S1: Today on building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman.
S2: I entered the holidays with some very unconscious expectations. I
S2: sort of resented some of the demands of the holiday.
S2: I'd like to put God back in the holidays, but
S2: others have a different agenda. Whatever. Being content with your
S2: role and being light in a dark place, even sometimes
S2: being around ones that maybe can't fully appreciate you, fully
S2: understand you, there is a battle in regard to this
S2: time of year.
S1: Welcome to building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman, author of
S1: the New York Times bestseller The Five Love Languages. Today,
S1: as we head toward Christmas and New Year's, we have
S1: a program that will help you keep God at the
S1: center of your celebrations.
S3: And on today's program, we're going to have a practical,
S3: spiritual discussion that's going to help you not just get
S3: through the holidays, but enhance your relationships as you navigate
S3: what's ahead. Doctor Bill Thrasher is going to join us today.
S3: He's the author co-author of Putting God Back in the
S3: Holidays now. The book deals with the whole year, with
S3: holidays throughout the year. But for the purpose of this conversation,
S3: we're going to focus on Christmas and New Year's. And, Gary,
S3: I know this is one of your favorite times of
S3: the year, but it can also be stressful on relationships.
S4: Well, it can be, Chris, you know, thinking about all
S4: the food we've got to cook and all the places
S4: we've got to find for relatives to stay when they
S4: come in. And, you know, those logistic things can really
S4: be kind of overpowering sometimes. And then, of course, you know,
S4: many families have an Uncle Claude, you know, who you
S4: got to put up with. And you know, he's going
S4: to be here and you've got to figure out, well,
S4: how are we going to, you know, treat him and
S4: let's be nice to him and we'll listen to his
S4: stories and all kind of things, all kind of things
S4: related to the holidays. So I'm glad that today we're
S4: going to discuss how to make the holidays Christian. I mean,
S4: you know. Yes. So this this will be a good discussion.
S4: I'm excited about it.
S3: And I'm trying I'm still trying not to be Uncle Claude,
S3: but I think I've become. Let's meet our guest. Doctor
S3: Bill Thrasher is a beloved professor at Moody Bible Institute.
S3: He's been teaching for 45 years. He is a graduate
S3: professor of Bible and theology at Moody Theological Seminary, frequent
S3: speaker for churches and retreats around the country. He's the
S3: author of a number of books, including Believing God for
S3: His Best A Journey to Victorious, Praying, and Living the
S3: Life God Has Planned that our featured resource today is
S3: written by Doctor Thrasher and his wife, Penny. It's titled
S3: Putting God Back in the holidays. You can find out
S3: more at Building relationships.us.
S4: Well, Doctor Thrasher, welcome back to Building Relationships. Well, I'm.
S2: Honored to be back with you. I love you too,
S2: and so very grateful for all you've done for the
S2: Lord's work and for Moody. It's honor to be to
S2: know you.
S4: Well, you have had a long career of teaching both
S4: undergraduate and graduate students at Moody. Uh, it must be
S4: rewarding if this happens, that students actually come back from
S4: time to time and return and reach out to you
S4: and let you know what your teaching is meant to them. Uh,
S4: have you had those kind of experiences?
S2: You know, that has been one of the greatest gifts
S2: that God has given me. Yes. Uh, just thinking. This
S2: past summer, my wife and I, we traveled to Manila, uh,
S2: a student that I had over over 40 years ago.
S2: And he's been a missionary for 40 years. And I
S2: did a mission conference there for 100 Christian missionaries all
S2: over East Asia. And that was one of the highlights
S2: of my life. And and that was dear Tom. Tom
S2: was a very skilled carpenter when he came and, you know,
S2: doing high end work. And he began to work in
S2: his church and be involved in evangelism. And since God's
S2: driving him to the mission field. So he was headed
S2: there and someone says, well, you know, he probably ought
S2: to get some training. And he says, where should I go?
S2: And he said, Moody Bible Institute. So he went to
S2: Moody Bible Institute and he said, I guess I'm supposed
S2: to apply. They said, have you ever taken the SATs?
S2: I don't know what the S.A.T. is. So. But anyhow,
S2: he came in, and even when he was an undergraduate student,
S2: he began, he enrolled with. Then it was called a
S2: different name. Now it's called Crestar. But he began connecting
S2: with students there and in the churches in the 80s.
S2: He said, do you have people that are friends of
S2: the mission? And yeah, we do. And so he began
S2: just doing Muslim awareness seminars in the 80s. It wasn't
S2: quite we weren't quite as aware of that. And he's
S2: been a faithful, faithful. So that's just one. I'm privileged
S2: to have students and even now have the sons and
S2: daughters of former students, and it is a great blessing.
S2: Sometimes they give me credit for more than I deserve,
S2: but truth matter, they were pretty amazing people when they
S2: came and God did a work in their life, and
S2: maybe I didn't mess them up. So. But it's a
S2: great joy to to have been a part of that.
S2: And I'm grateful now in these, these years, my wife
S2: comes with me to school and she sits in the
S2: class and and that's a huge help to my students
S2: as she shows interest and love and encouragement and prayers.
S2: And so anyhow, that's a it's a good area we're
S2: in right now.
S4: Yeah. Well, I'm sitting here thinking about some of my
S4: professors at Moody when I was there back in the
S4: dark ages. And I'm asking myself, did I ever express
S4: appreciation to them? Doctor Kenneth Weast I had for Greek. Yes.
S4: And Doctor Harold Gardner and Christian education. Yes. And I
S4: think there's a lot of students that that really don't
S4: reach back, you know, to say to professors along the
S4: way how much they appreciate them. But, uh, it's nice
S4: when they do. But as you said, what's really rewarding
S4: is when you see how God is using those students
S4: around the world.
S2: Amen. Amen. And I'm sure that's a reward to see
S2: how God is using you. You know, I, uh, maybe
S2: this is a well known fact, but I didn't know
S2: it till you spoke in chapel a number of years ago.
S2: That no one would publish your first book. You had
S2: to self-publish it.
