1 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,760 S1: The holidays are behind us. And you know what that means. 2 00:00:11,920 --> 00:00:15,120 S1: It's tax season. But do you know who your tax 3 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:19,639 S1: preparer will be? Hi, I'm Rob West. It's gone largely unnoticed, 4 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:23,520 S1: but there's a nationwide shortage of CPAs and accounting talent 5 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:27,200 S1: in general. Waiting to line up your tax preparer could 6 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:30,120 S1: cause problems, but I'll tell you how to avoid them. 7 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:34,280 S1: And then it's on to your calls at 800 525 7000. 8 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:37,880 S1: This is faith and finance. Live. Biblical wisdom for your 9 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:44,360 S1: financial decisions. So first of all, when you hire someone 10 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:47,160 S1: to do your taxes, the odds are that person will 11 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,959 S1: either be a CPA, a certified public accountant, or an 12 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,720 S1: enrolled agent. Both are qualified to prepare and file taxes 13 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,520 S1: for other people. Although the CPA requirements are much stricter 14 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,540 S1: than those of an enrolled agent. Some attorneys also specialize 15 00:01:02,540 --> 00:01:05,540 S1: in tax law. The problem is that there's a shortage 16 00:01:05,540 --> 00:01:09,180 S1: of CPAs, and enrolled agents are also in high demand. 17 00:01:09,340 --> 00:01:12,940 S1: In particular, not enough young people are choosing those fields. 18 00:01:13,060 --> 00:01:16,580 S1: One of the major big Four firms, KPMG, continues to 19 00:01:16,620 --> 00:01:20,940 S1: offer high school students internships at $22 an hour to 20 00:01:20,980 --> 00:01:25,339 S1: entice them into becoming CPAs. Now, this may become not 21 00:01:25,340 --> 00:01:28,740 S1: only an inconvenience to a lot of people this tax season, 22 00:01:28,740 --> 00:01:32,020 S1: but a real danger if folks become desperate to find 23 00:01:32,020 --> 00:01:35,460 S1: tax professionals to file their returns. It opens the door 24 00:01:35,459 --> 00:01:40,899 S1: to unscrupulous tax preparers who may even be falsifying their credentials. 25 00:01:40,940 --> 00:01:44,140 S1: The IRS suggests a number of ways to protect yourself 26 00:01:44,140 --> 00:01:47,260 S1: from these fraudsters, who come out of the woodwork every 27 00:01:47,260 --> 00:01:52,260 S1: tax season to perpetrate refund fraud, identity theft and other scams. 28 00:01:52,340 --> 00:01:56,620 S1: Look for a preparer who's available year round. If you're audited, 29 00:01:56,620 --> 00:02:00,520 S1: you certainly want your tax preparer available to represent you. 30 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:04,280 S1: So obviously you want to avoid fly by night operations 31 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:08,480 S1: when interviewing a tax preparer. Ask for their IRS Preparer 32 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:14,200 S1: Tax Identification Number or PTI paid tax return preparers are 33 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:19,239 S1: required to register with the IRS. Obtain a Tin and 34 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:22,560 S1: enter it on any returns they prepare. You can check 35 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:25,360 S1: whether a tax preparer has done this by going to 36 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:29,320 S1: Irs.gov and looking them up in the Directory of Federal 37 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:33,120 S1: Tax Return Preparers. This tool can also help you locate 38 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:36,720 S1: a preparer in your area with the qualifications you're seeking. 39 00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:40,640 S1: You should also ask if the preparer has a professional credential, 40 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:44,760 S1: such as a CPA or enrolled agent. Ask about continuing 41 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:50,200 S1: education classes they've taken. Tax laws are complex and change frequently. 42 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,240 S1: Preparers have to stay up to date on tax topics. 43 00:02:53,320 --> 00:02:55,440 S1: You can also check on the history of a tax 44 00:02:55,580 --> 00:02:59,300 S1: preparer for CPAs, check with the state Board of Accountancy 45 00:02:59,340 --> 00:03:04,019 S1: for enrolled agents. Go to irs.gov and search for verify 46 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:09,140 S1: enrolled agent status for attorneys. Check with their state bar association. 47 00:03:09,380 --> 00:03:12,859 S1: Then you also want to ask about fees. Avoid preparers 48 00:03:12,860 --> 00:03:16,299 S1: who base their fees on a percentage of their clients refund, 49 00:03:16,300 --> 00:03:19,980 S1: or if they brag their refunds are bigger than the competition. 50 00:03:19,980 --> 00:03:23,500 S1: Do not give any personal information or documents to a 51 00:03:23,500 --> 00:03:27,020 S1: preparer unless you've checked them out and are satisfied that 52 00:03:27,020 --> 00:03:30,740 S1: they're legitimate. All a fraudster needs is your Social Security 53 00:03:30,780 --> 00:03:34,380 S1: number to file a fraudulent return and steal your refund. 54 00:03:34,580 --> 00:03:37,820 S1: You also may want to make sure the preparer offers 55 00:03:37,820 --> 00:03:41,380 S1: IRS e-file, and then ask to have your return filed. 56 00:03:41,380 --> 00:03:45,420 S1: That way, if the preparer can't or won't file electronically, 57 00:03:45,540 --> 00:03:49,060 S1: that's a warning sign. Paid preparers who do taxes for 58 00:03:49,060 --> 00:03:53,660 S1: more than ten clients generally must file electronically. It's also 59 00:03:53,700 --> 00:03:57,450 S1: the safest and most accurate way to file next. Watch 60 00:03:57,450 --> 00:04:00,250 S1: out for a tax preparer who doesn't ask you for 61 00:04:00,250 --> 00:04:04,450 S1: records and receipts. Legitimate preparers need those documents and will 62 00:04:04,450 --> 00:04:07,930 S1: always ask you for them, so be prepared. Here's another 63 00:04:07,930 --> 00:04:11,490 S1: warning sign if a preparer says they can e-file your 64 00:04:11,490 --> 00:04:15,810 S1: return based simply on a pay stub. Head for the door. 65 00:04:16,010 --> 00:04:19,050 S1: They're required to use a W-2 and you'll need to 66 00:04:19,089 --> 00:04:22,050 S1: provide it. You also need to understand the rules of 67 00:04:22,050 --> 00:04:27,370 S1: representation if you're audited. CPAs, enrolled agents, and attorneys all 68 00:04:27,370 --> 00:04:33,250 S1: can represent you before the IRS in any situation. Non-credentialed preparers, 69 00:04:33,250 --> 00:04:36,930 S1: including your cousin Bill, who's a whiz with numbers, cannot 70 00:04:36,930 --> 00:04:40,890 S1: represent you if you're audited. The next one goes without saying, 71 00:04:40,890 --> 00:04:44,530 S1: but let's say it anyway. Never sign a blank check 72 00:04:44,529 --> 00:04:48,849 S1: or an incomplete return. Review the entire tax return and 73 00:04:48,850 --> 00:04:52,370 S1: make sure it's complete before signing. Ask questions if something's 74 00:04:52,370 --> 00:04:56,230 S1: not clear or looks inaccurate. Also, any refund should go 75 00:04:56,230 --> 00:05:00,350 S1: directly to you, not into your Preparer's bank account. To 76 00:05:00,390 --> 00:05:03,270 S1: make sure, check the routing and bank account number on 77 00:05:03,270 --> 00:05:06,349 S1: the completed return. Now, one way you can avoid any 78 00:05:06,350 --> 00:05:09,350 S1: potential problem with your tax preparer is to look for 79 00:05:09,350 --> 00:05:13,550 S1: a CPA, enrolled agent, or tax attorney with the Certified 80 00:05:13,550 --> 00:05:19,670 S1: Kingdom Advisor designation. Just go to find a com. That's fine. 81 00:05:22,150 --> 00:05:23,029 S1: We'll be right back. 82 00:05:34,510 --> 00:05:37,590 S2: The opinions offered during this program represent the personal or 83 00:05:37,589 --> 00:05:42,070 S2: professional opinions of the participants, given for informational purposes only. 84 00:05:42,230 --> 00:05:45,589 S2: Any information provided is not intended to replace advice from 85 00:05:45,589 --> 00:05:50,070 S2: a financial, medical, legal, or other professional who understands your 86 00:05:50,070 --> 00:05:51,690 S2: specific situation. 