1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,400 S1: Hi friends, this is Janet Parshall. Thanks so much for 2 00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:05,160 S1: downloading this podcast, and I hope you hear something that 3 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,560 S1: will really encourage and edify you. But before you start 4 00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:09,400 S1: to listen, let me take a moment of your time 5 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:11,399 S1: and tell you about this month's truth tool. It's called 6 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:14,640 S1: secure How to Have a Healthy Attachment to God. And 7 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,360 S1: it follows that very often, whatever our relationship is like 8 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:21,000 S1: with authority figures, predominantly our parents, we somehow transferred to 9 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,040 S1: how we see God. So if we have an angry parent, 10 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:25,319 S1: he's an angry God. If it's a distant parent, he's 11 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:27,520 S1: a God who's not there. I think it's important we 12 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:30,680 S1: understand who God really is. And in this wonderful book 13 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,760 S1: called secure, you're going to discover the character of God 14 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:37,120 S1: and how deeply in love God is with you. It's 15 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:38,839 S1: our truth tool. Our truth tools are my way of 16 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:41,680 S1: saying thank you because we are listener supported radio. So 17 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,600 S1: if you'd like a copy of secure, just call eight 7758. 18 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:48,760 S1: That's eight 7758. Give a gift of any amount. My 19 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:50,840 S1: way of saying thank you for supporting the program is 20 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:53,000 S1: I'll send you a copy of secure. You can also 21 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,480 S1: do this online at in the Market with Janet Parshall. 22 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:58,560 S1: Scroll to the bottom of the page. There's the cover 23 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:01,890 S1: of the book secure. Click on the photo. Go right 24 00:01:01,890 --> 00:01:03,930 S1: on through. Make your donation and we'll send you a 25 00:01:03,930 --> 00:01:06,730 S1: copy again of secure. If you want to consider becoming 26 00:01:06,730 --> 00:01:09,890 S1: a partial partner, that is the ever increasing circle of 27 00:01:09,890 --> 00:01:12,050 S1: friends who give every single month at a level of 28 00:01:12,090 --> 00:01:14,330 S1: their own choosing. And my way of saying thank you 29 00:01:14,330 --> 00:01:16,770 S1: is this you always get the truth tool for each 30 00:01:16,770 --> 00:01:18,930 S1: and every month. And in addition to that, you get 31 00:01:18,930 --> 00:01:21,850 S1: a weekly newsletter that includes some of my writing and 32 00:01:21,850 --> 00:01:24,410 S1: a little audio piece just for my partial partners. So 33 00:01:24,410 --> 00:01:27,369 S1: either way, thank you in advance for prayerfully considering the 34 00:01:27,370 --> 00:01:30,650 S1: opportunity to financially support in the market with Janet partial 35 00:01:30,650 --> 00:01:32,690 S1: and keeping it on the air. Now, I hope you 36 00:01:32,730 --> 00:01:34,850 S1: hear something that will encourage you to get out and 37 00:01:34,850 --> 00:01:37,850 S1: influence and occupy in the marketplace of ideas. 38 00:01:40,250 --> 00:01:41,770 S2: Here are some of the news headlines we're watching. 39 00:01:42,010 --> 00:01:44,290 S3: The conference was over. The president won a pledge. 40 00:01:44,490 --> 00:01:46,529 S4: Americans worshiping government over God. 41 00:01:46,850 --> 00:01:50,250 S3: Extremely rare safety move by a major 17 years. 42 00:01:50,250 --> 00:01:52,290 S5: The Palestinians and Israelis negotiated. 43 00:01:52,650 --> 00:01:53,970 S6: This is not. 44 00:02:07,890 --> 00:02:10,330 S1: Hi friends. Welcome to In the Market with Janet partial. 45 00:02:10,330 --> 00:02:12,690 S1: A very happy Thursday to you. Just a heads up 46 00:02:12,930 --> 00:02:15,570 S1: to my partial partners. Thursdays are the day we send 47 00:02:15,570 --> 00:02:18,090 S1: our newsletter to you, so be sure and check your 48 00:02:18,090 --> 00:02:22,050 S1: mailbox and enjoy the newsletter. It goes to my partial partners, 49 00:02:22,050 --> 00:02:24,490 S1: who are people who give every single month to support 50 00:02:24,490 --> 00:02:27,210 S1: this program a level of their own choosing. You always 51 00:02:27,210 --> 00:02:29,089 S1: get whatever the truth tool is for the month. Plus 52 00:02:29,090 --> 00:02:32,609 S1: you get the weekly newsletter, which includes my writing and 53 00:02:32,610 --> 00:02:34,970 S1: a bit of audio that goes just to my partial partners. 54 00:02:34,970 --> 00:02:37,130 S1: So if you'd like to join that group of people 55 00:02:37,169 --> 00:02:40,290 S1: who support the program every month, just go to in 56 00:02:40,330 --> 00:02:43,770 S1: the market with Janet partial scroll to the bottom of 57 00:02:43,810 --> 00:02:46,090 S1: the page. You're going to see a picture of the 58 00:02:46,090 --> 00:02:48,769 S1: book that says secure. That's the name of the book. 59 00:02:48,810 --> 00:02:51,410 S1: My friend Ken Zadek wrote it about how he can 60 00:02:51,410 --> 00:02:54,290 S1: have that secure attachment to know that God loves us. 61 00:02:54,290 --> 00:02:56,730 S1: Even if your earthly father, or someone who's very important 62 00:02:56,730 --> 00:03:00,420 S1: in your life made you feel that you couldn't trust anybody. Therefore, 63 00:03:00,419 --> 00:03:03,580 S1: you had this detachment with people and you feel detached 64 00:03:03,580 --> 00:03:06,100 S1: from God. So it's a wonderful truth tool. But if 65 00:03:06,100 --> 00:03:07,940 S1: you're a partial partner, you're going to get that and 66 00:03:07,940 --> 00:03:09,980 S1: you get the newsletter that comes out every Thursday. So 67 00:03:09,980 --> 00:03:15,780 S1: if you'd like the truth tool just alone. 877858877 Janet 58. 68 00:03:15,820 --> 00:03:18,060 S1: Ask for a copy of secure. Give a gift of 69 00:03:18,060 --> 00:03:19,860 S1: any amount. My way of saying thank you. We'll give 70 00:03:19,860 --> 00:03:21,620 S1: you a copy of the book. If you want to 71 00:03:21,620 --> 00:03:23,780 S1: become a partial partner or get the truth tool and 72 00:03:23,780 --> 00:03:27,340 S1: do it online in the market with Janet Parshall. Scroll 73 00:03:27,340 --> 00:03:29,260 S1: to the bottom of the page. Click on the picture 74 00:03:29,260 --> 00:03:32,660 S1: of secure. Make your donation and say that you'd either 75 00:03:32,660 --> 00:03:34,459 S1: like to be a partial partner, or you'd just like 76 00:03:34,460 --> 00:03:37,220 S1: the truth tool. All of that is available for you. Uh, 77 00:03:37,220 --> 00:03:39,460 S1: the world is percolating right now. I hope we're all 78 00:03:39,460 --> 00:03:43,060 S1: very aware of what's happening. The president had his initial 79 00:03:43,060 --> 00:03:46,380 S1: meeting of the Board of Peace today. Lots of conversation, 80 00:03:46,420 --> 00:03:49,700 S1: lots of talk about Gaza and what's going to happen there. 81 00:03:49,700 --> 00:03:52,260 S1: And at the same time, just over here to the 82 00:03:52,260 --> 00:03:56,780 S1: right a little bit, we're watching this massive military buildup 83 00:03:56,980 --> 00:04:00,860 S1: around Iran. And basically the president has made the statement 84 00:04:00,860 --> 00:04:03,620 S1: as he was flying from Washington, D.C. to Georgia to 85 00:04:03,660 --> 00:04:05,900 S1: give a speech on the economy. He was asked by 86 00:04:05,900 --> 00:04:07,940 S1: part of the press pool that followed him on Air 87 00:04:07,940 --> 00:04:10,780 S1: Force One, what's going to happen with Iran? And his 88 00:04:10,820 --> 00:04:13,780 S1: answer was succinct, but pretty clear. He said, we're going 89 00:04:13,820 --> 00:04:15,700 S1: to get a deal one way or another. We can 90 00:04:15,700 --> 00:04:17,900 S1: do this easy, or we're going to get a deal 91 00:04:17,900 --> 00:04:19,859 S1: one way or the other. So the bottom line is 92 00:04:20,140 --> 00:04:22,099 S1: this is when you and I pray for those in authority, 93 00:04:22,100 --> 00:04:25,260 S1: because this is a big issue and what will happen 94 00:04:25,260 --> 00:04:28,420 S1: in the next possible 24 hours to ten days, we 95 00:04:28,420 --> 00:04:31,340 S1: don't know. But boy, if our leaders ever needed wisdom, 96 00:04:31,339 --> 00:04:33,859 S1: it's right now. Let me go back to Gaza. A 97 00:04:33,900 --> 00:04:36,500 S1: CBN report from Paul Pettite. Have a listen to this. 98 00:04:36,820 --> 00:04:39,580 S7: Threats of war escalate in the Middle East as the U.S. 99 00:04:39,580 --> 00:04:44,300 S7: military buildup continues. This graphic shows the recent buildup of U.S. 100 00:04:44,339 --> 00:04:47,300 S7: air power in the Middle East. The Wall Street Journal 101 00:04:47,300 --> 00:04:50,500 S7: reporting it's the largest in the region since the Iraq 102 00:04:50,500 --> 00:04:55,230 S7: War in 2003. In Israel, the IDF Home Front Command 103 00:04:55,270 --> 00:04:58,830 S7: has been directed to prepare for full scale war. Iran 104 00:04:58,830 --> 00:05:02,430 S7: is holding joint naval exercises with Russia and the Chinese. 105 00:05:02,750 --> 00:05:05,830 S7: The regime is also calling on Hezbollah to join them 106 00:05:05,830 --> 00:05:08,229 S7: in the event of a U.S. military strike. 107 00:05:08,270 --> 00:05:11,589 S8: There are many reasons and arguments that one could make 108 00:05:11,630 --> 00:05:14,630 S8: for a strike against the against Iran. 109 00:05:14,910 --> 00:05:18,310 S7: U.S. military officials say they're ready to strike as early 110 00:05:18,310 --> 00:05:22,750 S7: as Saturday. Levitt reiterated that little progress was made during 111 00:05:22,750 --> 00:05:24,430 S7: Wednesday's nuclear talks. 112 00:05:24,470 --> 00:05:27,390 S8: Diplomacy is always his first option, and Iran would be 113 00:05:27,390 --> 00:05:31,030 S8: very wise to make a deal with President Trump and 114 00:05:31,029 --> 00:05:32,310 S8: with this administration. 