WEBVTT - Persecution Database 0:00:08.190 --> 0:00:11.280 Christians throughout the Middle East are persecuted for their faith. 0:00:11.280 --> 0:00:14.550 But now, for the first time, a Christian organization is 0:00:14.550 --> 0:00:17.640 tracking all of it with a database. What does that 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:21.120 mean for our persecuted brothers and sisters? How can average 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:24.120 people like you and me use it to raise awareness? 0:00:24.150 --> 0:00:27.030 That's our focus this week. Welcome to the land in 0:00:27.030 --> 0:00:29.100 the book, where we're about to give you an update 0:00:29.100 --> 0:00:31.680 on all the top headlines from the Middle East. Our 0:00:31.680 --> 0:00:35.100 host is noted Israel scholar Doctor Charlie Dyer, and I'm 0:00:35.100 --> 0:00:37.860 John Yeager, along with our wives. We have just returned 0:00:37.860 --> 0:00:40.890 from Israel. Charlie, what an experience to meet with folks 0:00:40.890 --> 0:00:43.350 who have gone through so much and hear all those 0:00:43.350 --> 0:00:44.760 firsthand accounts. 0:00:44.790 --> 0:00:48.540 I agree, John, it's a sobering experience, but also encouraging 0:00:48.540 --> 0:00:51.599 to see what Israel has been doing and where things 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:53.250 seem to be going for the future. 0:00:53.370 --> 0:00:56.040 Well, speaking of the future, those many conversations that we 0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:58.470 recorded are going to be part of an upcoming one 0:00:58.470 --> 0:01:02.070 hour special. You'll hear more about. All right. Passover will 0:01:02.070 --> 0:01:04.320 soon be upon us, and one of the traditional Passover 0:01:04.319 --> 0:01:08.070 questions is, what makes this night different from all others? 0:01:08.190 --> 0:01:11.730 Passover is an important biblical holiday that has great meaning 0:01:11.730 --> 0:01:15.090 for both Jewish people and believers in Jesus. So I 0:01:15.090 --> 0:01:17.190 think this is an important question to ask Charlie. 0:01:17.190 --> 0:01:18.959 It is John, and if you want to learn more 0:01:18.959 --> 0:01:21.690 about what makes Passover so special, well, our friends at 0:01:21.690 --> 0:01:24.360 Life and Messiah are offering to mail you a free 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:27.839 copy of their Messianic Passover Haggadah. The booklet will lead 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:30.209 you through the celebration of Passover to see the rich 0:01:30.209 --> 0:01:33.750 connections to Jesus, our Messiah, and to the Last Supper. 0:01:33.750 --> 0:01:36.690 You'll also receive a link for an interactive Passover Seder 0:01:36.690 --> 0:01:40.290 video with the Haggadah and video. You can celebrate Passover 0:01:40.290 --> 0:01:42.869 this year with your family and friends. Now to get 0:01:42.870 --> 0:01:46.620 this free offer, just go to Life in Messiah org 0:01:46.620 --> 0:01:48.990 and click on the Moody Radio button to find out 0:01:48.990 --> 0:01:53.820 more and request your copy. That's life in messiah.org. 0:01:54.060 --> 0:01:56.610 And now a look at current events stories based in 0:01:56.610 --> 0:01:59.309 the Middle East that have been unfolding all week long. 0:01:59.310 --> 0:02:02.160 This coming week is the start of Ramadan, which often 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:06.150 signals a time of heightened tension between Israel and the Palestinians. 0:02:06.150 --> 0:02:09.240 What can Israel do to help calm the situation? 0:02:09.240 --> 0:02:10.890 You know, if you listen to most of the world, 0:02:10.889 --> 0:02:12.990 they would say, all Israel needs to do is end 0:02:12.990 --> 0:02:15.779 the war with Hamas, get out of Gaza, lower tensions 0:02:15.780 --> 0:02:19.680 with Hezbollah. And that would calm everything. Sadly, that's not 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:23.220 supported by recent history. There have been conflicts at Ramadan, 0:02:23.220 --> 0:02:27.330 long before the current war in Gaza. In 2021, an 0:02:27.330 --> 0:02:30.660 11 day conflict between Israel and Hamas broke out over 0:02:30.660 --> 0:02:33.810 an Israeli raid on the Temple Mount following a disturbance 0:02:33.810 --> 0:02:37.889 up there during Ramadan in 2023. Just a year ago, 0:02:37.889 --> 0:02:42.210 Ramadan coincided with Passover and there were conflicts on successive 0:02:42.210 --> 0:02:45.090 days as stones were thrown from the Temple Mount down 0:02:45.090 --> 0:02:48.690 on the Western Wall Plaza where Jews had gathered to pray. 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:53.370 There's always tension during Ramadan, especially following Friday prayers. So 0:02:53.370 --> 0:02:57.150 what can Israel do to help de-escalate the situation? Well, 0:02:57.150 --> 0:03:00.840 two approaches have been suggested, and they're mutually exclusive. The 0:03:00.840 --> 0:03:04.020 first is that of the national security minister Ben-Gvir, who 0:03:04.020 --> 0:03:08.520 suggested limiting Arab-Israeli access to the site to worshippers over 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:11.670 the age of 70. The other approach, proposed by the 0:03:11.669 --> 0:03:15.149 head of Israel's security services is to not limit access 0:03:15.150 --> 0:03:18.000 to the site. He believes limiting access will turn the 0:03:18.000 --> 0:03:21.480 Gaza war into a Jewish Muslim fight, rather than an 0:03:21.480 --> 0:03:24.660 Israeli Hamas conflict. And that just plays into the hands 0:03:24.660 --> 0:03:28.500 of Hamas. Prime Minister Netanyahu asked different cabinet members to 0:03:28.500 --> 0:03:33.300 provide options for age criteria or other quotas for Israeli citizens. 0:03:33.300 --> 0:03:36.150 The real problem is that Ramadan and the Temple Mount 0:03:36.150 --> 0:03:40.230 are religious issues. It's no accident that Hamas named their 0:03:40.230 --> 0:03:44.790 October 7th attack the Al-Aqsa flood, a recent UN report 0:03:44.790 --> 0:03:49.020 said al-Qaida is changing its messaging since October 7th to 0:03:49.020 --> 0:03:52.500 focus on the so-called sanctity of the Al-Aqsa mosque as 0:03:52.500 --> 0:03:55.830 a way to help restore its credibility. Watch for Israel 0:03:55.830 --> 0:03:57.480 to look for a way to limit the size of 0:03:57.480 --> 0:04:00.990 the crowds, especially young males, while still trying to maintain 0:04:00.990 --> 0:04:04.410 a low profile. Also watch to see what they can 0:04:04.410 --> 0:04:07.410 do to restrain the more extreme right wing Jewish element. 0:04:07.410 --> 0:04:09.540 Who would like to use the time to push for 0:04:09.540 --> 0:04:13.650 greater Israeli control over the area. This next month will 0:04:13.650 --> 0:04:16.409 be a sensitive time. Just pray that the leadership there 0:04:16.410 --> 0:04:19.770 has great wisdom and that cooler heads prevail. 0:04:19.770 --> 0:04:23.520 Well, speaking of the Temple Mount, a recent archaeological discovery 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:27.179 hints at a Christian presence at the site prior to 0:04:27.180 --> 0:04:28.890 the building of the dome of the Rock and the 0:04:28.890 --> 0:04:31.619 Al-Aqsa mosque. Tell us about this discovery. 0:04:31.620 --> 0:04:35.700 Yeah, this is fascinating. It's somewhat unexpected. Find most assume 0:04:35.700 --> 0:04:39.480 the Temple Mount remained an unoccupied ruin between its destruction 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:42.150 by the Romans in AD 70 and the building of 0:04:42.150 --> 0:04:44.850 the dome of the Rock and Al-Aqsa mosque about 600 0:04:44.850 --> 0:04:49.830 years later. But two recently discovered Byzantine era weights suggest 0:04:49.830 --> 0:04:52.920 there was a Christian presence on the Temple Mount sometime 0:04:52.920 --> 0:04:56.520 during that period. The Temple Mount Sifting Project, which for 0:04:56.520 --> 0:05:00.000 the past 20 years has been sifting dirt discarded from 0:05:00.000 --> 0:05:02.880 the Mount when the Muslims built an underground mosque, are 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:06.240 the ones who made this discovery. The two small objects 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:10.020 each way. Just. Two hundredths of an ounce. That's half 0:05:10.020 --> 0:05:13.589 the weight of a paperclip. So these are small discoveries. 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:16.770 One was made of glass, the other was made of brass. 0:05:17.100 --> 0:05:20.339 They're likely official imperial weights that were required to be 0:05:20.339 --> 0:05:24.750 present in major churches. These and other objects discovered suggest 0:05:24.750 --> 0:05:28.680 a Byzantine church might have stood on the site prior 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:32.100 to the Islamic invasion. Now, since no excavation is allowed 0:05:32.100 --> 0:05:35.100 up on the site, we can't know for sure. But 0:05:35.100 --> 0:05:39.479 this fine, small as it is, does raise that intriguing possibility. 