S1: Well, now half of them own their own tablet or smartphone,
S1: half of 2 to 4 year olds and over two
S1: thirds of 5 to 8 year olds. So once you
S1: have that own personal device, there's a huge shift in
S1: what happens to their attention and your time.
S2: Welcome to building relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, author of
S2: the New York Times bestseller The Five Love Languages Today
S2: Setting boundaries and helping your children recover from Their Dependence
S2: on screens. Author and speaker Arlene Pelikan will join us.
S3: Arlene has been with us many times, but this is
S3: one of the most important questions that parents are asking today.
S3: What's happening to my child? My teenager who spent so
S3: much time staring at a device she and Dr. Chapman
S3: have teamed for our featured resources titled Screen Kids. You
S3: can find out more about it at Building Relationships with us. Dr. Chapman,
S3: this is one of the things that you didn't have
S3: to deal with when you were growing up, or even
S3: as your kids were growing up, right?
S4: Oh, you're right Chris. All we had to deal with
S4: was radio and television. It wasn't that hard. We gave them,
S4: you know, 4 or 5 options of what they could
S4: see on TV and how much they could see that week.
S4: And so they had a little choice in there. It
S4: wasn't that hard today. Whew. It is totally different. I'm
S4: glad we're discussing this today, and I know a lot
S4: of parents are going to identify with it.
S3: It's a complex issue, just like our world has gotten complex,
S3: but in other ways, it's it's a little simpler than
S3: we're making it. And I think Arlene is going to
S3: talk about that today. Arlene Pelican's, a friend of this program,
S3: and she's a speaker, the author of a number of books.
S3: We've talked about 31 Days to Happy Husband, Growing Up,
S3: Social Calm, Cool and Connected Parents Rising. Because of all
S3: the questions swirling in the culture about this topic, we're
S3: featuring the book Screen Kids five Skills Every Child Needs
S3: in a Tech Driven World, written by Arlene and our
S3: own doctor, Gary Chapman. Just go to building Relationships. Dot
S3: us to find out more.
S4: Well, Arlene, welcome back to Building Relationships.
S1: It's so wonderful to be back. Thanks so much for
S1: having me.
S4: Now we wrote a Screen kids and Grandparenting Screen Kids
S4: as well to respond to the negative impact of too
S4: much screen time in family life. So is the problem
S4: getting worse? Is it the same? Is it better? Where
S4: are we now?
S1: Yeah, I know we have to start with the bad news,
S1: I suppose. So I have to say, you know, I
S1: think it's getting worse. And the reason it's getting worse
S1: is we are seeing more and more people having detrimental
S1: effects of screen time. And it's happening younger and younger,
S1: you know. So all this in one way it's the
S1: same because even before the pandemic. So between 2004 and 2014,
S1: so it's way before the pandemic, we're seeing depression grow
S1: in teens by 37%. So this huge jump happens before
S1: the pandemic. And that's connected to, oh, instead of talking
S1: to people, we're now on our phones, on social media.
S1: Instead of getting a validation from our families and our
S1: church and people we know in real life, we're looking
S1: at the whole world and comparing ourselves against them. And
S1: we're realizing we don't measure up and we are depressed
S1: and sad about that. So in some ways it's the
S1: same problem. But I think Covid put it on steroids,
S1: because then we really were just with these screens for
S1: for that huge swath of time. And a lot of
S1: people have not bounced back to build those new, healthier habits.
S1: Once again. You know, they did a Wall Street Journal
S1: article with a survey of 33,000 college students, and they
S1: found that two out of three of them were struggling
S1: with loneliness. And, you know, you think of that. I
S1: like to say this to moms like, can you imagine
S1: being in a place where there was a thousand other
S1: moms just like you, with the exact same ages of kids,
S1: and you were all together like, wouldn't you find friends there? Right?
S1: Because this is college and it's people of the same
S1: age with same interests, same life stage. And there they
S1: all are, and they're struggling with loneliness. You know, the
S1: teenage girls, 60% of them, the research is saying, have
S1: extreme sadness and one out of four is thinking about suicide.
S1: So we are in a bad place that is getting
S1: worse because we're becoming more dependent on screens, not less.
S1: And then lastly, you know, it's younger. So to think
S1: of your two year old, three year old, four year
S1: old child or grandchild, you know, in the past they're
S1: looking at board books, they're playing, they're, you know, doing blocks,
S1: they're imitating you. They're pretending to be you, you know,
S1: all these things. Well, now half of them own their
S1: own tablet or smartphone. Half of 2 to 4 year
S1: olds have their own, and over two thirds of 5
S1: to 8 year olds have their own. So once you
S1: have that own personal device, there's a huge shift in
S1: what happens to their attention and their time.
S4: Yep, that's for sure. You know, I see it in
S4: the in the airports. Yeah. There's little kids wherever there's
S4: used to be running around and looking and pulling on somebody,
S4: you know, now they're into the screen. Yeah. Yeah. Now
S4: you have, you have two terms that I, that I
S4: really like and trying to describe the kinds of things
S4: that we are dealing with. And that is you talk
S4: about digital vegetables and digital. Or candy. Explain that concept
S4: in those terms.
S1: Sounds delicious. Right? It's the same like in the physical world, right?
S1: You know, there's food that's good for you and there's
S1: food that's not good for you, but it tends to
S1: be the brownies, the ice cream, the chips, all that
S1: that isn't so good for us. That's the stuff that
S1: looks good. And it's the same way digitally. And so
S1: there are digital vegetables. These are things like learning a skill,
S1: like learning how to play the guitar by watching YouTube
S1: or learning a language, or listening to a sermon or
S1: Skyping grandma and talking to her, you know, face to
S1: face over your phones, like, that's a great thing. Those
S1: are digital vegetables. They're good for you, they're healthy, they're non-addictive,
S1: and you never get in trouble for them. You know,
S1: you're not saying to your child, it's 3 a.m. in
S1: the morning and you're doing your calculus on your phone.
