S1: In November of 2007, after only a few weeks on
S1: the air, Moody Radio debuted the first Dear Gary broadcast
S1: on building relationships with Gary Chapman. Today you get to
S1: hear the first questions posed to Gary on this best
S1: of presentation of building Relationships.
S2: Hi, this is Gary. Leave a message and I'll get
S2: back to you.
S3: My husband and I are having an issue with his mother.
S4: I would like to know if he could maybe take
S4: the subject of getting your husband to open up.
S5: I had got into a relationship with an adulterous woman
S5: that went on for four years.
S6: What do you do? Get married even though you don't
S6: feel you're ready. Break up. What do you do? I'm
S6: calling about. My husband and I are on the verge
S6: of divorce. It's going nowhere. And I don't think either
S6: one of us want a divorce, but we can't live
S6: the way we were.
S7: Welcome to building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman, author of
S7: the New York Times best seller The Five Love Languages. Hi,
S7: I'm Andrea Fabbri, along with Chris Fabbri, and today we're
S7: pleased to present our very first Dear Gary broadcast.
S8: When we first came on the air back at the
S8: beginning of October, we gave a phone number out for
S8: you to call if you have suggestions for the program. Feedback,
S8: some encouragement for Gary and we have overloaded that line.
S8: Today is the day we're going to dump your phone
S8: calls right here. It's going to be a phone call
S8: harvest for us today. Questions from that phone line. So
S8: if you've left something there, today may be your day.
S7: Gary, you do get a lot of questions at your seminars.
S7: I know, and you have to think fast. Do you
S7: enjoy that part of the weekend?
S2: You know, I do. I enjoy interacting with with couples
S2: and sometimes just with individuals when they will come up
S2: and talk to me, their spouses in the back of
S2: the auditorium somewhere and they want to have a private moment.
S2: But I really do enjoy talking with people. Uh, I
S2: enjoy doing the seminar, but I enjoy personal interaction because,
S2: you know, when people come with personal things that, you know,
S2: they're hurting and you also know they're open for help,
S2: and when people are open for help, they're most likely
S2: to find it.
S8: You know, there's an interesting phenomenon that happens on that
S8: phone line, the listener line that we set up. And
S8: that is many of them have been to a seminar
S8: and they'll say, I talked to you afterward. That's kind
S8: of an energizing time for you. But at the same time,
S8: there's a lot of hurt out there.
S2: Oh, there is, yeah. You know, I use all the
S2: break times on my seminars on Saturday, use all the times,
S2: all the breaks to talk to people. I don't like
S2: to go back in the room and hide. I want
S2: to be with the people. Because the more I am
S2: in touch with people's need, the more effective I'm going
S2: to be as a communicator when I'm speaking.
S7: Well and to keep you, I'm sure, in touch with
S7: what the real issues are, because principles are one thing
S7: and yet it all plays out differently in individual lives,
S7: doesn't it?
S2: Well, it does because everybody's different. You know, every situation
S2: is somewhat different. Principles are pretty much the same, but
S2: you have to learn how to apply them in different situations.
S8: Mhm. Well what we want to do and what the
S8: mission really is of building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman,
S8: is not just to sit around here and have a
S8: good time on the weekend, but to listen to you,
S8: to hear what's on your heart and in the process,
S8: help a lot of other people. So let's get started.
S8: Here's the first person up for dear Gary.
S3: Hi Gary, I'm so glad to hear that you put
S3: this kind of a program on the radio every week.
S3: I'm so excited. Um, I have my husband and I
S3: are having an issue with his mother, and we want
S3: very much to have a relationship with her. It's just
S3: very frustrating. Every time we reach out, it seems like, um,
S3: it's never good enough or never acceptable. And we really
S3: could use some help.
S2: Wow. I think she represents a lot of, uh, a
S2: lot of people who are struggling with in-law relationships. You know,
S2: the caller wasn't specific in terms of what the what
S2: the problem is. But many times when people reach out
S2: to in-laws and try to build good relationships, they find
S2: that the in-law is not responsive. And, you know, you
S2: say that we'll come over and chat and they'll say, well,
S2: this is not a convenient time for you to come.
S2: And after a while you begin to feel like, wow,
S2: maybe they don't want to have a relationship with us.
S2: Maybe they don't like me. You know, so I would
S2: say this, first of all, the best person to talk
S2: to the mother in law is her son, not the
S2: daughter in law. If the son will say to his mother,
S2: you know, mom, I don't know what's going on here,
S2: but I know that, uh, Margie and I or whatever
S2: her name is, Margie and I are really frustrated with
S2: with what's going on. Can you help me understand what
S2: the dynamics are? You know what you're thinking, what you're feeling.
S2: Because we're getting the impression that you don't want us around.
S2: And I don't think that's true, but that's what we're
S2: beginning to feel. You know, if you just ask an
S2: honest question as you perceive it and let that mother
S2: respond to that son, he'll probably get the truth. And
S2: once you have the truth, then you can have an
S2: appropriate response until you know what the mother in law
S2: is really thinking. Anything you do is not going to help. So,
S2: you know, we've got to find out what's going on
S2: in her mind before you can solve the problem.