115 00:05:32,350 --> 00:05:35,990 S7: Secretary of War Pete Hegseth told CBN news the decision 116 00:05:35,990 --> 00:05:38,910 S7: to strike Iran lies with President Trump. 117 00:05:39,070 --> 00:05:41,670 S9: Should they not follow through on commitments? Should they not 118 00:05:41,670 --> 00:05:44,350 S9: be willing to make a deal? The president has options. 119 00:05:44,390 --> 00:05:46,470 S9: The only one that will make this decision. Well, two 120 00:05:46,470 --> 00:05:48,990 S9: people will make this decision. Iranians can step up and 121 00:05:48,990 --> 00:05:51,670 S9: make a real deal. And then ultimately, President Trump will 122 00:05:51,670 --> 00:05:54,920 S9: decide whether or not it's a deal, it's good enough 123 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:56,120 S9: for the American people. 124 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:59,800 S7: Middle East political analyst Esther Brown says any deal with 125 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,279 S7: Iran should come with reservation. Brown recently wrote this Times 126 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:08,200 S7: of Israel article titled Built to Deceive Why Iran Can't 127 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,760 S7: Make a Real Deal, where she explains the Iranian Islamic 128 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:14,040 S7: tactic known as taki. 129 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:20,320 S10: Taki was a survival mechanism. The believer could conceal his faith, 130 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:24,280 S10: conceal his style of life, to save his life, to 131 00:06:24,320 --> 00:06:27,040 S10: save his property, to save his community. 132 00:06:27,279 --> 00:06:31,960 S7: Brown says Western diplomacy wants to resolve conflicts. Iranian culture 133 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,240 S7: uses taqiya to manage it. 134 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:36,120 S10: It's not like they are lying because they have a 135 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:38,320 S10: purpose to lie. It's just the way how they see 136 00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:40,440 S10: the whole process of negotiations. 137 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:43,240 S7: Paul Pettit, CBN news, Jerusalem. 138 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,520 S1: Let me go to France 24 now where they report 139 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:48,120 S1: on the president kicking off this initial meeting of the 140 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:49,080 S1: Board of Peace. 141 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:53,160 S11: It's another step in U.S. President Donald Trump's ambitious plan 142 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:56,839 S11: for Gaza and potentially the world. More than 20 countries 143 00:06:56,839 --> 00:06:59,720 S11: will attend the Board of Peace's first meeting in Washington 144 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:04,000 S11: on Thursday. Israel, along with several other Middle Eastern delegations 145 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,960 S11: such as Qatar, the United Arab Emirates and Turkey, will 146 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:10,400 S11: also be joining. However, despite the summit being about the 147 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:14,800 S11: future of Gaza, there is no direct Palestinian representation. The 148 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:16,680 S11: aim of this first meeting will be to shore up 149 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:20,840 S11: fundraising and to propel Trump's fragile ceasefire plan for the enclave. 150 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:24,160 S8: President Trump will host a Board of Peace meeting at 151 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:27,200 S8: the Donald J. Trump Institute of Peace, where he will 152 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:31,880 S8: announce that member states have pledged more than $5 billion 153 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:36,120 S8: towards the Gaza humanitarian and reconstruction efforts, and have also 154 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:40,960 S8: committed thousands of personnel to the International Stabilization Force and 155 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:45,080 S8: local police to maintain security and peace for Gazans. 156 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:48,960 S11: But the White House's efforts have not been entirely embraced 157 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:53,090 S11: by everyone. Major European allies such as France, Germany and 158 00:07:53,090 --> 00:07:56,090 S11: the UK have decided not to join the board. The 159 00:07:56,090 --> 00:08:00,970 S11: EU Commission president, Ursula von der Leyen, also declined an invitation. Instead, 160 00:08:00,970 --> 00:08:06,090 S11: the bloc and some other European countries will send observers. Meanwhile, 161 00:08:06,090 --> 00:08:09,450 S11: another snub came from the Vatican. The Holy See's top 162 00:08:09,450 --> 00:08:12,650 S11: diplomatic official said such crisis efforts should be managed by 163 00:08:12,650 --> 00:08:13,290 S11: the UN. 164 00:08:15,890 --> 00:08:18,530 S12: No, the Vatican will not participate in the Board of Peace, 165 00:08:18,530 --> 00:08:21,809 S12: given its particular nature, which is clearly not that of 166 00:08:21,810 --> 00:08:25,690 S12: other states. Evidently, there are points that leave us a 167 00:08:25,690 --> 00:08:29,410 S12: little perplexed. Some critical points that need to be explained. 168 00:08:36,210 --> 00:08:39,730 S11: The white House called the decision deeply unfortunate and insisted 169 00:08:39,730 --> 00:08:43,610 S11: it was a legitimate organization. Trump himself suggested it would 170 00:08:43,610 --> 00:08:47,410 S11: expand beyond Gaza and aim to tackle global conflicts. This 171 00:08:47,410 --> 00:08:50,170 S11: has raised concerns that the Board of Peace might try 172 00:08:50,170 --> 00:08:52,690 S11: and compete with the United Nations itself. 173 00:08:54,090 --> 00:08:56,410 S1: Well, I'm not sure competing with the United Nations is 174 00:08:56,410 --> 00:08:59,130 S1: all that bad, but that's just my $0.02, by the way. 175 00:08:59,410 --> 00:09:02,010 S1: At the meeting today, Secretary of State Marco Rubio said 176 00:09:02,010 --> 00:09:04,290 S1: there is no plan B for Gaza. Plan B is 177 00:09:04,290 --> 00:09:07,170 S1: going back to war. Plan A, he said, is the 178 00:09:07,170 --> 00:09:10,449 S1: only path forward, and that's one that rebuilds Gaza in 179 00:09:10,450 --> 00:09:13,370 S1: a way of enduring and sustainable peace, where no one 180 00:09:13,370 --> 00:09:17,730 S1: has to worry about returning to conflict, human suffering and destruction. 181 00:09:17,890 --> 00:09:20,130 S1: So it'll be very interesting to see what happens. All 182 00:09:20,130 --> 00:09:23,290 S1: those people gathering together on this under the umbrella of 183 00:09:23,290 --> 00:09:25,290 S1: a Board of Peace, and all I could think of 184 00:09:25,330 --> 00:09:27,450 S1: is the only one who will bring lasting peace is 185 00:09:27,450 --> 00:09:30,850 S1: the Prince of Peace himself. In the meantime, it's conflict 186 00:09:30,890 --> 00:09:33,970 S1: time out. Conflict time out until Jesus comes and takes 187 00:09:33,970 --> 00:09:36,330 S1: us home. Pray for those in authority. They really need 188 00:09:36,330 --> 00:09:54,100 S1: it back after this. How does our view of God 189 00:09:54,100 --> 00:09:57,140 S1: get distorted? Do you struggle with feeling close to God? Well, 190 00:09:57,140 --> 00:09:59,540 S1: that's why I've chosen secure how to have a healthy 191 00:09:59,540 --> 00:10:02,540 S1: attachment to God. As this month's truth tool, discover how 192 00:10:02,540 --> 00:10:05,179 S1: to counter the lies about the truth of God's character. 193 00:10:05,340 --> 00:10:07,500 S1: Ask for your copy of secure. When you give a 194 00:10:07,540 --> 00:10:10,580 S1: gift of any amount to in the market, call 877 195 00:10:10,620 --> 00:10:14,819 S1: Janet 58. That's 877 Janet 58 or go to in 196 00:10:14,860 --> 00:10:21,940 S1: the market with Janet Parshall. Oh. I'm so glad you're 197 00:10:21,940 --> 00:10:24,620 S1: joining us on today's edition of In the Market with Janet. 198 00:10:25,020 --> 00:10:28,220 S1: And I'm particularly excited about this conversation today because I 199 00:10:28,220 --> 00:10:30,860 S1: get to turn the tables on one. Maggie Roe, who 200 00:10:30,860 --> 00:10:33,900 S1: for years has helped me procure some of the greatest 201 00:10:33,900 --> 00:10:37,500 S1: minds and softest hearts in Christendom, working as she did 202 00:10:37,500 --> 00:10:40,860 S1: for years as a PR professional for Tyndale House, and 203 00:10:40,860 --> 00:10:44,300 S1: did a marvelous job just connecting me with wonderful people 204 00:10:44,300 --> 00:10:46,780 S1: who had wonderful stories to tell. But now I get 205 00:10:46,780 --> 00:10:48,820 S1: to turn the table and I get to talk to her. 206 00:10:48,820 --> 00:10:51,860 S1: Not as a PR prof, uh, from Tyndale House, but 207 00:10:51,860 --> 00:10:54,380 S1: rather as someone who's written her own book. It's called 208 00:10:54,380 --> 00:10:58,380 S1: This Life We Share journeying well with God and others. 209 00:10:58,380 --> 00:11:01,020 S1: And I have a funny feeling I know why this 210 00:11:01,020 --> 00:11:02,620 S1: is the book that she's authored, but I'm going to 211 00:11:02,620 --> 00:11:05,100 S1: let that part of the story come out from her. 212 00:11:05,100 --> 00:11:07,220 S1: But let me just tell you that Maggie is a 213 00:11:07,220 --> 00:11:10,420 S1: national speaker. She's a dramatist, she's a blogger, she's a writer. 214 00:11:10,420 --> 00:11:14,140 S1: She performs original one woman dramas, and she's passionate about 215 00:11:14,140 --> 00:11:16,660 S1: connecting people to God and each other. She spent a 216 00:11:16,660 --> 00:11:20,020 S1: quarter of a century in ministry in New England with 217 00:11:20,020 --> 00:11:23,300 S1: her pastor husband, and she taught at Daniel Webster University 218 00:11:23,300 --> 00:11:26,619 S1: and directed women's ministries throughout the six New England states. 