S1: How could you be doing that? You know, so, you know,
S1: it's not a vegetable. It's it's good for you. The candy,
S1: on the other other hand, that's the stuff you do
S1: get in trouble for. How many YouTube videos are you
S1: going to watch now? YouTube is interesting because it houses
S1: vegetables and candy. It has both. You can use it
S1: either way. So it really is the content of what
S1: is what you're trying to really look at here. But
S1: it's so easy. You could start eating a vegetable on YouTube,
S1: like I'm going to learn brush up on my Spanish,
S1: you know? But before you know it, you're like somewhere
S1: completely different because they're offering you candy all the time
S1: of other things to watch. So candy is like social media,
S1: video gaming, all the stuff that's super fun to do
S1: brings a lot of amusement, and it's really hard to
S1: put it down. Just like if you have a bag
S1: of Oreos and you eat one, it's hard to just
S1: eat one. It's the same thing digitally and I love
S1: to encourage parents and grandparents. Can you imagine if you
S1: had a giant bag of M&Ms? I love that family
S1: size bag of M&Ms, and I carried it around with
S1: me all day long and I said to myself, I
S1: am just going to eat ten because I have self
S1: control and I'm filled with the Holy Spirit. I can
S1: do this. You know I'm not going to do it
S1: because this is impossible. So it's the same way when
S1: we put a device that holds so much candy in
S1: reach of a child, whether it's just, you know, on
S1: the table or it's in their pocket or wherever and
S1: it's just in reach, then they're going to reach for
S1: that all day long. And we need to understand that in,
S1: in small, you know, a little bit of candy is okay.
S1: You know, you've had your dinner, you've run around all day,
S1: you're having a piece of cake. Enjoy your piece of cake.
S1: This is lovely. And it's the same way with digital stuff.
S1: Like if you want a little amusement after you've done
S1: all the other stuff, fantastic. But you can't have it. Breakfast,
S1: lunch and dinner just in the same way. You cannot
S1: have cake for breakfast, lunch and dinner. You cannot be
S1: using screens for eight hours a day for amusement, which
S1: is what most kids are doing. Yeah.
S4: So what can parents or grandparents do if their children
S4: are getting way too much screen time, too much digital candy?
S4: What can parents do?
S1: I just want to encourage you as a parent, as
S1: a grandparent, that you can do something like, imagine if
S1: a lot of these problems that we're seeing are related
S1: to technology, then imagine if you can make changes in
S1: the technology. You can like this is very hopeful. It's
S1: not like having a prognosis that you can't do anything about,
S1: like you can do something about this. So I think
S1: having that courage and realizing I can help my child
S1: change before they have to, or I can do it
S1: because they have to, you know, like, I can let
S1: this get so bad that I have to step in
S1: like we're at calamity for, you know, like we have
S1: to do something to this child. They cannot get out
S1: of the house. You know, I've heard of kids who
S1: don't leave the house anymore. You know, when the parents
S1: say we're going to go out to dinner with grandma.
S1: Let's go. No, I don't feel good. I have a stomachache.
S1: And they always have a stomachache because they don't want
S1: to go outside. So what we can do, I think,
S1: is first have that attitude shift of, wait a minute.
S1: If my child was eating poison, I would do something
S1: about it. I would say like, okay, as long as
S1: you're under my roof, you can't, you can't eat that anymore.
S1: You know, we do would do this with drugs. We
S1: would do this with alcohol. So treating it that same
S1: way of saying, wait a minute, if this is making
S1: you sick, I am going to do something about it.
S1: So it might look like a two week detox where
S1: you say, we're going to take a break from this
S1: video game or from social media for two weeks, and
S1: I'm going to do it too with you. And we're
S1: going to do these activities instead. Okay. Does this require
S1: effort for the parent? Yes it does. But guess what?
S1: You're going to find your child so much healthier. And
S1: if you can get them back to being healthy, then
S1: imagine then your life becomes easy. So I kind of
S1: like to say, if you'll do the hard now, your
S1: life can be easier later. So if you see you're
S1: having your child is getting just a little. They used
S1: to just ask for the video game on Saturday. Now
S1: they're asking it for Saturday, Sunday, Tuesday, Wednesday. It's getting
S1: to be kind of this fight. You know what we're
S1: going to say? You know, we're going to shut this
S1: down and we're going to put pause on this video
S1: game for a month because it seems like you're kind
S1: of too into it. So don't let things slide as
S1: you start seeing those red flags do something about them. And.
S1: And you can do something about them.
S2: This is building relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, author of
S2: the New York Times bestseller The Five Love Languages. For
S2: more ways to strengthen relationships, go to Building relationships.us. You'll
S2: see today's featured resource there. It's the book by Dr.
S2: Chapman and Arlene Pelican. Screen kids just go to building relationships.us.
S4: Arlene. What are the age based recommendations for screen time?
S4: The amount of screen time?
S1: They say that for children younger than 18 months, avoid
S1: screens altogether. This kind of seems like a no brainer, right?
S1: If you have a baby, do not give them a tablet.
S1: Now they will say for babies, you know, like a
S1: one year old, etcetera. If they see grandma on the
S1: phone and grandma's talking to them, that is totally okay.
S1: So they give a thumbs up to FaceTiming with a
S1: real human being because it's not passive. The baby coos
S1: and the adult coos back like they like that. So
S1: so that is actually at any time. Okay. So if
S1: you have a regular rhythm of talking to your kids
S1: and grandkids on the phone, that's a very, very good thing.
S1: But you don't want them in front of TV otherwise.
S1: And I would say up to two years to to
S1: not have any screens other than that FaceTiming feature up
S1: to two years. And then after two years, 2 to 5,
S1: they'll say Academy, American Academy of Pediatrics, one hour or
S1: less of quality programming and then preferably co viewed with
S1: your child. I'd always giggle at this because no mom
S1: or dad who finally gets that one hour of screen
S1: time is going to be like, now I'm going to
S1: sit next to you and we're going to talk about
S1: what we're watching. You know, they're like, I got to
S1: cook and I got to do my errands. I got
S1: to get cut off, caught up on work. But ideally,
S1: you know, of course, these are guidelines. These are things
S1: we want to strive towards. That TV time. Video time
S1: is going to be best used with a young child
S1: between 2 to 5. If you can explain this is
S1: what's happening, you know. And then let's practice the sharing
S1: like we just saw on TV. Let's practice this in
S1: real life. That's how it's going to be leveraged the best,
S1: because we always talk about, oh, screens can be so
S1: useful for the development of your child. They're going to
S1: develop emotional empathy. They're going to learn grammar, you know,
S1: and spelling and how to put words together. And those
S1: things can happen. But particularly when coupled with an adult
S1: with them, a parent with them that's talking to them
S1: about what they're seeing. And then after five years old,
S1: they say, use your own discretion. And they used to
S1: say two hours or less, but think they they may
S1: be embarrassed or something to think that people can't do
S1: this because they're watching 7 to 9 hours of digital candy,
S1: but they are doing a study of 10,000 kids over
S1: ten years, and they have found three guidelines to really
S1: predict the health of a child. And if you're a
S1: grandparent listening, you're going to be like, you needed a
S1: study to figure this out. So the three things are
S1: eight hours or more of sleep a night, one hour
S1: of physical activity, and two hours or less of digital
S1: vegetables of that amusing screen time. It's not including school.