S4: That's right. And it was before. Before self-publishing existed, I
S4: literally self-published it.
S5: Wow.
S4: Wow. Well, for you, we're our topic today. What does
S4: it mean to put God back into the holidays? And
S4: how do you keep Christ central during this time of year?
S2: Well, you know it to some degree. That goes back
S2: to the to the why I wrote the book and
S2: and my dear wife helped. But it was it's this
S2: way back when, when I was a student, years ago,
S2: I noticed that the holiday time. Like I said, if
S2: you charted my spiritual life, the holidays would have been
S2: a valley, not a peak. As far as time of
S2: really being vibrantly alert to the Lord. And so I
S2: just sense a special battle around the holidays. Part of
S2: it was because I would be going from being very
S2: busy and then sort of having a break and and
S2: so I remember when I sensed God calling me into
S2: teaching and ministry, and I remember keeping a list of
S2: what I wanted to do if God ever opened that door.
S2: And one of the things was prepare my students for
S2: the holidays for the last 45 years, this would be
S2: the last class during the fall semester. I do talk
S2: about preparing yourself spiritually for the holidays, so I do
S2: that out of sensing my own need. And I've not
S2: only shared that with students, but also many, many other
S2: people and whatever. And people come to the holidays from
S2: many different backgrounds, you know, from a strong Christian heritage
S2: to a heritage that's hostile or indifferent, or from a
S2: strong marriage to a difficult marriage, to never marry, to
S2: a new marriage and divorce and all of those things,
S2: and maybe a parent and a single parent, but so
S2: but whatever the situation is, you know, our faith is attacked.
S2: And I came to find out about your faith I
S2: read today in Thessalonians. He says, lest the tempter having
S2: tempted you. First Thessalonians three five so you see, he
S2: attacks our faith. And I think, But God wants to
S2: strengthen our faith, that word be strong in the Lord
S2: and the strength of his might. That same Greek word
S2: is used in Romans four that Abraham was strengthened to believe.
S2: So I want individuals just to be strengthened to believe God.
S2: Christ left heaven to come to earth in this broken
S2: world that was fallen and rebellious against him, to enter
S2: into the world. And he wants to enter into your holidays.
S2: They may be the most joyous days of your life.
S2: You may have a great community of faith, or you
S2: may be the only person there that's crying out to God,
S2: but he wants to enter in and to communicate his comfort,
S2: his love, his encouragement, his hope, and to know that
S2: you're not alone. And so that's what I desire. I
S2: desire that for whoever. Whatever your situation is, we want
S2: to believe God for that. Yeah, I've charted this. Why
S2: is there such a battle? I've got. I've noted five
S2: reasons there is such a battle. And I'm sure you
S2: could maybe alert to others as well. But part of
S2: it is you look at all the holidays. There is
S2: a spiritual significance of them, even though we've greatly secularized
S2: them in our culture. But but even when everybody doesn't
S2: want to say Merry Christmas. I want to say Happy holidays.
S2: There is a focus on Christ during this particular time,
S2: and Satan hates Christ. And certainly you would expect him
S2: to attack people who truly represent him, even people whom
S2: all people whom Christ has created. And so it's no, statistically,
S2: there are more suicides and more depression and all that stuff.
S2: That's part of the battle. But also now maybe not
S2: everybody because, you know, Gary says it's the most joyous
S2: time for him. And I want it to be in
S2: his become that for me. But, you know, I usually
S2: enter this time of year very tired and very depleted.
S2: I finished up a semester, I'm preparing for a new one.
S2: And I think you're always more vulnerable when you're tired
S2: and depleted. And I don't think my situation is that unusual.
S2: I think others have told me that at this time
S2: of year seems to just exalt an unattainable ideal. I
S2: remember we were doing some caregiving for my precious mother
S2: in law, who is with the Lord now, and it was.
S2: I think it was it was right around Christmas Eve
S2: or close to it. And and she required 24 hour care.
S2: We covered those things and with some help from brother
S2: and sister in law and a few other people, and
S2: sometimes we hired a service called More Than Family. And
S2: this dear lady had done one shift, and I was
S2: talking to that lady before she was going to leave.
S2: And I said, you know, I told her what I was,
S2: you know, I said, well, that was my last day
S2: of my class for the semester. And I've talked about
S2: preparing spiritually for the holidays. I said, holidays can be hard.
S2: She says, oh, can it be hard? She says, I
S2: was preparing supper years ago for my extended family, and
S2: I saw my husband's phone go off. And so I
S2: went in there. I wanted to get his call, and
S2: that's when I discovered an affair he'd been in for
S2: many years that ultimately ended our marriage. And she says, oh,
S2: it's a very hard time before she left, says, you're
S2: not leaving. You're having supper with us. And she spent
S2: the evening with us. Now, even sometimes the painful memories,
S2: sometimes just unfulfilled Dreams, any kind of brokenness in our life,
S2: you know? For me, I think part of my struggle
S2: was this took me a while to realize this, that
S2: I entered the holidays with some very unconscious expectations. You know,
S2: my unconscious expectation was I deserve a break. I sort
S2: of resented some of the demands of the of the holiday.
S2: I think other people have told me, you say, boy,
S2: I like this idea of putting God back in the holidays,
S2: but he or she said, I'm not in control of
S2: my holidays. I'd like to put God back in the holidays,
S2: but others have a different agenda or whatever. So, you know,
S2: being content with your role and being light in a
S2: dark place, even sometimes being around ones that maybe can't
S2: fully appreciate you or fully understand you, that's a challenge.
S2: So those are some of the reasons that there is
S2: a battle in regard to this time of year.
S4: Well, Doctor Thrasher, we've just come through a contentious election
S4: season and all the divisions that we've heard about in
S4: our country, just a real political divide. Do you think
S4: the message of Christmas can help bring people together.
S2: Well, I think if the true message is is digested,
S2: it certainly can. It's unifying. It's a message of hope.
