S1: When the Nazis invaded Holland, they made it illegal for
S1: anyone to house or even help a Jewish person. Corrie
S1: ten boom and her family decided they simply could not
S1: obey this evil dictate, so they began hiding small groups
S1: of Jewish people and others who sought refuge. You've heard
S1: of Corrie ten boom? Perhaps, but her story comes to
S1: life through a dramatic interpreter coming up. Hey, welcome to
S1: the land and the book. Our host is Charlie Dyer.
S1: I'm John Jaeger, and this week we have done something
S1: a little on the crazy side. We've traveled to Israel.
S1: Charlie explained why we're here and what we're about, what
S1: we're gathering interviews and.
S2: Stories because we want to do a special for Moody
S2: Radio Israel after the war. So we've lined up a
S2: lot of people from the Gaza border all the way
S2: up to the Sea of Galilee to talk, to find
S2: out what's been happening and just look for a rather
S2: exciting time. And so hopefully people can stay tuned because
S2: a special will be coming shortly.
S1: Yes, Charlie says, keep an ear out for that special,
S1: which you'll be able to connect with either through this
S1: station or certainly online. And we're looking forward, as he says,
S1: to talking with survivors, people who were actually in those
S1: kibbutzim that were attacked, ministries that have been impacted, and
S1: so much more. Well, Charlie, Passover will soon be upon us.
S1: And one of the traditional Passover questions is what makes
S1: this night different from all others? Passover is an important
S1: biblical holiday that has great meaning for both Jewish people
S1: and believers in Jesus. But this is a great question
S1: to ask. What makes this night different from all others?
S2: That's right. And if you want to learn more about
S2: what makes Passover so special, well, our friends at Life
S2: in Messiah are offering to mail you a free copy
S2: of their Messianic Passover Haggadah. The booklet will lead you
S2: through the celebration of Passover to see the rich connections
S2: to Jesus, our Messiah, and the Last Supper. You'll also
S2: receive a link for an interactive Passover Seder video with
S2: the Haggadah and video. You can celebrate Passover this year
S2: with your family and friends. Now to get this free offer,
S2: just go to Life in Messiah org and click on
S2: the Moody Radio button to find out more and request
S2: your copy. That's life in Messiah. Org.
S1: Well, lots to talk about in the Middle East. So
S1: let's begin with story number one from Jerusalem all the
S1: way north to Mount Hermon, Israel has experienced a very
S1: above average winter weather wise. Well, how has the rain
S1: impacted the country and will it continue?
S2: Yeah. You know, if rain is a blessing, then the
S2: northern half of Israel has definitely been blessed so far
S2: this winter. Draw an East-West line through Israel right at Jerusalem.
S2: Head north and the amount of rain is above average.
S2: For example, at Capernaum they've received so far this year 170%
S2: of their normal to date rainfall. The water level at
S2: the Sea of Galilee is now three feet below the
S2: upper red line, which is when the lake is completely filled.
S2: It will keep rising as the rain that fell in
S2: the far north makes its way down toward the lake.
S2: In fact, it could reach capacity by the end of
S2: this month. The dam at the southern end of the
S2: lake would then need to be opened for the first
S2: time in decades, but head to the south of Jerusalem
S2: and the situation changes dramatically. Beersheba has only received about 50%
S2: of their normal to date winter rainfall, and other places
S2: down in the Negev have only received about a third
S2: of their normal rainfall. There's at least another month when
S2: rain can be expected, so the numbers could still change dramatically.
S2: The wheat farmers in the South are certainly hoping for
S2: more rain before it's time to harvest. Right now, northern
S2: Israel is definitely green and lush, and they're calling for
S2: a little more rain later this week. The long range
S2: forecast also shows several other periods of rain that might
S2: arrive later in the month. Seeing all the lush green
S2: vegetation in the north, along with a nearly full Sea
S2: of Galilee, is definitely a blessing.
S1: Well, the conflict between Israel and Hamas continues, but there
S1: are some hopeful signs the tensions might be about to ease.
S1: What's the latest on the war, Charlie? And how realistic
S1: are these hints? We're hearing about hints of progress coming
S1: from the region.
S2: Well, after five months, it's difficult to become too excited
S2: over reports of possible breakthroughs, but there are at least
S2: some hints of progress. A new round of hostage talks
S2: are underway. They're still discussing whether they can agree on
S2: a specific framework for negotiation. So there's a long way
S2: to go. Some are hoping a temporary ceasefire can be
S2: arranged in the next week or so. That would allow
S2: for the release of the remaining hostages. Then this past Monday,
S2: the Palestinian Authority government resigned. It's been under pressure from
S2: the US to reform, and a majority of Palestinians just
S2: see it as a corrupt organization that does need to
S2: be replaced. But what's unclear right now is whether this
S2: is an actual change or just a reshuffling of the
S2: deck to keep Abbas in power. Still another hopeful sign
S2: is that the Army has given the all clear for
S2: many living in the communities close to the Gaza border
S2: to return home over the next few weeks. This should
S2: lead to the resettlement of those communities. Now, we're planning
S2: on visiting the area this coming week, so we might
S2: see these communities coming back to. The life. Some of
S2: the hotel chains in Israel have also told evacuees they
S2: need to begin exiting the hotels. Part of the reason
S2: is the return to normalization. But the hotels also want
S2: to begin the process of cleaning and refurbishing so they
S2: can be ready for the expected influx of Jewish and
S2: Christian tourists, especially with Easter and Passover later this month
S2: and then in April. All in all, it looks like
S2: things will start returning to normal in the next few weeks,
S2: assuming that Hamas and Hezbollah cooperate, and that the new
S2: Palestinian government can rein in corruption and violence.