S1: So if you can get your child or grandchild on
S1: this program of sleeping at night exercising, I mean, this
S1: is what kids do, right? They run around naturally for hours,
S1: and we're the ones that have given them the screens
S1: that have kind of made them sedentary and so unhealthy.
S1: So if they get that one hour of exercise time
S1: and two hours or less of screen time, that's amusing.
S1: That's a wonderful goal to strive for.
S4: Yeah, I fully agree with that. And I hope our
S4: listeners are hearing it and just starting where they are.
S4: Begin to think in terms of what can we do.
S4: Now here here's a question. It's probably the number one
S4: question that I hear from parents. And that is when
S4: is a good time to give a child a smartphone.
S1: Like there is no good time to give a child
S1: a smartphone. I mean, let's think this through when they're two.
S1: Is that a good time when they're eight? Is that
S1: a good time when they're 13, when their hormones are
S1: raging and they're trying to figure out their identity of
S1: who they are? Is that a good time? So this
S1: is a very complicated question. And people want an answer
S1: like at the 13th and a half birthday, please give
S1: them a smartphone, you know. So sorry I'm not going
S1: to do that for you. But I will say this.
S1: It's going to be different for every child. You might
S1: have a younger child who's able to handle it and
S1: an older child who really could not. So you have
S1: to see the tendencies of your child. So don't make
S1: it this fair thing. When everyone turns 15, everyone's getting
S1: a phone. Don't don't do that. Make it an individualized plan.
S1: And think of it like driving. Like when you give
S1: keys to a kid, to a car, you don't just say,
S1: here's some keys, here's the car, go at it. There's
S1: training involved. There's practice involved. There's, oh, wow, look, you
S1: have your permit and you ran into another car, you know,
S1: and it's because you were irresponsible. Not because you were learning.
S1: Because you were irresponsible. This is probably not the time
S1: for you to be driving right now until we can
S1: get this piece in order. So if your child is
S1: not following the rules and is not responsible with things
S1: like chores, homework, respect to you, respect for siblings, going
S1: to church with a good attitude, you know, things like that,
S1: then for us to think that, oh, we'll give them
S1: this device, this video game, whatever, and they're going to
S1: be so responsible. Like where is the evidence for that? Right.
S1: So there's no evidence for that. So you're also looking
S1: at is my child is what's their character like. What's
S1: the responsibility. Like do they understand this because when you
S1: give them that smartphone, you're giving them the super computer
S1: that can give them pornography, that can give waste their time,
S1: that can give them a worldview that is not Christian
S1: at all, you know? So at best it's just going
S1: to waste their time, but at worst it's going to
S1: rot their soul in their heart. So what we have
S1: to think about, well, when are we giving the super
S1: weapon to our child? So I really recommend giving a
S1: dumb phone first. So that would be, you know, I
S1: love the gab phone gab and what it looks like
S1: because it looks like a regular phone, because you don't
S1: want the poor kid, you know, pulls out the phone,
S1: it's like purple. It's got like hearts on it or something.
S1: And they're like, oh, this is the phone my parents
S1: gave me. So it looks like a normal phone, but
S1: it just calls text, music, pictures. And that's kind of
S1: what the kid needs it for. So they don't need
S1: a smartphone that goes on the internet, that has social media,
S1: it has gaming. So I really encourage you when you're thinking,
S1: is this the time for to give my child a smartphone?
S1: So you know what, let me delay one more year
S1: and let's get that dumb phone instead. I think for sure,
S1: not in elementary school at all. You do not need
S1: a fourth, fifth or sixth grader trying to put on
S1: makeup for girls or for boys nowadays, you know, you
S1: just don't need that kind of influence in their hands
S1: in elementary school at all. If you need to contact them,
S1: then you get that dumb phone and you can contact them.
S1: And then I really caution with I applaud like movements
S1: like wait for eighth, which is saying wait for eighth grade.
S1: I applaud that movement. And that movement is saying wait
S1: at least until eighth grade or more. It's not saying
S1: you have to do it at eighth grade, so wait
S1: at least until eighth grade. And I would say so.
S1: Bill gates did not give his kids a smartphone until
S1: they were in high school. And he kind of knows
S1: something about this. So I think you should push it
S1: out as much as possible. So, you know, our claim
S1: to fame and strangeness is we didn't give our kids
S1: a smartphone until the summer before college. And my husband James,
S1: as he says, you know what? It's working out so
S1: well with them not having them. Why would we want
S1: to rock the boat? And my senior, my senior girl
S1: is actually at the stage where we said, you know,
S1: you want to have this discussion, like, do you want
S1: to have a smartphone your senior year? And she is like, no,
S1: I don't want to have a smartphone because she likes
S1: the discipline that's in her life. She likes the extra
S1: time that's in her life. She hates the idea of
S1: being monitored and tracked and Google knowing all these things
S1: about her, you know, the privacy issues. So she she's
S1: in the matrix like she understands like, no, I don't
S1: really need that now. So push that back because there's
S1: never a parent that says, oh, I didn't know the
S1: smartphone was so amazing. I should have given this to
S1: my child earlier. There is no parent ever who has
S1: said that.
S3: I wonder, Arlene, does your daughter also see friends and
S3: people who are caught in that digital world who can't
S3: get out of it? And. That. That's one of the
S3: reasons to that she doesn't want it 100%.
S1: So what she sees and these are good girls, right?
S1: These are girls who have loving parents. These are girls who,
S1: you know, try to do their best in school and
S1: they're in sports. So these are good girls. But she
S1: says they're hopeless. They don't see like, purpose. And it's
S1: because all their spare time is on the phone, and
S1: the phone just shows them all these superficial things that
S1: really don't mean much. Right? So she really sees that
S1: why is my generation so aimless, so hopeless? And why
S1: do you, as our parents, allow us to become this way?
S1: So she has seen that it's very negative, like it's
S1: a they have a very negative outlook, pessimistic outlook on life.
S1: And this is a lot of why she, she doesn't
S1: want that in her life.
S5: Yeah.
S4: Smart girl. So is there a way that parents can
S4: know if their child is involved in too much screen time?
S4: What are the things you look for?
S1: Yeah, that's there's that gut feeling, right, that something's not
S1: quite right. And then there are a lot of really
S1: obvious things. You know, your child changes behavior. So they
S1: used to be kind of even happy go lucky. But
S1: now you're like, wow, they're so annoyed or they're so
S1: withdrawn or you see the grades fall. You know, they
S1: used to be a B student, but now why are
S1: they being home? All these C's and D's. They used
S1: to love a sport. They loved going to soccer, but
S1: now they're like, oh, maybe I won't try out this year.