87 00:05:59,570 --> 00:06:01,770 S1: Well, thanks for joining us today on Faith and finance 88 00:06:01,770 --> 00:06:04,330 S1: live here on Moody Radio. I'm Rob West. We're going 89 00:06:04,330 --> 00:06:06,650 S1: to begin taking your calls and questions here in just 90 00:06:06,650 --> 00:06:11,330 S1: a moment. That number to call is 800 525 7000. 91 00:06:11,370 --> 00:06:16,050 S1: That's 800 525 7000. Why do we deal with money 92 00:06:16,050 --> 00:06:19,010 S1: every day on this broadcast? Is it because we want 93 00:06:19,050 --> 00:06:21,730 S1: to enrich ourselves? No, that's not it at all. It's 94 00:06:21,730 --> 00:06:25,250 S1: because money touches every part of our lives. And if 95 00:06:25,290 --> 00:06:29,770 S1: we're not careful, it can quietly become our ultimate treasure. 96 00:06:29,810 --> 00:06:32,650 S1: You know, think about it. Money reveals what we value. 97 00:06:32,930 --> 00:06:36,290 S1: It reveals what we fear and where we place our trust. 98 00:06:36,650 --> 00:06:41,530 S1: But when we approach the money conversation as Christ followers, 99 00:06:41,529 --> 00:06:45,729 S1: being conformed to his image, understanding that God's Word is 100 00:06:45,730 --> 00:06:50,910 S1: the source. Accepting our role as stewards, not owners. Everything changes. 101 00:06:50,910 --> 00:06:55,950 S1: Fear loosens its grip, contentment takes root, generosity begins to flow, 102 00:06:56,230 --> 00:07:00,710 S1: and capital is reclaimed as a tool for advancing God's kingdom. 103 00:07:00,710 --> 00:07:04,830 S1: It's really the abundant life that the Lord described for us. 104 00:07:04,870 --> 00:07:07,590 S1: Our joy is found in him, not in the things 105 00:07:07,589 --> 00:07:10,230 S1: of this world. He also is where we find our 106 00:07:10,350 --> 00:07:14,670 S1: our identity and our security. He is in control of everything. 107 00:07:14,870 --> 00:07:18,710 S1: Money then becomes a tool to accomplish his purposes, and 108 00:07:18,750 --> 00:07:20,550 S1: we want to help you do that. In light of 109 00:07:20,590 --> 00:07:23,510 S1: the the questions you're dealing with today in your financial life. 110 00:07:23,510 --> 00:07:27,790 S1: So whatever it is, call right now 800 525 7000. 111 00:07:27,830 --> 00:07:33,550 S1: That's 800 525 7000. Uh, by the way, uh, Jerry Boyer, uh, 112 00:07:33,550 --> 00:07:35,950 S1: will be by in the final segment today. And it's 113 00:07:35,950 --> 00:07:37,870 S1: a good day for it because you may not be 114 00:07:37,870 --> 00:07:41,950 S1: aware of this, but we just hit a pretty significant milestone, uh, 115 00:07:41,990 --> 00:07:46,230 S1: this afternoon, uh, in the market. That's right. The Dow Jones, 116 00:07:46,230 --> 00:07:49,250 S1: the Dow Jones 30 that you probably are familiar with 117 00:07:49,290 --> 00:07:53,530 S1: hit 50,000 for the very first time. The Dow is 118 00:07:53,530 --> 00:07:58,570 S1: up more than 1200 points at the close. 2.5%. Dow 119 00:07:58,610 --> 00:08:02,010 S1: 50,000 is a reality. It wasn't that long ago that 120 00:08:02,010 --> 00:08:05,370 S1: we thought, I don't know Dow 50,000 that if that 121 00:08:05,370 --> 00:08:07,850 S1: ever happens that's way down the road. And yet here 122 00:08:07,850 --> 00:08:12,570 S1: we are. Incredible. A massive snapback from the uh, the 123 00:08:12,610 --> 00:08:17,330 S1: rout in tech that has come roaring back today and 124 00:08:17,330 --> 00:08:22,250 S1: resulted in the Dow Jones up 2.5%, the S&P 500, uh, 125 00:08:22,250 --> 00:08:26,850 S1: approaching 7000, which is going to be incredible, uh, up 2% today. 126 00:08:26,850 --> 00:08:31,770 S1: The Nasdaq up 2.18%. We'll get Jerry's take on all 127 00:08:31,770 --> 00:08:34,050 S1: of that. But, uh, is a good day in the markets. 128 00:08:34,050 --> 00:08:37,130 S1: Your 401 K is probably doing pretty well today. All right. 129 00:08:37,130 --> 00:08:39,250 S1: Let's take your phone calls. Uh, the number to call 130 00:08:39,250 --> 00:08:45,410 S1: 800 525 7000. That's 800 525 7000. You can call 131 00:08:45,410 --> 00:08:48,709 S1: right now. Let's begin in Chicago. Herman. Go ahead. 132 00:08:50,030 --> 00:08:53,790 S3: Well, uh. Good evening. Thank you for taking my call. 133 00:08:53,830 --> 00:08:57,790 S3: Quick question. What is it better for me and my 134 00:08:57,790 --> 00:09:00,350 S3: wife to file together or separately? 135 00:09:01,270 --> 00:09:05,990 S1: Mm. Yeah. Uh, it's a great question. Generally, it's better 136 00:09:05,990 --> 00:09:12,670 S1: to file joint married filing jointly. And here's why. Uh, there's, 137 00:09:12,710 --> 00:09:18,830 S1: you know, joint filers usually reach higher income thresholds before 138 00:09:18,870 --> 00:09:23,430 S1: hitting the higher rates. So we're in a graduated tax 139 00:09:23,429 --> 00:09:26,870 S1: rate system. So, you know, when you reach a certain 140 00:09:26,870 --> 00:09:30,350 S1: threshold of your income, you go into the next bracket 141 00:09:30,350 --> 00:09:32,630 S1: and then that portion of your income is at a 142 00:09:32,630 --> 00:09:34,870 S1: higher rate until you get to the next bracket, and 143 00:09:34,870 --> 00:09:37,990 S1: then the portion beyond that's at an even higher rate. Well, 144 00:09:37,990 --> 00:09:43,630 S1: those thresholds for when those higher rates occur for joint filers, uh, 145 00:09:43,630 --> 00:09:48,700 S1: are higher thresholds. Also, there's credits only available if you 146 00:09:48,740 --> 00:09:52,780 S1: file jointly, so you get bigger deductions and credits. You 147 00:09:52,780 --> 00:09:56,260 S1: also have simplicity because there's just one return, one set 148 00:09:56,260 --> 00:09:59,460 S1: of numbers. And if you're paying a CPA, there's only 149 00:09:59,500 --> 00:10:02,780 S1: one return you have to pay the CPA for. And 150 00:10:02,780 --> 00:10:06,380 S1: so as a result of that, 90 plus percent of 151 00:10:06,380 --> 00:10:11,619 S1: married couples file jointly. Now where you might see is, 152 00:10:11,740 --> 00:10:14,140 S1: you know, if you have, uh, there needs to be 153 00:10:14,140 --> 00:10:19,780 S1: liability protection. Um, you know, there's no income separation, maybe 154 00:10:19,780 --> 00:10:22,780 S1: a high risk situation where, you know, you're owning a 155 00:10:22,780 --> 00:10:27,180 S1: business or you have unresolved tax problems, something like that. 156 00:10:27,179 --> 00:10:31,700 S1: But generally speaking, for the vast majority of people filing married, 157 00:10:31,700 --> 00:10:34,740 S1: filing jointly is going to be your most cost effective way. 158 00:10:35,780 --> 00:10:39,700 S3: Okay. Uh, now, with this new with with the big, 159 00:10:39,700 --> 00:10:44,040 S3: beautiful bill that was passed, uh, singles can get 75 160 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:48,280 S3: up to $75,000, and they'll get an extra 6000. Now, 161 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:52,400 S3: me and my wife together earn about 185 grand. I 162 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,720 S3: make most of that money. So dealing with that big, 163 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:59,439 S3: beautiful bill, I don't believe my wife is going to 164 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:03,040 S3: get 75,000. Even with the even with the Social Security. 165 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:05,679 S3: So would that make it better for her to file separate? 166 00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:11,000 S1: No, I don't think so. Um, because for a single 167 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:15,439 S1: filer over 65, the standard deduction is still, you know, 168 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:21,719 S1: roughly 16,500. Um, so there's not going to be an 169 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:26,120 S1: extra $6,000 there. Um, so I think you guys are 170 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,000 S1: still going to be in a better place to go 171 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:29,720 S1: ahead and file jointly overall. 172 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:33,960 S3: Because we're both over 70 years old, so. Okay. So 173 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,360 S3: you say it's better to file jointly. Okay. 174 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:40,280 S1: Yep. Absolutely. Thanks for your call, Herman. Call anytime. 