219 00:11:26,980 --> 00:11:30,540 S1: And again when she was also in the Chicagoland area. 220 00:11:30,580 --> 00:11:32,300 S1: Not only was she at Tyndale House, but she would 221 00:11:32,300 --> 00:11:36,220 S1: be a guest communications instructor at Wheaton College as well. So, Maggie, 222 00:11:36,260 --> 00:11:38,700 S1: first of all, the warmest of welcomes. How fun to 223 00:11:38,740 --> 00:11:40,460 S1: turn the tables on you and to be able to 224 00:11:40,500 --> 00:11:44,300 S1: talk with you about your book. And congratulations on the book. 225 00:11:44,380 --> 00:11:48,350 S1: And I just have to ask you. I'm so jealous. Okay, 226 00:11:48,390 --> 00:11:53,230 S1: I'm in the Mid-Atlantic. We all know about Asheville, North Carolina. Uh, 227 00:11:53,270 --> 00:11:55,430 S1: we have heard that it's where God goes to take 228 00:11:55,429 --> 00:11:57,429 S1: a vacation. Can you confirm that? 229 00:11:58,309 --> 00:12:00,550 S13: Oh, Janet. Well, first of all, thank you for having 230 00:12:00,550 --> 00:12:02,710 S13: me on the show. Yes, I used to be in 231 00:12:02,710 --> 00:12:05,510 S13: public relations, but I swear you are the best publicist 232 00:12:05,510 --> 00:12:08,270 S13: that could be out there. That was a beautiful introduction. 233 00:12:08,390 --> 00:12:12,990 S13: I am so impressed. Thank you. Friend. And yes, they 234 00:12:12,990 --> 00:12:16,630 S13: do say that North Carolina is where God gets his mail. 235 00:12:17,150 --> 00:12:19,630 S13: So I'm just saying, you know, nothing against the rest 236 00:12:19,630 --> 00:12:22,870 S13: of the country, but I think he has more than 237 00:12:22,870 --> 00:12:26,189 S13: a summer home down in these parts. It is lovely. Absolutely. 238 00:12:26,910 --> 00:12:29,550 S1: It's tremendous down there. I'm so glad you're there. And 239 00:12:29,630 --> 00:12:31,510 S1: it really is a bit of culture shock being a 240 00:12:31,510 --> 00:12:35,270 S1: midwest transplant out to the Mid-Atlantic. You going but you 241 00:12:35,270 --> 00:12:37,590 S1: lived in New England and then in the Midwest and 242 00:12:37,590 --> 00:12:40,310 S1: now in North Carolina. So you've been in some pretty 243 00:12:40,350 --> 00:12:41,309 S1: interesting parts. 244 00:12:41,790 --> 00:12:44,270 S13: And we love every place we've lived, Janet, because of 245 00:12:44,270 --> 00:12:46,480 S13: the people, as we all know, is people that make 246 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:48,760 S13: a place. But I do have to admit, I'm a 247 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:51,080 S13: farmer's kid. You know, I grew up in Illinois. And 248 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:54,160 S13: as much as I loved all those hundreds of acres 249 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:57,319 S13: of seed corn and soybeans, there wasn't much to look at. 250 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:01,040 S13: So down here with the mountains. Oh, boy. It is. 251 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:04,160 S13: It really is extraordinary. It's wonderful for one spiritual life, 252 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:05,200 S13: I can tell you that. 253 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,360 S1: Absolutely. And I wonder how often the verse I look 254 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,280 S1: to the hills from whence cometh my help comes to 255 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:12,040 S1: mind right over and over again. 256 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:15,199 S13: Oh, Janet, every day, because you can't live here and 257 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,440 S13: not see the hills we are. We live in an 258 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:20,960 S13: area that the Native Americans called Ashkenaz, which means the 259 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:23,720 S13: land of the Blue mist, from which we get our 260 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:27,680 S13: Blue Ridge Mountains. And they are always have this beautiful 261 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,800 S13: blue tint. It's just extraordinary. So I, I often think 262 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:33,840 S13: of that verse when I'm standing on our deck looking 263 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:36,599 S13: at the mountains and praying. It just it lends itself 264 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:38,960 S13: to looking up, which is something we all need. 265 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:41,680 S1: Yes, absolutely. But there's something about. 266 00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:43,520 S13: Any time you and Craig. I'm just saying. 267 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:46,120 S1: Thank you. Well, I think your. 268 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:47,600 S13: Listeners are my witnesses. 269 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:49,160 S1: I was just going to say you heard that, folks. 270 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:51,160 S1: So we're going to hold her to that, right? You know, 271 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:53,720 S1: I'm so, so glad that you're there, because I think 272 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:55,560 S1: what's going to happen is that God is just really 273 00:13:55,559 --> 00:13:57,679 S1: going to anoint your writing, and it's just going to 274 00:13:57,679 --> 00:13:59,800 S1: come pouring out of you now just because of the 275 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:01,520 S1: environment that you're in. But I want to backtrack a 276 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:04,199 S1: little bit, which is, yes, tell me about these one 277 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,640 S1: woman dramas that you do. I find this fascinating. I 278 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:09,440 S1: want to hear so much more about it. I'm a 279 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:11,199 S1: kid who started out at a Christian school, and I'm 280 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:13,440 S1: just telling you, Maggie, when I went there, I thought 281 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,200 S1: that I was going to be a musical theater major. 282 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,080 S1: And when I got to this particular Christian school, they 283 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:21,760 S1: referred to the drama department as, and I quote, hell, 284 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:24,360 S1: I thought, I don't think this is going to work out. 285 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:27,200 S1: And it didn't. And I ended up transferring schools. But 286 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:29,680 S1: the bottom line is, I want to know how you 287 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:31,600 S1: got interested in this. And when you do a one 288 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:34,440 S1: woman drama. Like what? What are your topics? 289 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:37,360 S13: Well, thank you for asking, Janet. It's a long story 290 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:39,640 S13: and I'll keep it short for your listeners, but I 291 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:41,400 S13: do have a background in theater in high school and 292 00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:44,130 S13: college and summer stock, but my husband and I have 293 00:14:44,130 --> 00:14:47,690 S13: been in pastoral ministry for decades, and living the life 294 00:14:47,690 --> 00:14:50,130 S13: of an actor and being in pastoral ministry, there's just 295 00:14:50,170 --> 00:14:52,450 S13: there really isn't time for both. So in a sense, 296 00:14:52,450 --> 00:14:54,410 S13: I sort of gave it up. And then when I 297 00:14:54,410 --> 00:14:56,970 S13: turned 40, and I don't mind telling you, that was 298 00:14:56,970 --> 00:14:59,810 S13: over 25 years ago, in a sense, God gave it 299 00:14:59,810 --> 00:15:01,890 S13: back to me because he began to give me the 300 00:15:01,890 --> 00:15:04,850 S13: idea of telling the story of great women of the 301 00:15:04,850 --> 00:15:07,650 S13: faith who were no longer here to tell their own stories. 302 00:15:07,970 --> 00:15:11,130 S13: And I began with Mary, the mother of Jesus, which is, 303 00:15:11,130 --> 00:15:13,130 S13: I always say, it's God's joke that I was running 304 00:15:13,130 --> 00:15:17,090 S13: around the country, uh, portraying a Jewish teenage virgin as 305 00:15:17,090 --> 00:15:20,210 S13: a middle aged Baptist pastor's wife. You know, go figure. 306 00:15:20,250 --> 00:15:23,650 S13: Only God could have gotten me into hundreds of churches, 307 00:15:24,170 --> 00:15:27,330 S13: Catholic and Protestant, both portraying the life of Mary according 308 00:15:27,370 --> 00:15:30,490 S13: to the Gospels. And that's probably what my ministry has 309 00:15:30,490 --> 00:15:32,850 S13: been best known for. And I've been doing that for 310 00:15:32,850 --> 00:15:35,010 S13: 25 years now. I have a couple of different dramas 311 00:15:35,010 --> 00:15:38,290 S13: about Mary, and uh, then the second one was written 312 00:15:38,290 --> 00:15:42,970 S13: for the Edwards Tercentennial commission back in New England about, oh, 313 00:15:43,010 --> 00:15:45,250 S13: 17 years ago now. And they asked me to write 314 00:15:45,290 --> 00:15:48,930 S13: a drama about the marriage of Jonathan and Sarah. As 315 00:15:48,930 --> 00:15:50,970 S13: you would know, because I know you're a student of history. 316 00:15:51,570 --> 00:15:57,170 S13: Sarah Edwards Sarah Pierpont Edwards was the Christian that Jonathan Edwards, 317 00:15:57,170 --> 00:16:00,170 S13: that great giant of the faith, admired the most. He 318 00:16:00,170 --> 00:16:03,810 S13: really looked up to his wife. They had an extraordinary union. 