S1: Or I used to love like biking with my friends,
S1: but I'd rather just like, stay in and play my
S1: video game. So you see these changes of behavior of
S1: things they used to like doing, they don't do anymore.
S1: They are, you know, things like hygiene, things like that
S1: kind of slip away. They are it's harder to pull
S1: them away from the device. So when it's time to
S1: go to dinner, it's like a fight or it's time
S1: to go to church. It's a fight. It's time to
S1: wake up. It's a fight that you see, like what
S1: is happening, what's going on. So if you see these
S1: kinds of signs emotionally, they're all over the place, then
S1: you can. No, wait a minute. Let's backtrack what has
S1: happened in their life since this change. And most likely
S1: it's going to be an increase of social media or
S1: a video gaming or something like that.
S5: Yeah, yeah.
S4: What about brain development? How does how is that impacted
S4: by the use?
S6: Yes.
S1: I'm so glad you asked that because it's very hard
S1: to talk about screen time without talking about the brain.
S1: Because the brain is learning. The brain is learning. Oh,
S1: these are the cells that we use, and these are
S1: the cells that we don't use. The brain wants to
S1: be very efficient. So at 13 when your child is
S1: getting this huge brain growth spurt, they get one spurt
S1: from birth to age three and they get another spurt
S1: hilariously during puberty. So when this brain spurt happens, if
S1: they say, oh, look, this kid is playing video games
S1: all the time, let's really strengthen that, okay? All these
S1: ones about eye contact and serving others and being grateful
S1: and learning to ride a bike. Like he hasn't used
S1: that for a long time. So let's get rid of
S1: those brain cells. So there is really an architecture that's
S1: happening that the brain that your teenager has is the
S1: brain that they have for the rest of their life.
S1: And you really want a brain that has pathways, the
S1: connections to people and to skills and to God's Word
S1: and all relationships, because it is relationships building relationships. That's
S1: what brings fulfillment in life. That's what's going to last
S1: in this life. So they have in the brain there's
S1: the prefrontal cortex, and that's the executive decision making center
S1: that says, you know what, you're really mad right now.
S1: You should calm down, or you've been playing this video
S1: game for five hours. You should probably get up and
S1: go to the bathroom. So when a child is playing
S1: a video game, let's say, and they're running, they're running
S1: for their life and they're shooting something and they got
S1: to do this. The body thinks, wow, the stress hormone
S1: goes up. We got to keep this kid alive. And
S1: all the blood drains out of the brain and that
S1: prefrontal cortex, and it goes into their major organs to
S1: protect them. And so what you end up having is
S1: this very flabby, weak prefrontal cortex, because it doesn't get
S1: much exercise, it doesn't get much use. And so if
S1: that happens once in a while, no big deal. But
S1: if your child is gaming or using social media and
S1: just waiting for that, that like, you know, waiting for
S1: that dopamine rush of who's going to like this, who's
S1: going to like this? Whoa, look, I have this. Like,
S1: if that's what their brain is accustomed to, then that
S1: prefrontal cortex is very weak. That decision making center, that
S1: self control center is super weak and it is affecting
S1: your child's brain. Growing up, they you know, they used
S1: to say 25 years old, that's, you know, you're still young,
S1: your brain's still developing. You're not 25 yet. Well now
S1: they say 30, you know. Oh you're not because they
S1: need more time because they're not getting enough practice using
S1: their brain. So it's very important that your child is reading,
S1: that your child has quiet time, that your child is
S1: sleeping so that the brain can catalog memories, that the brain,
S1: you know, it's I heard this guy talking about sleep,
S1: that when you're sleeping, your brain is actually figuring out.
S1: What happened during the day and kind of categorizing it
S1: the right places and regulating your emotions. And I just
S1: think of that's how God, when we sleep, how he
S1: heals us and he helps us. And what are screens
S1: doing there interrupting that sleep all night long and it's
S1: wreaking havoc on the system of the brain. And that's
S1: why our kids are so edgy and so easily defeated.
S4: I think many parents have never even thought about how
S4: this affects the brain. Yeah. So what you're saying is
S4: really extremely important, and I hope that those who are
S4: listening to us today will realize it does have a
S4: tremendous impact upon brain development. So parents are thinking, you know, okay,
S4: I think I need to make some decisions, but I
S4: don't want to get into a fight with my kids.
S4: How can how can we come alongside our kids instead
S4: of like, coming down real hard on them and saying,
S4: I read this book, or I heard this radio and
S4: we're going to that's right. As a parent, come into
S4: this to begin to make changes.
S1: Yeah, I think this parent grandparent can start with prayer. Lord,
S1: open the door. Open the door to my child's heart,
S1: to their mind to receive this. Because at the core
S1: is their relationship with you that's at stake and the
S1: place you have in their lives. So Lord, help me.
S1: And then, you know, I learned this from you, Dr. Chapman.
S1: As in screen kids, we talk about the language of apology,
S1: of coming to your child. Not like I've got the plan,
S1: but I'm sorry. Like. Like I like to say to
S1: my children, a lot of times, I've never had a
S1: college student, and I didn't know what to do, and
S1: I'm sorry, you know, so you say to your 16
S1: year old, you're 14 year old. I've never had a
S1: 16 year old. Or maybe it's their third child and
S1: they're like, yeah, you have. But you could say, I've
S1: never had a 16 year old like you, you know,
S1: and I've made some mistakes and I've allowed some things, frankly,
S1: because I'm lazy, mean we are all of us, you know,
S1: because I've been lazy. I didn't want to fight with you.
S1: I didn't I didn't want that. So I just let
S1: things slide and that was wrong. And I'm sorry. And
S1: you might not see this, but this has been really
S1: harmful for you. This video game, this social media, this device,
S1: whatever it is, I can see it's not making you
S1: happy in your life. And I'm sorry. So I am
S1: going to, you know, and things like take the phone
S1: out of the bedroom at night so you can get
S1: a good night's sleep. We're going to put this phone
S1: on hold for a month, and I'm going to give
S1: you a dumb phone instead. And we're just going to
S1: talk in a month to see if you see a
S1: positive effect in your life. So keep your voice real calm.
S1: You're sympathetic. You're on the same side. You might be
S1: sitting on a couch together, side by side. You might
S1: be taking a walk together. You might be driving a
S1: car alongside of each other, but something where they know
S1: my parent is on my side. My parent cares about me.
S1: My parent admits they've made a mistake and they're trying
S1: to remedy it. Now, even if you do all these
S1: things right, your kid might completely blow up and be like,
S1: you are the meanest mom or dad ever. There's no
S1: one on the planet who has a strict as you.
S1: You hate me. You must want me to not have
S1: any friends. And I can't believe you're doing this to me.
