627 00:33:19,220 --> 00:33:24,540 S1: transgender two transformed. Your maiden name was Perry, right? Laura Perry. 628 00:33:24,980 --> 00:33:30,660 S1: And you married Perry Smaltz, right? And so, uh, that's 629 00:33:30,660 --> 00:33:33,740 S1: interesting to have a husband whose first name is Perry. 630 00:33:33,780 --> 00:33:36,580 S1: That's another thing that, you know, parents would pray for. 631 00:33:36,620 --> 00:33:39,140 S1: It's like, I want my daughter to be my daughter 632 00:33:39,140 --> 00:33:41,739 S1: and not my son, and I want her to be 633 00:33:41,780 --> 00:33:45,580 S1: able to be married. And that's not prescriptive either. You know, 634 00:33:45,740 --> 00:33:49,180 S1: everything that we've just talked about. But tell me about Perry. 635 00:33:49,220 --> 00:33:52,380 S1: How did you meet? And, uh. And how did you 636 00:33:52,380 --> 00:33:53,260 S1: fall in love? 637 00:33:53,660 --> 00:33:57,900 S3: Yeah, we, um, we had a mutual friend that introduced us, 638 00:33:57,900 --> 00:34:01,620 S3: and she said it was just really heavy on her heart. Um, 639 00:34:01,620 --> 00:34:04,500 S3: I they were, they were in a singles group together 640 00:34:04,900 --> 00:34:08,580 S3: and she said it was so heavy on her heart 641 00:34:08,580 --> 00:34:11,220 S3: that she needed to introduce us. Felt like God wanted 642 00:34:11,219 --> 00:34:14,180 S3: her to. And she's we were actually on a spiritual 643 00:34:14,180 --> 00:34:16,340 S3: retreat and we were driving home when she was she's 644 00:34:16,340 --> 00:34:19,700 S3: telling me about this guy and she's describing him and 645 00:34:19,700 --> 00:34:21,820 S3: I'm getting more and more interested. He was a music 646 00:34:21,820 --> 00:34:26,420 S3: minister and just sounded like a great guy. And she 647 00:34:26,420 --> 00:34:28,140 S3: showed me a picture and I was like, wow, he's 648 00:34:28,140 --> 00:34:30,219 S3: really good looking. I was like, okay, if God wants 649 00:34:30,219 --> 00:34:32,980 S3: me to meet this guy, I'm getting really excited. And 650 00:34:32,980 --> 00:34:35,819 S3: we looked up and we were driving through Perry, Oklahoma. 651 00:34:37,100 --> 00:34:39,180 S3: So I was like, wow, this has got to be 652 00:34:39,180 --> 00:34:43,500 S3: a sign from God. So that was, uh, that was 653 00:34:43,500 --> 00:34:46,060 S3: just fun. And we met, um, the next day she 654 00:34:46,060 --> 00:34:49,140 S3: introduced us and, um, it was funny because it was 655 00:34:49,140 --> 00:34:53,299 S3: pouring rain. We were helping her move actually. Um, and 656 00:34:53,300 --> 00:34:56,419 S3: it was, it was crazy because I just looked like 657 00:34:56,420 --> 00:34:58,500 S3: a drowned rat and I thought, there's no way I 658 00:34:58,500 --> 00:35:02,020 S3: want to be introduced to this guy looking like this, but, uh, 659 00:35:02,020 --> 00:35:05,780 S3: we started dating a few months later, actually, but, uh, totally, 660 00:35:05,780 --> 00:35:08,580 S3: just within a few weeks, we knew that God had 661 00:35:08,580 --> 00:35:11,339 S3: put us together. I mean, I thought it would just 662 00:35:11,340 --> 00:35:14,020 S3: be a blessing for me to be married, but God 663 00:35:14,020 --> 00:35:16,540 S3: always wants what he gives us to be used for 664 00:35:16,540 --> 00:35:19,180 S3: his glory as well. Uh. God has brought so much 665 00:35:19,180 --> 00:35:24,700 S3: healing to me through through this husband. I've I've understand 666 00:35:24,940 --> 00:35:28,380 S3: so much more about God's unconditional love. Seeing a husband 667 00:35:28,380 --> 00:35:31,980 S3: love me so unconditionally. Uh, on my worst days when 668 00:35:31,980 --> 00:35:35,820 S3: I'm not deserving of love. And just to see him, um, 669 00:35:36,180 --> 00:35:39,860 S3: continue to love me and support me and cherish me 670 00:35:40,340 --> 00:35:43,379 S3: has just been an incredible experience. And then, um, we 671 00:35:43,380 --> 00:35:47,900 S3: opened this ministry together and, you know, it was funny 672 00:35:47,940 --> 00:35:51,940 S3: what God does and sometimes things don't make sense. I've, I've, um, 673 00:35:52,260 --> 00:35:54,180 S3: I've had a lot of health problems over the last 674 00:35:54,180 --> 00:35:56,340 S3: three years. So we got married, I was in great shape. 