319 00:16:03,810 --> 00:16:08,250 S13: In fact, historians call it an uncommon union. And they 320 00:16:08,250 --> 00:16:10,290 S13: asked me to write this drama about their marriage, and 321 00:16:10,290 --> 00:16:12,970 S13: I did. And then since I have done that drama 322 00:16:12,970 --> 00:16:16,010 S13: for pastors groups around the country, because the things they 323 00:16:16,010 --> 00:16:18,730 S13: dealt with are very contemporary to what we deal with 324 00:16:18,770 --> 00:16:22,890 S13: as well, you know, church conflict and criticism and all 325 00:16:22,890 --> 00:16:26,130 S13: those sorts of things that were around in the 1700s, 326 00:16:26,130 --> 00:16:28,570 S13: as they are now. And then the third drama, and 327 00:16:28,570 --> 00:16:30,930 S13: probably the one actually, it's the fourth, the one that 328 00:16:30,930 --> 00:16:34,370 S13: I like most is I love portraying Amy Carmichael. She 329 00:16:34,370 --> 00:16:37,610 S13: was such a giant of the faith. She went to India, 330 00:16:37,610 --> 00:16:40,540 S13: of course, to save souls, not to rock cradles, but 331 00:16:40,540 --> 00:16:45,500 S13: she ended up rescuing hundreds of children from where they 332 00:16:45,500 --> 00:16:48,860 S13: were being abused in the temples and starting this fellowship 333 00:16:48,860 --> 00:16:52,580 S13: that we know as Dohnavur. So, Janet, thank you. It's 334 00:16:52,580 --> 00:16:55,740 S13: a wonderful question you asked because I've always thought, you know, 335 00:16:55,780 --> 00:17:00,060 S13: as kind of a good Christian, good Christian kid. Growing up. 336 00:17:00,260 --> 00:17:03,660 S13: I've had a pretty conventional life, but these women did not. 337 00:17:04,060 --> 00:17:06,820 S13: So when I can tell their stories and reintroduce them 338 00:17:06,820 --> 00:17:09,980 S13: to a new generation, it's it's exciting to me. And 339 00:17:09,980 --> 00:17:12,860 S13: I don't put anything in my dramas that didn't actually happen, 340 00:17:12,900 --> 00:17:14,180 S13: you know? Oh, so. 341 00:17:14,220 --> 00:17:16,100 S1: Maggie, one quick question before we go to break, do 342 00:17:16,100 --> 00:17:18,300 S1: you write most of your own material for these dramas? 343 00:17:18,740 --> 00:17:22,500 S13: 100%, yes. It comes out of what we history. In fact, 344 00:17:22,500 --> 00:17:25,980 S13: the the Edwards drama. I had it vetted by Princeton University, 345 00:17:25,980 --> 00:17:29,899 S13: by Yale, which is Edward's alma mater, by one of 346 00:17:29,900 --> 00:17:32,060 S13: the Edward's sons. And so I try to make sure 347 00:17:32,060 --> 00:17:33,899 S13: when I write something, I don't put anything in it, 348 00:17:33,900 --> 00:17:36,100 S13: that we're not as sure as we can be. It 349 00:17:36,100 --> 00:17:39,629 S13: didn't actually happen. So I do write my own dramas copyright, 350 00:17:39,630 --> 00:17:40,310 S13: I can tell you. 351 00:17:40,350 --> 00:17:40,790 S3: Wow. 352 00:17:40,830 --> 00:17:43,990 S1: Wow. Fascinating. Maggie Rowe is with us. I'm so glad 353 00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:45,590 S1: you're getting to know her. And we're also going to 354 00:17:45,590 --> 00:18:00,869 S1: talk about her brand new book. More after this. We 355 00:18:00,869 --> 00:18:03,230 S1: have the privilege of spending this hour with Maggie Rowe, 356 00:18:03,270 --> 00:18:07,230 S1: who for years worked at Tyndale House in publishing and 357 00:18:07,230 --> 00:18:10,230 S1: just helped to negotiate some of the great books out 358 00:18:10,230 --> 00:18:12,830 S1: there and just appreciate so much my relationship with her 359 00:18:12,830 --> 00:18:14,990 S1: through that. But Maggie's so much more than that, as 360 00:18:14,990 --> 00:18:18,910 S1: you've just learned by a short time together already. Loves people. 361 00:18:18,950 --> 00:18:21,670 S1: Pastor's wife minister to New England for a while. Served 362 00:18:21,670 --> 00:18:24,310 S1: in Chicago not just at Tyndale, but also would teach 363 00:18:24,350 --> 00:18:28,310 S1: at Wheaton College and now is in Asheville, North Carolina. 364 00:18:28,350 --> 00:18:30,629 S1: Beautiful part of the world, and she is still doing 365 00:18:30,630 --> 00:18:33,190 S1: all that God has gifted her to do and has 366 00:18:33,190 --> 00:18:35,470 S1: given birth to a brand new book called This Life 367 00:18:35,470 --> 00:18:38,909 S1: We Share journeying well with God and others, and I'm 368 00:18:38,910 --> 00:18:40,709 S1: going to get to that book in a moment. But 369 00:18:40,710 --> 00:18:43,470 S1: its primary thesis, I think, comes right out of Maggie's life, 370 00:18:43,470 --> 00:18:46,590 S1: which takes me back to your serving in New England 371 00:18:46,590 --> 00:18:49,710 S1: in particular. Now, New England is a fascinating I absolutely 372 00:18:49,710 --> 00:18:51,750 S1: love New England, but I have heard many a person 373 00:18:51,750 --> 00:18:55,470 S1: who says, who says living and working and ministering there, 374 00:18:55,670 --> 00:18:59,990 S1: that there are some unique challenges to ministering in that 375 00:18:59,990 --> 00:19:02,230 S1: part of the country. Did you find that to be 376 00:19:02,230 --> 00:19:04,270 S1: the case? And if the answer is yes, what were 377 00:19:04,270 --> 00:19:05,510 S1: some of those challenges? 378 00:19:05,950 --> 00:19:08,750 S13: Thank you. That's a wonderful question, Janet. I have to 379 00:19:08,750 --> 00:19:11,389 S13: tell you, we loved our quarter century in New England. 380 00:19:11,430 --> 00:19:14,830 S13: I didn't think I would. I'm a midwesterner. New England, 381 00:19:14,830 --> 00:19:19,310 S13: we all know, uh, is is a very unique place there. 382 00:19:19,350 --> 00:19:23,109 S13: There are relatively few Bible preaching churches compared to the 383 00:19:23,109 --> 00:19:25,830 S13: rest of the country. Uh, to be a Christian, there 384 00:19:25,830 --> 00:19:29,630 S13: is not a culturally conventional as it might be, say, 385 00:19:29,630 --> 00:19:31,430 S13: in the part of the country where I live now. 386 00:19:31,710 --> 00:19:34,389 S13: But the great thing about that, Janet, is that those 387 00:19:34,390 --> 00:19:37,960 S13: who are followers of Christ there really see the need 388 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:40,280 S13: for each other in a way that we might not 389 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:42,960 S13: in other parts of the country. I was very privileged. 390 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,760 S13: We were at a small, older church on Cape Cod 391 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:47,480 S13: for a number of years where we saw God do 392 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,639 S13: great things. We called it the little church that could. 393 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:53,680 S13: And and only God could have grown that church through, um, to, 394 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:56,600 S13: to accomplish some amazing things. But out of the ministry 395 00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,120 S13: to women, we started at that church. We got involved 396 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:03,280 S13: in regional ministry to women, and I was invited to join, uh, 397 00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,320 S13: what then was called the Evangelistic Association of New England, 398 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:09,040 S13: or as you probably know it, Vision New England. It 399 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:13,240 S13: was really an association of churches and individuals who came together. 400 00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:15,880 S13: I used to call it a mission agency run by 401 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:19,720 S13: New Englanders for New Englanders, and it was unique because 402 00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:23,359 S13: we had every, uh, winter in Boston, we'd have what 403 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:27,480 S13: they called New England's largest family reunion. There were sometimes 404 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:30,040 S13: 10,000 of us who would come together in the Prudential 405 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:33,240 S13: Center for worship for praise, to bring in speakers that 406 00:20:33,240 --> 00:20:38,080 S13: are smaller churches. Couldn't necessarily host ourselves. And it was 407 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:41,719 S13: a wonderful way to just host the family of God 408 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:45,360 S13: all throughout those six New England states. So I treasure 409 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:48,160 S13: those years, and I still consider the women in New 410 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,840 S13: England sort of my tribe. As much as I love 411 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:53,440 S13: where we are right now. I loved ministering in the Midwest, 412 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,280 S13: but New Englanders have a big part of my heart 413 00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:59,240 S13: as our adopted country. So for those of my friends 414 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:01,280 S13: who are listening out there, we love you and I 415 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:03,720 S13: can't wait to get back to you. Thanks for that. 416 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:06,320 S13: Shout out to New England we. Wow! It is a 417 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:07,080 S13: unique place. 418 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,080 S1: It is indeed. And I'm so grateful that so many 419 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:12,080 S1: of our stations are up there in New England. Thank you. 420 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:16,000 S1: Broadcasting in particular for that. But, um, I want to 421 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,400 S1: say something else. And that is because you were and 422 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:21,960 S1: are a pastor's wife. I want to shake up some 423 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,560 S1: of the stereotypical thinking that a lot of believers have. Well, 424 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:28,080 S1: your pastor's wife, so defaults that naturally you'd be involved 425 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,359 S1: in women's ministry. Hey, your pastor's wife, what else are 426 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:33,280 S1: you supposed to do? I want to point out, Your Honor, 427 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:36,330 S1: for the record, that a calling is a calling is 428 00:21:36,330 --> 00:21:38,850 S1: a calling. That being a pastor's wife doesn't mean by 429 00:21:38,850 --> 00:21:42,410 S1: default you become involved in women's ministries. You still have 430 00:21:42,410 --> 00:21:45,330 S1: to feel that God has laid that calling on your heart, 431 00:21:45,330 --> 00:21:47,370 S1: because there's going to be a lot of sacrifice. There's 432 00:21:47,369 --> 00:21:49,450 S1: going to be time commitment. There's going to be a 433 00:21:49,450 --> 00:21:51,450 S1: lot of praying. There's going to be broken hearts and 434 00:21:51,450 --> 00:21:55,050 S1: laughing moments together. But it is a calling nonetheless. When 435 00:21:55,090 --> 00:21:58,369 S1: and how did you feel God wooing you into women's ministries? 