S1: And in that moment, you just have to realize they're
S1: looking short term in this exact moment. And you're looking
S1: one year out, three years out, five years out, eight
S1: years out. What kind of adult is this person going
S1: to be? And once they leave your home, you don't
S1: have any say in that. But when they are in
S1: your home, you have a lot of say. So just
S1: stay the course and just take the heat and and stay.
S1: Keep your boundaries, hold your ground, hold your ground. And
S1: most likely, in just a few days your kid will say,
S1: might say, I actually kind of like this a little
S1: bit better. They might admit it, but for sure in
S1: time they will. Thank you for sure. In time they
S1: will thank you.
S2: Thanks for joining us today for building relationships with Dr.
S2: Gary Chapman, author of the New York Times bestseller, The
S2: Five Love Languages. Find us online at Building relationships.us. We
S2: have some great resources. You can sign up for our
S2: weekly newsletter, take an assessment of your love language, or
S2: see our featured resources for today's broadcast with Arlene Pelican.
S2: She and Dr. Chapman have written Screen Kids five Skills
S2: Every Child Needs in a tech driven World. Go to
S2: building relationships. Dot us to find out more.
S3: Arlene, I understand there is a conference coming up in
S3: March of 2024. It's a few months away and it's
S3: going to be in San Diego, which is great to
S3: be any time of the year, but there's somebody special
S3: who's going to be speaking, is that right?
S1: One of my favorite speakers of all time, Dr. Gary Chapman,
S1: is going to be there. It's going to be so exciting.
S1: It is a good day when I get to share
S1: the stage with Dr. Gary Chapman. So it'll be Dr.
S1: Chapman and myself, Bill and Pam Farrell talking on marriage.
S1: Sally Burke, the president of Moms in Prayer, talking about prayer.
S1: And it is a day for parents and grandparents to
S1: gather and say, Lord, we care about our kids. We
S1: want to learn how to parent and grandparent better, and
S1: we're going to have extended worship and altar time to
S1: really seek God and ask God for help and our family.
S1: So I really hope you'll be a part. Parents rising
S1: in sunny San Diego.
S3: So is this will it be online as well or
S3: just in online?
S1: Only a live event? Yes, I think afterwards some of
S1: those main sessions may be available, but it is only
S1: a live event. Yeah.
S3: So get to get to San Diego in March of 2024.
S3: We have a link there at Building relationships.us where you
S3: can find out more about that. But I think what
S3: you're doing is you're modeling. No, I don't want this
S3: on your computer or on your phone. I want you
S3: to be able to look face to face. Right.
S7: Yeah.
S1: There is something really special, right? When you are there
S1: in person with people and you're hugging people and you're
S1: seeing the person in real life, it is something very special.
S1: I do love the live event.
S4: When I'm speaking. I love to speak to live people.
S8: Yeah, yeah. So such a terrible.
S1: Alternative when they're not live.
S4: You know, I mean, I do a lot of zoom
S4: and you know, during pandemic all of us did a
S4: lot of zoom. But I always prefer in-person events. So
S4: I'm excited about I hope our folks who are listening
S4: will put that date on their calendar and plan to
S4: be there. Arlene, let me ask you this question. What
S4: advice do you give to parents of older children when
S4: their parents come in with these ideas of kind of
S4: some limitations on screen time and they just super, super resistant?
S7: Yeah.
S1: And I think you can say, you know what, honey
S1: child of mine, you're going to be out on your
S1: own soon. And when you're out on your own, you
S1: can do all these things. You can make all these decisions.
S1: And that's going to be your life and your decisions,
S1: and you'll have the consequences or benefits of your decisions.
S1: But right now, I'm paying the bills. Last time I checked,
S1: we pay the mortgage. We pay for your food. We
S1: pay for your school. We probably pay for your phone.
S1: So since we have all those things, you know we
S1: would not be responsible if we didn't do what we
S1: thought was right. So we want to do right to you.
S1: And this is what we believe is the right thing.
S1: And we understand that you don't agree. But that's our
S1: job is to do what's right. And we love you
S1: and we love you. And that's why we want to
S1: do what's right for you.
S4: I like that it's accepting the responsibility that you, in
S4: God's plan as a parent are the authority. And but
S4: you need to be empathetic, just as you were and
S4: what you just said. Empathetic with the child. Understand how
S4: they may have feelings differently. I remember I said to
S4: my son along the way a few times I said,
S4: you know, Derek, just remember now I'm the father and
S4: you're the son, okay? And I have the final word,
S4: and I'm going to always do what I believe is
S4: best for you, because I love you so. And I
S4: think if a child, if you if you lovingly acknowledge
S4: your authority, they won't necessarily like everything that you do,
S4: but they will come to respect you. So yeah. Good word.
S4: What if your child says that they'll be left out?
S4: If I don't use social media or play certain games
S4: or have a smartphone like my friends do? I'll be
S4: left out.
S1: This is such a good one, right? Because this is
S1: why we, especially as moms, we capitulate. We're like, oh,
S1: we don't want our baby to be left out of
S1: any group chat. Look, let's get the phone right now,
S1: you know? So I think what we have to look
S1: at is, okay, we get the device so they won't
S1: be left out, but then what happens? Are they really
S1: not left out? Actually, it gives a microscope now and
S1: all the things that they are being left out of. Right.
S1: They're seeing now. Oh look, this person is at such
S1: and such a place and I wasn't invited or this
S1: person just scored a touchdown. I've never scored a touchdown.
S1: And now they are feeling even more left out. So
S1: I want you to consider that question and realize that
S1: the phone does not solve that problem of being left out.
S1: In fact, it magnifies the problem for many kids. And
S1: if your child has competence in an area so they
S1: feel they have a skill, you know, it could be
S1: drawing or riding a bike or fixing cars, whatever, right?
S1: And they have a community of people. They have real people,
S1: hopefully at church, hopefully a few at school, maybe some
S1: family friends that you've been friends forever. If they have
S1: those things, they have skills that they feel proud of.
S1: They have people in their life who care about them.
S1: Then they can combat that feeling of, I'm left out
S1: because I don't have a phone, or I don't have
S1: social media, or I don't have video games because they
S1: have something else that gives them belonging. Another thing to
S1: talk to your child about is, hey, guess what, sweetheart?
S1: You know, sweetheart, for your girl and big guy for
S1: your guy. You know, you get to be left out
S1: of a lot of future problems for girls. You get
S1: to be left out of a lot of anxiety and
S1: depression that girls are feeling from being on 24 over seven,
S1: you know? Remember when we went to school? You're trying
S1: to be cool, right? You're trying to have people like you.