0:05:39.510 --> 0:05:42.300 If you're joining us mid-stream, This is the Land and 0:05:42.300 --> 0:05:45.420 the book from Moody Radio, a one hour flyover of 0:05:45.420 --> 0:05:47.700 the Middle East. In this opening segment, our host, Doctor 0:05:47.700 --> 0:05:51.089 Charlie Dyer, noted Israel scholar and author, works us through 0:05:51.089 --> 0:05:54.540 a list of current events stories. I'm John Jaeger and Charlie. 0:05:54.540 --> 0:05:59.040 Egypt is struggling financially, and apparently they're selling off historical 0:05:59.040 --> 0:06:03.180 assets to generate cash as they plunge ever deeper into debt. 0:06:03.180 --> 0:06:06.420 What's been happening and why is it so concerning? 0:06:06.450 --> 0:06:11.160 Well, Egypt has been experiencing rising inflation. They've taken austerity 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.130 measures to help combat the problem. But the impact on 0:06:14.130 --> 0:06:17.100 the day to day lives of most Egyptians has been 0:06:17.100 --> 0:06:21.270 very difficult. The country is now the second largest detonation 0:06:21.270 --> 0:06:25.169 to the International Monetary Fund to generate cash. Egypt has 0:06:25.170 --> 0:06:28.650 been selling off some of its most significant properties, especially 0:06:28.650 --> 0:06:32.190 its grandest hotels. The Menna House hotel is one of 0:06:32.190 --> 0:06:35.580 the properties that's been sold. It sits by the pyramids. 0:06:35.580 --> 0:06:39.510 It's hosted guests like Winston Churchill. It's an incredible property. 0:06:39.660 --> 0:06:43.320 Another hotel is the old Cataract Hotel in Aswan. I've 0:06:43.320 --> 0:06:45.750 stayed there, John. It's one of the most luxurious hotels 0:06:45.750 --> 0:06:49.049 I've ever seen. A concerning part of these sales is 0:06:49.050 --> 0:06:53.010 that once the funds have been spent, the assets are gone. 0:06:53.010 --> 0:06:55.919 Now all isn't doom and gloom for Egypt. There are 0:06:55.920 --> 0:06:59.520 some positive investments being made in the country. Recently, the 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:03.090 United Arab Emirates unveiled a major energy pipeline project to 0:07:03.089 --> 0:07:06.810 link Egypt to Europe and generate income for Egypt and 0:07:06.810 --> 0:07:10.470 a group of Turkish investors are entering the Egyptian spinning, 0:07:10.470 --> 0:07:13.770 weaving and clothing sector to take advantage of Egypt's low 0:07:13.770 --> 0:07:18.270 cost labor. They hope to provide 70,000 direct jobs and 0:07:18.270 --> 0:07:23.250 an additional 100,000 indirect jobs, which would help the Egyptian economy. 0:07:23.250 --> 0:07:27.090 Egypt also signed a multibillion dollar deal with Gulf state 0:07:27.090 --> 0:07:29.910 investors to build a state of the art city west 0:07:29.910 --> 0:07:34.530 of Alexandria. Construction would pump billions into the economy immediately, 0:07:34.530 --> 0:07:37.320 with the hope that the new city will then attract 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:41.820 business investment and tourism once it's completed. The real question 0:07:41.820 --> 0:07:44.640 now is if Egypt can get some of these projects 0:07:44.640 --> 0:07:47.700 up and running before the country runs out of cash 0:07:47.700 --> 0:07:50.580 or things to sell to keep its economy afloat? 0:07:50.580 --> 0:07:54.240 Wow, that's an interesting conundrum there, for sure. Egypt's economy 0:07:54.240 --> 0:07:58.020 might be struggling, but archaeologists there continue to strike it 0:07:58.020 --> 0:08:01.320 rich in their search for historical treasures. What's the latest 0:08:01.320 --> 0:08:03.660 on the discovery of a tunnel that might lead to 0:08:03.660 --> 0:08:07.410 the tomb of Queen Cleopatra? I'm really intrigued here, Charlie. 0:08:07.410 --> 0:08:10.500 I am to John and this story is intriguing as 0:08:10.500 --> 0:08:12.750 it is left me, though, with just a little bit 0:08:12.750 --> 0:08:14.670 of a taste for more at the end, I'll explain 0:08:14.670 --> 0:08:16.290 why here in a second. You know, it's just when 0:08:16.290 --> 0:08:20.340 you think most major archaeological finds have been made that 0:08:20.340 --> 0:08:23.310 a report like this comes along. An archaeologist from the 0:08:23.310 --> 0:08:27.180 Dominican Republic excavating in Egypt has come across a tunnel. 0:08:27.180 --> 0:08:31.320 It's over 40ft underground now, the tunnels carved into sandstone, 0:08:31.320 --> 0:08:34.319 and it's actually over three quarters of a mile long. 0:08:34.320 --> 0:08:37.230 The purpose of the tunnel, it's not yet known, and 0:08:37.230 --> 0:08:39.929 part of it is still submerged in water because it's 0:08:39.929 --> 0:08:42.990 right up north near the Mediterranean. It was discovered in 0:08:42.990 --> 0:08:46.800 connection with a temple dedicated to Osiris, the god of death. 0:08:46.800 --> 0:08:51.420 Cleopatra tried to identify herself with ISIS, the mythological sister 0:08:51.420 --> 0:08:55.530 and wife of Osiris. Sculptures of ISIS, along with coins 0:08:55.530 --> 0:08:59.580 depicting the names and likeness of Cleopatra and Alexander the Great, 0:08:59.580 --> 0:09:02.610 have been found at the site. Now it's located west 0:09:02.610 --> 0:09:05.970 of Alexandria, right by the Mediterranean Sea, as I mentioned. 0:09:05.970 --> 0:09:08.309 But the questions that still need to be answered and 0:09:08.309 --> 0:09:11.160 that weren't answered so far in this article. Why was 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:14.850 the tunnel built? Where does it lead? And is it 0:09:14.850 --> 0:09:19.710 connected somehow to the still undiscovered tomb of Cleopatra? Now, 0:09:19.710 --> 0:09:22.710 having raised the issues, they didn't provide the answers that 0:09:22.710 --> 0:09:26.010 I was looking for, but hopefully, hopefully those answers will 0:09:26.010 --> 0:09:28.380 come to light as the dig progresses. 0:09:28.710 --> 0:09:31.800 Christians throughout the Middle East are persecuted for their faith. 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:35.280 But now, for the first time, a Christian organization is 0:09:35.280 --> 0:09:38.220 tracking all of it with a database. What does that 0:09:38.220 --> 0:09:41.790 mean for our persecuted brothers and sisters? That's a conversation 0:09:41.790 --> 0:09:43.950 we're going to be having next on the land and 0:09:43.950 --> 0:09:47.970 the book. Charlie, how can listeners support this ministry with 0:09:47.970 --> 0:09:49.980 a letter to the station, an email? Why is that 0:09:49.980 --> 0:09:51.030 such a big deal? 0:09:51.030 --> 0:09:55.020 Well, the stations are constantly being given opportunities for other programs, 0:09:55.020 --> 0:09:57.720 new opportunities, and they need to look and say what 0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:00.720 programs are meeting the needs of our listeners. And so 0:10:00.720 --> 0:10:03.030 if they don't hear from somebody they don't know, but 0:10:03.030 --> 0:10:04.890 if a listener writes to the station and says, yes, 0:10:04.890 --> 0:10:07.580 I'm listening to this program, I love this program. That's 0:10:07.580 --> 0:10:10.190 a a data point for the station to say, yeah, 0:10:10.190 --> 0:10:12.170 we should keep this program up and running. 0:10:12.170 --> 0:10:13.940 All of that to say, if you've never taken the 0:10:13.940 --> 0:10:17.840 opportunity to let this station know how you appreciate this program, 0:10:17.840 --> 0:10:20.270 would you think about doing that today? A quick email, 0:10:20.270 --> 0:10:23.540 a phone call, a text, a postcard, anything you got 0:10:23.540 --> 0:10:26.390 that would make a statement that says, hey, we appreciate 0:10:26.390 --> 0:10:29.240 your carving out airtime for the land and the book. Boy, 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:32.930 we'd sure be grateful. A conversation about a persecution database 0:10:32.929 --> 0:10:52.510 is next here on the land and the book. Discrimination 0:10:52.510 --> 0:10:56.620 and violence is nothing new for Christians around the world, 0:10:56.620 --> 0:11:00.819 as believers were promised troubles in this life. But is 0:11:00.820 --> 0:11:04.360 persecution a static thing, or are some areas kind of 0:11:04.360 --> 0:11:08.530 stepping up their hatred toward Christians? One organization has begun 0:11:08.530 --> 0:11:10.449 a database to keep track of it all, and we'll 0:11:10.450 --> 0:11:13.090 let you take a look at that next. Welcome back 0:11:13.090 --> 0:11:16.150 to the land and the book from Moody Radio. I'm 0:11:16.150 --> 0:11:19.179 John Jaeger here to share a quick idea. First, on 0:11:19.179 --> 0:11:22.810 sharing Christ with your Muslim friend or neighbor. Listen to this. 0:11:23.380 --> 0:11:26.230 You ever wonder what the Bible is referring to when 0:11:26.230 --> 0:11:30.460 it talks about Israel's spiritual blindness? Let's ask Wes Taber, 0:11:30.460 --> 0:11:32.590 who's an ambassador with life in Messiah. What do we 0:11:32.590 --> 0:11:33.430 mean by that? 0:11:33.550 --> 0:11:37.660 Well, all non-believers are blinded by Satan. John second Corinthians 0:11:37.660 --> 0:11:40.540 four says, but even if our gospel is veiled, it 0:11:40.540 --> 0:11:43.449 is veiled to those who are perishing, whose minds the 0:11:43.450 --> 0:11:47.829 God of this age has blinded, but God also judicially blinded, 0:11:47.830 --> 0:11:52.090 rebellious Israel. You know, back in Isaiah six six Corinthians 0:11:52.090 --> 0:11:55.000 315 says that there's a veil on their hearts when 0:11:55.000 --> 0:11:58.120 the Torah is read. And Paul says in Romans, this 0:11:58.120 --> 0:12:00.970 blindness is both partial and temporary. 