800 175 00:11:40,340 --> 00:11:43,340 S1: 525 7000 number to call if you have a financial 176 00:11:43,340 --> 00:11:46,059 S1: question today. Go ahead and and call right now. Our 177 00:11:46,059 --> 00:11:49,060 S1: team is standing by. We've got some lines open 800 178 00:11:49,059 --> 00:11:53,500 S1: 525 7000. Any financial topics in play today. Let's go 179 00:11:53,500 --> 00:11:55,140 S1: to Indianapolis Dan go ahead. 180 00:11:56,059 --> 00:11:58,059 S4: Thank you for taking my call. Rob I'm calling because 181 00:11:58,059 --> 00:12:03,179 S4: I have, uh, three CDs. Uh, they're all 100,000 each. Um, 182 00:12:03,300 --> 00:12:07,500 S4: I've just been rolling them over as they've matured right 183 00:12:07,500 --> 00:12:11,500 S4: now at the. The months are like three months, five months, 184 00:12:11,500 --> 00:12:13,860 S4: that type of thing because of how the market is 185 00:12:14,100 --> 00:12:17,580 S4: in terms of interest rates. So looking for some other 186 00:12:17,620 --> 00:12:20,660 S4: possibilities or any thoughts you might have in terms of 187 00:12:20,700 --> 00:12:26,060 S4: other options for this money, uh, perhaps besides the CD. 188 00:12:26,740 --> 00:12:29,660 S1: Yeah. Very good. Uh, and I would assume you want 189 00:12:29,660 --> 00:12:32,380 S1: to stay on the most conservative end of that spectrum. 190 00:12:32,380 --> 00:12:33,140 S1: Is that right? 191 00:12:34,220 --> 00:12:36,460 S4: Oh, I'm. I'm willing to venture out a little bit. 192 00:12:36,740 --> 00:12:39,100 S1: Okay. Yeah. I mean, if you want to stay on 193 00:12:39,100 --> 00:12:41,439 S1: the very safe side? Yeah. I mean, you could go 194 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:44,800 S1: back into some additional CDs. I mean, for instance, um, 195 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,560 S1: you know, our friends at Christian Community Credit Union, the 196 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,280 S1: largest Christian credit union in the country, they're paying 4% 197 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:56,360 S1: right now, up to $100,000 for 12 months. Um, and 198 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:59,440 S1: that's a pretty exceptional rate. And then for faithful listeners, 199 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,080 S1: there's a bonus of up to $400 when you open 200 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:06,080 S1: a new account. You could learn more there at Faith banking, 201 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,840 S1: but high yield savings, money market right now, even a 202 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,160 S1: one year CD about the best you're going to find 203 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:15,200 S1: for all three of those is right at about 4%, 204 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:19,160 S1: which is still a very attractive rate, historically speaking, and 205 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:22,040 S1: going to keep you on the most conservative end of 206 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,360 S1: the spectrum. If you wanted to begin to kind of 207 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,520 S1: move up that risk ladder, if you will. Still, on 208 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,720 S1: the very conservative side, you could start looking at things like, uh, 209 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:34,520 S1: you know, maybe corporate bonds, a short or medium term 210 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:37,640 S1: corporate bond fund or, um, you know, certainly you could 211 00:13:37,740 --> 00:13:41,460 S1: put Treasurys in there on the very conservative end. Um, 212 00:13:41,540 --> 00:13:43,980 S1: then I think, you know, you could start looking at 213 00:13:44,020 --> 00:13:47,540 S1: maybe adding some dividend paying stocks through a mutual fund 214 00:13:47,540 --> 00:13:50,579 S1: or something like that, but only that portion where you 215 00:13:50,580 --> 00:13:53,660 S1: could say, I've got at least a ten year time horizon, 216 00:13:53,660 --> 00:13:57,579 S1: and if the market were down significantly, I could leave 217 00:13:57,580 --> 00:13:59,340 S1: it alone. Does that make sense? 218 00:14:00,380 --> 00:14:03,260 S4: Yes, that makes sense. So you mentioned high yield and 219 00:14:03,260 --> 00:14:04,619 S4: what were the other ones? 220 00:14:04,660 --> 00:14:10,620 S1: Yeah. High yield savings, money market treasuries, US government treasuries, bills, 221 00:14:10,620 --> 00:14:13,540 S1: bonds and notes. You could buy those at Treasurydirect gov. 222 00:14:13,820 --> 00:14:17,060 S1: And then a mutual fund of uh of corporate bonds 223 00:14:17,059 --> 00:14:20,060 S1: would work. And then after that you start getting into 224 00:14:20,260 --> 00:14:24,060 S1: stocks at that point probably a stock mutual fund. Dan 225 00:14:24,060 --> 00:14:26,220 S1: I hope that helps. Thanks for your call. We'll be 226 00:14:26,220 --> 00:14:38,640 S1: right back. Hey, thanks for joining us today on Faith 227 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:41,040 S1: and Finance Live. I'm Rob West. We're taking your calls 228 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:48,480 S1: and questions. The number 800 525 7000. That's 800 525 7000. Uh, 229 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,200 S1: let's go to, uh, Saint Louis. Hi, Peggy. Go ahead. 230 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:54,960 S5: Hi. I have a question for you. I was never 231 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,240 S5: I had to take Social Security early, and, um, at 232 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:03,120 S5: that point, they told me I owed a late enrollment penalty. 233 00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:05,800 S5: I had no idea what that was, and they told 234 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:11,000 S5: me I'll have to pay it forever. So, um, but I, 235 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,800 S5: you know, which mine is not a whole lot of money, 236 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:16,880 S5: but the man that I was talking to said, there's 237 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:20,960 S5: people that have to pay, like over $100. Do you. 238 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:24,080 S5: Is that. And they said it never goes away. Is 239 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:24,840 S5: that correct? 240 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:29,040 S1: Yeah. What that's probably referring to is not Social Security 241 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:32,440 S1: but Medicare Part B, a late enrollment penalty. Does that 242 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:33,120 S1: sound right? 243 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,870 S5: It does. It's been so many years. I'm 76 right. 244 00:15:36,870 --> 00:15:40,110 S1: Now. Got it. Yeah, yeah. People often hear about it 245 00:15:40,110 --> 00:15:43,950 S1: when they claim Social Security early because that's when Medicare 246 00:15:43,950 --> 00:15:48,710 S1: decisions come into play. But essentially Medicare Part B works 247 00:15:48,710 --> 00:15:53,710 S1: like insurance risk pooling. So it was designed to prevent 248 00:15:53,710 --> 00:15:57,550 S1: prevent people from skipping premiums while they're healthy and then 249 00:15:57,550 --> 00:16:00,790 S1: signing up when they get sick. So it penalizes late 250 00:16:00,790 --> 00:16:04,470 S1: enrollment to keep the system funded. So the way it 251 00:16:04,470 --> 00:16:09,110 S1: works is if you delay part B without having qualifying coverage, 252 00:16:09,110 --> 00:16:13,630 S1: meaning you have an employer plan and your your company 253 00:16:13,630 --> 00:16:16,710 S1: has more than 20 employees where you're covered. If you 254 00:16:16,710 --> 00:16:21,870 S1: don't have that, then your premium increases 10% for every 255 00:16:21,870 --> 00:16:26,830 S1: full 12 month period you delay. And so that increase 256 00:16:26,830 --> 00:16:29,950 S1: lasts as long as you have part B. So if 257 00:16:29,950 --> 00:16:32,670 S1: you delayed it by two years, you'd have a 20% 258 00:16:32,850 --> 00:16:37,530 S1: higher premium. So if your part B is $175 a month, 259 00:16:37,690 --> 00:16:41,410 S1: now all of a sudden it's, you know, $210 a month. 260 00:16:41,650 --> 00:16:43,810 S1: And yes, it stays that way for the rest of 261 00:16:43,810 --> 00:16:47,890 S1: your life. So that is typically what people encounter in 262 00:16:47,890 --> 00:16:48,930 S1: this situation. 