S7: Well, let me go to the next step then. Suppose
S7: she says, well, of course I want you around. It's
S7: just that you're you're this and you're that, and poor
S7: me and I. And so it continues on where the
S7: son which I can see where that's the healthier way
S7: to go. Even then he feels like I can't win.
S7: I can't win, mom, I don't know I don't know
S7: what to do. Then what?
S2: Well, I think I would be specific. I would ask
S2: questions of the mother. What could we do that would
S2: be helpful to you because I want to be a
S2: good son. My wife wants to be a good daughter
S2: in law. What can we do that would be helpful
S2: to you? Be specific rather than general. And if she
S2: gives some ideas, then to the best of your ability,
S2: you try to do those things. You don't let her
S2: manipulate you, but you do take the information. And if
S2: it's something that's reasonable, then the two of you can
S2: begin to do that. Now we have to also acknowledge
S2: that there are some mother in laws and father in
S2: laws that you're never going to satisfy, but they have
S2: a negative attitude. It's not just toward you, they're negative
S2: toward life. And so consequently, what you whatever you do,
S2: it's not going to be right. And you can't change
S2: a person like that. But what I'm talking about is
S2: trying to build a healthy relationship to the best of
S2: your ability, which is what the scriptures teach. You know,
S2: as much as it lies in your side, you try
S2: to build a peaceful relationship with them and asking specific
S2: questions is the route to go. because if you have
S2: some idea of what you might do that would be helpful,
S2: then you can share that. But the other side is true. Also,
S2: you need to share with your mother what you're finding
S2: difficult about this relationship, because if your mother is not
S2: willing to make some changes, you know, again, you can't
S2: make her change. But often they need to change. And
S2: if they will, the relationship can be better. But the
S2: mother in law's got to know what you're feeling. So
S2: it's a two way street.
S8: And the rule of thumb is that it's the person
S8: whose mother it is or father it is. That's the
S8: best person to broach this. Don't put that on the
S8: the in-law spouse. Right.
S2: Yeah. Almost always Chris, that's the better route to go.
S2: Once in a while, parents will have a really bad
S2: relationship with their own child, their own son or their
S2: own daughter, and they really love the daughter in law
S2: or the son in law. So once in a while,
S2: the son in law, the daughter in law would be
S2: the one to talk. But by and large, it's better
S2: to have the son or daughter talking to their own
S2: mother and father about the problem.
S7: I think we have time for one more call before
S7: we take a break. Last week we presented a military theme,
S7: and here's a caller with a question along those lines.
S9: Hi, I just wanted to see if there's any way
S9: that maybe he could do a topic on when a
S9: spouse loses a spouse, and then the Lord gives them
S9: the encouragement to move on to another spouse and the
S9: trials that you go through when this happens. And the
S9: reason why I ask is my late husband was killed
S9: in Iraq. The Lord has blessed me with another husband
S9: who I never thought I'd have, and I'm very happy.
S9: But he struggles with the fact of my late husband
S9: and us not being divorced and the Lord taking him away.
S9: It's just been a very big struggle and I'd like
S9: to hear some more on this.
S2: Well, that's a pretty heavy topic. You know, anytime you
S2: lose a spouse, whether it's in a military action or otherwise,
S2: it's really a tough time of adjustment. I don't know
S2: how long time was between her husband being killed and
S2: the time she remarried, but often a part of the
S2: struggle is that people get married too quickly. You know,
S2: we're told by those who research grief that it takes
S2: about two years for us to get back on a
S2: normal emotional level, ground after the death of a spouse.
S2: And sometimes we end up getting remarried within those two
S2: years when we haven't fully worked through our own grief.
S2: So we're still struggling emotionally with that, and now we're
S2: in a new relationship. It can also cause a problem
S2: for the person we married, because they sense that we
S2: are still tied in some way to that spouse that's
S2: now deceased. And in reality, we are, because we haven't
S2: gotten through the grief process yet. We're still thinking about them,
S2: remembering them, going through things we did together. And and
S2: consequently we are to some degree tied to that person. Um,
S2: but if you're already married, obviously you can't. You can't
S2: extend the period before you get married. So I think
S2: we have to start where we are. We have to
S2: face the problem, lay it on the table. And apparently
S2: this may be happening for this particular caller that her husband,
S2: her new husband, is saying to her some things about this,
S2: it's disturbing him. That's healthy because he's sharing with her, uh,
S2: what's going on inside of him and what he's feeling
S2: about her. And she has to be honest with him
S2: and not try to deny it and say, no, he's dead.
S2: I'm not, you know. No, but but to say to him,
S2: you know, to be honest with you, I am struggling.
S2: I guess I'm still feeling some of the pain, you know,
S2: of the loss of all of that. I want to
S2: go on. I mean, I love you, and I want
S2: our marriage to be what God designed it to be.
S2: So just, you know, help me, be patient with me
S2: and let's talk about it. Let's work our way through this.
S2: Because really, the primary way of working through grief is
S2: to talk about it. The worst thing she can do
S2: is to deny it or to try to hide it
S2: and say, well, no, I'm not having thoughts of my husband,
S2: my former husband, because she is. And you can't build
S2: a relationship on deception. So she needs to be honest
S2: with him. He needs to be honest with her. And
S2: together they need to process the grief of the death
S2: of her former husband.