675 00:35:56,340 --> 00:35:58,259 S3: I was in great health. And then all of a 676 00:35:58,260 --> 00:36:02,060 S3: sudden started having all these health problems. But, um, I 677 00:36:02,060 --> 00:36:07,100 S3: was in ICU with like massive brain inflammation. I was 678 00:36:07,100 --> 00:36:10,540 S3: having all these crazy health problems. And it was during 679 00:36:10,540 --> 00:36:12,299 S3: that time that the Lord put it on our heart 680 00:36:12,300 --> 00:36:14,620 S3: that we were supposed to open our own ministry. And 681 00:36:14,620 --> 00:36:16,219 S3: I'm like, you got to be kidding. Like, this is 682 00:36:16,219 --> 00:36:18,459 S3: the time. Maybe I should pull back from ministry. Maybe 683 00:36:18,500 --> 00:36:20,900 S3: God's going. To give me a season of rest. But 684 00:36:20,900 --> 00:36:22,899 S3: that's what God had on our heart. And I thought, well, 685 00:36:22,900 --> 00:36:25,379 S3: I'm going to tell Perry what I'm thinking and he's 686 00:36:25,380 --> 00:36:27,739 S3: going to think I'm crazy. And he said, no, I 687 00:36:27,780 --> 00:36:31,540 S3: think that's where God is leading. I'm like, really? But, 688 00:36:31,580 --> 00:36:36,299 S3: you know, God has really sustained us through this. And 689 00:36:36,340 --> 00:36:39,220 S3: it's been incredible to see how God has carried me. 690 00:36:39,620 --> 00:36:44,100 S3: And even despite all the problems, like God has been faithful. 691 00:36:45,340 --> 00:36:48,500 S1: And it's called Eden's Redemption. We have a link at 692 00:36:48,500 --> 00:36:52,380 S1: the website kris.org. We also have a link to the 693 00:36:52,380 --> 00:36:56,379 S1: book transgender to transform the story of transition that will 694 00:36:56,380 --> 00:37:01,180 S1: truly set you free by Laura Perry Smoltz. You'll find 695 00:37:01,180 --> 00:37:06,259 S1: it at Kris Dot more straight ahead on Moody Radio. 696 00:37:13,540 --> 00:37:16,020 S1: Thanks for joining us today at the Radio Backyard Fence. 697 00:37:16,060 --> 00:37:20,779 S1: Special guest Laura Perry Smoltz. She is an author and speaker. 698 00:37:20,820 --> 00:37:25,379 S1: The book Transgender to Transformed is our featured resource. She 699 00:37:25,380 --> 00:37:29,660 S1: is the co-founder with her husband, Perry of Eden's Redemption. 700 00:37:30,100 --> 00:37:33,860 S1: You can find that link right there as well. chris.org. 701 00:37:34,219 --> 00:37:37,620 S1: Close the loop though, on Perry. When you first met, 702 00:37:37,660 --> 00:37:42,620 S1: he probably knew about your past already, but when did 703 00:37:42,620 --> 00:37:45,339 S1: you have a conversation about, you know, what we just 704 00:37:45,340 --> 00:37:46,500 S1: shared here today? 