S2: It's a message of of love. God putting his love
S2: upon us when we were his enemies and helpless and
S2: indifferent and unquestionably, you know, it's a time of great
S2: time where God wants to restore us. It's a time
S2: of joy. Joy is a slippery concept in Scripture, but
S2: the key to joy is when you and God are
S2: in harmony. You can be joyful. That's why Jesus was
S2: said to be the most joyous person who ever lived.
S2: Hebrews one nine that was love, righteousness, and hated lawlessness.
S2: Therefore God has anointed you with the oil of joy
S2: above all your companions. So he came to restore us
S2: and unite us to him. Anytime we're focused on something
S2: outside of ourselves together that brings real unity, let us
S2: exalt his name together. So I'm praying it will be.
S2: I pray that God we will see an unprecedented harvest
S2: of souls. I mean, I'm here because of the incredible
S2: revival that was happening in the 70s. I'm not sure
S2: we really fully realized it, but that was when I
S2: was in college and and there was just a stream
S2: of people going into the Lord's work. Campus ministries were.
S2: And that not that God has not worked since, but
S2: it was a very incredible time that God worked there.
S2: And so I'm praying for a great harvest of souls
S2: in this time. It's dark, it's challenging. You're all right.
S2: We've gone through a difficult season, but we just cry
S2: to God for him to pour out His Spirit upon
S2: us and and do an unprecedented work here in our land.
S4: Well, that's my hope to God loved us while we
S4: were sinners.
S5: Amen.
S4: And so we must love people even though we disagree
S4: with them on a whole lot of stuff. But we're
S4: the ones that will be reaching out to love them,
S4: you know? Love your enemies. Jesus said so, right? Wow, wow. Well,
S4: you were single for many years before you married and
S4: had children. How did you approach the holidays as a
S4: single person and what advice would you give for singles today?
S4: Who are listening to us?
S2: Well, you know, I was married at age 36. And
S2: so I will say, you know, God gave great grace
S2: as I threw myself into the ministry God called me to,
S2: and I felt his calling on me on that time
S2: was to be single. There was a great contentment, but
S2: holidays were a harder time. I think there in the
S2: holiday time. I think your singleness is sort of accentuated.
S2: I think you have to be prayed up that not
S2: to be vulnerable to some lies. I mean the the
S2: lie that can say, hey, if you're not paired off
S2: on a particular day of the year, maybe is something
S2: wrong with you? Are you as special as God really
S2: says you are? I think you can even be vulnerable
S2: to start a wrong relationship. I would keep a list
S2: of things that God esteemed in a woman scripturally, just
S2: to keep my eyes on what God esteemed. As I
S2: waited on God for his timing, spending time with him
S2: and letting him affirm listening to him, and they say
S2: the greatest influence about what we think about ourselves is
S2: as what we our perception of what the most important
S2: person in our life thinks about us. So when God
S2: wants you, let him erect himself as the most important
S2: input and listen to him. The devil is cruel. I
S2: think also as a single Christmas he came not to
S2: be served, but to serve and give his life a
S2: ransom to many. This is the principle of sowing and
S2: reaping was a big help to me in when I
S2: saw that, uh, I would just say, okay, when you
S2: feel like you need encouragement, you need so it give it.
S2: I would keep a people like a list of people
S2: that I could just give a call to that I
S2: think would appreciate a call or whatever, and it'll come back.
S2: I mean, it's just like plant a crop of kindness
S2: and it'll it'll come back. Not in the way you
S2: think it will, but it'll it'll come back. Maybe not
S2: in the timing. You think it will, but it'll come back.
S2: So it is a challenge. Sometimes in the church things
S2: are are very family oriented and we praise God for that.
S2: I thank God for some key families that were a
S2: tremendous help to me during my single years. I taught
S2: here almost nine years, eight and a half years single,
S2: and those were very, very precious time and my wife
S2: and I, we esteem singles. There was a time that
S2: we ran a family class at our church, and we
S2: did all our socials with the singles groups so they
S2: can be a great help to us and and we
S2: came to them. In fact, we still have some very,
S2: very close friends that are single that have never married.
S4: You mentioned that whole concept of serving as following the
S4: example of Christ. Uh, the holidays often give us more
S4: opportunities for singles to be involved in serving, right? And
S4: in various situations. Absolutely.
S2: I think that's one of the ways I think we
S2: can be prayed up in regard to making the use
S2: of this of this season.
S4: What are some practical ways that families can center their
S4: Christmas celebrations around Christ rather than just, you know, festive activities?
S2: This is maybe the longest answer, and it relates to
S2: a particular passage of Scripture. The familiar Mary Martha story
S2: has become one of my favorite Christmas texts, text. I
S2: know there's really nothing about Christmas there, but it sure
S2: sounds like Christmas when it says Martha was distracted with
S2: all her preparations. To me, that's Luke 1040. That sounds
S2: like Christmas. But the thing Martha did right. We usually
S2: don't talk about what she did right, but what she
S2: did right. She welcomed Christ into her home. That's a
S2: strong word. Just used three other times it's used of
S2: Zacchaeus welcoming Christ into his home and Jason welcoming the
S2: Christians in his home in acts 17, and even Rahab
S2: welcoming the the messengers in her home. That passage was
S2: the origin of a tradition that God gave me the
S2: idea for. And we've instituted in our home to have
S2: a special meal at the beginning of the holidays, um,
S2: usually at the beginning of December. Now we of course,
S2: our boys are grown now, so getting it scheduled is
S2: not as easy as it once was. But we have
S2: a special meal, have our finest China there, and we
S2: have an empty place setting for Jesus, and we welcome
S2: him to the holidays. And even my boys were very small,
S2: but we would just talk to Jesus as if he
S2: was at the table, because he is at the table
S2: and he's at every table, but in a special way.
S2: Just talk to him about our plans and say, Lord,
S2: we want you to be in the midst of this.
S2: Is there anything you want us to change? And maybe
S2: are there ideas that we haven't thought about? But we
S2: talked to him and we dedicate those holidays to the Lord. Um,
S2: I remember the time that it was going to be
S2: the first Christmas that we didn't have. My wife's father,
S2: my son's grandfather, my father in law with us. And
S2: I felt like there at that table, God gave us
S2: an idea that said, let's just let's address the elephant
S2: in the room. He's not going to be there. But
S2: let's talk about give our favorite grandfather memories or whatever.