S8: And in one sense, there's a positive in here that
S8: she had a good relationship with her husband who was killed,
S8: and that she's not coming from a a terrible marriage,
S8: that she's trying to get over all of this hurt.
S8: There was something good there. And so in one sense,
S8: that can be comforting to the new spouse coming in
S8: to say, I want to be as good, if not better,
S8: a husband than your first.
S2: There is a positive there, Chris. There's also a downside
S2: to that. And that is she may compare her new
S2: husband with her former husband in particular areas of life.
S2: And in her mind, she's saying, you know, my former
S2: husband would never have done that. he would have been
S2: more thoughtful than that. And so that's what she must guard,
S2: because no two men are alike. You know, men can
S2: be good men, good husbands, but they're not going to
S2: be alike. And in some areas, her new husband is
S2: going to be stronger than her former husband. And in
S2: other areas, he's going to be weaker. So she has
S2: to recognize him as a human and not yield to
S2: those comparison, uh, you know, dialogs in her own mind. Otherwise,
S2: she will be unfair to her new husband. So having
S2: said that, there's an upside and a downside to her
S2: having had a good marriage in the first marriage. But
S2: I think it's far better that her marriage was good,
S2: because she has a model of what a good marriage
S2: is all about. When we come out of a poor marriage,
S2: we don't have the model. So it's much easier to
S2: if we've got a good model in front of us.
S10: First of all, thank you that the Savories are back
S10: in the biz. I know that Chris is on MBI,
S10: and it's nice to have Andrea back because I remember
S10: both of them from the old midday connections. As a
S10: broadcaster on a secular radio station, it's exciting to have
S10: those two people back on the airwaves. And Doctor Chapman,
S10: you were in Youngstown several years ago. I came to
S10: see you and what an outstanding night it was. Just
S10: a words of encouragement. Keep up the good work. Bless
S10: you guys. Good to have you back. God bless. Bye bye.
S1: Hey.
S2: That's the kind of call we like to hear. Welcome back. Andrea.
S8: Yeah, I'd like to thank my brother for calling in. Jim,
S8: this is building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman, author of
S8: the New York Times bestseller The Five Love Languages.
S7: You're hearing calls that came into our listener line at 1866424. Gary,
S7: if you'd like to suggest a topic for a consideration,
S7: give some feedback about Gary's ministry in your life, or
S7: you just want to try and make us laugh like
S7: that did call that number 1866424 Gary.
S8: Well, we're presenting our first Dear Gary program today. Responses
S8: to your calls over the past few weeks. And let's
S8: get back to the phone and hear our next caller.
S4: Yes, I would like to know if he could maybe
S4: take the subject of getting your husband to open up.
S4: My husband is very close. He doesn't share any of
S4: his feelings with me and he doesn't. We've been married
S4: 29 years and it's just like, I mean, I share everything,
S4: I'm bubbly and everything, and he's just very withdrawn. And
S4: I'm just wondering if maybe you could explain how you
S4: could get him to share.
S2: How many times have I heard that one? The wife
S2: is talkative, the husband's quiet. You know, I wish I
S2: knew what was going on inside of him.
S8: Well, here's the other thing, Gary. They've been married 29 years.
S2: 29 years. Yeah, I think they could give us some advice.
S7: Well, it shows it doesn't just go away now, does it?
S2: No it doesn't. You know, in my seminars, I talk
S2: about two kinds of people when it comes to talking.
S2: One is the Dead Sea. That's the person who can
S2: receive lots of things in life, but they don't have
S2: any compulsion to share. They have this large reservoir where
S2: they store all of that. And the other type is
S2: what I call the babbling brook. Whatever comes in the
S2: eye gate or the ear gate comes out the mouth gate.
S2: And apparently she's a babbling brook and he's a dead sea.
S2: And maybe she's an extreme babbling brook, and he's an
S2: extreme Dead Sea. That's possible. In fact, that sounds like
S2: the case because she said of herself, I'm bubbly and
S2: always talking. So what I would say is this. He
S2: will never talk more until she talks less. A dead
S2: sea will never come into a river of flowing words.
S2: If you want a Dead sea to talk more, you
S2: have to leave little pools of silence. And the best
S2: place to leave your little pools of silence is right
S2: after your questions. You see the problem with babbling brooks sometimes,
S2: especially what I call super babbling brooks. They will ask
S2: you a question, and if you don't give him an
S2: immediate answer, they'll answer their own question. They'll even tell
S2: you what you think you know. They'll ask you, what
S2: do you think about this? And if you don't answer,
S2: they'll say, well, I know what you think you know.
S2: And so the Dead Sea is saying inside, you know,
S2: no need for me to talk. I mean, she can
S2: ask the questions and give the answers. I don't need
S2: to say anything. And this is hard, because if a
S2: person is a super babbling brook, they've been doing that
S2: all their lifetime. It's natural for them.
S7: Well, and it comes out with other in social relationships too.
S7: You can practice there being quieter because you can see
S7: it in couples. Well, I can see myself in this.
S7: You just fill the silences all the time, even in
S7: social settings.