436 00:21:58,770 --> 00:22:01,410 S13: Thank you for asking that, Janet, because if there are 437 00:22:01,410 --> 00:22:04,850 S13: any pastors or their spouses who are listening today, I'm 438 00:22:04,850 --> 00:22:07,090 S13: so glad you called that out, because it shouldn't be 439 00:22:07,090 --> 00:22:09,850 S13: automatically assumed that the pastor's wife will take care of 440 00:22:09,850 --> 00:22:12,250 S13: the needs of the women, that it's actually not what 441 00:22:12,250 --> 00:22:14,810 S13: I expected. And at our first church, it wasn't the 442 00:22:14,810 --> 00:22:17,209 S13: area I was involved in. But when God took us 443 00:22:17,210 --> 00:22:20,129 S13: to our church on Cape Cod, there was really nothing 444 00:22:20,130 --> 00:22:22,290 S13: for the women. And as I lay awake in bed 445 00:22:22,290 --> 00:22:24,610 S13: at night saying, Lord, what would you have me do here? 446 00:22:24,730 --> 00:22:27,730 S13: He consistently said, you need to do something for my daughters. 447 00:22:27,890 --> 00:22:31,450 S13: And my response was, I'm I'm a speech and a 448 00:22:31,490 --> 00:22:35,380 S13: writing teacher. I. I don't teach women. And if I do. Uh, 449 00:22:35,420 --> 00:22:38,020 S13: it's not about spiritual subjects. My husband's a spiritual giant, 450 00:22:38,060 --> 00:22:42,139 S13: not me. Don't ask me to do that. But. But, Janet, I. God, 451 00:22:42,180 --> 00:22:44,540 S13: I felt like God said to me. Maggie, I will 452 00:22:44,540 --> 00:22:47,460 S13: supply everything you lack. And I said to God then, Lord, 453 00:22:47,460 --> 00:22:49,780 S13: you know, that's about 90% of what's going to take. 454 00:22:49,820 --> 00:22:53,060 S13: I am not a Bible study teacher, but we started 455 00:22:53,060 --> 00:22:55,300 S13: with fear and trembling with one small study. I used 456 00:22:55,300 --> 00:22:57,859 S13: to come home from that study just soaked in perspiration. 457 00:22:58,220 --> 00:23:01,020 S13: And yet out of that, other churches began to say, well, 458 00:23:01,060 --> 00:23:04,500 S13: how do we start something new at a historically old 459 00:23:04,500 --> 00:23:07,700 S13: church where nothing has existed? And because of that, I 460 00:23:07,700 --> 00:23:11,500 S13: was asked to join this regional association of evangelicals. And 461 00:23:11,500 --> 00:23:15,180 S13: Janet saying yes to that calling changed my life. And 462 00:23:15,180 --> 00:23:17,260 S13: I tell a story in the book. It wasn't something 463 00:23:17,260 --> 00:23:20,340 S13: I wanted. In fact, when they asked me, I searched 464 00:23:20,340 --> 00:23:23,580 S13: the scriptures for reasons to say no because I thought 465 00:23:23,580 --> 00:23:26,540 S13: I am. I am the most, I'm the Gideon, I 466 00:23:26,540 --> 00:23:32,900 S13: am the Jeremiah. I am completely inadequate. And God said exactly, Exactly. Um, 467 00:23:32,900 --> 00:23:36,180 S13: you have something I can use, which is? You recognize 468 00:23:36,180 --> 00:23:38,980 S13: how much you need me. And out of that, when 469 00:23:38,980 --> 00:23:41,940 S13: I read the stories of of Moses and Gideon and 470 00:23:41,940 --> 00:23:45,180 S13: Jeremiah and even Mary, mother of Jesus, I realized all 471 00:23:45,180 --> 00:23:49,220 S13: of them recognized their own inadequacy. But they responded to 472 00:23:49,260 --> 00:23:51,700 S13: the promise of God when he was calling them. And 473 00:23:51,900 --> 00:23:54,740 S13: I never thought God would take me into ministry to women. 474 00:23:55,020 --> 00:23:57,940 S13: But it truly not only changed my life, but I'm. 475 00:23:58,300 --> 00:24:01,060 S13: I hope and pray that I'll get to heaven someday 476 00:24:01,060 --> 00:24:02,980 S13: and find that it changed the life of a few 477 00:24:02,980 --> 00:24:05,300 S13: others as well. In fact, one of the things I 478 00:24:05,300 --> 00:24:07,379 S13: say in the book is that, of course, the Lord's 479 00:24:07,380 --> 00:24:10,060 S13: Prayer is the prayer that never fails. But I always say, 480 00:24:10,060 --> 00:24:13,820 S13: the second best prayer is, Lord, let me be useful 481 00:24:13,820 --> 00:24:16,859 S13: in your hands. That's the prayer that never fails. 482 00:24:17,220 --> 00:24:20,379 S1: Yeah. Amen to that. Wow. Maggie's brand new book is 483 00:24:20,380 --> 00:24:23,700 S1: called This Life We Share journeying well with God and 484 00:24:23,700 --> 00:24:26,420 S1: others and so many of the things that she's saying. 485 00:24:26,420 --> 00:24:28,740 S1: You'll read in this book as well, but there's so 486 00:24:28,740 --> 00:24:31,830 S1: much more. And I'm so thankful that Maggie is sacrificially 487 00:24:31,830 --> 00:24:33,710 S1: giving me a full hour of her time. So we've 488 00:24:33,710 --> 00:24:35,550 S1: got more to discuss on her book when we return. 489 00:24:35,550 --> 00:25:06,430 S1: Stay with us. Are you the sort of person who 490 00:25:06,430 --> 00:25:09,550 S1: likes to have the inside scoop? Who wants to be informed? 491 00:25:09,550 --> 00:25:11,710 S1: When you become a partial partner, you're not only keeping 492 00:25:11,710 --> 00:25:14,389 S1: this program on the air every weekday, you'll also receive 493 00:25:14,390 --> 00:25:17,629 S1: exclusive benefits like personal emails from me. I'll help you 494 00:25:17,630 --> 00:25:20,390 S1: learn how to look at the headlines with a biblical perspective. 495 00:25:20,590 --> 00:25:24,909 S1: Become a partial partner today by calling 877 Janet 58 496 00:25:24,950 --> 00:25:29,110 S1: or go online to In the market with Janet Parshall. Oh. 497 00:25:32,869 --> 00:25:34,830 S1: What a joy to spend the hour with Maggie Rowe, 498 00:25:34,869 --> 00:25:37,590 S1: who's a national speaker. She's a dramatist. She's a blogger. 499 00:25:37,590 --> 00:25:40,670 S1: She's a writer. She's a pastor's wife. She and her husband, Mike, 500 00:25:40,670 --> 00:25:44,710 S1: ministered in New England for 25 years. She came to Chicago, 501 00:25:44,710 --> 00:25:47,109 S1: by the way, which is oh, that was her original 502 00:25:47,109 --> 00:25:49,430 S1: neck of the woods. She's a midwest girl. She got 503 00:25:49,470 --> 00:25:51,949 S1: a degree from Wheaton College while she was there, also 504 00:25:51,950 --> 00:25:55,550 S1: a guest communications instructor at Wheaton College while she was 505 00:25:55,550 --> 00:25:58,310 S1: working at Tyndale. And now they've packed up and moved 506 00:25:58,310 --> 00:26:01,470 S1: to Asheville, North Carolina, where the best is yet to be. 507 00:26:01,470 --> 00:26:03,389 S1: I think beyond a shadow of a doubt, which really 508 00:26:03,390 --> 00:26:06,189 S1: takes me to something important, Maggie. And that is, I 509 00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:08,470 S1: want particularly the men who are listening to understand this, 510 00:26:08,470 --> 00:26:10,590 S1: because I don't see this replicated in the life of 511 00:26:10,590 --> 00:26:13,230 S1: my husband or my sons, as much as I see 512 00:26:13,230 --> 00:26:15,390 S1: it in the life of my daughters and myself. And 513 00:26:15,390 --> 00:26:19,869 S1: that is, women tend to live their lives in seasons. 514 00:26:19,869 --> 00:26:22,670 S1: Do you agree? And if that's the case, why is 515 00:26:22,670 --> 00:26:24,750 S1: it important for us to understand that? 516 00:26:25,350 --> 00:26:30,040 S13: Thank you for asking that, Janet. because we do very much. 517 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:31,959 S13: I have a chapter in the book where I talk 518 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,640 S13: about friendship because that's a huge thing to me. We 519 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:38,840 S13: are we are inherently relational people. It's how God designed 520 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,240 S13: us when we think about God himself. Modeling relationship through 521 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:46,320 S13: the doctrine of the incarnation. Philippians two and the fact 522 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,800 S13: that that beautiful name for God, Immanuel, God with us, 523 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,840 S13: he created us to be in relationship. And women know that. 524 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:57,240 S13: And we we live our life in seasons by we 525 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:01,760 S13: make friends as we are walking side by side as children, 526 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:05,040 S13: when we're working side by side in a profession or 527 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:08,359 S13: a vocation, when we're worshiping side by side in a 528 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:12,719 S13: church or a faith community. And it's interesting, Janet, when, um, 529 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:14,640 S13: you'd asked me a little bit about how I came 530 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,320 S13: to write this book and it was really written for 531 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,320 S13: women in all seasons of life, because there are so 532 00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:23,960 S13: many niche publications out there that, in fact, you had 533 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,560 S13: mentioned I worked for Tyndale for a number of years, 534 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:28,919 S13: and I would notice that so many things in the 535 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:32,360 S13: publishing world were aimed at just a pretty narrow segment 536 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:36,280 S13: of women, say, maybe 25 to 55, that marketers would 537 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:40,480 S13: aim their products at that particular midsection, where I'd think, 538 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:42,600 S13: but what about the younger women? What about the older 539 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,800 S13: women who now have time and finances and and the 540 00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:48,600 S13: ability to pursue the things haven't in the past? And 