S1: You're trying to be kind of like the popular kids
S1: as much as possible. So when you're in the hallway,
S1: you're trying to be this person, and then when you
S1: go home, you just kind of let your hair down
S1: and it's just like, whatever. Good. Now I get to relax. Well,
S1: kids now are always on. They're always in the hallway
S1: because they're always on social media trying to portray themselves.
S1: And it is exhausting. And so for kids, you can
S1: let them know, hey, I'm leaving you out of a
S1: lot of stress, of having to keep up, having to
S1: respond instantly, of having to stay awake at night to wonder, like,
S1: I don't want to like, miss a conversation and then
S1: come to school and not know about something. You get
S1: to miss out on all of those things. And for boys,
S1: I mean, if they miss out on pornography addiction to
S1: violent video games, that's really going to help them a
S1: huge amount in their life. So you kind of have
S1: to think, too, of what are they being left out of?
S1: And maybe this is a quite a positive thing that
S1: they are being left out.
S4: So, Arlene, what about your own high school girls? What
S4: do they think about not having social media?
S1: Yeah, I have a senior and a freshman, and they
S1: both go to public school in San Diego. So we
S1: are not living under a rock and they do not
S1: have social media. And you know what people wonder? Like how,
S1: you know, are they fighting you, you know, or do
S1: you guys have talks about this all the time? But
S1: I think because if you can reach your children when
S1: they're young and you can help them have interests and
S1: do other things, then they'll see that, oh, I don't
S1: want to spend so much time just sitting on the phone.
S1: So it's kind of something inside of them. I think
S1: that they do like it. They for sure like it.
S1: So it's not like, oh, I have no interest. No,
S1: they have interest. So how we've managed it is they
S1: use my phone for social media. So basically I look
S1: like I'm a tennis fan and you know, like it's
S1: all on my name, that this is how it looks.
S1: But they use my phone, they scroll through it and
S1: that allows them to see what they want to see.
S1: But it's not in their pocket all the time. And
S1: that's kind of been a good hybrid for us. And
S1: my younger daughter had said, and we were listening to
S1: a podcast or something. And that's another thing, is just
S1: have your kids learn alongside of you. So when I
S1: learn something about social media, I'll share it at the
S1: dinner table. Or if I'm in the car, we'll listen
S1: to a podcast together about someone else. That's not me,
S1: you know, talking about the detrimental effects of social media, etcetera. And,
S1: you know, one of my children said, you know what?
S1: When I have social media, someday I'm going to use
S1: it on my computer because that way I can use
S1: it and see it. But then I wouldn't be tempted
S1: all day long to use it if it was in
S1: my pocket, you know? And that's something they're coming to
S1: the realization themselves. And I think that's as parents, that's
S1: what we want for our kids to kind of grasp it,
S1: to realize, okay, this is an okay thing, but we
S1: understand that they are trying to hijack my attention like
S1: they're very powerful technology companies. The US Surgeon General, Vivek Murthy,
S1: has talked about this mental health crisis. And he said,
S1: you're pitting a child against the world's greatest product designers,
S1: and it's not a fair fight. So I think when,
S1: you know, my kids have seen the documentary Social Dilemma,
S1: which talks about like all these tech insiders saying how
S1: they've created all these things to be as sticky and
S1: addictive as possible. You know that there's a reason that
S1: it has a notification that just says someone's tagged you
S1: in a picture. Well, then you want to look at it, right? Like, oh,
S1: who's tagged me in a picture? Now you're opening your phone. Well,
S1: they could have designed it so that the picture just
S1: pops up. You know, instead of that, you've been tagged
S1: in a picture. You know, they could have designed it.
S1: So you just peek at it and say, oh, look
S1: at I'm in this picture. But no, they want you
S1: in the app. They want you there. So under I
S1: think when your child my kids since they kind of
S1: understand oh my goodness, they're trying to manipulate me for
S1: my attention. They're trying to to feed me things. I
S1: don't want that in my life. I want to be
S1: in charge of what they're feeding me and not vice versa.
S1: So there becomes then an independence. And I think that's
S1: really what we want, what we want to put in
S1: our young people.
S5: Yeah.
S4: Those are mature children and they're never going to learn
S4: that on their own. In our culture, it's going to
S4: have to come from parents if they if they learn that. Yeah.
S4: What would you say to the parent who kind of
S4: has already let the cat out of the bag? I mean,
S4: they've just let the child, you know, do what they
S4: wanted to do. How do you how do you dial
S4: back some of the technology that's already been given? They've
S4: already been using it.
S1: And this is such a common question because most people
S1: will listen to this interview and be like, oh dear. Like, okay,
S1: we're we've done this, we've done this and this. Let's
S1: just do from this day forward, you know, God's mercies
S1: are new every morning. And so this comes with a
S1: thought of, okay, what would it look like if it
S1: was better. What would that look like? Would it be
S1: that they're not playing the super violent video game? Would
S1: it be that they're going to bed not with their phone, but,
S1: you know, with Scripture that I pray over them and
S1: we take the phone out of the room. So I
S1: think it begins without apology, like we talked about earlier, that, hey,
S1: I've given you this device, I've allowed you to play
S1: this really violent video game. I know I've been letting
S1: you watch a show on Netflix, but I don't think
S1: this is really the greatest show on Earth, you know?
S1: So it's an acknowledgement that I've. I've let you do
S1: these things, and I'm really sorry. And I see now
S1: that it's not the best for you. And let's we're
S1: going to take this back. Now, of course, it's so
S1: much easier to never give it in the first place
S1: than to take something back. Right? So if you delay
S1: giving the device, then they just don't have it versus
S1: wait a minute, I've had this phone for a year.
S1: There's a major ownership there. They feel like you can't
S1: do me wrong by taking that away. I've owned that
S1: for a year. But in reality, are they paying for it? No,
S1: you're paying for it, you know, so you can obviously
S1: point that out in a loving manner, but that that
S1: it's it's always going to be harder to take it
S1: away than to say no in the first place. So
S1: if you get into a juncture that you can say, no,
S1: I just encourage you, remember this moment. May it come
S1: to you and say, you're going to say, no, let
S1: me wait. You know, just say no. Let me wait.
S1: So don't give in. In that moment. No, let me wait.
S1: But if it's already been out, then it has to be.
S1: You know what, honey? I know you're super used to
S1: doing this. Super used to. But. But talk to them
S1: about it, you know, do you? If you didn't spend
S1: so much time playing video games, what are some of
S1: the other interests you would like to pursue? Are there
S1: things you know? Do you want to pursue biking? Do
S1: you want to learn how to play pool? Do you
S1: want to play tennis? Do you want to ride horses? Whatever.
S1: Like like help your child see that there are other options.