263 00:16:49,650 --> 00:16:53,170 S5: Oh, it's just it's just sad. But, um, like I said, mine, 264 00:16:53,210 --> 00:16:56,210 S5: I just went a few months that I didn't have coverage, 265 00:16:56,810 --> 00:16:59,930 S5: but and I, I, I wasn't, I thought was this 266 00:16:59,930 --> 00:17:02,570 S5: something that when, you know, when people were getting subsidies 267 00:17:02,570 --> 00:17:05,410 S5: and is this something that now since you were not 268 00:17:05,410 --> 00:17:08,530 S5: under the Obama things with the subsidies, is this something 269 00:17:08,530 --> 00:17:11,530 S5: that they could possibly get rid of it in time? 270 00:17:12,170 --> 00:17:17,690 S1: Yeah. Unfortunately not. No. These Medicare Part B premium increases 271 00:17:17,690 --> 00:17:21,409 S1: for filing late, unfortunately. Stick with you for the for 272 00:17:21,410 --> 00:17:22,250 S1: the duration. 273 00:17:22,850 --> 00:17:26,090 S5: Okay. I just wish like I said, I never even 274 00:17:26,130 --> 00:17:30,690 S5: heard about it. So is that something that is very 275 00:17:30,690 --> 00:17:33,389 S5: well known. I mean, I didn't know about it until 276 00:17:33,390 --> 00:17:34,109 S5: I filed. 277 00:17:34,510 --> 00:17:37,350 S1: Yeah, it's a great point. And, you know, a lot 278 00:17:37,390 --> 00:17:40,670 S1: of people, this catches them by surprise. We talk about 279 00:17:40,670 --> 00:17:44,510 S1: it often here. But essentially what happens is, uh, you know, 280 00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:49,109 S1: when you turn 65, unless you have qualifying coverage, you 281 00:17:49,109 --> 00:17:52,470 S1: have to go ahead and apply for Medicare. You have 282 00:17:52,470 --> 00:17:56,990 S1: a three month window before you turn 65, uh, including 283 00:17:56,990 --> 00:18:01,429 S1: your birth month and then three months after your birth month. 284 00:18:01,430 --> 00:18:04,990 S1: So a total seven month window. And if you don't 285 00:18:05,030 --> 00:18:08,030 S1: enroll in Medicare Part B during that window, then that's 286 00:18:08,030 --> 00:18:10,430 S1: when those penalties start kicking in every month. 287 00:18:11,070 --> 00:18:13,510 S5: Okay. Yeah. Mine was just for a few months that 288 00:18:13,510 --> 00:18:16,830 S5: I didn't have coverage. But um, so like I said, 289 00:18:16,830 --> 00:18:20,790 S5: mine's what, less than $50. But I mean, it keeps 290 00:18:20,790 --> 00:18:23,790 S5: going up just a few dollars every year. But I 291 00:18:23,790 --> 00:18:25,910 S5: thought the sad part is when he told me that 292 00:18:25,910 --> 00:18:29,310 S5: there's people paying over $100. That just made me sick. 293 00:18:29,730 --> 00:18:33,170 S1: Oh, I know it it it is unfortunate. Yeah. 294 00:18:33,810 --> 00:18:37,570 S5: Okay. All right. Well, thank you so much for your time, sir. 295 00:18:37,930 --> 00:18:40,770 S1: Lily. Peggy, thank you for your call today. God bless you. Uh, 296 00:18:40,770 --> 00:18:44,129 S1: let's go to Ohio. Becky. Go ahead. Becky? Are you 297 00:18:44,130 --> 00:18:46,290 S1: with us? I sure can. Yeah. Go ahead. 298 00:18:46,490 --> 00:18:50,129 S6: All right. Sorry about that. That's okay. My question is, 299 00:18:50,290 --> 00:18:56,210 S6: after I realized when I was doing online tax preparation, 300 00:18:56,210 --> 00:18:58,890 S6: I always try and go to see whether I need 301 00:18:58,890 --> 00:19:02,570 S6: to do, uh, married filing joint or married filing separate. 302 00:19:03,290 --> 00:19:06,770 S6: I made an error, but I didn't catch it until 303 00:19:06,770 --> 00:19:12,210 S6: after I filed my federal for myself. Married filing separate. 304 00:19:12,330 --> 00:19:15,570 S6: I have not done any other tax preparation. I haven't 305 00:19:15,570 --> 00:19:20,689 S6: filed state. I've done nothing for my husband. Can I 306 00:19:20,810 --> 00:19:25,850 S6: fix things for this tax season for 2025? 307 00:19:26,170 --> 00:19:26,570 S1: Yeah. 308 00:19:26,609 --> 00:19:31,669 S6: Can I go back on TurboTax to to rectify things. 309 00:19:31,710 --> 00:19:33,590 S6: And if so, how do I do that? 310 00:19:33,869 --> 00:19:36,510 S1: Yeah, yeah, it's a great question. Uh, the short answer 311 00:19:36,510 --> 00:19:39,669 S1: is yes. You can absolutely do that. You do not 312 00:19:39,670 --> 00:19:42,750 S1: need to wait until next year. Uh, you can go 313 00:19:42,750 --> 00:19:46,230 S1: ahead and do that right away. And so, um, you know, 314 00:19:46,270 --> 00:19:51,350 S1: essentially what happens is you would just provide an amended return, uh, 315 00:19:51,350 --> 00:19:55,669 S1: so you can change from married filing separately to married 316 00:19:55,670 --> 00:20:00,150 S1: filing jointly. And, you know, the IRS allows you to 317 00:20:00,190 --> 00:20:03,350 S1: amend a return as soon as it's been filed and accepted. 318 00:20:03,350 --> 00:20:05,629 S1: There's no waiting period. You don't have to wait till 319 00:20:05,630 --> 00:20:09,030 S1: the next year or a refund or an IRS notice. 320 00:20:09,230 --> 00:20:11,709 S1: You can go ahead and do it right now. So 321 00:20:11,910 --> 00:20:16,030 S1: essentially that, uh, that return is called a 1040 x. 322 00:20:16,070 --> 00:20:19,550 S1: That's the most common approach. And that's an amendment. And 323 00:20:19,550 --> 00:20:22,830 S1: when you file the 1040 x you would change the 324 00:20:22,830 --> 00:20:26,490 S1: filing status to married filing jointly. And then you would 325 00:20:26,490 --> 00:20:30,890 S1: just add in your husband's full income withholding deductions, credits, 326 00:20:30,890 --> 00:20:34,610 S1: you'd both sign it and that would replace your original 327 00:20:34,609 --> 00:20:35,730 S1: separate return. 328 00:20:35,970 --> 00:20:38,970 S6: And what do I need to account for if I've 329 00:20:38,970 --> 00:20:41,650 S6: already received the refund? It came in a week. 330 00:20:42,130 --> 00:20:46,930 S1: Okay. Yeah. Um, so what you would do is, you know, 331 00:20:46,970 --> 00:20:51,490 S1: as you're filing, that doesn't change anything. That doesn't prevent 332 00:20:51,490 --> 00:20:56,490 S1: you from amending the return. Uh, the IRS will recalculate 333 00:20:56,490 --> 00:21:00,330 S1: the tax as if you'd filed jointly. And, you know, 334 00:21:00,369 --> 00:21:04,130 S1: the refund you've already received would be credited. And then 335 00:21:04,130 --> 00:21:07,129 S1: one of two things will happen. Either an additional refund 336 00:21:07,130 --> 00:21:11,330 S1: will be issued or you'll owe the difference back. Um, 337 00:21:11,730 --> 00:21:14,930 S1: there's no penalties, you know, just for fixing it. So 338 00:21:14,970 --> 00:21:18,130 S1: you'll acknowledge that refund in the return, and then they'll 339 00:21:18,130 --> 00:21:21,210 S1: figure out, you know, whether anything's owed. What you may 340 00:21:21,210 --> 00:21:23,450 S1: find is and a lot of people are finding this 341 00:21:23,650 --> 00:21:26,800 S1: certainly for 2025 is you might get more back and 342 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,640 S1: then they'll just send you the difference. Okay. 343 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:31,040 S6: Thank you so much. 344 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:35,840 S1: All right. Thanks for your call today. 800 525 7000. Again, 345 00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:41,359 S1: that number 800 525 7000. This is faith and finance live. 346 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,240 S1: Can't wait to hear from you with your financial questions. 347 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:47,920 S1: We'll tackle those. Plus Jerry Boyer in our final segment 348 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:51,360 S1: Dow 50,000 today. We'll get Jerry's take on that. Stay 349 00:21:51,359 --> 00:22:04,440 S1: with us. Great to have you with us today on 350 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:06,719 S1: Faith and Finance Live. Coming up in our final segment, 351 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,960 S1: Jerry Boyer stops by the market red hot today as 352 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,600 S1: the tech sector came roaring back. That resulted in the 353 00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:17,000 S1: Dow Jones being up nearly 2.5%. But we crossed a 354 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:21,840 S1: pretty significant threshold today. Dow 50,000. That's right. The Dow 30. 