541 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,280 S13: so when I was actually asked to write this book, 542 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,400 S13: in fact, if I can circle back to something you 543 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:55,920 S13: said earlier at the top of the hour, you had 544 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,120 S13: mentioned my national drama ministry and which really came out 545 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:01,800 S13: of that, uh, great commandment, you know, seek first the 546 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,080 S13: kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things 547 00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:07,280 S13: will be added. I, I started a drama ministry not 548 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:10,080 S13: because I wanted to be out there, but because God said, 549 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,479 S13: here's a story to tell. I need a body. I 550 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:14,760 S13: want you to go and tell it. And as a 551 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:17,800 S13: result of that, the publisher of Navpress, which is the 552 00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,960 S13: publisher for this life we share, he was actually in 553 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:24,080 S13: the audience, Janet, which amazes me because I was simply 554 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:26,650 S13: there to tell the story of a woman, Mary, mother 555 00:28:26,650 --> 00:28:29,409 S13: of Jesus, who is no longer here. I mean, despite 556 00:28:29,410 --> 00:28:31,650 S13: the rumors, she doesn't travel anymore. I just have to. 557 00:28:31,690 --> 00:28:34,610 S13: Let's just put that out there. She's off the road. 558 00:28:35,050 --> 00:28:38,170 S13: So I go to places to tell her story that 559 00:28:38,450 --> 00:28:40,610 S13: she's not telling anymore. And of course, it's based on 560 00:28:40,610 --> 00:28:43,969 S13: the Gospels. It's totally from the Gospels. But the publisher 561 00:28:43,970 --> 00:28:47,370 S13: of The navigators, uh, publishing arm, Navpress, was in the 562 00:28:47,370 --> 00:28:51,250 S13: audience at one presentation and he said hello, sent me 563 00:28:51,250 --> 00:28:54,970 S13: a lovely note that he appreciated the hearing, the gospel 564 00:28:55,170 --> 00:28:57,890 S13: account through the lips of the woman who knew Jesus best. 565 00:28:58,130 --> 00:29:01,370 S13: We became Facebook friends, as sometimes happens with social media, 566 00:29:01,610 --> 00:29:04,690 S13: and I would link my blog to my social media accounts. 567 00:29:05,050 --> 00:29:07,650 S13: And about three years ago, Janet read out of the blue. 568 00:29:07,690 --> 00:29:09,610 S13: Don wrote and said, I think you have a book 569 00:29:09,610 --> 00:29:12,250 S13: in you. And after I wipe my ears and stopped 570 00:29:12,250 --> 00:29:15,170 S13: crying because I've always loved writing, I read the rest 571 00:29:15,170 --> 00:29:17,330 S13: of his message and he said, Maggie, what I'm looking 572 00:29:17,330 --> 00:29:20,650 S13: for is not just a book for 20 or 30 somethings, 573 00:29:20,690 --> 00:29:24,300 S13: not just a book for older women, but Janet. It's 574 00:29:24,300 --> 00:29:26,860 S13: exactly what you said. We live our life in seasons. 575 00:29:27,180 --> 00:29:30,500 S13: And for a woman such as myself, I'm on the 576 00:29:30,660 --> 00:29:33,260 S13: what I like to call the shady side of 65, 577 00:29:33,460 --> 00:29:35,700 S13: which is a lovely place to be. I recommend it 578 00:29:35,700 --> 00:29:38,979 S13: to everyone. I mean, it's the ultimate goal is we 579 00:29:38,980 --> 00:29:42,340 S13: want to get to the shady side of 65. Um, 580 00:29:42,820 --> 00:29:45,100 S13: but he said, I want a book that is for 581 00:29:45,100 --> 00:29:48,500 S13: women who are coming out of college, who are in 582 00:29:48,540 --> 00:29:52,700 S13: their first career, who are, uh, in an assisted living, 583 00:29:52,700 --> 00:29:54,700 S13: he said, a woman for all seasons of life. And 584 00:29:54,700 --> 00:29:56,580 S13: to do that, I need an older woman to write 585 00:29:56,580 --> 00:29:59,860 S13: it because somebody who has lived through many of those seasons. 586 00:30:00,060 --> 00:30:04,460 S13: So if that answers your question, that's that's very much 587 00:30:04,460 --> 00:30:06,500 S13: why we called it this life we share. 588 00:30:06,940 --> 00:30:09,020 S1: Well, and there and by the way, let me just 589 00:30:09,020 --> 00:30:11,020 S1: point out, just so people can understand how this works, 590 00:30:11,020 --> 00:30:14,500 S1: it is 52 Reflections on journeying well with God and others. 591 00:30:14,500 --> 00:30:17,380 S1: 52 do the math. That's one a week. Now there's 592 00:30:17,380 --> 00:30:19,420 S1: a methodology on why you set it up this way. 593 00:30:19,420 --> 00:30:20,580 S1: You tell our friends why. 594 00:30:21,620 --> 00:30:23,940 S13: Well, that's a good question. Originally, we thought of it 595 00:30:23,940 --> 00:30:26,860 S13: as a sort of a weekly devotional, Janet. And then 596 00:30:26,860 --> 00:30:28,860 S13: we thought, as you know, because you've seen a copy 597 00:30:28,860 --> 00:30:30,979 S13: of the book, it's really not a devotional, even though 598 00:30:30,980 --> 00:30:34,060 S13: it has devotional elements, including scripture and what I call 599 00:30:34,060 --> 00:30:37,940 S13: points of connection and a lifeline, a brief takeaway at 600 00:30:37,940 --> 00:30:41,180 S13: the end of every short chapter or reflection. But we 601 00:30:41,180 --> 00:30:44,340 S13: decided to make 52 so that women would know, oh, 602 00:30:44,980 --> 00:30:47,420 S13: I'm busy, I'm tired. I don't have to sit and 603 00:30:47,420 --> 00:30:50,740 S13: read this 260 pages all the way through. I can 604 00:30:50,740 --> 00:30:53,860 S13: pick and choose which section speaks to my life stage 605 00:30:53,860 --> 00:30:58,180 S13: right now. Maybe I'm a a woman who is just 606 00:30:58,180 --> 00:31:02,580 S13: leaving high school or college and wondering, how is God 607 00:31:02,580 --> 00:31:05,420 S13: going to direct me into a vocation that is more 608 00:31:05,420 --> 00:31:08,780 S13: than just paying the bills? Or maybe I'm in a 609 00:31:08,780 --> 00:31:11,660 S13: season of life where I'm really struggling with my own 610 00:31:11,660 --> 00:31:16,420 S13: emotional and spiritual health. Or maybe I'm a young mom 611 00:31:16,420 --> 00:31:19,100 S13: and I'm wondering, boy, I have neither quiet nor time. 612 00:31:19,260 --> 00:31:22,710 S13: How in the world do I incorporate spiritual disciplines at 613 00:31:22,710 --> 00:31:25,430 S13: this stage of my life. Or maybe they're at the 614 00:31:25,430 --> 00:31:29,670 S13: age that Janet, I am now past 65, and they're 615 00:31:29,670 --> 00:31:34,950 S13: seeing the signs of aging in a culture that seems to, uh, 616 00:31:34,990 --> 00:31:38,870 S13: put youth on a pedestal and saying, how do I 617 00:31:38,910 --> 00:31:42,630 S13: not only age gracefully, but how do I age gracefully? 618 00:31:43,270 --> 00:31:46,510 S13: You know, because we're sort of taught to deny or 619 00:31:46,910 --> 00:31:51,030 S13: decry or defy our age instead of celebrating it like 620 00:31:51,030 --> 00:31:53,470 S13: so many cultures do around the world where they value 621 00:31:53,510 --> 00:31:58,630 S13: wisdom and experience. So. So that's an excellent question. Why 52? 622 00:31:58,670 --> 00:32:01,070 S13: I think so that women will know if they want 623 00:32:01,110 --> 00:32:03,030 S13: to take a year to read through it. They can 624 00:32:03,070 --> 00:32:05,750 S13: or they can simply pick the selections that are most 625 00:32:05,750 --> 00:32:06,709 S13: relevant to them. 626 00:32:07,230 --> 00:32:09,870 S1: So so let me take something that you said and 627 00:32:09,870 --> 00:32:12,150 S1: just extrapolate it out a little bit. What you're saying 628 00:32:12,150 --> 00:32:16,030 S1: is that unlike and there's no casting aspersions against anyone 629 00:32:16,030 --> 00:32:18,070 S1: else who's done it this way. But, you know, I 630 00:32:18,110 --> 00:32:20,630 S1: keep moving. I keep walking through these stages of life. 631 00:32:20,630 --> 00:32:23,190 S1: And so I love to read and I want to 632 00:32:23,190 --> 00:32:26,390 S1: be fed. As I go along through every season of 633 00:32:26,390 --> 00:32:28,030 S1: my life, what I like about a book like yours 634 00:32:28,070 --> 00:32:30,110 S1: is that I can give it to daughter. I can 635 00:32:30,110 --> 00:32:31,710 S1: give it to a friend. Women who are in different 636 00:32:31,710 --> 00:32:34,150 S1: places at different times, and there's going to be something 637 00:32:34,190 --> 00:32:36,790 S1: for everyone, which I really appreciate. But I think there's 638 00:32:36,790 --> 00:32:40,670 S1: a bigger issue. And the fact that you ministered to women, 639 00:32:40,670 --> 00:32:43,430 S1: I know you resonate with this. Originally when the Lord 640 00:32:43,430 --> 00:32:46,110 S1: called me and like you, my attitude was being a 641 00:32:46,110 --> 00:32:47,950 S1: midwest kid. I'm just real happy to stay home and 642 00:32:47,950 --> 00:32:51,310 S1: have babies and live with my husband. And that's it. Amen. 643 00:32:51,350 --> 00:32:53,950 S1: I'm gone. And then that knock comes and it's like, okay. 644 00:32:53,990 --> 00:32:57,430 S1: My response was, in all obedience, here am I. Send Aaron. 645 00:32:57,470 --> 00:32:59,670 S1: You know, I was like, no, I'm not interested in following. 646 00:32:59,710 --> 00:33:00,270 S1: But yes. 647 00:33:00,830 --> 00:33:01,750 S13: Miriam, in our case. 648 00:33:01,750 --> 00:33:05,950 S1: Send Miriam exactly, exactly right. Exactly right. But what I 649 00:33:05,990 --> 00:33:08,550 S1: found is that when I originally came, for whatever reason, 650 00:33:08,550 --> 00:33:11,030 S1: the Lord called me into an arena where I would 651 00:33:11,030 --> 00:33:15,510 S1: debate on national television the founding mothers of the feminist movement. And, boy, 652 00:33:15,510 --> 00:33:18,750 S1: I learned so many lessons. And that's a multi-hour conversation 653 00:33:18,750 --> 00:33:22,000 S1: for another day. But what I discovered was we have 654 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:25,280 S1: struggled as a people, as a culture. On the role 655 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,360 S1: of women for some time now. To me, I think 656 00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,920 S1: there's a huge spiritual component in there, and I understand 657 00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,360 S1: the world. Who doesn't understand that the great liberator of 658 00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,040 S1: women was Jesus himself? That I am not an afterthought. 