S2: Yes. That's correct. You know, it'd be interesting to know
S2: if her husband talks more freely around other people when
S2: she's not there. I reason I bring that up. My
S2: wife and I were visiting a widow some time ago,
S2: and in the course of our conversation, her husband had
S2: been dead about a month, and we just went by
S2: to see her and she said, you know, my husband
S2: was a very quiet man. He just didn't talk much.
S2: But he was a very good man. And she went
S2: on to tell about his good qualities. Well, when my
S2: wife and I got back in the car, I said
S2: to her, do you think she's talking about the man
S2: we knew? Because the man we knew talked freely, you know,
S2: in social settings. When he would be by himself, he
S2: would just talk. He would joke. He was. I mean,
S2: he was a, you know, very outgoing guy. And then
S2: we both smiled because we knew what the problem was.
S2: At home, he never got a chance to talk. She
S2: filled up all the spaces. I mean, she was the
S2: night we visited her, we said very little. She just
S2: talked and talked and talked and talked and talked. So consequently,
S2: he had learned that he didn't need to talk at home.
S2: So he talked when he was around other people.
S7: So what would you say to the, let's say, the
S7: husband listening? Who knows? Who knows? That's my wife. She talks.
S7: She fills all those silences. Is there something he could do, though,
S7: to help?
S2: Or if she complains to him, if she says such
S2: things as I wish you'd talk more. I don't ever
S2: know what you're thinking. Then he can take that, that
S2: she has the desire for him to share more of himself.
S2: So he could then say to her, you know, honey,
S2: obviously I'm not the talker that you are, but I
S2: would be willing to talk more if you would give
S2: me a chance. So the next time you ask me
S2: a question, just give me a little silence. Give me.
S2: Give me a moment to think about what I want
S2: to say, and I'll answer your question. But when you
S2: ask the question and then you give the answer, I'm
S2: not motivated to think about what I want to say.
S2: So I'm willing to work with you. I'm willing to
S2: to to share more than I've been sharing. I know
S2: I hear what you're saying, and I'd like to share
S2: more with you, but we're going to have to change
S2: the pattern because I can't just give you an immediate answer.
S2: I have to think about what I'm going to say.
S2: So give me a little time and I'll try to
S2: do that. He's being very open and very honest.
S8: And if those opposites which normally attract, you're probably going
S8: to have one person that is a little more verbal
S8: than the other. But I even see it in the
S8: relationship I have with Andrea. I can talk all day
S8: long about the Super Bowl and about, you know, how
S8: the Rockies did in the World Series and all that,
S8: all this other stuff that really freely. But when you
S8: get down to the depths of my feeling, it takes
S8: a lot of effort to kind of drag that out.
S8: And so maybe what she's asking for is not necessarily
S8: for him to talk more. It's to talk more substantively
S8: about what's deep down inside.
S2: And most likely that's the case. He probably talks about
S2: the logistics of life with her, but he doesn't share
S2: what his thoughts and feelings are about issues that she
S2: is interested in. So I think you're exactly right. So,
S2: you know, you do have these dynamics of of our personality,
S2: the Dead Sea and the babbling brook. But there are
S2: other reasons why a husband may not be talking. Or
S2: sometimes it's a wife who doesn't talk. Sometimes they have
S2: tried to share their thoughts in the past, and when
S2: they did, they were condemned. Their spouse came across as saying, well,
S2: that's stupid. I mean, why would you think that? That
S2: doesn't make any sense at all. Well, you say that
S2: a few times, and the next time the spouse is
S2: not going to say anything because none of us like
S2: to be put down. You like to be clobbered. So
S2: you need to also look back and ask yourself, how
S2: have I responded when my spouse did share an idea?
S2: Did share one of their thoughts or feelings? How did
S2: I respond? You may be shutting down the communication that
S2: you deeply are longing for.
S7: Well, there were some really great questions on our listener line.
S7: If you don't hear your call, it's not because it's
S7: wasn't important. We listen to each one and have struggled
S7: to present some representative listeners. So up next, a positive
S7: story about the results of Gary's ministry.
S11: I'm a Christian counselor, have utilized Utilize the Five Love
S11: Languages book for a number of years. One of the
S11: most memorable experiences I had implementing it was when just
S11: one man came in without his spouse reporting that basically
S11: she was fed up, had given up. She was just,
S11: I think, solidifying the plans for getting out. She refused
S11: to come in to counseling with him. As we talked
S11: and I introduced the five love languages, I gave him
S11: an assignment to go home and ask his wife, what
S11: is one thing I can do that would show you
S11: I love you? Apparently, she responded in what I took
S11: to be probably a rather sarcastic tone and was telling him,
S11: do the dishes every night. Well, I told him to
S11: do his assignment, come back in a couple of weeks.
S11: When he did, he was just amazed. He said, I
S11: don't know what happened. She's not the same woman. He said.
S11: She's smiling at me. We're having a sexual relationship again.
S11: She's no longer talking about leaving. He said it's like
S11: night and day. And he said all I did was
S11: do the dishes. He couldn't believe that doing one simple
S11: thing made such a huge difference. I have actually shared
S11: that example with other couples too, because sometimes I think
S11: they underestimate the power of using or expressing love to
S11: their mate in their preferred language.
S2: I am so encouraged when I hear counselors share stories
S2: like that, and I hear it a lot. I'm encouraged.