S2: And that was a special time. So welcoming. Christ. See,
S2: Martha is rebuked not because she's serving. Somebody needs to serve.
S2: You talked about all the things that need to be
S2: done during the Christmas holiday, but they're in verse 40.
S2: It says she was distracted with all her preparations. She
S2: was worried, and she was troubled and bothered about so
S2: many things. And I think that's the way the the
S2: devil works. He says in one Corinthians 11 three, it says,
S2: he leads us astray from the simplicity and purity of
S2: devotion to Christ. So that's for what she's rebuked. Now,
S2: why is she rebuked? I would want a person to realize, hey,
S2: God loves you in your most distracted moment, your most
S2: worried moment. You're there. Be hope for none of us
S2: or the most trouble moment. Why he does. He loves
S2: us so much. He hasn't sent us, us to live
S2: that way. You see in that verse 40, what it
S2: leads to, it leads to doubting his care. Lord, don't
S2: you care that my sister, she begins to criticize Mary?
S2: She's left me to do all the serving alone. It
S2: makes you doubt and be critical, and also feel alone
S2: and abandoned. And the worst thing in verse 40, you
S2: begin to have a demanding spirit toward Christ. Notice how
S2: she talks to Jesus. Tell her to help me. Uh,
S2: Martha did right. She invited Jesus to her home, but
S2: she did not enjoy the visit. And I think a
S2: lot of people don't enjoy Jesus's birthday earlier years when
S2: you know we would have our little Christmas. They would
S2: go over to my in-laws house and the other relatives
S2: were there. Whatever. We had to so rush to get there.
S2: We said, hey, this is not right. We want to
S2: enjoy both. So we put a different day on the
S2: calendar earlier. We're not going to answer calls. We're not
S2: going to just going to be off and just really
S2: relax and enjoy. And so that was a help. Even
S2: when we knew whom we were going to have to
S2: host or whatever, let's say let's let's be relaxed as
S2: we host. But we needed to have our Christmas at
S2: a different day. So that's part of whatever, whatever you
S2: have to do to take that hurry. In the rush,
S2: Mary is commended not because she's lazy and not because
S2: she's not helping. It seemed to imply in the scripture
S2: that she had helped earlier, but she's a picture of
S2: abiding in the Lord, and she's attentive to him, devoted
S2: to him, sit at his feet, willing to do anything
S2: he would ask her to do. But he says she
S2: chose the good part that will not be taken away
S2: from her. It leads to eternal fruit. You know, the
S2: thematic placement of this particular passage, it's not chronologically related
S2: to what's before and afterwards, but I think it's thematically
S2: related before it is the story of the Good Samaritan
S2: that that story of spontaneous compassion, that one of them
S2: and the other is the teaching on prayer. I think
S2: that hurried spirit, we can't see anything. We're just in
S2: a survival mode. You can't see the spontaneous compassion, and
S2: it certainly destroys the spirit of prayer. So I think
S2: there's great fruit in listening to the Lord's rebuke. He
S2: loves us. He cares about us. And it's a work
S2: of God to be able to enjoy this holiday, especially,
S2: quite frankly, the one who is the host or the hostess.
S2: It's it's a it's a greater challenge to have that
S2: relaxed attitude. I like the diligent, diligent Christian worker of
S2: the past, John Wesley. He said, although I'm always in haste,
S2: I'm never in a hurry. I never do more than
S2: I can do except with perfect calmness of spirit. I said, Lord,
S2: that's a that's a diligence that I didn't grow up with.
S2: I grew up with diligence because I had a diligent mother,
S2: but not that kind of diligence.
S5: Yeah. Yeah.
S4: Oh, well, those are good words. I think that, you know,
S4: I like the idea of starting earlier in the, in December, like,
S4: you know, and do some things leading up to it. Yeah. Well,
S4: you know, Christmas of course, is a time of gift giving.
S4: But how can Christians approach the giving of gifts in
S4: a way that reflects the love of Christ and not just,
S4: you know, materialism?
S5: Well, when.
S2: We realize, okay, whose birthday we're celebrating, that dawned on me. Well,
S2: should we be giving a gift to Jesus? And so
S2: now I'm not a great gift giver either. You know,
S2: my wife is. I'm not. And I'm too practical. Even
S2: as a boy, I didn't like to get a gift
S2: that I felt like I really didn't need. You know,
S2: I just, you know, it was just the waste. I mean,
S2: the idea this has been a tradition we've done is
S2: the idea. Everybody announces what gift they're giving to Jesus
S2: that year. And we'll write it down and I'll rehearse,
S2: tell them, tell them about what they've done in the
S2: last year. You know, that meant so much of my
S2: boys were growing up, and one member one year says,
S2: I want to give the gift to Jesus. I want
S2: to make a greater investment in my younger brother. Or
S2: I remember my wife saying, I want to put more
S2: music in our home or whatever. Well, that's been the highlight.
S2: Now I've expanded it to not only talk about the
S2: gift you're giving Jesus, but also what gift. As you
S2: look back on this past year that Jesus has given you,
S2: are you especially grateful for even also expanded? What gift
S2: has Jesus given you that you see in the family
S2: members that are with you today and that you'd just
S2: like to verbalize, thanking them for the gift of God
S2: you see in their life. And then also, fourthly, they
S2: don't have to answer all of these, but the idea
S2: of what gift are you trusting God for for this
S2: next year? So, you know, putting that in there, have
S2: the story there in the book about the white envelope
S2: that you've probably heard. It's a well known story. The
S2: but there was a, a family that she knew her
S2: husband hated Christmas. Not the true meaning of Christmas. But
S2: he hated the hurry, the rush, the running around to
S2: maybe get a gift just to get it. But it
S2: didn't really need it. And so what she did, her
S2: son had gone to a had a wrestling match with
S2: an inner city school and and they didn't have enough
S2: money to even have the headgear, the wrestling headgear. And
S2: what she did, she went out to a sporting goods
S2: store and she bought that headgear, made a donation to
S2: that school, and she put a white envelope on the
S2: on the Christmas tree, and he opened it and she
S2: informed him what she had done. And that was the
S2: he says his bright smile was the highlight of that year.