355 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:25,700 S1: That index crossed 50,000 for the very first time. We'll 356 00:22:25,700 --> 00:22:28,899 S1: get Jerry's take on whether there's an AI bubble. That's 357 00:22:28,900 --> 00:22:32,139 S1: what was causing the tech sector to sell off the 358 00:22:32,140 --> 00:22:34,820 S1: last week or so. We're also seeing a pretty big 359 00:22:34,820 --> 00:22:39,100 S1: rout in Bitcoin. It was slashed in half. We'll find 360 00:22:39,100 --> 00:22:43,060 S1: out what's behind the. The crypto's what some are calling 361 00:22:43,100 --> 00:22:47,260 S1: an existential crisis. We'll get Jerry's take on that as well. 362 00:22:47,540 --> 00:22:51,659 S1: Also taking your phone calls today 800 525 7000. You 363 00:22:51,660 --> 00:22:56,180 S1: can call right now. Let's go to, uh, Garfield Heights, Ohio. Rebecca. 364 00:22:56,180 --> 00:22:56,740 S1: Go ahead. 365 00:22:57,540 --> 00:23:02,300 S7: Uh, my question is, what percentage of our Social Security 366 00:23:02,300 --> 00:23:04,140 S7: benefits are taxable? 367 00:23:04,700 --> 00:23:09,140 S1: Hmm. Yeah, it's a good question. It depends on, um, 368 00:23:09,140 --> 00:23:15,020 S1: what is considered to be, uh, your total combined income. Um, 369 00:23:15,020 --> 00:23:18,979 S1: so here's how that works. Uh, the IRS uses a 370 00:23:18,980 --> 00:23:25,040 S1: measure called provisional income, And that is your adjusted gross income. 371 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:27,879 S1: And I'll define that in a second. Plus any tax 372 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:31,560 S1: exempt interest. Most people don't have that plus half of 373 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:36,720 S1: your Social Security benefits. And that determines your provisional income. 374 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:41,640 S1: So your adjusted gross income, uh, you know, is basically 375 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:48,040 S1: most income. You receive wages, salaries, self-employment income, interest dividends, 376 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:52,320 S1: retirement income. If you take an IRA withdrawal, things like that, 377 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:56,399 S1: you put all that together and then you subtract any, 378 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:00,360 S1: you know, health savings accounts or anything that you know 379 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:05,679 S1: is deductible. And that's your adjusted gross income. You add 380 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:10,520 S1: that income to half of your Social Security benefits, and 381 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:15,280 S1: that's your income threshold. And when that goes above, uh, 382 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:21,460 S1: you know, for married filing jointly above 32,000, then up 383 00:24:21,460 --> 00:24:24,820 S1: to half of your Social Security would be taxable. And 384 00:24:24,820 --> 00:24:28,780 S1: if it goes above 44,000, then 85% of your benefits 385 00:24:28,780 --> 00:24:31,659 S1: is taxable. So let's work through this together because I 386 00:24:31,660 --> 00:24:34,420 S1: know there's a lot of information there. Do you receive 387 00:24:34,420 --> 00:24:38,420 S1: any kind of income right now other than Social Security? 388 00:24:39,060 --> 00:24:39,700 S7: No. 389 00:24:40,180 --> 00:24:44,060 S1: Okay. Did you take any withdrawals from a retirement account 390 00:24:44,060 --> 00:24:45,180 S1: that was taxable? 391 00:24:46,100 --> 00:24:47,780 S7: Uh, no. 392 00:24:48,260 --> 00:24:52,980 S1: Okay. Any, uh, interest or dividends that was taxable of 393 00:24:52,980 --> 00:24:54,100 S1: any significance? 394 00:24:54,700 --> 00:24:55,420 S7: Yes. 395 00:24:56,060 --> 00:24:58,460 S1: I mean, how much? You know, not a whole lot. 396 00:24:58,820 --> 00:25:01,179 S7: No, not a whole lot. 1400. 397 00:25:01,619 --> 00:25:05,580 S1: Okay. And then any other, you know, income to speak 398 00:25:05,580 --> 00:25:08,820 S1: of that you can think of rental income or self-employment income, 399 00:25:08,820 --> 00:25:09,820 S1: anything like that. 400 00:25:10,100 --> 00:25:11,740 S7: Gambling income. 401 00:25:12,100 --> 00:25:15,380 S1: Okay. Uh, well, that's a whole nother topic. For another, 402 00:25:15,460 --> 00:25:17,659 S1: I've got a radio program for you to listen to 403 00:25:17,700 --> 00:25:21,880 S1: that I did recently on on Gambling. Um, but how 404 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:23,000 S1: much did you have there? 405 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,240 S7: Uh, I think about six grand. 406 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:29,199 S1: Okay. Uh, and then how much did you bring in 407 00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:30,440 S1: from Social Security? 408 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:37,639 S7: Uh, I'm not sure I didn't add. It's usually about 409 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,560 S7: 32,000 somewhere with mine and my husband. 410 00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:44,720 S1: Okay. All right. Yeah. So you're in pretty good shape. 411 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:48,040 S1: It seems like that you're going to be below that threshold, 412 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,080 S1: which just simply means because you don't really have any 413 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,760 S1: other income to speak of other than Social Security. When 414 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:58,480 S1: that's the case, it is not taxable. Um, so you'd 415 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,000 S1: have to get, um, you know, if, if half of 416 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,440 S1: your Social Security. So you add up all the Social 417 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,040 S1: Security benefit you got all that your husband got, cut 418 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:11,000 S1: that in half and then add that 6000 to it. 419 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:15,680 S1: If that's less than 32,000, you pay no tax on 420 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:18,619 S1: Social Security. Does that make sense? Turn down the radio 421 00:26:18,619 --> 00:26:21,780 S1: and listen. Just listen to me. Hear through the phone. Um, 422 00:26:22,180 --> 00:26:24,980 S1: but if half of your Social Security plus any other 423 00:26:24,980 --> 00:26:28,260 S1: income is less than 32,000, you don't pay any tax. 424 00:26:28,619 --> 00:26:32,700 S7: Okay, so one half of the Social Security plus the rest. Well, 425 00:26:32,900 --> 00:26:36,980 S7: it'll be more because, uh, my husband gets a pension. 426 00:26:37,900 --> 00:26:40,659 S1: Okay. Yeah. So that's important. Yeah. Because it's both of 427 00:26:40,660 --> 00:26:44,379 S1: your incomes together. So when it goes above when if 428 00:26:44,380 --> 00:26:48,380 S1: it was between 32,000 and 44,000 and again, that's half 429 00:26:48,420 --> 00:26:52,720 S1: your Social Security plus other income. If it's between 32 430 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:56,260 S1: and 44, then half of your benefits will be taxable. 431 00:26:56,380 --> 00:26:59,820 S1: It doesn't mean 50% is is going to have to 432 00:26:59,820 --> 00:27:02,459 S1: be paid in taxes. It just means that half of 433 00:27:02,460 --> 00:27:05,619 S1: the Social Security gets added to your taxable income. And 434 00:27:05,619 --> 00:27:09,060 S1: then if you're in the 22% bracket, 22% of that 435 00:27:09,060 --> 00:27:11,380 S1: income would have to be paid as tax. If that 436 00:27:11,380 --> 00:27:16,560 S1: number goes above 44,000, half your benefits plus your other income, 437 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,760 S1: then 85% of your Social Security is taxable. So it 438 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:22,840 S1: sounds like you ought to get with a CPA and 439 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,280 S1: just kind of run the numbers, because between his pension 440 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,399 S1: and the other income you described and half your benefits, 441 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,680 S1: you're probably going to end up paying somewhere between 50 442 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:36,800 S1: or as much as 85% of your Social Security will 443 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,280 S1: be added to your taxable income, and then you'll pay 444 00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:43,359 S1: your marginal rate on that portion. So I hope that helps. Rebecca. 