S2: First of all, that counselors are using the concept in
S2: trying to help people. And over and over again, counselors
S2: say to me, you know, it's amazing how quickly a
S2: marriage can turn around when one individual starts loving the
S2: other person in the right love language. You know, for
S2: something so simple, uh, Chris and Andrea, it's amazing the
S2: emotional difference it makes in a couple. This wife's language
S2: is obviously was acts of service. And one of the
S2: things that she really appreciated was him washing the dishes.
S2: So when he asked the question and then responded to
S2: her answer, it communicated deeply to her that he really
S2: does love me. And she responded positively to him.
S7: Whether it makes sense or not, to him. And that's
S7: what he got past, obviously.
S2: Yeah. That's right. You know, I had a man say
S2: to me some time ago, he said, you know, Gary,
S2: if someone had told me that my taking out garbage
S2: every day would make my wife feel loved, I would
S2: have taken out the garbage, he said. But, you know,
S2: nobody told me that. So what he was saying was,
S2: you know, if I had known this concept earlier, I
S2: would have been using it. And I think that's true
S2: of many couples. In fact, I've had people say to me,
S2: you know, why didn't I think of this earlier? It's
S2: so simple. And the reality is, it is simple. Uh,
S2: not always easy to do because sometimes, you know, we're
S2: not highly motivated to take out the garbage. But if
S2: we realize that it makes our spouse feel loved, then
S2: we have the motivation, the Motivation. The results when what
S2: we want is for them to feel loved.
S8: And we're not saying that if you have a troubled marriage,
S8: all you have to do is one little thing to
S8: fix it. But this will help you show that love
S8: that you want so desperately to show to that other person.
S2: Yeah, you get on the right track when you discover
S2: their love language and it's not doing one thing. It
S2: may be a number of things. For example, acts of service.
S2: I mean, there are many acts of service, you know,
S2: washing dishes and and taking out garbage. Yes, but vacuuming floors,
S2: you know, uh, changing the baby's diaper, walking the dog,
S2: mowing the grass, I mean, all kinds of things. And
S2: any one of those things will likely speak loudly to
S2: your spouse. But I say, you know better to ask
S2: your spouse what would be most meaningful to you. Because
S2: even if it's an act of service, you may be
S2: doing one thing and they would prefer you'd be doing
S2: something else, so you may as well spend your energy
S2: doing something that's going to be meaningful to your spouse.
S1: You're listening to a best of building relationships with Doctor
S1: Gary Chapman from almost 18 years ago. This was our
S1: very first Dear Gary broadcast from November of 2007. Yes,
S1: our voices might sound a little younger, but Gary's wisdom
S1: is the constant here, and so is our featured resource,
S1: the Five Love Languages. You can find out more at
S1: five Love Languages. Again, go to five Love languages.com.
S8: Let's deal with singles issues in this segment, Gary. And
S8: here's our first caller.
S12: I'm 20 years old, a college student, and I actually
S12: I've just been wondering. My family ties at home are
S12: not as strong, and I'm just kind of in fear
S12: of having, um, strong my own strong family and, like,
S12: ties with my husband in the future. And just, I mean,
S12: I don't even have a boyfriend yet, but I just,
S12: I feel like since I don't have strong family ties
S12: at home, or how my relationships at home aren't what
S12: I want them to be, I just feel like I
S12: would likely have trouble making my own way and new
S12: relationships in the future.
S2: I am so encouraged that a 20 year old would
S2: be asking that question.
S8: Isn't that great?
S2: Yeah, because it says, you know, they're thinking they're looking
S2: back at their family. They're realizing there were some flaws
S2: in the quality of the relationship and the family. They're
S2: looking ahead and they're thinking about, you know, I don't
S2: want to have what I came out of. How can
S2: this be different? And the good news is that when
S2: a person is that open and that insightful, there's hope
S2: and there's help. The reality is skills in marriage and
S2: family life, the things that make marriage and family work
S2: can be learned. That's why we have so many books
S2: on marriage and family. That's why we have marriage seminars,
S2: parenting seminars, all these things. Because we know that if
S2: people can get the right information and develop the right skills,
S2: then they can overcome a lot of baggage from the
S2: past when they try to build their marriage and their family.
S2: So I would just say to this young lady, you know,
S2: read some good books, take a course. If you're in college,
S2: take a course on marriage and family. If there's one
S2: offered from time to time, you know, go to workshops
S2: and classes that may be offered at your church. Even
S2: though you're not married, you can still learn what what
S2: makes marriage work. The more you can learn, even before
S2: you get a boyfriend, the better off you're going to be,
S2: and the more likely you are to not duplicate what
S2: you came out of.
S7: And there's no easy road for anybody, even the best
S7: of family circumstances. You're still going to have a road ahead.
S2: Yes. You know, you can grow up in a good
S2: family and get married and wonder. Wait a minute. I
S2: didn't think this was the way it's supposed to work.