659 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,160 S1: I am not a second class citizen. That I'm fearfully 660 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:40,400 S1: and wonderfully made, and my gender as a woman, as 661 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,479 S1: much a reflection of his sovereignty as the color of 662 00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,240 S1: my eyes or the color of my hair. I don't 663 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:46,280 S1: have a problem with any of that. What I'm finding 664 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,760 S1: to be interesting is that there seems to be such 665 00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:52,680 S1: a I'll be gracious, robust conversation in the church capital 666 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:56,920 S1: C universal today about women. In some respects, we still 667 00:33:56,920 --> 00:33:59,480 S1: haven't got this resolved. Where do you think that's coming from? 668 00:33:59,920 --> 00:34:03,920 S13: Yeah. Oh, Janet, it's well, it's interesting just yesterday and 669 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:05,880 S13: I can't quote who said this because I don't know 670 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,480 S13: if somebody said it to me, but they mentioned that 671 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:11,280 S13: in our cultural conversation that often we're using the same 672 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:16,520 S13: vocabulary but a different dictionary. So we're trying to discuss 673 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,410 S13: things and use this biblical foundation, and we're using the 674 00:34:19,410 --> 00:34:22,609 S13: same words, but they mean very different things. And that's 675 00:34:22,610 --> 00:34:25,770 S13: why these conversations are so difficult. And one of the 676 00:34:25,770 --> 00:34:27,930 S13: things I try to circle back to in this life 677 00:34:27,930 --> 00:34:30,969 S13: we share is the fact that as women, I mean, 678 00:34:31,010 --> 00:34:34,729 S13: we need each other. When wisdom literature, you know, talks 679 00:34:34,730 --> 00:34:37,930 S13: about the need for cooperation, working together rather than jockeying 680 00:34:37,969 --> 00:34:40,609 S13: to be first. And as women, I love to say 681 00:34:40,610 --> 00:34:42,410 S13: one of the things I appreciated about working for a 682 00:34:42,410 --> 00:34:46,089 S13: Christian publishing house is we were not competitive with each other. 683 00:34:46,090 --> 00:34:49,850 S13: There was a wonderful camaraderie. And I often think, Janet, 684 00:34:49,850 --> 00:34:52,930 S13: that at the heart of relationship is, is the empathy 685 00:34:52,930 --> 00:34:56,290 S13: that we should have for each other, that that we're 686 00:34:56,290 --> 00:34:58,569 S13: all broken people, we've all hurt, and we need to 687 00:34:58,570 --> 00:35:02,210 S13: give each other that grace to realize that. That, uh, 688 00:35:02,250 --> 00:35:04,890 S13: we can have empathy for each other's struggles. In fact, 689 00:35:04,890 --> 00:35:07,009 S13: I can tell you just a little bit a funny story. 690 00:35:07,170 --> 00:35:10,089 S13: My original working title for this book was Not This 691 00:35:10,090 --> 00:35:14,770 S13: Life You Share. It was you too. And and, um, 692 00:35:15,489 --> 00:35:18,089 S13: and really where that came from. And you've heard this 693 00:35:18,090 --> 00:35:22,370 S13: quote C.S. Lewis famously wrote, friendship is born at that 694 00:35:22,370 --> 00:35:26,050 S13: moment when one person says to another, what? You too, 695 00:35:26,090 --> 00:35:26,529 S13: you too. 696 00:35:26,570 --> 00:35:29,730 S14: I thought I was the only one. So I called. 697 00:35:29,730 --> 00:35:31,969 S13: My book you too. And they said, oh, Maggie, sorry, 698 00:35:31,969 --> 00:35:33,650 S13: that's not going to work. There is a movement out 699 00:35:33,650 --> 00:35:35,969 S13: there called me too. And I said, oh, yeah, they said, 700 00:35:35,969 --> 00:35:38,410 S13: your book isn't about that. No. I said, actually it's not. 701 00:35:38,450 --> 00:35:43,530 S13: It's about friendship and camaraderie and empathy and emotions and relationships. 702 00:35:43,530 --> 00:35:44,930 S13: And they said, okay, we're going to give it a 703 00:35:44,930 --> 00:35:49,330 S13: different title. But the point is that we do empathize 704 00:35:49,330 --> 00:35:52,690 S13: with each other. And throughout this life we share. I 705 00:35:52,690 --> 00:35:55,450 S13: want women to know they're not alone, that we all 706 00:35:55,450 --> 00:35:57,609 S13: have struggles. A lot of us struggle with what I 707 00:35:57,610 --> 00:36:02,089 S13: call well, it's many sociologists have called it imposter syndrome, 708 00:36:02,250 --> 00:36:02,810 S13: meaning we. 709 00:36:02,810 --> 00:36:03,250 S14: Think. 710 00:36:03,650 --> 00:36:06,530 S13: Everybody else is good at what they do, but not me. 711 00:36:06,570 --> 00:36:09,250 S13: Someday they're going to find out I'm a fake. That. 712 00:36:09,450 --> 00:36:11,930 S13: That I'm just faking it till I make it. And 713 00:36:12,330 --> 00:36:16,060 S13: and I'm amazed. Women. Janet, as women have started to 714 00:36:16,060 --> 00:36:18,140 S13: read this book in just a couple of weeks since 715 00:36:18,140 --> 00:36:21,180 S13: it's released, a lot of them, said Maggie. You struggled 716 00:36:21,180 --> 00:36:24,180 S13: with inadequacy and lack of confidence, too. I thought I 717 00:36:24,180 --> 00:36:26,620 S13: was the only one. So that's very much why I 718 00:36:26,620 --> 00:36:28,020 S13: wrote this for all women. 719 00:36:28,660 --> 00:36:29,020 S3: Wow. 720 00:36:29,540 --> 00:36:31,660 S1: It's a wonderful, wonderful book and I want you to 721 00:36:31,700 --> 00:36:33,540 S1: learn more about it. I still have more time with Maggie, 722 00:36:33,540 --> 00:36:35,620 S1: but again, the book is called This Life We Share 723 00:36:35,780 --> 00:36:38,660 S1: journeying well with God and others. You can learn more 724 00:36:38,660 --> 00:36:41,620 S1: by going to in the Market with Janet Parshall. Click 725 00:36:41,620 --> 00:36:44,380 S1: on that red box. It says Program Details and audio 726 00:36:44,420 --> 00:36:46,540 S1: takes you right over to the info page. Maggie has 727 00:36:46,540 --> 00:36:48,700 S1: a fabulous website. I got a direct link to that 728 00:36:48,700 --> 00:36:50,900 S1: as well as well as the book we're talking about, 729 00:36:50,900 --> 00:36:52,700 S1: this life we share. We're going to talk more right 730 00:36:52,700 --> 00:37:12,020 S1: after this. We're visiting with Maggie Rowe, who's written the 731 00:37:12,020 --> 00:37:16,220 S1: book This Life. We share their 52 reflections on journeying 732 00:37:16,219 --> 00:37:20,820 S1: well with God and others. Wonderful. Written by women for 733 00:37:20,820 --> 00:37:23,899 S1: women and it will meet you wherever you're at. I so, 734 00:37:23,900 --> 00:37:26,540 S1: so appreciate this book again. You can learn more by 735 00:37:26,580 --> 00:37:29,700 S1: going to our website in the market with Janet. Click 736 00:37:29,700 --> 00:37:32,379 S1: on that box that says Program Details and Audio. It'll 737 00:37:32,380 --> 00:37:33,980 S1: take you to the info page. Click through and you 738 00:37:33,980 --> 00:37:35,259 S1: can figure out how you can get a copy of 739 00:37:35,260 --> 00:37:37,779 S1: the book, which is wonderful. There's so many things. I 740 00:37:37,780 --> 00:37:40,420 S1: have one segment left and I have like a gazillion questions, 741 00:37:40,420 --> 00:37:41,779 S1: so this isn't going to work. So I have to 742 00:37:41,820 --> 00:37:44,060 S1: try to decide which area I want to go because 743 00:37:44,060 --> 00:37:46,260 S1: there's so many things I want to ask you. Talk 744 00:37:46,260 --> 00:37:49,460 S1: to me about women and the striving for perfection. You 745 00:37:49,460 --> 00:37:51,819 S1: touched on this a little bit before. I don't know 746 00:37:51,820 --> 00:37:54,620 S1: again why this is harder for women, Christian women, it 747 00:37:54,620 --> 00:37:58,180 S1: seems to me in particular, although I think women universally 748 00:37:58,180 --> 00:38:00,660 S1: deal with this. But what is it about thinking that 749 00:38:00,900 --> 00:38:03,700 S1: we have to be perfect? It's the perfect makeup, the 750 00:38:03,700 --> 00:38:06,940 S1: perfect figure, the perfect house, the perfect marriage, perfectly balanced checkbook, 751 00:38:06,940 --> 00:38:09,100 S1: perfect kids. And when I invite you to dinner, it's 752 00:38:09,100 --> 00:38:10,700 S1: all got to be perfect. And if I make a 753 00:38:10,700 --> 00:38:14,149 S1: mistake somehow, then I have failed. Not just individually, but 754 00:38:14,150 --> 00:38:17,230 S1: I have failed as a woman. Why do we do 755 00:38:17,230 --> 00:38:18,270 S1: that to ourselves? 756 00:38:18,710 --> 00:38:22,070 S13: Janet, that's an excellent question, because I think almost all 757 00:38:22,070 --> 00:38:24,469 S13: women deal with that. Perhaps men do too, and just 758 00:38:24,469 --> 00:38:27,310 S13: don't admit it as readily as I think we do. 759 00:38:27,710 --> 00:38:29,150 S13: But I think part of it is we live in 760 00:38:29,150 --> 00:38:32,310 S13: a comparison culture much more than when I was growing up, because, 761 00:38:32,350 --> 00:38:36,270 S13: of course, social media, we have all these carefully curated images, 762 00:38:36,590 --> 00:38:40,029 S13: you know, Instagram and Facebook and Twitter and TikTok and 763 00:38:40,030 --> 00:38:42,710 S13: all kinds of things that are, are popping up every day. 764 00:38:43,030 --> 00:38:45,350 S13: But because of that, I've often said we tend to 765 00:38:45,350 --> 00:38:48,589 S13: compare our weaknesses with other people's strengths. Oh, she does 766 00:38:48,590 --> 00:38:52,230 S13: this better than I do, or she's thinner or she's taller, 767 00:38:52,230 --> 00:38:55,189 S13: or she's got a better family. And Scripture, of course, 768 00:38:55,190 --> 00:38:57,710 S13: tells us over and over that we are not to 769 00:38:57,750 --> 00:39:02,310 S13: compare with each other. We are each unique designer originals. 