S1: Charlie, I'm sure some of our listeners are as confused
S1: as I am when they hear that the Palestinian Authority
S1: government has resigned, at least symbolically. That's well and good.
S1: But isn't the real problem here Hamas anyway?
S2: It is. And the fact that Hamas is actually seen
S2: as the one group that has tried to do something.
S2: Abbas and his Palestinian Authority cronies have been known for
S2: inaction and corruption.
S1: You're listening to the land in the book. If you've
S1: joined us midstream, our host is Doctor Charlie Dyer. I'm
S1: John Yeager. We're working our way through a list of
S1: current events stories. The International Court of Justice met again,
S1: this time to consider issuing an advisory about Israel's control
S1: over the West Bank and Jerusalem. What impact could their
S1: ruling have on the current conflict?
S2: Yeah, this six day hearing, which ended this past Monday,
S2: is different than the previous one that was held. That
S2: hearing focused on charges of genocide that were brought by
S2: South Africa against Israel. And since Israel had signed that treaty,
S2: they appeared at that first hearing to defend themselves. This
S2: latest hearing focused on the UN General Assembly's request for
S2: an advisory opinion on the, quote, legal consequences of Israel's
S2: 56 year control of the West Bank and other Palestinian areas.
S2: The Palestinians claim Israel's guilty of ethnic cleansing, apartheid and
S2: genocide due to its long term rule of the area.
S2: They want the International Court of Justice to declare the
S2: Israeli occupation illegal and to order an immediate end. Advisory
S2: opinions like this one being sort are non-binding. They have
S2: no legal ramifications, but they can give diplomatic cover to
S2: other nations and encourage them to take action against Israel.
S2: The United States urged the court not to issue a
S2: ruling calling for Israel's immediate withdrawal from these areas. The
S2: US spokesman argued that both the UN Security Council and
S2: General Assembly had established a pathway to a peaceful resolution
S2: through negotiations that would exchange land for peace. Demanding Israel's
S2: unilateral withdrawal would harm Israel's very real security needs. Israel
S2: captured the West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem, the Sinai Peninsula
S2: and the Golan Heights back in 1967, in a defensive
S2: war launched against them by Egypt, Syria and Jordan. A
S2: UN resolution 242, passed shortly afterward called on Israel to
S2: withdraw from the territories it captured, but it also called
S2: for the termination of all claims or states of belligerence,
S2: and to acknowledge the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Israel
S2: and its right to live in peace within secure and
S2: recognized borders. That's the basis of the land for peace process.
S2: Israel made peace with Egypt and gave back the Sinai.
S2: For 20 years, Israel was engaged in peace talks with
S2: the Palestinians and two proposals were put forward. One was
S2: rejected at Camp David by Yasser Arafat, the other was
S2: rejected by Mahmoud Abbas. Now they want Israel to withdraw
S2: from all the land, but without any corresponding commitment to
S2: lasting peace. And October 7th showed why Israel distrust the Palestinians.
S2: 50 nations spoke John before this court, and very few
S2: stood up to speak for Israel. Thankfully, the US was
S2: one of those that did well.
S1: In an op ed piece on a Turkish news site,
S1: two Turkish authors charged that Israel is, quote, weaponizing archaeology
S1: by twisting historical findings to bolster Israel's claims to the land.
S1: How serious are those charges? And more importantly, are they true?
S2: Well, the charges are not true. It's actually these authors
S2: who've weaponized archaeology. They accused Israel of twisting historical findings
S2: to bolster the Zionist narrative. In reality, the charges don't
S2: fit the facts of history or archaeology. Israel is finding
S2: much evidence to support the reality that they're not Western colonizers,
S2: but indigenous inhabitants of the land. You know, they lived
S2: there from the time of Abraham until after the time
S2: of Jesus, and even after the Romans tried to ethnically
S2: cleanse them from the land, many still remained. From written
S2: references to the House of David on inscriptions. You found
S2: it tel Dan to the tunnel dug by King Hezekiah
S2: to divert the waters of the Gihon Spring to the
S2: Jewish ritual baths near the Temple Mount. In the time
S2: of Jesus. Archaeological evidence supporting Israel's presence in the land
S2: is indisputable. It's those who want to twist history, to
S2: claim the Jewish people are just a modern Western occupying
S2: power who are trying to dismantle the clear archaeological record.
S2: Is there archaeological evidence pointing to a clear Jewish presence
S2: in the land for the. Past 4000 years. There is.
S2: And that's what disturbs the authors of this op ed piece.
S2: But for those of us who accept the message of
S2: the Bible, the overwhelming archaeological evidence for Israel's presence in
S2: the land comes as no surprise. It matches what God
S2: has already revealed in His Word.
S1: Thank you Charlie. How can people pray for us as
S1: we travel throughout Israel?
S2: I think praying for safety and praying for wisdom that
S2: we would know who to meet, how to meet, and
S2: what to say to them at that time.
S1: Thank you for those prayers. We appreciate it. Well, when
S1: the Nazis invaded Holland, they made it illegal for anyone
S1: to house or even help a Jewish person. But Corrie
S1: ten boom and her family said no.
UU: Her story is next.
S1: When the Nazis invaded Holland, they made it illegal for
S1: anyone to house or even help a Jewish person. Would
S1: you have complied? Corrie, her sister Betsy, and her father
S1: Kasper were Christians who decided they simply could not obey
S1: this evil dictate. So they began hiding small groups of
S1: Jewish people and others who sought refuge. You might have
S1: heard of Corrie ten boom, but today you're about to
S1: meet her through a dramatic interpreter. Welcome to the land
S1: and the book. I'm Jon Jager. This month marks the
S1: 80th anniversary of the capture of Corrie Ten boom and
S1: her family. What if you could somehow go back in
S1: time and meet Corey? Ask her questions. What we're about
S1: to do just that. First, though, let's pause and think
S1: about some creative ways we can show the love of
S1: Jesus to the Jewish people who are in our lives.