S2: I remember my own son said to me, he didn't
S2: get married until he's 34. And he said to me,
S2: after the first year of marriage, hey, dad, you didn't
S2: tell me it was going to be this hard the
S2: first year. You know, he had he had seen our
S2: marriage and and, you know, he was a good family
S2: and he grew up and he was happy. And he
S2: thought he was going to get married and have a
S2: marriage just like ours. But of course, he knew, because
S2: we had told him that the first several years for
S2: us were rough as well. Uh, but you can, you know,
S2: you're going to find some difficulty in a marriage relationship,
S2: even if you came out of a good family. But
S2: if you have the concepts of of acceptance of the
S2: other person and learning how to negotiate the differences and
S2: learning how to resolve conflicts by listening to each other
S2: and and affirming each other, those kind of skills will
S2: go a long ways in helping you have a good marriage,
S2: whatever the background.
S8: Well, let's go from a 20 year old to a
S8: little bit different age range.
S6: Oh, hi. I just have a subject to discuss. It's, um,
S6: older singles, um, that are a couple or in a
S6: relationship for several months, but because of prior relationships, prior marriages,
S6: they're hesitant about marriage but still have a chemistry going
S6: on and know that physical relationship is wrong. So what
S6: do you do? Get married even though you don't feel
S6: you're ready? Break up. What do you do?
S2: Good question. And there's thousands of older singles who are
S2: in that situation. You know, we have attraction, natural attraction,
S2: men for women. And even if we're Christians and we
S2: had a bad marriage, or maybe a spouse is dead
S2: and we're single again, and so we start dating. But
S2: because of all the background and all the baggage, we're
S2: not ready to jump into another marriage. And yet we
S2: have these desires physically for each other. So what are
S2: we going to do about that? And what I would
S2: say is, certainly you don't get married just because you're
S2: struggling with your your physical desires. That's not a foundation
S2: for getting married. Secondly, I don't think you break up.
S2: There's nothing really to be gained by that, because what
S2: happens is you'll find yourself getting involved in another relationship.
S2: I think what you have to do is to be
S2: open and honest about the nature of your relationship. You see,
S2: if one of you is anticipating marriage to this person
S2: and the other has already decided, you know, I'm not
S2: going to get married, at least not for the time being.
S2: And you don't know that? Then you can find a
S2: lot of hurt and a lot of frustration. But if
S2: both of you sit down and say, let's just share
S2: with each other where we are, what are you thinking?
S2: What are you feeling? And be open about how you
S2: feel about the other person, but also what guidelines you
S2: have where you think this relationship might go. What timeline
S2: are you thinking about? Or maybe you're not even thinking
S2: about marriage at all. Anytime. So opening up and sharing
S2: with each other your honest thoughts and your honest feelings,
S2: and together deciding whether the relationship should continue or whether
S2: relationship should simply stop. But the two of you, if
S2: you're honest, can come. And if you're looking to God
S2: for direction, you can come to a good conclusion.
S8: Just one more observation. It seems to me that that
S8: from that call. And I'm so glad she left that
S8: message that there is this hormonal, this sexual drive that
S8: is kind of clouding the issue, much like happens with
S8: teenagers who believe I'm in love. I'm in love, and
S8: they really have that physical attraction, but not a whole
S8: lot else going on for that relationship. Aren't those two
S8: kind of similar, even though they're such disparate ages?
S2: I think they are similar because, Chris, you know, when
S2: you're in a dating relationship and especially if you have
S2: those those feelings of love, which I call the tingles,
S2: you know, we get into this real high, euphoric, warm
S2: feelings for each other and then the sexual, you know,
S2: feelings enter into that. It can be a very volatile
S2: situation and we know it is for teenagers. I mean,
S2: we have lots of teenagers who never intended to get pregnant,
S2: but they get involved sexually. And before they know what
S2: happens there, the girl is pregnant. So the same thing
S2: happens whether you're 45 or whether you're 20 or whether
S2: you're 55. I've seen single adults, you know, 45, 55,
S2: who are just as giddy as a 13 year, 14,
S2: 16 year old. And the dangers are just as great
S2: at that point as they are when we're earlier. So,
S2: you know, we have to have guidelines that to me,
S2: this is the key issue, have guidelines on our sexual behavior.
S2: It's fine to admit that we're sexual not trying to
S2: deny our sexual desires, but we we have to follow
S2: biblical patterns, and we have to have guidelines that help
S2: us be true to our convictions.
S7: There's one more issue we want to tackle, and here's
S7: a caller with that subject.
S13: Hello, my name is Linda. I'm 44 years old, divorced,
S13: two little kids. I'm dating a man that I met
S13: through a website and things are going well, although it
S13: is a long distance relationship. But one thing happens when
S13: we're together that concerns me. This man has been divorced
S13: for only one year. What concerns me about that is
S13: whenever we're having a discussion about something, um, that involves
S13: our relationship and how we're communicating, he brings up the
S13: fact that her filter that she used to hear him
S13: included her perception that he was controlling and manipulative. Um,
S13: I don't see it that way. He's a very strong personality.
S13: He has his own ideas about things, and there's no
S13: gray areas with him. It's all black and white, and
S13: I understand that. Um, but every time he brings her up,
S13: which happens probably every time we're together, it's with such
S13: strong emotion, such anger and hurt. I'm just wondering if
S13: maybe this is too soon for him. Or am I
S13: assuming it's too soon? I'm not sure how to interpret
S13: what I'm getting from him as far as his communication
S13: with me about his ex-wife.