770 00:39:02,790 --> 00:39:05,710 S13: But but it's tough because I think we look at 771 00:39:05,710 --> 00:39:08,270 S13: our messy house and we look at these beautifully curated 772 00:39:08,270 --> 00:39:11,270 S13: images online and we think, oh, I could never achieve that. 773 00:39:11,270 --> 00:39:14,310 S13: And we weren't supposed to. Which is why, Janet, I 774 00:39:14,310 --> 00:39:16,750 S13: don't know if you remember this part in the book, um, 775 00:39:17,350 --> 00:39:22,150 S13: where I mentioned visiting, uh, Ruth Bell Graham's grave in Charlotte, 776 00:39:22,150 --> 00:39:24,910 S13: North Carolina, not too far from where I live. And 777 00:39:24,950 --> 00:39:28,270 S13: I saw the words that were engraved on her gravestone, 778 00:39:28,270 --> 00:39:31,350 S13: which many people have have, uh, mentioned these over the 779 00:39:31,350 --> 00:39:34,150 S13: years since she passed away. But it was eight simple 780 00:39:34,150 --> 00:39:39,430 S13: words where Ruth wanted engraved on her tombstone. End of construction. 781 00:39:39,430 --> 00:39:40,910 S13: Thank you for your patience. 782 00:39:41,390 --> 00:39:43,590 S14: And when I saw those, I thought. 783 00:39:43,790 --> 00:39:46,190 S13: How wonderful, because she had a wonderful sense of humor. 784 00:39:46,190 --> 00:39:48,310 S13: I said, you know, eight words first spoken with a 785 00:39:48,310 --> 00:39:51,029 S13: grin and a wink and now engraved in stone. And 786 00:39:51,030 --> 00:39:53,990 S13: the reason that struck me, Janet, is for years I've, 787 00:39:53,989 --> 00:39:57,029 S13: I've had a speaking ministry in addition to drama, and 788 00:39:57,030 --> 00:39:59,149 S13: I love going to speak to women's groups all over 789 00:39:59,150 --> 00:40:02,750 S13: the country. But for years I have joked with women's 790 00:40:02,750 --> 00:40:05,590 S13: groups that I only need three words on my final 791 00:40:05,590 --> 00:40:09,149 S13: resting place, which are she meant well, you know, she 792 00:40:09,150 --> 00:40:12,160 S13: meant well. It's like. It's like my last apology to 793 00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:15,239 S13: the world for anything I've left undone, unspoken or, you know, 794 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:18,360 S13: unintentionally messed up. And Janet, that comes out of the 795 00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,239 S13: the quest for perfection that my parents didn't put that 796 00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,920 S13: burden on me. My teachers didn't. It's this. It's this 797 00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:28,240 S13: inner compulsion I have to try to be the best 798 00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:32,120 S13: I can be while realizing, especially when you're in pastoral ministry, 799 00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:35,000 S13: you will never be all things to all people. In fact, 800 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:37,960 S13: you know, the apostle tells us we are not supposed 801 00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,359 S13: to be and we're not supposed to be about just, quote, 802 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:43,120 S13: living our best life now. Our our best life is 803 00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:46,600 S13: is following hard after Jesus and doing what he'd have 804 00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:48,480 S13: us do in the place that he'd have us go. 805 00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:53,000 S13: But that's why these, um, when I talk about that 806 00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:56,560 S13: in the book, Ruth Bell Graham's epitaph, and then the 807 00:40:56,560 --> 00:40:59,280 S13: one I've said for years would be mine, she met. Well, 808 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,480 S13: I have actually changed that this last year, Janet, since 809 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:04,759 S13: I wrote the book, I've decided, no, I'm not going 810 00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:06,640 S13: to have three words on my tombstone. I'm going to 811 00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,370 S13: have five. And they come from Scripture. They come from 812 00:41:09,370 --> 00:41:12,810 S13: the words of Jesus. Uh, the gospel of Mark and 813 00:41:12,810 --> 00:41:17,090 S13: the five will be this. She did what she could, because, Janet, 814 00:41:17,090 --> 00:41:19,930 S13: that has freed me from the quest for perfection more 815 00:41:19,930 --> 00:41:24,090 S13: than anything, because it's all any of us can do. 816 00:41:24,290 --> 00:41:28,850 S13: That beautiful story of the woman who anointed Jesus ahead 817 00:41:28,850 --> 00:41:32,890 S13: with oil, sort of like a priestly anointing. The almost 818 00:41:32,890 --> 00:41:36,530 S13: like a precursor to to his burial. My my pastor 819 00:41:36,530 --> 00:41:40,930 S13: Chris once said 365 days of work for one minute 820 00:41:40,930 --> 00:41:43,410 S13: of an act of worship. I mean, it cost her 821 00:41:43,450 --> 00:41:47,489 S13: all probably a year's wages to that oil did. And 822 00:41:47,489 --> 00:41:50,690 S13: yet you remember that those who were there, as we 823 00:41:50,690 --> 00:41:53,810 S13: know from the gospel account, they were scolding her for it. 824 00:41:54,130 --> 00:41:56,650 S13: And yet into the scolding came the voice of the 825 00:41:56,650 --> 00:41:59,010 S13: Savior when he said, leave her alone, I love that. 826 00:41:59,050 --> 00:42:02,210 S13: You know Jesus saying, leave the woman alone. Why are 827 00:42:02,210 --> 00:42:05,090 S13: you bothering her? She's done a beautiful thing to me. 828 00:42:05,450 --> 00:42:08,850 S13: And then later he said those words that ensured her 829 00:42:08,850 --> 00:42:11,609 S13: act would be discussed throughout the world. Wherever the good 830 00:42:11,610 --> 00:42:14,770 S13: news is preached, she did what she could. And so 831 00:42:14,810 --> 00:42:18,730 S13: I have now. Now not just my husband is my witness. Janet, 832 00:42:18,770 --> 00:42:21,130 S13: you and your listeners are my witness to what I 833 00:42:21,130 --> 00:42:24,370 S13: want on my tombstone. I want those five words. She 834 00:42:24,370 --> 00:42:27,290 S13: did what she could, and that had to be enough. 835 00:42:27,810 --> 00:42:30,689 S1: Yes. What an encouragement to women who think that they 836 00:42:30,730 --> 00:42:34,010 S1: constantly miss the mark, and they listen to that tape 837 00:42:34,010 --> 00:42:36,050 S1: in their head that goes over and over and over again. 838 00:42:36,050 --> 00:42:39,850 S1: You failed. Which, as we grow up and mature spiritually, 839 00:42:39,850 --> 00:42:42,090 S1: we begin to recognize that's the voice of the accuser. 840 00:42:42,489 --> 00:42:44,850 S1: The comforter doesn't talk to us like that. The accuser does. 841 00:42:44,890 --> 00:42:47,930 S1: And learning to recognize that the distinction is important. I 842 00:42:47,930 --> 00:42:49,850 S1: have 30s, but I so want to get it in 843 00:42:49,850 --> 00:42:52,489 S1: in the advent of social media. Boy, I tell you what, 844 00:42:52,489 --> 00:42:54,810 S1: this is a word we toss around a lot, but 845 00:42:54,810 --> 00:42:56,890 S1: it should be synonymous with the word sacrifice because you 846 00:42:56,890 --> 00:43:00,610 S1: cannot mentor without sacrificing. How do we mentor in a 847 00:43:00,610 --> 00:43:01,969 S1: social platform world? 848 00:43:02,730 --> 00:43:06,370 S13: Oh, that's tough, isn't it, Janet? The, um, I think 849 00:43:06,370 --> 00:43:09,180 S13: by being real and being honest, by not just putting 850 00:43:09,180 --> 00:43:12,580 S13: up the carefully curated pictures ourselves, but letting people see 851 00:43:12,580 --> 00:43:16,580 S13: that that yeah, we've had messes too. And also realizing 852 00:43:16,580 --> 00:43:18,580 S13: social media isn't enough, we've got to pick up the 853 00:43:18,580 --> 00:43:21,219 S13: phone and maybe ask a younger woman in whom we 854 00:43:21,219 --> 00:43:23,739 S13: see great potential, who is asking good questions, to ask 855 00:43:23,739 --> 00:43:26,940 S13: her out for coffee and not lecture, but listen, because 856 00:43:26,940 --> 00:43:29,859 S13: we all need somebody to listen. I firmly believe that 857 00:43:29,860 --> 00:43:31,940 S13: we all need a mentor in our life, even if 858 00:43:31,940 --> 00:43:34,980 S13: it's like dead people in books who can mentor us. 859 00:43:35,260 --> 00:43:37,540 S13: And we also need to be mentoring someone else. Those 860 00:43:37,540 --> 00:43:39,700 S13: of us who are older and I am now one, 861 00:43:39,700 --> 00:43:42,940 S13: we have a responsibility to the younger generation to to 862 00:43:42,980 --> 00:43:45,940 S13: give them not a handout, but a hand up and 863 00:43:45,980 --> 00:43:49,100 S13: help them grow as we have been helped. Excellent question. 864 00:43:49,100 --> 00:43:49,740 S13: Thank you. 865 00:43:50,300 --> 00:43:53,459 S1: Maggie. Let me tell you, there's so much more so 866 00:43:53,460 --> 00:43:58,220 S1: much richness, so much really deep thinking and gentle conversation 867 00:43:58,219 --> 00:44:00,060 S1: in the book that I've hardly gotten the time to 868 00:44:00,100 --> 00:44:03,020 S1: talk about Over the Air. So I feel bad in 869 00:44:03,020 --> 00:44:04,779 S1: one respect. But on the other hand, I don't. What 870 00:44:04,780 --> 00:44:07,140 S1: I hope I've done is I've piqued your curiosity enough 871 00:44:07,140 --> 00:44:09,339 S1: to say, oh, I've listened to Maggie. The scripture says, 872 00:44:09,340 --> 00:44:11,100 S1: out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. 873 00:44:11,100 --> 00:44:15,060 S1: There's wisdom there, there's kindness there, there's compassion there. I 874 00:44:15,060 --> 00:44:18,100 S1: want to hear more because I need more. That idea 875 00:44:18,100 --> 00:44:21,460 S1: of getting that backpack of perfection off your back, well, 876 00:44:21,460 --> 00:44:24,939 S1: you can read more because there are 52 reflections on 877 00:44:24,940 --> 00:44:27,339 S1: journeying well with God and others. The book again is 878 00:44:27,340 --> 00:44:31,100 S1: called This Life We Share and is written by Maggie Roe. Excellent. 879 00:44:31,100 --> 00:44:34,060 S1: I strongly recommend it. My heartfelt thanks to Maggie. I 880 00:44:34,100 --> 00:44:36,140 S1: hope this is the first of many conversation in the 881 00:44:36,140 --> 00:44:38,299 S1: years ahead with her, and I thank you friends. Always 882 00:44:38,300 --> 00:44:40,100 S1: a joy to be with you right here on In 883 00:44:40,140 --> 00:44:41,620 S1: the Market with Janet. Partial.