0:12:00.970 --> 0:12:03.880 So in light of this spiritual blindness, what can we 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:05.140 as believers do? 0:12:05.170 --> 0:12:07.870 Well, pray. Pray for the veil to be removed and 0:12:07.870 --> 0:12:11.800 for God's Spirit to enliven the truth. Paul prays in 0:12:11.800 --> 0:12:14.500 Ephesians one, I pray that the eyes of your heart 0:12:14.500 --> 0:12:16.840 may be enlightened. Verse 18. What a great. 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:19.150 Prayer. May the eyes of your heart be in light 0:12:19.150 --> 0:12:24.420 that's West Tabor with life in Messiah. Doctor David Curry 0:12:24.420 --> 0:12:29.760 is CEO of Global Christian Relief, America's leading watchdog organization 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:33.630 focused on the plight of persecuted Christians worldwide. In addition 0:12:33.630 --> 0:12:36.630 to equipping the Western Church to advocate and pray for 0:12:36.630 --> 0:12:40.950 the persecuted, GCR works in the most restrictive countries to 0:12:40.950 --> 0:12:46.140 protect and encourage Christians threatened by faith based discrimination and violence. 0:12:46.170 --> 0:12:49.320 Doctor Curry currently serves on the United States Commission on 0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:51.960 Religious Freedom. And we want to say welcome to the 0:12:51.960 --> 0:12:53.370 land of the book, Doctor Curry. 0:12:53.670 --> 0:12:56.189 Thank you. I appreciate you having me on, Jon. 0:12:56.400 --> 0:12:58.530 Now, some would say, boy, you guys are biting off 0:12:58.530 --> 0:13:01.200 a mighty big bite with this database. How do you 0:13:01.200 --> 0:13:02.939 intend to keep it all updated? 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:07.320 Well, we're working with the Institute for International Religious Freedom 0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:10.800 who have just great researchers. They have, you know, been 0:13:10.800 --> 0:13:13.890 in this field for a long time. And, uh, and, 0:13:13.920 --> 0:13:17.340 of course, we have massive experience over 50 years as 0:13:17.340 --> 0:13:21.840 an organization working in these most contested areas where the 0:13:21.840 --> 0:13:25.290 persecuted person of faith is its most intense. And people say, well, 0:13:25.290 --> 0:13:29.640 where would that be? North Korea, Somalia, Iran, Iraq, some 0:13:29.640 --> 0:13:31.830 of these places that we we hear about in the 0:13:31.830 --> 0:13:36.720 news where extremist and or governments are targeting Christians in 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:40.500 their faith. What this index does that's different, however, is 0:13:40.500 --> 0:13:46.559 it really measures all violent incidents and incidents of persecution 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:49.650 against any faith. And I tell you why that's important, John, 0:13:49.650 --> 0:13:53.400 because for over a decade I've been reporting on violence 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:56.700 against Christians, but there's no context for it to get 0:13:56.700 --> 0:13:59.430 questions over and over again. What does that mean compared 0:13:59.429 --> 0:14:03.420 to what? And this index will measure all incidents, whether 0:14:03.420 --> 0:14:08.160 it's antisemitism against Jews or violence against Christians or others. 0:14:08.160 --> 0:14:11.490 So you're going to have a context ability, as the 0:14:11.490 --> 0:14:15.240 database grows, to really see religious freedom as a whole. 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:18.780 And I think at that point, people are really going 0:14:18.780 --> 0:14:23.430 to understand how massive the persecution and targeting of Christians 0:14:23.430 --> 0:14:25.410 has been and is right now. 0:14:25.410 --> 0:14:28.260 So how do these reports of persecution actually reach you? 0:14:28.260 --> 0:14:29.730 How do you get the information? 0:14:30.150 --> 0:14:35.700 Well, this database is of all publicly verified incidents. And 0:14:35.700 --> 0:14:39.120 what that means is it's limited in that it will 0:14:39.120 --> 0:14:41.760 always be a baseline number. It's not going to be 0:14:41.760 --> 0:14:45.479 the complete number. We have lots of information of things 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:48.480 that we believe has happened, but that hasn't been validated. 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:53.280 And that's intentional because when you have publicly validated information, 0:14:53.280 --> 0:14:56.640 whether that's in a new source or it's from some 0:14:56.640 --> 0:14:59.640 other way, the United Nations or other governments that have 0:14:59.640 --> 0:15:04.500 validated these attacks, the data is unassailable. So up until now, 0:15:04.500 --> 0:15:09.240 everybody sort of in their own category, somebody's talking about anti-Semitism, 0:15:09.240 --> 0:15:11.790 and people could say, oh, that never really happened. Or 0:15:11.790 --> 0:15:15.479 people would say, oh, the persecution of Christians isn't as 0:15:15.480 --> 0:15:17.940 big as you say in your list that only talks 0:15:17.940 --> 0:15:23.010 about Christians. These numbers are unassailable. They have been validated two, three, four, 0:15:23.010 --> 0:15:26.700 five different ways. So you could see the volume and 0:15:26.700 --> 0:15:31.050 the scale of this problem. For example, in India we've 0:15:31.050 --> 0:15:36.090 had over 62,000 Christians and some Muslims who've been displaced 0:15:36.090 --> 0:15:40.290 in the last year because extremist Hindus who have a 0:15:40.290 --> 0:15:43.680 nationalist agenda, they're tied to this is the the militant 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:48.720 arm of the Indian government has attacked Christian communities in 0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:53.340 Manipur and another district called Chhattisgarh and in other regions. 0:15:53.340 --> 0:15:56.280 So the Indian government denies it or they don't want 0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:58.080 to talk about it. They don't want to say that 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:01.350 they're part of it. But this is unassailable data and 0:16:01.350 --> 0:16:04.740 people have to deal with that, and it has political ramifications. 0:16:04.830 --> 0:16:08.430 But I also think, John, this is meant to wake 0:16:08.430 --> 0:16:12.210 up the church. My heart is, is that the church 0:16:12.210 --> 0:16:16.320 stand with persecuted believers, that we rally around them, that 0:16:16.320 --> 0:16:19.230 we understand that one of the tactics of the devil 0:16:19.230 --> 0:16:24.420 is to use violence to make people flee from their faith. 0:16:24.990 --> 0:16:28.500 And it works in some cases. And so if you 0:16:28.500 --> 0:16:31.320 want to strengthen the church, you have to start with 0:16:31.320 --> 0:16:35.970 serving the persecuted, praying for them, understanding their needs, and 0:16:35.970 --> 0:16:37.740 trying to find a way to strengthen the church and 0:16:37.740 --> 0:16:38.670 to stand with it. 0:16:39.060 --> 0:16:41.850 Thanks for joining us today on the land and the book. 0:16:41.850 --> 0:16:44.970 I'm John Jaeger with our guest, Doctor David Curry of 0:16:44.970 --> 0:16:49.650 Global Christian Relief. Let's swing our focus toward the Middle East. That's, 0:16:49.650 --> 0:16:51.690 of course, our heart here at the land in the book. 0:16:51.690 --> 0:16:55.050 Name some hotspots that you're tracking right now in that 0:16:55.050 --> 0:16:57.750 region that kind of pop up when you think about 0:16:57.750 --> 0:16:59.340 this country or that country. 