S2: I think it is too soon. You know, I said
S2: earlier in the program that research indicates that it takes
S2: two years after a divorce for a person to get
S2: back on level ground emotionally. And the most common mistake
S2: people make is they get involved with someone else too early.
S2: They're still going through processing the pain and the hurt
S2: of that divorce that they went through, or sometimes the
S2: death of a spouse. And they get involved with someone else.
S2: It meets needs for them. Yes, it helps alleviate the
S2: loneliness and the hurt, but it's too soon for them
S2: to be getting involved in a in a in a
S2: serious dating relationship. So to me, that would be a
S2: red flag waving. The other thing I would say in
S2: this particular case is if you're going to continue to
S2: see each other, I suggest that you have a personality profile.
S2: You're the fellow you're dating as well as yourself, and
S2: let's see what the patterns are in his personality. If
S2: his first wife saw him as controlling, and I hear
S2: you saying that he's very certain of himself, it's black
S2: and white. His first wife may have been right. He
S2: may be a controller. And you need to face that clearly.
S2: So I'd say go to a Christian counselor and just say,
S2: you know, we'd like to have a personality profile to
S2: help us understand what the points of conflict might be
S2: in our relationship. Uh, I wouldn't go. I wouldn't go
S2: very far without doing that. I mean, to me, that's
S2: just simply common sense. And you're being very honest and
S2: open with each other about your personality patterns, but I
S2: do think it's too early. And, uh, you know, lots
S2: of people do meet on the internet these days. But
S2: to be honest with you, and I mean, if it's
S2: if there's a filtering, if it's one of the programs
S2: where they have filtering patterns and, and help you find
S2: someone that is more similar to you and beliefs and
S2: those kind of things, that's one thing that can be helpful. Uh,
S2: but if it's just simply someone you met on the internet,
S2: a lot of red flags there, you ought to do
S2: a lot of excavation to make sure that what you
S2: think is true about this person really is true about
S2: the person.
S8: This is building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman and our
S8: special Dear Gary Edition. I think this is something we
S8: ought to do regularly.
S7: I do too, as long as listeners have questions and
S7: concerns and feedback they'd like to give, we will schedule
S7: these types of broadcasts. Our phone number is 1866424. Gary,
S7: we would love to have your question and include you
S7: on a future broadcast. one 866 424.
S8: Gary, let's get back to the calls. Gary, this is
S8: one of those that is so personal. And yet I
S8: think it will strike a chord with you and with
S8: a lot of people.
S5: I had got into a relationship with an adulterous woman
S5: that went on for four years. I've been a Christian
S5: since 1985, and the shame and guilt just got to me.
S5: And I still love her, still miss her, but I
S5: know that I had to get away from it. And
S5: I thought to myself, I really came to this revelation
S5: that if I really do love this woman, that I
S5: would let her go and not be selfish anymore and
S5: try to hold on to her. But I would let
S5: her go because she has children and a husband and
S5: a home, and I feel really good about that decision
S5: that I made.
S2: Wow. I wish we had more of those kind of
S2: calls of guys who realize in the middle of the
S2: stream that they're doing wrong and they're going to hurt themselves.
S2: They're going to hurt someone else, they're going to hurt
S2: some children. and in spite of their feelings of love,
S2: which is what I heard him say, I'm still loving her.
S2: I still miss her in spite of those feelings. They
S2: choose to do what is right. It's very difficult because
S2: you see in the theme in our society is God
S2: wants me to be happy. And so I'm not happy
S2: in my marriage, but I'm happy with this woman. And
S2: so even Christians make very poor decisions and break up
S2: their own marriage and break up someone else's marriage in
S2: order to be happy. The reality is, those feelings only
S2: last for a time and they come down off the high. Now,
S2: you know, he said they had been carrying on this
S2: affair for four years. When it's a secretive affair, the
S2: emotions tend to last longer. The average national level is
S2: that after two years of the the strong emotional feelings,
S2: you come down off the high. But if it's a
S2: secretive affair, those feelings can go on for a longer
S2: period of time. And in the middle of those feelings,
S2: when he's still feeling those positive vibes for her. He
S2: recognizes that what he's doing is wrong and he makes
S2: the choice to break it off. I wish other men
S2: and women could hear that and understand the reality of that.
S2: It's not easy to break off an affair, but it's
S2: right to break off an affair. And to be very
S2: honest with you. Chris and Andrea, I've never met anyone
S2: who regretted doing right, but they are in my office
S2: and other counselors offices every week. Who did wrong? Five
S2: years ago, left their spouse, ran off with the person
S2: they were having an affair with, and now they've come
S2: down off the high, and now they're trying to get
S2: counseling in that second or third marriage. Don't misunderstand me.
S2: I'm glad they're trying to get help, but it would
S2: have been a whole lot easier if they'd gotten help
S2: back upstream. I just wish that more Christians could understand
S2: that happiness is not God's goal for us. God's goal
S2: for us is that we follow his teachings and that
S2: in following his teachings, we will always be the better
S2: and our families will always be better when we follow
S2: God's teachings and when we violate those teachings, I don't
S2: care how we feel or how happy we may be
S2: for a while. We're going to cause problems for ourselves
S2: and all the people around us.