S2: And every year she would do that. And the kids,
S2: even though they would have toys, they couldn't wait for
S2: the white envelope. And one year when you know, he
S2: was no longer with him, it was, she said, it
S2: was so hard to get ready for Christmas. Oh my goodness,
S2: we missed him so much. And but then when they
S2: got to the cry and said, when they got to
S2: the Christmas Day, there weren't one white envelope. There were
S2: several white envelopes. Everybody had put a white envelope in
S2: honor of their father so that that that.
S5: Is.
S2: The origin of our little thing. We don't have the
S2: white envelope, but just what gift we're giving. Jesus.
S4: Oh, yeah. That's great.
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S4: Doctor Asher, before we took our break, we were talking
S4: about gift giving and how to honor Christ in that.
S4: You know, I remember several years ago I said to
S4: our church, and I don't know, this just kind of
S4: came to me. It was our missions offering. We're taking
S4: a missions offering in December. What if we give our
S4: largest gift to the missions offering. Give it to God
S4: for missions.
S5: Mhm.
S4: And that year we went from the previous year our
S4: church gave 250,000. That year we gave 500,000. Wow.
S5: Wow. Wow. That's beautiful.
S4: And our pastors kind of picked up on that and
S4: followed that through the years. You know, we're up to
S4: a million now.
S5: Wow. Wow.
S4: So that's another thought for putting Christ, you know, at
S4: the heart of Christmas.
S5: Amen.
S4: Now, in what ways can the church community serve those
S4: who are in need during the Christmas season? And we
S4: know that that that's a real, you know, segment of
S4: our society today. And and how does that embody the
S4: love of Jesus?
S2: You know, when sometimes even when we think about, you know,
S2: what gift we're giving to Jesus, sometimes God may give
S2: us an idea that we need other people to help. Now,
S2: we've done this a few times during Christmas season as
S2: an expanded family, you know, extended family. We visited a
S2: nursing home on Christmas Day. People that are in a
S2: nursing home on Christmas Day are really alone, or else
S2: somebody would have taken them somewhere, you know? What are
S2: the good works that God has caused us to walk
S2: in during these holiday times? And I believe if God
S2: gives an idea and God's in it, God will give
S2: the people a want to motivation to do it. And
S2: thank God for that idea about that mission project or whatever.
S2: That's that's extremely and it seemed like that's continued to
S2: go on. So we praise God for that.
S5: Yeah.
S4: What do you think is the most important goal for
S4: for Christmas?
S2: Well, I think the first thing to trust God for
S2: our Lord during these holidays. Lord, I'm asking you for this.
S2: I ask you to enhance my relationship with Christ. If
S2: that happens, you've had a successful holiday. You know what
S2: God said to the ancient king? As long as he
S2: sought the Lord, God prospered him. God, send things into
S2: your life that encourage you to to seek him. You
S2: don't seek him in a vacuum. I sought the Lord,
S2: and he delivered me from my fears. There's fear that
S2: causes us to seek him. You don't cast all your
S2: cares upon him. God entrust us with cares. So. Trusting
S2: God to enhance your relationship with him. And sometimes difficulties
S2: will be involved because some of his good gifts come
S2: in strange packages. Um, I said, it's not often in
S2: a prayer meeting that a person will pray, oh, God,
S2: would you give me the good gift of loneliness tonight?
S2: But if if loneliness causes you to seek the companionship
S2: of Christ, it's a good gift. Mhm.
S4: Yeah. You know there there is positive results from the
S4: hand of God when we use Christmas to celebrate the
S4: coming of Christ. Right.
S2: Amen. Amen.
S4: Now you have five key prayers for us as we
S4: enter the Christmas season. Can you share those with us?
S2: Be glad to. I need them and I pray them,
S2: and I share them with my students. I share them
S2: with groups, them. And the first one is what I've said.
S2: Go into it actively asking God to enhance your relationship
S2: with Christ. That's your that's your goal. If that happens,
S2: you've had a wonderful holiday. I'd say, secondly, ask God
S2: to rest you and refresh you. That is a work
S2: of God in Psalm 23, which so many people know,
S2: but it says it's a causative stem. He causes us
S2: to lie down in green pastures, makes us lie down
S2: beside the still waters. In other words, I'm a sheep.
S2: And I used to think, well, boy, give me some
S2: time off. That's the way I looked at it. And
S2: just I can take care of that. Truth of the
S2: matter is, you can't. You could sleep till noon every
S2: day and not necessarily be rested and refreshed. If you
S2: have some unresolved things in your heart, it's God who
S2: what knows how to rest and refresh you. And I
S2: think you see that in our precious Lord's life. He
S2: got up a great while before day. He was went
S2: to a lonely place and was praying there. And praying
S2: is not used primarily for intercessions for others, but for
S2: the outpouring of his own soul to find refreshment from
S2: his heavenly Father. So even Jesus, as the God man,
S2: did have emotional limitations and had to get refueled. So
S2: trust him to rest you and refresh you. And sometimes
S2: he can do that in strange ways. There there are
S2: times that I'd say, boy, I just need to to
S2: get away. And I'm not able to get away because
S2: I have responsibilities. But God, sometimes right in the midst
S2: of it, he can do it and think about a
S2: single parent. Sometimes they never can get away, but somehow
S2: God knows how to rest him and refresh him also.
S2: I'd say ask God to show you how he wants
S2: you to be a vessel of love. Let God fill
S2: in the blank to to family, to friends or ones
S2: in need and included. That would be the gift that
S2: he wants you to to give to Jesus that year.