0:16:59.880 --> 0:17:04.140 Well, obviously, the rise of anti-Semitism, or really the revealing 0:17:04.140 --> 0:17:08.940 of it from the October attacks is noted in the database, 0:17:08.940 --> 0:17:11.430 and there's more data being added all the time on 0:17:11.430 --> 0:17:14.490 this subject. One region that I think sort of falls 0:17:14.490 --> 0:17:17.699 below the radar for a lot of people is Armenia, 0:17:17.850 --> 0:17:22.629 and the ongoing struggle that is happening there between. Azerbaijan 0:17:23.290 --> 0:17:28.900 and Armenia. And it's not just a national problem. This 0:17:28.900 --> 0:17:31.300 is a Christian country, has been a Christian country. One 0:17:31.300 --> 0:17:33.850 of the first, if they they would claim they were 0:17:33.850 --> 0:17:37.120 the first Christian country to identify to say we're we 0:17:37.119 --> 0:17:40.330 are a Christian country back in, you know, many decades ago, 0:17:40.869 --> 0:17:45.160 I think it's 894 or something like that. AD so 0:17:45.160 --> 0:17:49.000 they have been a Christian country, people practicing their Christian faith. 0:17:49.210 --> 0:17:54.970 In the last few months, you've had 120,000 Armenian Christians 0:17:54.970 --> 0:17:58.750 who have been forcibly removed from their homes by the 0:17:58.750 --> 0:18:04.810 Azerbaijan government and the Christian heritage. There, again, centuries old, 0:18:05.200 --> 0:18:10.300 has been deleted, destroying churches, destroying Christian landmarks in order 0:18:10.300 --> 0:18:13.149 to sort of prove in their mind that this has 0:18:13.150 --> 0:18:19.629 always been Muslim territory and to force people into that faith. 0:18:19.630 --> 0:18:24.760 And it's tragic and it's not on anybody's radar. 120,000 0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:28.660 Christians removed from their homes, and now they're stateless because 0:18:28.660 --> 0:18:32.590 technically they were Azerbaijan's citizens, but now they've been forced 0:18:32.590 --> 0:18:35.380 into Armenia and they've been welcomed by Armenia, but they're 0:18:35.380 --> 0:18:37.600 not Armenian citizens. So, I mean, there's just a lot 0:18:37.630 --> 0:18:39.729 going on there. And this is the targeting of Christians 0:18:39.730 --> 0:18:42.760 in the Middle East. Armenia is just above Iran. It 0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:46.629 should be a partner with Israel, but they haven't been 0:18:46.630 --> 0:18:50.170 welcomed there yet either. So there's a lot going on there. 0:18:50.170 --> 0:18:52.149 This is the sort of thing that's revealed in the 0:18:52.150 --> 0:18:54.340 data that you could see compared to what else is 0:18:54.340 --> 0:18:56.380 going on. That is a major story that most people 0:18:56.380 --> 0:18:57.070 don't know about. 0:18:57.190 --> 0:19:00.940 Doctor David Curry is CEO of Global Christian Relief, a 0:19:00.940 --> 0:19:04.990 watchdog organization focused on the plight of persecuted Christians worldwide. 0:19:05.020 --> 0:19:07.810 He joins us today on The Land and the book. 0:19:07.810 --> 0:19:10.840 I'm John Jaeger saying thanks for your company. All right. 0:19:10.840 --> 0:19:14.560 What are some common forms of persecution that believers experience 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:16.510 in the Middle East? What are we talking about here? 0:19:16.869 --> 0:19:19.659 Well, I think first of all, we have to understand 0:19:19.660 --> 0:19:22.930 the index that we released in January is a violence index. 0:19:22.930 --> 0:19:26.050 In the spring around Easter, we're going to release index 0:19:26.050 --> 0:19:30.670 that measures other factors. When we measure persecution. What we're 0:19:30.670 --> 0:19:34.810 looking at is just the government doing the persecution is 0:19:34.810 --> 0:19:38.649 the persecution within the family. When you're talking about in 0:19:38.650 --> 0:19:41.320 the Middle East, a lot of people who are coming 0:19:41.320 --> 0:19:46.000 to faith from a muslim background. And within that structure, 0:19:46.000 --> 0:19:51.010 some extremists interpret Muslim theology to say that anybody who 0:19:51.010 --> 0:19:54.430 leaves and not even extremists, many people across it would 0:19:54.430 --> 0:19:58.960 say anybody who leaves the Muslim faith is an infidel extremist, 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:01.120 would say that gives them the right to kill them, 0:20:01.119 --> 0:20:06.070 to rape them, to beat them. And sometimes that happens 0:20:06.070 --> 0:20:09.160 where people come to faith from a muslim background and 0:20:09.160 --> 0:20:12.460 they're disassociated from their family. They can lose their job. 0:20:12.820 --> 0:20:16.659 And you see this amongst Palestinian Christians who are really 0:20:16.660 --> 0:20:21.310 struggling because they're denied, you know, a kind of understanding 0:20:21.310 --> 0:20:24.760 from the Muslim community in Palestine. And they don't fit 0:20:24.760 --> 0:20:28.900 within the the Israeli context. And so they just feel 0:20:28.900 --> 0:20:31.960 left out of place. But they're believers in Jesus. That 0:20:31.960 --> 0:20:37.359 redeeming story, the death, burial, resurrection of Jesus that transformed 0:20:37.359 --> 0:20:40.119 their life. But they come from a muslim background and 0:20:40.119 --> 0:20:43.179 it's really hard for them. So that's a church within 0:20:43.180 --> 0:20:47.020 the Middle East, Muslim background, believers that most people don't realize. 0:20:47.020 --> 0:20:52.360 Millions of people now who have come to Christ many times, miraculously, 0:20:52.359 --> 0:20:54.580 who are living there within the Middle East, and they 0:20:54.580 --> 0:20:58.720 face every kind of persecution, including martyrdom. 0:20:59.050 --> 0:21:01.600 So the obvious question is, why do so many of 0:21:01.600 --> 0:21:04.630 these stories? And there are, as you say, so many 0:21:04.630 --> 0:21:07.090 of them, why do they fail to make it into 0:21:07.090 --> 0:21:09.040 our media coverage in the West? 0:21:09.850 --> 0:21:13.180 Well, I thank God for programs like yours and others 0:21:13.180 --> 0:21:16.960 that do talk about it. I think we have so 0:21:16.960 --> 0:21:20.949 many distractions here. Your social media feed is going to 0:21:20.950 --> 0:21:25.600 be filled with stories of pain and so we can 0:21:25.600 --> 0:21:28.840 become overwhelmed. It can become fatigue. What I think we 0:21:28.840 --> 0:21:31.810 have to understand is that this is a biblical calling 0:21:31.810 --> 0:21:34.780 that's talked about in Hebrews and elsewhere, where we're to 0:21:34.780 --> 0:21:37.659 care for and pray for those who are in chains. 0:21:37.780 --> 0:21:39.970 It says, for the name of Jesus, as if it 0:21:39.970 --> 0:21:44.320 were your own family, as if it were yourself. And 0:21:44.320 --> 0:21:48.250 this is the key. That's the sentence. It is your family. 0:21:48.430 --> 0:21:52.389 And so I think we lack an understanding. Part of 0:21:52.390 --> 0:21:55.750 my calling is to wake up the church and say, 0:21:55.750 --> 0:22:00.490 this gentleman here, whose name may be Mohammed, he may 0:22:00.490 --> 0:22:03.370 have come from a muslim background, but he is a 0:22:03.369 --> 0:22:06.730 follower of Jesus. Therefore he is your brother. We need 0:22:06.730 --> 0:22:11.889 to care. It seems like we believe somehow, maybe not intentionally, 0:22:11.890 --> 0:22:15.100 that there's a distance between where they're at and where 0:22:15.100 --> 0:22:17.470 we're at. But here's the challenge, John, and I think 0:22:17.470 --> 0:22:21.429 you know this. I hope your listeners know this persecution and. 0:22:21.540 --> 0:22:26.160 Intolerance of Christians is growing here too, and the spiritual 0:22:26.160 --> 0:22:29.730 lessons that these people go through because they're strong and 0:22:29.730 --> 0:22:33.150 even in the midst of it, joyful in many cases, 0:22:33.510 --> 0:22:36.630 is the lessons we have to learn. How do you 0:22:36.630 --> 0:22:40.050 practice your faith? How does it become violent when it 0:22:40.050 --> 0:22:44.970 is opposed? When you're discriminated, when you lose everything? Is 0:22:44.970 --> 0:22:48.419 he still enough? And these are key spiritual questions. And 0:22:48.420 --> 0:22:51.360 that's part of why. One of my key elements is 0:22:51.359 --> 0:22:55.560 to post stories on our website Global Christian Relief. Org 0:22:55.560 --> 0:23:02.400 videos stories of transformation, of inspiration, and yes, in difficult circumstances. 0:23:02.400 --> 0:23:06.090 But it's still powerful and in an odd way that 0:23:06.090 --> 0:23:09.390 only happens in the spirit. Really, it is inspiring. 0:23:09.960 --> 0:23:12.480 You know, I think listeners are saying back to this 0:23:12.480 --> 0:23:16.199 database of religious violence, who has access to that? Is 0:23:16.200 --> 0:23:19.139 it restricted to members of the media? How would we 0:23:19.140 --> 0:23:20.369 get to that database? 0:23:20.700 --> 0:23:23.790 You can go on there and you say, what's happening? 