S1: Let's listen to this. The Old Testament is rich with prophecy.
S1: How much of that, though, can you really talk about
S1: in a conversation with your Jewish friend? For example, what
S1: about Daniel's prophecies concerning the Maccabees and the events of Hanukkah?
S1: Roy Schwartz says with Chosen People Ministries, are we on
S1: safe ground talking about this kind of stuff?
S3: Sure. For a Gentile to know about Hanukkah, are you
S3: kidding me? Especially to know that it was spoken of
S3: by the Jewish prophet Daniel. Don't get into the New
S3: Testament necessarily. Just talk about the reality that God, through
S3: the prophet Daniel, foreshadowed and foresaw the actual events of
S3: Antiochus and the events of Hanukkah. Now, most Christians don't
S3: know that, but I suggest you study that and see
S3: how Daniel and Hanukkah fit together, and that will blow
S3: the mind of a Jewish person that you are interested
S3: in those things.
S1: All right, so maybe we need to do a little
S1: work on our own history and then reach out and
S1: share those prophecies from Daniel as a tool to bridge
S1: into the life of your unsaved Jewish friend. Roy Schwartz
S1: is with Chosen People Ministries. Always a pleasure to have
S1: him in the studio. All right. This is the land
S1: of the book, a very special edition on this 80th
S1: anniversary of the capture of Corrie Ten boom and her family.
S1: And because our time is limited, we're going to jump
S1: right into our conversation, imagining that we are actually with
S1: the real Corrie ten boom. All right, walk down the
S1: streets of Harlem and Holland with me. A short train
S1: ride from Amsterdam as we connect with Corrie ten boom.
S1: Now again, the real Corrie Ten boom has been with
S1: the Lord since 1983, but today we're going to experience
S1: a simulated conversation with her on the land and the
S1: book with a historical interpreter. We're going to meet her
S1: in her real life later. Cory, you are known for
S1: a thing called the hiding place. Describe this. How big
S1: was it and how was it used?
S4: Oh, my hiding place. We also call it the angels.
S4: Then you see, that was a place that was built
S4: in my bedroom because I was up on the third
S4: floor and that was give more time, you know, with
S4: a hiding place, you have to have alarm, too. And
S4: so it was tiny, some 30in wide and some eight
S4: feet long, could hold six people. And the outside it
S4: appeared as a closet, but the bottom shelf was door.
S4: So those who would be staying in our angels, then
S4: they would have to climb into that small opening, and
S4: then I would close the door. And so it looked
S4: like the the closet. Yes.
S1: Six people at a time in this eight foot long thing.
S4: Yes, yes. So they had to take the turns, of course.
S4: Some sitting, some lying down. There were vents up in
S4: the ceiling when we first were visited by the Dutch underground.
S4: They say you need a hiding place. And the Mr. Schmidt,
S4: he come and he look and he look in my bedroom.
S4: Then in the days to follow another Mr. Schmidt come
S4: with bricks, and then. Then another Mr. Schmidt come with
S4: wallpaper and paint and and another of it. Would my
S4: papa say, uh, he says, I don't recall there being
S4: so many. Schmidt's in Harlem. We say, oh, Papa, we
S4: don't want to know their name. We call them Schmidt,
S4: you know, in case they arrest us. Yes.
S1: Well, your family knew the severe penalty the Germans would
S1: exact from those court helping Jewish people. Why get so involved?
S1: What drove your family to do this?
S4: Oh, my. In 1844, my grandfather, who live in the
S4: house that we live, we called the Bay. He was
S4: a Christian man and he had prayer meeting and they
S4: meet every week to pray. But one day in 1844,
S4: grandfather was visited by a pastor, visiting and pastor come
S4: to grandfather. And he said to him, do you pray
S4: for the Jews? And grandfather thought. He says, no, I
S4: do not. He said, you should pray for the Jews.
S4: You know they are God's ancient people, his chosen people,
S4: chosen to bring us the Savior. You know, Jesus was Jewish, huh?
S4: And he shared in the Bible, it tells us to
S4: pray for the peace of Jerusalem, be concerned for the
S4: welfare of the Jews, and you will be blessed. And
S4: so grandfather taught, and he say, yes, I will do it.
S4: And so from that point on, every week they meet
S4: in that parlor room to pray for the Jews, and
S4: we say a very strange not to be understood answer
S4: to those prayers some 100 years later, in that very place, grandfather, son,
S4: grandchildren and others were arrested for hiding Jews who are.
S1: Today on the land. In the book, it's a simulated
S1: conversation with Corey Tenenbaum. On February 28th, 1944, a Dutch informant,
S1: Jan Vogel, told the Nazis about the ten boom's work.
S1: Around 12:30 p.m. that day, the Nazis arrested your entire family.
S1: Describe that experience. What was going on in your heart
S1: at that moment?
S4: Oh my. That day I was very sick with the
S4: flu and I was upstairs in the bed, but we
S4: had others there at our home. They were meeting for
S4: the Bible study. And then when Jan Vogel came and
S4: it was he was Quisling, he was traitor. But the
S4: alarm went off and running past me while I was
S4: laying in the bed were the four Jews and two
S4: underground workers. And as they run past me, they say, Tanta,
S4: that is. And they say this is a real raid.
S4: And so I jumped from my bed and I helped
S4: them into the hiding place and get them closed in.
S4: And I closed that door. Yes.
S1: Wow. What became of your father?