705 00:37:46,820 --> 00:37:48,940 S3: Yeah, he didn't the first day we met. He didn't, 706 00:37:48,940 --> 00:37:52,780 S3: but he did before we got together the next time. Um, 707 00:37:52,980 --> 00:37:56,580 S3: he went home and the friend that introduced us told 708 00:37:56,580 --> 00:37:59,780 S3: him a little bit about me later that day. But, um, 709 00:37:59,780 --> 00:38:03,339 S3: he went home and looked up my testimony and all that, 710 00:38:03,340 --> 00:38:07,420 S3: so he knew my background and he still asked me out. 711 00:38:07,660 --> 00:38:13,180 S3: And when we first started dating, we were, um. I 712 00:38:13,340 --> 00:38:16,780 S3: was amazed as he would send people my story and 713 00:38:16,780 --> 00:38:19,700 S3: he was so not only was he like okay with 714 00:38:19,700 --> 00:38:22,819 S3: my past, but he was so excited about what God 715 00:38:22,820 --> 00:38:25,779 S3: had done in my life. And he would tell people 716 00:38:25,780 --> 00:38:27,780 S3: and he was not ashamed. I would always say, aren't 717 00:38:27,780 --> 00:38:31,340 S3: you embarrassed that I had this past? And he said, no, 718 00:38:31,540 --> 00:38:34,100 S3: I see you as the creature that God has made 719 00:38:34,100 --> 00:38:37,900 S3: you the new creation, you know, and he would tell people, uh, 720 00:38:38,020 --> 00:38:41,899 S3: that in second Corinthians 517 that, um, everyone who is 721 00:38:41,900 --> 00:38:45,420 S3: in Christ is a new creature. Old things have passed away. Behold, 722 00:38:45,420 --> 00:38:49,260 S3: all things have become new. And he would tell people that. 723 00:38:49,260 --> 00:38:53,339 S3: And so it's amazed me that he has been incredibly supportive. 724 00:38:53,340 --> 00:38:55,379 S3: And he said he felt called to be in this 725 00:38:55,380 --> 00:38:56,460 S3: ministry with me. 726 00:38:56,780 --> 00:39:00,299 S1: Wow. So that again, you know, the unconditional love that 727 00:39:00,300 --> 00:39:03,299 S1: you just talked about that in the past, you'd been 728 00:39:03,300 --> 00:39:08,300 S1: used abused by men. Now not only are you accepted 729 00:39:08,300 --> 00:39:11,830 S1: and loved, but there's no shame at all about this 730 00:39:11,830 --> 00:39:15,350 S1: past because he sees God's work in your life, right? 731 00:39:15,390 --> 00:39:19,910 S3: Right. Yeah. And God taught me so much about, um, 732 00:39:20,030 --> 00:39:23,190 S3: how he created man for good. I think sometimes women 733 00:39:23,190 --> 00:39:25,790 S3: who are abused and mistreated by men and they start 734 00:39:25,790 --> 00:39:29,310 S3: to hate men or not trust men. And, um, he 735 00:39:29,350 --> 00:39:30,989 S3: at the time, he had been working out a lot. 736 00:39:30,989 --> 00:39:34,510 S3: He was incredibly strong and, um, had these big muscles 737 00:39:34,510 --> 00:39:36,950 S3: and I remember feeling that strength and yet it was 738 00:39:36,950 --> 00:39:40,509 S3: protecting me and not hurting me. And I was like, oh, 739 00:39:40,550 --> 00:39:44,270 S3: this is what God created man for, um, to protect, 740 00:39:44,270 --> 00:39:48,549 S3: to love, to cherish and to use that strength under control. 741 00:39:48,950 --> 00:39:52,590 S3: And that was a big turning point for me to see, um, 742 00:39:52,590 --> 00:39:56,190 S3: the good of man. And I'm just so thankful for 743 00:39:56,190 --> 00:40:01,790 S3: God's design. And then it also, the more that he embraced, um, 744 00:40:01,830 --> 00:40:04,910 S3: his masculine role, the more I embraced my feminine role, 745 00:40:04,910 --> 00:40:08,149 S3: the more we appreciated each other. I think sometimes we 746 00:40:08,150 --> 00:40:11,549 S3: try to we try to fill in the gaps and 747 00:40:11,550 --> 00:40:13,950 S3: we try to to be the opposite. You know, a 748 00:40:13,989 --> 00:40:17,629 S3: lot of girls who, um, go in not all, but 749 00:40:17,630 --> 00:40:19,270 S3: a lot of girls who want to become men. A 750 00:40:19,310 --> 00:40:21,830 S3: lot of times it's because they've not been protected, they've 751 00:40:21,830 --> 00:40:24,230 S3: been hurt. And it's like, well, I'll become the man. 752 00:40:24,790 --> 00:40:27,109 S3: But the more that I began to trust him, the 753 00:40:27,110 --> 00:40:29,270 S3: more I was able to be feminine and the more 754 00:40:29,270 --> 00:40:32,910 S3: I was able to rest in that and not fight it. 755 00:40:33,870 --> 00:40:36,350 S1: There's a lot in your story, so many places we 756 00:40:36,350 --> 00:40:40,109 S1: could go. I want you to tell us about Eden's redemption, though, 757 00:40:40,150 --> 00:40:44,350 S1: because this is kind of an an outgrowth of the 758 00:40:44,350 --> 00:40:47,110 S1: story that you've just told. What do you do? What 759 00:40:47,150 --> 00:40:49,989 S1: what is the hope that you have with that ministry? 