445 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:44,960 S1: I think at the end of the day, I'd probably 446 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:48,040 S1: get with a CPA and just make sure you are 447 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,400 S1: paying the appropriate amount, because the last thing you'd want 448 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,440 S1: is for somebody, you know, the IRS to come back 449 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:54,359 S1: and say, you didn't pay us enough and now you 450 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,320 S1: got penalties and fees. Thanks for your call today. Let's 451 00:27:57,320 --> 00:27:59,000 S1: go to Georgia. Hi, Tripp. Go ahead. 452 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:01,320 S8: Hey, rod. How are you? 453 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:02,639 S1: I'm great. Thank you. 454 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,040 S8: Uh, quick question. So I went to file my taxes 455 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:11,919 S8: and my initial return got rejected. Um, saying that I 456 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:16,389 S8: needed to add a 1095 to it for marketplace insurance. 457 00:28:16,590 --> 00:28:20,030 S8: I do not carry marketplace insurance. So is there a 458 00:28:20,030 --> 00:28:23,710 S8: way to get the 1095 took off? Is there a 459 00:28:23,750 --> 00:28:25,510 S8: particular form that I can file? 460 00:28:26,710 --> 00:28:29,350 S1: Uh, that's a good question. I mean, that's that's not 461 00:28:29,350 --> 00:28:34,710 S1: a typical situation. Um, but it doesn't necessarily mean you 462 00:28:34,710 --> 00:28:38,070 S1: did anything wrong. Uh, does that have to do with 463 00:28:38,070 --> 00:28:39,590 S1: the Affordable Care Act? 464 00:28:40,710 --> 00:28:41,430 S8: Yes. 465 00:28:41,670 --> 00:28:47,870 S1: Yeah. Uh, so so the the marketplace insurance, um, the 466 00:28:47,870 --> 00:28:51,830 S1: 1095 a I'm just looking at this here, uh, is 467 00:28:51,830 --> 00:28:55,510 S1: only if you bought insurance on healthcare.gov, but you're saying 468 00:28:55,510 --> 00:28:58,150 S1: you did not know. 469 00:28:58,150 --> 00:29:03,590 S8: And I have reached out to healthcare.gov and they have filed, uh, 470 00:29:03,590 --> 00:29:06,630 S8: I guess, like, two tickets to get that took off. 471 00:29:07,110 --> 00:29:07,630 S1: Okay. 472 00:29:07,670 --> 00:29:09,230 S8: Um, but I don't know if they're going to send 473 00:29:09,230 --> 00:29:12,530 S8: me another 1095, So I didn't know if there was 474 00:29:12,570 --> 00:29:15,530 S8: a special tax form I could file, you know, to 475 00:29:15,570 --> 00:29:18,450 S8: maybe get that took off because it initially looked like 476 00:29:18,450 --> 00:29:23,050 S8: I would get a refund. And with that, 1095 added, it's, 477 00:29:23,250 --> 00:29:25,010 S8: you know, going to be owing a lot. 478 00:29:25,330 --> 00:29:27,570 S1: Yeah. So what I would do is go back in. 479 00:29:27,610 --> 00:29:29,810 S1: So you did this yourself in tax software. 480 00:29:30,890 --> 00:29:31,450 S8: Yes. 481 00:29:31,810 --> 00:29:35,090 S1: Okay. So I'd go back into that software and just 482 00:29:35,090 --> 00:29:39,810 S1: find the Health Insurance Affordable Care Act section and just 483 00:29:39,810 --> 00:29:42,570 S1: make sure you clearly answered, you know, did you have 484 00:29:42,570 --> 00:29:47,690 S1: marketplace insurance. No. And then that should remove the placeholder 485 00:29:47,690 --> 00:29:50,850 S1: for the 1095 A. And then you could resubmit the return. 486 00:29:51,170 --> 00:29:52,810 S8: Okay. Thank you so much. 487 00:29:53,050 --> 00:29:54,930 S1: All right. We appreciate your call. Thanks for being on 488 00:29:54,930 --> 00:29:58,690 S1: the show today. 800 525 7000. We're going to take 489 00:29:58,690 --> 00:30:01,810 S1: a quick break. When we come back, Jerry Bowyer will 490 00:30:01,810 --> 00:30:05,730 S1: be here. We'll get Jerry's take on the markets. Plus, 491 00:30:05,850 --> 00:30:09,010 S1: you know, Jerry and his team are active, uh, engaging 492 00:30:09,010 --> 00:30:11,790 S1: with the biggest companies in the world. We'll we'll get 493 00:30:11,790 --> 00:30:13,950 S1: an update on what Jerry's been working on in the 494 00:30:13,950 --> 00:30:17,390 S1: area of corporate engagement. You know, it's pretty exciting these 495 00:30:17,430 --> 00:30:19,710 S1: I don't know whether it's a culture shift or what, 496 00:30:19,750 --> 00:30:24,110 S1: but these, uh, these major companies that were getting distracted 497 00:30:24,110 --> 00:30:26,590 S1: from their core business and kind of getting off into 498 00:30:26,590 --> 00:30:29,870 S1: political issues that they had no business being in, they're 499 00:30:29,870 --> 00:30:33,710 S1: recognizing the error of their ways. They're listening to, uh, 500 00:30:33,710 --> 00:30:38,150 S1: the the thoughts and perspectives of, uh, the faith community 501 00:30:38,190 --> 00:30:41,510 S1: who are their shareholders. And they're making some changes. And 502 00:30:41,550 --> 00:30:43,590 S1: Jerry Bowyer is right on the front edge of that. 503 00:30:43,630 --> 00:30:45,910 S1: More on faith and finance. Live just around the corner. 504 00:30:45,910 --> 00:30:56,110 S1: Stay with us. Hey, great to have you with us 505 00:30:56,110 --> 00:30:58,790 S1: today on Faith and Finance Live. I'm Rob West. Jerry 506 00:30:58,790 --> 00:31:02,230 S1: Boyer's here. It's the final segment on a Friday. And Jerry, 507 00:31:02,230 --> 00:31:04,430 S1: we'll talk about corporate engagement here in a moment. But 508 00:31:04,430 --> 00:31:08,250 S1: first Dow 50,000. Who would have thought, huh? 509 00:31:08,610 --> 00:31:13,890 S9: Yeah. Well, um, it's kind of amazing. Uh, I mean, 510 00:31:14,090 --> 00:31:16,090 S9: earlier in the week, it wouldn't have looked that way, right? 511 00:31:16,130 --> 00:31:19,610 S9: There was some stumbling with the with the AI, um, firms, 512 00:31:19,610 --> 00:31:22,250 S9: and it's more that they're trying. They're like, competing with 513 00:31:22,250 --> 00:31:24,050 S9: one another. We're now starting to get a sense of. 514 00:31:24,050 --> 00:31:27,610 S9: Wait a minute. They can't all win. Uh, not everyone 515 00:31:27,610 --> 00:31:31,010 S9: can win. Um, this is something I learned from from 516 00:31:31,010 --> 00:31:33,730 S9: Rob Arnott that when you're looking at he was talking 517 00:31:33,730 --> 00:31:36,370 S9: about electric cars, you have to, like, add up all 518 00:31:36,410 --> 00:31:39,770 S9: of the valuations of everybody who's in the business and say, 519 00:31:40,090 --> 00:31:42,730 S9: can they all, can they all are they all justified 520 00:31:42,730 --> 00:31:46,010 S9: when you aggregate them together? Because if they're not, then 521 00:31:46,010 --> 00:31:48,010 S9: some of them are going to eat the others. Right. 522 00:31:48,050 --> 00:31:51,690 S9: And so anthropic come out, um, you know, with a 523 00:31:51,690 --> 00:31:54,930 S9: new version of Claude, which is doing a whole lot 524 00:31:54,970 --> 00:31:57,930 S9: of things that like Salesforce does. Right? 525 00:31:57,970 --> 00:31:58,730 S1: Right, right. 526 00:31:58,770 --> 00:32:00,810 S9: It's something you and I have talked about when we've talked, 527 00:32:00,810 --> 00:32:04,730 S9: when people were like, super, uh, you know, kind of 528 00:32:04,730 --> 00:32:08,830 S9: crazy optimistic, um, say about AI, you know, is there 529 00:32:08,830 --> 00:32:11,470 S9: any doubt they were ignoring the downside? There's a huge 530 00:32:11,470 --> 00:32:15,150 S9: amount of upside, but the downside is it only works 531 00:32:15,390 --> 00:32:18,550 S9: if somebody else loses market share. In other words, this 532 00:32:18,550 --> 00:32:21,510 S9: is a disruption. This is a new way of doing business. 533 00:32:21,670 --> 00:32:24,870 S9: And it will clearly it's going to create value. But 534 00:32:24,870 --> 00:32:26,790 S9: one of the things that creates this value is to 535 00:32:26,830 --> 00:32:31,310 S9: replace other systems that are not AI driven. Uh, and 536 00:32:31,350 --> 00:32:33,230 S9: of course, the first victims are people who work in 537 00:32:33,230 --> 00:32:36,550 S9: call centers and support lines or whatever. They're not hiring. Right. 538 00:32:36,590 --> 00:32:42,390 S9: But then it's other, you know, software service groups, the Salesforces, etc., uh, 539 00:32:42,390 --> 00:32:47,190 S9: who are selling services, which now maybe it's not just software, 540 00:32:47,190 --> 00:32:51,590 S9: it's AI, um, that's running that. Um, so it has 541 00:32:51,590 --> 00:32:56,670 S9: to to some degree, these new technologies have to their 542 00:32:56,670 --> 00:33:01,670 S9: growth premise is taking away somebody else's market share. So 543 00:33:01,670 --> 00:33:04,890 S9: somebody has to get hurt. And this week we figured 544 00:33:04,890 --> 00:33:08,130 S9: out with the new anthropic release that, oh, we've got 545 00:33:08,130 --> 00:33:10,250 S9: some idea who's going to get hurt, who's going to 546 00:33:10,250 --> 00:33:14,210 S9: get hurt, other software providers who are not as AI enabled. 