S4: Oh, my precious papa. So, dear. You know, that night when, uh,
S4: when we were arrested, uh, one of the Gestapo said
S4: to him. They say you are old man. If you
S4: will stop this nonsense with the Jews, you can die
S4: in your old bed. But my papa, look at him.
S4: And he say, if anyone comes to the bay, I
S4: will open my doors to them. And so they say,
S4: take him away. You know, he only lives some ten
S4: days in the prison because the conditions were such. It
S4: was too much for him. But all that great. And
S4: old men. And when they take him away from us,
S4: he looked back at us and he say, I love you,
S4: my children. The best is yet to be. You can
S4: trust the everlasting arms of Jesus. Jesus is Victor.
S5: Mhm.
S1: And yet the best wasn't immediate, that's for sure. You're
S1: hauled off to a work camp. Describe that work camp
S1: that you were in along with your sister Betsy. Remind
S1: us of things we don't quite understand about the conditions
S1: of daily life in prison like that.
S4: Oh my. First I was taken to an injured, which
S4: was to solitary confinement. Do you know, John? All my
S4: life I had been with other people in a very
S4: affirming atmosphere, but now totally alone. And when I would
S4: want to ask a question, they would say, shut up,
S4: no talking. You're a pig. Oh, my. Do you know
S4: to be talked to like that? But then from solitary
S4: I was taken to another camp. And then in September
S4: of 1944, myself, my sister Betsy, and others, they said
S4: to gather your things. You're leaving? We thought, oh, we're
S4: going to be released. But instead we were taken to
S4: Ravensbrück concentration camp in Germany. And oh, from the very beginning,
S4: the life was very harsh. I remember when they tell
S4: us we were in long line and they say all
S4: sorts of questions, but then they say, surrender your clothes.
S4: Do you know it was also humiliating? And as we
S4: stand in our nakedness before the guards. Oh, I think, oh, Jesus.
S4: But then I remember Jesus when he died on the cross,
S4: you know, he was naked and to suffer as Jesus. Oh,
S4: we were taken to barrack 28, a battery designed to
S4: hold 200. Now we're holding as many as 6 to
S4: 800 people. Oh, and when we come, I look. I say, Betsy, look,
S4: the floor is moving with vermin and the lice. Oh,
S4: but my sister Betsy, she squeezed my hand. She says, oh, but, Corrie,
S4: I'm thankful we are together. I say to her, well,
S4: I'm not thankful for the lice. Oh, but later a
S4: guard was there and say, every morning you must come
S4: out at 4 a.m. to roll call. If you don't
S4: come out, we come in and we shoot you. Oh my.
S4: But when that door close, one of the prisoners already
S4: in barrack 28 stand and say, welcome to your new home.
S4: We can do anything we want in here because, you see,
S4: the guards don't want to come in. They don't want
S4: to get the lice. Betsy, bump my arm and say, Gauri,
S4: even the lice we are thankful for. Oh, my. And
S4: in that place, we had smuggled a small Bible. And
S4: we were able to bring hope to a hopeless place.
S1: Yes, you mentioned Betsy quite a bit. Eventually Betsy's end
S1: came and that had to have been terribly hard on you.
S4: Yes, yes, Betsy told me one day. Oh, the treatment was.
S4: It was hard work and senseless, you know, move all
S4: these bricks from one place to another the next day.
S4: Who put the bricks there? Move the bricks. Oh, all senseless.
S4: But one day Betsy said to me, she said, Corrie,
S4: I have had a dream. And in my dream the
S4: Lord showed me that we will be released from here
S4: before the new year. Come, I say, oh, I pray
S4: it is true. She says no, I know it is true.
S4: And when we are released we will tell people everywhere.
S4: There is no pit so deep that God's love is
S4: not deeper still. Oh, and they will believe us because
S4: we have been here. Well, shortly before Christmas my sister
S4: was free, but she was dead. She died there. And
S4: then after Christmas I was standing in the roll call
S4: and my number was called. You know, we did not
S4: go by the names. We went by numbers 66730. My
S4: number was called. And when they call you number, you
S4: never see that person again. Oh my. And I thought
S4: I was walking surely to my death. But then they
S4: tell me to take the shower. And I thought it
S4: was gas chamber, but water come out and they give
S4: me my clothes. They say, Cornelius and boom! You have
S4: completed your sentence. Sign here. I say that they say yes.
S4: Sign that you have been well cared for. You know
S4: I sign it anyway, huh? But I learned later it
S4: was due to clerical error that I was released. Hmm.
S1: What did you hang on to spiritually that kept you
S1: from giving up what? One thing more than any other.
S4: Oh, truly, it was the love of God. You know,
S4: my papa told me from the time I was a
S4: small child. He say every life is valuable because we
S4: were created in the image of the Most High God.
S4: Every life is valuable. So I did not question God's
S4: love for me. No, I did it. Uh, perplexed. And
S4: why am I in this situation, Lord? But you know,
S4: as my sister say to one who questioned her. Why
S4: did God send you to this place? She looked at
S4: her and say, oh, so that we can tell you
S4: of his love. And that really was the sustaining thing,
S4: the love of God.
S1: You've been listening to a conversation today on the land
S1: in the book with somebody portraying Corrie ten boom, in
S1: the 80th year of the discovery of their hiding place.
S1: Cory actually lived from 1892 to 1983. And the name
S1: of our interpreter is Gail Haas. Gail is a wife, mother, grandmother,
S1: prayer warrior, teacher, and a storyteller. Thanks for being on
S1: the program, Gail.
S6: Thank you.
S1: Hey, do you find that as time goes by, fewer
S1: and fewer Christians are familiar with the life of Cory
S1: ten boom. Or worse yet, are there fewer and fewer
S1: who care?