0:23:23.790 --> 0:23:28.590 Azerbaijan attacks against Christians. You can select the faith that 0:23:28.590 --> 0:23:31.950 you want to target as far as understanding what's going on. 0:23:31.980 --> 0:23:35.040 Here's a great question that you can punch in. There's 0:23:35.040 --> 0:23:37.920 fields that you fill out and say closed churches. How 0:23:37.920 --> 0:23:41.730 many churches were closed last year? Where were the most 0:23:41.730 --> 0:23:45.420 churches closed? And I would just ask that of your listeners, 0:23:45.420 --> 0:23:48.300 do you know what country closed the most churches? The 0:23:48.300 --> 0:23:53.460 answer Nicaragua wouldn't have thought of that. No 179 churches 0:23:53.460 --> 0:23:57.600 were closed. And that's because Daniel Ortega and his administration 0:23:57.600 --> 0:24:02.550 is targeting Catholic and evangelical churches, that he sees them 0:24:02.550 --> 0:24:06.570 as a threat to his power. He's a communist and 0:24:06.570 --> 0:24:10.950 every communist country, there's some form of targeting of Christians. 0:24:10.950 --> 0:24:15.780 And they have been closing churches, arresting priests, arresting pastors 0:24:15.780 --> 0:24:19.860 who stand up to the government. They just released 18 0:24:19.859 --> 0:24:23.220 priests yesterday, sent them back to Rome, but they had 0:24:23.220 --> 0:24:28.050 been held in detention, including a major bishop, Alvarez, for 0:24:28.050 --> 0:24:31.170 many months. And all they were doing is practicing their faith. 0:24:31.380 --> 0:24:34.260 But they didn't go along with the communist dogma that 0:24:34.260 --> 0:24:38.220 said that that was preeminent. That's the challenge within communism, 0:24:38.220 --> 0:24:41.730 that that system has to be preeminent. Nothing else can 0:24:41.730 --> 0:24:44.639 stand up to it. Not Jesus, not anybody. That's the 0:24:44.640 --> 0:24:47.250 same problem that China has with Christianity, that they don't 0:24:47.250 --> 0:24:54.180 want any theology idea person above their communist ideology. And 0:24:54.180 --> 0:24:56.880 so Nicaragua's closing a lot of churches right now. You 0:24:56.880 --> 0:24:59.370 can just go in and select these fields and say, 0:24:59.670 --> 0:25:01.619 you know, where were the most people arrested? Where were 0:25:01.619 --> 0:25:04.830 the most people abducted for their faith? And again, these 0:25:04.830 --> 0:25:09.209 are baseline numbers. You will see, for example, in Nigeria, 0:25:09.210 --> 0:25:14.520 over 5800 people were abducted because they were Christians. And 0:25:14.700 --> 0:25:18.389 just all kinds of interesting tidbits. Anybody can access it. 0:25:18.390 --> 0:25:21.480 Our website, Global Christian Relief, is a portal to go 0:25:21.480 --> 0:25:25.230 see what's happening there. And and researchers. I'm hoping we'll 0:25:25.230 --> 0:25:28.200 go and policymakers and really dig into it. 0:25:28.410 --> 0:25:31.320 We'll link to your website, Global Christian Relief, when you 0:25:31.320 --> 0:25:34.770 visit our website, the land and the book. Org, our 0:25:34.770 --> 0:25:37.800 time is gone. But we really appreciate Doctor Curry. You're 0:25:37.800 --> 0:25:41.369 opening our eyes to all of this persecution worldwide and 0:25:41.369 --> 0:25:44.129 persecution in particular in the Middle East. Thank you for 0:25:44.130 --> 0:25:46.560 your expertise and for your devotion to this cause. 0:25:46.830 --> 0:25:48.450 Thank you John, I appreciate your show. 0:25:48.540 --> 0:25:50.609 Up next on the land of the book, it's Bible 0:25:50.609 --> 0:25:53.850 Questions and Answers with Doctor Charlie Dyer, our host. 0:25:53.850 --> 0:25:55.680 He's back right after this. 0:26:06.869 --> 0:26:09.000 You know, let's face it, you have so many choices 0:26:09.000 --> 0:26:11.400 in what you listen to these days and how you listen. 0:26:11.430 --> 0:26:13.860 The fact that you're with us, man, we count that 0:26:13.859 --> 0:26:15.510 an honor. And we want to say thank you for 0:26:15.510 --> 0:26:17.310 being a part of the land. In the book, I'm 0:26:17.310 --> 0:26:21.150 John Geiger. Seated across from me is Charlie Dyer, and 0:26:21.150 --> 0:26:23.640 right at his side is his Bible, which he's going 0:26:23.640 --> 0:26:27.030 to need because your questions are fast and furious and 0:26:27.030 --> 0:26:29.669 they're always about the Bible. I'm looking forward to those 0:26:29.670 --> 0:26:32.580 first though, Passover soon going to be upon us. And 0:26:32.580 --> 0:26:36.180 one of the traditional Passover questions is what makes this 0:26:36.180 --> 0:26:39.930 night different from all others? Could you answer that? Passover 0:26:39.930 --> 0:26:42.600 is an important biblical holiday that has great meaning for 0:26:42.600 --> 0:26:46.109 both Jewish people and believers in Jesus. So I'm thinking 0:26:46.109 --> 0:26:48.210 this is a great question to ask Charlie. 0:26:48.210 --> 0:26:49.919 It is a great question. And if you want to 0:26:49.920 --> 0:26:53.490 learn more about what makes Passover so special, our friends 0:26:53.490 --> 0:26:56.010 at Life and Messiah are offering to mail you a 0:26:56.010 --> 0:26:59.850 free copy of their Messianic Passover Haggadah. The booklet will 0:26:59.850 --> 0:27:02.580 lead you through the celebration of Passover to see the 0:27:02.580 --> 0:27:06.480 rich connections to Jesus, our Messiah, and the Last Supper. 0:27:06.480 --> 0:27:09.659 You'll also receive a link for an interactive Passover Seder 0:27:09.660 --> 0:27:13.800 video with the Haggadah and video. You can celebrate Passover 0:27:13.800 --> 0:27:16.650 this year with your family and friends. To get this 0:27:16.650 --> 0:27:19.950 free offer, just go to Life in Messiah org and 0:27:19.950 --> 0:27:22.590 click on the Moody Radio button to find out more 0:27:22.590 --> 0:27:25.650 and request your copy. That's life in Messiah. 0:27:25.980 --> 0:27:30.000 Org questions and answers. That's now on the land and 0:27:30.000 --> 0:27:32.700 the book, starting with Terry, who asks, how would you 0:27:32.700 --> 0:27:37.080 define Christ's kingdom? As it's mentioned in Matthew 610, the 0:27:37.080 --> 0:27:38.490 traditional Lord's Prayer? 0:27:38.880 --> 0:27:41.669 Well, I believe the kingdom being described by Christ is 0:27:41.670 --> 0:27:44.850 the Millennial Kingdom or the messianic Kingdom predicted in the 0:27:44.850 --> 0:27:48.270 Old Testament. The prophets described the coming kingdom era, when 0:27:48.270 --> 0:27:51.420 the Messiah would come to rule over the world from Jerusalem. 0:27:51.420 --> 0:27:54.570 In that model prayer Jesus gave in Matthew six, I 0:27:54.570 --> 0:27:57.180 see two phrases there used side by side to help 0:27:57.180 --> 0:28:01.139 provide the explanation. The first is the phrase thy kingdom come. 0:28:01.140 --> 0:28:04.020 But then Jesus explains what he means in the next 0:28:04.020 --> 0:28:06.600 phrase thy will be done on earth as it is 0:28:06.600 --> 0:28:10.080 in heaven. When the kingdom arrives, God's rule over the 0:28:10.080 --> 0:28:13.379 earth will match his rule in heaven, and ultimately that 0:28:13.380 --> 0:28:15.690 awaits the arrival of Jesus back to earth. As King 0:28:15.690 --> 0:28:17.460 of Kings and Lord of Lords. 0:28:17.550 --> 0:28:20.910 Nikki asks, how do we explain how so many pastors 0:28:20.910 --> 0:28:24.990 fall into scandal, especially sexual sin? I'm looking for scripture 0:28:24.990 --> 0:28:27.840 that explains how Satan manifests himself in our lives when 0:28:27.840 --> 0:28:30.300 we're weak or double minded. What do you think? 0:28:30.480 --> 0:28:32.699 Well, I think there's several passages. In fact, I would 0:28:32.700 --> 0:28:34.649 like to focus not only on the problem, but the 0:28:34.650 --> 0:28:37.919 solution and the passage. I go to Ephesians six, verses 0:28:37.920 --> 0:28:40.380 10 to 18. You know, Paul there describes the armor 0:28:40.380 --> 0:28:42.420 of God, and he tells us to put it on 0:28:42.420 --> 0:28:45.420 so we can take our stand against the devil's schemes. 0:28:45.600 --> 0:28:48.090 It's interesting Satan has more schemes than when I grew up, 0:28:48.090 --> 0:28:50.700 they would say. Then Carter has pills. So rather than 0:28:50.700 --> 0:28:53.760 focusing on his schemes, let's focus on what God's armor is. 0:28:53.760 --> 0:28:56.280 And the first part of it's defensive in nature. He 0:28:56.280 --> 0:28:58.890 starts with godly character. It's the first defense where to 0:28:58.890 --> 0:29:01.860 wear the belt of truth and the breastplate of righteousness 0:29:01.860 --> 0:29:04.380 and be ready to share the gospel. God's good news 0:29:04.380 --> 0:29:07.650 about Jesus. We're also to carry the shield of faith, 0:29:07.650 --> 0:29:11.250 our conscious choice decision to believe what God has said 0:29:11.250 --> 0:29:13.650 in spite of Satan trying to sow seeds of doubt 0:29:13.650 --> 0:29:16.500 in our mind and the helmet of salvation. That's God's 0:29:16.500 --> 0:29:19.650 protection over us. No matter what, God has guaranteed the 0:29:19.650 --> 0:29:22.710 salvation of those who've placed their trust in him. But 0:29:22.710 --> 0:29:25.560 I love it. Paul ends with two offensive weapons we 0:29:25.560 --> 0:29:28.320 have to defeat Satan, the sword of the spirit, which 0:29:28.320 --> 0:29:31.620 is the Word of God, and prayer. When Jesus was 0:29:31.620 --> 0:29:33.780 tempted in the wilderness, he used the Word of God 0:29:33.780 --> 0:29:36.690 to defeat Satan's attacks. And in the Garden of Gethsemane, 0:29:36.720 --> 0:29:39.120 he told the disciples to watch and pray that you 0:29:39.120 --> 0:29:42.660 enter not into temptation. So I believe the confession of 0:29:42.660 --> 0:29:45.540 sin is an important part, but the Word of God 0:29:45.540 --> 0:29:47.640 and the power of the spirit in prayer are the 0:29:47.640 --> 0:29:50.040 two big things. Now, one final item, uh, we're called 0:29:50.040 --> 0:29:52.980 on to resist the devil in Ephesians six and also 0:29:52.980 --> 0:29:55.410 in James four, and we do it primarily through prayer 0:29:55.410 --> 0:29:56.910 in the Word of God. But there is one other 0:29:56.910 --> 0:30:00.570 exception when it comes to sexual temptation, which you also mentioned, 0:30:00.570 --> 0:30:03.060 we're told to flee rather than to try and stand 0:30:03.060 --> 0:30:05.220 and oppose it on our own. You know, Paul told 0:30:05.220 --> 0:30:08.220 the people in Corinth to flee immorality. He told Timothy 0:30:08.220 --> 0:30:11.640 to flee youthful lusts, and we should more like Joseph. 