760 00:40:50,190 --> 00:40:55,510 S3: Yeah. So Eden's redemption really came out of, um, initially 761 00:40:55,510 --> 00:40:58,029 S3: out of my story and wanting other people to know 762 00:40:58,030 --> 00:41:01,390 S3: what God could do in their life. But really, over time, 763 00:41:01,390 --> 00:41:03,750 S3: what God has really given us a vision for in 764 00:41:03,750 --> 00:41:08,910 S3: this ministry is to help other people understand why they're broken. 765 00:41:09,110 --> 00:41:11,710 S3: If you listen to the top atheists in the world 766 00:41:11,710 --> 00:41:13,589 S3: at some point, they admit they don't like a God 767 00:41:13,590 --> 00:41:17,750 S3: that allows suffering. People are trying to figure out why 768 00:41:17,750 --> 00:41:21,589 S3: this world is broken, what happened? Because everybody knows that everything's, 769 00:41:21,630 --> 00:41:24,589 S3: you know, it's not quite right. Something's wrong. And I 770 00:41:24,590 --> 00:41:30,270 S3: think inherently we know, um, that this world is not right. There's, um, 771 00:41:30,630 --> 00:41:32,830 S3: you know, we were all created for the Garden of Eden. 772 00:41:32,830 --> 00:41:34,750 S3: We were created for a world that was perfect, that 773 00:41:34,750 --> 00:41:37,790 S3: had no sin or war or death or disease or abuse, 774 00:41:37,790 --> 00:41:42,109 S3: no broken relationships. And I think we're all trying to 775 00:41:42,110 --> 00:41:44,630 S3: figure out what happened, but we're not in the Garden 776 00:41:44,630 --> 00:41:46,710 S3: of Eden. This world is under the curse of sin. 777 00:41:46,710 --> 00:41:49,430 S3: And that's where Jesus comes in. He he died and 778 00:41:49,430 --> 00:41:52,510 S3: gave his life. He he entered his own creation first 779 00:41:52,510 --> 00:41:55,630 S3: of all, and became a man and became like us 780 00:41:55,630 --> 00:41:59,989 S3: in our flesh and still fully God, but came in 781 00:41:59,989 --> 00:42:02,270 S3: and entered his own creation, lived a sinless life, and 782 00:42:02,270 --> 00:42:05,750 S3: gave his life as a sacrifice for us in order 783 00:42:05,750 --> 00:42:08,549 S3: that we could be made new and give us the 784 00:42:08,550 --> 00:42:12,069 S3: power to overcome sin. He defeated death and sin, and 785 00:42:12,070 --> 00:42:15,670 S3: he transforms our life. But then we wrestle sometimes with why? 786 00:42:15,710 --> 00:42:17,750 S3: You know, as a Christian, why is life still broken? 787 00:42:17,750 --> 00:42:20,190 S3: Why do I still have these hurts? Why am I 788 00:42:20,190 --> 00:42:22,670 S3: still abused? Or why am I this or that? Why 789 00:42:22,670 --> 00:42:25,630 S3: do I still have health problems? But we. We only 790 00:42:25,670 --> 00:42:28,310 S3: see partial. Now it's like Paul said, we see as 791 00:42:28,310 --> 00:42:31,549 S3: in a mirror, dimly. But one day we will see fully. 792 00:42:31,550 --> 00:42:33,950 S3: And one day when Christ returns, the curse of sin 793 00:42:33,950 --> 00:42:36,270 S3: will be off the earth forever. And we will see 794 00:42:36,270 --> 00:42:39,990 S3: the redemption of all of creation. And that's the hope. 795 00:42:39,989 --> 00:42:42,790 S3: We look forward to that right now in this life. 796 00:42:42,790 --> 00:42:45,950 S3: As Christ redeems our life, he redeems and restores our heart. 