S2: Another is to trust God to keep a measure of
S2: discipline in your life. All of these things have come
S2: out of times that I didn't have that you know? Now,
S2: there's nothing wrong with having leisure times, but but it's
S2: even asking God to somehow, in the words of Philippians,
S2: that prayer, approve the things that are excellent even in
S2: your leisure times, asking him for that spirit of self-control
S2: and eating. Sometimes there's nothing wrong with feasting, nothing wrong
S2: with celebrations, but sometimes I'll walk around. The block is
S2: better than the third desert. So just just just keeping,
S2: you know, a measure of discipline in your life and
S2: things that maybe you would not trip people up, but
S2: maybe sometimes they they expose themselves and waste much time
S2: on media where at best and and defile themselves at worst,
S2: keep a measure of discipline. And also I would say maybe,
S2: you know, things that have tripped you up, trust God
S2: to prepare you for any, any temptation that you know,
S2: tripped you up in the past have been making no
S2: provision for the flesh. Having people praying with you about that.
S2: Those are the five things that I trust God for myself,
S2: and I trust God for others as well.
S5: Yeah.
S4: Those are powerful. I think folks who are reading the
S4: book will working their way through those five. It's a
S4: great for Christmas prayer times. Absolutely. Doctor, what about the
S4: family who has members of the family who are not
S4: believers in Christ? And at Christmas, they're thrown together. Uh,
S4: how can we be true to our own beliefs and
S4: yet respectful of those who do not know Christ.
S2: I think getting before God I look one of my
S2: favorite verses that I cling to. It says when my
S2: enemies turn back, they stumble in pairs before you. For
S2: you have maintained my just cause you sit upon your
S2: throne judging righteously. I think the just cause we have
S2: is just what God I want to be blameless in
S2: love toward my loved ones. Philippians one nine through 11
S2: I pray that your love will abound more and more
S2: in knowledge and discernment. That's the Scripture we have engraved
S2: in our wedding rings, and a part of the pain
S2: of that. Is it really. It's a suffering to be
S2: not be understood when you're around people who just do not,
S2: at this point don't have the capacity to fully understand
S2: and appreciate what drives you. Uh, you got to give
S2: that right up. And that's very painful. But say, Lord,
S2: I just want you. Would you give me your insight
S2: and be prayerful about it? I had people pray in
S2: my in my class before we recorded this to in
S2: regard to the situation, they would be like, But God
S2: just help us to be free and be love and
S2: and to do everything I can. And so I think
S2: prayerfully asking God for that. Sometimes you can think of
S2: of activities that could make everybody feel comfortable and can
S2: be bonding, but it's a prayerful thing and it's a
S2: painful thing, and it's a suffering when you want them
S2: to understand you, but they don't fully understand you.
S4: Well, Doctor Thrasher, we've been talking a lot about Christmas celebration,
S4: but let's focus in our last segment here about New
S4: Year's and celebrating the New Year. It's more than just
S4: a ball dropping on Times Square. You believe that the
S4: principle of First fruits gives us guidance for approaching a
S4: new year? Explain that.
S2: Well, I remember as a Christian leader one time talked about,
S2: had you taken the principle of first fruit and applied
S2: that to his time? And he says, you know, as
S2: I've given the first few moments of a day to God,
S2: as I've given the first day of the week to
S2: the Lord, and it's given the first part of the year,
S2: that was the part that was the most foreign to
S2: me the first part of the year. I had no
S2: idea what that meant. I was trying to give the
S2: first part of a day and honor the Lord the
S2: Lord's day. But I remember when, okay, when January came around,
S2: I was in April. I heard that. So I'd put
S2: on my daytimer. Okay. When January comes around, I think
S2: I have a few days that I can be a
S2: little more available to the Lord. So this was over
S2: 40 years ago, and so I one thing I did,
S2: I decluttered some things and gave away things I wasn't
S2: using that helped a little bit. Then, as I was
S2: looking through some past journals, three things sort of began
S2: to surface. And so the idea came to my mind,
S2: why don't you go into the year trusting God for
S2: these three things and being attentive to those as you,
S2: as you look to the Lord for that. That was
S2: nothing in Scripture says you have to do that. But
S2: that was a very special year. And so when the
S2: next year came around and nothing magic about three, but
S2: that's about as many as I can handle. So I said, Lord,
S2: what three things do you want me to trust you
S2: for for this year? In the in the book, on
S2: page 24 to 26, I list some of those first
S2: of year requests that I've seen God be very faithful in.
S2: I remember the the very first year this obvious things
S2: hit me in that first Corinthians 13 1 to 3,
S2: talking about how if I speak with the tongue of
S2: men and angels don't have love, I'm just making those
S2: first three verses says that love is what absolutely essential
S2: to give meaning to anything I said, Lord. And then
S2: I'm not sure I know what love is. But then
S2: I remember in first John four, we love because he
S2: first loved us. I said, okay, I'm putting those two
S2: things together. If love is the most essential thing that
S2: gives meaning to everything, and we love because he first
S2: loved us, I'm going to ask you, Lord, to overwhelm
S2: me with your love, that I can better love you
S2: and love others. You know, as I laid that before
S2: the Lord, number one, I understood that only God can
S2: love me the way I really yearn to be loved
S2: and need to be loved. Only God can. What? Think
S2: about me day and night. How precious are your thoughts
S2: to me? Oh God, a vast is the sum of them.
S2: If I were to count them, they would outnumber the
S2: sands of the sea. And when I wake, I am
S2: still with you. You. It would be foolish to put
S2: that demand upon any other your most precious human relationship,
S2: that you've got to think about me day and night. No,
S2: they're going to have a bad day sometime. They've got
S2: to sleep too. So that just that God loves you
S2: in a way no one else ever can or will.
S2: Even the depth of his love for me. Your passages
S2: that I had even memorized, you know, Romans five, you know,
S2: he set his love upon me when I was ungodly.
S2: One summer day I felt particularly ungodly, but my spirit
S2: was able to just drink up his love for an
S2: ungodly man we I never had before. And then. Then
S2: every time I would see an exhortation that I was
S2: to love, I'd back away and say, okay, God, I
S2: know I'm supposed to do that. Like Proverbs 717 A
S2: friend loves at all times. Lord, I know you want
S2: me to be that kind of friend, but most of all,
S2: I'm just. How do you love? Lord, I thank you.