0:30:11.640 --> 0:30:14.220 You remember when he was tempted by Potiphar's wife. The 0:30:14.220 --> 0:30:16.410 best way to avoid sexual sin is to put as 0:30:16.410 --> 0:30:19.260 much distance between you and it as possible. 0:30:19.260 --> 0:30:22.410 That's Charlie Dyer, I'm John Jaeger, this is the land 0:30:22.410 --> 0:30:26.190 and the book. Questions and answers, David says while visiting 0:30:26.190 --> 0:30:29.490 a Greek Orthodox church, the bishop there said that Joseph 0:30:29.490 --> 0:30:33.210 never had sexual relations with Mary. I know that Jesus 0:30:33.210 --> 0:30:35.610 brothers and sisters are mentioned by name in the book 0:30:35.610 --> 0:30:39.870 of Matthew. Our nephew, who was of this denomination, said. 0:30:39.870 --> 0:30:42.870 The tradition states that Joseph was old and already had 0:30:42.870 --> 0:30:46.530 children from a previous marriage when Jesus was born. This 0:30:46.530 --> 0:30:49.500 is like the Catholic belief that Mary was a perpetual virgin. 0:30:49.500 --> 0:30:51.840 I believe that she was a virgin before Jesus birth, 0:30:51.840 --> 0:30:55.890 but afterwards had a natural sexual relationship. What do you think? 0:30:55.980 --> 0:30:58.950 Well, there's nothing in the Bible which states or suggests 0:30:58.950 --> 0:31:03.330 that Mary remained a perpetual virgin. That is later church tradition. 0:31:03.510 --> 0:31:06.990 There's also no biblical evidence to suggest Joseph. Was substantially 0:31:06.990 --> 0:31:09.240 older than Mary, or that he had children from a 0:31:09.240 --> 0:31:13.320 previous marriage. Those are all attempts to protect the chastity 0:31:13.320 --> 0:31:15.960 of Mary. While trying to explain why, the Bible also 0:31:15.960 --> 0:31:19.800 says Jesus had brothers and sisters. So I believe Matthew 0:31:19.800 --> 0:31:24.300 125 strongly suggests Mary and Joseph had sexual relations following 0:31:24.300 --> 0:31:28.350 Jesus birth. It literally says Joseph did not know her. 0:31:28.350 --> 0:31:31.080 That is in a sexual sense until she gave birth 0:31:31.080 --> 0:31:34.380 to a son. The implication is that Joseph did begin 0:31:34.380 --> 0:31:37.770 having sexual relations with his wife following Jesus birth. 0:31:38.370 --> 0:31:40.980 Another question from David, who says, the pastor at this 0:31:40.980 --> 0:31:44.670 Greek Orthodox Church said that the church of Jacob's well, 0:31:44.670 --> 0:31:47.880 where Jesus met the Samaritan woman mentioned in John four, 0:31:47.880 --> 0:31:51.479 had a caretaker who had been murdered by Zionists. He 0:31:51.480 --> 0:31:53.790 said that now there's another caretaker at the site. What 0:31:53.790 --> 0:31:56.160 is the truth though? How? How can this use of 0:31:56.160 --> 0:31:59.100 the word Zionist refer to anti-Semitism? 0:31:59.310 --> 0:32:01.920 Well, the event to which the priest is referring isn't 0:32:01.920 --> 0:32:05.340 something recent. It actually took place back in 1979. That's 0:32:05.340 --> 0:32:09.540 45 years ago. Uh, the priesthood, Jacob's well wasn't murdered 0:32:09.540 --> 0:32:14.040 by Zionists. He was murdered by a mentally unbalanced Jewish man. 0:32:14.310 --> 0:32:17.160 The same man also killed a Jewish gynecologist in Tel 0:32:17.160 --> 0:32:19.680 Aviv and a family and load. And he attacked a 0:32:19.680 --> 0:32:22.200 nun at Jacob's well at a later date. But all 0:32:22.200 --> 0:32:25.560 those attacks were by a single individual against both Jewish 0:32:25.560 --> 0:32:29.310 and Christian Arab victims. It wasn't a Zionist plot against 0:32:29.310 --> 0:32:32.670 Christians or Palestinians. Now the cleric who replaced the one 0:32:32.670 --> 0:32:35.670 who was murdered and who eventually helped capture the assailant, 0:32:35.670 --> 0:32:39.120 he verified the assailant was one individual whom he identified 0:32:39.120 --> 0:32:43.170 as a madman. I think what makes this story anti-Semitic 0:32:43.170 --> 0:32:46.350 is that it's been expanded and embellished over time, so 0:32:46.350 --> 0:32:49.320 that that one mentally disturbed man became a group of 0:32:49.320 --> 0:32:53.160 fanatical Zionists who supposedly used a hatchet to display the 0:32:53.160 --> 0:32:55.469 sign of the cross on the priest's body and plucked 0:32:55.470 --> 0:32:58.020 out his eyes and chopped off three fingers to make 0:32:58.020 --> 0:33:02.160 him renounces Orthodox faith. Now, those added details parallel some 0:33:02.160 --> 0:33:05.040 of the medieval charges made against Jews, and were designed 0:33:05.040 --> 0:33:08.430 to inflame Christians into seeking retribution. And that's why I 0:33:08.430 --> 0:33:11.340 believe the inclusion of those details is what crosses over 0:33:11.340 --> 0:33:14.880 the line into anti-Semitism. A best defense against something like 0:33:14.880 --> 0:33:17.969 that is online ability. Now go back and try and 0:33:17.970 --> 0:33:21.360 find the original factual accounts of what happened, and then 0:33:21.360 --> 0:33:24.300 see what was altered to vilify a specific group that 0:33:24.300 --> 0:33:27.150 had no real connection to the event itself. And that's 0:33:27.150 --> 0:33:29.550 what happened in the later accounts of this event, which 0:33:29.550 --> 0:33:32.160 really did happen back in 1979. 0:33:32.340 --> 0:33:35.220 A question from Brian. The Bible teaches us that God 0:33:35.220 --> 0:33:38.340 formed us in the womb. This seems to indicate that 0:33:38.340 --> 0:33:41.160 abortion would be homicide. At the same time, I wonder 0:33:41.160 --> 0:33:43.290 if God would allow any exceptions, such as in the 0:33:43.290 --> 0:33:46.050 case of rape or incest, or to save the mother's life. 0:33:46.080 --> 0:33:48.630 Your thoughts? Yeah, and I'm going to wait in here 0:33:48.630 --> 0:33:51.000 and probably be hit on all sides, so that's okay. 0:33:51.420 --> 0:33:53.970 But I do appreciate, Brian, your stand on protecting the 0:33:53.970 --> 0:33:56.550 lives of the unborn. And I understand the concerns when 0:33:56.550 --> 0:34:00.720 it comes to sensitivity toward those possible exceptions. Uh, here's 0:34:00.720 --> 0:34:02.850 what I would say. I still see the issue in 0:34:02.850 --> 0:34:05.850 it all being the life of the unborn child. Though 0:34:05.850 --> 0:34:08.940 a horrible deed was committed, it doesn't seem right to 0:34:08.940 --> 0:34:11.549 me to impose the death penalty on the child in 0:34:11.550 --> 0:34:14.040 the womb for something that he or she didn't do. 0:34:14.040 --> 0:34:16.469 Those guilty of the crime ought to be punished, but 0:34:16.469 --> 0:34:19.500 that unborn child is still precious in God's eyes. Now, 0:34:19.500 --> 0:34:21.719 the issue of requiring an abortion to preserve the life 0:34:21.719 --> 0:34:24.810 of the mother is slightly different. But what I suspect 0:34:24.810 --> 0:34:27.120 is that the number of times where this might actually 0:34:27.120 --> 0:34:30.750 be the case are extremely rare. Uh, Doctor John Wolford 0:34:30.750 --> 0:34:33.899 was president of Dallas Seminary for years, and he told 0:34:33.900 --> 0:34:35.700 the story of how his mother was told she needed 0:34:35.700 --> 0:34:38.490 to have an abortion to save her life. She refused, 0:34:38.489 --> 0:34:40.770 and both mother and child lived, and he was that 0:34:40.770 --> 0:34:44.219 unborn child. There are many options now available to help 0:34:44.219 --> 0:34:47.219 protect the lives of both the mother and the unborn child, 0:34:47.219 --> 0:34:50.219 and I suspect this is used more as a theoretical 0:34:50.219 --> 0:34:53.520 excuse than an actual life and death situation. If the 0:34:53.520 --> 0:34:55.740 mother is committed to giving birth to the child, I 0:34:55.739 --> 0:34:59.460 believe that in most every case her desire can be accomplished. 