S8: Well, our final call is one of those that probably
S8: represents a lot of hurting people.
S14: My husband and I are on the verge of divorce.
S14: I've read your book, The Five Love Languages and so
S14: has he, but it seems like we still can't get
S14: it together and we're still fighting. So I wondered if
S14: you had any ideas. Um, I don't know. We don't
S14: take responsibility, maybe for what we've done or what's happened
S14: in our relationship. Do you have any ideas? It just
S14: seems like it's going nowhere. And I don't think either
S14: one of us want a divorce, but we can't live
S14: the way we were.
S2: If you don't get help from reading a book, then
S2: go for counseling. That's what counselors are all about. That's
S2: what pastors are all about. That is those pastors who
S2: do counseling. Uh, we're here to help people. And you
S2: don't have any problems that other people haven't had similar problems.
S2: And so you may as well reach out and ask someone,
S2: you know, look, here's where we are. We're Christians. We
S2: don't want a divorce, but we're we're miserable. So help
S2: us and you can find help. There's no reason that
S2: you need to go to divorce, and no reason you
S2: need to continue living with a level of stress that
S2: you're talking about. There are answers, and Christian counselors and
S2: pastors can help you discover those answers. So I would
S2: just really encourage people who are in those kind of
S2: marriages to reach out for help. I'm amazed at how
S2: many people come to the point of divorce. I'm talking
S2: about Christians come to the point of divorce, and they've
S2: never reached out for counseling. They say, well, I went
S2: to a marriage seminar once, or I went to a
S2: weekend retreat, or I read a book and, you know,
S2: but this is serious stuff. You need the best help
S2: you can get. And the wonderful news is that all
S2: over America, there are Christian counselors in every major city
S2: in the country, and you can find help. So I
S2: would just encourage you to reach out. Don't give up
S2: on the marriage, and don't lock yourself into a life
S2: of misery. Reach out and find help. There's help available.
S7: Give a word of hope, and maybe you can use
S7: a specific couple that you've seen. Or just generally speaking,
S7: I mean, you've seen many couples who didn't think they
S7: could make it.
S2: Who have many of the couples that come into my
S2: office come at the point of giving up? In fact,
S2: most of them are desperate. That's why they come. And
S2: what I say to them at the very beginning, I
S2: understand you don't have any hope, but I have hope
S2: for you. So believe in my hope, and let's try
S2: some things. And one by one, we begin to tackle
S2: the issues that have driven them apart. The issues they've
S2: never resolved. And as they begin to listen to each other,
S2: which is a big factor. Most couples don't know how
S2: to listen to each other. They listen long enough to
S2: give their opinion and they end up arguing. And you
S2: don't win anything by arguing. And so teaching them how
S2: to listen to each other empathetically, to understand what's going
S2: on inside the other person and then have a proper
S2: response to it. And when couples begin to get the
S2: thrill of being heard and being understood and solving conflicts,
S2: they don't have to take but 3 or 4 steps
S2: in the right direction, and they begin to feel better
S2: about themselves. That's why, you know, because of my own experience,
S2: I'm so positive on encouraging couples to reach out for help.
S8: And it can get messy. It can get ugly. There
S8: can be cross words said. And it you know, a
S8: lot of people really shy away from that. I think,
S8: you know, marriage ought to be always being happy and
S8: never raising your voice. But that's not reality. And if
S8: you get past that and get past all of the
S8: ugly stuff that it can can bring up, there's hope
S8: on the other side of that.
S2: There is. And, you know, one of the reasons Chris
S2: and Andrew and you know this about me, but one
S2: of the reasons I have so much hope for people
S2: is because of my own experience. And Carolyn and I
S2: went through so many years in those early times in
S2: our marriage in which we just struggled and we didn't
S2: seem like we were getting anywhere. And we argued and
S2: we put each other down and we withdrew from each other.
S2: So I know, I know those struggles, I know that pain.
S2: And that's why I identify with people so well who
S2: are in that situation. But I also know that there
S2: are answers. And God gave us those answers and brought
S2: us through that, and he can bring other couples through that.
S2: I'm grateful that people are being honest about their struggle
S2: because that's the first step. And then once you're honest,
S2: then you reach out and try to find help.
S7: Well, we want to thank all of you who contributed
S7: to our program today, and that's why we're here to help.
S7: And if you would like to be a part of
S7: our program future program, call one 866 424. Gary. That
S7: is our listener line. If you'd like to go to
S7: our website and email us. The website is five Love Languages.
S7: That's five love languages.com.
S8: What do you think, Gary? Do you like being dear
S8: Gary for a week?
S2: I'm ready to start my column. Chris. Yes.
S8: All right. We'll see you back here next week.
S1: And there you have it. From November of 2007, our
S1: first Dear Gary broadcast. Hope you enjoyed that. Today and
S1: next week it's a summer best of conversation with Doctor
S1: Patrick Morley. Don't miss his hope filled message for men.
S1: Big thank you to our producer, Janice backing and our
S1: engineer and musical aficionado Steve Wick. Building relationships with Doctor
S1: Gary Chapman is a production of Moody Radio in association
S1: with Moody Publishers, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute. Thanks
S1: for listening.