S4: Well, there definitely, as we have the privilege of sharing
S4: Cory's story around the country. Yes, there are many who
S4: don't know of Cory Boom's story, and, um, I have
S4: the privilege of going into schools as well. They are
S4: studying the Holocaust, and so I'm able to bring Cory's
S4: story to life, and the students feel like they've really
S4: met a real Holocaust survivor. And so I think that
S4: it raises the bar for young people, because there were
S4: young people who were working in the Dutch underground with
S4: Cory giving their lives. And this challenge is a great
S4: challenge for our young people today.
S1: What one thing do you want your audiences to take
S1: away from your presentation, Gail?
S4: I think the greatest part is, of course, her story
S4: of after the war. Cory met in Germany, one of
S4: the guards from Ravensbrück, and after her talk, he's coming
S4: up to her and she recognizes him and and she thinks, oh,
S4: I don't even want to talk to him. And he
S4: comes to her and he looks at her and he says,
S4: he says, you may not know this, but I too
S4: was in Ravensbrück. And when I was there, I did
S4: terrible things. But since the war, I have met Jesus.
S4: And he's forgiven me my sins. Oh, but would you
S4: forgive me? And this guard extends his hand to her. And.
S4: And Corey is thinking, oh, I cannot. But she's reminded
S4: of words from her mama and papa that said, you
S4: cannot or you will not. And as she shares, you know,
S4: forgiveness is not a feeling, but a decision that we make.
S4: And she extends her hand to the man. And as
S4: they take hands, oh, she says, it's like electric runs
S4: through her arm and she says, yes, I forgive you.
S4: You are my brother. So the big takeaway is the
S4: incredible power of God's love and forgiveness.
S1: You have spent so much time studying the life of
S1: Corey Tenenbaum. When you finally meet her in heaven, what
S1: would you ask her? What are you going to ask her?
S4: Oh, I think we will just jump up and down
S4: together and hug. And it will be. It'll be a
S4: wonderful time. Yes.
S1: We've been visiting with Gail Haas, who portrays Cory Tannenbaum
S1: and others in her ministry. A link to information about
S1: her at our website. The land and the book, dawg.
S1: It's Bible questions and Charlie Dyer's answers next here on
S1: the land and the book. Passover. It will soon be
S1: upon us. And one of the traditional Passover questions is
S1: what makes this night different from all others? Well, Passover
S1: is an important biblical holiday for sure, and it has
S1: great meaning for both Jewish people and believers in Jesus. Charlie,
S1: I'm thinking that this question is a good one to ask.
S2: It is John. If you want to learn more about
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S2: That's life in messiah.org. All right.
S1: Let's get to our stack of questions for the day.
S1: These reach us by email and I'll share that address
S1: with you later on. But you know, Charlie, our question
S1: number one takes us to the angel who told Mary
S1: she would be with child. Mary asked, how can this be?
S1: Because I'm a virgin. Mary was engaged to be married
S1: at the time, and she would have clearly known that
S1: the pregnancy would have been a result of sexual relationship
S1: with her husband. So doesn't the fact that Mary asked
S1: this question, how can this be since I'm a virgin?
S1: Show that she must have taken a perpetual vow of virginity.
S2: Yeah, and actually, I don't see anything like that in
S2: the passage saying she took a vow of perpetual virginity. Now,
S2: she knew she hadn't had sexual relations because such actions
S2: weren't to be taken until marriage was formalized. So when
S2: Gabriel announced she was about to conceive and bear a son,
S2: her question seems actually quite natural how can I be pregnant?
S2: Since I've not known a man? And the word she
S2: uses there is the idea of knowing someone sexually most
S2: translated since I'm a virgin. But the Greek literally says
S2: since I am not knowing a man, the verb is
S2: in the present tense, picturing current action. So she's simply
S2: stating what seems to her rather obvious. She's betrothed to Joseph,
S2: but they haven't been sexually active, or nor has she
S2: with any other man, so she doesn't see how it's
S2: at all possible that she could have become pregnant by
S2: this time. And by the way, I think Matthew makes
S2: that clear in chapter one, verse 18. He also says
S2: she was pledged to be married to Joseph, but she
S2: had become pregnant before they came together in the sexual senses,
S2: husband and wife. But there's nothing in either passage that
S2: suggests some kind of a vow of perpetual virginity.
S1: Our listener Stephen has a follow up question, writing the
S1: angel did not greet Mary by her name, but by
S1: her identity. In Luke 128, the angel says, hail, thou
S1: that art highly favored. Doesn't the word that the angel
S1: uses there mean that Mary was a pure vessel of
S1: grace without sin?
S2: Well, in Luke 128, the word Luke uses is a
S2: perfect middle participle. How's that for grammar this time of day?
S1: I love it, Charlie. Yeah, but.
S2: It's from the Greek word carita. Oh, it's connection to
S2: the word keras, which has the idea of grace or favor.
S2: But here's the key. The same verb is used in
S2: an active sense in Ephesians one six, where Paul talks
S2: about the grace that God freely bestowed on us. Mary
S2: was indeed favored or blessed by God, but so are we.
S2: The use of the word doesn't mean she was without sin,
S2: just that she was highly favored by God, which is
S2: why she was selected. I don't want to disparage Mary.
S2: She's a remarkable woman of faith. At the same time,
S2: the word used by Luke doesn't demand that she be
S2: without sin any more than the fact that Paul used
S2: it of us suggests we're sinless. It's simply pouring meaning
S2: into that verb that's not there.
S1: You're listening to The land in the book from Moody Radio,
S1: our host, Doctor Charlie Dyer, is addressing questions that you
S1: can email us any old time if you've got one.