0:34:59.489 --> 0:35:02.100 The bottom line for me is that an unborn child 0:35:02.100 --> 0:35:04.770 is a human life, and if we accept that premise, 0:35:05.070 --> 0:35:08.670 then it changes how we approach these exceptional situations. We 0:35:08.670 --> 0:35:11.250 would no more kill an unborn child who was born 0:35:11.250 --> 0:35:13.470 as the result of rape or incest, than we would 0:35:13.469 --> 0:35:16.140 kill a child already born who was the result of 0:35:16.140 --> 0:35:19.379 rape or incest. So I still think the child's life 0:35:19.380 --> 0:35:20.520 is the most precious. 0:35:20.790 --> 0:35:24.300 A question from Nancy about Queen Esther's banquet in the Bible. 0:35:24.300 --> 0:35:27.150 It states the banquet was of wine. Can you please 0:35:27.150 --> 0:35:29.160 clarify for me? Was it just wine or was it 0:35:29.160 --> 0:35:30.630 with food also? Thank you. 0:35:30.750 --> 0:35:32.850 Yeah, I'll start with this. The Persians were known for 0:35:32.850 --> 0:35:36.090 banquets that included a lot of drinking, even using elaborate 0:35:36.090 --> 0:35:38.550 wine goblets. But I believe the feasts that are there 0:35:38.550 --> 0:35:41.370 included food. And I say that for several reasons. First, 0:35:41.370 --> 0:35:43.800 12 times in the book it uses the word banquet. 0:35:43.800 --> 0:35:46.500 And while that included the focus on drinking, it would 0:35:46.500 --> 0:35:49.890 also include exotic foods. In Esther one 3 to 5. 0:35:49.890 --> 0:35:53.219 The length of the first banquet was 180 days, followed 0:35:53.219 --> 0:35:56.339 immediately by another seven day banquet. That suggests to me 0:35:56.340 --> 0:35:58.770 that they were doing more than just drinking wine, you know, 0:35:59.040 --> 0:36:01.319 half a year of just wine and no food. That's 0:36:01.320 --> 0:36:03.630 hard to believe. So I think the food was there. 0:36:03.630 --> 0:36:06.000 And then also in one nine, the original Queen Vashti. 0:36:06.210 --> 0:36:08.160 He gave a banquet for the women in the palace, 0:36:08.160 --> 0:36:10.650 which doesn't mention wine. So anyway, because of the use 0:36:10.650 --> 0:36:13.680 of the term banquet, I believe there's eating and drinking 0:36:13.680 --> 0:36:16.500 wine at these different events. The wine was used because 0:36:16.500 --> 0:36:19.020 it indicated extravagance. In the event, it'd be kind of like, 0:36:19.020 --> 0:36:20.880 pardon the expression on us. We'd be like someone at 0:36:20.880 --> 0:36:23.130 a modern wedding reception saying it's going to feature an 0:36:23.130 --> 0:36:26.370 open bar, so there's food, but lots of drink. And 0:36:26.370 --> 0:36:28.649 that's what was being said there and what the King 0:36:28.650 --> 0:36:29.430 was doing. 0:36:29.430 --> 0:36:32.190 Boy, it's been great. Getting all these questions in yours 0:36:32.219 --> 0:36:35.340 is welcome anytime with an email to the Land and 0:36:35.340 --> 0:36:39.480 the book at Moody's Edu. Charlie Dyer's devotional is next 0:36:39.480 --> 0:36:55.680 right here on the land and the book. So last Christmas, 0:36:55.680 --> 0:36:59.070 somebody gave me an emergency kit that featured, among other things, 0:36:59.100 --> 0:37:02.970 a light, a knife and a fire starting piece of flint. 0:37:03.180 --> 0:37:06.000 I have yet to try that Flint. Hi, I'm John Jaeger. 0:37:06.000 --> 0:37:08.400 This is the land in the book where Doctor Charlie Dyer, 0:37:08.400 --> 0:37:13.380 our host, is continuing his devotional series. Objects on my shelf. Now, Charlie, 0:37:13.380 --> 0:37:15.720 I've seen that shelf of yours. You've got plenty of 0:37:15.719 --> 0:37:19.469 material for devotionals, but among those objects, apparently a piece 0:37:19.469 --> 0:37:20.160 of flint. 0:37:20.160 --> 0:37:21.990 Uh, multiple pieces of flint. 0:37:21.989 --> 0:37:23.790 Okay. I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with 0:37:23.790 --> 0:37:28.260 that in your devotional right after this Holy Land experience. Testimony. 0:37:32.350 --> 0:37:37.540 I'm Heather, and one of the many things that I've 0:37:37.540 --> 0:37:41.920 been struck by is Charlie has not wasted one inch 0:37:41.920 --> 0:37:46.750 of real estate in this entire country. We have learned 0:37:46.750 --> 0:37:53.080 so much about the history of Israel, the people of Israel. 0:37:53.080 --> 0:37:57.549 He has taken the content of Scripture, put it into 0:37:57.550 --> 0:38:02.500 the context of the cultures. He's helped us understand the 0:38:02.500 --> 0:38:08.350 cultures and has brought us into the modern day problems. 0:38:08.650 --> 0:38:13.000 And I think what it's done for me is it's 0:38:13.000 --> 0:38:17.259 changed me dramatically, but it has also given me a 0:38:17.260 --> 0:38:21.670 resolve to be the kind of believer I need to 0:38:21.670 --> 0:38:24.310 be for Israel. 0:38:26.060 --> 0:38:28.670 All right, Charlie, I know nothing about Flint other than 0:38:28.670 --> 0:38:30.620 that I own a piece of it. I'm looking forward 0:38:30.620 --> 0:38:31.610 to your devotional. 0:38:31.730 --> 0:38:34.879 Oh. Thanks, John. Well, everybody, welcome back to my office. 0:38:34.880 --> 0:38:37.640 I hope you're enjoying this three week series focusing on 0:38:37.640 --> 0:38:40.310 objects I keep on display here on one of my 0:38:40.310 --> 0:38:43.640 office shelves. Today, I want to show you six relatively 0:38:43.640 --> 0:38:46.250 small stones that I keep next to that piece of 0:38:46.250 --> 0:38:49.010 salt I showed you last week, and know these aren't 0:38:49.010 --> 0:38:52.070 stones from the L.A. Valley where David fought Goliath. I 0:38:52.070 --> 0:38:54.650 also have a rock that I picked up there. The 0:38:54.650 --> 0:38:56.540 rocks I want to show you today come from the 0:38:56.540 --> 0:39:00.110 Judean wilderness, which happens to be my favorite spot in Israel. 0:39:00.110 --> 0:39:03.740 These rocks aren't the typical limestone or chalk or even 0:39:03.739 --> 0:39:07.610 basalt rocks that one normally sees in Israel. These six 0:39:07.610 --> 0:39:11.210 all have something of a glossy sheen and relatively straight edges, 0:39:11.210 --> 0:39:14.690 and their colors a mixture of black, brown, and gray. 0:39:14.840 --> 0:39:17.750 The three larger pieces have a thin layer of chalky 0:39:17.750 --> 0:39:21.380 limestone attached. I must be hungry because one of them 0:39:21.380 --> 0:39:24.109 reminds me of a brownie, a very thin brownie with 0:39:24.110 --> 0:39:28.010 a light tan marshmallow like topping on top. The smaller 0:39:28.010 --> 0:39:32.180 pieces have jagged, almost razor sharp edges. One even looks 0:39:32.180 --> 0:39:35.030 like it would make an excellent arrowhead. So what are 0:39:35.030 --> 0:39:38.030 these rocks? Well, depending on who you talk to, they're 0:39:38.030 --> 0:39:42.050 referred to as flint or chert. Flint is a variety 0:39:42.050 --> 0:39:45.920 of chert flints, usually black or dark gray, while chert 0:39:45.920 --> 0:39:48.680 can come in a combination of shades. Of the six 0:39:48.680 --> 0:39:52.220 pieces on my shelf, one definitely appears to be flint, 0:39:52.219 --> 0:39:55.070 while the other five might be classified as chert, but 0:39:55.070 --> 0:39:58.129 it really doesn't matter since apart from color, the stones 0:39:58.130 --> 0:40:01.850 share the same basic properties. Both flint and shirt are 0:40:01.850 --> 0:40:05.060 a type of quartz, which is why these rocks appear 0:40:05.060 --> 0:40:08.720 somewhat glossy, and when they're split, these rocks form edges 0:40:08.719 --> 0:40:11.960 similar in appearance to broken glass. Flint and chert are 0:40:11.960 --> 0:40:15.380 both hard enough to incise scratches on a glass bottle, 0:40:15.380 --> 0:40:18.470 and they can be found embedded in limestone and chalk. 0:40:18.469 --> 0:40:21.890 As those rocks weathered down, the flint remains and ends 0:40:21.890 --> 0:40:24.650 up scattered along the top of the ground. I picked 0:40:24.650 --> 0:40:28.370 up all these pieces while walking in the Judean wilderness. 0:40:28.370 --> 0:40:30.620 Now that I've shown you the rocks, let's head to 0:40:30.620 --> 0:40:33.439 the area in the wilderness where I found them. As 0:40:33.440 --> 0:40:36.140 our bus stops, follow me up the hillside just to 0:40:36.140 --> 0:40:38.330 our left. It's a bit of a walk, so take 0:40:38.330 --> 0:40:40.940 your time and pace yourself. A good way to do 0:40:40.940 --> 0:40:43.820 that is to look down at the rocks along the pathway. 0:40:43.820 --> 0:40:46.790 There are many pieces of white limestone or chalk, but 0:40:46.790 --> 0:40:49.940 look for the dark rocks scattered among them. Some are 0:40:49.940 --> 0:40:53.029 quite large, but focus on the smaller pieces. You know, 0:40:53.030 --> 0:40:55.640 the ones that will fit into your suitcase without putting 0:40:55.640 --> 0:40:59.000 you over that £50 limit for your flight home. Now 0:40:59.000 --> 0:41:01.700 we've reached the top and we're looking into the Wadi quilt. 