797 00:42:45,989 --> 00:42:49,190 S3: He mends relationships as we learn to forgive. And he 798 00:42:49,190 --> 00:42:52,790 S3: brings so much healing and restoration. But people also need 799 00:42:52,790 --> 00:42:54,549 S3: to know the hope that this world is not going 800 00:42:54,590 --> 00:42:58,830 S3: to be broken forever. And everything we long for in 801 00:42:58,830 --> 00:43:01,270 S3: this life, we are promised one day if we will 802 00:43:01,270 --> 00:43:02,910 S3: trust him and put our faith in him. 803 00:43:04,110 --> 00:43:07,070 S1: I want you to go back to yourself as a teenager, 804 00:43:07,070 --> 00:43:10,629 S1: as you're just starting to go through these, uh, this 805 00:43:10,630 --> 00:43:13,989 S1: situation in your life and thinking that I want to 806 00:43:13,989 --> 00:43:17,029 S1: be a boy. I want to be a man. Put 807 00:43:17,030 --> 00:43:20,710 S1: your arm around yourself at 15 or whatever age. What 808 00:43:20,710 --> 00:43:22,310 S1: would you say to yourself? 809 00:43:22,989 --> 00:43:26,549 S3: Yeah. First of all, I would say to myself, it 810 00:43:26,550 --> 00:43:28,870 S3: just almost makes me cry because I remember how much 811 00:43:28,870 --> 00:43:33,230 S3: pain I was in. Um, first of all, to let 812 00:43:33,230 --> 00:43:36,549 S3: that girl know that she has worth and value, that 813 00:43:36,550 --> 00:43:39,670 S3: God has a purpose for her life, and to know 814 00:43:39,670 --> 00:43:42,189 S3: that the enemy of her soul is after her, to 815 00:43:42,230 --> 00:43:46,190 S3: destroy her. That's the reason, um, she feels so rejected 816 00:43:46,190 --> 00:43:49,270 S3: and so hated is because the enemy hates her and 817 00:43:49,270 --> 00:43:52,310 S3: is trying to destroy her life. But Jesus wants to 818 00:43:52,350 --> 00:43:57,430 S3: rescue her. And also that, um, I would talk to 819 00:43:57,430 --> 00:44:01,630 S3: that girl about not going into all the sexual sin 820 00:44:01,710 --> 00:44:05,109 S3: as much as I had been, and I don't think 821 00:44:05,110 --> 00:44:07,670 S3: I mentioned that I was sexually abused by a boy 822 00:44:07,670 --> 00:44:09,509 S3: that was a year older than me when I was 823 00:44:09,510 --> 00:44:11,830 S3: about eight years old. That opened up a door of 824 00:44:11,830 --> 00:44:16,790 S3: sexuality and of curiosity. But really, what began to create 825 00:44:16,790 --> 00:44:19,109 S3: so much brokenness in my life is when I turned 826 00:44:19,110 --> 00:44:22,150 S3: away from God and I got into so much sexual sin. 827 00:44:22,790 --> 00:44:26,149 S3: And I thought I would find love, but instead I 828 00:44:26,150 --> 00:44:29,910 S3: was just so broken by these relationships and feeling used 829 00:44:29,910 --> 00:44:33,430 S3: and abused and just thrown away like trash. Always hoping 830 00:44:33,430 --> 00:44:36,509 S3: that somebody would want me, but never finding that we 831 00:44:36,510 --> 00:44:41,030 S3: will never truly find that true love, that true, deep, 832 00:44:41,030 --> 00:44:46,670 S3: abiding love outside of God's design. And in fact, I have, um, 833 00:44:46,830 --> 00:44:50,390 S3: I have talked to so many friends who have had 834 00:44:50,430 --> 00:44:53,870 S3: trouble when they first get married, trusting their husband. And 835 00:44:53,870 --> 00:44:55,630 S3: one of the first questions I ask him is if 836 00:44:55,630 --> 00:44:57,790 S3: they were having sex outside marriage. And most of the 837 00:44:57,790 --> 00:45:02,070 S3: time they were. And I said, you know, God designed 838 00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:05,560 S3: the man to protect you. And when you were having 839 00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:08,879 S3: sex outside marriage. Even if the woman wants it, even 840 00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:13,080 S3: if she's even if it's consensual. Um. God still designed 841 00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,240 S3: the man to protect you. And when he violates that 842 00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:20,200 S3: that protection, it causes the woman to doubt him and 843 00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:22,840 S3: causes a lack of trust. And when I saw Perry 844 00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:26,000 S3: when we were dating, I had never dated without having sex. 845 00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:29,640 S3: This was very difficult for me. For, you know, nine months, 846 00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:31,480 S3: and I realized I was still human. I thought I 847 00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:34,120 S3: was like this super Christian that wouldn't struggle with all 848 00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:36,399 S3: this anymore. And I realized I was weak. But as 849 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:40,200 S3: I saw Perry protect me, and I saw him continue 850 00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:43,640 S3: to deny his desires in order to wait, I have 851 00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:47,319 S3: thanked him hundreds of times for waiting for marriage. It 852 00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:50,600 S3: was so worth it. And I just. That's what I 853 00:45:50,600 --> 00:45:51,880 S3: want to tell young girls. 854 00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:54,800 S4: It is such a story of transformation. 855 00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:58,560 S1: And you said a little earlier, Laura, that you wanted 856 00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:04,040 S1: to erase your existence and become someone else. And it 857 00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,919 S1: was almost like you were drowning. Aren't you glad that 858 00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,960 S1: you went into the flood under the flood and then 859 00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,440 S1: came back up a new creation? I know that there's 860 00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:17,680 S1: somebody listening today who's been affected by your story. Thank 861 00:46:17,680 --> 00:46:19,799 S1: you for being faithful to all of that, to all 862 00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:22,560 S1: the pain and the struggle and for sharing it here 863 00:46:22,560 --> 00:46:23,440 S1: with us today. 864 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,160 S3: Amen. Thank you so much for this opportunity. 865 00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:30,440 S1: Laura Perry Smoltz. Again, you can find out more about 866 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:35,080 S1: her and her featured resource. Transgender two transformed a story 867 00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:38,680 S1: of transition that will truly set you free. And there's 868 00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:42,280 S1: also a link right there to Eden's Redemption. Well, there's 869 00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:46,759 S1: a lot right there at the website, Chris fabry.com. Our 870 00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,759 S1: program is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry of 871 00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:51,480 S1: Moody Bible Institute.