547 00:33:14,450 --> 00:33:18,130 S9: So I think that's remember Vinny Caravella and I, you know, 548 00:33:18,170 --> 00:33:22,489 S9: at your at your quarterly conference call a couple of 549 00:33:22,490 --> 00:33:27,570 S9: weeks ago, it's a conversation about does AI eat software? 550 00:33:28,050 --> 00:33:30,530 S9: The answer is yeah it does. It does a little bit. 551 00:33:30,930 --> 00:33:34,850 S1: Yeah. And it eats developers too because it's doing a 552 00:33:34,850 --> 00:33:38,690 S1: lot of the work, uh, that developers were doing. But, 553 00:33:38,730 --> 00:33:40,850 S1: you know, that's just a change in the economy. But 554 00:33:40,850 --> 00:33:43,250 S1: just what about from a macro perspective, Jerry? I mean, 555 00:33:43,250 --> 00:33:45,730 S1: I was looking at a headline on the Journal earlier 556 00:33:45,730 --> 00:33:49,250 S1: today and it said it was it was May 1900. 557 00:33:49,250 --> 00:33:53,250 S1: So this is 125 years ago, the Dow was at 60, 558 00:33:53,490 --> 00:33:57,330 S1: and investors were fretting about the future. And it described 559 00:33:57,330 --> 00:34:02,290 S1: this long and perilous road, you know, to 50,125 years later. 560 00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:05,680 S9: Yeah, I think that we would all be a lot 561 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,880 S9: better off if we go back and read the first 562 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:11,240 S9: chapter of the book of Genesis and understand that God 563 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,640 S9: created man to fill the earth and subdue it and 564 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:17,759 S9: exercise dominion over it. Yeah. So when we were built, 565 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:22,240 S9: we were built to exercise dominion over the creation. So 566 00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,759 S9: that is the arc of history. Sometimes we'll stumble, sometimes 567 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,000 S9: we'll embrace communism. And then we're not so good at dominion. 568 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:33,040 S9: Sometimes we'll embrace fascism. And again, not so good at Dominion. Um, 569 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:36,320 S9: we'll do all sorts of foolish things. But the plan 570 00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:40,279 S9: for mankind is dominion over the creation. Sin interferes, but 571 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,960 S9: it does not erase the fact that we are extremely 572 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:48,120 S9: good at, at at exercising dominion over the earth. Because 573 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,520 S9: it's what father made us to do. Um, and it 574 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,920 S9: is a lot of dominion to take natural gas, you know, 575 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:58,360 S9: from under the earth, which is there an extremely abundant supplies. 576 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:02,100 S9: Punch a hole in the earth. Bring that natural gas out, 577 00:35:02,140 --> 00:35:05,220 S9: put it in through a turbine, turn it into electricity 578 00:35:05,420 --> 00:35:10,940 S9: and run it through little tiny squares of intricately arranged sand. 579 00:35:11,340 --> 00:35:14,740 S9: We call them computer chips and use that to produce 580 00:35:15,540 --> 00:35:22,660 S9: detailed research reports, business decisions, legal briefs, um, medical diagnoses, uh, 581 00:35:22,739 --> 00:35:27,140 S9: and every other thing that thought leadership and knowledge workers 582 00:35:27,140 --> 00:35:32,100 S9: do to turn gas from under the earth. Long dead 583 00:35:32,140 --> 00:35:37,060 S9: dinosaurs and ferns, uh, in and put them through sand 584 00:35:37,380 --> 00:35:39,980 S9: and turn it into something that looks a lot like 585 00:35:39,980 --> 00:35:43,580 S9: knowledge is a high level of dominion. And that's where 586 00:35:43,580 --> 00:35:47,219 S9: we're going. And, uh, you know, if when we were 587 00:35:47,219 --> 00:35:50,380 S9: worried 100 years ago or I guess it's 126 years ago, 588 00:35:50,580 --> 00:35:53,859 S9: it's because we didn't have sufficient faith in God's design 589 00:35:53,860 --> 00:35:57,939 S9: for you. Think about the blackboard video, um, that I 590 00:35:57,940 --> 00:36:01,280 S9: that you guys play. That's the design of mankind. And 591 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:05,040 S9: that's what's going to happen with setbacks. Yes, but it's 592 00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:06,040 S9: the arc of history. 593 00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:09,000 S1: Jerry, you and I will be in Orlando next week 594 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:13,960 S1: with 3000 of our financial advisors, friends who are believers 595 00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:16,839 S1: that are in the financial advice business, and you're going 596 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,239 S1: to be leading a breakout with your friend David Johnson 597 00:36:20,280 --> 00:36:24,960 S1: on a theological and practical critique of economic schools of thought, 598 00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:29,080 S1: which give us a little spoiler alert here, uh, which 599 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:32,279 S1: economic school of thought most closely aligns to what you 600 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:33,280 S1: just described? 601 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:37,120 S9: I think the secular one that most closely aligns to 602 00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:40,320 S9: what I would describe would be Austrian economics, because Austrian 603 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,600 S9: economics sees economics as the science of human action. So 604 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,000 S9: it's the one that puts the human person in the 605 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:49,520 S9: middle of the economy. It doesn't put the government in 606 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:53,840 S9: the middle of the economy. It doesn't put economic forces 607 00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:57,400 S9: in the middle and personal forces. It puts human actors 608 00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,180 S9: into the middle of the economy. That's half of the 609 00:37:00,180 --> 00:37:02,900 S9: book of Genesis. In the book of Genesis, the greatest 610 00:37:02,900 --> 00:37:07,780 S9: economic actor is God. The second greatest economic actor is humanity. 611 00:37:08,020 --> 00:37:13,500 S9: Austrian economics at least recognizes humanity as an important economic actor. 612 00:37:13,500 --> 00:37:17,219 S9: But and by the way, historically, it's grounded in Christian theology. 613 00:37:17,219 --> 00:37:21,379 S9: But the Austrian economists forgot that turned towards atheism, and 614 00:37:21,380 --> 00:37:24,219 S9: it lost its moral rigor. But at least they have 615 00:37:24,219 --> 00:37:27,980 S9: that part right. They don't demote man. They do demote God. 616 00:37:28,180 --> 00:37:31,020 S9: All the other economic systems, to some degree, just see 617 00:37:31,060 --> 00:37:35,420 S9: us as pleasure maximizing agents or sheep in need of 618 00:37:35,420 --> 00:37:38,060 S9: a great government shepherd to tell us what to do. 619 00:37:38,340 --> 00:37:40,420 S9: You know, as water, to be pumped. You know, our 620 00:37:40,460 --> 00:37:43,299 S9: wealth should pump from here to there. You know, pump 621 00:37:43,300 --> 00:37:45,500 S9: money from the rich and out out to the market. 622 00:37:45,500 --> 00:37:49,420 S9: So it'll raise demand. You know, it treats us as inert. 623 00:37:49,580 --> 00:37:53,379 S9: We're not important. Uh, well, we're we're really important. We 624 00:37:53,420 --> 00:37:57,239 S9: are the second most important thing in reality. But we're 625 00:37:57,239 --> 00:38:00,399 S9: not the most important thing in reality. Austrian economics gets 626 00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:03,880 S9: that we're important. It just doesn't get that we're we're we're. 627 00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:06,759 S9: What does Psalm eight say? A little lower or for 628 00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,839 S9: a little while, depending on the translation, lower than the angels. 