S1: Maybe that is a helpful way to like, we're going
S1: to dial back this technology piece. But I really want
S1: to help you, you know, with your interests. Let's make
S1: a list. What are ten things if you got to
S1: be able to do them instantly, what are ten things
S1: you'd want to be able to do. And then look
S1: at it okay. What are what are things that we
S1: could learn to do from this list that are actual,
S1: real things that you could learn to do? And I
S1: think that will help take the sting out of, hey,
S1: we're going to take away this technology piece.
S2: This is building relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman, and Arlene
S2: Pelican is our guest. If you go to Building relationships.us,
S2: you'll see the book they wrote together. Screen Kids five
S2: Skills Every Child Needs in a Tech driven World. Find
S2: out more at building relationships.us.
S4: Arlene. Are there good aspects? What are the beneficial aspects
S4: of a child's development in terms of technology?
S1: Yeah, people are wondering, is there anything good about this?
S1: You know, we touched on one earlier is FaceTiming people.
S1: I mean, imagine if you're your dad is deployed in
S1: another country and you get to talk to him on
S1: the phone and see his face like, that's amazing. So
S1: I think the that's kind of what we, what drew
S1: us to this technology that, wow, we can talk to
S1: each other. So I think going back to the voice,
S1: like having phone calls with each other, FaceTime each other,
S1: those are very positive uses. If you use technology on purpose,
S1: like you're going to do it for, you know, you're
S1: going to learn an art course or you're going to
S1: communicate to a missionary or, you know, you really have
S1: a purpose and it's helping you with your goal. I
S1: think it's extremely helpful, mean, crazy, helpful. You know, we
S1: laugh at, you know, what in the world did we
S1: do before? GPS mean it gets us to our destination.
S1: So there are things that you can use on purpose.
S1: And I think that's the key that you before you
S1: turn on the device, you know exactly what you're there
S1: to use it for. You use it for that. And
S1: I think it can be extremely helpful. Yeah.
S4: Oh, another whole subject, of course, that we deal with
S4: in the book is a matter of developing social skills
S4: for children and a screen driven age, it's more and
S4: more difficult to develop social skills, which they're going to
S4: need the rest of their lives. So how how do
S4: we give us an overview of five skills that we
S4: deal with in the book that that children need to
S4: learn in, in an age in which technology is so impactful?
S1: Yeah, we know about the a pluses in schools that
S1: we're all like, yay, get those eight pluses. But really
S1: it's the relational ones. So the a plus skill of
S1: affection that they know how to give and receive love
S1: the a plus skill of appreciation that a child says
S1: thank you instead of this is the old iPhone. I
S1: want the new one, the a plus skill of anger management.
S1: They're going to get angry. We all do. But how
S1: do we deal with this anger? How do we decide
S1: if this anger is right? Good anger or bad anger?
S1: The skill of apology. Can your child say I'm sorry?
S1: Like take the blame. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings,
S1: I apologize, or is your child just going to not respond?
S1: You know, just lose that friendship. Never text that person back,
S1: you know, and just forget about it. And then lastly, attention.
S1: Can your child take their wandering attention and focus? Can
S1: your child sit in the classroom and give a teacher attention,
S1: a pastor attention during a sermon, a parent attention while
S1: they're giving them directions? You know, and I think attention
S1: is a huge one because kids are so used to
S1: you think of Mister Rogers. It was very slow paced,
S1: just one person just talking. And we all found that
S1: very mesmerizing, you.
S8: Know.
S1: And and even now, as adults, if we watch Mr. Rogers,
S1: we think, wow, this is really slow. This is what's happening.
S1: So for kids, they're just used to every three seconds
S1: something changes, something explodes, something's very exciting. So it's very
S1: hard to keep their attention. So in relationships for listening,
S1: you've got to be able to pay attention. So affection appreciation,
S1: anger management apology and attention.
S4: Boy. If a child can grow up to adulthood with
S4: those five social skills, we set them up for success
S4: in life in terms of relating to other people. And
S4: when we don't, we really set them up to have
S4: struggles in relating to people, and it'll affect them in
S4: their job. It'll affect them in school, obviously. In fact,
S4: I've had public school teachers, Arlene, say to me, I
S4: have to spend half my time just trying to get
S4: the attention of the students. And I know that there
S4: are some school teachers that have collected the phones before
S4: the class starts.
S8: That you think it's a good idea?
S6: Yes.
S4: I have to have permission from the principal, and then
S4: some parents are going to jump in and say, you
S4: shouldn't be doing that. But when kids have got that
S4: phone there and they're pulling it out, teachers can't always
S4: see what they're doing, but they're looking at something other
S4: than the teacher involved in something else. Well, yeah. And
S4: I think most parents, when you name those five skills,
S4: can see the value of those things. And so where
S4: are they going to learn if they spend, you know,
S4: the bulk of their time on the screens? Well, what
S4: are some ways that parents can be an example to
S4: their children regarding, you know, screen time? Should families participate
S4: in a, in a, in a digital Sabbath, you know,
S4: just have a half a day every week when none
S4: of us use technology? I don't know.
S1: Being the example that that is so key. And I
S1: kind of think that's why kids are struggling so much
S1: is because we as adults are struggling so much that
S1: we also in our marriages, it's easier to look at
S1: the phone. It doesn't demand anything of us. It gives
S1: us amusement and pleasure and demand zero from us. You'll
S1: get our spouse and we're like, oh, I need to
S1: meet your needs, and you need to meet my needs,
S1: and we need to serve one another. So I think
S1: a lot of it stems from us. You know, I
S1: like to ask the question, if my child use technology
S1: exactly like I do, would I be pleased with that?
S1: You know, so just kind of doing that check on ourselves.
S1: And I think some things that help are if you're working,
S1: a lot of us work from home and we might
S1: have children around, then you let your child know, I'm
S1: doing a digital vegetable. I am really working. And you know,
S1: when I break for lunch, we'll do something together. You know,
S1: it's the idea of when you're working, really work. So
S1: that way, when your child looks, well, me, you're looking
S1: at shoes. Thought you.
S8: Were working, you know, and you're like.
S1: Oh yeah. Slipping into the candy mode here. So I
S1: think labeling what we're doing because they just see us
S1: on a phone or on a device and they just
S1: think we're just ignoring them. But if we can label, oh,
S1: let me talk to let me tell grandma that we're
S1: going to meet her at five and you send that
S1: text and then you put it down. I think it
S1: helps us to be more responsible with how we're using
S1: the technology, and it's kind of showing our children, yes,
S1: we do have to use this, but when we're done
S1: with it, we kind of treat it like a hot
S1: potato and we try to put it down versus holding
S1: it all the time. Now I'm the one who talks
S1: about this, right? And I find myself holding it all
S1: the time, like I'll go to my girls tennis games
S1: and I will have it in my hand because I'm
S1: going to shoot a video, but then I'll start looking
S1: at things and I'm like, wait, what am I doing?