S1: The land and the book at Moody's Edu is How
S1: to connect. Okay, Gordon says, I've got 3 or 4
S1: friends that doubt the accuracy of the Bible. They say
S1: stuff like it's made up after the fact. It's just
S1: a bunch of unproven fables based on earlier manuscripts like
S1: the Epic of Gilgamesh. I'm aware that both Josh McDowell
S1: and Lee Strobel have written books providing proof of this
S1: historical accuracy of the Bible, but can you recommend 1
S1: or 2 other books that address whether we can truly
S1: trust the accuracy of the 66 books of the Bible?
S2: Well, the two books you mentioned are excellent, and I'm
S2: not sure adding additional books to that list will ultimately
S2: help your friends. You know, the real issue is faith.
S2: In Hebrews 11 it says, without faith, it's impossible to
S2: please God because anyone who comes to him has to
S2: believe that he exists and he rewards those who earnestly
S2: seek him. So in light of that, here's what I'd suggest. First,
S2: challenge your friends saying the real question is faith, and
S2: then say to them, okay, for the next month, would
S2: you be willing to read the Bible and then pray?
S2: And as you're praying, just ask God to say, if
S2: you exist, show yourself to me and then write down
S2: any impressions and have them come back to you and
S2: discuss what they found. And then second, if they say
S2: the Bible is full of errors, say to them, well,
S2: give me some examples. And I say that because a
S2: lot of people say, oh yeah, the Bible is full
S2: of mistakes, but they really can't identify any. It's just
S2: something they've heard repeated by others. But tell them if
S2: they come to you with those questions, you'll seriously try
S2: to get them an answer and do that, and then
S2: try and find those answers to come back to them. Now,
S2: there aren't enough books in the world to persuade someone
S2: who chooses not to believe. But if someone's willing to
S2: honestly seek for answers and interact with with the Bible
S2: and with God and with a good friend who can
S2: help them understand it, I think God will then work
S2: in their heart and bring them to a point of
S2: understanding and hopefully of faith.
S1: Cooper says he's concerned about the ways someone could violate
S1: revelation 22, verses 18 and 19, which talk about adding
S1: to or taking away from the words of prophecy. Do
S1: you think someone could violate revelation 22, 18, and 19
S1: in any way, through movements like sign language or other
S1: movements that directly communicate something? And if someone violates those verses,
S1: do you think that proves that they're not a Christian?
S2: Well, the word used there for AD two and in
S2: revelation 22 has the idea of imposing or placing something
S2: on what's already there. If someone tries to alter the
S2: meaning of what God has said by adding to it,
S2: a God then threatens that individual with plagues or judgments.
S2: If someone tries to explain away or remove what God
S2: has said, you know it says that, but it doesn't
S2: mean that something like that. Then God says he's going
S2: to remove them from having any part in the tree
S2: of life. Now, those are severe penalties that God's imposing,
S2: but he's doing it against people who deliberately try to
S2: change the meaning of what God has said is going
S2: to take place. Now, how specifically should we understand these
S2: words today? Well, at the very beginning of chapter 22,
S2: God said, blessed is he who keeps the word of
S2: the prophecy of this book. And the word for keep
S2: has the idea of keep or guard. Jesus said he'll
S2: bless those who accept what he said, and do what
S2: they can to protect themselves and others from trying to
S2: dismiss or distort that message. So in answer to your
S2: specific question, I don't think that the warnings against someone
S2: using sign language or or any other kind of physical action,
S2: the events he's describing are really things that are going
S2: to take place. And anyone who tries to get others
S2: to disbelieve it are the ones who are deliberately opposing God,
S2: and they're the ones being warned.
S1: Nick asks, was David abdicating his duty and granting Joab
S1: clemency instead of executing the law by saying, the Lord
S1: repay the evildoer according to his wickedness? Or was Solomon
S1: wrong for having Joab executed? It could be viewed that
S1: Solomon killed Joab because Joab wanted Adonijah to be king
S1: instead of Solomon. What do you think?
S2: Yeah, people are going to have to follow along, because
S2: that part of the Bible and most people's minds, their eyes,
S2: just go back in their head. But Joab was a
S2: loyal general to David, but he was, we might say,
S2: not a very nice guy. He ruthlessly ambushed. He killed
S2: Abner for killing his younger brother in battle, and Abner
S2: tried to talk his younger brother out of it. So
S2: Abner wasn't wrong and what he did. But Joab led
S2: in the killing of Absalom. Even though David ordered his
S2: men not to do that, Joab brutally murdered another man
S2: who had been tasked by David to put down a rebellion.
S2: And finally, while David was still alive, Joab took part
S2: in an ill fated plot to anoint David's son Adonijah
S2: as king rather than Solomon. So he was really a
S2: kind of a brutish guy trying to get his own way.
S2: When David gave his final instructions to Solomon prior to
S2: his death, he reminded Solomon. He said, you know yourself
S2: what Joab, son of Zariah, did to me what he
S2: did to the two commanders of Israel's enemy, Abner, son
S2: of Nir, and Amasa, son of John, whether he killed them,
S2: shedding their blood in peace time, as if in battle,
S2: and with that blood stained the belt around his waist
S2: and the sandals on his feet. On modern terms, we
S2: might say, he covered himself in the blood of the innocent.
S2: So why didn't David exercised judgment and order? Joab killed
S2: for what he had done. I think the answer is
S2: found in second Samuel three. David shows the people that
S2: he didn't have any part in these other executions. But
S2: then he says to his men privately, do you not
S2: realize that a prince and a great man has fallen
S2: this day? And today, though I'm the anointed king, I'm weak.