629 00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:13,320 S1: Mhm. Yeah. Well. And when God is on the throne 630 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:16,319 S1: and not the government and not the fed and not 631 00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:21,560 S1: anybody else, and we take our proper place as caretakers 632 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,480 S1: to keep and cultivate and take God's creation and improve 633 00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,880 S1: it and order it. That results in economic expansion. Right? 634 00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:33,359 S9: It does. And that shows up maybe not perfectly, but 635 00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:37,920 S9: that shows up in markets, um, a a desperately a 636 00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:44,160 S9: spiritually unhealthy society will not long have valuable markets. Uh, 637 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,400 S9: it can for a little while. You can debase the currency, 638 00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:50,040 S9: you can have government takeover, you know, you can have 639 00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:53,160 S9: subsidies and monopolies. That doesn't work over the long run. 640 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,660 S9: You and I have talked about principle based reasoning. Right. 641 00:38:55,700 --> 00:39:00,900 S9: And and, you know, principles help drive financial wealth creation. 642 00:39:00,900 --> 00:39:03,140 S9: But there are a few principles that if you break 643 00:39:03,140 --> 00:39:05,500 S9: them in the short run, you might actually get more 644 00:39:06,219 --> 00:39:10,100 S9: wealth creation, easy money and debasing currency. Like if you pump, 645 00:39:10,140 --> 00:39:12,540 S9: you pump up debt and you pump up money supply, 646 00:39:12,580 --> 00:39:15,620 S9: you might get some short term, you know, jumps in 647 00:39:15,660 --> 00:39:17,660 S9: the market, but in the long run you get inflation 648 00:39:17,660 --> 00:39:21,860 S9: and that erodes that value. So the only long so 649 00:39:21,900 --> 00:39:27,060 S9: in the long term markets basically reflect not perfectly but 650 00:39:27,100 --> 00:39:30,420 S9: as good as anything else better than government statistics. How. 651 00:39:30,420 --> 00:39:33,340 S9: Well we're fulfilling the Dominion mandate that's given in Genesis 652 00:39:33,380 --> 00:39:34,140 S9: chapter one. 653 00:39:34,580 --> 00:39:38,259 S1: Wow. That's well said, Jerry. The other topic you'll be 654 00:39:38,260 --> 00:39:42,260 S1: speaking on is related to corporate engagement. As you describe 655 00:39:42,260 --> 00:39:45,820 S1: what's happening right now in the boardrooms of the biggest 656 00:39:45,820 --> 00:39:48,620 S1: companies in America. With regard to their response on the 657 00:39:48,620 --> 00:39:52,740 S1: part of the faith community. Uh, how would you describe it? 658 00:39:54,050 --> 00:39:58,009 S9: Book of Joshua. Fall of the Wall of Jericho. 659 00:39:58,450 --> 00:39:58,930 S1: Wow. 660 00:39:59,730 --> 00:40:01,290 S9: That's what it feels like to me right now. 661 00:40:02,010 --> 00:40:02,410 S1: Wow. 662 00:40:03,050 --> 00:40:05,009 S9: Look, I had two meetings with companies today. I won't 663 00:40:05,010 --> 00:40:07,290 S9: mention their names because it's not public. One is a 664 00:40:07,290 --> 00:40:11,529 S9: very large financial institution. They said in the past, when 665 00:40:11,530 --> 00:40:14,650 S9: our charitable match program for employees, we did not match 666 00:40:14,650 --> 00:40:17,450 S9: to religious institutions, we would match. If you give to 667 00:40:17,489 --> 00:40:20,450 S9: a secular nonprofit but not to a religious one, we're 668 00:40:20,450 --> 00:40:22,170 S9: getting rid of that. We're going to match to all 669 00:40:22,170 --> 00:40:26,810 S9: of them giant financial institution. Um, yeah. Uh, I was 670 00:40:26,810 --> 00:40:29,489 S9: late for that meeting because in a meeting before that, 671 00:40:29,489 --> 00:40:32,250 S9: another very well known brand name said, well, you know, 672 00:40:32,290 --> 00:40:34,130 S9: we have all these employee resource groups, we have a 673 00:40:34,130 --> 00:40:37,130 S9: pride group, we have an Asian Pacific Islander. We have 674 00:40:37,170 --> 00:40:41,850 S9: we have these various ethnicity groups and gender, um, no. 675 00:40:41,850 --> 00:40:43,730 S9: Faith one, we said, would you be willing to have 676 00:40:43,730 --> 00:40:46,250 S9: a faith one? And they said, yes. Uh, and I said, 677 00:40:46,250 --> 00:40:48,810 S9: would you be willing to tell your employees that you're 678 00:40:48,810 --> 00:40:51,250 S9: willing to have a faith one? And they said, yes, 679 00:40:51,630 --> 00:40:54,950 S9: that's today. That's just today. There was there was a 680 00:40:54,950 --> 00:40:56,989 S9: meeting like that yesterday. There was a meeting like that 681 00:40:56,989 --> 00:40:59,830 S9: the day before. There's this is happening 3 or 4 682 00:40:59,830 --> 00:41:03,270 S9: times a week. Um, it's happening it's not. Other than 683 00:41:03,270 --> 00:41:05,109 S9: your show. I'm not doing any media on this. This 684 00:41:05,110 --> 00:41:09,790 S9: is a story that nobody's covering because we're too busy 685 00:41:09,830 --> 00:41:14,270 S9: accepting this. This the gift of Providence and companies kind 686 00:41:14,270 --> 00:41:17,270 S9: of coming back to neutral. Then we have time to 687 00:41:17,270 --> 00:41:19,390 S9: go out and do media about it, uh, you know, 688 00:41:19,469 --> 00:41:21,150 S9: or brag about it. And maybe it's not for us 689 00:41:21,150 --> 00:41:24,470 S9: to brag about anyway, because it's bigger than us by far. 690 00:41:24,590 --> 00:41:28,830 S9: But something's happening in America right now. And there had 691 00:41:28,830 --> 00:41:32,510 S9: been like a wall where there was just an automatic 692 00:41:32,670 --> 00:41:38,070 S9: secular viewpoint, an automatic. Well, we can't have Christian ERGs because, 693 00:41:38,350 --> 00:41:40,270 S9: you know, there's religious wars in the Middle East, and 694 00:41:40,270 --> 00:41:42,149 S9: these are religious people don't get along with each other. 695 00:41:42,190 --> 00:41:46,069 S9: It's like no religious ergs get along with each other 696 00:41:46,070 --> 00:41:48,990 S9: just fine. Employee resource groups, let me tell you, the 697 00:41:49,030 --> 00:41:51,930 S9: Muslim Employee Resource group is not throwing bombs at the 698 00:41:51,930 --> 00:41:55,290 S9: Jewish Employee Resource Group across the cubicle wall. They love 699 00:41:55,290 --> 00:41:58,209 S9: each other. They're getting along because they get that as 700 00:41:58,210 --> 00:42:01,130 S9: religious people in a secular environment, they're kind of in 701 00:42:01,130 --> 00:42:03,850 S9: it together. And now the company is nowadays. Oh yeah, 702 00:42:03,850 --> 00:42:06,489 S9: we see that. Okay. Sure. We'll have a we'll have 703 00:42:06,489 --> 00:42:10,170 S9: faith based employee resource groups. Now people can be reasoned with. 704 00:42:10,570 --> 00:42:14,009 S1: Yes. Incredible. Jerry. Well, we'll leave it there and we'll 705 00:42:14,010 --> 00:42:16,370 S1: celebrate that and take that with us into the weekend. 706 00:42:16,370 --> 00:42:18,450 S1: Thanks for your time today, my friend. Great stuff. 707 00:42:18,530 --> 00:42:19,730 S10: And for yours. God bless. 708 00:42:19,730 --> 00:42:22,609 S1: All right. That's Jerry Bowyer. He's our resident economist. He 709 00:42:22,610 --> 00:42:25,210 S1: joins us each Friday in this segment. All right. That's 710 00:42:25,210 --> 00:42:27,250 S1: going to do it for us. Another great week here 711 00:42:27,250 --> 00:42:29,330 S1: on faith and finance. What a treat to have you 712 00:42:29,330 --> 00:42:31,810 S1: along with us. Thanks for joining us for calling with 713 00:42:31,810 --> 00:42:34,650 S1: your questions for listening. Listen, I couldn't do this without 714 00:42:34,650 --> 00:42:39,250 S1: my amazing team today. Taylor, Tyra, Josh, Brandon, Dan, and 715 00:42:39,250 --> 00:42:41,690 S1: everybody here at Faith by Faith at Finance Live is 716 00:42:41,690 --> 00:42:44,089 S1: a partnership between Moody Radio and Faith five. We'll see 717 00:42:44,090 --> 00:42:45,490 S1: you next time. Bye bye.