S2: You're that to me. You loved me at all times.
S2: Or he who repeats a matter separates intimate friends. But
S2: who covers the transgression, seeks love. Proverbs 17 nine. In
S2: other words, if when you have a close relationship with somebody,
S2: you'll know things about them. If you could keep bringing
S2: up their failures, you could destroy that relationship. That's not loving.
S2: God doesn't do me that way. When I woke up,
S2: if he put every failure in my face I couldn't get.
S2: He doesn't do that because he's seeking to build a
S2: relationship with me. A love relationship. So anyhow, he'll never
S2: ask me to do something to others that he doesn't
S2: abundantly do that to me. So I'm just saying that's
S2: one thing. But just believing God, he's a living God.
S2: What does he want you to trust you for? For
S2: that year is a is a tremendous help in regard
S2: to starting the new year.
S4: Yeah, it's a great idea. Well, you know, during the
S4: year it would come to it. People are making New
S4: Year's resolutions, Christians and non-Christians, New Year's resolutions. But for
S4: those of us who are Christians, how do we approach
S4: New Year's resolutions with a Christ centered perspective?
S2: I remember reading one time in Andrew Murray's book, The
S2: Three Stages of the Christian Life. Quite frankly, I think
S2: you go through the three stages multiple times, but the
S2: first stage is I can do it, and that's going
S2: to lead to failure. The second stage is I can't
S2: do it now when we're in that stage, nobody said,
S2: nobody's going to psych me up to make any kind
S2: of goals or any kind of resolutions I'm not getting.
S2: I've already been through that kind of failure. But then
S2: there's the third stage. First. I can do it. Second,
S2: I can't do it. Third stage I can't do it.
S2: But I must do it. And I'm going to trust
S2: God to do it. That's how you do resolutions. I
S2: can't do it, but I must do it. And I'm
S2: going to trust God to do it. A professor I
S2: had a well-known professor in seminary. He said when he
S2: became a Christian, he was told to write these words
S2: in the front of his Bible. When I try, I fail.
S2: When I trust he succeeds. And here he's talking to
S2: me 40 years later and he says, you know, it's
S2: taken me all this time to understand what those words mean.
S2: When I try, I fail. When I trust he succeeds.
S2: So trusting doesn't necessarily mean without effort, but it's in
S2: that spirit that we we discern what is it God
S2: wants us to trust him for, and we believe him
S2: for it.
S4: Yeah, yeah. So what role does faith play in setting
S4: life goals and New Year's goals?
S2: Well, I think the posture of faith as we come
S2: before God and say, God, what do you want me
S2: to believe you for? You're the master and I'm the servant. Uh,
S2: what do you want me to believe you for? I
S2: was just talking to a class earlier saying, you know,
S2: if you take out a sheet of paper and you're
S2: about on the top of that sheet of paper, God
S2: want you to want me to trust you for for
S2: my life, if that's all you did, that's a good
S2: start to a life goal. And you okay, Lord, this
S2: is a blank sheet. Would you help me discern what
S2: is it you want me to trust you for from
S2: my life? See, it's not a matter of coming up
S2: with my dreams. It's laying hold of God's dreams for me.
S2: I like Philippians three, that I may lay hold of
S2: that for which I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus.
S2: When God laid hold of us as believers, he had
S2: a plan and a purpose, things that he wanted to
S2: do in and for us and through us. And so
S2: it's a matter of trusting God for that. He says, I,
S2: you know, don't give you very long to live down here.
S2: You know that Psalm 90 I took literally, you know,
S2: teach me the number of my days and I may
S2: acquire a heart of wisdom, 70, maybe 80, he says.
S2: I remember in my 20s, I started doing that. I
S2: multiplied 70 times, 365 and a fourth. I subtracted the
S2: years I lived at that time and every year since then.
S2: Now I'm 72 now, every day since then, I put
S2: one number less on my on a paper day timer.
S2: I'm probably one of the five people in the world
S2: still use the paper at daytime now. Now I'm numbering up,
S2: you know, because I'm past 70 or whatever. But, you know,
S2: in that deadline, God has something he wants to do.
S2: And I take a couple of days a year at
S2: least to just say, Lord, I'm listening to you today.
S2: Would you just make any adjustment you want me to
S2: make in my life? Any adjustment? I'm just listening to
S2: you today, and I'll write those down on a sheet
S2: of paper where I've written those down, and there's a
S2: page 32in the holiday book, some of those things, insights
S2: from those days or whatever. But God's a living God.
S2: Now that's in regard to a life goal and year
S2: by year. I have just some categories there on page
S2: 23 and 24 about spiritual goals or relational goals or
S2: physical goals. Nothing says you have to make goals in
S2: all these years, but you can lay them before the Lord.
S2: Intellectual goals, financial, recreational, vocational, academic, outreach, whatever it may be, it's.
S2: But it's a matter of God. What do you want
S2: me to trust you for? And and believe him for
S2: that and being attentive to that. Now sometimes when you say, okay,
S2: maybe I've misread you, I need to adjust that and
S2: that's okay. It's you and God. And I think when
S2: you quit dreaming or whatever, something something's something's wrong.
S5: Yeah.
S2: We die inside.
S4: I'm sure that there are listeners. In fact, there's a
S4: lot of people who have regrets over past mistakes. How
S4: can we let go of our past failures so that
S4: we can step into the new year with faith and hope?
S2: Well, I love Proverbs 2416. The righteous man falls seven
S2: times and rises again. Uh, remember those individual that lived
S2: on my dorm floor in seminary? He said, our greatest
S2: joy is not in ever falling, but in rising every
S2: time we fall. Uh, one of the church fathers says
S2: the danger is not that we fall, but that we
S2: remain on the ground. And so I think God was
S2: christened him. But God is ready to forgive. Psalm 80
S2: 65I had a person who became like a second father
S2: to me. He had that Greek word to telestai. It
S2: is finished. He had it engraved, and it was behind
S2: his desk that every client had to come in and
S2: see that funny Greek word. It is finished. Paid in full,
S2: paid in full. Sometimes you need a verse with the
S2: word all in it. Colossians 213 and 14 is one
S2: of those verses. You know, in Martyn Lloyd-Jones book on
S2: spiritual depression, one causes what this one thing I did,
S2: you know, regret they couldn't get over. I like Hebrews 1017.