S2: And these sons of Zariah, that is, Joab and his
S2: other brother are too strong for me. David looked at
S2: the alignment of forces, and he realized those loyal to
S2: Joab and his brother were actually greater than those loyal
S2: to David. The kingdom was still fractured following the death
S2: of Saul, and David felt that if he demanded that
S2: Joab be brought to justice, it was just as likely
S2: that he'd be the one killed. So does this demonstrate
S2: weakness and a lack of faith on David's part? I'm
S2: not sure it may show weakness, but it may also
S2: show wisdom on David's part. But when he tells Solomon
S2: is to make sure that Joab does get his justice. Do.
S2: And Solomon wasn't wrong in putting him to death, because
S2: Joab tried to take the throne in place of Solomon.
S2: So Solomon was the one who assured that God's justice
S2: was indeed done.
S1: And a quick follow up from Nick, Romans 13 four,
S1: makes it pretty clear that even ungodly authorities have the
S1: right to use capital punishment. What do you think about that?
S2: Well, I think it's right. And in fact, what I
S2: would end up saying in general is the law should
S2: exercise justice, but there are times when it's appropriate to
S2: extend mercy. Now, when go back to that question on Joab,
S2: I don't think. That's what was taking place. To use
S2: the language used today. His sentence was postponed, but it
S2: was never commuted. God may be patient, but justice will
S2: eventually get done.
S1: And that's a look at some of the questions that
S1: have come in. If you didn't hear yours today and
S1: you did submit it. Hang in there. We'll get to
S1: it on a future broadcast. And if you'd like to
S1: submit a question, our email address is The Land and
S1: the book at Moody Edu. It's been a while since
S1: you've been to the website, man, we'd love you to
S1: check it out. Information about today's guest pass programs. Future programs.
S1: All there at the land and the book. Org. More
S1: to come in Charlie's devotional. It's next right.
UU: Here. We're glad you're.
S1: Still with us here at The Land. In the book,
S1: I'm John Jaeger. One of the highlights of any trip
S1: to Israel is a visit to the Dead Sea. People
S1: who have never been there say, oh, isn't that the
S1: place where you can float in the water? And my
S1: answer is, it's stranger than that. It's impossible not to
S1: float in the Dead Sea if there's just a few
S1: inches of water that you're in. And the reason for
S1: all that is one word salt. Charlie Dyer, are you
S1: suggesting there's something in the salt that might just offer
S1: a lesson that we need to hang on to?
S2: Oh, there's an incredible lesson from that salt, John. And
S2: that's what I want to talk about.
S1: Well, we'll head down for a relaxing dip in the
S1: Dead Sea after this fully alive testimony from someone who
S1: has experienced Israel and shares this with us.
S7: One of the things that has really impressed me about
S7: this particular tour is how organized the group has been like.
S7: I've read about different tours, and I really believe that
S7: this tour has visited more places than any other tour
S7: that I've ever read about. I remember getting the book
S7: by Doctor Dyer about a Christians travel to the Holy Land,
S7: and being able to study about the different places and
S7: cross-reference them in my Bible before coming here. And we
S7: got a map, and we just got so many things
S7: that were in addition to over and above any other
S7: tour that I've read about. We received a journal that
S7: we could take on our trip, and I have been
S7: writing in it and taking notes. We received so many
S7: different things that are helping me a bag, you know,
S7: that travel bag that we could take? Name tag, luggage tags.
S7: I just was very impressed by this group and how
S7: you have organized things and just given to us to
S7: make the trip better.
S1: I'm looking forward to this devotional series, Charlie. It's called
S1: objects on the shelf. Yeah.
S2: Thanks, John. For the next three weeks, I'm inviting you
S2: to join me here in my office. Now, don't look
S2: too closely at all the books and bric a brac
S2: filling my shelves. I've got books squeezed into every available
S2: space in a random. Some would probably say chaotic order.
S2: But what's important is I know where the books are.
S2: When I go to find something. All the other items
S2: are curios that I've collected in my travels that take
S2: me back to particular places and times, and that each
S2: have a story to tell. And for the next three weeks,
S2: I want to share a few of those stories with you.
S2: Today's treasure sits on a shelf just to my right.
S2: At first glance, it might remind you of something you
S2: saw in a high school or college geology class, or
S2: perhaps in a visit to a store that sells geodes.
S2: This one doesn't look overly impressive because it's relatively flat,
S2: about four by six inches in size and formed from
S2: all white crystals. Now, what makes it interesting to me
S2: is I picked it up from the Dead Sea. Actually,
S2: it's a clump of salt that had crystallized on a
S2: pipe just under the surface of the Dead Sea. I've
S2: been floating in the bathwater. Warm water. When I noticed
S2: it on the pipe, I tugged on it and it
S2: slid off the pipe into my hand. The bottom is
S2: curved to match. The shape of the pipe at the top.
S2: Retained the jagged design formed by the salt crystals. Now
S2: this earned a place on my shelf for two reasons.
S2: The first had to do with getting it home for
S2: the rest of our trip. I had to let the
S2: piece sit on our different hotel room desks to get
S2: it to dry. I didn't want it to dissolve into
S2: smaller salt crystals on my flight home, so I also
S2: wrapped it in toilet paper and put it in a
S2: Ziploc bag. My suitcase was filled, so I asked my
S2: wife if I could put it in her suitcase. She
S2: agreed and we were ready to head home. Or at
S2: least that's what I thought. That was several years ago,
S2: when Israel had just installed a machine to detect chemical
S2: components of explosives. That machine set out in the security area,
S2: and you had to clear it before being allowed to
S2: proceed to check in on my suitcase went through without
S2: any problems, and then they ran my wife's suitcase through
S2: the machine and then pulled it aside for a more
S2: thorough inspection. It seems that in addition to sodium chloride
S2: common salt, the Dead Sea also contains magnesium, potassium, and
S2: several other minerals that can trigger the machine. Once they
S2: opened her suitcase and found the bag with the salt,
S2: we were cleared for departure. But the second reason I've
S2: kept that block of Dead Sea salt on my shelf
S2: is more biblical. To understand why, imagine living in Israel
S2: in Old Testament times, the Dead Sea, which, by the way,
S2: is never called that in the Bible, actually plays an
S2: important role in your life. Archaeologists have discovered ruins of
S2: what's likely a processing area where the salt was extracted
S2: from the Dead Sea. The salt was used for seasoning food,
S2: but it was also used as a preservative and a disinfectant.