S1: What are you doing? I put it in my pocket like,
S1: you know, so we all struggle with this. So I
S1: think the idea of a digital Sabbath is a swath
S1: of time that you're like, we are going to take
S1: a break from technology. So it could be a whole weekend.
S1: It could be a day like Sunday, it could be
S1: a week night like Thursday night. We don't use any
S1: electronics and we just have a game night and that's
S1: our rhythm. So I think having a rhythm where things
S1: are off, let's say you're just finding it's too much.
S1: You have too much technology in your life. Building a
S1: swath of time that is tech free is a great
S1: way to start.
S4: A good way to take a breath.
S6: Yes, yes.
S4: Yeah. Now, you mentioned earlier that your son Ethan is
S4: now in college and that he did not get a
S4: smartphone until the summer before college. Yes. How is that going?
S1: You know what? It's so funny. The biggest funny thing
S1: about that is, since he wasn't used to having it,
S1: he was very irresponsible with it. So, for instance, we
S1: were hike literally hiking in Yosemite and it is in
S1: his pocket and he like dropped it in the water.
S1: So that's how we lost the first one. The second
S1: one was in his pocket and he went into a spa.
S1: And that's how we almost lost that one. But we
S1: were able to pull it out.
S8: Fast enough so.
S1: He just doesn't know it's there. So that was very funny.
S1: But you know what a lot of parents will say, well,
S1: we have to and there's value here. We have to
S1: let them practice it. Or else when they go out
S1: they'll go crazy with it. That's we hear that a lot.
S1: But if your child has been raised in your home
S1: for 18 years, right, and they have those values inside
S1: of them, I would argue that when they have the
S1: phone now, they have a much better chance of winning
S1: against the temptations of that phone because they've allowed their
S1: character to develop versus, oh, now I have this phone.
S1: Now I can go crazy on it and like, play
S1: video games for ten hours a day, you know? So
S1: we found that it's. Been really a great and easy
S1: transition for Ethan. You know he uses he's very funny.
S1: He didn't get the latest smartphone. He you know it's
S1: also because we were on a budget you know. But
S1: he got an old phone like his first phone was,
S1: you know a couple versions back and he got an
S1: old phone and he's like, I don't need my phone
S1: to be super fancy, because then it's tempting. I just
S1: need it to do these basic things that I needed
S1: to do for college. So he it's been the opposite that,
S1: you know, if you call him, he's not going to
S1: pick it up because he's not fixated on it.
S8: So it's more like that.
S1: But he just uses it for what he needs and
S1: he's been responsible with it. He has not started gaming.
S1: He is very involved in different things. So, you know,
S1: he plays ultimate Frisbee. He's involved in crew. He's a
S1: mechanical engineering major. He's got plenty to do. And I
S1: think what you'll find for kids is if you can
S1: send them out with that knowledge of there's a lot
S1: of exciting things in life that have nothing to do
S1: with the screen, and they can engage in that. Then
S1: the screen is not so tempting to them. Yeah.
S4: Let's say a word to grandparents. How can they get
S4: involved in screen time with their grandkids?
S7: Yes.
S1: So that whole idea of FaceTiming kids is so great.
S1: And so if you have even if your child is
S1: in the neighborhood, it's not a bad thing. And if
S1: they're out of town, if you have like every Thursday night,
S1: you know, we before dinner to help Mom and dad,
S1: I call and we I read a story to my grandkids.
S1: Like how wonderful. That's a wonderful use of technology and
S1: a great memory to make with your child. So have
S1: that regular time of using screens on purpose, and then
S1: when they come to visit you in real life, then
S1: make screens absolutely invisible, you know, so when they're with you,
S1: with Grandma and grandpa, that's the screen free zone of, hey,
S1: these are books. Isn't this neat? You know, like, let's
S1: go fishing. Let's take a walk. Come help grandma with
S1: her errands. You pick this out. Let's bake cookies when
S1: we get home, you know? So these are screen free things.
S1: And I know for you grandparents who are listening, like, oh,
S1: that sounds very idyllic. My grandchildren are with me Monday,
S1: Wednesday and Friday. And that does not look like that.
S8: I'm exhausted.
S1: You know, and that's why we wrote that book Grandparenting
S1: Screen Kids for some tips. But a lot of that
S1: is just having different rules at your house that your
S1: grandkids get used to. Hey, at Nana and Papa's house,
S1: we only use the screens between 2 and 3, and
S1: the rest of the time you know, the screens take
S1: a nap and you read books instead. Or you color
S1: or you do something. And at first they might sit
S1: there on the couch board, you know, and that's fine.
S1: And eventually they'll come around like, I guess this is
S1: how it works at grandma's house, and they'll start doing
S1: whatever activities you put in front of them. So just
S1: be have those different rules at your house and let
S1: it be different at your house, because it is a
S1: good break from technology.
S4: Well, being a grandparent, I'm glad you shared a few
S4: words for grandparents because we want to make technology work
S4: for us and our relationship with them, and not have
S4: to feel that we always have to do everything they
S4: want us to do screen wise, and not have to
S4: be on screens all the time that we're with them.
S6: And you know.
S1: What, Gary? A word to the grandparents. You are so
S1: important because you are kind of the ones that remember
S1: of what life was like before this technology. And you
S1: can show your grandkids, hey, there are lots of character skills.
S1: There are lots of other. There's music and there's art
S1: and there's reading and there's building and there's hard work
S1: and there's farming. Like you can teach us things that that,
S1: you know, we're not learning about right now. So actually
S1: sometimes grandparents feel like they're put to the side. But
S1: please know you're so important.
S4: A good word. Laura Lane, thank you for being with
S4: us today. This has been a fascinating conversation, and I
S4: do hope that parents and grandparents who are listening will
S4: get the book one for the grandparents, one for the parents,
S4: and they'll find obviously even more things than we've been
S4: able to talk with today. So thanks again for being
S4: with us.
S1: Thank you so much, Gary. Thank you Chris.
S3: Featured resource is Arlene and Gary's book, Screen Kids five
S3: Skills Every Child Needs in a Tech Driven World. You
S3: can find it at Building Relationships dot.
S4: And next week I'll tackle some of your questions about
S4: relationship struggles.
S2: Don't miss our October edition of Dear Gary. While a
S2: big thank you to our production team, Steve Wick and
S2: Janice back. Building relationships with Dr. Gary Chapman is a
S2: production of Moody Radio in Chicago in association with Moody Publishers,
S2: a ministry of Moody Bible Institute. Thanks for listening.