S2: I'll remember your sins no more. Micah 719 says, he
S2: takes our sins, and he puts them into the depth
S2: of the sea. Corrie ten boom, as you well know,
S2: used to puts up a sign saying no fishing. He
S2: takes our sin and puts them in the depth of
S2: the sea. So sometimes we may need somebody telling us
S2: what God says to us. We don't need another mediator
S2: between because we just need one mediator, and that's Jesus.
S2: But sometimes we need somebody telling us what Jesus would
S2: say to us. I'll sprinkle clean water on you. It'll
S2: be clean. I will cleanse you from all your filthiness,
S2: from all your idolatry. God can restore. He can restore.
S2: Now to a to a repentant heart. An unrepentant heart
S2: can abuse what I'm about to say. But to a
S2: repentant heart, a person needs to know God can work
S2: together for good. That which was not good. My sin
S2: is not good. But God is so big and so
S2: great and so wonderful, he can overrule that and work
S2: it for good. Yeah, sometimes he doesn't wipe it out
S2: of your memory, and you sort of have to attach
S2: a new meaning to it. The dear lady that anointed
S2: Jesus and the Pharisees rebuked him. So if you, being
S2: a prophet, you ought to know what kind of woman
S2: that was. And he said, she who has forgiven much
S2: loves much, and so is he reminded of that thing. Okay, Lord,
S2: would you just use that to well up in me, Lord,
S2: a greater love for you and a greater forgiveness, and
S2: even use me as an instrument that other people would
S2: be spared from this, this mistake. You know, sometimes what
S2: grieves me is when I know my sin has hurt
S2: somebody I love. When the father of faith, Abraham, when
S2: fear struck him and he lied to Abimelech in Genesis 20,
S2: I love there in verse 17 and 18. Well, God
S2: did exactly what he said I'll do. I'll bless those
S2: who bless you and curse those who curse you. So
S2: he closed the wombs of Abimelech and all of their household.
S2: And and they weren't able to bear children. And though
S2: when Abimelech said to he rebuked the the prophet, saying,
S2: you've lied to me. And then it says, Abraham prayed,
S2: and God healed Abimelech. And that's what I want a
S2: person to say. God is so big and so wonderful.
S2: He can even heal the hurts that we have caused.
S2: So I worship him for that. You can't give God
S2: a perfect record, because none of us have but the
S2: eyes of the Lord look to and fro throughout the
S2: whole earth to find a heart that's completely his saying,
S2: God give you everything. Dear God, I want to look
S2: to you and you alone so God can restore. God
S2: can work and I praise God for that.
S4: Yeah, absolutely. As we near the end of our time
S4: together today, Doctor Thrasher, what are some practical steps that
S4: we can take in the New Year to strengthen our
S4: walk with Christ?
S2: You know one thing that recently this has been a
S2: tremendous help to my wife and I, and I owe
S2: it to a mentor that I had in college that
S2: I've just reconnected with. And 50 years later, we start
S2: the day with what we call a four fold praise.
S2: And it's not mechanical. It's relational. First, before I try
S2: to do it before I get out of bed, I
S2: praise God for some attribute. I have a bookmark. I
S2: know exactly what attribute today. It was fateful and I
S2: go through those those attributes each month, each one of
S2: them twice. So I praise God for it. Also, I
S2: praise God for what he's done for me. I have
S2: a list of all that the blessings of God, but
S2: I summarize it in a succinct way. God, I praise
S2: you that I'm accepted by you. I'm secure in you.
S2: I'm significant in you. And I pray God somehow my
S2: life could ministry could overflow and that countless others would
S2: be able to rest in those blessings too. Third, I
S2: ask him for just for a fresh filling of the spirit. Lord,
S2: I thank you. You know I'm not adequate, but Lord,
S2: would you take my life? And would you use it
S2: today to walk in the good works you have for me?
S2: And then, fourthly, I take my position in Christ. Above
S2: all principalities and powers. Just claiming the spiritual authority and
S2: the spiritual battle over my life and my family. Each
S2: of my sons and their families and my ministries. And
S2: so those four four things praising God for who he is,
S2: for what he's done for me, the gifts he's given
S2: for the filling of the spirit and for the spiritual
S2: authority that he's given me in the warfare I have.
S2: Those things are a tremendous help to me. And my
S2: wife would say that, too. And so we thank God
S2: for that. And we thank God for you and Chris there, Gary. Very,
S2: very much.
S4: Well, thank you, Doctor Thrasher. These are wonderful ideas. I
S4: do hope that many of our listeners will get the
S4: book because as we said earlier, it's not just Christmas
S4: and New Year's. You also deal with some of the
S4: other holidays. And as Christians, we want to use the
S4: normal holidays that that are designed to celebrate Christ. So
S4: thanks for being with us today. Thanks for investing time,
S4: you and Penny investing time in writing this book.
S2: Thank you very, very much. It's a pleasure to be
S2: with you.
S3: We hope something you've heard today is encouraged you helped you.
S3: As we move closer to the Christmas and New Year celebrations,
S3: find more practical help in the book. That's our featured
S3: resource Putting God back in the holidays. You can find
S3: out more at building relationships.us again. Building relationships.us.
S4: And coming up next week, David and Barbara Lehman take
S4: us on a guided tour of the Christmas hymns and
S4: carols that we all love.
S1: Don't miss the conversation and music in one week. A
S1: big thank you to our production team, Steve Wick and Janice.
S1: Backing building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman is a production
S1: of Moody Radio in Chicago in association with Moody Publishers,
S1: a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.
UU: Thanks for listening.