S2: Ezekiel 16 describes the practice of mothers rubbing newborn children
S2: with salt, and in Leviticus 213, God required sacrifices to
S2: be seasoned with salt. In the Bible, the Dead Sea
S2: is called the Eastern Sea, the salt sea, the sea
S2: of the Arabah, or simply the sea. The Romans and
S2: Josephus called it Lake Asphalt. Titus, because of the blobs
S2: of tarry, asphalt like material that on occasion could float
S2: to the surface. Now lots of different names, but the
S2: one found most often in the Bible is simply the
S2: salt sea. And if you've ever had an opportunity to
S2: visit the Dead Sea, you know why the name is
S2: so appropriate. The mineral content is so dense that you
S2: physically cannot sink, and if you have any slight nicks
S2: or cuts, you'll know exactly where they are. It's the
S2: equivalent of pouring salt on an open wound, and apart
S2: from a small area where a freshwater spring drains into
S2: the Dead Sea, the entire body of water is devoid
S2: of fish. They simply can't live in the water because
S2: of its high mineral content. And that's what makes my
S2: souvenir so important. I keep it as a reminder that
S2: someday God has said he'll do the impossible. In Ezekiel 36,
S2: God promised to bring Israel back to the land in
S2: a new covenant relationship. God then provided three examples to
S2: show how dramatic the change will be in chapter 37,
S2: God compared it to a valley of dry, bleached bones
S2: joining together and coming back to life. And in the
S2: same chapter, God used two sticks being joined together to
S2: show that this return will include both the northern Kingdom
S2: of Israel and the southern Kingdom of Judah. The promise
S2: was for all the descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
S2: But God reserved his greatest illustration for the Dead Sea.
S2: In chapter 47, God promised that life giving water would
S2: flow from a rebuilt temple down to the Jordan Valley
S2: and into the sea. Geographically, that would be the Dead Sea.
S2: And then, he says, when it empties into the sea,
S2: the waters there become fresh swarms of living creatures will live.
S2: Wherever the river flows. There will be large numbers of fish,
S2: because this water flows there and makes the salt water fresh.
S2: So where the river flows, everything will live. The Dead
S2: Sea coming to life, turning into freshwater, teeming with fish
S2: is the ultimate illustration God will use. In the coming
S2: Kingdom era to demonstrate his faithful promise to bring his
S2: people back to the land. Now, I'm not a fisherman,
S2: but Ezekiel 4710 goes on to describe the Dead Sea
S2: as a future destination for those who like to fish.
S2: Fishermen will stand along the shore from an jetty to
S2: any time there will be places for spreading nets. The
S2: fish will be of many kinds, like the fish of
S2: the great sea. This dead, salty body of water will
S2: become a freshwater Paradise. But doesn't that also create a problem?
S2: The Dead Sea was the chief source for salt in
S2: the region, and salt was a valuable commodity. But if
S2: the Dead Sea becomes a freshwater lake, where will the
S2: people go to get salt? This isn't something we think
S2: about very often because we go to the store to
S2: buy salt. It's a rather common commodity. But to the
S2: audience in Ezekiel's day, this could create concern because salt
S2: was valuable. And I believe that's why God adds an
S2: otherwise obscure statement in the very next verse. But the
S2: swamps and marshes will not become fresh. They will be
S2: left for salt in bringing about a dramatic transformation, turning
S2: the salt sea into a freshwater lake. God hastens to
S2: add that he will also continue to care for the
S2: needs of his people by retaining a marshy area where
S2: salt will remain. God thinks of everything. Well, it's almost
S2: time to leave. Take one last look at my hunk
S2: of salt, and then remember God's amazing promise to Israel
S2: and its application to us as well. And promising to
S2: restore the nation of Israel physically and spiritually. God was
S2: promising to do the impossible, and the Dead Sea becoming
S2: fresh will be a reminder of that in future days.
S2: But even as God demonstrates his power, he will also
S2: demonstrate his care for every detail of life. The water
S2: turns fresh, but he allows an area of salt to
S2: remain less. God's blessing also become a hardship. And for you,
S2: what are you struggling with today? God has promised to
S2: never leave you nor forsake you, to meet your needs,
S2: and to someday take you to be with him in heaven.
S2: But while you're watching for the big promises of God,
S2: the making the Dead Sea come alive sort of promises.
S2: Don't forget to look for the less spectacular everyday blessings.
S2: He also provides the leaving behind the salt kind of blessings. Or,
S2: as Johnson Oatman described it in the old gospel song
S2: count your Blessings. Name them one by one, and it
S2: will surprise you what the Lord has done.
S1: Thank you Charlie. We'll look forward to more from your
S1: objects on the shelf devotional series. Our time is gone,
S1: but we thank you for listening, and we thank you
S1: for encouraging a friend to listen with you as well.
S1: Pass along the good word about this broadcast and point
S1: them to our website where they can find the podcast.
S1: You'll find us at the land and the book.org. That's
S1: the land and the book.org. For our host, Charlie Dyer,
S1: our producer, Dan Anderson, I'm John Jaeger, thanking you for
S1: listening to The Land and the book, a production of
S1: Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.