0:41:01.700 --> 0:41:05.270 It's one of those oh wow experiences in Israel. But 0:41:05.270 --> 0:41:08.239 before you get distracted, let's look more closely at the 0:41:08.239 --> 0:41:10.700 rocks you collected on the way up. Now I see 0:41:10.700 --> 0:41:14.060 lots of brown, gray, and even black flint and chert 0:41:14.060 --> 0:41:16.819 sums embedded in a layer of chalk, but other pieces 0:41:16.820 --> 0:41:19.189 are not. Now turn them over in your hand and 0:41:19.190 --> 0:41:22.580 let the sun reflect off them. Notice the sharp edges 0:41:22.580 --> 0:41:25.550 and the glossy sheen. You can also see the hardness 0:41:25.550 --> 0:41:27.980 of the flint, especially if it's attached to a piece 0:41:27.980 --> 0:41:31.730 of limestone or chalk. That side produces a chalky residue 0:41:31.730 --> 0:41:34.190 when you rub your fingers over it. But the flint 0:41:34.190 --> 0:41:36.650 is hard. It doesn't come off when you rub it 0:41:36.650 --> 0:41:40.640 in your fingers. You now have an interesting and absolutely 0:41:40.640 --> 0:41:43.190 free souvenir to take home with you to put on 0:41:43.190 --> 0:41:45.799 your shelf, but let me add a biblical connection to 0:41:45.800 --> 0:41:49.130 make it even more significant. The Bible uses several words 0:41:49.130 --> 0:41:52.130 for flint, and it also pictures several uses for this 0:41:52.130 --> 0:41:56.540 hard stone. In Exodus four. In Joshua five, knives were 0:41:56.540 --> 0:42:00.260 made from flint and were used to circumcise Moses's son 0:42:00.260 --> 0:42:03.200 and the children of Israel. Now, depending on the piece 0:42:03.200 --> 0:42:05.210 you picked up, you might even be able to imagine 0:42:05.210 --> 0:42:09.740 using its sharp edge as a knife. Limestone might seem hard, 0:42:09.739 --> 0:42:13.069 but it's not impervious. Water can seep through it, but 0:42:13.070 --> 0:42:17.360 flint is impervious to water. When Moses struck the rock 0:42:17.360 --> 0:42:20.600 in the wilderness in Exodus 17, I always imagined him 0:42:20.600 --> 0:42:23.719 striking a large piece of limestone which broke open to 0:42:23.719 --> 0:42:28.100 allow water to flow out. But in Deuteronomy 915, Moses says, 0:42:28.100 --> 0:42:31.880 God brought water for you out of the rock of Flint. 0:42:31.969 --> 0:42:35.060 And in the last verse of Psalm 114, the psalmist 0:42:35.060 --> 0:42:38.690 also said, God turned the rock into a pool of water, 0:42:38.690 --> 0:42:42.290 the flint into a fountain of water. Two different words 0:42:42.290 --> 0:42:44.989 are used in those verses, but both refer to flint. 0:42:44.989 --> 0:42:48.950 Moses split a large flint rock that would normally resist 0:42:48.950 --> 0:42:51.890 being split in two by a mere wooden staff, and 0:42:51.890 --> 0:42:56.480 God brought water from a rock never associated with natural springs. 0:42:56.810 --> 0:42:59.480 But perhaps the greatest use of flint in the Bible, 0:42:59.510 --> 0:43:02.360 both for good and for evil, is. It's used to 0:43:02.360 --> 0:43:07.940 describe stern, hard determination. In Zechariah seven, God summarized why 0:43:07.940 --> 0:43:10.730 the nation of Judah went into captivity. He sent them 0:43:10.730 --> 0:43:14.180 into captivity because the people had hardened their hearts and 0:43:14.180 --> 0:43:17.000 refused to respond to his message. God says it in 0:43:17.000 --> 0:43:20.030 this way. They made their hearts as hard as Flint, 0:43:20.030 --> 0:43:22.489 and would not listen to the law or the words 0:43:22.489 --> 0:43:25.250 that the Lord Almighty had sent by His Spirit the. 0:43:25.360 --> 0:43:28.780 Through the earlier prophets. They hardened their hearts until they 0:43:28.780 --> 0:43:31.540 were as impervious to God's Word as a piece of 0:43:31.540 --> 0:43:35.800 flint is to water, they became hard and unyielding. But 0:43:35.800 --> 0:43:38.260 the hardness of flint is also used in the Bible 0:43:38.260 --> 0:43:42.279 as a positive illustration. Isaiah used flint to describe the 0:43:42.280 --> 0:43:45.280 resolute decision of the servant of the Lord, a prophetic 0:43:45.280 --> 0:43:49.330 picture of Jesus to remain true in spite of opposition. 0:43:49.330 --> 0:43:51.910 Listen to what he says in Isaiah 50 verses six 0:43:51.910 --> 0:43:54.910 and seven. I offered my back to those who beat me, 0:43:54.910 --> 0:43:57.669 my cheek, to those who pulled out my beard. I 0:43:57.670 --> 0:44:00.669 did not hide my face from mocking and spitting because 0:44:00.670 --> 0:44:03.550 the sovereign Lord helps me. I will not be disgraced. 0:44:03.550 --> 0:44:06.910 Therefore I have set my face like flint, and I 0:44:06.910 --> 0:44:09.400 know I will not be put to shame. If you 0:44:09.400 --> 0:44:12.550 want to know how resolute and determined Jesus was to 0:44:12.550 --> 0:44:16.660 endure persecution at the time of his crucifixion, squeeze that 0:44:16.660 --> 0:44:19.810 piece of flint. But the same kind of determination and 0:44:19.810 --> 0:44:23.439 fortitude that Jesus demonstrated has also been made available by 0:44:23.440 --> 0:44:26.650 God to his followers. How do I know this? Listen 0:44:26.650 --> 0:44:29.080 to God's promise to Ezekiel when he called him as 0:44:29.080 --> 0:44:32.230 a prophet to a rebellious nation about to be judged, 0:44:32.500 --> 0:44:35.529 I will make your forehead like the hardest stone harder 0:44:35.530 --> 0:44:38.200 than flint. Do not be afraid of them or terrified 0:44:38.200 --> 0:44:42.070 by them, though they are a rebellious house. Whatever opposition 0:44:42.070 --> 0:44:45.430 Ezekiel was about to face and he faced much, God 0:44:45.430 --> 0:44:48.940 promised to strengthen and protect him, to make him harder 0:44:48.940 --> 0:44:52.089 than Flint. It's time to head back from the Judean 0:44:52.090 --> 0:44:55.330 wilderness to my office and to say our goodbyes. But 0:44:55.330 --> 0:44:57.850 before you go, take one last look at that piece 0:44:57.850 --> 0:45:00.460 of flint in your hand and there on my shelf, 0:45:00.460 --> 0:45:03.219 and then think about how God used these rocks to 0:45:03.219 --> 0:45:06.970 illustrate his truth in the Bible. Water gushing from flint, 0:45:06.969 --> 0:45:10.660 struck by a wooden stick. That's definitely a miracle. The 0:45:10.660 --> 0:45:14.020 hardness of flint. To illustrate determination, hold a piece of 0:45:14.020 --> 0:45:17.020 flint in your hand and that makes perfect sense. It 0:45:17.020 --> 0:45:21.100 pictures the determination of the servant Jesus, who willingly suffered 0:45:21.100 --> 0:45:23.980 and died to pay the penalty for our sin. Sadly, 0:45:23.980 --> 0:45:26.739 it can also picture the determination of those in sin 0:45:26.739 --> 0:45:31.120 to continue refusing to listen to God's warning of impending judgment. 0:45:31.120 --> 0:45:33.279 And finally, it can serve as a reminder to us 0:45:33.280 --> 0:45:36.190 that God will give us the strength and ability to 0:45:36.190 --> 0:45:39.940 stand firm for him, even in times of trouble. So 0:45:39.940 --> 0:45:41.469 what do you see when you look at that piece 0:45:41.469 --> 0:45:44.500 of flint? Hopefully it's not a graphic reminder of a 0:45:44.500 --> 0:45:47.799 heart hardened against God. How about an illustration of how 0:45:47.800 --> 0:45:51.220 God can cause living water to flow from something as 0:45:51.219 --> 0:45:53.799 hard as flint? And he demonstrated that by having his 0:45:53.800 --> 0:45:57.730 own son have a flint like determination to suffer and die, 0:45:57.730 --> 0:46:00.220 to pay the penalty for our sin so we can 0:46:00.219 --> 0:46:04.120 experience God's forgiveness. And finally, if we turn to God, 0:46:04.120 --> 0:46:06.760 he'll give us the strength and hardness of flint to 0:46:06.760 --> 0:46:10.570 allow us to stand firm for him. Flint. Just one 0:46:10.570 --> 0:46:13.899 kind of stone, but with many applications. 0:46:14.110 --> 0:46:17.320 Thank you Charlie, and maybe as you listen to today's devotional, 0:46:17.320 --> 0:46:19.840 things are finally making sense for you. You realize your 0:46:19.840 --> 0:46:22.480 heart has been far from God and and you'd like 0:46:22.480 --> 0:46:24.970 to be forgiven. You'd like to be made right with God. 0:46:24.969 --> 0:46:27.640 And to know that that you're headed for heaven. Well, 0:46:27.640 --> 0:46:30.850 you can begin this relationship with Jesus in a conversation 0:46:30.850 --> 0:46:35.950 right now at eight, eight, eight. Need him, 888 need him. 0:46:36.280 --> 0:46:38.680 Thanks for listening today to the land in the book, 0:46:38.680 --> 0:46:42.070 our host, Doctor Charlie Dyer, our producer, Danny Anderson, I'm 0:46:42.070 --> 0:46:44.770 John Geiger and we point you to our website as always. 0:46:44.770 --> 0:46:49.060 It's the land and the book.org. Join us next time 0:46:49.060 --> 0:46:51.280 for another edition of The Land and the book, a 0:46:51.280 --> 0:46:54.820 production of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.